Wylie McGraw Helps Billionaires Fight Their Demons | Digital Social Hour #114

Burnout.

Burnout becomes a personality problem rather than just working too hard because there's no such thing as working too hard if you're in the right lane.

You only reveal someone's character when you stress them.

Push someone and stress them.

Watch what happens.

You get to reveal who they really are.

It's easy to tell people I love you, but it's in the storm is when you find out what people are really made of and what they're actually capable of doing for you and with you.

Welcome back to the Digital Social Hour.

I'm your host, Sean Kelly.

I'm here with my co-host, Wayne Lewis.

What up, what up?

And our guest today, Wiley McGraw.

How's it going?

Gentlemen, doing great.

How about you, Wiley?

I like the name.

Appreciate it.

Yeah, I've never heard that name, actually.

Good, good.

Rhymes of Miley.

Had to get bad kid.

Terrible, probably.

No, athlete.

Yeah,

athlete.

Yeah.

What type of sports?

uh baseball baseball yep that's a lot of things i mean i played football and soccer those are you know my very athletic household but uh grew up with a semi-pro ball player father okay who you know my talent three four years old throwing a ball put me on the mound right away and started training me so oh pitch i was a pitcher yeah 30 years yeah I kind of like the position pitcher because you're just like you you have to stand out like it's leadership everybody's watching a pitcher absolutely I don't really know who hit the ball but I know who the pitcher is every game and it's a lot of mental mind games yeah it's mental work focusing on

managing your emotions, your mental state.

It's focusing on fundamentals, being a leader for the team.

You set the standard and the tone.

It's a lot of work.

What goes through y'all when

you throw a pitch perfect and he hits a home run?

Like, what's the first thought?

Like, fuck.

It's an instant sigh.

I think that's, I've had a couple of a couple batters when I played take me yard is what they call you.

Yeah, you throw you know 80 mile an hour fastball 85 mile an hour fastball in the right spot you think that batter is weak at because you do you know you study the the the opponent but when they take you yard it's a sigh and then it's an instant get back in the game you don't have time to sulk worry or wallow in maybe what mistakes you made you learn that in that moment and then you just keep moving forward yeah wow discipline at a young age learning how to have that mental focus was uh difficult but it you know anything good is is not easy so right absolutely yeah talking about being a leader yeah yeah Talking about focus, because that's one thing you teach others how to improve on.

And a lot of people struggle with maintaining focus.

Well, I will say that I don't, I'm not a teacher per se, as more as a confidant in a battle buddy that's in the trenches, holistically

powerful people.

And part of that is redirecting their focus.

We need an outside force.

Most of the time to help redirect our focus, especially the more we become successful in life.

We tend to believe that the higher the ladder we climb, the more money we make, the more popularity we build, that we need less and less support.

So we get these asymmetrical growths and personal performance that kind of convolute our focus and ability to really see blind spots in the way that we used to when we were starting out.

So going back to you asking about teaching, yes, I can say, I guess I teach it in a format that is very integrated where I'm in the individual's life like this.

And everything that happens in the moment life is happening that throws focus off, I help redirect it by pushing them into those spaces where they don't want to go so that they can see the difference and contrast between what they have been focusing on and why they're lacking in their ability to truly be elite versus what it actually takes to take their game to another level and what are some common distractions you see at the elite level that are throwing people off their game uh

yeah bless you the belief that they've made made it and do not need to do anything more that's the the biggest complacentness absolutely i had a conversation with a uh just retired professional baseball player we had an hour-long call um and one of the things he said to me was i wish i would have known you existed when I was playing.

He said, the problem is that people see us at the top of our game.

They see the millions of dollars we make, the notoriety, the sponsorships, and they think we are the best of the best.

We are elite, but they don't realize the majority of professional athletes are suffering.

Their lives are not as optimal as they want them to be.

And that is actually, he said, by design.

He says, we were performing at about 60 to 70% of our true capacity because the dysfunctions of leadership with the team owners, the team managers hold them at a certain level.

He said, if we were 100%, 100% of the time, they'd have to pay us more money, and they don't want to do that.

So, why would they bring in resources that truly challenge us, stretch us, and push us beyond our own limitations in a way that makes us 100% elite at all times where our relationships are thriving, our health is optimal all the time, we are not experiencing burnout, stress, and pain playing through that?

We don't get that option.

They give us some support, but they need to keep us at a certain level because these leaders themselves, the owners, the team managers, are not their best either.

So why would they be able to do it?

Do you believe that the system in place is to keep athletes kind of like very

mentally worry in a sense so that they don't always peak at those levels or they don't have the right amount of support here and there to kind of throw them off a little bit?

Dysfunction.

It's athletes, it's CEOs, it's entrepreneurs, no matter what title or job they have, high achievers.

I don't even want to call them high performers because if you're living true high performance, you're high performance in all areas of your life.

Your relationships are thriving.

Your health is optimal.

Your mindset and your focus are disciplined.

You're clean all the way around.

We have this, again, this asymmetrical focus on how much money can I make, how fast I can do it, and how many followers I can get.

To me, that's the metric of success is what people think it is, but not for me personally.

That's not what it's all about.

I think success should be defined by how well you're living your life, how well you're able to influence others in a very meaningful, positive manner rather than just by a metric, a number, or a bank account.

So these people, these athletes, I'm coming from the table with this conversation with this gentleman who said straight to me, Wiley, this is how they keep us at 60 to 70%.

Can you imagine who we would be if we were allowed to be full throttle 100% all the time?

Wow.

But if our owners are not 100%, if they're addicted to drugs, to alcohol, to prostitutes, if they're literally not living a clean life, why would they allow us to do that?

Yeah, they're not even focused.

So, why wouldn't you?

So, it trickles down.

It truly is a leadership failure where we have people in positions of power that hold the title leader, but they are not operating as real leaders.

So, the nature of even what it is that I've seen over the last 14 years doing the work I do is getting into the trenches with these people and actually battling and slaying their personal demons, optimizing who they are, getting all areas of their life to a different standard.

And the byproducts become exponential growth and wealth, impact, and bottom line.

The byproducts become more notoriety, more movement in their legacy and the businesses that they run and lead.

Athletes as well, they perform even better.

You're around successful people all the time.

Right.

Do you see a lot of burnout and stress in their lives?

And if so, what do you tell them?

The burnout

I have found across the board comes from the rigid personality traits that come with the, I would say, the landscape of being a high achiever.

Achievement is an ability to accumulate, but that does not necessarily mean your life life is where you want it to be.

And what happens is we get caught up in this idea that I need to sacrifice all of these elements of my life for the sake of what society says is success, building a business, making money, scale, scale, scale.

That's true.

We get all these influencers, that's all they talk about.

And the noise of that drowns people's ability to actually see their own path to where they need to go.

And then they try to emulate.

a successful person.

Hey, Grant Cardone says, do this.

So I'm going to follow exactly how he does it.

And then they they end up becoming burned out because it's maybe not designed for them specifically.

It's not focused on the uniqueness of the individual.

And we create this drone-like society that says, well, so-and-so built a system.

If I follow that system, I can have it too.

And then you have what I call this never-ending quest and chase of high performance and peak performance rather than learning how to master it for yourself and experiencing what success might look like for you.

So we're basing success off of everyone else's success and not our own.

Right.

So So when I was a pitcher, I played

in the 80s.

I was trained by the California Angels pitching staff because of my dad's connections.

My dad knows Rod Carew, Bo Jackson, all those guys.

Reggie Jackson.

I grew up around these guys.

So when I was being trained by like Burt Blylev and Jim Abbott, they were teaching me the fundamentals of being a better pitcher, not on my speed, but on how to make sure that my delivery, my focus, my ability to understand the game as I'm in the middle of the pitch or even on the mound getting ready to deliver that pitch.

That changed my ability to

differentiate between speed of success rather than me as the pitcher in performance on that mound.

So it comes back down to the fact that if you are following these people, I didn't look at Jim Abbott and go, I want to be just like him.

Just like when I got in the military, I didn't look at the leaders as a private in the army and say, I'm going to do exactly like he did.

What I started to do was, I'm going to take the best qualities and traits of the leaders I would follow into hell and back.

And as I get older and I get more wise and I become a leader myself, I'm going to develop my own leadership style based on principles that I've learned and adopted, but not mimic.

When you mimic, you get trapped.

You get caught up.

And that's what leads back to your question: burnout.

Burnout becomes a personality problem rather than just working too hard because there's no such thing as working too hard if you're in the right lane.

Right.

Wow.

I love that.

Yeah, people compare themselves and then they feel that anxiety.

Yeah.

Yeah, they emulate.

So, what they try to do is instead of finding who they are, they find who you are and then be that person yeah because it's a lot of time seems more easier yeah he already got the blueprint i'll just follow him sure that is

selfless obviously but there's no focus on you now the focus is on you so if you start to change and catapult or get stagnant now i'm stagnant now it has its place and i'm lost again and i say that constantly it has its place i've worked with influencer influential people excuse me in personal development at the tony robbins level i know tony i've met all of these guys and it and it's interesting is the systems they have the processes and programs have a place but they do not take into consideration or account the nuanced areas of your life individually right they do not get into your life to experience where things may not be perfect or optimal.

They may not be able to see the stresses and interactions you have in your relationship with dynamics.

And that's the piece I think that's missing in the, I can use air quotes, self-help field.

And I think it's interesting that we call it self-help because that's BS at the end of the day.

Nobody of real success did it on their own.

Nobody is self-made from that standard.

We all have resources and support systems that push us.

But when you get to a higher level of success, you get to these people who believe they don't need a real challenge.

And what they do is hire yes men that make them believe that they're changing or transforming.

When in reality, they're not.

Follow my system.

If you follow my system, you'll have the life you desire.

Not really.

Because why are there so many people who are following these systems year in and year out are still struggling, still feeling like they're a failure, not really getting to where they want to go?

And despite spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on personal development, these public figures I've had as clients spent millions of dollars on personal growth and yet are still fried at their wits' end, about to lose their marriages, their children.

Let me ask you a question.

Yeah, go for it.

Now, is that the teacher's fault or the student's fault?

It's both.

Okay.

Why?

I think we're too fast,

too fast-paced in our society.

People don't slow down to discern what's a right fit for them or not.

Again, then it goes to the leadership.

Why are you just taking people's money just to take people's money?

Where's the standard?

Where is the decorum, the decency to say, you know what, maybe I shouldn't take your money because you're not right for what it is that I do or offer at this time?

We have people that want to build coaching businesses, we people that want to influence, and all they care about is that bottom line.

Take it at all costs.

It doesn't matter matter if that client says, I didn't get what I wanted from you.

So, it's not as much as heavily placed on the person as much as it is on the person that's in the position to lead.

I think the leadership is the failure.

I say it's on the person because just a fraction of it is slow down a little bit.

Just take a moment, discern.

Are you ready for this?

Do you need to be jumping into a Jocko-Willink type environment?

Or the mansion and Lamborghini look good to them, though?

Yeah, but that's the thing is

you're chasing the superficial.

Yeah.

It's like, how, how do you want your life?

Again, I know I'm pushing up against a very heavy-duty system that's like based in all of that superficiality, the flashy things.

Again, but that's the nature of who I am and what I see in the world.

But I work specifically with those people that are at the top that have that impact because it's all about making sure that they are living their lives to the standards they say and talk about and concept.

When you pull the curtain back from some of the people I've worked with over the years, celebrities, athletes, CEOs, I guarantee most people are like, wow, why am I even following this person?

What is really going on with that person?

I thought they had the greatest life ever.

It's always like that.

Behind the scenes, right?

With Kevin Hart, it was

relationship goals.

He got caught cheating, and now it's...

People like that need, people like that, though, need,

they truly need a private confidant that's in the trenches with them.

They don't need another

name.

celebrity name, celebrity coach.

Again, all it does is it strokes more of the superficial.

Having someone that's truly in the trenches, in it to win it with them, that is not afraid to push them in places that their therapist or their other advisors will never go is what's missing.

That's the nature of my mission and what I do, literally

these lives, slaying their personal demons, because at the end of the day, they haven't.

If you look at it, these people in the Will Smith slap, all of those things are showcasing truly what these people are still dealing with personally, and it's being expressed out in public.

Let me ask you this.

Okay, so you want that accountability partner around, but at what cost?

Most people don't like people around them to tell them, like, you're wrong.

They don't want to hear that.

Some don't want it.

They don't want to hear it.

So how do you combat against that?

Well, it's like you want that.

They should have that person around because obviously it stops you from self-destructing, which most do, right?

But probably about eight out of 10, maybe.

And then they kind of get back on track.

But how do you combat against those people who say, well, they want somebody like that around, but they never put somebody in that position?

That's a great, I love that question because it's so true.

The majority of people don't want the truth.

They spin it to say, well, that's just your opinion, or that's just your perspective.

Or you're a hater.

Or you're a hater.

You're a negative.

Especially right now in our

negative.

You're negative.

That's our culture right there.

Because people, unfortunately, are very weak mentally and emotionally.

They want things to show up a certain way.

It's the old adage that I heard before:

the man standing, it's an old religious adage: the man standing on the roof in the flood, he's asking God to save him.

And a boat shows up, but he's like, No, I'm good.

I'm waiting for God to save me.

And then a helicopter shows up.

No, no, I'm waiting for God to save me.

And then, you know, a ship shows up.

No, I'm waiting for God to save me.

And then he drowns and he's in heaven.

He says, God, why didn't you save me?

He says, I sent you a boat.

I sent you a helicopter and I sent you a ship.

And to me, it's like that is the problem with most people:

they think that it's supposed to show up a certain way based on on how they want it to look, how they want it to feel.

And anything else that is very uncomfortable or confrontational in their mind is a threat.

So, what we do is we see people that can't handle things that stimulate their own personal stress or dysfunction within.

So, if it's not the coach that says, you know what, do it at your own time, no problem.

We'll get there when you want to go, versus the coach that comes in and goes, you know what?

No, you're actually going to do that thing now or I'm walking away from you and pushing them into the space that actually they don't want to go.

Very few people want that.

And most people don't even know they need to be asking for that because we're so flooded with how it's supposed to look.

And if it doesn't feel good or doesn't feel right or doesn't match the concept of what I think is challenge, I'm going to reject it.

I'm just going to allow my fear to take over and the unknowns scare people.

Yeah, but our society doesn't award those friends.

They're more so what they call them like negative nasties or no, he's always on my case about something, bro.

Like, don't invite him because he's going to tell me not to drink.

Well, again, context.

Yeah.

The relationship itself, the containment, it's all about understanding discernment.

It's easy to say, well, he's negative.

Oh, again, you don't want somebody to come to your party and all they do is, hey, what's going on?

Pour a glass of whiskey.

And all they do is criticize you the entire time.

Yeah, I mean, that's

the most improper time to do it.

But if you want to be elite in your life, you need to seek out things you cannot control that challenge you.

You need to learn to discern when I show up to a CEO because someone introduced me to that person.

That CEO in the interaction with me feels: okay, something's different here.

My job is to lean in to discern, okay, the timing this guy showed up, where I'm at in my life.

What do I need to do right now to understand that what I'm feeling with him is actually good for me versus someone coming in that's actually there to threaten or take from that person.

The biggest problem we have in society is people's inability to discern the the difference between a threat and a support system.

Wow.

So they seek out that which matches

their idea.

Yeah, their idea.

Their identity at that time.

Trying to control how it's supposed to be.

Until they crash and burn.

And then they.

Right.

People at the top need those that.

The true transformation happens in the unknowns.

Embracing and yielding to the fear of the unknowns when it's presented to yourself, discerning why it's showing up in the timing it's showing up transforms an individual, a human being from the inside out.

So when you allow yourself to lean into the fear of the unknowns, like I, when I learned, when I got into a competitive rodeo and I started writing bulls, that's where I really learned to discern and understand that the fear I felt was part of me transforming and growing as a man, learning how to be present with my mind, my emotions, my intuition, connecting to God, my spirituality, and realizing, you know what, when I did that holistically, I performed way better than when it is I try to be rigid or mechanical about my bull writing.

So I learned that quick and then I transitioned into the military and it took that with me as I move forward in my life.

Is real transformation happens in challenges that are outside of your control.

You can surrender to a resource that you cannot control.

You'll go far beyond your own perceived limitations and you'll succeed in a way you can't even think about in this moment.

And a lot of leaders and powerful people don't even realize that because they've never been given that opportunity.

Wow.

Now, you were in the military and you also work with a lot of military clients that have PTSD.

I did in the past, yeah.

What were some things you noticed that helped out with that?

Because a lot of people struggle with that.

Being in the trenches with someone like that,

that in itself gives these people a place to finally let go.

It's kind of like taking the rucksack off in the military.

When you have a semblance of trust with each other, and you're, you know, my military clients back when I started my business, would be, would come to my home.

I'd have them stay with me.

We would live together.

That's what I even do now: when I work with a celebrity, I, you know, after I spend months, sometimes almost a full year, which I have before calibrating this potential client to make sure they're ready to do the work I'm going to put them through.

It's interesting is I live with them for an undetermined amount of time and I go wherever I need to go.

Relationships, they feel a new energy is in their house.

I'm sitting there with their wife and their kids.

I'm traveling around with them.

I see every nuanced area of their life.

They themselves say they've never had anyone who's willing to go into the trenches with them that way and see where the blind spots truly exist.

Rather than, hey, you know, I was at my therapist's office for the past 20 years and I feel like I'm not getting anywhere.

It's like, but after working and doing this for the last three, four months, it's like I've gotten more happen in my life than the last 20 years of therapy.

It's because therapists, unfortunately, again, I've studied psychology, but in the background of that is they're not designed.

The system's not designed to get into those very uncomfortable places.

And that's where I go.

And you need people that are willing to do that.

Yeah, I've tried therapy.

I mean, it was all right, but I think if I did a more hands-on thing, like what you provide, it would be way more valuable.

It's an acceleration, too.

That's my claim to claim to fame in my business to the fact that when I'm in the trenches slaying demons and

lives and pushing people past their limitations, powerful people have an enormous capacity to achieve.

So when you strip them down, rebuild them from the inside out and then from the bottom up into a very specific new version of themselves, everything around them that they touch accelerates.

Their ability to make more money just happens.

That's why it's like I love personal development.

Hey, everybody's selling money.

Make more money, make more money.

Like, why is anybody selling?

Become the most optimized version of yourself first so that the money you make just becomes an exponential breakdown.

They don't know how to optimize them.

They can only teach what they know.

Right.

You know what I'm saying?

So optimizing yourself is a very difficult task because the hardest thing to do is to look at yourself in a mirror.

Of course it is.

You're insufficient.

Well, it's easy to criticize everyone else's demons, but it's difficult when you turn around and look at your own and then admit, let alone admit you even have them.

But

the more successful these people become, the bigger the demons get and the more grip and control they have on their lives.

I'm talking about stresses, unresolved chaos that they've endured their entire lives.

I've listened to some of these billionaires talk about the pain that they've endured to get to where they are, the sacrifices they've made.

Like, there's a reason why all of that is being experienced through their words and their actions.

it's not balanced.

You can see it come out of them in the moments of stress.

You truly only know someone when you fight them.

You only reveal someone's character when you stress them.

Everything else is, it's easy for human beings.

We're adept at masking our true intentions, who we really are.

It's put our best foot forward.

Push someone and stress them.

Watch what happens.

You get to reveal who they really are.

It's easy to tell people, I love you, but it's in the storm is when you find out what people are really made of and what they're actually capable of doing for you and with you.

That's true.

I love that.

That's true.

What are some ugly truths that people will not admit, but you see commonly?

The fact that they need help.

The fact that they need it.

Yeah.

That's an ugly truth.

I mean, the leaders that I've supported over years believe they've figured out what it takes to be successful.

Therefore,

why do I need anything else?

But then they look at their lives and go, you know what?

33 years I've been doing this.

And this is an example of a client.

33 years I've been doing this.

I'm at my wit's end.

I'm burned out.

I'm fried.

I don't want to be doing this anymore.

My wife hates me.

My children don't respect me.

My health is suffering.

My friends are wondering if I'm going to kill myself.

Everybody I've hired, I've spent $3 million on other coaches and gurus and advisors that I know personally at the top.

And yet I'm still here after all these years.

Why?

I've made the nine-figure business.

I have the eight-figure bank account.

I have popularity, millions of followers.

Why do I feel personally feel unfulfilled, unsatisfied, restless, and looking for more?

That's unacceptable.

I don't care what anybody in society says.

That is unacceptable.

And human beings have grown into this space of going, no, that's just normal.

That's just the cost of being human.

And it's bull.

It's not.

Wanting more?

No, not wanting more, but wanting to be the best of who you are.

And when I met this guy through a contact of mine, a PR friend, she said, you need to sit down with him.

Would you be willing to?

And it's amazing how nobody was willing to confront.

those ugly truths about how he's interacting with his wife, the relationship dynamics that take place with his clients, his staff, his companies, et cetera.

All the turmoil that's basically baked into his performance was, in fact, the very places his therapist, his other coaches were not willing to go.

And they just kept trying to solve problems from the outside in, going, based on you said earlier, what they know.

Here's my education and my teachings.

Let me figure out how to move the pieces around.

And I go get out of the way.

I'm going to go into this and we're going to fight.

through where it really sucks.

But I'm going to be right by your side as we do it.

I'm going to feel the pain as you feel it.

And we're going to eradicate those stresses together.

And what happens is a whole new version of that person starts to emerge, and all of the things that they want in their life start to change for them.

Then it becomes a sustainable, accelerated leader.

Yeah.

What are some things that you actually struggle with yourself and that you feel like you need help on or that you need to work on?

Or do you feel like you

mastered yourself?

I wouldn't be doing what I'm doing if I still had demons I was struggling with.

No, no.

That's not true because therapists need therapy.

See what I'm saying right there?

But do you see where I'm going to challenge that?

Do you see where your mind just went?

Yeah.

No, no, no.

Everybody's got problems.

Well, I mean,

I'm giving you an example.

Right, but

is that not a fact?

Explain what do you mean a fact?

Okay, so this is what I'm saying.

In

a lot of people's cases, in a lot of studies, obviously,

you know that you've helped yourself enough to where that you're able to shape and build other people up, or at least try to initiate that or help just to dig deep because you've done that.

But are you done digging on your end?

Like, have you done like have you like shaped yourself to where it's like, okay, I'm good where I'm at, or are you still working on you?

So that's the key to what it is that I do and why I am uniquely different.

And it's hard for society to grasp that somebody out there actually just sees truth, knows exactly where to go, who lives very much that standard that he's out talking about.

So, when I, my response to you is, I have, I had an outside force or source as I got in the military and got on that path of self-mastery, learning about myself.

How do I live life without stress affecting my performance and my ability to have good relationships, to feel free within my body?

I did all of that first, and my business was built around a gift that I possess of erupting truth and getting out there.

However, God brought me in, that's exactly what happened.

So, I got to a place where accelerating through fighting and battling my own demons, get to a place of living life where I have a set point inside of me of peace.

It's funny because you said that to me.

And inside me, when most people start getting nervous, because they're getting challenged and they start to have all that, I don't get that feeling because I have a set point of peace that I've been able to achieve first.

That's what I wanted to know.

And what now where I'm at, I love it.

No, I'm totally get it.

Where I'm at now is I'm able to maintain equilibrium, even though I'm a man, even though I'm human, even though there are days where I get up and I crack skulls because I'm tired of seeing the injustices in the world, don't get me wrong.

I want to.

I'm not going to sit here and act like I'm some

fairytale version of myself right there.

But I understand because of the work I was willing to do, go into the places in the dark depths of hell to get to the place of optimized living.

I know exactly who I am, where I'm at.

And when I see something, I know exactly why I'm seeing it.

I know that it's not a perspective.

These are truths, whether people can accept it or not in those moments.

And if I start to feel out of balance, I still have my resource, my business partner.

She's always up,

if you will, to make sure I'm staying at the top of my game.

So you do so.

Because I'm out all the time.

Gotcha.

Every single day.

I have my resources that I dig into from the physical to the mental and emotional, but I'm not on a path of still trying to figure out and deal with stress.

You already passed that.

That's what I'm trying to get at.

Gotcha.

You can still experience that version of yourself where you're never-ending quest for more and feeling like, okay, I've been spent all this money.

I still am in pain.

I'm not at peace.

I react to things in life.

Or when my clients get done, they don't even know who the version of them was before they started working with me.

And they get to a place what we call the cap-out.

They are maximizing their potential, and now they can sustain it so that when they bring other coaches or advisors on with them, all that is doing is accentuating where they're at.

They're not bringing them on to now, okay, Wiley, I'm done with you.

So now I have more I need to do for myself personally before I can even be better.

They don't do that.

They go, I'm already, I'm at the top of my game now.

Now I know how to sustain it.

I have found peace and freedom within me.

Right.

Now I'm going to bring, Sean, I'm going to bring you in.

And you guys are going to help just accentuate that.

And it becomes even easier for them to do it because there's nothing standing in the way anymore.

That's the best way to do it.

So you basically shed the old skin, you kind of forget about how you used to be because you've elevated.

You don't even feel it.

You don't even remember it.

And it's true.

That's transformation.

So that's true transformation.

That's true transformation.

When you're at the bar and you kind of go resort back to your old self, that's not true transformation.

And that's why it's like,

it's interesting is, you know, if somebody has a tough, like you're in society and you're on the street and somebody flicks a cigarette at you and you're able to look at that person and you can set a boundary, but you don't have to fight.

They're going to feel the difference in you when you react to them.

You know, it's pick up the cigarette butt.

What?

Pick it up.

put it in the trash can.

Roger that.

They pick it up and put it up.

Why do they do that?

They can sense they're not getting to you, but you're setting a standard and a boundary, and you're telling them, I see you unacceptable, and it changes the whole behavior of the interaction.

Whereas some people in society will say something to someone, and you can tell the difference, and they fight.

It becomes a next viral video on YouTube or, you know, Twitter or whatever.

But that's the difference.

Is when you're willing, these powerful people need more than what they're getting because they believe that they're at the top of their game.

And the reality is most of them are not.

They may have the bank accounts, they may have the notoriety, but that's not enough to have a successfully, happy, fulfilled life.

They are turmoil inside, which is why they react to public stimuli the way they do.

That's what I'm getting at.

So, you may use everything that you've gained, that also might be your demise because you have enough money to self-destruct, right?

Right.

They mask, they cover, protect themselves with that.

Hey, I'm worth a billion dollars.

Yeah, okay.

That billion dollar goes to partying, yachts, drugs.

Tony Shea, yes, Tony Shea from Zappos.

Remember him?

He was suffering with his his inability to feel happiness inside miserably.

And I knew Connie.

Oh, I never knew that.

Miserably.

I heard about it actually.

So he would spend money.

He would basically pay yes men.

He would pay people six figures to hang around him that were happy to make him get the sense of happiness.

He would put on a front to show that he was happy, even though, I mean, the guy had a $700 million net worth, but he was miserable.

He was in pain.

He was struggling with his own personal demons.

So you don't pay people to be happy around him.

Around him.

So do you feel compassion for him?

Because he was trying to be happy.

Absolutely.

He was trying to be happy.

Absolutely.

Okay, okay, okay.

He's trying to find the solution and the outlet

to change it.

But what happens is you get people around you, and nobody is willing to go back to your thing earlier.

Nobody's willing to go, hey, no, Tony.

I love you enough to tell you you're up.

I love you enough to tell you this has got to stop now, and I'm going to drag you through and get you the right resource that's going to make this disappear.

Jewel, the famous singer, talked about, you know, she saw the pain he was in and she knew he was was not in a good place.

And it's like, but why didn't anybody do anything about it?

It's because everybody is just swimming in this idea that, well, it's not my place to say anything.

And I don't want to be the nag and I don't want to be the person he looks at.

Ah, it's Tony.

He looked at his guy.

He'll figure it out.

That to me is not right.

That's just not right.

Why are we not holding our leaders to a higher standard of excellence?

Those that have that kind of impact and power?

Why aren't we holding them to a higher standard?

We're not.

We're allowing them to just be, ah, they're just human.

Everybody's got problems.

Everybody's going to, so leave leave them alone.

Let him be what he's.

Who are you to judge that?

Because he's got the money and look at you.

You hear all of that.

You go, okay, cool.

Yeah.

Mark Cuban said, I'm a billionaire.

I hate coaches.

Why would I hire a coach?

I'm not going to hire someone who's never made a billion dollars to try to teach me anything.

And it's like, brother, a billion dollars doesn't mean anything.

So you can make money.

Great.

You probably need someone in your life to showcase all the other areas of your life that are not billion dollar value.

That money can buy.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I've worked.

I've been around people with nine, 10-figure bank accounts.

They didn't look at me and go, you don't know how to make money.

Why?

Because I run a seven-figure business and not a 10-figure business.

Has nothing to do with it.

I don't want to make that kind of money.

I can't.

I only work with two people a year, maybe three, and that's pushing it.

It's very intense and intimate.

It's like I live with my clients, travel with them, and I'm with them 24-7 by their side as life is happening to them.

So that's my model.

But it doesn't mean you figured it out because you're able to accumulate a bunch of money selling a widget to 100 million people.

But

that's not high performance.

That's high achievement.

Yeah.

You seem to take a very natural approach to things.

What are your thoughts on psychedelics?

The dangerous.

Research all day long.

I know Andrew Huberman's talking about it on his show right now.

The problem is that people hear these things, especially in America, and we just overuse it and abuse it.

Oh, mushrooms have an effect of good, and now I'm just going to eat mushrooms every single day.

See what I'm saying?

Psychedelics, here's the thing.

I worked with a client, a former Wall Street guy, became his own coach.

He managed $1.1 billion in assets on Wall Street.

He wanted to get out of the business after 15 years.

He was Mr.

Hack, wanted to hack his way to the best version of himself in success.

And when we met and we started doing work together, He went on an entire tirade.

So did the Hollywood gal that I worked with as well as A-lister.

And they both both, it was interesting.

They both went on a tirade of doing psychedelics every, it seemed like every other day for a month or two straight because they were trying to figure out a way to bypass having to look at the ugly stuff.

And I need to do it.

This is what I need to do.

Okay, fine.

And I allowed the latitude for them in our relationship to do it.

And both of them came back disheveled versions of themselves saying, I saw things that I cannot unsee.

My Wall Street client guy said, I don't even trust my own memories.

I don't know what the heck is going on.

I feel like I did some bad things, even though they were stimulated from it.

So, if you're not ready to experience the dimension of yourself in that regard, if you're not in a place still facing yourself, it is.

But here's the thing:

here's the thing:

why not do it like this first,

battle through and clear it out, and then if it makes sense to add a psychedelic in later, then you have the conversation in the right containment.

So, I have a network of 40-plus specialists that work in tandem with me.

Okay, doctors,

people that bring psychedelics to the table.

When they're ready and when the time is right, in the right context, in the right container, we add in what we need to to consistently accelerate and push that person even further.

I don't sit here and claim like I do it all, I know it all.

I know my specialty, my gift, and I have experts that I've curated over the years that I come in.

If I need a therapist, I got one.

If I need an MD, I got one.

If I need a designer for their house, I got one.

I bring them on when that person is ready for it, when I experience where they're at in that relationship because I can see it.

You know what?

Maybe we need to bring in this element of a psychedelic.

Maybe I need to bring in this therapist to help talk about XYZ.

But if you're not in the right containment, in the right environment, and you're not ready for these things, they can hurt you really badly.

You seem like you found the right level of happiness and success.

Success.

So what's next for you?

Because you seem like you could just chill the rest of your life right now.

No, no, I can't chill.

It's too many people need you.

That's it.

And the thing that I'm talking about here is coming out, you know, 12 years before the pandemic, I didn't have any digital presence.

I didn't have social media.

I didn't have a website.

It was all word of mouth.

It's all relationships.

It's all connecting with people through the work I started with veterans, being a combat veteran myself.

But my mission is not changing because at the end, I'm built.

This is all I'm built to do.

I couldn't do anything else.

Like, I might be doing a little online, you know, like masterclass with a couple other influencers that I know.

That's what we're kind of working on right now.

But the reality is there are powerful people out there that I see that are actually messing things up in those leadership positions that I can get my hands on.

Politicians, especially.

There are celebrities still.

There are some athletes that I'm talking to right now.

That's what I'm focused on the most is getting people to wake up and realize that self-help is broken.

Everybody is chasing the idea of being a better version of themselves, spending more money and time and energy, wasting it rather than learning how to master who they really are, finding that set point of peace and freedom within so that what they touch and focus on makes sense for them and becomes this exponential growth in their life.

So I might be, I mean, I have a podcast that I started, Wise Words and Whiskey with Wiley McGraw to have some fun with some guests, sipping a little good single malts and bourbons and things like that, talking about low-key conversations on high-performance living.

But in reality, I'm just kind of getting my feet wet in the whole digital space, even though my power and my specialty lies in being a private personal confidant for very high-powered, influential people.

So I'm going to continue to go down that path and keep fighting the mission.

That's all I have to do.

I mean, one, I mean, people are going to come when they come.

So, man, powerful.

Yeah.

Man.

Love you.

I appreciate it.

Yeah.

Thanks for coming on, man.

All right, man.

That was quick.

Yeah, it was it.

Yeah, it was.

I mean, it was spinning.

I appreciate you guys having me.

I appreciate you guys having great questions.

I love it for sure.

I mean, I like to kind of, you know, dig in and find out, you know.

That's challenge.

Yeah, yeah.

I love it.

You can't find truth without challenge.

It's easy to

feel safe, you know, in the unknown, but challenge is where you get to truth.

And then people also need to know that you went through the proper steps, oh, yeah, and that's the only way that you're going to able to teach them is because you're teaching them what you know, right?

I mean, I have a thing on there on wilymcgraw.com that's it's all about you know going into hell and back to understand what it really takes to face and battle your demons to eradicate them permanently so you can experience the set point of peace and freedom within you so that when you focus on projects, when you have podcasts and shows, when you go out into the world to do what you want to do, it just naturally evolves much more efficiently more fluidly and it makes sense for you and you don't waste any more time or money on things that you know are not necessarily good for your growth or what it is you're doing you're also preventing them from going to hell and back right you're basically going to stop them they're there and pulling them out

i've had them go there yeah i've had them do so before i've had clients that you know um have said that i'm like the uh again incarnated version of like uh constantine you know the hokey on a ribs and really that's what i do is i i'm willing to go into those places I can go into those places.

I have zero problem sitting in front of someone, a public figure, and they're not used to having someone not care about their notoriety or status or money and go, I don't care.

I see who you are as a human, and it's unacceptable you're living this way.

Obviously, your friend introduced us.

It's time to get on

as the most optimal version of yourself because you have the impact on the masses.

You are influencing millions of people.

You are a leader.

And if you are living your life from this space we just talked about for the last 10, 15, 20 minutes, the impact you'll have changes the dynamic.

If you notice what's going on in our world right now, you know, that's leadership is the cause.

There are no bad teams, there are only bad leaders.

If we get leaders to live optimally, you have empathy, understanding, but you are willing to get into the fight with them, we can change the course of direction for everything going on around us.

Man,

sleep on that, guys.

Man,

all right, thanks for watching, guys.

Digital Social Hour.

I'll see you next time.

Peace.