NFL Wild Card Weekend Recap!!

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Speaker 4 The Heed the Call Podcast.

Speaker 2 Just finished reading Inner Excellence.

Speaker 4 Any questions?

Speaker 4 So many.

Speaker 2 So many. How does one become excellent on the inside?

Speaker 2 This is not right now. Welcome to Heed the Call.

Speaker 2 The wild card round recap. Or most of it.
Dan Hans is here with Mark Sessler,

Speaker 2 Justin Graver, and from the city of Brotherly Love, Connor. Or, what's up, heroes? Let's get into it.
Playoff football, baby.

Speaker 9 Super wild card weekend no more. It's just wild card weekend now.
So I, you know, I was a little concerned about removing the moniker, but I think it ended.

Speaker 2 Well, I think we should go the other way because we used to, at the old place, rage against the machine about how stupid adding the super was.

Speaker 2 Now that they've taken it away, I say we bring it back.

Speaker 4 It's already over, basically, but yeah.

Speaker 2 Connor in Philly covered the Eagles Packers game, which we're going to get to in just a little bit.

Speaker 2 And also, we mentioned, you know, everybody's talking about that inner excellence book that A.J. Brown read.
We're going to get into that because, you know, Connor all over the beat.

Speaker 2 I'll just leave it at that.

Speaker 4 I'm just going to.

Speaker 2 When we, I mean, this, you know, we're recording shortly after the final game was played. Connor literally covered the football game, already has a column up about A.J.

Speaker 2 Brown, conversations with him about the book and how it wove into the state of the Eagles, and had a conversation with the goddamn author.

Speaker 4 This is all, it's already happened.

Speaker 9 A dog injourno.

Speaker 2 Absolutely.

Speaker 10 It's what I love to do.

Speaker 2 Like the dog ears of the copy of Inner Excellence.

Speaker 2 Hmm, that was nice. All right.

Speaker 4 Now, let us do this.

Speaker 2 Let us do this. No time to mess around.
It's playoff football. Five games were played on Saturday and Sunday.
Let's start with the game, really the only game that provided drama in the back end.

Speaker 2 So, to Tampa we go. Sestog, get us going, baby.
Hit the queue.

Speaker 2 You got to hit the queue. Playoff.
Playoff football, baby. He's novice.

Speaker 9 You want a true wild card? A team with an unknowable ceiling? Say hello to the Commanders as Jaden Daniels escapes fate, skirting away from Kalija Cancy.

Speaker 9 With the final seconds dripping away, Daniels does it again. First down.
Zayn Gonzalez playing with his hair and his helmet. Doing sin the game winner seconds later.

Speaker 9 Washington's first playoff siege since 2005. Dan Quinn told society, we're going for it tonight.
Ultra aggression. Five times they dial up plays on fourth down.

Speaker 9 They're putting Daniels and Marcus Mariota into the formation together. Daimi Brown is suddenly a John Taylor-like god.
Bobby Wagner as well.

Speaker 9 And very suddenly, Baker Mayfield and a Bucks team filled with heroic types themselves, such as bowling ball, Bucky Irvin, and massive-shaped human Vita Vea. They're flushed into nothingness.

Speaker 9 Baker never had a final drive. The game itself saves a wild card weekend that was largely prosaic until Jaden Daniels made it clear: I can beat anyone.
We can beat anyone.

Speaker 9 Nobody knows what will become of us. Commanders 23, Bucks 20.

Speaker 2 Nice job, Sess Dog. And yeah,

Speaker 2 we're going to stay positive on this. It is as a football fan and just as an observer of the two teams without a fan leaning, just because I love Baker and the drama he inherently brings to the sport.

Speaker 2 He just has such a sense of the moment. You want to get him.
You want to get him back on the field

Speaker 2 in that final minute. But credit to Washington, who really did such a tremendous job seizing the moment and and capitalizing, Mark, on the

Speaker 2 really killer mistakes, and we'll get into them that Tampa Bay made in key spots in this game. And yeah, that play by Jaden Daniels, it looked like he was dead to rights.

Speaker 2 It looked like it was going to be a disaster, and Chris Collinsworth's head was going to explode celebrating Kalija Cancey for shooting the gap and making a huge play to give that Bucs offense a chance.

Speaker 2 But no, I think there's going to be nightmares, Mark, for Kalija Cancey for the next days, weeks, months, and maybe even years where he falls short in various life situations and he looks down and all he's holding is Jaden Daniels' towel.

Speaker 9 Yeah, I mean, it's one of those moments as an athlete, but as fans and observers, like you just, you would never forget it.

Speaker 9 And you kind of like lost in the shuffle was that this Bucks defense with a banged up secondary.

Speaker 9 I thought they played with total courage and fire, like the goal line stand that seconds later, Baker Mayfield's biggest mistake happens and they give the the ball right back.

Speaker 9 But it was these little moments because Baker Mayfield's been tremendous this season, but these, you know, the botched snap late in this game between him and you know, there were these little moments where Baker got in his own way and it came down to that.

Speaker 9 And I think that the Commanders are a brand with Jaden Daniels. It's just like you trust that they're going to find a way at the end to forge their situation.

Speaker 9 take the clock away, get a chance to kick the field goal, and the Bucks are gone. And it's like, I'm not sure like how you're getting a rookie quarterback playing with this serenity and calm.

Speaker 9 He's reading that book we're talking about. Like he's doing all this stuff and you just kind of believe that the commanders could do this against anyone.

Speaker 9 Like there just doesn't matter what situation they get themselves into. They find a way at the end.
It's happened over and over.

Speaker 10 I'm dying to know.

Speaker 10 I mean, you mentioned the Baker miscue at the end, the gutting sort of, whatever that was.

Speaker 2 Was it Baker's miscue? Or was it on the center?

Speaker 9 It was a center snapped the ball before anyone was.

Speaker 2 It seemed like the whole team wasn't ready for it. It wasn't just the quarterback, you know?

Speaker 10 Yeah, and just like just the story behind that, because

Speaker 10 he's pointing at himself and he's saying, it's my bad. It looked like the guy who was intending to take the handoff didn't even, you know, look like he wasn't expecting to get a handoff.

Speaker 10 Was it supposed to be a fake? Was there supposed to be some sort of an action drawn off of it?

Speaker 10 And, you know, that's one of those things where it's just, you know, when pressure compounds late in a game like that, you can tell that a team team is just not right. It's not itself, you know.

Speaker 2 Yeah, and

Speaker 2 there was this pivotal moment in the game, and you mentioned, Mark, that Dan Quinn and the Commanders were aggressive all game, understanding that, you know, on the road, in this spot, they had to be to get out of Tampa with a win where they decide to go for it on fourth down.

Speaker 2 It was fourth in goal at the Tampa Bay 3, 1405 to play in the game, and they come up short.

Speaker 2 And they actually kind of, depending on who you talk to, but the rules analyst for NBC said that should have been penalized as a PI or defensive holding. It wasn't.

Speaker 2 So they turned the ball over on downs. And yeah, there were two massive mistakes that the Bucs made in the game.
We talked about the mistiming between the snap between

Speaker 2 Baker and his center, but to get the ball back after that dramatic fourth-down stop, and then on the fourth play of the ensuing drive, there was the fumble recovered by Bobby Wagner. That is,

Speaker 2 those are mistakes that you just didn't see. You just didn't see the Bucs make in pressure moments during the season.

Speaker 2 And again, we don't know who it was on and who it's not, but between that and the miscommunication at the end of the game that led to them settling for the field goal, these are the mistakes that cost you in the playoffs.

Speaker 9 I mean, you know, you get a game from Mike Evans where just the duel between Mike Evans and Marshawn Lattimore, which was a huge portion of this, is lost in the shuffle too.

Speaker 9 But, I mean, the Bucs, to me,

Speaker 9 they're the team I'm sad to see go. I really am.

Speaker 9 Someone like Bucky Irvin and just the way that they operated, there's a lot of really interesting,

Speaker 9 fascinating players on that team. And like, this was the game that no matter who lost, I'd kind of be sad to see what would happen with them next week.
But

Speaker 9 Baker Mayfield did lead the league in interceptions, too. And he had 41 touchdowns, which was second most in the league.
But

Speaker 9 you do get the, I mean, just as a Browns fan, I remember those little moments with Baker where he'd get in his own way, and it's like,

Speaker 9 it's a tough guy to watch lose tonight because it was such a special season for him. And

Speaker 9 I don't know. I have feelings about this game that I don't with the other ones.
It's just different for me. Like, it's hard to watch the Bucs be

Speaker 9 ripped out of the playoffs.

Speaker 10 Especially, too, when you, I mean, you mentioned Mike Evans. Like, that touchdown was ridiculous

Speaker 10 because it's not, you know,

Speaker 10 it's between two people he's fighting off press coverage uh earlier in the drive he had a nice catch on lattimore where he had to fight him off i mean lattimore is the kind of cornerback that you know during a lot of the games during this season teams just stopped throwing at him they just gave up you know and so this you know mike evans was just at his peak i mean coming off the record setting and all that like this is one of those veteran guys that you want to see keep rolling through the playoffs and get another crack at this at some point you know and i think they will i think they will but you know it's one of those situations where it didn't feel like I got ripped off or they gave up a 62-yard field goal at the gun.

Speaker 2 Those

Speaker 2 two key mistakes

Speaker 2 were the difference in a game that was just very tightly played between both games. As we said,

Speaker 2 yeah, it comes down to the field goal as time expires. And Gonzalez hits the upright and it goes through.
So you have the drama of all that. The first playoff win in 6,945 days.

Speaker 2 And it was great to hear a nice job by NBC to get Terry McLaurin after the game because Terry McLaurin has been through the wars and a lot of lost wars for Washington before he's finally

Speaker 2 had an opportunity to thrive on an actual real team. Here's McLaurin after the win.

Speaker 11 Terry, you told me, because you have been through it all, you've been through the turnaround here, that this team knows how to win in the gotta have it moments.

Speaker 7 How?

Speaker 12 Since DQ got here, that's what he spoke about. We have meetings each and every week talking about the gotta have it moments.

Speaker 12 And at some point we're gonna look at each other in the eye and say it's our time. And when we look at each other and say that it really means something.

Speaker 12 And the great thing about it, we've been resilient all year and we've been able to be in these moments, different opportunities, and we've come out on the other side victorious.

Speaker 12 It's because of the guys we have in the locker room. It's because of the work we put in.
It's because of the gotta have it moments.

Speaker 13 And so that's what the playoffs is about.

Speaker 2 Yep, that's what it's about. That's what it's about.
And the commanders, yes, now 13 wins this year, including the playoffs. We'll face the number one seed Detroit Lions in the divisional round.

Speaker 2 So, you know what? I know where you're coming from on this, Mark, that you kind of would like to see another chapter to the Bucs story. But Commanders, they slot in nicely, too.

Speaker 2 The Lions are going to be a heavy favorite in that game, I imagine, but they should be fun, too, because they are in

Speaker 2 house money mode. This is a successful season for them.
And if they can go

Speaker 2 against a Detroit defense, that's leaky, and we're going to get to all that as the week goes on,

Speaker 2 I would not count this team out.

Speaker 2 It sounded and looked like a team with a lot of confidence after that win.

Speaker 9 This all started with that Monday night game that we covered so long ago where they beat the Bengals 38 to 33 and put the Bengals into a blender, and everything changed.

Speaker 9 You could see Terry McLaurin's body language and belief in the team and the organization transforming. I don't want to deal with this team if I'm the Lions.

Speaker 9 This isn't the first team I'd want to deal with next week. I think they're very bizarre.
They truly are a wild card. They're very strange.
And like,

Speaker 9 if you're going to get Dan Quinn coaching this way and making these decisions, because I think that would have been the knock on him, maybe at the tail end of the Falcons journey, like there's just total belief in the quarterback.

Speaker 9 Like anything could happen into Dallas.

Speaker 10 That Dallas game, remember that? He wouldn't go for it on, he wouldn't go for the win, and then they lost in overtime to the Mike McCarthy Cowboys. Yeah.

Speaker 14 Just jumping in to say that the Detroit Lions are favored by eight and a half here as the Lions were just posted.

Speaker 2 Okay, that makes sense, but that won't be an easy cover if Jaden Daniels and the Washington Commanders play at this level next week in Detroit. All right.

Speaker 2 Any other thoughts before we move on in this one, Mark?

Speaker 9 No, I feel like we have a lot to talk about in the coming week regarding this team.

Speaker 2 Nice Baker season, though, Mark. We put a bow on that.
It really was.

Speaker 9 It's been the year of

Speaker 9 rejuvenated quarterbacks that broke our hearts in past seasons.

Speaker 2 Exactly. And we'll see.

Speaker 2 Maybe Sam will join him in Cabo tomorrow. We'll find out.
But for now, it is the Bucs going home, the Commanders advancing. Let's now move on to the next game that was played

Speaker 2 also on Sunday.

Speaker 2 And before we get into this, let's bring in our buddy, a colleague, and another member of the media that was in the house at the link, I think, hanging out with Connor Orr, if I'm not mistaken, James Palmer.

Speaker 4 What's up, buddy?

Speaker 15 Yeah, guys. It was, what was it, Connor? It was an

Speaker 15 access or opinion reunion.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 I know this could be shocking, but for those that do not know or are not aware of access or opinion is, go ahead for the audience.

Speaker 15 You should have heard the number of people that said, man, what happened to your guy's pod while I was getting like chicken fingers at halftime?

Speaker 15 The real number of people was zero because nobody watched or listened to Connor.

Speaker 2 That one's at an unmarked rave in the podcast semester. It was a

Speaker 9 media avalanche. That's how I describe it.

Speaker 15 The best part was when I used to text Connor after episodes, Are you going to promote it? He'd go, Lord, no.

Speaker 4 Me either.

Speaker 10 No, I was working for NFL Network and I said, Hey, can I do this podcast with James? And they were like, No.

Speaker 2 And then the company was like, We'll pay you like 50 bucks a week.

Speaker 10 And I was like, Okay, well, I'm going to do it.

Speaker 10 And

Speaker 15 free freshly food

Speaker 15 that they would send us, which was not very fresh.

Speaker 2 You two gentlemen. And it looks like, James, because you're in Philadelphia, Philly native,

Speaker 2 this has all the trappings of someone in their childhood home, giant dad chair, a frame photo.

Speaker 4 Is that you?

Speaker 15 Me right there and my sister.

Speaker 4 Yeah.

Speaker 15 Well, right back here, I think I'm like. I got to be like eight.

Speaker 2 That looks like there might be a bit of a floral pattern fabric above your blinds, which is definitely a mom move. These are all

Speaker 2 the signs.

Speaker 15 Yes, there's a fire hat up there. Obviously, firefighters is a big part of my family.
So there's a fireman hat up there. My grandfather's, there's a my dad has like 12 lazy boys.
They're like

Speaker 15 he rotates throughout the house in them.

Speaker 15 It's a scene, man.

Speaker 4 You're inside.

Speaker 2 All right, well, listen, you're comfortable. We're excited to have you, James, to talk a couple of games here because you were also in Baltimore.

Speaker 2 So

Speaker 2 both these games in a row. Let's do it.

Speaker 2 Connor, take us to Philadelphia, where the Green Bay Packers and Eagles did battle.

Speaker 10 On the sidelines at Lincoln Financial Field on Sunday, A.J.

Speaker 10 Brown thumbed through the pages of a book called Inner Excellence, and inside was valuable advice and insight that brought him peace and calm.

Speaker 10 The book said, Don't stress because Jordan Love is going to throw three picks. The Eagles won't be called for a helmet-to-helmet collision on the opening kickoff, causing a gutting Packers fumble.

Speaker 10 Their kicker will miss a field goal.

Speaker 10 Their offensive line, which set a record for continuity this season, will lose two starters, and 60% of their receiving core will also get hurt at some point in this game.

Speaker 10 It's not going to matter a goddamn thing if Jalen Hurts goes half the game without completing a pass, which he basically did. And with that inner piece, the Eagles moved on to the second round.

Speaker 10 Does it bother anyone? Well, as Lane Johnson put it, quote, not unless you're trying to get a good Yelp review

Speaker 15 I was standing there for that

Speaker 4 it was good

Speaker 2 this was a

Speaker 2 and we'll get into the

Speaker 2 book a bookgate of it all which became the biggest talking point it seemed out of Philadelphia after the game but this is a game James where the Eagles you know pretty much took care of business scoring the games

Speaker 2 10 points first 10 points in the first quarter and and their defense really

Speaker 2 kind of held Jordan Love in check for the entire game. A miserable game for Love, in fact.

Speaker 2 And just, you know, not overly impressive, I thought, the Philly side of it.

Speaker 2 They weren't, I don't think, at their best, but their defense absolutely dominated this matchup and got him to the divisional playoffs.

Speaker 15 Yeah, that's what I would second. The defense was on fire.
I was talking to a couple of coaches after the game, and they're like, our secondary stepped up. They know what Jordan Love can do.

Speaker 15 We've seen him go off in the playoffs playoffs for sure. Three picks.

Speaker 15 Talking to Darius Slay, sorry, misquoted. Talking to Slay after the game.

Speaker 15 He doesn't want you to say that, Darius. I'm talking to Slay after the game.
The Zach Bond interception was like next level.

Speaker 15 Like, even Slay was saying, like, what he did, and if you remember the play, drops off. I forget who's kind of like right there on the other side, kind of like the check down.
That's his guy.

Speaker 15 He knows he has him. He reads love and jumps in front of a ball that was going to go to who Slay was with.

Speaker 15 And Slay thought he was going to have to make a bang-bang play, and Vaughn jumps in front of it. One of the best stories, I think, in the NFL this season is Zach Bond.

Speaker 15 He's playing like a madman, and that he can drop like that, being a former pass rusher, like that he has the ability to play the middle of the field is insane. Now, they do lose Nicobie Dean.

Speaker 15 My understanding is, I don't know when this

Speaker 15 was this podcast, when this podcast comes out,

Speaker 4 this podcast exists.

Speaker 4 Like access or discretion with John Orr and James Balmer.

Speaker 15 The forum is maybe where my issues lie.

Speaker 15 But I believe it's an ACL.

Speaker 15 And so he seems to be done. But yes, the defense is right where it's been for the whole, I don't know, since the bye week in week four or five, whenever that happened.
Defense is there.

Speaker 15 Jalen Carter was a madman again, just drawing holding call after holding call. Nolan Smith was outstanding.

Speaker 15 Slay also called him skinny BG, as in Brandon Graham, skinny Brandon Graham, he called him.

Speaker 15 And so the defense is doing the same thing they've been doing for weeks. Talking to Jordan Mai a lot after the game, he said communication issues, a variety of issues we need to fix on offense.

Speaker 15 I think these all stem to Jalen Hurts being out and the time that he was away.

Speaker 15 Still ran the ball okay against Good Front, but they do believe, talking to a number of people, there's a lot to fix on offense heading into next week.

Speaker 9 It was such a Vic Fangio special.

Speaker 15 At least.

Speaker 9 I think the offense, like, they've got to,

Speaker 9 they survived. I mean, for me, I felt like I was watching the Packers dissemble and fall apart just before your eyes, whether it was like literally you're losing players left and right.

Speaker 9 The offense, which has been really well coached, fell apart. drive by drive.

Speaker 9 And that allows the Eagles to not play their best game and escape an opponent that I think would have been dangerous in a different setting and a different time.

Speaker 9 But like, it is just like that, it was one thing after another for the Packers.

Speaker 15 Like personal fouls and stuff, too.

Speaker 4 Oh, yeah. I was going to say like multiple times.

Speaker 2 I picked the Packers in this game.

Speaker 2 Some of it was just because I want to see the Eagles burn. But I also kept on, I watched the Packers at several points this season and was like, man, this team's kind of got it all when it's cooking.

Speaker 2 But we talked about New Year's resolutions a couple weeks ago.

Speaker 2 A New Year's resolutions around this Packers team is a team like the Packers going forward. They never lifted their game against top competition this year.

Speaker 2 And a team that always falls short against the big dogs, like they're telling you they're not one of the big dogs. And sure enough, they're not a big dog because they're going to Cabo now.

Speaker 2 And to the point, Connor, of... coming up small in this game.
They fumble on literally the first play of the game. And you could argue that, you know, they did recover the fumble, blah, blah, blah.

Speaker 2 But when you get smoked on the first play of the game and cough it up, anything could happen at the bottom of a pile. You miss a 38-yard field goal after drive stalls in the red zone.

Speaker 2 You have a season high in penalty yards. Jordan Love throws three interceptions, as we said.
They just played a shit game, especially on offense.

Speaker 2 The defense actually deserves a lot of credit because I thought they kept them in the game, but the offense flatlined here, and there's no way around it.

Speaker 2 This is a deeply disappointing end to a season that had a lot of promise for Green Bay.

Speaker 10 And for me, I think the way that you can tell is, you know, there are teams like whatever, like Jacksonville at the end of the season where everyone is giving up, right?

Speaker 10 Like the game plan is an exhibit of someone giving up. The players look like they're giving up, whatever.

Speaker 10 The Packers' game plan, actually, like the effort that they went through to try to get Josh Jacobs going against this Eagles defense was unbelievable.

Speaker 10 Like the amount of motion, the amount of movement that they put Josh Jacobs in a million different places. They started him from a million different places.

Speaker 10 They did everything they could to try to get him going. But the way that you can tell the Eagles are simply better is that it just didn't matter.
It wouldn't have mattered what they did.

Speaker 10 Like, Jalen Carter was in the backfield on half these plays. He needed to be triple teamed.
Like, they tried to wall him off on every running play, and they couldn't do it.

Speaker 10 And so, I think it's one of those things where, hey, this is a nice moment for Green Bay because it's like, here's a very clear demarcation between what we're as good as we are and as good as we need to be.

Speaker 10 And this team needs to, it's the youngest team

Speaker 10 in the NFL. I mean, they're going to mature over the offseason, but they need to add.
Like,

Speaker 10 this is a team that needs some pieces in order to contend seriously with the rest of the NFC.

Speaker 15 Yeah, I'll jump in real quick and just say the part that Connor's talking about in terms of where these two teams might be different and where they're at right now, even though Philly didn't play well offensively, what did you see at times?

Speaker 15 There's just so much talent that, like, Dallas Goddard returns and then he triple stiff arms his way down the sideline. And it's just like, oh, he's just better.

Speaker 15 Like, they're just better. They just have dudes.

Speaker 15 I've always had coaches tell me when they've watched the Eagles the last couple of years, like, even when Shane Steichen was running that offense and Jalen was playing really well, it was like, this isn't complicated.

Speaker 15 They just got better dudes. Like, and they're still that.
They just have better players. Like, the line is good.

Speaker 15 And as we talk about in Connor's brilliant open, like, with all the guys that went down for Green Bay, outside of Nicobie Dean, like, going down in this game, like, Philly's been pretty healthy this year.

Speaker 15 And you see a lot of these guys on the line, on the skill spots. You didn't even need Jalen.
You didn't even need A.J. Brown.
He's reading books on the sideline. He had one catch for 10 yards.

Speaker 15 And you barely noticed outside of Connor and I making references to Jim Murphy having just a tremendous Sunday, the author of the

Speaker 2 incredible Sunday for Murph. Yeah, Romeo Dowds goes, he goes out with another head injury, unfortunately, even with the Guardian cap on.

Speaker 2 Reed goes out with a shoulder. Christian Watson tore his ACL the week before, of course.

Speaker 2 And even with those guys in the lineup, something I talked about, Mark, and going into this game, and I still feel that way as you do a little post-mortem on the Packers and why they're not at the level of a top team, is who's the dude in this offense in terms of where Jordan Love is throwing the ball.

Speaker 2 I still think that guy is a missing piece.

Speaker 2 But a lot of criticism is going to come on Jordan Love out of this game.

Speaker 2 And I already saw some of the different stats and the pop the hood stats coming out about what kind of pocket passer he actually is.

Speaker 2 I think he's going to start catching heat. You saw it.
Here is his head coach after the game

Speaker 2 defending Jordan Love after an ugly playoff ouster.

Speaker 16 I love Jordan Love and how he competes and the work he puts in. And I think he's going to get better and better and better.
And certainly

Speaker 16 there's some lessons along the way, some tough lessons anytime you end up in defeat. I mean, that's hard to deal with.
but I think you got to be,

Speaker 16 he is very critical of himself,

Speaker 16 and I think he does such a great job of learning from every experience. So I think, you know, through this, I think we'll all be better for it, although it's tough to go through.

Speaker 16 But I think there's going to be a lot of learning over the course of the next, however many months, before next year arrives.

Speaker 9 I think that's fair. I mean, this is a really young quarterback surrounded by a lot of young skilled position players.

Speaker 9 If I want to point to continued optimism for the Packers is that I think all these players can get better and they can learn from this.

Speaker 9 And I think Matt LaFleur, and there are a lot of hand-wringing right now and a lot of Packers fans are very upset.

Speaker 9 And I get it because it's just like so, it's a torture to lose like this final game of the year.

Speaker 9 But I can think of five or six Packers games this year, and especially when they lost Jordan Love, where Matt LaFleur was a difference-making coach. And so I think there's a lot to work with here.

Speaker 9 This is a creative,

Speaker 9 thoughtful, interesting guy who knows how to use his players. And Connor, you pointed to it today.
So it's like, it's a rough and tumble exit. But

Speaker 9 this team has a lot of youth and a lot of hope going forward.

Speaker 9 This isn't the way I look at like, you know, the Steelers or some of these other teams that, you know, fell apart in ugly, grueling fashion.

Speaker 15 I'll make one note on love that I just know from talking to people, and this is the way Matt LaFleur works.

Speaker 15 This is like growth is not linear. He's talking about all these guys getting better, right? There's like these ways that you go through a season as you grow.

Speaker 15 They never stop putting more on Jordan Love. They want him to run the two-minute.
They want him to do more at the line of scrimmage.

Speaker 15 They just keep putting more on him, knowing this is a long-term big picture deal over a course of his career there, to where they want him to get to these other levels where there's going to be parts of a season where he struggles because they keep putting more on his plate as opposed to just having him play the position the same way.

Speaker 15 They want him to take these things to the next level, if that makes sense. And they're going to have those bumps in the road as you're doing that for him.
That's just the way LaFleur coaches.

Speaker 15 And I think it's great in the long term, say four years down the road, loves a whole different player than he was this year because they keep putting more on him the way that they want this offense to grow and grow with him having more on it, an earnest to it.

Speaker 2 And finally, before we move on from this game, let's talk about the inner excellence of it all. It is the book that A.J.
Brown was caught reading, if you want to call it that, on the sideline.

Speaker 2 Very quiet game.

Speaker 2 And yet,

Speaker 2 it is the book reading that made him one of the big stories after the game. Connor, all over the story for SI.
In fact, you even spoke with the author Jim Murphy shortly before today's show.

Speaker 2 Take us through it all.

Speaker 10 Man,

Speaker 10 so

Speaker 10 it is the Amazon, it is the number one bestseller on Amazon right now. I just double-checked.

Speaker 4 Unbelievable.

Speaker 10 So, Jimmy Murphy.

Speaker 4 What a windfall.

Speaker 4 Jim.

Speaker 4 It's amazing.

Speaker 10 So, Jim Murphy right now is in Dallas. He's preparing for an inner excellence retreat.
He does retreats. The book came out in 2020.
And

Speaker 10 he was telling me this amazing story. He used to be a minor league baseball player.
He had to retire due to vision issues. He poured $90,000 of his own money into this book, went into massive debt.

Speaker 10 The book came out.

Speaker 10 People liked it and it was in Barnes Noble, but nobody knew it was there. And so he gave his last $100 away

Speaker 10 and to like a homeless person, a person who needed money or was playing music on the street, whatever it was.

Speaker 10 And a couple weeks later, he gets a call from Henrik Stenson's caddy that says, read the book. I think it's going to change his life.
P.J. Golfer.

Speaker 10 PJ Golfer, he says, come out to Sweden and work with Henrik Stenson. A couple weeks later, Hunter Mahan, after the two of them read books, they won majors, they won FedEx Cups.

Speaker 10 And then he starts working with the CEO of KFC and Taco Bell.

Speaker 4 And the guy's like, this book changed my life.

Speaker 10 And he's like, I sent the book to all my executives. So, like, all this winding path leads to

Speaker 10 Athletes in Action.

Speaker 10 It's a program at the University of Texas. The team chaplain there gives the book to an Eagles player who is a teammate of A.J.
Brown's, who then recommends it to A.J. Brown.
A.J. Brown reads it.

Speaker 10 It changes his life.

Speaker 9 And every game on the sideline, he's reading a goddamn book.

Speaker 4 Like,

Speaker 4 this is unbelievable.

Speaker 15 You know, I love this.

Speaker 2 You lose hands on the book, apparently, James, huh?

Speaker 15 I did.

Speaker 15 It was coarse. It had been weathered.
It's a paperback. It has been on sidelines all over the place.
Yeah, that's me and AJ. I was the last, we were the last two in the locker room.

Speaker 15 And I went over to him, not knowing that my colleague Connor, well, I know he would crush his in-depth reporting with Jim Murphy, but I did say to AJ,

Speaker 15 I said, you know, I tweeted out,

Speaker 15 Jim Murphy did not expect this eventful Sunday. And he's like, and I go, do you think

Speaker 15 a little something might have to go your way? And he was like, you know what, man, I think we might have to give Jim a little more pub, AJ said. And he's like, hey, come here, look at the book.

Speaker 15 And he brought me over. He's like, this is the one I read between drives.
This is the picture that he, I asked if I could take the picture. He's like, I usually read this passage between drives.

Speaker 15 I try to do two books a month. I try to limit my screen time.
I don't want to, I don't like all the screens. And so he tries to do two books a month.
This one stays with him most of the time.

Speaker 15 Now, Jalen Hurts kind kind of tossed him under the proverbial bus in a way when he said, I see him have it, but I never see him reading it,

Speaker 4 which is a bit of a roast.

Speaker 2 You know, I was going to say that, like, he, this is a big win for A.J. Brown, too, because everybody wants to appear to be well-read.

Speaker 2 And it strikes me as the type of guy that's like, that shows up at the bar with a book and he's like sitting at the bar with the beer, like looking around to see if anybody's noticing him reading a book as he's at the bar.

Speaker 9 I feel like you're saying that because I've done that when I've met you.

Speaker 2 You would be someone I think authentically reads a lot in bars, but I think there's a lot of people there that sometimes that's a part of the affect of interesting person in tavern alert. Look at me.

Speaker 2 Is that what AJ was doing? It doesn't matter. It was a huge story in what otherwise was a kind of, you know, a game that I thought did not live up to the hype, but Eagles fans don't care.

Speaker 2 Eagles fans are going to the divisional round of the playoffs and they'll play the winner of Rams Vikings on Monday night. All right.
We got to keep moving, okay?

Speaker 2 Stay here, James, because you are also in Baltimore. Look at you.

Speaker 15 Look at you.

Speaker 4 Did you take the train? What did we do?

Speaker 4 What do you do?

Speaker 15 No, I drove. I drove.
Easy pass. Easy pass.
Drove my RAV4. Well, not my RAV4.
I drove Hertz's RAV4.

Speaker 2 Did you know that

Speaker 2 Connor recently came into a Chrysler?

Speaker 2 I wrote it down somewhere. Hang on.

Speaker 4 2016 Chrysler. John Doyle.
Chrysler?

Speaker 2 Chrysler Town and Country.

Speaker 4 Wow.

Speaker 4 What an automobile.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah.
It really, it truly is.

Speaker 4 Yeah. Drives like a dream.

Speaker 2 Let's take a break and we'll get to what went down in Baltimore.

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Speaker 2 Thanks, Mark. I appreciate that compliment.

Speaker 4 You're welcome.

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Speaker 2 All right, we're back.

Speaker 2 We keep churning through wild card weekend. Up next, we head to

Speaker 2 Baltimore, where the Pittsburgh Steelers on a four-game skid that cost them the north, it could all be forgotten if they could beat the Baltimore Ravens on a four-game winning streak and as the division champions as the postseason began.

Speaker 2 Oh, would things change? I don't know.

Speaker 4 I don't know, Jim.

Speaker 2 Mark?

Speaker 4 Oh, yeah.

Speaker 2 Got the good song, Mark. Go.

Speaker 9 Here we go again. Big old Aunt Tunney rips onto the lawn at 76 miles per hour in her stolen pickup truck.
Up the yard she marches, fleshy and falling out of her tank top and ill-fitting cut-off jeans.

Speaker 9 She arrives wildly onto the porch and grabs drunken niece, Fanny, by her ponytail onto the yellow dead yard.

Speaker 9 I'm going to teach you a lesson, a big old lesson, Aunt Tunny announces, smashing Fanny's pale legs and shoulders and pulling her hair while raining body punches on the dumb youth.

Speaker 9 That's Ravens Steelers. We exit the weekend with the deepest questions we've asked about the Steelers in eons.

Speaker 9 The most expensive defense in the NFL, giving up 299 yards on the ground, dominant, raw, and carved out of stone, the Baltimore Ravens. This was a murder, a death.
Pittsburgh, you were toyed with.

Speaker 9 What comes next? Ravens, 28, Steelers, 14.

Speaker 4 Antony's back. Ant honey.

Speaker 9 Well, just as a, like, I'll say real quick, like, we've previewed this matchup multiple times before.

Speaker 2 I feel like they played 14 times in the last 15 weeks.

Speaker 9 It feels that way, but to me, it's just like two kind of drunken relatives who are just beating each other up in a yard. And that's how I see it.

Speaker 2 I could see the Pittsburgh Steelers as being drunk and flailing, but the Ravens looked sober and in command to me. Like, this was the most dominant 28-14 win in the history of pro football.

Speaker 2 It felt like 50-3.

Speaker 2 And, like,

Speaker 2 Mark, I think the Ravens as a team that always was dangerous this year, even when they were 0-2 way back when you knew that they were dangerous, but they seemed flawed and they seemed like they could be a team that could be picked off at any time.

Speaker 2 And at times, they were this year. But now they just seem like a tank.

Speaker 2 And we know, obviously, Lamar Jackson and how special he is, but how the defenses figured things out now on our and you know another Are You Kidding Me scenario scenario um with their DC Zach or but also on top of everything else and on top of Lamar on top of the defense finding its way Derrick Henry on Saturday ran the ball like he was 24 years old I can't remember seeing him look so spry I'm sorry Justin complete nightmare fuel for the rest of the NFL

Speaker 9 I mean it really was and it they opened up on their first four marches touchdown drives of 13 13 and nine plays and dominant and we talked about about it on Thursday: that like, if you're Baltimore, you want to come out and make a statement right away, and they're up 21-0.

Speaker 9 And I look, you can go look at the final score, but like the dominance and the sheer yardage dominance, and the fact that Pittsburgh's offense never awoke in the final month of this season.

Speaker 9 And there's a lot of Pittsburgh to this as well. But Baltimore took care of business.
And I thought, you know, you don't have Zay Flowers.

Speaker 9 And so it was a big game for Todd Muncin after the way they fell apart in the playoffs. last year when they got away from their identity.
They used two tight end sets on like 70% of their snaps.

Speaker 9 They brought everyone else into the mix to make up for the fact that their speedster was gone.

Speaker 9 And I thought it was such an impressive strategic win for Baltimore with an absolute show of force and power.

Speaker 9 James?

Speaker 15 Yeah. I'm going back to two relatives fighting in the yard because part of me feels like one of the relatives in this fight was drinking like club soda and limes.
Right, right.

Speaker 2 Let the other one get it.

Speaker 4 Yeah. And then that's why people want to get mad at him

Speaker 2 when it was like, oh, no, you can't beat up somebody that's a drunk. He's like, no, I was drinking too, but no.

Speaker 15 I was totally drinking too. Bow.
Just laid him out. And that was

Speaker 15 the stat that I tweeted out in the first half watching this in the press box was like,

Speaker 15 the Ravens had more first downs in the first half, 18, than the Steelers ran offensive plays, 17, which is, to me, just unbelievable to accomplish that in a half.

Speaker 15 Now, what they were able to do to me, you mentioned Todd Muncin. When I talk to defensive coordinators around the league, it's this.

Speaker 15 I don't know if there's a harder team to prepare for during the week than the Ravens because there's so many different things they can do.

Speaker 15 And Shameless Plug on the show 89 with me and my man Steve Smith, who was also there. We had a tremendous dinner at a sushi restaurant where all the Zealers were eating.

Speaker 15 That didn't help them the night before. But

Speaker 2 by the way, the shameless plug is not just the book. It's also that you had dinner with Steve Smith, who probably doesn't say yes to everyone for dinners either.

Speaker 4 It's the double plug himself.

Speaker 15 Well, we walked from our hotel to the hotel next to us where the sushi was, and this guy goes, Steve, can I get an autograph? He goes, Absolutely not.

Speaker 15 And the next guy goes, next guy goes, Steve, can I get a picture? He goes, I do not do that. So,

Speaker 15 what I'm thinking, and I was like,

Speaker 15 he just went right back into our conversation. That is.

Speaker 4 As we were walking.

Speaker 2 That's the most interesting thing I've heard Wild Card Weekend. So if you have that mindset that you could just do it.

Speaker 2 So you're saying these were just people, fans that came up to him, but he has it. He has a

Speaker 15 no, he does this with everybody. He will take pictures.
That's the one thing Steve does. I will take a picture with you,

Speaker 15 but I don't sign. He doesn't sign.

Speaker 15 So that was his thing. But anyway,

Speaker 15 they're so difficult and so multiple to defend and try to figure out how they're going to attack you that week. We saw what? Like they let the ends crash like crazy, and Lamar just kept holding it.

Speaker 15 You knew that TJ Watts' assignment was Derrick Henry. You could see that early on.
And they just kept running that read over and over again. And TJ Watt ends up with an empty stat sheet for the game.

Speaker 15 Like nothing. And so

Speaker 15 the way that Todd Monkey can mix it up, I think this was like as equally as impressive as Aaron Glenn's performance in week 18 for people looking for a head coaching candidate.

Speaker 15 But also to do it without Say Flowers, the reason I did the 89 plug is we did an entire episode, and Steve was brilliant in this, about how Zay's usage frees everything up else up in how Derrick Henry is used, how Isaiah Likely is used, how Mark Andrews is used, all because of how they use Zay in a variety of ways to move the second portions of defenses.

Speaker 15 It was an awesome show of film study by Steve, and they didn't even have Zay Flowers in this, and they were able to do this.

Speaker 15 So I think there was a statement to be made, and the other part is this, being in the locker room afterwards,

Speaker 15 Lamar was bouncing around. He took a spin move on an equipment bag and jumped over.
And I'm like, he's ready to play another game right now.

Speaker 15 Like, that's where he's at physically into the postseason right now, as opposed to years past where he was kind of banged up heading into the postseason, right?

Speaker 15 Always kind of limping in a little bit from the season. He's different physically, and you saw that with him.

Speaker 15 I talked to some guys after the game, they're like, he said during the week, I'm not sliding. I'm going to show him I'm going for every yard, and I'm showing him how physical I can be.

Speaker 15 And that was a statement I was told, not just for the Steelers, but for everybody in the postseason.

Speaker 2 Let's check out that Ravens locker room after the win.

Speaker 9 Postseason, postseason franchise rushing record

Speaker 9 186 yards

Speaker 4 who else number 22

Speaker 18 three more man three more believe believe believe one day at a time practice execution slow becomes game reality.

Speaker 2 I feel like we do that every week man.

Speaker 18 Believe stay focused stay locked in everything we need bro.

Speaker 4 That's it bro it.

Speaker 2 Man, that man being on this team is such a difference maker. And speaking of Lamar and Henry, let's listen to Lamar talking about Derrick Henry and who he reminds him of.

Speaker 8 It looked like a movie clip.

Speaker 8 You know, when, like, I'm going to give Cars. You watch the movie Cars? Yeah.
You're a little bit too old to watch Cars, but anyway, for kids.

Speaker 8 I was a kid when I watched kids. I was a kid when I watched Cars.
That's all I'm saying. But,

Speaker 8 you know,

Speaker 8 when Lightning McQueen just flying, flashing past, and then it's like,

Speaker 8 that's how Derek looked. He was running past, and all those guys just, it looked, it looked like a movie, bro.
I'm not going to lie to you. But

Speaker 8 I'd rather be watching it than being on the opposite side of the ball. I know that.

Speaker 2 Lamar is feeling good, Connor.

Speaker 4 Wow.

Speaker 15 Kachow.

Speaker 4 Good for him. Like, this is.

Speaker 10 You know what it is? It's strange, too, because.

Speaker 4 You know, you know.

Speaker 10 We do this every year with Lamar, and I don't think it's necessarily fair for him in particular, but it's like, okay,

Speaker 10 you know,

Speaker 10 you've changed kind of the way that the NFL has played, but now you suck until you win a Super Bowl. And we're in this kind of mold.
But I looked it up after they beat the Steelers on Saturday.

Speaker 10 Lamar Jackson has the same number of playoff wins through the first seven years of his career as Peyton Manning. Like, you know, so

Speaker 2 we're doing okay, right?

Speaker 10 You know, and Lamar actually had a playoff appearance in which he completed more than 50% of his passes sooner than Peyton Manning.

Speaker 10 So, like, you know, these things are going to happen on their own time. They're going to materialize.

Speaker 10 But this is the year that this is probably the first year that I would genuinely be disappointed if he laid an egg in one of the next two games because he feels better and more complete, more fun, more energetic, all that than ever before.

Speaker 2 All right. And before we move out of this game, let's talk a little bit on the Steelers side because it's fair to ask, like, what do the Steelers actually want to be?

Speaker 2 What is the point of their current existence? And at what point does the organization, after the way this season ended,

Speaker 2 you know, start to realize that we're just circling this cul-de-sac?

Speaker 2 And I was trying to, like, what are the Steelers? It's like elite mediocrity.

Speaker 2 And they've been just idling in this cul-de-sac for so long now that you have to wonder what is it going to take to get the organization to make actual change, SESDOG?

Speaker 2 Like, what's it going to take for the Pittsburgh Steelers to say, you know, the idea of this might, I don't know, and if that means does it change with the coach and there's reporting that there's not a change at head coach coming, change a quarterback again, very good chance considering Russell Wilson might be the quarterback version of elite mediocrity.

Speaker 2 But at a certain point, do the Steelers sit down internally inside that building and say, we got to blow this up or make some type of big change or figure something out because we can't keep doing this year after year after year after year.

Speaker 9 Well, right. The mediocrity part of it, it's like

Speaker 4 mediocrity.

Speaker 9 It depends how you view it, though, because like you can say the Steelers

Speaker 9 in a positive way are an extremely well-run, patient organization. Like you look at some of the other teams in the AFC that cannot get out of their own way.

Speaker 9 It's like you wish you could be the Steelers from a certain point of view, but the ceiling and what they've been, especially in the last decade under Mike Tomlin, it's like you're going to keep his winning streak alive in terms of winning seasons, but there seems to be a real cap on greatness, like on where you can really go.

Speaker 9 And it used to be they were knocked out by the Patriots over and over in the playoffs, but now it's like you can't really deal with the Ravens in your own division. And I think the change is Tomlin.

Speaker 9 I don't think they should do that, but I think that's where the real change would have to come.

Speaker 9 Because Mike Tomlin's going to keep doing things a certain way, and he's changed the offensive coordinator.

Speaker 9 And they tried to get a quarterback solution this year, but we all are looking at that a bit sideways. And it's like, I don't, they're never bad enough to go draft a quarterback high.

Speaker 9 And they seem a little allergic to adding major players through free agency. They have the most expensive defense and just got absolutely obliviated.

Speaker 9 So even what their identity has been successful seems to be melting away. And that's when I get concerned about the future for Pittsburgh.

Speaker 9 Your identity is not even who you were in in this ridiculous defeat.

Speaker 15 I have two thoughts.

Speaker 15 The thought on Mike Tomlin, and I'm opening this up, and then I will speak again. This is for anyone to answer.
Is there starting to be a vibe with Mike Tomlin in Pittsburgh, like

Speaker 15 the back end of Andy Reid in Philadelphia?

Speaker 4 Yep.

Speaker 15 Where it's like, he's not a bad coach.

Speaker 15 They're not a bad team. But maybe it's best for everyone if we just, Now, we know it bottomed out in Philly, but I'll just say this, and anybody can answer.
Does it have the same vibe?

Speaker 15 Because there was a lot of success from Andy in Philly, four NFC championships, but never really getting... Does it have that vibe at all?

Speaker 4 It's a good example. It's a very good idea.

Speaker 2 Yeah. I agree.

Speaker 2 And of course,

Speaker 2 you know. The quarterback play is a central part of it also, though.
You had

Speaker 2 old Big Ben.

Speaker 2 You fail with the Kenny Pickett pick. You struggle through the Trubisky or whatever year last year.
Now you get the old Russ year. It's like, yeah.

Speaker 2 And if you pick in the middle of the draft every year and you don't nail a quarterback in free agency or stumble into something,

Speaker 2 they're in a cul-de-sac.

Speaker 15 So that's my second question. I feel like the AFC right now and for the foreseeable future is everyone's playing for four playoff seeds every year.

Speaker 15 You have Lamar, most likely you have Burrow, and you have Mahomes. So if you know what I'm saying, the rest of the conference for the next decade looks like they're playing for four playoff spots.

Speaker 14 And Josh Allen, don't forget.

Speaker 4 And Josh Allen.

Speaker 15 Oh, yeah, Josh Allen. So you're playing for three playoff spots, essentially.
Like,

Speaker 15 it's a tough go. And he's a good coach, and there's a good roster.
There's good pieces there.

Speaker 15 George Pickens is a lunatic, but athletically and what he can do on a football field is up there with almost any receiver in football. Like,

Speaker 15 there's, there's things, but, like,

Speaker 15 that's how, that's how the AFC is going to be for the next eight years,

Speaker 15 three playoff spots, yet you still have C.J. Stroud who can have a year.
You still have Herbert who can have a year.

Speaker 15 Like, I'm just looking at the makeup of the conference and where does Pittsburgh fall into that?

Speaker 2 And those four teams, Mahomes, Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson, Joe Burrow, and the Steelers, where they are at that position, the most important position is so far below that that it is a big difference.

Speaker 2 You mentioned Pickens before we move on because we have to move on.

Speaker 2 You know, the knucklehead wide receivers that cycled through Pittsburgh, unbelievable.

Speaker 2 Here's Pickens, who is, you know, flopped mentally and physically down the stretch for this team, although he did make some plays this weekend.

Speaker 2 Here's his conversation with reporters about the Pittsburgh Steelers offense.

Speaker 2 Enjoy. Yeah, I think it sounds like growth for sure.

Speaker 2 From past, you know, the first year I've been here, just way more groove for sure.

Speaker 2 Does that make you optimistic going forward?

Speaker 4 Uh, nah.

Speaker 9 The steamers in a nutshell, right?

Speaker 4 Nah.

Speaker 2 I also don't, I think my brain struggles with that. He does a little monologue about how he's seen growth for sure.
Are you optimistic? Nah.

Speaker 15 You know why? Because he's thinking about those four quarterbacks. Right.
And he's like, we can grow all we want.

Speaker 4 We don't have one of them.

Speaker 2 All right, let's move on. James, thank you so much, sir.
You deserve a nice good,

Speaker 2 a nice rest in your twin bed, your child's twin bed that you'll be resting in and rejuvenating yourself in.

Speaker 15 So excited. I told you to stay out of my room, mom.

Speaker 4 I'm excited to say that tonight.

Speaker 2 Is there like a

Speaker 2 Delimitri poster on the wall? Anything like that?

Speaker 4 Any remnants of your youth?

Speaker 15 Yeah, there's a big John Lennon poster on the back of my door that's

Speaker 9 refurbished your bedroom to be used for guests and other no, it's a museum for you know, they could charge people to go see James Palmer.

Speaker 15 It's all my trophies,

Speaker 15 yeah, yeah. Third in wrestling or something.

Speaker 15 No, uh, it is my mom does have it, she calls it her office, she doesn't have a job, but she calls it her office, and she does paperwork, she shreds papers in there.

Speaker 2 Actually, I want to know what she's shredding.

Speaker 4 All right, James, have a good evening.

Speaker 15 Thanks, buddy. Love you, boys.

Speaker 2 All right, there he goes. James Palmer, great, as always.
Let's now keep moving. We mentioned Josh Allen.
Let's head to Orchard Park where the Bills took care of business.

Speaker 2 Seeds the playoffs so only the best primetime songs get played as well.

Speaker 2 Bo Nooks.

Speaker 4 Bo Nooks.

Speaker 2 Bo Nicks stood strong in the pocket, kept his eyes downfield. Unaware or unconcerned at fast approaching Dwayne Smoot was hoping to render him a human donut with a helmet through the chest.

Speaker 2 Seconds later, Nix connected with former college teammate Troy Franklin on a 43-yard touchdown pass to temporarily silence the highmark stadium crowd and make everyone think, hmm,

Speaker 2 could the Broncos actually pull this off?

Speaker 2 Ron Howard narration. No, they couldn't.
Josh Allen and company took control of the game from that point onward, scoring every point thereafter in a 31-7 win. Connor.

Speaker 2 Allen was again a master of his craft in this one, nearly perfect. I think he might have had a perfect pass already, in fact.

Speaker 2 but the buffalo defense deserves equal kudos here for taking the air out of the broncos attack after that initial nicks deep strike uh next week bills v ravens no one gets out alive

Speaker 10 and it wasn't just the it wasn't just the touchdown it was the third and eight before that on the first

Speaker 10 where he was getting whacked and he threw it into coverage and you know after the touchdown you're just thinking holy shit like something's going to happen here and if you can take the air out of a place like Highmark, I mean, Buffalo fans are great, but you know, no fan base in modern times is like indifferent to like a little bit of disappointment.

Speaker 10 And you could take the air out of any building. And that momentarily took the air out of that building.
And it was, it was wild to see that.

Speaker 10 I mean, it's an amazing, you know, kudos to Sean Payton for, he's done this with Bo Nix a couple of times.

Speaker 10 I remember when he was struggling earlier in the year, that was that game when he took the ball off of the kickoff instead of deferring and then to try to get Bonix going and a lot of deep shots.

Speaker 10 And he did that in his first playoff game. And I think that's a nice way of saying, like, hey, we believe in you, so just go get it.

Speaker 2 Yeah, and it's not like the Broncos didn't understand what they were up against. Like they aggressively attacked in that first drive.

Speaker 2 They pulled off a very risky, when the game was still very much in doubt, fake punt that they successfully executed.

Speaker 2 But after that play, then it's kind of in a nutshell of Denver just not being at the level of Buffalo. They go three and out after they convert the fake punt that put them into Buffalo territory.

Speaker 2 And in the end, Mark, this was a game that was just as

Speaker 2 considering Denver, they missed a field goal in the final seconds of the first half that would have sent the teams into the tunnel tied.

Speaker 2 But

Speaker 2 from this, really, even before that, you would sense the Bills had

Speaker 2 taken over. And really, then once you came out of the tunnel in the third quarter, Buffalo just completely took over.
The time of possession at the end of this game was outrageous.

Speaker 2 41 minutes and 43 seconds to 1870.

Speaker 9 I don't recall it. I'm trying to think of, like, I would like to just see the next time of possession type of lopsided result like that.

Speaker 9 And to me, that speaks to there was no margin of error for the Broncos, and we all got that. And Sean Payton went full Sean Payton with the aggressive nature early on and the fake punt.

Speaker 9 And I thought that that missed field goal before half was a spiritual arrow to them because they really couldn't even afford to make the tiniest mistake like that.

Speaker 9 And I thought their defense, which has been a really great defense, was exposed in this game as being, I know they've talked about it being a little bit of a

Speaker 9 less sizey front seven. Like there's some quicker types of players here, but they're not massive.
And the Bills running game has become very powerful. James Cook is blooming into a complete star.

Speaker 9 And I thought that they just dominated their offensive line.

Speaker 9 The Bills use six-plus linemen A to Z in this game, all over the place to dominate Denver's front, and it showed, and that's how you get 40-plus minutes of time of possession.

Speaker 9 So I think the Broncos, it was an interesting start, but I'm not surprised by how it wound up with the domination of the line.

Speaker 2 And I got to give credit, Connor, to Buffalo, which even, you know, after giving up a touchdown immediately, what a clean, just kind of a clinic. And that's why I'm so excited.

Speaker 2 Baltimore versus Buffalo. We probably say this every year because there's usually one division matchup that's an absolute corker.

Speaker 2 This one has got to be up there as an all-time in terms of the hype of the Ravens versus the Bills because as great as the Ravens are playing, you watch the Bills today, and this is a team that rolls up 471 yards in eight possessions.

Speaker 2 They commit just three penalties all game. They're facing a fearsome defensive front for the Broncos that led the league in sacks, and they only gave up two sacks.
We mentioned the time of possession.

Speaker 2 Again, they gash you both on the ground and through the air. And Allen's ability, Connor, to just

Speaker 2 he's just

Speaker 2 unstoppable. I mean, that's the word.
It's he, the way his ability to buy time,

Speaker 2 the clinching play where he threw the touchdown past, who was it, dude, Ty Johnson, where he's able to shake free,

Speaker 2 wait out, wait out, wait out, and then throw that dart to the back of the end zone.

Speaker 2 He's just an unbelievable talent, and it's just hard to imagine one of these quarterbacks going home next week, Lamar or Josh Allen, but it's going to happen.

Speaker 10 He took a keeper in this game, I think, on the touchdown drive

Speaker 10 before they went up 10-7.

Speaker 10 And he just knocked a Broncos linebacker like clear, like four yards down the field when he put his shoulder down. And, you know,

Speaker 10 you just, I haven't seen, he's another perfect example.

Speaker 10 I mean, James had talked about this about Lamar, but how many times has Josh Allen gotten into the playoffs with a shoulder issue or an arm issue or there's something that hip it, you know, there's something wrong at this point?

Speaker 10 But he's another one that looks spry in this moment.

Speaker 10 So I think next week it's going to come down to which one of these two teams can do something to one of these quarterbacks that we haven't seen in terms of like spying them with a different body type or a different body size and punishing them for leaving the pocket.

Speaker 10 Can one of these teams get after them? Because Bo Nix's mobility was shut down by

Speaker 10 this Bills defense. And yes, Lamar and Bo are different, but they're both quarterbacks who like to get out of the pocket and use their legs.

Speaker 10 And so both of these teams have shown an ability to stop mobile quarterbacks. So I can't wait for this one.
This one's going to be the creme de la creme next week.

Speaker 2 Is that SI going to send you there? I'm going back to Philly, baby. Okay.

Speaker 15 You can't lose there either.

Speaker 4 Shest Dog.

Speaker 9 I think it's important to see how Matt Milano was used in this game. And that's a big player next week because he was essentially used as a spy against Bo Nix, and Bo Nix is a good running.

Speaker 9 They've compared Bo Nix on some level to like a version of Josh Allen on the ground, and he's not there yet, but Milano has been, you know, has missed a ton of time this year. That matters this week.

Speaker 9 It mattered today, and I think it matters a lot against Lamar Jackson. I really do.
So I think you're Connor, you're right.

Speaker 9 Like, you've got to find a way which of these two quarterbacks can be made uncomfortable.

Speaker 2 There are unstoppable offenses in the league right now. Buffalo is one of them.

Speaker 2 But the team that can combine that with the defense that steps up down the stretch probably ends up hoisting the Lombardi. And so Buffalo completely shutting down Venner.

Speaker 2 And we know Denver, we all kind of predicted this ahead of this game that the Broncos were kind of

Speaker 2 in above their heads on this one. So

Speaker 2 the greater challenges are to come. But the defense stepping up in this game, that was a message.

Speaker 2 And after the game, here's a nice little interaction between Razul Douglas and Ed Oliver in the locker room because, yes, the Bills and their defense have heard that they are the weak link for some time.

Speaker 13 I mean, didn't y'all just, wasn't y'all just talking to Ed the other day about that?

Speaker 19 We can't stop nobody and we can't get off the grass on third down. Wasn't y'all all saying that?

Speaker 13 It wasn't me, but yeah, we got to say that.

Speaker 19 Nah, that was that.

Speaker 4 It wasn't me. Ed.

Speaker 4 Hey, Ed.

Speaker 8 Pull up on me, Ed.

Speaker 8 Pull up on me real quick.

Speaker 19 Nah, nah, nah. That was all y'all.

Speaker 4 Let's see. Let's see what Ed has to say.

Speaker 13 Man, let's see what he got to say.

Speaker 13 And when they were saying when you was interviewing you, they said that

Speaker 13 we couldn't stop nobody on turning down.

Speaker 7 Oh, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 13 Wasn't they telling me about some Russian yards and da-da-da-da-da, and wood-da-woo-doo-woo.

Speaker 9 And I told y'all they wasn't about that. Didn't I tell y'all that?

Speaker 2 Can you cut that, Justin? Da-da-da-da-da. Woo-doo-woo-doo-woo.

Speaker 10 There's no more infuriating moment for a beat reporter when, because I can almost promise you what happened probably like four days ago, someone went up to Ed Oliver and was like, you guys are 29th in the NFL in this category, which is a fact-based statement.

Speaker 10 And I'm just wondering why that happened.

Speaker 10 This is why we have locker room access. And then two days later, they happen to play a good game.
And then it's just like, no one believed in us. And it's like, it's not that no one believed in you.

Speaker 10 It's that the goddamn numbers that track all these things led us to ask you why you're so bad at this.

Speaker 4 But congratulations.

Speaker 2 I kind of, Mark, I kind of sense pre-town and country ore coming out just.

Speaker 2 Yeah, you can feel it.

Speaker 9 It's late at night on the East Coast. I understand it, but you can feel it, yeah.

Speaker 2 All right. So, yes, the Buffalo Bills, Baltimore Ravens next week, and Denver Broncos, hold your head up high.

Speaker 2 That was a great building block season, and interesting to see if they add a couple pieces where they fit in the AFC picture

Speaker 2 to James's point. Like,

Speaker 2 if the Broncos take a step up

Speaker 2 in the next year, it could get even more difficult for the have-nots of the American Football Conference. More good news for the Jets and Browns and Titans, guys.

Speaker 2 All right, let's take a break and then we'll finish out the wild card recap.

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Speaker 2 All right, we are back. All right, one more game to talk about.
It was actually the first game that was played in Super Wild Card Weekend. Gotcha.

Speaker 15 Gotcha.

Speaker 9 It is Super Card Card. Well done.

Speaker 2 Super Wild Card Weekend. Anyway, here we go.
To

Speaker 2 NRG Stadium.

Speaker 2 Sports comma, man. For For an hour,

Speaker 2 it appeared as if the Texans would go out of the playoffs as quietly as so many doubters had predicted for weeks. The offense stuck in mud, the defense barely holding its ground.

Speaker 2 But an errant snap that seemed to guarantee disaster for Houston ended up being the play that changed the game.

Speaker 2 CJ Stroud scooped up the ball, scrambled away from a rush, and then spotted Nico Collins for a huge gain over the middle. That broken play fixed the Texans.
Sports comma, man.

Speaker 2 They ended up completing a 98-yard drive there, and then they dominate the rest of of the way on both sides of the ball in a 32-12 thumping of the Chargers.

Speaker 2 Yeah, the Chargers, man. We can't.

Speaker 4 They're still the Chargers.

Speaker 2 The Texans know they're the uninvited guest in this AFC superpower party. I'm guessing they don't care, Connor.

Speaker 4 You know,

Speaker 4 I...

Speaker 2 This one really surprised me. It really did.
I thought the Chargers were built different under Harbaugh. I thought this was a good matchup for the Chargers.

Speaker 2 And through one quarter of play, as I just laid out in the the intro, it played out exactly that way. And then it all went to hell for one side and it all went to heaven for the other.

Speaker 10 It was funny because the Chargers are, and, you know, I think everyone can realize that we don't direct our content towards teams that more people care about.

Speaker 10 But when you write a Chargers column, sometimes you hit send and you're like, no one's going to read this. Like, the Chargers don't have real fans.
And so

Speaker 10 when I was writing off of this game, you know, I went and I re-watched all of Herbert's interceptions, right? And I came to the conclusion personally that this wasn't really a meltdown.

Speaker 10 It's just like, you know, one of them goes through Will Disley's hands. The one is at the end of the game.

Speaker 10 So you cross that one out because he's not going to throw at Derrick Stingley in that way if the game is tight.

Speaker 10 And then the first one to Quentin Johnson, like, okay, Quentin Johnson is 6'5 and 220, and the defensive back is 30 pounds less and five inches shorter.

Speaker 10 You should be able to body him and get that ball. Now, in Quentin Johnson's defense, some people,

Speaker 10 you know, football people push back on that. I'll accept

Speaker 10 that there's a right or a wrong there. But, you know, I feel like this was just the hard cap limitation of what the Chargers have.

Speaker 10 Like, if Justin Herbert had a real number, you know, Lad McConkey's good, but like, you know, if he had a Jamar Chase or like one of these Malik neighbors, like a guy like that that can rip balls out of the air, like they're winning this game by two touchdowns

Speaker 9 mark I'm with you I I think it kind of showed where the Chargers have a lot of work to do Lad McConkey has nine catches for 197 yards no one else on the team accounts for more than 16 yards through the air and and if anything what we thought the chargers were going to be and I picked them to go to the AFC title game but it was in this world where I thought you're going to get a Greg Roman ground game paired with Jim Harbaugh and Justin Herbert where like the ground game by January is punishing people.

Speaker 9 And that's just simply not been the case. And I, you know, it was an atypical performance by Justin Herbert because he accounted for, what, three interceptions all year?

Speaker 9 And they had been in anything a very efficient passing offense and they were growing more dangerous. And one of those picks was like it was he's throwing across the entire field.

Speaker 9 And even Harbaugh, who stuck up for Herbert, said, like, the way we design that is that he should be on the other side side of the field throwing up a lane almost.

Speaker 9 So it was not a typical Justin Herbert game from the neck up, and they seemed to really disrupt them.

Speaker 9 And I can't explain this one entirely because I put the Texans in the same category as the Steelers to some degree. And instead,

Speaker 9 they're young pass rushers. I mean, they were dominant.

Speaker 9 Will Anderson and Danieil Hunter just dominated them. And the Chargers' offensive line played one of their worst games of the season.

Speaker 2 It was a nightmare

Speaker 2 Herbert game. And yeah, the O-line did not help him.
Herbert, after the game, he took all the blame as a franchise quarterback should, said he let the team down.

Speaker 2 But as you mentioned, Jim Harbaugh, which has been kind of a running subplot, and he's always done this, Harbaugh, if you've followed his career, he will talk up his quarterback like he is Joe Montana crossed with Tom Brady, crossed with Randall Cunningham.

Speaker 2 And he certainly has done that with Herbert. And at this kind of low point in Herbert's career, Harbaugh was asked, How do you think Justin Herbert played in this game?

Speaker 2 Like he always does.

Speaker 2 Complete beast.

Speaker 2 He's got to be able to finish a throwing motion.

Speaker 2 Quarterback's got to be able to do that. And

Speaker 2 we didn't put him in the position to do that enough.

Speaker 2 So you put it on the line.

Speaker 2 Yeah, at a certain point, sometimes

Speaker 2 you get the coach always defending the quarterback.

Speaker 2 But when you say that, you totally take Herbert off the hook, who threw some bad passes in this game, and you put everything on the five guys that were blocking in front of him or not blocking in front of him in this game.

Speaker 2 If you take this game and you take the meltdown against Jacksonville a couple years ago, his numbers are not great.

Speaker 2 And I'll just say it because sometimes it feels like Herbert, and I've been hot and cold personally with him, but sometimes it feels like he gets a little bit of a free pass.

Speaker 2 And Jim Harbaugh is, you know, kind of feeding into that a little bit with his post-game comments.

Speaker 2 Like this was a game where the running game didn't get going and you fall behind, and you do need this guy that's supposed to be your superstar quarterback to throw you back in the game like we see Josh Allen and the Greats do it.

Speaker 2 And it just didn't happen. And I understand Lad McConkey is a very promising young player.
Quentin Johnson made gains this season, but was terrible in this game.

Speaker 2 I'm sorry, no catches on five targets with drops and everything.

Speaker 2 Herbert just didn't get the job done. So I think Herbert deserves blame for what happened here.
He was being absolved by his coach, but I don't buy into that.

Speaker 10 I'm here to collect baby Herbert and just coddle him in my arms because I believe

Speaker 2 buying it.

Speaker 10 Because here's the thing: like when Herbert was coming up and everyone was like, oh, well, the reason that Herbert's awesome is because he has Keenan Allen and Mike Williams.

Speaker 10 What did Keenan Allen and Mike Williams do when they left L.A.? What did Keenan Allen do in Chicago?

Speaker 2 How did he help Caleb Williams along in any meaningful way?

Speaker 10 What did Mike Williams do with the Jets? He was traded halfway through the season. And now we have Quentin Johnson and Lad McConkey.
Lab McConkey's awesome, right?

Speaker 10 But he is a six-foot wide receiver, and he's made some huge yard-after-the-catch plays.

Speaker 10 Like, I'm not diminishing him in any way, shape, or form, but he does not have a true number one alpha, you know, contested catch wide receiver, and he needs one. I'm sorry.
He does.

Speaker 4 I agree with that.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I agree with that. And, Mark, the Texans defense, awesome, 261 yards.
The Chargers were held to. They turned it over four times.
So as we mentioned, they only had 15 first downs.

Speaker 2 But Houston, if they want to be taken seriously next week against Kansas City, they turned it over three times. It could have been four, actually.
It was a very close call.

Speaker 2 I think maybe it was an interception that got wiped away or it was dropped. But they didn't play the cleanest game on offense.

Speaker 2 So they got to be better as well.

Speaker 2 The spread is seven and a half right now, which seems actually lower than I expected.

Speaker 9 I'm with you. I think

Speaker 9 when I've felt good about the Texans, it's largely been because of their defense, obviously. And I think they could cause some disruption for Patrick Mahomes.
It's possible.

Speaker 9 If anything, I thought that Bobby Sloick, they were imperfect on offense, but it kind of brought some juice back to Bobby Sloick. They put a lot on C.J.
Stroud early, and then used Mixon later.

Speaker 9 And I thought that was a good way to kind of get through this game. But

Speaker 9 this, to me, was more of a Chargers just being an imperfect team at the wrong time.

Speaker 9 We'll see what the Texans can accomplish. But I don't hate them.
I think the Texans versus the Chiefs is a better matchup than anything else they'd be dealing with.

Speaker 9 I do.

Speaker 2 I mean, I think that's why I'm still surprised that the Chargers played so poorly in this game because Jim Harbaugh, GM could have maybe uglied up a Chiefs game, and it's 13-10 in the fourth quarter.

Speaker 2 But

Speaker 2 they just, this was not the day. And it is crazy.
I mean, interceptions are not all on the quarterback. The offensive line played a role.
Will Disley let one go through his hands.

Speaker 2 That led to the pick six that kind kind of put this game away. But just like the number, four interceptions in this game.
He threw three in 17 weeks. Just crazy.
You can't predict this stuff.

Speaker 2 And just a nightmare game for the Chargers. I was watching the game or the first half of the game with my youngest son, Harrison.
Kind of to your point.

Speaker 2 And there were Chargers fans in this bar in Los Angeles. And yeah, it's a weird week in Los Angeles.
So like.

Speaker 2 So maybe like spirits are in a different place. But yeah, it wasn't that that bar wasn't going off.

Speaker 2 It had a very very like Saints locker room after a Skyrizzy speech vibe to it

Speaker 2 during the game.

Speaker 2 So, you know, the Chargers seem to just be floating somewhere in the world. I don't know.
They float, they float off to Cabo now. Tough way to end the season.

Speaker 9 Got a lot of people going to Cabo.

Speaker 2 Yes, sir.

Speaker 4 Anything else on this one? Voiceful. Time of the year.

Speaker 4 What the fuck was that?

Speaker 4 What was that?

Speaker 10 It's Wes. It's West of Us.

Speaker 4 This is the West of Us game. This is time of the year.

Speaker 2 Oh, my God. It's Chris.

Speaker 2 It was. It was West of Us.
And Houston, they play well on West of Us. You know, the Bengals used to lose every time on West of Us.
And then they handed the West of US

Speaker 2 cape and

Speaker 2 crown and scepter over to the Texans. And

Speaker 2 they've had more luck, and we'll see. They're going to need it next week against the Chiefs.
All right.

Speaker 2 Boys, once again, another late night for the con man.

Speaker 2 He's done it again, ladies and gentlemen, as the clock ticks to 1 a.m. on the East Coast.

Speaker 2 Did you take the town and country to Philly?

Speaker 10 No, no.

Speaker 10 No, we

Speaker 10 I took the car that we're going to get rid of now that we have that one, because if

Speaker 10 it gets taken down here, it's fine.

Speaker 9 You could just leave it in a lot down there?

Speaker 4 Yeah.

Speaker 4 Just going to hand it to someone. Here.

Speaker 2 Were you tempted, though, to take the town and country?

Speaker 10 Of course. Yeah,

Speaker 10 I had a great.

Speaker 2 Oh, shit. Look at that.
Oh, miss me.

Speaker 2 Justin, bringing up the scoreigami shit.

Speaker 14 I had to troll you a little bit with that.

Speaker 2 32-12. That's scorigami.
It's the one thou, this is funny. 1,091st unique final score.
Please. Every week there's a scoreigami.
How could it be unique?

Speaker 4 Well, this is also

Speaker 9 this is an unimpressive scorigami.

Speaker 9 I'm surprised that 32-12 hasn't had. Also, and I've often tried to needle you with Scorigami.
Anything that's happened 1,091 times is not unique.

Speaker 2 Could there be anything more boring in the goddamn universe than that tweet that just wasted my time and all of our time? And I apologize to the audience.

Speaker 14 Look at the great moment that that created by putting that up. You guys getting mad.
Old man yelling at cloud.

Speaker 4 It's perfect.

Speaker 10 Gan has really converted me on this to the point where I don't want to hear from Skorigami until like a a playoff game ends like 69 to 1, and then we have to figure out how that happened.

Speaker 9 I'm with you.

Speaker 9 Make them

Speaker 2 aggressive to the eye. I am all about the Skorigami when a team scores one point.

Speaker 2 Please,

Speaker 2 I will be all about seeing that. Then I am excited.
And yes, I am very excited as we all are for what's going to happen next week in the divisional playoffs. I mean, that is, as we take the

Speaker 15 I got it, I swear.

Speaker 4 What?

Speaker 2 Now, I know that wasn't Wes.

Speaker 4 What was that? What's happening with Justin?

Speaker 14 DeMar Hamlin picked off Bonix, and then it was ruled not an interception. And Tony Romo was, that was, in his mind, what DeMar Hamlin was thinking in that moment was.

Speaker 4 I had it.

Speaker 15 I swear.

Speaker 2 Oh, my God. It sounds like Sessler at one of his Hollywood parties.

Speaker 4 No.

Speaker 2 where everybody's wearing blindfolds.

Speaker 15 You got sex addiction? You got a problem with sex?

Speaker 9 Why?

Speaker 4 I didn't even say anything

Speaker 15 or something.

Speaker 2 Yes or no? You've been to a blindfold party in Hollywood.

Speaker 9 Well, no, I did have to go to

Speaker 9 a birthday party. It was like a murder mystery, and everyone had to wear masks.
I never saw anyone's face. So

Speaker 9 that was years ago.

Speaker 9 But not not in the way that you uh are suggesting per se

Speaker 2 one more game mark

Speaker 2 which is

Speaker 2 uh the rams and the vikings rams from arizona cap super wild card weekend from glendale of course the uh fires here in los angeles uh

Speaker 2 necessitating a move to arizona so we will uh

Speaker 2 you know God willing, save for the theology podcast, we'll be back with you 24 hours from from now or so to recap that game and then get us caught up with a little post-mortem on the whole wildcard round and take a peek ahead at the divisional round playoffs.

Speaker 2 So good stuff. Great job, everybody.
It's been a fed up week. Let's be real.

Speaker 2 Justin now is somewhere in the foothills of Las Vegas because the fires, because the winds picked up again here in Los Angeles over the weekend and pushed those fires closer than he and his lovely fiancé, Jessica, were comfortable with.

Speaker 2 So he is in a place with great Wi-Fi. Let's look at the positives on this.

Speaker 2 But you are now outside of your home and it just, you know, it's crazy and surreal that these are the things that we're talking about.

Speaker 14 Yeah, you know, just wanted to be safe. Don't really think there's a risk that our apartment goes up in flames, but it's really toxic air in our area.

Speaker 14 We're pretty dang close to the edge of the Palisades fire. So we're just, winds are supposed to get really bad again on Tuesday.

Speaker 14 It's like, let's just get some peace of mind and get out of the city just in case.

Speaker 4 There you go.

Speaker 2 Cannot fault you for that, buddy. So anybody that's listening in the LA area, please stay safe and we'll get through this together.

Speaker 2 All right, everybody, thanks so much for checking out the super wild card recap of Heed the Call. Until next time, do what you must.

Speaker 4 Yeah, like I said, Heed the Call.