Chef Min Kim On Learning from Chefs in Japan, Starting Mizumi & Weirdest Food He's Eaten | DSH #231

What's the weirdest thing you've eaten?

So in Japan there is a thing called shirako and actually it's one of the delicacies in Japan especially during the winter time.

Okay.

It's basically a fish sperm.

I'm trying to picture this.

I can't be disrespect to the chef.

So like sometimes I'm just like I just close my eyes and I just shove it in my mouth and I just swallow and I'm like this is not good.

This is not good.

Welcome back to the show guys.

I'm your host as always Sean Kelly.

Got a special guest for you guys today.

Chef Min Kim.

How's it going?

Sean, how are you?

I'm good, man.

Thanks for having me, man.

I'm really excited for this.

Absolutely.

When we met, that was...

So you're part of Mizumi, obviously.

And got to meet you at your restaurant.

And that was one of the best meals I've ever had.

Thank you.

That's how much of a mark you left on me.

I had to have you on the show.

And considering that was two years ago, I was like looking back at my feed and you know the messages that we've been sending back and forth.

And I'm like,

holy hell, that was like two years ago.

It's been a while.

Time flies.

Time flies.

And obviously, like, I've been, you know, I'm a big fan of yours, so I've been following your journey and stuff.

And, you know, but just to think that was two years ago.

And I'm like, wow.

Yeah.

Before I even started the podcast or anything.

Right, right.

Crazy.

Yeah.

So, how'd you get involved with Mizumi and being at the Win as a partner?

That's an incredible feature to accomplish.

Yeah.

So, you know, I've been with the company for almost nine years now.

My journey with Win started in Macau.

We have our sister property in Macau.

You know, We have our sister property in Boston, but also in Macau.

And back in 2015,

there was a property called Wind Palace, which was second Wind property in Macau, was being constructed and getting ready to open.

So then one of my friends that I used to work with back in Australia, he was there already in Macau as opening, pre-opening team of that property.

And he called me.

I remember like I was in Australia at the time.

When he called me he's like hey

There's really cool gig like and this is like grand.

This is you know off this planet type of thing, you know, and I'm really excited for it and I want you to be part of it like if you want and I was like man like sounds pretty cool.

I've never even thought about working in Macau, right?

I'm like, okay, you know, let me just go and check it out.

So even before committing to anything, I went over there just to see what it's like.

And it was actually really cool.

So I'm like, okay, like I'm in, right?

so that was back in 2015 started my journey with Wynn and then after

four and a half years of my time in Macau I kind of thought it was my time to just move on and then you know at the time this opportunity came up in Las Vegas so I just got transferred from Macau to here and you know it's just been here ever since beautiful so you never been to Vegas before you moved there so I have a couple of times

but just to like travel right like just to visit and I think there is a huge difference between visiting a place and liking it versus like living there, right?

It's a completely different, I guess, dynamic.

So, and like, to be honest, like, I don't drink, I don't smoke, I don't gamble, right?

So

very rare for a chef, right?

Being a chef, like when I tell people, like, oh, I don't drink, and they're like, what is wrong with you?

Like, literally, they're like, they're seriously concerned, and they're like, are you okay?

Are you okay?

So, you know, like, so just in that sense, like, being in Vegas wasn't really top of my list, the place to live and work.

But, you know, I thought about the culture and the people that I work with at Wynn.

And, you know, being a professional and being a professional in my field and in my industry, for me, it's, I work so much that I don't, like, even get a chance to go out and enjoy the actual city so much anyway.

You know, so for me, it's about I spent almost like 70 to 80% of my life at work.

So what mattered more for me, and which still is, is about where I work and the people that I work with.

Wow.

So that really attracted me to come here because I need enough professional people around me that I'll be working with.

Yeah.

Wow.

70, 80% is high.

So you're pretty much at the restaurant all day.

All day, all day.

And I have like my different business that I run in Asia as well.

So because of time difference, let's say I'll finish my work.

and my restaurant and win at one and I'll go home have dinner you know work out a little bit and shower and from 3 a.m to 6 a.m i'll work on my business in asia holy crap yeah so i only sleep about like five hours every day so you don't sleep till 6 a.m yeah and then yeah yeah sometimes sometimes worry depending on what's going on over there like you know during the time especially i mean asia like generally like struggled a lot right fmb industry they suffer so much really

so you know um I took my restaurant and my business took a lot of hit and damage during the time and you know I had to focus a lot more on them in terms of operations and you know profitability and stuff like that.

So now I only spend about two or three hours every day with them but like comparatively speaking back back in 2021 I was spending probably about four or five hours every day just going through the strategies and plans and long-term plans and short-term plans and stuff like that.

It's amazing to see you thrive in this space because a lot of restaurants fail.

A lot, a lot.

I mean, you know, I mean, you probably know this, but statistically speaking, they say four restaurants out of five that open generally fails, like, globally speaking.

So, you know, only one restaurant out of five that opens actually survives and strives.

So, which is like a crazy number if you think about it.

Yeah.

Did you know that going into the restaurant industry?

No, really.

I mean, you know, like my dad is a chef, right?

So, like, in a way, I'm like second generation chef.

I was born in a restaurant.

My dad, you know, I grew up in a poverty.

I mean, for lack of better terms, terms, poverty.

Like, we did have a lot of money, right?

And, you know, back in the days, people become a chef because you're a

right.

People, like, you don't become a chef because you pursue glory and money and success.

Like, you know, I'm talking like 40, 50 years ago, you become a chef because you have no other skills in your life.

Like, oh, what do I do?

Okay, I'll just go to a restaurant and wash dishes.

And then you slowly move up the rank.

And before you know, you're like, hey, chef, right?

That's kind of what happened to my dad as well.

So, you know, when he decided to open his own restaurant, he didn't have too much money.

So what he did was he bought a property.

He actually built it himself, him and his friends.

So half of those, half of that property that he bought, he transferred into

like a restaurant, the forefront of it.

And then the back end of it, he turned into a like residential housing, I guess, like spot.

So when I was born, like literally, I was, in a literal sense, I was born in a restaurant.

Wow.

So like, you know, because we didn't have too much space, we actually even didn't have a kitchen.

The only kitchen space that we had for the house was basically the kitchen of the restaurant.

So we shared the same space.

So, you know, every single day, every breath that I took as a kid in that area was being part of the restaurant.

So I couldn't think of anything else.

but to become a chef, right?

Like, because that was almost the option, only option that was shown to me as a kid growing up for over a decade.

Yeah.

Was this in Australia?

it was in korea korea it was in korea so uh my dad specialized in japanese cuisine he studied and trained a lot in japan came back to korea to open up his own restaurant nice um and it was pretty cool right i mean like you know as a kid i would go into the kitchen you know and then i always see my dad like yelling and screaming you know he's like throwing around and he's like telling people off and like you know nobody's like talking back to him and i'm like dude that's cool right in my head i'm like man like i want to be like I want to be that.

I don't know what that is, but I want to be that.

You know, that's how I was kind of inspired to become a chef.

Dang.

So he was a hs.

Were you kind of fearful of him?

Very.

Like, very, right?

Like, I mean, he was a very, he was such a like authority type of figure, right?

I wouldn't, I wouldn't say he was a tyrant, right?

He was more like very honorably respected from his staff, right?

But even his presence spoke a lot.

Like, you know, when he entered the room, you know, like one of those people that comes into the room, comes into the space, and immediately you would feel the energy change, right?

He was one of those type of people.

Like, he will walk into the kitchen or he'll walk into the restaurant, and straight away, the air immensely just changed.

Wow.

That type of, like, it's, I don't, I wouldn't, I wouldn't want to say it was a feel.

It was more of that, I guess,

like

predominant, like,

alpha male type of energy right like you walk in and you're like oh dude respect type of feel yeah wow so do you kind of carry that in your restaurants too

to like to a degree i mean i try right i try and you know i'm a very very strict you know

like type of type of like leader because you know i have very high standard to achieve right and in order to achieve the high standard and excellence you have to pursue a pathway of discipline, like hardworking ethic, right?

Like commitment, dedication, your passion, everything, right?

Like

in the pursuit of excellence, it comes with a lot of sacrifice.

People don't realize that, right?

They think like, oh, just be good, like just, you know, just make it nice or like be excellent, right?

People think it's just like as simple and easy as just saying it, but there is just so much sacrifice.

that comes with it, right?

And, you know, like what I mean by sacrifice, there's a lot of that long hours, right?

When I was working in Japan, I used to work like 80 to 90 hours a week.

Jeez, right?

And like, you know, and like they are very, very strict and sometimes even like physically violent type of environment, right?

They will like literally like kick you in the leg, right?

They're like, white just stuff up, right?

So there was a lot of that

intense environment.

that really like makes you into almost like a monster but not in sort of bad way right monster in a way of like you are you are like fearless like you are strong and you are you know like the you have that dominance right like you get through anything correct yeah yeah so how long were you learning in japan for so i was there for four years and you know probably like working in japan was the hardest experience that i ever had in my career right like i was saying you literally work 80 to 90 hours a week and that's like normal right when there is like big event or when when it's a peak busy season whatever you will literally break like 90 to 100 hours and you're standing the whole time right whole time like running like literally running in your sweats wow so I remember some like during the summertime like I would finish work like 2 a.m.

3 a.m.

Cause like you gotta like clean the kitchen like oh you had to clean too?

Oh spotless clean.

Dang.

Like on my knees, on my hands and knees like scrubbing the floor with like toothbrush.

Like toothbrush?

Toothbrush.

Holy crap yeah like literally they give you like like one of the bigger ones like toothbrush and toothpaste and they're like okay you go from there to there

all the way scrub wow and I'm like like literally scrub

and they're like yep so that I mean like I could literally sleep on the floor that's how clean the place was

like and Japanese people are very like sensitive about hygiene the cleanliness and stuff stuff like that.

So, you know, which I thought it was really good thing for a restaurant to focus on.

So, I didn't have any complaints, but you know, sometimes I'll finish at 2-3 a.m.

in the morning and I will come out of the restaurant and I don't realize how much I sweat, right?

But, like, sometimes I'll come out and I'll see my black t-shirt completely almost white

from like the salinity from my sweat.

Crazy.

Yeah, that's right.

That's unreal.

Yeah, yeah.

Why is the sushi so good in Japan?

I think it's a dedication.

I think it's a dedication to master craftsmanship.

A lot of Japanese people, they dedicate their whole life in one craftsmanship.

Like, you know, you go to Japan, like, for example, you go to a sushi restaurant and they only do sushi.

Right.

For example, like, you know, comparatively speaking, in America or like in more like Western societies, even Australia, Europe, you go to Japanese restaurant and they do sushi, they do tempura, they do tepanyaki, they do like everything, right?

So, you know, it's good from a consumer's perspective, it's good because you have a lot more different varieties to try.

But I think

when you stretch out your pour so far, it's a lot more difficult for you to go in depth in terms of quality.

And I think that's what Japanese chefs do so great.

Like you go to like tempura restaurant in Japan in Tokyo and you know the chef you talk to he's like third generation of tempura chef like his father was a temporary chef.

His grandfather was temporarily chef.

So literally, he's been like the whole family has been running that restaurant for like century, right?

So then obviously when you do something for a century,

you know, it's probably safe to say you pick up a trick or two here and there, right?

So, you know, they literally master their craftsmanship.

you know and it's it's accumulated experience and knowledge over the course of so many years right and you know that's how you become a master at something something.

Yeah, I agree with that.

Whenever I go to a restaurant and the menu is super long, that's a red flag for me.

100%.

Like a diner, it's like five pages.

I'm like, oh my gosh, you're probably freezing everything on this.

Right, 100%.

Like, you literally feel like you're reading a Bible, right?

Like, page after page after page.

You're like, okay, at this point, like, I'm lost.

Yeah.

Right?

Yeah, I like simple menus for sure.

Correct, yeah.

Which dishes took the longest for you to perfect?

I know sushi is pretty hard, right?

Very hard.

And I think,

and to be to be very very honest sean like i don't think i've actually perfected any of that yet right um again comparatively speaking like you know um i know there are a lot of good chefs out there and you know i know there are a lot of good restaurants out there and every time when i go out to eat at those restaurants especially like in japan it really humbles me like

to a shame almost I'm like and I'm eating sometimes like at this like you know two machine three mission well like sometimes not not even like that level like sometimes you go to like, you know, this like really simple casual restaurant whole in the world type place in the back alley of like Tokyo Shinjuku whatever.

Yeah.

And you walk in and literally they don't have the menu, right?

And you talk to these like masters or like the head chefs and they're like, oh, you just eat whatever I give you.

And I'm like, okay.

And they start giving you all these crazy ass dishes and like just mind-blowing dishes.

And just like

to see how much they know and how skilled they are and how talented they are and they're like nobodies right nobody knows them they literally they own a like small joint with a hole in the wall in the back alley of like you know back of the toky or somewhere wow but like you look at them and you're like man you are so much better than i am

and like it just it just really humbles you the notion of that right yeah so even though like i like to think that i'm good at what i do and i i believe that i am good at what I do to a certain point, but

I don't think I'm to a level where I can say yeah,

I perfected like any of my skill set or craftsmanship.

Wow, and that's crazy to say because you've been working at this your whole life.

20 years.

Yeah, but there's always people doing better.

Always, right?

Yeah.

Is it hard for you to eat in the US?

Like eat at restaurants?

Yes and no, Sean.

Like yes and no.

I mean, yes, in a sense,

I've worked at like seven different, six different countries.

So, and I travel a lot, right?

I travel like, I think almost 60 countries.

So,

so, you know, there is so many things, I guess, so many references for me to compare to, right?

So, in a sense, I would go out and, you know, especially like this day and age, like everything is so inflated.

Like, you go to a restaurant and you literally like have like half full type of meal and it still costs you like 200 bucks.

Yeah.

Especially in Vegas.

Especially in Vegas.

Yeah.

Right.

So then like you think about the value for money that you pay, right?

Yes, it was a good meal, but when you really think about the value versus like how much you pay, I don't think it amounts to what you actually pay.

So in that sense, I think about, oh man, like, you know, if I was in Japan or if I was in like Korea or Singapore or like, you know, China, I think, man, like I could have had like a beautiful meal at like a fraction of the cost that I paid for.

So in that regard, in that aspect, I'm like, oh, it's kind of tough me going out to restaurants in America to pay that much money and get that sort of quality.

But no, in a sense, because in America, there are so many different options.

So many different options.

And, you know, I feel like I love the sense of when I go out to restaurants, a lot of like servers and you know, waiting staff, like front house staff, like they are very friendly, right?

Whereas like you go to a restaurant in Japan, in Korea, or like you know, Asian countries, they are there the waiting staff are a little more reserved.

They don't even talk to you.

They don't even talk to you.

You know, right?

I mean, I've heard about it.

Right.

And they just stand there and they literally like just look at you.

Like, you know, like

with their side eyes, like, are you done?

Are you done?

Yeah, yeah.

Right.

So it's kind of awkward.

But whereas like in America, like, everyone's kind of friendly, right?

You have actually great experience and time interacting with the staff at the restaurant.

Right.

So yeah, I think that's probably the biggest difference.

That's cool.

Yeah, I didn't even think about it.

You know all the margins.

So from that perspective, you're like, oh, this guy spent like twenty bucks on this and I paid two hundred.

So it's a curse.

It's it's a bless and a curse at the same time.

And I try not to think about the business aspect of the dining experience when I go out because once you start getting into the more technical and business side of you know the whole dining experience, it's just not fun anymore, right?

Yeah.

Yeah, you're becoming too anal at that point.

Right.

What's the weirdest thing you've eaten?

There are so many.

Weirdest, I mean there are just a couple of things.

So in Japan there is a thing called shirako.

Shirako is it's very commonly eaten and actually it's one of the delicacies in Japan especially during the winter time.

It's like

in a literal translation it's basically a fish sperm.

Fish sperm?

Yeah.

How did they even capture that?

So

I'm trying to picture this.

It's actually actually not as crazy as you think.

So you catch a fish and when you gut it, when you take the gut out,

there is a sack,

there is a sack of sperm.

Yeah.

Right.

So it's almost like, if you think of any type of organ, right?

But there is like a part where like the fish stores its sperm in its own like little sack.

Okay.

So they basically extract that out from the fish and they whether cook it or sometimes they serve it like sashimi roll.

You know, most times with the ponzu, with a little like citric soy sauce to sort of cut down that like a fishiness to it.

I understand it's a delicacy and I understand it's a cultural thing, but that is something that I can just never get used to.

I've tried a few times and you know when you go to these like top high-end Omakasi restaurants and you just have to eat what chefs give you, you have no choice, right?

And I can't be disrespect to the chef.

So like sometimes I'm just like, I just close my eyes and I just shove it in my my mouth and i just swallow and i'm like this is not good this is not good you can't see that being good yeah and even just like conceptually think like the notion behind okay this is a sperm

you know what i mean you know what i mean like it's just like something that i would never put in my mouth for million years but i'm doing it because i'm a chef right and it's yeah you're doing it for the people man yeah yeah exactly exactly um and there's like probably one other thing is like fugu

like blowfish Blowfish?

Oh, that's the poisonous one.

Poisonous fish.

And like, which is like delicious.

Like, but, you know, there is obviously like 70% of the actual fugu fish, blowfish, that you can't eat because it's like poisonous.

So there's only like 30 to 40% of the whole fish you can actually, which is edible.

But like, I love it, right?

Especially like it's such a winter delicacy during the winter time.

Like I crave it so much.

Yeah.

But every time I eat it, I think about, like, I'm just trying to comprehend, like, okay.

So

at some point through the human evolution, some guy must have thought, hey, what's that like weird looking blowing thing in the water?

Like, I wonder if I can try to eat it, right?

And then, like, he would cut it up and like, whichever way he cut it, he's like, hmm, I wonder if it's edible.

Hey, come here.

Like, hey, do you want to try this part of it?

And this guy dies, right?

And then, and then like, this guy must have been a psychopath.

So at that point, instead of saying, oh man, this is not edible, don't eat it, don't eat it.

He's like, oh, okay.

So that part is not edible.

What about this part?

Hey, hey, come call another guy.

He's like, hey, try this part.

And this guy dies too, right?

You go through so many of that practice to figure out what is edible and what part is not edible.

And like just the notion behind somebody even like willing to try something that he's seen people die from.

But just to pursue that procedure of like, I want to keep trying until I figure figure out which part that I can eat.

There's someone out there that did that once, probably.

It's just like, that is just mind-blowing to me.

Yeah, that's funny.

I tried jellyfish once.

Oh, that's, what'd you think of it?

I didn't like it.

Yeah?

Yeah, do you like it?

I do, but it's got to be done right, though.

It's got to be done right.

Was that, like, what was the part that you didn't like?

So I was at Wing Lay.

I tried it.

I guess it was kind of rubbery.

Yeah, the texture.

Texture, yeah.

It was the texture, right?

What about the flavor?

It just tasted bland.

Is it supposed to have a flavor?

No, I mean, depends how you do it.

I mean, there are different ways that you can prepare.

You know, you can season it and sauce it in a way that it can be infused into jellyfish.

But the jellyfish itself, like, naturally, doesn't have any flavor.

Okay.

Like, bland.

Yeah, that's probably why I didn't like it then.

Yeah, yeah.

It didn't have any, it didn't come with the sauces or anything like that.

No.

No.

Just plain.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

So I'm assuming the best sushi you've had is in Japan, right?

It's it's hard to say.

Like, I think, for me, yes.

But I think a lot of of times when you go to Japan like people have this weird not a weird I guess it's normal, but to me, it's kind of like strange idea and expectation of like I'm gonna have the best sushi experience ever Yeah, so at that point doesn't matter what they feed you You're gonna like it because you're in that already set of mind This is where the best sushi is at yeah, right?

Yeah, and I like I understand like some of the my best sushi experience definitely was in Japan, but even like some places outside Japan like Hong Kong, Singapore, like you can still go to Japanese restaurants in those cities and countries and have like exceptional sushi experiences.

And like, for example, like I do my sushi a little bit differently.

I do it more like in a contemporary way, which is not accepted in Japan.

Like if I made my sushi the way I do in Japan, people will tell me, go back to America, right?

It's very contemporary.

Wow.

But like, you know, Katie Perry used to come into my restaurant a lot and like literally she said like chef you can quote this anywhere you go she goes your sushi is the best sushi that I ever tasted in my life even compared to Japan that's awesome because for her like for Katie my sushi was more comfortable in terms of flavor right it's not as fishy right I sauce it differently I garnish it differently so it's not you know even like for example when you try uni sirochin some people don't like it because of texture because that's briny flavor yeah fishy right right but i sauce it differently i garnish it differently to a point you're tasting uni, but it doesn't taste as fishy and briny, right?

Right, whereas, like in Japan, the taste of ocean, taste of that brininess, is what is considered as tasty.

Yeah, so different, like, I guess, different concepts.

I noticed you did that because I don't like oysters, but when I tried it at Mizumi, it didn't taste as fishy as normal.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, so do you source your stuff from like certain parts of the world that are not as fishy, I guess?

I source a lot of my seafood, like majority of my seed food and fish from Japan.

Japan.

And I think there's a lot of authenticity behind that, right?

Like I'm a firm believer in authenticity.

And one of the best ways to bring out authenticity in the cooking is to try to source ingredients from where the cuisine is originally developed at, right?

It just makes sense, right?

So, you know, that's why I try to source a lot of stuff from Japan.

So even the oysters that you had was actually, that was actually local.

It comes from like West Coast.

I love West Coast seafood.

Yeah, so I'm not like really married to the idea of like I have to source everything from Japan.

Like for me, it's about the quality, right?

Sometimes some stuff that I get from Japan is good, but then again, I can actually find and source better ingredients locally, surprisingly.

So, you know, for me, it's always, I try to go by obviously the belief of authenticity, but at the same time, it always comes down to the flavor and then quality of the ingredients.

I love that.

I also saw Khabib stopped by, right?

Khabib, I love him.

Yeah, what was that like?

So he's a type of guy that I respect a lot.

Like, even before I met him, like, I've, I've always loved him, right?

Like, the way, you know, his, his work ethics and his, you know, his mentality and his,

you know, his striveness towards, like, success and winning, it's just, like,

it's so fascinating.

So when he came by, I was like, almost like starstruck, right?

I'm like, oh my God, he's Khabib.

And then, you know, I've, I have a lot of friends who is part of UFC, you know, Dana, who's a good friend of mine.

So, you know, he stopped by and, you know, they kind of hooked me up with him.

And like, they're like, hey, Chef, come here and say hello to Khabib.

And he was a very, very nice guy.

And he talked to me a lot about, you know, because I asked a lot of questions.

I'm like, man, like, what is it like to be like one of the best champs in the world?

And, you know, a lot of answers that he gave was like very humble.

Like, I like humble people.

I think having that humility and modesty is really important in people.

For sure.

Not to the point that you don't want to

dismiss yourself, right?

But to the point that I don't like people with, you know, boasting of the energy of like arrogance.

Right, right.

Whereas Khabib was, you know, considering how big he is and how successful and like famous he is, he was very, very humble.

And I love that about him.

Yeah, he's undefeated, one of the best of all time.

Yep.

And then you got guys like McGregor that are the opposite.

Yeah,

I have a lot of things to say, but I will not say.

Which

I've met Connor a couple of times too, because

he was on the property promoting his whiskeys and stuff.

I've met him a few times, and

I will just stop there.

Yeah.

I want to dive into the business side of Mizumi for a bit.

It's one of the top restaurants in Vegas.

It's been open for four years, right?

Yep.

What have you learned throughout that process about running a successful restaurant in Vegas?

I would say, Sean, like probably one of the biggest lessons that I've learned is

the power of the marketing.

And

we've talked about this briefly before jumping on a podcast.

For example, like, and again,

I'm being very careful mentioning these names and brand.

But for example, let's say Nobu, right?

Great brand, great restaurant.

And I have

I want to stress out this.

Like, I have so much respect for Nobu-san, right?

He's a great chef.

You know, he's one of the greatest mentor.

You know, but the thing about that Nobu and what they do so great is the marketing.

People like automatically think of like Japanese food and they think of Nobu.

Like, where do you want to go Japanese food?

Like, one of the probably first things that people think about is, what about Nobu?

For sure.

So it's one of those, it became such an iconic institutional figure in this industry.

And that's what I sort of learned and realized, like, even though Mizumi has, you know, almost on par level of quality with Nobu right and it's arguably in my opinion one of the best Japanese restaurants not only in Vegas one of the best Japanese restaurants that you could have like stationwide like it's just like nationwide right it's just such a great concept the food is great the quality is great like the standard is great but it's just so undermarketed so that's what i really focused on with obviously the marketing team from the win for the last four years to really truly try to develop that power of the brand right really strengthening the brand power, which is everything in this industry.

Right.

Yes, you do want to get your personal brand out there more and become more known.

Yeah, absolutely.

You know, I'm just starting to pursue my own venture soon, right?

And I think what I've done at Mizumi at Win is really great.

And, you know, and obviously I will continue to do that.

But, you know, I want to like really grow

personally, but also like, you know, have really my own brand out there, you know, just to, you know, compete with Nobu San and right, one of those top chefs levels out there.

And I really want to be on that level one day.

So that's what I'm trying to pursue very soon.

Nice.

Do you ever want to go on those cooking shows?

I've been on a couple of those cooking shows.

And, you know, the thing about that is, like, I don't want to mention the name because it's a very, very well-known cooking show.

But I was on this cooking show a couple of years ago.

And

so

that was filmed in Tennessee.

And what I didn't realize was, well, I only realized when I got there, the whole thing was like staged.

Oh, yeah?

There was a script?

It was like so upsetting and disappointing to find that.

Obviously, not to the whole extent of it.

Yeah.

But basically, they've already determined who is going to win.

What?

Ah.

So you can't even win.

You can't, like, unless you are so good

to the point you can convince the director or producer at that point on the spot to change his mind, thinking, you know what, I actually don't want that guy to win, I want this guy to win.

Wow.

Which never happens, right?

Because everything is already scripted to a point around knowing that who's going to win.

That's not cool.

And so, you know, and like there was a lot of different competitors and

people on the show, and nobody, like, except the guy who knew who is going to win, everybody else had no clue of that idea.

That's crazy.

So everyone was like really dumbfounded, right?

And we're like, oh so why are we even here yeah what's the point right so that was really disappointing and i i hear a lot of shows maybe not every show but a lot of shows like that damn that's upsetting yeah yeah but a lot of like viewers we don't know that right i had no idea we get so sucked into for example like you know shows like master chefs and you know stuff like you you like you watch and you get so drawn into that whole competition as if you are participating yourself.

But, you know,

so it's quite upsetting sometimes.

Wow.

So what's next for you man?

I know you got men's test kitchen going on right now, yeah, and you said you want to open up eight more restaurants.

Yeah, so you know, I'm sort of partnering up with venture capital people that I've known for a long time, you know,

and I think it's really time for me to just be on my own and just really spread their wings and

just see where the where the sky limit is, right?

I just really want to like get out there and start developing my own brand and

you know, see where that takes me.

Love that, man.

Anything you're trying to promote or end off with?

You know, like, I think I'm in a stage where I'm still a little bit cautious about

what to promote and how to sort of

like word it and how to sort of strategize it a little bit.

But, you know, when I have more definite plans of what I want to do and where I'll be, I'll definitely hit you up again, Sean, and you know, we'll make another session of it.

Love it.

Thanks so much for coming on, man.

Thank you, Sean.

Thanks for having me.

Absolutely.

Thanks for watching, guys, and I'll see you next time.