Cut Up Those Credit Cards so You Can Actually Chase Freedom!

welcome America you have joined the conversation here on the Ramsey show a conversation about you your life specifically your money your work and your relationships are the topics of the day I'm Ken Coleman.

Jade Warshaw joins me.

We're ready to go for you. Here's how you jump in.
888-825-5225. 888-825-5225 is the phone number.
I've got a little extra juice today because after the show, we're rocketing out of here, Stacey and I to go see our son play his first friday night football game of the season it's football time in tennessee it's football time in america some of you don't like football you could care less and i don't care that you're ready for some football but i got a little extra juice because that means that fall is in the air and so uh i may tackle somebody in the lobby today i don't know i'm just to warn you all. I might just get too fired up and tackle somebody.
We'll see what happens. That's inappropriate, Ken.
You ready to go? Yes, I'm ready. Yeah, of course I'm kidding.
Look at me. If I tackled anybody, I'd break.
I'd break. Not a big fella.
Not a big fella. All right, let's go to Newark, New Jersey is where we're going to join Kat.
Kat, how can we help today? Hi, guys. Thank you so much for taking my call.
You bet. How can we help you? So I'm a 25-year-old nurse.
I've been a nurse for about three years in New Jersey, and I'm in grad school part-time. Every time I get to baby step one, I end up using it to pay off my credit card bills for the month.
And even though I make a good salary, I'm chronically overspending and living paycheck to paycheck. And my debt is minimal.
So I feel like I'm missing a huge opportunity to spend. So I'm hoping for some advice to break that cycle.
All right. Well, I'm going to turn you over to the budget queen herself, but I'm just curious, what is your income? Without overtime, it's about $95,000 with overtime, maybe $110,000.
Oh my gosh. You're going to get scolded.
That's really good money. That's really good money.
You're doing a great job. What's causing you to use credit cards when you have actual cash money, as they say? I think I have this false sense of security.
I spend money before it's there. So I'll put it on my credit card and then when I get paid, the first thing I do is pay off that credit card and then I have no more cash left.
So what's happening is you're overspending on the credit card, then you're having to dip into your $1,000 in order to cover the difference. Did I understand that correctly? Yep.
And that makes exact sense. I want to validate that there is a very clear reason that that's happening.
And it's because we know that, I mean, studies have been done, that when you spend on a credit card, you do spend more money. And in the range, the percentage, it grows depending on what it is that you're spending money on.
It could be anything from 5%. It could be upwards of 13% for things like fast food.
And it could be up to 100% more for things like events, concert tickets, football tickets, things that you enjoy doing for entertainment. And so it makes sense that you're going over and spending more than you would if you were using a debit card and sticking to a budget.
So all that to say, I think there's a really simple, you know, anecdote for antidote. That's right.
And aote for this problem. And I think it's you getting out your credit card right now and slicing it up.
What do you think about that? I had a feeling you were going to say that, so I'm ready to do it. You're ready to do it? Let's do it on air.
Hold on a second. On air.
All right. So here's how we do this.
You've got to get it really close to the phone. Yeah.
So we can hear the snip snip. All right.
Tell us when and count us down so we can all listen all right let's see it's a metal kind of metal card so this should be interesting you gotta go hulk status on that one yeah all right i'm putting it close to the to the speaker here okay i'll tell you when i'm about to do it. Okay.
Three, ready? Two, one.

Oh boy.

Did you hear it? I heard it. I heard a snap.
Did it cut? It cut the slice. We're doing the rest right now.
Ready? Okay. Hear it? Oh, that's good.
I feel like it's a bit of a crunch. There we go.
I heard that. What kind of card was it? It was a Chief Prime Freedom.
Oh, Prime Freedom. Yeah, they had to add Prime to Freedom as if Freedom's not enough.
Oh, this is Prime. Let me tell you something.
Prime Freedom. You are now actually free.
You now are. Exactly.
These credit cards don't give a rip about your freedom. I can tell you that right now.
But Ken and I actually do. We want you to be free.
And I truly do think that this is going to be the start of a situation where you're not having to dip into your emergency fund every other month. Hey, do you have EveryDollar? No.
Okay. I mentioned it before.
And for anybody listening, EveryDollar is our budgeting app here. It's the best budgeting app there is.
It makes it so, so easy to budget, Kat. Even somebody like me, who's not really into apps and technology, it's very simple.
It's very intuitive. It goes on your phone or your desktop.
We're going to send it to you for free because this is the key to you really making progress with your money. Because nothing, Ken, nothing is more frustrating than finally getting $1,000.
And then you have to go right back into it. That will make you want to quit.
That right there. But with every dollar, you're going to feel victorious and you're going to keep going and you're going to make progress.
You're not going to take one step forward, two steps back. One thing I want to add real quick, Kat.
My mentor, one of my mentors, John Maxwell, leadership guru, friend of our organization, has said that a budget is telling your money what to do. And very simply put, that's about as beautiful of a definition of a budget as anything I've ever heard.
And that's what's going on with you, Kat. You've got to just get intentional.
Now, Jade's giving you every dollar and that's the mechanism, but the mechanism itself won't work unless you work it. So you've got to decide, I'm going to get intentional and at the start of every month, tell my money what it's going to do.
Right now, you're just doing whatever you want to do, right? Yep. So I just wanted to put that in there.
We're going to give you a wonderful mechanism, Jade, but you have to actually make it work or it won't work. It doesn't magically do it for you.
That's right. And Kat, I want you to find me on Instagram.
Do you ever go on social media? Oh, yeah. I follow you.
Okay. She's already with you on the gram.
I'm talking about it all the time. I'm really trying to help people optimize their budget, streamline what they're doing so that it's really working for them and it doesn't feel like a hassle.
It feels like something that they enjoy doing. It's working for them.

So make sure to tune into that because I'm, I mean, all the time I'm coming on there giving

tips.

So I think for you, you're going to get off this call with every dollar you're going

to, you've already cut up the credit cards.

Bravo.

Very, very good.

And yeah, now you can actually chase freedom.

There's a notion, but you got to be intentional.

So hang on the line.

We'll take care of you. Jade, I want to come back to that there because again, I love your story.
Stacey and I have our story. You and Sam paid off almost a half a million dollars in debt.
You don't do that without budgeting. And I mean, budgeting like to the penny.
Yeah. What is the mindset for someone like a cat, people that are listening right now, joining all the time and they're going, okay, I understand the functionality of a budget, but I want you to give them, you got a minute here.
I want you to give them, what do they have to do practically to start to make the concept of a budget work? Well, I always say a budget needs to be three things. Detailed, realistic, and flexible.
Love it. So important.
The detailed is when you go in there and you're really thinking through, what do I spend money on? Anything from those fixed expenses like rent or mortgage, your car payment, right? To variable expenses, things that have the ability to change like your gas bill or your groceries, things like that. And even those odds and ends that come through, you're taking your son to, you know, out of town to a football game that is added cost.
So you're budgeting through those things. You're being realistic.
Yeah. I'm a family of four.
We're growing groceries cost more now. So you're making, you're being realistic in the amount of money that you're setting in each category.
And then you're being flexible to know, Hey, no one's perfect. Things pop up.
I forgot I had that thing on auto pay and it's coming through. So I take from one category in order to make it work.
And I'm constantly budgeting, balancing that budget and being flexible with the numbers. That's how this thing works.
Tell people where to go to get EveryDollar. All right.
You can go to EveryDollar at ramsysolutions.com slash EveryDollar. There you go.
All right. She's Jade Warshaw.
I'm Ken Coleman. Don't move more Ramsey show coming right up.
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Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. Thrilled to have you with us.
888-825-5225 is the phone number for you to jump in. Jade Warshaw is with me.
I'm Ken Coleman, and we're here to coach you up today. We're going to coach you up with your money, coach you up in your professional goals or advancement so you can make more money.
And what's the relationship stuff going on around all of that? We'll coach you up there as well. Hey, for those of you who feel like this is a big year coming up, we're just getting into the last two quarters of the year, and 2025 around the corner, if you can believe that.
And you want to make some real marks coming up. You've got to be intentional.
The dreams and plans have got to be supported by goals and time. So we're excited to announce the new 2025 Ramsey Goal Planner is officially on pre-sale.
It's going to help you get organized and track your progress. It's not just an everyday planner that you've seen in your favorite store that you go to.
Ken, toss me that planner. All right.
I'll just do that. Toss it on over here.
I'm not going to toss it because it could hurt you. Yeah, it's substantial.
You're right. It is.
I was talking about that the other day. By the way, that could be a safety device.
It could protect you if someone sneaks up on you and whack them right in the head. You knock them on the head.
That's right. They're out.

You're right.

The reason she's so excited about it is because she,

she being Jade Warshaw, Rachel Cruz and Dr. John Deloney teamed up to put some great practical content that will help you with your money,

your faith, and your relationships.

And it's on pre-sale, which means it's the best price you can get for it.

It won't ever get lower than this.

$35.97.

$35.97. Last day to pre-order September 2.
And then the prices go back up to $49.97. So this sells out every year.
You can get it at RamseySolutions.com slash store. RamseySolutions.com slash store.
Let me tell you. It's a little price is right moment here.
You're going to model it for us? Planner people are planner people.

They want to know what's in it.

And one of my favorite things about it is the calendar orientation.

It has the calendar like you would normally see it on any sort of calendar,

but it also has agenda style in there to where you can write out what you plan to do for those days.

There's places where you can journal.

There's places where you can write down your monthly notes. I like using it for meal planning.
You can go in there and put your plans for there. There's a place where you can write the books that you're reading, the podcasts that you're listening to.
There's Bible verses. It's a lot.
There's even financial trackers in the back. So if you're tracking to save, tracking to pay off your house, there's not a better planner than this.
And I'm just saying that because I love it. Yeah, it's a handsome item.
It is. And one added bonus here, I'm just going to be honest.
Every year, this has happened every year for the last three years. I bought one for somebody else and then I'm jealous when I see it and I turn around and buy one for myself because they're great.
I know somebody in a building probably gets you one for free this year. Oh, I pay for it.
I know a few people. Listen.
You pay for it? I helped write it. Yeah, but that means you shouldn't pay for it.
No, it's like when you make your first dollar and you put it in a frame. I buy everything I've come out with.
I bought Money's Not a Math Problem. I bought the gold planner.
I bought the grad guy. I've got to tell you something right now.
I've never bought one of my products. You want other people to buy it? You've got to buy it.
I made it. I don't need to buy it.
America needs to chime in on this kid. I feel like that's a budget item that needs to be revisited.
Listen, just know I bought it. Oh, we know.
I got a lot of questions, but they don't need to be answered. There are other questions that need to be answered.
But I love how you gave me the guilt trip. What? You want to? Like, uh, uh, I wrote it.
That's true. Okay.
Anyway, Robert's up next in Miami, Florida. Robert, how can we help today? How's it going, guys? Thank you for taking my call.
Sure. I recently opened a business, and it's IT and tech repair, things of that nature.
I've been running it for two and a half years now, actually two years, five months, and 17 days. And every month has been fine, money-wise, numbers-wise.
Everything's in the green. Nothing's in the red or the black.
Nothing seems to be going wrong, but I seem to be having this perpetual fear that there's like a skeleton in the closet, so to speak, that something is going to come up, something's going to happen, it's going to cause some problems. Okay, let me jump in there for a second.
Something is going to happen, and there will be a problem. I want to go ahead and just, so there's no need to be afraid of it, because it's going to happen.
It's called life. It's called running a business.
So what we need to do is, is stop clutching our pearls and freaking out and start preparing for it.

When I was growing up, I lived, Jade, on the coast of Virginia.

And because we lived on the coast of Virginia, hurricane season, which we're in right now, was a pretty normal thing.

And when the forecasters would say, we might be in the track of this deal many, many days in advance, it was a normal thing in our neck of the woods where we would see people go that live right on the ocean or had businesses on the ocean. Robert, I hope you're listening to me.
And they would go buy plywood, three by four inch plywood and heavy, thick stuff. And they would board the would go get sandbags in other words they would prepare for the coming storm and we never knew for sure if the storm was going to hit us that's right you lived in Florida you understand this but you still prepared knowing that the storm was going to come and if it missed great.
You're more prepared for the next time. Yeah.
Then when the next time actually hits, you're prepared. So, Robert, I'm thrilled to hear that your business is healthy.
And your fear needs to turn from fear into vigilance. Okay? Vigilance is different than fear.
Vigilance is why we put soldiers on the wall. If you ever had a fort when you were a kid or watched the old movies, they'd have a soldier going across the top of the fort, looking out for potential danger.
So financially to be financially vigilant is what we want you to do. And so here's how you do that.
Okay. We call it retained earnings here at Ramsey Solutions when we teach business owners

how to prepare for a rainy day. It's the same thing as an emergency fund that Jade teaches people

when they call in for their personal income. And so you need to have a very robust retained

earnings account. So it'd be a savings account.
And it is there for when maybe a problem arises

that costs you a little something or maybe a lot,

but instead of it breaking your business, it's just like having to use the emergency fund in real life.

Is that at the crux of what the fear is about?

Is that thing that breaks your small business and takes away your ability to work for yourself?

Oh, no, no, no.

I have, pardon to say this, but I have six figures in reserve. I'm not worried about that.
The hoard in the keep is not the problem. It's, how should I say this? In education and schooling, I was always like the top of the class.
I was always the top 1%. I was the big fish in the bowl, so to speak.
Now that I'm out of the bowl and into the ocean, I feel kind of like a little fish in a big body of water, and I've never felt this before. Oh, I see.
But that's not what you said. You see? Well, now I see.
Can you two explain it to me? Well, you said you were afraid of a skeleton in the closet, which that's the wrong metaphor. I think you're just worried like you're not the top dog.
Like there's real competition out there, and you're going to have to fight to maintain what you have. You're probably going to have to fight harder than you ever had to maybe in high school or college to maintain what you had because it was a smaller pond and now you're out in the world.
Good for you to get that. So what's the fear though? So I get that.
But what bad happens as a result of you not being the biggest, baddest fish? Well, I mean, how should I say it? I feel like you said, I'm clutching the pearls. Hello? Yeah.
That's what I'm saying. I don't know how you say it, because I think we're back to the original thing.
You're afraid of something bad happening. You can't even define what bad happening is.
It's everything that's minor. So, for example, let's say I fix around 2,500 computers a year.
My ticket number almost reached up to 2,600 last year. For example, client comes in, isn't happy with their work and requires a refund.
I know I have the hoard in the keep and I have everything to maintain it. I just feel as though it's a mistake that I made or that was made by my company

and I'm worried that something will come from it.

Yeah, but not unless that becomes a pattern, my friend.

And there's a part of this that's like, I'm afraid on my commute to work that I'll get in a car

accident. Like there's a part of this that's like, some of it you can control and some of it you

absolutely cannot control. Yeah, you might have people come in and make a bunch of returns and

then you'll adjust and you'll fix it. People are very flexible and people are very adjustable

I'm going to fix it for free. This is The Ramsey Show.
Welcome back to The Ramsey Show, where we help you win with your money, win in your work, and win with your relationships. 888-825-5225 is the phone number.
I'm Ken Coleman. The fabulous Jade Warshaw joins me this hour, and we are here for you.
Let's go to Harrisburg, Pennsylvania next, where Amanda is waiting. Amanda, how can we help today? Hey, Jade.
Hey, Ken. Thanks for taking my call.
I'm so excited. Well, we're excited, too.
What are we excited about? I'm hoping you guys can help me settle a debate between me and my husband regarding if we should sell my car. Come on, Ken.
High five. That's our favorite.
We love this. We love getting in the middle of marital debates about things.
It's very exciting. Sometimes it turns into a debate with Jade and I, so you just never know.
It's a double bonus. Okay, so set it up for us, but as you set it up, we need to know,

America needs to know what your side of the debate is and what his is,

and then we'll dive in.

How about that?

Okay, so I think that we should sell the car and pay off debt.

He thinks we should keep the car because he believes that it's safe,

and it's a great car, and we are pregnant right now,

so he wants something that's safe for the baby.

Okay.

All right. Okay.

Now, I'm going to walk you through some quick questions and then Judge Jade and Judge Ken will get involved. Okay.
All right. So how much debt do you have? About 70,000.
What is that comprised of? Break that down, please. It is $42,000 of student loan debt, and the rest is an IVF loan.

Well, what about the car?

Is the car paid for?

The car is paid for. So I actually discovered Dave about 10 months ago.

I didn't really understand all of everything that he practices,

but I got Gazella Intense, and I paid about $63,000 of debt off in the last 10 months. Wow.
Good for you. And the car being a part of it.
Yeah. Yeah.
Okay. So I've got 42K student loan and 28K IVF.
Yeah. All right.
And what's the car worth if you were to sell it? About between 26000, so like $27,000. Okay.

And what would you drive?

Do you have a second car that you would just, what's the plan in your mind?

I was thinking, I was just looking before I called you guys,

and I found some reliable-looking cars for about $10,000.

So that would be what I would budget to buy a beater car.

Leaving $17,000 over to put towards debt.

Correct. Correct.

Okay.

And what is you guys' salary?

What do you guys bring home?

$140,000 a year between the two of us.

Okay.

And is this your only vehicle or is there another one?

And what's it worth?

My husband has the vehicle.

It's paid off.

It's probably worth about $10,000. Okay.
What is your vehicle, the one that we're thinking about selling? It's a 2021 Subaru Ascent. Okay, so this would be...
I'm ready. I'm ready to decide.
Yeah, I'm ready to decide. You can keep asking questions.
I've already reached my conclusion. Do you have any more questions, Judge Jade? Let me think here.
So the plan would be if you sold this car, the baby would ride in whatever car anybody's driving, right? Yeah.

His car is a, what's his car? It's a, I think it's a 2013 Nissan Frontier. Fantastic.

Great.

And what's the car that you priced out around 10 grand?

What was that model or something in that range?

It is, it's a smaller version of the Subaru Ascent.

Oh, okay.

I don't know what the model's called.

Absolutely.

I'm ready to rule.

I'm ready to.

Ladies first.

Okay.

You go first.

I'm going to say I'm on your side.

I would sell it.

Yes. And here's why.
here's why um i concur i just needed to get that in really quick because you're going to say what i'm going to say go ahead i concur here's why and you're not you're not above the guidelines um of car you know we always say you if you had more than 50 of your take-home pay in I'd be like, you got to get rid of one of these. If I thought that there was no way to pay this off in two years, I would also for sure definitely say you've got to get rid of it.
And those two things aren't true. But you do have a decent pile of debt here.
And you're able to clear $17,000 of debt, or're able to put, yeah, $17,000 on your debt.

And you're still able to drive a pretty nice car.

And so.

And the baby doesn't know.

The baby doesn't know the difference.

Exactly.

He doesn't know.

No, he doesn't have a clue. Part of me.

And here's the other trade off I want to say.

You guys said we're going to spend, we're going to go into debt for IVF.

And in many ways, this is you guys paying it back and saying, instead of going into debt, this is us, you know what I'm saying, swapping that money out. And I think that's going to give you a lot of peace going into this too.
I agree. Your husband's a good man.
I'd show him on YouTube. You can rewind it and he can see that we both have ruled in favor of Amanda.
Nothing personal to your husband. There might be some pride involved there, the nicer car.
Every man wants his wife to have a nice car, a nice house. And for the baby.
And the baby. But the baby doesn't care.
And then when the baby becomes a toddler, he's going to destroy the car. He's going to dump his bottle, his juicy juice cup.
There's going to be goldfish everywhere. Applesauce on the window.
I mean, honestly, I wouldn't get a nice car until the kids are teens. That's a fact.
That was our personal. That's what we did.
Same. They destroyed it.
Same. Destroyed it.
It was like a zoo. The time will come, Ken, when we get our G-wagons.
Come on. But today is not the day.
And I'm not even letting them in the car. I'm not even going to let them in the car.
They're going to be adults. I'll be 21.
Dad, can I ride with you? Nope.

Take your shoes off.

Why?

Because I have trauma from all the years you destroyed every other vehicle I had. You just stand there and look at me, and I'm going to zoom on by you.
I know. That's right.
I love it. Amanda wins.
We've ruled in your favor. Michael is up next in Minneapolis.
Michael, how can we help? Hi. Yeah.
I, so in 22, I got an inheritance that allowed me to pay off my house. Nice.
And since then, I've kind of felt directionless. Directionless professionally, personally, financially, or all three? Kind of all three.
Yeah. Well, what did you set out to do at some point before you turned 22 and got this inheritance? What's been rattling around in your brain? No, I'm not.
I'm talking about in 2022. Oh, I apologize.
Okay. How old are you? No, no, no.
I'm 50. Oh, you're 50.
Well, what do you do for a living? Software engineer. Do you enjoy it? I enjoy the work.
I'm not too happy right now with the company. Okay.
Now, let me tell you something. That's called right thing, wrong place.
You're doing something that you enjoy, but not in the right place. And so you're in a new financial position where you have, I would assume, not just financial freedom, but emotional freedom.
Is that true? Yes. All right, my man, I'd start looking.
I think this is the directionlessness is because you were maybe in the grind or felt like you were working for a living or working to pay off things. And now all of a sudden, this infusion of money has changed your perspective.
And this is a good place to be. I'll tell you what I'm going to give you, because I don't have time to unpack it with you in the couple minutes we have.
But I'm going to give you as my gift when we put you on hold here, the book, Find the Work You're Wired to Do. And in it, it has the Get Clear Career Assessment.
I don't think that you are somebody who has no clue what they want to do. I think you just might need to say, let's let my brain and heart start to align and go, I can actually pretty much go do a lot of different things right now.
And I would begin to allow your heart to explore and see some things. But we have some clues in that you enjoy the software engineer or certain elements of that work you don't like the culture in.
So I'd begin looking now for at least that type of work in a culture that is healthy and that has a potential ladder for you. But I think at 50, it's like, what do I want to do with a third of my life? Because that's what work is, between sleep and family or friends or hobbies or whatever.
That's the other third. I'd also start to do some work on excavating what your why was, because if the why behind the what wasn't substantial enough, then I could see you feeling aimless.
If the why was just because I want to pay off my house, because I want to have money in savings, because I want it. And if it was a shallow why, then I could see you feeling like, okay, then what am I supposed to do? Whereas if the why is much deeper, you know, about the type of life that you want to live, how you want to feel, how you want others around you to view you, how you want to be able to give to others, like dig deeper on that why.
And I think that it's also going to help with some of that aimlessness. Yeah.
And your purpose statement that is a part of your report that you will get in the Get Clear assessment, it's going to be a mirror for you. And you're going to see, this is what I want to do, and I understand the why.
Now I can begin to look for the where. So really good call.
Excited for you, Michael. This is a fun new chapter.
I just turned 50. 50's the new 40.
So there you go. I just did it was.
Hang on the line. We'll get you the Get Clear assessment in the book, Find the Work You're Wired to Do.
This is The Ramsey Show. We'll be right back.
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Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Thrilled to have you with us.
I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshaw joins me.
The phone number for you, America, to jump in is 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225. All right.
So we like to cover relevant items from the news, stories from the news that have enough data around it and enough of a movement of activity that it could affect this very, very large audience. And so this is a money-related story, Jade.
And so here we go. This is in my hands here.
This is an article from The Cut. The team loves when I do that.
It really freaks the sound guys out. But that's just an old technique that Rush Limbaugh made famous, and I like to bring it back.
So here we go. This is an article about 20-somethings that are taking what is now being called a mini retirement.
And in the article it's referred to as a sabbatical or adult gap years. So we're living a day and age, by the way, where we got to be cute the way we describe something.
Okay. It's a sabbatical.
All right. So this is what's happening.
A lot of younger people in their 20s are taking significant breaks from their jobs or leaving a job and taking a significant break before they come back to work. Okay.
Okay. And this is a specific quote from a young lady in this article.
I've recently decided that working for three years and then taking a year off is how it's going to be for me. Now, this was a teacher who started setting aside some of her money for her mini retirement in a high-yield savings account.
So this is a routine that she's going to do. She's saying this is going to be my life.
I'm going to work for three years. I'm going to save money and then I'm going to take a year off.
Okay. So that's a concept there.
Okay. So far, I'm not bothered yet.
Okay. All right.
So then the question becomes, what about health insurance? Okay. Debt payments, student loan payments, rent, the ability to save for your actual retirement down the road.
And she says, I'm not sure what I'm going to do about health insurance,

but she believes she's going to be able to save for retirement.

So all of this, to me, is a big nothing burger.

This gets a headline, and it gets an interesting story.

I see two negatives, Jade.

Okay, you tell me yours, and then I'll tell you.

I think consistently investing in a 401k or Roth, some type of retirement vehicle. Has to be.
I think that's a negative if you're taking a year off and you got to adjust for that. What are you doing? Unless she says I'm going to be saving 30% of what I make or whatever that ratio would need to be to cover the year.
So you can address it. I'm just saying the only negatives I see is if you weren't addressing your retirement strategy.
Your debt. That's right.
And then the other negative is in her case, and I think it's one of the few fields where she can probably get away with this, and that's the teaching industry. Oh, yeah.
A lot of industries, if you're taking a year off and you're just bouncing between schools all the time,

so let's say she does it over a 10-year period, she's at three different schools. It may not be a big deal in teaching, but I will tell you in the corporate world, if they start seeing multiple jobs every other year, or there's just a lot of separation, there's downtime, they're looking at the gaps, in other words, on your resume, that can create a massive red flag.
So if you can adjust for that or address that challenge, then I say, go for it. She's saving up the money if she's telling us the truth.
I think if you're doing this right and you hit on a couple of the things, I think a couple of other are, I mean, of course, you got to be debt free. You can't do this with debt laying around.
You've got to have, obviously, the right amount of savings to Ken's point, whether that be emergency fund savings or retirement savings. But I do, I like when people think outside the box.
I like when people go, you know what? I'm going to create a life that I love to use Rachel's framework. And this is how I want to do my life.
So much of what we teach is about living like no one else. So later you can live like no one else.
And if this person has put those things in place, I'm like more power to you. And I love that you came up with this idea.
I love that. If it's sound financial strategy, then you do what you want to do.
And I'm going to tell you something, this will freak some people out. This may be an article I'll talk about later, James, but I've been doing some homework on this and there's some pretty forward thinking people like the founder of LinkedIn, a really well-known dude for, you know, kind of predicting things.
Work is continually changing in the next five to 10 years. The way we work today, all I'm going to say is, may not look anything like the way we work in the future.
I'm interested in that. It's going to be very interesting.
A lot of travel and remote work. I'm just telling you.
These generations are pushing back on it. I mean, you can't.
That's right. There's lot going on around on social media.
I see memes like this probably every day, which is basically saying if the average lifespan is 76 years old, it's like, I'm supposed to work till 65 and then I get 10 years to do, you know, what I want. Yeah.
Like people are like, that doesn't sit right with me. And it's interesting to hear people's, I mean, this is one of those pushbacks.
You know, what's going to make's going to make that possible is AI. Yeah.
So the reason I'm saying that, I'm not going to get into the whole thing here, but the ascension of AI, and I'm not talking about robots doing everything for you. I'm talking about making the ability for a person to run their own business truly anywhere, anytime in the world.
That's what AI is going to do. So it's going to make it easy and easier for people to pretty much go, yeah, you know what? We're going to Bolivia, kids.
Get your mountain gear. So I'm just telling you.
Quality of life. This is not going to be that abnormal in the future and you're already seeing it.
This is a version of it. Ken Coleman, you heard it first it's not my prediction i'm just reading what very smart people are saying are we gonna be in flying cars uh i'm not i'll watch you flying cars i'll come to you i'll be like hey kids look miss jade and mr sam watch out uh i i prefer to feel the wheels on the pavement would you get in a self-driving car? Nope.
I wouldn't either. Nope.
Listen, if we're going to go to that, then I'm just going to go ahead and get a chauffeur. Yes, a driver.
I'm with that. But I need to trust a human being, you know? Preferably with a nice British accent.
Mr. Coleman, where would you like to go today? Yeah, that's fantastic.
That's more my speed. This report, this is very interesting to me.
I have to say, I'm very... Now, have you heard also, because here's the negative side of the forward, I'll put forward in quote, forward thinking.
Okay. First, you get ideas like this that are like okay i could see that working the other side is i have seen uh also with the 20 somethings taking their own i can't remember what the term is but they'll just say i'm gonna take a vacation yeah and they don't even put in the time no they don't even tell anybody and they're like no one's no one's keeping tabs on me anyway so i'm just gonna take just going to take a vacation.
Happens all the time. That's crazy town.
It is crazy. But this is also a backlash.
I'm glad you bring up vacation because I was talking about this on the Ken Coleman show recently. Millions and millions of Americans are not using their full vacation and this is the older generations because they're like they're afraid that if I take my vacation my boss is going to hold it against me.
You have to be seen. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And this younger generation is like, uh-uh. And they're almost a little too careless about it.
But to your point, what's happening is, and what's fascinating about this article is the millennials have been the largest demographic in the workforce for some time now, probably about five to seven years. So I'm Gen X,

you're a millennial. It depends on the scale you look at.
Oh, really? Yeah. Okay.
You need to receive that. I was giving you the millennial label.
Okay. Yeah.
Okay. Either way.
The point is my generation. I want your generation for the music.
That's all. Right.
Right. Appreciate it.
Thank you very much. We're so memorable.
They just gave us an X, not even a cool name, like millennial. We're just Generation X.

But the point is that now Gen Z is coming into the workforce. And so in about five to seven years, you're going to see Gen Z and millennials, the dominant drivers of work culture.
Yeah. So to your point that you made earlier, a kind of a nomad, a professional nomad.
Yeah. That's already a term that exists term that exists where people like well i do my work for many around the world but this is taking nomad to another level in that i'm i'm literally going to check out of the workforce for a year yeah and then i'll come back well i think covid obviously it was like first we had the shift with covid and then we've got this influx of ai technology so So I feel like those two things combined, it's the way of the future.

You heard it here first.

Let me tell you something.

You nailed it.

The pandemic woke people up to go, I got one shot on this globe.

How do I want to spend it?

Yeah.

Which, by the way, we should have been thinking about that from the get-go.

That's true.

But really fascinating is we see the world of work and how we make money change.

We're going to be on the front lines for you. Good hour, Jade Warshaw.
Thank you, ma'am. Thank you to our fearless leader, James Childs.
Thank you, America, for listening. We'll be right back.
Before you know it, this is The Ramsey Show. Welcome to The Ramsey Show, where we help you win with your money, win in your work, and win with your relationships.
The phone number is 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225.
I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshaw joins me, and we're excited to be together.
We always have a good time answering your questions, coaching you up, so let's get right to it. We're going to go to Lafayette, Louisiana, where John joins us.
John, how can we help today? Hey there. First of all, I really appreciate you guys taking my call.
I was just looking for a little advice on one financial, two kind of, you know, family relationship style. My father, he's 75 and has lived alone for a couple of decades, fell victim to a romance scam and he funneled every dollar he had into it.

And my brother and I,

we all, uh, fell victim to a romance scam and he funneled every dollar he had into it. Um, and my brother and I, we ultimately did an intervention with them and, you know, cut off that hemorrhaging.
Um, but now he's just in a rough place. Uh, he barely has a couple of dollars to his name, just living pension check to pension check, barely taking care of just the bills.
How much did he funnel into it? About $150. Ooh.

Whew. pension check to pension check, barely taking care of just the bills.
How much did he funnel into it? About $150. Can I tell you something? This is the second call that we've taken on this in the last two weeks.
I was on the last time, John, when a lady called in and it happened to her mother. Oh, gosh.
It's just the catfishing. It's just unbelievable.
Such an awful scam. So how can we help? What do you think is the biggest challenge, or where do you think we can try to give you some practical wisdom here? So it's super difficult, at least for me.
I get super wound up in my own head because, one, I'm involved, you know, and it's very difficult for me to separate, you know, logic from emotion and everything. I think problem number one is the enormous amount of distrust and tension in the family presently, and that goes both directions.
This has taken place over the period of about a year. And, you know, it started out, hey, I met somebody.
You know, the question was, well, where? You know, I'm happy for you. Congratulations.
And then it's like Instagram. And, you know, from moment number one, I'm like, okay, slow your roll.
You know, this is a little bit cautionary. And then that was immediately met with like, well, why aren't you happy for me? So that's the kind of distrust that has been from moment number one yeah uh for the entire year my attitude was please slow down don't do this so he didn't trust that you had his best interest at heart no he did not at all and for an entire year i was basically yelling at him please please stop this isn't good.
Does he acknowledge now that he has actually been scammed? Because the call we got last week, the mom was still believing that it was bad. Is he in a place of realization now that he, in fact, did get scammed? I don't think it's 100%.
I think he's majority there but for example um he still communicates with these people and has not shut them off exactly what the last call was like so is it can i get clarity is it a person that he thought he was maybe dating has he ever met these people in person no no never um and uh from all the details and i have plenty of details i'm an open book so uh you know i'll provide whatever and also keep me on track because i go but um uh this was a very very organized thing uh all the transfers were non-traceable through gift cards or cryptocurrency i don don't believe these people are U.S.-based at all.

They use encrypted Chinese chat programs.

Oh, my gosh.

I think it was called Dany.

And this doesn't ring any bells?

Here's the thing.

And I'm not trying to be ugly,

but you've got to be really lonely, I think,

to get to this point where it's this glaringly obvious

and you're still clinging on to it.

So, you know, I think.

Have you notified law enforcement?

I have done everything in my power.

The only the only organization that would take a report from me was the FBI.

And I did indeed lodge that.

But in terms of any local or state law enforcement, they they told me straight up that they cannot accept anything from me on behalf of another person. So he has to be the one that says something and tries to, because these guys are so organized, you can almost kiss that money goodbye.
So if I'm in your situation, you've got to get to a point where you're going to need some support and help to have an intervention here. Yeah, because he still thinks he's going to get a return on this money.
Is that right? Yeah. So the original scam, I think that ship has sailed in his own mind.
I think he believes that it's all gone. So I don't think he's clinging to the original idea.
But now we're in this weird zone where he's avoiding me and he's not straightforward to me you know i'll ask him you know he's probably ashamed talking to you yeah he's probably ashamed but i can understand that the question is uh going forward you said he's you know spent 150 000 on this all he has is his pension how much is the way? What does he get every month? I think it's maybe on the underside of 3k a month. Are you concerned that he's not going to be able to sustain himself? I think that that should be enough to continue his quality of life.
Okay. So this is really just how do I repair the relationship? It's not a financial question at this point, yeah? Well, it is financial as well.
Again, he's not straightforward with me about what does he do with his money. John, listen, it's not a financial thing.
That's why Jay's asking that. You can't do anything about this.
The only hope you have of giving him some financial advice is to restore the relationship. That's why Jade's asking that.
I mean, I hate to tell you this. There's very little you can do.
I think you have two options. I think it's either a super tough love.
I don't know if you've got any siblings. If you did, it's a all hands on deck, come to Jesus.
We are having a living room fall out, and we're going to take a stand and say, you need to know the facts, and then wash our hands and walk away. By the way, the come to Jesus meeting doesn't have to be ugly.
There's no yelling or screaming, but it has to be a confrontational situation. The other option is you're on your knees praying, and you are just trying to restore the relationship with the hopes that he sees that you respect him still and love him.
And then he maybe allows some type of help. I don't know what else to say on that.
I'll add a third option. I, you know, I, I'm a letter, I would write a letter maybe, because sometimes when you talk in person, things get lost or people are filtering it through tone or whatever.
But maybe sitting down and just writing a heartfelt letter and just saying how you feel, saying what you hope. And that way it's something he can go back to and read again and keep a copy for yourself, put a copy for him.
And that way, even if you start to feel some type of way, you can go back and say, I've already said it. I wrote the letter, you know, and it's just kind of that it'll help keep you steady to know I've already said this and I've already let him know it's on paper.
He won't forget, you know, that sort of thing. That's the only- I want to gift you with two books.
I believe we have them here, Christian. I believe we have them, Necessary Endings by Henry Cloud and Boundaries.
And these books, I think you've got to grasp this. You're an adult.
He's an adult. There's so much broken trust here and all kinds of wacky stuff going on.
And I think you need to be okay walking away. Not from your dad, but walking away from trying to fix this mess.
It's not your mess. You didn't create it.
And it's not yours to fix. And I don't think you can fix it.
I agree. So hang on the line.
I'll get you some help. This is, we're rooting for you, John.
I hate that this is happening. I can't imagine, Jade, anything more sad than this.
And again, second time that this has happened. I'm profoundly sad just thinking about an older parent who gets scammed because their heart is lonely.
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That's RamseySolutions.com slash SmartTax. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show, where we talk to you about you.
Your money, your work, your relationships is our goal. We want you to win in all three.
I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshaw is with me.
And the phone number to jump in is 888-825-5225. Excuse me.
Try not to say too many things at once when you're live on the air. It's tough sometimes.
Every once in a while I get on a roll a little too fast. It is time for today's question of the day brought to you by Why Refi.
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May not be available in all states. All right.
Today's question comes from Ken in Mississippi. My man.
All right. He says, I had a work performance evaluation after being at my current company for six months i got nothing but atta boys and received no criticism for the job i'm doing then they offered me a 50 cent raise per hour i just wanted to know how you guys felt about that after a performance review of nothing but great feedback am i being selfish or should i

just accept it for what it is and hope for better compensation next time well ken you are being selfish but selfish in this particular interpretation jade is not bad no you got to look out for yourself that thank you thank you for picking that up of course that word selfish gets a really negative thing, but when it comes to your money and your compensation, you are your agent. You are your manager.
That's right. This is your livelihood.
So all of the feels around this scenario are what I would call absolutely normal, dare I say, healthy. That's good.
In other words, he gets a good review. He's sitting there and he's getting all positive attaboy and then they go i love how you i love how you dramatize it even in the question it was like i think she was in a few dramas and plays when she was in school uh and so in this situation jade uh it's a it's a it's a shot to the chest 50 cents yeah i'm gonna tell you something if you don't feel something when you get a 50 cent raise it's a little insult then something's wrong with you yeah and so i would say ken uh you are being what i would call properly selfish in recognizing real feelings that should feel that way because I'm objective I have no skin in this and I would feel that way if I put myself in your shoes so now let's get to the second part of this uh should you accept it I don't know because here's what I would be asking and so I'm going to play your agent all right I'm going to be your agent, and then I'm going to give it to my assistant agent.
If Jade and I are agenting for you, I'm going to say I want to find out, is that a normal raise? The average in the United States, and this is not a law, if you look at the numbers, annual raises usually fall between 3% and 4%. Again, no one's beholden to that number.
50 cent raise is really, really low. That's right.
So the question becomes, Ken, why is it only 50 cents? Is the company struggling? Good question. You've got to ask that.
That's a good question. And if the company's struggling, we all got to tighten the belt in our personal budgets.
And so I'd want to know why only 50 cents and dig into that. And, uh, and then you have to decide from there.
Okay. That's the now answer, but I want to look at next is I don't want to keep feeling this way.
Cause you keep showing up year after year and you feel this way. It's not good for you.
It's not good for you. Yeah.
That's the thing. Uh, that's a good question.
Ken, if you ask and say, Hey, what's going on? You know, I? You know, I've done some research. I know the standard.
Is the company doing all right? And let's say he says, well, you know, no, we're not. Then it's like, okay, well, am I up for the ride of sticking it out until the- Last part of his question.
Should I hope for better compensation next time? No, brother. It it's getting lower it's only going lower from here probably i don't like hope when it comes to compensation yeah do you i love hope and i think in this case there's probably a lot more fish in the sea that have fatter pockets uh when it's time for you in the mixed metaphors that was strong yeah fatter fatterills.
We got to find some fish with fatter gills. That's good.
Truly, though. I'm with you.
I don't want hope in that. I want to put my hope in me and the Lord and action.
I'm not going to put hope in, well, it was 50 cents this year. Well, Ken, talk about motivation.
Gee, I hope they bump it to $1.25 next year. Talk about the role that sort of thing plays in the motivation of the worker.
Okay, so if you feel as though you've been devalued, it's a slippery slope to where you devalue yourself. That's good.
That's what happens. That's very good.
So you're saying he would start doing things to throw himself off. Yeah..
When you start questioning, I'm only worth 50 cents? That's good. That's tough stuff.
That is tough. But that's the real, real.
So anyway, sorry about that, Ken. I would be looking for greener pastures if it were me.
I agree. But, you know, again, and by the way, anybody in that situation, can I just say this very quickly? Get the Get Clear assessment in the book, Find the Work You're Wired to Do.
It's one purchase price. Get the book.
And I'm going to tell you something. Lay it over.
Take the results of the assessment. Read the book.
It's a 45-minute read. For this reason, J.D., it'll help people go, where could I go? Yes.
Where are my possibilities? I'm not stuck. This is not the only thing I can do.
Gosh, that's a really important theme for me is for people to see. I got options.
Even when you can't see them, I promise you, you have got options. So that book is really going to infuse you with the confidence to know.
100%. It's not just that.
That's not my only option. Yeah, I love that, Ken.
It's about self-awareness. And by the way, on the other side of self-awareness is confidence.

You cannot be confident if you aren't aware.

That's true.

So there you go.

Just a quick, that's why I put that resource out.

It's a fabulous little resource.

So there you go.

All right, to the phones we go.

Ed is up in Columbia, South Carolina.

Ed, how can we help?

Hey, Ken and Jay, thanks for taking my call.

Sure, what's up?

I just have a question about paying off a mortgage. And until I wouldn't have made this call, I knew the answer in listening to your show and listening to Dave.
But I was notified that my job is being downsized October 1st. Oh, man, I'm sorry about that.
Thank you. And the thing about it is I still want to pay off the house,

but I'm concerned that I should leave the cash in case we need it. Give Jay the numbers real quick.

Walk her through the numbers.

Okay.

What do you want me to walk you through?

How much is the payoff?

Yeah.

Okay, our payoff is $113,000.

The house is worth $400,000.

Okay.

And my wife and I in the last two years have saved $190,000 in our savings. Okay.
What of that is your emergency fund? It's not. I don't.
Well, if I was going to take the emergency fund out of that, it would be $50,000. Okay.
So it's $140,000. You got $140,000 up for grabs.
Yep. And that leaves you with $50,000 there.
Typically, what we would say in a time like this, we're kind of in a crisis mode, I would tell you not to do anything major, like jump into sums of money. How quickly do you think you can find new work? And is your wife also working? Those are my two questions.
My wife is working. I actually, I work two side hustles.
I listen to Dave a lot. So I started working two side hustles to save to pay off the house.
So will you be able to, if you keep those two side hustles, your wife works and you get laid off, is that enough to cover the bills and cover your life if you pay off the mortgage? A hundred percent. We're debt free.
Our cars, we don't know anything but the mortgage. Yeah, I do it I think so, too.
I do it. You've still got $50,000.
You're still able to make your bills even without this job. That's right.
And now you're lowering your expenses by not having a mortgage. It's just taxes and insurance.
Yeah, I do that. You getting a severance of any type? No, they don't do that.
But you know what? You got a head start. You're right.
That's right Listen, I got, I'd be looking for a job as soon as you hang up the phone. 100%.
I already have, I already have been. And, and I'm fortunate.
I'm, I'm a professional salesperson, but I also have a lot of experience in retail. Great.
Hey, you guys are awesome. I'll be at Walmart or Target or Costco.
Come on. You know, pay the house off, Jade says.
You guys are awesome.

You've done an excellent, excellent job,

and this is the fruit of your labor.

Good job.

And download...

You guys kept me off the ledge,

and I wouldn't be in this situation

if I didn't listen to your show, so...

Well, good.

I appreciate it.

You like country music?

I do.

You ever heard of an old guy

named Johnny Paycheck?

I know who he is, yeah.

Download his song when we hang up.

It's called Take This Job and Shove It.

You can take this job and shove it.

Because he's paying his house off.

I know, right?

Come on.

You're like,

Thank you. This is The Ramsey Show.

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It's free at netsuite.com slash Ramsey. I talk to people every day who want to know how to do better in two areas, money and relationships.
That's why I'm pumped to bring the money and relationships tour to a city near you. Join me and Dr.
John Deloney for a night that will challenge the way you think about this stuff and possibly change how you live forever. Starting April 21st, we'll be in Louisville, then on to Durham, Atlanta, Phoenix, Fort Worth, and Kansas City.
Grab your tickets at RamseySolutions.com slash tour before they're gone. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show.
I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshaw is with me.
The phone number is 888-825-5225 888-825-5225 Well, one of our favorite things to do on this show is to hear the stories for those of you watching on YouTube, to see the stories of what's on the other side of these baby steps that we preach and they are known as our debt-free scream so in the lobby of our Ramsey Solutions here, we're looking at them right now, lovely young couple. Grady and Brittany, how are you? Good.
Doing great. Tell us where you're from.
Portland, Oregon. Portland, Oregon.
All right. Well, this is exciting.
You ready to share the story? Yes. Okay, let's go.
How much debt did you pay off? $81,680.97.

Oh, to the penny. I like that.
All right. And how long did that take you? Nine months.
Oh, wow. Nine months.
Okay. What were you making during that time? $185 to $215.
Ooh, what did you do to get the raise there in income? Well, I got an increase at my job, and then he got a promotion. And then I also sold some clothes.
Nice. What kind of work do you guys do? I work front desk at a dental office.
And I'm in operations for a food distribution company. Okay, great.
All right. Wow, so really good income and fantastic stuff.
All right, so break it down. What was the debt of the 81,000? What was it all about? It was student loans, credit cards, and a car payment.
Car payment. My truck.
Okay. All right.
What kind of truck was it? We got to know. Tundra.
All right. Well done.
Well done. So what happens nine months ago that you're like you want to know what game on everything needs to change well about a year ago we started looking at where we're at where we wanted to be dreams we had want to own a home and it's like wow we can't afford any of this like what needs to change and so i'd heard of you guys a long time ago thought i was too smart to need any of that um clearly I wasn't.
So I started watching clips online. Brittany overheard me and was like, what are you watching? And then so she got hooked instantly.
Started watching every lunch at work. Oh, yeah.
Just watching in her car and going through it. So we bought the books, started reading, started budgeting.
Big thing for me, too, was just combining our incomes. Wow, yeah.
I was not about that. And she was, and finally, wait, tell me more.
We were roommates. Tell me more.
Cause that is, Ken can attest to this. That's one of the things that we get the most pushback on is, Hey, you got to combine.
What was it, Grady, that made you go, you know what? I'm wrong. I got to change this.
Tell us more. Well, just looking at the results, clearly we couldn't afford a home.
We couldn't do the things we wanted to do. So what I was doing was wrong.
What do you think about that, Brittany? Yeah. I was like, even before we started this, I was like, come on, are we going to combine or not? He's like, no.
So I've got to ask because Grady, I come from a family. I don't know if this was your case.
My parents, it was all combined. Yeah.
So that was a foreign concept to me. Honestly, until I actually joined Ramsey Solutions, we began to hear stories.
It was always foreign to me. Like, oh, really? So I'm curious, is that the way it was in your home, Grady, growing up, your mom and dad's separate finances? Or is this some kind of trust issue or some weird thing you had going on probably just i wanted to be in control and you know if it was mine it was mine and yeah yeah that sounds about right so how long into this watching videos online and all this do you decide we got to combine everything i was probably less than a month we jumped in pretty quick wow and and when you say we jumped in great i mean so i i picture when you were telling the story grady that britney's like what are you who are you talking to it was like that jake from state farm commercial you know you know what i mean it's like oh it's rachel christ oh it's jade horshaw uh how quickly did you jump on board britney as soon as you realized what he was listening and watching i was all in i was like so it.
You're like, I've been waiting for this moment. Oh, wow.
Okay. So you get addicted to the show, which it is very addicting.
You said you got the books and what else did you do? Was it FPU? Yep. We signed up for FPU like a month later, jumped right in and went to the class.
We looked forward going every Sunday. Yeah.
We were sad actually when it was over. Yeah, we were.
Wow. it was over yeah what was the hardest part of this process for you two um for me it was just i'm so used to like oh if i want it i'm gonna buy it like you know so um just like learning like patience and like okay well i can get it later this is more important and then you know I realized I was spending like over a hundred dollars on Starbucks every month I didn't need that gave myself a budget of like thirty dollars and it was like a treat so like every Friday I would get myself a coffee before work and I love that it kind of worked out so it's that intentionality of looking at what you're spending understanding delayed delayed gratification.
No doesn't mean never. It just means not today.
I love that. Yeah.
And for you, Grady, what was the hardest part? Very similar. I always thought I could just out earn stupid and that's not the case.
So it's just paying attention to what we're buying, have a plan. For me, credit cards, I love the points and all the rewards.
So getting rid of those was a little bit of a struggle. But it all makes sense in the end.
And like we talked about, combining the incomes, being intentional together. I mean, that was great beyond just our finances, our relationship, just talking about where we want to go and having goals.
I mean, it was really, really cool. Grady, I love hearing this from you because you are the target.
I target. I just want you to know, like, you're the one that we're like, beep, beep, beep, like zone in on him.
The guy who loves the credit cards, loves the points. I want to keep my money separate.
Like this is making my heart very happy right now. You're her favorite demographic, Grady.
It's very exciting. So I think we've got the answer already, but for young couples, anybody listening that's in this journey or they're kicking the tires, what would you all say is the key to getting out of debt? For us or for me, it was just start.
Like just just the momentum piece. Just jump in.
Yeah, exactly. Because if you're not going to start today, when are you going to start? That's right.
You may as well be saying. Absolutely.
Yeah. Brady, anything to add to that or is that it for you? Yeah, it was really just starting, jumping into it.
I mean, it's one of those things that we're always talking about in life, like, oh, I'll do it later. It's not perfect timing.
I mean, you just got to start and just go through it. It's not going to be perfect.
You're going to make mistakes along the way, but as long as you keep moving forward. So how does it feel? You guys, you come up here, you're moments away from the scream.
What's it like to be on the other side of this at this stage of your life? It feels really good. Stress-free.
I know she talked about, she just didn't like opening up the account and like, oh my gosh, how much do we owe? I dread making that payment. I'm like a sinking feeling when you look and you're like, oh my gosh, I have this much on my credit card or this much left on my loan.
Like, I didn't like looking at that. How old are you two? I'm 34.
I'm 36. I love it.
Oh my goodness. How are you going to celebrate? One thing to do to celebrate besides the debt-free scream.
I mean, we're here for vacation. So this is a celebration in and of itself.
And we're going on a cruise next month. Yeah, we are.
That's exciting. That's great.
Okay. That's a lot of fun.
What are you dreaming about? What's the big dream now that you're united on getting out of debt and living differently? What's the dream conversations? For me, it's a house. Yeah, definitely.
I just want to own a home. Come on.
Yeah. Come on.
And you will. You will.
What's your timeline for that? A couple years. Yeah.
All right. Very good.
What's the price range for somebody like the young couple in Portland? It's a lot. Too much.
That's what I was going to say. I was going to say, it's very expensive to get a home out there.
It is. Good for you guys.
Yeah. Oh, wow.
Who's your support group? Do you have people that walk, besides your FPU class, I'm guessing? Yeah. Who else did you have in your corner? Our family.
Our family. Yeah.
That's great. Wow.
Wow. It doesn't get any better than this right here.
You guys are amazing. I love it.
Yeah. I mean, here they are, young couple, and you guys are investing, I'm guessing now into retirement.
You're walking through all this. You're starting to walk through all the baby steps.
Yep. That's exciting.
So really, really fun. You know, you look at this couple and they are the American dream.
That's it. When it gets politicized or it gets categorized into something.
It still happens. They're going to get there.
And it's really, really fun. So fun stuff.
All right. Well, let's do this.
We've got Grady and Brittany from the Portland, Oregon area. They paid off $81,000 and some, some, some.
I forgot what you said there. Over nine months with a range of income from 185 up to 215 000 let's hear your debt-free scream three two one we're debt free wow oh yeah another young couple with nothing but freedom in front of him i know that's right It can still be done, Ken.
The dream is not dead, as you said. That's absolutely right.
Hey, if you're out there watching or listening, we want to help you. You can do it.
You deserve that freedom that having no debt has an effect on you. And it's generational, folks.
Yeah. It's generational.
I wish you could see the gigawatt smiles on that young couple over there. It feels really good.
All right. She's Jade Warshaw.
I'm Ken Coleman. You're listening to The Ramsey Show.
We'll be right back. Listen, guys, I've heard just about every excuse for why folks think they can't get ahead with money.
So let's go ahead and settle this right now. The truth is you get to decide what happens with your money.
And if you want to

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Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman.
Jade Warshaw joins me. The phone number for you to jump in, America, is 888-825-5225.
888-825-5225. All right, let's go to the phones.
Ray is joining us in Boise, Idaho. Ray, how can we help? Hey, guys.
Thanks for having me on today. A long-time listener and really enjoy your stuff.
Thank you. How can we help today? So, I have a question about partnerships.
I was listening to Jade the other day, and she had a really great call with, you know, some groups that were dealing with some partnership issues. And it's always kind of been on my mind.
So I wanted to call in and chat about it, but I, I'm a, about eight years ago, I bought into a firm for a large sum of money and got myself into four different partnerships. It's been kind of up and down with it.
There's really good days. There's some days I think my partners want to throw me in the ocean and vice versa.
But so far, I've been able to work. There are four of us.
I'm the junior partner and there's three older gentlemen. Each of us are spread out about 10 years.
Okay. But, you know, when I look, I guess, Jay, this is what I'm trying to reconcile in my mind.
You know, Dave always says that partnership's the only shift that doesn't sail. Yet, when I've looked at some of the top earning jobs, you know, that he's done in his research, you're looking at accountants, lawyers, engineers, many of those industries are organized as partnerships.
And from living it for the last eight years, I, I can see that there are some great benefits. I can see some of the downsides as well.
And so, you know, I, this last week I, I sold out of one of the first four partnerships that I bought into. I'm trying to clear my debt off working through baby step two still.
Um, and it was kind of a relief. I'm like, man, this is awesome.
And so do I need to continue with that? Should I be looking to exit the other ones and go out on my own? Or are there certain industries where this is just more of the norm where you're better off to stay in and keep going? We're a public accounting firm. Where I'm located, we do a lot of agriculture and kind of small business taxes and financial statement work for our local clients.
Well, let's compare why you chose the company of the four partnerships that you're a part of, why you chose the one you chose to exit, and how does that compare with the other three that are existing? Does that make sense? Obviously, you chose the one that you exited out of for a reason, and you felt relief after that. So then the question is, do those same problems that existed in the partnership that you exited, do those same problems exist in the other three partnerships as well? No, they don't.
The one I exited was a passive rental partnership we we owned a commercial building we were leasing it to a medical facility um my partners wanted to do a transaction in there that i think was becoming very complicated i i do work for the medical group that's in there and i didn't want to complicate my my relationship with them and got And it also had a large gain where there was some cash to be had. And so I said, look, I think this is a good business.
You guys pay, buy me out and I can go pay off my debt. But the, the other three entities are our operating entities, either buildings that we own and operate, or, you know, our main business operation, much more complicated,

but not impossible to exit at this point. I feel I have enough experience.
I could if it was

advantageous. What's your debt load? What are you trying to clear?

I have about 160,000 left. About 20 of that is on the house.
The other 140 is

mostly a building and then the original book of business that I bought. I am interested in you clearing out your debt on this, especially when it has to do with things like your home.
I don't want anything putting that at risk long term. Can I ask a quick question? Go ahead, Ken.
Just real quick, Ray. I'm following along with Jade here, but of the three other partnerships, one is accounting, the other two are real estate related.
Is that what I'm understanding? Yes, it's just us separating our real estate that we own and renting it back to the operating entity. It's the same partners, but there's different entities set up for tax reasons.
We're tax accountants. We love to be creative.
Oh, okay. I got you.
Okay. Okay.
Sorry, Jade. I just, I wanted to make sure I understood that because the question that I have here is, is if you were somehow get out of all this, do you want to go work for yourself and be a solo accountant or CPA or whatever? Or is this the type of thing, much like a law firm, where it is advantageous to have partnerships in that form? That's what I'm trying to understand.
Well, yeah, that's really my question for you on the research, and I've never really heard this dealt with on the show before. There are some advantages to working together like this.
I mean, when I have a question, you know, my partners have all been in business longer than me. So there's a lot of experience and things to lean on.
If I have to be gone for a day, it's not like my clients can't reach somebody. I would treat this like we treat, here's the way I would treat this.
You know, we have a lot of teachings on here about real estate, right? One of our teachings teachings is you don't do real estate deals unless... If it's not your primary mortgage, you don't buy real estate unless you buy it in cash.
That's a teaching we have. But plenty of times people call in here and they already have acquired rental properties and they're making money on the rental properties, even though they took out debt to get them.
And we don't immediately say, sell all your rental properties. You've done this poorly.
We say, well, if it makes sense, you're making money. And for now, this is working out for you.
You've cleared out your debt. It's not causing any issues to you.
Yes, we may have said, go about it differently, but you didn't call us then. You're calling us now, right? And so in those cases, we would say, yeah, keep your rental properties, try to clear out your debt and do that as quickly as possible, because you still have a really great asset here.
We just think maybe you went about it the wrong way. And so in your case, I'm going to treat it that same way.
You've got these three existing partnerships. If they're making money for you, if they're going to allow you to clear out this debt very quickly, if right now they're not causing a problem to problem to you for me i would keep my hands off it and keep watching it to ken's uh his vocabulary is remain vigilant on this and you know set a point to reevaluate and if if you feel like you know what i think i would gain more peace from getting out of this do so that's what you did with the other partnership and ken do you have to add? I think you said that beautifully.
The only thing I would say to what Jade is teaching here, she's right. I love kind of keep my eye on this thing.
And by the nature of what you do, your hands are in it. Your eyes are on this stuff all the time.
I think that if you feel like the partnerships that you're in right now are too complex and that is that's an emotional feeling based on your logic then I would say that's the point to start to simplify and the best way to get out of complexity is through simplicity that's right and so unwrapping those partnerships to the extent that you can uh I agree with Jade 100 on this I would let that gauge of kind of that feeling in the pit of our stomach to go, this is a little too complex and I don't think it's advantageous to me. I think it'd be better to simplify.
I think when that becomes really, really clear, I would go right with Jade's advice on that. I think that's probably the thing I'm feeling.
It's a feel thing. Does that make sense, Ray? Yeah, it does.
And I've, you know, looking back over, my firm's been in place for almost 100 years now. And so I've looked at some of the exits and stuff of our other partners.
And I guess, Jade, what I noticed with exiting the other partnership was there was just a certain piece that kind of settled in but like now i'm i'm not having to worry about this anymore and perfect you know as i as i as i get this debt paid off i see a light at the end of the tunnel and i'm like things are going to be good i think ken spoke to that that's the simplicity and i think judging from what i hear you say i think you want to make one more exit, at least one more to see if you get that same feeling, to see if that piece increases. Am I right? Yeah.
If I, if I do one, it'll have to be all three because it, it basically goes together as a unit. And, and I, you know, eight years ago I was lacking in a little bit

of experience. Now I feel like I do know how to go out and run my own off.
I think you're,

I think you're ready to do this. I do too.
It feels like you're getting there. You're convincing me.

And so that's, that's what I was waiting for. And you made that turn all on your own volition.

I think it's time for you to make this exit. And I think it's time for you to pay off your debt

and experience peace. All right.
Good call. You got this.
We're here to walk you through it. This is the Ramsey Show.
Thank you.