Micah Parsons TRADED: Around the NFC In Exactly 48 Minutes

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A blockbuster trade for the Green Bay Packers and the Dallas Cowboys landing the Packers.

Maybe the best defensive player in the NFL.

And the terms and the contract associated are massive.

Oh

my God.

Blockbuster trade in the NFL.

One of the biggest blockbusters in recent memory, as a matter of fact.

And you heard it there from Rapsheet, Micah Parsons going from the Dallas Cowboys to the Green Bay Packers in the conference to another, you know, Super Bowl contender potentially in exchange for a defensive tackle, Kenny Clark.

That's a three-time Pro Bowler, and two first-round picks.

Unbelievable.

Dan Hans is here with Mark Sessler.

Heat in that call.

Justin Graver on the ones and twos.

And Ceci, the regularly scheduled programming is around the NFC in 48 minutes, and we'll get to that.

But when a trade goes down involving one of the most consequential players in all of football, arguably the best defensive player or the biggest game wrecker in the league,

and goes from one NFC team to another, yeah, we're going to have to re-tape the top of the show, bro.

You got some classic emergency mini pod right at the top of the show.

You know, like a lot of times they call these trades shocking, and it's hyperbole, right?

Because we're not that shocked.

You kind of see it coming.

This one, whispers came up a couple hours ago that the Cowboys were listening or open to listening finally to a possible trade, but to trade him to the Green Bay Packers.

And the Packers now are giving Parsons what he wants, a four-year, $188 million extension with $136 million guaranteed.

The Cowboys refused to give him what he wanted.

Jerry Jones refused to.

To me, it changes what we think about the Cowboys almost entirely because in recent seasons, Dak Prescott signed at the 11th hour.

CeeDee Lamb signed at the 11th hour.

It's almost like Lindsey Rhodes, and I retweeted this because I thought it was spot on.

She said, Jerry Jones will sign Micah Parsons

on the day that they play the Eagles in the opener because that would be a Cowboys story to sweep up all the attention.

And to have this happen instead,

to me, it changes everything I think about Dallas because I have been watching the Gambler and his Cowboys, the Americas team documentary on Netflix, and it's great.

And that team back then,

out for blood, changing, growing.

They acquired Charles Haley.

They acquired Deion Sanders.

Now

they're moving and trading away and saying goodbye, and we can't get the deal done with our best player and one of the best players in all the NFL.

Who is Dallas right now?

I'll tell you what, Mark.

I love this trade for the the Dallas Cowboys.

I don't hate it.

I don't hate it from what they get.

I do not.

I'm with you.

And

it's a move that at long last

shakes them out of what I think has been a stubborn organizational

cul-de-sac that they parked themselves into.

Like kind of like this stars and scrubs mentality.

And like we've criticized them for so long, like not handling negotiations with star players well and then paying a premium when if they could have just gotten ahead of it,

they could have better financial flexibility.

And because they end up paying premium dollars to players like Dak Prescott

or a player like Micah Parsons or CD Lamb or Trayvon Diggs or, you know, the list goes on and on through the years, they end up having to go bargain hunting on the rest of the roster.

And, you know, just doing some reading about Dallas just a day ago, actually.

And, you know, part part of their policy is we

will invest in our superstar players and spend a ton of money.

And then they rely on the draft.

And then they rely on second chance players that kind of wash out with other teams, but were high on their draft boards once upon a time.

And they just, it's a, it's a, it's a structure that while they've had plenty of winning seasons in the last 25 years, They haven't been to the NFC title game.

Like they had to change something about what they were doing.

And I think what this trade does for Dallas, it gives them some much, much needed financial flexibility by taking a player of Parsons ilk off their books entirely.

And it puts them in much better position next year at the draft where they're going to have three first or they're going to have a first-round pick of their own.

They're going to have the Packers first-round pick, and then we'll get another extra first-round pick the year after.

And they could use those picks on players, or they could package those picks and to try to make a move up the board.

It gives them flexibility.

This is a team that never seems to have flexibility because they keep putting themselves in a corner.

They lose one of the best players in the league, but I think what they're going to gain is going to make them a healthier franchise.

Maybe.

Like my counter

to all of that would be this.

There are teams around the league that make trades where you get into a situation where you've got two number ones, three number ones over two years.

You could have 11 number ones over the the next seven and not find micah parsons so you had you had the best number one pick you could ever make you've got to go handle that now and get it done i would just say this isn't the jets and this isn't the browns right this is a team you can get on the you could get on the cowboys for a lot of things right but they have nobody's perfect but i feel like they have a good track record with top of the top of the draft picks.

So like they're a team, there's a hundred things to get on about the Cowboys.

I tend to think they have an idea of what they're doing in their scouting process on draft day.

It's clear this relationship just broke down because remember, Jerry Jones said, I've never heard of David Mulgetta, the agent for Micah Parsons.

Like, come, what are we doing there with that?

Like, it just seemed like this was one time that Jerry Jones couldn't get it done.

And it was like the trade was the only way to go.

I mean, I love it for Green Bay too, because now this is a team that clearly is absolutely like Super Bowler bust.

Let's get to Green Bay, but I just want to say, say like they could have, he could have gotten it done.

I think that's why it's notable.

Jerry Jones could have buckled and made Micah Parsons the highest paid non-quarterback in the history of the NFL.

But he said, you know what?

I'm actually not going to do that.

And I just say, if I'm a Cowboys fan who's been just frustrated by the kind of recycled nature of the franchise philosophy,

I know it's going to hurt to not have Micah Parsons.

I know if I'm Brian Schottenheimer, I'm bummed out about it.

I'm a first-year head coach, and now I don't have the backbone of my defense.

I'm one of the most impactful defenders that's come into the league in a decade.

But this could be one of those you have to take a step back to move two steps forward and just give yourself actual flexibility.

So, yes, I hear you.

I hear you on that.

And the whole idea of the draft, right, is to find a Micah Parsons.

And you're right.

Like, they just traded him.

What is he, 25 years old, 26 years old?

It's not, it's not ideal, but I see where they're coming from.

and and now i'll throw it to you on the packers because i'll only say this isn't like oh well the cowboys won the trade and the packers lost the trade no i love the trade for both sides you go first

well you pair micah parsons with rashan gary

lucas van ness like that that's like you are out to destroy your own division like i think that's part of it is This is a muddled and wild NFC North, and this puts you into a completely different place.

Now, I put them third in my power rankings.

Might have been a little prophetic, let's be honest there.

Is that the angle you're taking here?

You're referring to the person.

Well, I'm going to go personally.

No, I'm just saying, like, you're going to say that this was something you saw coming.

That seems a little desperate, but we'll let you have it if you want it.

Well, you just take the poll, you take the pull quote, and then we don't.

No, but it's like

the whole league is about destroying the opposing quarterback.

And I think now, like Green Bay's defense and the entire Green Bay organization has to be seen in a completely new light.

And they're a damaging defense now with this.

You can do so much with him.

And, you know, for years, I think recently it's been better, but for so many years, Green Bay's offense was dominant, but the defense was.

the problem.

And now it's like

you have a power center, a sun, an orb that can absolutely destroy the opposing quarterback.

Like, I just think Green Bay is going for it.

Like, to give away what they did, because you're right, Dallas got a ton.

They are saying this year, right now, this is us.

This is about us.

As I lose my voice, yeah, I know that.

You're getting emotional.

Relax.

It's just football, Mark.

But listen,

it's like.

I like that you gave yourself credit for putting the Packers third.

That's awesome.

The Cecil Wrights will get behind that as well.

That's excellent.

But what people are about to listen to on this their program

after we break out out of this breaking news conversation you're going to hear the zuzzer uh nailing a take on the packers which was i like the packers but the reason why i don't see them as the third best team in the league and this was recorded before the trade is because to me they're very much locked in just below the real dogs in the conference where i could see the packers winning 10 or 11 games but then being you know knocked out of the postseason perhaps handily in the wild card divisional round just because they're not as good.

They were a team that was missing something.

And guess what?

It turns out that's exactly what the Packers thought, too.

They thought they were a big piece away, or one piece away, from perhaps actually getting into the big boy club in the NFC.

And now they've made a move that they believe, and maybe others will believe that they are now in that group, that they are in with the Eagles, that they are in with the Lions, like they are in with the Commanders, or perhaps even better.

So

I think that that's the move when you're right on the cusp.

If you're a Packers fan, you love this trade because

this is the organization saying,

we think this team can win a Super Bowl and they just needed something.

And we're going to go out and we're going to mortgage our future and we're going to give up one of our most important defensive linemen.

And Kenny Clark's a very good player, 29 years old,

because we think if we add a true superstar to this defense, we can win it all.

So it's a great, it sends a great message to Packers fans.

I'm sure more gift certificates will be bought and put on the walls of living rooms.

Maybe that will help to offset the incredible cost of a Micah Parsons.

But yeah, it's a really cool, really exciting, fascinating trade.

It kind of fed up our podcast, but that's okay.

We're going to move past that, Mark.

We're going to move past it.

It kind of screwed up the opener that the NFL scheduled between the Cowboys and Eagles, too, because we don't get Micah Parsons in the game.

We don't get him signed that day, but it's like there's a little bit less juice to the Cowboys.

They're a bit more of a future team now.

They're changed.

I agree.

And maybe this is like, I'll just end it on a positive note again for the Cowboys.

Maybe for somebody like Brian Schottenheimer, he's probably pissed right now.

But if he sits back and thinks about it, he's like, you know what?

Maybe I get to like be part of building something here a little bit more rather than the perpetual race to 10 and 7 or 11 and 6 and then get your

ass crushed in the playoffs.

And this isn't a shot against Micah Parsons, but they had four years with Micah Parsons and with Dak Prescott and with CeeDee Lamb and

the core of this team, and they never got anything done or came close to it.

So they're taking a different angle on their team building, and the Packers are going for it.

And that is awesome.

That is fun.

And it gives this season even more juice.

All right.

So there you have it, Mark.

We're about to get into the rest of the show.

But

where does this trade stack up in terms of biggest blockbusters of the Dan and Mark podcasting NFL era?

It's got to be up there.

It's arguably number one.

I would say number two.

Like

when did we do emergency pods, right?

Like Deshaun Watson.

Now, that didn't work, obviously, and that was a disaster, but

it's a quarterback.

It might have been number one.

It changed a lot in the league, but this is arguably right up.

This has got to be number two, if not number one, right?

Well, I hope you're not forgetting about

the Roquan Smith trade deadline emergency podcast we did.

That's right.

That's gotta be number one.

So that helped us.

Roquan Smith, Deshaun Watson, Micah Parsons, in some order.

No, but in all seriousness, that is, these things don't happen often, and it's a fascinating trade.

And God, it's going to be fun to see how it all plays out.

All right, without further ado, let's now go to the previously scheduled programming.

We're going around the NSC in exactly 48 minutes with Andrew Ceciliano.

It begins right now.

Hey,

welcome to Heed the Call.

Third show of the week.

The last week without real football and I can't believe it.

Dan Hans is here with Mark Sessler.

And you know what, Cesi, like a Mark Sessler after another marathon evening with the runaways at Spawn Ranch.

We're tapped out.

I mean,

we've gone down every single road.

We've dissected the league from every angle in the summertime.

I feel like by the end of today's episode, when we go around the NFC in 48 minutes, yeah, we're tapped.

We're laid out.

There's only so much you can do with

runaways.

I would say this, like, you're right, we're at the point where we've discussed the various storylines to almost a breaking point, but there's still one more show where we're going to cover the very juicy items from the NFC, Dan.

Absolutely.

And yes, if you have not checked it out yet, please check around the AFC in 48 Minutes with Arif Hassan and Chris Brockman.

For Around the NFC, we're going to tag in Justin Graver,

our producer, Extraordinaire, and also welcome in a longtime friend of the show, the man, the myth, the legend, the voice of the Cleveland Browns, and now also

host of Inside Coverage, a daily NFL podcast on Yahoo Sports.

Yeah, it's Andrew Ceciliano.

Let's go.

Hi, friends.

Thanks for having me.

Great to see you.

Brockman, I guarantee you, I've not been able to hear the episode yet, been kind of running around, but I'm sure Brockman set the bar very high.

I will tell you.

He did a nice job.

Damn deep.

He did.

Solid.

To continue that tradition.

He kept his Patriots' homerdom to a minimum.

The one slip-up is when he made some type of comment along the lines of, you know,

we didn't realize we missed the Patriots until they were gone.

I was like, nah, nah, we don't miss the Patriots.

Not a collective wee spot there.

I love him.

He's a good friend.

You know, I kid because I don't care.

Yeah, well, that's good.

Also, now that I see this inside coverage podcast, Andrew, now a direct competitor of the show, and that adds a little edge to the entire proceedings.

You know, I'm not like one of those guys, like, oh, there's plenty of pie for everyone.

I want the whole pie.

There are so many football pods, shows, like, experiences, couch shows, watch with me's, walk-in talks.

I mean, it's, there's, there's a lot of stuff out there.

So, to say that anything is true competition to obviously the gold standard that you guys

have set.

You know me, Andrew.

I'm just being an idiot.

Uh, everyone should check out.

Firstly, I wish you well, Andrew.

And you're in depth.

Thank you.

And I wish you guys well as well.

That's always the case.

So, yes, definitely, wherever you get your podcast, go and subscribe to Inside Coverage.

And

without further ado, let's dive right into it.

No messing around.

We've given you so much this week.

We're about to give you 48 minutes, exactly more.

And a reminder, Andrew, I know you've did this with us last year, but three minutes exactly for each team.

If you go over, if you say a word, even that beautiful voice of Ceciliano, the voice of the browns even he gets the dart right to the throat right to the larynx

he's suffered a few before yes he has we i got done interviewing cj stroud yesterday name drop and we got done we're thanking and everyone hey great to see you have a good season he's like man andrew you got you got a great voice oh nice like that's good it's early in the morning here man it's just haven't had enough coffee anyway i you got a flight to catch go if we're doing speech stuff i will say i had a uh

when I was a freshman in college, we were doing like a, some type of speech class, and the professor said to me, Dan, you have great resin to your voice.

Resin.

And I was like, I didn't know if that was

a compliment or a put down until I went home and looked it up.

Resin.

I am searching for a similar compliment that I've received in the last decade or two.

So you didn't look like George Brett running over after he got thrown out?

with too much resin or pine.

No, those pine tar,

you were thinking of rosin.

Not Not the rosin, resin, pine tar.

I'm sorry.

Hey, sound off in the comments if I'm mispronouncing resin.

All right, enough.

Let's get to it.

Around the NFC in exactly 48 minutes, let's start in the NFC East with the team that got everyone going last year, the Washington Commanders.

The Commandos followed the playbook this offseason.

It goes like this.

Perpetual hang dog imports a promising QB, hires the coaching staff, which inherits a roster that's sneaky better than people realize.

Young QB takes off.

Coaching staff

maximizes surrounding talent and poof, perpetual also Rand makes a deep playoff run.

The ensuing off-season tends to follow a similar script.

Team X realizes their championship window is suddenly wide open.

They go on off-season spending and trading spree, plugging holes with veteran guys you know, capital G-Y-I-K, enter Laramie Tunzel, Debo Samuel, Javon Kinlaw, Von Miller, and more.

On paper, this team is even better than the one that nearly reached the Super Bowl, but now the big question: were the Commandos a true rising superpower or just a pretty decent to good team that got hot at the right time?

Do these veterans put them over the top?

Or is this simply a collection of progress stoppers, Parcel's trademark, who will be gone by the time we do this exercise in a year?

Andrew, get us going.

Wow.

What do we have?

10 seconds left?

I would say I'd love me some Jaden Daniels, and I truly do think that they are a wild card team this year.

Much like with any team or any player, there's often a sophomore slump.

I don't think he takes a step backwards.

I know he's been working as hard as anybody, fine-tuning his craft, getting there early and leaving late and all that fine stuff, especially working on his mechanics and his footwork.

That said,

I don't know that they are going to be one step away from the Super Bowl.

A lot of times, when you look at that roster and you have a new GM, it is a multiple-year rebuild.

And I think with Adam Peters, they're still adding all kinds of talent.

They need Terry mclaurin i'm glad he got paid i'm still not sure about all their weapons i think they're a better team with brian robinson believe it or not even though i love bill like i love bill bill bill should go high in your fantasy draft bill krosky merit and then you look at the schedule here look no one's taking this the the commanders lightly nobody join us one minute so i i cede the floor to the other two people who now need time to speak i think that what i love about this like second year of this is that Adam Peters remained aggressive.

It wasn't a team that got hot and they kind of just kept the roster and lost players.

And the thing is, you got Laramie Tunzil.

Debo Samuel has been getting glowing reports at camp that he's playing inside and out.

He's in the backfield and he looks healthy and he looks kind of like he was two years ago.

If that's the case, that is a dynamic.

I know people think he's kind of done, but I don't, I don't, that's not what they're saying.

And it's like, that's a big piece to add to a dynamic offense.

I'll only say say to that, Mark, that this playbook also includes those veterans always look incredible.

I'm sure we've heard similar things about Von Miller.

He probably is explosive right now in a way he wasn't when he was in Buffalo, blah, blah, blah.

You know,

it could all work.

I'm just saying, sometimes there's an assumption that you plug those holes and the team just takes that next step.

We shall see.

All right, here we go.

You're up.

The floor is now yours.

Gravy, the Dallas Cowboys.

All right.

Excited to be out of my bubble and in a box here.

I have more room to expand, but

the Dallas.

We're down to 255.

Obviously, Michael Parson is sucking up all the attention out of Dallas like a vacuum, and we're not going to talk about it.

We're going to talk about something else because that's how this show operates.

You guys know I am team shoddy, and I think Eberflus is a damn good defensive coordinator, even if he became a joke of a head coach.

I just worry the timing is all wrong for these Cowboys as Jerry Jones looks to go all in every year because let's be honest, how many years does Jerry have left?

It makes me wonder if this timing is just not right because the Commanders we just talked about are ascending.

The Eagles are stacked, one of the best rosters in the NFC.

I just don't know what the realistic expectations should be for the Cowboys this year, Mark.

I think

I'm not high on them at all.

When Dak Prescott has been healthy, they have never had a losing season.

But there are a lot of X factors here.

And I think it starts with, you know, we talked with Jordan Rodriguez about kind of the mood around the Micah Parsons thing.

We're not going to dig into that, but just that there's a weight around what this team thinks it is right now.

And secondly, like the Brian Schottenheimer, I like him too.

I actually think he's going to be a nice, I really think he could be a good coach, but it's another massive X factor.

And new coach in Dallas under Jerry Jones.

It's kind of just a bubbling pot.

I've been watching that Netflix documentary.

And I mean, it shows you the history and who jerry jones is and i kind of love him but it's p.t barnum

yeah i mean brian schotenheimer i don't know where this like i guess it's okay to have blind optimism but i don't anything schotenheimer's past doesn't point to me that he's going to be a good head coach other than i guess dad was marty who's who's clayton adams like what is he going to bring to this offense because andrew one thing i remember about last season before dak got hurt that that offense was out of sync and dak wasn't playing well before the injury and i just want to see if there's going to be more functionality to this offense.

George Pickens is a big pickup, and CeeDee Lamb desperately needed another dog on the other side of him.

Is that going to make a big difference?

And who's running the football on this team?

I think they actually have an interesting collection of running backs.

And I would go draft Phil Moffa if you're in one of those 23 roster slot fantasy leagues.

I am team shoddy as well.

And I think if you get to know him, you would.

get to love and support him as well.

But look, this is a daunting task.

And the Micah thing is toxic.

It's not like contract negotiations in the past because day one, when Jerry had his presser on Oxnard, he took shots at Diggs and Terrence Steele basically saying, Well, I regret paying those guys early.

That's

what resonates in the locker room.

So if Micah isn't out there, week number one, and as we sit here today, taping on a Wednesday, they get out of play in a week from today.

This is a road game.

I think that does,

I think that shows on the field.

I think this team struggles to be five.

Two, one.

The reigning or defending champions as of a week from Thursday, Philadelphia Eagles.

Andrew.

Okay,

when does the clock start?

Right now.

It started.

Okay.

Ouch.

I saw this team a couple of weeks ago.

I was there for two days of joint practices, Browns and the Eagles, and they are stacked.

When your biggest issue is like, hey, do we move Cooper DeGene outside?

Who is our corner opposite Quinyon Mitchell?

You step back and realize there is a lot of talent on a very young defense that was truly the engine.

Also, obviously, Saquon important as well behind them getting to and then winning a Super Bowl.

Ooh, Eli Ricks got cut.

They have too many guys in the secondary.

I mean, that was one of the things that they were dealing with a week ago.

Got to get A.J.

Brown healthy.

That is huge.

Got to get the O-line healthy.

That is huge as well.

I also think the big challenge for them them this year is not whether or not Nick Siriani uses the word repeat in meetings or whether or not he has too many NBA guys up there where the team goes, why are we listening to former NBA guys talk to us about, you know, getting hit and motivation, things like that.

I think the issue is, how does the offense actually adapt with Kellen Moore?

out of there now as the head coach in New Orleans trying to figure out who's his best option out of two bad options at quarterback.

Can Saquon run for 2,005 yards again?

The answer is no.

It's highly unlikely.

He's talented enough to do it, but defenses, guys, catch up.

They ran the ball after the buy last year more than any other team in the NFL.

They ran the ball more than that franchise had run the ball in 46

years.

Can they do it again, Hanzus?

And can they win as many games by doing it?

That, to me, is the biggest question.

I'll start by saying your setup is much longer than mine.

My second point

is:

great Call.

Can Saquon run for 2000 again?

Yes.

Has it ever been done before?

Has any running back ever done that?

No, it's never happened.

A lot of things have to go right for a season that special.

So we'll see.

And a new play caller and all that.

My question is: if the offense does come down a little bit and doesn't have that same level of dominance,

the defense, they still have Fangio, of course, but you also lost Darius Lay, Josh Sweat, C.J.

Gardner Johnson, Milton Williams.

There are holes to plug here.

And that, to me, the defensive side of the ball, after a historic heater mark down the stretch, do they have the ability to make it up if the offense comes down a little bit?

They're the most adaptable team in the league.

And you got to point to Jalen Carter becoming the centerpiece of the defense.

Cooper DeGene, Quinyon Mitchell.

Like, they just keep finding new people.

And even when they make a mistake, they move it off it pretty quick and accept the mistake and move on.

And I think you look at this era of the Eagles football, and I know there's a lot of Siriani heat.

That end collapse two seasons ago was really the only dark road.

Like everything else, it's been absolutely pretty glorious.

And we're talking about a team that's on the verge of like, if they go again, that's a dynasty if they wanted to do it.

And I really think this is a team that's built to keep going.

Three, two.

Offensive coordinator Kevin Petulo is under the most pressure of anyone in the league.

Coordinator.

Wise.

Don't dart yourself.

In fact, we apologize.

We're going to give you a little more space next time, Justin.

I'm stunned considering the unique pronunciations and pronunciations on this show over the years that Sessler didn't say dynasty.

Just for effect.

Justin Dardham, we don't have time for this.

Oh, come on.

You talk before me.

The G-Men with Mark Sessler.

Okay, the temperature is turned way up.

The G-Men are 1-11 against Dallas and Philly under Brian Dayball.

Oh, no.

They have an awful schedule this year, but I see young stars all over this roster.

Malik neighbors at the top.

The defense looks like it is rounding into the equivalent of a dark hammer.

So hear me out here.

Russell Wilson, nice guy.

Subway sandwiches, we get it.

But I think if Dayball could turn Jackson Dart into Bo Nicks 2.0, does this team, in terms of turning a corner, not record, but turning a corner, start to look like last year's Broncos?

Andrew.

Wow.

That was so short.

I was caught flat-footed.

I was looking at the Twitter.

All right, here we go with the New York Giant.

Nobody heard you.

Free Jameis Winston.

Here's my thought.

Free Jameis Winston.

You don't need him.

We all know Jackson Dart, Mark, I agree with you, is going to start sooner rather than later.

The schedule is brutal.

There's no need to do it right out of the gate.

But you could see the look on Brian Dayball's face.

It pains him to not praise Jackson Dart more.

But you see the smile there a little bit.

You see the fact that he ran ran him out there to be a captain and do the coin toss.

And Dart said, hey, I've never done this before.

How do I do, blah, blah, blah?

Okay, like he's going to start free Jameis.

Please

free Jameis and trade him to a contender.

Interesting.

Because once you do that,

you set your team free.

And Jackson Dart will lead the Giants to a Brian Dayball.

extension.

I actually think Russell Wilson is going to start a lot longer than a lot of people think.

I I think the version of the offense they ran in the preseason that Dart did very well with was pretty dumbed down.

It was a lot of screens and quick passes and go balls and not a whole lot of reading defenses.

Not to say he can't do it, but they didn't want to show what they're really going to do in the preseason.

They didn't ask him to do a whole lot.

I do think

Wilson brings a stability to this organization they haven't had in a long time.

Their front four is the best front four in football.

The Giants are going to win a lot more games than people expect.

At least they're going to be in games late.

And having a front four like that is going to help.

Having potentially the best receiver in the league on the other side of the ball after this season, I think we'll think of neighbors that way.

This team is going to be better than people think.

And that means Jackson Dart's not going to play as much as people think.

One quick thing.

Bo Nick's threw a lot of screens too, but yes, Dan.

Yeah, I just, I think we need somebody on this show to just tamp it down a little bit.

The Giants don't have to be the biggest success story in football to have a successful season, but I totally agree that

their pass rush can be a big difference maker.

But this offense has been pitiful in recent seasons.

And I think, speaking of progress stoppers, Wilson's the ultimate progress stopper.

So the quicker they get to dart and make this a development season, the better.

And if they get a surprise out of it, that'd be cool.

But I don't expect it.

Let's move to the NFC North.

The Lions find themselves in a funky place for an NFL organization.

I will now proceed to lay down the funk.

This is a team that has not reached Super Bowl Sunday in its 60 years, that game's 60 years of existence, and yet they enter a pivotal fourth season under Dan Campbell.

No, no, not that Dan Campbell, the other Dan Campbell, with the highest standards.

Anything less than playing in Santa Clara on the first Sunday in February will be considered failure.

And on paper, they should be able to get over the hump.

This team was actually better than you remember last year.

They dominated the league, won 15 games despite an avalanche of injuries.

How many injuries per FTM?

The Lions defense suffered 86 and a half adjusted games lost to injuries, the sixth highest total since 2001.

All those other teams on that list were below 500.

They went 15 and finging two.

Half their starting defense wasn't even in uniform when they got picked off by the commandos in the division round.

If the football gods exist, they will do Campbell, the players, Bob Seeger, Marshall Mathers, and most importantly, Lions fans a favor and have far better injury luck.

After that, all Detroit needs is for their coordinators on both sides of the ball to have the same connection that their predecessors did.

Shit, a lot of things have to go right to get to the Super Bowl.

Let's see.

Let's see, Sezy.

You know, I think it's the coordinator thing that to me is the top storyline.

Like, Aaron Glenn feels like the top kind of culture setter guy.

And with Ben Johnson, I mean, you've got to ask John Morton, who's called plays before, but I would say that Ben Johnson is this mastermind who can find a way, especially with the trick plays, to run an offense that can surprise and dominate.

And I just wonder with some of the changes Frank Ragnell's gone, like, can you dominate and be the identity of the Lions that you have been over the past couple of years?

That's the big question for me.

Me?

Okay, sure.

I'll go.

I love what they did at the top of the draft with Tyleek Williams and Tate Ratledge and Isaac Tesla.

Not Tesla, but Tesla, who has been like the star of the preseason offensively, obviously.

But I do wonder about the the coordinator change as well.

And the fact that they have four out of their first six against playoff teams from a year ago.

And the two that didn't make the playoffs are like, what, the Bengals and the Bears?

Whatever it is.

They have a very tough schedule.

There is a target on their back, as there was last year.

But I can tell you, I have talked to multiple assistant coaches around the league who, when I ask about the Lions, they say, man, I really wonder.

what it's going to be like with the coordinator change.

Not that they doubt the two new guys.

Matter of fact, they love the two new guys.

It's just a big change.

We'll see how it goes.

I think the defense is going to have to carry them more than they have because Ben Johnson was able to create magic on offense, and they still have great superstar-level players on offense.

But even before all the injuries started hitting, there was a lot of questions on the defensive side of the ball.

Aiden Hutchinson makes a big difference, but they need to step up and play at a higher level this season if they want to win 15 games again.

I'll take the dart.

Everything went wrong on the defensive side with the injuries last year, but a lot went right last year for the Lions, too.

And it's like, man, they're a tough team to figure out.

I root for them, though.

I think we all do.

They're America's team.

All right, the Vikings with Andrew.

Okay, hold on.

Let me pull up

these notes here.

Here's, wait a minute.

Give me 10 seconds.

You guys are just jumping around so much.

All right, here we go.

Three.

We'll use this tag.

I'm kidding.

Three, two,

and one.

I like the Minnesota Vikings this year, and I think they're a playoff team for multiple reasons.

Number one, they went out and they invested in the offensive line.

Number two, whatever Brian Flores has to work with, whatever pieces of clay he's given on the defensive side of the football, he's going to find a way to get after the passer and make it miserable.

You talk to opposing quarterbacks.

Brian Flores will make it miserable when you go into Minneapolis and you're nice and warm on the insides

in one of the most beautiful buildings in the national football team.

but but i do have legitimate questions about the quarterback i not that i dislike j mccarthy i do like him i truly do but all we have is this tiny little sample size that one deep ball to justin jefferson last august where we say oh look at this he's a pro bowler no he's in essence a rookie with a long year of studying.

I say they're a playoff team.

I don't think they are winning this division.

And I do think it comes down like it did a year ago to the very, very, very end.

Granted, I came for playoff seeding.

I'm waiting to see on JJ, but I think they're moving in the rank.

Yeah, another weird team to me.

NFC North is a fun division because they went 14-3 last year, and then things kind of, the wheels fell off a little bit, and the quarterback was kicked out of town, and the first-round pick now takes the job.

But I think they've...

Expectations have been pushed too far down for the Vikings.

I don't think they'll take a big step back.

And I agree with you 100%.

I think this is a playoff team.

And if they win double-digit games and the rookie establishes himself as a credible starter and a guy on the rise, the season will be a huge success, even if they win less games than they won last year.

Kevin O'Connell deserves another extension.

Yeah, he's a stud O'Connell, and he handpicked this quarterback.

And that, even though we don't have a sample size, Andrew, I think because of that, I kind of have faith that McCarthy is going to be able to play the guitar, Sese.

It's the opposite of what Caleb Williams went through a year ago ago with the defensive and chaotic coaching staff.

You've got one of the most trusted quarterback whisperers in the league, and he thinks highly of McCarthy.

And I think he's been a little up and down at practice, but when he's been good, he's been really good.

I know that game against Houston was a small sample size, but I saw good things, and it's like he's going to have to grow, though.

The problem is you're still going to need, where is he going to be by the middle of the season?

Because it's not going to happen all in week one.

And I think he's got one of the most complete offensive rosters around him in the entire league, but it's his job to catch up quickly, and that is hard to do when the real regular season games start.

And they trade for Adam Thielen on Wednesday morning, which was rumored for a couple of days.

Jordan Addison suspended a couple games up there for McCarthy.

I wonder if we see a shift sort of philosophically and the Vikings become a ground and pound run-first team.

They signed Jordan Mason this offseason.

If he can stay healthy, he was a bell cow for San Francisco in McCaffrey's absence last year.

I just wonder if they're not going to ask McCarthy to do as much, especially early in the year.

Vikings were the worst offense in the league running in the red zone.

Got to get better there.

Green Bay Packers with Mark Sessler.

You know, number one,

I've kept these shorter because I'm a very giving teammate here.

So I just want to let you know this is not going to be some sort of

soliloquy.

Well, was spending some time up there.

So anyways, Mark put the Green Bay Packers third in his power rankings, received a lot of

guff for that.

Now, Mark is A, seeing things before society sees them, possibly unlikely.

B, a semi-hack/slash lunatic who has vastly overrated this team and perhaps should be raking leaves in Lucy Hammer, South Dakota.

Or,

do the lambs still scream, Clarice?

I don't know.

Damn.

I'll go.

How about C?

All of the above?

I also took Jordan Love in the first round of my fantasy draft.

Oh, my God.

And people looked at me like, are you crazy?

I'm like, no.

Are you mad?

I think with Matthew Golden there, I think there's a deep shot presence here.

And look, I know there are injuries here, Christian Watson, notably, but I am bullish that maybe they do get out to a better start than they did a year ago.

I know this is a slow starting team, but I'm also, by the way, in a 14-team, 20-roster spot.

You must play two quarterbacks league.

And

I picked 12th.

So Jordan Love is my guy.

And I think the Packers, when many

are expecting them to take a downward turn, I am with Mark.

I think they are just fine.

You know,

when you're in a 14-team league and a two-quarterback league, that is so punk rock, Andrew, that's like drinking blood on stage and like

deflowering virgin shit.

It is miserable.

Justin, go ahead.

I definitely

wonder how consistent Jordan Love can be.

They paid him all that money.

His body of work was good.

He's had these seasons where he starts slow and then he picks it up towards the end of the year.

He's had seasons where he just is injured and plays through it.

And I think that was a big part of last season.

I love Matthew Golden, hook him horns.

I think he is going to add a dynamic element to their offense.

I just think, and Matt LaFleur is a great coach.

We got to see a better, consistent season from Jordan Love so that the Packers can take the next step.

Do you know what they seem to me, Mark?

And I don't think you've gotten a ton of guff.

It was just, it took us back a little bit that you had them as one of the superpowers of the league.

To me, they're almost like, because the conference is different too.

Keep that in mind.

Like the NFC's Houston Texans to me.

And I know the Texans, they might win their division, but a team that I feel confident is going to be a playoff team as long as they don't get savaged by injuries.

But

when push comes to shove and when rubber meets the road, I don't see them as a true contender.

They're just kind of locked in that second tier.

And until I see something different from them, that's where I'm going to view them.

If love takes the leap that Andrew is drafting the Matt, we're good.

Three.

Okay.

A lot of pressure on Andrew suddenly.

Just put him.

Ceciliano.

Just so you know.

Oh, call timeout.

We'll call timeout because that was a pretty heavy thing that Mark just dropped as well.

Well, no, I was sort of saying, if Andrew's faith in love pans out, we're good.

I know, but it's almost like you were pushing away now because you feel, I know you.

I love you, Mark.

To know you is to love you.

When you go out on a limb on this show, I could sense sometimes that you're uncomfortable and vulnerable about it.

And it feels as if you're pushing it onto Andrew now, onto his broad chiseled shoulders.

Like, take this weight.

Take it from me.

Take this cross and go up the hill.

Andrew platform, the platform on which we do our draft, you know, the AI does a review and they send everyone an email giving them a grade.

I got a D-min.

The grade AI stuff drives me nuts.

I've done that, gotten A pluses and gone 4 and 13.

I've gotten Fs and won the whole damn thing.

They got to start over.

This just AI.

See football is a lot of luck.

It's as useful as any draft grade.

I'm talking real draft right after we do the draft.

On NFL network, I would do this every year.

Guys, hey, go through the rundown on Monday.

We're going to do grades.

I'm like, no, we're not going to do draft grades, please.

Kenny Pickett Browns trade?

I give him an A.

I will say this.

I think both teams win there.

I think it's a win-win for both teams, but I digress.

Moving on.

All right.

Moving on indeed.

Finally, the Chicago Bears with gravy.

Oh, wait.

I got to hit time in.

And there we go.

Take us through the process.

It's a new era in Chicago, a quarterback-friendly era.

An era where offense, not the defense, is the point of pride for this new coaching staff.

But my question is, what path career-wise is Caleb Williams on?

For his sake, I really hope it's not the Trevor Lawrence.

I was the number one pick, but I had a terrible coaching staff my rookie year, so they hired a proven offensive guru to come fix me, but that also didn't work out.

And now everyone is wondering what my ceiling truly is, track, because I feel

concerns about Williams, just his ability in general.

Oh, wow.

Yeah.

We talked about this on the Rich Eisen show this week, Mark and I.

Check that out.

They have the full thing up on YouTube.

You look comfortable in those chairs.

Well done.

Did we?

How do you, because, well, you've actually offered that price.

But I'm taking your time.

Last week or two weeks ago, I was in one of those chairs, and it is awkward because you're sitting there.

I agree.

I feel like I don't know how to sit in that chair.

It's a beautiful studio, and I love the momentum.

It's like just sitting like, yeah.

What were we talking about?

I forgot.

The Bears.

Oh, yeah.

The Bears.

Me and Rich were both in lockstep.

I loved what I saw from Kayla Williams as a rookie.

This guy got his ass kicked.

He had a coaching staff that was incompetent.

He had all this background noise with his dad trying to get him in the USFL or whatever.

And yet, he stood strong in the pocket.

He made plays.

He showed that he could handle a firestorm of shit in his rookie year.

And now,

who could ask for more than Ben Johnson now as your coach?

I am so excited for the clean slate era.

Now, to the Trevor Lawrence point, Ceci, we said the same thing about that quarterback after Urban Meyer was sent packing and Doug Peterson took over.

So maybe it's a Peterson-Ben Johnson conversation more than anything else with that parallel.

I know it's a meaningless small sample size, but that 93-yard drive against the Bills, I saw a different type of offense.

I'm not saying it was all Caleb Williams, but it looked organized.

It looked like Ben Johnson-esque.

And I think there's a lot of hope on that front.

Yeah, and if for some reason this season goes sideways for the Bears, and I said it that night, Bears fans will always have that drive.

They will always have that drive against the Bills where he's whizzing it by the ears of linebackers into the hands of tight ends running up the seam.

Like, ooh, it's there.

And you know what I felt like watching that game?

Like when I watched Bryce Young in Germany last year against the Giants, where you go, oh my God, I know that guy.

That's the guy that played at Alabama.

I see it.

I know that guy.

And that's what I said with Caleb.

I know that guy.

That's the guy that played at USC.

He's really good.

Most important thing is here, the Bears invested in their offensive line, right?

They went out and they spent money and the D-line as well.

And that's how this team will win because Detroit won by smashing you on both sides of the line and with a good play caller.

I like the Bears.

I think they're in wildcard contention.

I like that.

Good news, bad news.

I agree that they could be in contention.

I also think they'll end the season as the best last-placed team in football.

Two, one.

Confusing.

Tough division, so it makes sense.

Dot yourself.

Dot yourself.

Right in the jug.

Let's take a break.

We'll get back.

We'll hit the rest of the NFC.

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We've got Rolling Thunder coming up down the road.

We've got our Friday fun show, which is an absolute blast.

And Dan, I know you got something special coming up.

Oh, yeah.

Oasis has come back to America, and me and Bob are going to be there, boots on the ground.

And of course, the Throwback Podcast has to tackle that topic.

So we have a very special Oasis Live 25 edition of the Throwback Pod coming up next week.

I mean, what else could you ask for?

Sign up for the Patreon.

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These are sexy times.

All right.

Back to the show.

All right.

We are back.

The NFC's South.

Let's roll funky division, sassy,

the Bucs.

You know, I think of the old serial ad from the 80s where they asked, there's no question grape nuts is right for you.

Question is, are you right for grape nuts?

That's how I feel about the Bucs.

Yep, they're in the NFC South.

They're not real.

Uh-huh.

They're just a wildcard team.

Uh-huh.

Baker Mayfield has had nine coordinator switches in seven years.

Don't care.

When they're tied in the NFC title game with 240 to go, that's when we say, there's no question this Bucs team is right for you.

Question is, are you right for the Bucs?

Okay.

I like it.

I mean, I like it.

It's fun.

It's fun.

We're on the NFC title game train for the Bucs.

I'd love to see it.

Yes.

We also talked about that on the Eisen Show.

Like the idea of a shootout that involves Baker Mayfield in the NFC title game with pick your NFC quarterback DeGior as an opponent.

I'd love to see that one special, and Andrew, I know it's conflicted, voice of the Browns, grew up a Browns fan, seeing Baker and wondering if he has that January moment in him, because I think he does.

Now is the rest of the team around him and this new play caller, again, going to hold him back?

We shall see.

I would say I'm not conflicted.

And he has had a January moment.

He won in Pittsburgh and beat the Steelers.

And Sad Ben was on the bench.

There's nobody in the building.

I mean, I take that away from you guys, but it's different if they got off the field for that Tyree kill end around.

And honestly, if they had thrown the flag at the end of the second quarter for the clear ear shot, whole shot by Nick Sorensen on Hollywood Higgins at the goal line at the pylon, yes, I'm still bitter.

And I've talked about it.

You're right, Andrew.

You're not conflicted at all.

I talked about that with Baker, and he gave me that, like, I see you.

He knows it.

I'm rooting for Baker.

I've moved on, truly.

And as for a mecha Abuka, get to know him.

Get to know him.

Especially with the Kate Otten injury that we find out today, he may not be ready for week number one.

I think

the Buccaneers can win this division.

They won a playoff game a year ago.

For Pete's sake, let's just, I think they did, right?

I think they did.

Yeah.

No, well, no.

Well, they lost the Commanders, but they beat the Eagles the year before.

Yes, that's a good idea.

All right.

Listen, I don't think they're a Super Bowl team.

I think they're a damn good team.

But that's kind of the point, though, a little bit like that was a Corpse Eagles team.

I don't want to take anything away from the Bucs or Baker, but Corpse Eagles team two years ago.

They get knocked off by an upstart commanders team.

Do they have a next gear in them in the NFC, especially if they do win this division and get back to January, Justin?

Yeah, I think they do have a next gear in them.

I think they are in a position to be a top three team in the conference.

Tristan Wurfs activated off the pup list.

Now we'll see if he's actually ready to play in week one.

I think that's, but that's a good sign that he'll be back sooner than later.

He's key to this team.

How good can Bucky Irving be?

That's a question I can't wait to see.

Fun team.

Very fun team.

Was it worth it?

Gotcha face.

Gotcha face.

Always worth it.

All right, the Atlanta Falcons.

I have made a promise to myself and Mark Zessler and God to have an open mind about the Atlanta Falcons this year.

I have long harbored mistrust for management and team building in the post-283 era of dirty bird football, but I'm wiping the slate clean in year two of the Raheem still,

Raheem still younger after all these years, Morris era.

Much of that is tied up, the real ones get that, much of that is tied up in optimism around Michael Pennix, of course, though we should all be reminded that the South Paw will make just this fourth NFL start come week one.

I adore Bijan Robinson.

I believe in the new DC Ulbric and the draft day gambit to import two first-round edge rushers to combat a decade-old defect in the defense, getting after the opposing QB, made sense in a vacuum, even if it came with the dunderheaded whiff of past Falcons maneuvers.

But there I go again, letting my old feelings about the Falcons creep through.

Clean slate, baby.

Clean slate.

Let's go, sussy.

Well, I think it matters too that they drafted Walker and Pierce two edges.

I think if the defense can change and be more, like just kind of become 20%, 30% better, and pressure a quarterback, that changes this team.

I think it's fair with Penix.

Like, I loved what I saw, but it's still an unknown what this offense will be over a 17-game sample size with him as a starter.

That said, like, a lot of reports coming out of the building and out of practice are that he's been like next level at moments, and that they're kind of blown away by his ability to process.

and see the field go through like progression.

So there's just a lot to suggest that he's a more mature quarterback that is ready to go.

And he's one of the most exciting quarterbacks that I can't wait to see going into the season.

I'm with you.

I have talked to people around the league that think Michael Panix is ready to truly go next level.

But I drafted in my very deep fantasy league last night, Kirk Cousins in like round 18 because the Caleb McGarry injury scares me.

We're not talking left tackle Rashawn Slater.

We're talking right tackle for a lefty.

And that injury in Atlanta to me is as big as the injury here in L.A.

for the Chargers left tackle.

They will miss Caleb McGarry.

That said, I'm going to bring it back to Dan here, not Graver, that I'm ignoring you.

Do you know that the Falcons have the second longest

playoff drought in the NFL

behind

the Jets?

I know.

You know that?

I know.

Well, I know.

I don't think they know the other one.

I don't know.

I know the comparison point.

But I do think there's a desperation here, and that's why they traded away the future number one, a trade that makes no sense to me to go up and get James Pierce, Pierce, a player that was on a lot of teams' boards, off the board.

The dunderheaded whiff I've spoken of, but I understand why they did it because it's been a long issue.

Yeah.

Haven't sacked a quarterback in 10 years.

True story.

I think it is, Justin.

Final point.

Put a puncture on it.

I am not buying the Falcons.

I have zero interest in watching this team this year, and I apologize to Falcons fans for that.

Hey, that's okay.

That's okay.

You're a plant.

You're a Dan plant.

I love it.

No, not a plant, but it's okay.

It's okay.

The Carolina Panthers with Andrew.

I saw this team a couple of weeks ago down there for a joint practice.

Bryce Young looks really good.

Think about it.

A year ago, they had Adam Thielen and Deontay Johnson.

Now they have neither, but they're really excited about Tet McMillan and Coker in his second year as well.

They think they have weapons.

And what if I told you the Carolina Panthers are the only team of the NFL with two backs in their backfield that each had a thousand yards rushing a year ago.

Can you name them?

Most people can't.

I'll open up their floor.

Anybody?

Chuba Dowdy.

Rico Dowdle.

Got it.

And Michael.

Chuba and Rico.

Yes, they signed Rico Dowdle for $2.5 million, and Dave Canalis is going to try to run the football.

The key here, however, is to get that defense just respectable.

They spent all this money.

I think Bobby Brown, the former Ram, yes, go ahead, make your It's Your Prerogative jokes.

Signing helps the middle of that line because they couldn't stop the run.

To quote Peter Griffin, they weren't just bad last year defensively.

They were circus ugly.

So if they can improve that, then maybe they fight for a wild card.

But I do think there is a chance that this defense is still so bad that we are looking at a top 10 draft position next year.

Remember, they tried to get Milton Williams, and it was initially reported that he was signing with the Panthers before he switched and went to the Patriots instead.

So they end up with with a hole in the middle of that defense and add Bobby Brown, add Tershawn Wharton.

This was the worst defense in NFL history last year in terms of total points allowed over the course of a season.

It doesn't matter how much better Bryce Young is and how good Tet McMillan is if the defense is still terrible.

Yes, they need to get better on that side of the ball, much, much better.

And they are a team.

Nobody's talking about the Panthers.

And just like we've talked about, Cam Ward made him not getting a lot of pop.

The former number one overall pick, Bryce Young, his second half surge was one of the

better stories I thought of last season because I think we all, a lot of us anyway, wrote him off, as did the Panthers, it seemed at one point.

And yet he ends up finishing strong.

They go four and five down the stretch after starting one and seven.

And in those five losses, Chiefs, Buccaneers, Eagles, you know, they combined.

the losses by a combined 12 points per FTN.

So this is a team that really made strides.

I'm really curious to see, Mark, if they build off that or if that was just a mirage and another double-digit loss season is on its way.

And, you know, regardless of the overall team record, like the growth of Bryce Young is still an incredibly valuable part of the season.

He seemed to me like someone who fell in love at the midpoint last year.

And his entire character and leadership and everything about him, his body language just changed.

Like if that's where we start.

Like that's the big story for me.

I don't see this as a playoff team on any level, but I think they're well coached and you just are missing pieces.

Let me just say, it is go time, though.

It's year three for Bryce Younger.

I think it's time for him, but not for the overall team.

I don't know.

The team-building process is still like

by

breaking news.

The Panthers just signed Hendon Hooker to the practice squad, guys.

We'll allow that.

No dart, that's a transaction addition by Andrew.

Justin the Saints.

Everyone expects the Saints to be one of, if not the worst, team in football this year.

Kellen Moore, young and unproven.

Spencer Rattler, Tyler Schook, also young and unproven.

And Rattler, it was announced on Tuesday, will get first crack at helming this potentially sinking ship of an offense, which could be a very rough watch this year.

However, I think we're sleeping a little too much on the Saints.

I don't think this is a number one overall pick type of team.

Why?

Because the defense is actually pretty stacked with some talent at various positions.

Brandon Staley, is this going to be a career resurgence moment for him?

Are we sleeping on the Saints D?

Let's see.

Who's new over on that side of the ball?

Justin Reed,

Julian Blackman, Devon Godshaw, Isaac Yidim.

Yadam.

What do we see?

Why do we see this as a defense that's on the right?

I watched them.

Yeah, I'll throw it back to you, Justin, Justin, on that.

What makes you think the defense will be better?

Well, Brandon Staley sort of revolutionized what defensive looks meant when he was the first time he...

grew to fame as a coordinator and then he had to become a head coach and everything went to shit with the Chargers.

But can he find a formula that works again that makes people think scheme is better, is more important than talent, which is sort of what he did the first time around, although he did have a lot of talent on that, you know, Rams defense too.

But I don't know.

I just like, I kind of feel a career.

I just feel like if everyone is on one side of something and everyone says the Saints are terrible, then they're going to be a little better than we think.

I don't think they're good, but like five to six wins feels totally achievable in a way.

They're going to be the victim.

And they're going to stun the Cardinals week number one.

My biggest issue is.

That game's in New Orleans, by the way.

You drafted a 26-year-old quarterback and you're going to make him sit and wait behind Spencer Rattler, who, to his credit, won the job.

Like, Spencer Rattler can play a little bit as well.

Go back to his Elite 11 days.

We had Cameras fall.

However, however, like, what are we doing trading a fourth-round pick for Devon Vele, who, when you go to next year's draft, will be 28 years old and entering his third season?

You have, because you mentioned Godshaw, they gave up a seven for him.

You have only five draft picks next year.

One of them could be number one overall, but this has, this roster is one of the most talent-deficient rosters in the NFL, and they are going to be in the conversation for that number one overall.

That's what makes me wonder at what difference Kellen Moore can make this year.

And also, like, you're working with the front office, and I know it's fine to say that cap room doesn't matter.

Like, they have $100 million

in dead cap space tied up, and another $30 in Alvin Kamara and Taysom Hill.

It's like, what is your flexibility going forward?

Like, I kind of just worry a little bit about Kellen Moore and what's going to be the experience this year and beyond.

Listen, Rattler went 0-6 as starter last year.

Even if the defense is better, there's going to be so many three-and-ouse.

The defense is going to be on the field all the time.

They're going to get killed.

This team stinks.

Arch Manning.

Certainly within the realm of possibility.

I like that you had to add that as if maybe people didn't think it was within the realm of possibility that the Saints will be one of the very worst teams in football.

I think we could deduce that.

I just don't want people to get the wrong impression of what I think because I was a little more positive there than anyone else.

On their record.

Justin, what's their record?

What do I predict their record?

Oh, what's their record going to be?

Five and twelve.

Okay.

That's not first overall.

Pick up.

Keep that in mind.

Santa.

Good.

Yep.

One more division.

It's the NFC U.S.

Let's start with Andrew and the Rams.

The Los Angeles Rams, who I saw last week.

So I think this says a lot.

The Rams had three guys claimed on waivers today, which I know sounds silly, but it speaks to the depth on this team.

Everything comes down to whether or not Matthew Stafford is healthy.

Oh, by the way, I did draft Jimmy Garoppolo late in my draft yesterday as well.

Just in in case.

Not that I have any inside interest, but

no, I didn't.

Look, none of us are young.

All of our backs feel like garbage when we wake up in the morning.

Matthew Stafford's 37 years old.

His back doesn't feel great either.

However, if his back is okay, I do think Devontae Adams and Puka Nakua is a fascinating 1-2 tandem.

They have a loaded backfield, and they have a young defensive front seven.

I'll throw it out to the audience.

Do you know how many sacks they had in their two playoff games a year ago anybody anybody they beat the Vikings they lost to the Eagles combined sacks in two games 14 you're all wrong they had 16 sacks they are loaded on the front seven if that front seven even gets better and takes it to a next level and Stafford stays healthy they could be driving up the five to Santa Clara oh hello Super Bowl Nice I like it bold bold take um I'm curious about those wide receivers because it was very interesting.

I know Cooper Cup maybe got old quick, or maybe not.

We'll see how he looks this year in new surroundings.

But the way that Nakua just basically inherited all the targets at wide receiver for the most part down the stretch or so much, so many of them.

Devontae Adams is used to getting the ball a ton, and certainly with Aaron Rodgers.

Matthew Stafford has a little bit of a balancing act to keep them both involved and both happy.

I'm interested to see how that breaks down target share.

I'm with Andrew.

If Stafford can stay vertical for 90% of the season,

I know they like Jimmy G, but that is not what we want to be happening here.

Then I would say this.

They definitely could win the division, and they already, like, they rebuilt their team so quickly that they were already being a problem.

They were already a problem in the playoffs when their plan wasn't even complete.

And they have a dominant defensive front at this point, post-Aaron Donald.

The sky's the limit unless Matthew Stafford's on IR in week four.

Jimmy Garoppolo has been to a Super Bowl before as well.

And I'm with you.

Like, I kind of roll my eyes when I hear that they're super confident in him.

But Sean McVay gets the best out of quarterbacks.

And that is why, like, obviously they got Jimmy G because they feel they have a Super Bowl caliber roster around the quarterback position, and all they need is competent play there.

And by the way, it's not only Matthew Stafford that has to stay healthy, and of course, the offensive line to protect the old quarterback.

But Puko Naku has missed a lot of time, and Devontae Adams is in his 30s now.

They need some things.

They need some help.

Everybody does.

The Niners with Mark Sessler.

The Niners have been talked about by many, win total-wise, as a genuine Super Super Bowl threat,

which I like because I'm a big Shanahan guy.

But in reality, does this more feel like year one of a two-year reload?

Like, get younger.

The defense has a ton of young newbies on it, new faces.

I think, number two, you get your cap in order, you dump cap money, which they've moved on from people, and you also keep your key stars of tomorrow.

And we just like we talked about the Rams.

I think they taught a masterclass in the modern-day, day, like rapid, you know, two-year rebuild.

And I kind of think the Niners appear to be following suit.

Or does dear old Shanny Boy have a trick up his sleeve?

Andrew.

I am the only one here.

Maybe, maybe the only one.

There are all these people that think, oh my God, the Niners have a last play schedule.

Look, they are going to take off.

Guys, this is a rebuild on the fly.

They lost legitimate pieces on both sides of the ball that went out and got good contracts in other places.

That was just in Denver.

Do you know how happy they are to have Dre Greenlaw and Talanoga, Hufanga?

They are thrilled.

That brings a toughness to the Denver defense that San Francisco is losing.

And look at all the injuries already a wide receiver.

Jawan Jennings has a calf and a contract, which is it.

Maybe it's both.

Brandon Ayuk is going to be at least a month, likely two months, until he is back.

And we're praying that Christian McCaffrey can stay healthy.

There are a lot of ifs.

The schedule is certainly to their favor, but I want Hanzeus that once you get to the regular season, especially through September, I kind of throw out strength of schedule.

It doesn't mean anything anymore.

That was my point, too.

So much has been made about the Niners' strength of schedule.

It's like, what are they playing?

The 2016 Browns every week.

It's like, we don't know.

We have no idea what that actual schedule will look like when we get to it.

But at the same time, I understand the optimism.

There's a lot of bounce back potential here here for this roster.

CMC has to stay healthy.

I think it's too much assumption has been made that that was a cursed season.

This is not the first time that he's had seasons wrecked by injuries, and now he's a 30-year-old running back.

Keep an eye on that.

And then the other, the other place, obviously, yes, wide receiver.

The depth there is troubling.

We all love Ricky Pirasol or Ricky Pirasol, as Mark says, but you almost have to pencil him in to be a guy that's like a 90-catch, 1,300-yard, 12-touchdown dude.

Or I feel like this offense is really missing something with Ayuk on his way back.

And George Kittle.

George Kittle has to be healthy too and be a contributor in the passing game.

Like he has been at random points in his career and then has disappeared at random points in his career.

And he's got to be out there and making plays as well.

They signed Marquez Valdez-Scantling, and they're

already

dealing with a ton of injuries this preseason, so it's a little scary for someone who has the over on their wins.

The Seahawks, the more things change, the more they stay the same.

Sam Darnold is coming off a season with the Vikings, in which he threw for over 4,300 yards, 35 touchdowns, just 12 picks, a passer rating north of 100.

And yet, his nomadic NFL journey continued, and he now takes over for Geno Smith in Seattle.

By most metrics, Darnold represents a significant upgrade over what the Seahawks got from the position of quarterback a year ago, but it's funny how things are perceived in our league.

Maybe it's because Geno seems to be the QB that the football cognacente

will die to defend, whereas Sam Darnold represents perhaps the opposite figure in that regard.

Always an eyebrow a sconce.

Asconce?

Is that how you say it?

When it comes to Darnold.

Anyway, it all sets up for yet another prove-it year for Sam.

The Darnold Hive will be rooting for him harder than ever.

But yes, the doubts remain about whether he can pilot an offense, especially without KOC and Justin Jefferson involved.

How say you, Mr.

Ceciliano?

I think that if you go back and look at what the Saints did the first two weeks of the year, I believe last year they scored 150 points in their first two games with Clint Kubiak calling plays.

No, it was like 80, and I'm not kidding.

I think they're going to see early success here.

I think they're going to pound the football.

The health of their backfield, which at times has been problematic the last two years, I think plays a huge part in their success this year.

Don't overlook George Hulani, the other back, of course, from Boise State,

with Cooper Cup JSN as their two go-to guys.

Curious about the downfield thread here.

Not that JSN is only the bubble and the hitch guy.

I think I know he can get downfield, but you cut MBS.

That to me is intriguing.

They love Gray Zabel.

I know that's not a fantasy pick.

They love Gray Zabel.

And, you know, strength up front, which might be an issue.

is really the key for their success this year.

I really like Mike McDonald.

I like the fact that he moved on from Ryan Grubb

and made this change.

To me, it shows flexibility.

And I don't like the idea of ever signing a quarterback off of like a solo career year to a big contract.

But in this case, who cares?

I think like Sam Darnold

is just one of these stories where he might be a late bloomer.

I believe the last year was not a mirage.

I know the end was an apocalypse, but

he's no downgrade from Geno Smith in my mind.

Any chance, this is now pie in the sky for Seattle fans.

Any chance that Charbonnet and Walker can both go for a thousand yards?

Ooh, like old Bengals or Browns.

Yes.

Yeah.

You're right, Andrew.

Like Piner and Matt back in the old days.

Yeah.

Because, yeah, we've talked about that.

They're going to run the pill a lot.

I think that's what got Ryan Grubbs got is that they fell out of what they wanted to be, which is grounded pound offense.

And that will set up Darnold Well as well with his play action ability.

Three, let's go.

Two, one.

Seahawks defense is going to be elite.

We have one more team.

Don't talk about them.

Arizona Cardinals with Justin Graver.

Trivia.

Which NFC West team led the division in point differential last season?

Answer.

I was going to say the Cardinals.

The Cardinals.

The 2024.

That's easy because you're talking about them.

Well, yes, I know, but I was just going to give the answer.

The 2024 third-place finisher, the Arizona Cardinals at plus 21.

This team has been on an upward trajectory since Jonathan Gannon took over.

2023, they went 4-13.

Last year, they went 8-9.

Is this the breakout season?

It feels make or break to me to understand if Jonathan Gannon is the guy going forward, but most importantly, to understand if Kyler Murray is the...

I hate to be reductive and take it all back to quarterback, but that feels like what it is for the Cardinals.

Can Kyler Murray connect with guys like Marvin Harrison Jr., Trey McBride, a decent to good offensive line, a fairly strong running game?

Does he have the Moxie?

Ooh.

Moxie, the Bonvoy Hotel mid-range chain.

I've stayed there in New York.

As have I.

Here's the story of the Cardinals for like the last five years, that they...

They have had among all teams the biggest decline in the second half of the season.

They were 6-4 at one point last year.

And, you know, I got fascinated with them.

And I think they are building a real team.

I would say Kyler Murray is the best pieces around him, especially if Harrison blooms the way that you'd want in year two that he's ever had.

But there's a lot on Kyler Murray, like to actually be a better quarterback, because he was third in passing DVOA at one point last year and then fell off a cliff with the rest of the team.

So to carry it out for the whole year, but I do think this is a playoff team.

I really do, despite Andrew saying that they're going to lose to the Saints in New Orleans in week one, which would be a problem.

I don't know that they're going to lose there.

To me, that's a trap is all I'm saying.

New coaching debut,

it's a trap, as somebody once yelled, I believe

he was an admiral.

Look at what they did drafting

their first five picks, four of them from the Big Ten, but their first five picks were all defense.

Their top pick, Walter Nolan, still hasn't seen the field, but Will Johnson and Jordan Birch truly look like the real deal.

Cody Simon is a block O, and Denzel Burke can cover.

Their defense will go a huge way towards them winning this year if they win.

But yeah, it's kind of another one of those.

Show us what you got, Kyler, years, because a guy with that kind of skill set should be able to carry a team.

I think we need to see it.

If there was like an NBA jam-style team where they have the big heads, and I guess that's what NFL Blitz was, which was a great game.

NFL Blitz was a great game.

Arsenal Williams on the cover running in the backyard.

Cardinals, I would grab the Cardinals all the time because Kyler Kyler Murray is fast and he could throw it far.

And Trey McBride is the best young tight end in football.

Or in that conversation, James Conner is eternally underrated.

Marvin Harrison Jr.

could be a superstar.

Oh, I need to see it all come together, though.

I don't believe it.

And I'll believe it when I see it.

We have gone around the NFC in exactly 48 minutes.

The closest we've actually ever come to hitting that.

I have breaking news.

I have mother breaking news.

You get a car and you get a car and you go.

I'm Tom Broke.

Am I having a stroke?

What's your breaking news?

What is happening to you?

The New England Patriots have claimed Tommy Cutlitz off waivers.

Listen, if Adam Schefter

If Greene and Schefter can stoneface the report breaking news that the fourth string quarterback of the Giants has been cut on live television.

So too can the old Zeuser break news on Tommy DeVito.

Hey oh Tommy, I'm backing up.

I'm backing up Drake May over here now.

I was there and I'm over here now.

Two things.

Number one, I really got to go to get to another show.

And number two, have you ever played the Greenberg Chefty drinking game?

Like...

Every time he says Chef Day, as opposed to, hey, Adam, or Adam Schefter is here, or Adam, or hey, Chefty.

Like, no, it's Chefty, D, Chef D, Chef D, Chef D.

I would definitely

be watching that.

I'll tell you that.

Whether or not you're going to be able to do that every day, then it's not a shot.

It's not a shot.

But you

just

next time.

I'm going up the mass pike over here now.

All right, Andrew, thank you, sir.

Thank you, Andrew.

Thank you for your time.

Pleasure.

I'm sorry.

It was a pleasure.

Oh, geez.

It was a pleasure.

I'm flattered.

I'm honored.

I'm touched.

I'm moved.

I'm emotional.

Thank you for inviting me.

Can we please do it another time?

I want the dart.

Let's do it.

You love the dart.

And let me just pay a compliment, Andrew, that you're so good at this exercise because I feel like there's not anybody in the business that is more knowledgeable of more things than Mr.

Ceciliano, which is a part of the reason why he's such a fantastic success in our business.

So thank you, Andrew.

Gentlemen.

The feeling and the admiration is mutual.

Long time listener and maybe third-time caller.

Later, buddy.

See you, boys.

We say goodbye to Andrew, and now we begin to say goodbye to the audience.

Great week of shows.

And yeah, that's it.

We're tapped out.

There's nothing else that I feel like we can say that we're just going to repeat ourselves.

So here's the good news.

Here's the good news.

Next week, we're going to

do a little hot butts.

with James Palmer to start the week, talk about the head coaches under the most pressure entering next year.

And then we begin.

We begin the process after that, marching towards week one and conversation around real football games that matter.

Pinch me, Ceci.

We've made it through another offseason.

Are you sure you don't want to go around the AFC and NFC again next week?

It's possible.

I would rather eat a bowl of toenails.

Well,

we can make that possible too.

But that's not to say that I didn't enjoy this exercise.

No, these were great.

The idea of doing.

Yeah, we reached the finish line of this type of discourse.

And everyone here feels like it's time to get to the real

battles.

We're now to the exciting part.

It is, in our business, it is a challenge at times to go from, you know, June or May until the end of August because you just don't have anything to

chew on.

But that's about to change.

So thank you to everyone

for listening and watching.

And make sure you subscribe, please.

And make sure we keep our subscriber count is going up on YouTube you know where we want to go you know where we want to get so please if you haven't subscribed on YouTube or you haven't checked us out on YouTube please do that and continue to rate the show and review the show and subscribe to the show wherever you get your podcasts as well the the hedonism moment the movement is upon us and it's all because of you guys and again big week for the show we're now in a partnership with Odyssey and and we're really excited about where that will take the show.

So all good times.

That's it.

Justin, great job, by the way.

Justin pulling the Otani, the equivalent of, it's the podcasting equivalent of Shohei Otani to be the on mic talent and the producer.

At the same time,

we love you, buddy, as well.

Oh, yeah, it was fun, guys.

I really enjoyed it, and I'm trying to find something here, and it's taking me longer than I've been doing.

All right.

I couldn't even tell you.

What a talent.

What a singular talent.

He's been an asset to us, man.

Oh, there he is.

All right, everybody.

Until next week, do what you must.

Heed the call.

United Healthcare Nurse Crystal checked in on a patient.

We do a routine call after surgery, and I could tell in her voice that she was struggling.

Crystal knew she needed help.

And I knew that this is very serious.

This is like septic.

This is life-threatening.

And she knew just what to do.

And I called the hospital and said she's coming in, here are her labs.

And got her the help she needed.

I see my role at United Healthcare as a life-saving role.

Hear more stories like crystals at uhc.com.

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