Karen Read Says She’s “Framed For Murder” -No One Believes Til Shady Cops CAUGHT Editing CCTV Video

From the producers of The Tinder Swindler, Jesse sits down to tell his side of the story.

A shocking true story of an allegedly fake story that some now say might just be a true story, featuring interviews with police, lawyers, journalists, investigators who claim to have uncovered new evidence about this case, and with Jesse himself.

This compelling documentary invites the audience to decide for themselves who is telling the truth about Jesse Smollett.

The truth about Jesse Smollett launches on August 22nd only on Netflix.

This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance.

Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game?

Well, the name your price tool from Progressive, you can find options that fit your budget and potentially lower your bills.

Try it at progressive.com, Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates.

Price and coverage match limited by state law, not available in all states.

Bada bing, bada boop.

When you first move into a new house, there are a few things that you're going to to do immediately.

The first one, and I have always pre-planned this, pre-scheduled this, someone needs to come in and change every single lock in the house.

You don't know who the previous owner gave the house keys to.

You don't know who still has them.

Why risk it?

A family moves into their new home, and there are just like a few quirks that come with it.

I mean, you could maybe say that the house is charming, objectively speaking.

It's got a spacious backyard with a pool.

It's three floors.

They do have this interesting flagpole at the front of the property, but they are just so focused.

This family is so focused on getting situated, unpacking all their boxes.

But it feels like they're in some sort of weird social experiment because periodically through the day, people will start randomly showing up.

People will stop their cars, get out, take photos of this house landscape mode.

They turn their phone.

What is wrong with these people?

It's a normal family home.

This is not a landmark.

This is not a massive mansion with Christmas decorations up.

It's a random house.

What are they doing?

Others are driving by the house and doing these very convoluted, random three-point turns, and the owners are just looking out their windows like, why are they doing 25 three-point turns right now?

Like they're in some sort of simulation and it's a glitch.

Are they practicing for some driving test?

Why do they keep doing this?

It's not even necessary.

It's not like they're going anywhere.

They're just doing convoluted turns.

Why specifically in front of their house that they just bought?

What's even more interesting is the pictures listed on Zillow show the basement, and the basement floors originally looked normal.

The previous residents used a good chunk of the basement as a workout room.

So, in the listing pictures, you have these American flags hung on the wall.

There are weights, weight benches.

And because it's a workout room, the floor is covered with gym mats, those black rubber mats that you piece together like a puzzle.

However, when the new owners move in, basement floors, gym mats have been taken off, and now it's just a random mix of plywood.

It's not even hardwood floors, not carpet, plywood.

And it's not one consistent type of plywood, not one consistent layer of plywood.

It looks like random patches of plywood.

Let's say you've got plywood flooring and I spill tomato juice down one side and you can't get it out.

Would you go through the trouble of replacing the entire room?

Or maybe just that patch?

That's kind of what it looks like.

Why are there patches of different types of plywood?

Is that a new thing that the previous owners did right before moving out?

I mean, that's up for debate.

Everything is being debated by the internet.

Everything about this house is being debated, not even by the new owners, but people online.

People with abilities, whether you believe them or not, I guess is subjective.

Up to each person.

They're saying that they can see and read energy, and they're posting these ominous videos of them reading cards into the house.

And they warn everyone, this house, the energy here, it's not over.

What you have to do is look at what's left over.

It's far from over.

Someone will have to step in.

They think the house is suspicious.

Other netizens online are like, okay, that's a little much.

However, we agree with you.

It is suspicious.

Like the fact that the house went up for sale in November of 2022, nobody lists a house for sale right before the holidays.

Nobody's moving at that time.

Additionally, the house is originally listed for $949,000, but ends up selling for $905,000, a $44,000 hit in an area where real estate is in such high demand that usually there's bidding wars.

How long did it take to sell?

Do you know?

A few months.

Hmm.

There is something inside that house.

The internet feels it.

Everybody knows about it except the new homeowners.

In fact, they moved from a different area, had no idea what was going on inside this house until they moved in, saw people driving by taking pictures of their new house.

That is crazy.

That is wild.

That is when they realized that they had just purchased 34 Fairview Road, previously owned by Brian Albert, the house in which John O'Keefe's body was found dead in the front lawn.

And the seller's agent,

Brian Albert's real estate agent, didn't say anything?

They didn't say anything.

And that realtor works for a firm that is owned by Carrie Roberts' sister.

This is part three of the Karen Reed case.

We would like to thank today's sponsors who have made it possible at Arotten Mango to to support the Deanna Farber Cancer Institute in Boston, Massachusetts.

They're a globally known cancer research center that also provides support for patients and families similar to John O'Keeffe's sister, who has since passed away from brain cancer.

This episode's partnerships have also made it possible to support Rotten Mango's growing team.

And we'd also like to thank you guys for your continued support.

As always, full show notes are available at RottenMangoPodcast.com.

A few disclaimers: there are mentions of driving under the influence, alleged physical assault, as well as drug usage.

So please watch at your own discretion.

This episode is only part three of a four-part series that is spanning to be probably longer than every single Game of Thrones episode combined.

I don't know what's happening.

I'm trying to take out some information, but I feel like everything is pertinent.

And there's two separate trials.

So there's trial one, trial two.

A lot of statements, a lot of testimonies have been condensed and or combined.

combined for brevity's sake.

If you have not seen part one or part two, I highly recommend that you go watch that because there's no way that any of this is going to make sense without watching those first two parts.

In addition, I will try to do like a very brief recap.

And all I can say is this is a case that consists of every single person on this board.

Some of them were at 34 Fairview Road, which is a house owned by the main Alberts.

The Albert is a massive family that I feel like Canton, Massachusetts, which is a 30-minute drive from Boston.

If there's 10 people, seven of them are Albert related.

They're either married into the Albert family, like Julie Albert is married to Chris Albert, who's Brian Albert's brother, or they're married in through Jennifer McCabe is Nicole Albert's sister who's married to Brian Albert.

I mean, it's just a freaking mess.

And then outside of 34 Fairview Road.

On January 29th, 2022, Boston police officer John O'Keefe was found in the front lawn in front of a flagpole.

Everyone inside the house that night, because there was a cop party, just like a bunch of cops coming together to drink and drive at night.

They say he never entered the house.

They say what most likely happened is John O'Keefe's girlfriend, Karen Reed, hit him with her car and left him for dead.

Karen Reed, on the other hand, is saying that's not what happened at all.

In fact, I am getting framed.

And these are the casts of characters.

So please go watch part two.

Go watch part one.

It's like, I think at that point, it's probably five hours.

Six hours.

Six hours.

There's just no way that I can recap anything more, but I will go over the colors.

Dark red, this red color here is the main Albert family.

So the Maine Albert couple, they're children.

And then you've got the orange, which is Chris Albert's family.

This is Brian Albert's brother, his wife Julie.

You got his son, Colin.

And then you've got the yellows.

The yellows are the McCabes.

They're...

They're like the McAlberts, you know?

They're related to the Alberts because of Nicole and Jen McCabe.

And then anyone related directly by Karen, so they're associated with this case through Karen, which is mainly just her defense attorneys.

They're going to be in pink.

Anyone who has a light blue color, such as John O'Keefe and maybe even ATF Brian Haha Higgins, that means that they are law enforcement officers or they have control over law enforcement.

So these are all cops.

These are all feds, except for the exception of Chris Albert.

who is not really a law enforcement officer, but he sits on the Canton Select Board, which controls the Canton Police Department as a whole.

It's five people.

He's one of them.

They get to appoint the police chief

of the Canton Police Department.

Brian Albert also has another brother named Kevin Albert, who is a detective of the Canton Police Department.

So there's just a lot of cops involved.

Is Kevin Albert, because we haven't really talked about him.

Is he part of the case at all or he's just related?

He's part of it.

Oh.

And then anyone in dark blue are investigating officers that are investigating the death of John O'Keefe, but jokes on them because their investigation is going to be investigated by the FBI for how abysmal it is.

And we also have multiple different law enforcement agencies at play here.

So we have the Boston Police Department, which John O'Keefe was a Boston cop.

Brian Albert, before he retired, coincidentally, conveniently, right after John O'Keefe's death, he was the head of the fugitive unit at the Boston Police Department.

And then you've got the Canton Police Department.

So John O'Keefe ends up passing away in Canton.

So they are the initial people to respond to the call.

So these three right here, this boy Sean, Paul, Michael, you're not going to like any of these people.

Like most of these people, you're not going to like.

They're Canton cops.

And then you've got Kenneth Berkowitz, Canton Police Chief.

And then you've got Brian Tolly, Yuri Buchanick, and Michael Proctor.

They're part of the Massachusetts State Police.

So these people, the state police officers, come in because the Canton police have to recuse themselves.

And then you've got the feds, the FBI that are actually investigating the investigation.

So four different law enforcement agencies.

So with that being said, I do want to say that nobody has been charged.

Well, nobody has been convicted of a crime.

There were two trials that ended in an acquittal.

Any conspiracies, any theories, there's a lot of netizen discourse surrounding this case.

And I will say it's very difficult to separate the emotion, the conspiracies, as well as what might be a neighborhood rumor versus what might actually have some truth to it.

So do your own research.

I know you guys are smart enough.

So before you make your own decision, opinion, judgment on any of the parties involved, do your own research.

And anything I say is alleged.

It's publicly available information.

It's recaps of online discourse as well as pulled from transcripts of the two trials.

So with that being said, let's get started.

There is a place called DNE Pizza and Subs.

It's like a hole-in-the-wall restaurant.

It seems exclusively made for takeout.

There's barely any seats, let alone any tables.

They sell pizzas, chicken wings, family favorite recipes, mac and cheese bites fried in a thick batter, a cheeseburger hot sub.

This is an interesting one.

It's a chicken Caesar salad pizza.

It's just like if you were to get a chicken Caesar salad, throw it on top of a pizza, a chicken Caesar salad pizza.

I mean, it was pretty self-explanatory.

They also have something called a triple decker sandwich.

But if you want something a little bit lighter, they've got egg salad, cold sub.

The menu is very extensive.

And if you order online, you get a whopping 5% discount.

But nobody wants to order online.

Nobody wants to order at all because the pizza shop is owned by Chris Albert, the brother of Brian Albert, whose front lawn John O'Keefe was found dead on.

One review, this is from 2018.

So this is before all of the suspicious activity has even occurred.

2018, one reviewer writes about this suspicious little pizza shop.

Second time there, and both times I had an issue.

First time, employees had a bad attitude.

Second time, they forgot to give me my dressing for my salad.

And by the time that they delivered the dressing, the chicken was disgusting.

It was cold.

I got a Greek salad and they said they brought me their house dressing, which is a mix of Greek and Italian.

It was disgusting.

The owner kept saying nothing was wrong.

Another one says, you better hope you don't get the blockhead that answered the phone for me when I was placing my order.

I wanted to go get my credit card to read the numbers off of, and he told me I should have had that prepared already.

To which another reviewer agrees.

They need a little work done in the customer service because I definitely overheard a guy calling me a piece of shit when I called back to add a soda to my order.

And then they tried to laugh it off later when he noticed that I was still on the phone.

Then when I got my pizza, it was burnt like hell.

Like, how the hell do you burn cheese pizza with no toppings?

And while all of this is ongoing, this place, these are reviews from 2018.

Somehow they survived 2018.

They survived the pandemic.

And even now, in 2025, this place is still going on.

This place is still open.

With one that is in commenting, how is the Albert Pizza Place still in business?

There cannot be that many people in Canton and the surrounding area that would support their business.

Why don't people boycott them and run them out of town?

The top comment responds, well, perhaps the business has other purposes than selling food.

As with any internet theory and or conspiracy, this could all be a made-up delusion crafted by a random shadowy internet figure who has mashed potatoes for brains and a working Wi-Fi router.

Just because words have been strung together into semi-coherent thoughts does not make it true or factual.

I'm not here to sway your opinion about a conspiracy, but it is an interesting conspiracy.

I did get sucked into the rabbit hole.

I turned into mashed potatoes for brains because it's just weird.

And it oddly starts with rice pudding.

In New York City, if you walk down two of some of the most popular streets, you've probably come across what people call a culinary mystery.

Two restaurants, most expensive areas in New York City with massive storefronts.

They always look empty for some reason.

It's just like a dessert shop.

It feels sterile.

It's called Rice to Riches.

It's like the most niche desserts shop.

There's so many dessert shops in New York City where they do all the trending Instagram desserts and they still close down because money is hard.

But this is rice pudding that's made fresh daily, that you can get in flavors like coconut coma, oreogasm, sex, drugs, and rocky road, hazelnut chocolate bear hug.

And then you just add toppings to it.

The founding family of the rice pudding shop is very wealthy, which people are confused.

Locals are wondering, who the hell is getting rich off of rice pudding?

Well, maybe they're not.

The restaurant opened up in 2002, and by 2005, the founder was arrested for operating what prosecutors called probably one of the largest gambling operations ever in Suffolk County.

This is actually that?

Yes.

An illegal sports betting ring that was bringing in $21 million annually.

Wait, so the store is a front?

No, the founder says they're two different businesses.

He said he's never mixed the money.

He's not money laundering.

The store's not a crime front.

That's crazy.

It's just a coincidence, he says.

It's a coincidence.

There's no connection between the gambling and the two dessert shops.

The dessert shop is 100% not a crime front.

That's what he says.

That dessert shop is still open.

There's no proof that there is money laundering happening.

I mean, there's still two of them in New York City in the most expensive areas.

So he's arrested, but his store is still running by someone.

Yeah, he got out pretty quick.

Oh.

Now, to complicate things even further, everybody does say rice pudding is actually pretty good there.

They say it's actually very addicting.

One comment reads, nah, because the rice pudding is so good.

I'm actually going to contribute to their gambling problem.

Another person writes, the rice pudding is worth the organized crime here.

That is what netizens believe is happening with D ⁇ E pizza without the good pizza.

There is no evidence.

But they believe based off the bad reviews of the restaurant predating 2022 and pictures of the food and locals saying, I don't know who goes there except for just fellow cops and like some random young kids.

They believe there is no way that these people are staying open for business and profiting to feed their whole family.

It doesn't make sense.

One internet rumor reads, I heard from a friend that Colin, Colin Albert, was selling drugs out of D ⁇ E pizza and his daddy knew all about it.

To which someone responds, of course his daddy knew.

Who do you think he gets the drugs from?

To be fair, another netizen comments, just no proof, just rumors.

Now, one netizen who has never met a bush and certainly does not beat around it just puts it quite frankly: D ⁇ E is a drug front.

John O'Keefe and Karen Reid pull up to the house.

John jumps out, goes into the driveway, makes it to the front of the house, but he mistakes the garage door for the side door.

Now, that's what's so confusing about 34 Fairview.

There are three doors at the front.

You've got the main front door, and then you've got a side door that opens straight up into the family living room.

And then you've got a garage door that opens straight into the garage.

They say that John O'Keefe went through, he thought he was going through the side door into the family room, but he ends up going in to the garage and he sees people, mainly Colin, engaging in and or selling drugs.

That's the theory.

Perhaps there are even large quantities of drugs stored in the garage to the point where the Brian Albert, he can't be like, I don't know what Colin's doing.

I don't know what he's doing in my garage.

And a fight ensues because nobody parks their car in the garage.

They say that they just use it for storage.

A fight ensues.

This is the theory.

And John O'Keefe is incapacitated.

Everyone, mostly Caitlin and the girls, are told to get out.

The biggest thing was, we know why the Alberts might want to lie.

We know why Jen McCabe might want to lie.

Why everybody on this board might want to lie.

But why are Julie Nagel, her brother Ryan Nagel, Sarah Levinson, why are they lying?

Because maybe they're also protecting themselves is this theory.

So mostly Caitlin and all the kids, the girls, they're told to get out while this is happening.

John O'Keefe is subdued.

Once everybody is out, he's transferred to the basement.

This is the internet theory.

This is what the netizen writes.

Chloe attacks because she smells blood.

John is beyond repair.

Things have gone too far.

Only option now is to move him to the yard and blame Chloe.

Chloe's the backup plan.

Unfortunately, Karen Reed makes herself a nice little pawn because she actually cares about her boyfriend, and the McAlberts take full advantage of that.

Some people have taken this conspiracy a step further to allege that that the drugs that we have no proof of being in the pizza shop that the drugs in the pizza shop are actually obtained through police stations and police investigations.

When officers confiscate drugs and do massive drug busts, it wouldn't be the first time that they take those drugs and then resell them for a profit because who's going to come after them?

The cops, they are the cops.

That is the conspiracy with zero proof.

Now, I don't think that this conspiracy would have gotten this far on the internet had it not been for the fact that August of 2023.

So, this is like a full year and a half after John O'Keefe passes, at a Canton select board meeting that this guy decides he's not going to show up to.

Chris Albert, one of the five selectmen, he's like, I'm going to sit this one out.

Chris Albert, he's not there.

However, a woman named Helena Rafferty is there.

Helena Rafferty is the new Canton police chief.

She replaces Kenneth Berkowitz.

Also, Kenneth Berkowitz dies.

Unrelated.

What?

He has a heart attack and he dies.

When?

Way after.

But he does retire the same year that John O'Keefe is found dead.

So John O'Keefe found dead?

After about six months, he retires.

And is there an investigation going on against him?

Like the FBI were onto him.

Yes.

We're on to everything.

Yes.

Huh.

Oh, but it gets weirder because Helena Rafferty, she becomes the new Canton police chief, the first female police chief.

Was she also, was she directly from the department as well?

Was she like transferred?

Oh no, all from Canton.

So they all know each other already?

Yes.

So she's the new police chief.

She also randomly retired recently.

Recently, when?

Like 2024.

While the case is still going on.

The trial is still going on.

Okay, so and then Kenneth passed away?

Yes, from a heart attack.

Heart attack when?

I think 2024.

Really?

Like no suspicions, nothing.

I don't think it was suspicious.

I don't think it's related to this case.

But what is suspicious is one of the last things he does on the job, which I'm going to go through later.

Now, Helena Rafferty takes over and she states in a meeting, I know it's been circulated that John O'Keefe had conversations with Canton police detectives related to drug activity in that neighborhood.

John O'Keefe, to give you some context, is a Boston police officer.

So he drives to Boston every day to go to work, 30 minutes.

But he lives in the city, in the town of Canton.

He reports that there's drug activity in Canton.

Now, does he report it to his boss in Boston?

No, because there's no jurisdiction.

So he goes to the detectives at Canton Police Department.

Who is a detective at the Canton Police Department?

Kevin Albert.

He went to Kevin Albert?

He was one of the people.

Huh.

And he tells them, hey, I think there's suspicious drug activity going on in Canton.

Mm-hmm.

And Helena Rafferty, the new police chief, says, Well, I'm here to confirm that John O'Keefe absolutely did reach out to Canton detectives related to drug activity in the neighborhood.

He reached out to the detective unit.

However, none, and let me repeat that none of John O'Keefe's well-documented correspondence with us included anyone alleged to be involved in this case.

Nobody believes her.

That's weird.

Okay.

What we're getting out of this is she did confirm that John O'Keefe told Kevin Albert and other Canton detectives that there is drug activity in this neighborhood.

And this is where it gets suspicious.

Chris Albert, Julie Albert, they had been neighbors with John O'Keefe for years.

They recently moved away.

But for years, they were two houses down.

They never got along with John O'Keefe.

They never really talked to him.

The day that John O'Keefe passes away, he goes to DE Pizza.

Some people think he's there to scope out what's going on.

He goes to DE Pizza, and that night, Chris Albert is the one to invite John O'Keefe to the Waterfall Bar.

Are you saying that he rarely goes to DNE?

Nobody really knows, but the fact that he went the day of, people think it's very strange.

Okay, another coincidence.

Another coincidence.

What's even more of a coincidence is when they get to Waterfall Bar, Karen Reed starts asking to go to DNE Pizza because she had heard that sometimes they open up after hours yeah to make a pizza okay so the order of event is on that day chris show up at dny in the morning of john o'keefe shows up for a meal for lunch with his nephew with his nephew right so chris met john o'keefee say hey my old neighbor we didn't like each other but come hang out with us tonight he says that they were friendly but there's evidence perhaps that they were not right right right yeah john shows up with karen yes To the waterfall bar.

To the waterfall bar.

And then Karen's like, oh, DNE,

should we go?

Can we go?

But they did it.

Like a different date.

Karen's saying, let's go another day.

No, let's go tonight.

Tonight.

Instead of going to 34 Fairview, let's go to DNE.

Oh,

okay.

And then they don't end up going.

They go to 34 Fairview, and John O'Keefe ends up dead.

So people think this is just too many coincidences in one.

It doesn't make any sense.

So this is where the theory comes comes into play that John O'Keeffe was killed inside the house.

We briefly went over it because there's multiple theories.

Some people think that the house is a house full of swingers and maybe John O'Keefe was confronted by Brian Higgins, Brian HaHa Higgins, about the conversations that he had with Karen Reed and all of that.

There are a lot of side theories, but I think if you look at the pictures of 34 Fairview, it's going viral on TikTok.

The Alberts officially lists their home for sale November 17th of 2022.

People start online studying these pictures to see if it's feasible.

A big running theory is that John goes into the house.

He's either in the garage where there is suspiciously this like paint spill, red paint that splattered all over the garage floor.

Some people think that the paint was poured on top of blood that had been scrubbed off.

Some people think it's just a paint spill.

Some people are like, we can't even confirm when this paint spill happened.

There's just a lot of, we're going to circle back to this.

Red paint?

Yeah, it's like a dark burgundy.

Huh.

Then I will see, is there a part of the house is that color?

Like, what are you using that color for, right?

I don't see anything that was that color in the colour.

Dark red.

Other people think that this occurred in the basement.

A fight breaks out in the basement in the workout room, which would explain the laceration to his head because

it could have been sustained from a dumbbell.

It could have been sustained from any of the heavy weights down there.

Regardless, all the theories end with John O'Keefe suffering a fatal injury to the back of his head.

Nobody thinks that any of this was premeditated.

In fact, a lot of the people that believe in the DNE theory, they believe that all these guys, they just want to beat John O'Keefe off.

That's their game plan.

And maybe it works with other cops.

You beat them up and you say, hey, so basically what's going to happen is you're going to shut up about this.

They make him feel fear.

That's the energy that people believe is existing inside of 34 Fairview Road that very night.

He suffers a fatal injury to the back of the head and everybody starts freaking out because it wasn't supposed to go this far.

Chloe, the German Shepherd, starts attacking John O'Keefe.

The residents and the partygoers ultimately freak out even more, and they decide that they're just going to lay his body on the front lawn, and they're going to blame the snowplow drivers.

They're going to say that John was drunk.

He gets out of Karen Reed's car.

Karen drives away, leaving him, which was a happy coincidence for them, and John gets hit by a snowplow.

People have died from getting hit by industrial city snowplows.

Okay.

He's drunk.

He didn't see the snowplow coming.

The snowplow driver at 3 a.m.

didn't see John and they hit him and he dies.

So they wait until the snowplow driver drives off, does their route of 34 Fairview.

Once they hear that snowplow go through, they move his body outside.

By the next morning, Karen inserts herself into the situation, thus giving them the perfect opening.

Again, this is all alleged.

Nothing has been proven.

That's the running theory of some internet users.

And they just need to know if it's feasible to bring John's body out of the basement without being seen by the neighbors.

The most popular theory comes from the basement opens into the backyard.

There's what they call bulkhead doors.

So it looks like one of those storm shelters.

It's like a plank of wood.

You know, when you are on the street in New York and you see those steel doors that open and then you walk down and it's the bottom of like the, it's kind of like that, but not as official.

It's just like a wooden door.

You lift it up.

There's a few steps and then a regular door.

You walk in and that's the basement.

When you get out of that, you're in the backyard.

You turn to the side.

There's a fence.

You open up that fence.

Directly in front of you is the flagpole.

And that is the darkest part of the whole property.

They believe that someone went, someone, one of these partygoers, parked a car on the side of the street.

Then the others came in through the back side door and dropped, dragged John O'Keefe's body towards the flagpole in the middle of the night, long after Karen Ardi went home.

But does the floor plan of the house make this theory feasible?

Some people are saying these are the wild cards.

All of Brian Albert's friends, because other than that, family has a reason to lie for family.

But what about Julie Nagel, Ryan Nagel, Sarah Levinson?

Why would they say, no, I didn't see John O'Keefe coming inside?

No, I didn't see anyone going to the basement.

Why would they say these things if you don't believe that they're involved in the drug theory?

Why would they lie?

It doesn't make sense.

Sarah Levinson is a nurse.

Why would she risk her career for any of these people?

Adding to the theory the most when you look at the floor plan of this house is that this is not an open concept first floor, which when everybody testifies, you almost envision it to be.

They're like, yeah, you walk in through the front door.

If I'm in the kitchen, I see everyone.

I see you in the living room.

I see you in the kitchen.

I see everybody.

That's not the case.

That's not the case at all.

The front door is like a vestible.

Okay, you walk in, and on your right is this small dining room.

And then to the left is a small entrance with the library, the study.

And then there's stairs leading right up to the front, like right in front of you.

There are stairs going upstairs.

And then behind it, there's a door that you open and it leads into the basement.

So there's stairs going down into the basement.

And then beyond that open door.

There's, wait, you're saying there's a door to the basement?

Yes.

to get into the stair, to go down into the basement.

And then if you were to keep that door open, behind that door is the small opening opening to the kitchen.

And these are small openings.

These are not massive grand arched entryways into each room.

These are door-sized openings.

So no, if you're in the kitchen, you might not even see if someone walks in.

You might not even see if someone goes into the basement if that basement door is kept open.

So all of these could justify why maybe some of Brian Albert Jr., Birthday Brian's friends, didn't see John O'Keefe that night if he were to have actually been in the house.

Netizens think this makes perfect sense, especially now with the Alberts selling the house.

The house had been in the Albert family for decades.

Albert, this Albert, Chris Albert, Kevin Albert, all of them grew up in that house and they just randomly decide to sell it.

Now, side note, if you do look at the purchase history, it says that this home was purchased in 2010.

That's not true.

Brian Albert purchased it from his parents in 2010.

It was owned by his parents before that.

Furthermore, there are rumors that Brian Albert filled the pool in his backyard before selling the house.

He filled it to the brim with concrete so that it's nearly impossible to go into the pool unless you have some sort of warrant.

Or even the amount of resources that it would go into digging up that pool.

Like how, but wait.

How legally exhausting would it be to fight something like that back and forth?

The rumors state that Brian Albert put bloody flooring from the basement into that pool, Chloe's body into that pool, because Chloe goes missing.

What?

Into that pool and then filled it in with concrete.

However, that doesn't make sense because, well, for one, the new owners would have every right to dig up that filled-in pool.

And with the attention that this case is getting, I'm sure someone out there with disposable income would be more than happy to even fund the operation of digging up what's in that pool and even paying for it, or even a contractor to do it for free attention to their services.

It doesn't make sense.

And it doesn't make sense.

And it's also not true.

Brian Albert did not fill up his pool.

However, his brother Tim Albert, Brian Albert's other brother that's not on this wall yet, he has been relatively quiet about this case.

Minus one social media post where Tim Albert, you know those like alpha male.

I'm so sorry.

Like okay.

I have so many questions.

Yes.

Okay.

So the pool.

Is it filled with concrete or is that is that a rumor?

At the Albert residence, it's not filled with concrete, but the rumor was that it was filled.

And where it got disconnected online is a different Albert pool was recently filled with concrete.

Ah, Tim Albert.

Yes.

Gotcha.

Not Brian Albert, but Tim Albert.

Okay, so these are just like rumors that's going around on social media.

Yeah, and they've kind of merged together, but there is a pool that's filled.

They are in the Albert family, but it is not Brian Albert's pool.

It's not 34 Fairview.

Right.

And Chloe is missing.

It depends on who you ask.

If you ask Brian Albert, he will tell you that Chloe has been rehomed to the state of Vermont, to a new owner all the way in Vermont.

If you ask anyone online, they might tell you that Chloe is dead.

Why would he rehome?

Chloe?

Like, that is pretty wild.

How old is Chloe?

They've had Chloe for seven years.

That is a weird time to rehome your dog.

Exactly.

Precisely.

Now, Tim Albert does make a social media post.

It's one of those like alpha male lion, black and white photos of a lion.

And on top of that lion are just words that read, I stand by my family 100%.

You don't fuck with them.

You fuck with them.

And I won't hesitate to make you the most miserable person.

What does Tim Albert do?

We don't know that much about Tim Albert.

He's not a cop.

However, he was involved in

a DUI,

in a little situation.

We're going to come back to Tim Albert.

Tim Albert's going to join the cast of characters.

He's going to be on this wall.

Timmy's not escaping this wall.

Okay.

Now, the pool is in his backyard.

It's completely filled in, and there's new grass planted on top, which is interesting because the timing is strange.

First of all, how did we find out he filled his pool?

And then, also, why do you feel your pool?

Tim Albert lives across the street from the Canton Police Department.

Tim Albert lives with the senior, senior Alberts, with their parents.

Oh, there's even older Alberts.

Yeah, and he lives in that house.

And that pool, people have taken pictures of that pool.

People have been watching the Albert family for a really long time.

There's actually one, um,

one person that we're going to get into in the next episode.

He's been like doing a lot of breaking coverage for this case, but he was one of the, I believe he was the first person to publicly state, and there were pictures provided, So it's not like he's just making things up.

Like, this is very real.

In front of Tim Albert's house, people were taking pictures.

You see the pool.

And then later on, you see it just patches.

It's all grassed up.

That's freaking crazy.

On top of that, the fence to the backyard looks like it's been opened up because whatever equipment they needed for concrete, it doesn't look like it had fit.

So they opened up the gate and the door is now bigger.

That is wild.

I just, I don't know why someone would fill in a pool.

I understand that maybe maintenance for a pool could be quite costly, but when you own a home, you try to maintain it.

But timing, though, when was it filled?

After this case?

Yes.

Recently.

That is so bizarre.

And it's not cheap to...

Like, concrete is expensive.

It's so expensive.

So expensive.

Yeah, we did a little bit of, it's so expensive.

Huh.

Yes, so expensive.

And I actually think it would be

cost to do that.

Yeah, how much it costs just to fill up a pool.

Even just to lay patches of grass on top these days, patches of grass have been expensive.

Don't ask me how much weird.

That is so weird.

Weird.

So there have been lots of rumors.

The strange part of all of this, though, is that the Zillow listing for the main Albert residence, 34 Fairview, it states, Have you been looking for a great house in a perfect neighborhood?

Well, here it is.

The home boasts a completely finished basement with a family room and exercise room.

But how is the basement finished when the flooring is just a random puzzle of unfinished plywood that doesn't even match, I would hardly call that finished.

It's probably the second worst thing that you can find on the flooring of someone's basement.

And the worst thing would be blood.

And that is where the pool comes in.

Because there's the unanswered questions.

Let's say hypothetically the Alberts were to rip up the basement flooring because maybe there was some random dark liquidy substance that they didn't want on there.

Where would they get rid of these massive planks of flooring?

Would they just trash it?

Or would they, I don't know, put it inside of a giant hole in the ground that used to be filled with water and then fill that up with concrete and throw patches of grass on top of it to make it disappear?

That is the netizen theory.

However, that still does not explain a lot of things in this case.

If this theory is true, that would mean that Karen Reed has nothing to do with John O'Keefe's death.

But then, how would you explain all the tiny pieces of her taillight that were found on the Albert property near John's body?

Okay, so you're saying that her taillight is next to John's body?

Yeah, there's just taillights everywhere on the front property.

Everywhere.

Is it?

Everywhere.

In his body?

Like, Jag, like, is it...

There are microscopic fragments of the taillight embedded in his clothing,

but

just take everything with a grain of salt.

Okay, but we're going to get into that.

There are a group of people, albeit small, albeit Albert, okay, just kidding, albeit small, there are a group of people out there that believe that Karen Reed is a thousand percent guilty.

They argue Karen Reed is guilty.

She's also the one that found him.

Furthermore, she's clearly an unstable, dishonest person.

She was probably afraid that her cheating would be discovered that night from Brian Higgins and bursted into another one of her unpredictable rages before John had the opportunity to go into that house.

Yes, the police were shady.

I simply don't think that they wanted their personal lives unearthed and affecting their career.

I don't like shady cops as much as the next guy, but these guys didn't frame her.

Maybe they used corrupt tactics to make sure she was found guilty, but at the end of the day, she's guilty.

Which I will say, anything that reads, quote, maybe they used corrupt tactics to make sure she's found guilty should be a massive red alarm.

But I digress.

There are people that hate Karen Reed.

Some argue, it's not even that I hate her.

Do I think she did it?

Yeah.

Did that mean that she meant to do it or she was aware that she did it based off of her intoxication?

No.

Do I think that this was also the worst police work riddled with conflicts of interest?

Also, yes.

Others say, it's crazy to me how in casual conversation, police corruption is a very rational idea, but in court, police corruption is irrational and absurd and it's a conspiracy.

So people are very divided.

And amongst the divided group of the ones that do think Karen Reed did it, are obviously the Mick Alberts, but also John O'Keefe's own family and friends.

One of John's childhood friends says, the defense theory has so many problems.

If you're going to suggest that people in the house are part of a conspiracy and it was a grand plan, why would you put Johnny's body still alive, mind you, on your front lawn?

There are a set of train tracks behind their house, behind the Albert residence.

That's a better place.

You don't have to be a genius criminal to figure out that.

They're just saying it doesn't make any sense.

They say nothing points to anything and anyone other than Karen Reed.

John O'Keefe wanted to be a police officer because his grandfather was one.

He told everybody he wanted to be one of the good ones.

His family say while other people were trying to figure out where they belonged in the world, he knew he wanted to be a cop.

His grandfather's a cop.

It was kind of in his DNA.

There was never an ounce of fear with that job from him.

We grew up in Braintree, which is middle-class suburb, heavy Irish, heavy Italian, and Johnny was both.

A friend of John says that she met him decades ago, and she says, I remember I asked him what he did for a living, and he was in the police academy.

I kind of made a joke, like, oh no, police officer.

And he said, no, no, no.

I'm the good kind.

I want to be a cop because my grandfather was a cop.

Side note, his grandfather's police badge was 490.

John requested that exact badge number, but because it was retired, he just added a two.

So his was 2490.

Nine years prior to John being found deceased, his older sister, Kristen Furbush, passed away with a brain tumor.

She left behind a daughter and a son.

And it's said that John was incredibly devastated.

They were really, really close.

And John starts making all these plans with his brother-in-law, Stephen.

He's like, I'm going to move in.

I'm going to help you raise these kids, my niece and my nephew, because my sister is gone and these are her children.

But before John can even move in, just two months after John's sister passes away, Stephen, his brother-in-law, passes away from a heart attack.

So the kids, they end up losing both parents in the span of two months.

John's friend says, it wasn't even a thought.

John was like, I'm taking the kids.

He said, I think my sister would like it.

I think she'd be proud of me.

I'm super close to the kids anyway, and I want to do this.

He goes from being a single guy, a cop, to now being this uncle slash dad, which, side note, the police, the Boston police force even let him work a desk roll so that he could have more stable hours to help take care of the kids.

Everyone in Canton seemed to know what he was doing.

Everybody wants to help.

But it's also, I imagine, kind of hard to date.

You've got two kids.

Now all of your new friends, that's how he gets close with Jen McCabe and Carrie Roberts because they have kids that are friends with his niece and nephew.

Suddenly, he's like a soccer dad.

And you've got all these now parents that are most likely married with children.

You're a single dad slash uncle.

You're in a very specific situation.

That's not to say that John wasn't dating.

It's said that he actually dated a lot of girls, but not a lot of serious relationships.

So during the pandemic, John reaches out to a few of his ex-girlfriends.

I don't know if he's sending a mass email or the same message, or if he's just like everyone bored from the lockdowns, but he reaches out to Karen Reed.

They dated back in 2005.

Karen says that she met John O'Keefe at a birthday party and she says, he was handsome.

He was sweet.

And I mean, I was 24.

So that was about the criteria at the time.

Oh, wow.

From young, long time ago.

From all accounts, it seems like they had a cute summer romance.

Karen went to Ireland to work, and now she's back in town for the lockdowns.

She gets a Facebook message from John that reads, Hey, Blast from the Past, how are things?

Karen says, I didn't answer it right away because I saw a picture of him with a bunch of kids, and I thought, oh, he looks like he's married and he's got kids.

And then I ended up reaching back out to him.

And then I learned the backstory of where those kids came from.

And I knew that John loved his sister more than anyone or anything.

And he loved those kids.

I didn't really aspire to have kids, but I cared about John's kids.

Karen's got her own house about 20 minutes from Canton so she would drive and stay with John maybe three to four times a week.

Now, side note, Karen teaches finance.

She's an asset manager and at night she teaches university kids about, I think, capital games.

And she works from home.

So John's niece and nephew, they also have to do remote learning.

John's a cop.

He doesn't have the ability to work from home.

So most of the days Karen would go to John's house, work from home, and then give the kids lunch, take care of them while John's not home because he's a cop.

And then every day she's working from home just doing this.

She's like a second parental figure.

She says, I've never been married.

I don't have kids.

I don't like envision myself having like a white picket fence bullshit.

Is that what she said?

Yeah.

And when it comes to marriage, she says, I would have considered it strongly for John, but it's not ever something that I've aspired to do.

Some people are going to say goals.

Other people say it's very bleak, which to give you some context to that, Karen.

Must be

a law for the small town.

Yeah.

Right?

I will say Karen is a very headstrong woman.

There are a lot of netizens who think that many of these mothers were very jealous of Karen

because Karen is cool.

She's a single woman.

She doesn't really care to have a traditional family in a traditional house and be a soccer mom.

She also seems like, whether you like it or not, she seems a little crazy.

She seems like she knows a good time.

She also seems like she's fun with the boys, like she'll drink a beer.

She sounds outspoken, too.

Is she?

Very outspoken.

I forgot what movie.

Like, there's several movies like that.

Like, the one I remember is like the Nicole Kimmen movie.

Like,

woman, this woman coming to the small town.

She's like opposite of everyone, and then everyone just go crazy.

Everyone just like ends up hating her.

It's the vibe a lot of netizens think is happening in this town.

But Karen has recently been diagnosed with Crohn's disease.

She also does have MS, which Jen McCabe also has.

But before she gets that message from John on Facebook during the pandemic, she had gone through 10 surgeries within an 18-month period.

So I can see how she doesn't care about the white picket fence bullshit.

She's just trying to get through these obstacles.

It's been reported that John and Karen bond over the fact that, yeah, maybe life has not been going according to plan for either of us.

They start dating.

Two sisters are called to testify during Karen Reed's first trial: Laura Sullivan and Marietta Sullivan.

They are the two sisters that were present on the New Year's Eve trip that Karen told Brian Higgins about.

Brian HaHa Higgins.

Remember, she was like, he was like, did they bang?

Question mark.

Do you remember that?

Yeah.

Yes.

So those were the women that one of them

was flirting with or had a thing with.

Everybody has a different opinion about what happened in Aruba.

Okay.

Because everybody's got a, there's no, I can't find a single fact or story that everyone in the small town of Canton is like, you know what?

That's what happened.

I don't know why everybody needs to have a different opinion about every single event, but that's the case with Aruba.

Interesting.

And that happened in like 2021.

No, this happened recently.

So just 29 days before John's passing, they go to Aruba.

Oh,

okay.

They go to Aruba 29 days before John's passing, and they had John was there, Karen was there, the kids were there, and there were a big group of small town friends that were there.

60 people ended up going.

How do they all know each other?

Well, John's best friend/slash partner in the Boston police force was a guy named Pat.

He was the father of Laura Sullivan's child.

So John's Boston cop partner is Pat.

Pat and Laura Sullivan are dating and she ends up getting getting pregnant with his child.

But before she even gives birth, Pat ends up self-exiting.

And this is, this was like eight years before Aruba.

Now, John was Laura's child's godfather.

He was very involved in the child's life.

Laura testifies he was the first person in my delivery room after I gave birth.

He was a constant connection to Pat because they were best friends.

He was always just making sure that my son was taken care of in the sense of being there to tell him stories about his relationship with Pat.

So now, eight years later, John, Karen, the kids, they're going to this Aruba trip, and Karen asks for two rooms.

Karen wants her own bathroom.

She wants her own space.

The prosecutors are going to make it look like, see, Karen is so needy.

Karen is so crazy.

She's just doing too much.

But in reality, I mean, she's got Crohn's disease.

She has a lot of difficulties using the restroom.

I think, likely due to her medical condition, she just wants her own space.

Their rooms are not directly in front of each other because it's just hard.

They're on opposite ends of this hotel.

When you say two rooms, are you saying Karen one room?

John and the two niece one room?

Uh, one niece, one nephew.

Yes.

So John and the kids are going to be in one room.

Karen's going to have her own room.

But the whole trip in Aruba, Karen's taking care of the kids.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I mean, I don't think that's bad.

Like, there's otherwise there's four people and she needs her own space.

Exactly.

So they end up on opposite ends of this.

pretty small hotel.

I mean, it's fine.

Laura says this was her first time meeting Karen, and she she just remembers Karen walking up to her, giving her a big hug, smiling that she's heard so much about her.

And it is so strange.

I do think a lot of netizens have some negative opinions about the Sullivan sisters.

I wouldn't go as far to say that because we don't know really anything about the Sullivan sisters.

I will say though, it is very interesting how the prosecution keeps calling all these witnesses to the stand.

And they all inadvertently make Karen look better.

And because it's also the way they say it.

The Sullivan sisters are like, yeah, it was my first time meeting her.

She came up to me, gave me a big hug.

It almost seems like they're trying to make it sound neutral, but it sounds positive.

It's a friend's birthday that night.

So the group of them, they go out to dinner and Laura is asked what happens there.

And

again, everyone's assuming something bad is going to happen.

But she says Karen had paid the bill prior to us receiving it.

And what if any reaction did you or anyone have in that instance?

The entire table was kind of taken aback and said it wasn't necessary, wanted to Venmo or give cash or something along those lines, and she declined, said that she was honored to be here and wanted to pay for it.

A lot of netizens thought, again, this part was weird because some say it's giving mean friend energy.

The way that it's said, people have been analyzing that.

I mean, to be fair, they are testifying at the trial.

I don't know what you expect them to do, to just like smile and giggle through it.

I don't know.

I mean, maybe I would because I'm so nervous, but it seems like they're just trying to be as neutral as possible.

But a lot of people are saying, that sounds like an amazing first impression.

Why are they even bringing this up?

However, Laura's little sister, Marietta, not nearly as good of a first impression of Karen Reed.

She gets up in the stand and Marietta says that she ends up flying into Aruba a little later than her sister.

And when she first arrives at the hotel, she's busy saying hi to everybody.

I mean, clearly she knows John.

That's her nephew's godfather.

Marietta says he was similar to a big brother to me.

Somebody that was there during my sister's darkest time.

So I really respected respected him for that.

She ends up running into him in the lobby the first night after dinner.

And she says that John O'Keefe is stumbling into the lobby.

She had just gotten out of the elevator.

John O'Keeffe is alone and Marietta says, I was like, whoa, are you okay?

I actually said, whoa, Godfather, are you okay?

But yeah, he was stumbling into the lobby.

She says that she goes up to him and gives him a hug.

She says that he was glassy-eyed, looking above me.

We never made eye contact.

It was like he was looking above me.

It looked like he was looking for someone.

I asked him, Where are you going?

Assuming that he would be coming to the pool bar to meet all of us.

So I guess all the friends were there.

He kept looking around and he indicated that he was going that way and pointed toward a bank of rooms to our right.

And I said, Well, you should go that way.

And I stepped back and I guided him toward the area that he was going.

He walked off.

I continued out to the pool bar where I heard very loudly his name screamed across the lobby very angrily and it made me stop in my tracks.

So I turn around to go back in and I'm going back in.

I hear hear someone yell, who the fuck was that?

And as I come around the corner, I see Mr.

Keefe walking toward a woman and they were, and he said, excuse me.

He said, calm down.

That's Laura's little sister.

I said, hi, nice to meet you.

And that's when Miss Reed had snapped up and she very loudly told me to go fuck myself across the lobby.

And I said, yeah, fuck you too, and walked away.

This was my first interaction with her.

I had never been fully introduced to her at all.

She was just very loud.

She was very energetically screaming at me to go fuck myself.

She was waving with her hands.

Johnny was trying to calm her down.

And after I said, yeah, fuck you too, I went out to the pool bar and I didn't see much after that.

I went straight to my sister Laura and I looked at her and I said, Johnna Keep's girlfriend.

And she looked at me and said, Karen?

And I said, yeah, you guys like her?

She said, yeah, she's okay.

And I said, well, she sucks.

Laura, Marietta's sister, says that she wants to talk to John about the whole thing.

So it seems like obviously Laura and John are closer.

So Laura wants to talk about her sister.

Yeah, what happened?

And she says, quote, I said, what's going on?

And he said, nothing.

I said, did Edda, Marietta, and Karen have words?

He said, I don't know.

And I said, well, that's not what Marietta said.

And I asked him if everything was okay.

And at the time, his phone was lighting up and it looked like calls, text messages, calls, text messages.

And it said, Karen on his phone.

I asked him if he needed to take it.

And he said, yeah, she's crazy.

I got to take care of this.

Laura says throughout the entire trip, he just didn't seem like himself.

She says, quote, he seemed distant.

I asked if he was okay and he just kind of shrugged it off and I said, are you happy?

And he kind of just rolled his eyes and I said something along the lines of life's too short to not be happy.

And he goes, well, Laura, it is what it is.

I said, do you want to talk about it?

And he was like, not really.

Eventually, Laura says that John tells her, well, apparently I made out with your sister the other night, according to Karen.

Side note, it has been debated whether or not they did make out.

Both the sisters kind of state that they never made out.

Some netizens feel like like they have mean girl energy, and if Marietta did kiss John, she could have easily said no.

Additionally, she had a boyfriend that night or that time, so she could have lied.

Wait, this is all from, you know, you know, how Karen was telling Brian Higgins that John was making out with a girl.

And the sisters are saying that was the incident in the elevator.

They're just walking out, exchange words.

But Karen thought, either thinking something happened or whatever.

That's it.

That was all the sisters are saying.

Yeah.

Wow.

Yeah.

I mean, some say the way that Marietta describes hugging John, it feels very intimate.

To notice that he's like looking above her while they're hugging.

It just, I don't know.

Some people, the way that she says that she testifies sounds more intimate.

People have been really dissecting it.

Either way, Karen ends up believing that they did kiss at some point.

And then she ends up believing that she believed it wrong.

Now, another thing to note that could indicate why Karen was so angry is Karen was in the hotel room room taking care of the niece and nephew while John was out getting drunk.

So that might have led her to believe that he was out doing something that he shouldn't have been doing, and she caught him in the act.

Later, Karen pulls Laura aside and she says, hey, I'm sorry.

I thought I saw something that I didn't and I would like to pay for some of your sister's room.

Really?

Yeah, Laura testifies, I said it's absolutely not necessary.

Just an apology will do.

Wow.

The prosecutor asks her, did she persist in wanting to pay for that room?

She did.

She just said, I'll apologize, but something along the lines of, I want to pay for some of her room.

Could I just get her room number, please?

I don't remember if I gave her the room number or not.

I really don't know.

Obviously, this Aruba incident was a big deal for Karen.

She was texting ATF Brian about it, and she sounds really hurt, which is why netizens are confused why the sisters were called to testify.

I mean, they have no connection with the alleged crime, the alleged charges.

Additionally, some netizens feel like it actually validated Karen's side more.

But nevertheless, that was the beginning of 2022.

28 days later, John O'Keefe and Karen, they get into another fight.

Wayfair makes it easy to love being in your space again.

Whether you're working with a tiny apartment or a huge house, whether your style is minimalistic chic or organized chaos, which I think is mine, Wayfair has something that'll work.

Plus, and this is huge, they deliver everything for free.

Even the big stuff like couches that typically come with $200 something delivery fees, not at Wayfair.

Sofas, dining tables, bed frames, desks, and more ships free.

You guys know my summer hobby was pickleball and I'm going to keep playing, of course.

But I think this fall, my new focus is going to be reading.

I just love a good book nook where it's cozy and just away from the chaos of everything where I can escape into whatever book I'm reading.

So with Wayfair's beanbag chair lounger and diffusers, I can achieve peace and quiet.

Plus the beanbag came straight to my door.

So there were no awkward moments of trying to shove it in my trunk in a parking lot, which was huge.

Get organized, refreshed, and back to routine for way less.

Head to Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home.

That's w-a-y-f-a-i-r.com.

Wayfair, every style, every home.

From the producers of the Tinder Swindler, Jesse sits down to tell his side of the story.

A shocking true story of an allegedly fake story that some now say might just be a true story, featuring interviews with police, lawyers, journalists, investigators who claim to have uncovered new evidence evidence about this case, and with Jesse himself.

This compelling documentary invites the audience to decide for themselves who is telling the truth about Jesse Smollett.

The truth about Jesse Smollette launches on August 22nd, only on Netflix.

It is a niche but unescapable feeling.

I call it the grocery run.

It's the grocery panic where you have to throw on mismatching shoes to run outside, help your mom, or help your partner carry in all the bags of groceries.

Or it's like when you try to carry in as many bags as physically possible so you only have to make one trip.

We've all been there, but the grocery panic doesn't have to be this reoccurring thing.

When life is full, time is tight, Instacart helps you stay on track.

Instacart is more than a grocery app.

It's a care company that works around your schedule.

You can get groceries, household essentials delivered in as fast as 30 minutes.

Whether you're hosting a barbecue, getting back from a trip, or juggling back to school chaos, I mean there's so much chaos going on all the time.

With reliable shoppers and a platform you can count on, Instacart delivers quality and convenience without cutting corners.

I especially love Instacart whenever I'm hosting for my family.

I can get all of my groceries, even my cooking ingredients, cakes.

If we're celebrating, I can get all of that plus candles delivered to my front door.

I don't have to make a ton of different trips from the car to the kitchen, back and forth, and save my energy for the fun parts.

Download the Instacart app and use code RottenMango20 to get $20 off your first order of $80 or more.

That's code RottenMango20 to get $20 off your first order of $80 or more.

Offer valid for a limited time, excludes restaurants.

Additional terms apply.

The morning of January 28th.

The date.

Technically the date,

Karen and John, they start arguing.

And it's mainly because Karen took John's niece.

to Dunkin' and Donuts for breakfast.

Karen says, he thought I spoiled them.

I was miffed because it was just in the essence of saving time.

I would say the arguments that we've had, this was probably one of the unfair ones.

So I got my backup more than I normally did.

And it sounds kind of like an unbelievable fight.

But a close friend of John's does state that John would complain about Karen.

And what would he complain about?

Quote, I did hear him complain about when Karen would buy very nice things for the kids.

He wouldn't like that.

Stuff like that.

Buy very nice things.

Mm-hmm.

Or take the kids to get their nails done or something like that.

He didn't like it.

Huh.

Which a lot of netizens, again, are saying, wait, how is this helping the Commonwealth case?

Because so we're just mad that Karen has financial resources and she is using them on not even her own kids.

Exactly.

There's a text from Karen Reed to John O'Keefe, read, January 28th, 2022, 9.49 a.m.

You really hurt me this time.

John responds, I'm sorry, this has been an issue with me for eight years.

It physically hurts me to see everyone else in their lives, the kids' lives, do things for them and I'm forced to always be the bad guy.

Which, while I can see how frustrating that is for John just on a human level, a lot of Nizams also argue, but that's not Karen's fault because Karen is not their parent, is not their guardian, is not their parental figure.

And if anything, she's being nice to the kids.

In fact, a lot of people say that the kids loved Karen and that actually caused a lot of strain in their relationship.

Karen responds, I am not the same as everyone else.

Most of the time, I try to do what is healthy and smart for them.

More importantly, I try to support you and what you need.

You just lashed out at me and said terrible things.

I don't know how you've gotten to this point with me when I'm just trying my hardest.

You made your point and you continue to beat me down.

I have a lot going on too.

Physically, I'm falling apart and trying to get answers and help.

I'm just your girlfriend.

I'm not a perfect parent.

I'm trying very hard and sometimes treat them nothing like I used to.

So a lot of people think it indicates that.

Maybe prior she would make a lot of meals that were maybe healthier.

John responds, I know.

I'm sorry for lashing out.

I'm just hurting and struggling daily with them.

Always feel like I'm failing at this parenting thing.

I wasn't built for this.

Karen responds, Niece, the niece's name redacted, isn't perfect, but everything wonderful about her is because of you.

I know she's her mother's daughter, but she wouldn't be so bright and successful if she lived with anyone else.

These are the morning of?

Yeah.

Wow.

Karen's texting him not to lose faith in the kids or himself.

And she says, life can pick you up sometimes.

Please be happy with them and put away your frustrations for the rest of the day and just be so proud of yourself, JJ.

But later in the day, I think Karen has some time to stew about it.

She thinks about it a little bit and she responds: I feel pretty shitty about how this morning went down.

I know you said sorry, but it really stung, especially when I've been trying pretty hard lately.

I feel like a loser turning around, just coming back over to the house after everything you said.

John responds, not sure what else you want me to do.

I said, I'm sorry, and I was out of line.

If you prefer to stay home, I totally get it.

Things in my own life have been difficult too, you know.

I know.

A lot of people think that the text messages, some netizens don't think it puts John O'Keefe in the best light either.

Um, I guess he does consistently brush her off when she wants to talk about how hard she's trying, and she does have her own struggles as well.

And other times, when she's trying to communicate, he's very standoffish.

And I think a lot of people think that adds to the statement that Jen McCabe said, which is that all the women in these little soccer PTA mom groups think that Karen Reed is just a glorified babysitter.

Karen says, tell me if you're interested in someone else.

I can't think of any other reason you've been like this.

Nope, things haven't been great between us for a while.

Ever consider that?

Kids are here.

I'm not in the mood to talk.

So you're not into it anymore?

That's fine, but I don't want to keep trying and you keep treating me like this.

I'm trying to kiss and hug you this morning and you whack me in the face with a pillow.

He says, sick of always arguing and fighting.

It's been weekly for several months now.

So yeah, I'm not as quick to jump back into being Lovey-Dovey as you, apparently.

It appears that Karen tries to get in contact with him by calling him non-stop.

I don't know what non-stop means, but he says, OMG, stop calling.

I've explained it a few times already.

I'm not doing it again.

So you're not into this anymore?

Not into fighting all the time, correct.

If you tell me you're interested in someone else, you will never hear from me again.

You can have all the space in the world.

He just responds in caps, I'm not answering.

Stop calling.

She texts him, I'm going to grab a drink in a bit.

Can you please answer?

John responds, no, Karen.

Not sure why you need to announce that you're grabbing a drink, but have fun.

She says, seeing if you want to meet me later.

Again, a lot of people say that these texts give the impression that Karen just really wanted attention from John, and that could explain why she was reaching out to Brian HaHa-Higgins.

It seems like she just wanted John to...

Show her some sort of

I mean the logic is coherent.

I'm not saying it's the right thing to do.

She later texts John O'Keefe, frustrated, I've been dealing with my own personal crisis over things that I have zero control over.

I'd like to lean on you too sometimes.

Instead, I just hear everything I've done wrong.

She also states that she doesn't want to go meet him at the house right now because she feels like the second she walks in, the niece and nephew are going to get chatty with her.

And, quote, that's going to irritate you.

So, again, which further, I mean, at this point in the text message, he doesn't disprove the theory.

Wait, she's saying that if the nieces are showing like interest in Karen, like getting close, like, you know, being friendly, that's going to irritate John O'Keefe.

I don't think it's just the fact that they're probably friendly with Karen Reed.

It's the fact that they probably think that John O'Keefe is the bad guy, the bad cop,

and she's the fun one.

And they're going to be like, You're fun, unlike JJ.

And maybe they say stuff like that.

I don't know.

You know?

So, I mean, there was another incident where Karen said that the kids had gone onto vacation with John O'Keefe's parents.

When they get back, they they hugged Karen first.

And that was kind of a situation in their relationship.

I think that maybe some netizens are saying it also adds to the dynamic of the fact that these are not his kids.

If they were his kids, he'd probably be a lot happier that maybe his kids even like his partner more than they like him.

Because that's what teenagers do.

But I think it's the fact that he was also...

their uncle, their fun uncle for the longest time.

Fascinating.

And then now he's, I don't know, right?

But Karen states that John would get a little upset over things like this.

Side note: in the text messages, there are conversations about a water heater that was not working at Karen's house.

And it's interesting because, again, when you read these messages, some people interpret it as, God, Karen Reid is so annoying.

She's so needy, so high maintenance.

Others think John is just kind of mean towards her and not really showing her basic appreciation.

He just, the only reason he even invites her to C.F.

McCarthy's that night is because he tells her straight up, his friend is going home, so he needs a ride, essentially.

And again, this does not really help the prosecution.

In fact, it just shows that Karen Reed wants a healthy relationship.

If she's not getting it, she would just rather John tell her and they can move on.

That's the vibe.

And it also seems like she likes him more than he likes her, which would mean that her outburst of believing that he's cheating on her doesn't seem so far left field.

One netizen comment reads, to be honest, I expected the text to be really bad.

Thus far, I just see a lot of standard couple bullshit.

Karen says this fight was pretty rough.

She ends up calling her dad that day before going to C.F.

McCarthy's and then Waterfall and then 34 Fairview.

She's at her house and she just says, my father just gently said to me, Karen, why don't you stay home tonight?

It's going to snow anyway.

But I didn't.

And she says, dad, if I had listened to you, none of this would have happened.

Because now John is being rushed to the Good Samaritan Hospital, and the likelihood of him surviving is very slim.

His body temperature is at 80 degrees Fahrenheit or 26.7 degrees Celsius, which means multiple organs are already shutting down.

A paramedic does mention when someone's hypothermic and in cardiac arrest, we can't declare them dead or passed on until they've been warmed up.

A lot of times with hypothermic patients, they can appear to be dead when they're actually still alive.

So there have been instances where people have woken up in the morgues that were hypothermic and when their body is warmed up a little bit.

So we have to be very cautious, very careful about treating them as much as we can.

But that doesn't seem to be the case here.

There is a fatal laceration to the back of John O'Keefe's head that has caused multiple skull fractures and bleeding in the brain.

John O'Keeffe will pass in the hospital while Karen is two doors down on the same floor, losing her mind.

Karen gets section 12 in that same hospital.

She says, while at this scene, she calls her mom, she calls her dad, her brother.

Nobody's answering.

She's freaking out.

Eventually, her dad calls her back.

And in this emotional, distraught state, Karen tells her dad she does not want to exist anymore.

He is so nervous for his daughter.

He calls the police to make sure that they're making sure she's not trying to do anything.

Like the Kempton Police Department?

Yes, and they section 12 her because, you know, his trust in the police was very high at this point.

Could you explain section 12 for?

It's like a psych evaluation.

So she's forced to go to the hospital, go through a mental evaluation to make sure that she's not going to self-exit and be a harm to herself and or to other people.

She ends up two doors down from John.

John's parents are driven to the hospital by Carrie Roberts.

So after leaving the scene, she actually drives back to the scene.

It's very complicated.

She and Karen leave 34 Fairview together.

And then the officer calls Carrie Roberts and is like, you got to bring Karen back because we got a Section 12 her.

So then she drives back to 34 Fairview.

Karen gets ambulance to the hospital, Section 12.

Carrie Roberts then goes to pick up John O'Keeffe's mom and dad, Peggy, and they drive to the hospital.

And Peggy O'Keeffe, John's mother, says, we started walking down the corridor of the hospital.

And as I'm walking down, I hear Karen Reed yell, Peg, is he dead?

Is he dead?

Peg, Peg, is he dead?

And I just kept walking.

And then I asked, I don't know if it was a nurse or a worker.

I just asked, what is she doing here?

And she says, oh, she's being psych evaluated.

To which Peggy is later asked by prosecutor Brennan, special prosecutor Brennan, right here.

He's the prosecutor for trial number two.

Yes, and he's a special prosecutor, so he's not a DA.

He's brought in specifically for this case, and he's paid like half a million dollars.

Sharper than Lally, I will say, but

still kind of...

His nickname online is Spanky.

Spanky?

Because his name is Hank.

Hank.

Spanky.

Yeah, they call him Spanky.

That's it.

Just because his name is Hank?

I think it's Special Prosecutor.

Ah.

Hank.

And I think it's supposed to

be not the nicest nickname.

Spanky.

Got it.

Yeah.

To which Peggy is asked later by Spanky.

So when she was yelling, could she describe her mood or demeanor?

Was she animated?

She was loud.

I don't know.

She was just loud as she was saying it.

Paul O'Keefe, John's brother, will also later testify that Karen screamed at him too, to which Paul at this point blows Karen a kiss and walks off with his family.

This blowing of the kiss has been interpreted in drastically different ways depending on the netizen.

Some people think that it's just him trying to show her love in a very difficult situation where everything is falling apart.

Others say it's kind of weird.

You know, I don't know.

Now, a firefighter later testifies that it appeared to him that Karen was showing signs consistent of having gone through a traumatic experience, rapid, repetitive speech, and it's been said that she was freaking out about how she was going to take care of the kids.

So she might have felt some sort of responsibility there.

Karen's brother says when Karen finds out that John is gone, she does lose it for a little bit, but within a short period of time, she finds a way out.

She says, By the time I finally get out of the hospital, right before noon, I said, Dad, I want to go see the kids.

So, Karen, her dad, and her brother, they all drive to John O'Keefe's house, where John's parents, John's brother, John's father, his niece and nephew are all there.

And Karen says, I hugged his dad and his niece, greeted his brother and his mother.

I knew they had just identified the body, and I said, Paul, which is John's brother, Paul, what did he look like?

What happened?

And he said, my brother looks like he went five rounds with Tyson.

Looks like he got beat up.

Paul would later say about looking at his brother.

He was pretty banged up.

His eyes had swelled up.

He had a breathing tube in, or a mask anyway.

Blood coming down his nose, blood coming down his mouth.

What really stood out to me were the eyes.

It was almost as if there were ping-pong balls under his eyelids.

They were that swollen.

However, Karen states John's mom clearly doesn't agree.

She claims John's mom, quote, and his mother leaned over the kitchen island and says to me, I think he looks like he got hit by a car.

I think he looks like he got hit by a car.

And I'm like, wait a minute, were you both looking at the same body?

That's what Karen says.

Karen eventually goes upstairs to grab her things and she just she knew immediately the whole thing felt off.

That's why she doesn't end up staying a long time.

Karen's dad and brother are also there and Karen's brother says after a couple of minutes John's brother gets a phone call.

He leaves the room and when he comes back the way he looked at my sister, it was like time stopped.

Oxygen left that room at that point, and there was some serious looks of guilt being thrown at Karen, subsequently at my father and I as well.

Karen says, I could read the room.

I could tell that I wasn't wanted there.

She really was not.

Later, Peggy O'Keeffe testifies, I never should have let them go upstairs, but at that time, I just couldn't think straight, and I really didn't have anybody else to help them down in the kitchen, you know?

So I don't know what they got up there, what they did.

So Peggy's saying, I shouldn't have let Karen upstairs that day.

Peggy also states that she doesn't remember ever saying anything to Karen along the lines of accusing her of hitting him with his, with her car, but I don't know.

One of John's closest friends also states, we had no details at this point.

I immediately called Johnny's brother Paul and Paul started to fill in some of the gaps.

Everyone liked Karen and everything changed on the morning of the 29th.

And everyone thought, if she did this, she's going to be held responsible for it.

And at this point, we didn't necessarily think that Karen hit him on purpose.

We just know that something happened, she hit him, and she left.

One of John's friends compares it to Karen needs to fall on the sword if this is what she did.

They just want her to admit it, show remorse, and they can move on.

But as the trial goes on, they change their minds and they say, quote, this is quite literally a murder carnival.

And it's as though Karen is the happiest murder defendant in America, walking a red carpet on her way into her own murder trial.

That's weird.

What What changed?

They truly believe that Karen did it, and they think that all these conspiracies are just heinous conspiracies crafted by the defense to they think that Karen did it on accident at first.

And then they're like, if she is trying this hard to make up all these, quote, lies and conspiracies and brainwash the media, then that means that she might have done it on purpose.

And there are things that maybe they just can't justify.

Like the fact that a tiny piece of John O'Keeffe's hair is found on the bumper of Karen Reed's car.

Now, some argue, yeah, well, that's not really that abnormal.

I mean, John O'Keeffe, like Karen Reed would park her car in John O'Keefe's garage.

This is not, this is not completely unheard of.

Other people say the fact that the hair was found on her car should already be alarming.

Because at this point, her car has been driven around a blizzard.

It's been towed from police station to a house.

It's towed everywhere.

And people are confused.

Quote, you're going to tell me a hair stays on the bumper throughout the entire 60 miles back and forth through a blizzard and you're going to find a tiny hair on the bumper?

That doesn't make sense.

Other things that don't make sense?

Well, you've got Michael Proctor.

To have a stellar performance review for work is a very hard endeavor.

If you've never had a bad mark on your employee performance review in 12 years, you might as well brag about it too, saying, quote, I've never had a single complaint.

I've never been the subject of any disciplinary actions.

All my employee evaluations are either outstanding or excellent.

That's what Michael Proctor testifies to.

But, sir, quit playing.

We know exactly what you've done.

Trooper Proctor is up on the witness stand.

And for my audio listeners, he looks like a freshly boiled egg.

There's not really a more eloquent way to describe his features, though.

Proctor is a witness and one of the lead investigators on the case of the death of John O'Keefe.

He's sitting at the witness stand looking like a defendant.

I mean, he might as well be.

He's fighting for his life.

He tries to win the jury over with the fact that he's been doing this job for 10 years.

And everyone's like, that's actually terrifying.

Five years with the homicide unit.

Again, we're scared.

Several homicide schools he's attended.

That's what he calls them, homicide schools.

He also has experience working in narcotics.

A lot of people are like lots of cops with access to drugs.

He was on a shift when the call comes in that there was a male party discovered on the snow outside of a residence.

That's what he says he was told.

He wasn't told anything else.

Canton police, these three right here, the Canton clowns, they quickly fill him in that it's a Boston cop, 10% survival rate.

That's what Proctor says that he's told.

And the first stop Proctor says he's going to make is going to the woman that called 911, Jen McCabe.

He goes, drives over to Jennifer McCabe's house where Jen McCabe is there.

Her husband, Matt McCabe, is there.

And then also her brother-in-law, fellow Boston cop, the the man whose lawn John O'Keeffe was found, Brian Albert, he is also at Jen McCabe's house.

This is second day, first day, 29th?

Yeah, the 29th.

So the Canton cops, they come out to 34 Fairview.

They're actually the first ones to talk to Jennifer McCabe.

Officer Link is.

He goes inside the house and he's talking to Jennifer McCabe.

Gallagher, this one, also goes inside the house and he's talking to Jennifer McCabe and he's talking to Brian Albert.

And then they're like, you know what?

We got to recuse ourselves because that's what Chief Berkowitz wants.

He says, we can't because Kevin Albert has been with us for 18 years.

Body found on Brian Albert's lawn.

We got to recuse ourselves.

Do they really recuse themselves?

Not really.

So then the Canton clowns, these three, okay, they go and they talk to the troopers that are taking over.

The trooper trolls, okay?

So they go to the trolls and the trolls are like, okay, what's going on?

Just give us the details so we don't have to do our job.

They say, you should probably talk to Jennifer McCabe.

That is where Trooper Proctor goes.

So

he pulls up in Jen McKay's house, and Brian Aubrey is now at Jen McKay's house.

Yes.

They shifted their meeting from Brian's house to Jen McKay's house.

Yes.

Brian is like, listen, I went to Jen's house because she's my sister-in-law.

She was going through an awful time that morning, as we all were.

And I wanted to be there to comfort her if she needed anything because we were close.

I didn't want her to feel like this was too much for her to handle.

A few things about that.

The man was found on your lawn.

Also your wife's lawn.

Maybe you should worry about your own wife.

A lot of people think a fair theories, swinger theory, affair theory.

Other people think that's a nice excuse to be like, I wanted to make sure that she doesn't fuck up.

Some people think, what if it was a coincidence?

What if he was just checking in on Jen and then Trooper Proctor shows up?

Well, during cross-examination, Jackson asks Brian, isn't it true that you knew, or at least you believed, that an interview with Jen McCabe as part of an official police investigation was going to occur at her house?

Yes.

You were not asked by the police to join her, correct?

No.

Now, Proctor does not think that this is weird at all, in the slightest.

I'm not sure he knows how to do that.

Think, that is.

I don't think he thinks at all.

To him, this is three birds, one stone.

Let's interview Jen, Matt, and Ryan all at once.

Because technically, these are the last three people to see John O'Keefe alive, whether that be at Fairview, whether that be at the waterfall bar.

These are extremely important witnesses, and I believe that anyone who has at least seen one documentary and maybe one episode of Brooklyn 9-9 would have better investigative skills than the trooper trolls.

They interview the three with no audio, no body cam, nothing, barely any notes.

Michael Proctor is asked by ABC: Does it change the nature of the investigation when you know the deceased is a cop?

Because, again, when you're dealing with a police officer, a cop that has died, I mean,

officers are usually very enthusiastic about solving that case.

True, true, yeah.

But no notes, no audio, just winging it.

He says, no, it doesn't change anything that the deceased is a police officer.

He says, nor should it.

I mean, there is a little more emotion involved.

A little more emotion involved towards the deceased.

Which makes sense.

And maybe that justifies why he starts looking through deceased officers girlfriend's phone for nudes.

You're like, yeah, I'm extra sad because the deceased is one of, one of me.

We're all one of a kind.

We're all law enforcement.

We face the same battles every day.

We relate to each other.

So what happened?

Immediately after they call Karen Reed to the station and took over her phone?

No, later they go to Karen's house or Karen's dad's house.

They tow her car and they seize her phone and then he starts immediately looking for nudes.

But he's telling ABC, you know, I was a little more emotional because the deceased was a cop.

And everyone's like, oh, so you're so emotional about the deceased being a fellow officer of the law that you're like, you know what?

Just to like spit on his grave, I'm going to look for his girlfriend's naked photos.

And who was he texting those messages to exactly?

The trooper trolls.

This one specifically, Buchanik.

That is crazy.

Now, that also made me think, what if he found, let's say there are photos.

You think he would just share the photos there?

Yes, because he said no nudes so far.

And one of the other troopers that's not on this wall yet, he thumbs down the message as in like disappointed.

Like darn.

Wow.

Proctor's sheer shamelessness makes my head spin.

Now on the stand, Proctor has to read his messages out loud.

He tries to read them in the most casual tone, not unlike Brian HaHa Higgins.

And he's just like trying to act as if he's reading off the Cheesecake Factory menu.

But I don't think that there is any way in which he can cadence delivery his way out of these words that he texted.

He reads, and this is in reference to him talking about talking to his high school buddies, why he's not investigating the homeowner.

So, high school buddy, that's a friend.

Yeah, these are friends.

So, he's got multiple group chats.

That, okay, so these are civilians.

Yes.

That's asking Proctor about this case investigation.

Yes.

He writes, from all accounts, he, aka Brian Albert, didn't do anything wrong.

She's a whack job C-U-N-T.

Objection?

Auntie Bev stops him.

Auntie Bev says, so don't spell it.

You have to, uh, so these are your words, Trooper Proctor?

Yes, Your Honor.

Go ahead and say them.

Proctor's mouth is in front of the mic, and he just quickly responds,

Yes, she's a babe.

Weird Fall River accent, though, no ass.

Friend responds, ah, not newsworthy then.

Good, no ass.

Proctor laughs in the group chat.

Wait, wait, wait, wait.

The friend say this is non-neutory.

Yeah, because she has no ass.

And then he goes.

No, another friend says, good,

no ass.

Like, good, she's going down.

No ass bitch.

And Proctor is like, ha ha, that was comedic gold.

Proctor laughs in the group chat, which if you're the lead investigator on this case and Amanda is found deceased outside another man's house, but you want only to investigate the girlfriend because she's a whack job, that's terrifying.

But Proctor is like, no, listen, listen.

The compelling evidence against Miss Reed at this point indicated that Mr.

Albert had nothing to do with Mr.

O'Keefe's death.

The rest of the unprofessional and regrettable comments are something I'm not proud of and shouldn't have written in a private or any type of setting.

Side note, Procter has multiple group chats going on, all of which is a cesspool of derogatory comments being made.

One, like I said, is with his high school buddies, his friends, and then another one, which is his work colleagues, including his supervisor.

This one right here, Buchanick.

Proctor sends his buddies pictures of

this one is back to his high school buddies, of Karen Reed being escorted from the state police Milton barracks.

His friend asks, Is this chick a smoke?

Eh,

nutbag, as Chief would say.

Chief, maybe, referencing Tully.

Tully's the big boss.

It's Tully Buchanik Proctor in the line.

Yes.

So Tully is the top dog and then goes to a Buchanan and then goes down to Proctor.

Yes.

And Tully calls her a nut job?

It's alleged that he's referencing Tully.

Okay.

He could be referencing Berkowitz, but that's not his chief.

But his official title is not chief.

But somebody, one of the officers, top dogs.

Okay.

He says she's got a leaky balloon knot.

It leaks poo.

Lally asks him to explain that.

Proctor says, again, to Miss Reed's medical conditions, they are, again, unprofessional comments I should have not made, nor am I proud of.

Proctor tries to convince the jury these juvenile unprofessional comments have zero impact on the facts and the evidence and the integrity of this investigation.

I said those unprofessional comments, but they absolutely did not detract from the integrity of the investigation or the facts and the evidence of it.

What's crazy is I did see a few netizens agreeing with Proctor.

With one writing, a cop's group chat with friends proves what now?

Another says, just imagine all your personal messages on display.

Another casualty of Karen the narcissist go to jail, Karen.

They continue to talk about Karen Reed if she's in Proctor's group chat, if she's hot enough to get away with the crime.

To which Proctor responds, zero chance she skates.

She's fed.

He also responds to, if she's hot.

He says, if you like women who shit themselves, to which to the jurors, he's all again a regrettable comment I made about Miss Reed's medical condition.

Proctor's testimony is a painful series of regrettable messages.

Some netizens believe that he's only started regretting them because he's been caught.

Others say that the only ones with regret should be his parents, but it appears that they are standing by their son.

However, the more alarming messages are the ones between Proctor and the Trooper Trolls.

Because why are you texting your supervisor about no nudes yet?

And why are they thumbs up in that message?

Buchanik thumbs ups that message.

Oh, so someone's thumbs down?

Yeah, is it?

Buchanis thumbs up.

Yeah.

He also texts into that group as he's investigating this ongoing investigation where you cannot come up with your own outcome before you investigate.

He said, Karen said, the Alberts beat the shit out of O'Keefe, left him for dead, and that's why her taillight was cracked.

She's gross.

Another trooper responds, oh, f her, bitch.

Whoa.

Then another trooper sends a picture of David Yannetti.

David Yannetti?

Karen reads Boston attorney, Boston-based attorney, the only local attorney during the first trial on her team.

And Proctor responds, funny, I'm going through his R-worded client's phone.

No nudes so far.

I hate that man.

I truly hate that man.

Talking about Yannetti.

Do they know each other?

They don't.

They don't know each other at all.

Yeah.

What?

Proctor continues, of course, to insist that this entire investigation is completely filled to the brim, overflowing, cup runneth over from integrity and honor.

Proctor says that he has this aha moment at the hospital when he goes to see John O'Keefe's body.

He is escorted by Buchanek, his supervisor.

So the two trooper trolls, they go to Good Samaritan and Proctor is like, look, John O'Keefe,

John O'Keefe is missing a shoe.

They only found one shoe on him.

He says the only thing that jumped out to both of us was that he only had one sneaker.

The reason that was important was important at the time is during my training and experience, and it's fairly common in a motor vehicle pedestrian incident for if not both pieces of footwear to remain at the point of contact but at least one so he's saying sometimes people will get literally hit out of their shoes

really and that's that's common it does seem to be common but you have to be going at pretty high speeds

he says i've been to pedestrian strikes where both shoots were right at the point of contact i've seen it where the people got completely ripped out of their clothing and their clothes are at the point of contact i don't know how true that is that's what gives him the feeling though and gives gives Buchanick the feeling that they're on to something.

We picked up that only one piece of footwear, which revealed the potential of a vehicle strike.

That is when he decides to follow the leads.

The one shoe, Jen McCabe, saying that, hey, Karen said I hit him.

He believes that perhaps Karen did indeed hit John O'Keefe with her car.

So it's time for Trooper Proctor and Buchanick to pay Karen Reid a visit.

This is the same day, January 29th, 2022.

They call Karen.

She's been released from the hospital.

She went to John O'Keefe's house.

She had that weird incident with John's family.

She's now gone back to her dad's house.

She's staying with her dad.

And they don't live in Canton.

They live in a place called Dighton.

So this is important later, but it's a completely different jurisdiction.

They show up at the house.

The blizzard is coming down strong, so much so that when they get to Karen's dad's front door, it won't even open because the snow is piled up blocking it.

So Karen is like, can you come around the garage?

I can open the garage and you can come in through the garage.

That's where she lets them in.

And both Proctor and Buchanan testify as they're passing Karen's Lexus in question, Proctor states, it's not just shattered.

A significant chunk is missing from that taillight, the right rear taillight.

So the passenger taillight in the back had large pieces missing from it.

Proctor says, we knew, we were very confident.

We knew what had transpired, which was Karen Reed backed her vehicle into John O'Keefe.

They're actually so confident that before they even get to Karen's dad's house and lay eyes on this car, potentially I could understand if they see the car and they see large chunks missing and they're like, hey, I think she hit him with the car.

I could maybe see that.

But they were actually so confident that even before they got to Karen's dad's house and laid eyes on this vehicle in question.

They're already on the phone with Dighton police trying to find out how to get her car towed back to Canton.

And they've got, they put all their eggs in this basket and they're going to die on this hill whether the Easter bunny comes to town or not.

They don't care.

That is when Karen's phone and her car are seized by the trooper trolls.

And sure, this guy is corrupt.

Proctor is corrupt.

But how do you explain 45 plus pieces of Karen Reed's taillight that are found in the snow on the front lawn of 34 Fairview Road in the vicinity where John O'Keefe's body is found?

40-something pieces of taillight.

I mean, some are tiny little fragments the size of a dime, others are the size of a banana buried in the snow.

I I mean, the evidence that Karen Reed did it was maybe right there all along.

Or was it?

Back to the Canton clowns.

Gallagher, Paul Gallagher, gets called to the scene by Sergeant Goode.

Sergeant Goode is working dispatch.

He's sitting at the Canton Police Department all night.

He's picking up the 911 calls.

First call he picks up in relation to this case, Carrie Roberts.

She's like, hey, my friend's girlfriend just called and is like, John Nokief is missing.

Do you have any reports of anything?

Nothing?

Oh, okay, thanks.

Then Jen McCabe calls and is like, hey, so there's a guy like laying in the snow.

He's picking up both those calls.

All he does is dispatch people.

But that day, he's like, I'm going to go.

Someone take over.

I'm going to head out.

What?

Because this is a big call.

And I'm a sergeant, so I'm going to go.

So he calls in Kelly.

Kelly Dever.

She's crazy.

She's in the next one.

He calls in Kelly Dever.

She takes over dispatch.

It's a whole whole thing.

Sergeant Goode comes to the address.

He calls Gallagher.

Gallagher is his boss.

His supervisor is Gallagher.

He calls Gallagher.

Gallagher ends up going to the wrong address.

It's either suspicious or it's stupid.

That's how I sum up every law enforcement decision in this case.

It's either stupid or it's suspicious because nothing is ever making any sense here.

I don't understand anything.

He ends up going to the wrong address.

And then he's like, you know what?

I'm not even going to go there right now.

I'm going to stop by the Canton police station before I head over there.

So he grabs himself one of those reflective jackets because it's dark outside.

He doesn't grab anything else, like an evidence bag, anything.

Just a reflective jacket.

What?

He shows up at the scene.

Sergeant Goode had already called for another person, Officer Link, Michael Link to show up.

So now it's the three Canton clowns that are there.

Okay, there's two other Canton officers there, but they're lower rank and they're not as pertinent to this case.

We talked about them briefly in part one where they just talk about what they heard, what they didn't hear, and the situations.

Mainly, their dash cam footage is the most important, but other than that, they don't really.

Yeah,

these three, they're there.

Now, mind you, Gallagher is the highest ranking one at the scene, top dog at the scene.

And at the scene, he says, we got to put up crime scene tape.

But it just starts blowing in the wind because it's a blizzard, which in his mind,

he's like, well, then we shouldn't even set up a tent because then a tent is also going to blow away.

And then also, they don't canvass the area.

They don't go and speak to anybody in the nearby homes, nothing.

And they, he shows up when John's body is already gone.

So John has been escorted to the hospital and he shows up.

And he's looking around.

He tries to put up crime scene tape.

So he says it starts blowing in the wind.

So he takes away the crime scene tape.

And then he's like, you know what?

The thought of putting up a tent did cross my mind.

But then I thought it's just going to blow away.

away he doesn't canvas the neighborhood nothing he gets there late he just asks them hey so where was john's body found and they point in a general area and this is where he just starts looking for evidence no photos nothing no

so they just start looking in this general area now gallagher will later bring the troopers out to show them exactly where John O'Keefe's body was found.

But he's never seen John O'Keeffe's body found there.

So what, I mean, is that not hearsay?

Yeah.

Karen's attorney is cross-examining Gallagher asking, so you were giving them information that you had no personal knowledge of, correct?

I had knowledge from other officers.

I did not see John O'Keeffe at the scene.

So you couldn't determine exactly how he was positioned, right?

Not precisely, no.

He's a six foot two man.

I don't know.

You don't even know that?

I don't know his size.

No.

Accuracy is vital in a homicide investigation, correct?

Correct.

Who was it that told you specifically where Jon O'Keeffe's body was?

I don't recall specifically.

I had a collaborative meeting with Sergeant Lank and Sergeant Goode.

Were you aware at the time that you had this collaborative meeting with Sergeant Lank and Sergeant Good,

that Sergeant Lank had also not seen Jon O'Keeffe's body?

Yes, I did.

I don't believe that they had seen John O'Keefe's body to my knowledge.

I believe John O'Keeffe might have been in the ambulance at that time.

So the two initial Canton officers, Seraph and Mulaney, I believe, they are the ones that tell Sean Goode and Michael Link where the body was.

And then they tell Gallagher.

Gallagher tells the troopers.

The troopers will later tell the accident reconstructionist.

So it's 20 layers.

Yeah, 20 layers of telephone and hearsay.

So if that were the case, then they wouldn't have personal knowledge of where John O'Keefe's body was either.

Not to a precise location, yes.

So, they're all talking about where John's body was, but none of them have seen John's body there.

But they start searching the area for evidence.

However, the snow is coming down hard, and Gallagher is worried that the evidence is getting covered in snow.

What evidence?

We don't know what we're looking for, but we're looking for something.

In what area?

We don't really know for sure, but in a general area, he's He's looking and he says the snow is covering everything.

What's everything?

We don't know.

Gallagher thinks that the idea of using a rake or a shovel is probably not great because he could inadvertently break something.

What is something?

We don't know.

So the ever-cautious, ever-intelligent Gallagher decides that he's going to use a leaf blower to get rid of snow to uncover the evidence.

He says the leaf blower is much better control.

One big problem is he's got this reflective jacket from the police station.

No leaf blower.

Didn't think of that one, did you?

So he has Sergeant Good go get a leaf blower.

Why the leaf blower?

Gallagher says it's a unique case.

There was snow.

I had never processed a scene with snow.

Side note, this man has worked in this area for 30 years.

You've never processed a single scene in Massachusetts where there was snow?

I had seen a leaf blower used in the snow, and it's quite effective at being controlled.

So that's why it was readily accessible.

The scene was debilitating as we were on the scene with the weather.

Snow was piling up.

And I thought that this was the best method at the time, which people think he's crazy.

He's asked by the prosecutors later, was it successful?

Very.

I started with a low speed and began whisking away the snow.

And then I saw how it was uncovering these pink spots, which were becoming a brighter red.

There's a video of him using the leaf blower to get rid of the snow.

They've got the, like, they've got the weirdest

photographic evidence of things that don't make sense.

Wait, someone recorded him at the crime scene, but there's no like photos?

A lot of the evidence is photographed, but it's photographed in a way where you have no idea where on the lawn it's found.

You just see snow and grass.

So you have no idea in what area, in what vicinity.

You don't even know where John's body was found.

So like, really, what are we doing?

We don't know anything.

This could have been found on the surface of Mars.

It could have been found in New York City.

We don't know.

I mean, obviously we know it's not, but

he says, see, it removes the snow.

I was removing the snow layer by layer, and right here is when you can see it exposing the cocktail glass.

You're going to see red spots appear as I remove it layer by layer.

Those pink spots start to turn to be dark red spots, as you can see.

We can control it.

We were, you know, we were concerned, but it worked.

He verifies that those pink spots to be coagulated blood, which I would imagine if an officer is called out to the scene of a potential death and there is blood, the bare minimum is to collect said blood.

But Gallagher proudly says, So, out of an abundance of caution, I decided that the blood was something we may want to collect.

But Gallagher only has his reflective jacket, and now he's only got a leaf blower.

How is he going to collect his blood samples?

They run across the street to another house.

Tom Keller is the neighbor right across the street.

Uh-huh.

He is another Canton cop.

In fact, he's only second in command after Chief Berkowitz.

He's the deputy of the Canton Police Department.

He is Gallagher's boss.

That's freaking crazy.

So they go to Tom Keller.

That's crazy.

Like he just knew, oh, that's Tom's house right there.

Let's go.

Let's go there.

They run to his house.

They say, hey, we saw some blood.

And out of an abundance of caution, we may want to collect the blood.

They go back to 34 Fairview with a stack of red solo cups, plastic cups that you typically drink beer out of.

Gallagher says that his genius thought behind this was: they were plastic, they weren't going to leak, they weren't going to get soggy, they were large.

I needed a small sample.

My thought was because it was frozen and coagulated that we could collect it, transport it, and transfer it to the crime lab, who could extract the DNA however they saw best fit.

He's asked later by Attorney Jackson, like the solo cups that you see at backyard barbecues, they hold liquid terrifically.

They're also not sealed, correct?

They are not.

Which Karen's attorney is confused.

So, what you did instead was you gathered red solo cups from a neighbor,

you unsterilized and scooped up the snow with what you thought the blood was and just carried them back to the truck?

Nope.

We took six individual samples.

Our philosophy was we will let the lab extract it the way they best see fit.

Those six samples were bagged and then transported back to Canton police headquarters and placed into evidence.

Which is basically what Jackson said, but like make it LinkedIn font.

It doesn't make sense.

I mean, I feel as if an internet sleuth that cops like to look down on would have made smarter choices in regards to evidence protocols.

This feels like a Home Depot dad coming across a baby stray animal that they're trying to take in, DIYing the whole process on the front lawn, which even Gallagher knows he's goofy.

Oh, and another side note, I'm so sorry, sorry, before we move on, Tom Keller, the deputy, never goes out to investigate.

Deputy of the Canton Police Department, another cop is found dead right across the street.

Brian Albert never comes out to see what's going on in his front lawn.

Tom Keller never comes out.

What's going on?

And he's the one that deleted his ring footage or no?

Well, he says, he says along the lines of,

And it wasn't ring.

There was like a whole argument.

It's like a different company called Arlo.

And everyone's like, that's not the point.

You know what the point is.

But all the Canton cops are like, Well, first of all, it's not ring.

It doesn't get that in the security footage, so it just rewrote itself because you know how every day it just rewrites itself unless you save the footage.

And he basically knew that it wasn't going to cover that area, so

essentially it gets deleted.

Wow, this is this is who's running the town.

Like, yes,

even if it's not covering that direction, they will get, they will pull the footage even from like down the street.

They will.

Because they're trying to see who drove by at what time.

And this top cop is saying that,

oh yeah,

I don't need it.

So.

In regards to the leaf blowing, Paul Gallagher says, I thought someone may wonder why I decided to use a leaf blower, so I wanted to demonstrate the effectiveness.

That is why we have a video of it, because even Gallagher knows that he's goofy.

The video is bad.

You just see him leaf blowing directly onto droplets of blood in the snow because that's precisely what you would want to do in a crime scene.

That is when they bring back to the police station six solo cups filled with melted snow, debris, and blood.

Those six solo cups, by the way, are placed in a wide open

brown bag, like a grocery bag.

And it is a grocery bag.

It says stop and shop on the side of it.

And that is also left all the way open and brought back to Canton police station.

They find that day along with that pieces of glass that seem to belong to a cocktail glass, a drinking glass, and they bring those back to the police station.

They just

put the blood in the evidence refrigerator, which the snow will presumably melt pretty instantaneously if it had not already.

I would nickname this guy Goofy, Goofy Gallagher, if anything about this case were actually goofy, but it's more terrifying than anything.

And he is so serious when he tries to justify all the insane things that he's he's done on the scene.

Why do you use a stop-and-shot bag?

He's asked by the defense.

They're basically the same thing as an evidence bag.

I don't know where the bag came from.

I was in a personal vehicle at that point.

Sergeant Lank was also in a personal vehicle.

He tries to argue that the stop-and-shot bags are similar to evidence bags.

Quote, if the bag were upside down, you wouldn't know it.

It didn't say evidence on it.

I'm not sure where the bag came from, but our evidence bags are pretty much the same thing.

The defense attorney is like, but it's not the same thing.

It's not the same thing.

And that's why evidence bags are much more expensive, isn't that right?

They're not quite the same, are they?

No.

And obviously the bag, it goes without saying, is not forensically sterile either, correct?

Most bags are not sterile.

Later, Sergeant Link, this guy, besties with Chris Albert.

We're getting into that later.

He says, he's looking at the picture and he says, it looks like a stop and shop bag.

It might be an evidence bag.

The defense attorney is like, it literally is not.

It's a stop and shop bag.

Okay, it says stop and shop bag, but it does look like an evidence bag.

It's the same thing.

That's a grocery bag, sir.

It is.

And that's exactly what our evidence bags look like.

So that's why I thought it was an evidence bag at first.

And it just, it's the seriousness on the stand for me.

At one point, they say we did not document which scoop went into which cup, which scoop of snow and blood went into which cup.

It's freaking crazy.

Netizens are going insane.

They're writing, imagine the embarrassment.

Who collects evidence in beer pong cups?

Another one writes, wonder if they put urine samples in Slurpee cups.

One says, the stop-and-shop bag evidence is so abysmal that we can't help but wonder if they have a stop-and-shop deal.

So you're saying they

collected, quote, blood into six cups and some glasses.

Yes.

What about the cartel light?

Did they collect those?

There was nothing.

Well, you'll see.

You'll see.

Now, mind you ridiculous this guy right here gallagher made three hundred and twenty two thousand dollar no three hundred twenty two thousand three hundred eighty nine dollars that year

three hundred twenty km is that normal that sounds for a cop is he just a cop what is no he's a sergeant he's a lieutenant they make that much in in oh he's a state wait no he's a canton cop canton cop yeah 320k yeah Yeah.

Is that average?

That doesn't sound right.

It sounds like a lot.

How do we know that?

It's public record because they're cops.

Wait, but why is everyone making that?

No, but he's pretty high ranking.

Officer Lank also gets promoted.

He ends up making, I think, almost a quarter million dollars, 200 something thousand.

And this is how they are investigating.

I'm sorry, if you're getting paid together, just you two are getting paid half a million dollars on taxpayer money, you better know how to collect evidence.

Yeah,

and you're saying there's not a single piece of car tell lie that they found.

The timing is very important in this, keep in mind.

Later, another forensic expert is testifying, testifying about something completely unrelated.

Well, not completely unrelated, but she is testifying about dog DNA.

And we're going to come back to this.

But the defense uses her cross-examination to just randomly randomly ask her about forensic processes.

And they ask her, so you wouldn't, you wouldn't use plastic to get blood.

And

she's testifying about sterile procedures.

Everything we use in our lab is sterile.

All of our tubes that we would use, or once we do a collection, we put it in a tube for the extraction process.

Those tubes are auto-acclaved and they don't have any contamination.

They are sterile.

So you wouldn't use a solo cup.

At this point, she just looks at him and goes, I'm sorry, what?

She looks genuinely confused and concerned.

And he is so proud of this.

Side note, Gallagher has also worked with the DEA, the Drug Administration, for 15 years, which some netizens believe add to this.

And also ATF, there's lots of drug overlap there.

So lots of people believe there's lots of drug connections everywhere, but technically they are law enforcement and drugs are a big part of law.

Sergeant Goode, however, there's lots of connections here.

Sergeant Good also grew up with Courtney Proctor, Trooper Proctor's sister.

There were only 144 students graduating that year, so their class is very small.

I imagine they were friends.

If not, they knew of each other rather well.

Lank went to high school with Courtney Proctor as well, but also with a girl named Jill.

Who is Jill?

Jill's not on here, but Jill is Julie Albert's sister.

And he's best buds with Chris Albert.

They've all worked the past 18 years with Kevin Albert.

And there is just a lot of connections here.

They also work in the same office as ATF Brian HaHa Higgins.

And this is what's crazy.

These are the Canton cops that actually go into 34 Fairview at the scene.

Gallagher and Link walk into 34 Fairview to talk to Jen McCabe.

Later, Trooper Proctor will go go to Jen McCabe's house to talk to Jen McCabe, but this is the first actual interview.

And this is after they recuse themselves or they're thinking about recusing themselves.

And they talk to Jen McCabe.

They talk to Brian Albert.

They don't search the house.

They don't ask to search the house, but they're inside the house.

And it's just weird.

They don't write a report memorializing the conversation or really anything, especially Gallagher.

And his whole excuse to all of that is just, well, I don't write reports.

I'm the supervisor.

Why would I write a report?

That's not my responsibility.

That's for the losers losers, like Link.

That's the vibe.

And they're just letting everybody talk to everyone.

Now, at this point, everyone in the house, a lot of these people have stated there was a morning meeting.

A lot of people were at 34 Fairview that morning.

And we're going to get into these two a little bit later.

But just to give you a recap, throughout the morning of 34 Fairview, lots of people stopped by.

Already inside the house were Brian Albert, Nicole Albert, and Birthday Brian, Brian Albert Jr.

Jen McCabe is there because she came there with Karen and she called 911.

Matt McCabe shows up because Jen McCabe calls her husband and is like, oh my gosh, we found John O'Keefe dead in the snow.

Eventually, Julie Albert shows up.

Julie Albert shows up completely randomly.

She says, it's Brian Albert Jr.'s birthday.

Here's what I do.

It's a birthday tradition that I get him six Dunkin' Donuts and I put them in his car, which already doesn't make sense because it's a blizzard.

I don't think birthday Brian's going anywhere.

So when is he going to find the Dunkin Donuts that you just put inside of his car 10 years later?

She shows up.

And then Brian Albert, who sees nothing, sees nothing, hears nothing, nothing, sees Julie Albert putting donuts in the car and is like, hey, come in.

We got to tell you something.

So they tell Julie.

Julie goes back home, gets Chris.

They drive back to Brian Albert's.

Brian Higgins got a phone call from Brian Albert and Chief Berkowitz that morning, but he doesn't pick up Chief Berkowitz's call.

He calls Brian Albert back and he's like, you got to come over.

He ends up coming over.

Brian HaHa Higgins works at the Canton police station.

These people work at the Canton police station.

Brian Higgins has testified that he was at 34 Fairview that morning.

These two guys are like,

I don't know if we saw Brian there.

What do you mean you don't know if you saw Brian there?

You work with Brian.

He works in the same office.

You would remember if you saw him.

Correct?

No.

They're like, well, I don't recall having a conversation with him, so I can't tell you if he was there.

At one point, Michael Lank also states that that he had mentioned to another officer that he believed that John O'Keefe might have been in a fight, like he could have been in a fight or something.

To which the defense attorneys asked him, if he had been in a confrontation, it could have started anywhere.

He's like, yeah, if he had been in a confrontation, it could have started anywhere.

It doesn't mean that it started in the house, which is why we didn't feel the need to search the house.

It's not like, oh, the house is the crime scene.

Right.

But the house is part of anywhere, right?

Correct.

So in other words, the house is not excluded in your mind at this point as a starting point for the investigation, is that right?

The starting point would have been where Mr.

O'Keefe had been discovered.

And then, based on speaking with the witnesses, there was no indication that he ever made it into the house.

I learned that speaking to Miss McCabe.

So, you just took Miss McCabe's word for it?

At that point in time, that was the only person that I had spoken to, and she gave me a timeline of events from that night where Mr.

O'Keefe was supposed to come back to the house, but never made it.

Have you ever been lied to in the course of investigating your cases?

Have you ever been lied to by a witness?

Yes.

So it's not necessarily the best best investigative technique to just take a witness's word for something, correct?

And he's like, correct.

It is incredibly weird, is it not, that at least four, maybe even more, Canton police detectives searched Brian Albert's front lawn for evidence the day that they found John O'Keefe's body.

They find a cocktail glass.

They find blood, but they don't find taillight pieces.

When you say cocktail glass, it's like a glass cup?

Like a whiskey cup.

You know, like a cocktail.

You put some whiskey, you put vodka in there.

I don't know.

I'm not really a big drinker.

So they were seen, Karen was seen leaving C.F.

McCarthy's with a glass.

Are you allowed to do that?

No, you're not.

Okay, she snuck it out because she didn't finish her drink.

So she snuck out her little glass.

And then I believe that same glass was seen walking out of waterfall, but in John O'Keefe's hand.

So it's from the bar, but the point that the defense attorneys are trying to make is that these sergeants from Canton Police didn't know it was from the bar, so you would think that it's from inside the house.

So you should search inside the house, but they don't.

They don't.

The number of pieces of taillight that are found by these at least four minimum police officers looking for evidence while it's still bright outside are zero.

They used a literal leaf blower and they have spotted not one piece of Karen Reed's taillight.

That's crazy.

And taillight is red?

Red and clear plastic pieces.

And some of these taillight pieces that they're showing in court, it's like the size of a banana.

Bright red.

Hmm.

It's only later in the day when the snow starts really starting to accumulate that the police miraculously.

Sun goes down, snow is pouring down, that they start finding pieces of taillight on the property.

And, you know, people argue, you don't think that's weird?

The police only start finding pieces of the taillight later in the day.

That's a little bit strange, don't you think?

Yeah.

So they find some later that day.

And then for the next few weeks, they find more pieces of taillight.

These taillight pieces, I don't know if they just magically appear.

The trooper trolls, they try to argue that it's because the snow is now melting and the evidence is unearthing itself.

They keep using that word.

More evidence starts to present itself, which is a very interesting phrase that you could choose from.

But some people argue, well, it's because these guys are not really trained to find evidence.

I mean, look at them.

They're doing solo cups.

How do you expect them to find evidence?

It's not until later that Trooper Tully, Troll Tully, we don't like Tully.

Nobody likes Tully.

Okay, just keep that in mind.

He decides that he's going to employ the CERT team from the Massachusetts State Police.

The CERT team is a special emergency response team.

So they just kind of go from place to place in Massachusetts, Massachusetts helping any law enforcement agency that needs the help.

He gets them out there and they conduct a search where they find John O'Keefe's hat and a few pieces of taillight.

Hmm.

And then for the next few weeks, they find 40 plus more pieces of taillight, which begs the question to a lot of people.

Wait, so the cert team that are normally better qualified to find evidence, they only find a few pieces of taillight.

And then suddenly there's 40 more pieces of taillight.

And the documentation of where these taillight pieces are found are horrendous.

They just take a picture of the taillight in the grass with the snow.

Most of these pictures don't have any sort of relation point of is it next to the flagpole?

Is it next to the hydrant?

Nothing.

You have no clue where on the lawn these pieces of taillight are from.

Hmm.

It takes, so they're saying that the snow takes weeks to melt.

Yeah, and as the snow is melting more and more, they're unearthing evidence starts to present itself.

That type of phrasing by a police officer, by a law enforcement officer, should be criminal.

Present itself.

I'm sorry, then why are you getting paid?

It's crazy.

Now, Prosecutor Lally asks Proctor where the taillight pieces are found.

He's not even asking for exact locations, which is what you would imagine would happen in an investigation.

He's asking, generally speaking, Proctor does a full-chested psy.

I don't specifically remember exactly if they they were around the flagpole because the cert team had come and shoveled the area around.

So

the stuff had melted first because it was a lot less snow.

And then they created more piles.

But as far as a general area, it was by the flagpole and the fire hydrant.

It wasn't on the other side of the property.

It was in that general area.

Nobody disagrees with the fact that these are pieces of taillight from Karen Reed's SUV.

That is a fact.

They just argue how and when it got there.

Now, just to give you a bit of a timeline on this, evidence starts to present itself starting the night of January 29th.

John is found at 6 in the morning.

By about 6 p.m., taillight pieces are found.

But prior to that same day, Karen finds John.

Karen is rushed to the hospital.

She's section 12.

She gets released, goes to John's house, feels unwelcome, gets her car, and drives to her dad's house in Dighton.

The troopers, they decide that they're going to go to Karen's dad's house and seize her car that day.

They take her car, bring it all the way to the Canton Police Department, which is already a little bit suspicious.

People thought it was weird.

These two troopers, they're part of the Massachusetts State Police and they have two facilities that are MSP nearby Dighton.

But instead, they have Dighton Police

tow it all the way to Canton.

Canton has already recused themselves from this case.

So it's very odd.

On top of that, it's very odd that taillight pieces continue to be found on the lawn for up to two weeks after the so-called accident.

Chief Berkowitz, as well, happened to be driving by 34 Fairview Road out of nowhere, February 4th, 2022.

And he said, look at this man.

I'm sorry, but this man is a little bit older.

This man does not look like he has 2020 vision.

He's driving by February 4th, 2022.

He stops his car and he sees on the lawn of the Albert residence from his car driver's side a shiny piece of taillight sitting on the lawn.

Most of the taillight pieces are found by this man, Trooper Proctor.

And it's just an odd instance.

Is it like all of these things are very odd about this?

And it makes people believe, well, wait a minute, maybe these taillight pieces were planted on the lawn.

It doesn't make sense.

So for people who believe that's the case, then where did they get the pieces from, the taillight pieces from then?

we're about to get into that.

Now, for the people that are saying, Hey, that doesn't make sense that you just find pieces of taillight after so many people have searched it and you keep continuing to find it in an unsecured location, they don't secure the scene.

This guy, Buchanick, he's like, Well, no, it makes total sense.

In fact, it's common sense.

He says, Well, common sense will dictate that if an item is found on the grass and there's snow covering that item, it would have to have been placed prior to the snow accumulating.

So, if an item is shoved into the snow, it'll be exposed as the snow melts prior to reaching the ground level.

He's saying there was snow on top of it, and that's why we didn't find it immediately.

And it makes sense, okay?

So they tow her car.

They also investigate the scene.

They find more taillight pieces.

Except it doesn't make sense at all because this man hits the stand.

His name is Sergeant Nicholas Barrows.

He has zero connection to the Canton Police Department.

He works instead for the Dighton Police Department, which is the jurisdiction that resides over Karen's dad's house, where the car is seized.

He showed up to Karen Reed's house too because he's working in cooperation with Procter and Buchanick for towing Karen's car.

He testifies on the stand, yeah, I did see Karen Reed's taillight.

It was damaged.

The taillight was damaged, but there was a crack missing.

So there were taillight pieces that were missing, but it was not completely damaged.

When you say a crack, do you mean a piece missing?

A piece was missing.

A piece maybe about six inches big, maybe about two inches wide.

He's shown a picture of Karen's Lexus from Sallyport.

So this is a picture that the troopers have taken.

And he's like, that is the car.

Yeah, that's the black Lexus.

But that's not the taillight the day that I was there at Karen Reed's house.

What do you mean?

He said, it's not.

He's asked, is this the condition of the right rear taillight when you showed up at the house on the afternoon of January 29th, 2022?

Absolutely not.

What's different about this photo, sir?

The taillight is completely smashed out.

He's saying the right side chunk is completely missing.

That was not the case at Karen Reed's dad's house.

None of this, the middle section is missing.

That's not the case either.

I mean, Dighton P.D.

are the ones that towed Karen's truck back to Canton Police Department.

But they don't have records of what the condition was.

Like, there's no photos.

There's no comparisons.

There's a photo, but it's not a great quality photo.

And there's snow all over both taillights.

Canton police and the troopers are arguing it's missing.

You just can't really really see it because the snow is covering.

Nicholas Barrows is like, bro, I was there.

Yeah.

I was there.

That's so crazy.

But the troopers are also saying, I was also there.

And it was just like that.

So when Barrows saw that, he said there's only a six by two missing.

That's it.

That's like pretty small, right?

But in the photos, the whole thing is missing?

Like a good chunk of it is missing.

A lot of the red parts are missing.

And they try to argue.

That's why when she presses the brakes, it's not even lighting up red at that section.

It's they're trying to argue lots of different things.

The whole thing is weird.

Now, another question is: why did you take it to Canton Police Department on top of what Sergeant Nicholas Barrows is saying?

It's just getting weird.

Buchanick says it's because the garage there is heated and they needed the snow to melt off.

It's just very strange.

This show is sponsored by Liquid IV.

This summer, my family and I started playing pickleball.

It always seemed like the best thing to start the day with until I started feeling just, I wasn't feeling well, especially when I played pickleball in the mornings all night long for seven or so hours.

I wasn't drinking any water and then to go straight to pickleball drinking plain water, it just wasn't cutting it.

So instead, I started to mix in liquid IV in the morning.

My favorite flavor has always been the sugar-free white peach.

All I have to do is mix it with a 16-ounce water bottle, give it a good shake.

Finally, I have hydration.

I actually pack a ton of liquid IV sticks into my bag because it's just a thing.

When you pull out a liquid IV, everybody crowds around you.

It's like the new gum.

Everyone's like, wait, is that liquid IV?

Can I get one?

And it's all thanks to Live HydroScience, a precisely balanced combination of electrolytes, vital vitamins, and clinically proven nutrients that transform regular water into premium hydration fuel.

Savor the last bits of summer with Liquid IV.

Tear, pour, live more.

Go to liquidiv.com and get 20% off your first order with Code Rotten at checkout.

That's 20% off your first order with code rotten at liquid.com.

This is an ad by BetterHelp.

It feels like every week there is a new self-help trend that goes viral on social media.

Sometimes it's ice baths.

Okay, that was a hard one.

Mindfulness apps, which was easier.

Digital detoxes, manifestation journals, and people who swear up and down that this is the best solution for becoming your best self.

But for those who are genuinely struggling, all these different online suggestions may just feel overwhelming and honestly just not that helpful enough.

With more than 30,000 therapists all over the world, BetterHelp has already guided over 5 million people towards genuine healing.

You can get matched with a credentialed professional that truly gets your situation and cultural background.

And if your therapist isn't the right fit, switch instantly free of charge.

Your mental health deserves more than trending tips and viral advice.

As the largest online therapy provider in the world, BetterHelp can provide access to mental health professionals with a diverse variety of expertise.

Talk it out with BetterHelp.

Our listeners get 10% off their first month at betterhelp.com/slash rotten.

That's better h-e-l-p.com/slash rotten.

Growing up, kids in my neighborhood would go out to play until dark and parents would leave the house unlocked without a second thought.

When I became a homeowner myself and a dog mom to two very domesticated dogs who are completely allergic to the outside world, I realized that security has become far more important.

Even alarms aren't enough to keep people out because by the time the siren goes off, someone has already tripped the wire and invaded your home.

Only with SimplySafe do I feel safe and just at peace.

I know that my dogs and my family are protected not just from reactionary safety measures, but preventative safety measures.

With Simply Safe's new active guard outdoor protection, you get a system that works to prevent that break-in.

Whether it's someone casing your home or testing door handles, SimplySafe's trained security specialists spring into action.

Agents can talk to them in real time, turn on spotlights, call the police, proactively deterring crime before it starts.

Visit simplysafe.com/slash Rotten to claim 50% off a new system with a professional monitoring plan and get your first month free.

That's simplysafe.com/slash Rotten.

There's no safe like Simply Safe.

But the timing on paper, it doesn't make sense because Michael Proctor swears under oath multiple times that Karen's car is seized at 5:30 p.m., which the car would still be in Dighton, Massachusetts at 5:30 p.m.

They get it on the tow and then they start driving to Canton.

The first piece of taillight was found at

34 Fairview Road, maybe at like 5.45.

It doesn't make sense.

They wouldn't even have had time to get to Canton Police Department to park the car in Sallyport.

The timing is not timing.

So where did they get the taillight pieces if it were to be framed?

That's what he says, right?

I mean, how could he possibly plant evidence if he can't be at two places at once?

But that's not true.

And Michael Proctor doesn't know that Karen knows it's not true because he doesn't know that her parents' home have cameras.

The car was seized at 4.12 p.m.

And it's not just Karen's cameras.

The Dighton police, the ones that towed the car, they state it was towed at 4.12 p.m.

That's an 80-minute discrepancy there.

He just made up time, Michael Proctor?

He strategically made it so that the taillight pieces could not have come from him because he wasn't even in Canton.

The car wasn't even at Canton Police Department.

So you're saying he lied about the time?

Is that correct or no?

I don't know if I want to be the one to...

You know what?

I'll say it.

I don't like this man.

I think he lied.

I think he's straight up be lying out of this mouth right here.

So was he confronted by the actual time?

Yes.

He was just like, I was a little confused.

Wow.

By the time that they get to Canton Police Department, they book the car.

There's movement around the car, and then Trooper Proctor leaves with enough hypothetical time to drop pieces of taillight at 34 Fairview Road front lawn.

But the Canton Police say, hey, it is suspicious that he lied about the time.

Is it not?

Yes.

However, we have video proof from Sallyport that shows that they never even went near that rear passenger taillight.

Dighton Police are the ones that towed it.

If Trooper Proctor was all up on that rear taillight, they would have said something.

They're already saying something, right?

They would have said it.

And then when you get to Sallyport, look at all the, here's the videos.

Sallyport is.

Sallyport is the garage attached to Canton Police Department, police station.

Okay.

So they're like, look at it.

There's nothing here.

So the defense argues, first of all, you guys never handed this video over in Discovery, which you're supposed to hand all these things over in Discovery during the trial because both sides need to have.

A good amount of the same information.

And so they're saying, this should have been in the discovery, and now you're just like whipping it out.

And second of all, there's so many odd things about this footage.

Additionally, the start time of the CCTV footage is 5:30 p.m.

and it stops at 5:48 p.m.

So 5:30 p.m., the car is booked into Sallyport.

So technically, it's about 17 minutes and 50 seconds, but the CCTV footage is only 5 minutes and 51 seconds long.

So more than two-thirds of the time in question is not there.

But Canton Police is like, well, actually, it's not weird because Sallyport CCTV cameras are motion-activated motion-activated cameras, meaning they only start recording when there's motion, which I already find alarming, considering that Gallagher has stated, Sallyport is where when we have an arrest, we bring our prisoners in.

It's basically an extra large garage.

It has doors that are numbered 1, 2, 3, 4.

We typically go in door 4, pull up towards there, and the prisoners are walked into the booking area, which is also secure.

I would imagine that a place where you have people getting booked, I would want cameras running 24-7 to protect both sides, both parties, not just motion-censored cameras.

But nevertheless, they show the cameras, and it does show nobody goes near the rear passenger taillight.

Buchanik testifies, Trooper Proctor and I never touched the vehicle prior to it being properly processed with a search warrant.

They never touched the back passenger taillight.

So at that point, is the taillight already missing?

You can't really see it.

Okay, okay.

But they do go to the other side of the taillight because there's a door near the driver's side taillight.

So you do see Trooper Proctor kind of hanging out in that area, but it's not the rear passenger tail.

That one, there's no taillight pieces missing, right?

And

Karen and her defense team are looking at this video and they see it.

Yeah, it makes sense.

No one goes near the rear passenger taillight.

But why

is everything

backwards?

There is a police car to Karen's black SUV and it says police, but it's backwards.

Like you're looking into a mirror.

Like, you know, when you write a letter and you put it up against a mirror, the words are backwards.

And then the number four on the garage doors, one, two, three, four.

Remember, they're numbered?

They're also backwards.

Why?

Because the footage is inverted.

Somebody inverted the footage.

So what the defense team does is they un-invert the footage.

That taillight that Trooper Proctor is standing around suspiciously is the back passenger taillight.

It's not the driver taillight.

And can we see the taillight?

You cannot see it, but you can see him in a little beanie hanging out behind there.

You're going to die.

I got to show you pictures.

Okay, so let me show you.

Okay, this is like the footage that they show, which you see this police car, and then this is Karen's car.

They said that this is an accurate portrayal of the footage, which would make you think that this is the taillight in question, the passenger rear taillight, right?

Yep.

That's what it looks like.

Nobody ever goes over there.

However,

this is the real footage.

That's the driver's side taillight that nobody goes around.

Oh my god.

The rear passenger taillight is the other side.

Oh my god.

That is so crazy.

And the prosecutors?

The prosecutors, they play the inverted footage.

They ask Buchanik, is this an accurate portrayal?

That alone is guilty.

Like, whoever did that is guilty.

That is crazy.

That is some like...

That is like a peak investigation, like...

like clue type of shit.

Like you try to play tricks to confuse everyone.

Can you spot the problem in this video?

But what's even crazier is when the defense team invert the video back,

the,

okay, they go and find other like Sally Port footage.

The timestamp is also inverted.

So that means somebody not only inverted the video, but they went and fixed the timestamp to make it look like it's not an inverted video.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And nobody knows who did that.

Everyone's like, I don't know.

I don't know.

Someone edited the video footage.

Someone inverted the video.

And then, right.

Yeah.

Right, right, right.

Oh my god and there is a point in the cctv footage where you do see michael proctor near the exact taillight in question and then all of a sudden timestamp jumps from 537 37 so 5 37 p.m and 37 seconds to 538 01 so there's like a good 20 seconds missing from the cctv footage and that's a good chunk of time

wow jackson later states once we inverted the video and showed it to the jurors oh my goodness, you could have heard a collective jaw drop in the courtroom.

During Buchanik's entire direct testimony, he states that this video is an accurate portrayal of what happened.

Not once does he mention, yeah, it's accurate, but it's an inverted video.

Clearly, whoever did this thought that they were going to get away with it, that the defense would not notice.

Additionally, during Buchanan's direct, he points to the guy in the back of the car as Trooper Proctor.

But now that this has been revealed, that it's a mirrored inverted video, suddenly during the cross-examination, he's like, well, I can't exactly be sure if that's Trooper Proctor in the back.

I can't exactly be sure who anybody really is.

I mean, the whole thing is shady.

The defense asks Buchananic, you were there.

You were then asked, you know, whether or not in looking at that video and watching it, whether or not Trooper Proctor approached, manipulated, touched that rear taillight at the time.

And your answer was never.

That's correct.

And while you testified that this is the video that was displayed for the jurors, correct?

That's correct.

For all appearances, it would appear that the right rear taillight of the SUV is the one facing the jurors, if you will, you know, facing the viewer, right?

AKA, it does seem like it's very misleading.

Yeah.

And you never mentioned that this was an inverted video, did you?

It was not brought up, no.

Do you agree with me that an inverted video is not accurate?

It's inverted by definition, right?

It's an accurate depiction of the events taking place.

Do you see where Mr.

Proctor went in the video?

Yes, the video depicts him going to the portion of the vehicle, but we can't tell how close he is.

So now it's like, okay, fine.

He went there, but we don't know how close he is.

But Buchanik is on this hill and he's going down with it.

He said, just because it's a mirror image doesn't mean that it's not recording the actions and what's transpiring.

I think it's just a mirror image of what's taking place.

If you see someone walking in or driving a vehicle and it's depicting the action of the vehicle being pulled in, and if it's mirrored, it's still documenting the activity that's taking place.

What?

Also, there's CCTV footage of a shorter-statured man that appears to be near Karen's vehicle.

And nobody can say who it is, but

everyone thinks it's this man right here, Chief Berkowitz, who happens to find a random piece of taillight on the Albert residence later on.

So he just walked by and grabbed a piece, type of thing?

That's what netizens think.

That's crazy.

So technically, the timeline is now making sense because Proctor lied.

The car was in Sallyport and Proctor lied about nobody touching the taillight in question he could have driven to 34th fairview and dropped the taillight pieces

so are we saying that karen's taillights previously broken yes so that there's a like a six by two missing piece right that has been there the whole time for a while karen was like oh i know that right

are we okay

Okay,

this is where it gets even crazier because remember, Karen has a missing taillight piece, and she was telling Jen McCabe and Carrie Roberts that morning when she was looking for John, my taillight's broken.

I don't know how it happened.

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

John O'Keefe has ring video footage over his garage.

And at exactly 5:07 a.m., you see Karen in the black Lexus pull out of the garage, backing out

and slightly ramming into John O'Keefe's car.

It's like a boom.

You can see there is contact made between the two cars at that exact rear taillight.

But can you see the taillight?

Is that the part that you want?

You can't.

So

the condition of the taillight was never captured on camera.

But you can see she makes contact with his car.

Right.

It's okay.

So it seems a lot of people that believe that the taillight evidence is planted, they believe that her taillight broke there.

That's where it broke.

That's where the taillight got messed up.

And then she's confused because in the footage, you don't really see any reaction.

She doesn't get out of the car.

She's already freaking out about John being missing.

She just keeps driving.

She drives off.

So people think that she's telling Carrie and Jen McCabe, literally, I don't know why my taillight is broken.

Yeah, but then wouldn't that piece of whatever left at the house or they can find some marks on John's car, maybe?

What's crazy is anytime that this video is showed, for example, it's showed to Buchanick.

The defense shows it to him.

Karen backing her car.

Yeah, and Buchanick says, as I watched the video, I observed the vehicle come near Mr.

O'Keeffe's car.

Everyone online is like, bro, it hit the car.

Like, we can see Karen Reed's car made contact with John O'Keeffe's car.

But he's like,

There is movement in the sh like they're debating whether or not contact was made

He says not with great certainty It appeared that there was movement of the tire, but I cannot say with 100% certainty that there was movement.

Logically speaking, the two vehicles would probably have had to come in contact for the tire to move.

So they had to have collided, correct?

At a slow speed, yes.

So they may contact.

Yeah.

Proctor states, you know, during the review of Mr.

O'Keeffe's ring footage, particularly the one above the garage that displays the driveway on the 29th at approximately 5.07 a.m., Miss Reed's pulling her vehicle out of the garage, backing up towards Mr.

O'Keeffe's vehicle and comes extremely close, if not slightly hitting the vehicle.

So we wanted to at least go document that there was no damage to Mr.

O'Keeffe's car.

I didn't observe any significant or any damage.

I did not observe any damage to Mr.

O'Keeffe's car.

Now, what's interesting is that a lot of people wished that there was more ring video footage because that ring camera can tell us a lot of information.

Particularly, the defense is looking for ring camera footage from around 12 in the morning when Karen comes home and they want to see that taillight because that would show that her taillight was not broken until 5.07 a.m.

That ring footage mysteriously is gone.

From where?

The ring camera.

John O'Keefe?

Yes.

And additionally, Carrie Roberts stated that when she got to John O'Keefe's house with Karen Reed and Jen McCabe, that she stood in front of Karen Reed's car and saw how messed up her taillight was.

But they only have footage of the three women walking into John's house, which is actually when Carrie Roberts said that this incident happened.

You don't even see her glancing at the taillight.

She just walks straight in.

So then, you know, people that want to give her the benefit of the doubt is like, okay, well, maybe it was on the way out.

Well, on the way out, that footage is mysteriously missing from the Ring app.

Who wrote the search warrant?

to Ring, the company, to get that data?

Proctor.

Proctor.

And Ring also provides a data log, which means it gives you all the times that somebody has accessed the app from which phone.

And after John O'Keefe's phone was seized by none other than Proctor, it accessed the Ring app.

Dang.

Wow.

AKA, he could have gone in there and a lot of denizens theorize and deleted all that.

And the Ring company has no backups.

I don't think they, if they do, they gave it to Proctor.

And he could have also just deleted that.

And I don't think the Ring camera cares enough to be like okay let me just publicly get involved in this right right right

wow but there are a few unexplainable pieces of evidence such as the microscopic you know taillight pieces that were in john's clothing they're not really microscopic they're just like small taillight pieces that were found on john's clothes Well, Buchanan testifies that when they go to the hospital, they find all of John's clothes just in one big wet pile on the floor.

They bag it up for evidence.

They don't take it to an evidence locker.

And an evidence locker is very important.

So, usually, with most police stations and police departments, evidence lockers are heavily guarded.

Not every single detective has access to an evidence locker.

And every time somebody goes into an evidence locker, it's logged.

It's very, I mean, the level of corruption to mess with evidence would be a little bit higher.

They take the clothing, the wet clothing, to the DA's office because technically they all work for the DA, the MSP, and they just lay it out in a secure room on butcher paper to dry.

The butcher paper, that's a normal thing.

You want to dry out the clothes so it doesn't get molded and contaminated.

But this area is accessible by any trooper.

And the pieces of taillight wasn't found until later?

Yes.

I mean, they don't test it until later.

But after six days of just sitting there with no log of who's been able to go near the clothing, those taillight pieces, a lot of people question the credibility and the validity of how do we know it's not been tampered with?

We don't know.

Yeah.

Especially when all the taillight pieces are already so suspicious.

Exactly.

Like, it proves nothing.

It's the same type of thing like you just found in the snow.

Exactly.

It's like, it's not really proof, is it?

What's also additionally interesting is that Karen Reed drove past a library at around 12.37 a.m.

to 12.39 p.m.

That's right after she's accused of hitting John with her car.

So she's driving from 34 Fairview back to John's house.

She drives past this library.

Her taillight should be broken and smashed.

The Commonwealth obtains CCTV footage from the library.

Karen and her team request it.

They get it.

But the exact, precise two-minute timeframe that her car passes the library is missing.

The Commonwealth says, we turned over everything we got from the Canton police.

Two minutes is missing.

Yes.

So the footage is like everything else is there?

Yeah.

But two minutes.

Uh-huh.

This is like,

what kind of world are we living in right now?

And the library is like, yeah, well, we didn't review all the footage.

We just made sure it was from that time span.

And then we turned it over to be analyzed by none other than Michael Proctor.

So the

library no longer has that footage because it's been so long.

They thought, I mean, we gave it to law enforcement.

We didn't know we had to keep it.

ABC interviews Proctor and asks him outright, did you plant the evidence?

Absolutely not.

I'm laughing because it's such a ridiculous accusation.

It's something that I would never do.

I've never done and there's no evidence of it.

This just gets worse and worse and worse.

Yeah.

ABC is like, you know, your own community, your locals, you know, why do they believe that you're planting evidence?

Proctor responds, that's just the loud minority, the silent majority.

We've had an overwhelming amount of support.

They're just not out there tweeting.

The ABC interviewers, like Alan Jackson told me that he could not understand why it was that every time you went back to the scene, new evidence would materialize.

He found that very suspicious.

Maybe he didn't read the weather report I provided in my reports.

Snow melted at a rapid pace, and the more snow that melted, the more evidence began to unearth itself.

At this point, even if you like Karen, don't like Karen, it's just too much reasonable doubt to convict her of really any crime.

I think one of the biggest reasons that people refuse to believe Karen, though, and I think that it's a small amount amount of netizens, skewing a little bit on the older side as well, is I think Karen has a very intense personality.

She really does not back down from a fight.

I also think it's very interesting.

I mean, I think this is like a good psychological study of how every single bit of her trial footage is analyzed by people who don't like her.

People interpret things differently.

And it's interesting that they want her many years, two years now after John's passing, to be crying in court when John is brought up.

But if you take it from her perspective, she's been framed.

How can she sit in a situation and be crying about her deceased boyfriend when she is about to be in prison for the rest of her life?

For killing him.

Yeah, which she didn't do to how she feels.

Yeah, I feel like that unjust is one of the most strong emotions for anybody to experience.

And I think it presents itself sometimes as angry.

Yeah.

And people think that that's not anger.

It's her being unremorseful and a bitch.

And I just don't see how that's the case.

If she genuinely did kill him and wanted to get away with it, I would imagine that she would be trying to cry in court.

Now, Karen is asked in a documentary, you're tired of being asked if you hit John with your car.

And she says, no, I'm not tired of it.

I hate answering it because I just feel like I'm being so scrutinized.

Like, did she blink three times or twice?

And did she like smirk or look to the right or down and up and or left or whatever and it just feels like so fake even though it's true i'd rather explain like everything else and i did not hit john with my car i can't make it sincere enough i hate saying it she says they say the trial became a circus it's not about justice for john it's all about the karen reed case but the karen reed case is trying to get justice for john the case is about how he died

One netizen says, I believe that Karen is maybe an unlikable girl, probably spoiled Brady personality.

I don't know where they're getting this, but I haven't seen one evidence that she's guilty of murder.

Drunk driving, yes, but they all were.

Commonwealth witnesses keep providing more doubt that she's not involved.

Others fight back.

One person says, I actually don't see it that way.

I happen to like her personality.

She seems like a sharp cookie and isn't going down for something she didn't do without a fight.

Another big witness in the Karen Reed trial is

Ryan Lochran.

I'm going to call him Lucky because that's what everyone calls him.

It's the Lucky Witness.

The Lucky Witness.

He is a defense witness.

He is called to the stand.

This man has been living in Canton for most of his life.

He knows the whole Albert family.

He's familiar with them.

He specifically went to elementary school and middle school with Chris Albert.

He worked for Chris Albert's DNE pizza, delivering pizzas for a little bit before he got a job at the Department of Public Works and became one of the regular snow plowers for the town.

He's told that day his shift is going to start at 2.30 a.m.

And there, you you know, because prior to there's no snow to plow.

And so he's going to come in and just plow the streets all night.

He gets in at 2:15.

He gets in his truck.

He gets stuck with the Franken truck.

That's what they nicknamed it because it's all a bunch of random parts fit into this snowpod truck.

A supervisor for the DPW testifies that the visibility on these snowpod trucks is pretty good, especially the ones like the Franken.

It's a big one.

So you're probably five feet up off the road and you can see, you can see a lot.

And the seat is an airlift.

So, Lucky says when it's snowing really bad and it's hazardous, he puts his seats all the way up so that his knees are touching the steering wheel because he wants to be able to see as much as you can.

On top of the snowplows, they have lights, big lights, and they're like beacon lights so that you can see everything.

Why?

Because snowplows are actually very dangerous vehicles.

They've got blades, they create snow dust clouds when they plow too quickly, and certain conditions can get very icy.

There have been many many instances where pets and humans have been killed by a snowplow.

Okay, since I've never seen one in person, yes.

What is it doing?

Cleaning the snow or yeah, it like piles all the snow to the side of the road.

So, you know, when you drive down, like, yeah, so, and that's why, okay, they have to go through the same road twice because you want to pile all the snow to the right side of the road, and you can only do like one direction at a time.

But that's why it's this is a very important witness because you don't just look forward when you're driving a snowplow you have to look at the sides in fact sometimes the sides are more important because that's where someone could get killed i mean obviously you could run over someone and that's also dangerous but the sides are very important

lucky is on that shift and fairview road is one of the roads that he is assigned to cover that night he knows the albert residence which again isn't shocking he's from canton that night when he passes the albert residence the house would have been on his right this is the first time he passes this he's driving the same way that every other partygoer has been leaving this albert residence at what time 2 30 2 45 a.m okay he's plowing the street he sees the lawn he sees the flag pull pole everything he doesn't see anything or anyone on the lawn at 2 45 a.m

2 45 not a sing not even like a bump nothing nothing wow he keeps plowing And then now he's got to do another street and then he's got to come back down the other side because he's, that's, that's that's how you do it.

And so he comes back down and this is around 3.30.

And this is when he does notice something.

There's now a car parked in front.

A Ford Edge.

Just parked right in front of the flagpole.

And who drives Ford Edge?

One of the Alberts.

Chris Albert?

I believe one of them likes a Ford Edge too, but it is believed to be Brian Albert's Ford Edge.

But it wasn't there?

It was in the driveway, allegedly.

But now it's on the side of the road.

And so 2:45 to 3:30, you said.

Well, he passes at 2:45.

He doesn't see anything.

2:30, he comes back, he sees a Ford Edge parked.

And he thought it was weird because he didn't say anything at 2:45.

And you're thinking, well, why is he even remembering where cars are parked?

Because you're not supposed to park your car on the street when the snow plows are coming through during a blizzard.

In fact, Lucky is actually told if there is a resident's car parked, you have to call it in.

You have to call your supervisor.

They try to wake up the resident to move their car, or they'll come tow your car because the streets need to be plowed.

You can't just inconvenience everyone because you want to park on the street.

He thought for that reason it's weird.

Also, the fact that the Alberts never really park on the side of the street, he just thought it was weird.

But he doesn't call it in because he said, out of respect for the Alberts, he just didn't want to.

He wanted to be courteous because I guess, you know, he had been friends with Chris.

He had worked for Chris at one point.

He's like, I'm not going to tattletale on the Alberts, but he did think it was weird.

He was like, it's fine.

I mean, because I guess he had already done that side, but it's weird.

He notates it, he thinks about it, and then he keeps on his snowplow route.

And then later, he comes back down to like keep doing his route because I mean, the snow keeps piling on.

And that's when he notices emergency vehicles all over the Albert residence.

And he's so confused what's going on.

He can't even get into Fairview because they're blocking him.

So, wow.

So, you think like Brian waited till the snowplow is passed by the street?

That's it.

And then move the car?

Netizens believe that after the first time Lucky drove by with the snowplow, he believed that the snowplow was no longer going to be there.

And they moved the Ford edge to the side of the street so that it could block the street view for anyone driving by as they're moving John's body.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And now, how does Brian explain that, Brian Albert?

They say that never happened.

They're like, this man doesn't know what he's talking about.

Okay.

It's crazy because Lucky is one of the most likable witnesses.

Karen actually cries when Lucky's on the stand.

Really?

Why?

Well, he's like her lucky witness.

And on top of that,

he's just a very likable guy.

He's worked a lot of jobs.

He just, I mean, to give you an idea, I don't know how to tell you someone's nice without giving you an example.

Otherwise, it's just like, he's nice.

That night when he was plowing the roads, he had hit one of those

basketball nets, like portable ones that you put water in the bottom.

And someone had left it near the street.

His snowplow, he saw it, but he couldn't break fast enough.

And so he hit it.

So he called it in and said, I hit this residence basketball hoop.

He just seems like a really nice guy.

And so he's being questioned by Hank Brennan, Spanky, on the second trial.

And Spanky's just aggressive for no reason.

He's saying, isn't it true that you've had pressure from social media to testify a certain way?

And Lucky firmly rejects all insinuations of that over and over again until he finally says, I did not know that I was required to testify a certain way.

At the time, I was also dealing with the loss of my wife.

I was not paying any attention to social media.

And Brennan just responds, sorry for your loss.

But you are aware during that that there had been pressure on you to testify a certain way.

And everyone's like, sorry for your loss, but question mark?

It just felt really cruel.

Dang.

So he's called Lucky because his statement is kind of like a very important saving.

I think that's his original nickname.

Oh, really?

Yeah, but it's fitting.

And he just seems very credible, reliable.

And there's no reason for him to lie.

But what is weird, another layer of frustration in this case, because the prosecutors keep trying to question Lucky's timing of things.

They're like,

We don't know for sure that you drove down that street at that time.

Are you sure it was this time?

Because last time you said maybe it was this time.

Is your memory not correct?

They're being really annoying about it.

DPW trucks, the snow plows, they have GPS systems.

And so the defense and everyone is like, Okay, just pull it up then because we everyone trusts Lucky.

Lucky has no reason to lie.

Coincidentally,

yeah, they said it's not working that night of the blizzard.

Happens sometimes, they say

all the troopers are asked, hey, so when you found out through the snowpowder driver that sometime around that night, he saw a Ford Edge parked outside.

Because, I mean, every witness inside of the party said after everybody left, we fell asleep.

So even if it's an innocent thing, it's still weird.

It goes against their statements, does it not?

Well, Buchanik is like, yeah, yeah, I know.

But I didn't investigate it.

I didn't go and see if any of the Alberts own a Ford Edge.

He just is so proud of that.

Toli, on the other hand, he says, yes, I'm familiar with it.

But he says that his investigation into the Ford Edge was that he believed that Lucky was lying.

Thus, he was not going to investigate the Ford Edge.

His investigation consists of I investigated it by thinking about how I felt about it.

And I felt like I didn't like it.

So I no longer investigated it.

Is FBI still investigating this whole investigation or no?

Oh, you said last time that.

Spanky says that they're no longer.

Okay, the prosecutor's office is saying they're no longer.

They closed the investigation.

Karen is saying, hey, a month before they came out and said that the FBI is no longer investigating,

I received certain documents that insinuated that it was an open investigation.

And she's saying, listen, I haven't heard from the FBI.

I haven't been alerted.

Neither have our attorneys.

But I just wouldn't trust the prosecutors.

So prosecutor has incentive to say that to prove that, hey, we have FBI found nothing wrong with our investigation.

Yes.

Versus Karen was saying, like, well, from my

insight, they are.

Yeah.

And we, none of us know, actually, if FBI is still working on it.

It's every, it's like, hush, hush.

Because the feds are usually pretty quiet about what they're doing until

they're not quiet about what

they release that.

Yeah.

If there.

That would be

like all of the.

Oh, my gosh.

If there is a conspiracy to the level at which a lot of netizens believe there is, that would be one hell of an FBI investigation.

Making this whole Ford Edge situation even stranger is that when Nicole Albert is testifying, she's asked about the cars parked in the driveway at the Albert residence.

And she says, I had my my car, which is a Cadillac SUV.

My husband had his work car.

And then we had, I think the kids had like a Ford Explorer.

And then another, like, I think one of the kids was driving a Ford Escape, maybe.

Interestingly enough, she lists the make and model of every single car except her husband's work car, which happens to be a Ford Edge.

Oh, she says work car,

not Ford Edge.

No.

The defense attorney is asking Nicole, does a Ford Edge have any significance to you in this case?

I've heard it talked about, yeah.

Nicole says she did not purposely omit it.

She was too busy thinking about all the different makes and models of all the other cars.

So, Chris Albert takes the stand and he's asked what he does for work.

And he says, I own a small pizza shop, completely just neglecting that he's on the select board for Canton, which, when he is asked, and it's interesting because he doesn't bring it up for most of his direct, later in cross, he'll be very defensive about it.

He's like, well, I was recently elected.

So as a town selectman, you have some power, do you not?

I'm one of the five selectmen.

Okay, one of five is that's a lot of power.

Chris says that he knows John O'Keefe for a while now.

Quote, he became my neighbor, and I guess just from me driving by his house and coming home, I saw him, would wave to him and stuff.

That's how I initially became to know who John was.

Over the years, he was friendly with some other folks that I was friends with.

So we'd maybe be out occasionally and I would bump into him.

And he'd also come to my pizza shop.

He would take his nephew to my pizza shop a lot.

It was not uncommon for him to stop by a couple days a week, usually just to grab a slice.

That's what he says.

Karen says that the only person that ever made John O'Keefe very, very angry, however, was this guy, Colin Albert.

He would always intentionally leave beer bottles.

and beer cans on John's lawn.

He's not even old enough to drink, by the way.

She remembers an incident in spring of 2020 where the home security system went off at john's house she's staying the night over she remembers john bolting out of bed she's running down the stairs after him and she looks out the window they see colin albert and a bunch of teenagers in the front yard and they scream at john when he comes out go yourself

That's crazy.

John screams back at them, get the fuck out of here.

The next morning, they go outside and the lawn is littered with a dozen empty bud-like cans thrown into the bushes.

She thought it was interesting because Colin Albert was 17, and this is the only person that John O'Keefe has ever had problems with, which netizens speculate, what if John O'Keefe already felt like he was doing some nefarious drug dealings at that age?

Yeah.

And that's why he's being

crazy.

Yes.

And he's, he's ballsy.

He has no fear.

He thinks

daddy and other daddy and all the mommies and daddies are going to protect him.

And I guess it's true.

It's happening if that were the case, if it is true.

In any event, in any event, if you do see colin albert on the stand aside from his profound inability to remember a single occurrence that has not happened in the past 0.2 seconds colin albert is nothing like Colin Albert on the stand.

There are videos of him that the defense have dug up where he's threatening hockey teams, rival hockey teams.

He doesn't even play hockey, but he's sending video messages to high school hockey teams saying, advantage, boys, pull the f up.

I'll f you up.

In another one, he says, quote, KO, bang, bang, in terms of what he's going to do to them.

For Halloween, you see a picture of him in a prisoner's uniform with a teardrop tattoo.

He's a murderer for Halloween.

Bro, what is going on?

There's another picture of him with his parents, and all three of them are flicking off the camera.

And it's believed that he has like a beer can in his hand.

And again, he's underage, and his parents are just drinking with him.

Yeah, he is not the studious, soon-to-be college student that he is trying so hard to sell his image as on the stand.

He is a young kid with a bright future.

He's not a young kid with a bright future.

He's a very scary kid.

He's the type of kid that you run into this teenager in an aisle at Target, you're going to want to cry.

And you're, I don't know, 30.

That's him.

Wow.

Wow and what's even weirder is with this connection remember how I said Chris Albert is the one that invited John O'Keefe to the waterfall bar that night the text message that he sends him is quote get over here then another text message reads if not I'm gonna f up your lawn laughing crying emoji Chris Albert says this is a joke it's a hee-hee haha joke inside joke because John O'Keefe loves his lawn he's very nitpicky about his lawn he's like one of those lawn guys He likes his grass to be green.

If not, I will f up your lawn, haha.

It sounds passive-aggressive.

It sounds tense.

It sounds like the type of text that you get where, hmm.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

To send a text message like that, I would assume that you would have to be pretty close friends.

Yes.

But they're not.

Exactly.

And there was already problems with the lawn.

Yeah.

I would not feel comfortable sending this to anybody.

No.

additionally, I will say there is a weird moment during Chris's cross-examination where he's asked about what John O'Keefe's name is in Julie Albert's phone.

So, Julie Albert, presumptuously, I guess she had John O'Keefe's phone number for a while because they're neighbors.

And I imagine that if they had any neighborly conversations, perhaps Julie was in charge of that while Chris is running DE Pizza.

On her phone, John O'Keefe is saved as the contact,

the N-E-B-E-R, the Nebber, and then the last name is C-R-A-C-K-E-R, which I think is supposed to be used in a derogatory way.

I'm not entirely sure, so I don't want to risk saying it.

But it's a character from a movie, a cartoon, and it's someone that is obsessed with their lawn.

It's like one of those grumpy neighbors that's like, get off my lawn.

And Chris says, this whole thing was a joke.

It was a joke because John was upset that one of the kids was cutting through his lawn to get to school.

And he's like, and it wasn't even Colin.

it was my other son.

Do we believe him?

Probably not.

Do we believe that's the reason that John was upset?

Probably not.

But that is the reasoning that Chris Albert gives.

And he's like, I don't know what you guys are talking about.

We were all friendly with each other.

But the fact that Colin Albert is allegedly leaving beer cans on John O'Keeffe's lawn, John O'Keeffe has real problems with Colin Albert.

Julie Albert has him saved as a very mean character on her phone, having to do with his lawn.

And then Chris Albert, the night of texts him come or i'm gonna up your lawn laughing emoji yeah yeah yeah it just feels like something is off there and if you're wondering okay well if that is some sort of motive or speculation or theory that people have how do they get away with it well chris albert's wife julie albert is best friends with a woman named courtney proctor this is trooper proctor's sister chris albert himself attended courtney proctor's wedding they've all known each other for past 20 years now Karen's attorney is asking Julie.

Now, in terms of the two investigators who did come on, you knew one of them quite well, did you not?

I knew them.

I wouldn't say quite well, but I knew them.

Okay, and when you say knew them, him.

I'm sorry, him.

Michael Proctor was the brother of one of your close friends, correct?

Correct.

You are close friends with Courtney Proctor, correct?

I am.

And you have a sister, Jill Daniels, who also went to school with Sergeant Goode.

But you have a sister that is very close friends with Courtney Proctor.

You would agree that Jill Daniels is also a lifelong best friend of Courtney Proctor, correct?

Yes, she is.

Julie Albert is asked by Karen's attorney about her relationship, and she's just

saying yes, but at the same time, she's also being very evasive.

At another point during her cross, she's asked about, okay, you're very close with Courtney Proctor.

And she says, How would you define very?

You talk regularly, correct?

Yes.

You text each other, correct?

Yes.

And you also talk by phone, very rarely.

This is when Karen's defense attorney has a little moment.

David Yannetti is like, wait,

because he starts on his next question.

He goes, is it fair to say, wait, did you just say you very rarely talk on the phone?

Usually it's text.

But you do stand by that testimony that you talk to Courtney Proctor very rarely on the phone.

This is never good.

This is never good when you are on the stand or you're talking talking to an attorney and they say, okay, so I need you to commit to this statement.

I need you to commit 10 more times because you just said it.

So commit again because you can't go back now.

So let's just drive it home.

Yeah, yeah.

Is he about to pull up some kind of receipt?

That's so good.

Let me ask you this.

Between February 1st, 2022 and September 6th, 2022, did you speak very rarely with Courtney Proctor?

I don't recall.

Were you using Courtney Proctor as an intermediary to communicate with Michael Proctor about this case?

No, I was not.

Are you aware that between February 1st, 2022 and September 6th, 2022, you and Courtney Proctor, this is not including text messages, in-person meetings, spoke over the phone 67 times?

Objection?

Were you aware of that?

No, I don't know the exact amount.

Do you deny that you spoke 67 times?

I don't deny it, but I don't recall the exact amount of times.

Okay, so you don't deny that you spoke 67 times.

You still want to maintain your testimony that you only talked very rarely with Courtney Proctor during that time period.

I just don't remember the exact amount of times.

You know that my client, Karen Reed, was arrested in connection with this case on February 1st, 2022, do you not?

I do.

You spoke to Courtney Proctor that date for 12 minutes by phone, correct?

I don't recall exactly.

Because Julie has amnesia, Karen's attorney gives her a sheet to refresh her memory.

Likely her call logs, cell data.

February 2nd, 2022 is the day that Karen Reed is arraigned.

Julie talks to Courtney three times before 9 a.m.

Then after the arraignment, they talk again for another 27 minutes.

Julie does not recall any of these phone calls.

She definitely does not recall the contents of the phone calls either.

Did you tell Courtney Proctor during any of the 67 phone calls that you were a witness in her brother's case?

I don't remember.

Defense attorney Yannetti brings up the fact that Julie said that she rarely talks to Courtney Proctor on the phone and he says, when I asked you how often you talked to Courtney Proctor, you could have chosen any word in the English language to answer that question, correct?

Correct.

What was the word you chose?

Not often.

I don't remember exactly.

Rarely.

Rarely, yes.

That was your word, correct?

It could have been.

I don't really recall.

I don't recall.

You don't recall telling this jury yesterday that when I asked you about how often you spoke to Courtney Proctor by phone, you said rarely?

I don't remember.

what's your definition of rarely not daily rarely doesn't mean 67 phone conversations within a seven-month period does it uh 67

months and how long in about seven months 67 times it's not a lot i i wouldn't think it's a lot in seven months Netizens were so frustrated by this testimony, they comment, Julia remembers everything except for the phone conversations and everything else.

Netizens think that she clearly had time to think about it the next day because she testified over two days.

I mean, three times in one day is that even that's a lot.

Side note: this is the glorious moment when Julia Albert is asked about which troopers came to her house to interview her, and she says, Trooper Proctor, and I don't remember the next guy.

I think it was like Trooper Bukaki.

And she says it with such a straight face.

She calls Buketic Bukaki.

That's his name now.

Yeah.

That's his name now.

It is believed that there is

like an online social media investigator who has nicknamed him Trooper Bukaki.

And so it's theorized that she's very much keeping up with his reports on this case.

Someone else named him Bukaki.

Yes.

That's dick.

Yeah.

Okay, he's going to be in the next episode, but he's pretty close with Karen Reed.

And he was actually one of the first people to really actively focus on this case and to focus on the fact that he believes that Karen Reed was framed.

And she clearly is keeping up with his

coverage.

Yeah.

Because the way that she says Officer Bukaki, I mean, I don't think she knows what that word means.

I don't think she gets the joke.

Because the way she said it with her full chest.

Oh, she thought that was actually his name.

Yeah.

Whoa.

Yeah.

It's just a very uncomfortable moment.

So Bukaki is like, what?

He's cocky.

Is that.

but Julie Albert maintains that it really doesn't impact the investigation or her status as a potential witness.

However, another group chat is unearthed from February 24th, 2022.

This is less than a month after John's death.

Julia Albert texts Michael Proctor in a group chat between her, her sister, Courtney Proctor, Michael Proctor, and she texts him, This is the weekend I've been waiting for, Michael.

Please send me ski videos of Courtney Proctor.

Don't, if she doesn't share them with me, laughing emoji.

What video?

I guess they're going on a family skiing trip and Julia is like, she's not going to send me her skiing videos and I want to embarrass her.

So Michael, you got to send them to me.

Jackson is staring at Proctor.

He's also bringing this up to Proctor.

This is sent less than a month that you had been assigned to the investigation in which Julia Albert is a witness, correct?

Correct.

And her husband, Albert, Chris Albert, has a connection as a witness, correct?

Correct.

And you didn't mention a thing about your relationship with Julie Albert, Chris Albert, or Colin Albert in any report that you've ever drafted in this case, did you?

I did not.

Michael Proctor's text messages to his own sister, Courtney Proctor, were also brought up during the court, during the two trials.

And it's mainly because the FBI dug them up and gave it both to the Commonwealth and the defense.

Without FBI?

Yeah.

30,000 pages for just Michael Proctor's.

30,000 pages?

Yeah.

What?

Of all his data.

Because I think when you add all the metadata, it becomes longer.

Oh.

Now, Michael Proctor texts his sister on January 29th, 2022, the day of the investigation.

He's texting her, what's up?

She says, what?

Why?

Just found a frozen to death on a front lawn in Canton.

Actually, just interviewed Jen McCabe.

She says she knows you.

Cut this shit.

Yeah, she knows Jack very well.

She's really good friends with Julie.

Her sister is married to Brian Albert.

You still working?

Yeah, gonna be out for a while.

Homicide.

The Canton thing is a homicide.

Don't say a word to anyone.

Of course not.

At the very least, it's suspicious.

This is your livelihood.

Julie and Chris were at the bar with the victim and the girlfriend.

Gotta interview them.

So he's already telling his sister, I'm gonna interview your best friend soon.

But he doesn't for a really long time.

Now, February 10th, 2022, Courtney texts Michael again.

How did it go at Julie's?

She was so nervous.

So this is what?

11 days after?

She was so nervous.

Mm-hmm.

Ha ha ha ha.

What was this?

A job interview, like recommendation from your bestie.

And why would she be nervous?

She's not even at the house.

Exactly.

Why are you nervous, Julie?

Exactly.

Why are you nervous, Julie?

It has nothing to do with you.

It's nothing to do with, yeah.

Nothing to do with you, nothing to do with your husband, nothing to do with your son, right?

Right.

Right.

And nervous is a very specific word.

I think talking to any investigator would make me feel uncomfortable.

But I think when there is a death, I don't know if nervous would be the word that I would use if you are innocent and in Julie's position.

He says, ha ha ha ha.

It was fine.

Just a quick convo.

Jackson asks Proctor and the cross, were you reporting the progress of your investigation back to your sister, Courtney Proctor?

No, absolutely not.

But you did say that the conversation of the formal interview went fine.

It was just a quick convo, correct?

Proctor tries to explain away these messages saying, I was just kind of letting her know I was working.

I mean, obviously, I didn't share anything specific.

I wouldn't share anything specific on cases with my family or anyone.

It was just kind of an overall innocent conversation.

But you did,

Proctor.

You have shared too much information.

You have shared things that are so insane that I don't even want to know the things that you haven't shared.

Jackson asks him, Trooper Proctor, Julie and Chris Albert were not actually treated like witnesses in a murder investigation.

They were treated more like friends, wouldn't you agree?

Absolutely not.

You provided your sister with updates and important advancements during the course of your investigation in this case, did you not?

Periodically, I made her aware of some newsworthy stuff.

There's also a random text message that's thrown in there.

I don't know why these were chosen, but one text is from Proctor telling his sister about how he's starving and just wants to go home.

And his sister responds, yeah, but is dinner gonna be waiting?

Ha ha ha ha.

I don't know if she's taking jabs at Elizabeth Proctor, Trooper Proctor's wife.

I don't know.

Yeah, what is that?

Yeah.

It's a weird comment.

Then, Later, Courtney texts Michael Proctor.

I just saw Julie, and she said when this is all over, she wants to get you a thank-you gift.

Oh, shit.

He responds, get Elizabeth one.

Elizabeth is Trooper Proctor's wife.

Elizabeth, yeah, I guess her and Chris were friends with John, and she's so proud of you for leading this.

That's what Courtney says.

John?

Yeah.

Who's John?

Oh, Julie and Chris are friends with John O'Keefe.

And Julie is telling Courtney Proctor, I'm so proud of your brother for leading this investigation.

Courtney Proctor says, Elizabeth, like, why would she get a gift for your wife?

Michael Proctor says she's been stuck with the kids for the last 10 nights.

Yeah, but she knew what life was married to a cop.

Oh, she doesn't like Elizabeth.

I don't think so.

Courtney doesn't like Elizabeth.

No.

Eventually, another text message is unearthed where Proctor texts his sister that he hopes Karen Reid self-exits.

And he's asked about this on an ABC interview, and he says that that comment was made in jest.

It's a figure of speech.

He's like, you know, hopefully she kills herself.

That's a figure of speech.

The ABC interviewer is like, that's a figure of speech.

Do you use that commonly?

I mean, yes, but not commonly, but it's just a figure of speech I made in jest.

It wasn't literally like, I hope she self-exits.

In the cross-examination, Jackson, rightfully furious, asks Proctor, you believe, Trooper Proctor, that your life would be much easier if Karen Reed was just dead, didn't you?

No, no, no, no.

Like I said, it was a figure of speech.

My emotion got the best of me based on, you know, that Miss Reed hit Mr.

O'Keefe with her vehicle and left him to die on the side of the the road.

But netizens are not convinced.

And if you feel bad at all for his wife, Elizabeth Proctor, don't.

June 9th, 2022, Michael Proctor texts his wife, Elizabeth, waiting to lock this whack job up.

This is after the grand jury indictment, and he's asked by the prosecution.

And again, as far as the terminology that you used in the text message to your wife, why is that?

Again, unprofessional message should not have been sent.

And he's just saying it's regrettable.

But the effect is not lost on the jurors.

I mean, the lead investigator has had it out for Karen Reed since the moment that this is all started.

On top of that, Jen McCabe during all of this, her car was spotted outside of Trooper Proctor's house.

Why is she at Trooper Proctor's house?

She's talking to Trooper Proctor's wife, Elizabeth.

And why is she talking to Elizabeth Proctor?

Well, I guess, first of all, they're friends.

And Buchanick tries to answer this question during his cross-examination.

He says, Elizabeth Proctor communicated with those individuals due to the harassment that they've all sustained.

So with the crazy behavior that's been imposed on them and the torturous harassment that they've endured, the traumatic experiences that they've had to live through, they've communicated.

And yes, I've since learned about that.

I mean, this whole thing...

What is he saying exactly?

He's saying that Jen McCabe went over to Trooper Proctor's house to talk to Elizabeth Proctor, his wife, because both of them are facing harassment.

Jen McCabe is getting harassed.

Elizabeth Proctor is getting harassed because her husband is absolutely crazy.

Elizabeth Proctor is not someone that a lot of people feel sympathy for.

She does an NBC interview where she states that her husband is being portrayed as some sort of villain in this case and it's unfair.

She says he is my best friend.

He's an incredible father.

He's loyal.

He's a hard worker.

And it's so frustrating as his wife to see that he's painted one way.

And who I know him as and his family and friends know him is the complete opposite.

The no Newts Proctor we're talking about here?

Yeah, and I'm just like, I don't think you know this man because that's not, I don't think we have it wrong.

Elizabeth says, since these text messages have gone public, their family has been on the receiving end of death threats and weird voicemails about people wanting to kidnap their children and send them to CPS to live with appropriate parents and to kidnap their dogs.

Which, do I think that those are appropriate?

No, but she's continuing to enable him.

She says, these last two and a half years have been a nightmare for our family.

Was there a moment, she's being asked by the journalist, was there a moment where you had to say to him, is there something to this?

Is there something you need to tell me?

No, never.

It never would have crossed my mind that he would do anything unethical with his job because I know how much he does the right thing and how much he cared about his job and cared about getting justice for Officer John O'Keefe.

Do they even talk about John O'Keefe in their investigation?

Barely ever.

Right?

Like, I feel like none of them.

And that's why Karen Reed said something that pissed off a lot of people, including John O'Keefe's family.

But outside the courthouse one day, she says, Nobody has been fighting harder for justice for John O'Keefe than I have.

Because if she's acquitted, perhaps they will look for the next who did actually kill him.

But naturally, it was very divisive.

Elizabeth says that she knew about the nature of the text messages before the trial, but she didn't know to the extent.

She said that when her husband was testifying, she told him, You got to just own it.

And while he was reading those text messages in the courtroom, she felt, quote, very uncomfortable.

You're his wife.

Like, how did that feel for you?

We've had so many conversations since then.

And it's like, he's incredibly remorseful.

But, you know, I'm not making any excuses for his behavior because it's inexcusable.

The language that was used, it was bad.

But at the end of the day, you know, it was the evidence pointed to her, not his bias.

Another time, she just fully states, I fully support my husband.

Karen Reed is a murderer.

Even Proctor's sister stands by him.

She released a statement that says, egregiously false statements from Karen Reed and her defense team.

He has been defamed, maligned, and falsely labeled corrupt by the alleged murderer, her family, her defense team, and a mob of her followers.

How would you feel if the contents of your personal phone were questionably released to the public without full context?

Um, I don't think we need full context.

And also, he tried to give us the context.

It didn't, it made it worse.

When talking to Dateline, yeah, Michael Proctor's out here doing interviews on his green grass lawn for Dateline.

He says, people love a conspiracy.

What do you want to say to anyone who believes that you framed Karen Reed?

It didn't happen.

And then on ABC, because it's a press tour now, he's talking about, he says, I 100% understand why people would think that any case that I've touched is a little weird, but when you have a fellow police officer around my age, two kids of his own, it generates an emotion.

And I express those emotions in a negative way, which I shouldn't have.

I shouldn't have been texting my friends anything.

The Proctor Couple later would argue, I would ask, what's in your phone?

What's in your private phone?

Your personal phone, your private conversations.

And I would answer, not that.

That's definitely not in there at all, or anything similar to that.

That's for sure.

Whatever was on his phone had to get the FBI involved.

So I would say, definitely, not that.

One criminal justice professor comments on this case.

When the FBI steps in, that's usually an indication that they are in possession of some information that is extremely damaging to the law enforcement agencies involved.

And that leaves people wondering: are they going to investigate DNE Pizza, the FBI?

People are commenting reviews for DNE Pizza.

One review reads, I was talking about how bad the food was, and the service wasn't what I had hoped it would be.

The ambiance wasn't worth writing home about.

Speaking about homes, Colin was never in the house.

Others emphasize some of Albert's Boston accents, writing, chicken parm was cold and mediocre at best.

Owner was very rude and called me a looza when I asked for it to be reheated.

Someone asked for a salad with a side of side bar.

So I'm convinced.

I've just like, I've never heard a Boston accent until this case.

You heard like

hundreds of hours of Boston accent.

Yes, and what's driving me crazy is I was talking to the RMT.

I kept saying cop and they're like, you, and I keep like extending cop.

Side note, it appears that they're also either using AI to respond to their reviews or they're also playing into all of this Because one review reads, I found pieces of what appeared to be a cracked plastic taillight in my pizza.

Probably fell out of the owner's pocket.

The pepperoni and sausage had the taste and smell of a German shepherd that had been dead for a few years.

One star, the establishment responds, David, we sincerely apologize for your experience and appreciate your feedback.

We are committed to improving and ensuring better quality for our customers.

Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Another review reads, the atmosphere I gave to you because the place looked nice from the outside, but I was never inside the place.

The restaurant responds, we appreciate your comments about the atmosphere and we are sorry you didn't get to experience the inside of our restaurant.

We hope to see you soon for a better experience.

This is when I started thinking, maybe it's not AI, because one review reads, the pizza is absolutely to die for.

The Alberts absolutely killed it.

Buy some extras to put in the garage and freeze it.

How slong to cook from cold?

Depends on the oven temperature.

This pizza shop is easily found right on the street.

Couldn't even miss it in the snow.

Our dog Chloe loved it so much, she almost took off my arm trying to steal a slice.

Unfortunately, due to random renovations, you can't use the restroom.

It's very cold inside.

It's definitely a cover-up type of situation.

To which the restaurant responds, Thanks a lot, Peter.

So glad you loved the pizza and that Chloe enjoyed it too.

Laughing, crying emoji.

We'll definitely keep your feedback in mind about the restroom situation.

Come back anytime for more delicious slices.

That is wild.

I'm thinking AI did not write that one.

Then who wrote it?

Someone here.

Are they just plain dumb?

No, they're also being passive-aggressive.

Oh, oh.

Yeah.

Another one reads: The Albert Pizza Special, available exclusively at Canton's most controversial pizzeria, comes topped with thick layers of confusion, a crust of connections, baked in secrecy, pepperoni slices that keep mysteriously shifting places, olives no one remembers ordering, finished with a drizzle of we can't comment on an ongoing investigation, and don't even ask who delivered it.

Half the town swears it would never arrive, the other half says it's been sitting outside the whole time.

To which the response is, Thank you for your creative feedback, George.

We appreciate your input and apologize for your experience.

But one review just reads, How's Long to Make a Bad Pizza?

And that is where I leave you with the very lengthy part three.

And the next episode is going to be the final episode.

That is the chicken parm pizza shop DE theory that has been kind of running amok on social media recently.

But Chris Albert is one to keep an eye out for.

He will be in the next episode as well.

And Chloe, we're going to get to Chloe in the next episode, some of the accident reconstructionists.

But Chris is an interesting man because there is a very strong connection.

He's not just friends with Officer Link.

They had an incident where they got into a very intense fight with some people outside of a bar many years ago.

But even before then, Chris is just the man with all the connections.

If you thought Brian Albert was connected, this one is connected.

He's connected to Chief Kenneth Berkowitz, who recommended him to be one of the five select men.

He's friends with all these people.

Michael Lank, Michael Lank was willing to get into a bar fight for Chris Albert, but he's also connected to none other

than Auntie Bev, the judge presiding over Karen Reed's case.

Why?

Well, it all starts when Chris Albert

allegedly murdered a man.

And that will be in part four.

Stay tuned, stay safe, and I will see you in the next one.

Sponsored by Novo Nordisk.

Hola.

Hey, you speak Spanish, but do you speak liver?

Okay.

People with conditions like obesity, type 2 diabetes, or high blood pressure could be at risk for a potentially life-threatening liver disease called MASH or metabolic dysfunction-associated steatohepatitis.

Whoa, I could be at risk.

I'll ask my doctor.

You're bilingual.

No, I speak liver now.

I'm trilingual.

Ask your doctor about your risk and if you should be screened for MASH.

Learn more at speakliver.com.

A lifetime original movie.

My daughter has been missing for 10 days.

I just want answers.

Inspired by real stories.

Please forgive me, Mama.

Her daughter's missing.

Feels like Lori's vanished into thin air.

And only mom knows where she is.

Have you lost your mind?

Starring Kyla Pratt.

In order for me to continue to live, you have to die.

I'm sorry, but you did this to yourself.

Girl in the cellar.

Premieres Saturday at 8.

Only on lifetime.