Dr. Mary Talley Bowden: How Vaccines Got Politicized and the Medical Industry Lost All Credibility

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PrizePix, run your game. Must be present in certain president certain states visit prize picks.com for restrictions and details so thank you for coming so i want to okay here's my question to you um you were one of the people who was right about covid and um certainly more right than the u.s public health authorities and the global public health authorities and i'm just going to summarize in two sentences what I think your position was.
So you're a physician in private practice in Texas, and you're vaccinated, by the way. No.
You were not. Oh, you're not vaccinated.
I almost did. God bless you.
But at first, you have no real reason to think that this is all completely backward. But then you treat COVID patients, thousands, I think.
And you start to realize that the therapies that the US government is recommending are not working, that the vaccines are not working as advertised at all. And you start saying something about it and offering alternatives to it, which are badly needed in the middle of this moment.
And you're attacked, really attacked. Your livelihood, your professional credentials are attacked.
And then time passes, now four years, and it becomes really clear that once again, you were more right than the U.S. public health authorities.
I think that's just demonstrable. I think the science proves that.
So here's my question after a long preamble. Have you been rewarded for it? Has the AMA given you the Physician of the Year award? No, I'm serious.
Has anybody said we were wrong in attacking you and you deserve credit for your foresight and bravery.

No, and I mean, I'm still fighting to keep my license.

I mean, I'm still fighting to keep my license. I mean, I still have the Texas Medical Board coming after me for something that happened.
Right now you're fighting? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.
Yeah. I have a hearing coming up end of April, and I was trying to save somebody's life.
It was a sheriff's deputy. This is a man that has served for 29 years trying to protect and save the public, father of six.
And he contracted COVID. And this was in the fall of 2021.
And that was the third and the largest surge of the pandemic. That's when this was following the rollout of the COVID shots.
So this was eight months following the rollout of the COVID shots, and they clearly weren't working. And this man, he got sick, he tried to get ivermectin, he couldn't find a doctor willing to prescribe it.
He ended up in the hospital. And he was, you know, went downhill, like so many people did.
And his wife, you know, the hospital was talking hospice they were giving up

they said we tried everything come on how old was this man he was late 50s early 60s not elderly no and you know he was a big guy but he had no comorbidities he had no other medical problems and so you know this is we saw this though with so many people you know day if you didn't get early treatment the second week of illness people would start really getting bad that this massive inflammatory response would kick in yes it almost always happened on day eight it was very weird it was very predictable um and you know the primary care doctors just shut their doors to these people they said oh this is just a virus we'll let it run its course and then go to the emergency room if you can't breathe so that that happened to can i ask you why would primary care physicians whose duty it is to treat patients and they must have known by this point that day eight is the critical day, why would they not treat these people? Because there's a dogma that we are taught in medical school and in our training that you don't treat a virus, that you let a virus run its course because there's this big fear about antibiotic resistance. So they don't want people over-prescribing antibiotics.
And so the assumption, if somebody comes to you with an upper respiratory tract infection in the first three, four days, five days, and they don't test positive for strep, you basically say, oh, you've got a virus, and we'll just wait and see what happens. Well, I mean, that was just catastrophic.
I mean, that was really, and I learned so much. I mean, I had that mindset prior to the pandemic.
but it just didn't sit well with me when people were coming in and really struggling to just do nothing. And so initially, I tried hydroxychloroquine.
But as soon as President Trump came out and said how great it was, the Texas State Board of Pharmacy, they literally shut it down. Like they prohibited doctors from prescribing hydroxychloroquine.
So I put it on the back burner and I just did my best. I did breathing treatments, steroids.
I did antibiotics for secondary infection. But initially I didn't really have a lot of demand for people coming in needing treatment.
I was doing a lot of testing and that sort of got me recognized in town because I had a saliva test that didn't require a swab up the nose and I was able to get the results back very quickly. You might remember initially LabCorp was the only lab in the country that had the test and they became inundated and it was taking two weeks to get the test results back.
So we had a saliva test and people could just, we could just give a cup and they could sit in their car and spit in it. And then we'd have the results back the next day.
So that sort of, that's where it all started. And then monoclonal antibodies came about and those, those worked great.
I mean, I could get as many doses i wanted i'd get them the next day i'd just contact the manufacturer say i need 200 doses to be at my bed doorstep great they worked wonderfully people turned around very quickly and but what happened is and this is during that big surge when jason jones a sheriff's deputy got sick couldn't get monococlonal antibodies, couldn't get ivermectin. When in 2001 was that? Do you remember? So the summer of 2021.
Well, so let's start in the spring of 2021. So this is following the rollout of the COVID shots.
The government is upset because people are not buying it. People are not getting, there's very low uptake,

very low interest. There's suspicion of these shots.
So in March, they started their PR campaign,

the government. They went after ivermectin.
The FDA put something on their website about

you can't use ivermectin for COVID. Biden doled out $11.5 billion to groups around the country.
Initially, it started with 275. It went up to 17,000.
Influencers, church groups, sports leagues, all sorts of people, just funneling out taxpayer money to go after doctors like myself that were spreading misinformation and to, you know, push people to get these COVID shots. So that happened in the spring.
And that's how, so Houston Methodist Hospital, and that's where I had privileges. They were the first hospital in the country to mandate the shots.
And this was April 1st, 2021 this was the exact day that biden announced covet 19 community core that that billion multi-billion dollar propaganda effort i think it was very purposeful i think the mandate started in houston for a reason i knew i think that they knew if they could get away with the mandates in texas they could get away with them anywhere where was your governor in this he was you know he he yeah republic a republican governor

yeah he was he was a little slow to act i mean he uh he was on board um with methodist in fact i have the ceo of methodist dr mark boom on camera saying that governor abbott wanted them to get a shot in every arm. That's according to the CEO of Methodist.
But he did come through eventually, but this is early on. So then that summer, started having all these breakthrough cases.
And I was seeing it because I was testing people. So I started to track people by their vaccination status.
And I saw that the vaccinated outnumbered the unvaccinated, and they were just as sick, if not sicker. So I brought this to the attention of Houston Methodist.
Were these your patients you're talking about? Mm-hmm. People that were coming to my office to get tested.
Why wasn't every doctor doing this? Well, we can get to that because, I mean, mean i'm independent so it allowed me to do things that other doctors can't do but i was actually collaborating with methodists i was sharing my data with them because i had so many i mean basically i was just all i saw was covid for a few years um and we were trying to get the data published so we had a good relationship so i reached out, hey, are you seeing what I'm seeing like these all these breakthrough cases? At the same time, I had all these people coming to me very distraught about the mandates. And, you know, because we were ahead of the time.
Right. This was before the rest of the country was mandating the shots.
But in Houston, if you were in a lot of people, Houston Methodist, they employ about 30,000 people.

Very distraught over these mandates.

And then I and then I see that they're not working.

At that time, I wasn't seeing the injuries.

And at that time, I was just very vocal against the mandates.

So I, you know, in August, late August of 2021, FDA put out the infamous horse tweet. And that's the attractive health care worker nuzzling the horse and says, seriously, y'all, you're not a horse.
You're not a cow. Stop it.
Tweet went viral. That's right.
That's when Joe Rogan got smeared for taking ivermectin. And then right after that, Biden mandated the shots and they took away monoclonal antibodies.
So it's all very orchestrated. But monoclonal antibodies, I've never heard anybody say that they weren't helpful.
Right. But if you have monoclonal antibodies available as an option, people are going to do that rather than get the shot.
So that's why, in my opinion, that's why they took away the monoclonal antibodies available as an option people are going to do that rather than get the shot so that's why in my opinion that's why they took away the monoclonal antibodies which were working they worked great i mean it was this is like the most evil thing that's ever happened in the united states yeah in my opinion definitely i'm sorry to keep interjecting it's just even though i live this it's just so stunning to hear it recounted as crisply as you are recounting it. So, okay.
So they take away monoclonal antibodies. They mandate the shot.
You're sharing your data with the hospital at which you have privileges. What are they saying? So their response was one sentence and it said, well, we think the shots are there to lessen the severity.
Well, interestingly enough, they've never shared their data, their hospital data. And being the first in the country to mandate the shots, you know they're sitting on an enormous amount of data.
And if the shots had been effective in preventing transmission or lowering the severity, then they should have shared that. They would have shared that.
They would have been, you know, screaming that from the rooftops. It fits their agenda, but they've been very quiet about that.
So, you know, I had, you know, all these things, all these patients coming to me very distraught. I had one patient come to me and tell me that her urologist at Houston Methodist called her and said, you're going to need to find a new urologist if you don't get the COVID shots.
And she had a history of bladder cancer. So she was very upset and she was calling me to try to find a new doctor.
The urologist said, I won't treat you? Well, he said that the department was talking, having discussions about not treating patients that were unvaccinated. He didn't say...
The Texas Health Department? No, this is at Houston Methodist Hospital. Oh, the Department of Urology.
Yes. That's what he told this patient.
Then... Doesn't he have a moral obligation to treat his patients yeah well we saw all sorts of uh moral issues during the pandemic i mean yeah crimes um so yeah that happened and then on the exact same day i got a notice from a surgery center where i operate that i'd have to get the COVID shot to continue operating.
And then on the same day, I got a notice from this hospital where I was trying to help the sheriff's deputy. They had a court order to give me emergency temporary privileges so that I could give him ivermectin.
The wife sued and she was, you know, last ditch effort, let a dying man try ivermectin the sheriff's deputy father of six yes um i testified she she asked me to testify i testified senator bob hall testified we won and the court was ordered to give me emergency temporary privileges and then i was to get either myself personally give the ivermectin to him or have a nurse do it because they thought it was too dangerous for one of their own members to do it. To treat a patient.
Yeah, with ivermectin, which is insane. Anyway, I got a notice that they were going to deny my privileges, even though, I mean, I've never been sued for malpractice, spotless record.
They made me get letters of recommendation. They made me submit my surgical case logs.
They just fought tooth and nail to make the whole process as difficult as they could. And the lawyers ended up having to go back to the judge and fight with them over just giving me privileges.

Whereas, you know, at that time, there was a shortage.

You know, they needed doctors to work in the hospitals.

And if I, under other circumstances, if I had just shown up and said, hey, I want to help out in the ICU,

they would have granted me privileges the same day.

There wouldn't have been any kind of letters or recommendation or, you know, surgery.

Anyway, they said they. Can I ask, were you pretty confident this man was going to die without treatment no so this is interesting so the the lawyers that were doing this case ralph uh lorigo and beth parlato they did 189 cases around the country similar situation um the the spouse is suing the hospital to try to get their loved one ivermectin in this last-ditch effort to save their lives.
Half of those people, they won the case. And in the cases where they won, all but three patients died.
In the cases where they lost, all the patients died. I mean, it's really amazing.
And apparently the judges, their political party matched the outcome of the trial. So the Republican judges were the ones that ruled in favor of the plaintiff.
And then the Democrat judges were the ones that ruled against the plaintiff. You're making my heart beat fast hearing this.
So what happened in this specific case? So, you know we there was a lot of back and forth it was very confusing it was very happening very quickly and you know his life is on the line and they basically the lawyers told me you have the green light we're going to go ahead we can go it's all good everything's cleared so i send the nurse to the hospital and she's greeted by the police and the hospital administrator and turned away and he never is allowed to get the ivermectin they appealed and were managed to get a stay on the order and then on appeal they lost so the wife luckily she was able to go in the hospital every day which was unusual most spouses didn't get to do that but that was one good thing and this was at Texas Hughley Hospital in Fort Worth so she applied ivermectin to him topically every day without the hospital knowing. The hospital tied up his feeding tube because they didn't want her sneaking anything in.
They put towels and rubber bands around it so that nothing could be snuck in. These people are evil.
Yeah. And I mean, they fought tooth and nail to keep him from just trying a very safe medication, which I believe should be over the counter.
And then they turned me into the medical board over it, and I'm still fighting those charges. The patient, he did survive, but he spent six months in the hospital.
He lost half of his body weight. He never was able to make a full recovery, and then unfortunately, he did pass away.
That's like, that's a, that's very upsetting to hear that. That's very upsetting.
And so the charges against you, boy, I thought I was done being upset by COVID. You just brought me back.
It's such a, it's such a stain on this country. It's a stain on the medical profession.
Just that people didn't storm the hospitals. Your father, your husband, your children dying alone.
Yeah. You should have showed up with guns and said, get out of my way.
It's my loved one, and I'm going to be with him when he dies. Exactly.
And so, you know, people should have done that, and I hope they will next time. Excuse me.
So, your crime is recommending a therapy for COVID. That's your crime? Or is there, am I missing something? Well, the technicality is that I didn't have hospital privileges when I sent the nurse to the hospital.
But because this was a legal dispute. But she never got in.
She never got in. And I was following the guidance of the lawyers.
So your nurse made to the threshold of a hospital, therefore you should lose your medical license? Well, I don't think they're trying to, I think they just want to fine me and... Fine you? Yeah, mark my record.
And I could have settled a long time ago. So you have something called an informal settlement conference.
It's behind closed doors. There's no witnesses or you don't really get to interact much.
And they offered to make it go away if I paid them $5,000 and took eight hours of CME and retook the continuing medical education. And then retook the jurisprudence exam.
So all doctors in Texas have to take a medical legal exam, which I've already taken and passed, but they wanted me to take it again. And I just said, no, I'm not caving to this.
And unfortunately, the latest, so it's been three and a half years. There have been multiple continuances.
They haven't been able to find an expert witness to testify against me.

The first one got sick with cancer.

The second one just, I think, just chickened out.

I don't know.

And the third one, the third witness, it turns out that the entire time, and he was the former medical director of the Texas Medical

Board, the entire time, the last 12 years, he's been working for Planned Parenthood.

So we found that out.

Wait, what?

Yeah.

Wait, what?

I'm so sorry.

Now I'm tuning in with greater intensity.

What is his job, his day job when he's not?

He's a lab director for Planned Parenthood.

What does a lab director at Planned Parenthood do? I don't know. Sell fetal tissue to vaccine companies? Yeah, probably.
Yeah. And he's on the medical board? He was the medical director of the medical board.
And he works at Planned Parenthood? Exactly, yeah. And this is not Vermont.
This is Texas. Exactly.
No, I mean, Texas is not what people think. No, I've figured that out.
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So do you think, like, take yourself out of this, this is just like a med school classmate is going through what you're going through. Do you see any other side to the argument? Any potentially legitimate justification for hounding you for four years? You know, the medical board's job is to protect the public from dangerous doctors.
I mean, it's true, though. I mean, you get a monthly bulletin and there are, you know, sex...
Like the ones who give your kids amphetamines for ADHD? Well, yeah. Or the ones who hook your wife on benzodiazepines because she has panic attacks? Those doctors? Right, right.
Well, no, I mean... No, not those doctors.
Oh, different doctors. Okay.
I mean, we get a monthly email just blasting all the crimes that doctors have done, and it's pretty bad.

I mean, it's, you know, sex offenders.

Oh, I'm not surprised even a little bit.

A lot of, you know.

So that's their role.

I don't think I'm dangerous.

I was trying to save a life.

I stepped on the toes of a hospital.

That was my crime.

A multibillion-dollar hospital, Advent Hospital.

And, you know, that's what happened with Methodist. I stepped on their toes and they just weren't going to have that.
So at any point during this, can you go to the, I mean, these are obviously huge corporations, but they're institutions whose goal is to save lives, improve lives, bring health to the population. Could you ever just call the CEO of the hospital and the medical director of the hospital and say, this is really crazy.
Like, I'm not profiting from this. Ivermectin, there's no profit margin in it, right? I just think this therapy works.
I've seen it and I'm going to try and help and why don't you back off? Yeah. Can you do that? I mean, at the time that this was going down, it was a legal battle.
i felt like well i really can't i just have to

yeah i can't step outside what the lawyers are telling me to do how much money do these hospitals take from the biden administration do you know i don't i don't know for sure but i know that houston methodist hospital has 13 billion dollars in assets that was actually a couple years ago it's probably more now.

In assets?

In assets.

So, 13 billion in assets.

And... in assets.
That was actually a couple years ago. It's probably more now.
In assets? In assets. So, $13 billion in assets.
And they have locations all over Houston. They don't pay property taxes.
They're non-profit. They don't pay property taxes? They don't pay any property taxes.
I do think we should get rid of non-profit status, period. I don I don't understand.
I've met almost no non-profit that I think is good, and that needs to be reformed.

Yeah.

We could probably close the deficit just by having these people pay the taxes that the rest of us pay.

Yeah.

Wow, that's just so shocking.

Was there any hospital in Houston where you live, I think, that was willing to be reasonable or was not taking orders? Yes, there was. Good.
Yes. So there was a Dr.
Joe Varone, who is a pulmonologist, critical care doctor. He's now the head of Independent Medical Alliance.
He and I, I would have, it was crazy. We'd have patients calling us all over the country saying, help, get me out of this hospital.
And he would accept transfers from all over the country. So people would be, you know, life flighted from ICU in Maine and taken down to Houston.
And he would care for them. And this hospital, UMMC, allowed him to use ivermectin.

And we were, there was a whole protocol that was, it's called the Math Plus Protocol and started by FLCCC, which now is Independent Medical Alliance. but it was high dose steroids it was high dose ivermectin it was high dose vitamin c

it was breathing treatment so it's all these very basic you know not dangerous things um that weren't being done uh he saved a lot of lives he worked crazy i mean i think he worked over two and a half years straight without even a break but i was fortunate to have him uh as an ally and somebody what a man good for him So you're clearly a data person. Do we have the final outcome? How did those patients do versus patients who were intubated in some Biden-controlled hospital? Well, if you look at...
There's a great website that compiles all the ivermectin data just by itself. And we have 105 studies showing the efficacy of ivermectin.
And it varied depending on the actual patient as it should. And you wouldn't always just use ivermectin.
So, in my more severe patients, I would use a combination of ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, azithromycin. During that second week, I would do higher dose steroids if necessary.
I would do breathing treatments. So it's hard to isolate saying, okay, well, it's just ivermectin.
But when you look on this compilation of studies, I mean, even in the late stages, and you were asking me about this earlier, even in the late stages, they showed that ivermectin could decrease mortality by 40%. It's most effective if you actually take it as prevention.
So people taking it twice a week do the best. And then the people that start day one or two or three, they're the next best.
So we, I mean, that's established. We know that.
Well, it depends on who you who you ask but yes there's plenty of data supporting that so why isn't that like the official cdc protocol for covid well you know it would help myself and other doctors who i mean i'm not the only doctor going through this with the medical board but if they could make it a countermeasure then it's protected under the prep act and then it makes all these issues that we're having with the medical board, but if they could make it a countermeasure, then it's protected under the PrEP Act, and then it makes all these issues that we're having with the medical boards essentially go away. Is there anybody who has counter data, numbers showing the opposite, that people taking ivermectin like die more? Well, I wouldn't say that.
They'd say it doesn't work or it's not but the studies that

that are all um establishment you know in the in the big journals they're either either they didn't give the ivermectin soon enough or they gave too low of a dose or the study was sponsored by somebody that has financial interest and seen it not work. So there are studies countering that.

But if you look at, there's just an abundance of data showing it works, and it's super safe.

So I was a little bit nervous before I started using it because of all the media that's only

for horses and that sort of thing.

So I dug into it, and I did what... Does it help horses? i know we kept hearing it was a horse dewormer is it effective yes i mean for for their parasite issues um but so i looked at the study where merc submitted to the fda it's on their website anybody can find it and you get toxicity data and there's's something called the LD50, which stands for lethal

dose 50. It's a benchmark number that's used to gauge how toxic a medication is.
So the higher the number, the lower the toxicity. And in COVID, we were using higher doses of ivermectin than what you use to treat a parasite.
So I wanted to make sure these higher doses were okay. Well, if you look at the LD50 of ivermectin, it's anywhere from 11 to 82 times what we're giving for COVID.
So we are far under that threshold. And then I did a literature search, and I tried to find accidental, intentional overdoses from ivermectin, and I couldn't find anything.
And I checked recently, and there was one study showing some issues, and it was a little bit muddy, like, was this really ivermectin and i couldn't find anything and i checked recently and there was one study uh showing some issues and it was a little bit muddy like was this really ivermectin but if you look at tylenol i mean there's thousands of papers showing toxicity from tylenol so i know someone who has you know advanced liver disease from it really wow yeah well that's the thing yeah as you know it is and thousands people die every year right yeah so um propofol used every day in hospitals. I mean, you screw that up by a tiny bit, you're dead.
Yeah. Correct? Right.
Well, yeah. Yeah.
I haven't seen it, but sure. So, Michael Jackson.
Yep. Well, that was...
Right, but I'm just saying, like, hospitals work with incredibly dangerous drugs every day. Right, right.
I'm sure you do. Yeah, yeah.
What are the side effects of it? I tell people I have a harder time with antibiotics in terms of side effects.

Like if I'm going to get a call back in my office, it's usually about an antibiotic problem, not ivermectin.

But you can get some GI issues, diarrhea, and then you can get blurry vision.

But the blurry vision goes away when you stop taking it.

And it's not like, oh, I can't read.

It's more like, oh, something's a little off. Yes.
You know. That's it and it's not like oh i can't read it's more like oh something's a little

off not you know that's it that's it so i guess what you're saying without saying it is that there's really no compelling medical reason to call the cops if your nurse shows up with ivermectin exactly so that's like purely political right how did your business get your profession get so politicized.

Yeah, it's awful.

Did you know that before all of this?

No, and I remember... That's like purely political.
Right. How did your business get your profession get so politicized?

Yeah, it's awful.

Did you know that before all of this?

No.

And I remember Methodist came after me very vocally.

And I had a press conference outside my office.

I'm not putting up with this.

And I said, politics has no business in health care. And at the time, I really believed it.
I was not political at all prior to this. Really? I shied away from politics.
I really didn't like it. And I thought it was too divisive.
And here I am. No, I think that's such a wonderful and very American, you have children.
Yeah. And that's like a sweet kind of that's that's how you should feel.
Yeah, that's how you should feel. I'm married to someone who feels that way.
I don't like people arguing like that's great. You know, we have important things to do.
Like, yeah, no, I'm not making fun of you at all. I love that.
But now I feel like there's no other choice. Right.
You just have to. You have to get to get involved.
So you were not politically aware at all before this started. And were you aware that your business, that medicine was so politicized? Had you noticed it at all? No, it's interesting.
I went and looked at the data for Texas because Texas has been infiltrated by people from all over the country. Oh, I'm aware.
Yeah, 33% population. It's going to be California.
Yeah, it is. And you look at healthcare professionals, what they donated to political parties.
And 10 years ago, they primarily donated to Republicans. And now they primarily donate to Democrats.
The whole profession has shifted. I have a theory for why, but you're the doctor, so you tell me what you think the cause of that is.
Well, I think medicine in general, I mean, the corporate practice, it's become the corporate practice of medicine. It's become centralized.
It's, you know, only 1% of doctors are not employed. I'm one of those, but not employed.

Like, so 77% of doctors are employed by a hospital. 20% are employed by private equity or an insurance company.
And 2% are employed by the government. And only 1% are like myself where.
So your choice is like your corporate douche overlords private equity or insurance companies if it's like a joke or the government and you're in the 1% that has your own business yep maybe that's the answer right there well I think it is I mean we have to doctors need to regain their power they've lost all their power and they have no power they have no power just like little worker bees getting ordered around i designed so i when i got out of residency i worked in a traditional practice and i started doing can you tell us doing what just ear nose and throat and sleep medicine and um it was small but it was it was easy and but i was always bothered by the stranglehold that the insurance companies had over my ability to treat my patients so like one easy example is an ear nose and throat doctor we do an endoscopic exam of the nose it takes about extra 10 minutes not really a big deal doesn't sound that though, for the patient. It's really not bad.
You numb it up first with spray. There's no shots.
But if I did that and I marked the code on the sheet, on the receipt, the patient might get some gigantic bill, like $400, for doing this little simple procedure, which as an ENT, it's pretty essential.

It's part of our, you know, makes us different from the primary care doctor.

We're able to look in there.

So it always stressed me out in the back of my mind, like, I'm going to do this.

And is the patient going to get some big bill?

Right.

I hated it.

So when I, you know, I took time off because I had four boys in five years.

And four boys. Yes.
And yes, it was it was chaotic. Yes.
And I wasn't sure I was going to go back. I started off, I'm just going to take a year off.
And that led to seven years off. I wasn't sure I was even going to go back to medicine.
But as I got older, I just kept nagging at me. So I decided to go back.
But I said I was going to do it on my own terms. So I call myself third party free.
I don't contract with insurance companies. I don't contract with hospitals.
And I don't contract with the government. And the only people I work for are my patients.
And it was... So they just like give you a credit card when they come in.
That's it. Yes.
And they can file a receipt. They can file a claim to their insurance company.
And it's very transparent. Everybody knows how much

everything costs. And it's actually, there's so many people that have very high deductible

insurance now that they're basically cash patients unless something catastrophic happens.

And if you go to a traditional doctor's practice, half the time, they don't even know what to charge you for a cash patient because they're just so entrenched with the insurance industry. But there is a growing movement of doctors like myself.
And I'm a specialist, so it's a little unusual, but there's something called direct primary care. And direct primary care is like affordable concierge care.
So you're paying cash, but the cost is typical like a gym membership. So it's not super high.
You get a lot more access to your doctor, you got a lot more time, probably more quality, they're not always like minded in terms of COVID. And to me, that's a litmus test for your doctor.
But it's a it's a better way of doing it, you get much more access, higher quality care, more time. And save your insurance for the catastrophic care.
That's what we do for our cars. And use your HSA, so health savings account, if you can get one of those.
And the government could expand those and make those more available for people, because right now it's sort of limited based on your employer but if you can pay out of pocket for your basics then you are likely to have a better experience i think it's in but it also frees the doctor to think independently right and to think on behalf of patients why didn't you get the COVID shot I almost got it

I and to think on behalf of patients.

Why didn't you get the COVID shot?

I almost got it.

In my mind, I thought,

okay, this thing, I don't think it's going to work,

but I didn't think it was going to hurt people.

I just thought, I just don't think it's going to work.

Why? Why did you think that?

Because I trusted, I trusted,

yeah, I really had never given the FDA, CDC, HHS a thought. I really hadn't, they weren't on my radar.
I just sort of assumed that everything was fine. Well, but because you assumed that, it's interesting that you didn't think the shot would work.
Right. Well, it's just because of the speed.
I thought, well, how are they going to get this together so quickly that it's going to work? I also I looked at the study and I looked at how they conducted the study and I didn't like how they did that. So the people, the test subjects were not routinely tested.
They were just tested that the doctor felt like they needed to be tested, which seemed a little too muddy to me. So that I had a hesitation on that regard too.
And then I showed up, but you know, I had this looming deadline because I had privileges that he used to me. So that I had a hesitation on that regard, too.
And then I showed up, but, you know, I had this looming deadline because I had privileges at Houston Methodist, and you had to sign an attestation. And the attestation said that you either got the shot or you intended to get the shot.
So I just woke up on a Saturday morning. I'm like, I'll just do it.
Let's just get it over with. to the uh a grocery store and i stood in line where everybody should get their medical care right um yeah right uh stood in line and the line was long and i got impatient and i was like i'm gonna leave i'll come back another time and i never came back thank you why why't I go back? Yeah.
I mean, that's just, it's a big deal. You've got privileges at this hospital.
You know, you treat patients, but this is part of your business. You're getting paid.
And you're a doctor. So you kind of have to get the shot.
Like, we're all on board. Everyone's doing this.
And they really were mad at doctors who didn't take it because that's, and nurses, because that's such a statement. Well, I mean, here's how I justified it in my mind.
I never stepped foot in that hospital. I had privileges there just as a emergency situation.
So it wasn't like, OK, let's say I got covid because I didn't get the shot. And then I'm going around the hospital infecting everybody.
I wasn't in the hospital. I also knew that early treatment worked.
So I knew that, you know, this shot was not necessary because I was seeing it first time. I know, but there's so much pressure on everybody, particularly on physicians at that point to do it.
If you don't do it, it's a big hassle. You knew that.
It was gonna be a hassle. And so just like, I don't know, the tide is moving really briskly in one direction and you decide to swim against it that's more than just like a casual decision that's a serious decision and i'm just trying to get to the heart of why you made it because you're clearly a thoughtful person doesn't like do rant you're a doctor you like you don't just do random things one day it's like what was it was think it was more, yeah, instinct.
And everything was so busy during that time. I mean, I couldn't think straight.
I mean, we were, it was just slammed. And I just remember thinking, oh, I'm just going to go get this over with and just knock this off my list.
And then when it didn't happen, I thought, well, this is a sign. I'm not going back.
So it may just be instinct. Or providence.
Providence. Okay.
So, I mean, that decision changed your life, of course, because it puts you on the other side from everyone else. Yeah.
How did your patients do with COVID?

Everybody.

So I used to give out my cell phone to everybody, especially the sick ones.

Everybody that got early treatment survived.

I even had some really, really sick people come in in the second, third week.

So second, third week is when the inflammatory cascades set in and people get really sick. I had a man come in with an oxygen saturation in the 60s.
And he was not a healthy guy. He'd had a history of a heart attack.
He had a history of throat cancer. He was a veteran.
And he basically said, I'm not going to the hospital. Because normally, if somebody walked in my office like that, I'd call the ambulance and say, hey.
But I had to allow him to potentially die in my office, which was very scary.

And I had a handful of people like this.

He wasn't the only.

So he sounds like he's on the brink.

Yeah.

No, he was bad.

But I had nurses that could do IVs.

So we gave him high-dose steroids in the IV.

We gave him antibiotics, breathing treatments, high-dose IV vitamin C. We gave We gave him high dose ivermectin.
And we brought him in every day as an outpatient because I didn't have a hospital bed in my office. And he survived.
And I had a lot like that. So it was very gratifying.
I learned a lot. I mean, I learned that just because somebody's oxygen saturation is low, they don't need to be immediately put on a ventilator, which is the dogma that we came into the pandemic with.
But I think that dogma has changed, or at least I'm not in medicine, of course, but for normal people, there is a sense that like, stay away from ventilators. I think that's a fair feeling.
Yeah. I mean, I can see why doctors did it.
Because if somebody's struggling to breathe, That's a fair feeling i yeah i mean i can see why doctors did it of course i get it yeah because you know if somebody's struggling to breathe that's a really scary um distressful feeling for a patient yes when you can't get enough oxygen it's horrible um so i can understand but i guess what i don't understand is why they didn't do more to keep them off the ventilator it's bizarre to me i mean they gave, they gave them steroids, but they gave them very small doses of steroids. I mean, why didn't they just throw the kitchen sink at these people? And they just got stuck in these protocols and just basically allowed people to die.
I was in a restaurant the other night, in fact, this weekend, and I had a little trouble hearing what people were saying. And I thought to myself, I'm a little young to go deaf.
Why? Well, because I grew up shooting, bird hunting, target shooting. And I remember my father saying, just stick a Marlboro filter in your opposite ear and you'll be fine.
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Canik, superior firearms. So you said you didn't want to go to the hospital.
I live in a, world like we all do but i don't know anybody who in my world who wants to go to the hospital i know a lot of people who have resolved i'm never going to the hospital and they really you know i've seen it very sick people i'm not going um what do you think of that attitude yeah i was i realized i've been in the hospital seven times and i know well childbirth as a physician oh well as a patient as a patient and one of them i was really sick i mean i had pneumonia and sepsis and i'm very grateful to the people who helped me um and this is from the flu and i had gotten a flu shot by the way um but now like you said i mean everybody is terrified to go to the hospital i mean the hospital used to be the place you go of course the safe place that's where you go exactly and now people are terrified to go to the hospital and so you know our current administration needs if they don't do anything that that's a big problem because um the trust has just been destroyed do you see that with your patients? Oh, yeah. That's the most common question I get is where should I go if I need to go to the hospital? And I don't have a great answer for them.
You know, your best bet is just keep yourself healthy. I mean, the biggest thing people can do is keep themselves healthy, manage your diet, manage your stress, get enough sleep, exercise,

get enough sun, and just stay out of the hospital.

But keeping your weight under control is probably number one.

Is it really?

Mm-hmm.

Why?

Because you gain weight, you're more susceptible to infection,

you're more susceptible to heart disease. You're more susceptible to cancer.

And those are the big three.

And you have to buy new clothes, which is unacceptable.

Yeah.

You don't want to buy new clothes.

Right.

Well, but, you know, if you lose weight, you have to put, I've, so I did carnivore for six months.

And I had to buy a whole new wardrobe.

I'm speaking as a man.

You can't buy new clothes.

You can't? No. Why? Not a lot.
It's against the speaking as a man. You can't buy new clothes.
You can't?

No.

Why?

It's against the rules.

Oh, oh.

Can't buy new clothes.

That's what keeps me in line.

Just, sorry.

Really, it worked that well?

I weigh now when I weighed in high school.

I never thought I'd get to that point.

I did it for six months.

And, you know, it's not for everybody.

But I will say it's a lot safer than ozempic and mangiorno and it's very simple i mean you you basically eliminate all carbohydrates from your diet you just eat meat and fat cheese yeah and you snack on bacon i mean it's crazy and you're like shedding pounds. It's boring, but it's simple.

You don't count calories.

You don't get hungry.

I mean, you do go through the sugar withdrawal.

Sugar is very addictive.

You think?

So, but.

What do you think of fasting?

Yeah, I tried the intermittent fasting.

It did not work for me.

I've heard that for women, it's not as effective.

I worry that it slows down metabolism. But, you know, I have never tried it.
And I know people swear by it. So you don't have a good answer on the hospital question, I noticed.
Oh, how to fix that? No, like what do you do if you get sick? Your answer was don't get sick. Well, if you have to go to the hospital be prepared have somebody with you um have your uh there is a patient bill of rights you have rights in the hospital make sure you know those i haven't noticed them yeah they don't they don't advertise them why do doctors patronize patients oh yeah so that that's a bit and it's what is that treating them like children well when i started, 23 years ago, patients didn't have a lot of access to information, not like they have now.
So we were in charge. We were definitely in charge because we had the information and patients really, unless they had textbooks, they didn't have it because we didn't have online information.
And now, I mean, patients are well informed. And so every conversation I have with a patient, I know that they have been researching and they have a lot of information at their disposal.
And I think a lot of doctors don't like that. I embrace it because, I mean, I learn from my patients.
And if a patient finds something, I will dig into it because I don't have time to dig into all of everything. Right.
And you see weird things and I like it. But I think the doctors don't like that.
It's a power thing. And I mean, it can be frustrating on the flip side.
If you feel like you really know what's going on and you're challenged by something somebody's read on the Internet, that can be frustrating.

But it's the doctors just don't.

It's it's a power thing and an ego thing.

Mostly.

That was my suspicion.

So what did you end up thinking of the shot?

The COVID shot?

It's horrible. It needs to be pulled off the market.
It should have been pulled off the market a long time ago. I looked at my patients in the two years following the rollout of the COVID shots, and 7% of my new patients were coming to see me for severe injuries.
I've never seen anything like it with any other product on the market. If this were an antibiotic and you were seeing all these side effects, it would have been yanked off a long time ago.
Normally, the FDA will put a black box warning on a medication if there have been five deaths. They will pull it off the market if there have been 50.
Well, according to VAERS, which VAERS is Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System, and it's vastly underreported, which I have seen firsthand. But it's been in place for 50 years or something.
I mean, it's longitudinal. So we can see the response to all these different medications, right? According to VAERS, there have been 38,000 deaths from these COVID shots.
So under normal circumstances, the FDA would have pulled it. But instead, they've doubled down.
They've put the shots on the childhood vaccine schedule. All babies are expected to get three COVID shots by the time they're nine months old.
The shots are still under EUA status for this age group. So under 12, they're not even fully approved by the FDA.
And yet they're on the vaccine schedule. And according to the CDC, 9 million American children have gotten the latest version of these COVID shots.
Actually? Yes. Yes.
Still? Yes. Yes.
9 million. 12%.
The concern I have with these kids. So we know myocarditis.
Wait, This is going on right now. Yes.
I think we voted against this. Yeah.
Correct. I don't know.
You're very diplomatic. But I'm just stunned to learn that that's happening right now.
Yeah. Could this be shut down? It should have been shut down a long time ago.

And, you know, what's... Nine million babies have had COVID shots?

Yeah, well, children.

Children?

Minors.

Is it compulsory?

It's still compulsory in some states, yes.

In some businesses, not in Texas.

So Texas actually passed a law outlawing mandates for COVID shots.

But I actually reached out to people on Twitter yesterday, and they said, all these people say, yeah, it's still requiring the shots for jobs or a nursing program or even transplants.

So we're going to let you die unless you get the shot. How could we fix that? Well, the shots need to be pulled off the market immediately.
Who could do that? Who could do that? The FDA. So Marty Macari, he could do that.

And then we need accountability.

I mean, we need,

we can't sweep this under the rug

because we will never restore that trust.

And that's the key thing is if nothing happens,

it's just a festering wound

and the trust will never come back. Are there any indications that this is coming soon? I mean, I'm not privy to conversations in the government.
I think you probably follow this as closely as anybody. There's so much going on.
So I'm going to just plead ignorance on that basis. There's like a lot.
Yeah. Multiple wars and the economy and, you know, there's just a lot to distract you from this question.
but I think it's a really important question, but you are focused on it. Have you seen any sign at all that these products, which according to the self-reporting system, VAERS, have killed 38,000 people, that they're going to be pulled off the market? I have not.
I mean, it seems to me that HHS, their focus now has shifted, or I don't know, their focus is on food and food quality and improving that.

And I haven't heard a word about COVID or the COVID shots.

Really?

Not, I mean, maybe I've missed something, but that's, I mean, I'm just reading what you're reading I mean I don't food is like smoking and I love bad food and I love smoking I don't smoke anymore but I I loved it and I'll just say that and I don't hate me for it but it's just true that's why people do it because they love it and I love pizza I don't think I ever smoked a cigarette I don't think I've ever eaten a slice of pizza without knowing it was bad for me. Yeah, exactly.
It's common sense. It is common sense.
I mean, I do think, like, we shouldn't allow food stamps or Snap to be used for Coca-Cola. Okay, obviously, there are changes you can make for sure.
But, like, you know when you're eating garbage. That's why we call it garbage.
I 55 they called it that in 1975 they'd be like oh you're junk food

you know what junk food

is right it's the delicious stuff

so like I'm

not I mean I think it's important I

do think eating right

is important and I try

not gonna eat any freaking

vegetables though but whatever

but like

the COVID stuff seemed

the shot seems like

an imminent threat

Thank you. vegetables though but whatever but like the covid stuff seemed the the vat the shot seems like it an imminent threat yes and my concern giving it to babies because myocarditis you you're positive that's actually happening babies are getting this oh yeah oh yeah definitely you can find it on the cdc i trust you it's freaking me didn't know that.
Yeah, that's why we can't let this just go away. Babies.
So myocarditis. We know there's an increased risk of myocarditis in teenage boys who take these shots.
We don't know what that risk is for nonverbal babies because the symptom is chest pain. So a baby, the baby could be getting myocarditis and we have no idea.
Myocarditis can leave a scar on the heart. And then years later, the heart is permanently.
Right. You're playing lacrosse and you drop.
Right. And that's my big concern.
These babies could be getting myocarditis, and we have no idea.

Do you believe that those shots are responsible for permanent immune system damage? I think, well, what I have been looking at is spike protein antibody levels. So when you get a vaccine, you can, traditionally we call them titers.
So like people who get hepatitis B vaccine, you can look at the titers, the antibody levels, and see if you have protection. We do that in the hospital a lot.
So they want to make sure if you work in the hospital, if you get stuck by a needle, you're not going to get hepatitis B. So I've started looking at these spike protein antibody levels.
And it's alarming because the people, I can tell immediately if somebody had the shot and in the vaccinated these antibody levels are I did an average um last night 13,000 and the unvaccinated average is a thousand so there's huge discrepancy and this is years after the shot yeah years after and these people most of these people have gotten two maybe. Nobody's gotten more than that.
And none of these people have been sick recently with COVID. So it's very alarming to me.
It suggests, I mean, we don't know, but it suggests that spike protein is still active and still replicating possibly in the body. I mean, the mRNA in these shots is not mRNA.
It's a synthetic mRNA. And it was made to avoid degradation.
So, it's made to stay in the body. That was the purpose of it, of modifying it.
So, when I see these levels like this, it really concerns me that we have an issue with this ongoing spike protein in the body. What are the consequences of that, do you think? Well, I think cancer is a big concern.
I think immune dysfunction. How would that affect cancer? Well, the spike protein is oncogenic.
Shun Sheen talked about that. So viruses can be oncogenic.
Your Shunshin talked about that. So viruses can be oncogenic.
It appears that the spike protein, the mRNA shots have SV40 in it, which is an oncogenic virus. There's something called frame shifting.
So when the mRNA is integrating, that it can produce new proteins just by little mistakes that happen. So these new proteins, we don't know what they are, but they could cause autoimmune disease and possibly cancer as well.
There's just a lot unknowns. I mean, we need a test to detect spike protein.
All we have now is antibody test. We really need a lot more.
We need an antidote. We need I mean, I am struggling because I have all these injured people and I usually start with ivermectin and ivermectin helps.
It binds a spike protein and it's anti inflammatory. But we're really limited and we need a a solution so we need the NIH to really dig into this and help these injured patients because they they're very challenging and you know we're sort of just you know experimenting because we don't know and they're not helping I would say I mean I get you know I've tried a lot of things and the thing that works the best is ivermectin.
But it's slow going. It's, you know, I usually put people on for a long period of time before saying, OK, this is not going to work.
And it's just hard because we, you know, there's just not we need the NIH to step up and help us. Time for another true life Alp story.
I got a call from a friend of mine yesterday, honestly, true story, who said his girlfriend had just broken up with him over Alp. He wouldn't stop.
And I thought to myself, that's kind of sad. And he said, no, it's not sad.
Imagine if I'd married her. Now I know I was saved.
Then the next day, this same friend is driving at twice the speed limit through a major American city, pulled over by a cop in a speed trap. Cop takes his license registration, goes back to the patrol car, runs him, comes back, looks in the window, and sees a tin of ALP on the dashboard.
Pauses. Stunned.
Says to my friend, you use ALP? Yeah, I do. Says my friend.
So do I, says the cop. We all do.
He looks at my friend thoughtfully and goes, drive safely, sir, and hands back his license and registration. No ticket.
So in two days, he's saved from a tragic marriage to a girl who doesn't like Alp and a speeding ticket. All true.
It's more than a nicotine marriage. In an age of 350 million people, we're guessing there are about 350 million Alp stories.
Email us yours. We want to know and read it on the air.
Email tellall at alppouch.com. Tellall at alppouch.com.
Give us your Alp story. I've got to say, almost everyone on our team looks suspiciously well-rested every morning.
It turns out most of them are using a product called Sambrosa. Sambrosa blends antihistamine with a syrup of herbs and honey, and is designed to help you sleep well, waking up, feeling refreshed and revitalized.
And based on the sunny, cheerful faces of the people I work with, it works. It's inexpensive.
It's less than 50 cents a night. And we know the people who own the company and they are great people.
They are faithful people and they are about the happiest family we've ever run across. The product Sambrosa has a ton of five-star reviews.
You can check it out on their website, sambrosa.com. So one of the primary platforms we use for distribution is YouTube, which in general has been great, actually, if I'm being honest.
A lot less censorship than I got at any television job I ever had. So we're really grateful to YouTube.
I never thought I'd say that. But the one area where we get censored by YouTube is when we talk about the COVID shot, which I think is really interesting.
So this will probably be censored on youtube but i just want to i just want to ask you but you're a physician clinical physician you're treating people thousands of people um and so i i feel like i have to ask you this tell us about the injuries you are seeing so i don't get the the sudden you know collapse uh myocarditis stroke sort of situation because i'm outpatient soccer players right i see i see the um yeah it's it varies but uh i've seen some very strange rashes that don't go away with steroids and antihistamines and have actually like rashes like bumpy red splotchy i mean i had this poor kid 15 years old it was all all over his face all over his body and he responded so well to ivermectin that was a great case um so are you sure that was vax related yeah it came on right i mean he had no prior history came on 15 he's 15 it came on right after the covet shots um the i see pots so pots is uh when the blood pressure drops suddenly or goes up real high suddenly for no clear trigger and your pulse may uh be erratic as well that's been a big thing with the coveted patients that's difficult to to fix I've seen a lot of neurological can I ask what does POT stand for postural orthostatic hyper or temporal hypertension postural orthostatic syncope I don't understand a single word of that I probably shouldn't have asked you but like what are its effects? So you feel faint. So you may just be standing there and your blood pressure drops or your pulse goes up way high and you feel like you're having a panic attack, that sort of thing.
So it's symptomatic changes in your blood pressure that occur without any kind of trigger. What? I mean, that sounds like it could be dangerous.
Yeah, yeah.'s very and it's very hard to treat so i see a lot of that i've seen neurological um tremors um oh come on oh yeah yeah no no tremors i saw a patient a little bit older than me ceo of a company he came in and he gave me his business card and he said hi i'm this so-and-so and he gave me his other card and he go and this is the biggest mistake i've ever made in my life he gave me his vaccine card um very difficult to i mean we've gotten a little bit of improvement but just you know in a lot of fatigue hand tremors whole body his whole body no way yeah even when sleeps? That's got to affect every part of your life a lot of these patients say they feel a lot of burning like pins and needles when they sleep um which is typical with neuropathy um so it sounds like a life destroyer no yeah it's it's bad and they don't, it's not like giving them an antibiotic and a week later they're better. These are chronic conditions.
And the government's not helping. So, you know, Breon Dressen of REACT-19, I don't know if she, so REACT-19 is an organization started to help the injured with the COVID shots.
The head of that organization was involved in the astrazeneca trial so she was a she volunteered to be a guinea pig and she got

injured government just came out and said they're not going to help her they're not going to give

her any kind of financial reimbursement when no maybe a week or two ago

i don't understand.

Like, we didn't vote for this at all.

Right.

I mean, the government, well, in her case, she was part of the clinical trials, you said.

Right.

But everybody else, not including me and you, took it because we were, you know, subject of like the biggest propaganda campaign in American history.. So we were forced by the government to take it.
By the way, why aren't the companies paying these people? Companies have no liability risk with these products. And the PREP Act even further protects them.
When was the PREP Act passed? It does not expire until 2029. And so under the PREP Act, they're even more shielded? Anything that's designated as a countermeasure is protected.
So anything that happens in the hospitals, anything that happens from these shots, it's all protected from liability. There is one really monumental lawsuit going on that could change that.
Brooke Jackson is a whistleblower for Pfizer, and she was involved in the research. So she was at the clinical trial sites.
She was the manager and she was seeing all sorts of issues with the way they were conducting the trial. And she brought that to the company's attention.
She brought that to the FDA's attention and she was fired. So she has been in this gigantic legal battle against Pfizer for a long time now.
I think we're going're going on four years and unfortunately and this was during biden the doj stepped in and and basically said no you can't sue pfizer it's crazy you can't sue pfizer oh of course you can't sue pfizer the doj stuck up for pfizer which is not usually how that works. I'm surprised they didn't arrest her for complaining.
Exactly. This has got to be making you pretty radical.
It doesn't seem very radical to me. Seems like common sense.
Yeah. You don't seem like a radical person, but this makes me feel radical.
So neurological symptoms, and you're pretty convinced those are also from the shot well you look at okay what was their past history do they have any issues were they otherwise healthy and then when did these things start happening and we the timeline and then the other thing is they typically go to other doctors and they get the million dollar work up and they can't find anything to explain it and the doctors are baffled they put them on psychiatric medications not really oh yeah I saw one patient on a sleeping pill a benzodiazepine and an antidepressant SSRI why do we have so many mass shooters in this country I don't know it's baffling um that's shocking so they used to i mean is in just american culture they used to make fun of 19th century medical cures for hysteria you know it was always like you know the victorian medical cures and one would have a problem they'd be like here's a giant vibrator or you know what I mean? Like, literally they made that. Like, it's all in your head, honey.
Calm down. And that was like a trope.
And I was hardly a feminist, but I was kind of sympathetic to that. Like, don't just dismiss people.
You know what I mean? Tell them they're hysterical. But that's what you're you're describing yes they don't get reported to VAERS i've had to report every single patient that came to my to see me for an injury i was the one even though they'd seen multiple other doctors it was me that had to report it to VAERS so i know it's underreported VAERS is one of those things um i love the idea of VAERS, and I remember reading the VAERS report in 2021 when I worked in television and just going on one night and reading it, like, here's what's been reported from this compound that people are being forced to take.
And man, I got so attacked by the Atlantic magazine and everybody. and everybody it's like no this is a federal reporting system right and that was kind of the last i ever heard of airs like no one ever mentions it like what's the what's the point of having it if it's like irrelevant yeah it's not subtle if you look on there you know you don't have to have a degree in statistics to understand what's going on i mean it's like nothing's nothing's happening and then whoosh, you know, just it's not subtle.
It was in place during the rollout of a bunch of other vaccines. Right.
Like going a long way back. So it's like, you know, measles, rubella, COVID.
Exactly. Right.
I don't have any degree and I could understand that. So do you ever hear federal officials make reference to VAERS?

Not to my knowledge.

I mean, I could have missed that, but no.

So the idea of VAERS seems to be that people are complaining again, they need to shut up?

Apparently.

It's one more thing that's being swept under the rug.

Okay.

So you've told a much sadder story than i expected to hear um are you concerned that because the technology in these shots was you know brand new never deployed before at scale anyway is that correct right um and the you know the trials for these drugs were like i think we can say it's fair to say a joke right uh that there are consequences that like haven't manifest yet yeah it's it's hard to get up-to-date cancer numbers but i'm hearing all sorts why is it hard to get up-to-date cancer numbers? That's a good question. We're in the middle of a cancer moonshot, doctor.

Right, right.

There's probably people that have access to that data, but publicly it's hard.

And, you know, so I have to rely.

I don't see a ton of cancer in my practice, but I do have friends at MD Anderson, and they said they've never seen anything like it.

The young people coming in with very advanced tumors, I think that's what we have to be worried about now. Can I ask, you've made reference like five times to numbers and the difficulty in getting numbers.
I don't understand why, I mean, I understand why the identity of patients is shielded by federal law. That seems reasonable to me for privacy reasons.
But, you know, just the fact that someone has this or that disease with no identifying markers connected, like that seems like it should be public information. How is that not? Why is there so much secrecy around medical data? Yeah.
The data itself. It could be, there could be an agenda behind it.
It could just be a total inefficiency of the bureaucracy it's hard to say but uh yeah it'd be nice if we could have more data well isn't that essential to science yeah it is um but you know it's it's also i guess it it's complicated in some degrees to get it all out there.

But, yeah, transparency would be, even aside from the cancer numbers, I mean, like I said, with COVID,

there are all these hospitals that had so much data at their disposal and didn't share it.

It'd be nice to see, you know, Houston Methodist come out and share their data with us. They were the first.
They led the way with the mandates. It'd be nice to see how successful that effort was for their employees and for their patients.
Can a lawsuit force that? I actually sued them to get that data. Man, you are ferocious.
I lost. On what grounds? I don't know.
It was just political grounds, I think. I sued to get their financial data, because as a nonprofit, they are supposed to give it to you if somebody from the public wants to know.
This is what they get in exchange for not paying property taxes. Right, right, right, right.
But there was some technicality. I don't understand really why we lost, but we did.
We even appealed and we lost on appeal. Do you think that COVID, clearly there's been no reckoning.
You've not been recognized for your bravery and prescience. You called it and you should be rewarded for that.
You haven't been, likely never will be. So there's so much about it.
The shots are still being given to babies. That's my takeaway from this conversation.
There's no effort to pull this stuff from the market 38,000 deaths later.

There's no recourse.

The average person has,

you can't afford to hire lawyers and you can't sue the companies that make these products and you can't sue the government officials that forced you to

take these products.

Like everything about it is just pure Orwell.

So that's the downside.

And it's,

it's like crushing actually to hear all of this from you.

Didn't expect to hear this. What are the upsides? Like, people are more aware.
Do you see medicine in the United States getting better now that people are paying attention know what's up? I think I think people are feeling more empowered, which is how they should be. I mean, they're not listening to the government for their health care decisions anymore.

I think people have learned from that mistake. And, you know, I haven't lost all hope.
I'm grateful. You know, there was a time where I couldn't even, I was banned from Twitter.
I don't know if you were, but, you know, we are, free speech is coming back. I wouldn't.
I mean,

they couldn't ban me from Twitter,

so they didn't. Yeah, yeah.
But they could ban

much more informed,

plus, how am I a threat? I'm just some

random talk show host with an opinion.

The people they want to ban

are the people who are telling the

informed truth,

the physicians who are treating thousands of COVID patients. Like, you're the threat, not me.
We're like, I'm a doctor. I'm a reasonable person.
I'm not political. Here's what I'm learning.
They have to ban you. Right, right.
Well, and, you know, we're making, hey, I'm grateful to you for having me on here because this is old news to most people, right? And, you know, we just need to keep speaking out. We just need to keep, I mean, my foot is on the pedal, you know, even though there is no pandemic anymore, but we must just keep pounding away at this.
Well, it sounds like indications suggest, I mean, I don't want to overstate anything, but it feels like the consequences are still rippling. And I don't know why there's not an organized effort to find out, you know, are cancer rates spiking? We eliminated cigarette smoking, which was supposedly the main driver of cancer.
I was there for all that. They beat me into quitting, which is fine.
You know, smoking's bad. I got it.
But, like, up. So like at some point I have to say, stop.
You told me this, the opposite happened. Let's talk about why.
Right. I'm not attacking you, but like I demand an answer.
And I don't know why, how hard is that to get some statistician at NIH or wherever, HHS, to tell me what's happening with cancer rates and pediatric

cancer rates especially, because that's like crazy town.

I think, yeah, the money is there for the treatment, not for the cause, right?

So it is, yeah, there's lots of money.

It's just going towards...

Well, that doesn't make any sense.

Like, how can you recommend treatment without knowing its effect?

How can you... You can't make any wise decision without all the facts, as we say.
Right? Right. But this is financially driven.
So if you're in it to make money, you're going to go after the treatment, not the cause. You're very cynical about medical care.
I've seen a a lot would you have gone into this if you had known yeah i mean i'm sorry not to get you to re-evaluate your life it's been very difficult but it's been impactful and um i i'm you know in some ways i'm glad it happened. It's been very educational.
And, you know, I have hope that it will change. It may take another generation.
But COVID should be the wake-up call. And the seeds were there before COVID.
But COVID brought it all out there. And hopefully, you know, we could actually learn from it and change course.
You said you got a flu shot and then you went up in the hospital with pneumonia and sepsis. I'm certain not to laugh at your illness, but you got a flu shot.
I've never had a flu shot because I'm lazy, but you clearly believe, you know, you wouldn't have got it. You're a doctor.
You wouldn't have got it unless you thought it was efficacious.

Right.

So you got one. Has what you've seen over the past five years changed your view of other vaccine courses? Yeah, I mean, what I've realized is I made a lot of assumptions about vaccines.

It was, you know, the gospel according to vaccines.

When I was in training. There was no questioning it.
It was just accepted fact. They were safe and effective.
And COVID made me realize, well, hold on. Let's see how they were tested.
And they have not been tested like other products on the market. So, they don't have placebo-controlled trials.
Any of them? No, not like the other products on the market. And they don't have placebo controlled trials.
Any of them? No,

not like the other products on the market. And they don't have liability protection.
So the companies are not motivated. They don't have liability exposure.
Yeah, sorry. Yes.
So the companies are not motivated. There's no repercussion if something goes wrong.
And there's no reason for it to spend a lot of money to ensure that it's safe. So now, you know, I have questions about all of them.
Now, I will say I'm not seeing the carnage from, you know, flu shot that I've seen with the COVID shot. I think there's a different degree of danger there.
But it does make me question it all. And if you look at the flu shot, in fact, has never been shown to decrease hospitalization or death in people that get the flu shot.
And it actually makes you more susceptible to other viruses. And you can treat it.
I had a child who was badly injured by the flu vaccine. Oh, wow.
And for me, that was one of the drivers in not, I mean, I had, when it happened, it was almost 20 years ago. I had no idea that vaccines, I never thought the vaccines could hurt anybody.
Right. Never even heard my mind.
I thought they were like one of the great miracles of science. I was so proud that we developed the polio vaccine, which I'm not against, but I didn't know that they had potential downsides.
And that's one of the reasons I was like a little slow to want to, but anyway, what would you do? So it sounds like you're not like against vaccines, but you, from what you just said, the system around vaccines does not put patient safety at the forefront of concern. Right.
So how would you change that? Well, remove their liability protection. Do you have liability protection? Do I? Yeah.
No, no, I don't actually. I don't either.
You know, we need that. Yeah, yeah, it'd be nice.
It'd be awesome. You just can't actually.
I don't either.

You know, we need that.

Yeah, yeah, it'd be nice.

It'd be awesome.

You just can't sue me.

I'm such a good person.

What I do is so important to the common wheel that you literally can't sue me.

Exactly.

That would be great.

Sorry, excuse me.

Yeah, so, I mean, just make them go through the process any other product has to go through. It's not very complicated.
So that's the first thing you do. Yeah.
Why isn't that happening? Apparently, it was in 1986 when Reagan put the act in place. I guess there were two companies that almost got just decimated financially because of all the kickback, the lawsuits.
That should have been a warning sign. Yeah, I mean, I obviously hate lawyers.
I've never sued anybody. I don't think I ever will.
I really hate lawyers quite as much as doctors, but in that range. Okay.
So I'm lawsuits too i get it i totally get it some of

the tort awards are insane and all of that stuff but i also think it's fair if someone keeps getting sued for the same thing like if i get a sexual harassment suit for political reasons if i get eight of them right like maybe i'm groping people, right? Right. Yeah.
That's fair? Yeah, that's fair. As an empiricist, you agree with that? Yes, I am on board with that.
So last question, what are you going to do now that this is all over? Like, how are you, other than treating patients, how are you as a formerly politically disengaged person spending your time? I try to get away from it all as much as I can. And that's what I would advise anybody is just find something, a hobby that gets you away from things and get outside as much as you can.
I probably, you know, my I'm probably going to slow down my practice a little bit just to give myself some breathing room.

And I still have four boys in high school. So, but I will continue to speak out.
And I may do a podcast. I may, I don't know.
I don't know what I'm going to do. But the fight's not over.
Thank you, doctor. I really appreciate it.
That was great.

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