Taylor Swift on Reclaiming Her Masters, Wrapping The Eras Tour, and The Life of a Showgirl | NHTV

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Speaker 1 Wait, so Reese's color is orange, and the Oreo cookie was invented in 1912.

Speaker 1 This one's been in the vault waiting for its moment. Reese's Oreo.
The biggest drop since, well.

Speaker 1 All right, let's get to

Speaker 1 the part of this show that I think is what everybody is going to be talking about.

Speaker 2 Do I get to say it?

Speaker 1 Do I get to say it?

Speaker 2 Do I get to say the two words? Yes.

Speaker 1 First of all, you can do whatever you want, Taylor. We're not going to review.

Speaker 1 This is very important.

Speaker 2 I want to work within the framework of the podcast. I'm a fan of the podcast.

Speaker 1 Typically, we would allow the guests to say new news.

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, I want to do it.

Speaker 1 I think Taylor has a little bit of new news.

Speaker 1 Yay!

Speaker 1 Welcome back to New Heights, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, 92%ers. We missed you.
This is a very special episode of New Heights, a wondery show. We are your hosts.
I'm Travis Kelsey.

Speaker 1 This is my big brother, Jason Kelsey, out of Cleveland Heights, Ohio.

Speaker 1 University of Cincinnati grads, Cincey. Wow, baby.
Barrel head can't come soon enough, baby. Let's go, Bearcats.
Let's go, baby.

Speaker 1 Subscribe on YouTube, Wondry Plus, wherever you get your podcast, and follow the show on all social media at New Heights Show with 1S for fun clips throughout the week. Jason.

Speaker 1 Oh,

Speaker 1 we got a good one.

Speaker 1 Why don't you tell the people what we got coming up? That's right. 92%ers.
You may remember when we said New Heights wasn't coming back till August 27th. Well, that was a lie.
That was a lie.

Speaker 1 And hopefully you can forgive us because we got a, as Travis said, we have a very special episode today that we just simply could not turn down. That's right.

Speaker 1 This is a special preseason episode that we decided to bring to you a little early. So let's not waste any of their time, Jason.
Let's get right to it. You want to do the honors?

Speaker 1 Our guest today is the singer, songwriter, producer, and director from Nashville, Tennessee. That's bullshit.
She is from Redding, Pennsylvania.

Speaker 1 She is the most awarded artist in the history of the American Music Awards, Billboard Music Awards, and iHeart Radio Music Awards.

Speaker 1 She has 14 Grammy Awards and is the only artist in the history doing the album of the year four times.

Speaker 1 Last December, she wrapped up the Aris tour, which spanned 149 shows across 51 cities, five millions, and was the most attended tour of all time. All time.
I'm still going. Hold on, Volume.

Speaker 1 Her last album, The The Torture Police Department, set a record with 1.76 billion streams globally within the first week alone. All right.
Now, that's a fan of that guy on the Chiefs.

Speaker 1 She has 19 wins, two ASC titles, and a Super Bowl. 92 presenters, are you ready for it? Making your podcast and debut, the most aggressive guest in the history of shows, Taylor Swift.

Speaker 1 That intro, Jason.

Speaker 2 Oh, my God!

Speaker 1 I've seen this before. No, look, his soul has left his body.
Just breathe.

Speaker 2 No, that was so good. Thank you.

Speaker 1 I tried to.

Speaker 2 Thank you for screaming for like 47 seconds for me. That was so nice.

Speaker 1 I'm shaking right now.

Speaker 2 I'm shaking today. No, you did a great job.

Speaker 1 Take a deep breath, big guy.

Speaker 1 Did I get everything?

Speaker 1 How much more could we have put in that? I felt like that was.

Speaker 2 That was such an amazing intro. And also, just like, thanks for wearing the merch.
That goes a long way. Just like immediately makes me feel comfortable just looking deeply into my own eyes.

Speaker 1 Okay. All right.
That's what I was going for. It's a good P-shirt.
I like it. Thanks for having me.

Speaker 2 This is my first podcast.

Speaker 1 This is amazing. Thank you for coming on.
What took you so long to jump on podcasts?

Speaker 2 You know what? I just, I was waiting for you guys to invite me. This is my favorite podcast.

Speaker 1 So we've already been over this. You're a big fan of the show.
You're a 92%er. What are your favorite segments that you hear Travis and I go into on a routinely basis?

Speaker 2 I like new news just because of the screaming. Like I hear him screaming new news from across the house constantly.
It's like my favorite part. Like he'll be like, new news, new news.

Speaker 2 And I'm in the kitchen be like, new news.

Speaker 2 So I love that because of just the bellowing of it. Like I love no dumb questions.

Speaker 1 That's a banger.

Speaker 2 I really like it when you give people advice. It's my, it's kind of my personal favorite.

Speaker 1 Do you usually agree with the advice or do you just like listening to it?

Speaker 2 I mean, I think that like you guys give such male-centric advice, it's which I think is just like just dudes who don't want drama. Yeah.
Dudes who are trying to avoid the mess.

Speaker 2 But sometimes you're going to like do a bit and say the messiest thing that they could do, which is funny too.

Speaker 1 So we're going to ask the question everybody watching the show is currently asking. Why are you coming on the show? Why?

Speaker 1 What are you doing? You have so many better things to do with your time.

Speaker 2 This podcast has done a lot for me. I owe a lot to this podcast.
This podcast got me a boyfriend ever since Travis decided to use it as his personal dating app about two years ago.

Speaker 1 So worked pretty good. Yeah.
Hey, were his friendship bracelets that good? Did you give the friendship bracelets, or was that just on the podcast?

Speaker 1 I've never been, I've never seen

Speaker 1 the stadium because I was butthurt, Jason.

Speaker 1 He threw a tantrum.

Speaker 1 He threw a man tantrum.

Speaker 2 It's so funny.

Speaker 1 It's like the planet is ruined. She loves me.
She loves me now. She loves me.
She loves me now. This is so funny.
She hates me.

Speaker 2 Like, it was such a wild, romantic gesture to just be like, I don't want to date you. Like, on,

Speaker 2 I don't know. It was at first when I looked at it, I was like, this dude is.

Speaker 1 That's what it does when you're on the stage and you perform in Arrowhead. That's what it did.

Speaker 2 This dude didn't get a meet and greet. He's making it everyone's problem.
That's what I thought at first.

Speaker 1 And then I. You come to Arrowhead.
I get to meet you. That's the perk of playing for the Chiefs.

Speaker 2 You realize he didn't even reach out to our management. I was like, when this podcast came out, I was like, did he ever reach out to be like in the tents? Or did we know he was in the building?

Speaker 2 He came with Pat and he thought that because he knows the elevator lady that you have to talk to her about just getting down. That's how it works.

Speaker 1 You just go. And I got denied.

Speaker 2 That's how it works in 1973.

Speaker 1 The elevator was just invented.

Speaker 2 But yeah, but yeah, he really just was like, I know a guy. I can figure this out.
But

Speaker 2 I actually, when I thought about it, I was like, actually, we live in a day and age where like I'm not a very, I'm not an online person at all. I'm not like on social media like that.

Speaker 2 And, like, I'm genuinely terrified to open my DMs. Um,

Speaker 2 it's just like, it's just like

Speaker 2 there's smoke coming out of my DMs. I don't want to go near that.
I don't know what's going on.

Speaker 1 If you want somebody to go through it, I'll go through it just because I'll laugh my ass away.

Speaker 2 It's like, if you have like 20 million unread DMs, you're just like,

Speaker 2 so this kind of felt more like I was in an 80s John Hughes movie, and he was just like standing outside of my window with a boom box, just being like, I want to date you.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Do you want to come on a date with me? I made you a a friendship place. Do you want to date me?

Speaker 1 Just come outside and meet me. Just meet me once.

Speaker 1 Just give me a chance.

Speaker 2 I was like, if this guy isn't crazy,

Speaker 2 which is a big if, this is sort of what I've been writing songs about wanting to happen to me since I was

Speaker 1 a teenager. And I was sitting there at the Aristotle listening to every single one of those songs.
Like, she, I know what she wants me to do.

Speaker 1 I feel that. That's a

Speaker 1 wish list of like, meet me, please. Now I'm butt hurt.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 I'm upset that you didn't meet me, even though you didn't know I wanted to meet you because I didn't do any proper logistical planning.

Speaker 1 Who planned? Typical Kelsey. Typical Kelsey.
It was wild.

Speaker 2 It was wild, but it worked. I'm glad it worked.

Speaker 2 I'm just circling back to New Heights to say thank you for this.

Speaker 1 Look at this. I'm the luckiest man in the world.

Speaker 2 So, yeah, that's.

Speaker 1 And thank you to New Heights, all the editing. Jake, thank you for putting that on social media and letting it do its thing.

Speaker 1 Before we move on, how did you know he wasn't crazy? Because that's the other side of that, right? Like a guy goes up there and professes his love for you.

Speaker 1 It's either one, it's like this could be the most romantic thing in the world. It can also be like this is he is crazy, Jason.

Speaker 1 But there's a there's a right crazy thing.

Speaker 2 Yeah, he's the good kind of crazy. And I knew that he wasn't crazy the first couple of times that we talked.

Speaker 2 I was just like, he's, he's truly like, he's truly getting to know me in a way that's very natural, very pure, very normal. Like, also, like, just the way that he could make me laugh so immediately

Speaker 2 about normal things.

Speaker 2 Like, Travis is like, he's just a vibe booster in everyone's life that he's in. He's like a human exclamation point.
Like,

Speaker 2 you know, he's like, when you take a picture on your phone and you put the, like, you push the enhance color button, that's like what you do to everyone's life.

Speaker 1 I just, I'm always.

Speaker 2 I use so many more exclamation points now, but I think it was just like, you also, you were so, you're so non-judgmental about people

Speaker 2 and you were not judgmental about the fact that I knew nothing about the world you were in.

Speaker 2 It was the best. You were nice.
You were so nice.

Speaker 1 You got a clean slate. You were like,

Speaker 1 he doesn't know any of my family.

Speaker 1 Are you kidding me?

Speaker 2 Jason, on our first date, I literally, I legitimately asked him what it was like when the Chiefs played the Eagles in the Super Bowl and he looked across the field, across the line of scrimmage and saw his brother standing on the other like five feet in front of him on the field.

Speaker 2 And he was like,

Speaker 2 he was, and he didn't even, he didn't even look at me. Like, I now know what an insane question that was.
He was like, actually, I'm on the offense

Speaker 2 and my brother's on the offense and I'm only on the field at the same time as defense. I thought everyone was on the throne at the same time.

Speaker 2 I thought that the quarterbacks. I mean, that's how you played it

Speaker 1 on the playground growing up.

Speaker 2 So I understand if if you hadn't like no you don't understand i thought it was like jared goff is here and josh allen's here and they're gonna be like they blow a whistle and then they they go at each other and they're like

Speaker 1 and it's like who's gonna win that's actually i would love to see jared goff

Speaker 1 play some defense let's see

Speaker 2 i've got some ideas I've got some thoughts. Yeah.
I didn't know what a first down was. I didn't know what the chains were.
I didn't know what a tight end was.

Speaker 1 I am forever thankful for you diving into the football world wholeheartedly.

Speaker 2 Oh my god, I fell in love with it. I became obsessed with it.
I became like a person who was running through the halls of my house screaming, we drafted Xavier Worthy.

Speaker 1 And my friends are like,

Speaker 2 What is who body snatched you? This is this is what do you mean

Speaker 1 we drafted Xavier worthy? I forget where I was, but you were the first person to tell me that you drafted a screeching

Speaker 2 in the draft. No, I was screeching.
I couldn't believe it. I was freaking out.

Speaker 1 We're talking about like, I'm like, wait, does she write? I got to look this up. I'm like, she did.
She get the wrong information here, but yeah, we traded up.

Speaker 2 Yeah, we're talking about cover two, cover four, cover zero. Man, cover, we're talking, we're learning.

Speaker 2 I continue to learn.

Speaker 1 Maybe somebody else that even knows what those coverages are.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I'm not ready to be an analyst right now, but

Speaker 2 give me 16 months.

Speaker 1 You're going to pick up on it. I'm telling you, you would ask some of the best questions when we were up in the booth.

Speaker 1 And there's like your desire to learn more, but your genuine excitement around it, as well as like your competitiveness. She's not fucking around.
No. Taylor's not fucking around.
Oh my God.

Speaker 1 She's not fucking around.

Speaker 1 Reclaiming Masters. You want to tee the central? Let's tee it up.

Speaker 1 One of my favorite things this summer was Taylor reclaiming her Masters.

Speaker 1 Her recording of her first six albums finally became hers.

Speaker 1 And you haven't really talked about it. You made that beautiful post on all your social channels, thanking everyone that made it happen and everything.
But why don't you

Speaker 1 tell the 92%ers how it really felt?

Speaker 2 Oh, wow.

Speaker 2 So to catch anyone up who doesn't know about this saga, like I signed a record deal when I was 15.

Speaker 2 And I always kind of refer to it as I got my music back this summer, but I never owned my music at all.

Speaker 2 So traditionally, traditionally, a lot of record deals are set up in a way that artists don't own what's called their master recordings.

Speaker 2 Owning your master recordings means that you have complete control and power over distribution, licensing,

Speaker 2 and essentially the way your legacy is shaped. It's it's um, it's a huge thing.
It's always been a huge thing for me.

Speaker 2 Like, since I was a teenager, I've been actively saving up money to buy my music back and to ever own it in the first place because it's usually the label that owns it.

Speaker 2 But I've always wanted this to happen. So

Speaker 2 it's been sold. My music has been sold a few times.
The first time that it was sold, it really ripped my heart out of my chest.

Speaker 2 And I told everybody exactly how that felt for me and what I was going through. And I started basically defiantly re-recording my music because I wanted, I wanted to own it.

Speaker 2 And this was the only way I thought it was ever going to happen. And so I- I knew she had a bad kid.

Speaker 1 And she's got a little bit of a bad kid. Yeah,

Speaker 1 that's not a bad kid. That's a fucking savvy kid.
That's what that is. That's like, hey,

Speaker 1 I've been told I've been defiant a lot of times. Well, you are defiant.
You're very defiant.

Speaker 2 It's like, I, I, um,

Speaker 1 insubordinate, Travis.

Speaker 2 Insubordinate. Yeah, it's, it's, I think for me, you know, that was the closest I ever thought I would get to owning my music.
And so re

Speaker 2 recording my music, it was so exciting to get to have that opportunity. But there was still like, I thought about not owning my music every day.

Speaker 2 It was something that I never was, it was like an intrusive thought that I had every day. And so, we do the ARIS tour.

Speaker 2 After the ARIS tour, I had a meeting with my team and we decided this might be a good time to approach the current owners of it. The owners of it was a private equity firm called Shamrock Capital.

Speaker 2 I knew them to be above-board people.

Speaker 2 You know, they had been very friendly to us.

Speaker 2 What I was looking to do, though, was I wanted to buy my music outright. I don't want to be in a partnership.
I don't want to own 30% of it.

Speaker 2 I want to own all of it.

Speaker 2 But it was a long shot to think that they would do that, that they would sell that asset to me.

Speaker 1 It's a big asset.

Speaker 2 It's a huge decision for them to make to sell that to anyone, including me. I decided that rather than this be like a

Speaker 2 business conversation, I'm in the business of human emotion. I would so much rather lead heart first in something like this because for me, this is not, oh,

Speaker 2 I want to own this asset because of its returns, because if it's, you know, because of the dividends that I will receive over the years,

Speaker 2 this was, I want it because this is my handwritten diary entries from my whole life. These are the songs I wrote about every phase of my life.
This is my photography, my music videos,

Speaker 2 most of which I funded. You know, my artwork, everything that I've ever done is in this catalog.

Speaker 2 And so rather than send lawyers or management, like in a big crew, I sent my mom and my brother, who I work with, to LA. And they,

Speaker 2 sorry, they sat down and they like, this happens. I don't ever really talk about it because it's,

Speaker 2 they sat down

Speaker 2 with

Speaker 2 Shamrock Capital and they told them what this meant for me.

Speaker 2 Like, this is, they told them the whole story of all the times we've tried to buy it, all the times it's fallen through, all the times we had gotten plans together and figured out something we thought was going to work and it didn't at the last minute.

Speaker 2 And so, like, my mom calls me afterwards. She's like, look, you know, they were wonderful.
They heard us out. We have no idea which way they're going to go with this.
And so I was like, I get it.

Speaker 2 I get it.

Speaker 2 I haven't gotten my hopes up about this in a decade.

Speaker 2 And so it was a couple months after the Super Bowl. We're in Kansas City.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 I get a call from my mom. And she's like,

Speaker 1 she's like,

Speaker 2 you got your music.

Speaker 2 And so sorry that

Speaker 2 this is, it's literally been so long since this happened. It's every time I talk about it.

Speaker 2 She was like, you got your music. And I just

Speaker 2 very dramatically hit the floor for real. Like, honestly, just started

Speaker 2 bawling my eyes out. And I'm just like,

Speaker 2 just, just weeping and kind of like

Speaker 2 unable. I was just like, really? Are you really? Really? What do you mean? What do you mean? And I'm like, get yourself together, get your shit together.
Like, just go tell Travis in a normal way.

Speaker 2 And I knock on the door. He's playing video games.

Speaker 2 And I'm trying to say it in a normal way. And I'm just like,

Speaker 1 drama!

Speaker 1 Oh, no. What just happened? What just happened?

Speaker 2 And he's like, he like puts his headset down. He's like, Gus, got to go.
And I think he thought something was wrong. And you come up and I'm just like,

Speaker 2 I got all my music back.

Speaker 2 And then just start absolutely heaving.

Speaker 1 Just deadweighed. Just deadweighed.
Dropped all control. Had no power in my legs to support myself.
And

Speaker 2 yeah, this changed my life.

Speaker 2 I can't believe it still.

Speaker 2 Every time I think about it, it's like I have to tell the short version to everyone because it is still like,

Speaker 2 this will affect the rest of my life. I think about this every day now, but instead of it being like an intrusive thought that hurts me, it's, I can't believe this happened.
Like, how lucky am I?

Speaker 2 How grateful am I? I'm so grateful to like the artists that helped me with my re-records because when I did my re-records, I started doing those in 2021.

Speaker 2 And a a lot of, like, most of the industry trades were like, this is a bad idea. This is her sort of derailing her career in a way nobody's interested in you doing the same album twice.

Speaker 2 Fans are not going to be engaged with this. This is not going to go well for her.

Speaker 1 Somebody knew, though.

Speaker 2 And it was like, I still was able to reach out to friends of mine, like, like.

Speaker 2 like Phoebe Bridgers, Keith Urban, Maren Morris, Chris Stapleton, you know, Haley Williams from Paramore, Fallout Boy, like all these absolutely incredible artists that like shape who I am as an artist.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 they like agreed to be a part of the re-records. And I like,

Speaker 2 you know, I, one of the only people I told before this happened was like, I called Phoebe Bridgers and I was just like,

Speaker 2 and she's like, I think you just, did you just say what I think you said?

Speaker 2 And so this has just been like, it was just, I'm so grateful for it. It's,

Speaker 2 it's just unbelievable. And I was so happy you were there when that happened.

Speaker 1 I mean, I was because I could not stand. Yeah, I mean, I started crying too.
You know, you were weeping. I was, I was just so happy for you because

Speaker 1 I've seen how you make music. I've seen how you make these videos.
I've seen the effort and the focus and the strategy behind what just one album in Torture Poets Department and

Speaker 1 Fortnite. And I was blown away that you had been doing this your entire life.
And for, you know, your first six albums, you weren't given the rights to all of that. And I know what that looked like.

Speaker 1 And I know how much it burns you that you didn't have that and you didn't have your creation. And I just, I think doing it the right way.

Speaker 1 creating the fan base that you did the right way and um and and leading your life in a in a direction that you you were eventually going to get it back somehow some way because of you um always doing things uh with the right intentions so thanks

Speaker 2 This is a real good story about Bronx and his dad, Ryan, real United Airlines customers.

Speaker 1 We were returning home and one of the flight attendants asked Bronx if he wanted to see the flight deck and meet Catherine Andrew. I got to sit in the driver's seat.

Speaker 1 I grew up in an aviation family and seeing Bronx kind of reminded me of myself when I was that age.

Speaker 2 That's Andrew, a real United pilot.

Speaker 1 These small interactions can shape a kid's future. It felt like I was the captain.
Allowing my son to see the flight deck will stick with us forever. That's how good leads the way.

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Speaker 1 So,

Speaker 1 I guess, how does music ownership? This is so crazy to me. So, you wrote these songs, you sang these songs, you put everything into them.

Speaker 1 And don't get me wrong, there's publishing companies of people that support artists out there, but

Speaker 1 how does ownership of music even work? Like, when you recorded these songs when you were 16, right? Is that like

Speaker 1 the singer? You dumb it down to us 95%.

Speaker 1 The singer gets a certain portion,

Speaker 1 the artist gets, or the songwriter gets a certain portion, and then the publishing company gets a certain portion.

Speaker 2 Okay, so this is that's a great question. And there's two main categories that we're talking about here.

Speaker 2 Go ahead. So master recordings is the actual

Speaker 2 recording. Yes.
It's the actual vocal, band, production, mixing, mastering, that actual thing. Yes.

Speaker 2 Mine also included my album artwork, my music videos,

Speaker 2 everything that went along with any era of music that I had done for my first six albums.

Speaker 1 Every era.

Speaker 2 So then there's also, then there's another category, which is publishing.

Speaker 2 I own my publishing, which is why,

Speaker 2 you know, I have control over, you know, if my song is used in a film

Speaker 2 and I wanted them to use Taylor's version instead of the original version, I, the songwriter, can decide that. Got it.
Okay. You know, and so it's like,

Speaker 2 I basically,

Speaker 2 I've always been very lucky because my publishing was protected. A lot of artists have had their publishing sold away from them or they sell their publishing.

Speaker 2 I, you know, and a lot of artists, it may not be important to them. It was always important for me.

Speaker 2 The publishing aspect of it has always been been something I've had firmly in place, which is great because my songwriting is the core of why I do this, why I love it so much, and what I think has made anything happen in my career at all.

Speaker 1 Greatest songwriter of all time.

Speaker 2 That's very nice of you to say that. It's like, says her boyfriend.

Speaker 1 Says a lot of people.

Speaker 2 Basically, then you have the master recordings side of things. Now, this is a discussion that was not really brought up amongst the artist communities, especially not with fans.

Speaker 2 This was all kind of industry-centric and kind of boring contract stuff that like fans were not speaking about.

Speaker 2 And so,

Speaker 2 one thing that I think is really great that has come about because of this is that

Speaker 2 I have so many new artists come up to me now and say, Hey, I didn't even know this was a thing.

Speaker 2 And when I went to go and negotiate for my record deal, I negotiated to have my masters revert back to me after a certain amount of years or that I own them outright. And it's not for everyone.

Speaker 2 Not everyone cares about this. Artist to artist, artists have different priorities.
Some artists sell off all their masters because everyone's allowed to have their own priorities.

Speaker 2 What I wanted though is that if I were to put the information out about what I went through, at least it gets artists.

Speaker 2 talking about this to decide whether this is a priority for them because you can't know if it's a priority for you unless you know what has come before you and what has happened and and so the master recordings thing that's your actual ownership of your recordings to put it in perspective if i never would have been able to buy back my music one day someone else would be leaving all of my music from my first six albums to their kids in their will right yeah and you think about it like that it's like i thought of it i made it i recorded it i paid for most of those music videos you know i wanted an opportunity to to to buy that back and that was important to me.

Speaker 1 You feel like they're yours, they should be yours. Yeah, exactly.
Do you think it was easier for you to do one because you're, I mean,

Speaker 1 just you talking about this, you're so aware of the business side of this and the legal ramp, like you're more aware than I think probably most artists are, but being a smartest woman in the world, it's crazy.

Speaker 1 Being a songwriter, that's her boyfriend, smartest woman in the world.

Speaker 1 You being the songwriter, being the singer, owning the publishing rights, being able to re-record songs, that gave you leverage and able to make this move, right?

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Yes. So that was, and also,

Speaker 2 you know, in my contract, they didn't put a clause in that said I couldn't re-record because nobody was doing it and nobody thought that was a good idea. Right.

Speaker 2 So, and also, like, who would be that stubborn? Like, who would be

Speaker 1 that petty? He's a badass kid over here.

Speaker 2 And they would record every single thing

Speaker 1 over and over again.

Speaker 1 What what was your favorite one not just not just that hold on bill but not just that who has a fan base that's gonna listen to the same album twice in a row it's a good point jason it's a good point honestly and this is where they missed it you had

Speaker 1 1989 you listen to that already built that's the thing is the fans told a story with the second time you released this album right and the fans got behind that narrative and they're like right

Speaker 1 screw the first album we're rolling we're rolling with the re-recorded album because we're supporting the artist they were like we ride at dawn

Speaker 2 And it was amazing because they're the reason why the re-records worked out. They're the reason I was able to purchase my music back because they came to the Arist Tour.

Speaker 2 And basically, they're the reason why any of this worked out. And I also want to note that, like, the other people who are like, We Ride at Dawn,

Speaker 2 my live band, they played on all the re-records. It's like, you want to know why they sound so perfect on the Aeros tour.

Speaker 2 They played on all those records, like they're session musicians, too.

Speaker 2 And that's how good they are. And I'm so impressed just by their ability and their dexterity as musicians to be able to do that

Speaker 2 so convincingly because

Speaker 2 there are actually some, there's the Taylor's version's one, I kind of refer a lot of that stuff. I think it sounds incredible, but I'm happy to have all of it.

Speaker 1 So that leads me to the next question, Tay. Now that you own all of it, you have the re-recordings, you have the original recordings,

Speaker 1 what should we listen to? Like, do I, do I roll with the recording? Does it matter?

Speaker 1 You're just like, whatever you guys want?

Speaker 2 Yeah, it's really whatever you guys want. Because I love both of them.
I would not have put out the re-records if I didn't think that they held up or were better.

Speaker 2 I think a lot of the vocals I did on the re-records are better than the originals.

Speaker 2 Okay. But it's like if you found a nostalgia in the originals and that was what you were listening to when you were 12 years old, bopping around in your bedroom, go crazy.
Yeah, we got them all.

Speaker 1 I'm going to start doing comparisons. That's what I got to do.
I just got to start doing comparisons. Yeah, you're going to listen to every beat.

Speaker 2 You're certainly, it's not mandatory, Jason.

Speaker 1 I mean, that sounds like a good time. I'll say this: there's a few good playlists out there that have a mixture of them all.

Speaker 2 You've been streaming?

Speaker 1 Yes. Thank you.
I've been streaming for about two years now. Oh,

Speaker 2 that's fantastic. Thank you so much.
That's why we got that spike in the

Speaker 1 35-year-old male demographic. Yes, that 1.7 billion.
That was at least 1 billion.

Speaker 1 We have one IP address from one iPhone that continually is listening to this stuff.

Speaker 1 Did you have a favorite album that you re-recorded?

Speaker 1 Are there different eras that you liked recording more re-recording?

Speaker 2 I really liked them all, but I think red was very special.

Speaker 2 There were songs that I called from the vault songs, and there was one which I think is maybe my favorite song I've ever written called All Too Well the 10-Minute Version where I unearthed there were there are originally so many more verses in that song than ended up being on the on the album that I had put out when I originally put out red.

Speaker 2 I made the

Speaker 2 glorious fortuitous mistake of saying that to my fans in an interview.

Speaker 1 You know what those words mean.

Speaker 2 I love it. You're so handsome.
So

Speaker 2 basically

Speaker 2 I said that in an interview to my fans and they just like hung on to it. They were like, where's the 10-minute version? Give us the 10-minute version.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 when it came time to doing Taylor's version and re-recording the album, I went back in, found the verses,

Speaker 2 restructured the song to the way that it pretty much was when I had originally written it, put them back in.

Speaker 2 And that song

Speaker 2 is one of my favorite things I've ever done. And it was when we were on the Aris tour.

Speaker 2 I'm watching people just like cathartically scream this song to the point where I'm like, Do you need to, do you need to go to the hospital?

Speaker 2 Like, it was so passionate, the fan response to that song at the Aristotle. And I remember thinking so many times, like, what if this never happened? Like, what if I never had a song?

Speaker 1 It's one of the most iconic parts of your, of that tour.

Speaker 2 It was so fun. And so, like, yeah, it really did make me fall back in love with that album specifically.
I have a song with Phoebe Bridgers that I really love on that, you know, from the vault.

Speaker 2 Chris Stapleton was a part of it as well. And I just, I think that one, I've always loved Fearless in 1989 in a very pure way.

Speaker 2 But Red, I've kind of gone back and forth over the years and been like, you know, like

Speaker 2 that re-recording it made me just be like, ah, God, I love that album.

Speaker 1 I have no...

Speaker 2 no complicated feelings about that. I wouldn't have done anything different.

Speaker 2 Maybe except to include the original verses the first time.

Speaker 1 Well,

Speaker 1 we just talked about the different eras a little bit. Let's talk about perhaps the most daunting thing that any artist has ever taken on, which is the Ares Tour.
Oh my God.

Speaker 1 You finally finished it up last December in Vancouver.

Speaker 1 I don't know. What did it feel like to wrap it up? What does it feel like now? Like not touring and being on a jet every day, basically trying to go from country to country.

Speaker 2 Yeah. I mean,

Speaker 2 it feels great, Jason, to be honest.

Speaker 2 I'm not going to lie to you.

Speaker 1 You might miss it.

Speaker 2 I miss it.

Speaker 2 I do miss it, but it's like, it was perfect for what it was. Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 And it was a lot of, it was a lot of physical therapy and it was a lot of like being in a state of perpetual physical discomfort.

Speaker 2 Kind of like when you're in season, you know? Yeah, no,

Speaker 1 I'm not getting hit

Speaker 2 by huge 300 pounders, but the heels.

Speaker 1 No, No, when I saw the recovery station in the hotel room after with the toe spacers, I got an acupuncture that

Speaker 1 I've got. I'm telling you, dude, the similarities were crazy.
I'm like, oh my gosh, she does more than I do.

Speaker 2 We're like comparing physical therapy stories, like recovery stuff.

Speaker 1 Have you ever tried taping your ankle? We related on how much big ankle tape guy.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I miss it because I miss the fans and I miss that connection. But at the same time, it was so special.
It was like the most formative time of my life.

Speaker 2 I learned so much about

Speaker 2 how far I can push myself.

Speaker 2 And if I set a goal, you know, making that a three and a half hour show in the beginning of the tour, it's like you can't be sick one day and then decide tonight it's going to be two and a half hours.

Speaker 2 Right. And it's really just like prioritizing the fans experience before

Speaker 2 anything else.

Speaker 1 And my fellow broken heart. Yeah.
Don't get me started. Or like, don't you get me started?

Speaker 2 Or like stomach flu or like just like aching feet or blisters or whatever.

Speaker 1 Like it's, it just was which she had all of this going through. Usually all at the same time.

Speaker 1 Going into her fourth show.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 And it's just, it was kind of the coolest thing in the world because when we were putting together this tour, I had some really lofty goals I wanted to reach conceptually because I wanted to show, I wanted to show fans, and especially younger fans, visuals and sort of performance art references that were really important to me as a kid and what inspired me to want to do this, right?

Speaker 2 So, like, I wanted to put elements of musical theater, Broadway, ballet,

Speaker 2 you know, scenery that you would see in an opera.

Speaker 1 kind of things like this.

Speaker 1 I watched the whole tour. I don't, I just thought it was amazing.
I didn't know this.

Speaker 2 But that's exactly it.

Speaker 2 I wanted it to be references that i thought were really high concept and really high value for fans and for them to see things they hadn't necessarily seen before all in one concert but i wanted to do it at at the highest intensity rapid fire you're seeing something new every 15 to 30 seconds and so it feels like you're scrolling in an algorithm right and when i heard reports of people saying that they got actual amnesia after the concerts.

Speaker 2 I was like, oh, I think we did it. Yeah.

Speaker 2 I think we did it, nailed it.

Speaker 2 That's, that's genuinely, that, that's, I wasn't even shooting for that goal when they're like, I saw so many things and I experienced a state of euphoria that I now don't remember what happened to me.

Speaker 2 I was like, oh my God.

Speaker 1 All I remember is that she didn't want to meet me. That's it.
That's it.

Speaker 1 That's all he got about it. And as much, as much as you, and I've told you this, as much as you want to, you know, give New Heights credit.
I give the Arrows to her credit. Yeah.

Speaker 1 I give the Arrows to her credit because if I would have never gone to that show and been mesmerized and just been captivated

Speaker 1 and then left

Speaker 1 with such a desire to want to meet you,

Speaker 1 I would have never went on here and told everybody how butthurt I was. Yeah, I'd never just been so engulfed in the curiosity of who you were.
Oh, that's

Speaker 1 one of the best things about that last statement is you didn't even know what the word engulfed meant before, like you met Taylor. Like, this is, you have broadened your horizon so far.

Speaker 1 We're the perfect. I'm telling you, it's so, she makes me so much better.

Speaker 1 Thank you for saying that. Thank you for saying that.

Speaker 1 But it's like you see you on the stage and you see how crazy you can get an entire stadium going. And then I get you in a room and it's like, I've known you forever.

Speaker 1 It's like, it was just the easiest conversation I ever had. And it was just so much fun that it just

Speaker 1 knocked my socks off from what they say. Knocked your socks off.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 Thank you.

Speaker 1 I felt like I was a little bit more. You blew me away.
And

Speaker 1 I had never experienced something so mesmerizing on stage and then so real and so beautiful in person.

Speaker 1 Hey, that's

Speaker 1 should I leave?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I think so.

Speaker 2 Honestly, at this point, I think everyone should leave.

Speaker 1 I don't know where to go from here now.

Speaker 1 How many countries did you do the heiress tour in?

Speaker 2 47,000 countries, Jason.

Speaker 1 You just listed that in the beginning. Well, I said 51 cities, which I don't know if that's right.

Speaker 2 It was a lot of countries.

Speaker 2 What was really fun about all the countries that we went to

Speaker 2 is when we first started dating, he was like, I always wanted to go and really vacation in Europe and see

Speaker 2 and

Speaker 2 go to Asia. And I was like, well,

Speaker 2 I got a tour for that.

Speaker 2 It's coming up.

Speaker 1 Oh, nice. You got room for a 6'5 guy to 300.

Speaker 2 Yeah, we can figure it out. Like, no, that's it.
The dimensions are wild, but we'll make some room. I think we'll have to leave some equipment trunks behind.

Speaker 1 Thank you for accommodating

Speaker 2 the size, but absolutely we'd be happy to have you.

Speaker 2 And we got to, you know, we got to travel the world and have vacations and adventures when i wasn't on stage which was really fun because like europe was so fun australia is amazing

Speaker 2 um yeah it was great and and

Speaker 2 that entire part

Speaker 2 of our lives like i was on tour for so long and now i finally am not on tour and it's it's kind of great because i'm getting my hobbies back like when i was on tour

Speaker 2 All I had the bandwidth for was what's the acoustic mashup this week? What,

Speaker 2 how do I say welcome to the Aris tour in Portuguese? You know, that was the only thing taking up my brain space. And now it's.

Speaker 1 It's been so fun to see what Taylor actually gets into around the house.

Speaker 2 It's like, I'd say all my hobbies could be categorized as like hobbies you could have had in the 1700s.

Speaker 2 You know, like I get all my grandma shit.

Speaker 1 You enjoy doing all of these homey things.

Speaker 1 That's basically what you're saying.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I like to sew. I specialize, as you know, in children's purses and baby blankets.

Speaker 1 I make two things.

Speaker 1 I know that very well.

Speaker 2 I'm very good at these two things. I love to paint.
I love to cook. I have a different baking obsession every six months.

Speaker 1 I am the luckiest man in the world. Right now.

Speaker 2 Right now,

Speaker 2 we're very deep in a sourdough obsession that has taken over my life.

Speaker 1 I am aware.

Speaker 1 And I'm very deep in it now. You've got me deep in this.

Speaker 1 I'm lucky I'm working as much as I am. I'm running as much as I am because

Speaker 1 I'm getting the caloric intake.

Speaker 2 Yeah, he asked me to send him two loaves of sourdough at training camp.

Speaker 2 I'm like wrapping sourdough loaves in like

Speaker 2 saran wrap or whatever, like cling film. The sourdough has taken over my life in a huge way.
I'm really talking about bread

Speaker 2 60% of the time now.

Speaker 2 It's become a huge, huge factor.

Speaker 1 I mean, and she's getting good with making all these different versions of it. Oh, yeah.
My favorite one was probably, I mean, the regular sourdough is one of my favorites, but the blueberry.

Speaker 2 Yeah, we do. There's a blueberry lemon.
There's cinnamon swirl, cinnamon raisin.

Speaker 2 And this one I've been workshopping for the girls because they love everything rainbow, fun feti sourdough.

Speaker 1 Oh my gosh. It's going to blow their mind.
No, it will.

Speaker 2 Because they love sprinkles. Like we put, you know, we put sprinkles in everything when we hang out.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 It's really,

Speaker 1 yeah. She's a loafer for life now.

Speaker 2 Yeah. And

Speaker 2 it's gotten

Speaker 2 pretty crazy over here. I'm just like always like baking bread and texting my friends and being like, can I send you some bread? I need some feedback.

Speaker 2 Do you like this one better than you liked the other one? Like, I did the rise a little differently. I'm on like sourdough blogs.
There's a whole, there's a whole community of us and I didn't know it.

Speaker 1 Oh my gosh. This is an amount of people hoping that you're on their blog.
Oh, I'm on your blog.

Speaker 1 Girl, I'm on your blog.

Speaker 2 But it's like, I just didn't know this. There's people like me out there,

Speaker 2 and this is where the internet is good. This is where the internet is a good place where you can curate a reality where like,

Speaker 2 All I really use the internet for is sourdough. And when Travis shows me videos of otters on his Instagram algorithm.

Speaker 1 I want

Speaker 1 a wild otter so bad. I just want to find these little creatures.
Yeah, he does.

Speaker 1 But he wants to be. Why a wild one? Why wouldn't you...

Speaker 1 Because

Speaker 1 how magical? Aren't they all wild? Oh, no, there's domestic. There's domestic otters.

Speaker 2 He wants one specifically whose life he saved, who knows that he saved it.

Speaker 2 It's a really specific type of otter he's looking for.

Speaker 1 The videos that I watch are somebody just in a canoe.

Speaker 2 Yeah, he doesn't want to like go up to an otter and take it from its mother. No, he wants to see an otter, and the otter's like, My paws caught in a shell.
And he's like, I got you.

Speaker 2 And then the otter's like, Thank you forever with its little paws.

Speaker 1 And then

Speaker 2 it swims up, and then it's, and you're kayaking, and it's like doing this to you. Like, that's what he wants.
And I want it too, honestly. Who doesn't?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I mean, who doesn't? Yeah. Right? Yeah.
So,

Speaker 1 do otters eat bread? Can we get a sourdough eating otter? That might be a good idea.

Speaker 2 We're going to figure it out.

Speaker 1 I don't know if they don't know if they do.

Speaker 2 They're probably. But yeah, we had discussed maybe like carrying around cans of sardines just in case we run into one.

Speaker 1 Nice.

Speaker 2 It's better in principle than it is in practice.

Speaker 2 Easier to conceptualize. It's pretty easy, though.

Speaker 1 You just got to go canoeing.

Speaker 2 Which is also easier in principle than it is in practice for us in terms of just the weight balance.

Speaker 1 I'm on the hunt. I'm on the hunt for a friend.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Stuff you didn't know you needed to know, right?

Speaker 1 Jason? I mean, I love otters. I don't know who this is.
This is what life after Airs tour is, though, Jason. You got to, it's so cool.

Speaker 1 I'm retired. I am all in on this.

Speaker 1 I want to bake. I just don't have the planning behind it.
Taylor's a planner and she's going to have the sourdough alive. We're not going to keep a sourdough alive.
I've folded.

Speaker 1 What is it?

Speaker 2 I've, what's the. He's actually done it.

Speaker 1 He's actually done it. Yeah, I've made a loaf.
You've had one of my loafs.

Speaker 2 He's done, he's done all of it.

Speaker 2 Like, we've, we've set it up where it's like i've got a station and he's got a station and he's done all of it okay so he's actually baked too yeah i've stretched and folded before yeah

Speaker 1 but there's just like something always slightly wrong

Speaker 1 no his was actually his rose higher than mine his was

Speaker 1 more delicious than mine it's like it's also you know no directions over here jason's i get into the no chance jason you've had it you said you loved it i'm not saying it's not good but it's nowhere as good as taylor's that's not true i'm telling you if you if you took like two chunks and you sent it off to the lab, there's going to be so many more germs and microbes and traffic.

Speaker 1 Oh my God. Oh, ew.

Speaker 2 The bacteria count.

Speaker 1 What is the fungus in this? That's on this one. No, that's true.
That's the sour. Jason, don't eat it.
That's the sour. Okay.
Why is there chest hair in it?

Speaker 2 How did you,

Speaker 1 there's like chest hair. Cheese aprons too low.
There's like chest hair in his.

Speaker 2 There's cat hair in mine. It's just like both of these are completely inedible.

Speaker 2 But it's crazy how you can how many puns you can make because I do the whole I got bread bags and I got

Speaker 2 um

Speaker 2 labels, and so it's you can you can really go for it with the puns.

Speaker 2 Um,

Speaker 1 you go, Are you ready for it? Are you ready?

Speaker 2 Um,

Speaker 2 uh, Flower Song is the slamming screen door, that's horrible.

Speaker 1 Um,

Speaker 2 um,

Speaker 2 uh, it's a loaf story, baby, just say yeast,

Speaker 1 just say yeast, Yeah.

Speaker 1 What's the one I was doing?

Speaker 1 It's a loaf story.

Speaker 2 No,

Speaker 1 it's horrible.

Speaker 2 Loafing him was bread.

Speaker 1 It's bad.

Speaker 2 You don't know that song, and that's okay. I love you.
It wasn't on the tour.

Speaker 1 Tour. So we do have this.
I did fuck that up. 21 countries.
Did you learn anything throughout the play?

Speaker 1 Is there anything at the end of the tour when you were wrapping up that you wish you had been doing the whole time? Is there anything you would do differently now that the entire tour is wrapped up?

Speaker 2 No,

Speaker 2 I'm really glad that I didn't know it would have gone on as long as it did.

Speaker 2 I'm glad that I got to actually be prepared for this tour the way that I was because, you know, in previous tours, I had noticed that I would get on the tour and I'd have to like get my stamina up throughout the tour.

Speaker 2 And by the last quarter of the tour, I'd finally hit my stride stamina-wise, and I'd be like, Oh, I can do this easily every night.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I wanted to be at that point at the beginning of the ARIS tour, so that's why I did so much more training, so much more endurance training, and cardio, and stuff that you know doesn't come naturally because I'm not an athlete.

Speaker 2 So it's like that stuff I have to really force myself to do.

Speaker 1 Don't you say that? I mean, don't you dare say I feel.

Speaker 2 And I don't even, it's not like I say that in a disparaging way. I, I, I don't care at all.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 why do we take it that way?

Speaker 2 It's not like, it's, yeah, I'm like, I really, I'm not an athlete, and that's fine. Like, I play in the future.

Speaker 1 I take it that way because we're undefeated on the beer pong table.

Speaker 1 I've seen you throw a football.

Speaker 2 No,

Speaker 2 that's not good, and you know, that's not good.

Speaker 1 It does. No, it does.

Speaker 1 You can

Speaker 1 spiral?

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 2 You got to be real. It's better than me.
Because it's not, there's no spiral. I don't think I've ever caught anything that's ever been thrown to me, near me.

Speaker 2 around me.

Speaker 1 I'm just disinterested in being an athlete.

Speaker 2 That's true.

Speaker 1 Can you hit something with a stick?

Speaker 1 That's a telltale sign of an athlete.

Speaker 2 Good with the sports. Yeah, no, I don't know, Jason.
I've never tried that.

Speaker 1 So it's like

Speaker 1 we're going out back out. Here's the thing, right?

Speaker 2 My relationship with sports was like, you know, I grew up in Pennsylvania. I always heard my dad yelling at the screen watching Eagles games.

Speaker 2 That was always the sports sounds that I heard in my house. However, I was up in my room playing guitar, learning instruments, playing piano.
Just, I was focused on different things.

Speaker 2 I was like so laser focused on music. And that's how I was in school.
Like I, I would go to sporting events so that I could sing the national anthem.

Speaker 2 Like everything was a means to an end to get me to get to do music. I've, I know every halftime show from the Super Bowls, but I don't, I didn't watch the sports.

Speaker 1 And so watching the girls tour and seeing that power skip, I knew you were an athlete from the, from the, from the power skip.

Speaker 2 That's, you're just saying words.

Speaker 1 It's one of my favorite parts

Speaker 1 to see you just skipping down that runway just looking like a giraffe that's limbs were put on all round not everybody can everybody can skip but not everybody can power skips

Speaker 2 that takes athletic thank you i appreciate that

Speaker 2 what a unique compliment um

Speaker 2 so yeah i uh i i definitely became obsessed with sports when it came to him i'm competitive on his behalf but like if you and me are gonna go against each other in something athletic like i'm gonna let you win because this to me like i don't see why what do the points even mean if I'm if I'm doing it?

Speaker 2 I'm a fan of athletics and the sports. If I'm doing the sports, like, I'm throwing like this because I don't, what I don't really care if it goes where it's supposed to go.
Interesting.

Speaker 2 It doesn't bother me.

Speaker 1 And when I'm doing it,

Speaker 2 I'm not embarrassed.

Speaker 1 No, she's a good teammate, so she'll give effort if it's teamed up. If it's individual sports, she's not going to care.

Speaker 2 But if she needs to be held accountable, if I'm on his team and we're playing gear pong or something, like I'm really trying.

Speaker 1 You're now you're in. You're a team sports gal.

Speaker 1 Because this matters to him, right absolutely i'm a team sports gal yeah put me put me on an olympic one person trying to do some stuff sport i'm doing this

Speaker 1 yeah i don't care

Speaker 1 yeah i'm i'm doing this i care okay i'm doing this i care this care a lot

Speaker 1 We're doing this. We're demeaning dough.
I don't care.

Speaker 2 I don't care if this happens. I don't care if this goes here.
It's not part of my metrics for my self-worth.

Speaker 1 All right, that's probably very healthy, to be honest with you. Hey, you know,

Speaker 2 I was like, as long as you're fine with this.

Speaker 1 What? No, I'm completely fine with you being an athlete. Yeah.

Speaker 2 I'm not an athlete.

Speaker 1 I'm never going to be. You just missed the whole point.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 What?

Speaker 2 He sees what he wants to see, and it bodes well for me.

Speaker 1 Do you have a favorite thing from the Aeros Tour?

Speaker 2 I have a lot of favorite things from the Aeros Tour.

Speaker 2 I would look out and I would see a lot of bonding happening between generations of people. Gosh, that's so true.
It was really wonderful.

Speaker 2 It was like the most incredible feeling in the world because I can see all that. I've got LASIK.
I have incredible vision.

Speaker 2 Basically, the Arist Tour, I think one of my favorite things was when the fans would come up with their own traditions, right?

Speaker 2 Because I can plan a stage show that's like, we know exactly what's happening, when it's going to happen. It's very stage-managed.
It's a whole production, right? And I love to plan.

Speaker 2 But I also do love surprises. Like, there's a time during the European, like, of the era's tour,

Speaker 2 there's a song called Willow where we do a performance where we have these, it's a very like witchy performance. We have these like light up orbs and we're in cloaks and it's all very woo.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 2 the fans decided that they were going to bring their own light up orbs. And by that, I mean balloons that they would blow up in the audience.

Speaker 1 Like,

Speaker 2 and then they would light their, they would use their phone light behind it and create a light up orb.

Speaker 2 When I tell you, I looked out, yeah, or a glow stick, whatever. Like they would figure out ways to illuminate them themselves.

Speaker 2 And it was insane to look out and see spontaneously thousands of these orbs just go up.

Speaker 2 And I just be like, I don't even know who organized this.

Speaker 2 Was there a group text?

Speaker 2 How did you guys even do this?

Speaker 1 It was so special.

Speaker 2 It felt like we were all part of something together in a way that couldn't be planned.

Speaker 2 And there's as much as I love and relish in planning, it was really fun that they would do things to sort of delight me every once in a while. They had little chants.
They had all these traditions.

Speaker 2 By the end of the tour, it was like Rocky Horror Picture Show, where they have their own show.

Speaker 1 They have their own show, literally.

Speaker 1 I remember being in Gelsengirken, Germany.

Speaker 2 And you know what?

Speaker 1 What did you just say?

Speaker 1 Gelsengirken. Love is him learning that.
Yeah. That's our actual, that's a city? He came to Gelsenkirchen.

Speaker 1 I think that's how he supported me there.

Speaker 1 If you say with a German accent, it probably sounds more like the actual city, but my American accent is Gelsengirken. Gelsengirken.
And

Speaker 1 I remember seeing that part of the show, and they were literally doing circles and like putting the orbs up in the air and passing them to each other like they were performing. It was so beautiful.

Speaker 2 They were so committed.

Speaker 2 I've never played for crowds that were as committed.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 So I think I loved the event of it. Like I'm always, I'm always trying to figure out how to to make music into more of an event, right? How do we make it romantic?

Speaker 2 How do we make it something that people experience together? And, you know, that's why I love vinyl. That's why I love,

Speaker 2 you know, putting so much into

Speaker 2 the tour or a music video or events or activities for them to do or Easter eggs or little puzzles for them to solve. Like it's gotten to the point where it's just like, it's a little bit,

Speaker 2 people are like, the Easter eggs thing is getting a little zodiac killer at this point. I'm I'm like, as long as they like it, you know?

Speaker 1 How do you go about?

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Speaker 1 Like knowing how to do an Easter egg. I don't even know, like, where does that process start? Are you like, well, I have some parameters.
What is the art of the Easter egg?

Speaker 2 The art of the Easter egg is that

Speaker 2 there's, there's do's and don'ts, right? Like, I'm never going to plant an Easter egg that

Speaker 2 ties back to my personal life. It's always going to be towards music or a musical,

Speaker 2 something I'm coming up with, something I have coming up, a plan I have coming together,

Speaker 2 something

Speaker 2 that you don't know I'm saying for a specific reason that you'll hear later and you'll go back and be like, oh my God. Like, I think my favorite one of those was

Speaker 2 I was given an honorary doctorate from NYU and I made the commencement speech and I put so many lyrical Easter eggs in that speech that when the Midnights album came out after that, the fans were like, the whole speech was an Easter egg.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 And that's for me, that's really fun because I, because they find it fun.

Speaker 1 For sure.

Speaker 2 And also just I love numerology. I love math stuff.
I love dates. I love certain, I just, that's stuff like I find really fun.

Speaker 2 And,

Speaker 2 you know, we, I'm, I want Easter eggs to be a certain thing where like, if you are a part of the fandom and you want to experience music in a normal way, then, then you don't even see these.

Speaker 2 You don't even care what that thing is above that doorway in under that dimly lit flickering light over there that's upside down, backwards, in braille.

Speaker 2 You don't need to know what that is.

Speaker 1 I love this. Yeah.

Speaker 2 But if you want, if you want to look at that,

Speaker 1 but if you do, then it's there.

Speaker 2 Do you know what I mean? Like, if you know, you know.

Speaker 1 You didn't know.

Speaker 1 You know.

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah. What's then you know? Then you know.
Let's talk about something I don't know. What is numerology? You threw that phrase out there.
Like, that's a common. What is numerology?

Speaker 1 Do you know what numerology is?

Speaker 1 I'm assuming something with numbers. Yeah.
Like, I'm 87 and she's 13.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Literally, it's that simple.
Just numbers. And

Speaker 1 100.

Speaker 2 Yeah. 13 plus 87 equals 100.
That's numerology.

Speaker 1 Like

Speaker 2 numbers that have a specific significance.

Speaker 1 Like, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 Yo.

Speaker 2 Do you not keep it 100 ever?

Speaker 1 I'm trying to. I attempt to.

Speaker 2 It's crazy that you don't. What numbers do I have deciding that like that?

Speaker 1 Kylie, I don't know how to do this.

Speaker 2 It's okay. It's not my favorite number.

Speaker 1 My favorite number is 13, though. It always has been.
Travis. I know.
And that's part of the numerology of why we're dating.

Speaker 1 Okay. That's part of it.

Speaker 1 It's been in my life, my friend.

Speaker 1 Travis likes people that like the number 13. Yeah.

Speaker 1 What does liking the number 13 say about us, though?

Speaker 2 It says that we're family in

Speaker 2 trichodectophilia, I think it is.

Speaker 1 Is the

Speaker 2 obsession with

Speaker 1 it's every day, dude? This is every day.

Speaker 1 That's a a real thing. You know what that means.
Every day. He knows

Speaker 1 trichodelphophilia. So that's the obsession with specifically number 13 or something.
I'm sorry.

Speaker 2 Yeah,

Speaker 2 trisca decaphobia is when you hate 13. Triscophelia is when you love it.

Speaker 1 Philia is love.

Speaker 1 I don't know why. I thought it was like everybody else was afraid of number 13.
So then I'm like, yeah, that's like phobia.

Speaker 2 That's what it is. Yeah, you're just being contrarian, which I love.
I love that about you. All right.
You're just like, you want to do this? I'm going to do this.

Speaker 1 That's exactly how I sound.

Speaker 1 Jason.

Speaker 1 Let's get. Jason, Jason, Jason.

Speaker 1 All right.

Speaker 1 Favorite thing about the Airs Tour was besides going to it and just being like this amazed at everything. I think I was on another podcast recently, just like

Speaker 1 all of the songs,

Speaker 1 everything you just talked about, where it changes so much, right? There's something new every 20, 30 seconds. It was incredible.

Speaker 1 The nonstop length of it, but I will, I'm going to be remiss if I don't say one of the things that I love is watching Travis Kelsey get on the stage, the man in the tuxedo.

Speaker 2 It was so good. It was so special.
That was like, we were like, that came about because we were just doing, we thought we were doing a bit. Like, we both thought we were just joking.

Speaker 2 Because a lot of what we're saying is like inside of a bit and we're laughing the whole time. And every once in a while, one of us would be like, Are you serious? Like,

Speaker 2 I could be. I'm, I could be serious.

Speaker 1 Are you serious like i was i was serious in

Speaker 1 and in terrifying fashion i was like yeah it was like a what wouldn't it be funny if kind of thing

Speaker 1 and um i would try not to fuck this up

Speaker 2 no the show's perfect you don't want to fuck the show up do you i knew you were going to be down for i knew you were if you wanted to do it like i was never going to pressure you to do it but the fact that when when we were talking about it we were joking i kind of got i saw that little twinkle in your eye where i was like oh he wants to do it you want want me to go on it?

Speaker 2 He wants to do it.

Speaker 1 He wants to. Do you want me to go on stage?

Speaker 2 Yeah, you got up there.

Speaker 1 You were so good.

Speaker 2 Every single beat, he's his comedic timing is crazy. Like, and when the lights are bright, he's like, he like slows down time.
Like, that's when he well, no, I just black out

Speaker 1 and hope that it ends out like perfect.

Speaker 2 That's you said you and I are saying the same thing.

Speaker 1 I just, I did, I did, I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, like

Speaker 1 I rose from that stage and I saw how many people are looking at you and I was just like

Speaker 1 blackout.

Speaker 2 You looked so good. It was so amazing.
Like it was, it was one of the loudest, if not the loudest, screams I've ever heard on the tour. It was insane.
It really was.

Speaker 1 How many, Trav, you played football in some of the biggest stadiums. You've been in front of people who have been staring at you your whole life.
What was that moment like? There's nothing like this.

Speaker 1 I felt like an ant. I felt like the smallest piece of life ever.
Like Like that entire stadium, the floor, everything.

Speaker 1 What are all these people doing on the field? Howard, holy, I didn't know this place felt like this. Oh my gosh.
What is going on? I have to pick her up now.

Speaker 1 Okay, here we go. Don't drop her.

Speaker 1 Don't drop her. Don't drop her.

Speaker 2 It's so funny that you were actually scared about that. You could like throw me over a mountain

Speaker 1 and like climb the mountain and catch me on the other side. Football players drop balls all the time.

Speaker 1 Which is not a

Speaker 2 Oh my God. It was so good.
It was London. It was Wembley Stadium.
It was those were such special shows. And we had just,

Speaker 2 wasn't this the week that I got to watch Jason meet the Royal Family? It was. It was.
Yeah. I knew you were serious when I was like, Jason, do you want to go meet?

Speaker 1 He was like,

Speaker 1 what do I do with my beer?

Speaker 2 Yeah, I watched him have this moment with his beer where he's just like, but I want to take it, but I know that I probably should not take it. That's right.

Speaker 2 I watched this happen, and it was kind of the most important thing.

Speaker 1 What do I do when I meet people? I like that you picked up on it because that was exactly what was going on.

Speaker 2 If I don't have my beer, what do I do with this hand now? Is it

Speaker 1 disrespectful to have a beer when you have loyalty?

Speaker 2 Or am I just like being authentic by having the beer? I would normally have the beer. Wouldn't they want me to be myself? I'm watching you say that in your head.
Yep. And it was fantastic.

Speaker 1 I don't know. I'll always remember that.

Speaker 2 I was just like, I'll always remember meeting you for the first time, Jason.

Speaker 1 Do we need to talk about that? That time I I did hold on to my beer.

Speaker 2 You did.

Speaker 1 What was, I guess you brought it up. What was that first impression like? What was, did you know I was told to be on my best behavior?

Speaker 2 I didn't know what you were told, but I did know that one of the first things I saw was like you say to Kylie, I was just shotgunning beers with the Bills Mafia, and I really want to go through one of the fire tables.

Speaker 1 Yep. I want to jump through it.

Speaker 2 I want to jump onto the flaming table. And she goes,

Speaker 1 Okay, can we not do that right now?

Speaker 1 Yeah, Kylie.

Speaker 2 And since then,

Speaker 1 I've heard her say that exact thing to your four-year-old

Speaker 2 about, like, mommy, I want to throw this pudding on the wall. Wouldn't that be fun? Can we not do it right now?

Speaker 1 That's a fantastic. That's a common phrase.

Speaker 2 And so I meet you. You're exactly as I thought you would be.
Kylie is exactly as I thought she would be. Just like the realest, the smartest, the coolest.
You're fantastic. Obviously, you know that.

Speaker 2 And then I swear to God, Jason,

Speaker 2 you flew through the window at light speed. I've never seen someone so big move so fast.

Speaker 1 It's impressive.

Speaker 2 It's like, you know, when you see a cricket and it's here? Yeah. And then it's gone

Speaker 2 and it's 16 feet that way. You're like, did it just jump that way? How did it do that?

Speaker 1 And he surprisingly, he gets more athletic the more

Speaker 1 beers. I mean, it's really wild.
I really should have played in the NFL drunk. I think it would have been.
You should have.

Speaker 2 You know what? Not know.

Speaker 2 At this point, I would never argue with that. And all of a sudden, like, you're out there in the snow.
You're handing me children through the window.

Speaker 1 He's trying to. It's fully.
It's not my best moment. It was.

Speaker 1 And, like,

Speaker 2 I think it actually was.

Speaker 1 And I'm like, he's like, Taylor. I was like, you want to see Taylor? I got you.
Let's go.

Speaker 1 We're going.

Speaker 2 Whose kid is that, Jason? Do you know where this kid came from?

Speaker 2 But yeah, it was, I think it was your best moment. And I think I'm very lucky to have gotten to see it.
I love this like new world that Travis has shown me because I really, it's so fun.

Speaker 2 It's so exciting.

Speaker 2 There's so much pressure on these players that I didn't, I kind of was like, I've only ever been in music and been like, you know, seeing that, but the pressure on sports is just such a different type.

Speaker 2 that I have such a respect for everyone, like everyone I meet on his team, like everyone I see doing this. I'm just like, you've been focused on this since you were a kid.
And it shows.

Speaker 1 Well, and I'm sure there's a lot of relatability there. Anybody trying to be the best at what they do and dedicating their lives to it.
I mean, yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 And I've been, I've been so lucky because I never have gotten to see what the suite looks like when I play the game. Because they didn't have to play.
I never get to see my friends and family.

Speaker 1 I never get. So now whenever I make a play, I get to see it, what it actually looks like, how much fun they're having, what, you know, the type of support that I get and how crazy it gets.

Speaker 1 So the Vegas Super Bowl, there was... There was a camera on the suite and when Micole scored that touchdown and to see everybody in that suite start jumping on the bottom.

Speaker 2 People are body slamming each other into other rooms. It was so violent.

Speaker 1 Kids giving me the jump.

Speaker 1 I'm the luckiest guy in the world.

Speaker 2 That video.

Speaker 1 To get everybody going crazy.

Speaker 2 People went down.

Speaker 1 Like

Speaker 2 there were people punching each other. It was like absolute chaos.
And like, I have, I have every memory of that. Like every memory of that moment is intact, but it's just like

Speaker 2 screaming and thrashing around and trying not to be taken down by this undertow of your friends going absolutely insane.

Speaker 1 I loved every bit of it.

Speaker 2 Oh, it was so insane.

Speaker 1 I mean, the suite. that is the Travis Kelsey suite that has been happening.
What was your first impression of that? Of everybody in there?

Speaker 1 Who's the MVP of the suite? Who's the MVP of the suite?

Speaker 2 Okay, so he's got, which is an incredible, like a huge green flag, is that Travis has had the same friends since he's probably four years old. Yes.

Speaker 1 Literally.

Speaker 2 And he's incredibly good at maintaining friendships and he's so loyal. And his friends are equally loyal.
And they're just the funniest, most hilarious group of people.

Speaker 1 Yeah, and you want to talk about green flags. The first game she went to, the Bears game, she literally went through the front door of the stadium.

Speaker 1 Yeah, we walked right in, just right in, like the tick, like general admission through general admission through with everybody on the bus to the game. Oh, my God.

Speaker 1 And I was just like, oh, she's just in it. She's down.
She's down for the ride. She's here for, she's here for the fun.
She's like, I'll fucking go.

Speaker 1 I'll go through the mud. I'll be a part of a Chiefs' Kingdom.

Speaker 2 Like, this is where we walk in. This is where we walk in.
I don't know what to tell you.

Speaker 1 I don't have an alternative.

Speaker 2 I'm like, you know, we just played here three months ago.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 And we went a different way, but I'm not going to say that. I'm not going to backseat drive this shit.

Speaker 1 What was that like?

Speaker 1 What were people doing?

Speaker 2 I remember using, like, Ross was like, Ross is so tall and so, and so broad

Speaker 2 that it's like that, that helps a lot. And then just you have a lot of other just like big, bulky dudes that you're friends with.

Speaker 1 Green flag. Not threatened by other guys.
That's true.

Speaker 2 I was walking in with, I had a hat on and I had a mask on. And I'm walking in, just in the front where we're walking in with thousands of people in Arrowhead and nobody

Speaker 2 nobody Noticed. Oh my gosh, there were rumors that we had been seeing each other, but I think people were like

Speaker 1 What would they talk about?

Speaker 2 Yeah, right, you know

Speaker 1 Yeah, I hinted on the Pat McAfee show that I was gonna see if you would be willing to come see me rock the stage at Arrowhead since I

Speaker 2 seen you make the stage but nobody was like oh yeah we're definitely gonna we're definitely gonna see her there and we're gonna see her coming in through general admission.

Speaker 1 No way this guy landed her.

Speaker 1 No chance. No chance that whole podcast thing worked.
I didn't believe it when you told me. You manifested it.
I did this.

Speaker 2 You summoned me. Here I am.

Speaker 1 Andy Reid has recently revealed that he was the one who set you guys up. How true is this revelation by Big Grid?

Speaker 2 Whatever Andy Reid says, we're going to stand by.

Speaker 1 We're not going to refute anything.

Speaker 2 He says it.

Speaker 1 Cuba. That's what happened.
Big Grid. It's all the same.
That's what happened.

Speaker 2 he's he's been friends with my dad my dad is is the most social man who's ever been born shout out to scott i was about to say who's not friends with scott he's just like he's just a maniac he will make a friend in an airport in 1971 have a five-minute conversation and still be talking to that dude twice a week now and but he's like that with everyone he meets like he has he's able to have very many very meaningful relationships and it's it's a skill it's a talent it's it is it is a mind-boggling talent that i have only known him to have yeah yeah he's a savant it is a present

Speaker 2 social savant my dad and so he knows andy and uh

Speaker 2 you know andy's been coming to shows for years and stuff like that so we've i've always had like a really positive vibe about andy reed i didn't really know what what what the sports were that he was doing but i knew that that was my dad's friend andy reed you knew he was really i now know he is literally the most iconic legendary yes coach of all time and like from the way that you talk about him, his leadership style is so, I respect it so much because I feel like it's done without like aggression or raising your voice or losing your composure.

Speaker 1 It's all very composed and focused. Could happen.
He will rip you apart for sure.

Speaker 2 But like not in a better be really like

Speaker 2 lazy's calling. Yeah, but that's the thing.
It's like, but it's not done. It's not overdone, right? Like if you get it from him, you know you deserve it and you're in the shape up.

Speaker 1 Exactly. That's what I heard from you.
Exactly. And yeah, there's validity to it.
There's like

Speaker 1 there's so there's such a genuine like

Speaker 1 want to get better that him getting you to like do it the right way is a is it's like a disciplinary thing.

Speaker 1 It's just like he he won't he wouldn't be doing it unless he saw the greatness in you or he saw your ability to get it right.

Speaker 1 And he wouldn't be doing it this way if it was any other way, if that makes sense. It does.

Speaker 2 There's a lot of heart.

Speaker 1 Yeah, there's a stoicism too, which makes the heart when he shows it to you. And I think this is what you're kind of saying, Taylor, he's so like composed and so like locked in.

Speaker 1 And then all of a sudden, when he does show that little bit of like warmth, it's like, oh, there's that teddy bear. I see him.
Yeah, he's funny. He's cheeky.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 But it's like everything has a reason. Like everything is, every, everything is very like intentional.

Speaker 2 He's like, I feel like he like coaches and lives in a very intentional way, which I think is really awesome. And it's just like a great leadership style.

Speaker 1 Yeah, there's a layer of trust and there's a layer of like discipline where you're going to have some fun playing with for him, but you're going to know when you got to flip that switch to be serious and be on point and do it his way.

Speaker 1 He says it all the time. He's got 51%.

Speaker 1 I was like, yeah, all right. Whatever you say, boss.

Speaker 2 I always feel like when you lose your shit, you lose your leadership.

Speaker 1 You know,

Speaker 2 for sure. It's just kind of something I've always kind of tried to administer is what I'm doing.

Speaker 2 But he's a huge role model for that of how he motivates people and how he does so without flying off the handle and is just very focused on what the right thing is at the right moment.

Speaker 1 Yep.

Speaker 1 So did Andy tell Scott something? Is that what I'm trying to get?

Speaker 2 What did Andy say to Scott? I mean, okay, so when you guys did the full send on the podcast,

Speaker 2 and he was like, you want to date me? And everybody heard it. It was the shooting your shot heard around the world.

Speaker 1 Yes.

Speaker 2 Basically, everyone who who likes you, which is a lot of people, started reaching out to everyone who knows me. There we go.
I think it was like Andy was vouching for you.

Speaker 2 I think it was my relatives, my cousins were like,

Speaker 2 please, please, please. He's amazing.

Speaker 2 There were friends that were like, he's actually an amazing guy. Like, he's so great.

Speaker 2 There was a lot of kind of people whispering. in my ear about you.
And I actually,

Speaker 2 that's not normal.

Speaker 1 It's not normal.

Speaker 2 There are people just willing to go to to bat for you and be like, you don't understand. This guy's incredible.

Speaker 1 Well, Andy, well done.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Thank you, Andy.

Speaker 1 And Scott, thank you. And Scott, thank you.
There we go, Scott. Speaking of which, how's Scott doing? He's doing good?

Speaker 2 So he is doing incredibly well. My dad had an interesting summer.
He actually

Speaker 2 had a quintuple bypass surgery, and that's a really intense surgery. Yeah.

Speaker 2 So it all happened really quick. He went in.

Speaker 2 I know he would want me to say this because he really like, he learned a lot through this process. He's had a healthy, perfect EKG every year that he's gone in to get his physicals.

Speaker 1 Perfect EKG. Yeah.

Speaker 2 But what found his five hard blockages in his heart was a resting stress test. So he's been telling all his friends, you need to get the stress test because that's what's actually preventative.

Speaker 2 If you can find that earlier, you don't have to have a bypass surgery. You can.
you can sort out those blockages with stents and things that are a lot less invasive.

Speaker 2 So he finds out that he's got these blockages. They're like, this is,

Speaker 2 we got to do this like tomorrow. Yeah.
You, you, you shouldn't like, we don't know how you walked in here, dude. This is crazy.

Speaker 2 Um, so he was, of course, saying to our family, he was like, you guys are busy. I don't want you guys to have to like come in here.
Like, you and Austin are busy.

Speaker 2 Like, just don't, you don't have to do this.

Speaker 1 Like, don't. The brave dad, the strong dad.

Speaker 2 He said something about like when a cat is injured, it curls up around a tree and heals itself.

Speaker 2 I was like, dad, cats don't have quintuple bypasses he tried to relate that's wild you're just saying stuff now that doesn't mean anything to me and so i was like okay i'm not gonna come there yeah all right like

Speaker 2 uh so he wakes up from surgery and it's it's my mom my brother and me and his best friend and he comes out of surgery and he was he did like a comedy act a comedy set for like 15 minutes he was the funniest he's ever been and he's incredibly funny but he's like he he we didn't know how many blockages he had.

Speaker 2 And I was like, dad, you had a quintuple bypass. You had five.
That's crazy. It's more than we thought.
And he's like, well, you see, I come from a very competitive family.

Speaker 2 And it was kind of wild because it was like, it was very parent-child reversal in a lot of ways. Like my brother and my mom and I were each taking shifts in the ICU and staying with them 24-7.

Speaker 2 And I remember when I was a teenager, my parents would always, the big fight we always had is I'd sneak my cell phone into my room and be talking to my best friend Abigail under the covers all night.

Speaker 2 And they'd be like, you have a test tomorrow.

Speaker 1 You need to rest.

Speaker 2 We're taking your phone, whatever.

Speaker 2 I get to the hospital. My brother will have done the night shift.
And he's like, he's like, Tay, you got to take his phone. I caught him FaceTiming his friends all night.
He needs his rest.

Speaker 2 He needs to be sleeping. He's FaceTiming all night.

Speaker 1 That's like one of the main things you need is you need that your body to just like recover.

Speaker 2 And I'm like, I'm not taking his phone. He'll get mad.
He's like, I'm not taking his phone. You got to be the one to take his phone.
I'm like, I'm not doing it. My mom's like, I don't want to do it.

Speaker 2 So we're just like, it's like, we've got our, like, our teen, we've got to take our teenage son's phone away from him because he's FaceTiming all night.

Speaker 2 He came out of surgery, tried to give guitar pics to all the nurses and doctors, but he wasn't wearing pants, didn't have pockets, hospital gown.

Speaker 2 You know, I'm like, I'm having these moments where I'm like, this dude built play sets and swing sets and cribs for me.

Speaker 2 I'm building his like, I'm building his shower chair and his walker and his like bed that goes like this. Like it's just surreal, man.
And you're like, you know,

Speaker 2 we just all moved in with him for the whole summer, pretty much. And just, you know, because you can't really walk on your own.

Speaker 2 We had a little harness for my dad, just like walking dad on his harness. And he was like the loveliest patient ever.
He just kept saying thank you over and over again.

Speaker 1 So the guy was full of life, man.

Speaker 1 He was appreciative that he caught it. He still is.
Yeah. You know,

Speaker 1 we had the FaceTime with him last time we were together, and I was like, yeah, he hasn't changed a bit. This guy's still freaking got the energy going.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 So, like, Trad was hanging with him the other day, and he was like, so, sweetie, he says he's at 75%.

Speaker 2 And if this is 75%, I'm truly terrified of what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 To give you the update, I'm probably at 85 to 90% now. We've still got a month, though.
Yeah, so

Speaker 2 my dad's like, new arteries, new me.

Speaker 2 My mom just got a new niece.

Speaker 1 New niece. There we go.
New niece. New niece.
Yep. She's doing great.

Speaker 2 She's scampering around. We're not quite at scampering yet, but she's doing great.

Speaker 2 Yeah, this was just like the summer of my parental upgrades. Like, we're just upgrading the parents, making sure that they live to be at least 186 years old.
Huge.

Speaker 2 Because they're two of my best friends and I just adore them.

Speaker 2 And it was actually one of the most special things that's ever happened to me, like spending all that time with them this summer and getting to like you, you have those long talks that you don't have when it's like a small, concentrated period of time.

Speaker 2 This is when I learned to do the sourdough, right? My parents' friend, Tina, sends over a loaf of bread. Shout out, Tina.
Shout out, Tina.

Speaker 1 That's my girl.

Speaker 2 Sends over like the best loaf of bread I've ever had in my life. To call it bread feels really honestly sort of like

Speaker 2 sort of like minimizing what this was, right?

Speaker 2 So I'm like,

Speaker 2 I need to know how to do this. I I go over to Tina's house, she teaches me how to do it, she gives me some of her starter.
Life is never the same.

Speaker 2 All these things are happening in Florida. Travis is doing his training.
He's like,

Speaker 1 look at him. Florida.
I'm in Florida.

Speaker 1 Look at him. And he's so fast and he can jump so high.

Speaker 2 So, if this was our Florida summer, that's what it is. It's a hell of a drug.

Speaker 1 We're really Florida it up. Florida.
Yeah, no doubt. All right.

Speaker 1 How many people have come up to you guys and talking about or spoken about how much they've appreciated you being a part of the Chiefs and like their daughters all of a sudden being in the sports?

Speaker 1 Because I get it all the time. I can't imagine how much you guys get it.
How much the game has grown.

Speaker 2 It definitely feels like a lot of people say that to us, which is really kind because

Speaker 2 there was never a thought in either of our heads that that was going to be.

Speaker 1 I had no idea. That was, yeah, that was a pleasant surprise.

Speaker 2 Seeing all the little girls in the stands at games and you can see a proud father right there standing next to him it's it's a it's it's definitely been fun to see that like surprise you know i think a lot of like a lot of the the women and girls maybe they maybe they like watched one game to see me cheer on my boyfriend or whatever but if they if they stayed which is what people are saying based on the numbers that's because the game is so great and it's such an amazing interesting thing to learn about i will say it was it was cool to see the comparison of it all because

Speaker 1 the way she runs her tour, her show, her team and everything like that is very

Speaker 1 team-friendly. There are similarities in terms of her athleticism,

Speaker 1 what she's doing for three hours. I mean, listen,

Speaker 1 I was screaming for 40 seconds during the intro, and I'm out of breath. That's what I'm saying.
That's what I'm saying. But the preparation it takes.

Speaker 2 I got a whole regimen for you.

Speaker 2 We'll get you on the tour prep. It'll be great.

Speaker 1 Perfect. The goals that you set for yourself to achieve.

Speaker 1 Like, it's very like, there are some similarities that I thought you found, like, I don't know, like fascinating that you kind of have that same regimen going into stuff.

Speaker 1 And I thought that was that was fun for me to at least see when I saw you on tour and saw how much of a team you guys were.

Speaker 2 On paper, like we actually kind of have a very similar job. Like our job is to entertain people for three plus hours in NFL stadiums.

Speaker 1 And it's like,

Speaker 2 when I'm there, it's called a dressing room. When Travis is there, it's called a locker room.
For me, it's called a rehearsal. For him, it's called a practice.
For him, it's called his coach.

Speaker 2 For me, it's my mom.

Speaker 1 So,

Speaker 1 yeah.

Speaker 2 So, there will be times for like game, game versus show, right? I'll be like, baby, how was the show? Game.

Speaker 1 Game.

Speaker 2 How was the rehearsal? The practice.

Speaker 2 You know, field, stage. They're the same thing.
We just call them different things.

Speaker 1 Yes, exactly. It was cool to see the comparisons and how it kind of I don't know both aligned and her how hard she works in the gym.

Speaker 1 We've been to the gym like numerous times and she works harder than me every time. That's not true.
That's crazy. You can like lift a car.
Okay, he's just telling, he's just saying

Speaker 2 words. That's just

Speaker 1 one rep.

Speaker 1 That's one rep. This is what people get.
I'm just gonna stretch more. That's what I can do more.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 I've heard about the we've talked about the treadmill walk-in while you're doing the whole show and like all of that.

Speaker 1 We can't walk for four hours, can we once the last time you walk for four hours, Trevor?

Speaker 1 i've never even tried that i'm not stupid enough to try something like that

Speaker 1 you're kidding that my knees would be shredded oh my god so one of one of the other things that's been crazy to witness is just the media attention right like i think you play in the in the nfl you think travis on that on the two the two of us well let me yeah

Speaker 1 okay

Speaker 1 The media attention on your guys' relationship, on the amount of people that talk about it constantly, the theories that are out there, of which I am probably way too invested in. What,

Speaker 1 how do you guys handle all of the noise and chatter about everything that's going on in both of your lives?

Speaker 1 We, we don't really.

Speaker 2 I don't see a lot of things.

Speaker 2 I'm of the firm belief that, like, you know, if you're basing your kind of, if you're getting your feedback from the internet or from comments and stuff, like, I just really think that like anything you put, anything you feed your brain, it will internalize anything you feed the internet it will kill yeah and i've been

Speaker 1 i've been in the music industry for 20 years it's pretty hard to hurt my feelings at this point she's a pro and it took me a little while to be a pro about it i think i think initially and there's still some like wacko theories from the beginning that I was very like, oh no, like, how is she handling this?

Speaker 1 I, I don't, like, the last thing I wanted to do is screw this up.

Speaker 1 So I'm like, in my mind, it's like her being so calm, cool, collected, and so just real and understanding about everything that's going on

Speaker 1 really made me grow up real fast in that aspect of things.

Speaker 2 But also, I think the fact that you genuinely find a lot of online discourse to be truly hilarious.

Speaker 1 Absolutely.

Speaker 2 And that changes things for me because discourse and truth.

Speaker 1 You know, if I find the humor in it, find the humor in it.

Speaker 2 If he's seeing things and he thinks it's funny, and it doesn't even affect his day at all, like that's really completely bled into the way that I metabolize these things.

Speaker 2 It's at a point where, like, I can, something can be about me. Like, my name can be in the actual headline, and it can still be none of my business.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 2 People can be out here, people might be out here doing too much.

Speaker 1 Just shake it.

Speaker 2 Doesn't mean I have to do a damn thing.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 We live in such a social media moment where a lot of people's identities and

Speaker 2 they get their feedback from that, right?

Speaker 1 Like,

Speaker 2 and I'm a real constructive criticism guy. like give me constructive criticism all day i will take it

Speaker 2 it'll fuel me

Speaker 2 it's helpful right

Speaker 2 but i have so many like friends or acquaintances or people where like they'll see one comment they don't like right and it will ruin their day it'll ruin their night like and i just want to say to them like you should you should think of your energy as if it's expensive as if it's like a luxury item Not everyone can afford it.

Speaker 2 Like not everyone has invested in you in order to be able to have the capital for you to care about this.

Speaker 2 Because, like, what you spend your energy on, that's the day. And it's so true.
Right? Like, it doesn't matter where you were. Like, maybe you went to go get coffee today.
Maybe you saw friends today.

Speaker 2 If you were obsessing over one thing that you saw, like you literally like saw some guy call you mid and this and you can't stop thinking about it.

Speaker 1 No, he didn't.

Speaker 2 You can't stop thinking about it. Dude, that's the day then.
That's the night then. And so I just, have been able to sort of mediate a really healthy relationship with not seeing a whole lot.

Speaker 1 To what you just said, too,

Speaker 1 social media expounds all this because everybody knows if they say one thing, but all of a sudden, if they put Taylor Swift attached to it, it's going to get a thousand more retweets and likes and hate comments or love comments or whatever.

Speaker 1 It's going to stir up tons of controversy. Totally.
And I get this way all the time where I just recently went into the facility with Cam Juergens and something was happening

Speaker 1 in the social media world that I was like, why are people like upset at this person? This is bullshit, yada, yada. And Cam just hit me with, like, are they really, though?

Speaker 1 Or did just one person say something? Because I used to get the same way where I'd get upset. And then it took me like, actually, nobody really gives a shit about this.
Jason's early Twitter news.

Speaker 1 Oh, baby. Oh, my God.
Oh, baby. He had to get off.

Speaker 1 He had to literally step away. It hit me right between the eyes.
Because he would respond to, I wouldn't say everybody, but he wasn't shy of letting people know how he felt on Twitter. Oh, yeah, no.

Speaker 1 Based off of their comments. It was honestly

Speaker 1 Philadelphia. You guys know this.
It was a treat. And it's become a treat again now that he's back on because you'll have a friendly conversation.

Speaker 1 Well, Twitter used to be like a different thing, right?

Speaker 2 Look, you remember Twitter. You're like, I fed

Speaker 2 a squirrel ate a piece of bread. Didn't know they

Speaker 1 need to get back on it. Straight smashed it.
Now that there's autocorrect, I need to get back on it. It used to be, right?

Speaker 2 I'm like, I need a pair of of scissors to open this, these scissors. Like, we're just thinking things, right? It's like a different thing now.
And it's kind of about like

Speaker 2 information is power, I guess, unless all of your information is geared towards you thinking that everything is about you.

Speaker 1 Because,

Speaker 2 you know, no, not everyone is ever thinking about one person all the time at any point. It's just like if your algorithm is giving you either criticisms of yourself or adulation or praise,

Speaker 2 You're creating an ecosystem in which you're the centerpiece of the table. And I just don't think that's healthy.
Like, that's not the way I want to move through the world.

Speaker 2 So I do detach from the internet in a huge way. Like, I'm just not, I have never, I have had my comments disabled on Instagram for like 10 years now.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 1 I don't miss it.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 I found that out after the Ars tour.

Speaker 1 Comments were going to be the first one. Dude, the problem is I get so mad, I then go and look at all the other comments, and then Twitter just feeds me more.
Dude, you're on like red.

Speaker 1 So we saw

Speaker 1 this like this. Boom, boom.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah, whereas I'm like, I don't know what this is, but get it out of my office.
It's on fire.

Speaker 2 My business is

Speaker 2 making music and taking care of my fans. And I have ways of monitoring what they want from me and how best to entertain them, which is my job.

Speaker 2 And everything else, I'm just sort of like, it's not my business. I have actual business that I need to run.

Speaker 2 Can you imagine if we just talked about what people said about our relationship?

Speaker 2 Because if we talked about that,

Speaker 2 that would be all we talked about because there's so much chatter. It's like

Speaker 2 we're busy having an actual relationship.

Speaker 1 I want to hear sourdough bread puns. Yeah.
And you will.

Speaker 2 And that's a promise.

Speaker 1 All right. Let's get to

Speaker 1 the part of this show that I think is what everybody is going to be talking about.

Speaker 2 Do I get to say it?

Speaker 1 Do I get to say it?

Speaker 2 I get to say the two words, yes?

Speaker 1 Well, I think we were going to try and

Speaker 1 you can do whatever you want, Taylor. We're not going to interview you.
This is very much whatever.

Speaker 2 I'm not within the framework of the podcast. I'm a fan of the podcast.

Speaker 1 Typically, we would allow the guests to say new news.

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, I want to do it.

Speaker 1 But with Zach Brown, we had another

Speaker 1 bit that we did. I don't know if you saw.
I don't know if we can. We harmonized.

Speaker 1 I forgot everything that Zach taught me already. All right, let's just let the expert take care of this.

Speaker 2 Okay, I just wanted I wanted to scream it. Taylor.
Just Travis style.

Speaker 1 Do you mean we just started or echoed it? I think Taylor has a little bit of new, new, new, new.

Speaker 1 Yay!

Speaker 1 She's a natural. She's a natural.
It wasn't as fun as I thought it was going to be.

Speaker 2 Oh, it was everything.

Speaker 1 It was everything and more.

Speaker 1 We did talk about Easter eggs earlier. Yeah.
And at the very last Aris tour, you didn't take the lift. You did not.
You went upstage and exited through an orange door.

Speaker 1 Why did you change the ending?

Speaker 2 So that's, I'm happy you mentioned that.

Speaker 1 I'm going to say, Jason, did you see that fans?

Speaker 2 Did you see that the fans noticed this? Because I was pretty proud of them for noticing that. They noticed this.

Speaker 1 I just,

Speaker 1 I was surfing the internet and saw something.

Speaker 2 Yeah. So that was, I was pretty happy that they noticed that.

Speaker 1 I was like, trained them well.

Speaker 2 So basically every night of the Aeros tour.

Speaker 1 Everything happens happens with a reason. Taylor's a planner.
She's not just a random orange door. Eggs everywhere.
Just eggs everywhere.

Speaker 2 What's happening there? Why is why and why? Anyway, so I would leave the stage every night going down the elevator lift.

Speaker 2 That's how every single Eras show ended, except for one, except for the last one, where I exited through a door,

Speaker 2 an orange door to be specific. And

Speaker 2 that actually was an Easter egg.

Speaker 2 Basically, the reason why I chose to exit that that way is because I kind of wanted to give a little subliminal hint to the fans that I may be leaving the Aristor era, but I was also entering

Speaker 1 a new.

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Speaker 1 Actually, I was thinking about heading out only because I want to beat the traffic. The best part of the sleepovers the next day.
I was going to throw the games off.

Speaker 3 Bobby Big Wheels.

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Restrictions apply. Multi-view requires Xfinity 4K capable TV box.

Speaker 2 So I wanted to show you something. Okay, what do we got? We got

Speaker 1 a briefcase. Yep.
Mint green with TS on it.

Speaker 2 Yep.

Speaker 1 What's in it?

Speaker 2 This is my brand new album.

Speaker 1 We got TS-12, baby.

Speaker 2 This is my brand new album. It's called The Life of a Showgirl.
Love it. It was something that I was working on while I was in Europe on the Ares tour.

Speaker 1 Oh, while you were on tour.

Speaker 2 I was working.

Speaker 1 I would be on tour. How on earth did she do this on the tour is still blowing my mind.

Speaker 2 I just love it. I just love it a lot.
I love music.

Speaker 2 I would be playing shows. I'd do like three shows in a row.
I'd have three days off.

Speaker 2 I'd fly to Sweden, go back to the tour, and actually, like working on this, I was physically exhausted at this point in the tour, but I was so mentally stimulated and so excited to be creating.

Speaker 1 And this is

Speaker 1 literally living the life of a showgirl. I was.
I was.

Speaker 2 She wrote it. That's why I said, that's why I called it that.
Nailed it.

Speaker 1 So,

Speaker 2 do you want to see the back cover?

Speaker 1 I would love to see all of it.

Speaker 2 The back cover is where we find the 12 tracks for my 12

Speaker 1 tracks, bangers.

Speaker 2 So, this is so we got all

Speaker 2 so we got track one,

Speaker 2 the fate of Ophelia.

Speaker 1 Okay, track two.

Speaker 1 Go ahead, go ahead. I was gonna say, dude, you know a fate of Ophelia? Okay,

Speaker 1 I just I

Speaker 1 Hamlet, I don't want to get Jason all riled up, so let's, we can just go through the tracks.

Speaker 2 Okay, okay, yeah, track two, Elizabeth Taylor.

Speaker 1 Okay,

Speaker 1 you know who Elizabeth Taylor is? You better. I'm just kind of following.
Just kind of following. Okay, all right, all right, all right.

Speaker 2 Track three,

Speaker 1 Opalite. Opalite.
You know what Opalite is, Jason? Why? Can we stop asking me? Okay, I'm done.

Speaker 1 He's like, I hate this structure of the poverty. I'm not about this album, and I'm excited.

Speaker 1 Track four, father figure.

Speaker 2 Father figure? Track five, eldest daughter.

Speaker 2 Okay. Track six, ruin the friendship.

Speaker 2 Track seven, actually romantic.

Speaker 1 Actually romantic.

Speaker 2 Track eight,

Speaker 2 wish list with two dollar signs as the S's.

Speaker 1 Just point that out and have it flourish.

Speaker 2 Track nine, wood.

Speaker 1 Would. Nice.

Speaker 2 Track ten,

Speaker 2 canceled, but it's in all caps with an exclamation point at the end.

Speaker 1 That's a bagger.

Speaker 2 Track 11, honey.

Speaker 1 Honey.

Speaker 2 And can you do drum roll?

Speaker 2 Last track, track 12,

Speaker 2 the title track, The Life of a Showgirl, featuring Sabrina Carpenter.

Speaker 1 Sabrina Carpenter!

Speaker 1 That's awesome. So that's that.

Speaker 2 Yeah, and so

Speaker 1 that is a showgirl. We got this orange vibration.
That's orange.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it is.

Speaker 2 And sparkly.

Speaker 1 Entering a new era. It's sparkly.

Speaker 1 It's very nice. So, what is the significance of the color orange? Why orange?

Speaker 2 I've just always liked it, Jason.

Speaker 1 It really feels like, I don't know,

Speaker 2 it feels like kind of energetically how my life has felt.

Speaker 2 And this album is about what was going on behind the scenes in my inner life during this tour, which was so exuberant and electric and vibrant. And,

Speaker 2 you know, one of the things about this record is like

Speaker 2 it's a record I made with my mentor, Max Martin, and Shellback. And this, the three of us have made some of my favorite songs that I've ever done before.

Speaker 1 Which ones, if you don't mind me asking?

Speaker 2 Well, they were my main collaborators on the Red album. We did We Are Never Getting Back Together, I Knew You Were Trouble, 22,

Speaker 2 Shake It Off, Blank Space, Style, Wildest Dreams.

Speaker 1 Hell yes.

Speaker 1 You know,

Speaker 1 ready for it. So that's the energy we're going with.
Yes, I understand why it's orange now. Okay.

Speaker 2 So, yeah, we've made songs that I'm so proud of.

Speaker 1 There's going to be some fucking bangers. Yes, I'm picking it up.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it's like

Speaker 2 it's like that. And so basically, we've never actually made an album before where

Speaker 2 it's just the three of us. There's no other collaborators.
It's just the three of us making a focused album where, I mean,

Speaker 2 it felt like catching lightning in a bottle, honestly. We hadn't worked together in like seven or eight years.

Speaker 1 And this feeds. This feeds.

Speaker 2 There's something about them. These guys, they like, they're just geniuses

Speaker 2 in different avenues, in different ways. And we kind of,

Speaker 2 I'm going to put it down.

Speaker 2 I've just

Speaker 2 never, like, this, today's the first day I've seen it. Do you know what I mean? I'm just like,

Speaker 2 so Travis is just going to cradle it the whole time.

Speaker 1 Don't drop the baby. I will not drop this baby.

Speaker 2 So it's like,

Speaker 2 working with them again was absolutely incredible.

Speaker 2 And actually, when I was on tour tour in Stockholm, I had Max Martin come out to the show and I was talking to him and I was like, I just feel like, I feel like we could just knock it out of the park if we went back in.

Speaker 2 And we did this all in Sweden, and it was just us three.

Speaker 2 Like, I want to, I essentially said to him, I want to be as proud of an album as I am of the Eras tour and for the same reasons, you know?

Speaker 2 And, and he was like, do you understand what kind of pressure that is?

Speaker 1 Yeah,

Speaker 1 that is okay. I was like, yeah.
Why would you, yeah, try? Let's try. Your entire career? Got it.
Yeah, we can do that in one album.

Speaker 1 Well, okay.

Speaker 2 So it's like, you know, I spent time in the time that we were off doing different projects and he and Shellback were doing different things.

Speaker 2 And I was making albums that were a little bit more esoteric, like folklore.

Speaker 1 So hot when she says these big words.

Speaker 2 You know what esoteric means.

Speaker 1 I know. It's for specific followers.

Speaker 2 Exactly. Exactly.

Speaker 2 He knows what that means. He pretends he doesn't know what these words mean, but he knows what it means.

Speaker 1 That term means for a specific following, like a specific genre of people.

Speaker 2 He knows what it means. Okay.
He's doing, he does like, he does like a pretty, I don't know what it means thing, but he knows all the words and he knows what they mean. I don't know.

Speaker 2 And he may not have read Hamlet, but I explained it to him.

Speaker 1 Don't tell my middle school English teacher I didn't read Hamlet.

Speaker 1 You guys are definitely supposed to.

Speaker 1 Spark notes. It's all right.
I watched the Lion King.

Speaker 1 See, he knows what Hamlet is.

Speaker 1 Wait, Lion King is based off of Hamlet? Yes.

Speaker 1 Jason, your Reddit searches need to be more focused on.

Speaker 2 We need your relationship with the Internet to be a little bit purer.

Speaker 1 I got the algorithm. I got the algorithm.

Speaker 1 My relationship with the Internet is bad. It's about as bad as it can get.
Yeah. Sorry.

Speaker 2 No, you're fine. So I was like,

Speaker 2 I made a few records that were a bit more like like

Speaker 2 specific in their sound or whatever, like folklore, Evermore. Those were a little bit more like alt folk kind of leaning and just kind of exploring and trying to challenge myself as a writer.

Speaker 2 And I feel like both Max and Shellback did that too in their own ways going out into the world. And when we, by the time we came back together, I feel like we had so much more dexterity to what we do.

Speaker 2 And it's almost like we'd all grown up so much. Like Shellback and I were both in our early 20s when we started working together, the three of us.

Speaker 2 And so it was very much like we were the ingenuous and Max was the mentor. And this was the time where it felt like all three of us in the room were carrying the same weight as creators.

Speaker 2 And it was really special. It like meant the world to me to have this creative experience where like

Speaker 2 we knew that we had to bring the best ideas we've ever had.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 And I know, I also know the pressure I'm putting on this record by saying that, but I don't care because I love it that much. And I'm so proud of it.
And it just comes from like the most

Speaker 2 infectiously joyful, wild, dramatic place I was in in my life.

Speaker 2 And so that effervescence has come through on this record. And like, as you said, bangers.
And

Speaker 2 we were just like,

Speaker 2 there's no other songs coming. It's not like, like, with Torture Poets Department, I was like, here's a data dump of everything I've thought, felt,

Speaker 1 experienced in two or three years.

Speaker 2 Here's 31 songs. This is 12.
There's not a 13th. There's not a fourth.
There's not other ones coming. This is the record I've been wanting to make for a very long time.

Speaker 1 I love it. I love this so much.
Can we? So, where do we start? I don't know where to start. You gave us a lot of information right there.

Speaker 2 I know. We didn't tell Jason that this, that we were doing this.
No, I just said, like, can I go on the podcast? Because Brad Pitt did it and I want to do it too.

Speaker 1 And Jason was like, yes, I mean, we can make that happen. That seems like a validation.
The request or the ask from either one of us was never going to come. I don't know why I would never ask you.

Speaker 1 I just, I, I, I don't know. Yeah, Brandon still hates me because I never asked you, but I think this is

Speaker 1 way better.

Speaker 2 We waited till I had some stuff to say, I think. There we go.
You know, I had to, I was waiting till I had like a sparkly briefcase to bring the needed props.

Speaker 1 It took me a long time to put that into production.

Speaker 1 Well, it is finished. And do you want to tell everybody when it's coming out?

Speaker 2 It comes out October 3rd. October 3rd.
This album comes out October 3rd. It's easy to remember.
It's 10-3.

Speaker 1 10-3.

Speaker 2 Still annoying. It is also your birthday week.

Speaker 1 We got Wyatt, October 2nd. We got you, October 5th, and then we got Mom, October 9th.
So this is

Speaker 1 a good month.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I picked a good month.

Speaker 1 It's going to be a good week.

Speaker 2 You know,

Speaker 1 all these Libras. 10-3.

Speaker 1 13. The Opal birthday.
I'm picking up this numerology. There we go.
There we go.

Speaker 1 See,

Speaker 2 never not annoying.

Speaker 2 Always going to try to force a 13 into the situation. And this one was right there.
It was just right there. For the photos,

Speaker 2 there are a lot more photos in this. And there's a poem in this.
And

Speaker 2 basically, I love the photography so much that I don't want to show it right now because I want to keep some mystery going.

Speaker 2 Because that's, you know, just fun to have things to still discover. But the photos are done by Mert and Marcus, who are two of my favorite photographers.

Speaker 2 The last time I, and the only time I worked with them for an album cover sheet was with Reputation with that album. And I loved what they did with those photos.
So I called them up for this one.

Speaker 2 And I'm so happy with the way that the photos came out for this one.

Speaker 2 And it just basically was like, I was so proud of the music and so excited about this project from a creative standpoint that I was just like, all hands on deck. We're going all out.

Speaker 2 This is a full send. Like, I care about this record more than I can.
even overstate.

Speaker 1 It's so much fun. And I mean, I understand what she's saying.
And obviously,

Speaker 1 I've been fortunate enough to hear every single song on here, so I know they're all 12 bangers.

Speaker 1 It's a lot more upbeat, and it's a lot more like fun-pop, like excitement. And I think that's that's a completely like I think it's a complete 180 from a lot of the songs on Torture Poets for sure.

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah.

Speaker 2 And it's just life is more upbeat.

Speaker 1 Well, that's what I was about to say. It probably,

Speaker 1 do you find that your albums mimic everything that's happening in your personal life?

Speaker 2 Yeah. Like, definitely.

Speaker 1 Your genres that you've done are like so widespaning between like country, pop,

Speaker 1 and then, like, it can get, I don't even know, Torture Poets, it was like so cathartic, it felt like for you probably to write those songs and to release all that.

Speaker 2 Definitely.

Speaker 2 And it was like, I have different goals with different albums.

Speaker 2 And Torture Poets Department, my goals were strictly lyrical.

Speaker 1 Like, I, and I, I. I felt like every song was a poem.

Speaker 2 Oh, yeah, and I love that album so much from that perspective. That was strictly what I was was trying to accomplish there.
It was just really a full catharsis. And I loved to embrace the mess of

Speaker 2 writing from that perspective, of the rawness of that. This, I have a totally different set of goals.

Speaker 2 I always try to do something completely different. That's what I'm feeling at the moment.
And I was feeling a complete pivot.

Speaker 2 at this point in time. And I wanted the album to feel the way my life felt.
And this completely matches the way that my life has felt.

Speaker 2 And I also wanted it to be just every single song is on this album for hundreds of reasons.

Speaker 2 You know, and

Speaker 2 you couldn't take one out and it'd be the same album. You couldn't add one and it be, it's just right.

Speaker 2 And that focus and that kind of discipline with creating an album and keeping the bar really high is something I've been wanting to do for a very long time.

Speaker 2 I tend to love to write lots and lots of music. So it's a temptation to release lots of music.
Sure.

Speaker 2 I wanted to do an album that was so focused on quality and on the theme and everything fitting together like a perfect puzzle that these 12 songs for my 12th album, it just, I feel like we achieved that.

Speaker 2 And I'm really happy about that.

Speaker 1 So you mentioned a couple of things there. First, what is the theme of the album if you would describe it as one like theme, if that's possible?

Speaker 2 I would say it's everything that was going on behind the curtain.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 1 And then what are the goals? You said something like there, what would be like your main goals with this album?

Speaker 2 My main goals were melodies that were so infectious that you're almost angry at it.

Speaker 2 And lyrics that are just as vivid, but crisp and focused and completely intentional. Check.

Speaker 2 So it's like, I feel like we actually came together in a really beautiful way, the three of us, Shellback, Max, and I, where we had a conversation about how Max was like, I loved folklore.

Speaker 2 I loved the storytelling on folklore. I don't want that to change.
Like,

Speaker 2 just because we're making these, like, these infectious anthems, like, I don't want you to leave that behind. And I was like, I don't think I couldn't if I tried.
So at this point, I'm

Speaker 2 married to that kind of writing, you know? And so it was really amazing that we were able to, without doing too much overthinking, we were able to get in there.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 2 it was just ideas flying, and all of these ideas were like, we've been waiting years to come back together and make this project.

Speaker 1 It felt really amazing. You were going to move.
You are going to move.

Speaker 1 Do I have to wait till October 3rd? Do I have to wait till October 3rd? You do, Jason. God damn it.
This is unfair.

Speaker 2 We don't trust you at all.

Speaker 1 I mean, honestly, smart.

Speaker 1 I completely get it. Completely get it.

Speaker 1 The artwork, how do you settle on a front piece of like artwork for an album?

Speaker 2 This represents the end of my night. Okay.
Right? So, like, when I'm on tour, I have the same day every single day. It's another reason why we have a very similar life.

Speaker 2 His game days are the same days every day.

Speaker 2 His practice days are the same every day. His meetings is scheduled.
My show days are the same every single day. I just happen to be in a different city.

Speaker 2 And my day ends with me in a bathtub, not usually in a bedazzled dress.

Speaker 1 Sure. Well, it's got to be, it's on the front of it.
We'll try to get it. It's got to be decent.

Speaker 2 I wanted to sort of like glamorize all the different aspects of how that tour felt. And that's how that felt to be at the end of the night when all this has gone down.

Speaker 2 You won't be able to get to bed till four in the morning after this, but you had to jump through 50 million hoops in this obstacle course that is your show,

Speaker 2 and

Speaker 2 you did it. You got two more in a row,

Speaker 2 but you did it tonight.

Speaker 1 That's all the matters.

Speaker 2 And the reason I wanted to have it sort of like an off-stage moment as the main album cover is because this album isn't really about what happened to me on stage, it's about what I was going through offstage.

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 2 it's like a, it's, you know, I didn't want to have like the lights are bright, I'm on the stage as the main album cover. It's just this, this, to me, tells more of what the actual

Speaker 2 contents lyrically of the album are.

Speaker 1 Got it.

Speaker 2 Which is the life.

Speaker 1 The life of the showgirl. Not

Speaker 1 what you're seeing. It's the life

Speaker 1 behind it all.

Speaker 2 It's the life beyond the show.

Speaker 1 Okay. Which is fascinating.
Travis, I'm very jealous.

Speaker 1 Very jealous that you've heard these songs. As you should be, Jason.
Yes. As you you should be.
I think it's very fitting that it's orange. I mean, it looks like a giant sun.

Speaker 1 Pull that thing out again. Like, it feels like it's going to be full of energy.
Like, the record itself. You have no idea, Jason.
All right. Look at that thing.

Speaker 1 That thing is awesome. That is so cool.
Very cool. Thank you.

Speaker 1 All right. Well, congratulations, sir, baby.
Congratulations.

Speaker 2 Thank you so much.

Speaker 1 Everyone, you heard it here first.

Speaker 1 You have heard it here first. October 3rd is the release date of the TS-12, The Life of a Showgirl.
12 bangers. Congratulations, Taylor.
I know you've been working on this for a long time.

Speaker 1 You're going to be moving the internet.

Speaker 2 Thank you so much.

Speaker 2 You can pre-order it now.

Speaker 1 You can pre-order it now? There we go. Yeah, on my website.
Okay, I'll be right back, guys.

Speaker 1 You heard it here first, folks. The Life of a Showgirl is available now.
You can pre-order it. And the official release date is 10-3.
That's October 3rd. Yes, sir.

Speaker 1 All righty.

Speaker 1 We are going to move to We Gotta Ask. You don't have to answer.

Speaker 1 I know you're familiar with this segment, but for anybody listening, this is a segment we often get to where our guests were going to ask a bunch of rapid-fire questions.

Speaker 1 They are not obligated to answer.

Speaker 1 Matter of fact, they are free to tell us the fuck off if they so choose. Okay, cool.
If you so choose.

Speaker 1 All right. All right, now.
How do you feel about Jason telling his kids that cats are poisonous?

Speaker 2 It was actually really a great challenge because as soon as as I got the kids around the cats, it was my

Speaker 2 goal to prove to them that they weren't poisonous. And there's no better way to prove that than to just hand them Benjamin, my ragdoll cat,

Speaker 2 who lets humans hold him like he's a baby. And I mean, like my favorite thing ever is just like when Benny will come up to me and just go, I find Benjamin.

Speaker 1 I find him.

Speaker 2 And she's just like over there, just like laying with him and petting him and holding him. And they're drag.
The cats are so good with kids. They're like drag.

Speaker 2 They're just like, there's like, Meredith is here. I'm like, yep.
And you know what? She didn't bite you at all, did she?

Speaker 1 No, she didn't.

Speaker 2 And if she did bite you, she wouldn't be poisonous. They're like, that's not what our dad said.

Speaker 1 I'm like, well,

Speaker 2 I heard you're getting a cat.

Speaker 1 I heard this from a very well-placed source. I will neither confirm nor deny.
We'll see if you're getting like a proper cat.

Speaker 2 You're getting like a cat that chases mice. What I have are not that.

Speaker 1 Yes.

Speaker 2 I think they sit around.

Speaker 1 There's a chance I have been talking. There's a happy medium.
There's a chance I have been talked into a barn cat

Speaker 1 that does not go inside, that will

Speaker 1 survive off of rodents in the field. Those girls are going to be sneaking that cat into the city.
There's no way that cat.

Speaker 1 This is why I lie to my kids, though, is to, I want them to be able to be critical thinkers. They need to realize it's absurd to think this.
And

Speaker 1 you handing them Benjamin and then realizing and then walking them through critical thinking ability. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Now all of a sudden they won't believe something that every moron tells them on the internet.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it was really like, I know it wasn't helpful for you, but it really, like, it was helpful for me.

Speaker 1 My allergies are going to be in severe.

Speaker 2 I think you have, I don't even know if the allergies are a thing, Jason. I think you just have to have a lot of time.

Speaker 1 I mean, I've had an allergy test, Taylor. I've had an allergy test.
Oh, yeah. They tell you everything.
Allegedly.

Speaker 2 I'd like to see a copy of it.

Speaker 1 Fair enough.

Speaker 2 I think that you just maybe don't like.

Speaker 1 I don't. I mean,

Speaker 1 I think some cats I get down with. I always like Flash growing up, the cat that we had.

Speaker 2 What did you think of my three cats?

Speaker 1 My three perfect cats. Well, the only one that would go near me was Benjamin.

Speaker 2 Yeah, because the other two consents that you had resting cats.

Speaker 1 That might be it. All right.
If you had to choose to bake one thing to show off your baking skills, what would you choose?

Speaker 2 Oh, right now it would be my cinnamon swirl sourdough.

Speaker 1 Cinnamon swirl sourdough? I thought you were going to go Pop-Tarts.

Speaker 2 Pop-tarts, Pop-Tarts. It depends on who I'm baking for.
The Pop-Tarts.

Speaker 2 God, I just love making pop music and Pop-Tarts. I love it.

Speaker 1 I didn't even put those two together, but that makes a ton of sense.

Speaker 2 Been really experimenting with the flavors there because we got now wild blueberry, raspberry, strawberry, the original. And Kylie got me baking the cinnamon sugar.

Speaker 1 You're doing that now?

Speaker 1 Yes.

Speaker 1 Well, if I may, we need an orange Pop-Tart now. We need what's a,

Speaker 1 I mean, like an orange.

Speaker 2 I'll do it if you really want me to, like, with like a marmalade, like an orange marmalade in the middle, and then orange extract.

Speaker 1 Paddington bear. I see.
Paddington Bear. Okay.
Okay.

Speaker 2 No, I can get, I can get with this. I just didn't see the vision until now, and now I think it's kind of genius.

Speaker 1 You've ruined Pop-Tarts outside of yours, just so you know. Thank you.
Thank you so much.

Speaker 1 so now I got to try the cinnamon swirl sourdough though if you're putting that above Pop-Tarts yeah yeah I'm gonna send some over it's a banger perfect all right there's a rumor that you played the bear in happy gilmore 2 in the scene where Travis S.

Speaker 1 Panny put on him

Speaker 1 can you confirm or deny this rumor I can deny like this is

Speaker 2 this is one of those ones where like we'll send it to each other and be like hey did you hear I was the bear and there he's like yeah you hear we bought a house in Lake Coma like right it's we're just sort of like, at this point, we're just like, Of course, they think I'm inside of a bear costume.

Speaker 2 Like, I'm honored to be thought of in that context because I loved that movie so much. I watched it multiple times,

Speaker 2 um, loved it so much. Whoever did the bear acting was

Speaker 1 exquisite,

Speaker 2 exquisite performance.

Speaker 1 Bad Bunny and the Bear killed that scene. And

Speaker 2 Bad Bunny, he absolutely delighted me in that movie.

Speaker 1 He's so good. I was like,

Speaker 1 amazing.

Speaker 2 His comedic timing is so good. There's this one part where they look over, where they're like, who did that? And like,

Speaker 1 his name is Oscar.

Speaker 2 His character's name is Oscar in it.

Speaker 2 And it's like, his brother gets hit by the golf ball, and they look over and they're like, who did that? Who did that? And they do, there's a face that Bad Bunny makes and they do the kind of

Speaker 2 like the

Speaker 2 pan in the Zoom.

Speaker 2 And it was just, I was like, who thought of that? How did they know he could be that?

Speaker 2 I watched it five times.

Speaker 1 Benito kills it. Yeah, he really kills it.

Speaker 2 He's so funny. He's so good.
He's also.

Speaker 1 No.

Speaker 2 I felt so much for this character. I'm so excited to go to his restaurant.
Like, I thought this was a real man.

Speaker 1 I believed this.

Speaker 1 Whose idea was arriving to the era's tour stage via a cleaning cart?

Speaker 2 Mine. That's a weird idea that I, that's my type of weird idea.

Speaker 1 Where did that come from? Well,

Speaker 2 when you're putting on a first show of a tour like that, you're not just performing for the entire stadium. You're performing for the entire internet.

Speaker 2 And so I wanted to curate and really romanticize the images that they were seeing first. So I didn't want them to see my first outfit and my first look,

Speaker 2 which would have given away what the first era was

Speaker 1 before,

Speaker 2 you know, when I'm walking up the ramp behind the stage, there's all these fans that are seated behind the stage at certain angles where they would have been able to film it.

Speaker 2 I didn't want that to be the first thing people saw from the Aeros tour. I wanted it to be the huge lover motif and they're surprised and delighted by the fact that lover is the first era we're doing.

Speaker 2 And they have, that's the first time they've seen that Versace bodysuit all lit up. Like,

Speaker 2 like once the lights hit that thing, it's just like,

Speaker 2 oh, I love that outfit so much. And so it was really about preserving kind of like the sanctity of a surprise moment, right?

Speaker 2 So I kind of thought I might only do it for night one, and then I just got attached to it. I was like, I just, I find this fun.

Speaker 1 It's a perfect intro. It really is.

Speaker 2 There's a like weird little side of me that likes sneaking around.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 2 I think the fans found it funny too.

Speaker 1 They're like, what a weirdo.

Speaker 2 We've come to see a weirdo in concert. Why is she doing that? I was like, I don't know.
Why did I make it look like a mop cart?

Speaker 1 I don't know, man.

Speaker 2 There's just like so, like, if you can't have fun with the hijinks of this thing, there's enough stress that goes into this. If you can't get joy from silly little things like the mop cart,

Speaker 1 man,

Speaker 1 you need to live a little. You're doing it wrong.
Loosen up. Live a little.
Loosen up.

Speaker 2 Get into a fake mop cart. Everyone knows you're in there, but you're in there like, I'm sneaking around.
Nobody knows I'm in here.

Speaker 1 Everyone knows you're in there.

Speaker 2 But it's like, it's one of those things. Like, I work so hard to try to surprise fans.
And they're like, I don't want to be surprised. Sometimes they really don't think they want to be surprised.

Speaker 2 They want to figure stuff out.

Speaker 1 No, they do.

Speaker 2 But then I know, I know that when I can really get them and surprise them, that it was, it was, it was so worth it.

Speaker 1 Cause that's what entertainment is, really.

Speaker 2 It's just giving people something to escape, to sink their teeth into, to

Speaker 2 like we're world building, you know, that's what the whole tour was. Hopefully, people never thought that we'd go on this podcast and announce an album.

Speaker 2 Like, I was hoping that that's something that the fans would be like, that's from Left Field.

Speaker 1 Like, if we accomplish that, then that's she went out with those two idiots to release us.

Speaker 1 Man, things are really getting dark for Taylor.

Speaker 1 All right, we ask all of our guests this. Yep.
Who, what is your welcome to the NFL moment? Oh,

Speaker 1 oh,

Speaker 2 I'd say it was the first time I stepped on the field, which would have been when you won the AFC championship. Baltimore.

Speaker 2 The first season that I was with you and it was in Baltimore and we're in the suite and he's just won the AFC championship. We're freaking out.
Everybody's screaming.

Speaker 2 And his mom goes, all right, let's go down to the field. And I was like, what we're doing, what are we, what do you mean?

Speaker 1 What are you talking about?

Speaker 2 We're going, why, we're going where, and she's like, We're going down to the field, and I was like, Did he say that?

Speaker 2 That's okay, like, I because we hadn't talked about this, there was no, like, there was no, like, hey, if I didn't want to jinx, I didn't want to jinx it, yeah, he doesn't, he doesn't jinx anything, which I respect actually.

Speaker 2 Like, I'm all about that. Um, but we hadn't had a conversation about it, so I'm like, Is he gonna be like, What are you doing down here, dude? Um,

Speaker 1 it was best presumptuous, mama knows best, she knew I wanted to, and so she was like,

Speaker 2 trust me, he wants you there. And I was like, okay, well, she would know.

Speaker 2 And so I'm walking out onto this field and it's just like,

Speaker 1 oh my God.

Speaker 2 Oh, my God. Oh, my God.
This is, it's so, there's so many lights.

Speaker 1 We're going in a Super Bowl. I've never seen this many cameras.

Speaker 2 I've never seen, I was like, I've never seen this much media in my life, and I've seen a lot of media.

Speaker 2 And then the media sees me and they're like, ah, and then they just start running at me, and I'm looking at you, and you're and then you're screaming into the mic because when there's a mic and there's Travis, like he physically needs to scream into it, of course,

Speaker 1 all right, okay.

Speaker 2 That's like I just so basically I'm experiencing this whole heightened scenario that I had no idea five minutes before I was going to be experiencing, and it was it's one of my most cherished memories because I was so proud of you.

Speaker 1 And I was so proud that you came down there to enjoy that moment.

Speaker 2 It was so magical, it was so fun.

Speaker 2 It's like crazy. It's crazy to get to see someone you love work that hard and then have that kind of like euphoric payoff where you're like,

Speaker 2 you did it. Like you did it underlined a hundred times.
You did like you did it.

Speaker 1 Human exclamation point. What do you mean you broke my husband?

Speaker 1 That's crazy.

Speaker 2 Like, yeah, I had such a great rookie year. It was crazy.

Speaker 1 It was a great year. What is your welcome to like, I don't know if it's like a singer, like

Speaker 1 being a pop star, being a performer? Yeah, what is your welcome to the industry moment in that regard?

Speaker 2 Oh, my God.

Speaker 2 Man,

Speaker 2 I never really,

Speaker 2 I actually never really allowed myself to feel like the you've arrived thing. Sure.
I've just now started to be able to really be in a moment when I'm in the moment.

Speaker 2 That's why I'm so glad that the Arrows tour happened when I'm an adult, because I was able to completely and totally soak in these moments while I'm planning obviously what I'm doing next in the show but like when I'm at the end of that show and I'm standing there taking it in that's me 100% present but you know starting to do this when I was putting out my first album when I was like 16 I was always on to the next plan and that I get joy in planning so it's not like I wasn't happy with that but I never allowed myself to say you've arrived you've made it I was always like how are you getting How are you going to get to make the next project?

Speaker 2 And it was all about,

Speaker 2 it was all about the higher I climbed, the more creative control I had, and the more fun I had making stuff, right?

Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 So, it was not the like the altitude I was reaching, there was more pressure every step of the way, but I was getting more creative control and freedom every time.

Speaker 2 And I, and that is why it felt so much more special to keep working harder to get it to new levels. It's not like, oh, like I can afford to buy this or whatever, like it, it not to discount that.

Speaker 2 But for me, every time I got higher up on a new rung of the ladder, I could make stuff in a more focused and free and autonomous way.

Speaker 1 What else would you want as an artist?

Speaker 2 I never really let myself be like, I've made it, but the eras tour, I was like, oh,

Speaker 1 this is different.

Speaker 2 Like, this is not, this is nothing like what I've ever experienced before. It was so much better than anything.

Speaker 1 Literally, while she's doing that, she's still creating the next thing. Yeah.

Speaker 1 That's what's crazy to me. I love it.
I love it. Live Show Sweden.
Live Show Sweden. Live Show Sweden.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 That's what I do. No, I adore what I do.
I absolutely love it. And I love then taking the songs and writing a treatment for a music video and directing the music video.

Speaker 2 Like all of the things that I get to do now, I'm so grateful for the ability to create. Like that's still what drives all of it.

Speaker 1 Well, Swifties appreciate your dedication. We are very grateful for this as well.

Speaker 1 Thanks, guys.

Speaker 1 All righty. Do you have any questions for us? We're kind of out of the questions for this section.
Is there anything you wanted to ask Travis or I? I mean, you have a

Speaker 1 put Travis on the spot right now. Yeah.
I know.

Speaker 1 Well, I don't know.

Speaker 2 I was wondering how that wax is growing in.

Speaker 1 Like, how am I going to have

Speaker 1 it?

Speaker 2 Because I haven't talked to him a couple weeks about it, and I just feel like it's really important for you to

Speaker 1 make sure that those hairs don't get a little itchy, bud.

Speaker 2 No, it's fine. It's good.
When you go, like, when you go from

Speaker 2 fur to no no fur at all,

Speaker 1 and you can wear us, Cousin, we got some thick hair.

Speaker 2 It's like important to figure out, like, I mean, just

Speaker 1 don't tell us too much.

Speaker 2 Are we,

Speaker 2 how, how are we doing?

Speaker 1 We're doing good. We're doing good.
Are we managing it?

Speaker 1 Well, we're not managing it. That's how we're managing it, is we're not managing it.
Okay.

Speaker 1 It's

Speaker 1 fortunate for me.

Speaker 1 My hair grows fast. Yep.
It's coarse. It's got a texture that

Speaker 1 was difficult for about a couple weeks, very itchy. Yep, and

Speaker 1 we've passed that phase now.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 are we going to do it again, do you think?

Speaker 1 I don't think so. And I listen, shout out to the people in downtown Philadelphia.
They did a great job. European wax.
I'm not. I don't think it's going to be a recurring bit.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it was the best it could have been.

Speaker 1 I also don't think I'm going to find myself in a speedo again. Jason walked into a door that said European wax and was treated with the utmost respect in class.

Speaker 2 He had to try it in order to know.

Speaker 1 That's life.

Speaker 2 You know,

Speaker 1 it feels important that you did it.

Speaker 2 And also, it's because now you know.

Speaker 1 Now you know.

Speaker 2 I know what I always say that after I make unfortunate

Speaker 2 judgment calls.

Speaker 1 Right?

Speaker 2 Well, now I know.

Speaker 1 Now I know.

Speaker 2 Had to try it.

Speaker 1 The one thing I didn't try was

Speaker 2 wasn't great. Wouldn't do it again.
Yep. Yep.

Speaker 2 And on that note.

Speaker 1 Now you know. Thanks for having me.

Speaker 1 Tay, thank you so much for hopping on. Oh my gosh.
All right. Thank you so much for hopping on.
You are the best. This has been a blast.

Speaker 1 I think Kylie enjoyed being the number one most viewed episode for her time that she had.

Speaker 1 This is

Speaker 1 don't you do that to Kylie?

Speaker 1 Don't you do that?

Speaker 2 If you guys throw Kylie under the bus, you're going to pay her rent.

Speaker 1 Why Nelliot are already doing it? Find out. That's right.
And that's a wrap, folks, on another episode of New Heights. Thank you to our guest, Taylor Swift, for joining us on the show.

Speaker 1 Life of a Showgirl comes out October 3rd. Pre-order is now available on TaylorSwift.com.
Reminder, New Heights will be back to kick off the editable season August 27th.

Speaker 1 Make sure you're subscribed to the New Heights channel on YouTube and follow New Heights in the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcast.

Speaker 1 You can listen to new episodes of New Heights early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. All right, now, once again, New Heights, a Wondery Show.

Speaker 1 Follow the show on all social media at New Heights Show with OneS, and thanks to our production and crew always for your editing skills and making us look entirely better than what we are.

Speaker 1 Taylor got to see this firsthand, actually. Thanks, guys.

Speaker 2 It's been great.

Speaker 1 And to the 92%ers and to the Swifties, we love you guys. We'll see you guys next time.
Bye. Peace.

Speaker 1 All right, I don't know. Oh, God,

Speaker 1 where to go from here?

Speaker 2 I went.

Speaker 2 There was confetti all over it.

Speaker 2 Oh, this is like when the cats taste something they don't, that they're confused by.

Speaker 2 This is my favorite impression.

Speaker 2 It's a confused, the cat ate something, it doesn't know what it is. This is this that gets gets you every time.
That gets me every time, man.

Speaker 2 I will laugh at that. I will like fall off the couch laughing at that if he'll do it at his, you know.

Speaker 1 Mom and dad, uh, mom and mom, dad and dad, whatever, parents, are you about to spend five hours in the car with your beloved kids this holiday season?

Speaker 1 Driving to old granny's house, I'm setting the scene, I'm picturing screaming, fighting, back-to-back hours of the K-pop demon hunter soundtrack on repeat.

Speaker 1 Well, when your ears start to bleed, I have the perfect thing to keep you from rolling out of that moving vehicle. Something for the whole family.
He's filled with laughs. He's filled with rage.

Speaker 1 The OG Green Gronk give it up for me, James Austin Johnson, as the Grinch.

Speaker 1 And like any insufferable influencer these days, I'm bringing my crew of lesser talented friends along for the ride with A-list guests like Gronk, Mark Hamill, and the Jonas Brothers, whoever they are.

Speaker 1 There's a little bit of something for everyone. Listen to Tis the Grinch Holiday Podcast, wherever you get your podcasts.