#409: I Received A Message From A Serial Killer’s Wife Asking For Help…

Speaker 1 Welcome back to Listen to Your Heart.

Speaker 2 I'm Jerry.

Speaker 3 And I'm Jerry's Heart. Today's topic: Repatha Evalokimab.

Speaker 1 Heart, why'd you pick this one?

Speaker 3 Well, Jerry, for people who have had a heart attack, like us, diet and exercise might not be enough to lower the risk of another one.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 3 To help know if we're at risk, we should be getting our LDLC, our bad cholesterol, checked and talking to our doctor.

Speaker 1 I'm listening.

Speaker 3 And if it's still too high, Repatha can be added to a statin to lower our LDLC and our heart attack risk.

Speaker 1 Hmm. Guess it's time to ask about Repatha.

Speaker 4 Do not take Repatha if you're allergic to it. Serious allergic reactions can occur.
Get medical help right away if you have trouble breathing or swallowing.

Speaker 4 Swelling of the face, lips, tongue, throat, or arms.

Speaker 4 Common side effects include runny nose, sore throat, common cold symptoms, flu or flu-like symptoms, back pain, high blood sugar, and redness, pain, or bruising at the injection site.

Speaker 1 Listen to your heart.

Speaker 3 Ask your doctor about Rapatha.

Speaker 2 Learn more at rapatha.com or call 1-844-RAPATHA.

Speaker 5 This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game?

Speaker 5 Well, the name your price tool from Progressive, you can find options that fit your budget and potentially lower your bills.

Speaker 5 Try it at progressive.com, Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Price and coverage match limited by state law, not available in all states.

Speaker 1 Ramble.

Speaker 2 Bada bing, bada boo.

Speaker 5 Three months ago, a very interesting question pops up on the subreddit, relationship advice. It's where people go to ask strangers on the internet for advice for their relationship.

Speaker 5 It's a 29-year-old man and he writes, I don't really have anyone else to talk to about this. This is the final option.
I made a Reddit account.

Speaker 5 I was browsing through Reddit to see if anybody else had any sort of relationship trouble that was similar to mine, but I can't find anything. So I've hit rock bottom and I'm going to write this post.

Speaker 5 I have been in a very serious relationship with my 28-year-old girlfriend for a little over a year. I'm gonna refer to her as Jay.

Speaker 5 We have a lot of mutual friends, so I can't even ask a friend about this. Not that I think that they can even help me, regardless.

Speaker 5 I feel like they'll just see her differently and treat her differently. Anyway, my girlfriend and I have been looking into moving in together.

Speaker 5 Things have been getting really serious, and we talked about how to even split the finances and all that good adult stuff. I've been really excited about this new chapter with my girlfriend.

Speaker 5 I even started casually looking at rings a couple of months ago because honestly, I feel like she's the one for me.

Speaker 5 She's smart, smart, beautiful, funny, loved by nearly everyone that she meets, and just overall, the best person that I've ever met. Now on to the issue.

Speaker 5 About two weeks ago, I started spending the weekend at her place. We usually alternate weekends at one another's apartment, and I ended up catching some stomach bug on Sunday.

Speaker 5 So I took a sick day off work on Monday, and Jay, my girlfriend, offered for me to stay at her apartment since I didn't feel good enough to drive home. And she was really sweet about it.

Speaker 5 She offered to make me soup when she got off work. I mean, she works 10 to 6.
So I was mostly alone during the day, mostly sleeping and spending time in the bathroom, throwing up.

Speaker 5 OP, the poster, ends up throwing up in her bathroom floor. He doesn't make it to the toilet.
There's vomit everywhere and he's looking for a way to clean this up, trying to find her linen closet.

Speaker 5 He finds some rags that look like you would use them to clean. They're on the very top shelf.
He's feeling weak. He's feeling frustrated.
He doesn't have a ladder. He doesn't know where anything is.

Speaker 5 So he just kind of jumps and yanks them down. And a bunch of other stuff come falling down too, including this very small shoebox.

Speaker 5 He says, I mean, I really don't like going through her things when she's not around because we really value and respect each other's privacy. I completely trust her.

Speaker 5 But as I was cleaning up everything that fell out of the shoebox, I happened to notice something really odd and I just couldn't help but be a little nosy. It was an envelope.

Speaker 5 addressed to her and the return address was a prison in another state.

Speaker 5 As I looked at the other stuff in the shoebox, I found way more envelopes just like it, as well well as some drawings. I mean, I will admit, in a moment of weakness, I could not help myself.

Speaker 5 I had to see what was going on. This is where I feel the need to explain that I found it so odd because my girlfriend has told me everything about her past, her family, her childhood.

Speaker 5 I can name every single pet that she's ever had. I've met her parents, both of her siblings, and quite a few of our other family members, and not once, I mean, at least...

Speaker 5 anyone that she knows not once did she tell me she knows anyone in prison or that she's communicating with anyone in prison So as it turns out these letters dated way back before we even started dating and the most recent one was from three months ago Obviously, I didn't see the ones she sent because they're in the prison, but the ones she received are all very affectionate for lack of a better term like some something long-distance lovers would write to each other I know Jay has an interest in true crime.

Speaker 5 She watches the documentaries, listens to the podcast, and nothing too unusual though, but I recognized the guy's name pretty quickly.

Speaker 5 And knowing what he did and finding out that my girlfriend, who I adore and love so deeply, actually talks to him in this way is really fucking with my head.

Speaker 5 I don't know if naming him violates some kind of rules, but let's just say his case was huge, fairly recent, like within the last five years.

Speaker 5 He very brutally killed his pregnant wife and two kids and he even confessed for fuck's sake. I ended up reading through about three or four of the letters until they literally made me sick.

Speaker 5 Then I put everything back just the way I found it, cleaned up the the mess in the bathroom, and drove myself home.

Speaker 5 I texted her some made-up excuse that I was feeling better, and I just wanted to sleep in my own bed so that I could go to work the next day.

Speaker 5 I mean, I want to talk to her about it, but I just, I just don't know. I still love her deeply.
I miss her every hour of every day, and I've been sleeping like shit.

Speaker 5 I'm super distracted throughout the day. I'm trying to figure out how to handle this.
I still love her deeply, but how do I move past this? Is there a part of this that I'm not considering?

Speaker 5 To which most netizens are responding, speculating that his girlfriend is writing to Chris Watts, who side note, if you don't know Chris Watts, he murdered his pregnant wife and their two daughters, who are three and four years old.

Speaker 5 He smothered his daughters to death and then strangled his pregnant wife. His actions undeniably get worse.
He dumps his daughters' bodies into oil tanks.

Speaker 5 The oil tank openings are only like eight inches in diameter. He had to shove his children's bodies into the tanks to get them inside.
They basically got scalped in the process of this.

Speaker 5 Then he goes on to do a whole media tour, if you will, pleading for his missing family's safe return until it's revealed Chris Watts was having an affair and he's the one that annihilated his whole family.

Speaker 7 This is the one that he was caught like outside of his house. Yes.
The viral video, right?

Speaker 5 Yes. And like side note, he does have this moment where he tries to argue that his wife killed the kids.
And in return, he was so upset and distraught that he killed his wife.

Speaker 5 So if it's true that OP's girlfriend is exchanging affectionate letters with Chris Watts, I mean, most of the comments read along the lines of, it's one thing to watch true crime shows and be intrigued by aspects of how someone could possibly do something so extreme, but to write letters to someone like that?

Speaker 5 Others comment, I mean, it's one thing to be intrigued by extreme human behavior, but craving a connection with such people is alarming.

Speaker 5 Maybe, maybe it's like a surge of adrenaline for her, but in all honesty, I would personally be very worried and think twice about moving in with her.

Speaker 5 Another one just writes, no way your girlfriend is emotionally cheating on you with Chris Watts and you're thinking of staying with her, crying emoji.

Speaker 5 Any person who would ever associate with a man like that is very, very messed up.

Speaker 5 Not only is your girlfriend completely unempathetic to the pregnant wife and children that were murdered, but she's also mind-numbingly stupid to believe any sort of sob story that this murderer is spitting.

Speaker 5 But it's an interesting thought, is it not? Or more likely a fear that a lot of netizens have because you never really know who you're dating.

Speaker 5 Others say, yeah, this is bad, but at least OP caught it early.

Speaker 5 I mean, sometimes you marry the person and then you realize too late that they're a little bit bizarre and that something bizarre is happening.

Speaker 5 Some netizens argue, if life is a competition, which it's not, but if it is, at least his girlfriend that he adores did not kill anyone.

Speaker 5 Because there are other people that wake up one morning and realize the person that they married is the killer.

Speaker 5 I mean, hypothetically speaking, what do you do if you wake up and your husband is a serial killer, your wife is a serial killer? Seattle went through this very dark period in Washington.

Speaker 5 For almost 20 years, they had an active serial killer operating in Seattle. Initially, people were terrified.
I mean, the residents were terrified for 20 years, but they're also getting so fed up.

Speaker 5 Why the hell can't the police catch this guy? What's the big deal? You pass by the magazine stand in the grocery store, all the headlines are so bleak.

Speaker 5 This is being described as one of the nastiest homicides in King County record. Bodies of young women found near Green River, what's their connection?

Speaker 5 Green River killer continues to elude massive task force. It's believed that the Green River serial killer has taken the lives of up to 71 victims.

Speaker 7 Is this solved or unsolved?

Speaker 5 It's solved. Wow.
And it's scary, but at least Judith from Seattle feels some semblance of security considering she lives with her husband, Gary. I mean, he's kind of like an old school gentleman.

Speaker 5 He pulls out the chairs for her. She doesn't even remember the last time that she opened her own car door when he's nearby.
This has been her marriage for the past 13 years.

Speaker 5 Until there's a knock on the door. She opens the door and it's a swarm of Seattle police.
Gary is not who she thinks he is. Gary is the Green River killer.

Speaker 6 Wow.

Speaker 5 And initially, she

Speaker 5 did not believe them. In fact, for two years, she stands by her husband's side because how can he be a sexual sadist? That doesn't even make sense.

Speaker 5 First of all, their intimate life is very active i mean how

Speaker 5 why i mean she thinks the police have the wrong guy until he confesses that's when things slowly start clicking for her the carpets that he were he was removing from the home after they she had been on a trip she thought he just wanted to fix up the place it lines up with the time that he had killed a woman on the carpet and there were bloodstains She remembered at one point he had gotten rid of the bed frame.

Speaker 5 This is when they were first dating. He had gotten rid of it because he had brought a victim there and killed them and didn't want the blood to be left behind.

Speaker 5 She says all she could think was, I mean, was my life real with him or did he just use me? He made me smile every day. I had the perfect husband.

Speaker 5 I had the perfect life and he was the perfect serial killer. Initially, Judith does not really have anyone to talk to about any of this.

Speaker 5 The community, they actually feel that Judith must have known to some degree. That's what they're all thinking.
I mean, some of them aren't saying it because 13 years, how do you not know?

Speaker 5 This is the person that's closest to you. You sleep in the same room as them on a daily basis.
A lot of people would drive by her house, take her planters, smash them onto the ground.

Speaker 5 Once she asked a neighbor to watch her cat for her, which they graciously said, of course, we'll watch your cat. She goes back to get the cat back and they slam the door in her face.

Speaker 5 The words exchanged included something along the lines of, no, you're married to the Green River killer. You can't have your cat back.

Speaker 7 What? Like they say yes intention, like seemingly, intentionally to take her cat.

Speaker 6 Wow.

Speaker 5 It's an interesting perspective in everything that's going on because, with all these cases, you have the victims, you have the victims' families, you have the serial killer, the serial killers' families, the detectives, witnesses, the jury, the judge, the prosecutors, defense attorneys, media, and then the serial killers' partners.

Speaker 5 They're kind of like a forgotten piece of everything. I feel like people care more so about the serial killer's parents, the upbringing, more than they do their current lives.

Speaker 7 Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 5 A few weeks ago, we received an email, the title being: I was married to a serial killer for seven and a half years.

Speaker 5 I need help.

Speaker 5 You guys know how holiday pot looks or Friendsgivings go? Three days before the party, everyone's texting the group chat. Wait, who's handling dessert again? Who's on beverages?

Speaker 5 Should I just grab something on the way? Here's what I learned after years of holiday stress shopping. Just bring Stellar Rosa.
Just do it. Stellar Rosa Black makes every get-together feel special.

Speaker 5 And Stella Rosa Black Sparkling is the bottle that makes every gathering feel like a celebration. Sweet enough that even your cousin who doesn't really drink can join in on the celebration.

Speaker 5 Festive enough to feel special and honestly just the right choice no matter what chaos is happening around the dinner table. It's made with natural ingredients and around 100 calories a glass.

Speaker 5 There's something about that slightly sweet, bubbly situation that just works.

Speaker 5 Whether we're doing a fancy sit-down dinner or just hanging around someone's kitchen island picking at appetizers, the holidays are complicated enough without having to stress about who brings what to the potluck or who's on desserts and who's on beverages for Thanksgiving.

Speaker 5 This year, when that inevitable group tech starts up, take it from me and volunteer for for Wine Duty. You can't go wrong with Stella Rosa.

Speaker 5 Grab a bottle or two today to make your holiday celebrations even more special. Must be 21 plus.
Please celebrate responsibly. This episode is brought to you by Saks Fifth Avenue.

Speaker 5 Saks Fifth Avenue makes it easy to holiday your way, whether it's finding the right gift or the right outfit. Saks is where you can find everything.

Speaker 5 From the perfect Chloe bag for that hard-to-shop for sister to a Prada jacket that's perfect for a fancy holiday dinner.

Speaker 5 And if you don't know where to start, Saks.com is customized to your personal style so you can save time shopping and spend more time actually enjoying the holidays.

Speaker 5 The best part of holiday shopping at Saks is the element of discovery.

Speaker 5 Think unexpected treasures from designers you love, luxe pieces that feel indulgent, and gifts that make people wonder how you knew exactly what to get.

Speaker 5 From bold fashion moments to cozy finds that feel like little secrets just waiting to be unwrapped, Saks turns holiday shopping into something exciting instead of stressful.

Speaker 5 Make shopping fun and easy this season and find gifts and inspiration to suit your holiday style at Saks Fifth Avenue.

Speaker 5 My nieces have just started tennis lessons, and every time they have practiced, everyone in the family is making bets on which one of them hits the most balls.

Speaker 5 It surprisingly changes every single time, but the best part is that we have these aura frames to keep everyone in the loop.

Speaker 5 So instead of everyone crowding around my sister's phone while she plays a video of the girls during practice, she can send it straight to our aura frames to display to everyone in the network.

Speaker 5 My parents each have one, my sister-in-law. You can share photos and videos effortlessly straight from your phone all year long.

Speaker 5 Also, it's a really good idea if you're in a long-distance relationship. Plus, you can get unlimited free photos and videos with the Aura app just connect to Wi-Fi.

Speaker 5 You can't wrap togetherness, but you can frame it.

Speaker 5 For a limited time, visit auraframes.com and get $45 off Aura's best-selling Carver matte frames, named number one by Wirecutter, by using promo code Rotten at checkout.

Speaker 5 That's A-U-R-AFrames.com promo code ROTTIN. This exclusive Black Friday Cyber Monday deal is their best of the year, so order now before it ends.
Support the show by mentioning us at checkout.

Speaker 5 Terms and conditions apply.

Speaker 5 We would like to thank today's sponsors who have made it possible for Rotten Mango to support the NECMEC, the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, as well as the GoFundMe for Lavna to help aid in the pursuit of getting her son back.

Speaker 5 This episode's partnerships have also made it possible to support Rotten Mango's growing team, and we'd also like to thank you guys for your continued support as we work on our mission to be worthy advocates.

Speaker 5 As always, full show notes are available by rottenmangopodcast.com. A few disclaimers for today's case.
We could not get too much information on the new Cairo serial killer.

Speaker 5 Most sources were in Arabic, and we did have someone that speaks Arabic on the team to assist, but we couldn't do as much of a thorough deep dive like we normally do, considering it felt like for this particular case, time is of the essence.

Speaker 5 The big issue here being there is a child that has been kidnapped by a serial killer's family.

Speaker 5 But as always, perhaps more so on this episode, if there's anything that you felt was mistranslated, miscommunicated, or anything additional you know, please leave it in the comments for all of us to read.

Speaker 5 Lubna reached out to us to assist in getting her message out.

Speaker 5 However, she said she was unable to talk about the case itself or anything that could put her in legal hot water as she's still trying to get her son back.

Speaker 5 She's also stated that she's been getting death threats from the serial killer side of the family. She still wishes to get her message out and find her son, but I think she's being...

Speaker 5 smart and rightfully cautious about making comments towards them about them, about their son, the serial killer, for her own safety. Which brings us to another disclaimer.

Speaker 5 Nothing I say in this video is a representation of Lubna's thoughts or experiences or opinions.

Speaker 5 I've exchanged a few emails with her, but I'm not privy to any sort of private thoughts or information, so keep that in mind.

Speaker 5 And with that being said, there are mentions of domestic violence as well as essays. So please watch at your own discretion.
Take care of yourself, and let's get into it.

Speaker 5 How much do you really know your husband?

Speaker 5 I mean, it's the age-old question, right? Darcy Brutus didn't know that her husband had a thing for feet.

Speaker 5 Yeah, Darcy, okay, if we're being specific, Jerry has a thing for shoes, high-heeled shoes, and women's lingerie.

Speaker 5 But their marriage is not the type of marriage where they openly talk about things like this. For Darcy's husband, Jerry, maybe he doesn't mention it because it's always been like this for him.

Speaker 5 It's like mentioning that I have five toes on my right foot. It rings true to me, and it's been like that for as long as I can remember.

Speaker 5 So maybe I wouldn't consider it a big thing to announce to my husband, hey I have five toes on my right foot Jerry's fascination with high-heeled stilettos is like that it starts at a really young age but he blames his family friend she had fallen asleep at the Jerry Bruto's home the family home he sneaks in there and sees that she's wearing these high-heeled shoes and something about the way that her foot arches the way that her toes are just cramped into those stilettos it unlocks something in him he tries to slowly creep up on her and grab the heel of one stiletto and slowly peel it off so that he can steal it while she's asleep.

Speaker 5 Unsurprisingly, she wakes up. His plan goes down the drain, but it awakens something inside of him.

Speaker 5 Instead of stopping, he goes and he hides in his first grade teacher's desk to steal her high-heeled shoes. He fails.
But naturally, none of this is mentioned to his wife Darcy.

Speaker 5 He also fails to mention at how at a young age, in middle school he would go and steal undergarments from his friends sisters.

Speaker 5 He had a thing for sniffing their undies, but that eventually escalates to him putting them on. He would steal them and then model them on himself.

Speaker 5 Or when Jerry turned 16, he had this lightning bolt strike of creative problem solving. He masterminds this whole plan.
He would lure women to his home. Trick them typically.

Speaker 5 When he was alone with them, he would give them a full tour of his bedroom before excusing himself. Let me just grab a a water.
Let me use the restroom. I'll be right back.

Speaker 5 But when he comes back into the room, he's changed into a new set of clothes. He's wearing a mask, holding a knife and a camera.

Speaker 5 He forces the woman to strip down while he takes pictures, all whilst, you know, threatening to take their lives if they don't comply. Then when he gets the pictures he wants, he leaves.

Speaker 5 He takes off the masks, ruffles his hair, changes back into the first pair of clothes he invited the victim over with, runs back into the room.

Speaker 5 The craziest thing just happened. There was a masked knife-wielding man that had just broken into the house, tied me up so that they could get pictures of you or something.
They left. That's crazy.

Speaker 5 I fought them off and they left.

Speaker 7 And it worked?

Speaker 5 Yeah, I think sometimes it worked. Other times the girls were just too scared to say anything.

Speaker 5 Sometimes laziness would get the best of Jerry. He would eventually ditch the mask.
Home intruder ruse out the window. And then he would just part his hair differently.

Speaker 5 He would part his hair, walk into the room, and be like, I'm Jerry's non-existent brother, Ed, and you better strip down and I'm going to take pictures of you or else.

Speaker 5 He would even start fondling the victims. Perhaps it's the sheer confidence in how he does it.
Some of the victims truly believed that they were essayed not by Jerry, but by his brother Ed.

Speaker 5 Keep in mind, this is all happening while he's in high school. It only gets worse as he grows up.

Speaker 5 He begins stalking women, and at first, he would just stalk them to strangle them, to steal their shoes, their stilettos.

Speaker 5 I mean, the shoes didn't even necessarily have to be on someone. It could be him.
He would wear them.

Speaker 5 In another arrest, he's found in a college dorm wearing jean shorts, women's underwear, and high heels. And then it stops because he's, he marries his wife, Darcy, and he thinks, the past is the past.

Speaker 5 We're not even interested in that stuff anymore. I love Darcy.
Darcy is my wife, okay? They're going to be in love. They're going to have kids, which they do.

Speaker 5 They do have kids, but they're no longer in love. Not that it matters considering Jerry Brutus is a serial killer.

Speaker 5 So with his wife in the same house as Jerry, he would go back to his teenage ways of inviting people into the house, luring them, but now he's killing them.

Speaker 5 He's strangling them until they're unconscious, essaying their bodies. He's spending sometimes multiple business days to perform acts of necrophilia on the corpses.

Speaker 5 His favorite thing to do was, remember how he stole underwear and shoes? He had closets. He had so much stolen stilettos and underwear.

Speaker 5 His favorite pastime was to dress the victims' bodies in those stolen items and then take pictures like they're his personal dolls solely existing to model his garments.

Speaker 5 He would obsessively dress and redress the victims over and over and over again. And unfortunately, Jerry was a big souvenir guy.

Speaker 5 The first victim, he sawed off her foot and kept it in their family freezer in the basement. And he would take it out anytime he wanted a foot model.

Speaker 5 His second victim, he cut off her breasts to keep as souvenirs. But even after he cut off their breasts, he still wanted to play dress up with the corpses.

Speaker 5 So he would stick paper towels where the breasts used to be and put a bra on to take pictures for his collection. Another victim, he kept her corpse in the garage after essaying and killing her.

Speaker 5 He had her hanging in the garage on a pulley system so that he could dress her in different outfits and shoes. He would even try to electrocute her to get her to, quote, dance

Speaker 5 and look alive.

Speaker 5 Which brings many to the question of how much did Darcy, his wife, actually know about what Jerry was doing? Most of his murders were committed inside the house.

Speaker 5 She did not go on lengthy business trips or trips with her children while he was killing. So did she hear nothing, see nothing, sense nothing?

Speaker 5 On one occasion, he even had dinner with his wife and kids while the victim was tied up alive in the basement. The police firmly believe that Darcy knew something.

Speaker 5 So they arrest her. They bring her in, interrogate her as an accomplice, and they're confronting her.
You're telling us that you saw this chopped off breast laying around in the house.

Speaker 5 And you thought,

Speaker 5 I thought it was a paperweight.

Speaker 5 What? That you get from like one of those sick antique stores, I guess, because it was encased in resin.

Speaker 5 He didn't just have like a flesh breast. He had put it into resin to mold it.

Speaker 6 Wow.

Speaker 5 I mean, it's almost unbelievable, right? Except that it's true. Darcy had no clue.
She had been forbidden from entering the garage, basement, and freezer.

Speaker 5 After Jerry's arrest, he tried to ask Darcy to get rid of evidence and she refused. She truly was oblivious to all the signs, like many wives of serial killers.

Speaker 7 This is just another serial killer

Speaker 7 from the Green River one.

Speaker 5 Yeah,

Speaker 5 a lot of them have wives that had no clue.

Speaker 6 Wow.

Speaker 5 And they never kill their wives because,

Speaker 5 you know, some people argue maybe there's some sort of emotional attachment. It's definitely more of a disguise.

Speaker 5 I don't think that there's any serial killer killer that truly cared much for their family members.

Speaker 5 I mean, I don't think that they have the capability to do that.

Speaker 6 Yeah.

Speaker 5 Now, for Darcy Brudos, the signs were objectively a bit more obvious, but what about the new Cairo serial killer? The guy that they call the butcher of Egypt? What are the signs there?

Speaker 7 This is the wife who reached out.

Speaker 5 Three bodies, all dumped on this stretch of desert land in Egypt. The Egyptian authorities have a problem.
They've They've got three bodies. I mean, they're clearly connected.

Speaker 5 All three women have been murdered. They've been dumped along the desert road.
There's evidence that they've been whipped pretty badly. Their necks are all broken, potentially strangulation.

Speaker 5 There are clear signs of torture wounds. There's meth and other drugs in each woman's system.
I mean, it's pretty much undeniable that they're linked.

Speaker 5 But other than the same torture wounds, there is nothing else that can help the investigators. All three women live in different areas.
They don't know each other. They range in age between 19 to 37.

Speaker 5 What is the connection between these three women? Once the bodies are located, news starts spreading. There's a serial killer active in Egypt.
Some are calling him the butcher.

Speaker 5 There's only been about four well-known serial killers from Egypt, and the police have no leads. Until a father walks into the station.
My daughter, she's missing.

Speaker 5 Okay, when was the last time you saw her? She told me she was going to study English with a professor, an English professor, I think. His name is Karim.
He's a famous TikToker.

Speaker 7 So this is all happening very recently?

Speaker 5 2024, early 2024.

Speaker 6 Oh. Yeah.

Speaker 5 Karim's TikTok account was called Hooked on Phonics. It has since been suspended.

Speaker 5 But Karim, the police are now investigating, is an English teacher living in Egypt, and his whole TikTok account is to try and teach non-native English speakers English.

Speaker 5 He would have a harder to pronounce English word on the screen for non-native speakers. How do you pronounce, he would say this, how do you pronounce this word? Exquisite.
Exquisite. Ecstatic.

Speaker 5 Ecstatic. Or you know how sometimes when you learn English in a non-English speaking country, you learn phrases that most native speakers won't use? Like when someone asks you, how are you?

Speaker 5 The response that a lot of non-native speakers learn is, I'm fine, thank you, and you. But that's rarely ever heard in natural conversations.

Speaker 5 So he would make these little TikToks saying things like, don't say, I'm sorry. Say, I apologize, which I'm not sure what the difference is.

Speaker 5 He would also do these TikToks with his cute son, who's about nine years old, named Zane, where they would go over all the ways in which you can merge words in English.

Speaker 5 Instead of saying, give me, you say, and the little son would say, gimme, give me that.

Speaker 5 Instead of saying, want to, you say, I wanna, I wanna go home.

Speaker 7 Like the son is in the video. You can see him.
Yes. Okay.

Speaker 5 In another TikTok, Karim, the now suspect, does a little skit. How do I tell a woman you're so beautiful?

Speaker 5 He's like in a nerdy outfit, and he's asking a cool guy, who is also him, cosplaying as the cool guy, how do I tell a woman you're so beautiful? You're like a dream come true.

Speaker 5 Your beauty is like a priceless masterpiece.

Speaker 5 I'm sorry, you're breathtakingly gorgeous. I'm out of breath.
You're beautiful gorgelicious.

Speaker 5 You look absolutely fantastic.

Speaker 5 In another one, he says, don't say I'm tired. It's boring.
Instead, use these slang terms instead. Exhaustipated.

Speaker 5 I've never heard that. Fatigue, pooped, tie-tie, bed-deprived, Z-Z-Z-ish, naptastic, zonked, chic-a-boom, bed.
Again, I don't know where he's getting any of these.

Speaker 5 Then he has this moment where his inflection goes down and he says, dead,

Speaker 5 beat, and then he leans into the camera and says, wrecked.

Speaker 7 How many followers does he have?

Speaker 5 660,000.

Speaker 6 Wow.

Speaker 6 Yeah.

Speaker 5 His account has some odd moments like that one, but I would hardly call it odd. I mean, there's nothing alarming or damning on his social media accounts.

Speaker 5 A lot of people are reposting some old videos with some creepy music, but it's more so hindsight. There's nothing in his videos inherently that's alarming.

Speaker 5 It's just him teaching questionable slang that I've never heard most English speakers use.

Speaker 7 Is he here in the US or he's in Egypt?

Speaker 5 He's in Egypt, but he was briefly in the U.S. He grew up in the U.S.
I believe he might hold U.S. citizenship.

Speaker 7 I see. Yes.

Speaker 5 The police need to find out more about this guy, Karim, to see if he really is the butcher. Because again, his TikTok presence doesn't really tell them anything.

Speaker 5 Karim taught English at a local school, to which some sources say that the coworkers who knew him knew him as the rose guy.

Speaker 5 The flower, you know, which sounds like a good thing.

Speaker 5 He would randomly show up to work with a singular rose, hand it to a a coworker, his male or female colleagues, it didn't matter, which again, kind of sounds inherently sweet if it's not creepy and not HR worthy, like reporting worthy, but the rose usually comes as a form of an apology.

Speaker 5 If these incidents are true, his coworkers likely hated seeing the damn roses. It's alleged that he would blow up on coworkers over nothing.

Speaker 5 Truly, it felt like if you looked at the guy strange, or you said something that irked him for reasons unknown to you, he would just blow up.

Speaker 5 And the very very next day, he would bring you a singular rose, present it to he verbally assaulted the day before, and they would be forced to forgive him, or they would be seen as the difficult one at work.

Speaker 5 If these personal accounts are true, it appears Karim has a whiplash-inducing personality.

Speaker 5 Some that knew Karim personally said, he's incredibly helpful to the point that one could call him a generous, elegant man. But you know when someone is too nice to you?

Speaker 5 But it doesn't feel like genuine.

Speaker 5 There's this second layer of ick that hits you, but you can't can't explain it in correct words. I don't know why, because you just sound like an ungrateful person.

Speaker 5 No, no, no, yeah, they were so nice to me. They, of course, they helped me move, and but it just feels like they're not doing it with good intentions.
But then who are you to complain?

Speaker 5 Because they've helped you.

Speaker 5 A lot of people said that Kareem appeared to like helping people because that automatically puts him at the top position, the one that is helping and not the one being helped.

Speaker 5 They say he was born to this financially secure family with a seemingly unsufferable air of superiority to them.

Speaker 5 It seems like he has this complicated chip on his shoulder considering he wants to be known as successful, but he wants to be successful on his own.

Speaker 5 But the reality is, the only thing that makes him successful and special is the fact that his parents are financially okay.

Speaker 5 Everyone knows that his success depends on his dad and he knew that everybody knows that.

Speaker 5 Side note, it's been said by people close to him that he genuinely does not care about his dad, not even in the slightest. He uses his dad like a bank.
He calls his dad, dad, I need a new iPhone.

Speaker 5 Magically, a new iPhone would appear. And by this point, this man is 37 years old.
Could he really be a serial killer? This little daddy's boy, the butcher of Egypt? It doesn't even sound similar.

Speaker 5 The authorities track his car, his whereabouts, and interestingly enough, his car shows up at the spots where the bodies are dumped. So it's time to give this guy a visit.

Speaker 5 The fifth settlement is one of the most well-known wealthy areas in Cairo. The detectives are staring at each other.
Are you sure this is the right place? Like, this is where Karim lives?

Speaker 5 They speak with the landlord, and there are signs. Like, what? Okay, for one, he was adamant that he needed a fully soundproofed encased room.

Speaker 5 He said that he was always creating music, I don't know, recording social media videos, that out of respect for his neighbors and for his son that lives with him, he needs a room that you can't hear out of once you go inside.

Speaker 5 He would like crisp, pure audio for his videos. That's what he said.

Speaker 5 When authorities get upstairs to the unit, they find the soundproof room, but they also find various drugs and what has been described by many sources as instruments of torture.

Speaker 5 They try to arrest Karim, who tries to miserably fail at making a run for it.

Speaker 5 They chase him down, they arrest him, and immediately states he has no idea what the police are talking about because he's insane. He's mentally unwell.
He cannot be held liable for his actions.

Speaker 5 He doesn't even know what they're referring to.

Speaker 7 So this cold case happened because they found three bodies on the side of the road. And did three of them all die around the same time?

Speaker 5 Pretty, yes, relatively. Okay.
It was like pretty back-to-back that there was some sort of connection. Back-to-back? It was, yeah.
The cool-off period, if you will, for the serial killer was very low.

Speaker 7 And then he just left him in public, just like that.

Speaker 5 Like on stretches of desert land.

Speaker 7 Oh, I see.

Speaker 6 Yeah.

Speaker 5 Also found in his apartment were deleted but recovered videos from his phone and laptop that show him murdering the three victims.

Speaker 5 Videos of him drugging, essaying, and torturing the victims, not unlike Jerry Brutus. Eventually, he tells the authorities what happened.

Speaker 5 He would lure the women to his apartment, drug them with meth and other drugs.

Speaker 5 At one point, it seems like he's trying to get brownie points for the fact that he fed them narcotics, which would help with the pain that he was inflicting on them. He's like, you know what?

Speaker 5 I am inflicting a lot of pain. However, I gave them drugs, so it should decrease the pain that they felt.

Speaker 5 Sometimes he would even engage in watching sexually sadistic videos while his victims were in his home, incapacitated. Then he would begin his torture.

Speaker 5 He would start out first by assaulting them, whipping them, pulling their hair, then slowly transitioning into ripping out their nails. He keeps the process slow, painful.

Speaker 5 Sometimes the victims would be at his apartment for 18 days at a time.

Speaker 5 It's unclear how many of those days were them consensually believing that they're spending time with a friend, friend versus how many of those days are them actively being tortured and killed.

Speaker 5 It appears that he likes to relish in the pain that women feel. When he thinks he's done, he slowly strangles them to death, usually with a rope or an iron chain.

Speaker 5 But even then, he will continue engaging in sexual acts with their corpses.

Speaker 7 That is crazy. That, I mean, how do you just coming out like this? Yeah.
There must be a lot of reflux before this.

Speaker 5 A lot. By this point, the body is completely disfigured.
He takes the body to the desert and disposes of them.

Speaker 5 And a total of three bodies were found in the desert, but Karim admits there could be at least six or more victims, like at least six total victims or more.

Speaker 5 Unfortunately, most people believe it's a lot more than that. Neighbors said that there were lots of girls going in and out of the house.

Speaker 5 Alarmingly, sometimes they would even hear screams, but they would stop mid-scream. So it sounded like a scream, but maybe you're goofing around.

Speaker 5 Maybe you see a bug, you scream, but you don't keep screaming. You don't scream, help me, you just scream once in shock.

Speaker 5 When Karim is arrested, the police take into custody his nine-year-old son, Zane, who was living with him.

Speaker 5 They need to find the next person that would have custody over Zane because Karim can't take care of him. Karim is going to face the death penalty.

Speaker 7 That's crazy. So the son was living in the same house.
Yes.

Speaker 6 Wow.

Speaker 5 They ask Karim, where is your son's mother? He responds, She's dead. December 13th, 2024, a TikTok goes viral of a woman named Lamna.

Speaker 5 It's her wearing a blue hoodie sitting in front of her camera and she looks very serious. She starts off, I was married to a serial killer for seven and a half years.

Speaker 5 All my videos have been in Arabic to reach the Arabic community. So basically, the serial killer, he tried to kill me many times.
He tried to kill my sister many times.

Speaker 5 Then he got caught with three bodies in his apartment in a torture chamber. And he's very well known in Egypt and the Arab world.
This was recent. This was seven months ago.

Speaker 5 So he kidnapped my son from me three years ago. And anytime I tried to get him, he would basically try to kill me, try to ruin my life and try to find me.

Speaker 5 Like I would be at places, he would just show up and I would have to run. It was just like a flipping nightmare.

Speaker 5 So finally, when he got caught this May, so May of 2024, end of May, they locked him up. He's going to get hung very soon, hopefully.

Speaker 5 The problem is whenever he got locked up, he told the police that I was dead. So his mom took my son.
So now it's been seven months. I haven't seen my son.
I haven't heard from my son.

Speaker 5 I've filed all the police papers, all court papers. I have full custody.
I have educational custody. I have every single right.
I just cannot find this woman, the serial killer's mom, Zane's grandma.

Speaker 5 I just need the English world to hear my story. Very soon, I'm going to be on a big channel and you're going to hear my story, but I really hope that before that happens, I get my son back.

Speaker 5 I'm dying, honestly. I'm dying to see him.
I'm dying to talk to him again. I just need as much exposure as possible.
And this lady might be in America. She might still be in Egypt, but who knows?

Speaker 5 I need to find her and I need everybody's help as much as possible. I have pictures of my son, of her, her, so if you want to take a look, please help me.

Speaker 5 This is Karim Salim's wife and she is not dead. She had to flee Egypt for her own safety and now she can't get her son back.

Speaker 5 Lubna says that she found out through the internet that her ex-husband, the father of her child, that had her child, had been arrested in Egypt for being a serial killer.

Speaker 5 She says in an interview in Egypt, she says, I couldn't believe it. The first thing she did was call her attorney and just kept asking, is it true? Is it true?

Speaker 5 I mean, for a second, she thought it was fake so that she would have to fly to Egypt. It wouldn't be the first time.

Speaker 5 After she fled Egypt, fearing for her own safety, he would try to lure her back into the country.

Speaker 5 Wow. All these like fake methods.
He would, oh, he would even put... So her sisters live in Egypt.

Speaker 5 He would call them and say, your sister Labna is dead. You need to come to the morgue to ID her body.

Speaker 5 And when they came, it's likely that he was, I don't know, these are just allegations and speculations that I personally and a lot of netizens have.

Speaker 5 He would likely hold the sisters captive to make Lavna come to Egypt.

Speaker 7 Did she go?

Speaker 5 No.

Speaker 5 She hasn't been back in Egypt. I don't think for a while.

Speaker 5 I mean, she is now, but.

Speaker 7 Oh, she is in Egypt right now.

Speaker 5 She's searching for her son. Okay, okay.
But if this is true, that he's a serial killer, Labna says it was jarring. And again, this is speculation.

Speaker 5 I'm sure a part of her felt guilty because perhaps she could have done something to prevent it, but she always felt like she was under the assumption that he just wanted to kill her, which makes sense when you're in a very abusive relationship with someone who's violent, you don't necessarily think that they're a serial killer.

Speaker 5 You think that they want to kill you because you're in this relationship with them, right? She did not know that he was out to kill people. Otherwise, she probably would have done something.

Speaker 5 She said, I thought I was the only one he tried to kill. At this point, Lovna just knows that she doesn't have her son, Zane.
Karim's mother, Zane's grandmother, has him and she wants him back.

Speaker 5 She packs all of her clothes. She had fled to the UK at this point because she's a UK citizen.
She's a UK national.

Speaker 5 She grabs all her clothes, leaves everything else, gets on the first flight to Egypt. But the minute she gets there, she reaches out to Karim's mom, who has her son, and she blocks Levna.

Speaker 5 Does not accept her calls, nothing. The message is clear.
You're not getting your son back.

Speaker 6 Wow.

Speaker 5 To Levna, Karim was a very normal person when they first started dating. Like the first first few years of marriage, he's very normal, very polite, well-mannered, if not even a charismatic guy.

Speaker 5 It's not until they have their son Zane, things implode.

Speaker 5 Zane is Lubna's whole world because, you know, when you become a mom, you care about your kids a lot and maybe more than anything else in the world. But Karim does not like that.

Speaker 5 He starts getting jealous that Lubna is putting Zane first.

Speaker 5 Anytime he felt Zane's, their literal baby's needs were put before his own, which would be all the time and should be all the time, he would blow up on Lavna, getting incredibly aggressive and upset.

Speaker 5 He became this controlling menace. According to one source that we have translated, he apparently was even in a TikTok where he was promoting an app that helps track your family's location.

Speaker 5 But the messaging is more so keep your wife and children safe, which in hindsight is very alarming. Which the relationship, regardless, the relationship just deteriorates from there.

Speaker 5 He accuses Lovna of cheating on him non-stop. Meanwhile, Lovna literally finds videos of him cheating on her.

Speaker 5 He would record videos of himself having intimate relations with other women while married with a child.

Speaker 5 But anytime she would confront him about it, he would beat her, strangle her until she's passed out on the floor, and then he would sob and weep that he was sorry.

Speaker 5 I think it probably doesn't help that Lubna and Karim would move around a lot. At some points they were in Egypt.
At some points they were in Michigan in the United States, then back to Egypt.

Speaker 5 It's harder to leave an abusive relationship when you're not in the most familiar territory with a strong support system.

Speaker 5 One might assume that Lubna also stayed because Karim's family was financially secure. You know, perhaps it's hard for her to find that stability anywhere else, but that's not true either.

Speaker 5 Karim was astonishingly lazy. He refused to work.
Lovna was the one making most of the money paying for their things and taking care of their kids. She says, he tried to kill me several times.

Speaker 5 He tried to kill my siblings too. All of them are younger than me.
This proceeds for about six years.

Speaker 5 Lovna keeps trying to leave Karim and he keeps coming back and beating her. And I'm sure it's made much more complicated by the fact that they share a child.

Speaker 5 Eventually, she decides she's going to leave him. She's going to take Zane with her, put her foot down, and conveniently, Karim is like, can I just have a play date with my son? I miss him so much.

Speaker 5 Just for a few hours, take him out to dinner. Levna agrees, but that would be the last time she sees her son, Zane.
That was three years ago.

Speaker 5 So from what we can piece together from our sources, as a way to make sure that Levna cannot come back for her son, Karim files for divorce and accuses her of adultery, stating that he caught her with his own two eyes sleeping with his best friend, which I doubt, but regardless, adultery is punishable by law in Egypt, whereas domestic violence was not.

Speaker 6 Wow.

Speaker 5 So she's facing that.

Speaker 5 In addition to Karim waiting outside her place of residence for four days straight, threatening to kill her, she had to put on a disguise to leave everything and flee Egypt three years ago.

Speaker 5 And that's why she has attorneys, because for the past three years, she's trying to get her son back.

Speaker 5 She's trying not to get killed because if she gets killed, then her son is forever going to be with Karim, right? She's just trying to get her son back. She's a British citizen.

Speaker 5 She's hiring attorneys, spending every cent that she makes on her attorneys, trying to figure out what to do, how to do this.

Speaker 5 But now that Karim's been arrested for being a serial killer, she still can't get her son back.

Speaker 5 He has been quote unquote given to Karim's mother and she refuses to let Lemna see her son, let alone she doesn't even know where they are. Lemna believes they might be in Egypt or maybe in Michigan.

Speaker 5 Now, if you're wondering why Michigan, Kareem used to live there when he was younger. He does have a U.S.
citizenship.

Speaker 5 I don't know if he gave it up for an Egyptian citizenship or if it's dual, but he essayed a girl in Michigan. He does have a criminal record in the United States.
He was arrested.

Speaker 5 And afterwards, he moved to Egypt to, I guess, have a clean start because that's on his record. He can't really get a job in the U.S.

Speaker 5 That's why after they had kids, after they had Zane, they were in the U.S. for a while, he couldn't work.
So she's working.

Speaker 5 At this point, the authorities have found three bodies, but it's believed that there are at least six victims. At the very least, potentially more.

Speaker 5 Mint chocolate chip ice cream is the best ice cream, hands down. And Mint Mobile is the best premium wireless coverage available for your cell phone.
Most holiday gifts end up in a drawer.

Speaker 5 Not this one. Unlimited premium wireless for $15 a month.
That's their best deal of the year. AKA, the only holiday gift you'll actually use every day.

Speaker 5 My favorite part of Mint is that I was able to transfer carriers while keeping my same tried and true phone as well as my cell phone number.

Speaker 5 I didn't have to worry about memorizing a new number or having to update all my contacts and save all my photos. It was seamless and easy to transfer, the best and most useful gift available, truly.

Speaker 5 Don't get them socks, get them premium wireless for $15 a month. Shop Mint Unlimited Plans at mintmobile.com/slash rotten.
That's mintmobile.com/slash rotten.

Speaker 5 Limited time offer, upfront payment of $45 for three months, $90 for six months, or $180 for 12 months plan required. $15 per month equivalent.
Taxes and fees extra initial plan term only.

Speaker 5 Greater than 35 gigabytes may slow when network is busy. Capable device required.
Availability speed and coverage varies. See mintmobile.com.

Speaker 5 I feel like Mingo has taken it upon herself to become the guard dog of our property. I think she genuinely thinks that her barking is working because we haven't had any security breaches.

Speaker 5 I am happy to report that she is now in full retirement. She's got the the full retirement package of treats and was honorably discharged from her guard dog duties for a job well done.

Speaker 5 She does not have to know that it was all SimplySafe. State-of-the-art security system doing all of the work.
Simply Safe's active guard outdoor protection can prevent crimes before they happen.

Speaker 5 Simply Safe isn't a reactionary security system, but a state-of-the-art preventative system.

Speaker 5 Their AI-powered cameras detect threats while they're still outside your home, then alert real SimplySafe agents who then can confront the intruder on a two-way audio, letting them you're on camera and the police are on their way.

Speaker 5 They can even trigger a loud siren and spotlights. Don't miss out on Simply Safe's biggest sale of the year, 60% off.

Speaker 5 Right now, our listeners can save 60% off on a SimplySafe home security system at simplysafe.com/slash rotten. That's simplysafe.com/slash rotten.
There's no safe like SimplySafe.

Speaker 5 The defense argument lied on Kareem being out of his mind. His lawyer argued that Kareem did not intend to commit premeditated murder.
The victims went to him on their own free will.

Speaker 5 And in fact, if anything, they were benefiting from him. You know, Kareem was spending lavishly on them.
That's what the attorney is alleging, which...

Speaker 7 How is that related to a murder?

Speaker 5 Yeah, if someone buys you a Gucci belt, can you just kill them?

Speaker 5 I don't understand this defense. It's mind-boggling.
But he continues. We are facing a strange case that we need to study.

Speaker 5 My client is a mentally ill person that feels remorse after committing those crimes and should be referred to a medical hospital with a committee of psychiatrists rather than being executed.

Speaker 5 Which the judge clearly did not entertain. Karim Salim was sentenced to death to be hanged.

Speaker 5 And now Lemna is desperately looking for her son. She reaches out every single day to her son and grandmother.
Someone is reading the messages because it says red, but she doesn't know who.

Speaker 5 She messages her son before she goes to sleep.

Speaker 5 She doesn't go to sleep much much or wake up without thinking about how to get her son back her message for her son is Zane I'm never gonna stop looking for you until the day that I die until my very last breath she says I used to know what his favorite food was I don't know if it's changed I don't know if he's taller than me now I don't know what he looks like other than from the videos and pictures that were posted on Kareem's TikTok I don't know what his voice sounds like anymore I can't see my son I can't talk to him I don't know what he loves what he hates now how he's growing up I don't know how he lives his life I I don't know if he goes to school, if he likes school, what subjects he likes.

Speaker 5 I don't know anything. Because also, you have to think from six to nine, it's a huge developmental period where a lot of things change.
Yeah.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 5 Her last memory was about a week before she last saw her son. Zane asked to purchase a bunch of balloons at the store.

Speaker 5 And the two of them walked around the shopping center and he would give out balloons to strangers. And she thought it was so fascinating.
That's who her son is.

Speaker 5 He's the type to open doors for strangers for her. And for right now, Lubna's life is on hold.
That's kind of how she explains it. She doesn't feel good.
She just wants her son back.

Speaker 5 She's lost about 40 pounds in the past few months, but she's not going to give up. She says, when they reunite, she's going to take him to the beach because that's our thing.
We love the beach.

Speaker 5 In one interview in Arabic, she says, Someone please help me. Someone stand up with me.
Come with me, please. I finally reached the end.

Speaker 5 I may look okay and be talking on the outside, but on the inside, I'm broken.

Speaker 5 So most netizens are just trying to get the word out right now to figure out how to get Lubna back. And this will be, you know, one of the rare times that we show a child's face that is, you know.

Speaker 5 Not super, I guess,

Speaker 5 you know, certain cases, you see the child's face, like John Benet Ramsey. It's hard to not see her face anywhere when you talk about her.

Speaker 5 But for this case, if you see him, please reach out to authorities. That's what Lubna says.
Reach out to Lubna because legally she has custody.

Speaker 5 So if she, if that child is with anybody else, that is against the law.

Speaker 7 He's either in America or in Egypt. Yes.
In America, there's Michigan. But in America, he should be in school.

Speaker 5 Yes.

Speaker 5 She has educational custody, and that's a point that she brings up.

Speaker 5 Nobody can enroll him in school without her because she has educational custody she is worried that he's missing out on school right now too because it's a developmental time that he needs to be in school he needs to have a some sort of semblance of normalcy normalcy right because it's just

Speaker 5 but um a lot of people comment schools these days if you're a grandma and you can prove they're the grandma they're not really gonna check Some schools, yeah.

Speaker 7 Yeah, yeah, I don't know if every school will check, but if he is in school, then I feel like he will be

Speaker 7 found. Found pretty quickly.
So

Speaker 7 I feel like it's more likely that he's being hidden away. Not at all.
Because it's already getting so much. Much attention.

Speaker 5 Yeah. Like if he was in school, he'd probably be pulled out of school by now.

Speaker 7 Or, like, people would have at least said, oh, that's my friend or my classmate.

Speaker 5 Oh, yes, yeah. That's true.
I haven't seen any of that.

Speaker 5 I haven't seen that. He could also be in Egypt and maybe, I know it's gone viral, viral in the English-speaking world.

Speaker 5 It seems less viral in the Arabic-speaking world. I think Karim's case is viral, but perhaps maybe not her pleas to

Speaker 5 get her son back.

Speaker 6 Wow.

Speaker 5 I don't know. The whole thing is so heartbreaking.
I do believe that her son is an American national, though.

Speaker 5 But I don't know. Some people are recommending Lubna go to the U.S.
Embassy. I think that she has.

Speaker 5 If I'm not mistaken, I'm pretty sure that she has. But just to remind you guys, so many kids go missing in America.
That's true. You know, it's not just go to the embassy, everything's solved.

Speaker 7 Yeah.

Speaker 5 So if you guys see anything, hear anything, sense anything, let Levna know. I'm going to link her GoFundMe

Speaker 5 as well as her TikTok. Just message her with actual information, I would say, and show her support in her videos.

Speaker 5 But if you're going to DM her, make sure you have some information because I think it deletes the DMs. But yes, if you know anything, let her know.
And with that, please stay safe, everyone.

Speaker 5 And I will see you in the next one.