Shelise Ann Sola: What Cult Survivors Know That Outsiders Don’t | DSH #1700

What people don't realize is the effect it has on children because when you're born into Scientology, you're not wanted. They even, if you're in the Sea Org, you're not allowed to have children.

And so, when they do get pregnant, they usually get kicked off or like taken somewhere else.

And the kids are just like dropped into this orphanage situation and they're raised by people around them who aren't really watching them. So, they're severely neglected in every sense.

Medical neglect, emotional neglect, education neglect, all of those things. And the stories you hear about the children are so heartbreaking because, again, they don't really know any different.

Okay, guys, we got Shalise from the Cults to Consciousness podcast. We're going to be talking about some interesting stuff today.
Thanks for coming on. Thanks for having me.

I was really excited when you reached out because you have such a colorful array of guests that I was like, all right, what are we going to talk about? All sorts of perspectives, too.

I got some Mormons, some Christians some Islam you know got a little bit of it all yeah so your audience is more like

like what how would you describe it I guess our audience is comprised of a few different things I would say we do have a large majority of people who have left cults themselves because we interview cult survivors so we have people who find solidarity and understanding and validation in our guests and their stories and then we have people who are more interested in true crime who just like to hear the interesting stories that happen to real people

and other other than that, I think people are just interested in cults or people who want to be advocates. We have an amazing community who rallies around our guests.

And so it helps our guests feel supported and willing to come on and share the deepest, darkest parts of their life because we get so many positive comments, which, as you know, is pretty rare for a social media platform to get mostly positive comments.

I would say that's like one of one. I know.
It's crazy.

I don't know how it happened, but we just always, I guess we start every show off with encouraging people to leave positive words of encouragement. And so I think they see how much it helps.

And we also have people sharing their own stories in the comments. And so I think them feeling safe enough to do that says a lot about the community.

Yeah, you're providing like a safe space almost, right? Yeah, I bet the only hate you get is from the cult leaders themselves.

Exactly. Have you gotten some of those? Yeah, not so much from the cult leaders themselves.

I think they couldn't be bothered to do that, but the people who are still involved in the cult in some way, maybe just haven't seen all of the information yet.

And we get it because I've been there myself where I defended Mormonism to the death and I was like, you guys don't understand. You have it wrong.

Not realizing that I was the one that was misinformed. I was the one who was lied to by the church itself.

So whenever I see those comments, I can still have compassion for them because I know that they don't have the full story. Right.
Wow. So you used to defend Mormonism.
Oh, 100%.

From what age range? All the way till I left. Wow.
I actually lived in Vegas. I lived out here.
And this is when I decided to leave.

There was a bishop that was just harping on me super hard and I thought I was doing everything right. I was living in Sin City and still never drank alcohol or smoked weed.

The only rules I was breaking would be the modesty rules.

But what's the modesty rules? So this shirt would definitely not be allowed.

You have to, it has to be a sleeve and it can't be sheer. So when you get married in the temple, which is like the highest honor, it's what everyone hopes to achieve one day.

You get what's called garments. So you may have heard of them.
It's like an undershirt and undershorts that you wear as your underwear, men and women. And so you have to follow the modesty.

It helps you be modest because if they're showing, then your shirt's not modest enough. Wow.
So it's like a t-shirt.

But the funny thing is they recently changed them to tank tops or they gave options for tank tops and everyone is rejoicing, which is great.

I love that they're being more progressive, but also all of us who were shamed and ridiculed for having tank tops are like, are you kidding me? It doesn't even matter anymore. What's going on?

I think all the social media pressure is forcing them to make some changes, right? I think so. Social media, in some ways, they are loosening up and then in other ways they're doubling down.

So there was something that came out recently. It was like a leaked publication to the bishops and the ones in charge of the different congregations.

And they were saying that you can't give temple recommends to women who are using the yoga pants loophole because you don't have to wear your garments. There's like the four S's or something.

I'm I'm sure everyone will correct me in the comments, but there's like sweating, which is working out,

sex, swimming, and showering. I think those are the main ones.
And so if you just put on yoga pants, it's like, well, I'm about to go to the gym.

And so you don't ever wear them because you're just in workout clothes all day.

So there was something that came out where the higher council was telling the bishops, hey guys, if they are not wearing their garments and they're doing the yoga pants, then you can't give them a temple recommend, which is a really big deal in Mormonism because if you can't go to the temple, that means you're not going to be able to go to the highest level of heaven if you're not consistently going and doing the endowments for the dead and all that.

So, yeah, it's a harsh punishment when you can't go to the temple. Wow.
Did that ever happen to you where you weren't allowed to go? I never made it because I wasn't worthy enough. Um,

12 years and you weren't worthy enough.

So, I was in until I was like 21. I left when I was 21, and I didn't go because there's a couple ways you can get your garments.
The first way is if you go on a mission.

So they lowered the age to where you can go, I think when you're 19 as a girl, before it was 21, because they wanted you to get married instead of going on missions.

Now you can go when you're younger. And if you go on a mission, then you go to the temple, take out your endowments and get your garments.
The other way is if you get married.

So I didn't go on a mission and I didn't get married. So I never went to the temple.
Some women,

if they don't do either of those and they're later in age, like in their 30s, they can ask for special permission to go in solo and get your endowments out.

So I just didn't make it to those milestones. And I'm glad I didn't because I would have hated it.
Yeah. Yeah, they're doing a lot of missions these days, I heard.

Yeah, they're sending out missionaries. Even recently, yes, I was just going to say, I know of someone personally whose son was sent to...
a really dangerous part in Africa.

And I wish the name popped up into my head. And I don't want to say the wrong thing, but it was just on the news of how dangerous it was.

They're decapitating people in the street and they're sending these these 19-year-old boys to go preach the word. And I just think that that's really stupid.
That's awful. Yeah.

Why would you risk that?

I think personally that missions, and they've said this, so it's not even an opinion.

They've said it over the pulpit that missions are to convert the missionary more than to actually get converts outside. Oh, really?

Because if you it's like a boot camp, they have a very, very strict schedule. They have to wake up, I think it's at 6 a.m., maybe 7, and do Bible study.

And their day is completely scheduled until they go to sleep.

They have one free day called a P-Day, which usually just means this is the day we do laundry and get groceries and everything that we couldn't do throughout the day.

It's like a really intense boot camp situation for two years of their life. And so by the time they get back, it's the sunk cost fallacy of, well, if I don't believe it, all of that was for nothing.

So then they tend to double down in their faith. Some missions are great experiences for people and they come back with a new language and new experiences.
Others are extremely scary.

I had a cousin who had a severe medical situation that was not handled properly. Some missionaries are not given enough money for food.

I interviewed someone on our channel who was put into a hoarder's basement as a living situation and it was so filthy. She had asthma issues.

So the thing that bothers me the most is it's a billion dollar corporation and these kids are paying to go out and be free marketing, free labor for the church to bring in more members who will bring in more timing money so to me it's just it's a big MLM scheme where they're sending out kids to do this work and they're the ones who end up suffering in some cases and a lot of cases and the church doesn't need the money yeah they really don't and it in this day and age when people have the internet People aren't converting to Mormonism because they're like, oh yeah, I saw that cults to consciousness podcast.

No, thank you. So that's why they're going to places like Africa or third world countries where they don't really know any better.

And it seems like a good thing because they may be offering some type of help or exchange, but they don't really know what they're signing up for. That's nuts.

So if you're on a mission and you're like a month in, but you want to go back home, is that even possible? You can. There are ways, but it comes with a lot of shame.

So if you come home early from your mission, your whole family is shamed. You could say that that's a social thing.
The church isn't telling people to shame others who come home, but

it's seen as something really awful. In fact, well, I guess it's not entirely true because there was a sermon, I want to say 20 years ago or so, maybe

a little before that, where one of the prophets or the general authorities told their son, and he was explaining this in a general conference talk, he said, I would rather you come home in a coffin than come home early.

Jeez. So yeah, it's a big deal to come home early.
These nuts. Yeah, these people are so, some of them, not all of them, are just so indoctrinated, right? Yeah.

It sucks because they want the best for their family obviously but yeah and the parents don't really know any better because they were most likely raised in it too and it's just part of the society and it's something that everyone goes through and you just kind of you keep following the cycle until you wake up from it until you do your own research until you look into the truth claims in the history there's a lot buried in the history so when i moved to portland my senior year of high school out of utah because i grew up in utah in a small town where everyone's mormons and no no one asks questions.

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