Breaking Cycles in Real Time with The Dude Dads

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Speaker 9 Welcome to the shit show. Things are going to get weird.

Speaker 9 It's your fade villain, Kale Wower.

Speaker 9 And you're listening to Barely Famous.

Speaker 9 All right, everyone, welcome to Barely Famous Podcast. I'm sitting with the dude dad, your favorite male co-hosts.

Speaker 2 Welcome to Barely Famous.

Speaker 2 that's pretty uh your favorite male co-host that's special at least i am how are you guys amazing yeah yeah amazing how are you blessed i haven't seen you in a long time i see jerry almost every morning but i have not seen you in a long time you know we graduated we left at school you know we wait what yeah

Speaker 9 for anyone listening to this podcast in delaware you can send your kids to any school you want i think i've talked about it on coffee combos you can send your kids to any school in Delaware if you're willing to drive them.

Speaker 9 So my kids keep asking me to be a bus rider.

Speaker 9 And I'm like, when we build a new house which who knows when that's gonna happen um yeah when we build a new house and you'll be a bus rider but for now yeah is what it is I actually rode out to your property yesterday did you do hunt on it no I just rode out there just to get put put my eye on it oh yeah see how the beans are doing you know is it still being farmed do we know if that oh okay because I went out there the one day and I was like I don't even know if he's doing the farming here anymore.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's planting beans. You got a nice neighbor across the street.
That little garage house that looks really nice.

Speaker 9 I haven't seen it. I haven't been over there.
There's no reason for me to go over there because we haven't started the build. brand new really nice um jerry sold me the land for

Speaker 9 i whatever i'm if i build on it or not it's you know 20 almost 20 acres so i mean 20 acres on that part of delaware is pretty nice well i've had people ask me to buy it from me and i'm not don't i will sit on it even if i never build on it i will sit on it forever because keep me a place to hunt yeah there's a there's a stand out there already so um but so jerry and i have been going through it a little bit um i entered into the dead dads club as everybody knows, and both of y'all's dads are dead.

Speaker 9 Boo.

Speaker 2 Yeah,

Speaker 2 boo.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's not a fun place to be on this side.

Speaker 9 It's a little different for me. Like people have said, I'm sorry for your loss.
And I was telling Kristen yesterday, like, it doesn't really feel like a loss for me because I didn't know him.

Speaker 9 I met him twice.

Speaker 9 But then you also.

Speaker 9 Yeah, I met him once when I was 16 and pregnant. I was 17 and pregnant.
And then I met him again in September. Those are the only two times I've ever.

Speaker 1 No other conversations. Not even like a phone call, a birthday card.

Speaker 9 I had one phone call before I went to meet him when I was 17.

Speaker 9 Talked to him on the phone. And then that was the only phone call we ever had.

Speaker 2 But did he have like a big change of heart there when he was like, I'm assuming he's like on a deathbed there and just like, was he like absolutely different than you remember or like attitude different?

Speaker 2 Like just like.

Speaker 9 It was all the same. Okay.
It's just slower moving. He wasn't even on his deathbed.
Like he was doing hospice in home care, but he wasn't like in a bed.

Speaker 9 Like we sat at the table he got up to go the bathroom on his own like I thought I had maybe one more visit left with him

Speaker 9 but he

Speaker 9 and did he reach out to the one say I want to see you or you reached out July my aunt called me I was working in New York and she called or she messaged me on Facebook and said your dad is has stage four COPD

Speaker 9 you know he's about to start hospice and that was like the in-home care thing and at that time I was really upset because I was like oh like I thought I had more time.

Speaker 9 Um, and I don't think I ever really had plans to talk to him. Um, and so like all the backlash that I'm getting now is like, um, you know, why now? Why would you wait until he's dying?

Speaker 9 Well, I didn't have, I didn't know how I was going to feel when I found out he was dying. Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 9 Like, I couldn't have known for the past 10 years that, yes, when he's on his deathbed, I'm going to want to go talk to him.

Speaker 2 Do you feel like you learned anything? Yeah.

Speaker 9 I think that I learned way more than I did when, even if he said everything that he said in that visit in September, even if he told me all of that when I was 17, I don't think that my brain was processing it at 17 years old.

Speaker 9 So he might have even told me that stuff back then, but I don't remember or like.

Speaker 1 You weren't listening. Yeah.

Speaker 9 I wish that my mom would have given me the opportunity to get to know him and form my own opinion, because even if I decided I didn't like him and I didn't want to go there anymore, that should have been up to me.

Speaker 9 And that's really all it comes down to. And so I think

Speaker 9 It doesn't feel like how you guys have talked to me about y'all's dads. Like it hasn't, it wasn't really like that.

Speaker 1 Yeah, but you know you said a second ago you getting backlash like why now and it's because situations like that you know someone dying or you know either when they die or right before they die you're not going to be the same person you know and it's i don't think there's anything wrong with that it doesn't doesn't mean you're cold or anything like that just it brings you kind of to earth and go like oh shit this is real this uh we're only here for a finite amount of time and and

Speaker 1 you're gonna think about things differently that's just human nature i don't think there's anything wrong with that. It's not like, oh, well, I'll wait until the end and then I'll care.

Speaker 1 Or when somebody dies,

Speaker 1 well, you know, not to bring in like my sister to this, but you know, my sister passed away. All of a sudden, all the bad shit goes away

Speaker 1 and you are back to what you wanted to get back. Right.
And it's, it's insane because if you would have said something to me three months ago, I'm like, I don't give a fuck. But it's funny because

Speaker 1 when like death happens or you're at the end all of a sudden some shit that probably shouldn't have mattered it it it all goes away you know i mean somebody at my sister's funeral said one of her old friends says you know what you wanted you wanted her back you know but then with her dying you kind of got her back because you forget all the bad stuff that's not what you're focused on you're focused on everything else before that or what you wanted back so it's like in a weird way you kind of get get that like now i'm like thinking all these great things and seeing the good things right and i think it's the same thing with your dad of like you're like oh now it's like the end is near and now you kind of

Speaker 1 you know you look at it differently you made a little bit of different effort that sort of thing and i don't think there's anything wrong with that i think that's just human nature you know i mean yeah so for people to be judgy be like oh well you just waited till now or you're just getting content like that's bullshit to your point like we are only here for a finite amount of time like i didn't know how it was gonna feel if i found out that he was dying i don't know how i would feel if my mom if i found out my mom was dying or honestly she could be dead i don't know

Speaker 9 But

Speaker 9 it was a little trauma dumping this morning.

Speaker 2 So yeah, I'm proud of you for going out there. I mean, it takes a weak person to blame him and not want to see him.

Speaker 2 And it takes a stronger person to just go, well, at the end of the day, he's a human. I'm human.
It still is my dad. No matter, I mean, at the end of the day, you only get one of them.

Speaker 2 And it takes a stronger person to go out there and have closure. Yeah.
No matter how it looks, how whatever it is, but I feel like you have to.

Speaker 9 It felt, I mean, it was, I guess, cathartic. Is that the right word? Like cathartic for me.
I hope it was for him, too. Like, I hope that he passed away with peace.
You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 Well, when you saying you thought you had more time and then you didn't, I think that might have had something to do with it.

Speaker 9 I just thought that, and in the moment when I was there, it was like still a little frustrated. But then like once I came home and slept on it for several days, I felt really good about it.
And

Speaker 9 I was not expecting him to die when he died at all.

Speaker 1 There was no other conversations after that?

Speaker 2 No other phone calls.

Speaker 9 Nothing. He asked me to unblock him on Facebook, which for the record, he was never blocked, but I added him and he never accepted my friend request.
So now it's just like sitting there.

Speaker 2 Oh.

Speaker 2 Did he tell you

Speaker 2 his life, like what he did?

Speaker 9 Not really. He told me he was in the Marines.

Speaker 9 He told me he lived in Alaska, Hawaii, the Philippines. He went to Japan.
So he kind of had like a cool life

Speaker 9 or the opportunity to have a cool life, but he didn't really capitalize on it. Like he didn't really do much with it, which is kind of sad.

Speaker 9 And I think that it's interesting because I just am so opposite of that. It's like, I never know if everything that I've built can be taken away from me.

Speaker 9 So I'm always looking for like the next thing to do to make sure that I have like revenue and just like, you know, building whatever.

Speaker 9 And so it's really interesting to have like a parent that is so polar opposite of that. I was telling Jerry before, I don't know if you heard me, but he had two bachelor.
two associate's degrees.

Speaker 9 Why not just get one bachelor's degree? And then, um, so one was in like like golf course management and hospitality, and then the other one was in like it was like associates of science or something.

Speaker 9 And I'm like, obviously, you're like, you could have done something. You didn't have to live like this.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 He may have done something. I mean, he may have just lived the life he wanted to live.
I mean, did he do the outdoors? He fished.

Speaker 2 He had to, I mean, he never all those things you say, do come with responsibilities and come with management and, you know, upkeep. And I understand about the business part.

Speaker 2 You got to keep growing or it could get taken from you. You know? Yeah.
Some people are discontent with that. If he's in Alaska, hitting a nice fishing hole, slamming some salmon and

Speaker 2 that. Wait, you need to put that on merch.
You got to put the dude dad's merch, slamming salmon.

Speaker 2 And just like, you know, catching the views and enjoying it, you know. Yeah.
Well, I don't know. That might have been it.
I mean, you said he was like in the rodeo, right?

Speaker 9 Oh, yeah. He, uh, he had lost his teeth bull riding.
So that was like, he lived a cool life.

Speaker 2 He sounded like more of a simple life kind of guy.

Speaker 9 But I think it was the simple life, but like like a little bit harder than it needed to be yeah like choose your hard you know work hard to like have a little bit of income and like live fairly simple or like literally do nothing and then be scraping by do you know what i mean like i just choose your hard i don't understand it do you think he saw you live vicariously through your success and was like well one of us made it i'm good

Speaker 1 Maybe. Did you ask him that? Did you ask him if he followed you?

Speaker 9 Yes, and he followed my sister and me like through social media and things like that like he knew my oldest son was gay asked me how i felt about that um i don't know did did your dad leave you anything did uh do you like your sister have any like do you even just uh literally nothing he had like tom when i tell you the trailer and i haven't even said this on any of the podcasts like the trailer was empty was he was he like a ranch hand like what did he do for money um that i don't know I think he said that he was working at like a convenience store at one point.

Speaker 9 Like,

Speaker 9 um, and that's, I'm pretty sure he said a convenience store, and that's like his co-worker or someone like called the ambulance for him or whatever when he first got diagnosed with COPD, but um, literally had nothing.

Speaker 9 Like, he didn't, I wanted to see if he had the necklace that he tried sending to me, but I guess like all the years of like moving and stuff, I don't think he had it, but yeah, well, it seems like I mean, anything that you can't really answer now, it's not important, you know.

Speaker 2 I mean, you had his life, you've had your life, and I think just the fact that you got to go there and have the closure. I mean, that's that was like the most important thing.

Speaker 2 What already has has already happened was it that's that's it they can't even

Speaker 2 you're trying to find something you know what i mean there's nothing to find really it's already happened so i think that meeting that you had was everything

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Speaker 1 And you got to ask questions too. And there's something that like,

Speaker 1 you know, with my dad being killed in an accident, like I didn't, I'm a little jealous of you because you got to ask some questions.

Speaker 9 Would you have wanted to ask your dad?

Speaker 1 Yeah. If I'm, if I know, hey, man, like any day now, you're not going to be here anymore.
And then I'd want to hear more stories and ask more questions.

Speaker 1 And, you know, what, what is, what is it like, you know, when I have kids? Because I was only 22. So there was a lot of shit.
that I didn't know.

Speaker 2 You were a kid.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 I was still living at home. You know, so, so, like, I'm a little jealous that you got to do that, even though, like, mine was a completely different situation.
You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 But it's uh, there's something good in everything, yeah, right? There's, there's always something good, you know.

Speaker 1 Tom, with Tom's dad, right, he wasn't, that wasn't his dad at the end, but he had however many phenomenal years with him.

Speaker 9 Did you have a good relationship with your dad when he was sober?

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, I had a great relationship. I have like no bad and no bad memories of anything, you know, there's no like I like my dad was still like Superman.

Speaker 2 Eventually, you watch Superman, like I used to watch Superman fall out the sky.

Speaker 2 But like I was describing with Jerry, you know, when people get, you know, when the grab, you know, get on heroin, it's like you have to lose them twice. Yeah.
So you have to watch an adult.

Speaker 2 Like, you know, I was only, I think I was like getting out of high school, getting into college, and like slowly figuring things out, letting the truth unveil itself. Like, all right.

Speaker 2 They're obviously hurting for money. They're not making good choices.
And I think that they're abusing prescription drugs.

Speaker 2 So eventually like, okay, they're definitely on heroin like this is unreal okay we've lost a house and then now we're going out in public with him and he's trying to fight people in a mall or he's literally just stealing stuff out of the wawa

Speaker 2 how old were you

Speaker 2 uh

Speaker 2 you know in my young 20s oh so you were like an adult though like i say kid but yeah like i was like when they're really trying to figure it out like when i was in college yeah like uh you know they were slowly losing stuff and like my brother's going like hey man they're like not paying the house they're probably going to lose the house and when they come to visit you know like i'm like damn my dad looks like is this motherfucker losing teeth like what are they doing you know like uh and then just being incoherent like uh i mean dude i've i would be at coming home from the winter or something and i could sit see my mom just sit on the couch you know eyes rolling back her head like dozing off your mom yeah they were both on heroin Oh, because I'm like, why wasn't your mom saying anything?

Speaker 9 They were both doing it.

Speaker 2 Yeah, both. I didn't know she was on it until we were literally hanging out side by side.
Just, you know, My dad's dead on the floor. And she's like, yeah, you know, I've been on heroin too.

Speaker 2 I'm like, what the fuck? She said it to you?

Speaker 9 And what did you say?

Speaker 2 Nothing. I mean, I didn't really, honestly, I told Jerry the story.
I didn't really get a chance to like have my own time to console. You know,

Speaker 2 when you're, when you're, when you have people that are on an addiction, you know, you have to lose them twice. That's what I told Jerry.
You got to lose them twice.

Speaker 2 You literally lose the person that you know, they're on drugs and it just becomes incoherent. Like, like, what the fuck is going on? Like, like, you know, they're calling your friends late at night.

Speaker 2 They're calling you late night and saying weird shit.

Speaker 2 And then eventually, like, it gets to a point where you're like, all right, we've lost a house. They're in an apartment.
Like, there's nothing great is happening.

Speaker 2 So eventually, like, the calls come in. I'm like, all right, man.
Like, then you're just kind of waiting.

Speaker 2 Like, at this point, you're like, there's going to be a call where one of the, one of them dies. Like, there's going to be a call.
And sure enough. I got the call.

Speaker 2 It wasn't early enough and it wasn't late enough. It was like at the perfect 4 a.m.
I was like, fuck, man. I was like, this is it.
And when I answer, like, hello, and I heard a pause.

Speaker 2 I was like, one of them's dead. Like, that pause.
I just knew right there. Like, I heard that pause on the phone.
I was like,

Speaker 2 somebody, I don't know who it is, but somebody's getting to gear up to tell me, you know, drop some bad news on me. And it was my mom.
She's like, your dad's dead.

Speaker 9 I was like, was she sober at that point or no?

Speaker 2 No, she was on hero. Oh, she's sober like that day.
No, she was, no, she was on heroin.

Speaker 9 Is she sober now?

Speaker 2 She's sober now. Yeah.
She has taken this boxing and all that stuff. Yeah.
But I just remember getting that call and I just, I literally

Speaker 2 jumped on Skype, hit my brother up. He's like, Yo, what's happened? I was like, Dad died.
He's like, The fuck. He's like, He's on, he's in Burma at this point.
He's in a hotel time zone.

Speaker 2 He's actually getting ready to go out. He's like, What?

Speaker 1 He's in. He was in Burma.

Speaker 2 Where is that? Uh, that's Southeast Asia. Is it Vienna? Myanmar.
What? Yeah. Overseas.
Overseas. Yeah.

Speaker 2 He lives there. He lives overseas.

Speaker 2 He lives in Thailand right now.

Speaker 2 He lives in Singapore now. Oh, Singapore.
But so I call him and then I just, and then I just, I fly up there.

Speaker 2 And I just remember, like, I open up the door and they live in the top stairs of this apartment.

Speaker 2 I go I walk upstairs and the first thing I see is this my dead dad spread out, you know, literally like right next to the stairs.

Speaker 2 And I like my mom comes running up and I'm like, okay, well, that's, that's for real. That's my dead dad.
And I'd like no time to

Speaker 2 take in what's happening. And I'm like, all right, well, it's time for my mom.
Like, fuck me. This is for my mom.
And I step over my dead dad to give my mom a hug.

Speaker 2 She's like, can't you believe you got here so fast? And blah, blah, blah. I'm like, okay.

Speaker 2 And then we just go sit down. down i'm just like what the

Speaker 2 like this and then we i must have hung out my dead dad probably at least an hour you know you can see like the pretty much a crime scene and then uh she's like i could i was like she go i could release some cigarettes i'm like all right so then i have to i walk over back over forth over him several times i went to wawat twice wait but you were in the vicinity of a i've never even seen a dead body outside of like a viewing yeah

Speaker 2 yeah that's when they're like chilling just chilling chill were you okay it wasn't about me that was just about my mom at that point. Yeah, that's

Speaker 2 like it's instantly like that. You just, you're just the man.
You're just like, all right, well,

Speaker 2 thank God he raised like a strong son. So I'm like, I'm just here to take care of this moment, get my mom what she needs.
I'm just stepping over my dad a few times. You know what I mean?

Speaker 2 Kind of just like, well, there he is. Like,

Speaker 2 what the fuck? And I remember like, she's like, you got to call everybody. I was like, I'm like, all right, getting on the phone.
This is why I got mad. Like, call him like, oh, my dad's dead.

Speaker 2 I'm like, oh, my God. So I'm like, you know what? Fuck, someone is losing.
What the fuck?

Speaker 9 Yeah. Yep, my dad's dead.
Like, you just make these phone calls.

Speaker 1 I've had to make a lot of those phone calls.

Speaker 2 Yeah, you got to make the phone calls. And then eventually, you know, the guy comes to get my dad.
And I just sit and the sun is coming up, right? And I'm like, standing there.

Speaker 2 I'm like, and this guy comes in with two rooks. And I'm like, and he's showing them how to maneuver the body, how to get it in a bag.
I'm like, these two are just here learning. That's their work.

Speaker 2 You know what I mean? He's training those guys. I'm like, and the world, the sun's come up, like, and I'm just like, damn, the world just moves on and take them down.

Speaker 2 I just watched him stroll out, you know, my dad in the bag. I'm like, that's the last time i'm gonna ever see him it's

Speaker 9 what you just said like life just goes on like you and i had a conversation at football not that long ago about our family members passing and i'm just thinking to myself like i told my therapist on wednesday i said i have not had time to like grieve any of it because life just goes on.

Speaker 9 Like I still have seven kids that need me. I have to figure out custody arrangements.
I have, I had court on Monday. Like I, life just keeps going and there is no.

Speaker 9 And so I was telling my therapist, I was like, it's coming out in different places, right? Like, I,

Speaker 9 if I spill something, now I'm, it's what could have been like, oh, fuck, I spilled that is like now a whole meltdown because I have not had a chance to grieve what everything else that I'm dealing with.

Speaker 9 You know what I mean? And so it's like a, what is it called, a pressure cooker. So as soon as it just lifts a little bit, it's like everything rolls out.

Speaker 2 Yep.

Speaker 1 But the mildest inconvenience all of a sudden is a, you're crying over spilled milk, literally.

Speaker 9 Exactly. But I know that your sister passed away recently too and um similar circumstances.

Speaker 1 Yeah, we don't, I don't know 100% yet.

Speaker 1 The toxicology has got to come back.

Speaker 1 What her boyfriend is insisting on is that withdrawal is what killed her.

Speaker 2 Like,

Speaker 2 I believe.

Speaker 1 The other day, he was just like, I'm telling you, man, you wait till it comes back. You're going to see like she had a heart attack or something.
Like, the withdrawal killed her.

Speaker 1 And, like, I've heard like fentanyl withdrawal is

Speaker 9 incredible. I think, don't quote me on this, but I believe alcohol withdrawals are the only ones that can kill you.

Speaker 1 That's what I, that's what I've heard. And I've had a buddy go through that.
The, another, one of my best friends that I lost to alcohol five years ago.

Speaker 1 That was we five years ago next month, um, I saw him go into the hospital with withdrawal and like the hallucinations and the, and the, the, the crazy, like it literally almost killed him.

Speaker 1 And then he went back to alcohol and then that eventually.

Speaker 9 Cause I think you have to taper off alcohol, like slowly taper off of it.

Speaker 9 Um, when you guys, this goes for both of you, um, have had addiction in your family, like for my mom, for example, I'm trying to take what I learned from my dad and apply it to my mom in some ways.

Speaker 9 Like I had to cut her off because I never wanted to,

Speaker 2 um,

Speaker 9 this is probably awful to say, but like it was almost easier to like get the call to say that she passed than to have a, an ongoing relationship with her to constantly be worried because if she's calling me always fucked up, I'm like, okay, like which call is going to be her passing away?

Speaker 9 Like, do you know what I mean? Like she passed away.

Speaker 9 So you don't have the bandwidth to worry about about that no so like for me it was like okay cut her off and when i get the call i get the call but for you like you still had a relationship with your dad throughout and obviously your dad wasn't an addict but um yeah i remember my dad was at the top of the stairs alive and that was like a few months before i was like man

Speaker 2 He's just being a wild. I was like, man, I'm about to take an insurance policy on your ass.
He's like, yeah, you probably should. I was like, probably that's the last thing I said to him.

Speaker 1 I have a wild story about that. About what? My mom? No, insurance fraud.
Oh, it's a real convoluted story. I try to make it as simple as possible.

Speaker 1 A good friend of mine, I've had from high school, we call him Crazy Dan.

Speaker 1 He's very, he's, he's literally crazy, but he's the best guy ever. I would not want to be on his bad side, though.
Good. Because he could probably kill someone.

Speaker 9 Does he, is he going to hear this?

Speaker 1 Side,

Speaker 1 probably not.

Speaker 1 Side note, to tell you a little quick story about Crazy Dan, two things.

Speaker 1 One time we were in Dewey hanging out in the balcony of a hotel and we're standing there just looking down the street, drinking, and all of a sudden he just like just peed, just like pissed.

Speaker 9 Over the balcony?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I have a picture of him. No, like just in his pants.

Speaker 2 Oh.

Speaker 1 And he was in a bane suit leaning up against a rail. I have a picture of him leaning up against the railing with a puddle of piss under his feet.
Is he drunk? No, he just did it just to be funny.

Speaker 1 Yeah, he was drunk. But another time he picked up Mark and my buddy Rob, the one I just talked about, passed away, picked him up from a bar or something.
Dan's like, yeah, go, get in the back seat.

Speaker 1 And this is in probably 2005, 2006.

Speaker 1 And they get in the back seat and there's like blood all over the floor and like 37 37 pagers.

Speaker 9 What's a pager?

Speaker 2 A beeper.

Speaker 9 Oh, a pager. No, no, no.
I was, I was, I was around for the era of pagers. I just didn't know if it was something else.

Speaker 1 But this was still post-pager era.

Speaker 2 But it's so funny.

Speaker 9 I think I've just gotten into high school when you're, you said 2005. Yeah.
I was in high school. I was a freshman in the United States.

Speaker 1 So, yeah, so pagers were big in the 90s. But anyway, they get in, they're like, damn, what the fuck is this?

Speaker 2 And he's like, oh, don't, don't worry about that.

Speaker 1 And just like, just dismiss the bloodstains and the 30 pages sitting on the floor in the car.

Speaker 1 Who knows?

Speaker 9 But anyway. 30 pages.
Like you robbed someone. I was just busy.

Speaker 1 Yeah, crazy.

Speaker 2 Just busy.

Speaker 1 Yeah, good old, good old crazy, crazy Dan. Now I fucking forgot where I was going with that.

Speaker 9 Did you cut him off or something before? No, no.

Speaker 2 Oh, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 Thank you. So one day, Crazy Dan comes over to my house years ago.
He always had some random friend with him. This guy, random friend, don't even know his name.

Speaker 1 We called him Glow Skulls because he had a shirt on with a bunch of like bright green skulls and looked like it would glow in the dark. So we just called him Glow Skulls.

Speaker 1 Okay. And then all of a sudden, months go by.

Speaker 1 Dan calls us and goes, Yo, remember Glow Skulls? I was like, Yeah, he was like, He try not to laugh.

Speaker 1 They're like, He got murdered. It was in like Tennessee.

Speaker 1 Listen, so he gets murdered, right?

Speaker 1 Then fast forward. Oh, yeah, he got shot.

Speaker 1 While

Speaker 1 long time passes, right? There's a fucking a uh a crime show documentary on whatever uh no

Speaker 1 some it was it was about a person that was taking out insurance on somebody without them knowing and then killing them and and collecting the the insurance money and he was a victim of that

Speaker 1 that's wild no yeah he got he he got away with so he killed him i think it was

Speaker 1 he killed they killed him uh got away with it got his insurance money and then did it to someone else and got caught and they trace it back to this guy killed him for his insurance money.

Speaker 9 I've seen that on like crime shows.

Speaker 2 Like, ID

Speaker 1 his story was on ID.

Speaker 9 Oh my god. I wonder if it's the one that I watched.

Speaker 1 Then probably was.

Speaker 1 Then, years later, we tied it all together. Like, holy shit.
Yes, that was him.

Speaker 2 They talked about it.

Speaker 9 Wait, what if he was killing people and got the beepers?

Speaker 1 It wasn't Dan. Oh, it wasn't Dan.

Speaker 9 It wasn't Dan. How is Dan? Is he okay?

Speaker 1 He's he's medicated. He's okay.

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Speaker 9 If you had a nickname for me, what would it be? Because y'all have like good nicknames for everyone. We got Glow Skulls.
We got Crazy Dan. We got like, what would be my nickname?

Speaker 2 You know, you just can't give out a nickname. Why?

Speaker 2 Nicknames typically come from like something you fucked up. Oh.

Speaker 2 So then if you fuck, you've like fucked up something, like, you know, like, you know, in the locker room, like murder boys with football, you fuck something up.

Speaker 2 Like, that's typically how you'll find yourself.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's hard to do on the spot. It would probably be something about having kids and

Speaker 9 crazy kill.

Speaker 9 Crazy band and crazy kill.

Speaker 2 Maybe, I don't know. Yeah.
You got to let it come now. Maybe something loose.
I don't know. Because I don't know.

Speaker 1 Maybe.

Speaker 9 Goosey kill.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Damn.

Speaker 1 For the record, I don't believe you're loose. I don't, I don't believe in that.

Speaker 2 I don't believe in that myth of babies and all that.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I was talking more about the amount of heads that have come out of your body oh okay well thanks that um because people call me a whore all the time so i was just wondering well like i would only use whore with you as a term of endearment oh thank you you know i appreciate that kristen does the same thing yeah yeah

Speaker 1 there's good whores and bad whores yeah i mean

Speaker 9 according to the ed gain docuseries it's a jezebel dude it did you watch it it's disturbing did you watch the edge i'm gonna i'm gonna be so real though and i haven't talked about the ed gain docu series on any other podcast so like i feel like it's a safe space here I cried in episode seven.

Speaker 9 I felt really bad for him. None of that was his fault.

Speaker 9 None of it was like, yes, obviously he killed people, but he didn't even remember killing the people because he was so mentally ill and he gets sick from blood. And like, I get it.

Speaker 9 He was very mentally ill. I get it.
And that's not okay. But there was no resource.
Like all of it could have been prevented.

Speaker 1 When was it? It was in the 40s, right? It was during World War II.

Speaker 9 It was around the same time as the Holocaust.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Which I didn't realize.

Speaker 2 And I don't even know what we're talking about.

Speaker 9 Ed Gein.

Speaker 2 Exactly.

Speaker 9 Do you not know who he is?

Speaker 2 The Texas Chainsaw Massacre was based off of Ed Gein, Leatherface.

Speaker 1 There's a bunch of horror movies that were based off of pieces of him.

Speaker 9 So just to like summarize it all for you, Ed Gein had a really, really unhealthy relationship with his mom. And she was basically like, don't get married to a woman.

Speaker 9 There is sin, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And like, so he was just eager to please his mom.
He wanted to please his mom. His dad was an alcoholic, left the family, whatever.

Speaker 9 Brother died, not confirmed whether Ed had anything to do with that.

Speaker 9 But he was, when his mom died, was so obsessed with trying to bring her back from the dead that he started doing the grave robbing and like

Speaker 9 not killing people. They were already dead.
And then he was like trying to put together like a like essentially like a costume of his mom. And then he had, um, not necrophilia.

Speaker 9 It's not proven that he ever actually had sex with any corpses, but that he would collect like vaginas, like he would cut out their vaginas and like collect them.

Speaker 2 So he was like, he was, he was into like a distasteful art.

Speaker 9 But it turned out that he like they alluded to him possibly having one of the worst cases of schizophrenia yeah because there's a lot of that that docuseries that's not true correct that's like just hollywood fluff correct because i've seen people that come to come to his defense like i definitely think he has this guy suffered big time some of this isn't fair because it's not true i cried in episode seven because i was just like he really was just dealt an unfair hand and honestly they said from everything i've read not the docuseries itself but from what i've read he really thrived in the mental institution they didn't send him to prison they sent him to like um ruled him insane he couldn't stand trial which i would agree with um but what i read was that he he was a model patient in the um he was where he's supposed to be i mean you're closely advocating for him i am and i know that that sounds crazy this might go back to the conversation we had off camera

Speaker 2 damn

Speaker 9 look at tom with the truth series i just feel so bad because i'm like i've seen the girls that are like, my great aunt or my third great aunt was one of the people that he dug up.

Speaker 9 And like, I empathize and sympathize, but like, this is someone so deeply disturbed and it was so out of his, his control. His mom was insane.

Speaker 1 Dude, I watched one episode the other night. It was late night.
I don't like watching shit like that late night before I go to bed. It just fucks me up.
I don't want to happen.

Speaker 2 Night terrors.

Speaker 1 So you'll appreciate this. What I had to do.
I watched an episode. It got done.
And I was like, what the fuck, man? It wasn't going to be a good thing.

Speaker 2 It was probably 10 o'clock.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I i turned on blue mountain state i had to watch blue mountain state for a couple episodes to get my mind right had to give some some fad and morale in my life you know what i mean

Speaker 9 oh gosh no but you should if you can like thug it out i would definitely try to finish it i was going to watch it last night but the kids were in the living room it's long i mean it's eight episodes so it's like really long but i felt i hope nobody gets mad at me for feeling bad for ed gain but you're not the first i've seen other people like come to his defense

Speaker 9 and and not saying that he it's okay that he did all of that he he just didn't have any recollection of killing the two women because he's like, I'm so squeamish.

Speaker 9 Like, I don't, everything that I've read is like he, it was this, possibly the schizophrenia that, like, yeah, I felt real bad for him in the first episode.

Speaker 1 I guess these are spoiler alerts, but you've already spoiled enough.

Speaker 1 When he, when he killed, when he killed his brother and like that's not real. And then he saw his brother come back.
And then the next morning, he saw him in the barn. And I was like, damn, man.

Speaker 9 From what I read,

Speaker 9 there's no confirmation that he actually did that. Like, there's no confirmation.

Speaker 1 The Hollywood thing.

Speaker 2 Yeah. And they're

Speaker 2 like really defending them.

Speaker 2 Jerry, no, he didn't do that. And I fucking.

Speaker 9 I'm also really mad at the woman. What was her name in the docu series? Adeline was like his girlfriend.
It was like this like 20-year like friendship or whatever.

Speaker 1 That bitch.

Speaker 2 She was hot.

Speaker 9 Everything that I was reading was saying that, like, the first like real life interview that she did, she said that they had a romantic relationship for 20 years.

Speaker 9 And then immediately following that interview, she did a second interview. And this is in real life, not in the docuseries, where she backtracked and said it was only platonic.
It was never romantic.

Speaker 9 But I'm leaning towards it was probably a little bit more than you're saying it was. Because if you said that during the first interview, that's probably how you actually

Speaker 2 that's the truth.

Speaker 9 And then the second one was like, oh, I fucked up.

Speaker 2 Yeah. I don't give a bit.
I don't give a fuck that bitch stubs or toe. You know what I mean? So

Speaker 1 man, we are jumping all over the place.

Speaker 9 Oh, that's what happened.

Speaker 2 Going back to dead dads, you know, it is quite a bit.

Speaker 9 Well, to be fair, to circle it all, to bring it all together, like Ed didn't really have a dad either. You know what I mean? Yeah.

Speaker 1 That's what, and that's the thing I feel like, I don't know, maybe not so much you, I don't know, but you know, for Tom and I, like, we had the best dads when we needed them, right?

Speaker 1 And that's like my piece. So it's like, at 22, his job's done.
Like, I missed out on the friendship part, maybe a little late, late life advice. But like, other than that, like i got

Speaker 1 and don't take this wrong way don't take anything i had a phenomenal dad for 22 years yeah you weren't fortunate enough to have that right so like i can recognize that and be like i'm i'm good man like i'm i know some people don't have what i had so like i can't really be upset about that you know you know you know what i mean or it's just like or people dying young or getting upset that they get old like yeah i just turned 45 and some people are like oh my god you're 45 like some people don't get that some people don't get the gift of turning 45 right so like, as you're getting older, you people, and women are like this a lot.

Speaker 1 Like, they're upset when they turn 30, 40, 50. That's me.
Be fucking excited because some people aren't blessed to turn 50. Like, and if you get there, like, that's fucking awesome.

Speaker 1 You know what I mean? And you got, you're, you're going to have young kids when you're 50, you know, younger. You know what I mean?

Speaker 2 But you have to be a little bit more than a hundred.

Speaker 9 I don't ever plan on turning 50.

Speaker 1 You're 49 and a half forever.

Speaker 9 I will be 30.19. It'll be like 30, period 1.9.

Speaker 1 How old are are you right now? I'm 33.

Speaker 2 33.

Speaker 9 God damn it. I know.

Speaker 2 You're old.

Speaker 9 No, you're not old. I have a fear of getting old, not of dying.
I don't want to look old. I don't want to feel old.
I'm very afraid of that.

Speaker 9 Maybe it's vain of me, but I don't want to look old or feel old.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Now, you know what's great about that? Is there's all kinds of medical procedures.

Speaker 9 Yeah, I've had most of them.

Speaker 1 And that's what we talked about this a couple episodes ago on Dude Dads. Like there's like a lot that I don't want to say trending, but a lot of women right now are getting like mommy makeovers.

Speaker 1 As they should, if they want to feel good,

Speaker 9 if they want to feel good, there are certain I, there, there's a whole conversation around plastic surgery in women, especially in moms.

Speaker 9 It fucking chaps my ass when people are like, stop getting work done. But there,

Speaker 9 you cannot fix some things that motherhood does to you. You cannot fix that with gym, diet, exercise.
You cannot.

Speaker 1 You're taking the words out of my mouth.

Speaker 9 And it's so infuriating because, especially, like, I had the genetic, my dad had it.

Speaker 9 If you watch anything from my dad, like this, like the, my dad had it, it, my mom had it, the droopy neck and the jowls, I also had it. My mom had it.
My grandma had it.

Speaker 9 And so like, that was never going to be fixed if I didn't get surgery. Right.

Speaker 9 It doesn't matter how much CrossFit I do, no matter how much working out, no matter how many bike rides I do, it was never going to go away. Yeah.
Stop telling me to stop getting work done.

Speaker 9 In order for me to feel good about myself, I, this is what I feel. I feel like I have to do it.

Speaker 1 And, and like, there's a generation.

Speaker 1 pretty much boomers, I think, that will like judge the younger girls of like, oh, why would you do that to yourself?

Speaker 1 And like, because I fucking can and it makes me happy it makes me feel good about myself and you get that back a little bit why wouldn't you do that Pam went through it I was fully supportive of her getting a mommy makeover and like and all the things she got done it's like okay the money's not going to change our life and you're going to feel great about yourself you're still a mom you still went through all the things you know but you don't have to just accept you know

Speaker 1 something. You know what I mean? It's it's no different than getting old man men getting older and going on TRT.
Like, why wouldn't you want to like like hormone therapy?

Speaker 1 Oh, like there's no, there's no difference. I mean, you want to age gracefully, yeah, you have an ability to do it, especially

Speaker 9 just because like times have changed too. Like 50 years ago, there wasn't social media and things like that, and like events and like working network things the same way that they are.

Speaker 9 I mean, there was, but not the same way. And I just, I don't know, I feel, I personally feel like a better mom when I look good and feel good about myself because I feel good.

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Speaker 9 I don't know if there's a direct correlation, but like I get my daughter

Speaker 9 ready every single day. Like I'm doing her hair, I'm getting her ready.

Speaker 9 Like I want her to feel good about herself, not because her looks matter, but how she, if she feels good, like I tell her, oh my gosh, she looks so beautiful.

Speaker 9 Like if she feels good about how she looks, she's going to feel good about everything she does. I hope.

Speaker 1 And then know how to like, because, well, you're saying with your daughter now, she's one, two. She's two.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 And then like Charlotte is 12. Yeah.
She gets herself ready. And she probably loves it.
And she looks phenomenal.

Speaker 9 When she gets ready, she probably feels better. Yep.

Speaker 1 She cares up. She has her skincare routine at nighttime.
She does, puts a little fucking band on her head and, you know, does her, does her stuff. And then in the morning, she's on her own.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Her hair's nice and tight.

Speaker 2 But she probably feels good.

Speaker 1 Yeah, but but it's because she

Speaker 1 was taught that. She went through the same stuff when she was a little kid, like you're talking about.
She sees her mom caring about herself, so she cares about herself because that shit does matter.

Speaker 9 But I will say, I hope that I could teach my daughter that like

Speaker 9 she's got to still take care of herself. Like your looks aren't everything.
You should still like. truly take care of yourself.

Speaker 1 Yeah, there's all, there's a bunch of pieces of all that stuff. Just talking about the physical aspect of like just having some effort.

Speaker 9 Yeah, just putting a little effort in, feeling good about how you look, how you're dressed, whatever. It'll change the productivity of your whole day.

Speaker 2 I feel. No, it'll be.

Speaker 9 Because it's the same for men because y'all could just roll out of the bed and look at it.

Speaker 1 Jerry don't give a fuck what he wears.

Speaker 9 But like Jerry just gives me like

Speaker 9 badass vibes. Like he's just such like a cool dude.
You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 He's himself, that's for sure.

Speaker 2 But like, you know, he's like.

Speaker 9 hunting, fishing, whatever, wrestling.

Speaker 1 He got out of the truck today, walking to school, and he puts his fucking

Speaker 2 vipers. Yes, that's it.

Speaker 1 And he just puts them on he puts them on he goes these are my friday glasses i wear these every friday tji like with his mullet you know what i mean he has a cool mullet yeah and that and it's it's a pain in the ass because it's like now i'm back to like i'm taking care of charlotte's hair in the morning go like to brush his hair and oh yeah does he let you brush it he does it himself now did y'all have mullets growing up no i mean how old are you i had shaggy hair i'll be 40 this year Oh, I didn't realize that y'all, there was such five years between y'all.

Speaker 2 Yep. Oh, yep.

Speaker 1 Yeah, just under five years. But I think, well, obviously, Muller's are coming back.
I think what I'm going to do with Jerry when he wants to get rid of it, I'm going to bring back the rat tail.

Speaker 9 Oh, no. Jerry, that's where I draw the line.
What?

Speaker 2 We're not doing the rat tail. I let him rock it for a couple weeks.

Speaker 9 The kids that grew up having rat tails when I was in elementary school, like I didn't, like, it was like gross.

Speaker 9 Like, it, do you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 It was just like

Speaker 2 it's like the porn star mustache came back.

Speaker 9 Don't know, that's the pedo stash. Or the

Speaker 1 old baseball players.

Speaker 9 They need to stop making fetch happen because it's not cute make what happen fetch what's what's fetch come on man you're talking to dude dads here fetch is it's like you saying you're gonna bring oh i get what you're saying okay you're trying to make something happen that's not gonna happen and

Speaker 9 the pedo stash is never gonna happen pito stash and then the rat tail is never gonna like that was never cute and it's never gonna be cute i i you will hear it from me first i bet in 10 years-ish the rat tail is gonna come back that's about our cycle where we're at.

Speaker 1 With the mullets are popular, the big shaggy hair is popular, which was in like the late 70s, early 80s.

Speaker 1 In like early 90s, late 80s, the rat tail was big. I think in about another eight to 10 years, you're going to start seeing some rat tails.

Speaker 9 That's disgusting.

Speaker 2 I have been saying the word fetch for at least, I don't know, I would say the last three years, but I like to, I'm still trying to bring it back from the movie Clueless. No, mean girls.

Speaker 2 Mean girls, yeah, yeah. Those mean girls were mean girls, yeah.
That's so fetch.

Speaker 9 Yes, so fetch. Don't say that.

Speaker 2 So fetch.

Speaker 2 Anyway, going back to dead dads. Speaking of kids,

Speaker 2 what happens when your dad dies early? It certainly puts a

Speaker 2 timelines your life. The kids already timeline your life, but when you have a dead dad in there,

Speaker 2 I cannot help

Speaker 2 think more of death, my own death, the time it's going to be.

Speaker 2 And I always think back, like, where was my parents at at this moment, my age with me? you know, and I try to make sure like, oh, yeah, the comparison.

Speaker 2 I just can't, I cannot, that, unfortunately, that's probably the only trauma that came, you know, like that it has seemed to stick is the almost not the fear of death, but like thinking about it, probably too much of my, like, because I'm now the dad, you know, for my son, and I don't have, you know, a dad.

Speaker 2 I think, like, I think some people, this is my view of things, like

Speaker 2 people that have both their parents, you know, and if their parents are taking care of themselves, they still are the kid.

Speaker 2 And they kind of don't think about the time that their parents are going to die.

Speaker 2 And if they have kids, I don't think maybe they don't think about their own death in that way and like maybe enjoying the moment as much, thinking about, well, this is, this is age, this is when we should do that.

Speaker 2 And only 20 years later from now, one of them dies.

Speaker 2 You know, it's like, this is so like, you don't even know this moment's really how special it is because there's only so many few years later, somebody's dying.

Speaker 2 So I kind of have that in the back of my head. So I think like with me having that experience, I'm like, I have these moments where I'm living up.

Speaker 2 I'm like, I treat a lot more moments like, all right, man, this is like the best. I'm gonna make the most of this because, like, who the fuck knows?

Speaker 2 You know, at one point, I'm gonna have to outlive my dad's age, you know, like it just that's probably the only trauma left.

Speaker 2 Is I do think about my death, how it's gonna affect my kids, and when is it gonna be? And now, it's like, I better get in healthy ass shape, like, I can't die early on them, you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 So, it's like there's a different motivation there.

Speaker 1 I'll tell you what, what else is uh, my dad was 43 when he died, and you've already surpassed that, and I've surpassed it. And leading up to me turning 43, it like fucked with my head a lot.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 I thought I was weird. Like, I thought that's like, I did, I said it to Pam.
I didn't say it to anybody else. And I had it to the day where I was going to be alive longer than my dad was.

Speaker 1 Like, it was sometime in like January when I turned, you know, after I turned 43. And it was like the day was coming.
And I was like, oh my God.

Speaker 1 Like, and then the day after, I was like, I'm, I was officially older than my dad was. And it's, and in my head, I'm like, I'm still, I'm just a kid.

Speaker 1 I'm not an adult I can't like what he knew everything

Speaker 1 all the time I still feel like me and Mark were talking about this the other day like I got a problem I call his dad because it was my dad's best friend my mom's cousin I call him up because I feel like he's he's he's more of an adult than you he's more of an adult he know he has to know more than me I'm just I'm just a dumb you know I'm 45 but I'm just like a dumb 20 year old I don't know shit you knew you have all the answers not me but like thinking about my wait a minute my dad was here too did he think the same way and then like oh my god am i gonna die because and then i was at a wedding one time and uh i had this end up having this conversation at a bar with it was actually the the bride's father who i didn't even know and he was like dude he said i went through that too he's like you're not weird he said the same thing he's like you're gonna be okay he's like my dad like his dad died when his dad was 50 and he was like i was just i i wanted to kick off that age so much because i didn't I didn't know what was going to happen.

Speaker 1 And it like, it makes you think, I don't even know how to explain it.

Speaker 2 It makes you feel weird, though it makes you feel like i'm not normal thinking like this but he was like no man you're that's normal i promise you you're gonna be okay yeah that was a cool conversation to have the other part of that we've talked about this the other part that sucks about that too is is for men is the fact that our sons will not get to meet their grandfather and i feel like no

Speaker 2 you know no no diss to the grandfather on the on the wife's side but like this is the male dominant fucking this is what we are you know and if you never get to meet your your grandfather, you never really get to meet your dad as much, you know.

Speaker 2 Like, if you get to see the grandfather, you get to see your dad, who he was. Like, you see a lineage there.

Speaker 9 I see what you're saying.

Speaker 2 And, you know, so I, I did not meet my dad's grandfather or dad. I never had a grandfather on my dad's side.
And so I only knew my dad. And I don't know anything past him.

Speaker 2 I don't know a lineage, you know. So I

Speaker 2 make it's not going to know that. So I'm like, that fucking sucks.
Like, he would have loved me. I even thought Candace, like, you would have loved my dad.

Speaker 9 You know, oh, Candace, your wife never met your dad? No.

Speaker 2 and i was like man you would have loved him like you know it's just like if for him to be here now like this is when he was like most needed like this now would have been cool like i've like he could have seen who and where i come from you know seeing that pedigree you know you know what you know the funniness that you know all the all the just the it would help my wife too she could even see like this is this is where i come from you know me like this to help her kind of understand me more and uh and jerry and i talked i brought this question up you know is is having you know having a dad die early and having no sons ever meet their grandfather and their dad's side does that raise harder men you know i don't know you know because you're always fighting to to maybe create some type of pedigree because there's no lineage like that's two decades of no lineage like so like yeah hopefully i'm gonna be the first start of like i'm gonna be the first grandfather in a hundred years you know what i mean like that we're gonna make this thing happen

Speaker 2 that way if someone's uh the male side like the male side is sitting there at the table whether thanksgiving christmas there is a there's there's a pass-off you know

Speaker 2 my son could be like i really like my grandfather So if I have a grandchild, he's only like, I really love my grandfather. I understand where I come from more.

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Speaker 2 You should have started earlier. Yeah,

Speaker 2 yeah, I'll be old.

Speaker 9 I love my grandfather. My grandfather died in 2014, but he was, I loved my grandfather.

Speaker 1 Was this your dad's dad?

Speaker 9 My mom's dad.

Speaker 1 Okay, do you ever know your dad's side?

Speaker 9 No.

Speaker 9 of the both of his parents were dead, but his dad is not even who he thinks.

Speaker 9 When he died, he thought someone was his dad that is not his dad.

Speaker 1 Oh, that's fucking crazy.

Speaker 9 Yeah, so mighty. And my aunt asked me to not tell him.
I think for him to die, like thinking whatever he thought is fine. Yeah, that's not important, right?

Speaker 1 Was it like adultery or

Speaker 9 my

Speaker 9 who he thought was his dad could not have children?

Speaker 9 So,

Speaker 9 and I don't know if it was known that he couldn't have children, but basically my grandmother went, was like, my husband can't have children. Can you please knock me up kind of deal?

Speaker 9 And then went back to her husband.

Speaker 2 I would like to have that job.

Speaker 9 Would you just like procreate all over the place?

Speaker 1 I might.

Speaker 1 I might.

Speaker 2 I'm like, seriously considering it.

Speaker 1 I remember I joked with a friend of ours. I won't mention her name because she probably does listen to this.
All she wanted was to have a baby.

Speaker 1 And you thought about it. And I was like, and I made a joke, like, I mean, I'll be that guy for you if you want.
And Pam's like, you're, you're snipped, Jerry. I'm like, don't tell her.

Speaker 2 Yeah, but you can go. Oh, oh,

Speaker 2 don't tell her that. I don't know what's going on.

Speaker 9 But you can still go get like your sperm pulled out, even if you're snipped.

Speaker 2 You can? Yeah.

Speaker 2 Oh, I said that.

Speaker 1 Speaking of which, I'm at that like seven-year mark post-vasectomy. And apparently that's when like shit can.

Speaker 1 has grown back together. I'm like, what? I'm going to go get tested just to make sure.
Are you serious?

Speaker 9 Yeah, I've heard enough of those stories where I'm like, I want to go get tested again to make sure I ain't got no swimmers they say around like the seven year markish if it's gonna happen that's when it happens i have never heard that in my whole life yeah people go like oh yeah i've had a vasectomy and then they just like blast in everywhere and all of a sudden your wife turns up pregnant yeah and like i cannot have that but wait i was gonna say something to your point about like the grandfather thing is like it's so interesting that you say that because i it brought me back to my childhood before hit the fan and like My grandfather was always in my life, but like the women are the ones who ran the family.

Speaker 9 Like my great-grandmother, my mom's grandmother, and then my mom's mom were the ones who like were the glue and like kept shit going. It wasn't the men, which is so funny.
Really?

Speaker 9 Yeah, it was the women. It was always.
I'll tell you what, man.

Speaker 9 My grandfather was like, kind of like y'all. Like, you kind of, not that you're old, but like.
personality-wise, kind of remind me of my grandfather.

Speaker 9 No, he was just like a hunter, a hunter, a fisherman, like built shit, like was like, he worked on guns, like he had a workshop, like, you know what I mean? Like, shit like that.

Speaker 9 He was a dude, dad, you know, like a dude grandpa. And so, um,

Speaker 9 but even with that energy and like what you're describing like really masculine energy like the women still ran shit really yeah

Speaker 1 we were I know when my dad died that's when like shit my family fell apart like interesting it felt like not

Speaker 1 well some ways bad but but also other ways just like that's when big family dinners stopped happening when like extended families stopped getting together when your dad died yeah interesting and it's and it's it wasn't intentional.

Speaker 1 No. It just seemed like when like a certain patriarch is gone, then you, it just stops for some reason.
And like, I hate it. And it's one reason why,

Speaker 1 one of the million reasons why I love Pam's family, because they are massive on traditions. I mean, huge.
Their holiday dinners and their traditions that they hold are like really tight, really big.

Speaker 1 And like, I fucking love it because I still get that. We still get the big Christmas, big Thanksgiving.

Speaker 1 Our Thanksgiving with her family literally is eaten in two shifts.

Speaker 1 The men eat first and the women hang out, drink wine, pick at desserts, and then the women eat dinner and then the men go eat dessert because there's so many fucking people.

Speaker 2 Hey, don't, don't, don't leave out what you said on our podcast. Don't fucking shy away from you saying who does the cleaning.

Speaker 1 The men do, the men do the dishes, yeah.

Speaker 9 As they should, yeah, as they should.

Speaker 2 He was very proud of the menu.

Speaker 1 But the women, it's nice to see like the

Speaker 1 great ants and all that stuff. When the men are done eating, they come clear of the plate from you in front of you and stuff like that.

Speaker 2 I think all two of you could, everybody has an addiction in there. Did you find like eventually,

Speaker 2 like, I remember my dad, like, I went from someone that I was like super proud with to someone I was going to be embarrassed by. So, like, we had like a Thanksgiving, like, you talk about like

Speaker 2 Thanksgivings and Christmas dinners all start slowing down. I can remember like a last few couple there.
I'm like, man, I hope my dad does not say anything weird weird or inappropriate or like.

Speaker 9 See, what's interesting about that, because y'all know my mom is also an addict and an alcoholic. My mom was on her best behavior around our family.

Speaker 9 She was not drinking at Christmas or Thanksgiving. She had to be on her best behavior, well-dressed, keep it together, almost to like a point where it was like, okay, shut the fuck up.

Speaker 9 Like you are not doing all of these things. Shut up.

Speaker 2 You know, my dad never had like any weird, like, it never like some weird outbursts or anything like that. It just might be like everyone, no one's coming to the truth yet moment.

Speaker 2 like everyone's like because you know like my in-laws or i mean not my in-laws but like my my uncles and aunts would call me like hey what's what's going on at the house like are your parents on drugs like you know we're hearing things and stuff like you know like and then you go to i'm like i i don't know what's going on and uh

Speaker 2 And then you show up to a dinner. Like, you know, my dad might be like slurring or saying like some inappropriate shit, like trying to make a joke.
That's like, what the fuck is going on?

Speaker 2 But not like some outburst or nothing like that. Just like, everyone's like, what's going on right now? Like, this is not them or something, you know, something like that, you know?

Speaker 9 Did anyone like rally to try to help save the house or anything?

Speaker 2 We tried.

Speaker 2 Yeah, my brother got them hooked up, like, I think on some type of, you know, payment schedule where they could just, if they, it's like, we were on the last leg of like, you just make these payments.

Speaker 2 Just make these payments. Like, that's all you have to do.
It's been whatever they do at the end there where they can, you know, you get on a payment schedule essentially.

Speaker 2 And like, if you just make these and they just couldn't do it. I remember yelling at my dad.
We were trying to clean the house out. And I was just like, I remember leaving.
I was just yelling at him.

Speaker 2 I was like, Kimberly, you fucking lost the house and everything i was just i just left home did your dad die in the house across the street from me no oh he did he died in an apartment no because you know like his his childhood home is across the street from my house oh i did not know your house that you live in now oh interesting yeah i thought he died there no they died in newcastle

Speaker 2 um because i sold that house and i conveniently left that out because i thought i'm like i wanted to tell you to the to the buyers who are buying it like yeah my buddy's dad died top of these stairs but i because i thought it was there well thank god because now you didn't lie by omission either no no it was it was uh no it was it was up there i remember we're when my boys came up when we cleaned the house out and stuff and mom's like you know like saying goodbye in there like the the she was like the the neighbor wants uh uh the the the bed set and stuff i'm like that bitch i threw that i threw that bed set right in the trash bedset is crazy i was like she was like did you throw it away like you wanted i'm like that bitch i'm like she can go lose her own fucking father i'm like fuck that bitch and i mean like fuck this bed set let's get the fuck out of shithole newcastle like wrap it it up.

Speaker 2 You're coming back with me. I'm buying a house.
That's where they fucked this place.

Speaker 9 With the holidays approaching and having dead dads that were present in y'all's lives, do you have any advice? Not necessarily,

Speaker 9 I can't give advice because my dad wasn't around, but like, is there any advice that you have for people that lost someone close to the holidays?

Speaker 9 And maybe this is their first holiday season without a loved one.

Speaker 1 Yeah, that the firsts are rough. My, my dad died December 7th.

Speaker 2 So right before Christmas.

Speaker 9 After Thanksgiving, right before Christmas.

Speaker 1 Yeah, so the first, like, I remember, like, I was still home, you know, Christmas. I still lived

Speaker 1 at my house, my parents' house. And like Christmas morning,

Speaker 1 you know, you just, and it's just your mom sitting on the end of the couch, and me and my sister opening presents. And

Speaker 1 I had this thing always,

Speaker 1 my whole entire life,

Speaker 1 I would, we have Christmas, everybody opened presents when you were a kid. And I would always say, like, oh, this is the best Christmas ever.
And that like carried into like my teens.

Speaker 1 And I still would always say because my mom like waited for me to say, this is the best Christmas ever. oh

Speaker 1 and i'm like trying not to cry um i thought i'd get through this without the without doing this

Speaker 1 and like the first christmas without my dad and you just you you go through with it because you're this is it's still christmas right the world doesn't give a fuck it's still happening and

Speaker 1 opening presents and all that stuff and we get done and my mom

Speaker 1 my mom goes

Speaker 1 I'm really sorry. This isn't the best Christmas ever.

Speaker 2 And you're like, what the fuck, man?

Speaker 1 And that was literally the last time I ever said it. You know what I mean? It was just like dumb shit, right? Like that, right? But,

Speaker 1 but yeah, like as far as like moving forward, like it's the world does not stop. And there's still people you have to live for, you know what I mean? Including who you lost.

Speaker 1 You still have to live for them. What are you going to do? Like not get your kids Christmas?

Speaker 1 Like like literally every every woman in here is crying.

Speaker 2 Because it's fucked up.

Speaker 1 Are you like not gonna get you're not gonna get your kids christmas like you am i not gonna celebrate my kids not gonna celebrate my niece and nephews so like that's really the thing is you have to go you have to live for them and you can't focus on oh well dad's not here anymore oh look at you thank you kristen

Speaker 1 dad dad's not here anymore and you know all those like bad things which is so easy to get sucked into it's way easier god damn it kale

Speaker 1 It's way easier to get sucked into like all the bad shit and you could sulk. That's that's easy.
You've got to like live for them and keep traditions going for them. You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 Because we're all going to experience it at some point. Some point I'm going to die, and Pam's going to have the first without me.

Speaker 1 And I don't want them to not have a good Christmas or a good Thanksgiving.

Speaker 2 You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 That's really, that's really the only thing.

Speaker 2 Yeah, that's

Speaker 2 yours. Went that way.
But

Speaker 2 mine, you know, yours got worse, and mine probably got better because, like I said,

Speaker 2 we already lost. We already lost those.
The Christmases, they became,

Speaker 2 there wasn't, like, by the end, like, there was no gifts. Like, so literally, like, you know, I don't even remember, man.
I just don't remember the first ones.

Speaker 1 You're probably a little bit relieved. Like, it was a little bit less stressful.

Speaker 2 This is, this is, Jerry and I talked about, is the sadness that happens when the person who's addicted to the drugs, especially heroin, like, this is fucking, like, there's a whole train loss there.

Speaker 2 You literally lose everything. Like, there's a fucking, like, there's a, there's a roadmap to, like, you, it just fucking to death, you just start losing everything.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 so

Speaker 2 there's some relief to like the train, the fucking train of madness is over. You know what I mean? Like it's like, all right, well, that's all done.
Like,

Speaker 2 you start your own things. Now you start like rebuilding.
And so like the first Christmas, whatever, I'm just like, you know, you can start, you can, you know,

Speaker 2 it is. It's just real.
And so you start, you know, get my mom gifts and like, I'm the man. So I get her all her shit, you know, got her a house and all that.

Speaker 2 Like, you know, make sure she's coming there for dinner. It's like, hey,

Speaker 2 it's my role to get the, you know, get the family thing going. Everyone's not coming.
It's just going to be us. You know what I mean? It's like my family and my mom.

Speaker 2 You know, so you come over, you know, we're going to start our own new traditions. There's going to be presents for you.
Is what the fuck it is. So let's get it rolling.

Speaker 2 So like, but we had already lost the Christmas. So now they're just getting better and we're just, we're rebuilding.
You know what I mean? And my dad completely different things.

Speaker 2 Yeah, he didn't, because he didn't go. My dad, I mean, the day that's sad, he didn't go out near Christmas, but my dad did do.
He was, he did plan it well, and he went out on Father's Day.

Speaker 2 So Father's Day is a little different for me. You know what I mean? I'm like, you know what I mean? It's a little different.
He's going to fucking do it. Let's just do it.

Speaker 2 Let's just hit her on the head.

Speaker 1 What a Father's Day. But now you get to celebrate with your son.
Yeah. Because that's another thing, right? For dads out there, you might not have a lot of dads listening, but maybe daughters.

Speaker 1 The first Father's Day is rough too, right? And I remember years, like, I just, Father's Day was bullshit. And even, even into me having my own kids.

Speaker 1 And I remember Pam said to me one time, he's like, You know, you have kids trying to celebrate you.

Speaker 2 Like, don't. Why am I going to cry again?

Speaker 1 Because you're in the zone. You're in the crying zone.
And it was, and it snapped me out of it like that. Like, I, so you're talking when I had, you know, Charlotte, I was in my early 30s.

Speaker 1 I guess I was, yeah, 33. Yeah.
And, um,

Speaker 1 so it was years after that, even my dad died in 2002. And I was still kind of like mopey on that Father's Day.
And it was, it was a jealousy because I get to see Pam celebrate her dad.

Speaker 1 And it was like, there's some jealousy there, we're being honest. Like, God damn it.
I wish I had that. Like, I'm so jealous that you have this.

Speaker 1 And it just one day, Pam just hit me with the hard truth. She's like, you, you have kids trying to celebrate you now.
And it just, that ended it for me. I was like, you know what?

Speaker 1 You're fucking right. Can't do this anymore.
Can't be sad on Father's Day. You know, that's being selfish because,

Speaker 1 because again, the world keeps fucking going. It does

Speaker 2 have talked about that. Like, I've reminded her sometimes on like

Speaker 2 it's bittersweet. Well, we're just going to do a lot with her side of the family, right? And all this stuff.
And sometimes I'm like, yeah, I don't really want to do all that. Like, can we just do it?

Speaker 2 She's like, why do you always try to get out of these things? I'm like, I'm not trying to get out all of them. I'm just saying, like, you know, it's my day too.

Speaker 2 Like, and don't forget, like, y'all are hanging out. Like, also, I don't have that shit.
So, like, sometimes I just want it real personal between us. Yeah.
You know what I mean?

Speaker 2 Because, like, it's not feeling that way. Yeah.
So I'm going to take it personal if I don't want to do all of them. You know what I mean?

Speaker 9 It's like, that's like it's like a bittersweet. Obviously, it's no shade to anybody on her side, but it's like you're going through it too.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 I don't know. And it's not really a big deal.
I mean, it just is what it is. Like, you know, it's just as a look.
Like Jerry and I say, we're lucky.

Speaker 2 Our dads raised us with a lot of confidence and to be men. So it's like, you know, just literally stepping there, my dad, hugging my mom, like, whatever.
I fucking got this. Let's roll, dude.

Speaker 2 You know what I mean? Like, let's just fucking roll on this. That's the thing with men.

Speaker 1 And like, probably a lot of women will probably crucify me for this, but, like, being a man can be hard because no one is there to save you. Like, nobody.

Speaker 2 Like, emotionally, you mean? Yeah.

Speaker 1 Like, nobody's going to be there. Nobody's coming for us.
So we got to be like, all right, well, fuck it. This is, this is my role now.
That's what I got to do.

Speaker 1 With right now with my sister, like, I'm just helping my mom, helping my sister's boyfriend, trying to get him back on his feet. The kids, like, that's all I care about.
She's gone.

Speaker 1 That's done. But I still got a job to do.

Speaker 1 Now I got to now.

Speaker 9 Your dad's not here to help. You gotta sort of be that person.

Speaker 1 Yeah. And everybody else is suffering.
So I gotta be that person. You know, and that doesn't mean I didn't mourn or nothing like that, but you gotta push it aside.

Speaker 1 And it's like, nobody's coming for me. I gotta be here for those people.
And that's our responsibility. There's no other way to do it.
It's just that's the response. That's the way the world is.

Speaker 2 There's no time for you to be hysterical and all this shit and all that.

Speaker 9 I'm not a man, but I am the provider. I'm the sole provider for five of my kids.

Speaker 9 And they feel very much like masculine, like uh like i'm the provider i'm the person that does that so in some ways i can't you are you are the exception though you know what i mean so i like have to be both parents yeah we're not we're not throwing shade on any no no no no i didn't take it that way i was just saying like i could i could really

Speaker 9 i'm not a male but i could relate to that a little bit is like aside from the girls like

Speaker 9 family-wise nobody's checking on me nobody's making sure that i'm good nobody's i mean my uncle texted me and was like oh like sorry for your loss like raymond died or whatever but it's like

Speaker 9 that's it

Speaker 2 that's it that's the way the world is you just keep on okay yep one thing that's like

Speaker 1 was a was a real aha moment as dumb as it sounds remember like days after my dad died I was getting gas in my car and uh I was sitting there pumping gas and I'm sad and I'm like looking around at everybody else that's at the gas station and everybody's doing their thing getting their shit starting their day and I remember thinking like what the fuck are you doing like Don't you know, like, there's something going on?

Speaker 1 Like, how are you? Just going about life. How are you doing this?

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 that night, I was at my grandparents' house. I was talking to my puppet, and I told him about that.
He was like, Yeah, he said,

Speaker 1 Life don't stop. The world, he's like, They got their own stuff too.

Speaker 1 And I, and at 22, I was like, Oh, fuck, he's right. Damn, I didn't never even thought about it.

Speaker 2 It hurts, though.

Speaker 9 And it's like, it's nobody's fault.

Speaker 2 But how dare you pump your gas right now?

Speaker 9 No, but literally, like, I went to Wawa when I, I don't remember. I think it was like around the time that my dad died.
And I'm thinking to myself, like,

Speaker 9 same sort of like, like, what are we doing? doing like life it wasn't like a what are you doing it was more like a

Speaker 9 what the fuck like yeah

Speaker 2 essentially the same concept is what I'm saying I can't explain it in words but you felt what I felt yes and I was just like that's it like that's it yep we just keep going yep I could tell you no no immediate family there ain't no one that called me to check in like yo how you doing you know I mean

Speaker 2 none of it just like it was just like no one checked in like your time you're right because I'm the only I'm the one doing all, like, making all shit. Like, you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 People like when I bought my mom the house and then we're doing like, I mean, you got to see somebody, you know, at a function. It's like, oh, you're doing a great job.
You're like, all right, yeah.

Speaker 2 Well, no, you motherfuckers called.

Speaker 2 Matter of fact, if you didn't call me at my worst, don't call me at my best either. But you know what? I didn't expect no call.
I mean,

Speaker 2 I don't expect no help. I mean, I guess we just, we don't, we didn't, I don't have that in our family, whatever that distant habit.
I didn't expect it anyway. It's like, it's all good.

Speaker 2 I like the fact that I took care of it all anyway, selfishly. I'm like, fuck it.
That's my job. I'm built to do it.
So I'll do it all. Yeah.

Speaker 9 Makes sense. Well, thank you guys for coming on Barely Famous.
Jerry has a barber appointment.

Speaker 2 Thank you.

Speaker 2 I got

Speaker 2 probably like this motherfucker said he'd be going for an hour. Where the fuck's he's at?

Speaker 9 I appreciate it. So, no TikToks today.
Next time.

Speaker 1 Having us our little

Speaker 1 dude dads on the gigantic Barely Famous. We love it.

Speaker 9 Well, everyone should go listen to Barely.

Speaker 9 Everyone should go listen to the Dude Dads podcast on Spotify, Apple, wherever you get podcasts. Where can people find you on Instagram?

Speaker 1 Everywhere. The dude dads podcast on TikTok, TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, YouTube, all of it.

Speaker 2 Just go hit the follow button. It's easy.
Takes you a second.

Speaker 1 It helps us tremendously. It takes you one second.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 we could use some reviews on Spotify. Keep boosting us up so we can keep building up that ladder and so we can do more.

Speaker 1 Bro, I think we made 27 cents last month.

Speaker 9 That's amazing.

Speaker 2 Bro, first off, it's real. He sent me like, it was like two bucks.
I was like, yo, no jokes, like jokes aside.

Speaker 1 Like, I know it's only like $2, but but like it's real we said something uh two years ago and now it's monetarily like it happened like it's real like it's remember i told you i said it might as well have been five thousand dollars yeah no because it's it's the start of something which is so exciting so fucking pumped about it ladies listening um i know someone's experienced something we talked about today um y'all have husbands brothers dads friends right make sure you send a send them to us at least this show go give us a follow we talk a lot of but we talk about a lot of real shit too.

Speaker 2 We talk about, we don't, we do not have a cheesy podcast. We get right to it.
We get into things that you probably are thinking that you wish someone else was talking about.

Speaker 2 You want to hear those same life experiences and how they're handled. And that's what we do.

Speaker 1 So send your men over to the Dude Dads podcast.

Speaker 2 Come on.

Speaker 19 This October, Fear is free on Pluto TV with horror movie collections from paranormal activity, The Ring. You will die in seven days.
Scream. And from dusk till dawn.

Speaker 1 This is my kind of place.

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Speaker 18 I'm Justin Sylvester.

Speaker 9 And I'm Blakely Thornton.

Speaker 13 Join us for Yesterdays, the podcast where we break down the most pivotal pop culture moments in history and give them the queer love that they deserve.

Speaker 18 The things that got us riled up during dial-up, those makeouts that should have been breakouts, and the drops that were cemented in pop. I'm talking Benifer, Tyra vs.

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