Glenn Reacts to Hecklers at His TPUSA Campus Speech | Guests: Frances Staudt & Paul List | 10/10/25

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This is

the Glen Beck Program.

Hello, America.

Welcome to the Glen Beck Program.

I was in North Dakota last night and it was absolutely amazing.

TPUSA and what Charlie started has grown into something absolutely amazing.

There were about 2,500 students there last night.

I had a blast.

They were so gracious and so kind and the audience was great.

But there is inside of that a warning.

that I didn't realize until the last six minutes that I was on stage when I was taking questions that I want to talk to you about.

So we'll go over that

and something that Christopher Ruffo wrote the other day, The Right Way to Fight Anti-Semitism.

And I read it, and I think a lot of people will think, oh, Glenn's going to be against this.

Nope.

I believe Christopher Ruffo was 100% right in what he wrote, and I want to share that with you in just a second.

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Hello, Stu.

How are you?

That's a great question, Glenn.

No idea.

That's my new position on that question.

I have no freaking idea.

So, in other words, it's going to be exciting to see how it all works out.

It really will.

It really is.

Yeah.

Intense movie we're about to watch.

Got more intense last night.

Got more intense last night.

And I will share what I'm willing to share with you on the air today,

but I want you to really hear me carefully.

There is a grave, grave danger that is building,

and I want to talk to you about it.

I saw it last night with my own eyes

in a very small number.

I want to make this really clear.

Very small number of students.

I saw it last night, and I want to talk to you about it.

But first, let me set it up with this.

So Christopher Ruffo wrote, on the right, many supporters of Israel, I think that would be you and me.

many supporters of Israel, because I'm a supporter, including prominent Republican politicians, argue that America has a theological duty to support the Jewish state.

Now, I think personally, for me, I feel that's true.

But what does that mean exactly?

I'll get into it in a minute.

Their view is based on a complex interpretation of Bible prophecy.

As a Catholic, I find it mystifying.

As a political

analysis, I find it unconvincing.

Analysts, sorry.

The other supporters would like to shut down critical analysis of the war altogether, equating criticism of Israel with anti-Semitism and suggesting those who question the wisdom of America's support should be unwelcome in polite society.

I want you to know on the outset, absolutely wrong.

Because you disagree with Israel does not make you an anti-Semite.

Doesn't.

It doesn't.

It makes you a thinking human being, honestly.

These moves might have been effective in the past, but not so much anymore instead of theological or shame-based approaches friends of israel must frame their arguments in terms of america's national interest 100

right

100

right

we need to understand our national interests

so

hear me out on this So you know, I have received the Defender of Israel Award from Benjamin Netanyahu years ago.

I was just named by the

Jerusalem Post as the number one Christian supporter of Israel in America.

So I'm kind of known as, I guess, a Zionist.

I believe that Israel has a right to exist and the Jewish people have a right to live.

Somehow or another, you get awards for saying that.

But I want you to understand something.

My support is not blind loyalty, nor is it anything that

makes me Israel first, doesn't

God first, America second.

Israel is in the pile of everything else.

Okay.

My first citizenship is to the kingdom of Christ.

My second citizenship is to America.

I will do nothing that will violate my citizenship, my passport to the kingdom of God.

And I certainly won't violate things for my first citizenship to save my second citizenship.

But that's the rank of my citizenship.

God first,

America right behind it.

In the earthly sense, America first.

Okay?

No loyalty to the government of Israel.

In fact, there's many things I don't like about the government of Israel.

But you know what?

I'm not a citizen.

I don't vote, and I don't have to worry about their laws.

When it comes to war, I want nothing to do with that foreign war.

Or quite honestly, almost any foreign war.

I'm tired of paying for it.

I'm tired of our blood being shed.

I want nothing to do.

That's not my support of Israel or the Jewish people.

What is required when we talk about these things is

Israel's existence is not just about their national survival.

It is about the survival of Western civilization itself.

It is the only lone beacon in the Middle East that is standing against radical Islam.

They're the only ones.

They're the number one target of radical Islam.

Now, look at what's happening in the Middle East right now.

Those countries that we used to think of as having real radical ties, Now, Saudi Arabia, they're actually saying, you know what, we can coexist.

That's what's necessary, coexistence in the Middle East.

As long as we have a reason, as long as we believe we each have a reason to live and we have a right to live, we can solve any problem.

We can solve any problem.

They are facing Islamicist evil.

And

that evil is the same evil that wishes to dismantle our civilization and our country.

And it's happening in our own country.

My support is not rooted in politics.

It is rooted in something simpler and older than politics.

A people's moral and historic right to their homeland and to their right to live in peace.

That's it.

And I would say that to anybody.

If the Gazans wanted their own

land

and say, because this is a two-state solution that's been offered to them over and over over and over again, but it wasn't river to the sea, which is the definition of wipe out all of the Jews.

No Jews in this land.

Okay.

You want to share?

I'm totally fine with that.

But I can't, I couldn't, we wouldn't, put up with a neighbor who's constantly saying and trying to kill you.

So

when it comes to politics, I believe Israel has a right to defend herself against those who openly, repeatedly vow her destruction.

But I'm not going to fight that.

I don't agree with everything that Israel has done.

But what difference does that make?

Because I'm not asking for our dollars or our blood to be spent.

I just say everybody has a right to live.

But let me make it personal.

If

somebody told me over and over and over and over again that they wanted to kill me and my entire family, that I didn't have a right to exist, that I was the source of all evil in the world,

and then acted on that threat over and over again.

Do you believe I would have a right to defend myself?

If I couldn't get anybody in the world to listen and stand with me, and I had to do it all myself,

would I have a right

to

take action?

in response to them.

Remember, I believe, you know, nature's law gives us a lot of stuff.

If I walk into a bear cave and mama and the cubs are in there, I think the bear has a right to maul me to death because it senses trouble.

Now, that's an animal.

But if I go in and I'm hunting those cubs, mom does have a right to kill me, but that would

you know that would assume that she had any kind of intellect.

Humans have intellect.

If Hamas were Canada and we were Israel and Hamas, Canada, did to us

what Hamas did to Israel,

answer this question honestly.

Would there be a single building left standing north of our border today?

If they came and raped the same percentage, killed, slaughtered, set our babies on fire, Do you think that we wouldn't have crippled Canada right now?

And no matter what anybody said, you think we would stop until that threat stopped?

That's not a question of morality.

That's just the truth.

All people, everybody has a God-written God-given right to protect themselves, period.

And Israel is doing that in the way they feel it's right.

You can argue with that and you can disagree vehemently with the way they're fighting the war.

My support for Israel's right to finish the fight against Hamas comes after 80 years of rejected peace offering, two failed state solutions.

Hamas has not hidden its mission.

Hamas says it's the eradication of Israel.

That's not a political disagreement.

That's not a reasonable disagreement in my book.

It's not a land dispute.

That's nihilists.

That's people

who are actually calling for genocide and proudly calling for wiping out of all the Jews.

Okay.

Do I believe that America should be in that fight?

No.

Do I believe it is in our national interest?

Yes.

To support the people who are standing up against what will be our possibly last foreign war, as Jefferson said.

Islamists believe,

if you listen to what's being said in Dearborn, they are planning on Sharia law here in America.

That is, that will wipe everything of the West out.

And they are moving into our countries.

I have no problem with Muslims.

I have a big problem with Islamists.

And there's a huge difference.

What we saw on October 7th was the face of evil.

Women and children slaughtered.

And beyond that, even the Nazis tried to hide it.

Okay.

The Nazis,

they knew the rest of the world would not approve.

These people were proud of it.

We've played the tapes for you.

Babies burned alive, innocent people raped, dragged through the streets.

And now we see people defending that evil in our own country.

That is nothing short of a moral collapse.

That is probably the greatest danger that we have is this

is this ideology that says, if I disagree with you, I can kill you.

The confusion of I disagree with Israel the way they're fighting a war.

And so I'm going to say, I support Hamas because the Jews are always wrong.

The Jews are lying.

And I don't believe any of those videotapes because it was probably Jewish propaganda.

That's moral collapse.

If the chants in the street were, Hamas, give up the hostages, don't ever do things like that again, and Israel, for the love of Pete, stop the bombing, I'd be totally cool, totally cool, because that's reasonable.

But that's not what we hear.

We hear open sympathy for genocidal hatred.

That is a chasm that is opened up in our society.

And it's not just a chasm opening up, you know, from decency, but from humanity itself.

And that's where the danger lies.

The same hatred that we saw in the 1930s, that I predicted would happen again about 2008, that we would see it on our streets, that hatred is taking root here, in Dearborn, in Minnesota, in London, in Paris, and not as horror, but heroism.

And if we're not vigilant, the enemy that Israel is currently facing today will be the enemy that the free world will face tomorrow.

That's not about politics.

That is truth.

It's about having the courage to call evil by its name and say, that doesn't happen.

Never again, not in the future.

That doesn't happen.

You don't have to open a Bible to believe or understand this.

You don't.

But if you do, if you're a believer, then the issue cuts much, much deeper.

And I wrote an op-ed on this and we'll be publishing at Glenbeck.com that goes deeper into that.

But I don't expect you to believe the Bible or believe what I believe.

I believe it's a very strong case, good versus evil here, or right versus wrong, if that's the way you want to phrase it, and national interest.

If you look at what the world is headed towards,

this is not just about Israel's right to exist.

exist.

This is about whether we still know the difference between right and wrong, good and evil, life and death cults.

It's about do we have the courage to stand for the principles that God outlined.

And that's not, you're going to inherit the land or any of that crap.

The principles of

You can live.

I believe you have a right because you, just like me, are a beloved child of God.

That's what it is.

And if we can't, if we don't have the courage to make the case

and

we're trying to convince people just to blindly follow because God says, God expects us to kick into reason.

God expects us to think things through.

And God expects us to disagree.

If we can't do those things, if we won't do those things, then the question is not, will Israel survive?

The question is, will we survive?

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10 Second Station ID.

So last night I was in North Dakota and I had a blast.

The people at TPUSA are just doing an unbelievable job.

This crowd last night, 2,500 people,

was fantastic.

They are awake.

I mean, I was boring them with history for 90 minutes.

And they were still awake?

And they were still awake.

Wow.

Yeah, they were still awake.

And

like maybe five people got up and walked out.

I mean, you know, it was probably because I was boring them to death.

But anyway,

they were fantastic.

We got to the questions.

and I don't want to overstate the support of these questions, okay?

But I want you to know it only takes one to change everything.

My first question I got last night was from a very respectful kid who asked me about my religion.

And he was very respectful, and we had a great conversation about it.

And, you know, you believe what you believe.

I believe what I believe.

Here's why.

Let's just not divide ourselves.

Everybody who's trying to fight for good, look at the fruits of the of the tree and let's, God will settle all this stuff.

He will.

You know, if I'm not a Christian and that's the only way I can get to heaven, which I believe,

well, then you know what?

I'm going to hell.

And I'll be very well aware of that when I get there.

But that's for God to judge.

And I'm not going to judge you.

So it was great.

The next question and several questions after that

were,

well, one of them ended, and the audience couldn't hear this you know clearly because it was said by the person behind the person with the microphone but it all was about the jews and when you talk about israel that's one thing when you talk about the jews

and again

don't think that you have to agree with israel

to um to not be anti-semitic you can be vehemently against the war and how they're fighting and benjamin netanyahu and all the politics you want and you're not an anti-Semite.

But when somebody says like they did last night who was lined up,

where's your proof that Hamas did any of those things on October 7th?

That's a Jewish conspiracy.

We're in trouble as a movement if it's coming from our side and it is.

This is Glenn Beck.

We'll continue our conversation and I want to play some of the things that I said last night coming up.

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subscribe to the free email newsletter at glenbeck.com it's every story we talk about every day set of now glennbeck.com

Welcome back to the Glen Beck program.

We are so glad that you are here.

Thank you so much for listening to the broadcast today.

I just got back late, late, late last night from North Dakota.

I wish you would have been there, Stu.

With TPO say, it was amazing.

They're awesome.

Amazing.

They are.

I wish I was there, too.

I saw that you're retiring.

And so are you going to become a baker or are you going to be...

Yeah, somehow or another, I announced that I was retiring.

I didn't know that, but I didn't know that actually either.

You know, seeing that I, you know, just signed an extension to my contracts.

But

yeah,

that came out all wrong.

I was talking about Charlie, and I was talking about how

I was trying to teach, you've got to work for the things, finish what you start.

get up every day and work and do the things you have to do to get.

And I related it to when he was 16 years old.

He said he wanted my job.

He wanted to be like me, which translation, he wanted to be like Rush Limbaugh.

He wanted the network show and everything else.

And

what I was trying to say was

I was going to say to Charlie either last night when we saw each other

or when I saw him at Amfest, Charlie, I told you, well, kid, Maybe someday when he was 16 or 17 years old.

You got to do the work.

You got to do the work.

And I watched him and he did the work.

And I wanted to take that to the next step and say, good job.

Good job.

You deserve any way I can help you.

I will mentor you.

When I retire in 10 years,

I'm never going to retire, but if I retire in 10 years, here are the keys.

Take it.

You deserve it.

You deserve it.

I mean, he's such a powerful person in the movement.

And that is

something that you've talked about, I know, to me, even off the air, but

as well.

and i think that i don't think he actually would have

i would have also said to him you're stupid because you are

you are everywhere doing everything yeah why you know rush used to talk about this i make my impact here charlie was making his impact everywhere yeah in politics in washington you know what i mean but that's what i was trying to say so didn't reintroduce my retirement uh at all

so excited i was like oh my gosh, he's going away.

And then you're like,

yeah, sorry, sorry.

Not going to do that.

Unfortunately.

Here, let me give you a couple of things that I shared

at TPUSA yesterday.

I tried to, you know, as I was flying up, I thought, I want to share like some lessons that I've learned that are important.

Cut one.

You promise me if I live my life the way you tell me to live my life, if I'm always doing what you ask me to do,

you will take this from me.

This is about redemption.

I don't know why they cut the words with me crying.

And my life changed overnight.

See, I feel like if I was out on a ship, I wouldn't want my captain to be crying like this.

The truth is about you that you have running in your head.

But it's probably not very good.

We all have these things.

Oh, if people only knew, if people only knew what I thought or what I did, or I'm not good enough, I'm a fraud whatever it is that's a lie maybe somebody in your life has been telling you that crap turn that off

turn that off you are a divine daughter and son of God with all of the rights and privileges that go with that you are equipped with everything you need

Don't let anyone tell you somebody stands in your way.

Don't let anybody tell you you can't do it.

The system is rigged against you.

I am a son of God.

I have everything I need.

So, you're retiring to be a yacht captain?

That's what that's.

No, I'm going to take over for God.

Oh, okay.

Yeah, so he talked to me.

He's going to turn the keys over.

He's retiring.

He's going to turn the keys over to me.

Here I am talking about the recipe for success.

Hopefully, I'm not crying in this clip.

Please help me.

I meet a million people

all the time who say, I want to have your job.

Usually what they're saying is, I want the fame or I want the fortune and I'm like you can have that.

It's battery acid to the soul.

Really?

You want my job?

Yeah.

Well I'll

help you any way I can.

If you want an intern or you know, you want a mentorship, I'm willing to do that.

No.

Nobody finishes.

Nobody's willing to actually put in the work.

You're not paid what you're paid because you kind of phone it in.

You only succeed when you are doing

everything

all the time and you are focused and you're disciplined and you work hard and you finish what you start.

When that happens, the whole world changes.

I'm telling you, work hard.

People who are successful will see it and you'll rocket to the top.

That is the section where I was talking about Charlie.

He did the work.

He did the work.

He deserved to get the breaks because he created them.

Next one.

I talked about,

is there bad?

Listen to this.

There is no such thing as bad things.

It's what you do with it.

It's what you're going to do with Charlie Kirk's death.

You had a choice.

Choose death, choose anger, choose vengeance, or choose life.

Choose charity.

Choose peace.

Choose forgiveness.

And look how you've already changed the world.

There is no such thing as bad if you make the choice to see the good that can come from it.

It was a great night.

I could have spent, I mean, I could have sat down with those people all day long.

I just, they are,

there is great hope for America in the youth.

And the bravery and the focus of that organization to continue with these events after everything that's happened.

Let me tell you something.

Real, true bravery.

Yeah.

True

bravery.

It is, it's just great.

And I, you know, I talked to him last night, and I want you to hear this, and I want you to share this with people who are their age.

Do you know what people were saying about the greatest American generation?

Back in the day, this is in the 30s.

You know, everybody's, you know, doesn't have a job.

It's the Great Depression.

Things are not going well.

We just came out of the roaring 20s.

So now these kids who were born in the 20s, you know, they had refrigerated.

This is what their parents and their grandparents and everybody else said about that generation.

They didn't have to go out and cut ice.

We used to have to cut ice.

We had to milk the cow every day.

We wanted milk.

We didn't have a refrigerator.

We had to plow the fields by hand with horses.

Now they get on their tractors.

These kids are soft.

They haven't had to work a day in their life.

You turn the keys over to them.

God will help us because they don't have any work ethic.

They don't know how hard it is to actually.

All of the same things you're hearing about the 20-somethings now is what was said about the 20-somethings in the 30s.

And those 20-somethings were the ones who became the greatest American generation.

So it's normal for us to say these things because when I was a kid,

that happens every generation.

Cut this generation some slack.

Look at what's happening with the kids at TPUSA.

Sorry, I don't mean to say kids.

The college students, the 20-somethings.

Look at what's happening.

Then look at those who are still in their teens

they're different

what what we have to do is let them know gang this is your country this is your country you're going to be the generation that fixes it it's not my generation we're the forgotten generation

we're just trying to hold things at bay The generation before us screwed everything up.

They're hippies and everybody's got to have everything and all of this crap.

And then

because we lost

view of actual morals, actual moral sentiments, and we just got trapped into fame, fortune,

everything's about money, all of that.

We started worshiping other gods.

We lost it.

They instinctively know this isn't right.

They instinctively know this isn't going to last.

They instinctively know.

I didn't know that when I was in my 20s.

I didn't see the problem.

They see the problems.

They may not know how to fix it yet, but that's our job.

Our job is to teach them principles, not the answers.

Principles.

They will find the answers, and they're going to be the ones that either push us into slavery or push us into freedom.

I see great hope on the horizon every time I'm with these kids.

Every time I'm with them, I realize, oh my gosh.

I remember David Barton and I talked while we were at Fox and he said to me, I got news for you, Glenn.

We're not going to change it.

And I'm like, what?

Then what are we, what do you, what?

He's like, we're not.

Look at history.

And he taught me some history about how it happened in the Revolutionary War.

He's like, we're the ones who teach.

We teach the youth and the youth are going to be the ones that are fixing it.

And that's true.

Charlie's generation, they learned from me and David and others like us on Fox.

They took it and then went to Hillsdale and actually got a real education that they didn't pay for.

They didn't care about the diplomas.

He didn't care about the, he just wanted to do the work.

He really, truly was hungry for the truth and he looked for it beyond today's truth.

He went to ancient truth and then worked his way forward.

When I thought, you know, we're not, wait, we're not going to be able to fix this.

No.

I'm like, oh, geez, that's not our job.

Our job is to teach.

Their job is going to be the ones that set the country right and design it the way.

I mean, this is very Jeffersonian.

Set it the way they choose.

It is now their future.

I prefer they don't, you know, decide to liquidate all of us over 65 at some point.

You know, well, can't afford health care, Grandpa.

You're out.

But

they will find the right path.

Have faith in the future because you have faith in God.

And God sent these people at that age.

They were born for a reason.

And I believe they were born to save the world from authoritarianism.

So have great hope.

And thank you, TPUSA.

Thank you, Charlie, for everything that you built.

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Welcome to the table.

Freedom's worth a lot more than comfort.

Here's what I found on the web about that private conversation you just had.

What?

Are you uncomfortable yet?

Glenn Beck is back after this.

Welcome to the Glenn Beck program.

We're glad you're here.

Boy, there is a ton

going on in today's world.

There's a lot.

President is going to, what, Egypt?

On Sunday, he'll be over in Egypt, and they're going to sign the peace deal.

That is such a historic thing.

Such a historic thing.

Massive development.

Yeah.

We just pray that it continues to go down the right road.

He's working so hard along everybody, I think, involved in this.

I was listening to some coverage on this from the mainstream media this morning, and it was interesting to hear them talk about it because they're sort of perplexed by Trump.

You know what I mean?

I think there is an element of people who just hate him no matter what he does.

And there's an element in the mainstream that is just like perplexed as to everything he does.

They don't understand any of it.

And they're

coming around to this version of understanding

where

they're.

Let's see if you think the same thing I do.

I'm interested.

Go ahead.

They're seeing it almost as like

he's able to disrupt.

It's almost at a disruptor version.

And they see it as.

That's true, though.

I think it is true.

Where he is

so

unmoored to all every, you know, what was the thing that Kamala used to say?

Yeah, not burdened by what has been

whatever that nonsense was.

In a way, it really applies to him.

He doesn't care about what

an advisor to Kissinger thought a million years ago.

He just does it.

He does what he thinks is right.

And there are times where you might not like that approach.

But in this situation, it seems to be the only thing that could have possibly shaken

calcification around these conversations.

It's never been able to move at all.

So it's so funny that you say that because I think that's accurate, and that's an accurate view of him.

He doesn't care about

the moors of the past.

However, all I'm hearing is he's only doing it for the Nobel Prize.

I have heard that as well.

Oh, my gosh.

Yes.

They've said that one explicitly.

Oh, yeah.

You know, he just wants the Nobel Prize.

And it's like, yeah, that's the only thing he cares about.

He's not saving people.

Do you know how much this guy cares about war?

He hates war.

He hates it.

You don't understand that as a businessman, right?

Even outside of just the fact that he likes, he actually likes people and wants them to live, which I know the left can understand.

But also, like, it's very disruptive to try to do anything in a situation like that.

And he is, so for multiple reasons, he is that way and has been that way for a long time.

He really cares about this.

But even if his motivation were the trophy,

so

who cares what his motivation is if this happens?

Look at the fruits of the labor.

Look at the fruits of the labor.

And anybody who's saying that, you know, the Jews control, did you see how he pulled this off?

I'm not listening to Benjamin Netanyahu or Christian Pat or anybody else.

Or at least that's what my Zionist master master has told me is saying.

More, it's Friday, America.

Coming back in a minute.

This is Glenn Beck.

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Gotta face the dark and embrace the fire.

The fusion of entertainment and enlightenment.

This is

the Glenn Beck program.

So Rutgers University

had a professor, has a professor dubbed Dr.

Antifa.

And it was TP USA students that

went to work to make sure Dr.

Antifa didn't have an office.

How did it all work out?

Where are we on this story?

I'm going to talk to the Rutgers University,

the chapter treasurer,

also the Turning Point USA Outreach Coordinator.

Both of them were instrumental in what just happened.

I want them to tell the story here in 60 seconds because,

as I said last hour,

have faith in the younger generation.

They get it and they are really rolling up their sleeves.

And big changes are happening.

First, let me tell you about the International Fellowship of Christians and Jews.

Hopefully, all of the bombs have stopped falling.

The sky is quiet right now.

That kind of silence has a weight to it.

For years, the Jewish people in Israel have lived with the sirens and the loss and the thing that, they've built, often lying in shattered pieces.

If the ceasefire holds, if this is the beginning of the end of that, then the work of rebuilding begins.

The day after the war,

it doesn't start with blueprints or buildings.

It starts with people.

It starts to bring families back to doorways that used to be their homes.

Children walking back to school that

still smell like smoke.

It starts with food, water, medicine, and hope, the basics of life that make tomorrow possible.

And that's where the International Fellowship of Christians and Jews is already at work.

They're on the ground helping Israel rebuild their lives.

And right now, there is a way to show you stand with the Jewish people.

It's called Flags of Fellowship.

It's a movement of Christians who refuse to let Israel rebuild alone.

I don't want our government doing this.

I want people who actually believe in this doing this.

I don't want our government to use our tax dollars to do any of it.

It's our job because we feel it passionately.

To get information about how you can join this historic movement, the Flags of Fellowship, visit the fellowship at ifcj.org.

That's ifcj.org.

Megan Doyle,

Ava Kwan, welcome to the program.

How are you?

I'm doing great.

Thank you so much.

Yeah, you bet.

Who wants to tell me the story of what was discovered and

what you were facing?

Then I'll ask for somebody else to tell me the rest of of the story of what happened.

Who wants to start?

I can start.

Okay.

And which one are you?

I'm Megan Doyle.

Okay, Megan.

I'm Megan Doyle.

Thank you.

All right.

So I first want to share with you some of our findings that we found on Mark Bray.

His

pro-political violence rhetoric is something that should not be tolerated, especially on campuses.

And that's what we found in his Antifa the anti-fascist handbook they go over strategies like doxing to create mental burdens they call

anyone who basically opposes Antifa as fascist like Donald Trump and Bill O'Reilly so it's really concerning to see that and

I also want to mention that his

handbook in the introduction he states that nearly 50%

of the author proceeds from the book would go to the Legal International Antifa Defense Fund, which

has notably

provided legal support to

10 suspected Antifa members who were charged with terrorism and attempted murder on

an ICE facility in Alvarado, Texas on July 4th, 2025.

So, you know, this guy has serious problems.

His rhetoric is quite concerning for conservative students on campus.

How long has he been teaching?

I believe he has been teaching around near 2017.

I believe that's when he joined Rutgers University after previously being fired from Dartmouth

for his rhetoric that he was teaching in class, which is political violence.

And

is this the the first, I mean, so at Dartmouth,

he was fired for this.

He goes to Rutgers.

Was anybody concerned?

Was anybody bringing this up until you guys?

At TPUSA?

I believe no.

I believe no.

Also, just to kind of add to that as well, you know, I think that's a big part of why we started our petition in the first place.

You know, we wanted to see peaceful change at our university, and we hadn't heard anything from Rutgers or any information about, you know, Mark Bray's long rap sheet.

And it's a...

Give me information on his long rap sheet.

What do you mean by that?

You know, just him being dismissed from Dartmouth, you know, for advocating for political violence, you know, being an author of his book, you know, Antifa, the anti-fascist handbook.

You know, he has continuously lied to the media about his involvement in Antifa.

You know, back in 2017, he was on a podcast called The Final Straw, where he blatantly admits to being a member of a Black Rose anarchist group.

Oh, wow.

You know, he was, if you scroll down on his X account back in 2017, he's directly involved with the G20 riots that were in Germany back in 2017.

I mean, he posted himself.

It's just like right in your face.

So, you know, when we found out about...

you know, Dr.

Antifa, we knew we had to, you know, do things, you know, do things the right way and start a petition for our university to try and draw attention to this matter.

And we also want to make clear as well,

we don't condone any of the violence that's been being sent to Mark Bray.

We condemn any alleged death threats that have been sent to Mark Bray.

Obviously, we're not big fans of this professor, but we don't want to see him threatened.

It's very sad to see that

he does feel threatened by violence, and we don't want to see that.

There's nothing more harmful than violence.

And if our side engages in violence, you have greatly hurt the Republic and greatly hurt our cause.

And beyond that, it's just out and out wrong.

How do the students now feel, besides, you know, conservatives, how do they feel about him on campus?

Well,

we.

Well, you know,

I'll speak first and then Megan could go.

But, you know,

we have not received that great of a response from students on campus.

I've personally been doxxed by unhinged left-wing activists on Reddit.

And both Megan and I have received a multitude of threatening messages online.

You know, and I think that the media has a big part to play in all of this.

You know, they've, as I mentioned earlier, they keep spreading this misinformation about Mark Bray, that he isn't involved with Antifa.

Meanwhile, you know, like I mentioned, he's on podcasts where he admits to being a part of the Black Rose.

And if you scroll down on his ex, you see that he's been part of the G2 riots in Germany.

So it's, you know, all this misinformation is being spread.

And, you know, we're just students who created a petition.

We don't want

threats or violence whatsoever to him.

And we've been labeled as the scapegoats in all of this.

So Megan,

what's the atmosphere for conservatives like at Rutgers?

The atmosphere, the best way I can say it, it's like stepping,

you have to tread carefully whenever you're speaking.

Whenever you have a conservative opinion that really doesn't align with

the majority of the leftists at Rutgers,

you have to tread.

And

as a conservative myself I've been attacked in high school and in college now for my opinions especially with me wanting Mark Bray to get fired

so yeah

you really have to tread carefully when you're speaking at a campus like this

Megan let me stay with you for just a second how has the university reacted to what you guys are doing

the university has not directly responded to us.

They have not expressed concern for Mark Bray's alignment with Antifa, which is it's concerning, it's disgusting.

I feel disappointed with the university that they haven't taken appropriate action, like terminating their professional relationship with Mark Bray.

So

I feel concerned that he's going to be continuing to teach, which he already is.

I mean, he had his trip to Spain to flee from the quote unquote death threat that he's been receiving and he's beginning online classes so it's and the university is allowing that so instead of conducting a proper investigation

what what what does he teach what is his class

um I believe he teaches

a European history I believe he's a history teacher so I believe know that he teaches an anti-fascist class anti-fascism to be specific, and he teaches

European history too.

I would love to see his his syllabus.

I'd love to see what he says

in the class.

Ava, so how many signatures do you have?

How many do you think you're going to get to actually

have the university engage?

Or is there a number that you think will have them engage?

You know, I haven't checked the petition in the past couple of days, but I think the last time I checked our petition has around 1,000 signatures on it.

Now, this is just students?

I'm not sure.

I don't have the list of names.

I think it's a mix.

Megan and I have been trying to spread the petition around online to try and draw as much attention as possible to hopefully get Rutgers to comment on it.

But, you know, we're hoping to just kind of spread this around, you know, keep finding out more about Mark Bray, and hopefully we'll be able to get the university's attention.

Yeah, and

sorry.

No, I also want to note that from what Ava said, that the petition is not directly targeted for students.

It's targeted at alumni, non-students, and even donors.

So they're educated on who Mark Bray is.

Where do I go if I wanted to sign this and find out more?

So you can go on change.org.

Change.org is

where the petition is at.

And I

think

also, you know, I posted it as well on my X account.

It's Ava Jay Kwan, if you want to go and find the link to it.

And, you know, we also just want to preface as well that our petition has nothing to do with the death threats that he's received.

And, you know, we don't want to see any violence towards him whatsoever you say strongly condemn anyone who says that and they're not part of your movement of course of course we don't want to see that whatsoever okay you know and I think you know after

you know seeing the reaction from many of the students and you know just random left-wing activists online what I've really taken away is that you know language today is just used far too carelessly.

You know, our words have immense power.

You know, so when we're labeled as Hitler or fascist, you know, it's not just an insult to us, but it's implying that, you know, someone's very existence is evil.

You know, if someone, you know, came to you on the street and was like, if you had the chance to kill Hitler, would you?

I think a lot of people would say yes.

So when you're calling someone Hitler, you're calling someone fascist, you know, you're basically saying that this person is so irredeemable and so wicked that the world would be better off without them.

And that kind of language and rhetoric is so dangerous because it doesn't invite dialogue.

It shuts down any option of a conversation.

And

people who resort to this kind of rhetoric aren't interested in any understanding or reconciliation.

And this kind of language is the same kind of language that led to Charlie Kirk's assassination about a month ago.

It's the same rhetoric that's now being used against us at Turning Point.

And it's the same ideology that Dr.

Antiva is promoting in his classroom on the New Jersey taxpayer dime.

And, you know, our petition, we wanted to do things the right way.

We wanted to enact peaceful change at our university.

We don't want to see anyone threatened.

We don't want to see any death threats going around to anyone.

I want you to go to change.org.

I want you to look the story up.

Mark Bray, Rutgers University.

If you feel compelled to sign the petition, please sign the petition.

I would strongly recommend that we are all praying for peace and we are all praying for anyone who is brave enough to stand up.

Charlie is not going to be the last, I fear.

And we must have forgiveness and love in our hearts.

The only way we win this is if

we shod our feet in the gospel of peace, if we follow the teachings of Christ,

you put good face to face with evil, put them split screen.

People in America still at this point, I believe, will pick good, but we are close to losing that.

So we have to be good, decent, inspiring, uplifting people.

And ladies, I don't mean to assume you're both identifying as ladies, but

yes, we are.

Yeah, okay, good.

I just want to encourage you, keep it up, stay safe,

know where your lines are, and just don't ever give up.

if you get discouraged call me because I have I have great faith in your generation and I'm really really happy to see the way you're handling this thank you thank you so much you bet Megan Doyle Avaquan from Rutgers University and Turning Point USA all right

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All right.

Stu.

Gosh, where do we begin?

What else do we have to cover today?

We've got to cover the

peace deal.

Looks like it's going through, which is amazing.

Yeah, Hamas still needs to deliver hostages, which is key.

I thought Coleman Hughes had an interesting point.

I know you're familiar with him, but he's just brilliant, a brilliant guy.

But

he said that they're seeing in coverage of this in Israel, pure joy is in the air, is how Israeli journalist is describing the mood in Israel right now.

He asked the question, though, but how could that be?

If the Israelis want, above all, genocide and ethnic cleansing, then why would they celebrate a deal that ends the war with no ethnic cleansing and 97% of Gazans alive?

Pure joy is not what you feel when your deepest ambitions have just been thwarted.

It's almost as if the goal of the war was really to get the hostages back and oust Hamas.

It's almost as if Israelis are motivated by a deep, dark desire to live in peace with their neighbors.

Ah, that can't be true.

That guy's got a Zionist master.

He does.

He's got a, wow, anti-American, that guy.

He's being controlled by the Jews.

Okay, I want to continue.

One more thing to show you who the youth of America really is.

I have a high school athlete fighting to protect girls in girls' sports.

Next, I'm going to introduce you to her.

She's 16 and amazing.

This is Glenn Beck.

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I want to read something from Frances Stout.

She posted,

she's 16 years old, she lives in Washington State.

This evening, as a young female athlete in the United States of America, I was actively silenced for standing up for my own safety and belief.

During the Tumwater High School girls basketball game on February 6th, 2025, a biological male from Shelton High School opposing team was was brutalizing my teammates, using his biological, his biological advantage, clearly and intentionally overpowering his competition.

I made the decision to sit out one of my very last basketball games of the season because I refuse now and forever to compete against any biological male in any sport that I play.

I was incredibly distraught at the fact that nobody would step in on our behalf, including the staff coaches, referees, and parents from both sides.

This is due to the sheer fact that in our society, we have been pushed to be silent and bow down to the demands to accept what we know to be untrue.

When I became visibly upset and angry, I was met with allegations of discrimination as well as threats made by other players in a grown man who is tasked with serving my school district.

The principal and athletic director who stood in front of parents and the students claiming to care about our students' bodies, their beliefs, and feelings, but they certainly did not care about mine tonight.

This is far from over.

It has fueled a passion in me to speak out and go against the wrongdoing that is still happening to female athletes in this great country.

Isn't it ironic that just yesterday, National Girls and Women's Sports Day,

was the day that President Trump signed the No Men in Women's Sports Executive Order.

And here I am the very next day, having to deal with such an injustice that

has caused so much emotional distress in my life.

I will never not stand up for myself or my ability to speak out and protect my safety as a female athlete.

16 years old from Tumwater, Washington.

It's Frances Stout.

Hello, Frances.

Hello.

Thank you so much for having me on the show.

It is not lost on me the significance of speaking with you today.

Oh my gosh.

Thank you.

So Francis,

you were...

You were not notified.

Nobody was notified.

You just go to this game and you see somebody who you describe as obviously a male.

Yes.

Why do you say that?

I mean, and tell me the intimidation tactics or the brutalization tactics, if you will, that you felt he was doing.

Well, I feel it is obvious from any stand where

he would have stood out on the court.

He was warming up and stretching,

looking around, dancing with the girls on his team.

It was obvious.

There's clear biological differences between girls and boys.

And you could just see by everything.

And

lots of

there was a lot of just roughness on the court and pushing girls down and

nothing that a normal girl on my team or the other team would have really been able to do.

Very harsh and

just

it was a queer difference.

So you go and say,

I'm going to sit this game out or I can't play because I don't feel safe on the court, correct?

Yes, that's correct.

And what was the response at the time?

At the time, people kind of looked and were, oh, whatever, just asked me, oh, are you sure you don't want to play?

It's not that big of a deal.

I got told by a lot of people, it isn't that big of a deal.

It doesn't matter.

There's not, nothing's going to happen, and you're just looking for attention.

Every sort of thing that you could hear from people.

But it was only until I got upset after

seeing him hurt girls on my team and also take away from my ability to play because I feared for my own safety that people really started having issues.

And what, when you got upset, what happened?

So I went and tried to talk to the principal of Tomwater, Zach Suderman, and I told him this is wrong.

Why are you not protecting me and my right to play in my own sport?

And why are you not putting a stop to this?

It's clearly wrong.

It is a violation of my own privacy and safety that you've told every single person at that school that you care about, but you he did absolutely nothing to help me he told me that it was discrimination against the boy and the man actually 18 years old he said the man yes

he said he said i'm not going to um

misgender quote unquote um

this individual

okay um he has also said

and maybe it's not the principal maybe it's the superintendent as a district we remain committed to fostering an inclusive environment where all students feel safe, supported, and valued.

Do you feel safe, supported, or valued?

That is a very easy answer.

Absolutely not.

There is in no way am I feeling like I'm supported.

I have had, when I was 15 years old, the 18-year-old man was in my own locker room.

That is quite the opposite of safe and supported that I should be able to feel.

There's a man or boy in the girls' locker room right now at Tomwater High School that they're still doing nothing about, telling girls that they can go somewhere else to change if they feel uncomfortable.

They only care about a certain protected class, and it clearly is not the girls who just want their own privacy and safety.

So now a lawsuit has been lodged against you.

The Foundation Against Intolerance and Racism filed a civil rights complaint to the Department of Education.

Yes, on our behalf.

On your behalf.

Yes.

Okay, thank God.

I read that and I'm like, what are they, how is that possible?

On your behalf.

However, yeah, I was investigated, however, by the WIAA and Tomwater School District for harassment and bullying for, quote-unquote, misgendering the man, saying that he was a man was apparently bullying and harassment, and that is what happened.

But myself and my family was the one who filed the complaint.

Well, I'm glad because I was having a hard time understanding how our DOJ was

not standing up for your civil rights on this, especially since

the president has made it very clear.

Yes.

Can you give me any update on where this stands and where this is headed?

So we are so waiting to hear back.

We filed it a little bit ago and still waiting for news.

We have hope that it'll be in our favor.

And

I

am very much looking forward to seeing where it can take us.

And

yeah, I am hoping that it'll be all good.

Francis, I have to tell you,

you give me an awful lot of hope.

I think we treat our children

as little kids.

You know, you hit 16 years old.

Back in the old days, back in the old days, I mean, older than me, you know, our founders were in their 20s and 30s.

You know, Thomas Jefferson, I think, was 30.

They were expected to do more.

And we just say, oh, your childhood, your childhood.

Yeah, there is something about keeping childhood sacred and keeping childhood as safe as possible.

But you are a great example of what 16-year-olds should be like.

You should know what your rights are, what your responsibilities are, why you believe certain things that you do if you're passionate about them.

Obviously, you're passionate about this, and make the case.

You give me an awful lot of hope, Frances.

I very much appreciate that.

Well, I can not tell you how much I, as I mentioned in my speech last Saturday, this is the turning point of America.

And I was an

incredible fan of Charlie Kirk.

I think he was an amazing man.

And I think he's given me a voice to speak out and given me courage.

And I think that it's important, although we are young, to speak up for what we believe in.

It's important.

had those values instilled by my family as well and my parents.

And

I think it's very important.

He did not die in vain.

I think that we need to make our country proud.

And we are going to be the future of America.

And we need to start acting like it and speaking up for what we believe in and what is right and

no good and evil.

Do you have any friends in Washington State?

Because I grew up in Washington State.

I know what it's like.

Your family, you would just must, is it just you guys?

Are you just

alone in Washington State?

Because you're amazing.

But it

must not be very popular to be you and your family in Washington State.

Well, no, you see all around there's people who disagree, but we have a close group.

It really shows you who your close friends are and who is there for you.

But it is definitely not the majority in Washington State of what me and my family believe in.

But this isn't over, and I think that we can make a change.

And I think people need to have their eyes opened and realize that

there's clearly something wrong.

And I think people can be very oblivious to the fact of that.

But

it is pretty small majority, especially in Washington State, as you can probably.

I know it.

I know it quite well.

Do you have any friends that disagree with you that are still standing with you as a friend?

I don't really have many friends who have told me they disagree.

I've been called a lot of names.

I've lost a lot of friends over it.

But I don't have many friends who disagree.

I think it's really sad because they've been told by so many people that they are right and people who disagree with them are automatically horrible people.

especially Chris Reichdahl telling people that, oh, this isn't happening.

So kids are believing him and parents are believing him.

And so they think that I'm just wrong in looking for attention.

And I've been called,

just the other day, I got called a transphobe in the hallways by this kid that I used to be friends with and say hi to every day.

And I walked by and got yelled at.

And it's sad.

It really is.

Yeah, you sound smart enough to know there are easier ways to get attention, right?

Exactly.

Yes.

Thank you so much for everything you're doing.

Please keep me informed.

Keep us up to date.

We want to follow the story.

And if there's any way we can help, just know you're not alone.

And, you know,

it'll be people like you that will be remembered someday.

It's the people who did the things they didn't necessarily want to do, that didn't make them possible, in fact, made them a target, but

they had the faith in something bigger than themselves.

They knew they had a responsibility and they stood.

Those are the kinds of people that actually make it into the history books, not the one that walked through the crowd as you were walking through who said, you're a transphobe.

That person is never going to be remembered in history.

You will be.

So thank you.

Keep it up.

I truly appreciate that.

And it means more than you know.

From the bottom of my heart, I appreciate this opportunity in speaking with you.

And I will not forget what you said.

That means a lot.

Thanks a lot, Francis.

God bless you.

See, there is good news.

There is good news.

There are things that are happening in the country that is really good.

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This

is Glenn Beck.

Welcome to the Glenn Beck program.

It is Friday.

Letitia James has has been indicted on bank fraud charges.

And, you know, the word is that Donald Trump said to Pambondi, prosecute.

You know,

I have faith that nobody is going to prosecute.

I mean, it went to the grand jury.

The grand jury found her

indictment and found her prosecutable.

And I want to make sure that we play by the rules.

But I have to tell you,

Donald Trump and his family are not going to be in trouble next time because he won't be able to run again.

So they don't care.

But I will tell you, all of the people in the cabinet, all of the people, Pam Bondi and all these people,

they better hold the line and do exactly the right thing every step of the way.

I don't think that's going to protect them.

If you think weaponization has happened in the past or is even happening now, wait.

If the Democrats take control, and they will, at some point they will, hopefully later, you know, over sooner, but they will.

There is massive trouble coming.

I think they're, I mean, I don't want to go too far here, but I think there's a chance they might try to put, you know, someone like the president into prison.

And they, maybe some of their donors might even try to kill the president.

I'm just, I don't know.

I think that's possible.

I wouldn't go that far.

I think it's possible.

It wouldn't go that far.

It is unbelievable.

You're going to say they're going to make up stuff.

stuff.

I can't take,

I can't take the, I can't believe he's going after his enemies stuff.

Like,

I get,

I feel like pretty credible on wanting to hold that line.

But you guys can't complain about it.

Like, Jimmy Kimmel.

Oh, gosh, I got suspended for four days.

Whoa, did you?

They almost threw the president of the United States in prison in about six different districts and tried to bankrupt him and get him thrown off ballots.

Yeah, take him off the ballot as he's running for president.

You want to talk about going against a...

But let's just make sure we watch our side and pray for the people that are currently in power, that they do the right thing and they're protected.

This is Glenn Beck.

We have a fascinating guest on with us in just a second.

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All right, next:

Tolkien and AI.

Woah Woah,

oh, oh, hey.

The fusion of entertainment and enlightenment.

This is

the Glenn Beck program.

I've been waiting for this guy to come on for a while now.

I'm really really excited about this.

His name is Paul List.

He has written a book called Mount Doom.

He and his co-authors think they have decoded

the mythology that is in Tolkien's writings, the Lord of the Rings.

And he says that it is a warning for today.

You know, I think we all know.

I mean, well, maybe a lot of people don't know.

I mean, Tolkien and C.S.

Lewis were good friends, and C.S.

Lewis challenged Tolkien, you write something, I'll write something, and let's see who comes up with the best, most enduring story that will lead people subtly to Christ.

C.S.

Lewis came up with the Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, and Tolkien did Lord of the Rings and the Hobbit.

Lewis said, you win.

But now people are trying to squeeze all of the hidden messaging out of it.

Well, Paul says there's even more to it than just that.

And he's been studying it for a long time.

And I can't wait for you to hear his theories.

That's coming up in 60 seconds.

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Paul, Paul List, Mount Doom co-author.

Welcome to the program, Paul.

Hi, Glenn.

Can you hear me okay?

I can.

I can.

I have been waiting for this conversation as I think you're...

I think you're I think your theories are

you know, I haven't done my own homework on this, so I don't know if they're correct or not, but I think they are absolutely intriguing.

And especially in a world that is having the problems that we're having,

and in a world where everybody's saying, no, Tolkien didn't mean any of that.

Oh, no.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, he absolutely was writing hidden messages.

And you say

you've cracked that code?

Yes, I have.

I have from a scholastic point of view, which almost nobody has anymore.

Scholasticism is the original philosophy of Christendom,

and it was pushed aside and negated and frankly defamed by Francis Bacon

in the early

16th century.

And it fell out of favor for all the abuses and the novelties of the Enlightenment.

So nobody, and we fell heavily under the influence of Descartes.

So we have a very Cartesian education system now.

So everybody's deeply, that goes through the whole academic process, they're deeply infected with the Cartesian

Baconian mindset.

So they can't see and they don't even pay any attention to Thomas Aquinas, so that Aristotle.

I will tell you,

I think it is so fascinating

because I think you're right on this, that

when you see people, if you are college educated, you're not seeing so many times the even things like how the economy actually works.

You're just seeing systems.

You're being taught what to think, not how to think.

And so you miss everything that's really important.

Yeah, really.

I honestly don't understand how anybody can function well in the world without having studied Aristotle's basic works, Treatises on Logic.

And almost nobody does.

And modern philosophy classes are just a disaster.

And philosophy has been, we don't have any real philosophers anymore, or very few.

And most of the people who actually study the Tolkien mythology seriously as a serious work, because it is a very, very deadly serious work, they come at it from this

Cartesian

viewpoint and perspective.

And now it's heavily, heavily contaminated with John Dewey.

who is actually plays a prominent plays a prominent role in the mythology in Tolkien's work.

He's actually, the character is Saruman, who's taken over academia.

And, you know, people, if people really want to understand why our state of our education is in such a mess and so infested with Marxism,

they have to read the works of John Dewey.

He really, really, he was a big Marxist.

He was a real fan of the industrial education and machinery.

And he had taken over, he was a second, he's right from my hometown here in Burlington, Vermont.

And, you know, the local university darn near apotheosized him, you know, and they, you know, they think he's great.

But he's really, he was really a disaster.

He became president of the teachers' college at Columbia University, where he spread his errors all over the world, the Western world, through his education of future teachers.

And that's where we are.

And I'd like to hear his name come up in a lot of these conversations.

For instance, I was listening earlier to the girl from the girls from

was it Rutgers?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Rutgers.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You know,

go back and read the works of John Dewey and really understand where we are and how we got here.

Tolkien, he was a contemporary of Tolkien, and Tolkien knew very well who he was.

He was very popular.

And they were both educators.

Tolkien was a professor of English literature at Oxford University, and he loved teaching.

So he paid attention.

These ideas, Tolkien's mythology is infused with the most powerful ideas, most potent ideas

of all.

So before I get too carried away, I'll let you go ahead and ask some questions.

Okay, so

I want to get to what you believe Tolkien was saying about AI and his relationship with Alan Turing, et cetera, et cetera.

But can we start?

Let's start with just some of the characters

that are in Tolkien.

So

let's start with

the hobbits and the elves.

Perfect.

Go ahead.

Yeah.

Well, we'll start with the hobbits.

Hobbits are habits.

Okay, so the word habit is used nine times in the whole Lord of the Rings mythology.

And lo and behold, it's used eight times in one chapter.

And that one chapter is the prologue called Concerning Hobbits.

And so they're the habits.

And the

Arda, and it's difficult to explain this to people who aren't familiar with the Silmarillion, which is the back history that Colton worked diligently on after the publication of the Lord of the Rings.

And he had to totally switch it around to make it work and be in complete unison and harmony with what he had created in The Lord of the Rings.

So

hobbits are habits, and the four hobbits that we're most familiar with in the Lord of the Rings, Frodo, Sam, Pippin, and Mary, are the highest of the virtues, and virtues are habits.

This is all Thomas Aquinas.

So the Frodo is temperance.

Sam is fortitude.

They're the interior cardinal virtues.

And the exterior exterior cardinal virtues who have to serve the interior and grow are Pippin prudence and Mary Justice.

And Gullum is intemperance.

And that's why he calls Frodo master.

Not because Frodo has the ring, but because temperance is the only thing that can master intemperance.

That's why

they're so similar and why Frodo has some sympathy.

for Gollum because

they're the opposite ends of the spectrum, but they're very much, they have a lot in common.

So Frodo is the only one that can carry the ring because temperance moderates our sensual desires for pleasure.

And the one ring, I'll just get this out of the way right now, is binary code.

It's ones and zeros.

It goes on the finger.

It's a digital.

Okay, so the war here, there's several conflicts going on in the whole mythology.

And the first, well, not the first, but prominent among them is the war of language.

Go figure because Tolkien was a philologist, world's leading philologist, the science of language.

So what's at war is what Arda, the being in which, within which Middle Earth is part of it.

Middle Earth is the material brain.

Across the sea is a man, the undying realm, and that's the immaterial intellect.

Again, this is all Thomas Aquinas.

This is scholastic philosophy, which nobody, or scholastic psychology, which has now been replaced by modern

Jungian-type

states of consciousness and this stuff.

But it was never like that.

So within

the battles that are going on, art is made up of music, and it started with the mighty theme that Alouvatar, God Alouvatar, proposed to the INUR, and the INUR are the angelic beings.

It's funny.

Polkin is a great humorist.

So he named, as Aquinas called the angelic

mind,

the intellects.

Tolkien names them derivatively the INUers.

Like I know, I knew.

It's really funny.

So we've got two languages going on.

Arta, the being that it's about, it's not about this world.

It's about a representative

person that represents all of Christendom throughout its history.

Okay, and

Arta is made up of music.

And against the language of music,

which mathematically and linguistically is expressed through the harmonic overtone series,

Okay, from which we get our key signatures and everything else, that's the highest language.

It doesn't need words.

It cuts right through to everything.

And then against that highest language of creation is the most brutal, ugly language of the machine.

It's machine code.

Okay, okay, so wait, so wait, wait, wait, wait.

Show me in the, you know, Lord of the Rings or The Hobbit or whatever,

where you are, where you are, where he was making the point about music and the machine.

Can you do that?

Well, I mean, it's all in my book, but I mean, the point about music, the music is, is that if you've ever read the Ainu Lindelade, which is, are you familiar with the Sommerillion?

Yes, I am.

Okay, it's the first chapter in the Sommerillion, the song of the Ainur, and it's just beautiful.

I think it's one of the most beautiful writings in all of English literature.

And it's about the creation.

And Polkin's whole mythology, he takes the Genesis

story of the creation of all creation

and he adopts it to tell the story about

the conception and creation of an individual soul, a person.

And this person is named Arda.

And within Arda is Middle Earth, and the Middle Earth is the material brain.

And so

you've got Arda is made up of music.

And if we think about it, everything is made up of, you know, relies on the electromagnetic of the forces that hold everything together and generate everything else like gravity and everything else.

But it's harmonics is critical.

Everything lives by everything, lives by the laws, mathematical laws of harmonics.

And remind me to come back to that and how that relates to Alan Turing and how the rings are developed as a consequence.

Go ahead.

Finish up while I have another question.

Yeah, so we've got

the language,

to go back to

the conflict between these two, and to try to make an example, the ring itself is destroying the music.

And the music is the fundamental basis upon which Arta exists.

All of creation exists.

And the ring itself is like

a dissolving agent that's actually tearing it apart and dissolving it

and destroying it and

darkening our upper intellect, destroying our imagination, sucking us into pornography, sucking us into the virtual realm.

and leading us quite literally.

This is a spiritual conflict.

Tolkien was very aware of that.

So the machine is there to very seductively and deceptively, insidiously, lead humanity right into hell.

And there's no doubt about that.

So does Sauron,

is he representing technology?

Well, he is artificial intelligence.

He is AI.

He's inseparable from the Tower of Beradur.

That's why you never see him or know much about his physical form in the third age.

The first form, you're familiar, and they show this pretty well in the movies, and we could get into the problems with the movies because they were very well done, but they were also very deceptive.

They left way too much out and changed a bunch of stuff because they didn't know what it was about.

But the first, you remember that opening scene where Sauron comes out and faces down the last line, and he's swinging his big mace, and that was beautifully done.

But that version of Sauron is the child computer, and that's right out of Alan Turing's 1950 paper

on

computing machinery and intelligence, where he changes the nature of intelligence to make it imitation, and he actually sets up the imitation game.

And that's what we're dealing with right now, with like ChatGPT and whatnot.

And that's why so many people think that it's actually alive, because it imitates, just as Turing said that that's what he wanted, it imitates.

But we'd have to start with like a child.

We'd have to

treat the computer like a child, with nothing, no information, and train it.

And that's exactly what they're doing.

That was the first iteration.

That was the child computer.

And then in the third age, it has an eye now.

And it's funny because the child computer didn't have the eye of Sauron, so it was illiterate.

It couldn't read.

It couldn't read the, it couldn't see necessarily the ones and zeros.

So this stuff all comes out of Tolkien develops the development of Sauron.

He develops over time.

And

Tolkien gives him all the elements that are right out of Turing's most potent papers, which in 1930...

go ahead.

No, No, no, no, finish.

I'm sorry, finish.

1936 paper on computable numbers with an application to the skydunks problem, where Alan Turing literally invents the computer on paper.

Okay, and then in the 1950 paper, where Computing Machinery and Intelligence,

where he proposes

the imitation game, and he also talks about the idea of, which was very keen to him,

the idea

of a machine being able to harbor a human soul.

And that's the essence of

their deception of transhumanism.

And then the final paper, which is

a little more obscure, was the chemical basis of morphogenesis, where he talks about rings and he talks about morphogenic,

he uses a ring of cells to actually define and show mathematically through all the technology and knowledge that they even had at the time in 1952 that we could actually predict how a

homogeneous substance in a state of unequal or unstable equilibrium with the right harmonic disturbance, we could predict how it would grow and develop.

And AI or actual technology these days are using science, or computer science is using

those same mathematics from 1952 for the computer, AI, to develop its own neural network, its own synthetic brain.

Okay, so you are.

So let me stop here for a second.

Yeah.

You are like 10 times smarter than I think I am for sure, maybe higher than that.

And so you're

it's it's

there's a there's a lot of meat here on the bone.

Let me I'm gonna take a quick break and then I want you to come back.

We'll have a couple of minutes.

I want you to tell me the relationship between Tolkien and Turing.

Did they know each other?

What was his thought about all of this?

And then we can come back into the story.

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10 seconds.

Okay, so for people who don't know, Alan Turing is the guy who the movie Imitation Game was all about.

He's the guy who developed the Turing test.

How do you know if it's AI

and will it ever be able to get to the place to where you think it's human?

And AI is blown past, if I'm not mistaken, blown past the Turing test long ago.

And this is why we're having a hard time with people going,

I'm having a relationship with it

because they're really deeply confused.

In a minute, can you tell me, did they know each other

and how did they know each other?

Well, what a lot of people don't realize is that in 1939,

before World War II, when England knew that Hitler was coming, and they decided to put together

a group of their top intellectuals, 50 intellectuals, to actually participate in what was called the government code in Cypher School.

And their mission was to crack the Enigma code.

And

this is the substance of the movie.

Was the information

imitation game?

Was Tolkien a part of that group?

Yes, yes.

He was recruited and he tried.

Yeah, exactly.

He trained there for three days and he was offered a job.

He was the world's leading philologist.

He spoke like 12 languages.

But what he realized very quickly was this wasn't about language.

It was about statistics.

It was data.

Wow.

Pattern recognition.

All right, hang on just a second.

More in just a minute.

This is Glenn Beck

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paul list is uh with us he is the co-author of a book called mount doom um i am a big fan of tolkin's books my i mean we watch them the director's cut uh every year we'll sit down and we'll watch it for a you know marathon day or two um we just love it and i love

looking looking i know when it was written and it was written in a time of world war ii and and you know the the buildup and all of the evil that the world was seeing much like it is today and uh i look at that and i and i look for the hidden meanings in it and it's it's brilliantly written most people i think if you watch the movies you may miss all of this stuff So Paul is here, and I want to bring you back to the characters that we see and we know and what they mean, what the mythology is actually trying to tell us.

Well, I'll start with the most important characters of the bunch and the enigmatic character and what they left out of the movie were the characters Tom Bombadil and Goldberry.

And no, that's been the big mystery.

Well, who the heck is Tom Bombadil and nobody's ever figured it out?

Well, you can't figure it out unless you have a scholastic point of view.

And Tom and Goldberry are the trans-migrated fallen spirits of the trees of light.

Okay, they are the gold, the spirit of the silver tree, which is Talpurion.

That's Tom.

And the golden tree, and that's Goldberry.

And Goldberry actually gets her name from the last golden fruit with which,

when they died, they were killed by Shilob's mother,

Angoliant.

They produced one last silver flower and one last silver fruit, which became the moon and the sun.

But their spirits, you have to figure this out, their spirits were transmigrated, and Aulay, the faculty of growth in the soul,

one of the Balar, made new bodies for them, just as he had made the dwarves.

And with the Louvatar, they had free will.

So they were given these spirits, and they became Tom Bombadil and Goldberry.

And what they are is the rational will, or the free will, which is Tom Bombadill.

That's why he can do anything he wants.

He's the will, and the rational intellect, which is Goldberry.

And it's all scholasticism.

Who are the elves?

The elves are faith, and all their various, because we have faith both in the material and the immaterial.

So the three high kings, okay, are how we love and serve the Lord.

This is basic Trinity

catechism.

Tolkien's giving catechism lessons.

They are love, serve, and know.

So we have the kings of knowledge, service, and love.

And the elves, the Naldor, of the knowledge, and Feonor, who made the somerils, he's the knowledge to make, or the knowledge to make.

And he made the somerils.

And his sons, the seven sons, are the quadrivium and the quadrivium of classical education, how we actually learn and the virtues of the mind.

So the whole myth, and men, we'll go to men.

Men are reason, and all of the

categories of reason, from high reason, which is Aragorn, to practical

reason, which are the Roherum, and all the way down to the wild men, which is vital intellect, or vital

vitality.

It's just instinct.

So we've got, for instance, and the whole mythology is about the reunification of faith and reason.

It's a response, it's Tolkien's late response to Pope Leo XIII's great encyclical Aeterni Patris, which he was calling the West back, trying to get them to turn their back on the cacophony of these philosophies that were turning the Western world, Christianism, suicidal.

And we see that, it's true, and trying to get us to come back to Thomas Aquinas and the scholastics.

Which is

faith and reason together.

Faith,

exactly.

And that is the reunification of Araborn, the last of the high reason.

That's why

he's the king, because he's the king of the rational soul.

And

Elrond's daughter, Arwen, is the last daughter of the elves of faith.

And it's the

reunion of the heirs of Baron and Luthian, which are in the Saumerillion.

And Luthian, of course, is the heart of the whole story.

And Baron, and that is when faith and reason came and joined to their highest degree.

And so we're come back, and then when they come from the room.

Who is

Gandalf?

Or what does he represent?

You know, he's philosophical wisdom in two parts.

So the wizards are, according to Aristotle's Necomachean ethics, they are the means by which we acquire knowledge.

This is right out of

Necomachian ethics.

So we've got Gandalf is philosophical wisdom.

Saraman, who's taken over academia, is practical wisdom.

No longer concerned with the higher realm of philosophy, metaphysics, first principles.

Okay?

And then we have Radagast, who's rational intuition.

The two blue wizards that don't come into the, they keep going east.

They go outside of the psychology.

They're art and science.

And they're the exterior beings by which we acquire knowledge.

But Tolkien takes them into account.

So he covers all five of them.

So Gandalf is Gandalf the gray, gray in the mind, and gray's, he's kind of indecisive.

He's pagan, pre-Christian, pre-revelation philosophy, Aristotle, for instance.

When he falls in the mines of Moria, which are the halls of academia, it's under Saruman's control, he falls with the spirit of pride of academia.

That is the bellrog.

Bellrogs are spirits of pride.

He falls down into the body and he's subjected to Darwinism.

Durin is Darwin.

Subjected to Durin trying to prove that, hey,

you're just an animal.

And then he defeats the Bellrog, comes back on the wings of the angels, not like in the movie, he comes back on the wings of the eagles.

And the eagles serve Manway, which is the power of sight, and they are the good things that we read.

And he's saved by the good reading.

He comes back a full-timeistic theologian, Candolph Law, and he's no longer indecisive.

He knows exactly what he has to do.

So he takes control of the great spirit of decisiveness, which is Shadow Facts.

When they pick up the

eye of Sauron, right?

The stone, the seer stone.

That wasn't.

That was a palantir.

That was a palantir.

That was one of the seeing stones, but that wasn't the eye.

The eye of Sauron he had corrupted because his Nazgul had gained that.

They had taken that earlier in the third age.

And that was the other one, one of them

was in the Tower of Beradur, which, by the way, is the microchip.

The Tower of Beradur is the microchip.

And that's the tower where Gandalf at one point is trapped on, right?

Well, no, no, no.

That's actually the black and ivory tower.

That's Ivan Garden.

That's where Saruman is.

Okay, Saruman, yeah.

So the two towers are the tower of corrupted academia and the tower of Berardur, which is the chip in the brain.

And Mordor is it's Glenn, this is so fascinating.

It's all laid out according to the old Victorian pseudoscience called phrenology.

That's the the study of the head, right?

The study, right, right.

Where all these areas were representative of this and that.

Well, Mordor is in the cerebellum, the back here,

the reptile brain, as it's called, and that's the area of all crime and hate and fear and all that.

And that's where Mordor is, and that's where the microchip is.

So at this point in Arda's development, which is the history of all of Christendom,

it's been microchipped and it's become transhuman.

And what happens is the will and the intellect, Tom and Goldberry, decide they're going to break out and they're going to change their evil ways and they're going to do away with Gollum, this insatiable lust for pornography and all these things that they can get through the one ring, through the computer, through digital technology.

And they decide to call out of the shire the cardinal virtues and send them on a quest with philosophical wisdom and high reason, okay, and fallen.

fallen high reason, which is Boromir, but still salvageable.

And they send them on the quest to destroy the ring.

And that's the essence of

the quest to destroy the ring.

And they have to destroy the language of the machine, because at the basis of every digital technology, whether it's the surveillance state, digital money, virtual reality, self-driving cars, all these things, at the heart of that, none of this functions without the one ring, ones and zeros.

This is, I mean, if your theory is correct,

this puts him

decades ahead.

Decades ahead.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

But like I said, his training with Alan Turing, Tolkien was a huge skeptic of machinery because he always knew that it was about dominance.

Like he wrote in a letter to his son Christopher in World War II, he said, the only winner in any war is the machine.

And we create, you know,

war advances the machine, not to our benefit all the time.

I mean,

every day, every war advances the I'm sorry, advances the machine.

So Tolkien was a great scholar.

He was very much in touch.

He was a traditional Catholic, as I am, a traditional Catholic, not this modernism crap that we're seeing coming out of the Vatican

now that the modernists have taken it.

He was a traditional Catholic and

he

saw this coming very much.

So

this is fascinating, with the reunion of faith and reason now comes the rebirth of the white tree.

And the white tree of Gondor is neglected.

It cannot be tended.

And Glenn, it is the traditional Latin Mass.

That's what it is.

So when faith and reason comes back together, Christendom is healed.

We return to the traditional Latin Mass, the Mass that the FBI is all over and calling us

terrorists and

whatnot.

And it's the original Christian faith.

It's an extension of the perpetuation of Christ's sacrifice on the cross, where he gives us his real body and blood, not a symbol, the real thing.

And this is what Tolkien is telling us.

So he is,

what is the way

out that he is, I mean, in today's language, what is Tolkien saying is a, because he's predicting transhumanism, the merging of man and machine, AI.

We are on the doorstep of that.

What, in real terms, is his way out?

Well, we have to cultivate virtue, and we have to do away with pornography.

And pornography is represented in Tolkien's mythology.

That is Shilob.

The spider.

That is the spider.

That's Shilob's lair is pornography.

Gollum leads them there because that's his favorite place to dwell with the ring is in pornography.

He can slake his lusts like crazy there.

Just like that's why pornography is so huge in the digital realm.

It's so easy.

And it he's telling us, and but this is fascinating.

We have to cultivate our vert the cardinal virtues, temperance, fortitude, prudence, and justice.

And

Christianism has to be reunited.

And we have to do away.

We cannot subject ourselves to modern music, which is brain-deadening, mind-numbing, to modern entertainment, which is just as brain-dead and mind-numbing.

We have to read.

We have to be competent.

We have to learn and try.

to understand.

Human beings are

the combination of the joining of the animal realm and the angelic realm.

And we've been forced largely by Bacon and Descartes and then Darwin, forced into the strictly animal realm, which is just a disaster for the human intellect.

And we really have to re-establish our ability to ascend, transcend the material realm.

And when we can do that, we can do that through prayer and through reading and through

the contemplation of the higher purposes of our being.

We transcend this realm and we get out of the realm of the machine because the machine owns this realm.

And if we are stuck in this realm, we become food for the machine.

And the machine is devouring millions, I'd say billions of souls at this point.

And we have to pull away.

We have to turn around.

We have to destroy the machine and return to our humanity and do not enter the virtual realm.

And do not get your children virtual glasses or goggles.

That's a direct competitor to God's natural creation.

And where we put our attention is where we put our souls and our hearts.

Paul?

So we have to

God's natural created world.

We really do and cultivate our humanity and become competent.

We have to take responsibility for our health and responsibility for our own education.

Paul,

I think you're fascinating.

And the book is called Mount Doom.

I highly recommend.

Tolkien was way ahead of his his time.

And I've always known that there's deep, deep meaning, but I haven't been able to figure it out.

And I think you have cracked the code.

You can find this in the book Mount Doom by Paul List.

Thank you so much, Paul.

I appreciate it.

Thank you for having me, Glenn.

It was a great privilege and an honor.

Great.

Thank you.

Readmountdoom.com.

Read Mount Doom.com.

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Glenn Beck will be right back.

Oh my gosh.

I have to tell you, Stu and I are just sitting here enjoying the lengths that Fox News goes to to avoid me is hysterical.

It is really hysterical.

All morning, they've been showing clips of a very powerful event in North Dakota turning point, but they will not mention that I was the speaker at the very powerful event, and they just showed Vivek Ramaswamy, who did a very powerful event like a week ago.

I mean, it's,

to be fair, we have the volume down.

Well, yeah, so they may have said it, but they didn't show the pictures, which, you know, honestly, it works to get into my video for a reason.

Yeah, it does work to my advantage.

By the way, I just didn't get a chance to talk about organ harvesting.

Yeah, I know.

It's supposed to be organ harvesting Friday.

I know, I know, but we'll have to maybe try to squeeze it in.

It's a story I've been sitting on all week and I can't wait to tell you about it.

But I look at it every day and I'm like, I don't know if it's organ harvesting day, you know?

And definitely not today.

So I noticed you also wouldn't lie, you wouldn't address the fact that Jimmy Kimmel's words were maliciously mischaracterized by people like you.

Right.

I'll note.

Right.

You didn't know you didn't talk about that at all.

You didn't address that.

I didn't.

No, I didn't.

Gosh darn it.

Because, well, I'm trying to ban his voice.

This is the biggest crackdown on free speech by the government in American history.

Ever.

You know, he missed four shows.

Right.

And, well, that was kind of the end of it.

But still, it was the worst.

He was sent home, and he missed, he didn't do the shows, but he still got paid for it.

He still got paid.

Yeah.

That's where the real crime is.

This is Glenn Beck.