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The Heed the Call Podcast

has made it to 100.

Gotcha, Betty White.

Bang.

Put a check mark in the old W column, Mark Zessler.

Heed the Call turns 100.

Today with our

Wildcard Weekend preview.

Not super wild card weekend.

They removed that branding.

But anyway,

100 episodes.

How you doing, Mark Sessler?

Weird week.

It is a weird week.

I mean, we had been through many weird weeks when we did episode one.

A lot of things have happened to Los Angeles that have been unpredictable in this past week.

And so it makes sense to me that 100 would be met with some unusual life circumstances surrounding it.

But how are you guys?

Because I, you know, we've tried to be in touch a little bit, but we're in different parts of the city.

A city under siege.

Yes, very sad.

A very sad week.

And yeah, our first episode, there was an earthquake in the middle of the episode.

That's right.

And now episode 100, the city is kind of burning actively as we speak.

And,

you know, that doesn't,

not making light of it.

It's just like the chaos and I guess the trade-off in some ways that comes with living here in California.

And I know all of us are not L.A., you know, we didn't grow up here.

We all came here.

And that's kind of what I've been thinking about.

I was thinking about it this morning about how,

you know, and Mark, I could speak for you because we've known each other for so long, but like we both had like a romantic vision of like this idea of going west and going to LA.

And I've always loved LA because it's like this place where everybody goes that has these big dreams.

The city promises you nothing, but it will take you in and then give you a chance.

And it gave us a chance, and that's why we're here and have families here and have, you know, lives and careers here.

So this has been a really difficult thing to watch.

And I just hope everyone uh anyone listening, obviously, and watching right now that are affected directly, I hope you're okay and and and safe and we see our way through this.

But it's uh yeah, it's been a a shitty, scary week.

And,

you know, just I love I love this part of the country so much.

I love I love Los Angeles.

So it's been, you know, it's been heartbreaking.

It's been really bad.

And we're lucky because

right now, you know, Jordan, for instance, who obviously is our regular Thursday

person with Mike, and Jordan had to evacuate her place where she lives,

and there have been notices all across the city.

The three of us have not been hit as hard, obviously, as others, but at the same time, like as we're recording this, there's no promises.

The biggest fire has 0% containment.

So, yeah, it's been a tough one for sure.

I'm with you.

I realized in the middle of this that I always think like I moved here, so I'm not from here, but I've lived here longer for 20 years plus than anywhere else in my life.

And so it really is my home.

And I think like, you know, part of it is when a news, it's like a news event plus a life event, but then I'm looking out my window and you can literally see, I was driving up north of sunset, coming back from somewhere, and like

a hillside is literally burning, massively burning.

And we were in like an evacuation zone for sure.

And we

stuck it out and

it was okay by the next morning, but it's not been okay for so many other people.

And you look at what's happened in like Pacific Palisades.

Like it's been like literally destroyed.

And you're watching like McDonald's, a McDonald's burned to the ground.

Like, it's just sort of surreal images, but it's actually happening like miles from here, and it's affected thousands.

So, like, I never know what to say in situations like this, too, because it's like it just doesn't feel completely real to me, but it's completely real.

And, like, it's, yeah, it's affected us.

It's like cinematic and

like the apocalypse nature of it.

And it's so close to us.

We're right next door to it all, and you don't know if we're going to get pulled into it.

But again, yeah, like

I, the, the great thing about the city, too, is that,

and it's why, like, for instance, West fit in so well here.

Just, it's people with big hearts and, and, um, empathetic people in a natural way, not in an unnatural way.

Like, that's just the, it's the, it's the way of this part of the country.

And, and, like, my wife, for instance, Emily, who's amazing, like, she spent yesterday going through our house and because we know people whose houses burned to the ground and, you know, a family with two boys like we have that they lost everything.

And so, going through the house and collecting all the clothes we can, and then I get sent on a disastrous

Costco run.

I get sent on a Costco run yesterday, right, to pick up toothbrushes in bulk, toothpaste in bulk, baby formula in bulk.

Have you been to a Costco, by the way?

Well, yes, I have.

I mean,

not during this week's up and down nature of life, but yes.

That place,

you have to be an absolute genius.

It was easier to find bin Laden than it is to find Baby Formula at a Costco.

And I look around and I don't see any employees.

The only employees are the people that are making the little treats and giveaway things.

They don't know what's going on.

There's no directory.

And I just let's just let's think about the old Zusa this week, I guess is what I'm saying, because the trip to Costco was an absolute nightmare scenario that will stick with me.

Yeah, I think you buried the headline there by bringing that up after the rest of what we discussed.

I mean,

I feel for you.

I don't like shopping in general, but

I always thought that the Costco employee generally was more helpful than you're describing, so that's an alarming update.

And thank you to everybody.

I didn't even get the job done.

I'm going back with Emily to actually do it right.

You couldn't find the

formula specifically.

But yeah, so the city will fight back.

I know it will, and that will be a great thing when it happens.

But just got to get through this part of it.

And thank you to everybody.

Finally, before we turn our attention to football, because we want that to be the focus of the show, because obviously who wants to dwell on something as sad and horrible as this.

But thank you to everybody that reached out to us.

I know, Mark and Justin, I'm sure you got a lot of messages, as did I, on social media.

So, yes, we are lucky to be

in a much better situation than others.

But

yeah, obviously, our hearts go out to everybody.

All right.

Anything else, Mark, before we turn the page there?

No, I think we should turn the page.

I mean, I'm with you on that.

Nice.

Lots more, but I mean,

that's a different type of show.

So I think we delve into what

we do.

I love this place.

I really do.

I love it.

I do too.

I think I will say one thing.

L.A.

gets a bad rap.

for being, you know, pretentious and materialistic and all that stuff's true, but that's true of any city.

But like the greatest greatest people I've met came to LA for very specific reasons that you mentioned up there.

So, it's like, I don't like seeing like that.

I think part of it is this town's misunderstood, and to live here is to know it in a different way.

And so, it's,

I'm still kind of like, this all feels unreal to even be doing this right now.

And I'm not trying to, you know, it's, we're, we're in a good shape, but like, it is weird, and like, uh,

it's a strange time.

It's a strange time.

We were planning to get together, and we couldn't even get together this week.

So it's things like that.

You just get, your life gets upended.

Yep, indeed.

All right, let's do it.

Let's talk football.

It does remind me,

it has brought back some unfortunate memories of COVID when that first happened, and you're kind of locked in your house and not sure what to do.

And

I remember, you know, and people that are fans of our old show remember we did our bunker casts, and when we did that,

we did daily shows for three weeks as COVID broke out in March of 20.

And that really felt like almost a safe space for us and the audience.

And in this case, obviously, that was a global situation, COVID.

This is very much central to exactly where we live.

But to the same point, it's going to be nice now.

Just let's talk about football for an hour.

And with no Jordan or no Mike, we're going to kind of be a little bit quicker and go through the round with some great football games.

So let's turn the page for now.

I'm going to stop saying turn the page also.

Because I turned the picture,

turn the page on, turn the page.

Right.

And then you said, yeah, let's turn the page.

And then I said again now after a little california interlude okay let's turn the page we're that phraseology has been removed from the show

yeah

all right

flashpoint focus california is that what this is is that not turn the page bub seeker

no shut the f up justin it's not

the bots are crawling

i thought justin was doing a very insensitive southern California flashpoint focus, which we don't need right now, Justin.

Inappropriate page.

Inappropriate.

Turn the page reference.

Not appropriate.

Sorry.

Let me start this way as we turn to football.

And Justin and Mike will be back next week.

Can't wait for that.

Oh, Justin's here?

Hey, Justin.

You said Justin and Mike.

No, that was a joke.

No, you're right.

Sorry, I misspoke.

Jay.

We actually had an off-mic conversation a couple days ago

that I flubbed a couple phrases

in the previous week and nobody corrected me.

And I was like, hey, just give me a heads up.

I don't think I knew you did personally.

Like, just

if you're pointing the arrow at me, I wasn't aware that it occurred.

Are you insinuating that I was angry that you purposely didn't correct me to hang me out to dry?

Kind of.

I don't, like, yeah, the way that, like.

That's not really my goal.

It doesn't help me or you or anyone.

Or those.

But anyway, thank you for the correction there.

Yes, Jordan and Mike.

Back next week.

All right, here we go.

Before we dive in, obviously there are 14 teams left that can win the Super Bowl, technically.

Two teams on by this week, the Chiefs and the Lions, obviously.

Mark, real quick, give me yes or no, nothing else.

Who can win the Super Bowl?

In a way where you could actually imagine a scenario, okay?

Because I think this exercise tells you why these playoffs are going to be good.

Chiefs.

Yes.

Bills.

Yes.

Ravens.

Yes.

Texans?

No.

Chargers?

No.

Steelers?

No.

Broncos?

No.

Lions?

Yes.

Eagles?

Yes.

Bucks.

Don't do it.

Don't do it.

No.

Thank you.

I know you love them, but come on.

Well, no, not yet, no.

Rams.

No.

Vikings.

Yes.

Commanders?

Yes.

Ooh, feisty.

Packers.

Yes.

Okay.

So I'm in a total agreement with you.

I didn't give the Commanders the yes.

That wasn't the same.

I did give the Packers the yes.

But I mean, the Commanders are a 12-win team with a dynamic rookie quarterback.

Crazy things happen.

So you have eight teams that can win the Super Bowl in a feasible way in terms of just rational thought.

That's a lot of teams.

and that means we could be for a great round of football.

Now, to that point, as we get into the games of wild card weekend, it's important that we send some of these other teams out of the mix and get serious.

So let's start.

Let's go in order

in terms of where things lie.

And let's start where we must, West of us.

Oh, sweet West of us.

How I miss thee, the

great Chris Wesling, the great late Chris Wesling, who's already come up once in the show because we think about him all the time.

He's right over my right shoulder right now, always watching over us.

And Wes absolutely adored the first game of the playoffs as a celebration, right, Mark, of

things that he likes and hates and those things colliding.

In fact, let's listen to Chris Wesling.

This was a few years back, obviously, asking Chris,

what's the deal with West of Us?

Well, we created the holiday to celebrate the Bengals' annual elimination from the playoffs on wild card weekend, five straight years from 2011 to 2015.

Since then, the Texans have taken over as the surrogate West of Us team.

They always get that early Saturday window, which is the West of Us window, the game that nobody really wants to watch.

They put them in there.

The Texans have now played more games on West of Us than the Bengals have.

Mark, you want to hear some more, Chris?

Yes, absolutely.

Let's listen to some more, Chris.

And then I used to always butt heads with Wes about like he would actively root against the Bengals, the team that he had

separated from and divorced with this famous dossier.

But I always was like, yeah, but

you got a whole like, all your loved ones are living and dying.

The Nick Weslings of the world.

What about them?

Here's Wes.

Well, you were openly rooting against the Bengals.

That was part of the festival atmosphere.

Was you hoping the team would

be true there?

What?

Were you rooting against the Bengals?

Oh, yeah.

That's why it was a part of it.

Yeah, you're not rooting against the Bengals.

I was just going to say, you don't feel that way about Hughes.

I'm rooting against Jackson's.

I can't get behind that, Wes, because you had all these friends and family that still support the team.

They're chubs.

You know what you forget a little bit about Wes is that, like, because we remember the wonderful aspects to him, but one of the wonderful aspects was when he'd get a B in his bonnet about something, like, no one's pushing him an inch.

Like, he's not going to let go.

And, like, he would not let go of this one.

Well, I mean, that's one of the many reasons he was a tremendous podcaster.

And, you know, rock and tour, let's face it.

Anyway, great to hear from Wes.

So, yes, the Texans always get thrown into this first game partially because of the market, partially because the team never seems to rise above being,

you know, the

logical first start to the playoffs in the least sexy matchup.

And look at this: this tweet from Vidran

sent our way: start time for every wild game, every wild card game in Texans' history, which dates back to 2002.

2011, Saturday 3.30.

2012, Saturday 3.30.

2015, Saturday 3.30.

2016, 2018, 2019, 2023.

And 2024 slash 25, Saturday, 3.30.

Now,

we've also been waiting, Mark, to get rid of the Texans, I feel like, for a long time.

Kind of circling this first round of the playoffs or a Texans team that is disappointed relative to expectations.

Do you think the Chargers make this West of this a celebration in the Chris Wesling sense of getting rid of this boring team that always shows up first in the playoffs?

Logically, I do because I think you're looking at two teams that have been operating and moving in different directions for a long time.

For me, it starts with the quarterback, like Justin Herbert.

They've won three in a row.

Justin Herbert has been lights out,

73 completion percentage, 7-1 touchdown interception ratio.

He is fitting very well into the Jim Harbaugh offense.

They've got J.K.

Dobbins back.

You've got Lad McConkey operating as

one of the most effective rookie wideouts we've seen in a long time.

And the Texans, to me, feel kind of broken.

Like, I'm at the point wondering, like, are we days away from Bobby Sloick, who was a head coaching candidate, a hot one a year ago, being fired?

Like, the offense is broken down, and the stuff that...

plagued them early still plagues them.

Like they've never come up with a solution to a crumbled offensive line that seems to put Stroud into endless third and long situations.

He's 31st and pass EPA

since week six.

So this is a quarterback that literally has broken down to some extent.

So what do you point to with the Texans who are shattered injury-wise as well at skill positions?

Joe Mixon's not running the ball.

What are you pointing to to say, no, the Texans can do this?

Like, this is not the hardest opponent in the Chargers, but it's just like, I don't really see how you diagnose a win for them without it being a big surprise.

Yeah, and we're going to have a challenge during the playoffs.

We're going to call it the Mr.

Perfect Challenge.

We're going to all try to go.

How many games are there?

13?

12?

Whoa, that's an odd.

12 this week.

Yeah.

Well, not 12 games this week.

No, there's six games.

There's 12 teams.

Six?

You want to know how many teams?

Four,

two,

one, right?

Super Bowls.

13 games.

13.

Yeah.

Going straight, no spreads, no nothing.

Can we, can any of us, including Justin, including Jordan, including Money Mike, go 13 and up?

okay so we're gonna pick every game throughout the playoffs here and this one is one of those games where I feel I feel like what you're saying I agree with about Houston that they just hit this wall and I'm not writing off CJ Stroud I think it's really crazy how quickly everything can change in the NFL like if you look at CJ Stroud looked like the next great quarterback right

at the end of last season

and Bryce Young for instance looked like the next great bust that everyone will talk about for years.

And then you look at their stats in the back three quarters of this regular season, and it's like you flip their careers.

Stroud has absolutely crashed and burned this year.

And you could put that on Stroud, which he deserves some blame.

You could put that on the OC, Slowick, which you can.

You could put it on the injuries that have destroyed the offensive line of wide receiver.

I think it's a combination of everything.

And I guess my only like, how do you, what do you take out of year two of the C.J.

Stroud experience is that that maybe he's not the special guy at the level of, like, a Burrow or a Peyton Manning, like the true, the greats, that no matter what's around them, they find a way, Josh Allen.

And I think he was not able to lift this unit up when a lot of chaos hit.

But at the same time, I don't think Slowick, I don't think he should be coaching for his job.

I think this turned into a bit of a Murphy's lost season.

I also think that this is going to be the end for the Texans.

I think they're going to struggle to score points.

I think Jim Harbaugh is licking his chops to get after this team.

He's going to have them ready to go.

He's going to get after Stroud, who's been running for his life all season.

The Chargers have given quarterbacks hell this year, and I think that's what we're going to see here.

I don't think we're going to see a high-scoring game, but I think I see a comfortable Chargers win where they run the football well.

Herbert has played mistake-free football all year.

He has not lit up the box score by any means

or made fantasy champions, but he threw three interceptions all year.

So you have a quarter, this is a Jim Harbaugh fever dream, this team in a lot of ways, Mark, because they got a talented quarterback who can make a big throw in a big spot, has a huge arm, but doesn't make mistakes, a Dobbins-led running game that can move the chains and control time and possessions, and a defense that is basically built to shut this offense down.

This feels to me 20 to 6.

I could see that.

Yeah, I think like, you know, because it's easy, the first thing you think of is Justin Herbert and Jim Harbaugh, but like, it's, it's the Chargers' defense that has absolutely smothered opponents at certain times.

And they're the best red zone defense in the league right now, and the Texans are a bottom-five red zone offense.

And I'm with you on Stroud on one thing.

Is there a world where they nip the Chargers in this game?

I could see it.

Like, I think everyone's so down on them that we just assume that they're going to get sailed away.

But it really is just the environment around Stroud.

Like, I'm not ready to say anything about his career at this point.

Like, they have lost their top two to two of their top three wideouts.

Nico Collins has really not been the same guy in that situation because you just double them.

I do like their secondary.

Like, if they can create a couple turnovers at home and get the Chargers uncomfortable early, that's your way out.

But I just, I don't really see that against

this offense or defense the way that the Chargers are playing right now.

They really have become the best version of themselves.

So I'm with you.

Last stat for me.

Texans ranked 27th in offensive EPA per play.

They're against the number one scoring defense.

Right.

I just don't like this setup.

You're right.

Could the Chargers get beat here?

Neither of these teams are under our category of actual Super Bowl contender.

So it's certainly possible.

This just feels like a game that Harbaugh is going to chew up and grind up and spit out as a head coach.

Watch Derwin James make a big play in this game.

26 is my prediction.

What do you got?

I've got Chargers

18, Texans 16.

Okay.

Okay.

Yes, Justin.

Chargers, 20, Texans, 13.

All right, there we go.

Across the board, we got Chargers.

And let's, before we move around, West of his scores, by the way, that's a very West of us game.

This is at a West of us Central casting, this game.

Yeah.

This is Wes

drinking a beer or six and standing over his green egg,

cackling, watching plays as he cooks a beautiful piece of meat.

Correct.

Let's listen to Jim Harbaugh talk about Justin Herbert because I could listen to Jim Harbaugh talking about paint drying.

He's the kind of athlete that could play tight end in this league.

He could play edge rusher in this league.

And some of the other things.

I mean,

there was a throw he made on a check down

with a defender right in front of him, and he went

like that.

And then the throw to Ladd

on the two-point play.

I mean,

the degree of difficulty and

it was a higher degree of

difficulty than Montana to Dwight Clark on the catch.

Wow.

And when you see where he let the ball go and with the guy like right

there

and then

put it on a

dime, as we like to say, you know, into like a six-inch window in stride to lad running across.

I mean, that's

it's artistry.

It's incredible

what Justin's capable of doing.

How can you not be romantic about football?

All right, let's take a break and we'll continue our wild card round preview.

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Alright, we're back.

Now we move to the Saturday primetime game, Sess Dog.

By the way, you know when I knew something weird was going on?

I did the Sheck Show

on

Tuesday morning.

Right.

And right behind me,

I do the show in a converted garage, essentially.

And this is a garage door painted to look like a real wall.

And I have a flag that's on the other side of this wall, a California, state of California flag.

And it was whipping so hard that I could almost feel the wind coming through the wall as I was doing the check hit.

And I was just like, uh-oh,

this feels a little bit different than your typical Santa Ana winds.

And sure enough, it literally, like a,

there's a bad Howie Long movie about this, I think.

It was a, it was a fire tornado that broke out.

later that day.

But yeah, that just brought back some memories.

No, it's the combination of the two.

And like,

I did the thing

where I look like an utter goon where I was having a conversation with someone saying, like, it's so LA to be concerned about these wins.

Like,

we don't, we make the biggest deal.

We were on the text messages with you earlier that day.

Yes.

Well, it's like, I couldn't have been more incorrect about my theory there.

And so take the big L.

That's okay.

Justin was trying to get through to you throughout the day.

Hey, this is serious, Mark.

This is serious.

Justin was very forceful about me leaving leaving my apartment, too.

Isn't that sick?

In a caring way,

in a caring way.

I see that.

Yeah.

I mean, when you got the get out, there's a fire, the fire is on the hillside, and you're taking pictures from your balcony, and it's like literally a mile from your apartment.

It's like, yeah, it's time to go.

Right, there's some visual clues there.

You're right.

But don't forget that Mark Sessler is a man who's always liked to watch the world burn.

So, you know, you got to look at it from that perspective.

Well, not a perspective.

All right, let's get back into it.

Let's see, let's see, let's see, let's see.

Pittsburgh at Baltimore.

Speaking of the Shechy,

obviously

a fair part of our conversation focused on his beloved Steelers.

This is another team like the Texans now for a month straight.

Everyone's circled.

Okay,

first game of the playoffs for them.

Let's get them out of Dodge.

It's over.

And there's a lot of logic to that, but there's a little more to this game, too, right, Mark?

You have Pittsburgh riding a four-game losing streak.

You You have Baltimore on a four-game winning streak.

That flipped the division, obviously, and led to this game being played at M ⁇ T Bank Stadium.

And I know Baltimore handled Pittsburgh during that run of four games when their seasons went opposite directions.

But then look at every game between these teams outside of that window, including their first matchup this season.

And I just, I can't shake the feeling that anybody that thinks that the Ravens are just going to roll over a dead Steelers team, it could happen.

I just don't think it will.

I think this is going to be a struggle.

And if you are a Ravens fan,

even if you're not admitting it, you're very nervous about this first-round matchup because this is absolute Steinbrenner doctrine territory for the Baltimore Ravens as an organization.

Anything less than a championship is considered failure.

And now you got the Steelers just to get out of round one.

That's a toughie.

I'm with you.

I would point to, I know they lost this game, but the Steelers defense showed up against the Bengals.

They played well.

And And it's a divisional matchup, and so you kind of throw all the rest of it out the window.

I guess what concerns me is just how dominated the Steelers were by actual solid playoff teams.

Like the Chiefs, you know, the Eagles beat them up.

The Ravens did beat them up in that second matchup.

And we kept pointing to like George Pickens being the Shecky kind of Jenga piece.

And George Pickens doesn't seem like he wants to be involved in this right now.

And so I'm looking at a Ravens defense that against the pass has vastly improved.

Nate Wiggins has come on as a really solid rookie.

Marlon Humphreys,

Marlon Humphreys has been playing some of his best football.

They are not allowing big plays through the air.

And that really was sort of what Russell Wilson had brought to Pittsburgh early on with George Pickens was the deep pass.

And it seemed to give so much flair to

Arthur Smith's offense.

And it's like, I don't know how they get out of jail at this point because they seem a little lost to me.

And the Ravens are in a specific, they're in the place that we all talk about from the summer on.

You're here.

This is when you change the narrative.

And so I think if you're Baltimore and you lean on Derrick Henry big time in this game, because they've done a good job against Lamar Jackson, the Steelers historically, like you get out to a fast start and you basically take the life away from Pittsburgh early.

I think you want to do that.

I think you want to, and they've been getting out to fast starts.

Take Pittsburgh out of this thing right away because then change the narrative.

Lamar has a big playoff win and a lot of the mumbo jumbo around Lamar Jackson goes away with that simple thing happening.

And I think this is a good, they're getting the Steelers at the right right time.

Well, I disagree in that, and that's what makes the degree of difficulty difficult.

The degree of difficulty is very difficult for the Ravens because

beating the Steelers is not enough.

Like, the Mumbo Jumbo will stay right in place until the next round where maybe they have to go up to Buffalo or something.

You know, that's true.

They have a right to play Patrick Mahomes in the AFC title game.

And it's like the Ravens have to slay three beasts to get to the Super Bowl, or or this is just a huge failure.

So this is just step one.

And in fairness, and I sung the praises like everyone else of Lamar Jackson, who is very deserving of the MVP if he gets it, for having an incredible season.

But there is something to the playoff struggles of this team with Lamar Jackson as the quarterback.

It's not just narrative-based.

It's a real storyline.

If you go through the years, they've won two MVPs.

Their quarterbacks won two MVPs.

They had an historic defense last year and couldn't get to the Super Bowl.

The pressure is even higher.

And I agree with you.

Pittsburgh needs to hold their ground in this game early.

They can't go down 14-0 because they're cooked.

At that point, it will turn into a boat race.

How do they do that?

All right.

You know, obviously the defense has to play at a high level.

TJ Watt has to be playing like peak

TJ Watt, making plays.

Arthur Smith, you got to get in your bag, son, because do not roll out some vanilla-ass attack hoping that Russ plays as the best version of himself at this stage of his career, because I think that's just a recipe for scoring three points in this game.

So I think Pittsburgh's defense will play with pride.

I think for Tomlin, Mark, this is

like

the magic of Tomlin, who has taken on a little bit of water here during this four-game losing streak, as have the Steelers in terms of like, you know, this Mike Tomlin guy.

Everybody says he's one of the best coaches, but they just keep winning eight, nine, 10 games, and then they're not a factor anymore.

In the playoffs, there's so much motivation.

There's so much external fuel of being written off that I think that defense plays at a high level.

If the offense can make a couple plays, I think this is a game that is 13-10, maybe Ravens winning in the fourth quarter.

And then it becomes

something I said on the Shek show: like that moment in Rocky IV when Balboa hits Drago with the right cross

and the Russian is cut.

And I told Check,

the Steelers to steal this game, they need the Russian is cut moment, some type of big play, a turnover, a special teams play that silences the building.

You start to feel that nervous energy in MNT Bank Stadium, and then maybe you seize on that and you steal the game.

So that's what they need.

Do they get their Russian is cut moment?

We'll see.

I can certainly see it because of the way these two teams have slow danced with each other for two decades.

I mean, it's like you like, there is a road to it, but the Steelers to me feel kind of like that

60s film like Lady in Cement.

Like, I just don't know if

they melt that cement and reawaken and reanimate and become what we hope.

I think you kind of need Jalen Warren to have a big game.

Like, guys, you're just not.

Someone's going to have to step up and make and score these points that we're talking about here.

But it's not crazy to think because psychologically, and we can think we're making this this up but like if the ravens are in a tight situation in the third or fourth quarter like there's a lot going on in the head there i mean we're all talking about it and thinking about it i don't know and lamar jackson crumbled against the chargers a number of years ago where they had a great scheme against him he they fell to the titans like they really have been a different team in the playoffs so i think it is narrative driven for everyone watching show us that we've been saying it all year this is a different lamar jackson well now is when he needs to be different and right away and early on and you got to go blow the doors off to

make a statement.

Yeah,

I think he can do it.

I think it's been a major motivating force for him since last summer, and he's talked about that, and he came into camp in the best shape of his life, and actually was and was a better athlete than he was last year when he won the MVP.

I think this is a 13-10 game in the fourth quarter.

I think I'll predict that Derrick Henry, big run, seals it and they end up winning 2010, and it's like around what the point spread is, but it won't be an easy win for the Ravens.

What do you think?

It is a pretty disrespectful point spread to the Steelers.

I don't know if that's ever, I don't know if they've ever faced each other with a 10-point spread there, but

they closed at nine and a half

as of this taping.

Yeah, that's that's pretty unusual for these two.

Um, I'm gonna go Ravens 31, Steelers, 19.

Um, a couple injury notes real quick.

Yes, Jesse.

I was gonna give my prediction: oh, yeah, Ravens win 27-17.

Okay,

I wonder if, because these teams played three weeks ago, I wonder if Pittsburgh, they were not locked into a playoff spot at that point, but they were pretty much there, 10 wins already.

I wonder if Pittsburgh sort of held anything back, anticipating a potential playoff.

I mean, they're fine for the division, though.

That's true.

So probably not.

But I wonder it's still.

It's not like the Steelers are the team with like 40 magic tricks up their sleeve.

But I hear you.

But I mean, it's like, I just don't think that was.

What they're going to need is a couple magic tricks.

They're going to need to get Justin Fields on the the field and doing something weird.

And yeah, I think they're going to need seven points somewhere from their defense or their special teams.

There is no Zay Flowers that matters.

Right.

Outright with a punt return, kickoff return, pick six, fumble recovery, or something that sets them up deep inside the red zone that the offense can potentially.

And then maybe they steal one 17-16.

Don't see it, but it could be possible.

Zay Flowers, yes, as we talked about, injured in the season finale, the star wide receiver of the Ravens.

They thought he might be able to play, but he was ruled out earlier this week.

Probably the right play as this team has bigger goals, and I think they believe they could take care of the Pittsburgh Steelers here.

And just to be,

we got to have all this stuff.

It's the preview episode.

Cycling back to the first game, Quentin Johnson and J.K.

Dobbins both listed as questionable, but I know Dobbins has practiced this week.

Has Johnson been practicing as well, Justin?

Limited Thursday did not practice Wednesday.

So that's something to keep an eye on.

Josh Palmer, their wide receiver, is out for the Chargers.

All right, let's move.

Let's take a break.

Halftime.

Is it halftime?

It's not.

There's six games.

Correct.

Maybe

second quarter.

Yeah, why don't we do three games?

That bothers me for some reason.

It's not actually halftime.

So let's do the third game and then do halftime.

Does that make sense?

I like on the show that we're working through our process

for fun of the listener.

I hope everyone understands.

Zuzz are in a big spot.

That's Peyton Manning going to the line,

surveying the field, pointing out that there's the mic, watch the mic, and then checking out of a play.

And then checking into a gorgeous play action post-route to Marvin Harrison for six.

Well, I think none of us doubt the reality of that analogy.

Denver at Buffalo, as we move to Sunday.

Denver, the number seven seed,

gets the Bills, the number two seed.

One of the great number two seeds in recent memory.

Buffalo getting eight and a half points here.

Nance, Romo, and Wolfson on this game.

This is the game that I feel most confident in, Mark.

I think, with all due respect to the Broncos,

I think they've maxed out what they can this year.

They go to the playoffs with a rookie quarterback.

This is so it's not so much a shot to me on the Broncos because I know what we've seen great things from them.

And of course, you've got a week 17 or week 18 you take with a grain of salt

because the Chiefs basically treated it like it was a preseason preseason game.

But

I gave

Bonix flowers, as everybody should have, for how he played that game.

But I think there is a danger in now taking that performance that we just saw the Broncos and be like, okay, look at them.

They're playing at a high level.

No, no, no.

Playing the Fugesi Chiefs at home when you have your entire season on the line

is very different to going to Orchard Park against the Buffalo Bills, also in Steinbrenner Doctrine territory.

And as explosive as any team is in the league right now, I think the Bills really whip up on the Broncos, and it might be a humbling end of the season for Denver, but I still think it will be seen as a victorious season for the Broncos in terms of their arc.

But this feels like Bills and a laugh are your thoughts.

Well, the Bills have been a dominant wildcard team.

I think it's four years in a row where they've gone out and taken care of business.

And

the roadmap for that to happen is absolutely there.

I guess, like, the one reason I think, if I want to make an argument for Denver, is that the Bills' defense in general, look, this is a team that gave up 86 points to the Rams and Lions in back-to-back games.

Like, it's not a pristine defense, but what they do try to do, at least, is take away the big play.

And I kind of think that the Bo Nicks and the Broncos are built to pick you apart in, like, short area passing situations against, like, a zone defense.

And can they make, can they create drives that keep Josh Allen off the field for chunks of the game?

I think that's your move there.

The defense is, it's a great defense.

And so, what if you get the Josh Allen game like it was a couple weeks ago?

You know, I think he sort of ended this season last couple of weeks.

He didn't play against the Patriots, but the two games before that was like not the pristine version of Josh Allen, who lost a lot of fantasy games for people a couple weeks ago.

Like, can you get that version of Josh Allen who's not on fire?

Because if you get the Bills team that's like having a human celebration 17 minutes into this, I'm with you that this doesn't hold up.

But the Broncos are just solid.

They're just a solid team.

Like I could see them hanging around.

And I think people are just like, what is this team?

But their defense really could create problems for the Bills offense.

And so for me, it's like, I don't see this being a blowout necessarily, but I'm with you that Buffalo, it would be a stunner if Buffalo were to crumble at home where they're dominant.

And I think they understand, like, like the Ravens and Lamar.

It's like, this is it.

This is our window.

This is happening right now for us.

And you're not going to fall to the Denver Broncos at home if you have any sort of like understanding of the moment and that's i think buffalo does yeah i and i and like i said there there is pressure on the bills too that they're expected to make a deep run and maybe finally get back to the super bowl but i think they don't carry the same ghost with them um as if i feel like the baltimore ravens do no um because it's not been josh allen's fault like he's right some of the bills losses in the postseason for instance during their great run they've been on have just been you know the obviously the 12 seconds loss against the Chiefs.

That's not a team playing tight.

That's just an all-time classic NFL game that ended in a tragic way for Bills fans.

The Bills are 8-0 at home.

That stadium is going to be going ape shit by kickoff, and it will stay ape shit.

And I think Allen is going to feed off that.

I think one thing that is,

I wouldn't say it's gotten lost

in the mix, but as we've talked about, the Bills who tied the NFL record for

a number of players who had receiving touchdowns,

their ability to spread out their offense after Stefan Diggs left, just a masterful job by their staff and the execution and different players stepping up.

And then the other guy that I really want to shine a light on is James Cook, who quietly turned into,

I don't know if he's in the Superstar Club, but he turned into a 1,000-yard rusher who averaged five yards of carry that had

32 catches for 258 yards on top of it.

So we're talking about a guy knocking on 1,300 total yards with 18 total touchdowns.

So this is a well-rounded offense that can beat you in different ways.

And Denver's defense has been very strong this year.

Obviously, they're better at home.

They're not at mile high in this game.

They have X factors on the defense, none bigger than Patrick Sertan.

And we'll see if he can make a big play in this game because they're going to need a big play from their defensive special teams, just like I was saying with Pittsburgh.

But I think even that won't help them because the Bills, I just, I think they're going to score almost every time they have the ball.

And this feels to me like, I'm going to say 37

to 17.

Yep, I think that's, I think you're in the ballpark there.

Buffalo averages more points per drive at home than any team in the league.

So you're right.

Like they've just been dominant there.

And if you look at Denver, it's like what a season.

You built a lot this season.

So I think you were both sort of saying like credit to them.

But if you take away the Chiefs' final week of the season win, which really doesn't count, they're one in five against playoff teams.

And so I think this is sort of the end of the road.

A lot of progress made, but I'm with you.

I think this is going to be an amped up environment.

I've got Bills 31, Broncos 21.

Okay.

And you, Justin?

I'm in agreement with you guys.

I feel like this is the type of game where Sean Payton goes for it on a couple questionable fourth and threes, fourth and fives, and things just sort of spiral and get away from them in that regard.

And I feel like Buffalo takes it 34-20.

That feels like a Sean Payton storyline right there.

I like that.

There's a lot on Nix's plate.

He would have to do something superhuman in this game to pull off one of the biggest upsets in recent memory.

And the other thing, yeah, they got to maybe force some turnovers, Denver's defense, but but the Bills have only turned the ball over eight times in the regular season, which is tied with the, this is a great stat from ESPN Research, tied with the 2019 Saints for the fewest since turnovers were tracked in 1933.

Whoa.

This is Josh Allen.

It's a Josh Allen quarterback team.

Like one thing that you used to be able to ding Allen on is that he would throw the ball for grabs for time and give you chances.

No, he is,

I mean, Allen and Lamar are two of the best

MVP options, you know, head-to-head MVP battles of all time.

With Joe Burrow outside after a 45 and 5,000 season being like, I can't get a seat at the table.

That's how good these two guys have been.

It is another week where we get a stat, like an outlier stat that tracks back to like pre-Civil War times for the last time anyone did this.

The Civil War was in the mid-19th century, 1933.

Maybe the Depression would have been a better reference.

Okay, sure.

Well, yeah.

Got your ass.

He did.

Let's listen to Travis Kelsey real quick.

This is tangibly, you know, tangentially related because a lot of people got pissed that the Chiefs supposedly laid down and let the Broncos into the playoffs,

citing thoughts that, oh, the

Chiefs were afraid of letting the Bengals in the playoffs.

Anyway, I would save this for next week, but I could see you getting lost in the mix.

So just listen to Travis Kelsey on the New Heights podcast with his brother, Jay.

Jay Kelsey, nobody calls him that.

Well, there's some people alleging that it was a purposeful letting get your ass.

I ain't scared of it.

I'm not nobody.

I'm not alleging this.

I wanted him in the f ⁇ ing.

I'm not alleging this.

I want to slay every dragon one by one, like Mortal Kombat.

I don't even want this to be like we play the lowest seed.

Just give me the best teams.

I'm not Travis.

I'm just telling you.

AFC, NFC.

Give me all

Mortal Kombat style.

I'll go through every f ⁇ ing one of them, just giving them my best effort.

I ain't scared of a single soul, man.

You didn't want to see the Bengals in Burrowhead or in Cincinnati.

I'll play them at the Walmart parking lot.

I don't give a shit.

We can have our own game in the offseason.

Well, we really do get out of game.

Listen, I love competing against the greatest.

Spoken like a man wearing a funk yourself ball cap.

Elliot keeps saying, like, I'm not alleging it.

I'm not alleging it.

The New Heights podcast, very good show.

Produced by our buddy, TD.

Yep.

Well, we went up against them in a podcasting competition of sorts.

How'd that go?

We did not win.

We lost in that Walmart parking lot to them.

We got curb stomped in that Walmart parking lot.

Yeah, we did.

All right.

Yes, Justin.

They did use our set at the Super Bowl in Glendale, in Phoenix, I mean, to tape their show.

So without us,

would they have even had Super Bowl coverage?

Some might question that.

don't you remember that it's a nugget

halftime

all right let's get let's get into some news a nice for he's a jolly good fellow for these men

one two you know what to do for he's a jolly good fellow for he's a jolly good fellow for he's a jolly good fellow

with nobody can deny.

Here's the ultimate magic of Jim Harbaugh, that

this like 65-year-old guy or whatever Jim is at this point can get a bunch of young men born like in the early 2000s

from disparate backgrounds.

And they all know the words to that song and sing it together, smiling, arm in arm.

It's like a Disney movie.

And also, like, I would have never thought in the modern NFL something like that could happen.

And that's what makes Jim Harbaugh one of one.

Well, you're right.

I wouldn't say it's the hardest song on the planet to learn words-wise.

It's not like there's 17

verses.

Did they practice?

Like,

did he teach that song?

It's not like a...

I feel like it's not a song that's woven into the fabric of the world at this point if you were born in 2003 or whatever.

It was during the Civil War, yes, but not so much now.

In the 1930s?

I feel like it's a song that I learned from my grandfather, and I wonder if grandfathers of those people, the young players, they're too young as grandfathers to have even cared about it themselves.

Justin, can we get some history on for He's a Jolly Good Fellow, The Origins?

I bet it would take us to the very early 20th century.

Yeah, or prehistoric times.

I mean, we don't know how to do it.

Okay, prehistoric, now we're talking dinosaurs, bro.

Yeah, okay.

The tune is of French origin and dates at least from the 18th century.

Allegedly, it was composed the night after the Battle of Mauplacuet in 1709, became a French folk tune and was popularized by Marie Antoinette after she heard one of her maids singing it.

That's deep.

Wait, who's the jolly good fellow in that initial setup?

You can look for that while we do.

And the American versions of the lyrics differ,

which nobody can deny is the American version.

In the British version, which our listeners in that part of the world may be familiar, and so say all of us.

That's very American for us just to say you can't deny it.

It's absolutely true.

Marie Antoinette to Derwin James.

That song has endured.

It's pretty amazing.

All right, real quick.

We're going to cycle through this.

The news.

The Raiders do.

The Raiders, man.

The Raiders.

It took them a couple extra days, but the Raiders did decide to fire head coach Antonio Pierce, and then they took another day or two, and then they decided to fire general manager Tom Tolesco.

So the Raiders are doing a clean reboot of the product, which takes us, what, to six firings now as we inch closer to that typical seven to eight every year.

I don't need to dwell on this personally because I always thought Pierce was the wrong guy to lead the team, dating back to last December.

And then there's nothing that happened this season that made me feel like he was a long-term answer.

So I think the Raiders made the right move here.

The GM component of it, there's two ways to look at it.

Like Tolesco actually, you know, for instance, just brought in one of the great young tight ends in recent NFL history and wasn't certainly, I think, maybe deserved a little more rope, but you could also look at it as like, okay, this allows...

opens the door for other options for the Raiders to be a more appealing job for a head coach they really like rather than pair them with an existing general manager.

So it might have been a a baby thrown out with the bathwater scenario for poor Tom Tolesco.

I think that's exactly what it is.

And speaking of Tom, I think

this is exactly the world where Tom Brady, who is announcing football games and going to other team complexes, is going to be very involved in this.

I know Pete Carroll's one of the people that I don't think he does go to other team complexes.

Isn't that part of the rules of his

weird announcing something?

But that's why he can't because he's doing this, which is right.

It's confusing, but it's like Tom Brady's fingerprints will be all over this.

So

it's an intriguing search for that.

Why do I not believe that Tom Brady's actually anything other than a figurehead with that?

Because I think Mark Davis,

we'll find out how much he's involved, but I think Mark Davis brought in Tom Brady for this exact moment and because he looks up to

the kind of ideas that Brady would bring.

We'll see who gets hired, but I really think Brady is absolutely involved.

I really do.

Involved, sure, because he's a part owner, right?

Or has a part of the organization.

I just, I'm just curious, like, how much, because the Raiders are the Raiders.

And like, I remember going to that stadium last year for the Super Bowl, and they have, like,

Jerry Rice's number retired on a wall, and guys that, that had no real, you know, not that Rice had no, but you know what I mean.

Like, anybody that's a name brand, they like to connect to the silver and black.

And I'm wondering, yeah, will Brady have a real vocal role in this?

But beyond that, this just, it's more wheel spinning for the Las Vegas Raiders and this organization that can't seem to get going.

So they went 4-13.

Tolesco signed Gardner Minshew

to a two-year deal, $15 million guaranteed.

That didn't work out, obviously.

But, you know, overall, I think he also brought in Brock Bowers, as I mentioned.

Their second-round pick was Jackson Powers Johnson, who started games for them this season.

They have

DJ Glaze, who they took

in the third round.

He had a starting role this season.

So

you could say like Telesco kind of got screwed here.

But yeah, this might be, for instance, what we were hearing with James Palmer, like, okay, like Ben Johnson.

He wants to have power.

He wants to have a role.

This feels like a team that wants to bring in a coach that has a big list of what I want, what I want.

But the thing I worry about with the Raiders is that they've done all this with no guarantees they get that guy.

and where do they end up after that so if you're a Raiders fan you have a right to have anxiety around this I think so too I mean it was clearly a clean the clear the deck type situation which I don't like it's not fair to Tolesco

but

the problem with the Raiders is they haven't been bad enough they just missed out on bonics to the Broncos a year ago and they're sitting in where they are in the draft this year where it's like you're not going to get one of those quarterbacks so like you can't saddle the next coach with a no quarterback plan like this coach was saddled with um and the Raiders, for the record, have, as you would imagine, several head coaching interviews lined up after the firing.

Pete Carroll will interview with the team next week, ESPN reported.

And whoever is the new GM of the Raiders will have over $107 million in salary cap space that he comes to.

So, no quarterback, but a lot of cap space and a lot of work to do with that team.

And not the only team to fire their general manager, the Tennessee Titans decide it's over for Rand Carthon after going 9-25 under his leadership.

The Titans parted ways with their GM after two years.

This was a, at the time, Justin, of the hiring, a bit controversial because this was not Mike Vrabel's pick, we heard internally, and that led to a fissure there in that relationship that might have greased the skids for Vrabel out of town.

They went with Carthon, an outside guy who had been in the San Francisco organization, and nothing about this ended up working.

Do you think this was the right move by the Titans?

I think that this was the right move based on what's coming out, but then I wonder how much of what's coming out is a smear campaign to make it look like the right move because it's kind of similar to what's going on with Gerard Mayo, how he's like, they say Gerard Mayo was playing card games with players on the team plane instead of diving into film.

There were similar reports that ran Carthon while everyone else was watching film to get ready for Monday.

He was sleeping on the team playing back.

And it's like, that doesn't sound that egregious to me, but all these reports came out that sort of defamed his character.

That the new Chad Brinker, president of football operations, is leading the GM search.

The new general manager will answer to Brinker on all personnel matters, roster matters, and all matters, which isn't typical for a GM.

Usually the GM has full roster control.

And it was so blatant that the NFL did a review into the new position that this is for the Titans and the job description to determine if they could interview assistant gm candidates to make sure that this was enough of a step up like a vertical move instead of a lateral move they did determine it to step up so that's good for the titans but the whole organizational structure feels weird there's not a lot of teams that have this structure i think the lions are one of them but even for the lions the general manager brad holmes still has final roster control so It's kind of a weird situation.

I think the Titans may be one of the most dysfunctional teams, organizations behind the scenes.

I think there is a constant constant power struggle that went from John Robinson, who was fired, to Mike Vrabel, who was fired, to Rand Carthon, who was fired, and now Chad Brinker is running the show.

And I don't know.

I'm not like a fan of what the Titans are doing, but I do think with the number one pick, if you hit on a quarterback, it papers over everything else.

And that is my only, I mean, that's the dream right now for us.

Justin kind of just did his, I think listeners just got one of Justin's Titans featurette podcasts right there.

That was a, you know, eight is a shit.

Let's not bury the lead here.

And we don't have to talk about

Euler's Gate anymore, Justin.

But the moment that you got behind that, the Titans helmet behind you stopped spinning.

And it's still not spinning.

You know what it was?

We lost power, and I never really said it.

Well, you lost power with your commentary on the Oilers' uniforms.

I think that we start right there.

Sure.

Just think about that.

It's still not spinning.

You wouldn't agree with it.

Literally, the Orley ceased to exist around the Tennessee Titans.

Right.

The energy, the goodwill.

Like, you would agree that

the public has come out and voiced their opinion on your opinion on that

issue.

And the good news is I talked all about that so we can move on to the next game and not spend too much time on this dysfunctional mess of a team.

Well said.

Well said.

That's what's happening in the news.

All right, back to the games.

The number seven Green Bay Packers in the NFC, but not your typical number seven seed.

You know what I mean?

I do.

I mean, this team won 11 games, nearly won 12.

Got picked off in the last seconds in the finale by the Bears.

But a very solid, rock-solid 11-win team traveling to Philadelphia to get the number two seed Eagles.

The Eagles getting four and a half points, Mark, but I love it.

I've been circling this one for a long time.

Game of the round.

Like, this is the best game of the round.

And this is where the season started down in

Brazil.

I love it.

I can read the headlines now after they denied Saquon Barkley's chance at history.

Oh, we need to be ready to go for the playoffs because we have bigger goals.

Oh, to go out one and done.

Oh, that would be so

delicious.

You're openly rooting

for the Green Bay Packers then.

That's

openly rooting against the Eagles.

There's bad blood between the Zuzzer and the Eagles fans.

When is it going to get cleared up?

We don't know, but not this week.

But in all reality, my real feeling about it is, I have been predicting there is going to be some type of inciting moment where Nick Siriani ends up in the crosshairs.

Could it be this week?

I don't know.

If it's not this week in the Eagles advance, it will be next week, or maybe the week after.

But this is a very difficult matchup for a number two seed at the end of the day, Mark, because usually you're getting a dead-ass number seven team that probably did not deserve to be in the playoffs.

That is not the Packers.

On the flip side, Mark, the Packers, we talked about this this a couple weeks ago.

Every time they've had a game against one of the Titans of the NFL,

not your Titans, Justin, one of the big dogs in the NFL.

And as much as I kid and have fun, the Eagles are one of the big dogs in the NFL.

They have fallen short.

They've lost to the Eagles in the first game of the season in Brazil or somewhere.

So

will the Packers show that they do have a next gear and can upset the Eagles, or will the Eagles take care of business in their building with Super Bowl on their mind?

They were also swept by the Lions and Vikings, so I think they're properly slotted against those teams where they are in the playoffs.

The different thing for me with Green Bay than all these other teams of the past is the defense, and they've been pretty good against the run.

Jeff Hapley's defense has improved on that level.

So I really do think this is an ⁇ it kind of reminds me of the Bills a little bit, where like Philly is explosive.

They could pour points on you if things go right.

Do you get Saquon running for 150 yards in the first half and like they're up 17 to three or something and the loss of Christian Watson matters a lot for Green Bay?

I think it matters they don't have Jair Alexander.

They haven't had him from

the most of the season, but they have given up major yardage in recent weeks to Justin Jefferson, to DJ Moore, to Jalen Naylor, to Jordan Addison.

What happens with A.J.

Brown?

Do we get an A.J.

Brown explosive first half?

Like, if I had to pick one team that could blow the doors off, it would easily, it would, for me, easily be the Eagles because their defense has been good too.

But, you know, I think it matters a lot that Jordan Love is healthy.

I was really concerned about that, but it sounds like he's fine.

And where do the big plays come from?

I guess it's like for me, it's Josh Jacobs and you keep the Eagles off the field.

Yeah, I think one thing that the Packers might look to invest in, even though I know LaFleur has been very, at times, pissy, quite frankly, about

this conversation.

But like that true number one wide receiver, the true difference maker that can step up.

And I say this as guys like Tyreek Hill are, you know, openly talking about going out the door.

And there's always options out there that you Garrett Wilson is unhappy with the Jets.

Like guys like that, like what would that look like in this offense with Christian Watson, who isn't like, you know, a week-to-week cog that puts up big production.

But yeah, he was a field stretcher and played an important role in the offense.

So the Packers not having that true dog to go to at wide receiver, at least right now, will that lead to them

being held in check by a very good Philadelphia secondary?

And the Eagles, Mark, deserve a lot of credit for how quickly they built that defense back up.

And

obviously, Howie deserves all the credit for that and adding big pieces.

So

the possibility of the Packers wideouts and pass catchers being locked down at that point, yeah, if Jacobs doesn't find a way to neutralize that, then I think they're going to be in a lot of trouble, the Packers in this game.

So it is a good spot for the Eagles, but also the Packers, there's a reason I agreed with you.

They are a team that could win the Super Bowl.

They could show up as the best version of themselves, as they've done at times this year, and they could beat anybody, I think.

So it's a great game, a beautiful wild card round game.

It really is.

I mean, if you take out that wild Commanders Eagles showdown that they lost, You have to go back to week nine, where they allowed more than 20 points in a game.

The defense is playing very well.

And so I think it's Green Bay's challenge to create two or three explosive plays that change this game if you're not running the ball the way you want.

And I think you're right.

Like, you could point to the fact that they've got a lot of interesting young weapons, but who's the guy that takes over the game?

Someone's going to need to, and you're going to have to find a way.

The one thing I do want to see, like, Jalen Hurts is back.

He's healthy.

It sounds like it.

But something about that concussion situation that we never heard from him for ages.

He's just wiped out of the lineup.

I just wonder what Jalen Hurts we get in this game.

There's just a chance where he's not heading out.

It's a brain injury.

So you're right.

Like, you don't know

where he's at.

At the same time, because of the strange setup in the NFC this year and those superpowers in the NFC North, the Eagles felt like they were kind of just locked out of movement in their conference for the last couple of weeks, and it allowed them to

play it safe.

Siriani said on Friday that Hurts was out of the protocol, quote, ready to roll against the Packers.

He sustained that concussion in the first quarter against the Commanders on December 22nd.

So by the time they play, obviously, he's had a nice window to get right.

And

you hope he is right and is the best version of himself.

This game, to me, yeah, comes down to

do you have a healthy Hurts?

And is Saquon Barkley now take what he did in the regular season?

And all the stuff and all the decisions that were made around Barkley and not chasing the Dickerson record in part was so you get the best version of Saquon Barkley in this game.

And in what's been

a really special season for the running back, does he continue to build on that with a monster round?

You'd kind of be foolish to bet against him not stepping up and having a big game.

And he is, as much as the defense and the rebelt back end of Philadelphia's defense has changed their fortunes this year, Barkley being the best version of Barkley behind a still great offensive line is what makes the Eagles a Super Bowl contender.

I'm with you.

And I'm going Eagles 27, Packers 21.

I kind of wish this was the Monday night game, but no arguments.

Saquon in some of these games has got it started really early, and I think that matters here, and I think that's what we get.

I think they're able to control the game, but it's going to look closer than it maybe is.

All right.

I agree with everything you said.

Yes, Justin, what do you got?

I am taking the Packers in this one to pull off the upset.

Matt LaFleur has pulled off playoff upsets before in Green Bay.

I think Jordan Love is playing at a high level again, and I think he's going to be healthy.

That's obviously a big deal, but Hurts also coming off a period of, you know, not playing, maybe having a little bit of rust.

Nick Siriani was asked if he's he's worried about the rust, but I am.

Nick Siriani may not be.

I am.

I'm taking the Packers 24-22.

We can't all pick the same team.

I mean, I was about to dramatically pick the Packers, and now it doesn't seem so dramatic.

Oh, shit.

I'm off kilt.

You know what?

This situation in Los Angeles is affecting all of us differently.

It's all good.

It's all good.

Yeah,

how could I, after all my madness and nonsense,

pick pick the Eagles in the first round of the playoffs?

Let's go, Pac.

Let's do this.

Let's have Nick Siriani fist fighting Dom at the end of this game.

You know what I mean?

It's like Dom just absolutely

like that

punch that you'll see in like bar fights where the guy is he's out cold before he even hits the ground.

You want that?

Dom.

Just sick of the shit.

And then Dom going to Siriani's press conference and naming himself head coach

before being arrested and led away.

And then

they get outside the stadium, they get outside the link, and because he's friends with all the cops, obviously Dom.

They go, hey, man, you know, this was just for appearances.

And they like, and take the cuffs off.

And Dom's like, hey, man, I appreciate you.

And they like throw it out.

And then Dom hops into a Lambo and drives off.

It's like a Central American coup d'état to some degree where there's no actual rhyme or rule or rhyme here.

And then like smash cut back to the Eagle sideline.

There's nothing left but Gatorade and like old gum and tape from like wrists and everything.

And it's still Sirian is just laid out, still there as the lights turn off on the stadium roll credits.

This is like a damn fantasy world that we exist in now.

All right, next.

This team won 14 games, by the way, just letting you know.

I know, I know.

You're right.

You're right.

You're right.

But, you know, like my scenario, it's plausible, right?

Maybe not a Lambo, I don't know, but like everything else is.

Plausible is the word I'd use.

I mean, it's plausible that Big Dom goes and announces himself as head coach before.

That's my favorite part of it.

We should mention Jordan Love, who had that elbow issue

that took him out of the finale against the Bears.

He practiced in full capacity Thursday.

He's good to go.

He doesn't have any more numbness in his hand, but his elbow is still a little bit sore.

So he's playing, but both quarterbacks, let's see what they look like once the games happen.

All right, let's take a break and then we'll finish out this preview.

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All right, we're back.

All right, Mark.

I know you have this one circled.

It's the Sunday night game.

Terico Collinsworth Stark will be there with NBC.

The Washington Commanders with their super rookie Jaden Daniels, a full practice participant Wednesday and Thursday.

He had a little bit of a quad issue.

He should be good to go Sunday against Baker, Mayfield, and the Bucs, who moved up to the number three seed by virtue of their week 18 win paired with a Rams loss.

Bucs getting three points here.

Another game, a total coin flip game, Mark.

And I'm curious what you think about it.

This is the biggest coin flip to me.

And I would not,

I don't feel like you mine your way through the season, get a home playoff game, and then have to deal with a pretty freaky commanders team based on the fact that no matter when it feels like you've killed them, they're never really dead.

And I'd be most concerned if you're up by 10 points with four minutes to go in the fourth quarter and they've got the ball because I kind of trust them to wiggle their way out of any issues.

What I do like, though, for Tampa Bay,

they that what's different about this team, obviously, than when the last year's Bucs or the Tom Brady Bucks is that they're really balanced on offense.

Bucky Irvin, they can run the ball.

They're very punishing.

Baker Mayfield's had his most successful year on the ground.

And each game, there's three or four dashes where Baker Mayfield converts, moves the chains, and just seems driven and possessed to use that part of his game.

And Washington has been the fourth worst rushing defense.

So to me, it adds up if you get Mike Evans, you get Jalen McMillan through the air, but then you can really control the ground game and be balanced.

I think that's how you keep, I kind of want to keep Jaden Daniels just off the field.

And the Bucs have done a nice job in recent weeks, last month, of long double-digit play drives where they've kept the ball for a long amount of time.

Whether it's even been field goals, it's like they're able to, they're not a big play one and done offense.

Like they really can move the ball with the ground game.

So I think you want to just like, almost in a boring, methodical fashion, keep Washington out of the mix.

Yeah, I think you hit on it, and it's something that we haven't put a lot of focus on, and nobody's really put a ton of focus on.

That because Baker is such a fun guy to root for, and he's the best version of himself, and he's very much more than maybe any other player in the league, like the identity of the Bucs, that you could just focus on the Bucs passing game and Evans, of course, the dramatics of the season finale and all that.

But their running game has been excellent this year.

Bucky Irving is obviously not going to win Offensive Rookie of the Year.

A running back is usually not going to win that, especially with Jaden Daniels in the league and also some historic seasons from tight ends in this league.

It's been a good rookie class, but this guy ran for 1,100 yards.

He had nearly 400 yards receiving.

So over 1,500 total yards, eight touchdowns rushing, averaging almost five and a half yards a carry.

And as a group, the Buccaneers, led, obviously, by Irving, have been absolute monsters on the ground, averaging over 183 yards a game in the past seven weeks running the football.

So a perfect setup for Baker, giving us that balance.

And now you're facing a Washington defense that has improved as the season's gone along.

But they are near the very bottom of the league.

Their 30th, in fact, defense against the run.

So I think what you're going to see from Liam Cohen and Todd Bowles is a run-heavy approach.

If Baker needs to start slinging it, and Baker will always have moments where he is at the center of their offense, but I think they're going to say the way to beat this commanders team is run the football, control the clock, keep Daniels off the field.

And I think they can do that.

And even though I'm like, we went through that exercise at the top of the show, Mark, about like who could win the Super Bowl.

And I was like, yeah, I could, I could see Washington being one of those teams.

I kind of like the Bucs in this game as we're talking about it.

And that might end up being my pick.

What do you think?

Yeah, I think this is like this is one where home field matters a lot.

The Bucs seem to have some sort of magical energy at home.

They really do.

I guess I'd get concerned because they've had a banged up secondary.

They are one of the worst teams against the pass.

And if you get Terry McLaurin and Jaden Daniels just in sync and they're hot, like do the

Bucs can win shootouts.

And they dominated Washington in the opener, but that feels like four universes ago.

But the thing that sticks to me there to some degree is that the Bucs offense was dominant in that game.

I don't care about the Jaden Daniels side of it.

That was his first game as a pro, but is it a matchup thing where the Bucs just match up well with Washington versus some of these other teams that Washington's like poured points on?

But you can pass on the Bucs.

So I think it's like, could this be the kind of thing where it's like, we're watching this thing in the fourth quarter and it's 36 to 30?

I wouldn't be surprised.

Yeah, that's where I'm at, too.

I think

this has got game of the week written all over it.

I could see

it going either way.

It's a total coin flip for me.

I'm going to go

Commanders ahead late by a field goal, and then Baker has a big moment at home.

That place goes nuts.

They score a touchdown.

35-31 bucks over the Commanders.

I'm really close to you.

I'm going, like the score I just picked, I'm going 36, Tampa Bay 36, Commanders 30 in overtime, though.

So it's a walk-off touchdown that gives the Bucs the victory.

What do you got, Justin?

I've got the Commanders.

I've got

I'm seeing in my head a slow first half for Washington where Tampa Bay gets up maybe, you know, two scores or in that range, and then the Commanders turn it on.

Jaden Daniels ignites, and they lead a comeback.

Commanders win 31-28.

Solid.

Solid.

Rock solid.

Dan's still annoyed that you usurped his surprise Packers pick from the previous

game.

That's going to linger.

That's going to be later.

Can I be completely honest with what happened there?

I was.

What else would you be?

Deceitful.

I was

making sure our ad reads were ready to go that we have to tape after we do this recording and wasn't paying full attention.

And after I heard Mark give his prediction, I assumed that Dan had already gone.

So

that's what happened.

Because I did leap you, Dan.

That's not how this show has gone.

I leaped you.

So that's the thing.

Listen,

the show's a two-hander, Mark.

I mean, it's right there in the title.

You can leap.

Justin, I appreciate your honesty, your candor,

and everything you do for us.

So there is.

Thanks.

I'm okay, and you're okay, and we're okay.

In fact, it's actually secretly Mark who's mega-pissed at you about this.

Yeah, I'm holding on to it inside, as you can see.

Justin has been an asset to us, man.

All right, last game, right?

Here we go.

Vikings.

Best fifth seed ever.

Maybe.

14 and three.

At Rams.

And this game was supposed to be at SoFi Stadium, but because of the fires, the NFL moved the game to Arizona.

That was announced on Thursday night.

A decision made in the interest of public safety as the wildfires continue to chew up our beautiful Southern California and Los Angeles landscape.

So that, and that matters, Mark.

This has been a Rams game that, a Rams team that has played very well at home this year.

And to me, that was one of the things, me trying to convince myself of this being

a close game.

And it can be, but I think moving the game to a neutral site,

and I know there are more rabid Vikings fans than there are Rams fans.

Like, this is going, this might even turn into a kind of a Vikings home game

on a neutral field.

I could absolutely see that being a pro-Vikings crowd here.

And I expect it to be, quite frankly.

So the Rams catch a bad break there just within the, you know, very...

There are much bigger things in the world, but within the NFL realm, the game getting moved to Arizona is a bit of a ding for them.

And I think everyone's eyes, Mark, are going to be on, I think, Sam Darnold here because Darnold has been one of the biggest stories in the league, the great comeback campaign, and there's no way around it.

Even in the Darnold Hive, we do not look the other way.

We understand that Sam Darnold did not play well in the biggest game of the year with all the eyeballs on him.

The Hive is still active.

The Hive still believes in Sam Darnold.

But Sam Darnold has a lot to prove in this game, and

they need Sam Darnold to get off the mat.

I think he will.

And I've said this last week.

I think the Vikings will show up here.

I fully expect the Vikings to advance out of the first round.

But until we see what Darnold looks like early in this game, we're not going to know for sure.

You will know that Darnold is struggling again if you see those balls sailing again.

That's when Darnold struggles.

The ball sails, and that could lead to turnovers and missed opportunities as we saw against the Lions.

I just don't view the Vikings holistically as a back-to-back.

lay an egg type team.

And I don't view Darnold that way.

I think you're going to get a clean, motivated version of Darnold.

You're right about something else.

I mean, this is a tough Rams defense.

They gave up 24 points between weeks 15 and 17 before they sat their starters against the Seahawks.

But that's been kind of quietly the story of the Rams is their young defense.

But is it, does that work against Justin Jefferson and Jordan Addison?

And Addison's been huge for this offense.

And I think that the Vikings are going to want to create some big plays out of the gate to take away any doubts sitting in Darnold's mind.

I don't think he's built that way.

I think he, this is, this guy is going to come out and play, I think, like the way that we expect.

I really do.

I think it matters so much, and you mentioned it, that if you're the Rams, because

your families are dotted all over the landscape and probably many of them affected quite a bit by what's happened, because it really depends what part of LA you're in.

You've got to leave your family behind in this situation and go to, and they're used to some, it's not the Bills, like they're used to playing at SoFi and hearing a lot of visiting crowd like that's that's sort of been part of their dna and they can do that technically but i think it's just like this journey of of gaining a home playoff game and you've got to go somewhere else where we were even joking last night but just asking like who's at this game who's buying tickets this like are the vikings fans that were going to fly to la rerouting themselves to phoenix and are ram are rams fans from la going to go to phoenix it seems like a weird weekend to go do that so who's at this thing i don't know but it's a weird it's like we don't see playoff games like this and i think that all all that stuff matters, but if you're the Rams, you got to shut it out and just be like, it's us against the world.

And they have had many games at SoFi like that.

So I think of any team for that to happen to, they're kind of better adjusted to that situation.

And they're well run.

I mean,

they have from the top down the organization with Sean McVay.

I think they'll be prepared for this.

I mean, the distractions, if you want to talk about outside distractions, to your point, are off the charts.

They're practicing this week outside with the city on fire behind them.

And obviously,

everything

has taken a back seat in our region to this terrible tragedy, an ongoing tragedy.

And, yeah, to get on a plane to play a playoff game, it's just

a tough situation.

Then, on top of it, you're playing, like we said, one of the better wildcard teams ever in the Vikings, a team that can beat you in different ways.

And defensive coordinator Brian Flores, who obviously is going to cook up a game plan meant to flummix Matthew Stafford.

Now, Stafford played very well when these two teams met in week eight, and

he did a very good job in terms of connecting with his receivers.

The Vikings' pass rush faltered in that game, and so

can Stafford do it again in this spot.

Puka Nakua, who that was his first game back from the injury the first time they played, and he went over 100 yards in that game and looked very good.

I expect him to eat as he always does.

I want to see what we get from Cooper Cup, who disappeared down the stretch, as fantasy managers can attest.

But even beyond that, you kept on waiting for him to come back and go in the last three or four weeks, and he just was off the grid for them for the most part.

I think they need to actually be a tangible Super Bowl contender, a team that you can imagine winning multiple games.

He's going to have to be some version of the Cooper Cup that we've gotten to know to give the team the balance in its passing game and its passing attack.

So I like the Vikings in this game.

This is a bit of a soft spot pick for me because I do really hope that Darnold, because it would be terrible for Darnold

if the season ended with another egg.

And it would probably, honestly, like to put pressure on the guy's shoulders, it would probably lead to him leaving the organization.

As crazy as it sounds,

if he flatlined against the Lions in week 18 and then had a terrible playoff performance, I would think that would be enough for organizationally for them to go to the rookie and let Darnold walk in free agency.

I could see that as a path if this ends a certain way.

I just don't think it will end that way, Mark.

I think I like the Vikings in this game.

I like at 31 to 24,

the Rams go home.

I really agree with you about Darnold.

The one thing about Darnold is like, he's the kind of quarterback where you could get that one killer error that changes everything.

But

Stafford's available for that too at times.

And he's been hot and cold, no doubt about it.

I'm with you though.

The coaching matchup is huge here.

And I think if you're Darnold,

whether or not you stay with the organization,

if you show up in this playoff game and then even if they melt away next week,

you're talking about personal wealth and millions and millions of dollars based on what people will think of you on the last time they saw you.

So this matters for a lot of reasons for him as a human being.

I've got Vikings 28, Rams Rams 25.

I think it's going to be a classic like right down to the last couple minutes.

Justin.

You guys are high scoring, higher scoring than I'm going to go in this one.

So I filled out my playoff bracket.

I picked the Vikings.

I kind of wish I'd picked the Rams now, but I'm going to stick with my bracket on this show.

So I'm going to pick the Vikings.

And I'm keeping it lower scoring, 19-16.

You know what stands out in my head is that matchup where the Sam Darnold face mask and how the Vikings just couldn't get anything going earlier in the season that you were referencing earlier.

And I just feel like Kevin O'Connell, I trust him to figure something out, but I also am filled with concern for the Vikings just based on how that first matchup went.

Everybody's been waiting to

bury Darnold.

Everyone's been waiting for him to fall on his face all season.

Do you feel that way?

I feel like Darnold's changed a lot of...

A lot of mindsets.

I think there's a big segment that have begrudgingly went along, like the Michael Sean Duke Guards of the World.

And I don't even mean that as a put-down, but like that have been like, yeah, it's been really good.

But, you know, every time he falters, there's this idea that he's about to come back to the guy that you remembered on the Jets.

And I just think he's in a totally different situation with different personnel around him, a much better coaching staff, and he's matured and improved as a player.

So I'd be very surprised.

And that's why the perfect challenge will be intact with the Vikings taking care of business.

By the way, Mark, this was a huge.

Oh, go ahead.

Well, I was going to say, one of the three of us are not going to win this perfect challenge thing.

We've varied ourselves.

Let's face none of the three of us are going to win the perfect challenge.

Look at the other contests we've been involved in.

I picked the lower seed to win every NFC playoff game and the higher seed to win every AFC playoff game.

So there's no way that happens.

You have the heart of a champion, Justin.

That's what that is.

When you talk about bravery in Southern California right now, I think about Justin Graver's NFL playoff picks.

By the way, a huge This Matters show for Mark.

Your This Matters usage off the charts in today's show.

In what way are we discussing that?

What did I do?

This matters.

I think this matters.

Oh, did I say that multiple times?

A lot.

Yeah.

Like if we had a this matters, like if we had a, just in a this matters ding, it would be

ding.

I think that, and I heard a lot of version of.

So, you know, we've, we've, we've got our.

Why would I be wasting people's time with something that doesn't matter?

Why do I need to classify that as that it matters?

Like, if I'm wasting the listener's time with multiple sentences that don't matter, probably.

Right, this doesn't matter.

You're right.

I mean, you've absolutely nailed this.

If you were just littering the show with this doesn't matter,

that would be a waste of time.

But no, you're telling the audience what does matter.

And that.

This matters with Mark Sessler.

Sounds like a great Patreon exclusive, by the way.

It really does.

Like,

it's got a 1980s sort of PSA feel to it.

Or, like, I'm just giving you ideas in an editor-type role, like

your next edition of I Dream in Red around the inauguration.

Like, this matters.

That's not.

I find that.

I'm not proud to be an American, where at least I know I'm free.

The problem with this bit is, I have to actually clarify for people each time that that's not what that

scene slash newsletter is about.

You call it a bug.

I call it what really makes the machine operate.

Like subscription rates have tumbled due to this bit.

It's taking money out of my pocket as well, but it's like all worth it.

It's worth it.

Okay.

Well

exciting.

All right.

In all seriousness.

Thank you to everybody for your thoughts

and checking in on us.

And hope hope everybody

we get through this in LA and we'll be back, God willing, Sunday night recapping every show that we just previewed here and

recapping every game we just previewed here.

And that's it.

So again, this was nice, Mark.

We could just talk some football and forget about what's going on outside.

And now let's just hope LA catches a break and we get out of this.

Yep.

Kind of classic to do it, the three of us, but we'll have Jordan and Mike back in post-haste next week.

So back to the grind.

Back to the grind.

All right.

And we'll resume.

Yes.

And we'll resume our fearless predictions next week and get that contest back on track.

Kind of a big deal that we're going to not have a week of scoring for you guys who have to basically get it right every week to even.

Oh, contrafuer.

We're going to double the stakes like a skins competition in the divisional round.

Worth double.

Rule change.

All right, till next time

Rule change change.

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