Free Agency (Something) Day 4 LIVE: Aaron Rodgers Watch (UGH) + MORE!

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Speaker 1 Dirty, 30. 30, 30.
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Speaker 1 Heed in that call.

Speaker 1 Thursday, Free Agency Week.

Speaker 1 Dan hands us with Mark Sessler.

Speaker 1 And Ceci,

Speaker 1 we are live once more. And shout out to everybody in the live chat right now as we continue to comb through the wreckage of what's been a very busy week in our league.

Speaker 2 Slowing down. A little bit, but a couple of huge names still.
We're kind of like, where do the dominoes tumble into?

Speaker 2 And like, oh, is it Aaron Rodgers that's going to make make us spend an extra three weeks talking about Aaron Rodgers?

Speaker 1 That's

Speaker 1 way on my radar, Ceci, because we're going to end up talking about Rodgers today.

Speaker 1 So we're part of the problem. You know, we're going to have Arifa Sanon

Speaker 1 of

Speaker 1 great Vikings coverage fame in a bit. And we're going to have an old friend connected to the Pittsburgh Steelers to close the show out.

Speaker 1 And it just so happens that Rodgers is tied to both those franchises.

Speaker 1 I want to say, like, as we get into everything everything today, that, you know, this is not what we want to do because we've done the Rodgers thing for many years now.

Speaker 1 But what he's done here, slyly, Aaron Rodgers, and probably on purpose, because maybe he's a little bit of a mad genius like this, Mark, is that he knows once you get to the middle of the week of free agency, the storylines dry up.

Speaker 1 So why not?

Speaker 1 I let make all these teams wait and become the story that everyone salivates over.

Speaker 2 I don't jump to the notion that I hear from others that he's a narcissist and he demands all this, but he is like, there are photos of him out on the beaches of Malibu with a blanket and a woolen cover over him with his bare legs just walking by the sea.

Speaker 2 While teams are trying to figure out what are our draft needs,

Speaker 2 free agency concerns.

Speaker 1 You don't believe Aaron Rodgers is a narcissist?

Speaker 2 Not a damaging one. Like there are levels to narcissists.
I'd say he's like maybe a soft-touch narcissist. Like, uh,

Speaker 2 anyway, I don't know. I, you know, we are you kidding me?

Speaker 2 I'm not, I'm just saying I don't know him personally. So, to say that about someone is

Speaker 1 that's kind of a cop-out, though, because anybody could say that. Oh, I wouldn't, I wouldn't feign to say anything negative about him.
I don't know him personally.

Speaker 1 I'm just based on the 20 years of knowledge that we have, especially the last five years or so, it seems like he's he's might be looking into the reflection and staring at the reflection coming back at him.

Speaker 1 That's all.

Speaker 1 I can see that.

Speaker 1 It's not in the book depository.

Speaker 2 I'm not arguing that, but even like Sandra Dee and Grease,

Speaker 2 or John Travolta, one of the two of them, looked into a pond and saw their image coming back at them.

Speaker 1 You're the same guy that got on me about the Save by the Bell reference, and we're doing the 1978 Grease film reference now. That's where we're at.

Speaker 2 I have a long history of scanning films, and yes, you're right.

Speaker 1 Long history of scanning films. Mark, when we put you on the cover of Alien Weekly, that might be the subhead.

Speaker 1 Let's get Justin on. Long history of scanning films.

Speaker 2 Look at Justin on that job during the show. Like he said to create multiple magazine covers during the show.

Speaker 1 All right. Speaking of Rodgers, let's throw it to some ESPN footage of Adam Schefter as the world waits with bated breath, kind of, for Rodgers to make his decision.

Speaker 2 Okay, but let's talk a little bit more about the Giants because you said that he's that Aaron Rodgers is also their number one. So where exactly are they in the pursuit for Aaron Rodgers?

Speaker 4 They're waiting to hear. Everybody's waiting to hear.
He has not communicated to either team what his timeline is, what his preference is. Nobody knows.

Speaker 4 And so the Giants, like the Steelers, they're in a holding pattern right now. And the hard thing about this is they have only one quarterback under contract.
That's Tommy DeVito right now.

Speaker 4 And the Giants need to... come up with an upgrade somehow, some way.
They're waiting on Aaron Rodgers. They're interested in Russell Wilson as well.

Speaker 4 And so if Aaron Rodgers were to take the chair in Pittsburgh, that would leave Russell Wilson, presumably, with the option of taking the chair in New York with the Giants. But again,

Speaker 4 I don't believe that that would be the only option for Russell. So I think there's going to be other options out there, and we'll see how that works out.

Speaker 1 I hope Schefter,

Speaker 1 who's deep inside the machine, he knows exactly what's going to happen.

Speaker 1 He knows exactly where all these people are going, but it's like you have to say it a certain way and you have to slurp on some agents as one does it.

Speaker 1 You know, speaking of Russell Wilson, this seems a little bit past its expiration date as well.

Speaker 1 Like that it's like Russell Wilson watch. Where is he headed?

Speaker 1 Here's live footage of Russell Wilson exiting the Browns facility after meeting with the Browns.

Speaker 1 Like, are we still like, we're covering Russell Wilson visiting teams and camping outside facilities to see it?

Speaker 1 Have we been watching the same Russell Wilson since about the pandemic?

Speaker 2 i mean well it's it's such a tell on yeah it's such a tell on um and we're trying not to do this but it's such a tell on uh the industry it's like do i trust someone from the browns facility to drive me to the airport the answer could be no

Speaker 1 so you have russell wilson bouncing around like Adam Schefter knows, and I'll tell you, because I could already see it into the future, that it will end with Russell Wilson

Speaker 1 with the New York Giants. I see that.

Speaker 1 Aaron Rodgers will probably end up with the Steelers, I would guess.

Speaker 1 And the Vikings, well, we'll get to the Vikings with a reef, but I have my theories there as well.

Speaker 1 But so Russ is in the mix. Aaron Rodgers in the mix.
And then there's Kirk Cousins. Why don't we do a little cousins check-in, Mark?

Speaker 1 Because it has been assumed by many, myself included, that Kirk Cousins would be a figure in this world.

Speaker 1 And even with the teams that we're talking about, certainly not the Vikings, who wisely, the Vikings have done a lot of things right the last couple of years.

Speaker 1 They got out on Kirk Cousins just in time.

Speaker 1 They get rid of him or they say goodbye to him. He goes to the Falcons, has a nightmare season where he plays poorly.

Speaker 1 The Achilles just barely in the rear view, gets benched. And everyone's expecting Kirk Cousins to be someone else's quarterback.
But for the time being, he's still on the Falcons.

Speaker 1 Here's Charles Robinson, veteran reporter. I don't know why I keep on calling Charles Robinson veteran reporter this week.
I think he is, but I don't know why.

Speaker 1 That's the first thing that comes to mind from Yahoo. They're going going to roll.
This is what Robinson wrote.

Speaker 1 They're going to roll right through the Sunday deadline to lock in another $10 million in 2026 guaranteed salary and see where this goes, Cousins.

Speaker 1 And the Falcons, either he's a pricey backup or a trade candidate.

Speaker 1 Cousins also has a no trade clause here. So he has some agency mark deciding where he plays next.
But I don't see any reason why he'd want to be with the Falcons.

Speaker 1 And I still think, keep an eye on these teams, the Pittsburgh Giants, that Cousins could be the QB one of those squads by the end of this.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I think it's just the order of

Speaker 2 human activity here,

Speaker 2 the dominoes, because it's like, why?

Speaker 2 It tells me that the Falcons have not gotten...

Speaker 2 You can say I'm saying it the wrong way, but I think the Falcons have not gotten an offer that entices them enough to do anything.

Speaker 2 And if nothing happens in this cycle right here,

Speaker 2 Kirk Cousins could be the answer to

Speaker 2 the Vikings or the Packers or some other team if a quarterback injury happens down the road. Like you change, you trade him then.

Speaker 2 Now what? You cut him now or you trade him for like lowest value.

Speaker 2 It's kind of weird because we killed them for drafting a rookie quarterback when they had signed Kirk Cousins.

Speaker 2 But now it's kind of flipped where like the veteran quarterback may be the thing that benefits your organization.

Speaker 1 No, that's that's what

Speaker 2 now they're starting the rookie quarterback and Kirk Cousins is the person that's not in the set in the in the in the picture. He's not in the frame.
So it's like, what do you do with him?

Speaker 2 You're not keeping him just to pay him $10 million. It tells me like you've not gotten the right offer.

Speaker 1 I mean, by the way, I just get a text from our producer. Hey, I should probably start the timer, huh? Yeah, bud.
We started the show like eight minutes ago.

Speaker 1 30. 30.

Speaker 2 Who knows what's going on down in Texas? I think one of the reasons that Justin relocated to Texas, we have no jurisdiction over what he's up to for most of the day.

Speaker 6 Lots going on, lots of juggle.

Speaker 1 We don't get to

Speaker 6 this particular commenter, JP, who pointed out that there is no timer.

Speaker 1 So a commenter on the live stream helped us out. Thank you, JP.
Yeah, the Falcons, it's not like, oh, it looks like they were right after all, taking the quarterback of the top 10 pick.

Speaker 1 No, you should have just taken the quarterback with the top 10 pick and played him last year. But then instead, you got into bed with Cousins, and he turned out to be a disaster.

Speaker 1 So now, and you end up turning to the rookie earlier than you planned, but now you have this Kirk Cousins problem and it is a problem and they have to figure out how to offload this problem.

Speaker 1 I will, and I'll just say that I do think Cousins could be, for somebody out there, the team that loses out, I guess, on this Aaron Rodgers sweepstakes is kind of depressing as it is on some levels.

Speaker 1 He could end up starting. And I think he would be a good guy.
If, like, for instance, the Giants are desperate just to have a guy

Speaker 1 to make their offense function on a basic level. Like, getting Cousins a little bit more removed from that injury and healthy could be a good bridge guy.

Speaker 1 Maybe not as good as Rogers or as Matthew Stafford would have been, but probably better. I would rather, who would you rather roll with for a year, Kirk Cousins or Russell Wilson?

Speaker 1 Give me Cousins and let me see if he can, you know, be healthier this year and play the guitar. Because I think I know what I have in Russell Wilson in 2025.

Speaker 2 I'd agree.

Speaker 2 Although I'd leave concerned about the age of Cousins and

Speaker 2 literally just what we saw.

Speaker 2 He can tag on these injuries, but the team that's left out is like Russell Wilson just blew out of Cleveland in a white

Speaker 2 semi

Speaker 2 ultra-uber.

Speaker 2 Maybe Cousins winds up.

Speaker 2 But Cousins and Stefanski work together in Minnesota too. And it's kind of a Stefansky type quarterback.
And I'm not attracted to that.

Speaker 2 But the Browns do not give me anything I'm attracted to in general. So that's not the referendum.
But like I could see him in Cleveland.

Speaker 2 I could find, I could see that being kind of like the last chip to fall. Like the Browns have Kenny Pickett, who is clearly not the number one.
They've got a

Speaker 2 the worst quarterback that anyone's ever traded for with a double Achilles injury in like one in like two months because he was on vacation with like a random woman.

Speaker 2 And like then now you've got maybe Kirk Cousins becomes the starter. Everything's amazing.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 But would you rather have Kirk or Russ in Cleveland Browns army?

Speaker 2 I think Kirk Cousins, despite like outside of the I want to live inside of like a plastic vinyl thing during Corona times, is less drama and probably just more of a,

Speaker 2 you just get through the season.

Speaker 1 You just get through the season with him. Did you know five years ago yesterday,

Speaker 1 Rudy Gobert was like, from the jazz was like touching all the microphones and mocking COVID. And then the world got shut down when Tom Hanks got sick.
It was, it was five years ago.

Speaker 2 Yes, you're exactly right. Yep.

Speaker 2 It took, it took, like, it took,

Speaker 2 I mean, I really do think that, like, it was the NBA players, and that kind of like was a tipping point. The NBA.

Speaker 3 I don't care.

Speaker 1 What do you mean you don't care? What is, you know,

Speaker 2 Justin, what do you, you don't, what?

Speaker 1 It's like the most significant, literally the most significant world event, probably, of the century, or at least since 9-11. And you're hitting us with the Tommy Lee Jones, I don't care drop.

Speaker 1 I'm sorry, Justin, if we can't give you what you want as podcasters. Yeah.

Speaker 2 It's like, I'm Gen Z. I'm just going to click it over to OnlyFans the minute this ends.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 2 All right, Justin.

Speaker 1 Thank you, though. Yeah.
You are correct, though.

Speaker 2 That was a historical note from yesterday, and I appreciate that you mentioned that.

Speaker 1 You know, we we touch on a lot of different topics on this show

Speaker 1 in other news the Bengals reportedly asking for a first round pick and more for Trey Hendrickson that from Cam Wolf our former colleague at NFL Media and per Dan Graziano that teams are quote turned off by the high asking price well I don't care.

Speaker 1 Well, you're turned off. All right, then take a walk.

Speaker 1 Is anybody willing to meet our price? And

Speaker 1 do the Bengals actually know what they're doing? I feel like the Bengals just have a lot of

Speaker 1 business to take care of. And they remind me of myself as a student when I was just like, just keep kicking the can.
I'll do it later. I'll do it later.
I'll do it later.

Speaker 1 And then all of a sudden you have three final exams to write and an essay and

Speaker 1 you have pushed all this work. They still haven't signed Jamar Chase.

Speaker 1 They still haven't given Dee Higgins the contract he wants. He's still got Hendrickson on the trademark.
It's like, do something. Go one way or the other.

Speaker 1 I'm sick of talking about all this stuff hanging out there.

Speaker 2 They are. It's annoying that the quarterback needs to roll in with like Excel spreadsheets to try to reorganize the franchise and the front office on some level.

Speaker 2 Trey Hendrickson, I think, is maybe the best free agent addition of the past three years. If you look at all the multiple years, like, what are we doing here? Like, this is your window.

Speaker 2 You've not had a window for most of our adult human lives. Like, you're in a window.
Pay them. Every other team is figuring out how to play.
Crazy contracts are going to players all over the place.

Speaker 2 Look at the Saints. If the Saints can be a bad team and pay as much money as they are to so many people, Bengals pay what should have been potentially the defensive player of the year from a year ago.

Speaker 2 Like, I don't, I'm with you. I'm befuddled by the concepts.

Speaker 1 I'll say it again. I'll lay it out there.
Nobody cares. Certainly the Bengals don't care.
But this is what we do. Let's go ahead and pay Jamar Chase.

Speaker 1 Long term, make him the highest paid wide receiver in the league or close to it. Easy.
Next, trade T. Higgins.
Get some draft assets, bring, and then use

Speaker 1 the money that you're saving by trading your wide receiver two to get one of these solid veteran wide receivers that are on the market. Play him next to Jamar Chase.

Speaker 1 Then give Trey Hendricks and his money because he's a vital part of your defense. And what you do is you kind of thread the needle.

Speaker 1 We go, Joe Burrow, we couldn't give you everything you wanted, but we gave you your top defensive guy. We took care of your buddy wide receiver one.

Speaker 1 And here's Cooper Cup or insert, you know, Stefan Diggs, insert veteran X here. And we move on.
But do something.

Speaker 2 Be smart. Like someone in the chat asked, like,

Speaker 2 is it, and I'm not saying this is logical, but like, is it, are we in a window where another team could come in, because the Bengals are like, they're just stingy.

Speaker 2 They want to just run a little mom-and-pop diner out in the middle of the country. Like,

Speaker 2 someone drops like three first-round picks and you trade for Burrow and like, get them out of there, and we solve all problems because you just, you simply want to exist. Oh, believe me.

Speaker 1 I'm thinking about that.

Speaker 1 My team's got Justin Fields, and it's like, oh, that could work. Or

Speaker 1 it might not work. But if I have a chance, some flexibility a year from now when Burrow goes nuclear and says, I want out of here, I mean, I would give everything to get that man.

Speaker 2 I wonder if they'd listen because I don't know who they are at this point.

Speaker 1 Mike Brown. Well, let's see how they, when they eventually do handle these things in front of them, let's see how all that goes.

Speaker 1 Finally,

Speaker 1 before we get to a reef, Adam Schefft reports that the Seahawks, Broncos, Patriots, among others, quote, bear watching for Cooper Cup. Just mention him.

Speaker 1 Jordan Schultz Cup has interests from at least five teams. He prefers to make a decision quickly.
All right, well, then make one.

Speaker 1 And then Karen, I'm sorry if I get her name wrong. Gerigian of

Speaker 1 Mass Live Sports reports that the Patriots are interested in signing Cooper Cup, but his price at the moment is, quote, a bit too steep. I don't really want to hear it

Speaker 1 from the the Patriots, you know,

Speaker 1 who are throwing money at everybody.

Speaker 1 Like I said, within our unsolicited advice earlier this week, you cannot come out of this offseason without adding major pieces on offense around your second-year quarterback.

Speaker 1 I think Cooper Cup would be a great guy to have in that building.

Speaker 1 I don't know if he's your wide receiver one, but could be the guy that you pair with a rookie or someone else you go out and get, Brandon Ayuk, for example.

Speaker 1 Be aggressive and attack the market in a wise way for Drake May. All right, that's what's happening in the news.
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Speaker 1 All right, let's take a break. And when we get back, Arif Hassan on the Vikings.

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Speaker 7 Welcome back.

Speaker 1 Our next guest

Speaker 1 is a hero of the Twin Cities.

Speaker 1 He's on that level of Prince. That's where I'll put him.
You can find him on Twitter.

Speaker 1 X

Speaker 1 Arif Hassan NFL. Check out his newsletter, Wide Left, about the NFL and how it intersects with the politics and the culture and all that.
And he also hosts the Minnesota Vikings podcast, Norse Code.

Speaker 1 Yes, Arif Hassan, what's up? Welcome to Heat the Call.

Speaker 3 Hello, thanks for having me.

Speaker 1 Hey.

Speaker 1 Love it.

Speaker 2 Thank you. I don't know.

Speaker 1 Maybe that was a little strong about the the Prince thing, but.

Speaker 3 It was pretty strong. I'm kind of worried about blowback.
But, you know, for now, I'll just kind of bask in it.

Speaker 2 Set the bar high. I like that.

Speaker 1 You're a Minneapolis guy, so I do have to ask. For some reason, I'm just like,

Speaker 1 as a fan of rock music and

Speaker 1 everybody's, you know, obviously very curious about Prince and everything. Like, what about that estate? Whatever the estate is.
Have you ever been there?

Speaker 1 Have you ever been behind the walls of Princess Paisley? Yeah. Paisley Park.
Yeah.

Speaker 3 No, it's fantastic.

Speaker 3 What's going on over there?

Speaker 1 Have you ever been in the vault?

Speaker 3 I've not been in the vault. No.

Speaker 2 What happened to like the two, what were the names, the two women that were always kind of left and right of him? The two the songstresses. What happened to them? What's happening?

Speaker 1 Well, you have to signify which week or month because they.

Speaker 2 Well, no, I thought he had like, didn't he have like sort of two side singers that were his like.

Speaker 1 We had Apollonia, right?

Speaker 3 She was.

Speaker 1 I don't know. Reef, can you help us out?

Speaker 3 Yes, I'm a little lost on

Speaker 3 what's become of them. them.

Speaker 3 What a question. I think the estate is taking care of them.
But

Speaker 2 that was my only concern. I just want to make sure that they're safe and sound.

Speaker 1 All right, Arif, it was great having you on. There goes Arif.

Speaker 3 Fantastic with our weekly Prince update, the Prince Estate update.

Speaker 1 Now, listen, we're talking Minnesota. We're talking Prince, and we're talking the Vikings.
And Arif, let's start here because I think...

Speaker 1 The Vikings are this close, for the listeners. I'm holding my pointer finger and my thumb about, I don't know, two inches apart, to a perfect offseason.

Speaker 1 They nailed, and give credit to Quezy last year, everything he did worked, including Sam Darnold, obviously, 14 wins.

Speaker 1 And then they make the right decision to move on from Sam with the kid waiting in the wings. They do the right move so far in free agency where they're beefing up the line on both sides.

Speaker 1 They go and bring back Harrison Smith because we all love that. And now all they have to do is not fall to the temptation of Aaron Rodgers.
Can they? Is it even a real thing? Let's start there.

Speaker 1 Do you sense that the Vikings are actually wrestling with this?

Speaker 3 So, my understanding is that they've definitely had a conversation about whether or not it makes sense.

Speaker 3 I don't know if it's gone any further, but my impression is they're just making sure they kind of like check all the boxes, right? They want to go through every available option that they have.

Speaker 3 I don't know how serious it is.

Speaker 3 To me, it suggests that it's not that serious that they're going to be pursuing Aaron Rodgers, but I think, you know, people reporting that the Vikings are considering it are being technically accurate.

Speaker 3 I don't know that

Speaker 3 whenever you report something, it makes it seem like that thing is like a very important element to the discussion. And that's not what I'm gathering from it.

Speaker 3 So I don't think that they'll be going after Aaron Rodgers. My understanding of Rodgers is that he's really only considering the Giants and the Steelers.
So

Speaker 2 I guess I would ask you, because I feel like... if you're the front office and I feel like the Vikings have a vision.

Speaker 2 They really do seem to be tied to the idea of a rookie quarterback contract and build a team around him. It's like, why is this even in the atmosphere? Like,

Speaker 2 why would we even consider delaying J.J. McCarthy another year? Is there anything about J.J.
McCarthy's, I guess,

Speaker 2 his recovery from his injury where there's like we need to get someone in there as a bit of a stopgap until a later part of the season?

Speaker 3 Yeah, no, I think it's a fair question. Like, why would that happen? And of course, that would raise, you know, concerns about McCarthy's recovery.

Speaker 3 But actually, you know, you hear publicly that he's ahead of schedule. When you check in privately, it's the same thing.
Like they're really confident that he's ahead of schedule recovery-wise.

Speaker 3 They're really impressed with him. They're remarkably impressed with him.
I can't get them to stop shutting up about how much they like him.

Speaker 3 So it is kind of a curious happenstance that this is like part of the reporting, right? That Aaron Rodgers might be considered by the Vikings.

Speaker 3 But again, I just think it's like a due diligence thing more than anything else. I think that they really do want, you know, to give McCarthy that opportunity.

Speaker 3 Certainly seems like the Vikings are acting, you know, given all of the other moves that they've made in free agency. Like there's a win-now window.

Speaker 3 So maybe, you know, that would suggest we got to bring in somebody that knows what they're doing. But I do think that they're really confident that McCarthy has the ability to do a lot for them.

Speaker 3 I have a theory.

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 1 Aaron Rodgers, 41, coming off pretty grisly two-year stay with the Jets, and he's looking at his options. And the Giants and the Steelers, both clearly interested at a high level.

Speaker 1 Both teams in varying states of middle of the pack and below. Aaron Rodgers looks at Minnesota and he's like, shit, I could play in a dome.
I could play with a team that just won 14 games.

Speaker 1 I could play with a highly respected QB, whisperer, play caller, and Kevin O'Connell. I could play with Justin Jefferson.

Speaker 1 I'm going to put it out there. I'm going to put that out there.
I'm going to try to get to Minnesota because that's where I want to play because I could win a Super Bowl.

Speaker 1 And although I don't like ever being connected to Brett Favre, let's face it, it'd be hilarious if he went from the Packers to the Jets to the Vikings. And Arif, you remember.
You remember.

Speaker 1 We all remember. Brett Favre went to the Vikings and had a fairytale season before he just missed out on the Super Bowl in that crushing Saints loss.

Speaker 1 Like, there is a path where it makes sense, where if Aaron got what he wanted, just presupposing that's what he wants here, that he could make the Vikings even more viable a contender.

Speaker 1 Because there is, but from the Vikings side of it, I get why, even internally, if they're not like saying it out loud, there's risk here because you do have this roster that's ready to go.

Speaker 1 And you could say you love J.J. McCarthy, but he's essentially going to be a rookie quarterback.
And that will be the gamble. So

Speaker 1 that's just kind of my read on it: that Rodgers would love to be in Minnesota. The Vikings love their kid in the house, but still, there's probably a little bit of a queasiness in the stomach.

Speaker 1 It's like, man, we're going to turn this thing over to someone who's never thrown an NFL pass.

Speaker 3 Yeah, no, absolutely. I think that uncertainty is 100%

Speaker 3 part of the equation here.

Speaker 3 I think from an Aaron Rodgers psychology perspective, I think we're all experts, of course.

Speaker 3 I think that

Speaker 1 I'm a Jets fan, so I'm a little more qualified over the last two years of studying. Yeah, I got my master's.

Speaker 3 I think that this is like he would he would view the comparison to Favre as

Speaker 3 a necessary risk to finally get one over on him and actually win in Minnesota with Favre, right? And that would be all worth it in the end if he could grab it.

Speaker 3 But no, I do think that the Vikings, you know, are aware that

Speaker 3 this guy has never thrown an NFL pass, is a bit of a concern. I will say that when

Speaker 3 you know, before McCarthy's injury,

Speaker 3 his ability to kind of pick up the offense surprised them,

Speaker 3 like pleasantly surprised them.

Speaker 3 How quickly he picked up the offense and how good he looked in that preseason game.

Speaker 3 I think that that is driving a lot of

Speaker 3 their

Speaker 3 optimism about this, which of course is a remarkably small sample to work off of, and not a very clean sample. It's like a preseason game and some practices, right?

Speaker 3 So I think that they're kind of aware that they're putting a lot on the line in that way. And then they're also

Speaker 3 bringing in a bunch of, I mean, the Vikings, I believe, were like by, you know, if you weighed it by snaps, the oldest team in the league last year. And I think they may have gotten older.
Like,

Speaker 3 it's kind of crazy.

Speaker 1 Well, that's how it works.

Speaker 2 They would get older.

Speaker 3 Well, a lot of teams get younger because they get rid of the older guys.

Speaker 3 But I appreciate that time marches on.

Speaker 1 Arif gets it, Mark.

Speaker 3 Oh, sorry. Well, I was just explaining sort of how

Speaker 3 to do it.

Speaker 1 The man has been to Paisley Park, okay?

Speaker 3 True.

Speaker 1 Yeah, there's the dichotomy there, right? Arif, where you have like this older roster, veteran roster, and you're going to turn it over to the kid who's never thrown a pass.

Speaker 1 Was there, did you get a vibe in your conversations around the team that the Sam Darnold staying was ever something that was a possibility?

Speaker 1 Because that, I guess, was the ultimate security blanket where you just slap him with the franchise tag and ride for one more year.

Speaker 1 But obviously they went in a different direction with Darnold going to Seattle.

Speaker 3 Absolutely. That was an option.
I don't think that they

Speaker 3 were

Speaker 3 so committed to the idea of that option that they were ever going to offer him the kind of money that Seattle offered, which is not an extraordinary amount of money for a starting quarterback. But

Speaker 3 my impression is that they were willing to offer something like 25 million or something like that. So well below what his market would be.

Speaker 3 But they wanted to put it in a spot where it wouldn't impact the cap too much when they went after all of these free agents, which in this case, that it wouldn't.

Speaker 3 And also that kind of money commitment to a guy that might be in a competition at the beginning of camp, that you'd be comfortable benching that guy. It's tough to bench a $40 million guy.

Speaker 3 It's a lot easier to bench a $25 million guy.

Speaker 3 And so my understanding is that they were willing to put and maybe even actually put an offer on the table that was well below the market and just kind of said, hey, you know, we want you to do what's best for yourself.

Speaker 3 And if that's, you know, $8 million more per year, it's kind of difficult for us to be upset about that. So go ahead and do that.

Speaker 3 But I think that there was that conversation, but it was always going to be at a particular limit that's going to make them the most comfortable.

Speaker 2 This is a bit of a weird question, but like

Speaker 2 we are in a strange offseason where you've got teams searching for quarterbacks and we don't love the draft

Speaker 2 outside of the top two guys.

Speaker 2 It's a lot of milquetoast kind of veterans out there. Do you think anyone has called the Vikings about J.J.
McCarthy?

Speaker 2 Maybe now, not because they've moved on from Sam Darno, but did anyone pick up the phone maybe and say, hey, if you're going to stick with a veteran for a high price,

Speaker 2 would you be willing to trade J.J. McCarthy? Or is that just not something that teams do? I would just be like interested in the idea of exploring that.

Speaker 3 There are a lot of teams that will do like fact-finding missions with phone calls like that. There are a lot of teams that do that.
And it would shock me if that didn't happen.

Speaker 3 I know that there were some reports in January that some teams called. I couldn't verify, but I know there were some reports in January that teams did call the Vikings.

Speaker 3 We're like, hey, if you stick with Sam, and it sounds like you should,

Speaker 3 you know, would you,

Speaker 3 you know, would you be willing to kind of trade J.J. McCarthy? And my understanding is that the Vikings didn't entertain that.
But again, that's not original reporting for me.

Speaker 3 But yeah, I would think that teams would do that. Not every team is going to do that.
A lot of teams will only pick up the phone when it's something that they're genuinely interested in.

Speaker 3 But there are other teams that are just like, we want to know what the market price for any available option is going to be. Right.
Because you could be surprised. Right.
I don't think,

Speaker 3 you know, I think the week before Jimmy Garoppolo got traded to the 49ers, I don't think that that was like a serious option. A lot of people were like, Tom's on the way out.

Speaker 3 And the 49ers called and they're like, hey. Let's talk about Jimmy.
And that turned out to be a price that they were willing to pay.

Speaker 3 So I think some teams are comfortable just trying to figure out what market prices are and other teams will only call when they're genuinely interested in it.

Speaker 3 I think you got a couple of teams in that first category that called.

Speaker 1 All right. So elsewhere on the roster, I mentioned Harrison Smith comes back for one more year.
Ryan Kelly and Will Fries, they upgrade the interior of the line, which needed it.

Speaker 1 We saw how it collapsed down the stretch there. Jonathan Allen and Jason Hargrave.
Javon Hargrave, they add to the defensive line side of things. Isaiah Rogers, Taveri Thomas.
They've been very busy.

Speaker 1 What else does this team need to do to take that next step in your mind beyond obviously needing McCarthy or whomever to give you high-level quarterback play?

Speaker 3 Yeah, I think that they still need to add a little bit more to that cornerback room. You mentioned DeBir Thomas.
You mentioned Isaiah Rodgers.

Speaker 3 I think Rodgers is an interesting signing because he's only ever played like a couple hundred snaps every season.

Speaker 3 And, you know, he has the gambling suspension, too, in his history.

Speaker 3 But he's looked looked good, but it's like 200 snaps last year, right? So you don't know how good he's going to be. They brought back Byron Murphy, which is great.

Speaker 3 We don't know if Makai Blackman, who a lot of us are presuming is going to be the third starter at cornerback, is going to be able to kind of fulfill that role to the extent that when you had Shaq Griffin and Stephon Gilmore last year, you had those roles mostly covered.

Speaker 3 They didn't play outstanding football, but they played well enough.

Speaker 3 And I think that they probably want to bring in another cornerback, whether that's in the first round or the third round or something else, in order to kind of fill that out.

Speaker 3 And then long term, of course, know, Harrison Smith is probably going to retire at the end of this year. It was really awesome that he came back, but you have to have a long-term plan.

Speaker 3 So maybe you grab a safety and long-term plans on the defensive line. Jonathan Allen is 30.
Javon Hargrave is 32. Harrison Phillips is up there too.
You probably want to grab a defensive lineman.

Speaker 3 But I think in terms of,

Speaker 3 you know, immediate needs, I think cornerback is up there.

Speaker 3 I think that...

Speaker 3 I still wouldn't be upset if they added to that defensive line rotation, but maybe get some competition at the other guard spot.

Speaker 3 I know that changing out three interior offensive linemen is kind of tough to do in one offseason, although the Bears seemingly just did it. So I guess you could just do that.

Speaker 3 Well, it's got to work too. Yeah.
Yeah, right. It's got to work.

Speaker 1 That's one of the tropes of the free agency month of March where people, oh, we fixed our offensive line. Well, they got to actually play well together and you have to sign the right guys.

Speaker 1 There has to be chemistry. They've got to stay healthy.
A lot of assumptions are made this time of year about people, quote-unquote, fixing their line.

Speaker 2 Not by our show, but by the other shows, sort of out of the

Speaker 3 Yeah, the lesser shows. No, I understand.

Speaker 3 But yeah, I think more competition at that other guard spot, because you mentioned that the interior collapse. That's true.

Speaker 3 All three members of the Vikings' interior offensive line underperformed throughout the season. I mean, they did bench one of them for another one.

Speaker 3 But yeah,

Speaker 3 that's a difficult situation. So I'd want to see some movement there.
And then probably another running back.

Speaker 3 Maybe not in the first round necessarily, but to pair with Aaron Jones, who they brought back at $10 million a year.

Speaker 3 Jones is a very good running back, but I think it's pretty clear he operates best in a committee or on a pitch count situation.

Speaker 3 And having another back would be nice. Cam Akers is a free agent.
I don't know if they want to bring him back. Ty Chandler, I think, has kind of demonstrated that he's not going to be that guy.

Speaker 3 So you've got a really deep running back class at some point. You probably want to plumb those depths.

Speaker 2 I have...

Speaker 2 A friend who's a,

Speaker 2 we all have a friend who's a Vikings fan. And like, you know, even though you have a nice season and then it goes into the tank, I asked him, I mentioned that you were coming on.

Speaker 2 He knows who you are and he's read a lot of your stuff. I said, do you have a question for

Speaker 3 Arif?

Speaker 2 Here's what he wrote me. Because

Speaker 2 I sort of want to address where I think Vikings fans are, even though a nice team did a nice job. He said, I have completely blackballed.

Speaker 2 professional sports for my life since the second quarter of the Vikings Rams game.

Speaker 2 What would you tell Vikings fans that no matter what they do, there's sort of this aura, like this, an aura of kind of like, we are doomed. Like, is this team different?

Speaker 2 Is this coach and this front office different? Are we going somewhere different?

Speaker 3 I would never tempt fate to say that this is definitively a new situation, right?

Speaker 3 I would never argue that the Vikings are not doomed, but I would say we should act as if they aren't because I think we're going to enjoy life a lot more.

Speaker 3 You know, the pain is going to be the pain.

Speaker 3 And when you open up, you know, and you make yourself vulnerable to that kind of stuff, of course, it's going to hurt more at the end. But you're going to enjoy the ride along the way a lot more.

Speaker 3 And at some point, it is possible that the Vikings could, I know this is crazy, they could eventually win a Super Bowl. And you want to be in a spot, I know, I know, but it is possible.

Speaker 3 But you want to be in a spot where emotionally you can enjoy that instead of always guarding yourself until the final moment.

Speaker 3 And that's just going to, that you're just going to be living a better life that way. So yeah, of course, you'll get hurt a couple of times along the way.
But that's what life is.

Speaker 3 That's what sports are. So yeah, the Vikings, I don't know, maybe they're doomed, but hey, enjoy the ride.

Speaker 1 Yeah,

Speaker 1 that's very good advice from Arif Hassan. Yeah, before that happened, tell your friend, who, by the way, could probably use some better help, use the code HTC,

Speaker 1 that you had 14 wins in an unbelievable, exciting ride and a number of incredible finishes in that season. Come on.

Speaker 2 I get the end, the final chapter reaction, though.

Speaker 1 Yeah. But sure, you're right.
Yeah, I get it. Arif, thank you so much for giving us your time during this busy time of year.

Speaker 1 Again, check out his newsletter Wide Left and the Vikings podcast Norse Code. And you're the man, buddy.
Thanks for joining us.

Speaker 3 Thanks for having me. Peace.

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Speaker 1 All right, we're back. Thank you to Arif Hassan

Speaker 1 for getting us where we needed to go to learn more more about these Vikings

Speaker 1 and the journey ahead. Let's hit some other news,

Speaker 1 Mark, real quick before we bring in our second guest. The 49ers have

Speaker 1 added a new quarterback. I mean, I feel like this has been four years in the making, but Mac Jones signs with San Francisco.
It's a two-year deal up to an $11.5 million. That's like based, that's...

Speaker 1 Based on the contracts we've seen, it's kind of what the market is. It's about $4 million or so.
It can get up a little higher with incentives.

Speaker 1 Kyle Shanahan finally gets the guy that he always wanted way back when they ended up with Trey Lance famously, which was a disaster, and they got bailed out by the Brock Purdy

Speaker 1 pick. But now Mac Jones is behind Purdy in the pecking order in San Francisco.

Speaker 2 I would leave it, I'd ask you this. Like,

Speaker 2 are we bringing in

Speaker 2 Mac Jones to be kind of like if you're like a guy or girl and you like a certain type? They're very certain types. And like,

Speaker 2 is Mac Jones kind of like the next move here for the Niners? Like, are we, are we taking out everything that we've ever done? We're not going to pay Brock Purdy. I think.

Speaker 1 Oh, you mean they're going to let Brock Purdy leave and make Mac Jones the starting?

Speaker 1 I hope that's not the

Speaker 1 reason why I don't think that's going to happen, Mark, is because

Speaker 1 that's a smart organization. And I find, I figure that Kyle probably thinks I could do better with Mac Jones than Belichick could, and certainly what was going down in Jacksonville.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 I also know, based on what we've seen in four years of NFL play, that he's not the prospect I thought he was. That's kind of like what my vibe on it is.
I wouldn't, I know you love the Niners.

Speaker 1 They're kind of like one of your pet teams. I wouldn't be concerned about him being their QB1 when the dust settles here.

Speaker 2 I would just ask, like, is the plan like we're moving on from

Speaker 2 most of our major stars, and then we sign our quarterback to a gigantic contract.

Speaker 2 Or do we get by for a couple years with

Speaker 2 someone else?

Speaker 1 Or I would say this. Your toning and your inflection is weirding me out right now about the 49ers.

Speaker 2 Well, no, or we tell like Brock Purdy, like, we're not going to pay you what you think you should get paid.

Speaker 1 45.

Speaker 1 That's all.

Speaker 1 I think

Speaker 2 Brock Purdy is not going to get like a massive contract. It's like, we're going to give you a lesser contract and you're going to live with that or not.

Speaker 1 We'll see. We'll see how it plays out.

Speaker 1 Everything I feel like we've heard out of San Francisco is not only is Brock Purdy not going anywhere, they're prepared to pay him at a level commensurate with a high-end starter in the NFL.

Speaker 1 And if you're telling me that now they have a backup plan in Mac Jones, if that doesn't take, I would be very surprised. I think Jones is just the QB2 locked in.
But we'll see.

Speaker 1 I mean, 49ers fans on the live chat right now and listening and watching right now are like, Sessler, don't even put that energy out in the air. We are in the Super Bowl.

Speaker 1 I'm more just saying, like, what is it?

Speaker 2 But like, that was my thing from yesterday's show. It's like, what is the plan? Like, are we taking it down to the studs?

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Or are we going to sign a quarterback to a massive contract and remove like everyone around him?

Speaker 1 Yeah, they're in a tough spot. A little weird.

Speaker 1 They had their window. The window closed and now they're trying to figure out how to reopen it.

Speaker 1 The Patriots released longtime starting center David Andrews, a ring of honor type dude on their all-decade team, won two titles and has been a rock for that team.

Speaker 1 Back when Belichick had the juice and had the magic touch, I believe he was an undrafted player who became their starting center in year one

Speaker 1 and became a stalwart for them. And when it would drive people like me crazy, why are the Patriots staying this good for this long? long? It was stuff like David Andrews.

Speaker 1 And when that started to dry up, so too did the Patriots glory.

Speaker 1 In other news, the Panthers rework Adam Thielen's contract. He'll remain with the team in 2025.
That turned into a good signing.

Speaker 1 Total afterthought when Thielen joined the Panthers a couple of years back. Seemed like a washed-up dude, but he's turned into a guy that they can count on, and obviously they like him.

Speaker 1 They also signed running back Rigo Dawdle, Dowdle. That name gives me trouble, formerly of the Cowboys.
And the Chargers bring back

Speaker 1 Mike Williams, the wide receiver, one year up to $6 million back to the Chargers after a fairly calamitous year away from the team.

Speaker 2 You had like a John Lennon year, like when Oko, like when he broke up with Oko Yono, it's like, just went to the Jets and you come back.

Speaker 1 Did you just say Oko Yono?

Speaker 2 Yoko Ono, please. Yeah.

Speaker 2 You know what I mean? Like he just like he went away and then he came back.

Speaker 1 Yes, the Oko Yono years.

Speaker 1 And finally,

Speaker 1 but that's. Why not? Why not bring in Mike Williams and see if he could still play the guitar?

Speaker 1 The Steelers, where Mike Williams, one of the teams he wasted away with last year, have made offers

Speaker 1 to Aaron Rodgers.

Speaker 1 Made an offer to Aaron Rodgers. The delay is not about the money per Jerry Dulock.

Speaker 1 They

Speaker 1 also brought back Mason Rudolph. Pinch me.
Two years, $8 million, $4.5 million guaranteed.

Speaker 1 Mike Garifolo on the Steelers beat also said that the Steelers remain in the mix for Rodgers, but they valued Rudolph and want him as a part of their QB mix no matter what.

Speaker 1 So they locked him down before anyone else could. I can't imagine the market was ferocious for Mason Rudolph, but obviously they have him.

Speaker 1 And this is the perfect time, Ceci,

Speaker 1 to talk to an old friend from the schoolyard who suddenly is having lunch in a different part of the cafeteria.

Speaker 3 O'Doyle rules.

Speaker 2 Thanks a lot, O'Doyle. Nice meeting you.

Speaker 11 Wait till they start with the wedgies.

Speaker 11 Yeah, you ought to start cutting your underwear before you get to school. So it rips easier.

Speaker 2 I see. Who are you guys?

Speaker 11 We're the guys everybody used to pick on before you started here.

Speaker 2 Oh no, they ain't picking on me. They're just giving me a hard time because I'm the new guy, a little first-day hazing.

Speaker 2 Are you in loser denial or something?

Speaker 11 I had a bad case of loser denial myself. Until the lacrosse team stuck a parking cone up my ass.

Speaker 1 Welcome, Dave Damashek. Shek, you're sitting at the table with us right now, the Browns and Jets fans.
How does it feel?

Speaker 5 Well, listen, as one of society's foremost empaths, I know you guys want to talk about the Steelers v.

Speaker 5 Giants QB search, but, you know, manners require a congratulations to Mark Sessler, his favorite football team. Now is the proud possessor of one Kenny Pickett.

Speaker 5 Good for you. Good for you.
Congrats. Enjoy.

Speaker 2 We welcome him.

Speaker 2 I am emotionally distressed myself. So I agree with you.
And

Speaker 2 I don't take it in as a gift per se.

Speaker 5 Don't be surprised if he's under center for you in week one. That may well come to pass.
Although, as I understand it, they almost had Russ, or at least Russ was just there.

Speaker 5 He left without a contract, though.

Speaker 1 They could have received it. Really, he left in a white car.

Speaker 2 We've covered that. Like, he left in a white car.
Like,

Speaker 2 I don't love that for Cleveland or for him.

Speaker 5 Do you like him leaving in a white car or the guy the Steelers are chasing this year in a towel out on the beach pondering his existence?

Speaker 1 I don't think Sierra works in Cleveland.

Speaker 2 Let's, like, I'd say that the city is an issue. Like, she wants to be in metropolitan places.
And, like,

Speaker 2 I like,

Speaker 2 I'm at the point, like, you're, see, you're still dug in, Dave.

Speaker 2 Like, I'm at a place where I'm at a bit of a loss where it's like, I don't,

Speaker 2 what the Browns do cannot control me at this point because they make decisions that are problematic.

Speaker 5 Oh, listen. No, we park our cars in the same garage, Pally.

Speaker 5 The Steelers do not control my, well, they, to a degree, they control my sense of self-worth, but not all of it.

Speaker 5 And the part that I still possess, I'm holding on to, Aaron Rodgers or otherwise, don't get to decide whether or not I'm a Steelers Steelers fan.

Speaker 5 He's going to come and go, and who's going to still be sitting there? Old Dave Damashek, that's who.

Speaker 1 You're going to outlast Aaron Rodgers. That's for sure.
I'll say, Check, that

Speaker 1 as my time with Aaron Rodgers in the last two years has been rough, I noticed, and you're obviously an incredible follow on Twitter, that you've for many years have had your fun at Aaron Rodgers' expense.

Speaker 1 And I guess that's one of the reasons we wanted to catch up with you. Is like,

Speaker 1 where are you at? Like, how, how will this affect you? I know you're saying you'll be okay as a fan.

Speaker 1 He doesn't have that power. But it does feel like that the Steelers kind of

Speaker 1 dropping to their knees in front of Aaron Rodgers and begging for him to join.

Speaker 1 That feels different because I feel like from...

Speaker 1 Till this point, ever since Big Ben got old, the Steelers always felt like they were in control a little bit, even though things didn't work out, whether it was Pickett or Russ or Fields.

Speaker 1 Like, it was like, here's our plan.

Speaker 1 This is the first time I feel like the Steelers are sitting at the table with guys like Mark and myself, where it's like, oh, God, we're kind of panicking a little bit.

Speaker 1 And now let's get this guy in here, even though we kind of know it's probably not the best long-term or short-term plan for the team.

Speaker 5 Well, until

Speaker 5 they sign Nathaniel Hackett, Aaron Rodgers Caddy, to serve as offensive coordinator and/or Alan Lazard is required to be on the active roster.

Speaker 5 The Steelers haven't given everything away just yet, but close enough. We now, our peer group is now the Browns, the Jets, these sorts of teams.
And it makes the group sad.

Speaker 5 Where am I for the record? I don't think this is

Speaker 5 a new,

Speaker 5 the last couple of months. In fact, to me, deja vu all over again from last year.
I think that we've talked about this before.

Speaker 5 Tomlin, when Rothesperger hurt his elbow, determined in that moment with Duck Hodges and the aforementioned Mason Rudolph that I'm going to game the QB league.

Speaker 5 I don't need to have a Hall of Fame level quarterback to win in the NFL. And I'm going to show you all right now.
And to a degree, he revealed his mastery.

Speaker 5 He validated everyone who's had his back in that regard because how many teams, how many coaches, I should say, could get those rosters, Duck Hodges, Mitchell Trubisky and Kenny Pickett and otherwise, to playoffs or playoff adjacent.

Speaker 5 Very few, if any. Belichick and Reed, maybe you want to throw out there, but the list is very short.
So he succeeded, but there is a ceiling on that. What is now,

Speaker 5 what we also now fully understand, or at least should is you ain't winning in the AFC if you think

Speaker 5 it's clear to me that he thought as late as like mid-December 2024 that

Speaker 1 he had a chance of making a Super Bowl run.

Speaker 5 It's one thing for Mike Greenberg to conduct panel conversations safely from New York or wherever he is about, can Russell Wilson take this team to the Super Bowl?

Speaker 5 But if you were watching them game in and game out, obviously that was Pap. That was Hui.
That was applesauce. And yet the head coach of the team seemed to believe that.

Speaker 5 By the other side of it, once they took that second loss in Baltimore in January, it did feel like it come to Jesus. Tomlin kind of got to the podium and said,

Speaker 5 we got to find our quarterback now. No more fussing around.
And now here we are chasing Aaron Rodgers once again. I don't like this any more or maybe less than I didn't like the Russell Wilson thing.

Speaker 5 I don't like, and call me precious or whatever else. I have, as a Steelers fan, I've watched my team.
win multiple Lombardies, be relevant, be a powerhouse for

Speaker 1 almost all of my life.

Speaker 5 There is no need for the desperate flailing about, especially for my head coach who talks all the time about, we don't seek comfort.

Speaker 5 What are you doing other than seeking comfort right now? You know that this doesn't result in a Super Bowl run, right? So then what's the point? Why would you, if you're the Browns or the Jets or

Speaker 5 the Buccaneers a few years ago and you're so desperate, if you're the Vikings and you're willing to

Speaker 5 trade your dignity to bring in a former tormentor to try and bring you a Lombardi, So be it. I get it and I empathize or I sympathize with that.
The Steelers do not need to play that game.

Speaker 5 This is embarrassing stuff to

Speaker 5 be bargain hunting at TJ Maxx for formerly good fashionable QBs who are now out of outmoded.

Speaker 5 It's weird stuff to try to do.

Speaker 5 And like I say,

Speaker 5 the Steelers, the city of Pittsburgh is not about, we're in a position of luxury, relatively speaking.

Speaker 5 Bradshaw, Lambert, Mean Joe, Lemieux, Crosby, Clemente, Pop Star Joe, they were not just black and gold, only black and gold. I'm allowed to hold out hope for that standard to be met.

Speaker 5 Not in the QB league should RQB be a mercenary from some other team who was a legend on that team. We don't have to play that game.
That's for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers to do.

Speaker 5 Come be a mercenary for us. We'll take it.

Speaker 1 If you bring a Lombardy, we're going to love it.

Speaker 5 That's not the position I sit in.

Speaker 2 Go ahead.

Speaker 2 I would ask you this.

Speaker 2 Like, I know you've had some wordplay with Omar Khan, the GM of the Steelers, but

Speaker 2 if you took over the team and you had the next month to reorganize things,

Speaker 2 what would you do? What quarterback would you sign? Like, who, what, what's your plan?

Speaker 5 This will seem extreme, but I think,

Speaker 5 and there's no history that would indicate that this is plausibly going to happen. But you asked the question, I would move heaven and earth to go all the way up and get Cam Ward.

Speaker 5 I would be willing to trade away T.J. Watt if that's what it required to do.
A first and TJ Watt to get Cam Ward deal.

Speaker 5 They have to get, you know, as I say, and obviously anybody who's been paying attention understands at this point, even Mike Tomlin has to understand the reality. And

Speaker 5 I don't think it's ultimately a great spot for the NFL to be. And it's sort of like the NBA

Speaker 5 in where it is now, which is the only chance you have to win is if you abide by a certain approach.

Speaker 5 You must have perimeter shooters who you surround, they pitch it into the low block, pitch it back out,

Speaker 5 and hit the reason. If you can't do that, you can't win the NBA title.
Now, you either have one of the six or eight best quarterbacks, or you have no chance.

Speaker 5 You might be in the play, but you have zero chance of doing anything. That's a little uninspired.

Speaker 5 And then the extra wrinkle with that is, especially if you look back at December and January in the Super Bowl, we have some of the most distinctive talents in the history of people.

Speaker 5 playing pro football right now. And it's all boiled down to basically what we watch when we watch figure skating every four years, which is don't fall down.

Speaker 5 Hey, Lamar, we know you are faster than anyone who's ever been on a football field can run away. That doesn't matter.
Just don't turn the ball over.

Speaker 5 It's uninspired. So that being said, you're nowhere without the QB.
So I would trade up and try to get Cam Ward. And short of that, here's the rub with Tomlin.
I am not knocking him.

Speaker 5 I just complimented his ability without being a QB whisperer to still win more games than you lose in the NFL.

Speaker 5 Mason Rudolph, believe it or not, you can scoff. They would win nine games if they start Mason Rudolph.
They'll win 10 or 11 if Aaron Rodgers is their QB. They will always win eight, nine, 10 games.

Speaker 5 The issue is now, are you going to make some hay in January already or not? Stop providing yourself comfort by taking these little side projects on and lean in.

Speaker 5 Got to go all the way up and get the guy. I do think that that's what they're aligning to try to do is to get right all those compensatory picks in time for 2026.

Speaker 5 The problem is, in the meantime, you're spending one more season in the twilight of Cam Hayward and T.J. Watts' careers.

Speaker 1 Yes. And I think that that's at some point, and I do agree, they make a lot of sense as a team to be aggressive and go get a young quarterback and really, for the first time in a long time,

Speaker 1 be building something up. But there's some risk there, right? Because you got to be willing to maybe not go nine and eight or 10 and seven.

Speaker 1 When are they going to just take their medicine and get out of this middle class?

Speaker 1 They're parked in this like cul-de-sac of mediocrity, and it's like elite mediocrity, but it's still mediocrity. And I don't, the Rodgers doesn't solve that.
Russell Wilson doesn't solve that.

Speaker 1 The only way to really solve that, I think, is to do something bigger. And I think that's the frustration around the Steelers right now.

Speaker 1 And I'm sure for Steelers fans that you're just kind of like hanging out there. And

Speaker 1 how do you get that?

Speaker 5 Yeah, you know.

Speaker 2 I want to ask it this way. Are the Steelers

Speaker 2 the AFC's version of the Dallas Cowboys?

Speaker 1 By the way, I got to say, Sheck, Sessler, can you tell by his face? He loves this whole conversation. No, I don't, because

Speaker 1 you're dangling on the end of the Fisher rod here, and you're struggling, and the Steelers are in this weird place, and Ceci, the Browns fan, is loving it. He's loving it.

Speaker 5 I've been, frankly, a little disappointed in my so-called friends from across football awareness.

Speaker 5 This isn't just about Sessler, who've hit me up to say, I am really rooting hard for Rodgers to wind up on your Steeler so I can laugh all season long.

Speaker 1 Thank you, everybody out there. Stop reading that to you or to know.

Speaker 1 It would be funny. I think it would be funny.

Speaker 2 Are you the AFC's Cowboys?

Speaker 5 No, they're in a better spot at the only position that really matters. So, no,

Speaker 5 they're not in that boat. And the thing that's weird is like, they got to get out of this purgatory.

Speaker 5 But then if you start floating names into it, like Mason Rudolph or Danny Dimes is a, for instance, here's the thing with Danny Dimes, like in a vacuum, if you like, they'd win eight or nine games if they had Danny Dimes on that team.

Speaker 5 And then you're officially seduced. Like maybe they should just do that then.
Why, why go bigger than that if you can get to that level with that kind of quarterback?

Speaker 5 That's how you get into this endless cycle of like,

Speaker 5 how we're never going to be able to go three and 14 anyway. So we have to aspire to the playoffs.
And, you know, rightly, that's, I mean, you know,

Speaker 5 the NFL is an always foot on the gas league. That step back thing is, is talk about

Speaker 5 a questionable strategy.

Speaker 5 There you have it. I mean, how many times have teams tanked and come out on the other side? Arch Manning, for all we know, is going to go back to college in 2026.
And then what?

Speaker 5 Everybody, oh, just tank so you get Arch.

Speaker 5 Do that.

Speaker 5 How do you know Arch Manning is even going to be eligible for the draft? And you don't know how he's going to play this college football season.

Speaker 5 So you don't know what his standing is going to be by the time we're in this same spot one year from now.

Speaker 5 Go for it now, like the Rams did.

Speaker 5 Are they ruined because they went all in and gave up all those draft picks and traded away their former first overall pick who they paid, which was a bad mistake to pay him, but then they traded him away for another guy, but they had no draft picks for five years.

Speaker 5 Well, they're ruined. They made a deal with the devil.
That's it. Hope they enjoyed that Lombardi because we're never going to hear from them again.
They almost beat the Eagles.

Speaker 5 One more throw from Stafford a couple of months ago, and the Eagles ain't no world champs anymore. So, listen, obviously,

Speaker 5 and the commies show us also this thing about like they're too far away. A quarterback, you don't reach for a quarterback when you're when your roster is in that state.

Speaker 5 Who was more of a punchline than the commies were last year? Jaden Daniels arrives. Voila, we're contenders.
What else do you need to know?

Speaker 2 Dan, one thing I'd ask, because so Dave, last time you were on our show, like you saw, like you used the camera and you moved around, there was like

Speaker 2 stuff all over the place, like piles of stuff. And then the camera went out, but like, is the room more organized at this point? Are we?

Speaker 5 I don't recall the state that you last saw it in. I've got a Bob Knight basket.
Let's see, Indiana University, tournament-bound. Strange, strange.
Hit Panthers, not tournament-bound.

Speaker 5 is, by the way, these people who keep coming at me like, you don't like Aaron Rodgers because of politics. Like, what are his politics?

Speaker 5 I don't even know what his, I, I sincerely think that's a good idea.

Speaker 1 I never got the vibe check that it's a politics thing with you as much as you just think he's a jackass. And that's

Speaker 1 like a pop of stick.

Speaker 5 Right. He comports himself like a troll might, someone who might slip into your

Speaker 1 PMs on me.

Speaker 5 I have no idea what position he holds on almost anything besides one issue that he won't shut up about.

Speaker 1 That's it.

Speaker 5 What I care about is that he tried to destroy the Green Bay Packers on his way out the door, failed, went to the Jets, and succeeded in destroying that team. That's the guy you want, right?

Speaker 1 Well, we were already destroyed, but that's beside the point. He just didn't fix us.
And

Speaker 1 I hope, however it turns out, Check, you end up being.

Speaker 1 I mean, it's weird, like,

Speaker 1 to how much how much can Jets fans, Browns fans feel for Steelers fans in this situation but uh you know the idea that you're waiting or Steelers fans are waiting for the smoke to come up from the chimney whether Aaron chooses you or not it's like bro you ain't Aaron Rodgers anymore you are technically Aaron Rodgers but you're not that guy

Speaker 1 so I wish we weren't covering him that way but here most of our episodes Rodgers has dotted it so he's the trampy one on sex in the city in in the in the late which one was that like that feels like a like oh everybody in the beloved was kim cottrell whatever her case.

Speaker 1 Kim Cottrell. Oh, and from the rest of the what were the rest were not what they were puritanists.

Speaker 5 We're still positioning her as a sex pot. Like everybody in

Speaker 5 all men in Manhattan are falling all over themselves. She's a 57-year-old.

Speaker 1 You're a sexual icon. Do you think, do you agree? Last thing, Shaq, we were talking about who are we if we're the golden girls that I said that I'm a total Darthy.
And

Speaker 1 then I said Mark was Estelle Getty. Do you agree with those characterizations?

Speaker 5 No, I don't want to diminish it. I don't know all the characters' names.

Speaker 5 He's got the petty white thing to him, which is,

Speaker 5 I'm not diminishing you because you're more clever than she is, but you're sweet, ultimately.

Speaker 5 The number one thing I would say about you above all else, a wordsmith and clever and a fascinating conversationalist and everything else. But ultimately,

Speaker 5 your most winsome trait is that you're a sweetheart. You're a sweet to you along.

Speaker 2 And Dan, you tagged me as the oldest, like the especially older woman.

Speaker 1 Well, no,

Speaker 1 you are the Sophia Petrillo. And I think, Shek, maybe you haven't watched a lot of Golden Girls or it's been a while, but or we disagree with you.
Sophia was a good person. Sophia was at her heart.

Speaker 1 She was, you know,

Speaker 1 but she was, you know, she was sassy and sharp and quick-witted.

Speaker 5 What are you? B. Arthur?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I'm B. Arthur.

Speaker 5 You are. Okay.
So then why did you deceive me?

Speaker 1 I would say you were

Speaker 1 probably.

Speaker 5 you're a tough one though to to pin down chef I would say maybe a cross between Rose and Blanche maybe hey let me ask you this sorry to go off the rails here but before we wrap up and last time I was on we talked a little bit of movies and I thought it was it was weird um I was flipping the dial the other night and and um

Speaker 1 uh

Speaker 1 uh

Speaker 5 what's it called uh i can't think of the name of uh uh

Speaker 5 kojak name of the stupid movie indecent proposal Jesus

Speaker 5 is indecent proposals on this is one of the weirder storylines I mean it's it it it it's a compelling one-line pitch elevator pitch or whatever like a um

Speaker 5 you know down on their luck couple meets a millionaire who offers a million Robert Redford I believe

Speaker 2 was it Robert Redford yes

Speaker 5 yeah so

Speaker 5 Woody and Demi, they talk about it, they're like, this is bad. And like Woody's like, no, don't do it.
Don't do it. That would be terrible if you did it.
And of course, he doesn't resist her doing it.

Speaker 5 And she's like, we need the money. I'm going to do it.
So then she lays with him. And it's too much for their relationship, for Woody and Demi.
And they split.

Speaker 5 They break up.

Speaker 5 Then Demi starts betting down with the old man, Bob Redford.

Speaker 1 Starts laying down with him.

Speaker 5 And now she's dating. I think this is maybe the most outrageous thing I've seen in a movie until at the end, then Woody takes her back.

Speaker 1 Gets her back.

Speaker 1 You slide her under the bridge.

Speaker 5 You laid with that multi-millionaire old bag.

Speaker 5 Whatever. Life is long.

Speaker 1 So your question, Dave, is what are thoughts on the Indecent Proposal?

Speaker 1 It was a little far-fetched,

Speaker 1 but I quite enjoyed the Demi performance in it. Much more than the substance.
I'll say that.

Speaker 5 Okay, I think I know what you're saying.

Speaker 2 Are you saying, Dave, that like,

Speaker 2 because I think my issue...

Speaker 1 I'd have had a VHS copy of some of the scenes from Indecent Proposal.

Speaker 2 My issue would be like if you're Woody, you don't move on.

Speaker 5 You move to addiction. You've got a sex edition? You got a problem with sex?

Speaker 5 You're addicted to sex? You move

Speaker 2 a new county, a new country, a new world. Like, you don't take her back.
Like, I'm with you. That's what you're saying.

Speaker 1 All right.

Speaker 5 I mean, you have some deep emotional problems if the man who paid you a million dollars and destroyed your marriage in the process

Speaker 5 courts you and you're like, nah, okay.

Speaker 5 All right. Let's do this thing.
Like, it's at minimum, a lot of range, lady. You're with the poor artist, the poor architect in the one bedroom, but then, but then you get the

Speaker 5 taste of the high life, and now you're gone out the door, even though he's even though he's he's 30 years your senior. What are you, Belichick's girlfriend now?

Speaker 2 I think Dave and I like can enjoy complex lifestyles, and like I think we agree

Speaker 2 on multiple fronts.

Speaker 1 Well said.

Speaker 1 Dave, thank you so much. Make sure you check out the iconic Dave Damashek on the Shek show.

Speaker 1 Get him wherever, wherever you get your

Speaker 1 podcasts, also on YouTube.

Speaker 5 Good deep dive on Aaron Rodgers today, everybody. I'm Shek.
Go check it out.

Speaker 1 Unbelievable. Check it out.
All right. Thanks, Shek.

Speaker 1 And that takes us to the end, Mark. Oh, so great.
Whenever we could talk with Shek,

Speaker 1 just a legend.

Speaker 2 It's easy. It's fun.

Speaker 1 It's easy. It's fun.
We want to thank everyone who has followed along all week on this live chat. We did.
What do we do? We did shows from Sunday.

Speaker 1 Well, we did live shows Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday.

Speaker 1 And you guys, big numbers in the live chat. We appreciate you all.
And

Speaker 1 Mark, just want to let you know, this is a big honor. It does put you on the radar in ways that might be problematic, but I'm sure you might take the trade-off because any publicity is good publicity.

Speaker 1 You have indeed made the cover of Alien Weekly. Congratulations.
Look at that. Unbelievable.
Sessler steps out. I don't care who knows.

Speaker 2 I can appreciate it.

Speaker 2 I don't know who's putting it in.

Speaker 1 Look at this magazine. You got to check it on YouTube if you're listening.
Universe domination. These are the other aspects of this magazine's edition.
Another planet is ours.

Speaker 1 Is your human family suspicious? Best places to live for hidden aliens. And then Mark on the cover.
What a moment.

Speaker 2 I think the human family suspicious angle is probably where I'm kind of shoehorning myself into this publication on some level. So, yes.

Speaker 1 Thank you. Thank you to Arie Hassan.
Thank you to Dave Damashek. And yes, once more, thank you to you, the listeners and the viewers.
And we are getting very close, by the way,

Speaker 1 to 20,000 subscribers on YouTube. So if you can,

Speaker 1 whether you're watching live right now or you're watching later or listening later, head over to youtube.com,

Speaker 1 find Heed the Call and bang that subscribe button. Get us to 20K.
You know where we want to go. This is just the beginning.
We love you. And until next time, Mark, any final words?

Speaker 2 It is truly... an honor to do these shows with you and Justin and all the rest of the people.
I never knew I'd be here, but I'm very happy. I just say that.
It's a real actual emotion for me.

Speaker 2 Thank you.

Speaker 1 Eat the call. Yeah.

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