Mason Kuhr: Stop Preaching, Start Embodying: The Key to Real Influence | DSH #1516

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They wouldn't listen to me.

And,

you know, finally, I just stopped caring.

I stopped trying to change them.

And what I've learned in the process is like we're so focused on changing other people that when we change ourselves, that's when the change actually happens.

Because you become a lighthouse instead of a tugboat.

Like you stop trying to go out into the waters and get killed and you just give them the light to come find you.

Okay, guys, got Mason on today.

Haven't seen him in two years.

We actually filmed a podcast when I was first starting the show that never aired, but it's good to see you again, man.

You too, bro.

It's been a while.

A lot has changed.

A lot has changed.

And I think this episode will air.

So that's a good thing.

Let's go.

Hopefully.

so So you've gone from uh new age because you were new age two years ago right um i mean i guess if you want to put the label on i call it more self-reliant yeah right so it's like the control your reality type thing use willpower um i mean i was manifestation yeah manifestation in a way i i use what is called mental transmutation yeah right which it's still valid it's like using the power of your mind against itself to to help you

when people try and control reality all they can do is control their perception right so that's really what it's doing.

It's just helping you interact with life differently.

But I thought that was it.

Right.

And then I've gone down that path.

I've gone down like Buddhism path, Hinduism, explored a little bit of Islam,

shamanism, done the plant medicine.

Like I was saying before, was raised in a Christian home.

So it's like been down all these paths and then they led back to me to a relationship with Jesus.

So it's been like, I didn't want that relationship.

So it's not like I'm someone who's born in the church.

I was very much against having a man have authority over me.

Like that's, it felt like I don't trust him.

It felt like I had to like earn love.

Right.

So I just had this belief.

I was like, nah, I'm just going to do my own thing because I don't trust him.

And, you know, what I found too is people's view of God is usually based around their view of their dad.

Interesting.

Yeah.

So the way you

view you viewed your dad, if he was like a hypocrite, you don't trust what God tells you.

Wow.

If you think he was controlling, think God's a tyrant.

Right.

If you think he is soft, like, I don't look up to God.

You know, and so we project, that's our dad's job is literally to be a representation of God's character from the day we're born.

And because we're born into sin and sin just means missing the mark, right?

If you think about it, it's like your parents had issues, right?

Yeah.

Their parents parents had issues.

But it's a long lineage of issues.

And that's what it is to be born into sin, separation, where we're not living in this like God-connected character.

And so we inherit all the dysfunction and it ends up on us.

You know, and so we basically go our entire lives trying to rewrite that and build a relationship.

And what I found, it's like, hey, I just had to build a relationship with Jesus.

who was pure, who was not messed up in those areas, right?

Because it's like our parents weren't trying to do anything to us, they're doing the best they could, but they still were not perfect, right?

And they were still carrying generational trauma and bondage.

And it's like you talk to new agers and all that stuff, they'll say it all the time.

It's like they acknowledge the generational stuff,

but the one thing they won't acknowledge is that there is a hierarchical system with authority, right?

So it's like there's two different camps: the self-reliant.

I want complete freedom.

I can float around like a fairy.

it's very like feminine energy that is not

grounded right and there's no boundaries around it so it's like you can do whatever you want it's like spiritual orgies in a way and then on the other side you have people who are born into like the church or just religion but they don't understand why like they just accepted this identity and so their hearts are not actually connected to it and they go around their whole life in their mind like this is what you got to do blah blah blah but they don't understand why because they haven't actually lived it right right so it's like it's this heart or it's this heart and the mind type of battle back and forth where it's like the true path is embodiment of the message which i found is in the bible it's embodiment of the message that's the only way that you can know the truth because people have knowledge about the truth but wisdom comes through walking it That's how you gain understanding.

Yeah.

Right.

It's like every lesson we've learned in our life was after the fact.

Right.

We had to look back and be like, oh, this is what came out of it.

Right.

Right.

And so you have to actually walk it, or it's just theory,

right?

You just, uh, you're playing on theology, which is important, but it's like, you don't even understand it.

It's not real to you.

And so you can't know it.

You just believe it.

Right.

And then the other side of it is, yeah, I'm just going to float around, do whatever I want and think I'm my own God, but not realize that there's still something missing inside of me.

And I feel.

like I have to biohack myself to death or, you know, meditate myself to infinity and beyond and do all of these things to try and attain a relationship with God when the deeper level language that's being said is, I'm not worthy.

That's deep.

Yeah.

Getting right into it.

I know.

It's been like five minutes.

No, there you go, bro.

So when you see guys like Billy Carson say like all this stuff about Christianity, like the Bible's been rewritten and we are all God, like what goes through your mind with that?

Yeah, so I mean, I used to believe all that.

I'd be curious to hear about Billy's life growing up for sure, because I don't want to make like a snap judgment on him but he had a lot of trauma he was homeless and a lot of parent trauma yeah see that's what when you're homeless there's an orphan spirit right so with the homeless orphan spirit he's trying to find a way to reconcile the past and create control with reality

and um

you know whether that's true or not it's it's a pattern i've seen over and over

and yeah like we're i used to think we are god like after i did ayahuasca i came out of that i was like we are God, but it's like, no, we're not God.

I've experienced oneness.

I've experienced the feeling of like totality where I was everything.

But it was still

recognizing that I'm just a, like a child of everything.

When you hear child of God, like I'm a shard of that oneness and that oneness is Jesus.

Right.

And so, um, you know, there's an authority problem they have.

It's, it's very fear built and based.

Like, you know, I see the content.

It's like, don't eat this, don't eat this, don't eat this, don't eat this, don't, don't do this, don't do this.

It's just like this language in his head,

you know, it sounds a lot like, you know, what do I avoid?

What's the truth?

But it's like, there's not actually going.

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Towards something.

You can make that fear-based argument for Christianity, too, though.

Totally.

Yeah, people have a horrible relationship with it because, like what I was saying, the people born in...

in religion, it's like a shaming.

It's like, you're not doing this.

And so

you're not worthy, right?

And then they're scared their whole lives.

And that's what happened in the Old Testament, right?

And so the whole point of Jesus coming around was to undo that because everyone was bound by the law of like Moses in the Old Testament.

And for anyone that hasn't read, the Pharisees are basically like the religious leaders at the time in Israel when Jesus gets there.

And so.

You know, it had been a long time that God was trying to discipline the people and they just kept rebelling.

And so by the time they get to the Pharisees, their hearts were nowhere near God.

What their hearts were for were the titles and the authority and the positions that they had as religious leaders.

Like they loved how people would, you know, talk to them or, you know, tithe.

And they'd have all these benefits from being in a position, but they didn't actually have a heart for God.

It was no humility.

It was actually pride.

Right.

And so by the time these prophecies that were being said in the Old Old Testament were all fulfilled by Jesus showing up, they missed it.

Not because their eyes were closed, but their heart was closed more than anything.

They couldn't actually sense the character of God in front of them because they were expecting a warlord to show up.

Right.

They were viewing from a human lens of understanding and projecting their own man-made beliefs of God onto God rather than trying to seek how God would come.

Right.

And so that was the whole issue.

And, you know, people like that, the Pharisee types, they still exist today.

Right.

The mega churches, right?

Yeah.

I mean, mega churches, they're just a lot of them too are just entrepreneurs, you know, but they're, they're false, right?

So a lot of them just kind of want money.

Yeah.

You got to be very careful.

Like, if they're not actually using the Bible to talk and they don't have a relationship with Christ, then

you shouldn't be going because that's the whole point.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's the whole point of the whole thing.

But,

you know, hardcore like like Catholicism or like Russian Orthodoxy, it's like, you know, there's great people in all of it for sure.

But when it's just so dense, like this is how you do it,

you can get so focused on the practice that you forget why you're doing it in the first place.

Like, what are you practicing for?

Yeah.

You know, I'm sure, you know, you've experienced it.

You get so lost in a business doing the same thing over and over and over.

And then you're like, why am I doing this?

100%.

You know, so your heart's not actually in it.

You feel disconnected from it.

And it's no different in that situation.

That's why I've hopped businesses my whole life.

Yes.

But this is the first time where I feel like my heart's in it.

Yeah, because you're in alignment.

Yeah.

That's the thing is most people aren't in,

they're all over the place.

Like they're, they have allegiance to so many different things.

They feel like they're living a double life, which I've felt so much, especially in the past year.

Yeah.

Going from that old identity to this one.

And unless you're in full alignment with what you know is true inside, which requires you to lose so much.

Like the, you lose relationships, you lose friendships, you lose old partners, like you lose your entire life that was attached to that, right?

And unless you're willing to go through that,

then yeah, you're gonna, you're gonna feel out of alignment and you're gonna always be like, why, why is what I'm doing not the thing?

Facts.

How tough was that for you making that transformation?

Bro, it's been so hard.

I mean, even this past week, like I had to,

you know, go through a very hard time where,

you know, in the past year, I was dealing with a lot of

issues that I was trying to overcome internally in my walk with God.

And one of the biggest ones was like my struggle with lust.

Like I, I, I had a very hard time with that.

And so I had to encounter a lot of the parts of myself where in my heart, I saw that I always thought my entire life, I had to earn love.

Right.

Like I had to

do something to be loved.

Yeah.

And you can see how how that plays into, you know, that, into lust.

And lust, just not, it's not just sexual.

It's like food.

It's a lust for business.

It's overambition.

Right.

It's like that, I need to do this.

I need it.

I need to consume it.

And, bro, it's been so hard.

Like I've,

it, I've shed so many tears and felt so many emotions that I didn't want to feel like panic, terror, grief,

everything, because you're literally dying to yourself.

And that's what the whole Bible is about, right?

It's a walk.

It's a walk with God.

And that's why the disciples, it's a discipline.

They have to have the discipline to be able to let go of themselves.

So it's like, yeah, dude, when people hear all these terms, they start to associate religion.

It's like, this is just life.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life.

You're just walking a path.

Yeah.

I never connected disciple to discipline.

That's crazy.

Yes, exactly.

It's a disciple of what they called the way.

Like early Christianity, they just just called it the way.

Christian was actually an insult.

Oh, really?

Yeah.

So it's like it was followers of the way, like the way Jesus was moving.

I like that more than the Christian term.

Yeah.

See, that's because there's an association with the idea of it, which is what religion does.

Right.

Right.

Because religion is a man-made interpretation of how we think we should relate with God.

And then using mankind's interpretation of it to relate with God rather than just going straight to the source,

which requires you to surrender all of that, forget everything, admit that you've been a liar your entire life.

Like I just put a post out today, I was like, to my audience, I was like, guys, I just got this conviction reading the Bible that the past,

I'd say 1.5 years ago to three years ago, all of it's not even true.

Wow.

It was true to where I was.

Right.

So it's like, it works.

It was all the mindset stuff, all the nutrition stuff, like the things we talked about, but it didn't have the full piece

of the puzzle, which is Jesus.

It just wasn't true.

It wasn't it.

Yeah.

There's a lot of people that focus on just the physical health, all these biohackers, but they never touch on the spiritual side of things, which is a huge component to health.

And so if you look at that,

you have to ask yourself, like everyone listening to this, sit right now in your body.

and ask yourself,

what feelings are you avoiding feeling?

Like, why are you actually doing doing what you're doing?

Like, a lot of the biohackers, for me, myself, when I started fitness and all that,

it was to feel powerful because I was actually feeling powerless, right?

It was to feel worthy and confident of love

because I felt like I wasn't seen, right?

So it's like all these little things that we're doing are telling us, hey, I'm either running away from something and making it my goal in life, or I'm running to something.

And it's actually what's meant for me.

Right.

So, like, check your actions, check your motives.

It's all driven by the heart.

There's something in your heart, right?

That's that's making you do what you do in life.

So, it's it's a very, you have to have the introspection and the, and the relationship with the Bible and Jesus.

Like, I hope you guys are enjoying the show.

Please don't forget to like and subscribe.

It helps the show a lot with the algorithm.

Thank you.

It's two pieces to the puzzle, right?

And that's where the camps are separate.

Yeah.

Going back to psychedelics real quick, do you think there's a place for any of those at all?

Or are you completely completely against them?

So, I mean, I'd be a hypocrite if I said I didn't do it.

You know, I've done mushrooms.

I've done ayahuasca.

And, you know, for where I was at, they helped me experience emotional blocks that I needed to feel.

But knowing what I know now, you don't need to do it.

And I would say don't do it.

Because the thing I needed to experience more than anything was Jesus showing up.

So that overpowers the power of it.

Overpowers all of it because what they are is they can become an idol and like a back door into a spiritual club.

So it's like you go into the back door of the club, you know, you may get into the club, but there may be some like shady people back there too.

There are spiritual influences that are malevolent and they're demonic.

And so, you know, that one video that I, I hit you up about, it's like when you're talking to all these like commanders of the stars and all that stuff,

bro, you're talking to demons.

When you're channeling, yes.

Yeah.

Unless it's coming from Jesus, bro, you're talking to fallen angels and demons.

Because they're around, like, they know, they believe in Jesus just as much as we do.

They believe so much they're scared of him.

Right?

But

that's how, that's how Satan.

And I mean, Lucifer means the bringer of light, right?

That's his other name.

And so

you think about it.

How would a pimp, for example,

manipulate someone into following him?

Well, usually you create an enemy and then you save them from the enemy you created, right?

So it looks like everything you asked for, but it's a false light.

Right.

And so you can go down these paths where it's like, I found the answer.

I found the answer.

And then you stay there because you actually found the answer, but you found a counterfeit answer.

Wow.

And that's how the kingdom of darkness operates.

It's like it's a counterfeit.

Holy.

And it looks like everything you've ever wanted.

Everything, like unlimited money, unlimited relationships.

Like people glorify just sex all the time.

Everything you could want.

actually disconnects you from the one thing you need, which is that connection to Christ in the heart.

And it requires you to lose all of that.

I do feel like there's a lot of demonic influences, especially today.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Our culture is overrun by it.

I see it as I progress higher in certain circles, too.

Well, yeah, that's yeah, they're attracted to power.

Yeah.

Because they don't have any.

You can see it in some people's eyes.

Yeah.

I'll be watching a podcast and I'll be like, does that guy have a soul?

Like, he's just, yeah, like something's off about the way he they're looking.

I feel like so to conceptualize it, like the way

the kingdom of heaven, it's like these, these terms will definitely throw some people off, but it's an actual thing.

Like I used to be like, this is so annoying.

Stop using that term.

Kingdom of heaven is real.

And it's like, it's a hierarchy, right?

Just like a kingdom in real life is based off of that.

And so there's a hierarchy of authority, just like, hey, if the king was like, you are now.

you know, the head knight or whatever.

Like they give, you have a place of authority now, right?

Because of your position.

And so you can see like what you're saying is you go up in the in the social classes and groups people seem to want power more and more and more so it's like trying to attain power but outside of the hierarchy of god in the kingdom of heaven right creating your own authority instead of receiving it which requires you to drop your pride get rid of humility and actually open up your heart right but heart connected to christ instead of everything.

Right.

Which is how you end up in, like, yeah, I'm just going to open my heart up and you get manipulated.

Sell your soul is what they call it.

Yeah.

And you didn't even sell it.

It's just like you gave it away to someone you thought was your best friend.

Yeah.

But they actually don't care about you.

That happens all the time.

Yeah.

That's why LA gets such a bad reputation.

Yeah.

Because people are just climbing.

They're just fake, dude.

And it's like, I can see what they're trying to do.

It's like they, they want to be,

they want to be known for something,

which tells me there's like this deep need to be seen

underneath the surface.

So they want to be seen so bad because something in their past, they weren't seen as they were.

They had to perform, right?

It's a city of performers and people want to be seen.

It's like, I got to put on this mask to be worthy of love.

So then you seek validation.

You seek

people pleasing.

Right.

You seek attention.

And it's like

all there's so many different places you can just like look at the core wounds of where people gravitate to.

That was a big one for me: people pleasing and wanting to be seen, dude.

Me too.

Yeah, I put on a mask.

Um,

for me, I felt like whenever I'd show negative emotions or the part of myself that was

like ugly, it's like no, nobody will want to be around me.

I'd feel like I'd be rejected or judged, right?

And so

I dealt with that too.

And it requires you to actually have the courage to

bring that up.

And in the process, people will leave.

And it's going to break your freaking heart.

And some people will stay.

And the ones who stay actually see you for you.

Right.

If you're really raw about it and you're real, you're a place of humility.

You know, people can weaponize vulnerability too.

Right.

And try and try and use it against you.

But if you're, if you're coming from a place of like deep truth, this is who i am

then eventually you heal that wound and you just own it and you can walk onto a podcast podcast start talking about like how i struggled with lust you know it's like that doesn't affect me the same way yeah two years ago i'd never say that a lot of people wouldn't ever admit that no no and that's like the raw truth that's why the truth heals you to hurt you

right it's it's got to it's got to rip something out of you to free you yeah right and so just like if you, if you pursue like, what's, what's really true inside of me, what am I hiding?

And you bring that to the surface, everything changes.

And you end up meeting Jesus on the way.

Right.

That's, that's what happened for me.

I didn't, I didn't go try and seek him first.

I had to actually understand that there was, there was nothing else left holding me back from that relationship.

And so by me going through all these different levels of myself that were lies and removing the identity at each stage that I was at.

I just ended up understanding him.

And I was like, he's been with me the whole time.

I love that.

So throughout this process, did you lose family members?

Was it tough for them?

My parents have been very supportive, but

yeah, I mean, like before I moved down to Tampa, when my, when Stampede, my, my brand popped off, um, you know, I was trying to change their nutrition and all that stuff.

And it was just like annoying.

They wouldn't listen to me.

Yeah.

And,

you know, finally, I just stopped caring.

I stopped trying to change them.

And what I've learned in the process is like, we're so focused on changing other people that when we change ourselves, that's when the change actually happens because you, you become a lighthouse instead of a tugboat.

Like you stop trying to go out into the waters and get killed and you just give them the light to come find you.

It's embodiment versus preaching.

Yeah.

Right.

It's like, I trust someone more who's actually been there and done that.

and is that

rather than someone who just says it.

Right.

And I've been guilty of that.

Like I've, I've lied and you have, you, you constantly go through parts of your life where you're checking yourself, like, is what I'm saying actually like me?

You know?

And so it never ends.

And that's, that's the journey of growth.

That's true discipleship.

It takes real humility.

Developing discernment.

Yeah.

And you have to, you have to be curious.

Like you cannot walk the path unless you're actually curious and want to grow.

Yeah.

Like growth has to be something you love because it sucks.

It's hard.

Yeah.

It's a daily thing.

I still work on it every day.

For sure.

It's like, what do you do when you encounter that obstacle that makes you want to stop?

It's like, if you don't actually have a heart for growth and knowing the truth and, and,

you know, loving at the end of it, it's Jesus, then you're going to stop because there's nowhere you're going.

You're just stuck.

I love what you said about, is what I'm saying actually true because there's so much programming going on that if you took your core beliefs a lot of the time,

they don't come from you.

No.

They come from something else.

Yeah, they're, they're all programmed into you by other people's fears that were given to them.

That's what I'm saying.

Like the generational trauma and all that stuff.

It's

not even theirs, right?

It's, it's just like all of this,

it's just this lineage of disconnection, which is what the Garden of Eden was.

Right.

So it's like the first sin when Eve ate the apple, they then gained the knowledge of good and evil.

They were separated.

And so it's like that has just been a part of humanity ever since.

Right.

And And so you can't reconcile that unless you end up finding yourself in that relationship with Christ or wanting to be open to understanding it.

Like I'm not going to sit here and be like, hey, yeah, everybody, like go force yourself to do it.

Cause that's, that just doesn't get, it's not realistic.

I don't like when people go on the street and do that.

Yeah, it's, it's, you're not.

It plants seeds, but I wouldn't necessarily say it's like a welcoming way to someone who's so against it because they don't even understand them.

Especially on the megaphone, it's like,

it's almost like a negative thing.

Yeah.

And I mean, it depends who you're talking to as well because some people need the emotional trigger to feel the thing that they're not wanting to feel.

Yeah.

Right.

So it's like if you go to like a LGBTQ parade or whatever, and they're doing it out there, it's like the trigger is actually what people need to feel because they're running away from something.

And it's like, if you look at something like that, they're living their whole lives.

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based on their outer identity instead of instead of their inner identity.

Right.

Right?

That's like, I have pride in this.

You know, that's why it's the pride movement.

They're pride in who they think they are and the ego rather than who their soul actually is.

Wow.

That's deep.

Happy Pride Month, bro.

Yeah.

Happy.

I went to a, this kind of ruined my, one of my favorite brands.

So I went to a Cold Play concert.

Yeah.

You know, Cold Play?

Yeah.

Oh, like, I didn't, okay, I didn't know how liberal or whatever.

Were they hardcore with it?

Bro, they brought two guys, and this is in Allegiant Stadium.

This is 60,000 people.

They brought two guys on the stage and they were making out

in front of families, in front of kids.

Like, to me, that's a little extreme.

I mean, they're so bought out.

I mean, like, any mainstream,

most mainstream artists, like, I'm not going to say all of them, but the music industry is huge.

Yeah.

You know what I mean?

I mean,

sorry to cut you off.

I'm just saying, I'm not even against gay people.

It's just like in front of, in that environment, you know, with kids around.

It's programming, bro.

I mean, it's like you're taking a feeling of feeling good and associating it with the image of that and so actually it's like training people to seek that yeah which is it's evil right and that's how the music industry works and all that stuff like music is what

you catch yourself humming songs you know it's like but

it's like you just thought about mcdonald's yeah right so it's like you got all these sounds that you get associated with images in your head and and people who control music they can get straight into your mind especially if it's like a good sounding tune but the lyrics are like i'm gonna jump off a bridge 100 a lot of music's demonic people for sure for sure and they don't even know about the subconscious uh with the frequencies who

like just regular people when they listen to music oh they have no idea no idea most people are unaware yeah there's certain frequencies not even just the lyrics you're being programmed but the frequency too yeah yeah so it's like they listen to you know i'm gonna go down the street i'm gonna shoot up everybody like type music and it's just like

you don't even know what you're putting in your head and your heart right now.

I used to sing those songs.

Dude, so did I.

Yeah, in high school.

It's like we'd be flying down the street and I'd be like thinking I was a thug.

Yeah, yeah.

And that was me trying to fit in.

Yeah.

Me trying to people please.

Yeah.

It's like, I'm cool.

I'm tough.

Right.

And so it's like that image of like,

um, you know, me and my friend back then is like, I'm a dog or like, I'm a killer or just something like, it's like freaking white dudes in suburbia, but,

you know, it's just like that image of being tough because with that, it's like, oh, people will pay attention to me.

Right.

It's just insecurities.

Yeah.

It's like, oh, I have social status because I got power.

I forced myself to like hip-hop because my body subconsciously didn't want to be listening to that music.

And I literally would put songs on repeat until I kind of liked it for hours a day.

But I hated hip-hop and rap.

Yeah.

And I forced myself to like it to fit in.

What do you listen to now?

Classical high-frequency music.

I can see that.

Yeah.

Not really anything with lyrics, to be honest, unless it's like old music.

I feel that.

I feel like the music industry got taken over.

For sure.

Yeah.

I listen to a lot of the

same with, I don't have a ton of lyrics in it, but I listen to like a lot of the new kind of gospel stuff.

I actually like church music.

It's fire.

Like Brandon Lake.

I don't know the artist, but you would like Brandon Lake.

Yeah.

It just feels good, like that type of music.

Yeah, for sure.

Yeah, that one's digestible, but that, like the folk types.

You know, either way, it's like

you're digesting a story

when you listen to the song.

And it's like you know, those people are in those states, it doesn't mean you have to let it into your mind.

Have you had any encounters with demons or demonic energy?

Yeah,

um,

damn, this one hit the nail, huh?

Right, I mean, yeah, I've had a lot.

I mean, I'd say the biggest one was

when I did ayahuasca.

Crazy story, dude.

The first night, you know, I thought I discovered everything.

Like I experienced unconditional love.

And again, as I say this, like, don't go do this.

I'm not, don't, I'm not recommending anybody to do this.

And I don't want you to do it because it's not the way.

But I like experienced this feeling of unconditional love.

But the second night, I experienced unconditional infinite death.

Oh my God.

Which was the, dude.

So I'm like meditating, right?

And the shaman's in front of me.

And there's like a group of five of us.

And so I'm meditating.

And

I start to feel in my body just like this fearful feeling coming up.

I didn't know what it was.

It's just like it's so uncomfortable, but it kept slowly going up and up as I tried to like suppress it.

It would just keep coming up more and more and more.

And it got to the point where I was like wanting to tell a shaman, like, yo, like help.

Yeah.

But I didn't want to tweak out everybody in the group.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Right.

And so, like, again, at this, at this point in my life, like I was exploring Jesus, but there's no relationship.

Okay.

And so

I went through this like experience as this fear is rising up more in front of me.

And I see this visual in front of me where it's like all gray, almost like cement, and then blackness.

And then the blackness is coming at me.

And as it gets closer, I start to get just more and more fear.

And it's like if you jump off of a bridge into water, you know how you splash and you stop versus like a skydiving feeling, you just keep going.

It was like that, where it's like there was no limit to the fear.

It just kept getting worse and worse.

And I see this image of a panther swerving in and out of the darkness.

Dude, it gets so close to me at one point.

I sound like a lunatic right now.

It's hilarious.

It gets so close to me.

That

by the time it's opening its mouth at me, I had a realization.

i was like i'm going to die

and so

this panther had clamped down on me when i had experienced infinite fear it felt like rings were going off in my head and i was literally just gonna die

um worse than a panic attack like it was yeah it was i'm gonna die die for real i get clamped down it's like static happens and then

my business partner he was sitting next to me he said he saw my body basically just like do this and flop back.

Holy crap.

Yeah, I was gone.

I smacked my head on my, my water bottle on the ground.

And the shaman was like, yo, what?

I like died, dude.

What?

Like, died, died.

Like, your heart stopped?

Yeah, bro.

Like, yeah, so much fear.

Everything stopped.

Oh, my God.

Yeah.

And so when that happened,

I can't even like,

it's so hard to.

put into words because I went to a place that your mind can't even comprehend.

Yeah.

So like purgatory, or it's like everything just expanded out from me.

Yeah.

And it was everything was there at once, kind of like interstellar in the wormhole.

Oh, okay.

Um, but was it a life review, like a life flash?

I called it the realm of self.

I was an I,

right?

So, like, I was just this point of awareness.

And

as this point of awareness, there was all these eyes, like eyeballs, yeah, floating around.

Like, I had no identity.

There's nothing.

There's no me.

There's no Mason.

I was just like this infinite

I.

And I would, I would float into one of the eyeballs and I would become a me.

And as a me, there would be a whole timeline in front of me.

I'd see a whole life.

Holy crap.

So I'd go into a me and become like a Sean.

I'd go into another and become like a Mike.

I'd go through all these freaking timelines in infinity.

And so I was like always there.

That doesn't even make sense to the mind, but I would go through every timeline that ever was and I was always there.

Wow.

And so like time didn't exist.

But, you know, by the time I came back from it,

I had this realization

where,

and coming back from it was a freaking nightmare because I kept going through like this fear experience where I'd see like a thermometer.

And as the thermometer would.

would increase, the fear would increase.

So I had to learn how to power up my heart from within to calm it down.

I'd use my breath to like calm down my heart and give it love.

Yeah.

So I was like trying to keep this thermometer from hitting the top where I die again.

My God.

It was crazy, dude.

But by the time I get back,

I had this realization where I basically I got like crucified right in this experience out of fear.

And because I had this mindset of I'm just going to eat it.

And then I was like, dude, I get what Jesus did on the cross.

I was like, I understand.

Like he loved everyone around him so much.

He loved them so much.

He gave his entire life.

He's like, I'm willing to eat death.

Wow.

And so, again,

people listening to this, because this is going to be like huge for people who follow Christ or like, you know, wanting to understand what that stuff does.

And people who haven't, like, just don't, don't do it.

Please.

Doesn't sound like a pleasant thing.

Don't do it.

It wasn't good.

And,

um, but the thing about God is he uses everything for good.

And my intention going into that one was was I want to understand Jesus.

And so I did.

And I came home and I had a hunger and a craving for the Bible.

Wow.

Like

I was going in, bro.

And I was seeing it from a new lens too, as if Jesus was the author of it.

And so then I understood the prophetic, the prophecies.

I was like, everything he's been writing has been telling people he's coming.

Like all these things happening.

It was all prophetic.

And he was the author of the whole thing.

That's why why it's the book of life.

Right.

So I just had this whole new lens and then started going to church with my girlfriend.

And, you know, throughout that relationship, I worked through my heart so much

and just like the wounds in myself that with this new understanding of Jesus and a hunger and a desire, as well as moving through the patterns in myself that were not loving, it eventually collided into this one thing where it was like,

bro jesus has been there the whole time and he's the way

and it's it wasn't even

you know it's hard to define a moment but it was just like it made sense finally yeah and i found the voice yeah and it was like the voice i'd been listening to that was actually guiding me you know towards my highest good that sometimes i would ignore

That was Jesus.

Wow.

So it's like,

I was being guided.

I didn't know who I was being guided by.

And that's the thing is most people just don't know the identity of who's who's guiding them because we can hear God.

We can hear God audibly.

Yeah.

Yeah.

We can feel it, like your gut instinct too, like your conscious, all of that.

It's God.

And we shut it down because we just think of it as like a second thought.

Yeah, going against your gut, right?

Yes.

Yeah.

And so.

And there's like a higher level gut.

Like there's a, there's a primal gut where it's like, I need to go fight versus like, hold on, take a minute and look at the situation.

It's like that deeper gut feeling that just kind of comes through.

There's like this weight to it.

You know, when you have a thought, it's just like a really good idea and it has like a certain weight to it.

Yeah.

It sticks out.

It's usually divinely inspired.

I could see that.

Yeah.

Whenever I go against my deep gut feelings, it ends up horrible.

Exactly.

And so it's like you have to learn how to tune in and quiet your mind.

And in the Psalms, David writes, be still and know that I am God.

Right.

And so we're commanded to be still and know that God is with us.

Like, and that's where you hear him.

He wants you to lean in.

He's so gentle and loving and good and real.

It's not a concept.

It's like you can interact with the God of the universe who created you as a father.

And when you realize your identity as a child of God

and you reconcile that relationship with him as your dad, right?

It changes everything about you.

You walk in a new light.

It's like you can imagine how Baron Trump would walk into

his dad's office versus like the VP of the company.

Like the VP may have a bunch of responsibility, but the son,

like the son has way more power, even though he doesn't have that position.

That's a good analogy.

Exactly.

And so that's what it's like to be in the kingdom of God.

And that's what I was talking about.

Like the demons chase, they chase all this power, but they don't have the relationship.

Right.

And so people don't have the relationship, but seek all this authority and social status.

It's the same way.

It's like you can go, you can be the VP, but you want to know the president the best.

You got to be a son.

Yeah.

You can go reach in the fridge versus the VP.

Yeah.

I'm going to start reading the Bible this year.

Yeah, dude.

I want to do it.

Do it.

Yeah.

It's really takes like a couple of years, but it depends how.

I mean, it depends your, your pace.

What would you be your advice, I guess, for first time?

Should you start from the beginning to end or how do you go about it i mean yeah a lot of people say like start at the big beginning personally for me i started in the gospels which is like matthew and and mark and all that

um

because i just wanted to understand jesus more first yeah and so as i started to understand his character and reading more about how how good he is Then I was like, okay, now I'm more interested in the other stuff.

And for me personally, like I took that route.

The Old Testament made more sense because i'd see how it was connecting to that in advance like as i read it yeah right because everything there god is god is so precise precise and he doesn't contradict himself so everything he said there

was coming up in the new testament too in a different way like he was using the people to um to allude to Jesus,

his coming and using different prophetic signs and all that stuff.

So the reason I've been pushing it off is because the New New Age movement always talks about how the Bible has been rewritten.

So I never fully looked into it to see if that claim was true.

But if it comes from source, I'll definitely give it a shot.

Yeah, I mean, it's been rewritten in different languages.

You know, like the King James versus like modern versions.

Luke 17, 21,

I believe is.

It says the kingdom of heaven is within you in the King James.

But the modern versions, the kingdom of heaven is amongst you.

So if you think about someone with awareness difficulties,

it's like, where is their attention being directed in that?

It's two separate locations, which changes everything.

So, words have been changed over time, but the essence of it is still God-breathed.

Got it.

It's fully, dude.

It's fully trustable.

Like, I was so deep in the, I can't trust it because I thought it's been changed, but it is 100%

from experience.

It is, you can trust every word inside of that.

Wow.

Every single word, bro.

And it's the only thing you can really trust fully.

Damn.

There's not another

Quran or not.

No.

No.

Some people say the Quran came

after the fact, but it still doesn't recognize Jesus as the one true God.

They recognize him as the Messiah, but they don't recognize him as the one true God.

Interesting.

It's different.

I actually have a good friend.

Shout out to Nick.

He commented, but

Nick, who?

You commented on that one video I hit up.

So, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, he's a good friend of mine, but he was Muslim.

And throughout our relationship, I ended up actually baptizing him.

Really?

Yeah.

Wow.

It was crazy.

He's Christian now?

Yeah.

Holy crap.

That's a big change.

Yeah, based on our conversations, like the way we relate, because a lot of Islam is based on earning love.

It's so heavy masculine, but it's like they have brotherly love, but it's, it's, it's based on works.

Like you're working your way to heaven.

And it's like, if you think about it, all these things outside of Christianity, I don't even look at Christianity.

I just like look at Jesus.

I don't associate with the religion still.

All of

all these other ones, it's about attaining godhood or oneness or like earning your way to heaven.

But what's the one thing that's different about Jesus?

He came down to meet us.

He lowered himself to a servant.

When he was riding to Jerusalem, he wasn't on a horse, he was on a donkey.

Wow.

He's on something very humble because God doesn't have to prove himself.

That's crazy.

God doesn't have to prove himself.

He already is God.

Yeah.

It's like, you don't have to do anything.

He came to meet us because we can't get there without him.

And that's

the love.

Like everyone thinks you have to climb the mountain.

No,

he came down to meet us at the bottom of the mountain and guides us up

do you believe we're in the biblical end times right now yes why do you believe that uh if you read it the signs of the times where you can see it like um you got the false preachers um

just the debauchery going on uh

you know pride has become an identity uh people are becoming their own gods um

and then if you just like go through all the different signs that it talks about, you can go through Revelations.

Yeah, I mean, Jeremiah,

everything.

It's like, it's all there.

Yeah.

You know, so it'll start showing you, wow, I'm living in a time where all these patterns are happening.

And so you got to just look, you got to look for the pattern of what you're reading and then look at where we're at and be like, okay, yeah, this is actually a sign that I'm in that time.

Right.

Jesus talks about signs of the end times too right so it's like just just find where they're speaking about these things and read what's actually going on because when you do for yourself i'm not going to be like telling everybody the answer because like y'all need to go read it yeah like go do your own research um

but it's all there and if you read it you can see the pattern of yeah we are we are here We are here.

And I don't think it's a coincidence that there's so many revivals popping up around the U.S.

and the world.

Revivals.

Yeah.

So many people coming to Christ, dude.

Oh, that type of revival.

Yeah.

I thought you meant from the, from the dead revival.

Yeah.

And it's like you can look too at Israel.

Like everyone's going at this right now.

Yeah.

Which

is actually like part of God's plan.

Really?

Yeah.

Yeah.

And it always has been because they're so obstinate.

You know, they still are today.

I've been to Israel.

But.

You know, they're God's chosen people in the covenant.

And like, there's a difference between a contract and a covenant.

Like a contract is based on mistrust or distrust.

Covenant is complete trust and it never breaks, right?

It's forever.

And so, God has a covenant with Israel, even when they are

rebellious.

He wants them to come back.

And so, because he's good, he allows people that are not for God

to be used as tools of wrath, right?

Vessels of wrath.

Right.

For example, he'd use,

you know, all the, all the Middle Eastern countries around Israel back in the Old Testament times.

All of them were used to punish Israel into submission.

Right.

So God wouldn't directly punish them.

He would allow them to be punished.

Yeah, it was punishment in a way, but it was out of obedience and love.

It's like, okay, you're going to learn that you need me to survive.

Right.

Otherwise, you die.

And so you can see the same thing happening.

Everyone like going at the and all that stuff it's like they're fake christians they're not real they don't have the heart of christ in them because we're commanded to love all of our neighbors as ourselves it's like when you hear a label and you think that's the enemy congrats you just got pulled into the luciferian rabbit hole and you're being manipulated you got programmed yeah it's like you're falling into the new age trap And all that stuff that when Jesus actually comes back, you're going to think he's the enemy because he's going to sit on the throne of Jerusalem.

Wow.

you think he's actually going to come back in our lifetime yeah i used to be one of the people i was like he's already here he's just christ consciousness he's going to come back damn i'd be nuts he's going to come back yeah but we have you have to have a relationship with him really so if you don't you won't be able to see him um well everyone will see him like every name and tongue will will profess that christ is king but

not everyone's going to be making it to the place that he comes from.

Damn.

Yeah.

So if you're not a believer, like let's say you believe in Islam or Hinduism or Buddhism, he comes back.

Yeah.

If your heart wasn't in it, like

that's, that's how it is.

Damn.

Yeah.

You have, there's been so many opportunities to know the truth.

That's the thing.

It's like you look at our world.

We have social, we have media everywhere.

Yeah.

There's Bibles everywhere.

There's people coming up to you.

If you're truly like curious to know, that's the thing.

Some people just genuinely don't want to know the truth.

And if they don't, then they probably won't be getting signs because, yeah, their eyes will be closed to it.

But if you're actually open to it, God will answer you.

And so,

you know, he'll show up.

And you can see in the Middle East, like so many Islamic people, Muslims,

which again, there's no hate for any of them because I've understand them.

I have plenty of friends who follow that.

There's so many that are

converting to following Christ.

Wow.

Because they're actually getting visions and experiences of him.

Holy crap.

Yeah.

And it's like,

he's a real man, God that you can experience.

You just got to talk to him, be open to him.

I mean, you can do prayer.

If you want me to, at the end of this, I can do a prayer with you from the wrap up with that.

Yeah.

One more thing I wanted to ask you.

Did you watch the Jordan Peterson 1 on 25 debate?

I did watch that.

What were your thoughts on that?

As you represented Christianity in that, right?

Well, I thought for one,

the whole point of the debate was stupid.

Because I was like, you're talking to people who don't actually want to learn anything.

They want to disprove, which is the Pharisees.

And so, you know, when these people come in with a hard heart and you don't match them with the softness of heart to understand them, it's not going to work.

Yeah, he came in fiery.

Yeah, you came in trying to prove instead of understand.

Right.

We have to understand to gain empathy.

And it's like you have to give what you want to receive.

Right.

So it's like, if I'm talking to an atheist, like, hey, I'd be like, dude, I understand

what your thoughts are.

And I'm just curious, like, what, when did you learn about this?

Like, what led you to this?

Instead of me trying to disprove them.

And so all of a sudden, their voice that has never been heard or the soul in them that has not been seen is now giving an, it has an ability to be seen.

And through that, that's how we bring Christ in because it's just, I'm showing up in the character to understand.

I'm not here to condemn.

right?

I'm here to convict and drive you forward, give you confidence because I want you to know yourself.

It's like you're my brother or sister.

It's like, I don't need to, I'm not going to debate you something that's already true.

Sorry.

Like, I don't know what to tell you there, but I'm curious to understand what your experiences are and knowing who you are and what led you up to this moment.

You know, what's really in your heart?

Like, where are you hurting?

And so,

you know, I could, I'd win all those debates, to be honest with you, because I'd just get to the root of like what led them to feeling that way.

Yeah.

And even if they don't entertain the idea of it on,

you know, that

they'll go home that night and question their entire life.

I'd love to see you do that with Alex O'Connor.

I don't even know who it is, but I'd be down.

That'd be great.

I'd totally be down.

I'll set some up for you this year.

Easy.

Yeah.

Let's end off with a prayer, man.

Thanks for coming on also.

Absolutely, bro.

This is great.

All right.

Dear Father, thank you for for the opportunity for us to amplify your voice, amplify your truth, amplify your message.

We know that you're good.

We know that you're holy.

We know that you are love itself.

And so I pray that this message goes out and reaches everyone it needs to reach.

I pray that it opens the minds, the eyes, and the ears.

of those who are looking for the truth, who are looking for guidance, who are looking for that deeper relationship with you, Lord, because I know for a fact that when they get a glimpse of you and they feel your touch, their entire lives will change.

You've changed my life.

And I pray that you continue to use my voice in this podcast as a way to amplify that truth of who you are and your innate goodness.

And I pray with Sean, I pray that you, Jesus, you come into his life.

You make yourself known in a way that is so specific to him.

he will know without a doubt that you are there if his heart is open to it if he's willing to receive it and for anyone else who is listening or watching this podcast, pray, Lord, that you come into their lives if they're truly open to experiencing your power and your infinite goodness.

Thank you for everything you do, your provision, your everlasting love, and your mercy.

In Jesus' name, amen.

Amen.

Let's go.

Thanks, brother.

That was awesome.

That's awesome.

Check out Mason.

We'll link his stuff below.

I'll see you next time.