‘Task’ Episode 5: The Best Episode Yet?

The Prestige TV Podcast, episode 5, Task.

Joanna Robinson is here.

Rob Mahoney is here.

This was a wow of an episode.

A lot of answers, a lot of drama, a lot of action.

Biggest answer, our guy DJ Grasanova is the mole.

Tough, tough beat for everybody.

We like this guy.

Yeah, I had, uh, I had, I had kind of moved myself into, no, no, he's not it's somebody else, but no.

Uh, so we had that.

I mean, we had a bunch of stuff in this episode.

Where do you want to start, Joanna?

Uh, well, first, I want to just say for the record that your text to us after you watched this episode was like eight exclamation points.

Yep.

And then we responded, and then you just responded with like eight more exclamation points.

So you really loved this episode of television, Bill.

It is true.

I watched it right after within eight hours of when we recorded our episode four breakdown.

And I actually sent you the exclamation points halfway through the episode.

Oh, okay.

Do you remember that?

I went back for more exclamation points at the end.

Yeah, it was a double exclamation point text.

Anyway, go ahead.

I think the biggest thing that happens in this episode is that Tom and Robbie finally meet and we get

not like the diner scene from Heat face to face, but the car ride was sort of looking in the rearview mirror into the back seat, which I thought was electric and very good.

I really, really liked it.

I think having that too, where they're not face-to-face, weirdly makes it even less adversarial.

Like, it's these two guys who are really kind of feeling each other out, even though one of them is being held at gunpoint.

And Robbie's like finding ways to like Tom over the course of that sequence, to like kind of appreciate and care about him in a way that like Tom Pelfrey can really sell.

Like, there's just like a tenderness to him as a performer that that I think makes Robbie impossible to fully root against, even though he's doing some pretty crazy things.

Yeah, and they, it's a long scene because they cut away and come back.

And it's probably like a three-part scene of this same scene.

I thought the same thing with Heat.

It's basically the Heat showdown, but they invert it so they're not face-to-face.

Yeah.

It's a little more tender.

And in Heat, they're trying to...

you know, find this human connection.

And you're rooting for Neil Macaulay, who's basically just a sociopath.

Like he has a condo with no De Niro's characters, condo with no furniture.

And if the heat's around the corner, he's out.

Like there, there's not a lot there.

Tom

is this really complicated,

you're kind of rooting for him.

You kind of see it from his side.

Like he was really traumatized.

I'm sorry, Robbie.

Yeah, yeah.

I would say Tom Pelfrey.

Yeah, yeah.

The Robbie, his,

you know, you kind of see it from his side, even though he's also a maniac.

And we saw him beat the shit out of somebody in the last episode.

And he shot people, but you're watching him going like oh man i wish this damage guy could just figure this out i thought it was really great how they did it it's been interesting because we've gotten a lot of emails from listeners or text from colleagues or whatever who are who are frustrated that robbie is so inept uh and i guess the question i have is like does he need to be a really good criminal for us to be interested in his story and and if the story of this episode which is titled vagrant and there's this whole runner about you know the summer tanager, which we can talk about in a second, and all of that.

He's a bird who's lost his way.

And so he's not a career criminal.

He's not De Niro and Heat, right?

He is like a guy who was trying to do a thing in a half-hearted sort of attempt at revenge and something else.

And he sort of bumbled his way into

like deep waters that he can't find his way out of.

And so I don't need him to be really good.

I don't mind that he keeps making mistakes because this isn't what he does.

This is something that he has been trying.

Yeah.

And we like him and he's just floundering.

You know what I mean?

He just needs to be like a little better than dumb.

And I think he clears it.

Like he's just clever enough that it's like, okay, he kind of knows what's going on.

He kind of knows like, okay, the cop car would be traceable, but this one isn't.

We need to get off the highway here.

So it's a little harder for them to find us.

Like he knows just enough that you're not frustrated by his decision making.

At least I'm not frustrated by his decision making.

And it also, like, him being in that zone of sometimes kind of inept, but really ultimately quite desperate, I think is what makes him such a good foil for Tom, who is an okay cop, like good at some things, not so great at other things, but ultimately like not an ace detective by any means.

Yeah, it was funny.

The showdown of them, it's basically two guys who are slightly above average at their, at their jobs.

Right.

Robbie's smart enough to realize.

The pee didn't sound right.

Tom's probably there looking for him.

He circles around the back, puts the gun to his head.

Tom's not smart enough to realize Robbie probably has already figured out who he is and he's in real danger.

And then when we get into the car,

Robbie's not smart enough to realize I'm going to let this guy go and they're just going to probably come find me in the next two hours.

Like if you're like Neil Macaulay shoots him in the leg or something, so he's limping.

So it takes him three hours to get out of the woods.

Yeah, he's not, he's not Neil Macaulay.

He doesn't have it all buttoned up.

And he even, Joanna just has, he just has to feel that Pennsylvania water on him to make it's it's his real kryptonite he can't make a decision or really start any impact he's got to get a little of that cold Pennsylvania water on his chest yeah and of course that costs him at the end yeah but you know he's a C-plus criminal yeah and and that's okay that's enough that's passing enough for me but he's like he's a really compelling character and his

his bid for Maeve safety there at the end him letting Tom go and Tom does not think he's gonna let him go.

When he says, You'll see it, it's beautiful.

And I don't know if he means the lake, but that moment when Tom stumbles out of the woods and it's just all these people living their lives when he thought he was about to die.

And then his first call is to Emily.

Like that really impacted me.

I thought that was just stunning part of this episode.

Cliff, Cliff, terrible criminal, by the way.

Cliff, Cliff F.

Well, but kept his mouth shut to the bitter end.

so loyal, you know.

Sure, but also photographic evidence on the fridge.

Yeah, it's just terrible.

What are we going to say, Rob?

I just think the fact that we do hit those like emotional, contemplative beats.

Like, this is a huge episode for like staring at the sun steepling through the trees.

Sometimes that lets Perry catch up and drown you in a lake, but sometimes it's just this really sweet sort of character beat and moment and like pause in what ultimately is like a really propulsive, plot-heavy episode.

And so the fact that we can have all of that at once, I think, is what makes this the most effective episode of the season so far.

Let's dive into that car scene quickly and then we'll hit the other stuff.

The piss tell.

That's where you're like, maybe Tom's even a D-plus as a detective.

Like, he's just pouring a Coke in a toilet.

Like, come on.

That does not sound like P.

But I really liked his fumble-bumble, I'm so dumb routine.

I'm so old and dumb routine that he was giving.

Like, I thought that was really fun.

Did I read that?

Was Robbie, was Robbie flexing on him later with his steady stream?

You know, when he stops for his own pee break, I think it's a bad thing.

Is this saying it's like a prostate versus prostate battle?

Classic prostate versus prostate.

And I have to say, we know who won that one.

Yeah, we do.

I wrote that it was the Mumblecore Heat Showdown.

It was like directed by the Duplasse brothers with one guy in the mercy.

Robbie tells them the whole story.

We get God involved because, of course, that's a stealth theme of the show.

Robbie says, I never once felt God in my life.

I think people want to believe there's more than this because if there's, if this is all there is, it's too fucking depressing for people.

There's nothing else after this.

We're just hitting the theme of the show, I guess.

Like, this is your one life.

And sometimes that's not going to work out the way you thought it was.

And then you're going to die.

Sometimes not only your brother gets.

killed by a psychopath motorcycle gang leader, but also your best friend and it's your fault.

Yeah.

Sometimes Jason wins twice and that's terrible for Robbie.

But I love when Robbie said he was hashtag Team Susan in the car on the on the sort of like atheist believer side.

I like learning a bit more about Tom and Susan's,

how they came together in the first place.

Tom is doing that thing that I learned from Oprah when I was a kid, which is you're supposed to humanize yourself to your kidnapper, right?

So you're supposed to tell them personal details about yourself.

Here's my main nit to pick with this episode.

And in general, there's a lot that I can let Task get away with.

Like,

why have the cops not interrogated Cliff's garbage colleagues or anything like that?

Like, I can let them get away with that.

Robbie having serious satellite radio in his car,

I'm not sure that's an expense that he is paying for.

What do you think?

I think maybe the reception, maybe the reception in his area for Eagles games isn't the best.

You know, and it's like, we really like, there's one thing you simply cannot live without, and that's enough for him.

Also, is that true that anyone with serious satellite radio is trackable?

Surveillance state, baby, apparently.

I was, uh, I was a little concerned hearing that

the serious people can track me.

My take, so I did think about this.

I think Robbie was probably signed up for the free trial and then was too stupid to cancel it.

Oh,

and it's just paying for it.

It's like, God, I wish I wasn't paying this $19.99.

But you might need it in the backwoods of wherever he lives.

That's true, true.

That's true.

That is a really good note, though, Joanna.

I liked when he said, I kidnapped the world's most depressing human.

Yeah.

It was really funny.

But Tom doing the, can I just call my kids?

Can I just call my kids?

Great.

Yeah.

Great.

Here's what to do if you've been kidnapped.

At some point during this car ride, I realized Tom wasn't going to get killed.

Which I did.

Were you guys on the same thing or did you think he was going to get shot?

Partly because it is Mark Ruffalo who's the star of the show.

I did see episode 2.

Yeah, exactly.

That's why I wasn't worried about Tom.

But did you feel it all to you?

You know, CR texted me after he watched this episode and he was like,

his concern is that they're maybe dragging it out a little bit.

Like, does it feel like in episode five, we see them meet and then release and then we're headed into episode six for, you know, everyone's converging in the woods.

What is episode seven?

Like, you know, I'm not that worried.

I'm, I'm, I'm eager to see.

And I loved this episode.

I thought this was the best of the season.

So I think

we'll have to see.

But I don't know.

Did you feel that way at all?

That it was just sort of like too soon to have all of this converge with two more episodes to go or not worried about it at all?

Well, it is, you know, the heat formula is here, right?

The meeting and then the chase.

That's all there.

But it's still a season of TV.

And I feel like a show like this has as much in common with like.

top of the lake where it's like there's kind of an episode of like fallout right it's like maybe everything gets kind of like technically wrapped up in six and then seven is more, you know, the brand is home life.

It's, you know, if Perry's still alive, reckoning with everything that he's done to get here, it's like, how is this all settling with these characters?

And honestly, these characters are rich enough that I think it deserves that kind of introspection.

Um,

he at least sticks up for Maeve, our girl.

Yeah.

Robbie.

I'm really worried.

I'm really worried about Maeve.

He not just sticks up for her, though, but like him, like ultimately, the fact that their meeting culminates in like both of them kind of like asking for help is so interesting.

It's like Robbie kind of pleading with Tom.

Like, please, like, you are the only person who can vouch for her, basically, in these circumstances.

And Tom, you know, trying to talk him out of doing something dumb and also save his own life in the process.

Like, just a really fascinating collision of those characters.

I just, I just want to call my kids.

I just, can I just, I just, just want to call them.

I just, please, can I call them?

We're in the woods a lot in this show.

And we're by bodies of water and lake.

We had some incredible text from our friend Dave Jacobi

about the quarry, the lake.

He doesn't really understand quarries at all, which is a big sidetrack for us.

But it does seem like when a quarry is involved in

any movie or TV show, it's usually a place to either die or get paralyzed or have something horrible happen while at the same time seeming really peaceful.

And I was just trying to think of

other, like times where the quarry was just used in a way where it was just fine.

Just a nice, happy place.

No, no violence or negativity at all.

And I think Jacoby's right.

It seems negative.

In Coda, which is like our introduction to Amelia Jones, I feel like she swims in a quarry a couple of times in a way that is just like nice and idyllic.

Or what's the difference between a lake?

What's the difference between a lake and a quarry?

I guess Many people are asking.

Yeah, I think there's got to be some rock formation distinctions or like some containment of the body of water.

This is all above our pig.

What's on the bottom?

Are there like giant rocks?

Like you could dive in and just hit your head on a rock?

I don't know.

I just need more information.

You got to be careful for sure.

But I think, look, this kind of backdoors into one of the potential predictions coming out of this episode, which is what is the thing that Aaliyah will not be able to smell that will become a critical plat device?

And is the answer,

you know, she goes for a dip in like the foul, toxic part of the quarry.

Wow.

Right.

Check off sense of smell.

Look, it's coming.

She's going to smell

Karen.

Maybe she's smell.

It's like, I think post about it.

I thought that was more to like show her connection to Lizzie.

That exchange was just, well, two things I got out of that.

There is.

Aaliyah can't smell things.

That is, you're right, Rob.

That is a fact.

I think her, when she describes calling her ex's parole officer and pretending that it's a federal case or something like that, that shows her willingness to slightly bend the rules if there is a greater good involved, right?

So

in the

rat hunt for Grasso, which has got to be something that happens at some point, like how much will Aalaya be like playing it by the books or how much will she bend the rules for the greater good or something like that?

I don't know.

Let's take a break and we'll hit the

rest of the big things that happened this episode.

Fall's finally here, and Nordstrom is your go-to for the best of fall fashion and the hottest trends of the season.

Discover new arrivals from brands you love, like Reformation, Free People, Mango, Addicted, Princess Polly, Madewell, and more.

Perfect for refreshing your closet without overthinking your budget.

And with free shipping, free returns, and easy in-store pickup, shopping's never been easier so go ahead shop in stores or nordstrom.com or download the nordstrom app today

fall's finally here and nordstrom is your go-to for the best of fall fashion and the hottest trends of the season Discover new arrivals from brands you love like Reformation, Free People, Mango, Addicted, Princess Polly, Madewell, and more.

Perfect for refreshing your closet without overthinking your budget.

And with free shipping, free returns, and easy in-store pickup, shopping's never been easier.

So go ahead, shop in-stores on Nordstrom.com or download the Nordstrom app today.

All right, in order.

The other big revelation, DJ Grasanova was the mole and

completely changed how you watched him as a character, but he also did a nice job of,

it was a little Matt Damon in the departed

where he's on the phone trying to figure out how to get, how to alert his biker gang buddies, but couldn't.

And he's just all all of a sudden very shifty and um i also liked when they when he met he met uh our guy jason under the bridge

and i like when they have the interactions and at some point jason's like remember who you're talking to like there's a lot of good tropes in this episode but what did we think of dj rob will you walk us through your emotions I mean, on one level, we were expecting it.

On the other, I have been, look, Joe has been spot on on predictions all season.

Joe, I feel like you've been nailing development after development.

I have been, in my approach, a little more like drooping Pepsi dribbles into the toilet and barely hitting the bull.

So we've hit at some point that Grasso

could be the mole, but it also seemed like they were fainting maybe and it would actually end up being someone else.

I think all we know at this point is that he is one of the moles.

And one of the dangling loose ends is still like, we don't know what overdressed Connor came up with in terms of digging into the task force.

And maybe that is just a means for them all to find Grasso in the end.

But maybe it could have some other little complicating reveal along the way.

So, and so we still think the door is open for Martha Plimpton's character to be mold number two?

Maybe.

I don't know.

Here's my main question about

good old DJ Grasanova.

How much would you guys pay for a post-divorced house exorcism?

Which is something that he was looking into.

Well, that Lizzie Lizzie sent him as a shit post, basically.

Yeah.

What was it?

Was $1.99 the going rate?

It was more than I would pay, personally.

You're not getting the couple from the conjuring, I'm guessing.

Probably like somebody way more discount.

The

grass is slang to like rat on someone, right?

Like to grass on someone is a snitch on someone.

News to me.

Isn't that the case?

He always learned slang from Joanne.

It was an unexpected bonus of posting a pod with her.

Is that what it is?

Is that true?

I think to grass on someone is to like to snitch on someone.

All right, so can we walk through how does he meet these guys?

What's the history?

Because you talked about we have two episodes left.

Yeah.

What are the two episodes?

There's still a lot of flashback stuff we haven't done yet.

We don't know the history of him with the biker gang.

We still know.

We deeply, deeply, deeply believed there was going to be a 2017 flashback to where was that fight in Redding?

Reading, yeah.

Right.

Yeah.

Biker battle.

I feel like less like that's going to happen.

Yeah, maybe just enough time.

Like, period.

Oh, there's a lot of time.

We have everything converging at the end of episode five with two hours left.

He has the information he needs.

He knows that it was Billy's gun.

He knows that it's Robbie.

Like, we know everything.

Like, what is there left to learn from Redding flashback?

You know what I mean?

Well, I mean, there's one thing left to learn.

If our guy DJ Grasanobo was

there in the footage

and they're studying the footage and they see him see I feel like they probably go way back you know like we know that he was DJ Grasanova we don't necessarily know that he worked alone like Grasanova feels to me like the DJ who is all technique just you know behind behind the scenes doesn't want to be the vocal MC presence maybe maybe Jason is the front man maybe he's the hype man you think Jason has the charisma to be the front man of a two-person DJ team you know what not all of us have the luxury of of our theories being correct, Joe.

Some of us are just out here throwing things.

The good old Jason who walks in covered in blood and like grunts in Aaron's direction.

That guy?

I don't know.

Can I posit this one?

He said he was a DJ in college.

Yeah.

Is it possible I never went to college?

I'm beating it to question everybody.

I think he was the DJ for the biker gang instead.

Oh, a bike.

Do you think he was DJing?

He was the cookout in Redding.

He was a biker gang.

Okay.

Yeah.

I don't know.

I just

wanna see the Redding shootout footage and behind the turret tables is DJ Grasanova.

I think Fabian Frankl, who's the actor who's playing our good old DJ Grasanova, is so good.

He's really good on House of the Dragon, a show that I know you guys, or I know that Bill doesn't watch, but like the way that he's trained, there's a lot in common between his two characters, especially now that I know that he's a double crosser.

So there's a lot in common, but he's, he's convincing me of his sort of, I'm an American,

you know, Philly accent.

And

I don't know.

I just, I feel like this is going to be a big launching point for him.

Like, I feel like other people are going to want to cast him out of this shit.

I couldn't agree more.

I think he's a leading man guy.

Yeah.

There's no question.

Really good.

I could totally see him in all kinds of stuff.

So well, here's a question about Grasso as a character, though.

Like we see this meeting with Jason.

Bill, you're right.

We get the trope of like, remember who you're talking to.

We also get, though, by the end, Grasso, in his desperation, kind of barking orders of his own, which also makes me think like they have a longer history than just like a guy who is subservient to the assistant regional manager of the Dark Hearts or whatever.

But what is it that we think that Grasso is after?

Because he seems to be like kind of like he's concerned about Tom.

It seems genuinely.

He's helping Jason.

Is he trying to help the Dark Hearts get their drugs back, but also get whether it's the valor or the commendation or just to save this kid's life to like also bring in Sam.

Like, is he, is, are those the goals?

And is it possible he's like kind of straddling both lines in a way that's like attempting to be somewhat helpful, if not entirely honest?

I mean, I think he cares about Lizzie, and I think he cares about Tom.

Like, I genuinely do.

And so, that puts him in this huge conflicted space as we head into this, everyone's converging on the cabin showdown in the next episode.

And I am very worried because he's paired off with Lizzie.

It's like Grasso and Lizzie are paired off walking into the woods where all the like the MC is.

And that is really scary.

Can I, can I read you the part of the craziest email we got?

Did you see this email, Rob?

No, I just can't believe it took us this long to put MC and MC together.

Like again, Grasso and Jason, I think there's something there.

The motorcycle MC.

Okay.

So our listener, Maria,

was like going back to the whole Sam talking about deer crossing the road.

And we do see a dead deer on the side of the road as Tom and Robbie are driving.

She's like, Sam's not the deer.

She's like, Lizzie is the deer.

Lizzie is the one who freezes

when it's most important.

This is what she wrote.

She said, Lizzie in the chase isn't the hunter, but the runner, not the prey, but not the full-blown predator.

Either Grasso and Aalaya tackle the robbers like wolves as Lizzie bolts over fences and through traffic just to get in a position where she is in over her head and her life is in danger.

She tells Grasso in the moment that that she is paralyzed by the pressure of making the right choice.

We've been talking about this all season of like, if Grasso is, is,

you know, a rat or a mole rather, and or Lizzie is, there will be a confrontation.

This is something that we had wondered about because Lizzie freezing has been sort of stressed so much.

And so, like,

is is this, is she going, is she the deer that's going to freeze in the headlights and get got because she can't make a move?

Or is she going to, as we were sort of wondering, finally be able to make her move that she hasn't been able to make all season?

Like, what kind of show are we watching?

I'm glad.

Well, this was going to be one of my predictions later.

I'm doing it now.

Okay.

The bridge was that wide shot of the bridge with people going two different ways was really interesting.

Oh.

Lizzie going with DJ Grasanova.

Yeah.

Scary.

Made me think we're headed toward a moment where they run into at least a couple of the biker gang people.

Yeah.

And somebody says, Grasso, what are you like?

She realizes they know him and freezes, and then he has to kill her.

Oh,

I hope that's good.

I'm going to throw that one out there.

I mean, yeah.

Go ahead.

Bill, let me, let me ask your managerial opinion on something.

If you were running a task force and you had a moment like this where you're all converging in the woods and you have a team of three and a team of two, which team are you putting the woman who freezes on?

Are you putting her on the team of three or the team personnel?

I want a three.

Yeah, I want a three person.

It's not having a non-shooter.

You can't have two non-shooters together in the NBA.

Lizzie's Andre Robertson just waiting in the corner for her moment, but it's tough.

Right.

I think what Rob said earlier, I think this is going to be how they land the plane on this show, whether this ends up being a great show or not.

And I don't know where it's going to go.

I think we felt after two episodes this had a potential to be a Hall of Fame HBO show, right?

How they land the plane with Grasso is going to determine that.

Yeah.

Because

they only have two hours left.

If I'm not convinced, like, oh, that was fucking stupid.

Like he's like the classic.

Oh, he was working for the other side.

But then he still, he cares about Tom and he cares about Lizzie.

Yeah.

There's too much going on with him.

And if they don't unwind that, I don't think the show is going to hit the levels that it needs to.

Here's my question.

We're talking so much about like Lizzie and Grasso

from the start.

Robbie has, we're like, Robbie's cooked, right?

This, this episode, all the talk about, you know, vagrant birds and stuff like that makes it more clear than ever before that, you know, he knows he's done, like he's done, right?

And so

that's never been the tension.

And so what if like sort of hidden is the real tension is what's going on with Grasso and Lizzie and

agendas and will they figure it out and all of that, like that, that the back couple episodes are less about what will happen to Robbie, we know.

Yes.

How it will happen, we don't know, but we know that like, I mean, I don't think he's surviving this series.

We've said that from the start, right?

But, like, so that's not attention, but like, what's going to happen to Grasso, a character we like kind of do care about, even as we're like, this guy is responsible for Cliff getting brutally beaten to death in last episode and stuff like that.

Like, that that's sort of the hidden

denouement of the whole story, you know?

But if that is our assumption, and it has been that Robbie is going to get caught or got in the end, wouldn't him getting getting away be the most subversive thing that the show could do?

Like, if there's all this fallout, including maybe to Maeve and/or Sam, but Robbie somehow gets away, I could see that being something that the show is interesting in, interested in.

I could also see a situation with Grosso where Lizzie dies and maybe even Jason dies, like the two people he's kind of connected to on both sides.

But he, in kind of straddling the line, winds up surviving, but also like paying a really huge price for everything that's happened.

Can I give you one more scenario?

Please.

The biker gang takes Lizzie.

Oh, no.

Second kidnapping.

Oh, boy.

Oh, no.

And then they try to get information from her, but Grasso is on that side and then has to be in the position of

I liked Lizzie.

Do I protect her?

We did make out on a couch once.

We got the most

number of emails from people

were about a request to try to identify what season we're in.

And we could talk about that whether or not we want to.

But, like, as we go into this shootout, Lizzie is already

slick with sweat.

Like, she is already pouring sweat.

And it's not summer.

We know that for sure because Tom made so much about the fact that the summer tanager is here.

And so it's not Tanager season.

There's baseball, so it can't be later than September.

Right.

I think

basically we've, we had, right, Rob, we had so many emails about this.

So many.

People were like tracking Philly's games, tracking when the water ice places open, tracking

migration patterns.

Oh, it was amazing.

The fact that Tom has tomatoes from his garden.

Yep.

So, and then the kids are all, we saw Emily in school in this episode.

The kids are in school.

So I think it is September.

I think that's, that's what we've figured out.

Um,

we had some other things happen in this episode.

We had uh, Robbie went to see Freddie.

We got Freddy Freesty in our life,

sort of.

That was really fun.

I mean, I don't know, it felt a little like anticlimactic to me.

Like, I was just happy to see him again.

I well, I think they had to set the tone for he's going to be more involved in these last two episodes.

Right, it was a little tester, but I like that he had his protege,

he had he had his,

he's the Vito Corleon.

He had his little Michael Corleone at his side that he was talking.

There are so many ways to save on cozy fall meals at Whole Foods Market.

Save daily with low prices on no antibiotics ever meats, like chicken breasts, ground beef, Atlantic salmon, and more from 365 brand.

They have yellow low price signs on comforting favorites like Whole Foods Market, rotisserie chicken, and tempting mini croissants made without bleached or bromated flour.

Shop low prices and quality at Whole Foods Market, in-store or online.

Youtine, adjective, used to describe an individual whose spirit is unyielding, unconstrained, one who navigates life on their own terms, effortlessly.

They do not always show up on time, but when they arrive, you notice an individual confident in their contradictions.

They know the rules, but behave as if they do not exist.

Mutine, a new fragrance by Mimu, defined by you.

Hi, it's Eva Longoria, and let's be real.

After 40, we should ask for more from our skincare.

I swear by Revitalift Triple Power Moisturizer by L'Oreal Paris.

With vitamin C, pro-retinol, and hyaluronic acid, it reduces my wrinkles, firms, and brightens.

And it's not a procedure.

It's just a hard-working moisturizer.

Revitalift Triple Power Moisturizer by L'Oreal Paris.

Grab it today in fragrance-free or with SPF 30.

Available at your local Walmart.

We had Perry sniffing out the Aaron thing and just going like really dark villain.

Yeah.

Nice.

Goes to the Maeve's house.

I really like that scene, the tension of it, because it wasn't really good.

They're both.

I thought she handled it really well, but the tension of that, of all of that.

But he's just, he's like, something stinks here.

I'm going to figure this out.

And then all of a sudden finds the landing space.

And now we have a little quarry, a little quarry race.

A little 100-meter freestyle.

And guess what?

Aaron, too many cigarettes for her.

Perry's in boots.

He's setting records out there somehow.

It was an amazing technique from him.

What an athlete.

Here's my question

about Aaron

drowning in the quarry.

Does that now mean we don't expect Sammy to drown in the quarry?

If like,

can we have two?

Well, that's Anthony.

Sam's in the police.

Like, we might not see

yeah.

I'm not gonna get my crows scattering as he gets shot in the woods moment that I predicted.

I guess I'll take the L in that one.

But yeah, do we see Sam again?

Like, so

I don't know.

There's a lot going on here.

I also like Perry being surprised he killed Erin after he drowned her was just, I thought that was a kind of a weird scene.

It felt kind of like of Mice and Manny to me and sort of like, I don't know, my own strength sort of thing.

Yeah.

That he was so concerned with keeping her quiet.

I think what I'm really missing this season, what I would love to know more about, and we've already, I've already raised this, is like the Perry-Jason connection.

Like, why is Perry so protective of tender towards Jason?

Because the fact that he is now killed the mother of Jason's children is, of course, this big ticking time mom inside of the MC.

And so the level of that betrayal, like why he would feel so guilty about, I mean,

you should feel guilty if you kill a woman.

Like that's, you know whatever but like um a bold stance joe thank you i like

i like to even throw in all human beings oh

anybody you're right animals

animals too for sure you guys why not spread it around but murder should bring some guilt but the fact that it's jason's like the mother of jason's kids jason's wife yeah like

is an extra layer of something for perry and i would really like to know why perry and jason have this connection and what counter you know yeah counter she she, she did this whole basically this drug stealing ring against the biker gang.

She had to go.

They're going to keep their rep.

She went against the gang.

But that needs to be there.

A decision Jason's involved in.

You know what I mean?

The whole like mother of my children, like weird sort of Omerta tough shit inside of.

You got to get the council together on that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I don't know where you have that combo, but hey, your wife has to go.

She's stole a lot of drugs from us.

I don't know how she comes back from that with the rules and laws of the biker gang rob.

Oh, I thought you meant back from the dead in the lake.

Well, back from that in the game.

That's a different show.

No, no, I don't think she was coming back.

And ultimately, like, Jason probably would have understood if presented in that way.

I do agree with you, Joe, though.

It feels like we're missing like one Perry Jason beat.

I like that we get to a place where this guy who we have seen just be like so hard-edged is kind of breaking down and a little shaken up by what he has proven to be capable of.

And I think that is because this is a personal thing, because he's reacting to Aaron the way that Jason reacted to finding out that Aaron cheated on him, right?

It's like this emotional, impulsive outburst from this person who has been so procedural.

And like that part I like.

How we got here, I feel like I'm just like missing a little bit of thread.

Well, I have a friend who has a smoking hot theory that

Perry and Jason might might be romantically involved a little bit.

Wow.

Love this.

I need the Perry-Jason film.

That one scene when Perry was like their heads were really close and they were spitting on each other.

It was like, yeah, it was a little weird.

That was just foreplay.

Yeah, it was like something, something about that interaction.

Anyway, I don't agree with that theory, but I thought it was interesting.

That certainly would fill in some blanks with what we're talking about.

Sure.

Perry also might just be a homicidal maniac.

Could be.

But I like what Rob's point about it.

He's been so in control.

Well, to a certain degree, but like he's been the one.

We were just remarking last episode about like Detective Perry.

and then he shows up at maeve's house and he gets he sees the photo of cliff and robbie you know he does miss the kid hiding in the chicken coop um which actually one of our listeners called that that sammy would be hiding in the chicken coop at one point i was like that's

really good prediction wait well done but like um that whole thing was so tense uh perry definitely was like uh fuck your clean floors even though that was a lie that maeve told i love how later he just like walked in with his boots he's like i don't give a shit about your floor story.

He knows Mavis is lying.

When he says, remember your family, it's such a threat.

It's so scary.

So to have like, yeah, Perry, menacing, in control, all this sort of stuff, just lose it on Aaron and now have to hide that from Jason.

I mean, I think you're right, Bill, that if he told Jason like, Aaron betrayed.

betrayed the family, she had to go.

But that's not the route he's taking.

He's taking, I got to hide this.

and now that is definitely gonna explode on him somehow right um also he's gotta make up with his girlfriend after the bathroom door and stuff that was pretty rough d you can do better i swear to you you can so step up from the from the coffee uh well then the other one is me brought sam to the police she said fuck it which it's funny because we've wasted you know i i think some some minutes in the first four episodes and then the whole sam going to the police we don't even see him in the holding thing He's just gone.

Like we don't even see where he is.

Yeah.

I thought that was a pretty good scene with Martha Punton, though.

But I, so, what happens to Maeve now?

I think she might also be off the board in terms of potential tragic death because if she's at least going to be in custody for questioning, I would think, in connection to all this, and maybe Tom gets her off the hook.

Maybe he doesn't.

We'll have to see kind of what her fate is.

But I don't think she's getting caught in a crossfire anytime soon.

What do you think, Jeff?

Yeah, I do think Maeve is safe from death, but I'm worried, is she safe from being blamed for all of this sort of criminally?

So yeah, that's the question.

Can Tom get Maeve off the hook in a way that he kind of promised Robbie that he could, you know?

Or does Maeve get out of all of this?

And the show ends with Maeve on the highway.

Tuesday's gone

away.

We get the Altman Brothers and we just see the car zooming off in the distance.

Bill, I hate to do this to you, but we did get a lot of emails that Tuesday's Gone is a Leonard Skidder song and not an Almond Brothers song.

Good point.

Yeah, I did mix that up.

I was not going to say anything.

I just want to say I've been mixing up those bands since the

original.

And I think that's fair.

I'm not the only one.

I think that's fair.

What would the Almond Brothers?

I still like the Tuesdays Gone.

I think that's the call.

Yeah.

They're both on smooth, serious country radio or whatever, or at least adjacent to it.

Do you think Robbie Spring for the family plan?

Does like Maeve also have serious section radio in her chat?

That has not been a thing for Maeve.

Ain't wasting time no more doesn't work for the Maeve driving away.

I think it's got to be Tuesday's gone.

Okay.

Some skinny.

Sorry, Leonard Skinner.

Sorry, I gave you the wrong thing.

So as she is driving off into the distance, does she just have to raise her two cousins as her own children?

Like, is that just her fate for the moment?

She's moving to Hollywood to become a waitress at Mel's Diner and try to get some acting.

She promised that girl she would not leave her.

You think she's going to leave her with her coworker?

I don't know.

She's out.

I love how her coworker was like, for how long though?

Reasonable question.

Very reasonable question.

How long am I watching these children?

The other piece.

Well, we forgot at the beginning.

Robbie goes to kill scary face Ray

and then runs into the wife and the

wife's face.

I'm a good person.

Take me with you.

I'm a good person.

That's why I want to sell all this dope.

Come on.

That's why I broke into your house with a ski or Cliff's house with a ski mask.

I wrote down in all caps here after this scene: are there any good people on this show other than Maeve?

I guess Tom.

Who else?

If you just had your good people rankings, do we have five?

Gertie, number one, Unimpeachable.

Yeah, yeah.

Sammy, good old Sammy.

Yeah, Sam.

Fine.

There's four.

We don't know if Martha Plimpton, if Martha Plimpton isn't

a mole, but merely an emotional eater, I'm willing to put her on the good person list, you know?

Look, very emotionally intersecting.

That was pretty funny.

Though, to go back to our bagel conversation previously, that was one of the

worst-looking bagels I've ever seen in my entire life.

The poll she has to do to get that bite.

It was like a no.

No, no.

Tough.

Not good.

And Tom, I mean, I'm sorry, Robbie.

There might be a good person deep down there, but he's also a violent sociopath.

So I can't put him in the rankings.

I think we're less than five total for the show.

Which makes it a classic HBO bread.

That's fair.

I think Lizzie's a good person, right?

Ish.

We don't know enough about her.

I think we've known, like, they've given us so many Lizzie scenes explaining who she is.

So, like,

a good person if

probably should not be in this job person,

you know, but not about.

And Aaliyah, right?

Yes.

I think Aaliyah, we have no reason to think or suspect that she's not a good person.

Yeah.

So how did we feel about that whole subplot?

Because they had the two sisters in the kitchen.

And they're still Emily.

They want us to care about this.

And I don't care.

And every time I don't care.

And it's just no matter how good the show is, they always have to have this one plot that's happening over here.

And you're like, oh, here we go.

Yeah.

I hang out another four minutes with these two.

I think it's too bad that that is a

like I cared that Emily answered the phone and that Tom called Emily.

Like I cared about that.

But Sarah and Emily in the kitchen, I had a hard time with Sarah's whole story about her husband and the infidelity.

I did like Sarah asking like, how long have you felt like you could only feel gratitude?

I did like that moment.

But I, yeah, that whole everything with Sarah, Emily, and Ethan, like it's not jelly the way that the rest of the story.

Like I'm so invested in Maeve and i'm just like not invested in emily and sarah the way that the show wants me to be

interesting on paper like again they're like some of the ideas and as you're saying joe like them having a moment to confront this idea of what has been hanging over emily her whole life like that could be a good scene this one just felt like really a little stale to be honest with you like very flat and i i think some of it like i know there are many different kinds of families there are many different kinds of affection the brandesses are not huggers so the idea of having your like heart to heart be, I don't want you to feel that way anymore.

And my response is to put out my cigarette and walk away, it just felt very cold.

Yeah, and it's like, maybe your husband traded you in for a younger version of yourself because the younger version isn't drinking wine like it's fucking a 50-ounce Diet Coke at a Dodger game.

We don't know when the wine goes.

Maybe that's one of the reasons.

We don't know when the wine goes.

That feels like a post-infidelity.

It's a compensation.

Wine issue.

Oh, you think you think it's a response?

He is the reason she is drinking.

It's not Sarah's fault, I don't think that Andy found new co-counsel.

Like I just don't think that that's necessarily her bag.

I don't think you just immediately start drinking 20-ounce wines.

That'd be my take.

That's true.

You're probably at 16 ounces.

Yeah.

You're not just graduating to that right away.

Anyway, I don't like that character, and I wish she wasn't on the show.

It's not great.

And I think you referenced this earlier that we're in this like riveting car chase or car scene and cutting away a couple times.

And when we cut away to Tom's colleagues frantically trying to figure out where he is, that's one kind of energy.

But to cut away to this like resolution between two characters that we're having trouble sort of relating to and it's taking us away from this other scene that is so good, that that doesn't do it any favors either.

I mean, we could have, we could have seen Robbie touch the Pennsylvania water for a third time.

I mean, listen, what about nine more flashbacks of Robbie and his brother jumping in a quarry?

I would like it.

You know what?

I'm I'm not mad at any of it.

The water on the shoulders, the flashbacks, the bird metaphors, the talk about God.

Like, hell yeah, brother, for me, honestly.

Come on.

Like, this is why I'm here.

The vagrant stuff is really good.

Rob, I have a really important question for you.

When

after he's talking to Aaron,

Robbie looks up and sees the bird in the sky.

Did it remind you of the episode of The Sopranos College when after Tony Soprano kills someone, he looks up in the sky and sort of regards the flying birds.

Did that ping for you, Rob?

Look at that.

To people who have now seen some episodes of The Soprano.

Proud Dad.

We are but fledgling ducks flying out of the pool ourselves.

I wrote down the quarry flashback to start the show with the two brothers

where it's like they're putting the water on themselves.

I wrote down, thank God Robbie had the peace and calm of that quarry growing up because he never would have become a murdering, fentanyl-dealing garbage man.

Thank God.

Thank God that was his happy place.

What could have gone wrong if he didn't have it?

I do like the back tattoos, though, and the fact that Robbie's tattoo now has the dates of Billy's birth and death underneath that matching tattoo on the back.

I like it as a visual shorthand for these brothers.

And

every time we've seen their bare backs, whether as teens or as adults, it's like, this is this thing that unites them.

I think he really loved his brother.

All right.

Well, I also do love the water stuff as like, I mean, the conversation between Robbie and Aaron at the quarry, I think is just really, really great.

And in particular, Pelfree in that scene, like the don't fucking touch me right now.

Like, he's this, this character's like losing his shit in slow motion and constantly having to like calm himself.

Yeah.

And so from that perspective, like, I like the water as a moment, as like a beat to say, like, you know, self-soothing in a moment of absolute panic.

I thought Pelfree's, Pelfree was so good there.

All the play of emotion on his face with Aaron.

And then similarly at the end,

when Tom draws on him, says his name loud enough for Jason to hear, not great.

But Tom draws on him, and then all the play of emotion on Robbie's face of like, what do I do here?

Before

don't forget the sound piece of it, too.

Whatever they did with the audio for that, the water picked up, the voices really dropped.

I thought it was cool.

I thought it it was really good.

Well done.

Really good.

Predictions.

What do we got for episode six?

My first prediction question.

Does Robbie make it to episode seven?

I'm going to flip and say he survives.

I'm talking myself into this in real time, that Robbie will get out of this show alive.

Slithers out of it somehow?

Somehow, like he'll be the last man standing on a

standoff in which everyone else dies, basically.

And somehow he gets out of it.

Are we getting a Tarantino three-way shootout?

One can only hope.

Because we had the triangle coming in.

Yeah.

Here's my question.

I like Rob's point about the fact that this is the kind of, like, if we use Meravistown as a blueprint, that's a show that had a lot of like, how does Julia Nicholson feel about everything that happened?

Like a lot of wrap-up room at the end of sort of the climax of that show.

So, Robbie either dying in episode six or at the beginning of seven, you know what I mean?

Like, gets shot at the end of six and then makes it to seven or something like that.

Um, kind of makes sense for me that it that it won't be what's happening with Robbie up until the very end.

We can't possibly do that for two more episodes when everyone is surrounding him at the at the river.

I'm actually most

excited to see what Grasso does

with

all of the things pulling on him between his motorcycle allegiance and Lizzie and Tom.

How does he handle all of that inside of one of these situations?

Where,

as Martha Plimpton was careful to tell us, they don't have any reception.

So he can't send any sneaky texts.

It's all got to be like on-the-ground sort of communication.

How is that going to work out?

Well,

key point here.

The bridge, they they went two separate rays, right?

We know where

Tom is, is where all the action is going to be, right?

So, Lizzie and Grasso are all the way.

If there's any gunfire, it's going to take them probably six, seven minutes just to run the other way to catch up with what happens, right?

So, all the action is going to be, who else was with Tom?

Aaliyah and Martha Plimpton, yeah.

Yeah,

yeah, so it's the three of them in that gunfight, and then Grasso coming in later.

But where's the MC?

Which side of the bridge is the MC on?

And they could split up, right?

Like you could see Perry taking some guys one way, Jason taking some guys the other way.

Like Grasso and Lizzie have to run into the dark hearts.

I think narratively speaking, they have to do it.

So Lizzie, the options are get shot, gets kidnapped, changes,

Grasso's the mall and shoots him.

Choose him.

Yeah.

Any other possibilities?

Not that I can think of.

I'm really nervous.

I'm really nervous.

They've done a good job.

Even though we've been like theorizing this from the beginning, like the Lizzie Grasso flirtation and affection and that connection into this trap.

Again, I'm not nervous about Robbie because I don't think he's going to make it.

So I'm just sort of like, Robbie's going to die one way or another, is how I feel.

Joanna Robinson doesn't care that Robbie's kids are going to be orphaned by episode seven.

Just absolutely.

Maeve exists for a reason in the plot.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's a Maeve sticks around, probably.

Yeah.

And then Sam, we just never see again.

We got to see him by seven.

He has to have a landing spot, I would think.

Yeah, where does it?

He has to be okay.

So where does he land?

Hopefully not in the system somehow.

So like, that would be,

do they put it back with Maeve?

That seems like an insane thing to do, but like, is that something that they would do?

We did have that listener suggest that he wanted winds up with Tom because they both like animals so much.

So does Tom do like a do-over adoption

with a new kid?

Oh, Rob's making a major face right now.

I don't.

It's tough.

I don't.

I don't love my first adopted son murder, like manslaughtered slash third degree murdered my wife.

So I'm just going to adopt a new son.

I agree.

It's

tough.

It is tough.

So Maeve's driving away to the Almond Brother, Leonard Skinner, Tuesday, gone.

She's going away.

Sam and Maeve's oldest one that she said we're going to protect both now living with Tom and they're feeding animals in the back, and that's how the show ends.

Does Tom also adopt Gertie?

That's my question.

Tom's adopting everybody.

Tom adopts Lizzie.

Lizzie's moving in, too.

It's a real Brady Bunch situation by the end.

Are the episodes?

Speaking of Tom,

when do we get the trial?

Maybe never.

Or

the hearing to see if the son...

Wasn't that like right around the timeline we have right now?

So we have two episodes left for that.

Right.

And he talked about like, yeah,

he's got to to figure his shit out enough to go to the trials and things like that.

Most, I just Googled this because I didn't know.

Most of the Allman Brothers are not alive anymore, but I think some are.

And it is not too late maybe for there to be an Allman Brothers cover of Tuesday's Gone just for Bill.

Well, they both had the Allman Brothers and Leonard Skinner both lost bam members at like the peak of their power.

Yeah, I know, but there's like some surviving members.

I don't know.

Yeah, they could just, you know, they always should just combine.

Does Robbie Robbie play bass?

Like, maybe there's a future career for him off the grid somewhere.

You know, just get out of this life.

Maybe it's hard to, maybe, maybe it's time for DJ Grasanova to give us like a mashup of Leonard Skinner's Tuesdays Gone and an Almond Brothers song.

Just to like really classic girl talk material.

Yeah.

Does DJ Grasanova make it to the end of episode seven?

I think he does.

The end of the show?

But does he make it alive?

Alive, but in custody?

Or that part?

I don't know.

well here's my next question and this is going to get i think a lean back

mouth face thing from joanna

are we sure this is a one season show

ask and you shall receive because

you always do this to me

you always do this to me the smart move if this is going to be a more than one season show

is for everything gets resolved but dj grasanova still still is like the hero of this

and becomes the centerpiece of season two as they try to realize, like, wait a second.

And now he's with the biker gang and he's trying to juggle these two identities.

Basically, Matt Damon in the last 20 minutes of the parted after he actually gets away because spoiler alert, Leo gets shot.

Movie's been out for 20 years.

Sorry.

But when Damon like gets away and gets away with it, maybe that could be season two of this show.

Who's Donnie Wahlberg in season two of this show?

That's my question.

Oh, yeah.

But yeah, but that's it, like Mayor of East Town, we knew that was a one and done.

I don't know if this is a one and done.

They've never said anything.

Oh, um, yeah, I haven't seen whether or not they said they might have said one way or another.

Um, that would be interesting.

I don't know.

It would be

an amazing like final post-finale, like Task is renewed for season two news drop.

But I think Mark, Mark Ruffalo's involvement tells us this is a one-season show, or at least that Tom Brandis is a one-season character.

But imagine doing season season two with like, what, is Martha with love and respect of Martha Plimpton?

Is Martha Plimpton like anchoring the show?

And

John Hammond.

John Hammond is right there.

He's more than one to come into all streaming franchises for the second season.

Just he'll carve out 10 weeks and he's right there.

Yeah, just moving around with a Pennsylvania accent.

He's playing Ops.

Anything else before we go?

I am professionally obligated to comment on Robbie makes a joke when they're having their nice car ride together, he and Tom, that actually the duffel bag is full of basketballs and actually they're headed to a pickup basketball game together.

Scouting report on Tom Brandis as a pickup basketball player really moves the ball.

Okay.

Can only score between four and six feet on weird little flip shots.

Horribly out of shape.

I've played with that guy a million times.

Robbie scouting reports.

Definitely gets somebody hurt.

Oh, 100% gets somebody.

Blue guy, but undercuts somebody on a rebound.

Everyone's mad at him.

He's apologizing.

He's a nice guy, so you don't stay mad at him.

Yeah, we've played with him.

He gets to come back, but everyone is still kind of quietly pissed at him.

The Robbie scouting report, he is the guy who takes the worst possible shot in the worst possible moment because he has decided it is Robbie Pendergrass time.

So I've also played with that guy, unfortunately, but such is life.

Yeah.

And his brother was way better than him, but sometimes he could he check it up.

But his brother was awesome.

Oh, Billy was great.

Everyone.

Billy was great.

Billy was just great at everything.

Except apparently pleasing his wife.

Oh, no, that was Jason.

I I'm mixing it up.

How dare you?

That was such a great joke.

Yeah.

Billy is unimpeachable.

He had everything.

Billy was good at pleasing his wife.

He sure was.

Damn, I almost landed that one.

Any other things we have to hit before we go?

Other than episode six, first 10 minutes is going to be one of the TV moments of the year.

I'm really excited for this.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I look forward to getting eight more exclamation points from Bill on whatever happens in those first six minutes.

Are we together for the last episode?

I hope so.

Joe, are you coming through yeah i'll be you'll be in town let's do are we going to be able to get a screener of the last episode don't we have it i think we of the seventh i think we have it oh i haven't look i'm afraid in the way they do the screeners i don't even go past the episode i'm watching because they actually have a lot of

they don't have a lot of description of the next episode they don't i don't like the title but what i really like about the screeners on the hbo site is that they don't have thumbnails yes you know what i mean so you're not like well i know so-and-so survives till this episode or something like that so i like that you know the the thumbnail for the finale is just aaliyah like really smelling something strongly bob i hope this happens for you i really do this is yeah this is your best one checkoff's sense of smell and also chekhov's perry's claw marks around his neck like the look they're gonna come back i don't know what to tell you yeah yeah because he did he lied about whatever jason's gonna figure out at some point during the sixth episode that perry killed his wife and it might just be as simple as she just pops out of the water dead Like, what lies beneath style?

Who knows?

Did he not do something with that body?

He's just in the water.

He probably tied a rock to the bottom.

He did in the water.

I also don't understand.

Like, he kills Aaron, and his explanation to Jason for why his face is all messed up is, I slipped in the shower.

My guy, you're middle management for the dark hearts.

Like, you can just say I had to take care of some things.

Like, it's cool.

You don't have to make up the shower story.

Just an own goal by him.

Um, you think Perry's going to just start wearing like a lot of turtlenecks in this unseasonably warm early fall?

He's got like his dark heart.

It's got the logo and the turtleneck.

All right.

Thanks to Joanne and Rob.

Thanks to Donnie.

Thanks to Justin Sales.

Thanks to Leonard Skinner and the Altman Brothers.

Hopefully they'll combine

for the end credits.

Good luck to all the people we want to survive.

I really hope DJ Grasanova doesn't shoot Lizzie because that would be depressing.

We'll be back for episode six and then we'll do the season finale in person, hopefully.

Great to see both of you.

Yeah, likewise.

Thanks, Bill.