Share & Atone & Tell with Nick Wright and Kevin Wildes

Welcome to Pablo Torre Finds Out.

I am Pablo Torre.

Today's episode is brought to you by DraftKings.

DraftKings, the crown is yours.

And today we're going to find out what this sound is.

I'm not acting.

I don't think he's acting.

It's just a character.

He's just a real-life character.

Right after this ad.

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You're listening to DraftKings Network.

What a delight to have you both here, by the way.

You know, for me.

Thanks for having us.

Yeah.

You're taking stock of your surroundings, Kevin.

Well, I've seen,

you know, I'm a big fan.

Oh, yeah.

Waiting for Nick to chime in in with a compliment, but none has come.

I don't like to

come over the top on someone else's compliment.

Yeah.

And I also don't like to lie.

So I was in a weird spot, you know, kind of a double way.

But

by the way, evidently my hair is getting screwed up by the headphones.

I think it looks great.

It has been looking good.

No, I appreciate that.

All of our hair is looking pretty good.

Pablo's got great hair.

Wilds has great hair.

I just my hair's fine i'm in a room with two people objectively with better hair than me my hair gets graded on a curve because i used to have a shaved head and people thought that was by force than by choice so people oddly think this is like fake hair um yeah but set that aside we're gonna rank everything in the room by the time this episode is over rankings matter you know what can i just say something these people that think they're too goddamn good to like oh for lists and rankings and whatever that's what life is.

I'm not into people that think they're too good for what everyone enjoys.

Rankings are number one, dude.

Yeah,

rankings.

Rankings are number one.

As far as ways to organize, number one, number one, number one, rankings, number two, art,

and that's the end of the list.

Just rankings and art.

Yeah,

let's all get claps, though.

We good.

No, that was a good clap.

Missed it.

Best clap, Nick.

Second best clap, me.

Worst clap, Wilds.

Okay, so you should know that the reason that I've decided to start the new year with Nick Wright and Kevin Wilds here with me in studio is for a very particular reason.

Nick and Wilds, in case you did not know, co-host a popular sports television show called First Things First over on FS1.

Or, as they called the show at the start of one episode last year.

The show that's going to vanquish Pablo Torres.

Oh, come on.

Don't put that on the air.

Why I'm serious about it.

Okay, all right.

We're going to do it together.

All right, let's go.

And shout out to their co-host, by the way, Chris Broussard, who you could hear at the end of that video just then, just immediately washing his hands of all of this.

But my feud with Nick and Kevin actually began a lot earlier than that.

And so I needed to begin this episode, which will go unusually deep inside of the business of sports media and the art of giving takes and the crafting of magic words and the ranking of celebrity because Nick started off originally as a solo radio host and Wilde started off as a television producer that I worked with at ESPN.

And I just needed to confront them about the last time that the three of us had been together in person,

which was naturally at Kevin Wilde's family holiday party.

Okay.

December 2023, Nick.

It's the Upper West Side.

It's almost Christmas.

I see you.

Yes.

And you say to me something that I've been waiting over a year to talk to you about.

Great.

I have no recollection.

You say to me,

I think you're the second smartest person in sports media.

I called you second?

I would have thought maybe third, but sure, yeah.

Did I have myself first or Bilmani first?

I never followed up until now.

I want the rest of these f ⁇ ing rankings.

Well, do I think I am the smartest guy in sports media?

Obviously, I think that.

And I would think anyone that is in the lane I'm in, if they think there's someone smarter than them, I would lose respect for them.

Is the lane you're in breathing person?

No.

Or whatever.

I don't think I'm the smartest person in the world.

That's ridiculous.

I don't even think I'm one of the...

No, but I'm in an industry where the barrier for entry of intelligence is not exactly high.

How dare you!

And I, how dare you!

And the lane I have is

the

annoyingly accurate smart guy.

He has been right about the Chiefs.

You called that one.

Well,

that is at least one-third true, annoyingly accurate.

I would just ask the audience:

what else are we going to assign my success to?

My look?

No.

My, I got a great voice?

No.

Connections?

No.

Athleticism?

No.

Likeability?

Pretty clearly not.

It's like, god damn it.

That guy really irritates me, but

he's smart.

I learned something and he's right a lot.

That's a great take.

I mean, what do we assign Wilde's success to?

He's incredibly handsome.

He's one of the funniest people I've ever met.

He's super likable.

Yeah.

Well, trust me.

If he had all of those things and was the smartest guy in the room, I don't think he, I think he's precedent.

But, but this is, this is the.

I don't know if I got complimented or diss there.

I think, I think, I think it's 60-40 diss.

It's a real ice cream sandwich of a compliment.

I didn't grade it all.

But I also think it really says

a profound amount about you that it stuck with you for 14 months because it means that

you operate under the same assumption i do that you're the smartest guy in the business it's hard to debate that yeah

who you want to be the smartest to want to be is a real loaded clause

you guys are

do you know see why this guy's my rival do you see this rival's thing is more

do you get it having like a

we're 30 seconds away to debating the salary cap

the reason apron oh look at the second apron that doesn't work

so important for Wilds to be a little bit more.

It's so important for Wilds to be here because I think it's so putative.

Can't make anything happen.

Shut up.

Meanwhile, Wilds' take is like, why is it an apron?

No, that's it.

Here we go.

No, do the rivals thing.

I want to catch people up on that.

Oh, yeah.

Which is that Nick declared on Lebatard's show that he has rivals.

Kevin Wilds makes fun of me because he says that this is an insane way to look at my career, but I just assumed everyone looked at it this way,

which is I have a rivals list.

Everyone in the media that is within two years of me or younger than me, I must vanquish and I must be more successful than.

I have to do it.

They are all my rivals.

And the reason I mention it is right now, rising to the top of the rivals list is Pablo Torrey, and he will be vanquished.

The top Pablo's younger than me.

Pablo made fun of me a bit on the show the other day, which only solidified that he is my rival.

And it doesn't matter that we're friendly, it doesn't matter that he's always been kind to me, it doesn't matter that I was at a Christmas party with him.

I will vanquish Pablo Torre.

You guys at one point were both like young.

I've known Pablo for so long.

I'm like, remember when Pablo was like the young guy at ESPN?

Yeah,

Pablo's young and you were young.

Yeah.

And now you're 40.

Right.

But so I am 39.

I mean, that's basically that's 40.

So the, that's even worse than 40, honestly.

I don't, I, I don't know.

That's a good take.

I don't think that it is unique in any industry

to look at the other high achievers that are around your age and measure yourself against them.

So everyone that was

around my age, even though we're not young anymore, they're all rivals.

And then I tried to set up like a beef.

It didn't really take off.

Yeah.

I was.

You said some bombs over.

You, you said some swear words.

I was like, yeah.

I think I went.

But I think we were on vacation too.

I was like, why'd you launch the rivalry beef?

I hate Nick Wright now.

Okay.

I feel that.

And

which camera

can I speak into?

This is the drawers.

Oh, yeah, all of them.

Nick Wright.

F you.

Kevin Wilds.

You're a C-word.

Capitalism.

Content.

Capitalism.

I think it's like, I think Pablo started a beef, but we're not even going to respond.

First things first was on vacation, and I was just yelling into

the noise-deading foam in this room.

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Whether you're celebrating a big win or simply enjoying some cocktails with family and friends, Remy Martin 1738 is the perfect spirit to elevate any occasion.

So go ahead, treat yourself to a little luxury, and try Remy Martin 1738 Accord Royale.

Learn more at remymartin.com.

Remy Martin Cognac, Veen Veeen, Champain, afforded an alcoholic volume, reported by Remy Control, USA, incorporated in York, New York, 1738.

Centaur design.

Please drink responsibly.

We do have a segment that I wanted to do, and the segment was going to be Take Atonement.

And when I texted you guys about this, immediately and unsurprisingly, Nick refused to play along with the segment.

Wilde was down.

I was down.

You are not.

I know.

Again.

Do you want me to read into the court transcript?

Will you text it.

Please.

And see if the audience thinks that I refused.

Also, just lie.

Say he said something.

No, read exactly what I wrote.

Pablo, you are the number one smartest person in sports media.

Strike it from the record.

And then Wiles replies, I'm in.

The next morning, Nick replies, I'm not saying I'm not in.

Exactly.

But I'm sure you guys will understand that asking me to compile my allegedly worst opinions assumes facts not in evidence.

Parentheses, that such opinions exist.

Close parentheses, period.

New text, this could be a Herculean undertaking.

Exactly.

So, as I stated before, I never said I wasn't in.

I just said it's going to be hard.

But I've got some things ready, but do you want to go first since you guys were the ones in first?

You're saying that you have generated.

Yeah, I've got some ones that didn't work.

For sure.

Is it this one?

I'm ready to move from the flirtation stage to the commitment stage.

And I am picking the Chicago Bears

and Caleb Williams to win the NFC and to be a rookie quarterback representative in the Super Bowl.

Wow.

Yeah, I mean, that's the obvious one.

Now, I am curious if Jaden Daniels were to make the Super Bowl, that take becomes basically half right because most of the people's objection was a rookie quarterback's never made the Super Bowl.

And it would have been like, if you say, hey,

if an asteroid's going to hit Earth in

Peru in 2028 and an asteroid hits Argentina in 2028.

You weren't as wrong as the people who were like, no way, it's not coming.

You were definitely more right.

And so, Jaden Daniels' season kind of vindicates the opinion a bit, but obviously it didn't go that way.

There's a whole nother sliding doors thing of if Tyreek Stevenson doesn't taunt the fans and the Bears get to 5-2 and Jaden loses that game, what we're talking about.

But no, that was a bad take.

The thing about sports predictions is they're predictions.

And the, you know,

as try as I might, you can't flawlessly tell the future.

Yeah, that would have been probably, I don't know if that would have been the number one draft pick for the wrongest take I've had.

But it's up.

I mean, it's a take, though.

That was just the one from this past year that could be.

I mean, that's a great take, though.

Yeah, obviously.

You're saying the process of the take

was good.

The result was bad.

If the take cuts through and it makes sense, it's a great take.

It doesn't necessarily have to be.

Right or wrong.

What was your request since you have the text pulled up?

The request.

Bad predictions?

Was...

It was actually, I thought it was a magnanimous offer.

It was a take exorcism.

We all volunteer a take that we Oh, if it was just one take, then that would have been, then it wouldn't have been Herculean.

I thought we needed like a long list.

We do have this take also just for the record on that.

I don't believe in the Eagles.

I don't believe in their coach.

And I'm starting not to believe in their quarterback.

Yeah, I mean, two-thirds of that applies.

I don't believe in the quarterback, and I don't believe in the coach.

Now I was dead wrong on Saquon and his impact, and brew nailed that yeah the thing that i was going to bring to the take exorcism was i did pick the lakers to beat the nuggets oh yeah that love that was my shining moment

no

zeros on the clock the nuggets advance they have won

here's the other thing

I don't understand people being embarrassed by incorrect sports predictions.

I think that old takes exposed guy existing has been one of the greatest things that ever happened in my career.

Because I think there's a lot of people who are like, oh boy, I don't want to get old takes exposed.

Let me water this one down.

Do I care?

Like, what is like, like, oh no, oh, no, this loser is going to retweet the thing that I said six months ago.

Isn't there some amount of tension, though, in being guy who is the most right and being guy who does not feel an ounce of pain when he is wrong.

Isn't that in conflict?

Can you be both?

Because I take so much pride in being correct, I should

feel shame when I'm wrong.

It's a classic having cake and trying to eat it as well situation.

How so?

Because you want to be the guy who's right, but also when you're wrong, you say, I don't actually get bothered by being wrong.

Well, it's the it's a lot of upside, but almost no downside that you are going to absorb.

I

fundamentally disagree.

It is

the life of a

in a different genre, professional gambler.

I knew it.

I knew it.

Which is,

I am going to, in a theoretical world, be the world's greatest sports better.

And I'm going to make millions of dollars a year betting sports.

And my path to doing that is being correct 56% of of the time.

And part of that means I know going in, I am going to be wrong two out of five.

And if every time I'm wrong, I'm like, oh, what am I going to do now?

Then that is, you are the ultimate trust the process guy.

You are the ultimate.

This is unfortunately true.

And so, no, I don't, I don't go into every football season saying, well, we're going to be perfect.

I go into every football season saying, I'm going to be better than all my rivals.

And luckily, all of them year after year convince themselves the greatest team any of us have ever seen is probably not that good.

So I start off way ahead.

And I only need a few other things to fall to be the rightest one.

Nick does have a remarkable thing going wilds where, and again, this is not an original observation, but somehow his portfolio includes LeBron James.

I said this a few months ago, and I believe it 100% to be true.

He'll never be bad.

And Patrick Mahomes.

You know why teams do weird shit when they're playing the Chiefs?

Because staring across the sideline and seeing Patrick Mahomes and Andy Reid terrifies them.

And he has marked himself as an underdog somehow, despite those being the two items at the top of his list.

Can I be prying and rude?

on the subject of Nick's relationship with Patrick Mahomes.

And LeBron James.

Sure.

The idea that LeBron or Patrick Mahomes would be in the midst of some take storm and they would see yours and be like, thank you for saying that.

Yeah.

I think they appreciate it.

Shingoon has never reached out to me.

All I do is sing the guy's praises.

I was early on that.

Oh, but Shingoon is learning from Joker.

He's baby Joker.

Okay.

He is.

Okay.

Baby Joker.

Okay.

That's fine.

You should have just got me already.

Being his personal followers like the pro bono publicist for Shingoon.

This dude is out here.

He should make the audience.

You really should get more love

from your guys.

Yeah, because my guys.

Well, hold on.

I rock with my guys.

Mac Jones did start following you on Twitter.

Yes.

Oh.

Yeah.

Does that mean that he's not being submitted to the center of the table for a take atonement?

No.

I mean, I can get into that.

I thought that that's what you were going to get into.

Never.

But now it's.

I'm never going to leave Mac Jones basically because Sam Darnold,

I'm telling this the Sam Darnoldification of sports.

You want a $5 word.

Sam Darnold's success

has

made

it possible for me to never sell any bad take

anywhere.

I'll play action.

Stepping up.

Launching downfield.

And it is cool.

Twisting, turning, touchdown, Jefferson, Minnesota's back in front.

Like Sam Darnold was given up on by the Jets, the Panthers, and then when he got to the 49ers, what was it, Shanahan?

He's like, he reminds me, like, why can't Sam Darnold be good?

Steve Young got good at 30.

We're like, whoa, that's a compliment.

That kind of hit my radar.

Like, time to get into the Sam Darnold take business.

And Sam Darnold is amazing.

So, why is

Mac Jones right now as good as Carolina Sam Darnold?

Probably not.

But never leaving Mac Jones.

But point taken.

That's it.

It's the ceiling of

guys that I'm never giving up on anybody until they retire.

And like, I don't know.

Maybe USFL, he can come back.

With the point, the point you're making is that Sam Darnold was a turning point in the sports discourse, such that because he has had a comeback like this,

now we cannot write off anybody.

Certainly quarterbacks who are so situationally coach, wide receiver, offensive line dependent.

Sure.

What I'm getting, though, is that neither of you are going to play this game.

No, what do you mean?

You're both rejecting the concept of having a take to it.

I'm going to free Pablo.

You haven't said one of yours.

Ben Simmons.

I'm not giving up on Ben Simmons.

He gets his back healthy.

Ben Simmons unfollowed me on Twitter.

Ben Simmons is my answer.

You're giving up on Ben Simmons?

I think I have to.

You have to believe in Ben Simmons then.

I think I have to.

My take on Ben Simmons was always, and this is, I'll do a little Nick right for you.

Nick,

if I gave you a flying car, you'd be impressed, right?

Sure.

If this car was the fastest car in the world, you'd be impressed.

Yeah.

If this car didn't have a stereo, you'd be bummed, but you'd still think incredible car.

Yeah.

That's Ben Simmons.

That's such a terrible take.

I'll stick with your analogy.

If because the lack of brakes exist, you're afraid to drive the car fast, but it can go fast.

You're afraid to take it on the freeway, but it can drive above traffic, then it doesn't matter.

It can do all those other things.

The other guys in league history who have had a hole in their game, it didn't

metastasize in a way that it undermined every other piece of their game.

And that's what happened to this kid.

And I don't know, I don't, I don't don't know the full psychology of it, but it's been, we've known it for five years.

I don't like that Nick has workshopped my take into a better take.

Although I think my analysis is

Ben Simmons number one

fan and supporter available real estate.

Yes.

You want it?

I mean, if it's available

is that Kevin Wilds can become the number one Ben Simmons.

The number one Ben Simmons guy.

Yeah, I'll do that.

Pablo wants you to atone for a take.

I have atoned for the rest of the time I'm not playing along.

I atoned for Saquon not working with the Eagles, the Bears making the Super Bowl, Derrick Henry not making a difference for the Ravens.

I will throw in, and

the Lakers beating the Nuggets

in last year's playoffs.

So there's four.

I don't think I may need to atone for anything.

We won.

How about no one's beating the Nuggets in a seven-game series, and they won literally one seven-game series.

That's what I was weird.

And then blew a 20-point lead at home that wasn't great

how do i remain so confident i'm always reminding myself bang no one's beating denver in a seven game series i'm gonna say it a hundred times i'm always reminding myself

i'm not atoning for that though you can do a non-sports take atonement i didn't specify you can do any is there any take wilds that you regret that you've come around on in the last year or more we can do more.

I'll give you one in the meantime while you're thinking.

A non-sports take that I've just been wrong about.

I'm like, you know what?

This is good.

He said he has one he wants to give you.

Yeah, go ahead.

I'll brainstorm.

I'm a morning guy now.

I used to want to stay up late.

Now I wake up at like 5.30 a.m.

Was that a take or just like an evolution of your life?

I think I was like, mornings suck.

I think I was dead wrong.

Yeah.

My take previously had been, I will never want to wake up this early.

And now I'm regularly waking up this early.

and it's better.

Yeah, I get so much more done, yeah.

It's better, yeah.

The mornings are great.

Also, being a dad, I feel like I get to spend time and you know, yeah, that's the take.

Mornings are better than night, yeah, exactly.

I'll fall asleep at 11 p.m., 10:30, even

aging.

Yeah, I think that's just maturity.

This also brings us to the vocabulary portion.

So, what is this portion?

It's just the idea of your favorite portion.

It's your favorite?

Yeah, go off to Oklahoma.

Sorry, Wild, set it up, please.

Words that work for sports debate, maybe like magic words.

My favorite is deserve.

Deserve is one of my favorite words.

Does Lamar deserve to be a 10-point favorite?

Does Russell Wilson deserve to be a 10-point underdog?

Do the Chiefs deserve the buy?

Like, what?

They're 15-1.

Yeah, they do.

Yeah, but do they deserve it?

It's just so good.

So I was trying to sort of...

It's weighted with morality even.

Oh, it's just fantastic.

Do they cosmically

merit?

this thing that has so do you have a do you know the other ones that we use on the show reaction no what do you mean

so bad at this game he's so bad at this game why would i be good at this i don't even understand the game the correct answer was

disrespected

okay

is sean payton being disrespected okay i get it those those are i think another one should the lions be afraid oh yeah that's good of anyone in the nfc yeah and we do the we do another version of that which is how how scary are

the bangles.

Yeah.

Are the bangles the scariest?

The scary.

Yes.

Scariest.

Scary is good too, because it's just, it's very like, you get immediate reaction.

I'm not going to be scared of that.

But the subtext in the best vocabulary words in this way are always the words that imply some level of disrespect.

Yes.

Deserve, disrespect, fear.

Unfair, we use a lot.

Unfair, that blank.

Unfair is this unfair, but it's all based on disrespect.

Justice, a cosmic sense of justice well yeah it's just it's to get

wilds wants

more emotion and less analytical responses

yeah typically that creates the best show yeah some sort of some combination of the two yeah but an emotional response with a with a statistical foundation is nice yeah no no no it has to be based in

fact,

but a feel to it.

Yeah, that's what makes it with philosophical kind of a clash.

So I did high school debate.

One of the things that I learned is that a key to ensuring a messy disagreement is to never define the term that you're actually debating.

Oh, and be valuable.

Valuable, greatest.

These are things where Nick has, Nick's brain has already activated.

If you were to put an fMRI on Nick's brain, as I said those words, you would have had already like a decision tree of just arguments about

in the debate team, that's something from like the, i'm not totally i've seen a few debates but i'm not totally familiar with the format

but it's terrible that's something that the initial you will have to spend time in your in your opening case like saying that you define the terms you attempt to define the terms so that you both agree on what you're arguing about and if you don't you end up eternally debating michael jordan versus lebron that sounds great like if you were to just dive into it without agreeing on on what value means you would never actually engage or at least you wouldn't engage with what the other person is actually trying to say until like

several levels into the argument that you agree with that's the fun part though taking the fun of yourself until you're taking the fun yeah so what well that's what i mean messy disagreement is actually yeah i like the messiness of it great to watch two people really good at disagreeing uh do but really bad if you're trying to resolve anything which is why you don't actually want to have a word that is so clean and binary.

You want to have something that you just lose yourself in.

Okay.

Yeah.

Now you know.

Got it.

I hate you guys.

What was that?

I don't know.

You seemed like there was a period at the end of that.

Here's a question that I've genuinely been curious about with you guys.

The best form of famous.

Who is famous best?

Whose fame do you want?

The whole world is available to draft.

draft.

Whose famous do you want?

Is there any financial association to this?

Yes.

Or is it just the fame?

There is financial association with it.

You can monetize it.

You can do whatever you want.

No, no, no.

That's not what I mean.

What I mean is, do you get this person's fame and wealth or just their fame?

I'm not saying

you can then make money off that level of fame.

What I'm saying is

if you see.

Do you understand what I'm saying?

Do you understand the question I'm asking?

I do.

list.

Because, like, I don't, this is not who I would pick.

I don't think Chris Bosch's fame is hyper, hyper

monetizable, but he's got a couple hundred million dollars already.

So, I'm asking if you're in that scenario, if you were to pick Chris Bosch, do you take with you the couple hundred million dollars?

It's probably more interesting if the answer is no, that you're just getting their fame.

Right, right.

It's celebrity.

Do you have a answer for this?

I have a draft pick.

Okay, I want to hear yours, if that's okay.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I want to be Mike Trout.

Mike Trout.

I want to be revered among those who know what it is that I do and respect why it is that I'm good at it.

Yeah.

But I also want the plausible deniability of ever actually being identified as

or stopped as Mike Trout.

I mean, as far as a number one pick, like, can Mike Trout get into every restaurant?

Because if you can't, if like, if Mike Trout and his wife are going to be like, they said it's going to be 15 minutes, maybe 45.

Like, she'd be like, honey, you're Mike Trout.

I know, but I played with the Angels.

What if Mike Trout has his assistant that's just him

who has registered

Mike Trout assistant that she met?

Send a reservation request with the hyperlink to my wife.

I don't know if that plays.

I think I have a better answer.

Let me hear you.

What do you got?

Sully.

Sully Sullenberger?

Yeah, hero.

Hero with a mustache.

I think hero, like hero for being cool,

not just saving lives.

You didn't just, you know,

you're not a scientist that, you know, wow, this, this invention that you made saved a lot of lives, which is very good.

Don't get me wrong.

Like, no, I...

saved lives in a dramatic way in the city.

Now, with the Tom Hanks movie, I guess he had to go to, people were mad at Sully for some reason.

Yeah, but

I didn't like that part at all.

Did they cancel Sully at the end of Sully?

No, no, he was in the midst of it.

People were, there was,

if the Hanks movie's correct, he was really raked over the coals about did you actually have to land in the Hudson?

Yeah, I don't know who's giving Sully.

Yeah, I would have gone to the congressional meeting.

They came in.

Sully.

The events of January 15th, 2009, have been well documented.

And rather than recite them now in great detail, I want only to reiterate to the subcommittee that the successful outcome was achieved by the actions of many.

I think Sully is just great.

Everybody loves him.

Maybe he's got some waning fame, but he's just

a lot of people.

You want people to say thank you.

Hero is not.

But let me ask.

Hero is pretty sick.

Definitely sick, but let me ask a question.

To me,

that answer tells me you don't value at all

recognized on the street.

No, that's probably a detriment.

I don't think famous people like that at all.

So I think some people don't.

Others don't.

Tommy DeVito's agent lives for it.

That's a good level of fame.

Your draft pick is Tommy DeVito's agent.

No, that's not.

No, no, no.

That's not my draft pick.

I was just saying.

So it was just interesting that Wilds picked a guy who I think Sean Stilato

only becomes

recognized

upon introduction and never randomly.

You understand what I mean?

Like people hear the name and I think most people know it.

If you have the stash,

even with the stash.

I got to tell you right now, I don't know what he's...

If I close my eyes and think of that guy, I just think of Tom Hanks.

Like, I don't remember what the guy actually looks like.

And if he was walking down the the street, I wouldn't know him.

What happened to us on the way in,

that to me is

awesome at that exact level.

When we were walking in the building, somebody just walked by.

I was like, hey, fellas, love the show.

Like,

that's a great,

like, endorphin boost.

Yes.

I also think being truly famous.

would be exhausting.

And I don't think that would be fun.

No, but if the guy was like, hey, wow, I was going to say, yeah, he's like, you're amazing for landing a plane in the Honor, saving all those lives.

I agree.

Thank you.

I'm trying to think of the name of who this describes.

Because my answer would be someone who, if they want to be recognized, is wildly famous.

And like you said, can get in anywhere, no weight,

but also

with sunglasses and a baseball cap on.

That's Mike Trout.

That's the the Mike Trout.

That's why I drafted Mike Trout, Nick.

But you're saying that Mike Trout couldn't, can't just get in.

Wait, hold on.

Are you describing like a DJ?

Like, I'm a Vici.

No, people are like, oh, my God.

No.

I'll be honest.

I'm lying here.

I'm lying.

Whatever level of fame I have, I enjoy, and I would like more.

So this, I don't want to be anonymous.

I think it would bum me out.

It would bum you out to be anonymous?

Yeah, because I

appreciate Nick's honesty too.

So here's why.

Unfortunately, relate to this.

But I've never,

and you're going to laugh at me, but just follow me.

My entire adult life, I've had

tiny, slightly increasing fame.

How about like Kansas City rate?

Right.

So Kansas City, right.

And so at 23,

once a week, someone would be like, yo, love the show.

And it's just slightly, so not only

am I,

has it never been weird for me?

Because it's like watching your kid get taller, like you don't actually recognize it because you see him every day.

You know what I mean?

Like it's just been,

but also I have no recollection of it not being there.

So I think Wilds had a whole successful career without any real fame associated with it.

And now, in the last five years has gotten increasing levels of fame so wild has a a standard to remember like oh yeah yeah everything like i was an adult with a wife and kids and none of this yeah you're like a child star basically no that's not what i again that's why i said you want to make fun of me but to next point you kevin were a producer yeah you were like having secret meetings with kobe bryant once upon a time secret but

that's what you were doing you were like producing like shows for the most famous and inconveniently famous people, yeah.

And Nick and I

have been

clawing,

digging my fingernails into a tree trunk of celebrity, yeah.

So, that so

so I think my answer is like

Daniel Day Lewis,

I drink your

milkshake,

I drink it up.

Because I don't.

All that dude tries to do is hide.

Well, but he's different than me.

It's such a perfect.

But

I think that Daniel Day Lewis, if he wants to just go out and go to Walgreens, is able to do it.

But I also think it's like, shit, man, I want to be Daniel Day-Lewis tonight.

He obviously can be.

That seems awesome.

I guess so.

You're like the chameleon.

Yeah.

So like,

so I, because I initially, so someone like Mark Wahlberg that seems exhausting like he just has to be Mark Wahlberg at all times and everywhere he goes like anyone that feels like I have to you know what I have to have security that seems exhausting right

Wahlberg walks around thinking that he could do a better job of saving people on an airplane than Sully

He did do an airplane movie.

He also believed he could stop 9-11.

I have another one.

Yeah.

Again, it's super, it's even more anonymous.

I wrote Winston Wolf famous.

Oh.

As in

the fictional character Winston Wolf, where for some reason he's in a tuxedo, so he must be in tracks.

He's rolling in these interesting circles.

And when,

who does it?

Ving Rahms.

Ving Rames.

Rames.

Did you earnestly pronounce it Rahms?

I didn't know.

I don't know how you pronounce Ving Rams' name, but now I do.

Mispronunciations are fine because it means you learned it by reading it instead of hearing it.

I may have just misremembered it.

In any event,

and then Sand London Jackson, like they're very excited to see him.

It seems like he's got a nice car.

He has connections at the dumpster.

You're...

Jimmy, right?

This is your house?

Sure is.

I'm Winston Wolf.

I solve problems.

Like, it just seems like it's.

He's there to help you get out of a bind.

But not necessarily, like, I don't want that to be my job necessarily.

No, but what you mean is within an industry, I'm considered

really

drug kingpin famous.

That's an interesting type of famous.

I do not, I think it's quite dangerous.

No, I understand, but I, but it's the same type of thing where it's like you are anonymous to everyone except for the people who know who you are.

And to those people, you're a big deal.

And in that element, that's also like kind of like a sully thing.

Except

I would urge you to reconsider.

And do Mike Trout?

Taking Taking Mike Trout.

Taking Mike Trout.

He gives you drug kingpin fame.

I didn't want that.

That was him.

He wanted to assassinate

fame at all.

No,

I was just trying to, maybe I should use a different analogy.

Phil Ivey.

That's a good level of fame.

Where, once again, people who know know

and to those

who are using that visual

usually

conspicuous also.

But also you're, you know what I mean?

That's what mine is, is, but it's like I can wear a tuxedo.

I'm big on if I can wear a tuxedo.

That was a good question, Pablo.

Do you have a list of questions that we should have let you ask instead we just said dumb stuff for 40 minutes?

We've reached the end of the show and at the end of every show We talk about what we found out today because it's called Pablo Finds Out.

So I will ask us to go around the table.

We all say what it is we found out after hanging out with each other and finding all this stuff out.

I have found out that Nick Wright drafting Daniel Day-Lewis is the perfect answer for a guy who I can't tell

is acting or not.

You can't tell if I'm acting?

I think you are a method

arguer, and that is the highest compliment I can pay to you.

I'm not acting.

I don't think he's acting.

It's just a character.

He's just a real life character.

What did I learn?

That Sean Stilato was, in fact, Tommy DeVito's agent.

No, I knew that.

He knew that.

I saw you at Yankee Stadium, by the way.

Yeah, game five.

We said hello to each other.

Yes, but I think Sean Stilato is also there.

Yeah, I know.

That's the bit that I eat.

Sean Stilato, you know why you recognized him?

Because he was walking around begging people to recognize him and hoping someone said, Please take a picture with me.

Like, that's why.

Wiles doesn't like me saying this because he thinks it's mean and it is mean, but sometimes truths need to be spoken.

You go on what you learned, and then I'll go.

I also just learned that truth.

I learned I hurt Pablo's feelings

at your Christmas party.

I don't think you hurt his feelings.

I don't think that was the takeaway.

I've learned, I found out that Nick is

projecting onto my feelings.

This is his own feelings.

No, it's not.

I'm trying to find a nicer one because the one that's actually there, I feel like it's not take it kind, take it.

I think you guys are nuts for not wanting to be anonymous.

Like, I feel like you're like headed towards

you're going to be in the old folks' home.

You're like, hello.

I'm like, it's just,

I don't know.

I don't know.

I'm going to be podcasting till I die.

So, yeah.

Just,

I guess.

Call me crazy.

I don't know.

The external validation is a little concerning for me.

I didn't have you guys pegged for that.

Really?

Maybe you didn't have me pegged for that?

External validation.

What I have found out is that Kevin Wilds is terrible at pegging people for nothing.

No, I did.

For external validate.

I didn't know.

No, because you kind of like,

I don't know.

I thought the art of the take was good enough.

No, like, can I ask you a question?

If you were on a deserted island, but this setup,

just you, do you think you would give takes?

Of course.

That's what I'm saying.

But it would just be a mic plugged into nowhere you'd be like all right yeah no so so both

can be true in itself yes oh a thousand a thousand percent that is true what is also true is

i have

become

addicted to the occasional what i call it endorphin boost or ego boost or whatever of the stranger saying you know saying

like what you do yeah recognizing me or whatever.

And I have become very with something that I do not

is not a positive trait, but I recognize it.

I've become very

impatient on lines.

Because like I still go out to clubs and stuff with my wife.

And I used to, oh, there's a line.

We'll just wait in it.

And I just don't have the capability anymore.

I'm like, can't do it.

Can't do it.

I can't.

That's not, that's not

a public-facing thing.

You think that's just getting older?

Yes.

No, so I maybe, but it's my time's running.

As soon as you get old, the older you get, the less interested you are in lines.

Like, if you're 88, like, man,

you got limited time here.

That part's true.

Stop waiting online.

Yes, but it's also why

I don't think human beings are

wired for fame.

And I just, I think it is unnatural.

And it's

prior to

the last

20 years,

very, very, very few people were actually had any fame.

And everyone wondered, like, what's happening to society, whatever,

that's too

wide-ranging.

But I truly believe

millions of people now having an element of notoriety or fame via a social media following

is the symptom of so much of people losing their minds.

People get more anchored to opinions they had because you used to be able to have a bad opinion anonymously and change it, but now it's like shit.

Eight years ago, I posted on Facebook that I believed this, and now people, I'm tied to that, like a bad sports take that people won't let go of.

And I think that people have started manicuring and curating their own belief system to what they think their following likes because people aren't wired to deal with fame.

And so I think one of the other pieces of that is once you have an element of it, I think most people feel they need it.

I'm not saying it's healthy, but I think it's more typical than you would think of people who've been in the public eye for a long time needing to keep some relevance.

What do you think?

Can we end the podcast with a funny story?

Proceed.

Belmont Stakes.

We're there.

Fox has it.

So we're there.

I've got my kids with me.

Did you, oh, you brought

my daughter?

My daughter's friend.

There's some executives there.

And it's just a great time.

And then Nick is,

I felt like maybe I'm just telling myself this.

but you had some like gambling crossover that maybe people recognize you from poker because they're

a little bit of poker

of sports.

Globally competitive poker player.

Yeah, thanks, Pablo.

Accurate.

Nice to see you.

Guy comes over to like the little, you're in like little squares, and the guy comes over and says, Oh, Nick, love the show.

And I'm like, I'm on the show, you know, I'm on the show.

It's hard to like consume the show and

stumble across me, you know?

It's like, I love the steakhouse.

Like, I'm the salt shaker.

Like,

I'm there.

I'm not saying I'm the star of the show, but I am there.

And you usually have to spot

And then Nick very kindly senses this kind of tension because the guy's talking about the show.

And, you know, Wilds, he goes, he goes, I know, we know Wilds right here.

And the guy looks at me and goes, I think he said, do you want a picture with him?

And the guy goes, yeah.

Just kept talking to me.

Didn't walk away.

No.

It was just, he's like, yeah.

I'm like, buddy, it's not even on film.

It's not even a college.

It's just a free.

It's not like when I was growing up, like, we we only had 12 pieces of Kodak and we don't want to waste one.

There you go.

That is my level of fame.

Kevin Wildes,

Nick Wright.

I mean this when I say this.

Two of the greatest guests

in the history of Pablo Torre finds out.

Why is

it because remember you said it's like a messy entanglement.

Thanks, Pablo.

Bye, Pablo.

Pablo Torre Finds Out is produced by Walter Averoma, Ryan Cortez, Sam Daewig, Juan Galindo, Patrick Kim, Neely Lohman, Rob McRae, Rachel Miller-Howard, Carl Scott, Matt Sullivan, Claire Taylor, Chris Tuminello, and Juliet Warren.

Our studio engineering by RG Systems, our sound design by NGW Post, our theme song, as always, is by John Bravo.

We will talk to you next time.