"Jon Bon Jovi"

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I am really excited. About? I've got some great news.
About? Well, it's about... Are you pregnant? It's about today.
Oh, what's happening today?

We are... Well, fuck, you're going to find out.

It's an all-new Smartless.

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That was... You guys.
Hi. smart bless that was you guys hi we just had a little connection problem with will it sounded like your hal from 2001 yeah i'm glad you got it all worked out i know me too i um was there a ghost in the machine i guess so right that's wasn't Wasn't that a band? That was an album the police did.

It was by the police.

Very good album.

By the way, the police...

Yeah.

You know, I used to listen to them all the time.

And we don't hear about them in, you know...

Well, because Sting went off on his own.

I know, but it's just a good memory.

When he went on his own, is it accurate to say that he defunded the police? Wow. I don't know.
It's early. It's early.
It's really early. It's early.
What am I going to do? They're not all going to be home runs, JB. Jason, so did we miss you on Sunday because you just weren't feeling it, or were you out of town? No, I was flying back to work.
I left at noon. Oh, that's right.
That's not a man to say. Apropos of nothing, Shawnee, I was sent a picture from someone, you and Eric Idle in a picture together.
It looked like it might have been a bowling alley. No, it was a roller rink.
Okay, so I was close. That was just yesterday.
Pretty close. And that was just sort of just like a date you guys had? Like, maybe meet me at the roller skating rink? That's a great question.
Tell me what you look like so I can recognize you? First of all, that's crazy. I wonder who sent you that.
Was it Kevin Nealon? Eric Eidel and I share an attorney, the great Tom Hoverman. Oh, okay, great.
Yeah, no, it was Kevin Nealon's wife, Susan Yagley, who's a very funny actress person. She decided to have her birthday party at a roller derby, like a roller, what is that called? Roller rink.
It's a roller skating rink. Roller skating rink, yeah.
And so I was too nervous. Have you been drinking this morning? You feel like you've been...
No, it's too early. He's got a latte going.
Have you been eating? No, not at all. Have you eaten anything yet? And so Scotty, I was really nervous.
No, I haven't eaten anything. So Scotty, I was really nervous.
Scotty's frying up some donut holes. But they did have like pizza and cake and I had all that.
And and popcorn it was i described sean the other day

as junk food curious uh hey uh were there any terrible accidents there at the roller skating rink yeah because you can really really hit your tail oh do you have any good do you have any good roller skate rink uh uh accident stories can't wait to ask the guest yes so scotty so i didn't want to put him on because i'm on blood thinners i'm almost almost done with my blood thinners because of my AFib, right? Hang on. What does a roller skating accident have to do with blood thinners? Because if you hit your head or something, you could bleed out and die.
Way to think about the worst case scenario. So anyway, so the first 30 seconds, my friend Kevin, who you both met, Kevin and Carrie.

Sure.

Kevin, bam, mashed his head on the fucking wood floor, wiped out immediately.

And so I ran over to him.

I was like, are you all right?

You're right.

He's like, yeah, no.

I go, are you seeing stars?

And he's like, no.

Which one, yes.

No, but when did they get here?

That's a bummer if he looked at you and he says he's not seeing any stars. I mean, that's got a...
That's insult to his injury, you know? Will, you really... I'm glad you rebooted.
Yeah, somebody slept really well. Yeah, I did sleep well.
Anyway, roller derby, but good idea for a birthday party, right? For an adult? Sounds like not a good idea. It's up there with an ice skating.
You've just described why it's not a good idea.

No, Kevin's totally fine.

Oh, good.

Is he?

But I walked, because I didn't want to put the skates on,

so Scotty had skates on,

and I walked with him around the thing while he skated.

Isn't that so dumb?

A little bit.

It's kind of on brand.

You know, now they've got at these rinks,

you know, like an old man, old woman walker

that can help you

ice skate or roller skate.

They didn't have that in my day.

You just had to kind of like

Yes, I see that.

The kids had that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But so Eric Idle was there.

I never met Eric Idle

from Monty Python.

I was like, oh my God.

What a genius.

Yeah.

Incredible.

Really nice guy.

Did he ask for like

a drink from you

or was he like, hey, can I get a Diet Coke? Bring my car up, boy. He was really nice.
Whose guest is it today? It's my guest. And how do you feel about your choice today, Will? I feel really, really good.
Really? Yeah, you know why? You know what I like? I like international superstars. Oh, my God.
A lot. This is a legit.
you don't often. Are we going to see stars? Are we going to see stars? You're going to see a major international superstar, and I'm embarrassing him, but it's so true.
But on top of it, or sort of not on top of it, beneath it, he's a really, really, really great guy that I've had the good fortune of spending a little bit of time with over the years. Super, super good dude.
And then you forget that he sold a gajillion records. That's a lot.
I mean, a gajillion records over the years as a member of a Rock and Roll Hall of Fame band and then as an equally impressive solo career. He's in the Songwriters Hall of Fame.
He has written multiple massive hits. And he's an actor and he's an incredible philanthropist.
And he's got a new docuseries about his story. I think it's called Thank You, Good Night.
How do I know all your friends? Once I start getting, if I start saying specific things, you're just going to guess it. So I'm just going to say, guys, please allow me to introduce you to the one, the only, the phenomenal, Mr.
Jon Bon Jovi. Wow.
That's triple A list. Look, I mean, it is triple.
No one sings higher. Yeah.
Or better. Or better.
Or better. Oh, my gosh.
Good morning. I saw John like six months ago or something last summer, and I was like, would you ever consider doing our podcast? And he said yes.
And it took a minute to organize. He's a very busy man.
And I'm so happy you're here. John, good to see you, man.
I'm so happy to be here. I'm a huge fan.
I listen all the time, and watch the entire uh series that you guys did on the road oh my god in the dead of winter yes it was great it was great listener uh we have john bon jovi from the white house uh i mean you look like you're in the kind of place i would love to live you're doing doing well, clearly, right? This is a nice... I see a lot of house envy just in the pre-roll when you were talking about Sean's house.
Well, look at me. I'm doing a hostage video here.
I was going to... I need to up my situation.
But no, and I see a Patriots jersey. Are you a Patriots fan? Oh, yeah.
Look at it. I see the background in my office.
Yes, I'm a huge Patriots fan. That is Bill Belichick's hoodie.
Now, oh, my God. They're right.
The short sleeve. Why did he wear a short-sleeved hoodie? Fashion statement, right? Yeah.
Fashion. Well, no, also, he might run hot.
Like, he wants the thing, but he also runs a little bit hot. My question is, who cuts them? Do you know, John, who cuts them? I don't know who cuts them.
No, knowing, when you look closely, I think he probably, I think he cuts them with a butter knife. Yeah.
Well, that just has an odd, he's got sweaty forearms, and I've never met anyone with that. Maybe Thoreau came over and gave him the snip.
It might be a Justin. Yeah, maybe.
He's giving Justin Thoreau a run for his money. Well, listen, I think if you're winning that many championships, you know, you're doing something right, and he doesn't want to mess with whatever system he's got going.
Why do you have director's chairs there? Just to hang out in? Because I'm a groupie, and when I did my little movie career, I actually stole the entire chair, not the back. You guys that make real movies, I took the whole chair.
You took the whole chair. Well, you made a bunch of movies.
I want to get into that in a minute. You've done a lot, actually quite a surprising amount of acting.
Yeah, it's a fascinating career. Yeah, I think that, but you started as a singer, as a musician, and I kind of want to talk about what was that? I want to know how you know you could sing.
Well, yeah, like what was that first thing growing up in New Jersey?

What was that early music scene, and how did you plug into it?

You know, how do you get started?

Yeah.

What do you do?

Any kid that's all of our ages thinks of three things when they're 13.

You want to be a baseball player or a rock and roll star or an astronaut, know so you strum the tennis racket and you you think you can sing yeah when you're playing in the garages in the school dance with your first band um the benefit of that for me was that the drinking age in new jersey was 18 so at 16 i could be playing in a bar and i loved it so much that i didn't have the and i didn't have the responsibilities of a career path you had a job a higher education thought you know it was like music music music i like music and because my parents were somewhat supportive their attitude was if you're going to be in a bar at one or two in the morning

at least we know where you are and they saw that i was you know really really wanting to pursue that career path and then i was also blessed because you know i wrote runaway when i was 20 so that's i got a record deal at 21 yeah i want that was your first hit in in 1983 i put that out independently without the band and then got a record deal.

And it's been the same record deal for 40 years wow that's great was it ever did you so you started singing so young uh that was it was it was singing uncool at that age you know because like when i was a little kid like i always just thought singing was not was not was not cool because i was so young what was it like at your age when you did it all the centerfolds of circus magazine was pretty cool you know in the late 70s it was like zeppelin and aerosmith and queen and and leonard skinnard and springsteen and all the and then remember that Bruce Springsteen and Southside Johnny were from 25 miles south of my house. Wow.
So chances are with 10 Asbury Jukes and seven members of the E Street Band, by playing in those bars, you're going to see real live rock stars. Right.
And when you're 16, that's like seeing santa claus yeah you know so all of these

things were incredibly inspirational and being a lead singer in a rock band mr jason sir yeah it's pretty fucking good yeah i was gonna speak more about ballads probably in my head opposed to a rock and roll the ballads work the ballads work they work too are you kidding of Of course the ballads work.

Are you crazy, JB?

Think it through, dude.

Are you kidding? Of course the ballads work. Are you crazy, JB? Think it through, dude.
Yeah. Are you, but here's what blows my mind about your voice.
I always comment about how, like, your pipes are just incredible. The fact that, whoa! I mean, that's like way, way, way, way up there.
And not a lot of people can do that. And strong.
And where do you find find at such a young age because people are already trepidatious about opening their mouth and am i going to be able to sing and you're just wailing like where does that confidence come from like to really go for those notes at such a young age and write those songs that are massive not naivete it was i was too stupid to know any better. Yeah.
I didn't even study.

Really?

You just got in front of a mic and yelped until it made sense.

Yeah.

You know, I regret.

That's a high C, Sean.

The high note is a fucking C.

It's crazy.

It's like a soprano.

It's not good.

You know, when you're, I'm going to be 62 Saturday.

Wow. I'm 62 years old.
Happy birthday. Hitting a high C.
Can you do it? I can hit a, I can squeak out a C, yeah. Right.
So does it, does it, does it start to leave just like, you know, Tom Brady ain't thrown anymore? Yeah, the big thing about this huge documentary that we just did, the parallel story, and Sean, you relate to this. I went, I under went a massive surgery for the first time in my life in your throat for your vocal cord yeah oh wow i didn't know that scary yeah that's what i'm going through right now and hence this um but what not your typical nodule yeah because i really have studied singing for a lot of years you have but i had what's called now a medialization, if you're at all familiar with that.
One chord was atrophying while the strong one was pushing the weak one around and I wasn't singing well. And I couldn't understand it.
And this is on the last two years since the surgery. And they put a plastic implant outside the cords to strengthen them.
Wow. So I'm still in the rehab stage.
And it's disheartening. John, what was that like when you first noticed that? Do you remember having that first thing of like, shit, I'm not, yeah? And what you would do is compensate.
You know, you're like,'t work today so let me do it this way let me do it this way and finally you're standing on your head trying to hit a note and you would compensate and and to a point where it just wasn't very good anymore and other things start getting out of whack right way out of whack. And then your mind.
How are you feeling now?

How is it going?

I'm 20 months post-surgery.

I would say I'm 90% there.

And you still got to get the ghosts out of the machine, as you guys were saying.

The ones in your head.

Yeah.

The ones that are saying now that you're over back to, let's just say, you don't have to compensate anymore.

Your mind still has to remind your body that it's fixed.

You don't have to compensate anymore.

Right, right.

What about the absolute panic and horror of going under the knife?

And when I wake up, I hope that, A, I can speak.

And in the perfect world, I can still sing.

I'm sure your research on doctors must have been intense. Yeah, and this is what I do, right? This is, I'm a singer.
Yeah, the doctor, I knew the doctor that did Julie Andrews. So you and I both know that story.
And you went to him too. And so did I for a lot of years.
Yeah. But the guy that I found in Philadelphia, the greatest thing he said after I exhausted everything, every bit of what I call voodoo, every Eastern medicine, every laser, every dietary singing lessons, everything I possibly could.
And I did 15 shows and it just was not working. And I went to see him and I said, I can give you a hundred percent of 80%.
And he says that good enough and I said no I'm gonna quit he says now we can talk about this surgery oh and he says and I guarantee you nothing he says but if you work hard this will give you your best shot so I've been diligent in my recovery and hoping that you know everything's gonna be all right but I I I don't know are you bullish on uh being able to get out there and tour again i'm hoping to be i'm i'm being bluntly honest you know i if i'm not great i'm not going yeah but but but but but hang on i mean like there are plenty of musicians and bands that i would easily pay top dollar to go see even if they but even if they can't make the song sound like it did when they recorded it fucking 30 years ago i still want to see them doing it and just move the mic away from their mouth a little bit when they reach for that high seat like i mean but look at john's like no john but you're providing more than, you know, incredible singing.

We want to see you, John.

Watch YouTube.

I'm not interested.

Not interested.

Well, what about your bandmates?

Are they understanding of that position?

Or are they saying, fucking come on?

No, you know, we are actively rehearsing.

We did a couple of days this week.

Everybody was here in New Jersey just running it hard for a couple of days and measuring the progress.

Oh, that's great.

Because I have this great new record.

I feel optimistic about the record.

I love the film.

A guy named Deepak, Gotham Chopra, Deepak's son, directed it.

It was a two-year, four-part docuseries that will air on Hulu. Deepak, Gotham Chopra, Deepak's son directed it.

It was a two-year, four-part docuseries that'll air on Hulu, but I'm very happy with it

because it's on the band.

Yeah.

It's so great.

It's our 40th anniversary right now.

I can't wait to see that.

That's so mind-blowing, 40 years.

I feel like I became really, well, like a lot of people,

really well aware of you guys with the massive, first all your massive hit living on a prayer which well there's tons yeah i mean there's tons of but that was the 10 different of course but that's sort of like for me that was the first one that really i was like holy shit and that you guys kind of do you remember the first time playing that when it was a hit and playing it in front of an audience and everybody going like, fuck yeah. Maybe not the first time, but what was interesting about that song is we really didn't know what we had because it was so different.
It didn't sound like anything on the radio. And, you know, it had a Motown kind of a bass line.
It had the boy-girl story that is almost Shakespearean at the end of the day, you know.

And it's so, You Give Love a Bad Name was the first single on that record,

and it was a number one song.

And that was pretty evident and obvious that it would be.

But when we put out Living on a Prayer, I thought, yeah, it should be second,

because who knows what it's going to do.

And then, of course, you know, it's one of the biggest pop songs of all time. We'll be right back.
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And now, back to the show. Can I tell you something about You Give Love a Bad Name? I guess.
My first dog was named Buzzy and when I was, yeah And when I was potty training him,

he would go outside and he would poop on the lawn.

So I changed the words from what they are to,

there's poop on the lawn and you're too blame.

Buzzy, you give dogs a bad name.

I love that. Thank you, Sean.
You're too Blaine Buzzy. You give dogs a bad name.
I love that. Thank you, Sean.
You're welcome. There's poop on the lawn.
And you're too Blaine Buzzy. This is the family member that you just stop inviting, you know? No, we're not having Thanksgiving this year, Sean.
Sorry. You know? Wait, I have other stories.
Sean, tell me more about your music career because I didn't get the chance, but Dorothea saw the play. It was so good.
My wife saw the play and was talking so incredibly about not only your playing, but your singing as well. How did you keep it eight days a week? Well, that's so nice.
It was just a play. I didn't sing, but I played.
Oh, you didn't have to sing. No, I'll never do that again.
But his voice, she was probably talking about, he did a whole different voice for this character that I remember Will and I kind of, Will, did we look at each other? Like when he came out, I think we've told the story. It was such a big swing.
A big swing. Look at each other like, oh boy, here we fucking go.
Because it's one of those moments, John, where you're like, it's either going to be great or it's going to be terrible. What are we going to say to him backstage? And like 30 seconds past that point, it's like, oh no, we're in good hands.
He's pulling this off. And it was a big, it was a different voice, a whole gate and everything.
I said to Jason when I saw him right after the show, I said, can I guess your thought bubble when I first came out? He said, yeah. And it was just, uh-oh.
Wait, John, did you ever do Broadway? Did you ever do a show on Broadway? No. God, you were great.
The stage to me is the stage. Yeah, of course.
I didn't need that even in the learning experience. For me, when I went in to try to learn to act, and I studied for a couple of years before I ever even went for an audition, it was the opportunity to grow in the arts.
It was just a different avenue in the arts that I could bring that back then to the fold, different material to write about, different humility, standing on the audition line and, you know, being turned down before you even walked into the room. And all of that humility that I brought back while I was learning about the craft was incredibly formative.
What was your feeling about that as you were starting to learn about acting and quote-unquote study it? Because I'm always sort of of a little pessimistic about if it's something we can learn to do i think it's all something we all know how to do it's just freeing yourself up but like did you think it was like oh this is a real craft a real art form that i'm enjoying or were you like oh this is just learning how to be full of shit i mean both both are valid both are true but there's just just different perspectives on what it is and and how where did it find itself on you i just have too much respect for y'all and and i immensely respect the craft that i i wouldn't dare think that even pacino or dinero if i put a microphone in their face and said sing me a song right they'd be any good at it right i think in order to be good at it you should learn how to do it yeah amen and so i studied for two years privately not in classes but uh privately until like i was confident enough to even you know try to get an audition yeah i had too much respect for it and what was the one things that you that made you feel like you wanted to take on that challenge of of expanding your creative juices from music to acting i had had um five records uh by that point and slippery was our third that was a monster new jersey was a monster then i wrote the soundtrack to the young guns record and i you know i win all the awards with that so there was this kind of stupid ego moment in the band's history where you're like you think you're too smart the incredible thing about starting over with something in the arts that you know nothing about but you've had so many other life experiences brings you a great humility and so that when you take that back to music it was it was an opportunity for me to share that with the guys and for them to then learn from that. And it humbled all of us to go.
I think that's a big reason why when we went into the 90s and the grunge movement happened, we didn't even slow down. We still had hits.
We still kept going. We had more international growth than ever.
and all of that was i think a direct result of my sitting in that basement apartment in manhattan with harold guskin for years you know getting yelled at and so i i really really loved the process of acting the bitch was whenever and you guys know this well i would go in and they'd say anytime you get a spark this town, you take off for a year and go on the road.

We don't think you're serious about it.

I said, I'm fucking serious about it,

but you pay me two cents.

And I'm six on the call sheet.

Right.

What am I going to do here?

There's a stadium waiting in, you know, wherever.

Right, right, right, right. What was that first film that I remember you did?

Moonlight and Valentino was a girly movie. Moonlight and Valentino, yes.
Yeah, Gwyneth and Whoopi and Kathleen Turner and Liz Perkins. So do you remember the first, so let's talk about that.
So you, I mean, you talk about it, but like you're a massive international superstar rock star, and then you go on the set of this movie, and it's a new thing that you've just been sort of learning about that first day on set, that first take. Oh, yeah.
So I say I'll never forget it. The director was a guy named David Ansbach who had done Hoosiers and Rudy.
And so he was a guy's guy writing those kind of movies. He's got four ladies as his stars i'm the cute you know house painter

we're doing take two take three take four after the girls are giving him like one take a piece and walking off the set and he's going take two take three and i walked over to him i said david i'm sorry we have to do so many takes i'll pay for the film this is how we make movies I'll pay for the film

that's so sweet

it must have been nerve-wracking though

yeah I'll pay for the film. That's so sweet.

Now, were you encouraged? It must have been nerve-wracking, though. Yeah, I'll bet it was nerve-wracking.
But did you find some sort of encouragement and inspiration that there were— you weren't the first of, like, Sting and David Bowie. They did some great performances.
Was that inspirational for you? No, because they'd all, by definition, weren't successful. You may look back and think that those movies were cool, but we were, as musicians, told you do either or.
Bowie and Madonna and whatever were, know no there's musicians that want to act they're not allowed to freely do both the ways sinatra could but what were your expectations you weren't you weren't possibly looking to match your level of success with acting that you had it wasn't based on success it was based on opportunity so that the opportunities just kept going down and down and down and then suddenly you're making like an indie to an indie, and I'm sitting on the curb outside of CAA like with a tear in my eye. What have I done? But did you find that, I mentioned that you were in the Songwriters Hall of Fame, you're such a great songwriter and lyricist and music and everything.
And did you find when you were acting throughout the years, did you find that sort of common thing as an artist as you're doing it, sort of the beats of it? Was there a commonality between being a performer, being a singer, songwriter and being an actor? What was that kind of? I think there are commonalities, but again, I think the biggest thing to me was that finding something else in the arts that gave me an opportunity to grow. It wasn't like I went from singing to building cars, you know, one has nothing at all to do with the other.
This is another way to emote. This is another way to tell a story.
This is more information for me to write about because, you know, all I had to write about between 21 and 30 was life on the road, to be honest with you. I was nowhere near as seasoned a man as Bob Dylan or Woody Guthrie.
You know, I was writing pop songs in a rock and roll band, you know, in a very sheltered middle American white suburban life. So, you know, going and learning about, I don't know, Tennessee Williams and coming home and writing something and thinking, ooh, you know, why did I get to write Blaze of Glory and the whole Young Gun soundtrack with my hands on a script? I know how to do that.
Does it still hold interest for you? Where does it sit now for you, the acting? I would have to stop doing music and go back to really working hard on the craft. You know, I have far too much respect for it to think, sure, send me a role, I'm ready to go.
Well, is it sitting there sort of in second position to... Second position.
As you start to see, like, let's see how the voice does. Yeah.
And if the voice is not to your standards maybe we can look

forward to seeing more acting from you i wouldn't be i wouldn't say no for sure i would just make sure i did it right yeah what about producing music or producing uh other i did all that early on i don't need it i don't need any any more egos in the studio i got a big enough one myself okay Well, Sean, you can log off.

Hey, did you...

Forgive me. more egos in the studio.
I got a big enough one myself. Okay, well, Sean, you can log off.
Hey, did you, forgive me, did you see the We Are the World documentary? Yes. Wasn't that, yeah, incredible.
I want to see that. All those people coming together.
Wow. I'd never even thought about that they were there through the night.
Yeah, I know. And at six in the morning, they're waiting for their solo line and like you know bruce and cindy lauper are just cockeyed still just being good sports about it i mean i i you were missed in that i was like where's i was i was just a little too young it was i had two albums out by that point i wasn't big enough oh all right i wasn't big enough yet but go go back to the performing, in big arenas and shows and stuff and fans and dealing with fans and stuff like that.
Is there any kind of, was there any kind of moment? Have you ever had, like, any kind of crazy happening on stage with a fan that was just completely through the show? Sure. I mean, all the cliche, you know, stuff.
People screaming and that kind of stuff. Rushing the stage.
Girls throw you their underwear throw you their underwear i mean you're everybody got to be yeah that's not that's not even original because you know what i mean it's sort of every kid got to be justin bieber to justin timberlake all the way back to elvis you know it just it's sure i would harry styles you know all that yeah and how do you or any of those people you just mentioned avoid the intoxication and complete transitioning into, well, I'm God. And it's never going to be anything different.
And you end up buying the ego that you, in retrospect, should have been renting. But, like, how do you avoid that big pitfall of it's never going to be any less than this because you're you're in a you're in a four six or sorry three sixty of of idolization that is got to be impossible to not or to make right size jump into yeah i don't know i mean for me it was you seem so balanced not being there where y'all are for me that was one thing when i bought the house in Malibu.
Staying out of California. I bought the house on the beach in Malibu.
And my wife and I looked at each other and said, not for me. Because I knew what the lifestyle was, and we were caught up in it.
A lot of those people, we had a house right on the beach. We were all at the height of everybody's craziness.
And that was one of the things that we said, let's go back to New Jersey where there's no Joneses to keep up with. Right.
You know, let's go back to what we know. You mentioned it, John, your wife, Dorothea, who I've also had the great pleasure and honor of spending a little bit of time with and getting to know a little bit.
And she's such an awesome person. And I was yeah you you didn't you didn't fall into any of those pitfalls you grew up I mean and I'm when I say grew up I mean like sir your 20s those formative years you were a massive star was that was you and Dorothea kind of were you guys in it together did that help keep you grounded absolutely we've since high school.
Yeah. Wow.
So for us, that was, yeah, we grew together. Yeah.
Yeah. So she's seen the whole ride.
And then, you know, she didn't have to buy into something or I didn't have to doubt her commitment to it. And then I could fall in the gutter throughout the course of it.
And she could say, okay, I got it. I know why.
And, you know, let's pick it up and go from here. So, yeah, I give her the credit for so much of it.
How lucky are you that you have that? You had this partner with you. Oh, I know.
Right? Yeah, we're married 35 years already. Bono went through the same thing, right? Yeah, yeah.
With his work. Like, it's just incredible.
So, John, I always, you know, we always talk about, too, people who are in the music world about, like, Chicken and the Yag. Do you write the lyrics? Do you write the music first? Talk about your process.
Like, what inspires you to write a certain way as opposed to other? And do you like, your voice lends itself to ballads so much more than the other stuff, and it's all great, but you have such a lyric voice. Well, thank you.
It's come both ways, but for me, I would like to say just a slim majority of it comes from a title first, because for me that dictates the feel of the music. And then, you know, I write the lyric.
Just like something that you like you you know want a dead or alive is is you know that kind of a feeling of an open d chord it just it just it calls for that and better roses would call for something else you know um that was it was sort of meant to be written on a piano um but the process depends on on the situation and we had a record out in the midst of covid called 2020 and it was a topical record so it covered everything from gun control to george floyd to covid to an introspective topical record released into a black hole of covid that i couldn't promote it couldn't tour and it's good that i was able to do that. I was very proud of it.

This record, post-surgery, and the process,

because there's no happy ending yet,

is that I'm finding joy for the first time in a decade.

I'm truly finding joy. I haven't had joy in a decade.

Why?

Wow.

Because of the voice.

Yeah.

I was honored just recently at this Music Cares event two weeks ago, three weeks ago out in L.A. The Grammys pick one person to celebrate their catalog, and in my case, the philanthropy.
Michael McDonald's involved with that, yeah? Yeah. And I was this year's honoree.
And on the Saturday morning after the night, I I woke up and I was like, something's weird. And I went, I know what it is.
It's the first time in 10 years the only voice in my head was mine. No doubt, no fear, no second thoughts.
You know, it's just I had fun last night. Would you have, despite the not despite your despite the surgery myself to shit for the last decade but i would have beat myself i do it daily anyway yeah and i don't have anything wrong with i don't like that sean i'm fucking tired of it yeah tell me how you stop doing it because what are beating yourself up yeah but you know what i always say like we were talking about this a while ago like if if if beating yourself up of putting yourself down if that cured you then we'd all be fixed right it doesn't work right it just doesn't work oh right and it you know um it's hard to yeah it's hard to um you know stop that voice in your head that probably're probably a perfectionist.
And so anything less than,

you start beating yourself up.

I always beat myself up when I leave

any social event at all.

I'll get in the car and be like,

God, was that okay?

I said that to that person.

Personality hangover, we call it.

Oh, personality hangover.

Yeah, exactly.

But Sean said to me once,

I remember you, and you said,

nobody's harder on me than myself.

And I said, give me a shot. That's true.
But John, what was bringing on the beating yourself up? Just that you weren't having access to do your stuff, you know? Like you were just. Yeah.
It was like, you know, I was saying that, you know, the only thing that's ever been up my nose is my finger. And now suddenly God's taking away my tools.
And I'm like, I'm at my wits end. And the crazy doctor says, I don't know what it is.
But I just gave you all my trust. What do you mean you don't know what it is? Now, I'm aimlessly out there.
Take more drugs for it.

Take another shot for it.

Sean can relate, right?

And I'm going down this. I mean, when I did, not the recent Broadway show,

but I did a musical once.

What was it called?

Promises, Promises.

Anyway, thanks.

And I was on Prednisone for a year.

Yep.

Just because you had to,

it's always inflamed, always inflamed.

It's no life.

It's no life.

And it gets you puffy.

It gets you a little puffy.

There's Jason.

There he is.

I thought your mic was not working for a second.

And we will be right back.

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at H-E-R-o dot c-o and now back to the show john um with the the um the frustration of not being able to you know perform and and go out there and do, you know, throw your fastball was probably

at the same time that you were probably more loaded with quality ideas and inspiration

for stuff to write.

Yeah.

Just because I just find the older we get, the smarter we get, the better we are at everything.

And so are you now sort of approaching a possible where where they match or you know i'm hoping i i think i'm on the verge i think i'm on the verge of that yeah these last couple of that attitude that i couldn't fully celebrate these last couple records i'm hoping and and believing that um i'm going to have that opportunity again when we do get to go out. Yeah, that's the hope.
Honestly, John, that attitude, you have that, you kind of ooze positivity. I will say, I didn't realize that you were going through all this.
And anytime I see you, you've always got such a great attitude. You come into a room, you shine light, you ask people how they're doing.
I love that about you. I think it's really great.
And I also know you do a lot of philanthropy as well, right? You started, you got the Jon Bon Jovi Soul Foundation. Is that what it is? The foundation and the kitchens, yeah.
And the kitchens. I mean, this is great.
Talk to us a little bit about what you do. These guys don't know about this stuff.
It's awesome. Kitchens.
A thousand years ago ago i used to own an arena football team my aspirations were to someday own an nfl team and it was me cutting my teeth yeah but in order to win in the in the community in philadelphia i said we got to be more philanthropic than everyone so that sort of was my first foray into this we started to find something that anyone everyone could relate to which was affordable

housing and hunger and so i started to do that and everybody was like yeah bravo good job you know habitat for humanity does this every day right when the economic downturn of 2008 happened torthea said now you got to feed the people in the houses you've built and it's like hmm and in of consciousness, she just lays out a plan for this thing that we now call the JBJ Soul Kitchens. Simply put, if any of you guys came and laid 30 bucks on the table, it would cover your meal and the meal of somebody else who can't afford to pay.
It empowers people because we ask them if they can't pay anything to volunteer. And if you guys were to come and didn't volunteer, you'd sort of think you're missing the party because everybody's working in the garden or bussing a table or washing a dish, folding napkins.
It's not difficult labor, but when they feel empowered and they've earned their certificate to not only pay for their meal but perhaps it's a kid he comes back with his entire family and you've got that pride in a teenager bringing his family back and feeding them it's all farm to table we take no government subsidies so we did our first one in an auto body shop that we converted into this restaurant second one we we built after Hurricane Sandy in New Jersey here,

and we have all this service providing around it,

a food pantry, a food bank, culinary program.

Then the third one and the fourth one, this blows people's minds,

are on college campuses because we were aware,

but most people think, wait a minute, I just sent my kid to the university.

Well, guess what?

They're not necessarily eating ramen by choice. They don't have any money.
So we came to that realization many years ago and we put one on two different university campuses here in New Jersey. So we currently have four of those restaurants.
And then myself or our foundation fund the shortfall. And we've been doing that for 12, 13 years now.
That's so cool. My mom started a, she was one half who started a food bank for people in the Chicagoland area called Northern Illinois Food Bank.
Very similar to what you're doing. And that's kind of her legacy.
And she's still remembered there. It's part of Second Harvest, which I'm sure you know.

Yeah, and I bet you it gave her hard work but great joy.

No, Will, I want to go first.

So she was just sort of half on her.

She just kept an eye on part of it.

I was going to say she could have called it Eye on Hunger.

Sean's mom. My mom had one eye.
Oh, Jesus Christ. It's just a nice little.
She had two. One of them was wooden.
One of them was made of wood. No, it wasn't wooden.
It was glass. It was glass.
Sick. He brought it out on stage and we held it.
The eye. It's in a nice box.
In his mom's eye, we held it. Yeah, for real.
Nice guys. Nice guys.
You call them your friends. But, wait, so, John, what the hell is Bon Jovi? Is that, what nationality is that? What the hell is Bon Jovi? What kind of question is that? Sean, can I talk to you for a second? What the hell is Bon Jovi? No, I mean, I always...
It's Italian. Okay, since I was a kid, I thought you made that name up.
B-O-n-g-i-o-v-i oh really b-o-n-g-i-o-v-i b-o-n yeah the same way g-i which in italian phonetics is the j sound yeah okay so it's pronounced the same way but it's b-o-n-g-i instead of a j and it's always been two separate words no no no it's it's the silly american that couldn't figure it out and in truth when i got the record deal and i had gotten the band together to help me play runaway because i had it on the radio um all over the country yeah um i went to the record company said we got an idea it should you know it should be you And I went, how about if it's we? And if you remember Van Halen. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I was like, we make it two words. Oh, very good.
This is good. Oh, that's great.
In truth, it was a little bit of that in the 80s because I didn't want to be a solo artist. I really knew that that's too much heat.
Yeah. I mean, because when I was a kid, I i thought it was you guys were all related the worst guy on the and that the worst fair weather fan will come up to you on the street and go hey bond no it's not bond motherfucker you're not a not a very big fan hey on the on the on on the music uh industry business sort of and because our industry is going through a bit of a transition now, your business was started much earlier with the transition.
How do you feel that the industry is doing and adapting? Are you a fan of the current state of things? I think we've at least hit a place now where there's stability. I've said it before.
We, my band and i at this time and those around our period uh were there for what was called the gold rush you know when cds were invented and everybody bought their record collection again and you could sell 20 million copies of an album um so i was fortunate enough to have been in the in the heat of that yeah nowadays, because they finally settled on streaming. I'm okay with it.
You know, I, I wish and I blame Apple for breaking up the CD, the work of art, the book, they sold you one chapter of the book at a time instead of the entire book. I was always pissed off about that.
And their attitude was, we're going to sell you one song at a time so you don't have to buy the whole album. Well, wait a minute, I just wrote the whole album.
I'm excited about the whole album. I want to present it as a whole.
So I've always been pissed off since that, the advent of the iPod. But I think we've reached a stable place with streaming.
And in this current state of affairs for the young talent, what was also daunting was that the record companies now aren't signing you because you just wrote a great song. They want to know how many likes you've got on social media, which is a sin.
But on the other hand, it affords the world the opportunity to have another Bob Dylan because there was a period in time where unless you sounded like you could sing on American Idol, you weren't going to get a record deal. So the internet allows for a Bob Dylan.
The streaming allows for some stability, even though it's a low rate, but it's something. And this is the new world order order so it's obligating you guys to go out and do a bunch of touring in order to make a bunch of money and that's kind of exhausting still as criminal as it ever was it it's it's it's harder on the young band and how are they going to support themselves on the road if they don't have any record money or there's tour support and all the things that we had 40 years ago that they're not going to have now.
I've heard and have been in on conversations, but it's obviously not something I can directly relate to. It's not as big a business for the young kid coming up.
It's like I get to do that, but I'm also going to have to do this and this in order to make a living. It's the same with all entertainment.
It feels like you have to learn how to do it all. I think about it all the time.
Starting as a young actor today, as opposed to when we started out, and you could go out and you get a job, you auditioned for stuff, you were in the mix, you auditioned for pilots, you get a movie, do all that. Because now it's such a free-for-all.
Or you could do a commercial and you could expect $30,000 by the time it's done its run. Like now it's all non-union and, you know.
Yeah, you could do a Golden Grahams commercial. You know what I mean? Has anybody ever done a Golden Grahams commercial? Yeah, I'm in a go-kart in that one.
My son is a young aspiring actor and he would have that magic when he walked into a room for an audition.

But because he came up during COVID and now,

everything is on these Zooms.

And I think that all those casting agents

are missing out on the personality

of the young actor or actress coming in.

Totally agree.

And winning your heart, not just reading their lines.

I will tell you, though,

I'm in the middle of casting something right now.

And none of these casting sessions are in person.

They're all on the ground. not just reading their lines.
I will tell you though, I'm in the middle of casting something right now and none of these casting sessions are in person.

They're all on Zoom.

And I am so jealous that the actors

are not stuck in what was always for me

the most stressful thing I could ever do.

Yeah, that's true too.

Was waiting in the lobby,

hearing the actor before me doing it killing them being late me going over my sides and over my sides and then going in having to do the the bullshit talking with them and now i'm sweating and i'm having to be and then i gotta switch into acting gear and then i gotta do then they get like it was so nerve-wracking the fact that they get to do it on Zoom now, to me is like, it's much less stressful. But I think there's always been a flaw in that, Jay, because you shouldn't just put all the actors up for the same role in one room.
It's just, you know, is there another way to do it? Like schedule them? The whole thing is torture. Yeah.
I don't know, but there's something to also going through that experience, you know, after, somebody who I grew up in New York in the 90s, in my 20s, and went on a million auditions and bombed a bunch. And I learned so much from that process.
And then also, conversely, when I did start having success, I really appreciated it. It wasn't until my 30s that I had any success.
I really appreciate it because I had gone through that for so many years and was starving. Yeah, you do.
I also made some friends during the process, so they're missing out on that. I made a lot of friends.
Yeah. Right.
A lot of friends. I just think that they missed the personality.
Yeah, I agree, John. Wooing that casting agent some and letting them see that spark.
And knowing whether they're going to be a problem on set. Do they have, are they nice people? Yeah.
John, I think that you're totally on to something. I was also just thinking about what you were saying before about albums and when you would write an album.
And I was just thinking, like, you remember that feeling, you really hit on something, that feeling as a kid of getting an album and taking it home and taking the plastic off it and taking the sleeve out and reading the lyrics and listening to every freaking song. How does it start? How does it start? Is it my imagination or is the third song always one that kicks your ass? That's the single.
That's the single. Okay.
Wait, I didn't know that. Is that by design? It just happens to be sort of commonplace.
You kind of start slow and then you nail them and then yeah and then there's a there's a there's a balance there was the third track on was it really there you go yeah hey give me the first note are you by piano or a guitar or anything give me the first note of the chorus sean are you gonna sing i'm gonna try it oh oh please thank you come on well we're out of time, everybody. I'm not that close.
Now you are. Stay tuned for Smartless Extras, where you can enjoy some of Sean's...
It's that, in minor. Didn't you hear that? Yes.

I had to run across the room and bang on the piano.

Wait, wait, wait. What's the one?

Whoa, whoa.

Is that the first note, but it's up in octave?

Yeah, it's a G, yeah.

Whoa, whoa.

Yeah.

Halfway there.

Go on.

Whoa, whoa.

Nope.

It's so high.

It's so high, it's crazy.

You know what you do then is you hold the microphone out. Put the mic out.
It sounds like you're furious. Let the audience do it.
You hold the mic over the audience, you go, Buzzy, you give dogs a bad name. But John, you know what? Whenever your songs come on the radio in the car, I will pretend I'm you and I will scream my head off.
Love that. It's impossible, impossible not to just absolutely belt out one of your songs, John, when they come on.
It's just the best. Dude, we've taken up too much of your time already.
You're such a— So much fun. John, when you're coming to town, let's hang out.
I would love that. Nothing would make me happy.
You're never coming back. Very brave.
Don't give me your thumbs up. No, let's do it in New York.
Let's do it in New York. In New York.
That would be great. That'd be awesome.
And then, and then we'll do, we'll do it, JB's in New York for the next six months. Year.
Let's do it. Yeah.
Yeah, please. Let's get together.
Cool, guys. This was really a joy.
Thanks for doing it, too. Likewise.
Thank you. John, you're such a great dude.
You're such a cool dude. Yeah, and such a great artist.
And thank you for taking the time. Thank you all.
And wish you all the best, man. Can't wait to see you again.
Thanks, guys. Thank you, John.
All right, have a good one. Bye now.
You too. All right, pal.
The great Jon Bon Jovi. He's great.
So fucking easy. They don't make them like that anymore.
You know? I mean, the great Jon Bon Jovi just sounds like a little, like, we need a better word than great. Yeah.
JB, you were just, yeah. Yeah, I just said the great Jon Bon Jovi, but you're right.
It doesn't seem like it's enough. Right.
Well, and who's doing it? What they did, who's doing that today? There isn't a size of a band today like that. it's enough right well because well and who's doing it what what they did who's doing that today there isn't a size of a band no today like that it's all sort of like been um diluted a bit i didn't even ask him about like the prep for a show with the hairspray and the hair and the outfits and those were all wigs always no i'm kidding i'm kidding no um yeah no super easy to hang out with.
Yeah, he seems such a good guy. Where did you meet him, Will? I met him, we have a bunch of mutual friends and obviously...
Long Island. And just, yeah, just over the years.
And he is one of those guys, every time you see him, he's just, he's very sort of warm and very generous with people. Actually, one time I had lunch with him years ago.
We were down on vacation and Archie was maybe a year old. Feels like this could be a St.
Bart's story. Go ahead.
We're down on vacation, you know. And he got, Archie got like all these little bites all over.
We didn't know what was going on we were freaking out you know you got a one year old you're like what's going on we're in the middle of nowhere and John helped us sort of call a friend who had new you know got us in you know to get him looked at it it was great he was very sweet I love that he was a very sweet guy yeah he's super You know, that Slippery When Wet album was so huge.

That's where that Living on a Prayer song was.

But there was another song on there.

Oh, my God.

Here we go.

And it was called, and really, it's a real song.

Is it?

I know, I know.

I'm sorry.

Do you have another appointment?

No, it's called Never Say Good Bye.

It's a real song. It's a real song.
You know what your nickname is? Shoehorn. Because you just turn a shoehorn.
You're always looking for a way out. We always got you on the tail.
Are you late? No. Smart.
Nice. Smart.
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