Aly & AJ: Disney & Dating Disasters

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Speaker 2 What is up, Daddy Gang?

Speaker 1 It is your founding father, Alex Cooper, with Call Her Daddy, Daddy, Daddy, Daddy.

Speaker 1 Allie and AJ, welcome to Call Her Daddy. Thank you for having us.
You guys, the last time we saw each other was we were hanging out backstage at my tour, and you were the loveliest people.

Speaker 1 And I always have these moments because I'm like, I watched you guys growing up. Obviously, I love you guys, your music, all of it.

Speaker 1 But meeting you guys in person was so fun to be like, oh my God, you guys are like normal girls and we're all just hanging out. So I'm so happy we're finally doing this.

Speaker 3 Same. Same.

Speaker 2 So happy to be here. So I'm so happy to be.

Speaker 1 So happy to be here. Okay.
If you guys are not like touring, if you're not working, if you don't have all the chaos of your life, what is your most fun thing that you guys usually like to do together?

Speaker 4 We're big like spa people and we kind of have been since we were young. Like we were like hanging out in a spa at like 10 and 12 and we were just loving it.

Speaker 4 And our parents would be like, I don't know. They just like love hot dry saunas and getting massages.

Speaker 1 Oh, I love this for you. So like

Speaker 4 spa. So spa.

Speaker 2 Spa. You're going to the spa.

Speaker 1 If you stay off, you're going to the spa together.

Speaker 2 That's our number one. That's our number one.

Speaker 4 I mean, literally, it's like a movie, like just on AJ's couch, just like

Speaker 1 ordering in. Yeah.
How like often do you guys hang out?

Speaker 2 All the time.

Speaker 1 Yeah, all the time. Like every day?

Speaker 3 Well, no, because now that she's a mom. She's just me, yeah.

Speaker 3 So now that she's a mom, it's not every day. And also, we don't live down the street from each other.

Speaker 4 We literally used to live. I'm not even kidding you.
Like me in my car

Speaker 4 driving to AJ's four minutes. I could walk to her house in like 20.

Speaker 2 Wait, how far now? Now I'm like an hour and a half. What? Yeah, I know.
What happened? Well,

Speaker 2 I had a kid. She's like, I'm like, AJ.

Speaker 4 Well, really, we moved for like, to be closer to my mom. My mom lives out in San Yanez.
So we were like, okay, if we're closer to her, that will help with, you know, just like child care or whatever.

Speaker 4 Of course.

Speaker 4 And then having more space because the house house that we live in in that we lived in in the canyon that we ended up renting out is like a super cool pad but it's more like it's for a couple it's not really for a kid so we we ended up renting a place that just had more space like so we kind of were just like we'll see but we still it's only an hour and a half i visit

Speaker 1 every week actually yes but would you ever move I love Santa Barbara.

Speaker 2 Okay, you're happy in Santa Barbara. She would.
I'd move there in a second. Okay.
Okay. Okay.
That makes me feel good.

Speaker 3 I really would. I'm not ready yet.
I really love where I am. Yeah.
But I think down the road I would. I absolutely would.
And I think it's a beautiful place to raise a son.

Speaker 1 Do you guys play the typical like older, younger sister roles? Do you feel like, or is there anything that you're like, I don't act like a younger sister or an older sister in this way?

Speaker 4 I think they were swapped when we were younger.

Speaker 2 Oh, really? Very much.

Speaker 4 I'm kind of younger sister and she was like older sisters.

Speaker 3 And then it switched.

Speaker 4 Like, we always joke how when I was young, I was very shy.

Speaker 4 Really shy. And I would.
have her just kind of, you were like my translator.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 3 She would like nudge me. It's like, and I'd be like, she wants a turkey sub.
No cheese and X, no mustard, no mustard, X, or whatever. And it was like, literally, I would speak.
She knew.

Speaker 4 She like knew. It was very strange.

Speaker 3 Always inspired her. You got out of that, though.
I got out of it.

Speaker 4 And then I think it swapped to being like, okay, now I guess I'm going to be able to do it.

Speaker 3 You don't translate for me, but yeah.

Speaker 2 You're like,

Speaker 2 you never did.

Speaker 1 Never. But I think what's interesting is like, obviously, you guys then, like, at a pretty young age, got into the spotlight.

Speaker 1 So like, you don't think that a kid would be shy that then gets into like this industry. When Disney entered the conversation, were your parents at all like, this is like too much?

Speaker 1 Do they ever try to talk you guys out of it?

Speaker 3 No, at that point, we were fully in. Like sad card in hand, doing commercials.

Speaker 2 Well, not you, not me. Because I got my sad card.

Speaker 3 Your first gig was Phil of the Future.

Speaker 4 Yeah, yeah. So like I didn't even have, like, I, I mean, I knew the basics of like, this is a mark and stuff, but I learned like everything on that set.

Speaker 1 Oh my God, wait, your first gig was Phil of the Future?

Speaker 2 Yeah, forget. That was like kind of like kind of the biggest fights ever.
Wait, what?

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's funny. Yeah.
When you guys, like, I obviously was thinking before I like sat down with you.

Speaker 1 I'm like, when you look back at that era, you think about like, you think about you guys, you think about Demi, you think about Miley, you think about Selena, you think about the Jonas brothers.

Speaker 1 Like, when you were in the era that you were in, because it shaped so much of our childhood, I feel like, did you guys realize it was that iconic in the moment, or did it literally just feel like work?

Speaker 3 I think once Calibell's hit, we knew.

Speaker 4 Yeah. And I feel like

Speaker 4 when the music started happening on the channel and that was happening simultaneously with Phil, I think that's when we were like, oh, this is really like clicking with people.

Speaker 4 And I do remember going to, I don't know, I think,

Speaker 4 were we with Hollywood Records at the time? I don't know. I don't think so.

Speaker 3 Well, I think they signed us season two of the show.

Speaker 4 It was season two, but I think season one of Phil the Future had been out. So no, we weren't signed yet with Hollywood.

Speaker 4 But for whatever reason, we were invited to Hillary Duff's concert at, I think, the forum or something.

Speaker 2 Oh my gosh. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 4 And I think you were with me. Yeah.
And like, I got mobbed at this concert.

Speaker 3 And I was like, yeah, Yeah, because season one had aired.

Speaker 4 It was weird. It was like the first real time I remember being like, oh, like people know me from this show.

Speaker 4 And then it was just, you know, after that, it was still very, we had a very normal life, but I just remember being like, oh, people are stopping me because of this TV show.

Speaker 2 Oh my God.

Speaker 1 A Hillary Duff concert, like take

Speaker 2 me back.

Speaker 1 Oh, my God. Cause I was going to ask, like, how your life changed with Phil of the Future because I feel like that was a very, very, very big moment.

Speaker 1 And I feel like some shows popped, some shows didn't. That one, I like, feel like I watched every freaking episode.
It was so good.

Speaker 4 Thank you.

Speaker 4 It did pop, but like, we only did two seasons, which people kind of forget.

Speaker 3 What? Yes, that's it. That's it.

Speaker 4 I know it's a travesty. And then it got canceled.

Speaker 1 Wait, but how many episodes were in a season?

Speaker 2 22, I think.

Speaker 1 Okay, that's also so different. Like, these days it's like six episodes.

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, that's a good point.

Speaker 1 Yeah, okay, but 20. He's still a lot of episodes.

Speaker 4 Yeah, so it was only two.

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Speaker 1 Okay, so back to because i was thank you so much because i was thinking about you guys and like now that i'm like a businesswoman and obviously like you guys can share what you want but i was thinking about you guys and i'm like you were so young and you guys looked like you were at the top of the world but like when you look back financially did you feel like as kids you were compensated correctly i don't know if that's like a fair thing to say

Speaker 3 um i don't think we would have known anything to compare it to yeah i don't think it's crazy when you have a job that young of course

Speaker 1 and in a strange way like any money that you're making of course seems like great but like i made like seven thousand dollars right per episode on yeah that's not good that ain't nothing like do you know what i mean yeah that is interesting like because when you i don't know what that would equate to today but like true right but i guess for a kids show you're kind of like that's great that could go into their college fund like and how did you guys handle it with your parents because obviously i remember we were standing in the hallway of my tour and I looked at you guys and I was like, how did you guys just stay so normal?

Speaker 1 And you guys are like so lovely. I feel like you guys are like my girlfriends from back home.

Speaker 1 And the unfortunate side of the industry, I feel like we've all seen is like so many of these kids, whether it was like the parents were abusing the power and taking these kids' money, the parents were forcing the kids.

Speaker 3 We saw it all the time.

Speaker 1 The parents didn't help the kids. So they were just kind of by themselves on set.

Speaker 4 They're just like dropped off and left with the teacher.

Speaker 1 Right. Yeah.
What attributed to you guys staying so grounded throughout this whole process?

Speaker 3 Well, I can tell you we weren't the boss of our household. That's for sure.
Like just because we were working did not put us at the top. Like we were the kids.
Yeah.

Speaker 3 And then second, like our parents were very,

Speaker 3 very clear about like,

Speaker 3 yeah, you can go to this event, you can promote this project, but like you're not going to go to like some late after party with a bunch of adults when you guys are underage.

Speaker 3 Like I just feel like when you're younger, you can kind of get away if you're in the industry, but just rolling into every situation.

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 4 And you're like a little mini adult, even though you really shouldn't be.

Speaker 3 It's not really the time and place for that time in your life. Like you just shouldn't be at those kind of things at that age.
Like a, you know what I mean? Yeah.

Speaker 3 I feel like our parents were very, they were pretty strict.

Speaker 4 And like our mom was on set with us. Like amazing.

Speaker 4 If she needed to be somewhere for you and I was like on set, she would be gone to like get you to the audition and then would be like straight back on set. You know?

Speaker 1 That, I feel like that's like the biggest key that when kids come out now, it's like there's this like, missing element, which was kind of like the parental figures. Yes.

Speaker 1 And like to give the parental opportunity to people that weren't the actual parents. Totally.
They are just looking at these kids like they're cash cows.

Speaker 1 And really, your own parent hopefully would be the one to be like, no, no, no, I need to have some guidelines for my kids. Right.
Is it true that you were going to possibly be Hannah Montana?

Speaker 4 I mean, yeah.

Speaker 4 I mean, it's funny.

Speaker 3 Like, she had the offer.

Speaker 4 I had the offer. And it was

Speaker 4 Phil hadn't ended at that point. It was like they knew that Phil, I think, was on the way out or it told us like, you know, we might not be doing a third season.

Speaker 4 And, and Gary, who you know was the head of of the channel gary marsh at the time and rich um yeah was like this pilot has come in and we think that you're really perfect for it um

Speaker 4 and i just remember reading it and being like wait but i'm doing music as allie And this might be really confusing being Hannah and being the character also playing Hannah.

Speaker 4 I just think there's three versions.

Speaker 2 Three versions. There would be three of them.
It would be very confusing.

Speaker 4 And I was like, you know, how does AJ relate to this? And then

Speaker 4 they they literally said well then aj could play the best friend part

Speaker 4 lily i think yeah so they're like why don't you have and i was like but it feels like it's my show it's not really like the hannah and lily show um and i think at that point too i was probably

Speaker 4 like close to being maybe 17 at that point um which is funny too because like we weren't on the channel for that long like i i booked phil at 13 and then by the time it was over i was like you know whatever 16 and a half or something.

Speaker 4 So I was like almost 17, I think, when that was offered. And I just remember thinking, like,

Speaker 4 I've kind of done what I wanted to do here on the channel.

Speaker 2 You know what I mean?

Speaker 3 And we had done cowbells. The music had aired a lot.
Yeah. On Disney Channel.
Cowbell. Or I guess Cowbells we were just starting to like dive into.

Speaker 4 Yeah, like we're like, yeah, exactly. Yeah, I did.

Speaker 2 You're right. You're right.

Speaker 1 I mean, I obviously like

Speaker 1 that was meant to be for Miley.

Speaker 1 But that's so interesting how like those pivotal moments, obviously, like everyone was kind of up for certain roles that like it would have looked so different with you guys in that position versus her, obviously.

Speaker 1 Okay, is it true, AJ, that you had your first kiss with Joe Jonas?

Speaker 3 Yes, that is true.

Speaker 1 Thompson bring up all the old stuff.

Speaker 2 I'm like, we gotta go through it. We gotta go through it.

Speaker 3 In a bowling alley, it was so innocent.

Speaker 2 Wait, a bowling alley? It was sweet.

Speaker 1 That's so cute. And did you guys like date for a long time?

Speaker 3 We dated for a while. I don't,

Speaker 2 I mean, for like a young relationship, like over a year is pretty good and a half, something like that.

Speaker 1 that's pretty solid that's a really long time yeah I feel like I was so curious like all of you guys were on such like different shows but like this was kind of your high school experience yeah so like how did you guys all hang out and like meet on different shows like what was the social dynamic like we met on tour so the jonas brothers opened for us and that's when we started like there was like a spark and i was like oh this would be fun like we started dating trying to make like something happen with like me and kevin kevin and i was like it's not really vibing and then i mean bless but like yeah and then it was like, no, maybe you can like date the bass player, Greg.

Speaker 4 And I was like, no, it's still not vibing. And I mean, like, again, bless him too, but

Speaker 4 it just wasn't. I was like, no.

Speaker 2 You can't like force that. You can't force it.
It was like natural that her and Joe had connection. It was natural.
We were all buddies. Of course.

Speaker 3 We were. And it was a really fun tour.

Speaker 3 But I think beyond that.

Speaker 3 So like for me, it's like. We were homeschooled our whole lives.
We didn't experience school dances. We didn't, but instead we had tour like at a really young age.
Like to me, I wouldn't trade

Speaker 3 any of it because I'm like, our experiences on the road were so cool. And it's actually why I love touring as an adult.

Speaker 3 Cause I think it was ingrained in me at a young age that it was a really cool opportunity to have this moment to connect with your fans over there.

Speaker 2 It's not drawn to like go on the road. And I love it.

Speaker 3 It's very natural. I think some people dive in as an adult and they're like, I don't want to be on the road.
And we're like, we love it. Bring it on.

Speaker 2 This is all we ever know. Yeah.
Yeah. It's weird.

Speaker 3 So anyway, I wouldn't, yeah, there's nothing I would really trade.

Speaker 1 I just no, no, that's an amazing answer. Okay.

Speaker 1 Did you secretly date your Phil of the Future co-star for six years?

Speaker 2 No, not. Wait, who said that? That's funny.

Speaker 4 It's a sweet the same thing online?

Speaker 1 Rumors online that you secretly dated Phil of the Future co-star for six years.

Speaker 3 I literally can attest, never even kissed. You guys didn't even.

Speaker 4 It was always a friendship.

Speaker 2 Now, although I remember like, he's also older than you.

Speaker 4 Well, and in that, that age range felt huge. Like I was 13 and I think he was 16.
I think

Speaker 2 that's a big gap in that age.

Speaker 4 But I remember during the test, like when I tested for Phil of the Future and I saw that he was the other boy that was up for her, I was like, he's really cute. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 And then, of course, you meet them and then you're like, oh, now we're just buddies.

Speaker 1 And like, we actually became really good friends with his girlfriend during that show like he was dating her yeah that is true yeah sweet yeah so no no no um okay we're clearing up all the rumors that is so funny years and years later okay um obviously we know disney was like very strict now that like everyone kind of like knows the deal were you able to experiment at all like normal teenagers like have your first drink and like go to parties at all or no yeah yeah for sure you did yeah i think we had a healthy like teenage life yeah

Speaker 4 But we were like not party girls. Like for whatever that's worth, I think.

Speaker 3 The channel got very lucky having us on the bread.

Speaker 4 We should have been around for like 15 years because they would have been like, they're good. We don't need to be worried.

Speaker 2 No, it's true. Keep going.

Speaker 4 Like, yeah, for whatever reason, we just were not like rebellious types, both of us. And I think maybe part of it was because we had each other.
Yeah.

Speaker 4 So it was like we didn't have to act out and prove ourselves to like.

Speaker 3 our parents or it was just kind of not i don't know yeah no you're right i don't even know what it is it's like luck i feel maybe it's just luck but also like, Allie and I, this sounds kind of ridiculous, but when we got a little older, but we weren't quite like drinking age, people like kind of in LA started like trusting us as the girls that would like go into Ledue but not get

Speaker 2 like let them in. Like they can have a like we used to go to the bouncers and they would just like mark our hand and they'd be like, we trust you.
They're like, give them some bread. I'm not kidding.

Speaker 4 Like they're fine.

Speaker 1 Like there's never going to be a liability.

Speaker 4 No, like truly. And we kind of, I mean, and that was during the height of all of those girls.
You know, we're just going to be able to do it.

Speaker 2 We don't see everybody coming out of the fun. That's right.

Speaker 4 But like, we were just fine.

Speaker 2 You were like, hi.

Speaker 1 I will just be like, no problem in the corner.

Speaker 2 I remember being like a kiss, kiss ass.

Speaker 3 It was just like who we were, who we were.

Speaker 4 Which I think is which I think then made people would be like, oh my gosh, we're so darling. The Mashaka girls.
Like, they're just harmless.

Speaker 1 Sweetie.

Speaker 2 Yeah. That's really funny.

Speaker 1 Everyone knows you guys as Allie and AJ, right? Like everyone, it's Allie and AJ. It's Allie and AJ.
Have you guys ever resented that package deal

Speaker 1 concept?

Speaker 2 No, I think we've always. Like the duo aspect?

Speaker 4 No, we've never resented that. I think the only thing that maybe we've been like, gosh, I wish we had had like a different

Speaker 4 band name.

Speaker 2 It wasn't our name. We didn't think it was cool.

Speaker 3 Like as kids, we were like, why did we do the Allie and AJ thing?

Speaker 2 Cause now it's just our names.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's very memorable.

Speaker 3 No, the duo thing didn't bug us. It didn't.

Speaker 1 No, no. Like when you guys were growing up at all, obviously taking different projects.
And if like one was having more success than the other at a time, like how did you guys handle that as sisters?

Speaker 1 Because I have a sister and I don't care what we're doing. Like we were competitive.
Competitive.

Speaker 2 You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 And like we are always supportive of each other, but I do feel like naturally there can be moments where it's like, oh, like you're getting the better parts or you're getting the better roles.

Speaker 1 Or like, did you ever have moments where you had to like sit down and be like, let's talk this out?

Speaker 3 I think the only time where we felt like, okay, we're getting.

Speaker 3 asked to go out for the same roles and we feel really strongly that one of us is really right for this and would you mind standing down?

Speaker 3 Like I think there were a couple of times when we both got the same audition.

Speaker 4 But usually one of us would come to the other and be like, I'm really not ready for this. You should just go out for this.

Speaker 3 And I'm just going to. And the other one wouldn't.
And not even. That's happened before where we're like, we've just said, okay, fine, you go for it.

Speaker 3 By the way, it would never be between us.

Speaker 4 It would never be down to the two of us. Like our acting is so different.

Speaker 4 So I think our ages, our looks, our energy, like...

Speaker 3 But we did get asked sometimes to go to the same audition.

Speaker 4 And I think some of that was just because of like,

Speaker 2 I don't know.

Speaker 4 Some parts kind of would overlap. Yeah.
Where it's like, you know,

Speaker 4 22 to 25.

Speaker 2 And we're like, well, we're in.

Speaker 3 But there was never a role specifically where I was like, wow, I really wish that had been me. And like, I kind of bummed it was out.
Like, never.

Speaker 3 Like, for me, it was like, I thought it was so cool that she was like an EZA and Hellcats. And like, she's done great work.
And it always felt like it should be Allie. You know what I mean?

Speaker 3 And I always want to be her over anyone else.

Speaker 2 So if I'm not going to book it, it better be rather than be a family member.

Speaker 1 That's true. No, that's such like a healthy way to look at it.
Cause anyone that has a sister, I'm like, I want my sister twin always. And I think there's, you're right.

Speaker 1 There's like a natural also, like, aside from competitiveness, you're also very protective of your sibling, being like, I want her to do the best.

Speaker 1 But I also think it's very like healthy that you guys are able to have that because I'm not in the same industry as my sister.

Speaker 1 Like I can't imagine at some capacity, you guys are intertwined and there is a slight competition in light moments that, but that's kind of healthy that you guys are like, we didn't feel it that much.

Speaker 4 No, no. And like, if anything, where it was, I mean, I guess you could call it competitive, it would be like if we like the same guy.

Speaker 2 Oh, yeah, let's talk about that.

Speaker 3 Yeah, that would happen.

Speaker 2 Like that would happen every once in a while.

Speaker 1 You guys had the same taste growing up, similar, right?

Speaker 4 Yeah, similar.

Speaker 4 I would say, yeah, our tastes were very similar.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 What are you guys adjusting now?

Speaker 2 You're like, I know, I know.

Speaker 1 Adjusting. Wait, stop.
So, you guys at one point would like have a crush, and how would you handle it?

Speaker 3 Well, neither of us would get that guy.

Speaker 2 Yeah,

Speaker 4 just like, yeah, neither of us.

Speaker 3 Yeah, just both of them would be like, we both liked him and both of us failed.

Speaker 4 Or, like, I remember, this is funny that you asked this. We were making a record in New York, one that never ended up coming out.
And

Speaker 3 we, we have 10 of those.

Speaker 2 Yeah, just one.

Speaker 1 But you're like, one day maybe they'll come out.

Speaker 2 Yeah, two.

Speaker 4 And we were, we were feeling very cool that we were like, you know, living in New York for like a month, no parents. You know, I don't know.
At this point, we were like 21 and 22 and 20.

Speaker 2 Right.

Speaker 4 And every night we were really obsessed with wanting to go out to all of these restaurants in New York.

Speaker 4 We're like, sometimes it didn't even make sense where it's like, girl, that's way on the other side of tech.

Speaker 2 That's a 30 minute.

Speaker 4 You come from Los Angeles and you don't know shit. So we would be like, okay, we're going to catch or whatever.
And we went to this one restaurant called Revel. I don't know why I remember that.

Speaker 2 I don't know if Revel is still around.

Speaker 4 And there was a cute guy that was our waiter, and I left my number for him on the bill. And I told AJ and she was like, what?

Speaker 3 I was pissed. And she was like, we left the restaurant.

Speaker 2 And that was really.

Speaker 3 And I was like, he was cute. And she's like, I know I left my number.
And I was like, what? Like, you mean I could have? And I didn't know.

Speaker 4 Like, you were judging me that I had done that, you know, and like put my

Speaker 2 neck out. So dumb.

Speaker 4 Like, obviously this guy never texted.

Speaker 2 Rude. So you never called.

Speaker 4 so right meanwhile it's like i don't need to be competitive because i didn't worry you either we i'm obsessed and did you guys ever ever ever hook up with the same person at any point in your lives like overlap of like years later you met up with someone like same kiss or yeah no no no there's been a couple like close calls yeah where it was like i liked that guy kind of and then it was like oh no like AJ and him were kind of dating and then it would be like over after or there was a moment where I like tested for something and then meeting guy I thought was really cool and then Allie actually ended up dating him later.

Speaker 2 Yeah,

Speaker 3 but it wasn't like a I was also with him.

Speaker 4 No, no, there's never been an actual crossover. No, thank God.
I mean, that would be kind of weird.

Speaker 2 We're so enmesh in each other's lives already. I know.

Speaker 1 It's like you're literally like one in that concept. Like when I talk about, because my sister's four years older than me and we've never dated the same guy.
Yeah. But even you talk about it.

Speaker 1 incessantly with each other like when you start dating someone obviously so it's like i couldn't go to her if i knew that she liked the guy that i was saying right she knows all the inside how do you detail it out she's like i know and it's different with a friend because with a family member, I would be like, Catherine, you need to get over it because I need to tell you everything.

Speaker 1 She'd be like, okay, he was cute, but now I'm over. Okay, go tell me everything.

Speaker 2 Right, right, right.

Speaker 4 She did one time help, like, literally held my hand while I broke up with a guy over the phone.

Speaker 2 I'm not kidding you.

Speaker 4 She was like, do you remember that? It was in Calabasas. You were like, you can do it.
I did. And I'm like on the phone with him being like,

Speaker 4 I really don't, this isn't right.

Speaker 2 Like, I, and I'm like, am I doing this? Isn't that?

Speaker 2 You got it.

Speaker 1 No, that is like literally so much.

Speaker 2 So that's also so funny.

Speaker 3 I mean, that just brought me back to that bedroom. Isn't that funny?

Speaker 2 Calabasas. Calabasas.
Yeah.

Speaker 3 No, breakfast. We were Calabasas' kids.

Speaker 2 I don't know. Before I was cool.

Speaker 3 Way before it was cool.

Speaker 1 Love that for you.

Speaker 2 Like names of Johnny Rockets. You know what I mean? Like, we're that far from it.
I love that for you.

Speaker 1 Breaking up with someone is the worst feeling ever.

Speaker 2 The worst. It's sickening.
It's so hard.

Speaker 3 It's actually sickening.

Speaker 1 But that's why like people, whenever I'm like, there's nothing better than having a sister. And I feel for my friends that are like, I never had a sister.
I don't know what it's like. It's like.

Speaker 1 It's a friendship on steroids. Like, you are literally going to kill for her.

Speaker 4 And it's different than a brother,

Speaker 2 completely.

Speaker 3 It's actually almost a diss to call it a friendship.

Speaker 2 It's like, no, this is living on another. Yeah, that's a great point.

Speaker 1 It's like an extension of yourself. Yeah.
Yes. It's so fun hearing you guys talk about your dynamic together.

Speaker 1 And obviously, so much of what you're writing also goes into like love and your life and your family.

Speaker 1 And but potential breakup song, I just have to ask the one question because I think it's like, I saw TikTok. We're going to, we have to make this TikTok.

Speaker 1 And it's someone being like, you guys remember when those two sisters walked into the studio and they really said this.

Speaker 1 And to this day, still such an anthem. What inspired that song?

Speaker 2 No,

Speaker 2 you're not.

Speaker 4 I'm not a real person. Not a real person.

Speaker 4 It's actually the most like,

Speaker 4 it's the most anticlimactic.

Speaker 2 I mean, there's no real person.

Speaker 1 I need to pause you guys because the way you both just paused, I thought I was about to get

Speaker 2 jeezy.

Speaker 2 Sorry, like,

Speaker 1 recording.

Speaker 1 It doesn't exist.

Speaker 2 It doesn't exist.

Speaker 4 Okay, tell me, though. I think we just were like, what if there was a guy that was such a terrorist? Like, I mean, at this point, we were 18 and

Speaker 4 maybe 17 and 17 17 and 15 writing this song which we had did but like at this point we had probably each had you would have probably two boyfriends i had barely had one boyfriend because i was way behind she was behind behind her okay so like i'm like she was behind she was behind a lot of so still a lot of the songs were like living in a dream world of what we thought a relationship was like because we were still really young yeah so To us, it was like, what if this guy was like so terrible that he didn't call you on your birthday and that you begged him to get your stuff back and he like wouldn't give it back?

Speaker 4 And then you just had had to deliver it in a box at your house.

Speaker 3 Literally, that's like exactly.

Speaker 1 Literally, like you two sitting on your bed together being like, genius, let's go.

Speaker 2 Yeah, let's go.

Speaker 4 But what's funny though is that we couldn't drive.

Speaker 4 I do remember we were young. We were young enough that we were driving.

Speaker 1 Since there is no story behind it, tell me both of your like most brutal breakups.

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Speaker 1 We've got a lot of girlies that listen. How did you get through it? What was your most like brutal breakup and how you got through it?

Speaker 1 Obviously, like, we're not naming names, but just like the concept, like, have either of you ever been cheated on?

Speaker 2 I mean, Age, you go first.

Speaker 3 Yeah, I was cheated on. And I found out the guy was like hooking up with our really good friend at the time.
No, how did you find out? It like blew up the friendship and the relationship.

Speaker 3 I don't even know how it came out, but it happened in the Calabasas Commons parking lot.

Speaker 2 Stop.

Speaker 4 Yeah. And it was like, it was.

Speaker 3 And we were young. So it was like, obviously it hits hard no matter what age you are when you feel like, wow, I've been completely.

Speaker 4 But this was like a friendship. This was like a friendship, a girl friendship that was basically the breakup.
It wasn't like the guy, if that makes sense.

Speaker 4 It was like we had found out some stuff about her that made us feel like we didn't really know who she was and we had been friends with her for like a long time and that was truly the the worst breakup and it was a girlfriend breakup yeah that's the and now we're and then we mend it like we're okay now yeah like if we see her at a yeah whatever we like we'll dm and stuff but we don't like hang actively which is kind of sad because it was a big part of our childhood but like that is so that was the guy that guy was like didn't even matter right you're like it's just the concept of what happened with the friends that's always the worst when like understandably people are like don't blame the girl blame the guy and it's like no no no for sure but if you were almost closer with the girl than the guy that you were dating,

Speaker 1 that's where it's like, how do you recover from those moments? And then it gives you like full trust issues because you're like, how did I not know that?

Speaker 1 And you could like hold my hand while I'm crying over this. And little do I know I'm crying because of you.

Speaker 2 Yeah, that's sick. Okay, Allie, go.

Speaker 4 Okay, I'm trying to think, gosh, worst.

Speaker 3 You haven't been cheated on, have you?

Speaker 4 I haven't been cheated on.

Speaker 2 That's nice, which is actually good. That is for you.
That's great. I know, that's good.

Speaker 2 That's good. That's good.
I don't know what that's for. It's all clap for that.

Speaker 4 um no trauma um yeah no trauma um i i'm trying to think of hmm i mean i've had guys

Speaker 4 i've i've had more guys probably break up with me than me break up with them okay so i've been broken up with probably quite a bit have you been blindsided by the breakups I mean, I feel like I was blindsided many times.

Speaker 4 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Like, not many, but, but, but a lot of them.

Speaker 4 It was like, you know, I was being broken up with because this person was like a professional athlete and was like, I need to work on my job. And like, you're a distraction.

Speaker 2 I'm like, I need to work on my job. I'm on a tour bus right now.

Speaker 4 You're a distraction.

Speaker 1 I need to work on my job. Yeah, I know.

Speaker 2 Wait, ridiculous. Do you know where you're sitting in a direct quote? No, no, that is the best direct quote I've ever heard.

Speaker 2 A professional athlete telling you, I have to work on my

Speaker 1 job.

Speaker 2 We,

Speaker 2 you know, that I talk a lot about that.

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 1 Yes. We, how long did you date?

Speaker 4 It wasn't that long, but it was very like,

Speaker 3 that was like a solid year.

Speaker 4 Maybe, maybe a little, I don't even know.

Speaker 2 What sport? Hockey. Football.
Football.

Speaker 4 I remember being really heartbroken by that. Now I'm looking back on it being like,

Speaker 1 but to any of the girls that are like, I feel like around New York.

Speaker 1 a lot of people end relationships because I feel like everyone's like, oh my gosh, like I want to start fresh. I want to kick this person to the curb or I want to like try something different.

Speaker 1 Like, do you have any advice when you look back at those relationships when people ended things with you?

Speaker 4 As hard as it was in the moment now when you look back like give us some advice of how to get through those horrible blindsiding moments honestly like having a couple really solid guy friends was really helpful like i would talk to them about this and they'd be like this guy's a total loser like absolutely not and and you know of course you could say exactly what you're saying that they want to get with you but right these were like truly platonic even if they do okay even if they do

Speaker 4 but they were platonic relationships that were really like i would yeah i would be on the phone like talking to dan you know

Speaker 2 and be like, can you believe this?

Speaker 4 And he'd be like,

Speaker 4 this is an absolute sign that this guy is not right for you. And like, he was only in it because he just wanted to like sleep with you and be done and over.

Speaker 2 And you're like, thank you, Dan. Thank you.
Now let's hook up.

Speaker 1 No, I'm just kidding.

Speaker 2 Totally.

Speaker 1 Okay. Daddy Gang needs some advice.
And I feel like all I'm getting from this entire episode is you guys are very wise and you've always been wise and you've always been like little Yodas.

Speaker 2 No, literally, like you guys, no, but actually, you guys have been like,

Speaker 1 people would let you into the the club because they're like, Allie and AJ are going to keep it real. You guys didn't lose yourself to fame.

Speaker 1 You didn't lose, you guys have like seemingly very normal lives and you're still so successful and you're still in the spotlight. So we need your advice, okay? Okay.

Speaker 1 You want to end a friendship where you've been drifting apart. Do you have a breakup conversation with your friend or do you let it die out?

Speaker 3 I've done both.

Speaker 4 I've had more, if I'm being honest, I've had a couple die outs, not conversations where it's just kind of like you kind of stop texting and then it's like they also do.

Speaker 4 Yeah, and then it's like you kind of were like, we both know this isn't right.

Speaker 3 Which is kind of a form of ghosting. It's not great.
It is. It is.
I think you should have the conversation.

Speaker 1 When you have the conversation, it's bigger to do that. Do you think those were more extreme moments? Like, did something.

Speaker 3 Yes, it can make it too big of a deal. But, but it was usually because it was.
based on something that happened that I was like, I can't really not see this now and it's here and let's talk about it.

Speaker 3 And this is why I can't go forward as a friend.

Speaker 1 But I think that's good advice. It's like you kind of have to gauge where you're at.

Speaker 1 If it's just like, you never really see each other anymore, but you have this like weight over you and they're not being that great to you. You can maybe let it simmer.

Speaker 3 Yeah. To me, some, some things don't need like spotlights.

Speaker 4 True. Sometimes sometimes it's not like this big, huge fight.
Sometimes it's like, I'm seeing some things about your lifestyle that doesn't gel with mine or

Speaker 4 that, you know, I don't know, you weren't there for me in these moments that I needed you. And it's kind of like showing your true colors.
And that's okay. We just part our own ways.

Speaker 4 And that's like, sometimes that's part of just growing up and being a girl.

Speaker 1 I think that's what's like been so eye-opening as I've gotten older. Like growing apart from friendships is so sad.
It is.

Speaker 1 And it's like horrible to look back at like some of my like high school friends that I'm not as close with anymore or whatever, or just also like recognizing like we really grew up and we are different or like we live our lives differently.

Speaker 1 And that doesn't mean they're a bad person. You're just like, it doesn't mesh anymore.

Speaker 3 But it is sad when a part of your childhood in that way kind of dies.

Speaker 2 Dies.

Speaker 3 Like, yeah, I just said bye to a friend in a way that I know I'm not really going to connect with again.

Speaker 1 And I think it's like sometimes, yes, sometimes those are harder than actual breakups with men sometimes where you're like, shit, that hurt.

Speaker 1 But I think that's a good like bit of advice is like you can do both, but I think don't actively seek out a conversation if the person's going to be like, wait, what, what are you talking about?

Speaker 1 If something happens, absolutely address it. Yes.
But you can also like let something simmer if that's like. the natural course of where it was going to go anyways.

Speaker 3 Yeah. And it says a lot if both sides aren't really reaching out.
Then it's like the natural course was for it to chizz.

Speaker 2 It changes everything in a way.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 1 You find out you you were accidentally the other woman. Do you reach out to her or do you stay out of it?

Speaker 3 I'm the type that would reach out.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 We're both breathing so heavy. We're all like,

Speaker 3 I'm like, yeah, I think I would contact you.

Speaker 4 I think I would, I think I would.

Speaker 2 I think

Speaker 4 the other woman. I'm so sorry.
I didn't know.

Speaker 4 Well, what's funny is that we've seen one of our girlfriends, our close girlfriends do that. And it was like, I was kind of being like, don't do this.
This is this is cringe.

Speaker 4 Like, why is this such a huge message?

Speaker 3 You know, I don't know if she did it right. She didn't do it right.
I think there's a way you can.

Speaker 4 I mean, I've said that to her face.

Speaker 2 Like, yeah,

Speaker 2 you didn't nail that. Too long.

Speaker 1 Oh, she literally wrote like a paragraph.

Speaker 2 Paragraph. Yeah, no, no, no.

Speaker 4 And also then that girl is like, uh-huh, yeah, right. Sure, honey, you know, and then making her look like

Speaker 2 she's actually saying the truth.

Speaker 3 Are you making this up that you're really the other woman?

Speaker 1 Like, yeah, you look insane.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 This is really interesting. Yeah, I think a paragraph to ever start something off.

Speaker 1 That's you got to go in shorter and just begin the combo rather than hit it hard where someone's like, oh my God, I need to like read this tonight when I have time, like and sit down and actually think about this.

Speaker 1 But, okay, so you guys would both say something.

Speaker 3 I would be like, I'm sick. I'm ill.
Like this, this happened. I need you to know.
And I'm so sorry. Bye.

Speaker 1 I kind of agree with that. Like, I feel like if you were not, again.
Clarifying, you didn't even know you were the other woman. If you were aware, like, then that's a completely different situation.

Speaker 1 That's like on you. Karma's on you.
Yes. But if you weren't aware, I kind of agree.
Because then even if she stays on her, you don't even know.

Speaker 3 At least you had your moment to say, like, this moment happened. And I said my piece.
And like, I can live with that.

Speaker 1 Love this. Yeah.
If you knew one of your close friends was cheating on her husband, who you're also friends with, how do you handle that?

Speaker 2 That's really hard. That's really hard.

Speaker 4 That's never happened.

Speaker 2 Thank God.

Speaker 4 Has that ever happened to you? Maybe not husband or you.

Speaker 1 I have known, not husband, but yeah, I've known that there's like shadiness going on and you're close to both of them yeah

Speaker 1 and I kind of stayed out of it because I just didn't know did it dissolve on its own with with you staying out of it you know what's interesting together I'm not really that close with them anymore so I don't know what happened but I also think maybe that partially is because it was like bleeding into every part of their life when you're lying that heavily in your life

Speaker 1 everything in your life like she was more distant because she was being so cagey but and then i was kind of like i don't know oh wow yeah i think it depends on maybe who like, who's the OG friend?

Speaker 4 Is it, is it her or is it the guy? Like, I don't know. If you met him at the same time, I mean, if you met at the same time, it's it's hard.

Speaker 1 It's so hard.

Speaker 4 I'd like to think I'd have the courage to say something or to be like, I don't know. Like, is everything okay?

Speaker 3 Like, well, I want to think if I'm the same woman who's going to tell the person I was the other woman and didn't know until just now, I'd be that same person to say this.

Speaker 3 Like, I'd like to think those two ladies are the same person.

Speaker 2 I agree. Like, bold.
I agree.

Speaker 1 I think what's hard sometimes in friendship dynamics is like, there's a lot of dynamics.

Speaker 1 I feel like you start to feel as you get older and there's cheating involved i have found sometimes i'm not privy to all the information of these people's relationships and a lot of times i'm like oh you kind of knew that sure like i dared the whole side yeah so i'm like If I'm super close, if it was my best friend and I'm fine, I'm hearing something, I'm telling her, obviously, and be like, I love you so much and I support you.

Speaker 1 I just need to tell you

Speaker 1 this. And then I'm here, whatever you want to do.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 Cause I think it's half the time the judgment that people feel when someone brings that information, they get so anxious, like, I have to leave him now or I have to leave her now.

Speaker 1 And it's like, I don't know, sometimes I feel like I come off as judge you and you tell them. So I also think your delivery has to be like, I love you and I know this is so hard.

Speaker 4 But I saw so-and-so at this restaurant and this.

Speaker 3 And I'm leaving this information here.

Speaker 1 Yes. But I'm here for you if you want to talk.
And like, whatever you do, I love you.

Speaker 3 I think now in my 30s, that is how I would approach it. But it would take me a hot minute to come to that.

Speaker 4 Yes. Like bravery of like, okay, we're doing this.

Speaker 1 You'd call your sister first. Yeah.

Speaker 2 What do we rehearse it? Totally.

Speaker 4 totally we'd rehearse it i'd hold her hand while she says the conversation or we would go in person and i'd hold her hand in person yeah

Speaker 1 um okay you accidentally send a screenshot of the conversation to the person you were gossiping about how do you play it off oh have you noticed ever done that i don't know oh my god i have never done that

Speaker 2 have you done it multiple times

Speaker 1 in college i was talking shit about the guy that i was seeing and i was like texting my friend and I was sunbathing. I was at Boston University.
I remember exactly where I was laying.

Speaker 1 I was in my little bikini and it was so bright out and I was holding my phone up texting and I was talking to this hockey player. He was so dumb and I was just like so

Speaker 1 texted to him. I screenshotted it, send it to him being like, hockey player wants me to go on his boat later.
Like I'm going to have to have like a couple drinks to him.

Speaker 3 And it went to him.

Speaker 4 And then what was his response? Was he like,

Speaker 2 now you can unsend?

Speaker 2 So we're in a good era. Now we're fine.

Speaker 4 So now we're good.

Speaker 1 And then, guys, I literally responded. I'm pretty sure.
Like, first I called my mom screaming. Like, you guys, I am under the sun.
I realized I do it.

Speaker 2 I'm pretty sure he responded, like, lol at first, which is like, actually, that's kind of hard to be like, oh, that's funny.

Speaker 2 How dumb.

Speaker 4 This is a funny joke, right?

Speaker 2 Yeah. It shows how smart.
You're like, yeah, the other episodes in the house, not smart.

Speaker 1 You're like, I am hilarious. Yes.
No, and then I was like, lol. I'm just kidding.
Like, I just can't decide if I want to come. Like, what are you thinking? Good job, you guys?

Speaker 4 Did he roll with it?

Speaker 1 He completely rolled with it.

Speaker 2 Wow.

Speaker 1 Saw him later that night. Ooh, but that says even more.

Speaker 2 You did start the conversation saying he wasn't smart.

Speaker 1 Completely. Also, why did I go? I don't know.
I was bored. You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 I was thinking there was an ego thing where I was like, I have to see this man to make sure that he actually forgave me.

Speaker 1 Like, this is insane that he doesn't recognize that I was completely shut up in this.

Speaker 4 That's an insane day. I would be more likely for sure to do something like that.

Speaker 3 100% it would be out.

Speaker 2 You would. Way oversane.

Speaker 4 Like, I'm actually surprised it hasn't happened, but it has or twice.

Speaker 1 Why? Because you're just like, you're going to do some like clumsy shit where you're like, how did I get in this situation?

Speaker 2 Clumsy text or page is like, Hello, you're on the wrong group chat.

Speaker 4 And it's like, oh shit.

Speaker 3 There will be times where I'll like sidebar chat to her and I'll be like, just so you know, you're talking in a way that if this leads to more, you're in the wrong track.

Speaker 2 You're in the wrong, we're on the wrong track here.

Speaker 3 And she'll be like, oh, thank you.

Speaker 2 Totally. Thank you.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 That is kind of like younger sister energy, though.

Speaker 2 The direction officer.

Speaker 1 I call my sister and I'm like, are you okay? And she's like, what? And I'm like, why are you sending that to the family group chat?

Speaker 2 We were just texting.

Speaker 1 And she's like, oh my gosh, I don't know. Like, yeah, I'm kind of funny.

Speaker 4 That is, yeah, that that does track his younger sister. It is.
It is.

Speaker 1 It's like, we, we know everything.

Speaker 2 Like, stay on the side.

Speaker 1 Exactly. Um, okay, do you guys ever go on double dates?

Speaker 2 Oh, yeah. Yeah.
I mean, with our people now. With our guys are.

Speaker 4 I don't think in the past, have we ever really done that in the past? I'm trying to think.

Speaker 3 Before Stephen and Josh?

Speaker 2 No, I don't think so.

Speaker 3 I don't think so. That's become more of an adult like

Speaker 3 that.

Speaker 4 Or it's been like three-wheeling, where it's like two people on a date, and then I'm like, hey, I'm here hanging with you having lunch, you know, or that's true.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Let's talk about Stephen and Josh.

Speaker 1 Oh, my gosh. So serious.
Ali, you met your husband when you were in your early 20s.

Speaker 1 What made him stand out to you?

Speaker 4 I don't know. I just got a vibe.
Like, this guy is just different. Like, he's really deep.
He's very mature. He's just like tapped into something.

Speaker 1 Where did you meet?

Speaker 4 We met on a set.

Speaker 4 He was the DP and I was the like lead actor in this like really tiny little indie.

Speaker 4 And I don't know, like, I just picked up this energy from him that

Speaker 4 like just instantly I was kind of like, this guy is like, I'm like safe with this guy. Like I can really be myself around him.

Speaker 4 And he's like artistic and he really cares about this project and how he's talking about it and how he is on set.

Speaker 4 He has very much like a leadership kind of energy, even though he was very young and it was the first movie that he was, you know, a DP on.

Speaker 4 So I don't know. It was just like, it was a meant to be thing.
And at the time, I was seeing a guy that I was in, like, I call it like a kept relationship.

Speaker 4 He was like, I couldn't get out. It was just like, he was a guy who was older than me,

Speaker 4 that I had lost my virginity to, to be completely clear.

Speaker 2 And I was like, girl, we got to get rid of him.

Speaker 4 I was like, I'm good. Like, it's, it's all good.
Like, this is a sweet memory and moment, but like, we're good, we're done.

Speaker 3 You did break up and he and he was like,

Speaker 2 I made you a woman.

Speaker 4 Like, bad.

Speaker 3 He said that. He did.

Speaker 2 It's cringe.

Speaker 1 No. No, it's cringe.

Speaker 2 It's really cringe.

Speaker 1 No, how long were you together with him?

Speaker 4 Uh, like a year,

Speaker 4 like a year and a half.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I made

Speaker 2 a moment. You hated him.

Speaker 4 Well, you had an okay friendship with him in the beginning.

Speaker 4 It's someone that should have always been like a guy friend. Like you never should have dated.

Speaker 2 100%.

Speaker 1 For a man to say that he made you a woman, I will kill you.

Speaker 2 No, I know, I know.

Speaker 4 But the fact that I was like kind of chill, like almost kind of like a bro, like, this is nice. Like, whatever.
Like, who cares? I lost Virginia to you. It's like not that big of a deal.

Speaker 2 And he was so sentimental.

Speaker 1 He like had it in his diary that he was like, very much a big deal.

Speaker 4 Like, wow, I'm excited.

Speaker 1 How did you end a relationship with him? Because that's hard. Like, to be like someone that's clearly, he was more into it than you.

Speaker 1 You called it a kept relationship.

Speaker 2 Sweet. I know, I know.

Speaker 3 I mean, you did end it. And then, remember, he like convinced you to stay in it.

Speaker 4 Stay in it. So I like, we had broken up and then we got back together.
And then I'm on this movie, like hanging out, you know, shooting in Sequoia National Park.

Speaker 2 We're all

Speaker 4 staying in these cabins at the base of the mountain. So like after we would rap, we all would eat dinner together

Speaker 4 and like hang out and like run lines or whatever. And

Speaker 4 I just remember like

Speaker 4 essentially like talking shit about him to people being like, I don't know. I'm like, I'm in this relationship, but like I got to get out of it.

Speaker 4 Like, you know, at this time, it was like, what, it was like November, beginning of November. So I was probably thinking like, you know, I'm going to try to wrap this up and be on my way.

Speaker 4 But I knew that I had. I had agreed to do a movie that he was directing that was next.
It was the next film. So I had to do this next movie with him as a director.

Speaker 2 And I broke up.

Speaker 4 I broke up up with him at the beginning of the movie. I was so brutal.

Speaker 3 But then had to be in it. But had to be in it.
Directed by him.

Speaker 4 Yeah. And he would be kind of trying to be like, no, like, we can make this work.
And I was like, we're done. I really don't want to do this.

Speaker 1 You're so strong.

Speaker 2 It was brutal.

Speaker 4 It was not.

Speaker 2 I do not recommend doing that.

Speaker 4 I recommend just bailing out of the movie and not doing the movie.

Speaker 1 True. But also, that's like your career where you're like,

Speaker 1 do I do it or not? That's tough.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 That's also like. Ladies listening, I have been in that situation before.
When you try to break up with someone, anyone, whatever,

Speaker 2 together, okay, will literally won't let you.

Speaker 1 And they won't let you, that makes it really bad.

Speaker 4 Run.

Speaker 2 It's kind of like firing.

Speaker 3 It's kind of like firing someone that's like, you're not, yeah, and they're not doing this.

Speaker 2 I'm not leaving. What? But why would you want me now? Like, if I'm firing, you would always be like, you'd always be like, no, that's normal.

Speaker 4 Like, there'd be like ups and downs. Like, sometimes like, you'll be, you'll be in and out of love.
I'm like, no, no, no.

Speaker 2 That ain't how it works.

Speaker 1 No, when someone doesn't want you, listen to them and leave.

Speaker 3 Yes, believe them.

Speaker 1 Oh, my God. Okay, wait.
So when you met Allie's husband, like, were you immediately like?

Speaker 3 No, in the beginning, I was was like i think she was a little judgmental like hated there's some not hated some crossover that's happening here i was a little judgy i'm not gonna lie

Speaker 3 even though i knew allie was gonna get out of it i was like you should have gotten out of it like six months ago and then you'd be like free and clear but whatever um but then

Speaker 3 you know true he turned into the husband so i'm happy and he's literally become like my brother like i love him and i have so much respect for him as a husband and uh dad like to watch him as a father like it's really beautiful um but in the beginning i was like I don't know about this guy.

Speaker 3 Like, he was really shy, he was really quiet.

Speaker 3 I don't really grate with quiet people, except for like when I'm translating, except he's a translator, but like in general, like I'm like, come on, like, let's go, like, let's have a conversation.

Speaker 3 Like, I've got a really bubbly personality, and he was just very quiet. He's like an intellectual, he's very, he's super grounded, super smart.

Speaker 3 And I think I felt maybe like a little like, okay, here's this like Ivy League guy. I'm not going to be able to like carry a conversation with him.
He's probably smarter than me.

Speaker 3 Like, I think I was intimidated.

Speaker 1 I get that. And again, back to what we were saying with sisters.
It's like

Speaker 1 you're so protective and you have to look for her blind spots. Yes.
That's how I am with my sister. Like she's dating right now.
And I'm like, no, what is going on?

Speaker 1 And what it like, cause I'm just like, I want the best for her. So naturally, it is your job almost to be like, I don't like you until you prove that I should like you.

Speaker 3 Yes. And then he did.
And I was like, I love him. Although two years later, when he proposed, I like stopped.

Speaker 4 Oh, yeah. And you knew before.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 3 I got so, not because I wasn't happy for Allie. I literally felt like I'm like, I'm going to lose my sister, I think.
That's like I had this weird, unrealistic idea that a marriage meant that

Speaker 2 the sisterhood would be over.

Speaker 3 Yeah, like I literally went up, we were living together in Laurel Canyon and we were sharing a place. And I went upstairs, I lived in the top loft, and I like closed my closet door and I sobbed.

Speaker 3 I was so happy for her, but at the same time, I was like, I'm literally going to lose my sister. And it didn't happen at all.

Speaker 2 Of course, here we are. Yeah.

Speaker 1 But I do think that's really relatable. Like, I've talked about this with my siblings, especially like around the holiday season, you get to spend more time with your family.

Speaker 1 And it is kind of like sad when you start to get older and adult and do all the things that adults should be doing and your core family starts to expand.

Speaker 1 And it's like now you're creating your own family. Right.

Speaker 4 And your own memories and traditions.

Speaker 1 And it's so sad, but exciting. But I realize that a lot of like, as we are all growing older, you're like, wait, I want to hold on to my siblings and what we had in our core.

Speaker 1 Don't grow up and don't leave me. But really, it's more just like, there's now more memories and there's more fun.

Speaker 2 It adds to it. You more.
Nothing dies.

Speaker 1 No, but I get why you would would freak out because, like, I'm the same way.

Speaker 3 You're gonna, on the wedding night, like, God bless our dad, but like, he, we were doing like a dance, even though it was a father-daughter dance later down the road.

Speaker 3 It wasn't my father-daughter dance. You had had yours, but I was like later dancing with dad.
And I was like, This is a really sweet moment. And dad goes, Honey, how are you doing?

Speaker 3 And I was like, I'm really happy for them. Like, I feel really good about this.
And he was like, That's awesome. You know what? You lost a sister, but you gained a brother.

Speaker 3 And I was like, What the?

Speaker 2 Huh? I mean, I said it was everything I had cried about literally.

Speaker 3 No, he didn't mean my dad just, our dad talks like that.

Speaker 1 Like, he does. And I was like, huh?

Speaker 2 You're like, wait, come again. You're like, dad, this is not getting mentally unwell for the whole time.

Speaker 3 Yes, unwell. But this is also the same man.
Love you, dad. Shout out to dad and mom.
Great people.

Speaker 3 This is also the same man who like lost his father a few years ago and Stephen never got to meet him, our grandpa.

Speaker 3 And literally at the funeral, I wasn't at the funeral because I was working and at the funeral told Stephen, I want you to meet my dad. And he was dead in the car.

Speaker 2 But He's in the, like, that's like we're just not, we're not like that verbiage is interesting.

Speaker 4 It's just interesting.

Speaker 3 They're like, dad, I want you to meet my dad.

Speaker 2 It's no one in past. It's no longer here.
Shake his hand.

Speaker 2 And I don't know how.

Speaker 4 Wait, you were there to witness.

Speaker 2 I was there.

Speaker 4 You said that Stephen handled it as a story.

Speaker 2 Stephen handled it. It was so well.
He was like, okay, Mark.

Speaker 1 Stephen's like, Mark.

Speaker 1 I am going to meet your dad and we're going to hit it off over here.

Speaker 1 Stares at the open cast.

Speaker 2 But dads can say some really

Speaker 2 facts. It's on well.
You're like, whoa.

Speaker 1 The more and more they get older, dads, you have to smile. My dad has been saying some crazy, love you, dad, some crazy shit lately.
I'm like, huh?

Speaker 2 Love you, dad. Love you, dad.
You got to do that. Happy holidays.
Happy holidays.

Speaker 1 Happy holidays. You're all insane.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 Okay. AJ,

Speaker 1 you have a boyfriend.

Speaker 3 I do. It's been six years.

Speaker 1 Yeah. How did you guys meet?

Speaker 3 We met at a film festival in Napa. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 3 Bougie. Allie and I, I know it was actually bougie.
Allie and I had made a film with her husband that had gone to the Napa Valley Film Festival.

Speaker 3 And he had produced and starred in a short film that was shortlisted for an Oscar that year that was also premiering at the film festival.

Speaker 1 Oh, wow.

Speaker 3 And it was an amazing short film. And him and I met and like, there was like a spark, but at the time he was with his girlfriend there and I was dating someone in Canada.
Classic.

Speaker 3 I loved long distance for a while, which was just really okay.

Speaker 2 I was really on that kick.

Speaker 3 And

Speaker 3 I just was like, gosh, I'm going to know this guy for a while.

Speaker 2 And I don't know how or why.

Speaker 3 And it's going to happen at some point. But I remember he was wearing this like lumberjack red, black flannel.
And I was just like, this guy is hot. And he's like salt of the earth vibes.

Speaker 3 And then down the road, a year later, he was single, I was single, and we connected on Instagram.

Speaker 4 And we needed somebody in our video overtake me.

Speaker 4 I asked him our victim in our, in our video, because we were playing vampires.

Speaker 2 And like you. And you were like, can we kill you? He should be hot.
He should be in the video. Like, let's have him in.
Yeah. What was your first impression?

Speaker 1 How did you meet him? When did you meet him?

Speaker 2 I met him at the festival. Yeah.
I think he was like, wait, maybe, was there like a cross-a-panel or something together? I think. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 And then we did the video shoot and he was like super down. And then we had a couple girlfriends come and also be victims and they were like down to just kind of like hang out for the day.

Speaker 1 When they started dating, were you protective or no?

Speaker 4 I don't know. What do you feel like?

Speaker 3 I feel like because you already had Steven in play for such a

Speaker 2 good chunk of your life,

Speaker 3 you've lost some of that because you're set and you're like, sure. She's got this.

Speaker 4 Yeah. I think maybe when I AJ was younger, I was more protective or more like, who is this guy? Like, what are you after? Are you actually a loser? And you're just like hiding it really well.

Speaker 2 Yep.

Speaker 4 But, but I feel like I've always been on like. good terms with most of the guys that you've dated.
I feel like you've got kind of a friendly banter.

Speaker 4 Maybe not as much where you've been like friends with my true.

Speaker 3 In a way, I've been more judgmental about who she's dated than the other way around.

Speaker 1 Which again, maybe is the little bit of a sister.

Speaker 2 Oh, me too.

Speaker 1 I'm like, you're a fucking loser. You don't deserve my sister.
My sister's like, Alex, I've gone on two dates with this man and you just ran into him on the street in New York.

Speaker 1 This wasn't even a planned meeting.

Speaker 2 I'm like, back off. Yeah.

Speaker 2 He's like, what? Um, okay.

Speaker 1 I'm like, yeah, that's a nightmare to have me. Your parents are divorced, right? Yeah.
How do you guys think their divorce informed how you approached your romantic relationships in your adult lives?

Speaker 4 If I'm going to speak for AJ, I think that.

Speaker 2 Oh, oh, oh, no, that's fine. Don't speak for you.
Speak for me.

Speaker 3 I think, I mean, we kind of do when each other is

Speaker 4 like maybe a bad habit, but

Speaker 4 I think that AJ as the little sister vibes was more

Speaker 2 like heartbroken by it. Yeah, Yeah, I took it back.
And shattered and took it really bad.

Speaker 1 What age did they get divorced?

Speaker 2 20

Speaker 3 and 21. Okay.

Speaker 2 Okay. Yeah.
19 and 21.

Speaker 4 So, like, in a way, you're old enough to know exactly what happened, all the details. Like, I think there's a positive and a negative to it.
But I think for us, I was shattered.

Speaker 4 It helped that I was on a TV show and I was living by myself alone for the first time out in Vancouver. Oh, yeah.
And so I was just focused on that. And you were like left to be at home with my mom.

Speaker 4 Still, all of us at that point were living together and you were kind of mourning the divorce a little bit with her. So I think in a weird way,

Speaker 4 you like carried some of that trauma with you where I was kind of like, bye, I'm off shooting the show for eight, nine months.

Speaker 2 And then I think.

Speaker 3 But when you rapped, we ended up living together. We lived with our mom while she kind of dealt with getting her life back together after the divorce.

Speaker 3 Like we, it would ended up being like a home of three women.

Speaker 4 Like kind of like three's company, but just ladies.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 No, that kind of stuff, like I know, can like, you're right, affects people in different ways, literally down to like logistically where you were at in the middle of your parents getting divorced can play such a role and like how it genuinely affected you because you got to be essentially removed correct yeah do you see the point did you notice anything with like how that affected when you started to like engage in romantic relationships there was infidelity with what happened we're actually like super close with both parents and i was able to forgive our father and like i actually feel like we're in a great place now but at the time it was really hard for me and i think when i was dating people i immediately had this trigger that like they're gonna cheat up like they're gonna like because how could that happen after 23 years of marriage?

Speaker 3 Like, I feel bad talking about it because I love my dad, but like, it really was one of those things that became a trigger point that, like, didn't really need to be there.

Speaker 3 Like, no one needs to be assuming you're being cheated on. You just feel like you've seen it now.
So you're like, it's going to happen.

Speaker 1 It's more horrible. I also think like.

Speaker 1 That's such an interesting dynamic because I could be sitting here with someone that had their parents get divorced when they were like six and it fucked them up.

Speaker 1 It is interesting hearing you guys talk about because I know this is a very, very, very relatable topic, which like I have a friend that has a similar situation to you guys with your parents.

Speaker 1 When you are that age and you're very deep and about to begin to explore your romantic adult relationships to have a foundation that was like pretty, it seems like pretty solid for your whole area.

Speaker 2 Well, people would be shocked, you know, to find out to find out like wait what the Macaulay family they broke up.

Speaker 1 So your reality was so like disrupted. I can imagine that.
Yes.

Speaker 1 Like then you're like, we, if I can't trust like my dad, then I can't trust any of these men when really again it's like they're doing this for the first time too and that's their relationship or whatever but it interpersects you it does girls but i don't think it's like or at least i didn't feel like it turned me off from marriage or not believing in marriage for whatever reason no no i think we still like believed in the idea of it and

Speaker 4 and

Speaker 4 i don't know i think we always felt like okay

Speaker 4 there is a

Speaker 4 there is a chance that you can actually have a successful marriage in in this day and age. You just got to really work on it.
And I think if I'm

Speaker 2 if I'm going to be the little Yoda that I am bringing it, bring it.

Speaker 3 Here we go. That I am in my heart.

Speaker 2 I love it. I'm kidding.
I love Yoda. I'm joking.
But I do love Yoda, actually. The child.

Speaker 2 The child.

Speaker 4 I think that not working on

Speaker 1 the

Speaker 4 relationship between the mom and dad

Speaker 4 is the whole end of the marriage because everything was poured poured into me and AJ. And that was almost like the scapegoat.
And then it was like, oh, we don't work on ourselves.

Speaker 4 We're not going to be in therapy. We're not going to do these things.
We're not going to make sure that you are flown out on tour every, you know, two and a half weeks.

Speaker 3 Instead, we're going to pride ourselves being the parents that were really there for the two kids in the industry.

Speaker 4 But then it's like, but then you're going to get what caused us apart, which then affects us.

Speaker 1 Right. That's interesting.
I saw someone recently talking about

Speaker 1 when people just become their identity as being a mother or a father. It's like, you can't just be one thing.
Like, what's your identity to yourself? What's your identity to your partner?

Speaker 1 And that's how you lose yourself if you're just one. I wonder, like, obviously, how old is your child?

Speaker 4 He's, he'll be eight months. I mean, I guess when he's, when we, when this is out, like, oh my God, you know, almost like that.

Speaker 1 Almost, oh my God. Yeah.
How has like that concept of like recognizing still needing to pour because you're in the thick of it right now. Like you've got basically a newborn.

Speaker 1 How have you tried to like work with your partner to make sure you guys are good, even in the excitement of having like a new child? And that's all you want to talk about.

Speaker 4 Well, I think, I think making moments where it can be the two of us, or even if like our kid is around, it's like, okay, well, he's like asleep right now, but we can still kind of have like a little date night and go out to dinner and put him in his little stroller and like it can still be romantic or we can put a movie on or we can get away to our favorite place in Big Sur and it can be not just all about the kid, you know?

Speaker 1 No, your son is so adorable. Like when he was at tour, I was literally like this, like

Speaker 1 calm baby. I literally walk into your dressing room.

Speaker 2 He's here. You can see him.

Speaker 4 I see him after you. Yeah.
Yeah. He's in a little swap.
He's not in a matching. We couldn't get a miniature, but he's,

Speaker 1 yeah, we would. I'm obsessed with that.

Speaker 3 Merch team was like, we can't get that turned around.

Speaker 1 They're like, please calm down. You're like, okay, fine.

Speaker 1 Okay, before we're going to go through now, I want to do new music and we're going to play one last game because I think it's fun because sister dynamic.

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Speaker 1 I love it.

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Speaker 2 Okay, ready?

Speaker 1 Who is the more bougie one between the two of you?

Speaker 4 Who likes the nicer stuff me maybe maybe aj she'll splurge on more like

Speaker 2 um

Speaker 3 like a skincare thing or like doing like like skin is beautiful or like facials massages yeah oh yeah the spa the spa you both love a spa but i i tend to like maybe do it a little too much i was gonna say that like the most like what is the luxury thing you can't live without the spa yeah facials like every like every week well it's paying off like literally aj does you have great oh my gosh

Speaker 2 did you ever have bad skin like as a teen did you Oh my God.

Speaker 1 Yes. So like I will take all the compliments.
No. Oh my God.
You guys, I had like full Accutane when I was younger.

Speaker 2 Oh, wow. Really?

Speaker 1 But it was just like very hormonal. And then I got over it.

Speaker 2 And then it was gone. Wow.

Speaker 1 And now like, here we are. Blowing.
Facials.

Speaker 1 Okay. Who is more likely to take a secret to the grave?

Speaker 2 Me. Probably AJ.

Speaker 1 AJ. Yeah.

Speaker 2 You just smiled so

Speaker 2 AJ. You're like, give it up.
Although, that is true.

Speaker 4 AJ, I'm like, your mom, bitch. But I'm pretty good at keeping it.
No, you are with each other. Like, like

Speaker 4 to the grave together.

Speaker 2 Do you know what i mean like

Speaker 4 that's not i know but it's like it has to be between the two of us who is more likely to pick a fight between the two of you i mean we both can pick a fight with each other pretty like quickly pretty quickly if it's the right subject matter you know the right thing if it's like we're disagreeing on something like how something was handled like a g will be like you had a bunch of typos in this one business email i'm like who cares yeah i'll have a correction off like she's like she will she's like you're you're you're writing an email like you're texting you know like you i'm like this this is sloppy.

Speaker 2 This isn't good for our business.

Speaker 4 I'm like, okay. I'm like, sorry, like that, you know?

Speaker 1 That's not even a fight.

Speaker 3 But like, I usually start something sooner, I feel like, than you. That's probably true.

Speaker 4 Yeah. Adri's maybe a little more fiery.

Speaker 1 I would love. If you had to say, what is your biggest pet peeve about each other?

Speaker 2 Hmm.

Speaker 1 I just like start a full fight. She's full of fight on this podcast.

Speaker 3 Oh my gosh. I have it.

Speaker 2 Wow.

Speaker 3 Oh, wow. Allie started doing this in the last like year very consistently.
I actually don't think I have addressed it with you.

Speaker 2 Oh, my God.

Speaker 3 Where she'll go, maybe you could do that.

Speaker 4 Like, yeah, you're right. It's me.

Speaker 2 It's me.

Speaker 3 She'll start a sentence that she's asking you to do something, but instead, it's like, maybe you could get that bottle, like for Jack, or like, maybe you could get that. That's true.

Speaker 3 You know what I'm talking about. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I don't know how you word it exactly. I think it starts with maybe you could.
Oh, interesting. And it's like a, you want me to,

Speaker 2 or I could just ask me the question and I'll do it.

Speaker 4 Okay, so I should just be asking the question. Just ask.
Or just be like, get me this.

Speaker 2 Get me this. Get me this.

Speaker 3 I mean, I'd rather you just say, like, do that.

Speaker 2 Get the burp cloth. Maybe you could.

Speaker 4 Maybe you could. Oh, interesting.

Speaker 1 Oh, that's infuriating.

Speaker 2 That drives me nuts.

Speaker 1 That's a good one. It drives me nutty.

Speaker 2 That is a great one. Okay, your turn.
Ooh, AJ.

Speaker 2 Hmm. Okay.

Speaker 4 We both are OCD and we know this about each other, but AJ loves to reorganize an area that I've already kind of pre-tried to organize, knowing that AJ doesn't like something moved.

Speaker 2 That's true. Like the shoes or something.

Speaker 4 I'm like, okay, she'll like it in this corner. And then it's like moved and it's like the shoes are just in a different corner, but they're still.

Speaker 1 They're still on the ground. And you're like, I literally cleaned for you.

Speaker 4 I'm like, I've cleaned for the OCD, like just trying to get ahead of it.

Speaker 3 That's OCD. You can't.
That's the beauty. It has to be your way.
You have to be in your way.

Speaker 4 Not in your way. Mine doesn't make any damn sense, but it's your way.

Speaker 2 Even if you have a lot of people. There's nothing logical.

Speaker 2 Nothing logical.

Speaker 4 It's like this pile of clothes.

Speaker 2 You're lucky I did not reorganize my cook shop. I can't imagine what's actually feeling in this room.

Speaker 3 It's only in my own space.

Speaker 2 Okay, that makes me feel good. Never in someone else's ever.

Speaker 1 Who is the first to usually apologize if you guys are coming back from a fight?

Speaker 2 Probably AJ.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 3 Allie, I don't even remember the last time you said I'm saying.

Speaker 4 Yeah, yeah, I'm not good at saying that.

Speaker 3 She does not apologize. Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 1 no, you said, but you're you said you're usually lightly starting it and then you're ending it.

Speaker 2 Yes, yeah, love that for you. I'm a closer.

Speaker 1 Um, you guys, your new music.

Speaker 2 Okay, we're here.

Speaker 1 Let's talk about it. You have a new album coming out and a single.
The single is coming out on January 10th. Love, what is it called? What it feels like.

Speaker 3 We were supposed to do that at the same time, but it's gonna do it.

Speaker 1 Yeah, let's do it again. Ready? Okay, what is it called?

Speaker 2 What it feels like. Wait.

Speaker 2 Fuck.

Speaker 1 And five, six, seven, eight.

Speaker 2 What it feels like.

Speaker 1 Gorgeous. Gorgeous, gorgeous.
Okay, talk to me about this album. What is the inspiration behind the music?

Speaker 4 I mean, this record feels like it's never been more us.

Speaker 4 Obviously, every single album, you're hoping to achieve, you know, that 10%

Speaker 4 better, right? Each time, just like you would with like each, you know, season of the show. But I do feel like we've really stepped into like our womanhood on this album.
And I think part of that is,

Speaker 4 I think, just seeing that

Speaker 4 this music

Speaker 4 has been so informed by our live show and touring and playing songs to a live audience and with our band that we've now been playing with for a few years has really helped us identify, okay, this is the kind of music we want to put on a record and what we want to then go out and tour.

Speaker 4 So I think it's looking at it from like

Speaker 4 the live show is the top of the pyramid and how do we get to the live show?

Speaker 4 and i think a lot of this music was um created with people that we felt really safe with and was

Speaker 4 while i was like heavily pregnant i mean i guess we started writing it right before i got pregnant and then really the whole making of this album has been either me pregnant and then delivering and then album is finished and delivered oh my gosh yes her water broke in like day two of like pre-production production at her house at my yeah in the guest room at like 6 a.m that's kind of like i was texting texting with Stephen.

Speaker 4 It was very interesting.

Speaker 2 I'm like, what's going on in there?

Speaker 3 He's like, I think her water broke.

Speaker 2 I was like, what?

Speaker 3 We just started.

Speaker 4 And then I got really nervous thinking, OCD. I was like, she's going to be pissed because this water is on her bed and on the ground.

Speaker 3 Not when it's like

Speaker 2 your child.

Speaker 3 I know. Although that is pretty funny.

Speaker 2 Allie's like, clean it. I was like, clean it, clean it.
Get the rags.

Speaker 2 Wait.

Speaker 2 Oh, my God.

Speaker 1 Wait. Okay.
So how long was the writing process of this album?

Speaker 3 The writing was finished. So I would say the writing took a solid year.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 3 Before we we really were ready to be like, these are the 15 songs we want to record. We're very like.

Speaker 4 Like just, maybe just under, maybe just under a year. Yeah.

Speaker 2 This is a hard question.

Speaker 1 What is your favorite song off the album? That's hard.

Speaker 3 I'm so happy with this record, but I really think my number one is Michael's song.

Speaker 3 We wrote it about a really dear friend of ours that we had worked with in the industry for years, and he passed away last year.

Speaker 3 And we were like, we have to write about this.

Speaker 2 And we were on tour.

Speaker 3 We were on tour during the funeral. We weren't able to come.
Our parents came on behalf of us, which was really sweet. We're really close to his daughter and his wife.

Speaker 3 Literally like a long-standing member of the Alley Nation.

Speaker 4 Like the longest running team member

Speaker 4 for us. Like, you know, so it was like it was kind of almost like a father figure.

Speaker 4 You know, so it was very hard to come to terms with it. And then we we felt like this could be a song, you know, and it's so specific.

Speaker 4 Like when you listen to the song and you read the lyrics, you're like, oh, this is, this is very specifically about

Speaker 3 like the very last time we saw him. Yeah.

Speaker 1 and not knowing, of course, that it would be the last time that it was like our last dinner, but I feel like that's such a powerful message because everyone has experienced grief, so they'll be able to like transport themselves probably when they're like the last time they saw whoever it was to them that they lost.

Speaker 3 And they, what is your favorite?

Speaker 4 Honestly, it's kind of a tie between two, and I think it's because it has to do with my son and then the fact that I was leaving

Speaker 4 Laurel Canyon to then live in Santa Barbara, like away from AJ. And I wrote, I basically wrote this song with AJ about

Speaker 4 like moving into this new house and this new space and it not feeling like a home and feeling like I was kind of like summoning it to be this, this place that I felt welcomed in.

Speaker 4 And not, not like it had like bad juju revives. I just was like, this isn't perfect and this isn't right.
And I want to change out this doorknob. And my husband's just like, okay.

Speaker 4 And I'm like pregnant and like nesting and I'm just like frantic.

Speaker 2 I'm like, fix this.

Speaker 4 This needs to be fixed. And it just, and I was like, you know what? This would be a good song, like willing this to happen and to make this space a home.

Speaker 4 And I really love AJ's, uh, the way she sings the bridge on, on that song. Um, the song is called, I don't know what it is.
And, um,

Speaker 4 and I think that song just, whenever I listen to it, it's almost kind of healing because I'm finally at a place where the home doesn't feel like a shell. Yeah, like a shell.

Speaker 4 It feels like, oh, this is a place that has good memories. And I associate like my birth and I birthed in this living room right here.

Speaker 4 and this is this wasn't traumatic this was all kind of what i hoped it would be oh um so that's beautiful yeah so i think it's like the the the end story of it is really great but it was very much me struggling to find my identity within the home and then the other song that's like maybe uh equal to that is this song called dandelions which is about Jack.

Speaker 4 And we kind of wrote this pre him being born, which is crazy.

Speaker 2 So knowing he was coming.

Speaker 3 Knowing he was coming and that we wanted him to like have this message of hope and like whatever dreams we're not able to reach he is more than capable of reaching them himself you know that is and hopefully each generation reaches more oh my god how crazy and cool that you guys like one day like your son will get to watch you perform a song about him live and listen to it and have it forever like that's such a beautiful gift yeah i mean that is the power of songwriting yeah like it really is i think the other thing about specifically songwriting and it's funny because i'm learning constantly about music we've actually already written but i'm learning new things about what we've written after the fact.

Speaker 3 Like to me, when a song takes on a new life, but it had a different meaning when you wrote it. Yes.
Like, I don't know what it is.

Speaker 3 Now, when I listen to that song and I picture your home, which you've now created from the ground up as like a beautiful nest, I'm like, whoa, this is so different than how we came at this song writing it, thinking we're splitting up as sisters.

Speaker 3 We're no longer going to live in the canyon by each other. We're like, what are we doing? We're going to be torn apart.
And it's like, no, we're just shifting into other parts of our life.

Speaker 1 Right. Now that song is like, shows your growth because you're like, now now your house is a home and now you're so happy.

Speaker 2 That's what I love.

Speaker 3 How songwriting teaches you something, but you wrote it. And a year later, you're listening to it differently.

Speaker 2 It's kind of prophetic in a way. That's really cool.

Speaker 2 How songwriting is. It is.

Speaker 4 And I think with this record, there was so much like feminine energy around it. And I think part of that was me being pregnant.
But then part of that was us just.

Speaker 4 going through the growing pains of like we are getting older and we don't live down the street from each other and we this like we aren't living in our childhood really anymore we're we're out of that and we're not in our 20s anymore anymore, which we just got reminded by an executive, yeah, yeah, literally.

Speaker 1 Stop.

Speaker 2 No, we went to have a meeting, like, I'm not getting like a label meeting.

Speaker 3 And literally, like, last week, the note was like, we love the record, we think it's amazing, but like, we're not here to break women in their 30s, like, we're here to break pops.

Speaker 4 I was like, so we need to be like 21 or something.

Speaker 2 I was like, I'm 35. I was like, I'm 33.

Speaker 3 I was like, we're still young as hell. And I was like, now I'm reminded that we're not.

Speaker 4 After the meeting, she's like, I'm sorry. I just, I have to kind of like, well, not after the meeting.

Speaker 2 In a process.

Speaker 4 After we had heard that it was a no.

Speaker 4 So it was like, you know, we did the meeting and and then it was like, you know, whatever it was two days later, it was like, oh, a call's coming, you know, and we're kind of going, okay, well, I want, I hope it's like positive.

Speaker 4 And then that was the feedback. And Adrian's like, I just need to sit with this for a minute.

Speaker 3 Yeah, because I'm like, I've never even thought of myself as not being in the zeitgeist of it. Right.

Speaker 1 And you're also like, is the music good or no?

Speaker 2 Right. Like, what does it have to do with how old I am?

Speaker 1 And it's like, how many times do you think they've said that to a man?

Speaker 2 Probably never.

Speaker 1 Oh, like, never trying to break a

Speaker 1 what? I know. I know.

Speaker 2 I know.

Speaker 3 So I'm like, we're not horses.

Speaker 2 And yeah, yeah, you don't need to break us.

Speaker 3 Totally. And we've broken.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 4 so I think part of it was, besides, you know, like you said,

Speaker 4 the fact that it's maybe not ideal age for breaking an artist, whatever, in the music industry.

Speaker 4 I think part of it was also like the album was completed and done. They couldn't meddle and change stuff.

Speaker 2 Because it was finished. It's finished.
Because it's finished.

Speaker 4 It's not like, hey, here's some demos. And they're like, oh, yes, we love track one.
No to two, three, and six. Change this sound.

Speaker 2 And you're like, no.

Speaker 4 And they were like, you know, and we wouldn't maybe go down this route like sonically for you.

Speaker 4 you i'm like like us playing music and writing the music like what what do you mean oh yeah it's wild so it was though a blessing that you guys did on your own and you don't want to work with someone that doesn't want to like doesn't want you in the way you are exactly at right now because clearly you guys said you have other records that you never put out this feels right to you yeah so go with so go do it it's it's it's a message that that is very pure in what it is there's no like gimmick behind it so they're not like oh i can like it's harder to sell something yeah it's harder to sell something because they're like what's the shtick?

Speaker 4 And it's like, just we're sisters. We play music.
We write. We've been doing this since we were young.

Speaker 1 But I think that's like the best part about you guys. Like, I have to say

Speaker 1 growing up and listening to you guys, you have such incredible voices, but hearing you perform live at my tour, I remember like pinching my best friend, Lauren, being like, their voices are so beautiful.

Speaker 1 Like literally, you guys have like such incredible voices. And what I appreciate about you guys and about this album is actually more like that it is real.

Speaker 1 It is obvious when people have not written their music and when they're told to wear the certain thing and look the certain way, just kind of like you guys are describing, you would go into meetings and you feel people trying to shift and mold you into something that you're not.

Speaker 1 And I think if people are looking for something in their life music wise, that's actually going to connect them to the real shit that they're going through. This is more of the album.
I think like.

Speaker 1 people right now are more interested in than maybe who knows no but sure you can love top but like i really think that you guys are connecting to something that people are loving, which is authenticity.

Speaker 1 So, that's exactly what you're saying.

Speaker 4 I mean, yeah, and I, and I feel like people gravitate towards that, you know, I think

Speaker 3 that's why this show works.

Speaker 2 Yeah, like it's authentic to the truth and how women talk and how women feel and how we communicate.

Speaker 3 You knew that was a missing piece, yes, yeah, it wasn't really going on.

Speaker 1 I think it's so exciting to see you guys like back at it, and I think it also is such a testament to like your ability to be critical of yourselves, to be like, we didn't put out certain albums because it didn't feel right and we weren't ourselves.

Speaker 1 And so the fact that like this is all you, this was done at a very incredible, vulnerable, emotional time in both of your lives.

Speaker 1 Like, I think that the world is going to be so, so, so excited to hear it. And they're going to love it.
So I'm so excited for you guys. You are so lovely as human beings.

Speaker 1 I know we haven't spent that much time together, but like, I feel like I now know you guys enough to be like, you guys are real ones.

Speaker 1 So thank you so much for taking the time during the holidays and coming and sitting down with me. You guys are the best.

Speaker 2 Happy New Year. Happy New Year.

Speaker 4 You could be a little bit more.

Speaker 1 Oh, I'm putting it on. You're an honorary.

Speaker 2 You're the youngest. You look like we're the youngest sister.
You are. I'm coming.
I'm coming in.

Speaker 1 I'm going to put it on. Love you guys.

Speaker 2 Love you, Taylor.

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