Seth Rogen Returns Again

Speaker 1 Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free right now. Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts, or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 1 Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. Experts on Expert.

Speaker 1 We have an unconventional expert today, but when you hear him talk, you will know he is an expert.

Speaker 2 Peek behind the curtain. He was going to be a Monday.

Speaker 1 Sure. Because

Speaker 2 obviously he would be a Monday. But then it got really interesting.
We got into a lot of filmmaking stuff. And it was so cool that it was like, no, you know what?

Speaker 1 You were editing.

Speaker 2 Yep.

Speaker 1 And you text me, what if we moved Seth to Thursday? And I said, no, you have bad ideas. Fuck you.
You're a piece of shit. I hate you.
Don't ever think again.

Speaker 1 Click. And then I forgot about it.
And then you did it every day. I just did it.
And now we're here. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Seth Rogan is an actor. He's a comedian.
He is a filmmaker. He is a martial arts star.
Yeah. Remember when he was a kid in Canada, he was all about that karate.
Super bad.

Speaker 1 This is the knocked up Neighbors Pineapple Express in a new series that I, it'll be obvious in the episode. Truly, I love this show.
I'm still dying to see it. Oh, it's so impressive.

Speaker 1 It's so funny and impressive. And the plot is like a freight train.

Speaker 1 It's called The Studio, and it's on Apple TV, March 26th.

Speaker 1 So please, I couldn't recommend it enough.

Speaker 2 I lump him in with Chelsea Handler of people in this industry who are extremely generous.

Speaker 2 They say yes all the time if you ask a favor. I don't think people really know that about him, but he is.

Speaker 1 I think he's just a lover of it. You know, like there's haters.
Yeah. There's jealous people.
He's a lover.

Speaker 2 Yeah, he's a nice person.

Speaker 1 He loves projects. He pops up in things.
He just loves the whole world.

Speaker 2 We like Seth. Yeah.

Speaker 1 I like when the good guys win.

Speaker 2 Yeah, me too. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Please enjoy Seth Rogen. We are supported by Nordic Naturals, the number one selling fish oil brand in the U.S.
Something I take every evening before bed.

Speaker 1 So I saw this article the other day about nutrition, and there's this stat that completely caught me off guard.

Speaker 1 Apparently, 80% of Americans don't get enough omega-3s from their diet, but it turns out omega-3 fatty acids, EPA, and DHA are critical for cellular health.

Speaker 1 We're talking about stuff that affects your heart, brain, immune system, eyes, mood, basically everything that matters for feeling good day to day.

Speaker 1 Nordic Naturals is the number one selling omega-3 brand in the U.S. with products formulated to support your whole family, including kids and pets.

Speaker 1 Their ultimate Omega provides concentrated omega-3 support without any fishy aftertaste. Comes in soft gels, liquid, even zero sugar gummies.
I love them. I eat them every night.

Speaker 1 My numbers have been great, which is so comforting. Use promo code code DAX for 15% off your next order at nordic.com and discover the power of Omega-3 for yourself.

Speaker 1 These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease.

Speaker 1 We are supported by T-Mobile 5G home internet. Like everyone, home internet is our life, and there's nothing worse than when it slows down.

Speaker 2 Oh, I know, especially when you're doing something important like editing this show.

Speaker 1 Well, actually, there's one one worse thing: waiting around all day for the cable guy to show up to install it.

Speaker 2 I want those five hours back.

Speaker 1 Fortunately, T-Mobile's got home internet. They have fast speeds and it sets up easily in 15 minutes with just one cord.

Speaker 2 Anyone can do it. Even me.

Speaker 1 Hey, we were first in on T-Mobile's home internet. We were using it up in the attic.
Yeah. If you recall.

Speaker 2 It powers this very show.

Speaker 1 Yes, it's so reliable. And when you've got a podcast full of valuable insights about human nature and poop jokes, you need that.

Speaker 2 We all need that.

Speaker 1 Oh, and the low price is guaranteed for five years.

Speaker 2 Five years? Gotta respect the LTR.

Speaker 1 Guarantees monthly price of fixed wireless 5G internet data. Exclusions like taxes and fees applies.
Service delivered via 5G network. Speeds vary due to factor affecting cellular networks.

Speaker 1 Check availability and guarantee exclusions and details at t-mobile.com slash home internet.

Speaker 1 He's an alternative.

Speaker 1 He's an opt-chance.

Speaker 1 He's an old chancel.

Speaker 1 He's an option.

Speaker 1 Something very specific happened. Oh, what do you want to know? What happened?

Speaker 2 I already informed him about the robbery.

Speaker 1 It's related. Okay.
Was there another robbery?

Speaker 1 There's been a second robbery, a follow-up robbery. They missed some shit.
They forgot a few things. You know, it's weird.
That is the only thing that bothers me.

Speaker 1 I can accept that the stuff got stolen. It's the notion, like, well, are they going to come back? It's very easy.
They had a good time. Yeah.
Things went well.

Speaker 1 That's what's driving me a little bonkers.

Speaker 2 So they know we're going to obviously replace the camera.

Speaker 1 We have to. It's just a never-ending camera replenishment.
They open a camera shop down the corner. Sells the same 12 cameras.
I'd be delighted to buy them off. Just broker a deal with them.

Speaker 1 Seriously. It's like the mafia.
I'm willing to pay them $500 a month to just stay away. Pay them camera protection.

Speaker 1 But when I have anxiety, I cut my hair compulsively.

Speaker 1 And I was like, oh, I have a lot of time. I'm going to really get in front of the mirror and then I'm going to start trimming my hair.
And I got lost in it.

Speaker 1 And then I thought, I should just glance at him. I'm sure I got 10 minutes left.
And I was like, four minutes after

Speaker 1 I was in a state of flow, I guess.

Speaker 2 You need a rule. Maybe no cutting before an interview.

Speaker 1 I know. I just, I thought it was going to be three snips, as I always say.
I just couldn't stop. It was too good.
What's your thing that you'll most lose sense of time doing? Is it the pottery?

Speaker 1 I would say I'm annoyingly conscious of time all the time.

Speaker 1 Sometimes when I'm filming, I kind of lose track of time, but I also usually have my eye on the clock because there's an amount of time we have to do shit.

Speaker 1 But pottery, sometimes, watching reality TV, sometimes I'll watch enough of that that I just kind of zone out. Here's another thing I fucked up.
I was like, I have so much time. I'll cut my hair.

Speaker 1 I'm also going to bring a fan down and I'm going to bring an ashtray for our guests. Oh, it's okay.
Are you sure? Yes. Okay.
We love that you smoked weed.

Speaker 2 Yeah, that was fun for us.

Speaker 1 That was fun for us, but it did lead us astray. This room is small, also.
I've now done these types of things where I make people really stoned.

Speaker 1 And then I'll see them months later and be like, I was so fucked up that I apologize. And everyone feels bad about it.
Well, that's what happened. You did it.
And we were like, that was great.

Speaker 1 Nothing happened. And then Wiz Khaled.
Is that his roach? Yeah. Yeah.
And I was like, hey, feel free to smoke. He probably smokes at a different rate than I do.

Speaker 1 Exactly. He did five back-to-back over the course of an hour and a half.
And there was a point where I was like, I'm a little lost. And I looked over at Monica and Monica was like, this.

Speaker 1 And then I looked at Robin. He wasn't even looking at the board.
He was just sitting on his chair hanging out. And I was like, oh.
I've hung out with him a few times.

Speaker 1 And every time I'm like, this guy smokes less.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 It's kind of impressive because he was fine.

Speaker 1 Yeah, he's fine. That man doesn't have anxiety.
Who's the Muhammad Ali of it? Of smoking weed? Yeah. Like, okay, so you were around him and you're like, oh, boy.
Snoop Dogg.

Speaker 1 I mean, there's no debating. I was on Howard Sturd once with him and me and him smoked a bunch of weed.
And then afterwards, he invited me to like his little trailer, which is like a tiny little room.

Speaker 1 and we smoked so much weed and it was one of the first times from just smoking weed i had to like cancel my entire rest of the day's stuff and i was just like i can't fucking do anything and then i just sat in my parked car for like 90 minutes

Speaker 1 slowly regained my faculties snoop's the best though there's no point in that for you though where you're at all nervous right you're just like okay here we are no okay i would say eating weed though some of the most unpleasantly high times i've had in my whole life and this is a life of doing many drugs eating weed is the thing that can tweak me out where I'm just like, oh, I've gone too far.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it can go south on you. Yeah, because it's not pleasant.
These other drugs have like a pleasant cushion. That's the point of them.
That's the point of them.

Speaker 1 It'll bolster itself with the pleasant effects of the drugs, but eating weed can just go down and there's no bolstering. It's like you're free-falling without a parachute.

Speaker 1 It's fun to hear you're afraid of that a little bit.

Speaker 1 Isn't it like comforting? We love fears. Yes.
We love vulnerabilities. I've said that a few times where I've been so high eating it.

Speaker 1 I was like, how could this be more powerful than crack and psychedelics? And the duration is very up in the air. It's a real bummer.
Yeah. I've done way too many shrooms.

Speaker 1 Even that's not that bad in comparison to way too much. Because there's at least like a catharsis.
No catharsis comes from eating too much weed.

Speaker 1 I think you're just like, I should never fucking eat weed again. Shrooms, you're like, I should do this differently.
I should do that. This was a rough trip, but got intense for a while.

Speaker 1 But at least I came out of it with some sort of food. Yeah, you might dissolve your ego and learn some stuff about yourself.
There's like a sense of accomplishment afterwards.

Speaker 1 There's no sense of accomplishment that comes with eating eating way too much weed food. You don't feel proud of yourself at all.
So you'll never do it. Eating some food.
No, I don't know.

Speaker 1 I do it all the time. Of course.

Speaker 1 What I do is I drink weed a lot now. There's weed beverages that are fantastic and they have a much more moderate amount.
Like a five milligram

Speaker 1 three or five. That I get down with.
My favorite thing, I want to say you were doing Stern where you had smoked a bunch of weed doing Stern, but then you were co-hosting with Hoda? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 And you got hammered too. Yes, they got drunk with them very early in the morning.

Speaker 2 Because they drink.

Speaker 1 Kathy Lee and Hoda. They would drink.
Yeah. I could not believe it.
Like, I thought it was like a shtick. You hear, like, Frank Sinatra had apple juice in that glass.

Speaker 1 And it's one of those times where you're like, oh, a glass of wine holds almost a bottle of wine.

Speaker 1 Yeah. They just give you like a full glass bottle of wine at like 8:30 in the morning.
Oh, my God. How to get it? I was like, wow, this is legit.
They are drunk on television every morning.

Speaker 1 What a hack. What a great way to live.

Speaker 1 People love it.

Speaker 1 I really am envious of that experience. I didn't drink in the morning until I did, and then I had to quit.
But there were times throughout the year where you did drink in the morning. Camping, sure.

Speaker 1 St. Patrick's Day.
Wake up, get out of bed. Brunch.
Sometimes I do brunch.

Speaker 1 I love brunch.

Speaker 1 And it's a special feeling

Speaker 1 to have the whole day ahead of you. Yes.
Wine tasting. I'm glad I never ruined drinking.
As I was having a martini the other night, I was marveling at, I've kept this relatively under control.

Speaker 2 That's how I feel.

Speaker 1 I'll have like two drinks and that's it. I'm not great at moderation, so I'm impressed with myself.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 As I'm doing it, I'm like, look at you, man. Two martinis and calling it a night.

Speaker 1 I have that same inflated pride about not having a gambling addiction because I'm like, everything I've ever touched, if I like it, I do it too much. But I can gamble.
I did it Saturday.

Speaker 1 Chris and I were in Vegas for like nine hours. I'm like, let's gamble.
Did 40 minutes. Very normal.
Gambling's one of the worst. It's an addiction where you're just burning your money, basically.

Speaker 1 You're just losing your life, literally, not even figuratively. At least drug addiction.
There's moments where you're like, this is fucking great. I'm on heroin.

Speaker 1 There's an escape. Rob, who's your favorite guest? The chef we love? Roy Choi.
Oh, yeah. You know him? Yeah, I met him.
I was on Jon Favreau had like a cooking show

Speaker 1 10 years ago. We were on it together.
Well, he had gambling addiction and he really shared with us.

Speaker 1 And I'll say the added fucking burn of that addiction, aside from drugs, is there is this notion you can get even.

Speaker 1 For me, like day three of a crack run, if I thought, oh, I could smoke two rocks and it'll erase what I I did. Go back in time.

Speaker 1 Yes, it has that promise. That's worse.
I'm in deep shit. I've lost the house, but I could fix it all with this addiction.

Speaker 1 The right hit will make my brain chemistry know how to solve all these problems. Look, I get no pleasure from gambling.
I don't gamble.

Speaker 1 Not even sitting at a blackjack table and tapping into the Sinatra thing of it all.

Speaker 1 I'm always afraid I'm going to get yelled at and I'm not doing the right thing and that they're going to get bad at me at the table. That fear overpowers any pleasure I get from it.

Speaker 1 I'll stand around and watch my friends gamble. What if you went with a buddy who is kind of good at it and he just was like, you got you hit a six to this now? I've done that.

Speaker 1 I've gone with my friends who are like, I'll be very instructive. Protect them.
And I just feel like a fucking idiot. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 My friend whispering in my fucking ear what to do. I'd feel like a child.
He's gambling by proxy.

Speaker 1 It's not fun either being puppeted by your friend at the blackjack table.

Speaker 2 We both have money, so you two.

Speaker 1 Don't let yourself cherry on the bottom.

Speaker 1 Everyone's got money in the room.

Speaker 2 So you can't tell yourself, oh, it's because I need it. There has to be something else sort of happening.
Someone's just telling you what to do. It's not like, oh, I have a skill.

Speaker 1 Well, that's kind of my struggle. I was just explaining.
Someone else was on the trip who's your struggle. You write a book called that.

Speaker 1 My struggle.

Speaker 1 Minecraft. It's a sticky title.
It is. It did well.

Speaker 1 It did very well. You can't say it didn't work.
You could argue it was a powerful book. You can say a lot of things about him, but to say his book was not effective.
It was sticky.

Speaker 1 Oh, my goodness. God.
Well, yeah, there's a dude on the trip who really gambles.

Speaker 1 And I was saying to him, I'm in this nether world where I used to gamble with $1,000 in the bank and I would gamble 100, which was a tenth of my net worth. And if I won 200, I literally went up 30%.

Speaker 1 It was real life altering. It changed my life dramatically that weekend.
That's bad. And now, like, I'm not willing to go gamble 10,000.
No, exactly. That's crazy.

Speaker 1 The best time I ever had a casino was Danny McBride got married many years years ago in Pop Springs, and we all went to a casino afterwards.

Speaker 1 I was with Adam McKay and Chris Hinchy, who is a comedy writer. And the best storyteller alive.
Possibly so funny.

Speaker 1 And they did a thing at the blackjack table that was the funniest thing I've ever seen, where they sat down separately, pretending not to know one another.

Speaker 1 What McKay kept doing would be he would hand Chris objects and Chris said he was a magician and a sleigh to hand magician and he would keep pretending to steal things from Adam McKay.

Speaker 1 And it was only for the benefit of the dealer and like the three other people who happened to be sitting at the table. And McKay would be like, I bet you're not that good.

Speaker 1 And then he'd be like, then how did I get your shoe? And everyone would be like, that's incredible. And I'd be like, that was lucky.
Well, then how did I get your wristwatch?

Speaker 1 And it went on a very long time. That's a great thing.
It was actually one of the funniest things I've ever seen. And it's so pure.
It was pure for four people and nobody else. What are you watching?

Speaker 1 What shows are you obsessed with? I've been loving Severance. It's amazing.
Walk me through the experience of watching it. Do you watch it? Yes.
Obsessed. Obsessed with that.

Speaker 1 We've seen the whole thing because like your show, we got screened.

Speaker 2 But I haven't seen the last episodes.

Speaker 1 I mean, I started it when it started. I'm a huge fan of Ben Stillers.
And I've known him since I was 16 years old.

Speaker 1 And a lot of people I worked with when I was first starting had worked on the Ben Stiller show. And Ben was on Freaks and Geeks.

Speaker 1 And the DP who shot Freaks and Geeks had shot the movie that Ben was the star of. He was someone I just looked up to immensely.

Speaker 1 And he was a writer and director, and he did all the things that I wanted to do. And he acted, and he was so funny.
I've always just been a fan of his.

Speaker 1 And so when I heard he was directing a new show, I watched it right away. I know Adam Scott for a long time.
He's the best. And it's incredible.

Speaker 1 And every time I see Ben, I gush over it because I really think, and it's sort of the complete opposite of what we have tried to do with our show, but precision and comedy are hard things to marry.

Speaker 1 And I'd say almost like a sterile level of precision. Stanley Kubernetes did it very well in Doctor Strange Love, but very few people have actually done it effectively since that, I would argue.

Speaker 1 And there are things that are pretty funny with that style, but I think Severn's a very funny show. Yeah.
And the story's amazing. And I love the mystery.

Speaker 1 I watched Lost, which was a real bummer ultimately, because I don't feel like it added up to the experience. And this feels like it's giving me the lost energy, and I have faith that it does add up.

Speaker 1 I'm optimistic as well. I also loved watching Lost, and I do often in my head think, was it worth it? It's a good philosophical question.
Is it worth a great journey if the ending sucks?

Speaker 1 It's like a new redo. There is no destination.
Yes, exactly. It's a journey worth taking without a destination.
And I am glad I did it ultimately because all our friends, we get together, we watch it.

Speaker 1 It was so fun, but it was a real bummer we did not love the enemy very much and so i am getting a similar vibe with severance where it does feel like a mystery everyone's trying to unpack a reveal everyone's excited to see what comes next a lot of people i know watch it so it's nice to talk about it but the style of it is unbelievable most things that are like frame fucked and within an inch when you're acting for the camera only so precise you could tell they're pouring over every millisecond of the show and usually again those things suck the comedy out of things And this does not do that at all.

Speaker 1 Yeah, like Wes Anderson can have that kind of meticulous world and comedy. He's literally probably the only other person

Speaker 1 that really do it like that. Do you like Righteous Gemstones? I've never watched any Righteous Gemstones.
I'm waiting for it to end and then I'm going to watch it. Okay, that's fair.

Speaker 1 So you can plow through. It's like a treat I've left for.
I actually watched the first episode. I was like, I love this so much that I don't want to have a staggered viewing experience.

Speaker 2 That is similar, actually. It's also shot so beautifully.

Speaker 1 Well, you saw the pilot, right? Yes. Danny directed the pilot.
This fucking tracking casino style shots with the money. Yeah, those guys are great.

Speaker 1 And those guys are some of the first guys I worked with that really wanted their comedies to look a certain way. Well, they were film school people.
Exactly.

Speaker 1 And Judd, the people that I was making movies with, were not like that.

Speaker 1 It was very much performance capture oriented. Since then, everyone's style has evolved.
But at the time, it was cross-coverage. That's it.
If it doesn't look great, who cares?

Speaker 1 All that matters is we're capturing the joke. In the defense of everyone, that was the first full embracing of improv, all the time.

Speaker 1 So you couldn't afford to miss someone's room. No, no, no, no, no.
And that's what people liked, and it was working, and it was very alive.

Speaker 1 And then I remember seeing Foot Fisway, and I made Observe Report with Jody Hill. All of a sudden, I was like, oh, there's shots in this movie.
I was like, whoa, this is fucking crazy.

Speaker 1 The whole other way to work. And then I watch a lot of reality TV.
That's easy.

Speaker 2 That's your anxiety release.

Speaker 1 Exactly. White Lotus.
I don't watch White Lotus.

Speaker 2 I could see you on White Lotus.

Speaker 1 Fingers crossed.

Speaker 1 Saying it here. Exactly.
I watched your wife's show. I thought that was great.
Okay, great. What a kiss, right? Yeah.
Handsy kiss. Handsy.

Speaker 2 It's all about those hands.

Speaker 1 I was watching with my Evan, Aaron Weakley, since sixth grade. And we were in Texas on someone's couch.
We're staying at someone's house and we decided to watch the show.

Speaker 1 It had been out for maybe a week or two.

Speaker 2 You were playing it like hard to get.

Speaker 1 No, I had been really busy. Something happened.
And I was actually excited because I was now. available to watch it.
And we were sitting on a couch with a very tiny love seat. And that kiss happened.

Speaker 1 And I was like oh my god that's the best kiss i've ever seen on television he goes has she ever kissed you like that i'm like no

Speaker 2 aaron goes i don't know who i want to kiss more him or her i'm like a same it's a powerful moment can you remove yourself layton and adam are talking about this too she's like when i watch the show i don't see him i can't really do that every time i watch kristen i see her right it's like your buddy is making out with yeah

Speaker 1 it depends i sometimes have a hard time watching people i know in things.

Speaker 1 Sometimes it takes me a few viewings to desensitize myself, especially if it's someone I know and they're doing a real character. Sometimes that throws me for a loop.
Of course.

Speaker 1 Or they're like smoking cigarettes and they've never seen it. Yes, things like that.
But then I start to love it. I always think of like Jonah and Wolf of Wall Street is like so good and so funny.

Speaker 1 And I think it maybe took me a minute where I was just like, what is going on here? And then I was just like, oh no, it's one of the funniest performances ever.

Speaker 1 At times, it takes me a minute to wrap my head around. Lauren has acted in things where she's made out with people.
And how do you feel when that happens?

Speaker 1 I get it, because I also know when I'm doing it, that I don't actually feel like I've kissed the people that I've kissed in movies. Not one? Not for real.
Wow. I for sure have not.

Speaker 1 I maybe never had one real moment ever

Speaker 1 on our off screen. In any moment ever.

Speaker 2 Because you're in your head. You want it to look a certain way.
You have to be aware.

Speaker 1 Mine that I'll say in public is. I had watched Friday Night Light.

Speaker 2 Oh, no.

Speaker 1 I loved Lila Garrity. And then all of a sudden on Parenthood, she becomes my love interest.
I'm like, I'm going to get to kiss Lila Garrity. I'm going to drop out of character for those moments.

Speaker 1 I'm going to drop back into character. Crosby hat on.

Speaker 1 Dax on. Exactly.
You've heard the stories, right, of actors who've really had sex, right? You kind of collect these stories. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We were very bummed out to find we had Halle Berry on.

Speaker 2 Dax asked.

Speaker 1 Oh, there's that rumor of her. And she said, no.

Speaker 1 Absolutely not. Were they on a staircase? They were on the couch.
Maybe I'm conflamed.

Speaker 2 Staircase is something else. You talked about staircase.

Speaker 1 That was Thomas Crown affairs. Or maybe history of violence, I'm thinking of.

Speaker 1 another very convincing sex scene perhaps on the staircase i just have an encyclopedic knowledge of staircase

Speaker 2 the fact check is just going to be a list of staircase

Speaker 1 one of my funniest moments with my oldest daughter thus far that has happened in the 12 years is i was like thomas crown affair i love that movie that snappy scene with the bowler hat she's gonna love this and i showed it to her when she was probably like eight And we're watching it.

Speaker 1 And I'm like, oh, I forgot about this fucking scene on the staircase with Renee Russo and Brosnan.

Speaker 1 And it's it's just going on forever and i'm like i wonder if she's gonna say anything and then she just goes do people really do that

Speaker 1 and i go have sex and she goes on the staircase and we go

Speaker 1 no exactly you know

Speaker 1 but in movies people are constantly they can't get up to the bedroom they can't even make it up there

Speaker 1 for the extra 20 feet

Speaker 1 well i want to add to there's a couple things you've said in the previous two interviews that really really stuck with me. That's crazy.

Speaker 1 I think about them often. I never expect anyone to think of anything I ever have said before.

Speaker 1 It was really aspirational. Like, some of you were talking about business managers or this or that.
And you said, like, I don't know if they've stolen from me. I mean, I hope they have.

Speaker 1 I hope they have. And I think it's half a joke and actually half insanely aspirational to not be so attached to it.
No, I still am like that. I'm a prime target for serious robbery and embezzlement.

Speaker 1 I've decided everything. You send me a docu site, I will send it back.
I hope they have because I still have no scrutiny.

Speaker 2 I have never read of a docu sign in my life. But it is aspirational.

Speaker 1 What I guess I've seen over time, and I'm just so not like this, money is a thing people really hoard and have a lot of pride in the money itself.

Speaker 1 And so want to turn their money into more money and love how much money their money is making them and how... profitable their money's money is.
And that is just like not how I think.

Speaker 1 I have no desire for my money to itself be out there working for me. It's an employee.
I don't view my money as lazy. I don't think of it like that at all.
And I get how people do it.

Speaker 1 Are you like that? I am. You love your money to make more money.
It's a thing people like. Mine's just a fear.
What are you afraid of? That you're going to run out of money? Yes. Yes.

Speaker 1 That's not a fear I have. I'm afraid I'm going to die with too much money.
That is my fear.

Speaker 2 You don't have children.

Speaker 1 I don't have children. And I'm afraid I'm going to die and be like, I'm going to have a fucking place.
stay shit. I'm going to die.

Speaker 1 I don't want to die with $10 million in the bank that I could have spent doing fun alive things. A jet to Paris on a whim.
Yeah, exactly. I'm going to look back.
You would never do that.

Speaker 1 You could have been jetting this whole time. I also have that fear.
I'm so nuts about it. And I'm such a hoarder.
And then I'm going to die.

Speaker 1 And I'm going to be like, all I see now is a bunch of trips I could have taken. Exactly.
Yes. That's more of the fear that I live off of.
So I was single mom. Money was tight.

Speaker 1 We were panicked about it. You guys weren't fucking rolling in cash.
Not at all. But was there no fear around it in the house?

Speaker 1 I actually remember as a young person being very concerned about the amount of money we had. And a lot of my friends had way more money.
Yeah, you also went to school where there was some.

Speaker 1 Yeah, so I went to a school that was way across town from where I lived. So I essentially was surrounded by much richer people than me.
And so it was something that I remember being worried about.

Speaker 1 But then I just... I mean, at a very young age, I started making pretty good money.

Speaker 1 And I remember being like 18 and my dad being like, in the last two years, you made more money than I have in my entire life put together, basically.

Speaker 1 If he lived this long off that amount of money, I'm sure I can live.

Speaker 1 And I think not having kids, I would imagine people seem to want to leave their kids money, I guess, which is, I guess, a good thing to do. And that's complicated in of itself.

Speaker 1 I'll tell you this much. I went into this going like, no, no, you don't give your kids money.
It ruins them and they need to be hungry and work and blah, blah, blah. I started feeling a little guilty.

Speaker 1 It's like. If I didn't get shit when I grew up, that'd be fine.
All of our family vacations were in a van eating caramels and we slept in the van.

Speaker 1 I I unfortunately have given them a lifestyle that they're going to feel like it's too late. Yeah, you can't really.
Oh, you can't go back from that. It's going to jump off a cliff.

Speaker 1 And I'm like, well, that wasn't very fair to them either. No, exactly.
So now what's the ethical thing I do? I don't know.

Speaker 1 Had I raised them like shit pigs like I was raised, then I would be like, cool. Yeah.
Had you just started like that? Yeah. If you had like another little house on this property that was bad.
Yes.

Speaker 1 Oh my God.

Speaker 2 That'd be hilarious.

Speaker 1 And we went on vacation. They didn't.
Yeah. You keep them in the bad house.

Speaker 1 and then when they get out of college and they can't go on vacation i'm like yeah that's normal but now the realization like you might not travel for 13 years yeah that's a hard kind of crazy yeah you can't go back i don't know i still kind of think it's a good idea to not give them anything what about when they're some amount but not too much spend it all

Speaker 1 do you want to go to paris tonight yeah exactly i was in a beastie boys video many many years ago and one of the things i remember is they were showing me pictures or something on one of their phones They had recently gone to Paris and there was all these pictures of them in an incredibly expensive menswear shop just in like ridiculous matching outfits.

Speaker 1 And they were like, oh yeah, every time we go to a foreign country like this, we all go buy funny matching tuxedos and stuff like that.

Speaker 1 And I was like, that's a good thing to do with your money. You'll never regret buying matching tuxedos with your three friends with top hats and canes and tails and going out on the track.

Speaker 1 You'll never regret that. You're rich.
That's a thing that is good to spend your money to.

Speaker 2 I'm struggling with this currently very much.

Speaker 1 How much money your money should be making. Yeah, mainly that.

Speaker 2 No, just kids versus

Speaker 2 feeling very free. I really, really like feeling very.

Speaker 1 Are you a married person?

Speaker 2 I'm not married and I don't have

Speaker 2 children.

Speaker 1 I literally have nothing except the house I'm building for me only. That's great.

Speaker 2 I mean, it does feel great, actually. But then I'm like, oh, am I going to regret it later? Or is it going to feel empty later? I mean, there's just so much that I struggle with.

Speaker 2 I like being able to go on vacation and do it up, fly first class, stay in the hotel.

Speaker 1 You're not worried if you're fucking your kid up.

Speaker 2 Exactly. I'm also very scared of that too.

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah. When I was young, we'd do these press tours and I'd be on like a private jet going to do press with a nine-year-old.

Speaker 1 And I'd just be like, this child is going to have a hard time coming back to Earth from all this. Exactly.

Speaker 1 It's harder than I anticipated, which is, well, I worked my whole life so I could fly first class. They're too young.
I got to be with them. So what the fuck am I going to do?

Speaker 1 I'm going to sit back in the exit row next to the toilet. No.
That feels unfair to me. It is unfair to you.
It's unfair to everybody. No one should have to do that.

Speaker 1 I re-listened to the second interview. I want to publicly apologize.
I was coming really hard at you about kids. And then I've censored other remarks you've made.

Speaker 1 And I certainly was a part of the problem. No, you were publicly.
I never did articulate what I was going for in that. I've never felt you needed to apologize for the record.

Speaker 1 Well, it was pretty full horror press. The real essence of it was, is I was like, like, you would be such a fun dad for me.

Speaker 1 Yeah. I would want to family.

Speaker 1 Sometimes you see people and you go like, that would be a very fun dad. He has the spirit to be a dad.
Ultimately, I think I was just trying to give you a compliment that you would be such a fun dad.

Speaker 1 Thank you. Being a good parent is nowhere on our list of reasons whether or not we would or would not have children.
I assume we'd be good parents.

Speaker 1 I know people who are so much fucking stupider who are good parents. Seriously.
I do think I would be a good parent, but I just don't think I want to be a parent. Yeah, yeah.
I love it.

Speaker 1 I heard you say something recently, and I was like, yeah, yeah, that's fucking ideal for him. And I should have shut up.
It was in the press recently. Him basically just saying that.

Speaker 1 We're having a great fucking time. And I don't feel like I've missed out.
And everything's groovy. Paraphrasing.
Things are good.

Speaker 1 This is a random question, but I think maybe because of our guest that came out today, which was Nikki Glazer, and we went through this whole thing where she had made some jokes about me and I was very, very sensitive.

Speaker 1 Really? Yeah, yeah. What did she say? No, it was great.
Everything's random. Did you have a show? We're out in the world.
She was going to make it in the Golden Gloves.

Speaker 1 And I I had found out that it was too hard for the Golden Globes. And I was like, oh, no.

Speaker 1 And then during the whole monologue, it was just one of those cameras was on us, and I was just waiting to have to fake some positive reaction to being shit on.

Speaker 1 And then so she didn't tell it there, but then she told on Stern the next morning.

Speaker 1 But then I purposely didn't want to hear it because I thought I'd made up these fucking jokes that were so mean to me. And I was kind of just devastated.
And then I heard the joke.

Speaker 1 It wasn't bad at all. And I was like, what a waste of my time.
Then we had her on. We talked about it.
It was so fun.

Speaker 1 But I think because she was the guest today and I posted and I was just reliving that whole thing, I was curious, are you sensitive? Like, I'm so sensitive.

Speaker 1 Yes, I am sensitive to people making jokes about me for sure. It's really hard.

Speaker 1 It's comedians I like. Yeah.

Speaker 1 It's happened a few times. Like when we made the interview, we kind of became open season because we were like the news to remind people North Korea hacked someone.
You hacked somebody.

Speaker 1 Biggest act of industrial espionage in history, I believe.

Speaker 2 It's kind of cool you were a part of that.

Speaker 1 That's a cool deathbed. It is.

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah, I fucked up world relations for a minute. Yeah.
Geopolitics. Like, I'm powerful.

Speaker 1 Well, that is another good lesson. You can hit the bullseye too effectively at times.
There was comedians that I like making jokes about us in the movie.

Speaker 1 Whenever they would make jokes that the movie sucked, that I just didn't like because that's all I care about. But again, you get over it.
And it's happened again.

Speaker 1 You've been obviously invited to all these rows. Yes.
Have you ever gone to one? Yeah. Nothing at those has ever really insulted me.

Speaker 1 I have like a pretty thick skin about because I also make jokes about other people all the time, especially in our movies. We make a lot of jokes about people.

Speaker 1 And I've had people come to me and been like, that wasn't great. Being in a theater full of people, having them laugh hysterically at a joke, making fun of me.

Speaker 1 And like I've received direct text messages from people being like, why would you do this? And I'm like, yeah, I get it. I'm sorry.
And I've gotten better.

Speaker 1 I have been in some situations recently where I was going to make jokes about certain people and certain things and had the foresight to ask the people beforehand as to whether or not they felt as though this would be in poor taste.

Speaker 1 And when it was told to me and no one searched that it would in fact be in poor taste, I was happy to not do the joke.

Speaker 1 And I know enough about myself now to know that I'm drawn in a bad way to the joke I shouldn't be making sometimes.

Speaker 1 And I get a kick out of

Speaker 1 saying the thing that I know I probably shouldn't. And it's not even always the funniest.
Sometimes it's very personal. Something it's just something I know I shouldn't necessarily be saying.

Speaker 1 I used to be much more inclined to do it.

Speaker 1 And because I think I wanted to show I would do it or I didn't care, or I thought it was just funny that I was treading into these waters that even if the average person didn't think they were taboo, like I knew in my head, I was like, oh, this is fucked up.

Speaker 1 It's like you're answering the calling to the commitment to comedy. Like in that moment, you elevate it.
Yep, I actually thought it was funnier. It's not even always funnier.

Speaker 1 It's just like a thing that I know I shouldn't be saying. It's a slippery slip.
This is terribly corny, but hurt people, hurt people. There is some reality.
And we even had fun talking with Nikki.

Speaker 1 It's like, the bottom line is I'm really sensitive. And because I'm really sensitive and insecure, I'm great at seeing other people's sensitivities and insecurities.

Speaker 1 So it's like you almost have to be. a little wounded to even know what to do.
Or sometimes you've just tread into an area where you are fodder for comedy, whether you like it or not.

Speaker 1 That's what it felt like with the interviewer. This is such a big story.
You have to make a joke about it. And I just got that.
People wouldn't be doing their job. Exactly.

Speaker 1 Like you'd feel as though you were ignoring a big thing that was happening

Speaker 1 if you didn't do it. And in those moments, are the feelings of a few more important than like addressing the elephant that all sees in the room.

Speaker 2 Like Diddy. I mean, it's not going to happen now that those jokes aren't going to pop up at the shows and stuff.
You're just like waiting for it. I know.

Speaker 1 And all I'm thinking is, how does Diddy feel?

Speaker 1 I know. That's what he's worried about.

Speaker 1 All I'm thinking is I'm watching this stuff. This guy is so watching these jokes.

Speaker 1 For all of his improprieties, he never really made fun of people.

Speaker 1 He didn't even earn this. He didn't deserve it.
That's not what his bag was. He wasn't out there shitting on other people.

Speaker 1 Stay tuned for more armchair experts.

Speaker 1 If you dare,

Speaker 1 we are supported by JCPenney.

Speaker 2 You know what's even better than getting compliments on your holiday outfit?

Speaker 1 Getting compliments on your holiday outfit that you got for way less than anyone would guess.

Speaker 2 Ding, ding, ding. Exactly.
I just hit up JC Penny for some holiday party looks. And let me tell you, the quality and style are great.

Speaker 2 I got this really gorgeous velvet blazer that everyone thinks was designer, but it's not, but it really looks luxe.

Speaker 1 Yeah. But you're sitting there like, oh, this JCPenney.

Speaker 2 It is really fun to see the look on people's faces when you tell them. And it's not just clothes.
Their home stuff is perfect for hosting.

Speaker 1 Plus, they've got gifts for everyone on your list that look so much more expensive than they actually are.

Speaker 2 Because when it comes to holiday gifts, it's what they think you spent that counts.

Speaker 1 Shopjcpenny.com. Yes, JCPenney.

Speaker 1 We get support from AG1. I'm always looking for ways to simplify my wellness routine without cutting corners.
That's why I've been drinking AG1 every morning for years. I love the taste.

Speaker 1 I love the simplicity. I love how I feel after I have my glass of AG1.
AG1 is a daily health drink that's basically replaced my entire supplement cabinet.

Speaker 1 75 plus vitamins, minerals, and whole food ingredients in one scoop. It supports gut health, gives me steady energy without crashes, and supports my immune health.

Speaker 1 Huge when I'm constantly around people for interviews. Less than three bucks a day doing the work of multiple supplements.

Speaker 1 With travel and holiday chaos, those antioxidants and functional mushrooms help my body stay resilient.

Speaker 1 You know, we had back-to-back Halloween, then I traveled to Palm Springs, hosted a birthday party, came back, and my first thought was like, ooh, I got to totally recharge. Went straight to the AG1.

Speaker 1 Head to drinkag1.com/slash stacks to get a free welcome kit with an AG1 flavor sampler and a bottle of vitamin D3 plus K2 when you first subscribe. That's drinkag1.com slash stacks.

Speaker 1 We are supported by Peloton. You know how life gets especially chaotic this time of year? Work, kids, trying to remember what day it is.

Speaker 1 For me, finding time to move can feel impossible, but that's where Peloton comes in.

Speaker 1 Peloton has completely reimagined cross-training with the new Peloton Cross Training Tread Plus, powered by Peloton IQ.

Speaker 1 It's Peloton's most elevated equipment yet, real-time guidance, endless ways to move, and it helps you get more done in less time.

Speaker 1 I like the time crunch aspect of it because sometimes I only got 20 minutes to squeeze something in. This is perfect.

Speaker 1 With Peloton IQ, you get personalized plans, form correction, and weight suggestions that help you train smarter and stay consistent no matter how busy life gets.

Speaker 1 Let yourself run, lift, sculpt, push, and go. Explore Explore the new Peloton Cross Training Tread Plus at onepeloton.com.

Speaker 1 We are supported by Allstate. You know what's smart? Checking Allstate first for a quote that could save you hundreds on car insurance.
You know what's not smart?

Speaker 1 Not checking your phone's volume before blasting your morning pump-up playlist in the office break room. Or not checking that your laptop camera's off before joining the meeting in your robe.

Speaker 1 Or something I'm a little too familiar with, not checking your grocery list before heading to the store and realizing you bought everything except what you needed. Yeah, checking first is smart.

Speaker 1 So check All State First for a quote that could save you hundreds. You're in good hands with Allstate.
Potential savings vary subject to terms, condition, and availability.

Speaker 1 Allstate North American Insurance Co. and affiliates, Northbrook, Illinois.

Speaker 1 Before we get to the studio, I just want to say I love the boys so much and I love Gen V so much. Oh, that's so nice.
How much time does that whole thing take up? I want it to go forever. I know.

Speaker 1 It would be great. They're doing the last season.
Oh, they are? Yes. But they're doing another show.
We've slowly become the thing we are making fun of, which is the Marvel Cinematic.

Speaker 1 Yeah, good, though.

Speaker 1 So we are doing another show that's like a prequel about the formation of Vought set in World War II with Soldier Boy and those characters.

Speaker 1 But it's a funny thing with the boys where me and Evan, it's a very well-run show. And the guy Eric Kripke, who runs the show, does such a good job that it makes it.

Speaker 1 It does not occupy very much of my time or energy. We were very involved in the very beginning of the show.
We like cast the show and kind of designed a lot of the uniforms.

Speaker 1 I would imagine you were taking all of your cultural capital and power at the studio to allow that tone to exist and be that bold.

Speaker 1 And then once that was achieved and rewarded, you could step away a bit. Well, it was also Amazon.
It was a good moment for us. We found ourselves at a place who was like looking for its identity.

Speaker 1 in some ways. They didn't have like a flagship show.
And so they kind of didn't know what it was. The people who are running it changed over in the midst of the time we were doing it.

Speaker 1 So I actually think we kind of just got lucky. No one had any reason to tell us no, basically.
They actually really believed in it. And our pitch was very clear.

Speaker 1 People want the R-rated version of Superman. Well, but maybe the X-rated.
Very much so.

Speaker 1 In a world that was like so inundated with superheroes, people will get such catharsis to see what this would kind of be like in real life and how gruesome it would be and how gross it would be.

Speaker 1 And I remember that was the thing we would always say in the pitch is just your whole life you've seen Superman Superman shoot lasers out of his eyes.

Speaker 1 You've never once seen how grotesque the effects of that would be on like an actual human's body. 6,000 degrees.
Exactly. And that was like a thing.
We were just like, that is what the show is.

Speaker 1 They really don't fight us very much on stuff on that show. From a content standpoint, I'm amazed at what they let us get away with.

Speaker 1 The reason I love it so much, and Kristen, I'll say this all the time, mid-sequence. We're like, I can't believe it's on television.
I mean, half the appeal is I can't believe it's on television.

Speaker 1 Yeah, and that's like our favorite tone and that's like a thing we've always chased it's a thing i was actually just talking to my wife about i actually think there's something about barry was a defining moment i could only speak personally but i do think it was a moment where I saw things in a movie where I was like, I didn't think you could show that.

Speaker 1 Putting calm in her hair. I always think of the first thing where you see his nuts and dicks stuck in the zipper.
It's so funny because you're just like, they don't show that.

Speaker 1 And the joke is they're not showing it. And it was still one of the funniest scenes ever, even though they aren't showing it.
And then they show it.

Speaker 1 And it was one one of those things where you're looking around in the theater at the people around you, strangers, and you're just like, are we fucking seeing this?

Speaker 1 Like, is this real? Are we actually in a theater where this is happening? We've seen throughout the years when our movies are functioning the best.

Speaker 1 That is a moment we've been able to elicit from a crowd. And that's like a thing me and Evan are always referencing.
It's not like laughter and it's not cheering.

Speaker 1 It's disbelief that people were allowed to do this thing and that also somehow it's actually serving the overall story and the movie and the comedy that's like the dragon we're chasing a lot of the time when the audience is just like are we fucking seeing this and yeah with the boys based on a comic and it was one of the first things me and evan read we were just like i can't believe someone even drew this okay so the comics are as the comics are even more hardcore oh they are i would say if anything we toned it down honestly and made it more comedic the comics are a little less comedic and are a little just dark and violent and gross.

Speaker 1 We added a slightly more human, you you know, like it's a little over the top with the blood and the popping of the human heads, which I think adds comedy to it. Yeah, definitely.

Speaker 1 It's so much fun to work on.

Speaker 2 I have a weird question. Were you attracted to dangerous things when you were young?

Speaker 1 Well, he's a karate master. Yeah, sort of.

Speaker 2 Well, that's controlled danger. I mean, like, that's type of danger.

Speaker 1 Yeah, because I played rugby. I wasn't adverse to danger and adrenaline.
As I've gotten older, I'm very adverse to physical danger. Just injury in any way.
Because of the Todd Phillips thing.

Speaker 2 Yeah, your comedy is dangerous.

Speaker 2 What you were just describing is the shock and awe and disbelief of, oh my God, we're going to do this, is bringing people along on a dangerous ride comedically, which always is the funniest, really.

Speaker 1 It is all in service of the audience. As a fan of movies, I've felt these moments where I'm like, oh, they're fucking going for it.
Yeah. Your novelty meter goes up.

Speaker 1 Like, oh, I'm going to actually see something new and original. Exactly.
Can you watch The Substance? I love that movie. That's so good.

Speaker 1 And that was one of those times, honestly, recently where I was like, holy fucking shit. I know Coralie a little bit and I think she's a genius.
Her first film, Revenge, is very, very good.

Speaker 1 I don't know if you've seen it. Have you recommended it? It's another 10 out of 10 movie.

Speaker 1 But in a movie that already showed me it's willing to go as far as anything, I never thought it would go this far. I loved it.

Speaker 1 It's almost more rewarding, I think, the older you get because it gets harder to do that to you. So yeah, I was sitting in the substance going like, here we go, man.
I'm 18 again.

Speaker 1 I feel like I was watching like Dead Alive or an old Sam Raimi movie or something like that, where you're just like, oh my God. Yeah, those were movies we love.

Speaker 1 Dead Alive, which is one of Peter Jackson's first movies.

Speaker 1 is this grotesque kind of horror zombie movie that is so gross and me and evan watch it and just be like oh my god this is what we're looking to

Speaker 1 yeah

Speaker 1 this is the stuff right here and evil dead and army of darkness in those movies they're so gross and funny it's amazing the two of you have been able to continue together and evan's had kids yeah they have really amazing yeah okay so before you came in It was told to me that you were hopeful I would watch all 10 episodes of the studio.

Speaker 1 It's always helpful. And I go, man, I love them.
But this is a tall order. That's five hours.
I watch the whole series.

Speaker 1 Like, normally I have to watch someone's movie or I watch an episode of two movies. Well, they're half hours.
They're half hours. But I'm like, man, I got to watch the whole series.

Speaker 1 So, of course, I go into it with a little like, oh, fingers crossed.

Speaker 1 From the bottom of my heart and sincerely, I have probably told 40 people all right. That's so nice.
How much I fucking love it. I watched two by myself.

Speaker 1 And then I said to Kristen, you've got to go watch these two and catch up because we're going now for the next five five nights. We're doing this show.
And then so she too is obsessed.

Speaker 1 I just plowed through it and I loved it. And I'm so glad I had all 10, to be honest.
But I don't know what part of your dick to start sucking first.

Speaker 1 I want to tease the tip a little bit more into it. The chap is calling my name.
That's why I do this.

Speaker 1 Holy fuck. I think the first thing I want to just say is the cinematic accomplishment, I did not see it coming.
And it's so fucking impressive.

Speaker 1 Let's go premise first just because I want to get to to the one or so bad. But hit me with the premise of the studio.
It exists in a world where there's just kind of one other studio in Hollywood.

Speaker 1 There's like Universal and Netflix and Columbia, and then there's Continental Studios, which in our world was founded 100 years ago.

Speaker 1 And it's in our Hollywood as we know it, except there's one other fictional studio, and every other movie exists. And there's the movies that this studio has made, basically.

Speaker 1 And in the pilot, my character who's worked at the studio for decades and has always wanted to run the studio and who loves films more than anything, finds himself to be the head of the studio.

Speaker 1 And it's really based on our dealings with studios. We've been producing a very long time and writing a long time.

Speaker 1 And honestly, this one sentence that was said to us by an executive many years ago was the kernel of the whole idea.

Speaker 1 We were getting notes on something and he goes, you know, I got into this job because I love movies and now it's my job to ruin them. And we were like, oh, wow.

Speaker 1 And that's honestly something we've seen a lot because we've befriended a lot of executives over the year. We've worked with great executives.

Speaker 1 Catherine O'Hara seems a little archetype of Amy Pascal a little bit. Inspired by her role in our lives, especially as like a mentor and someone who taught us a lot.
I adore her. Oh, she's the best.

Speaker 1 She watched the whole show. She was very nervous about it, but she loved it.

Speaker 2 Wait, Amy.

Speaker 1 Amy Penskell used to run Columbia Sony. And was sort of unceremoniously outstanding.
And unfairly. Yes.
Sort of in the wake of the interview. I would be lying if I wasn't.

Speaker 1 Her email was partially responsible for it all happening, which adds a layer to it all. Wow, okay.

Speaker 1 But since then, she's become a very successful producer and it's a much better job, but it's a hard transition, which is something we can deal with in the show. And can we talk for one second?

Speaker 1 Because for years, the president of the studio was a threatening figure for me. It was who I would have to really bow over and impress in a pitch to get them to buy it.

Speaker 1 And then to get it green lit was its own fiasco and so hard. And so I just had this weird relationship.
And then over the years, I've been able to step back.

Speaker 1 I imagine we feel the same way, which is might be the worst job in all of Hollywood. Exactly.
Anything you do could get you fired.

Speaker 1 So it's a constant dance of how much responsibility or ownership do I take over any given thing.

Speaker 1 Because you want to be associated with successes and not associated with failures, but you don't know which one is going to be which.

Speaker 1 There's countless movies that everyone wrote off as bombs that become huge hits and vice versa. Things that everyone's betting on as a huge hit that becomes a bomb.

Speaker 1 And also, art and commerce are obviously big themes in Hollywood and in our lives, I would imagine. And they are truly the inflection point of those things.

Speaker 1 And they really are the people who every day are faced with the choice of do I support creativity or do I mitigate risk and bet on commerce?

Speaker 1 These two actors I don't even want, no one agrees are good, but they're gonna secure me X amount for them. They have 50 million followers.
Exactly.

Speaker 1 Or you make the dumber version of the movie and the smarter version. And it's a very fear and panic-based job because you could actually lose your job at any moment.

Speaker 1 I've known people that run movie studios for like six months. 18 months.

Speaker 1 They're gone. They're never even there to see their movies come out.
No, or they don't do anything. That's That's actually a strategy a lot of people take is to do nothing.

Speaker 1 So you can't be blamed for it. A lot of people's strategies are to come in and to try to not make movies.
It's just an all-fear-run job. I started getting really empathetic and sympathetic.

Speaker 1 These people I used to kind of hate or was scared of. Now I'm like, oh my God.
It's like hard to fully villainize them once you get to know them. So it was during the pandemic.

Speaker 1 I re-watched the Larry Sanders show, which was one of my favorite shows ever when I was young. And I was just like, it'd be fun to do something kind of like this.

Speaker 1 What's my version of this type of character who's constantly at odds with what he wants to do and what his job is making him do? He wants to make art.

Speaker 1 He wishes he was Robert Evans in Robert Evans's time. Yeah.
No one is anymore. But a lot of studio heads are like that still currently.

Speaker 2 Sad. It really is.

Speaker 1 It's a bummer of a job. It's really sad, but it's funny.
It's like inherently was very comedic to us. We would constantly just see these people in these situations.

Speaker 1 where we're just like, thank God, this is them, because it's so fucked up.

Speaker 1 And a lot of it is also, they just want want famous people to like them and they just want directors to like them and they want writers to like them.

Speaker 1 And the writers and directors and actors just want something, such a transactional relationship. At best, they like you because you're giving them things.

Speaker 1 And at worst, they don't because you're not, or they just think you're a fucking idiot.

Speaker 1 And a lot of them just want to be like, if there's that group of people at the party talking, that's the filmmakers, they just want to be invited into that group.

Speaker 1 Well, the show starts with Seth's character, Matt. You're visiting Seth for the first time in Pete Berg's directing.

Speaker 1 I don't even think I've put it other than I've been directing a movie and the president stopped by, and I'm just panicked.

Speaker 1 I don't want him there because I'm afraid I'm going to do a bad job in front of him. I really underestimated how rough it is for the studio.
They often don't want you there.

Speaker 1 And I think that is palpable to them as well. And they just want to be there.
And they killed themselves for 30 years to get this job.

Speaker 1 And then they show up at their movie that they're financing and no one wants them there. It's really sad.
But you make yourself the joke of the whole movie, which is fantastic.

Speaker 1 Back to the sensitivity thing and who you can make fun of. I think it's very fair because you're the one who's probably most embarrassing in all these situations.
Oh, for sure.

Speaker 1 And it really is tapping into my own fears. I am a producer now.
I produce more things than I act in or write. I am often in the position where I'm like, am I making these things worse or better?

Speaker 1 Are people happy when I show up or are they bummed out when I show up? It's hard to know. It is hard to know.

Speaker 1 And a lot of the stuff that I wanted to write about and put into the show was my own feelings of insecurity just as someone who, at times, we are the people who decide which movies are getting made and which ones aren't.

Speaker 1 And we're betting on people and not other people. And we're casting people and not other people.
And it really is that fear that I'm ultimately mitigating risk as opposed to nurturing.

Speaker 2 It's weird to be on one side of the line and transition to the other side, identity. wise.

Speaker 1 That conflict is really something about like the character that I thought was very funny and interesting. I've put so much more work into this than anything I've done in a very long time.
It seems so.

Speaker 1 Yeah. And so I really knew I wanted to be a character that I thought I could perform in a funny way, but also

Speaker 1 really spoke to my own.

Speaker 1 Your struggle. You can say it.

Speaker 1 My struggle.

Speaker 1 Look for the German translation. But yeah, so all those things were really the reason that we made the show.

Speaker 1 So you get this job, but you make this Faustian deal right out of the gates with the chairman, Brian Cranston.

Speaker 1 He basically says, like, I will give you this fucking job if and only if you get on board with making this exciting new franchise, Kool-Aid. Yep.

Speaker 1 Oh,

Speaker 1 you fucking got a fucking movie on Kool-Aid. Yeah.
Which isn't even that nuts. It's not crazy.
It's like just enough to be something. It's like one degree stupid earth.

Speaker 1 Probably would make a great movie the more I watch the show.

Speaker 1 Well, what's funny is in the show, we come up with like a plot for the Kool-Aid movie and we really put a lot of thought into it. It's funny that I watched The Bear and I really like it.

Speaker 1 And that was something I would say a lot as we were making the show is like as seriously as they take cooking, is as seriously as we have to take filmmaking.

Speaker 1 We can't pretend that something would happen that wouldn't. And we can't present the audience with an idea that we are telling them people would be excited about.

Speaker 1 But in the back of your head, you know, they wouldn't make that fucking movie, or that cast wouldn't be exciting, or you wouldn't be nervous talking to this person. It has to feel real, also.

Speaker 1 Okay, so that's the premise. Ike Baron Holtz is one rung under Seth's character.
Yeah. And fucking

Speaker 1 couldn't love Ike more. Catherine Hahn is the head of marketing.

Speaker 2 These are all our favorite people.

Speaker 1 She's so funny. What a monster she is.
She's so fucking funny. Oh my God.
I've never really worked with her.

Speaker 1 I did like a live reading with her once a few years ago, and I just always been a fan of hers.

Speaker 1 It's funny because in the script, originally, that character was sort of like the straight person, the smartest in the room, the most buttoned up. And then she came in and was like, no.

Speaker 1 But also was like, that's not who the heads of all publicity are. They know everyone.
They're kind of in on influencer culture. They're so online.
Want to be the hippists in every single thing.

Speaker 1 These archetypes are pretty consistent through all the studios. Oh, they really are.
Sure.

Speaker 1 Building up to the show, we interviewed almost every person who runs a studio in Hollywood, almost every person who runs marketing for a studio in Hollywood, people who used to run studios.

Speaker 1 One of actually the resounding... Feelings from the marketing people was that they view themselves as more creative than the executives.
They're like, we actually make stuff. They do.

Speaker 1 We actually create things. We're making commercials, content.
We're thinking of posters. We're thinking of little ads.
These guys are just sitting in rooms fucking giving notes and shit like that.

Speaker 1 I'm sitting in front of an editing machine. They're the arbiters of good ideas and we are the creators of good ideas.
And so that was like a really funny dynamic. They have extreme ownership.

Speaker 1 They're incredibly confident in a lot of them, which is also like the dichotomy. A lot of the executives are sort of like me.

Speaker 1 They're kind of like nebbeshi Jewish people who are feigning confidence at best, but the marketing people come from sales. They have like a whole different energy.

Speaker 1 To defend them for a minute, because that other job is so terrible. They have nothing to do with what gets made.
They actually are on the green light committee at some of the stores. That's true.

Speaker 1 But most often, they are handed a movie. Their task was make everyone in America.
Well, they could have directly been overruled, is what happens a lot.

Speaker 1 Often they will have said, we should not make this movie.

Speaker 1 We cannot sell it. And then they're like, guess what? We did anyway.
And if it fails, you're the original.

Speaker 1 They got to polish a lot of turds. Yes, for sure.
That was just a very funny dynamic to add into the show. And Catherine O'Hare is on the show.
Catherine O'Hare, Canadian. Fellow Canadian, the legend.

Speaker 1 Canadian. Icon.

Speaker 1 Icon. She's just so fucking perfect and everything.
Okay, the episode that I have to imagine you feel proudest of, I can't stop talking about, is episode two. It's called The Wanner.

Speaker 1 That was a tough one. I don't want to give too much away, but I also want to whet people's appetite because it's an incredible accomplishment.
The episode's called The Wanner.

Speaker 1 It starts with you and Ike driving to visit Seth. We already know people do not want you to visit Seth.

Speaker 1 And the stakes couldn't be higher because Sarah pauly is directing a movie and they're getting a shot at magic hour which means you have this tiny window of 40 minutes of good light and then the shot's going to be the camera and it's going to do a one or we're never going to cut it has to be perfect and you guys decide to visit in that moment yeah tell people what a one or is it's a continuous shot like the most famous one probably it's like the one in goodfellas where they start outside the coca cabana and they go through the kitchen and they weave their way through and they drop the table and the comedian starts there's no cuts no cuts one long uninterrupted and everything has to be done perfectly yes you can't fuck up once there's no coverage for it it's a full commitment the very famous one in hit and run yeah

Speaker 1 very famous it's probably the second most famous one but by the way when you commit to one and it works the fucking exhilaration beats anything you can do on a second because it's a team sport everyone has to hit everything perfectly a lot of moving parts they're very hard and then the show is so menace so also they're acknowledging what masturbation a wonder is how no one notices how it's just for the filmmakers to get off on their own technique.

Speaker 1 Yes.

Speaker 1 I've even heard stories about people having the existing record on the monitor that they're trying to beat. That's funny.
Yes, yes, yes.

Speaker 1 Okay, so what's fucking impossible is the episode is also a wonder. In real life,

Speaker 1 the episode itself is a wonder about a wonder. And then all the things that are being laid out in the episode are just so fucking satisfyingly woven into the

Speaker 1 episode is a wonder? Yeah. Well, in the whole show, every scene is a wonder on the whole show.
There's a few episodes where it's maybe only four or five shots throughout the whole thing.

Speaker 2 For 30 minutes.

Speaker 1 Yeah, that is

Speaker 1 really impressive. But also, not only are they choreographing their own wonder, which is the episode, but there's also a real-life one-ner happening in the show.

Speaker 1 Jesus,

Speaker 1 no, it is so mighty scrambly.

Speaker 1 It's an insane accomplishment. Thank you.
Because it's not just the one-ner, it's the labor

Speaker 1 payoff. It's magic.

Speaker 1 holy did you direct it yeah we directed the whole show we wrote the show knowing it would be woners it wasn't like a thing we just decided when we showed up and for that episode especially we had to really block basically the entire episode and the days leading up to it but not with the actors so like me and evan who i direct with and the writers we only had access to this house for like two days before we started shooting it and so As they were rigging the house, we just would walk through it and really try to block it.

Speaker 1 What we would do is we could only actually shoot for around an hour a day because of the light. So we could only shoot between 5 and 6 p.m., basically.

Speaker 1 So everyone would show up in the morning and we would rehearse whatever that day's chunk was. And they were eight or nine minute chunks.
There's very little trickery in that episode. Oh, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 It seemed like you had three cuts. Yeah, exactly.
There's like three or four cuts total in the whole thing. Which you can't tell.
They're stitched beautifully. Chris and I, we were even arguing.

Speaker 1 I'm like, probably there was a hood mount on the car that was somehow easily detached. Yeah, it's exactly what it was.
Oh, thank God. I just won one arm.
You do visual effects to erase rigging.

Speaker 1 That's like a trick we would do. That's what Christian said.
Well, it'd be on the hood. There's a lot of sleight of hand involved.
This is a cinephiles fucking whack off section.

Speaker 1 We were geeking out. It was so fun for us.
It was just like the opposite of how we were always brought up making movies. It was always about two cameras, improv.
We'll figure it out editorially later.

Speaker 1 We were like, what if we do the exact opposite and we are painting ourselves into this corner that we cannot paint ourselves out of? Because there's 15 actors in that episode that all have lines.

Speaker 1 If one person forgets their lines, it's scary. Nine minutes into a take, it's back to the car.
Oh, the Golden Globe one was the hardest because of the amount of people.

Speaker 1 That has a lot of long shots in it, but there's also 400 extras in every single scene. So my question about that episode is, did you guys piggyback on when the show was actually?

Speaker 1 No, we created our own.

Speaker 1 That's another episode we shot at four days because we couldn't have that room for very long. And we had to load in and load out in the same week.
But no, we threw the Golden Globe.

Speaker 1 No, it's a full Golden Globe. So that shows has to be functioning as a real Golden Globe show in the background.
Oh, yeah.

Speaker 1 We had to cast so many people and the choreography of it was unbelievably complicated.

Speaker 1 But it's funny because as we were doing it, we're like, I don't even know if the average person will be able to articulate what is happening here.

Speaker 1 The energy of it, I think, is what we were excited about. Well, okay.
So another achievement of the show is you have fucking plot. A lot of comedies really don't have plot.
They don't have an engine.

Speaker 1 And these fucking episodes, every one of them are so stressful. The tension is thriving throughout the whole show.
And that's because of the wonders. Yeah, it's because you're never cutting.

Speaker 1 And I think it's also because it never settles into a rhythm of cutting back. There's no breathing between two people.
We were always like, the tone should be stress and panic. It is.

Speaker 1 And there's only A stories in the episode, which I think was also conducive to that.

Speaker 1 type of storytelling is we're never cutting between you set up my story and I'm doing this thing and you set up Mike's story, and he's doing this thing.

Speaker 1 The stories are all singular, and so that also helps with the singular camera and the singular style of being in the room with the characters. From like a writing standpoint, you know, it's funny.

Speaker 1 I did these table reads, it's actually where I met Catherine Hahn for the Netflix is a Joke Festival a few years ago. We did a live reading of Seinfeld scripts.
Oh, I remember this.

Speaker 1 I was Jerry, and Aziz Atzari was George, and Jack Black was Kramer, and Catherine Hahn was. Oh, my God, I can't do it.

Speaker 1 And I feel like in reading them, it was like the Rosetta Stone Stone or something like that. It's all the structure.
Math. And it's not even the jokes.

Speaker 1 It's the order of the scenes and the raising of the stakes. That to me is what I would want to do with the show.
It's like true situational comedy.

Speaker 1 And then also the score, you have this like chaotic jazz, and that's fucking nerving you up. No, it's like never rhythmic.
That's what we'd always tell the composer.

Speaker 1 We're just like, never have it settle into a rhythm. Whenever it feels rhythmic, it would get boring.
Always make it a little off and uneasy. It really is stressful.

Speaker 1 So driving home the night of the episode, The Wanner, did you get a burst of elation?

Speaker 1 I was pretty happy. You could also watch it the next day.
You don't have to wait for an editor to assemble it. Yeah, exactly.
I was honestly really nervous about how we were shooting the show.

Speaker 1 And I would talk to my wife Lauren a lot about it. I talked to Evan a lot about it.
The first few weeks, especially, I was just like, are we fucking up? Are we making a mistake?

Speaker 1 Are we so up our own fucking asses with this that we're just sacrificing comedy? That was my real fear. I was like, are we making it less funny in service of this style?

Speaker 1 And I kept being like, no, I really think we thought of this because it would be additive to the tone and the comedy. And then I saw it cut together and I was like, thank fucking God.

Speaker 1 And I was so excited about it, so happy by it. And yeah, when we finished the Wonder episode, I was really happy.
And Sarah Pauley is someone I've known a very long time.

Speaker 1 I was in a movie she directed 15 years ago or something like that. And she's such a funny person and such a funny actor.
Go was one of Mina and Evans' favorite movies. It was inspirational to us.

Speaker 1 It's a wild and frenetic

Speaker 1 Exactly. I think Pineapple Extress is very inspired by Go.
And Dawn of the Dead. I was just always a huge fan of hers.
And then I worked with her.

Speaker 1 And I'm just like, she's one of the funniest fucking people I've ever been around.

Speaker 1 But again, you have a non-actor in this kind of high-stakes situation where she's going to have to hit all of her beats really well. She like nailed it.
She couldn't have been funnier.

Speaker 1 Yeah, that was the thing with the show. We have a lot of non-actors on this show, filmmakers, writers, directors.

Speaker 1 That was another fear I had where it's like, we're taking these non-actors and essentially asking them to do like the hardest kind of thing you can do as an actor.

Speaker 1 Now you got to be a part of this seven-minute scene. Yeah, a play.
You literally say one word wrong. We have to start over.
And we got a 50-minute reset. Sometimes, yeah.

Speaker 1 Literally, we got to get back in the car.

Speaker 2 This is so sad.

Speaker 1 Try back up the block. You're breaking shit all the time.

Speaker 1 I'm following those stunts in the show.

Speaker 1 So what you were saying, it did become like a real team effort. And those are also my least favorite moments on sets often is just you're sitting on an Apple box.

Speaker 1 The crew guys are on their phone because it's just, okay, now it's this shot. Now it's this shot.
One out of 200 people feel like they're working. And that's kind of the person who's on camera.

Speaker 1 Then I've been in some movies. I got to be in a Steven Spielberg movie.
And he had these very elaborate shots sometimes where it was like, oh no, it's all going to play in this one shot.

Speaker 1 And I would just see how the whole crew would come together and be so psyched about it. You're right.
People rarely all do their job at the same time.

Speaker 2 Exactly. That's why people like doing theater because it's everyone coming together.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 And in this, even if you had two lines in the scene, it was so fun.

Speaker 1 You didn't feel like you were just window dressing dressing or just waiting for your part you were part of a huge scene and that was another reason that it was partially procedurally alluring to us yes so i think there's a lot of ways you can be a good director i really i think have grown a better understanding of what is needed to accomplish these things and how much time it'll actually take and how much preparation it will actually take and so we're very prepared and it would get very discouraging at times this shooting style where we would joke often that until sometimes like the seventh eighth ninth tenth take of these long sequences it's just not even fucking close and we would be looking at each other being like is this the one that like we can't do and sometimes it's just the camera has to like latch on to the car and the fucking magnet keeps fritzing out we're relying on technology to do what we want that isn't as reliable as you would hope it is sometimes and sometimes it's just an actor keeps like missing the thing or tripping over the thing

Speaker 1 imagine if you fucked up your line twice no i feel comfortable saying saying this because he's my dear friend, but David Krumholtz is in a few episodes of the show.

Speaker 1 And there's a very complicated sequence of me entering the Golden Globes. It literally starts in the limbo, and then I walk the whole red carpet, and then I walk through the

Speaker 1 new joke. He's got to hate you.
Exactly. And then I walk through the ballroom.
I'm interacting with a bunch of people throughout it: Adam Scotson and Ike and Ohera and all these people.

Speaker 1 And the last moment is me and Crumbholtz. And it's like a three-line exchange.
And there's 500 extras, cars, limos, all this shit.

Speaker 1 And he's just got nine minutes sitting in a chair waiting to fuck up and fly.

Speaker 1 Exactly. More and more nervous.
He sees the machine like coming towards him. He's like, you're not holding his side somewhere.
Yes. You like seeing the train rolling down the tracks.

Speaker 1 And I will say, God bless him because I would tell the actors, look, if you genuinely think you've thought of something that is better than what we've written or additive and it comes to you in the moment, I want you to do it because I don't want it to be too rigid and I want it to feel alive.

Speaker 1 But just know if it's not good, it's fucked up everything. Workshop it in the mega trailer.

Speaker 1 I'm trusting you to gauge in your own head whether or not you think I will think it's good enough. Oh my God.
To warrant this risk you're taking. And James several times was just improvising stuff.

Speaker 1 And even he would do it. We would cut and he would just look at my face and be like, I should have said that.

Speaker 1 He is one of my favorites and he's spectacular in your show. He's so good on the show.
He's one of the best. And then he he nailed it.

Speaker 1 I think some of our moments are some of the best moments of the show. And we would put him in it more after that because it is so alive and you do feel like, I don't quite know what he's going to do.

Speaker 1 And at its worst, the show, in the earlier takes, that was always to me the scary zone is we would start to get it, but it would just feel sort of rigid because everyone was too focused on hitting the mark and the timing and the camera in the wrong place.

Speaker 1 And that's why it's good to have agents of chaos like Dave in there.

Speaker 1 In some ways, just can't say the lines the same way twice.

Speaker 1 And Han was like that too she would just say other stuff and you could see there's like a moment where everyone's like oh no is this gonna cause a major problem but then that becomes its own fun thing for you to play with right very much like you're scared the whole time characters are actually stressed out

Speaker 1 actually like quite on edge that we're not gonna get oh there's something so kids in a playground about it that's what was also fun about it it's like it is how kids film things you just point the camera at who's talking and you walk around and that's it and so there is that energy it did feel a lot like that it's a cool way to keep your self-interested yeah year 30 it's like you gotta first do something to wake yourself up no definitely i'm afraid of the next show you do

Speaker 1 underwater what are we gonna do you know what i heard it's impossible it's underwater in space

Speaker 1 stay tuned for more armchair expert

Speaker 1 if you dare

Speaker 1 We are supported by ServiceNow. You know what I love? Not having to do boring, repetitive stuff.

Speaker 1 I want to focus on the interesting conversations, the creative work, the things that really matter to me. And apparently, that's exactly what ServiceNow does for entire organizations.

Speaker 1 AI is only as powerful as the platform it's built into. Here's the thing.
ServiceNow has basically become the operating system of AI.

Speaker 1 Instead of Frankensteining together different tools, ServiceNow unifies people, data, workflows, and AI, connecting every corner of your business.

Speaker 1 That's why it's no surprise that more than 85% of the Fortune 500 use the ServiceNow AI platform. We're talking HR, customer service, every department you can think of.

Speaker 1 And here's what's cool: they got Idris Elba as their brand ambassador.

Speaker 1 I mean, come on, if you're going to have someone represent your company, might as well be the guy who's basically the CEO everyone wants to be, right?

Speaker 1 With AI agents working together autonomously, anyone in any department can focus on the work that matters most. Learn how ServiceNow puts AI to work for people at servicenow.com.

Speaker 1 We are supported by Quince. So I'm standing in my closet the other day and I realize I'm reaching for the same three things over and over again.

Speaker 1 And they're all coming from Quince, which got me thinking, when did I become that guy who actually cares about where his clothes come from? I'll tell you when, when I discovered Quince.

Speaker 2 Exactly. I was at a happy hour a couple of days ago with a very cool woman named Margo, very chic.
And I was like, ooh, I love your pants. I love your sweater.
And she said, Quince. Boom.

Speaker 2 And I was like, I should have known.

Speaker 1 Should have known. Turns out Quince cracked the code on something I didn't even know was broken.
They partnered directly with these ethical factories, cut out the middlemen.

Speaker 1 So you get the same Mongolian cashmere that costs 200 bucks elsewhere, 450. Same quality, none of the markup.
Perfect timing too, because holiday shopping is coming.

Speaker 1 And I actually have good answers for once. Not just clothes either.
They've got home stuff, travel gear, all of it. Give and get timeless holiday staples that last this season with Quince.

Speaker 1 Go to quince.com slash DAX for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too.
That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash DAX. Free shipping and 365 day returns.

Speaker 1 Quince.com slash DAX.

Speaker 1 We are supported by Credelio Quattro. Every dog deserves to enjoy the outdoors and be protected from dog parasites.

Speaker 1 Credelio Quattro offers the broadest parasite protection of its kind by covering six types of parasites in one monthly flavored chewable tablet, fighting ticks, fleas, heartworm disease, roundworms, hookworms, and tapeworms.

Speaker 1 Woof. Other products say they're all in one, but Credelio Quattro is the only monthly chewable tablet of its kind that covers three species of tapeworms.

Speaker 1 And it's flavored, which means your dog might actually like it. Whether you're going on a hike or just in the backyard, you can help protect your best buddy.

Speaker 1 Talk to your vet if your dog has a history of seizures or neurological disorders. Visit quattro dog.com for more info.
Ask your vet about Credelio Quattro. That's quattro dog.com to learn more.

Speaker 3 For full safety information, side effects, and warnings, visit CredelioQuattroLabel.com. Consult your vet or call 1-888-545-5973.

Speaker 1 This message is brought to you by AppleCard. It's a great time to apply for an Apple Card.
You'll love earning up to 3% unlimited daily cash back on every purchase and no fees, period.

Speaker 1 Through this special referral offer, when you get a new Apple Card, you can earn bonus daily cash. To qualify, you must apply at apple.co slash get daily cash.

Speaker 4 Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City Branch. Variable APRs for Apple Card range from 17.99% to 28.24% based on credit worthiness.
Rates as of October 1st, 2025.

Speaker 4 Offer may not be available elsewhere. Terms and limitations apply.

Speaker 1 Me and Evan, we kept saying as we were doing it, we're like, this is one of the most creatively invigorating things we've done since we made Super Bad.

Speaker 1 Yeah, how long did it take you from start to finish writing it and then shooting it and finishing it? I was shooting the Fablemans when I first... thought of it.

Speaker 1 So that was two and a half years ago or something like that. And then it maybe took six months for us to start writing it.

Speaker 1 And then I think it took like a year of writing because we wrote the whole show, basically, and then we shot the whole show. So not that long, actually, like on the grand scale of things.

Speaker 1 No, with how intricate it is and how well done it is. Any amount of time would not have shocked me.
Yeah. Okay.
I hope you're able to do this. So.

Speaker 1 The fucking appearances are one after another. Like Martin Scorsese's in it.
Steve Buscemi. Ron Howard's in it.
Shirley's Thrones in it. Zach Effron's in it.
Olivia Wilde's in it. Ice Cube's in it.

Speaker 1 It never stops. And when I'm watching that, I'm so happy for you because to me, that is this crazy reflection of what you've built.
You can call Martin Scorsese and he'll show up and do your thing.

Speaker 1 You call his manager.

Speaker 2 Ultimately, he has to be able to do that.

Speaker 1 I've never met Martin Scorsese before. There's a lot of accomplishments on display.
There's the technical accomplishment. There's the writing.

Speaker 1 There's the life story of you and Evan, but also there's the goodwill. Yes, what you've built goodwill-wise.
Really, it's all there. Part of my whole thesis in general is to try to over-deliver.

Speaker 1 I don't take any success for granted. When we made This at the end and all these things, we were just like, give people more than they're expecting.

Speaker 1 Don't tell them it's Hollywood and then have a few people and try to sell that as Hollywood.

Speaker 1 So that was something for us that was very important is we were like, if it's going to be about Hollywood, you have to believe that these are the people a studio head would be excited by, intimidated by, wanting to impress, wanting to befriend the actual people who.

Speaker 1 are in movies and we're not trying to tell you yeah this guy's in a movie this is the tom cruise of this show Exactly. We really didn't want to do that.

Speaker 1 And Larry Sanders, again, was a thing that was hugely inspirational for that because as a kid, I remember Sean Penn's on it and Jim Carrey's on it and Tom Petty's on it and Elvis Costello's on it and all these great comedians and actors are on it.

Speaker 1 And I was like, that's part of the fun of it. They got them and it feels real as a result.

Speaker 1 There's so many that Kristen said to me mid-episode, do you ever start feeling offended you're not in something?

Speaker 1 The whole time you're just like, I just hope this this is easier the second season she's also an acting robot she would have killed those waters she's built for a winner also we didn't want to only do people that we know and that we work with and they're kind of like associated with us and it was kind of like a mix of people that we didn't even know that well yeah do you have a relationship with scorses i met him once for two seconds before this it was a cold call we really tried to make the roles good honestly that was like a big part of it was even if you had one joke we wanted it to be like a great moment and to not feel like like you're just kind of there.

Speaker 1 And they're not just like extras in the scene. Everyone has to have a moment that they can really sink their teeth into, but it was really hard.
And we spent a ton of time.

Speaker 1 rewriting the scripts for people. They want it to be good.
And once they commit to it, they're like, okay, what if I do this? And what if that? And it was always very welcome.

Speaker 1 Everyone that came had some leverage. Everyone has leverage.
You want them to think it's funny. And that's the other thing is we're always just like, we want you to be excited about this.

Speaker 1 Like we don't want you to feel like you're doing us a favor. We want you to feel like you're getting to do a thing that you think is cool.

Speaker 1 It was by far one of the biggest challenges of the show was to get all these people and to schedule it and to not let them down, honestly.

Speaker 1 Did you find it hard to direct these huge people where you're like, oh, fuck, I gotta see? The answers, yes.

Speaker 2 I could tell Martin Scorsese what to do.

Speaker 1 It was different. Talking to the actors is the thing I struggle with most as a director.

Speaker 1 And it's also because I'm an actor in the scenes, and some actors just don't like to be directed by the other actors. Me and Olivia Wilde were talking about it.

Speaker 1 Me and Evid would kind of do like a good cop, bad cops thing. I would be in the scenes and be like, great, perfect.
And then I'd go to Evan and be like, tell her to slow down.

Speaker 1 She's not hitting her mark. She's not saying this life properly.
And she actually was the only one that clued into it. But it's really hard.

Speaker 1 I had to do a thing with Michael Penou, and I didn't figure this out until like two weeks into shooting because we're in every single scene together and I'm directing it.

Speaker 1 And about two weeks in, it occurred to me. He doesn't hear me give myself a note.
All he hears is me say something to him. So like two weeks in, I go, I need you to know.

Speaker 1 After these takes, I go like, that was too slow. I got to speed it up.
I give myself notes and then I come to you. I just want you to know, I don't think I'm doing it perfectly.
I'm berating myself.

Speaker 1 And then I go on to you. I would have a hard time doing it alone.
Having a partner makes it much easier, I think, in a lot of ways. Because they got to be a little suspicious.

Speaker 1 Like, how the fuck's he know what happened? He's inside the scene with me. A thing that would happen is the people I was in the scenes with could tell when I just was dropped out of it.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 Because I was also very aware where the camera was and what it was capturing at all times. So there'd be times I would just see, like, oh, the camera guy, he just missed it.

Speaker 1 You started talking too soon. So that's easy to call cut on.

Speaker 1 But I think the thing that would be hard, how on earth did you manage when someone did a shitty delivery of a line minute one of a five minute one or did you go like, oh, I'll just go through to the end or will I just be brave right now and say cut?

Speaker 1 It depends what take it was. Cause also you got to navigate just stop bumming people out.
Yes. And that's something me and Evan talked a lot about.

Speaker 1 And that's something we actually learned a lot in improvisational comedy is. It's a fine line between directing improv and just shutting people down.

Speaker 1 Sometimes we would let people go on these runs for 10 minutes where we're just like, this isn't going to mean the fucking movie. But like, they seem to really think funny.

Speaker 1 We'll get 10 other good things out of them today because we didn't tell them this.

Speaker 1 Basically, yeah. And so that was math that would happen in our heads.
Sometimes it was a hard reset.

Speaker 1 I would stop early because I would just know, like, oh, once this happens, it's going into a new zone. But that was something we were constantly navigating.

Speaker 1 Well, this is the most I've ever talked about a show when someone was promoting a show, but I have still a couple more questions. Great.

Speaker 1 One is the other thing that I became hyper-aware of is your own aesthetic, or at least what I think is your aesthetic, is really on fire. Every single house we go to

Speaker 1 is an architectural masterpiece.

Speaker 2 I complimented Seth's outfit when he got here. Very nice.
Are those bottega shoes?

Speaker 1 They are. Yes.
Yes. Very nice.
It's like a little style boy.

Speaker 2 You can do that when you don't have kids. You can spend all your money on clothes.

Speaker 1 Couches and clothes. It's a thing I'm like sort of making fun of myself with.
I like all that stuff.

Speaker 1 And then, of course, for me, I got hyper-focused on all the cars. So every episode, Matt Remick is driving a different 60s

Speaker 1 or

Speaker 1 there's an MG, then there's an old Merck, then he's in a 53 vet. You don't have a car thing, though, do you? I do like old cars, but I don't have like a collection of old cars.

Speaker 1 Do you have any old cars? I have a Carmen Guilla. That's perfect for you.
Yes, yeah. I have a Studebaker Lark.
Not the one in the show, but I have one like that one that we drive in the Wonder.

Speaker 1 Have you ever an Avante? Yeah, those are amazing. I like those.
Oh, I'll add to the complexity.

Speaker 1 He's driving these old fucking 70-year-old cars that are are all stick shifts up, even in the Wonder episode. Getting in the driveway for real.
I'm starting thinking, he's got his hands full.

Speaker 1 He's directing this thing. I was just driving that.
And I'm driving so fast in that episode. Ike was so scared the whole time we were doing it.
And you know the look on your face when you drive.

Speaker 1 Ike started clocking. You almost like lick your lips as you're navigating.
There's a giant fucking camera. You can't see.

Speaker 1 You're in an irreplaceable car. If you fuck it up, you're down for the day.
It's when we made this at the end, honestly. We were designing the house for the movie to be set in.

Speaker 1 And at first, the joke was like, it's a douchey over the top overly stylish house and by the end i was just like oh no i just made my dream house yes yeah you're like nancy myers in this way it worked in both ways though to the average viewer it was a douchey over the top house and to me it was my dream house and so that philosophy carried through me and haven't joked about a lot a lot of my memories in hollywood are being in beautiful places with beautifully dressed people screaming at each other about the stupidest shit ever.

Speaker 1 And that was like an energy we wanted to capture.

Speaker 1 It's glamorous and it's institutional and it's been here for decades and great architects have built these homes that people live in and they're these beautiful homes.

Speaker 1 And then you're in there just like screaming at each other about like how much of the guy's balls you can show in the street.

Speaker 1 Amy Pascal, this like. gorgeous architectural house and the studios are very beautiful.
Is this real? No, we built that completely.

Speaker 1 Okay, I got really angry because we're watching it and you seem to be on Warner Brothers for lots of this show.

Speaker 1 And there's a Frank Lloyd Wright building. In the show, the ideas that Frank Lloyd Wright designed the main offices in the Mayan period are exactly.
It's like Mayan Revival.

Speaker 1 So I was like, I fucking worked on that lot for two years and I'm

Speaker 1 not sure what to do with that.

Speaker 1 I was angry. I was beating myself up for having missed that.
So that's entirely fabricated. Entirely fake.
Thank God.

Speaker 1 Because I could see where it was positioned and I was like, it's where the Warner Brothers.

Speaker 1 You can kind of buy into it. It's like, oh, yeah, I could see that.
It was part of the idea of making it seem like old and monumental. A lot of these studios are gorgeous.

Speaker 1 The Paramount offices are beautiful. The Columbia offices are these like Art Deco marvels.
So much artistic thought went into the building. And then inside, they're making

Speaker 1 decisions of all time. They're so bucking against any creative freedom as they're standing in these like cathedrals of cinema that people were given free reign to make beautiful.

Speaker 1 But I'm just a huge architecture fan and I love Frank Lloyd Wright buildings in LA especially.

Speaker 1 And they are all this Mayan Revival, but there's a great documentary about Frank Lloyd Wright and it talks about how all of his buildings in los angeles are essentially uninhabitable because he had suffered like a terrible family tragedy before he came to la and they are all very tomb-like this one right down the street the uh black dolly house yeah exactly constantly being rented they have like a sarcophagus-esque vibe to them and to us that was a funny work environment for a lot of reasons because it feels very old and it feels like we're trying to uphold this days that have gone by institution we're like encased in this tomb basically a big cement blob but it's also kind of beautiful and all the houses in the show are John Lautner houses, who is a student of Frank Lloyd Wright.

Speaker 1 A lot of his houses are in movies. In Lethal Weapon 2, the Garcia house is a John Lautner house.
So, yeah, we also like this idea that it was an architect whose work is in film.

Speaker 1 And a lot of the music in the show is from other movies. Chinatown.
Yeah, we use the Chinatown square. We use the long goodbye music.

Speaker 1 I also started adding up your budget as I was watching it, but he got a nice

Speaker 1 pretty good

Speaker 1 show. The tech company

Speaker 1 keep buying those iPhones.

Speaker 1 Exactly, right?

Speaker 2 I always ask this when we have people on who are infrared of partnerships where one person's more of the days. And shame with Ike and Dave.
Has there ever been tension there?

Speaker 1 He doesn't get it. It occurred to me on this interview, Monica.
I was like, it's time the next time somebody's going to be able to get it. We need to have

Speaker 1 it. Yeah, wouldn't we be up for that? Totally.
I was like, is it starting to feel immoral for us to not include Evan? Whenever I'm on Howard Stern, he's also fascinated with Evan.

Speaker 1 And he's always like, what is his deal? Yeah. The fact that Evan has no desire to be in front of the camera, I think, is an instrumental part of our dynamic.
And that he is not jealous.

Speaker 1 If anything, he's like, I'm so glad I don't have to do it. I'm doing all the stuff that I have to do as the performer in the things.

Speaker 2 Because sometimes that gets tricky. I mean, we had also Phineas with Billy, obviously.
He's like, how are you guys doing it in a way that, but some people just don't care.

Speaker 1 But it's also reflective of us personally. Well, yeah, of course I find it.

Speaker 1 Of course, I find it interesting.

Speaker 2 It's not that easy for us. It's a little more complicated, I think.

Speaker 1 I know so many partnerships that have broken up over the years and more than haven't, actually. Right.
I know a lot of teams that have split up.

Speaker 1 We had a therapist actually say to us, we were producing a show.

Speaker 2 Things are getting real hairy for a second there.

Speaker 1 She looked at us and she said, you guys are in the Beatles. Look what you guys get to do and what you make.
Don't break up. Don't fuck up.

Speaker 1 It's really great. Thank you for saying that out loud.
Yes.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 It's true. But when you're in it, you can feel like, I'm not getting this recognition or I'm not getting this.
I could see for Evan or Dave or for Phineas, like, no one knows what I'm doing.

Speaker 1 Maybe they can do it. It's interesting because Phineas doesn't have that.
Some people have it. He knows damn well what he's doing.
Yeah, Evan too. He doesn't care at all.

Speaker 1 He does get a lot of credit for so honestly. I'm sure he's got a really nice house.
Great. Yeah.
Yeah. He'll probably leave his kids some money.
Exactly.

Speaker 2 Well, Phineas said something really interesting. He said, actually, I get attention, but it matters that Billy gives me the recognition.
If she wasn't doing it, then yeah, I'd have a problem with it.

Speaker 2 If within the partnership, there wasn't that acknowledgement.

Speaker 1 Definitely. I feel very fortunate about it.
And it's not lost on us. We recognize it.
We are like, isn't it great that we still like each other and we still work together well?

Speaker 1 And his life is very different than mine in many ways. And we've found ways to navigate that.
You know, he has kids and I act sometimes.

Speaker 1 We both have things that pull us away from just writing and directing together, but we've never really had any issue.

Speaker 1 i feel very lucky about it it's very fortunate okay last question in the show you're acknowledging the real context of our industry which is like movies are harder and harder to get to make money it's just gotten more stressful they make less movies less of them work the whole thing's terrifying yep you perfectly pivoted into tv

Speaker 1 And I wonder, do you consciously do that or did it just accidentally happen? When I look at a lot of your peers, you somehow went perfectly into doing virtually what you were doing in movies and TV.

Speaker 1 It was sort of conscious. I think what's good is we are also able to keep making movies just in a different way than we did before.

Speaker 1 Yeah, but like making a $30 million comedy that's going to make $120,000. That's just off the table.

Speaker 1 Ninja Turtles to us is a movie that we can write that's like a high school comedy that is really fun and we love it.

Speaker 1 But in order to make that movie now, it has to be Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles movie.

Speaker 1 And it's a lot of ideas that we would put into any movie, but it's just like, oh. Or Barbie for me.
That's a comedy. That's a straight-up comedy.

Speaker 1 I think we've always been realistic as to what the market wants and can bear. We may knocked up and super bad, but very quickly we were like.

Speaker 1 We got to add machine guns and car chases to this shit or it's going to start to feel the same.

Speaker 1 And after that, we're like, oh, we got to add like demons and monsters and meta celebrity in order for this to feel new and relevant.

Speaker 1 I don't know if we've ever spent that much time lamenting the trends and instead have tried to really see what is working and work through that.

Speaker 1 So with television, that for sure was like a conscious thing. We're like, oh, now you can do shit in television that used to be the stuff we did in movies.
It's different, but it's kind of the same.

Speaker 1 Yeah. Now on the other side of all of it, and as much as I lamented the disappearance of all that and I suffered, I've made movies that didn't work in this fucking era.
I also recognize I...

Speaker 1 I'm so glad The Boys isn't a movie. Yeah.
So on the other side of it, have you found making TV is just as fun or even more? I mean, we had so much fun with this show.

Speaker 1 I've always been able to really wrap my head around writing movies.

Speaker 1 And I think writing TV and movies are very different, as is evidenced by the fact that there are brilliant TV writers who write terrible movies and brilliant movie writers who make terrible TV shows.

Speaker 1 They are not the same skill set.

Speaker 1 And I actually did always find I struggled to be a meaningful contributor on a lot of our TV shows because I think the thing that I had a hard time wrapping my head around was this seven-hour movie idea.

Speaker 1 And then with the studio, one of the big revelations for me was like, no, it is not a serialized show. It's very episodic.
Oh, I can actually really wrap my head around one 30-minute movie, basically.

Speaker 1 Something with a beginning, middle, end, a setup, and a payoff. That's the thing that is exciting about television is you can sort of create your own type of narrative and they're just much more open.

Speaker 1 to risk.

Speaker 1 I mean, in the 80s, maybe this would have been a movie in the 70s, but this was conceived of for TV, knowing this is not at all the type of thing that they would make into a movie, but this is exactly the kind of thing that they would make into a well-budgeted TV show.

Speaker 1 But we still have movie ideas. We are working on movies and we would like to keep making movies, but we just try to be realistic.
I saw one of them days with Kiki

Speaker 1 and Sizza, yeah, and it was fucking hilarious and it did well. R-rated comedy, I saw it in the full theater and I was like, it works.
It can still work.

Speaker 1 I just saw Judd give an interview where he was saying, like, if the hangover came out today, it would fucking annihilate. I think it's a trend.
I do think it ebbs and flows.

Speaker 1 There are moments where all seems lost.

Speaker 2 And then Barbie comes out.

Speaker 1 And then a movie comes out where you're like, oh, no, like people are into this stuff. But also I'm watching Fall Guy and I'm like, this movie is flawless.
It's got everything you would ever want.

Speaker 1 This thing should make half a billion dollars gold. It's just too expensive.
That's the thing you have to be smart about also.

Speaker 1 And that's the thing we've always tried to really consider is you have to be realistic about what your movie costs and what you're asking of people.

Speaker 1 You know, if I was making what was essentially a romantic comedy, I would not. spend 80, 90, 100 million dollars on it.
I'd spend like 20, 30 million dollars on it.

Speaker 1 And that's always been part of our philosophy, but we're we're never as existential about it, I feel like, as some people get.

Speaker 1 Because I think I've personally seen these trends ebb and flow just throughout the time I've been here.

Speaker 1 You know, and like Sandler makes movies that are on Netflix, but they're great and people love them. And I was out to dinner with Aziz and we just were talking about comedy.

Speaker 1 The waitress was there and she's like, who's the best comedian alive right now? Adam Sandler. Without skipping a second.
She said it or you said it. She said it.

Speaker 1 We were like, we don't get an obligatory nod.

Speaker 1 We're right in front of you.

Speaker 1 Those things give me hope people still like these things people always will want a comedy movie just the system has crumbled a little bit when i was younger you could write a funny movie they would buy it and then cast it that doesn't happen very much anymore.

Speaker 1 Now they want you to have everyone attached, but actors don't want to get attached. Kind of rightfully so because you're exposing yourself.

Speaker 1 And if you attach yourself to a thing and no one buys it, then you could feel as though that's a knock on your career.

Speaker 2 You don't have any capital. Exactly.

Speaker 1 But also, that shouldn't be the system. The studio should just buy and develop it.
Buy this crap if they like it. And trust me, once that movie exists, it is going to be made.

Speaker 1 You will be able to cast it.

Speaker 1 Actors who are great, who know it's a real thing, who aren't exposing themselves and their name instead of studios doing what they should do, which is buy and develop films and then decide which ones to make and then cast them and hire directors and make them.

Speaker 1 That system has gone away a little bit. And I think that's out of just pure terror and risk mitigation and panic and all the stuff that is in the show.

Speaker 1 And it's people thinking that that will give them a more sure bet, but it's also negating the entire system that's in place of like executives developing ideas that are hopefully good and working with talent that is hopefully good.

Speaker 1 Well, I love it, man. I'm so glad that I got to see all of that.
That's so nice. Feel very lucky.
Appreciate it. It comes out on March 26th on Apple Plus, and it's spectacular.

Speaker 1 And this is number three, and I can't wait for number four. We'll get Evan in here.
Yeah,

Speaker 1 we have space. You do, yes, yes.
Tell him there's a seat waiting for him. All right, well, thanks for coming in.

Speaker 1 Thanks for having me. That was great.

Speaker 1 Hi there. This is Hermi and Permium.
If you like that, you're going to love the fact-checker. Miss Monica.

Speaker 1 Oh.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 1 Oh.

Speaker 1 Oh, my God.

Speaker 2 You're excited because you're getting a boat today.

Speaker 1 Not today, but.

Speaker 2 Oh, you're getting a boat today.

Speaker 1 By the time this is out.

Speaker 2 It's Christmas for this little boy.

Speaker 1 For the gearhead, I'm going to have my first pontoon boat.

Speaker 1 Oh, it is. It's very exciting.
It's gorgeous. I can't.

Speaker 1 Monica, the leaps that have been made in the pontoon world,

Speaker 1 I could bore you for hours.

Speaker 2 And see, Sim. Why? Because by the time you got your boat, it's the best.
It's much better.

Speaker 1 Don't look at me like that. Oh, I got you.
I'm not even saying by the time I get it, like I receive it tomorrow. But yes, by the time I got the market for, yes, there was a huge leap forward.

Speaker 1 Let me hit you with some of the feats.

Speaker 2 Okay, let's hear it.

Speaker 1 Pontoon, I grew up on a pontoon boat. Dave Barton, my sweet stepdad, he had himself a pontoon boat.
Two steel pontoons on the bottoms.

Speaker 2 What is a pontoon?

Speaker 1 A pontoon's a big steel rod.

Speaker 1 What would I say? Pontoon? I mean, I don't know what other word to use. If you could picture a kayak,

Speaker 1 but completely sealed and it's stainless steel

Speaker 1 or aluminum. And it's you have two in the water, and then there's a flat deck.
So it doesn't have like a hole. It's not made out of fiberglass like a normal boat.

Speaker 1 It's just got these two pontoons and then a big flat deck on top. They're ideal for maximum passengers.
Right. But what I got is called a tri-toon, Monica.

Speaker 1 They've added a third pontoon in the middle of the boat. It's very buoyant.
And then it has these little runners on the side that actually lift it out of the water at speed. So less drag.
Okay.

Speaker 1 Barton's pontoon, which this was standard. You'd generally have like a 50-horsepower Johnson outboard motor.
That's lovely. And you'd go, it could maybe go 13 miles an hour.

Speaker 2 I thought you just said 50 miles.

Speaker 1 With a tailwind. That's Barton's boat.
But now we're up to tri-tune with the elevation. Mine has a 400-horsepower V10 on the back.
So eight times the amount of motor that Barton's.

Speaker 2 So, how fast is it going to go?

Speaker 1 I think it'll go about 55 miles an hour.

Speaker 2 I thought you just said his went 50 miles an hour.

Speaker 1 15, 13.

Speaker 2 That's why I got

Speaker 2 1-5, not 5-0. It sounded like 50.

Speaker 1 Full ski rig on it so I can pull skiers, tubers, everything you used to want a speedboat for

Speaker 1 is available on this with 13 passengers. Wow.
Oh, money. The sound system is off the charts.
We're going to be dancing on this motherfucker.

Speaker 2 That's really fun. Oh.
Boat culture is.

Speaker 1 I'm new to it. You're not new to it.
Well, I'm not new to it, but as an owner. Sure.
Sure. Shout out Ken Kennedy.
He's my

Speaker 1 brains. I'm like, I'm getting a punch.
He's like, well, you need, these are the two brands. Then he found me.
He's like, this one's pretty perfect. So you got to get the easy top.

Speaker 1 I'm going to add one more thing that'll bore everyone to tears. The pain of owning a boat,

Speaker 1 anyone who owns one will know.

Speaker 2 Talk about the negative.

Speaker 1 I'm going to. The worst part of owning a boat is that when you're done driving it, you have to take the cover and put it back over so that the cabin's completely covered.

Speaker 1 And there's all these snaps and it never fits right. And it's, it's like a fucking 15-minute ordeal every time you get off the boat.

Speaker 1 So then you get lazy and you go, I'm going back out in a couple hours. I'm not going to put the cover on.
And then you don't put the cover on.

Speaker 1 And then the interior of the boat just gets destroyed and you're slowly destroying this boat. Oh.
It's the big problem with owning a boat. Mine has an easy cover.
Monica, it's a remote control.

Speaker 1 So when we're driving, I have two different, three options, Bimini. I can have the front of the boat in shade, the back fully exposed to sun, if that's your jam.
Okay.

Speaker 1 The back fully shaded and the front open to sun bathing or full open. So total shade.
Okay. And then when I get back, I hit a button.
The whole fucking top drops down and seals.

Speaker 1 the whole top as if I put the cover on and snapped it with a button.

Speaker 1 Again, that didn't exist.

Speaker 2 It's really privileged.

Speaker 1 It's so privileged. That is.
And it didn't exist

Speaker 1 five years ago.

Speaker 2 Exactly.

Speaker 1 I waited just long enough to get into this pontoon game.

Speaker 2 I think one of the best things in life is to have experts in your life. I mean, this is, I guess, what we've accumulated over the past seven years.

Speaker 2 It's part of the joy is you get experts in your life in different areas. So you always have some.
I mean, you don't like asking for help, but I love asking for help.

Speaker 2 And I like asking the smartest, best, most knowledgeable person for help. Yeah.
So it's just accumulating a mass of people who are the.

Speaker 1 It saves you a lot of time.

Speaker 2 So much. In fact,

Speaker 2 last night, I reached out to someone, an expert, a medical expert. Oh.

Speaker 2 That we met here on this job for help with an important question.

Speaker 1 Perimenopause question? No.

Speaker 2 Okay. But

Speaker 2 I am going to ask Mary Claire. Something did come up and I was like, ooh, I need to ask her about that.

Speaker 1 How receptive were this, were they?

Speaker 1 Extremely.

Speaker 2 Nice to say. Okay, I guess I'll say it.
I wonder if I should say it. Yeah.
I think I can. So I was listening to, nobody's listening, right, Elizabeth and Andy.

Speaker 2 Elizabeth was telling a story about her taking her son to urgent care. The doctor comes in, and the description of the doctor is very unsettling.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 2 Extremely.

Speaker 1 Beard, eye patch, and a hook.

Speaker 2 I think would be better.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 2 I mean, I've been watching a lot of the pit and ER.

Speaker 1 So I'm in this.

Speaker 2 I'm like, I know what's going on. Yeah.

Speaker 1 He has a drug problem.

Speaker 2 Okay, sure. I really do think so.
Oh, okay. He was like.

Speaker 2 over his scrubs wearing this like puffy vest that was all stained oh and then he was wearing a his mask was stained oh geez and then he was like incoherent

Speaker 1 okay cte probably

Speaker 1 yeah

Speaker 2 so anyway she is telling this story and i was like oh my god and so i i texted her and i said elizabeth i you need to report him oh report him yeah i was like i really

Speaker 2 i just think because she obviously has the ability to say like I'm gonna get my kid out of here and I'm gonna take him to another doctor, but a lot of people there don't. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And they're just gonna have to take this doctor at face value. And so I texted Elizabeth.
I said, I really, not to scare you, but I think you need to report this. I'm watching ER and like, it's back.

Speaker 2 The pit. Yeah.
And also the pit. And Chicago Hope.
Oh my God, something is so excited happening. I thought I was done with the pit.
Like I thought it was over and it's not. It's ongoing? Yes.

Speaker 2 Oh my God. So then I got to watch another episode.

Speaker 1 Oh, congratulations.

Speaker 2 Thank you. I was so excited.
Anyway, so I

Speaker 2 DMed

Speaker 2 a old guest of ours

Speaker 2 and said, what do I do if, yeah, is there a way to report? He helped me. He gave me some resources.
Oh, good. So I sent them to Elizabeth.
We'll see.

Speaker 1 TBD.

Speaker 2 Speaking of ER.

Speaker 1 Yeah, you were.

Speaker 1 Continue. When you're the one speaking of it, you could just continue speaking of it.

Speaker 2 I wasn't speaking of it. It came up.

Speaker 1 Speaking of what if I said that, what if I literally, but what if I said? Speaking of pontoon boats.

Speaker 2 Okay, so speaking of ER, guess who was on? I posted about this.

Speaker 1 Oh, Dr.

Speaker 1 Adam.

Speaker 1 Dr. Adam.
Dr.

Speaker 2 Adam Scott.

Speaker 1 Dr. Adam Scott.

Speaker 2 He was a little patient in there. He was only in the very beginning of the episode.

Speaker 1 He's great, of course.

Speaker 2 Of course, he's great. But he's so young.
And I was staring, and I was like,

Speaker 2 is that Adam? He had a neck brace on and he was being brought in. So it was kind of hard to tell.
Yeah. And so I had to wait till the credits to double check and it was him.

Speaker 1 And they needed a freeze frame and a photo and a post. Of course.
Yeah, naturally. He's a friend of the pod.
I got to promote his episode of ER.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 And in the episode before that, another friend of the pod, Bradley Whitford, saddest episode of ER,

Speaker 2 top three saddest episodes of ER total.

Speaker 1 Okay. Ding, ding, ding.
Bradley Whitford was on an episode of Brooklyn 99 that they were watching yesterday. Oh,

Speaker 1 that show is way, way funnier than I had guessed it was. It's quite, quite, quite funny.
It's a very good show.

Speaker 2 Mike Scher, he doesn't fuck up.

Speaker 1 No.

Speaker 2 Speaking of Mike Schur.

Speaker 1 Speaking of ER.

Speaker 2 Speaking of Mike Scher, I was watching ER last night.

Speaker 1 Have you guys seen the show Adolescence that's on Netflix? Oh, so it keeps getting recommended to me.

Speaker 1 Have you watched it?

Speaker 1 I've seen half of it. It's all Wanners also.
Oh. It's one-hour Wanners.

Speaker 2 And isn't it like really intense?

Speaker 1 It's about a boy that, like, 13-year-old boy that stabs a little girl. And it's his dad, like, dealing with it.

Speaker 2 Yes, I've heard. There's all these articles that say it's flawless.

Speaker 1 Okay, I'm going to do it. Maybe when I'm driving the bus home, I'll plow through the whole season.

Speaker 2 It seems a little intense to watch

Speaker 1 driving. Four episodes only.
Oh, it's only four episodes. Hour long.

Speaker 1 Okay. So that'll get me 280 miles.

Speaker 2 Why don't you just watch it tonight?

Speaker 1 Because

Speaker 1 I have to get in the car at 5 a.m. tomorrow to go to the airport.
So I'm not going to watch anything tonight.

Speaker 2 Why don't you just try?

Speaker 1 Okay. I'll watch it tonight.
Okay.

Speaker 1 Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert.

Speaker 1 If you dare.

Speaker 1 We are supported by Empower.

Speaker 1 See, you've always wanted to take that bucketless safari trip where you hop in a Jeep at sunrise and cruise the Serengeti. Here's the thing.
If you invest well, you could do things like that.

Speaker 1 With Empower, you can get your money working for you so you can go out and live a little. Isn't that why we work so hard to splurge at certain moments?

Speaker 1 Maybe it's those concert seats that don't require binoculars or taking that trip to Athens in Greece, not Georgian, no disrespect, money.

Speaker 1 So use Empower to help you get good at money so you can be a little bad. Join their 19 million customers today at Empower.com.

Speaker 3 Not an Empower client paid or sponsored.

Speaker 1 Okay. Okay.

Speaker 2 Let's get serious.

Speaker 1 Let's get serious.

Speaker 2 Seth Rogen.

Speaker 1 Yeah, she's so so serious.

Speaker 2 I love Seth Rogen.

Speaker 1 Me too.

Speaker 2 Okay, now,

Speaker 2 does History of Violence have staircase sex? Yes. Top 10 movies that have stair sex.
Oh, okay, great. Now, I think it's worth us revisiting.

Speaker 2 You did bring up that you'd rather have sex on a unicycle than on the stairs.

Speaker 1 Absolutely.

Speaker 1 Not only would I rather, it's a personal goal.

Speaker 1 Once I thought of it,

Speaker 1 I would love that. Yeah.
Talk about a high wire act.

Speaker 1 I mean, the stakes would be so high. If everyone reached orgasm in that dynamic, I bet it would be explosive.
Because you'd be scared you're going to fall and get a concussion.

Speaker 2 Okay. I just feel like you wouldn't be able to fully let yourself go.

Speaker 1 That's the challenge.

Speaker 2 Okay, yeah. History of violence.
Close enough to touch. Never heard of it.
A woman in the mirror. X deal.

Speaker 2 I know. I am worried they're pointing out.
I'm worried about that, but I don't know.

Speaker 2 Spanish Fly.

Speaker 1 Okay, let's talk about Spanish Fly.

Speaker 2 Okay, teach us about Spanish fly because I didn't know what Spanish fly.

Speaker 1 You didn't know what Spanish fly was.

Speaker 2 And you taught me.

Speaker 1 And Spanish fly, and again, I got to be very, very clear about this. This was not, this is an urban legend.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it's not real.

Speaker 1 All growing up, I knew about Spanish fly. And it wasn't a drug that would knock women out so you could rape them.
Let's just be very clear.

Speaker 1 It was not.

Speaker 1 It's not roofy. This was a magic pill you would give girls that would make them super horny.
Yeah. And they would find you irresistible.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 It's more like a hatchy thing. Yeah.
Like a love spell.

Speaker 1 And probably still some deception. But, anyways, that's a yeah, that's a urban legend that there's a pill.

Speaker 1 And then the other one that I was always told growing up, mostly my brother told me this is that actors to prevent getting erections took saltpeter.

Speaker 1 And I don't know if saltpeter is real and it really does prevent you from getting an erection. Rob, will you do a perfunctory search of saltpeter? Potassium nitrate, component of gunpowder.

Speaker 1 Gunpowder. It's been used to prevent blowing up hard cheeses.

Speaker 1 Prevented from what? Blowing up hard cheeses? Blowing of hard cheeses.

Speaker 1 What makes hard cheese soft? Let me

Speaker 1 search erections.

Speaker 1 Yeah, do saltpeter's erections. The belief that saltpeter can suppress erections is a myth.
There's no scientific evidence. So good.
I said it was the equivalent.

Speaker 2 is saltpeter.

Speaker 1 This is like Marilyn Manson's ribs. Yeah.
Okay. But we, this is worth noting that we were doing an episode of Armchair Anonymous yesterday.
Uh-huh.

Speaker 1 And it had occurred to me that I had had sex in a stairwell.

Speaker 2 Exactly. And last time we fought, we fought about this because you thought it was crazy that I said, I think I would rather, I would definitely rather have sex on the stairs than a unicycle.

Speaker 2 And then you thought that was crazy. And then it turns out you've done it.

Speaker 1 Well, hold on. I don't think you would because you have to imagine how painful it is to have three thin points of contact on your body.

Speaker 1 So your own weight on these three very hard, tiny points of contact, then someone else's weight and thrusting on you. It would be insanely painful.

Speaker 2 I would expect the guy to kind of prop themselves up also on the stairs. So they're not slant.
They're not like whole body weight is on mine.

Speaker 2 I think you'd be surprised at how good I am at lying on the stairs.

Speaker 1 I would be quite surprised because I don't know how you get around the fact that you have these three points of contact. Better, huge improvement.

Speaker 1 But anyway, someone said, well, I bet a lot of people have had sex in stairwells. And then I realized, oh, I had done that.
Yeah. What a blessing.
One of the real blessings of my life.

Speaker 1 No, don't say that.

Speaker 2 No, don't say that. You have children.

Speaker 1 One of, not the blessing of my life.

Speaker 2 One of how many?

Speaker 1 I've had hundreds of blessings in my life and this is one of them okay i was gambling in las vegas at the luxor casino in my 20s

Speaker 1 and i met a very attractive woman from australia oh my god yes and after a couple hours of flirting and drinking at the blackjack table we excused ourselves her her

Speaker 1 request her request

Speaker 1 led me did you know are you sure sure? Saltpeter.

Speaker 1 Led me to the staircase at the Luxor, the stairwell, which is a very weird staircase because it's diagonal. That's right.
Diagonale.

Speaker 2 Diagonale. It is a pyramid shaped.

Speaker 1 Yes. So the staircase is going up like an MC Escher situation.
But again, that was not on the stairs. That was like more leaning over one of the railings.
Sure.

Speaker 2 Listen,

Speaker 2 what if you had taken Saltpeter and she had taken Spanish fly?

Speaker 1 It was a match made in house. Bad match.
match. That's the worst.
That was me on Coke, to be fully honest with you. Oh my God.

Speaker 1 Yeah. Everyone's horny and then I can't

Speaker 1 perform.

Speaker 2 That's so weird that then you loved that drug because you loved having sex.

Speaker 1 I told you that's when...

Speaker 1 I mean, there were numerous times where I had to acknowledge what a problem it had become.

Speaker 1 But yes, there was a moment where I was at a bar and I decided, I told the dude, like, oh, get the guy and let's get an eight ball. And I, and there was a girl there that liked me.

Speaker 1 And I was like

Speaker 1 this is something you're you would rather do that drug than have sex with this attractive person and i previous to that would have thought there was nothing i would want to do more than have sex with an attractive person and you'd rather poop in the bed say what

Speaker 1 you're just you're like grabbing

Speaker 1 you're grabbing from everywhere speaking of er

Speaker 2 So no, you did poop in the bed once.

Speaker 1 That's not, that's not relevant to this conversation.

Speaker 1 Yes, an excessive amount.

Speaker 2 So that's my point.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Anywho, I'm glad for you that you had sex in the stairway. Me too.

Speaker 1 Me too. One of the blessings.
But

Speaker 1 there's blessings all around if you keep your eyes open.

Speaker 2 I guess that's right.

Speaker 1 If she remembers me and she's hearing this, thank you so much. What a great memory.
No?

Speaker 2 No, yeah. I just, I just had like a very prudish judgment.

Speaker 1 Oh, cool. What was it about? Just sex?

Speaker 2 No, it was just like, I don't think she's okay.

Speaker 1 Oh, my God, Monica. I know.

Speaker 2 I'm sorry, you ass. And I wanted to be honest.

Speaker 1 I just thought. You're blood-shaming.

Speaker 2 No, I know. That's why.

Speaker 2 I'm glad you're owning it. I said it was a prudish judgment.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 And it's not necessarily true, but you can imagine how. What if you would killed her?

Speaker 1 What?

Speaker 1 What happened? That's nice boy.

Speaker 2 You know.

Speaker 1 Right. I don't think murderers, like, that's not how it works with murderers.
They're not like, you know what? I'm going to go gambling.

Speaker 1 If I meet someone who wants to fuck in the stairwell, I might murder them. I don't think that's how it works.
No, that's not how it works.

Speaker 2 They're there knowing they're going to be charming and Ted Bundy.

Speaker 1 I don't even think murderers are gambling and having fun and getting drunk.

Speaker 2 No, they are to

Speaker 2 lure.

Speaker 1 They're in their grandma's underpants. No, no.
Grab headset in seven. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 2 Not Ted Bundy. He was hot and out in a shot.

Speaker 1 He was in a cast hanging out by cars, acting like he couldn't get his crutches or something.

Speaker 2 Whatever. he was still playing it he was still luring he was playing a victim and luring people you don't think anyone's been lured please that's what roofing that's what a lot of roofing is at bars

Speaker 2 what okay we're talking about no we're talking we're talking about killers yeah and we're talking about roofing well raping and we're talking about me playing blackjack in vegas no i'm saying okay i'm saying that just because you're having fun and in a bar and you're fun doesn't mean you're safe.

Speaker 1 Well, I was, though. I know.

Speaker 2 I'm not talking about you anymore. Okay.
Okay.

Speaker 1 Okay. I'm talking about you.
Okay. I know.
You're just saying there could be someone drinking at the blackjack table who's a killer.

Speaker 2 Yeah, or a rapist.

Speaker 1 And then they're using that method to meet people that they'll kill. Or rape.
Right. And they'll be on all the Vegas cameras.
with a ton of documentation.

Speaker 2 There's so much trouble for this.

Speaker 1 And a lot of documentation that they were talking to their victim. It'd It'd be a really dumb serial killer to get their victims in a Vegas casino because it's so filmed.
Okay.

Speaker 1 Well, I just. You want to be out in the woods in a parking lot with a cast on.

Speaker 2 No, a lot of people. No.

Speaker 2 They act like they're going to hook up with someone and then they rape them or kill them. This is common.
Okay. So my point is, I just don't know if she's still with us.

Speaker 1 I think she is. She was really a cool, smart.
I'm sure she was.

Speaker 1 But you can imagine how neatly neatly it filed into my whole thing about Anglos, right?

Speaker 1 Because the only other really time that that had happened in such an aggressive manner was when I was in 10th grade, the aforementioned snowboard trip story with my friend from Munchester. Right.

Speaker 2 That was in a stairwell too?

Speaker 1 No, but it was an English gale. And now I had an Australian gale.
And I was like, something's going on with these gals. They're very assertive.
Right, right, right. Yeah.

Speaker 1 It funneled nicely into my stereotype. Right.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 2 Oh, my God. The next movie is Impulse.

Speaker 2 The Thomas Crown Affair.

Speaker 1 Oh, there we go.

Speaker 2 That's my favorite. Serve the People, Misty the Room.

Speaker 1 Okay, so I have heard of three of those 10 movies.

Speaker 2 Yeah, me too.

Speaker 2 Okay, existing record for a wonner. Several movies

Speaker 2 have been filmed to appear as if they are shot in one continuous, uninterrupted take, including 1917, Birdman, Children of Men, Silent House.

Speaker 2 Okay, Now, hold on. I'm going to pull up another article here.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 2 Good fellas. Yeah.
That's three minutes.

Speaker 1 Feels so much longer.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Well, it was early.
It was early days of Wonders. Creed, four minutes.

Speaker 2 Atonement, five and a half minutes. Children of Men, six minutes.
1917, eight minutes.

Speaker 2 Extraction, 12 minutes. Birdman, 15 minutes.

Speaker 1 Now we're talking.

Speaker 2 Gravity, 17 minutes.

Speaker 1 Ooh, we're climbing.

Speaker 2 Boiling point, 92 minutes.

Speaker 1 Was Boiling Point a John Woo movie? Nope. It's Stephen Graham from Adolescence isn't that.
No!

Speaker 1 He's the lead in it.

Speaker 1 So, Sam. But a London restaurant.
Oh, my God. I'm cutting that.
Dothie said I'm cutting that. I'm too scared of cutting it.
It's too much.

Speaker 2 Russian Arc, 96 minutes.

Speaker 1 wow they're so rewarding when you are directing one and everything goes right yeah nothing really feels like that stunt like when a stunt goes right yeah that's a really

Speaker 1 like the hardest i've ever celebrated

Speaker 1 was in chips when my friend drove a humvee through a motorhome and drove it right through the center of it and broke it in half and made it through the other side at full speed as explosions were going off and i was on the sixth street bridge and I screamed with elation like you can't imagine.

Speaker 1 Oh, highlight of another blessing of my life. There's a lot of stunt people in your movie.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 And chips? Yeah. Oh, yeah, the whole fucking movie.

Speaker 1 Stunts.

Speaker 2 So many stunts.

Speaker 1 I'm listed as a stunt performer for Michael Pena. That's.

Speaker 2 He did brown face.

Speaker 1 I did all the driving in his getaway car scene.

Speaker 2 That's appropriation.

Speaker 1 I didn't do brown face. I just went to a tanning

Speaker 1 spray tanning and went too far.

Speaker 2 Okay, that's it for Seth. We love Seth.

Speaker 1 Oh, God, we love him. I can't wait for number four.
Me too. Bye.
I love you.

Speaker 1 Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondry app, Amazon Music, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 1 You can listen to every episode of Armchair Expert early and ad-free right now by joining Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

Speaker 1 Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondry.com/slash survey.

Speaker 2 Hey there, Armchairies. Guess what? It's Mel Robbins.
I'm popping in here taking out my own ad.

Speaker 2 Holy cow, Dax, Monica, and I, I don't want this conversation to end, and I'm so glad you're here with us. And the other thing, I can't believe, Dax loves the Let Them Theory.

Speaker 2 He can't stop talking about it. I hope you're loving listening as much as I love having you here.

Speaker 2 And I also know since you love listening to Armchair Expert, you know what you're going to love listening to?

Speaker 1 The Let Them Theory audiobook.

Speaker 2 And guess who reads it?

Speaker 1 Me.

Speaker 2 And even if you've read the book, guess what? The audiobook is different. I tell different stories.

Speaker 1 I riff. I cry.

Speaker 2 You're going to love it because it's going to feel like I'm right there next to you. We're in this together as we learn to stop controlling other people.

Speaker 2 So, thanks again for listening to this episode of Armchair Expert and check out the audiobook version of the Let Them Theory, read by yours truly. Available now on Audible.

Speaker 2 You can even try it out for free with an Audible trial.

Speaker 1 Download the Audible app today.