BORDER ANGELS EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR JESUS GONZALEZ

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Speaker 2 My guest today, Jesus Gonzalez, is the executive director of the non-profit organization Border Angels.

Speaker 2 They advocate for human rights, humane immigration reform, and social justice.

Speaker 2 Their work is done in an attempt to reduce the number of fatalities along the USA-Mexico border by educating and assisting communities on both sides of the border.

Speaker 2 They have a huge variety of services, including educational educational programs, water and food drops throughout the desert, day labor outreach, familias reunidas, which means reuniting families that get separated, shelter, aid, support in Tijuana, and much more.

Speaker 2 I think this is such an important conversation now more than ever with newly president-elect Trump talking about mass deportation, talking about declaring a state of emergency.

Speaker 2 I think no matter which side of the conversation you're in, the more we educate ourselves always the better. So I hope you guys enjoy the super important conversation with Jesus.

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Speaker 2 It's such an honor having you here.

Speaker 1 Well, thank you. And I'm honored to be here.
What an amazing opportunity. So thank you.

Speaker 2 I know how busy you are, I guess, now more than ever, but I have to say I'm very grateful. Number one, for being an immigrant.
This is such an important topic for me.

Speaker 2 But I think now more than ever with immigration, I know a lot of people are not in arms. A lot of immigrants, illegal immigrants are freaking out, afraid.

Speaker 2 I've been getting hundreds and hundreds of messages. So I really appreciate you being here on the show.

Speaker 2 And maybe you can help us clarify, you know, regarding what's going on on the borders and help us figure out, you know,

Speaker 2 give us guidelines throughout this chaos.

Speaker 1 I will do my best.

Speaker 1 And of course, you know, I don't, I'm not the, I don't have an answer for everything, but I can offer you our, you know, call our phone number at the office and we will get you the information that you need.

Speaker 1 So don't worry about it. We're here to help.

Speaker 2 Okay, so first and foremost, let's put it out there. What's the number in case somebody's out there desperately listening?

Speaker 1 Okay, and I've got my card here since I don't have to remember. 619-487-0249.

Speaker 2 Okay, great. So we got that out of the way.
We're going to repeat it several times.

Speaker 2 And the link for their website, guys, is attached to this episode because we really, really, really want anybody out there that feels they need help. to be able to reach out to you guys.

Speaker 2 So right now, right after the elections, you are down there in San Diego. You are near the border.
What is the mood? Do you feel a big change once Trump got elected?

Speaker 1 I don't know that there was a really big change because there's, you know, there's always been tension around immigration and policies and stuff.

Speaker 1 I know that Biden did what some make some changes and Kamala Harris had some too, but there's always been tension on the border. So

Speaker 1 again, what I would say to you is that in the couple of interviews that I've done

Speaker 1 with some of the community, is that there's a great sense of fear and concern for what happens next.

Speaker 1 I think, you know, rightfully so, there's been, there's a history in this country of mass deportations on several occasions. And so I think that's what people are fearing.

Speaker 1 Now, having said that to you, I've also heard many, many accounts of people feeling very empowered to try and make change and try to respond to what's coming up. specifically around, you know,

Speaker 1 I don't know if you saw the information out there about Los Angeles taking on

Speaker 1 the title of Sanctuary City.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I actually literally just

Speaker 2 before we started our interview, I saw that maybe about seven hours ago, right, they declared that they are going to

Speaker 2 Yeah, they declared themselves sanctuary city. They're going to stop

Speaker 2 giving funds for, you know, to aid deportation and all that stuff. Yeah, I did.

Speaker 1 Exactly. And I think that's what will happen in this community as well.

Speaker 1 Again, I'm one of those very optimistic people.

Speaker 1 And so I like to, you know, again, if half of the country is in support of, you know, the Trump policies, I want to remind everyone that half of the country is not. So it's...

Speaker 1 It's both of us, right? We have an opportunity here. And

Speaker 1 yeah, so again, people are afraid looking to what will happen next because there's a lot of,

Speaker 1 you know, nasty stories out there and whatnot. But at the same time,

Speaker 1 there's a lot of people who have learned from what's happened in the past and are ready to fight the fight.

Speaker 2 Yeah, so

Speaker 2 obviously he's talking about this mass deportations. I think he's even talking about declaring a state of emergency so he can use the military, right?

Speaker 2 This sounds extremely radical. Normally, I don't like talking about politics, you know, coming from Brazil, which is a country with horrible politics.

Speaker 2 I try to stay away from it, but I feel it's the first time in my life I have to speak up because, like I said, I'm an immigrant.

Speaker 2 I've never been an illegal immigrant, but I love that you guys say that. And it's really important.
You are advocates for a humane immigration reform.

Speaker 2 And I love that. And I completely agree.
There are very, I think there should be a very humane way to do it. And in my eyes, the way he's talking about is like very aggressive,

Speaker 2 just very scary.

Speaker 2 Do you, do you, do you, because you must talk to a lot of these, these people crossing the border, right? You must talk to a lot of illegals. You must talk to a lot of people in detention.

Speaker 2 Do you do you think they're afraid of these mass deportations? Do you think they're afraid of Trump actually putting the military out there?

Speaker 1 I think so. I would, I mean, again, like I told you before, I don't have direct contact with a lot of people.

Speaker 1 The few people I've talked to are really just tired and looking for some way to get settled and start their lives. And by the way, I'm an immigrant too.
I'm from Cuba.

Speaker 1 And, you know, my parents brought us here. And

Speaker 1 I just, you know, I'm sad that this country that has been so good for me and that I have been able to support and contribute to

Speaker 1 is,

Speaker 1 again, that's what some of these people are. That's all they want.
That's all they want is an opportunity for a good life. And it's really tragic.
So anyway, I'm sorry. I forgot your question.

Speaker 2 No, my question was, do you think that there are a lot of people? out there arriving now or a lot of these people who are here illegally that are afraid of of his

Speaker 2 his tactics of actually throwing everybody out and separating families and putting the military out on the streets, you know?

Speaker 1 Yeah, no, it is pretty dramatic. And again, I don't want to speak for anybody.
I think that people who

Speaker 1 immigrate here have great concerns regardless of whether it's Trump or another president. So there's a lot of risk that people take,

Speaker 1 really put themselves at such great risk, give up so much to come to this country. And

Speaker 1 so I, you know, again, I think this just makes it more intense.

Speaker 1 But I think they all have, they have those concerns anyway.

Speaker 1 And rightfully so, rightfully so, because that we have plenty of proof that

Speaker 1 there is, you know, the children being separated at the border.

Speaker 1 Again, lots of examples of abuse, lots of examples of abuse.

Speaker 2 Which is something that, like you said, we are Americans and it's heartbreaking to know that that in our beautiful country which was built by immigrants these things are happening right yeah yeah it just it breaks my heart i really wish and i don't know if we're gonna see i i honestly don't think we're gonna see that in our lifetime but i really wish there would be a way of handling it but but in a very kind

Speaker 2 and nice manner, especially when it comes to children, you know, because children, at the end of the day, they're always innocent victims, of course. They don't even know what's going on.

Speaker 1 They don't know what's going on. They are being brought here by adults and again, doing being with their families, being with their loved ones.
And

Speaker 1 yeah, I mean, near and dear to my heart. That's why the Green Cards program is so important to me because we're advocating for those children that have been separated from their families.

Speaker 2 Yeah, we're definitely going to talk about that. Now, a few weeks ago, I finished shooting a movie.
It's coming out in the beginning of 2025. It's called 40 Days.

Speaker 1 Congratulations.

Speaker 2 Thank you. And it's exactly about, and it's by an award-winning director that I love so much.
His name is Peter Tekla. He's an Egyptian immigrant.

Speaker 2 But this movie is exactly about what we're talking about. It's about immigrants crossing the desert.
to come to the United States illegally.

Speaker 2 And as I was shooting the movie, my part in the movie is very small. I played one of the coyotes.

Speaker 2 Wow. And I, and, and it's the first time in my life that I was behind the camera as one of the producers.
But as I was playing one of the coyotes, and we were not shooting on stage, right?

Speaker 2 We were not shooting on set. We literally were shooting out in the woods

Speaker 2 in the Tahonga Mountains in the elements.

Speaker 2 So as I was shooting the movie, I was getting very emotional. It was a very, for all of us, of course, especially for the actors playing, playing, you know, these immigrants.

Speaker 2 I'm standing there 12 hours, 18 hours, you know, and I'm having to mistreat these people because that's my character.

Speaker 2 And I was thinking to myself, wow, right now, at this given moment, there are people actually out there in the real desert, right?

Speaker 2 Risking their lives.

Speaker 2 Many, many times they get murdered by these coyotes. They get left behind by these coyotes.

Speaker 2 to and they so throughout they hope they're gonna reach the u.s border but they don't know right has correct so this is my question to you which i don't i don't even know if you can answer but that's the part that all is always always mind-boggling to me

Speaker 2 i mean why would anybody risk their life is it worth it is is their life that bad that they're like i'm gonna grab my backpack and i'm gonna go for it yeah um again I don't have any personal experience, but I can tell you that through the water drop program, which is amazing, right?

Speaker 1 We're out there leaving water and food and we know that we're saving lives because we have had people who crossed the desert and found the food and found the water and then came back to us and said, thank you so much.

Speaker 1 You saved my life. If you hadn't done that, I don't know that I would have made it.

Speaker 1 And in fact, the beauty there is that those same people then want to volunteer to work and volunteer as a water drop volunteer and do it for others because they know how important it is.

Speaker 1 But to answer your question, I can only guess,

Speaker 1 because again, I want to reiterate that people are giving up everything,

Speaker 1 their culture, their home, their language, family, friends to do that. And I think there has to be a really, really difficult circumstance that happens.

Speaker 1 Now, I know that some people are doing it because

Speaker 1 they're being persecuted. Their family members have been killed.

Speaker 1 In fact, in the documentary that we're showing tomorrow, it talks about some of these people who lost family members and they really had no choice. It was either stay and die or try to escape.

Speaker 1 But yeah, no, I think people think long and hard before

Speaker 1 make that journey.

Speaker 1 And again, always with the hope that they will have a better life.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it's interesting that you said that because that's another thing, too, that I think this government, many times they give people this impression.

Speaker 2 And I also think a lot of Americans, they think, oh, these illegals are all criminals. And it's far from true.
Some of them are. Yeah, some of them are, yes.
But I think that's the minority.

Speaker 2 Like you said, most of them really just want a chance at a better life. And I think you mentioned something.
A lot of them are many times running away from the cartels, right?

Speaker 2 Their lives are threatened by the cartels.

Speaker 2 Their families got murdered. They don't have food.
They don't have anything. And they're just so desperate.

Speaker 2 Because, like you said, I think people forget when you're crossing the desert and you can die there halfway through,

Speaker 2 you're taking a huge risk. You're not like coming here for fun, like, oh, I'm going to go to Disneyland, or oh, I'm going to go there and steal somebody's Rolex, you know? Yeah.

Speaker 2 And it's so important to shed light on this part of their story.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I want to, you know, again, let's add to that.

Speaker 1 And I think that this is also really important because that stereotype of criminals is also related to Latinos and how it's all of these people who are crossing are from Mexico.

Speaker 1 And that is simply not true.

Speaker 1 There are wars happening in other countries, and people are fleeing those wars, specifically like in Ukraine, and coming or trying to cross the border to come to this country because they're fleeing war.

Speaker 1 And so that

Speaker 1 perception of one particular group is just not true. There are people coming here from, like I said, Ukraine, China, Haiti, Venezuela, I mean, from everywhere.

Speaker 1 And so, again, that's why Border Angels is around because we're trying to look at that and say, okay, how do we help these people from all these different countries with different languages and different cultures?

Speaker 1 How do we help them

Speaker 1 get them the resources that they're looking for?

Speaker 1 in the culture, in the language that they need,

Speaker 1 connecting them with whoever can help them.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it's so tough. You mentioned for people that

Speaker 2 a lot of people didn't even understand. You were talking about the water drop.
And it's literally what you said. You guys go out there

Speaker 2 to the crossing where they are, and you literally leave water and food, correct?

Speaker 1 That's right. That's right.
Because

Speaker 2 yeah, can you go ahead? Go ahead.

Speaker 1 Yeah, no, no, I was just going to say, you know, I'm very grateful to the volunteers that we have.

Speaker 1 We have a tremendous group of people who are so committed to this and who have the health and energy to climb those mountains.

Speaker 1 And, you know, what they do is they'll go out and look for places where people have left trash, which is

Speaker 1 a way for them to know that someone is using that path. And so they pick up all that trash and leave fresh water.

Speaker 1 And so with the hope that that person, that the people on that same journey will find it when they get there and help them survive.

Speaker 1 Again, during, like you said, you were out there 16 hours. You know how hot it gets and how cold.

Speaker 2 Oh my God. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And like I said, and we were acting. So of course, you know, you say,

Speaker 2 take a break and we have food, we have water, we have coats, we have jackets. But as I was there, of course, my brain and I remember the main actress.

Speaker 2 You know, there was a scene that they're crossing this little river and her shoes were soaking wet, soaking wet, soaking wet. That's right.
And she was exhausted. She's an actress.

Speaker 2 And at one point, we looked at each other and we had tears in our eyes because we were like, can you imagine that there is someone out there right now going through this, but she doesn't have a warm shower.

Speaker 2 She doesn't have other shoes to put on. She doesn't know if she's going to make it.
She doesn't know if she's going to die out here because these coyotes, that's another thing too, right?

Speaker 2 They take these people's money and they say, let's say, whatever, give me $10,000, give me $15,000. But they're not treating them like, you know, tour guides.

Speaker 1 Right. It's not a tour guide.
And again,

Speaker 1 you know, you talk about coyotes and I want to clarify for you that there's also wild animals in the desert as well. So there's, there's, you know, there's fear of being attacked.

Speaker 1 And you talked about this woman crossing the water. Imagine her with two children.
Imagine her being pregnant. You know,

Speaker 1 again, another misnomer is that people say it's just men, but it's not. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 2 It's families. It's little children.

Speaker 1 It's families. So, so again, how can we not treat them humanely? And I understand that it's against the law and we have to address that as well.
But

Speaker 1 let's do it humanely. Yes.
Let's do it humanely.

Speaker 2 So let's address that because, of course, I know a lot of people are going to listen to the podcast. And so let's play devil's advocate.
Because

Speaker 2 let's be honest, most of the country voted for Trump. A lot of people agree with mass deportation.
A lot of Americans are going to listen and say, you know what? They're illegals.

Speaker 2 They shouldn't, shouldn't be here. They shouldn't be in our country.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 2 So.

Speaker 2 And I completely agree with you. I'm a huge advocate for some kind of a

Speaker 2 very humane immigration reform. How do we do that? Do you have any idea where would we even start?

Speaker 1 That's a really good question. And again, this is where we have to look at

Speaker 1 who are the people out there advocating and whatnot and being vocal, but making sure that they are being heard at the...

Speaker 1 in the government, right? Because that's where it's all going to happen. So advocacy is really, really important.

Speaker 1 And I feel very grateful that that there are so many groups out there working very, very hard to make this. But it is a tremendous challenge.
Let's be realistic. It won't happen in one year.

Speaker 1 It won't happen in four years. Long after Trump is gone, we will still be debating this.
So,

Speaker 1 you know, all I can say is that I am grateful to be a part of it. And I encourage everyone to participate at whatever level they can, whether it's volunteering, giving money,

Speaker 1 talking to senators, talking to government officials, and talking about, because again, yes, you're right.

Speaker 1 You know, Trump won the election fair and square, but that doesn't mean that he represents everyone. And for those people who do not believe in these policies, they have to step forward.

Speaker 1 They have to participate.

Speaker 1 And again,

Speaker 1 do it legally. Do it professionally.
Do it with kindness, right?

Speaker 1 There's a lot of people who are being angry and whatnot. That's not going to work.
We have to be.

Speaker 1 We don't want to be that person. We want to be the kind person who represents the people we want to serve.

Speaker 1 If that makes any sense.

Speaker 2 No, I agree with you 1 million percent. And you know, to me, and tell me if you agree with me or you think I'm being too simplistic.

Speaker 2 I always thought about when I think about these people right that come in here, okay, somebody's illegal. I think it's a very easy way to solve the problem.

Speaker 2 I don't think immigration is like one size fits all because each person is different. So let's say someone comes in here and they have a job for whatever, 10 years, 15 years.

Speaker 2 they are contributing to society, they're not bothering anybody. Okay, give them a visa, let them stay because that's what we want.
We want somebody that's contributing and paying taxes.

Speaker 2 I think it should be a very simple solution, a case-by-case decision, as opposed to like when they go in front of this detention center, whatever it is, these attorneys, they treat everybody like a number, like the law.

Speaker 2 And I never understand that because why would you treat, okay, somebody is a criminal. If somebody committed a crime, I agree to roll them out.

Speaker 2 But there are people that have been here for 10, 15 years the other day i saw on tv this lady that has been working in some she picks crops tomatoes i forgot the details for 20 years she doesn't bother anybody that's all she does day and night night and day she picks crops and she works for this farm and she sends money back home 20 years i mean you're gonna throw this lady out You know what I mean?

Speaker 2 I think why don't they see each one case by case? That would be the end of the problem. No?

Speaker 1 catherine that's a very simple solution

Speaker 1 why don't they do that

Speaker 1 it's it's unfortunate but it is too simple again there's so many variables in all of this and and again i want to just do a real shout out to the people who come here for education and for the DACA students who are able to stay and be educated.

Speaker 1 And it impacts not just the United States, but it impacts the world, whether it's in science or medicine. They are contributing.
But again, sorry, it's too simple.

Speaker 1 It's not going to be one by one because there are millions of people who are being impounded.

Speaker 2 But listen, they throw, let's say they get 500 people today and they throw them in a detention center.

Speaker 2 Like they're all criminals, which is not true. True.
Right?

Speaker 2 They give you a number like, okay, all of you are going to be deported because the law says none of you can stay here.

Speaker 2 I personally think they're just saying to me, that's a little too radical. I think

Speaker 2 they, and they all have to go through the officer, right? Every single person that goes to the detention center, they have to go through an immigration. I don't know what they're called.

Speaker 2 They're not called immigration officer if they're called ICE or they have to go through a representative. What's the name that's inside the name of the corporation?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I don't.

Speaker 1 yeah, but, but again, you know what?

Speaker 1 Again, you're painting a picture about the detention centers that I can't answer, but I can tell you because we have a program that allows those people in detention centers to get a bond so they can go live with their family and friends while they're waiting for their court case.

Speaker 1 So for us, it's about, okay. We can't fix the detention center.
We can talk about it and we can learn from it, but we can advocate for the people who are in the system.

Speaker 2 I love that. So there you go.
So once they

Speaker 2 do that and they get a bond and they go stay with their family, once they go to court, in my opinion, the judge, whoever looks at the case, should look at a case by case.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 2 I don't know if they do.

Speaker 1 That's not what I heard.

Speaker 2 Honestly, that's not what I heard, especially now. What I heard now is that like, if you're illegal, you're going to be kicked out.

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Speaker 1 Yeah, I don't think that's the case.

Speaker 1 I think what we're seeing is an overwhelmed system.

Speaker 1 that is, and again, talking about how it impacts us, right? Yeah. So we put a post a bond for an individual and then they wait for their court date.

Speaker 1 Because the system is so backlogged, there are lots of people waiting and waiting and waiting. And I don't know for how long, six months, eight months, whatever.

Speaker 1 That backlog is causing those people to have to be in those detention centers for a very long time, which is why we step in and provide them the bond.

Speaker 1 And by the way, you know, for anybody who's listening, the majority of people who we help by giving them that bond do show up to court and go through the process. They don't go into hiding.

Speaker 1 They don't do any of that stuff that you've heard that. That's not true.

Speaker 1 For us, the majority of people participate and honor the fact that we are helping them all the way into their court cases and stuff.

Speaker 1 So it's a really wonderful testimony, I think, to the people who are, again, are just trying to do it properly, legally, by going through the system.

Speaker 2 That's amazing. That's all they want, right? They just literally want to stay here legally and contribute and get jobs.

Speaker 1 That's right.

Speaker 1 That's right. That's right.
So, again, just to correct that, in case people

Speaker 1 don't understand why we do that.

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Speaker 2 A lot of people don't understand it. And I got some messages.
I was talking to a friend of mine and she said something. I mean, it's not me, but I'm going to put it out there.
Okay.

Speaker 2 And I don't agree with it at all, by the way. But she was like, that's all she said.
She said, oh, you know, I'm a legal immigrant. She's from Europe.
She's been here her whole life.

Speaker 2 She said, I am a legal immigrant.

Speaker 2 I came here with a student student visa i studied i worked my ass off then i got a green card blah blah blah blah blah blah blah then 20 years later i became a citizen i did everything by the book if these people like these organizations like border of angels are it helping illegals you're just encouraging more people

Speaker 2 to come illegally if they cannot come legally

Speaker 2 What would you say to somebody like that?

Speaker 1 You know, I would say, and I don't know the history of this this person, right? But like I told you, I'm an immigrant. I became a U.S.
citizen as well, but I didn't do that alone.

Speaker 1 My family gave up everything to come to this country. And for us, we were very fortunate that there were community organizations to help us who provided us food.

Speaker 1 who provided us transportation, who helped us find a place to live for my family, right? Not just me, but my whole family.

Speaker 1 And again, I would remind your friend to maybe look back on their history and say, hey, did anybody ever help you in

Speaker 1 your

Speaker 1 process?

Speaker 1 And that's all Border Angels is doing is just stepping in. And again, not just us, right? There are lots and lots of wonderful organizations out there doing amazing work.

Speaker 1 And I'm talking about big organizations like Jewish Family Services to the church around the corner. All of these people are helping in some way.

Speaker 1 And those are the same people who, fortunately for my family, helped us to get settled so that we could, you know, again,

Speaker 1 live the American dream that everyone wants to do, right?

Speaker 2 Yeah. And I don't, I personally, this is what I think.
Let's say you guys did not exist.

Speaker 2 People would still be coming. And I think, like you said, more people would be dying, basically.
More people would be dying trying to cross this horrific crossing, which I knew of it,

Speaker 2 of course, you know, nowadays, especially with the internet, social media, and everything.

Speaker 2 But once I did the movie and we did so much research and everything, and once we started shooting there, I was like, oh my God, the crossing.

Speaker 2 And I invite, I'm not kidding, this is the most perfect timing for this movie to come out. It's called 40 Days.

Speaker 2 Once it comes out, I encourage everybody to watch it because I think even people that have a negative view of these illegal immigrants, if you have a heart, you're going to feel compassion towards them because these are real people.

Speaker 2 Like you said, they have kids, they have families, they have dreams.

Speaker 2 Some of them die on the way because if you get hurt, like you said, if you get bit by a snake or anything, like if you fall and you trip and you get hurt, they leave you behind.

Speaker 2 They leave you behind and they keep walking. Like they're not going to help you and carry you.
They leave you in the middle of the desert to die, right?

Speaker 1 Yeah. And again, it's not just coyotes.
I mean, people are doing it on their own. Yeah.
Right. People are crossing the desert on their own.
Again, I just say whether you believe that immigration is

Speaker 1 that people are migrating here, shouldn't do it illegally or not. I would say just open up your heart and look at the humanity of it and say, okay,

Speaker 1 here they are. What are we going to do? Right.

Speaker 1 What do we do? It's just like finding someone who is hurt. You don't walk away.

Speaker 1 You try to help them. You call at the ambulance.
You call 911, whatever.

Speaker 1 It's just the humane thing to do.

Speaker 2 We hope, right? We hope if you see somebody hurt, Anywhere, you don't ask them, oh, by the way, are you legal? Do you belong here?

Speaker 1 right right or or or for race right i mean it could just be race or sex or whatever yeah um there's a lot there's a lot going on there's a lot going on and again um not trying to solve the world's problems but trying to do a little bit to make it um better to make it better and so that people who

Speaker 1 you know have questions need the support um

Speaker 1 they they they know that we will direct them to, and by the way, there are numbers of organizations, I'm very proud of this,

Speaker 1 all along the border, not just in San Diego, but also Arizona and Texas, who are doing the same water drop kind of programs

Speaker 1 because they know, they know how important it is and how necessary it is. So

Speaker 1 it takes a lot of us to do what we're doing.

Speaker 2 Oh my God. Yeah, it's thousands and thousands of people out there and it's a huge, huge area, literally.
I mean, it's

Speaker 2 and I have to mention before I forget, although Trump, of course, I think he's very radical the way he looks at immigration, even his wife, right?

Speaker 2 I think it's the first time she rarely opens her mouth, but I think it's one of the few things that she made a point in saying that she did not agree with his policies, especially when it came to separating children from their mothers, because that's one of the most horrific things.

Speaker 2 I mean, I don't have kids, but I cannot imagine doing that to a mother. I cannot imagine doing that to a kid.

Speaker 2 And I'm so glad she spoke up. And I don't know moving forward what they're going to do.

Speaker 2 I don't know if she has any influence in him and how the government acts, but it's something that should change right away, right, Jesus?

Speaker 1 Yeah, again,

Speaker 1 we aren't involved in the legal aspect of advocacy. I mean, of legally

Speaker 1 pushing for change and whatnot. Though certainly we do support those things.
But

Speaker 1 again, I would say to you, there are people on the front lines right now looking at ways to block those changes.

Speaker 1 A bunch of different legal

Speaker 1 organizations that are looking at blocking that,

Speaker 1 as well as people in the political field that don't agree with it who saw firsthand when it happened how horrific it was people living in cages and and whatnot

Speaker 1 and i personally volunteered uh one summer to do social work with the children that were separated and it was devastating to see them

Speaker 1 it was devastating i again we we had the opportunity to let the children talk to their families for the first time in a long time. And it was heartbreaking.

Speaker 1 But it was, again, these children were still, and I say this to you because it's important. Regardless of how

Speaker 1 bad those things are, they still were happy at moments. They still had fun.
They were still children, you know?

Speaker 1 And we were able to help them through that.

Speaker 1 But that, you know, that's small compared to the experience and the trauma that they experienced in being separated from their families.

Speaker 2 Oh, my God. Yeah.
I would hope to God this never happens. That's one thing that honestly embarrasses me.

Speaker 1 Me too. Me too.
I just don't, I just don't see it.

Speaker 2 I say like I am a proud American immigrant, but that's one aspect of it that makes me cringe and it really makes me want to cry.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Well, again, you know,

Speaker 1 I don't want to get too philosophical, but you know what?

Speaker 1 We're all human beings and we're learning and we're doing the best that we can and there are ups and downs and we hopefully will learn from our mistakes.

Speaker 2 Yeah, but on a good note, you guys do, let's talk about this because I think it's very important. You do have a project of green card for kids.

Speaker 2 Can you tell people about that? Because it's on your website and I think that's super nice.

Speaker 1 It's really near and dear to my heart. There's an attorney.
Her name is by the name of Fabiola.

Speaker 1 I can't remember her last name right now, but she had this idea about helping kids that were, you know, in child protective services.

Speaker 1 And she contacted Border Angels, and they started the program a few years ago. And it's amazing.

Speaker 1 The challenging part for me, of course, is because these are children, we don't get to interact with them, you know, for their protection. But we do interact with her.

Speaker 1 And she has wonderful stories about these kids.

Speaker 1 So yes, that's another program I hope that we can continue to grow so that we can serve more kids. Because obviously, or maybe not obviously, but it's expensive.

Speaker 1 Even though, you know, she is gracious and gives us a very nice discount on legal fees. Some of these kids are going to need services for a very long time.
And

Speaker 1 so, yeah, that's, but it's an amazing program. And I'm so glad that she presented it to us.

Speaker 2 And you guys, so how does it work? Like, if somebody out there is listening, they reach out to you and you connect the person with that, with this attorney.

Speaker 1 So typical, yeah. So typically what happens is that the child

Speaker 1 will be in the detention center. Right.
And the social worker will contact us regarding the child and ask us to pay for Fabiola to represent the child in court and

Speaker 1 whatever their situation might be um

Speaker 1 whether they're nine years old or whether they're 15 years old there's a lot of different pieces that i don't i'm not familiar with since i'm not an attorney and i have to mention and you guys are a non-profit and all the money that come in is from donations right that's right that's right the goodness of people's hearts and i'm very grateful for that Again, another positive, regardless of all of the stuff, there are still really wonderful people out there who are making contributions.

Speaker 1 The number of volunteers that we have to be able to do water drops and educational programs that couldn't happen

Speaker 1 without their giving of their time and energy to make it happen. So, yeah,

Speaker 1 it's again, it's an amazing organization. I'm very proud to be a part of it.
I am

Speaker 1 you know, going to do whatever I can to

Speaker 1 continue to do what we've been doing, as well as look at new ways of helping.

Speaker 1 And I, and again, we haven't even talked about the Borbindo Casa program or the, you know, helping out the shelters in Tijuana. Yeah.

Speaker 2 You guys do so much. It's incredible.

Speaker 1 It's incredible. So, yeah, so invite people to come to our website.
And

Speaker 2 I am putting the website here on this episode, which is borderangels.org, right?

Speaker 2 Borderangels.org. If you guys want to know more, I think it's a very complicated issue to say the least, right? Jesus.

Speaker 2 But in my eyes, the way I see it is like, you know, before you judge people, before you say, like, oh, they're all scumbags, you know, they're all monsters.

Speaker 2 They're all coming here to rape and kill and murder. This is so not true.
This is so far from the truth. So many of these people

Speaker 2 are wonderful people that just want a shot at a better life. So I agree with you.
I think I always hope and pray that there is a much more humane way to deal with the situation.

Speaker 2 And you guys do a fantastic job down there.

Speaker 1 Thank you. Yeah, no, again, I think once we have the documentary, I mean, we're promoting it so that we'll be able to share it with the world.

Speaker 1 I think that's a really good way for people to see it. Just like the movie that you're in.
Yeah. I'm hoping we can share that as well.

Speaker 2 Yeah, where can people find the documentary?

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Again,

Speaker 1 parts of it have testimony from people that have gone through the experience of being in the detention center, living in the shelters,

Speaker 1 all of those things. And it really presents

Speaker 1 the whole immigration issue really well in that it shows them as human beings, it shows them as families and it shows them as being, you know,

Speaker 1 just again, just human beings like you and I having good days and bad days and still feeling hope. And I think that's another thing.

Speaker 1 Again, if we can convey that to your listeners, is that we are all about that. We're all about that hope and trying to

Speaker 1 give people some hope in a very, very difficult time.

Speaker 2 Yeah, amazing. Thank you so much for your time.
Congratulations on your work because I know it's very, very hard. I love the name border angels because I think you guys are definitely angels.

Speaker 2 You have to be a very special type of human, not human, a special type of angel

Speaker 2 to help these people. They definitely need help.
And I'm very grateful for you to be here on the show.

Speaker 2 And if you guys have any questions, I know I'm going to get tons and tons of messages, the positive and the negative, because I know a lot of people out there,

Speaker 2 you know, it is what it is. They say, like, we don't want them here, get the hell out, period.
But I'm on your team. Like, I agree.

Speaker 2 I think there's always a right way to do things and there's a right way to treat people. And I always think we should put ourselves in the person's shoes.
That's the way I live my life, you know.

Speaker 1 And I appreciate it that we live in a country where we can express our opinion, whether it's agree or disagree um i just ask people to be kind and you know whatever way you feel that's fine just be kind about it and and nothing more

Speaker 2 um yeah which is getting tough sometimes you know even asking people to be kind this day and it's true it's true you know sometimes it's like wow i see so much aggression out there and the way we talk to each other that's another thing that i don't like the words used you know and the aggression, which is completely unnecessary, especially about people that we don't know.

Speaker 2 We don't know the stories. We don't know the background.
So I think we need to pause.

Speaker 2 And yeah, like maybe if possible, like put yourselves, if you can, on the person's shoes and what they're going through. And maybe through your documentary, My Movie 40 Days.

Speaker 2 This is why I love telling stories like that, because maybe you can see a little bit more the hard side of what these people go through, right?

Speaker 1 That's right. That's right.
And so I'm going to say my closing statement, become a border angel. Okay.

Speaker 1 That doesn't mean you have to come and join me. It doesn't mean you have to volunteer for me.
Just become a border angel wherever you are.

Speaker 1 Live that experience. All right.
That's what people need to do.

Speaker 1 Yeah, you're right. And

Speaker 1 it'll be a better world because of it.

Speaker 2 Oh, I couldn't agree with you more. Now, before I let you go, where is this documentary going to be available if anybody wants to watch it?

Speaker 1 Sure, sure.

Speaker 1 Again, if people go to our website,

Speaker 1 they can see the film teaser. Okay.

Speaker 1 Once the film has premiered, then we will make it available for our viewing.

Speaker 2 at you know wherever wherever anybody wants to see it the more people see it the better and this is what i said like i said whichever side of the conversation you guys are in, even Trump voters, even Americans

Speaker 2 that agree with mass deportation, do yourselves a favor and educate yourselves about the subject.

Speaker 2 Right, Jesus, that's how I feel. Before judging everyone, I mean, I've been judged my whole life.
I'm sure it has happened to you as well. Like, right? Just the fact that we're immigrants.

Speaker 2 Just because I have an accent, when I tell people that I'm an American and I've been here my entire life, they don't believe me. They're like, no, you have an accent.
I'm like, I have college degrees.

Speaker 2 I've been here in my home. I don't know why my accent doesn't want to go away, but it's true.
So I've been judged my whole life.

Speaker 2 But I think whatever you want to decide about immigration, illegal immigrants, mass deportation, watch the, go to the website, look at Border Angels, watch the documentary, see some stories, some testimonials, educate yourself before judging these people because they need some compassion for sure.

Speaker 1 If nothing else,

Speaker 1 again,

Speaker 1 Catherine, there are so many things that we need to fix. Yeah.

Speaker 1 That immigration, again, it's important to me and it's important to you. But if it's not important to somebody else, then tell them to go and

Speaker 1 pick up trash or

Speaker 1 volunteer at the senior home. There's lots and lots and lots of good that needs to happen in this country.

Speaker 1 Even if this is not your topic, go do something else.

Speaker 2 Oh my God. I know.

Speaker 2 And by the way, I'm recording. We're doing this via Zoom and I'm not at my studio.
I'm recording from home. And my dog, Phoenix, has been so nice throughout the entire episode.

Speaker 2 And now he woke up because there's somebody at the door. So thank you, Phoenix, for being nice for.
45 minutes. So now he's like,

Speaker 1 I can't believe we've been talking for 45 minutes.

Speaker 2 I know, right? We could talk for like, like you said, go do something.

Speaker 2 On a last note, this is what I'm going to say. If you're against immigration, go pick your tomato, especially here in California.

Speaker 2 We are responsible for 50% of the produce and fruits of the entire United States.

Speaker 2 And if you talk to the farmers, the people working in the farms in California are illegal immigrants because they are the only ones that want to work there.

Speaker 2 And even if the farmers offer more money, Americans do not want to work in the farms.

Speaker 1 You're so political.

Speaker 2 No, no, I'm kidding. Before you say anything, if you don't want anybody here, that's another example, right? Just give these people like some kind of a visa to work in the farms, you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 Before throwing them out, because Americans don't want to go work in the farms. And if you want to throw them out, you're going to pay a lot more for your blueberries and your strawberries.

Speaker 1 All right. But no, no, no.
I want to focus on people, just people, whether they want to work as a farmer or they want to be a scientist and go to a university, okay? Of course.

Speaker 1 There's something for everybody. Oh, I agree.

Speaker 2 No, 1 million percent. This was just on a side note.

Speaker 1 Missed politics. Yeah, I know.

Speaker 2 Thank you so much, Jesus. Congratulations.
You guys doing amazing.

Speaker 1 Stay in touch, okay? Yes.

Speaker 2 And next time, hopefully, I'll come down there and we can do the next

Speaker 2 person. I would love that.

Speaker 1 I would love that.

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 1 You are welcome anytime. And of course, let us know about your movie.
Congratulations.

Speaker 2 Yes. And congratulations on your beautiful documentary.
And I know we're going to get 10,000 questions for you guys. So it will be a huge honor to have you back.

Speaker 1 Good, good. Well, I'll keep you posted.

Speaker 2 Thank you. Very grateful for your time.
Thank you, guys. Be safe out there.
And I'll see you very soon.

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