157. Dr. Jessica Peatross: Detoxing From Environmental Mold, Lyme Disease, and Parasites

Speaker 1 I started out as a conventional medical doctor. Eventually, there started to be cracks in the system.
Why am I discharging people on 40 different medications?

Speaker 1 And they said, Listen, if you don't stop doing this, you can't work for us.

Speaker 2 You can't take somebody who's in a toxic environment and then just overload them with every supplement, vitamin, and mineral, and amino acid.

Speaker 2 Now you're just overloading a body that doesn't process it anyway. They just get on the hamster wheel of medicine and never find a solution.

Speaker 1 And that's part of what's wrong with medical doctors. They aren't open to learning things that they weren't taught in medical school.

Speaker 2 In the functional medicine or lifestyle medicine arena, we forget to like take that step back and really look at the person, their lifestyle, their spiritual well-being.

Speaker 2 Life's not this collection of goals and priorities. It's a collection of habits.

Speaker 1 These are people who are really sick. They're gluten-free.
They're dairy-free. They're soy-free.
They're nut-free. They're egg-free.
And I'm like, it's not your diet that's keeping you sick.

Speaker 2 A lot of people listening to this are in that place where something's going on. They can't put a finger on it.
They've been told by everybody that they're fine.

Speaker 2 And the end road for them is they get referred to psychiatry.

Speaker 1 Goes back to the childhood and then what their continued stress is in life, because what I've noticed is

Speaker 2 hey guys, welcome back to the Ultimate Human Podcast. I'm your host, human biologist Gary Breco, where we go down the road of everything anti-aging, biohacking, longevity, and everything in between.

Speaker 2 And today, you are in for a real treat, especially you females. My audience has been asking asking for more female guests, and I'm so excited to have this next guest on.

Speaker 2 We're going to go down the road of environmental toxins, breast implants,

Speaker 2 mold, mycotoxins, viral pathogens, parasites, all kinds of pathways that I've been talking about, especially in the media for the last few months, and especially on my VIP channel.

Speaker 2 These are the things that just go undiagnosed and even unchecked for, sometimes for decades.

Speaker 2 So, this is going to be the podcast for you, for those of you that have been suffering from that unknown ailment that you just can't figure out. Your doctor's telling you're okay.

Speaker 2 Your labs look fine, but something's just not right. You're going to want to tune in today.
So, welcome to the podcast, Dr. Jessica Petrost.

Speaker 1 I'm honored to be here.

Speaker 2 Thank you for having me. I'm so psyched to have you.
Like, we like you and I can't get a word in edgewise with each other. Like, we're talking over each other, and I'm listening to her.

Speaker 2 She's listening to me. And

Speaker 2 there's just so many, so many topics that you're a subject matter expert in that I am

Speaker 2 deeply interested interested in, and my audience is interested in.

Speaker 2 You know, and I talk about this on the podcast all the time. You know, there's a, there's like a common theme that I feel runs through the Ultimate Human podcast.

Speaker 2 And that is that the most impactful people, the people that are the most passionate, that have discovered God's purpose for them, that are out there really changing the world.

Speaker 2 Sometimes they're not even physicians.

Speaker 2 They are people that have solved a problem.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 maybe it was drug and alcohol addiction. Maybe it was a tough relationship.
Maybe it was financial difficulty. Maybe they had Lyme for a decade and nobody could help them.

Speaker 2 And they became their own citizen scientists and they fixed this problem. And now they're this booming, impactful, passionate voice for that, whatever it is.

Speaker 2 So I'd love for my audience to know your story, your background.

Speaker 2 How did you get here today?

Speaker 1 How did I? It's been a wild ride, absolutely. So, and I would say my story exemplifies the saying from Rumi, the cracks are where the light enters.

Speaker 1 And so I started out training as a conventional medical doctor. I went to school at the University of Louisville in Kentucky.
I went to residency there.

Speaker 1 I did internal medicine and I was board certified. And I worked as a hospitalist.

Speaker 1 So the person that's kind of the quarterback of the team, the ER calls them to admit everything but general surgery, pretty much.

Speaker 1 And so I had to know something about everything. And I did that for almost seven years in a hospital.

Speaker 2 I'd learned that. So internal medicine was your specialty, okay?

Speaker 1 Yep. And I only worked in the hospital.
And I learned a lot. I triaged and I kept care of a lot of sick patients.
But eventually there started to be cracks in the system for me.

Speaker 1 I started asking questions that people didn't like. I started saying, you know, why am I discharging people on 40 different medications? That's not health to me.

Speaker 1 Why do we have Coke and Pepsi contracts and feed factory farm meats and cheese to patients who have cancer?

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 1 Why is Jell-O on a clear liquid diet?

Speaker 2 I have a friend right now who just was discharged a week ago from Mayo Clinic in Scottsdale,

Speaker 2 which, you know, hats off to the Mayo Clinic, first of all, because they saved my friend's life. He was septic when he went in there.
But he's in the ICU of the oncology unit.

Speaker 2 And I did a little post about it. And I walk in there and he's got a Seagram soda sitting on the tray.
He's got pureed applesauce and he's got this sugar-free jello, which, of course, I flip around.

Speaker 2 I'm like, well, that actually. Red dye three was just banned.
They must be getting rid of the inventory. And

Speaker 2 it was just shocking to me because here's this medical system. Clearly, the people in there are highly trained.

Speaker 2 you know had it not and i can't emphasize enough had it not been for them you know um my friend wouldn't be here today because he was very septic and they they absolutely saved his life but once he was stabilized and in there i was just like wow this is the this is the icu for the oncology unit at arguably one of the best medical systems in the country maybe even the world that's right um and so i didn't mean to interrupt you but i just it struck a chord it drove the drove the point home it's true like you know the doctors should be really ashamed of the food that the hospital system has had contracts with.

Speaker 2 I think they'd be ashamed that they knew.

Speaker 1 They don't know. Some of them don't know.
And I will echo what you said.

Speaker 1 If I was in an emergency situation, I broke a leg, I head straight to the emergency department because thank God for acute medicine. But in chronic medicine, they kind of missed the mark.

Speaker 1 They did. And so, you know, I started to see that in the hospital system.
And I started to ask questions. Maybe they didn't know.
Maybe what would happen if I said something?

Speaker 1 And it wasn't, they labeled me a disruptive physician. It didn't turn out so well.

Speaker 1 And the last straw, actually, I had been complaining about things.

Speaker 1 And the last straw was I wrote, this patient that's being admitted to our service, I wrote this in the electronic medical record, has been on a proton pump inhibitor called Pravoced for eight years.

Speaker 1 When the package insert, it clearly says six months to one year. And I wrote that in the chart.

Speaker 1 And the primary care doctor, who was an outpatient doctor, called the hospitalist lead hospitalist to complain about me and said she's a liability rather than him being the liability for the medication he had this patient on for years.

Speaker 1 And they set me down and they said, listen, if you don't stop doing this, you can't work for us. And I'm kind of knee-jerk reactive sometimes, especially when I don't feel the ethics align with me.

Speaker 1 And I said, okay, I quit.

Speaker 1 I didn't have a husband. I didn't have kids.
I had the leeway to be able to be a little bit more free. I may have not done that had I known because I made a fourth of what I used to make when I left.

Speaker 1 What people don't know is there's not a ready-made system for holistic doctors or doctors who don't go the conventional path. My malpractice, my insurance was paid for in the hospital.

Speaker 1 I didn't have to think about anything. I got out of there and I got trained in functional medicine and had to make my own system, had to be a businesswoman out of the gates for it to work.
Wow.

Speaker 1 So that was a big lesson for me.

Speaker 2 So when you say I got trained in functional medicine, what do you mean? I think people are familiar with allopathic medicine, right? Most MDs are allopathic MDs and they have a specialty

Speaker 2 and they do plenty of schooling and they're very skilled and they have a high area of expertise in that core competency.

Speaker 2 What's also kind of astounding to me is the way that we just bifurcate

Speaker 2 the human body. We sort of, it reminds me of like the hub of a wheel and then all of these spokes.

Speaker 2 And the patient's kind of in the middle and we're trying to determine, should you see gastroenterology? Should you see neurology? Should you see the OBGYN? Should you see the internist?

Speaker 2 Should you see the psychiatrist? Because

Speaker 2 you have a psychiatric issue.

Speaker 2 gut issue, you have an autoimmune disease,

Speaker 2 you have a personality disorder, you have, and, and, and so what ends up happening is we slot slot people into these categories but you know human beings exist in communities cells exist in communities the the the the biome of the human body is a giant community ecosystem it's an ecosystem and and and it fascinates me that you know psychiatric medicine for example will treat this you know from neck up and and then there's neck down right and and like these are somehow not connected yes um look you know and and this is just observational but you we've had hundreds of thousands of people through our clinic system.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 I never once saw a client.

Speaker 2 I don't have patients. I'm not a physician, but our physicians had patients.
And I never once saw a client, for example, that suffered from severe anxiety that didn't also have gut issues.

Speaker 2 That's right. Not once.
I mean, literally not once. As soon as someone said, I have rampant anxiety or, you know, I'm

Speaker 2 taking medication for anxiety, instantly I would go to the gut. And 100% of the cases, they have the gut.

Speaker 2 So there's, and we know gut-brain connection and gut microbiome, and I think most people are relatively familiar with that.

Speaker 1 Yeah, 80% of serotonin is made in the gut that then converts over to melatonin. So if your immune system sucks, you can't sleep, and you're unhappy, you should be looking at the gut.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 to your point, you know, the specialists, they do good work with their organ system, but the body doesn't work as separate organ systems. It works as a symphony as a whole.

Speaker 1 And it's a very delicate symphony. And I've seen chart wars in the chart where the heart doctor was arguing with the kidney doctor about which one was more important at the time.

Speaker 1 I've seen this over the years. So, you know, it's not always, there's no perfect system, but I think we can do better than what's out there right now.

Speaker 1 And so for me, I started to say this in the system to people. And when they didn't listen, I quit.
And I got trained in functional medicine. I got trained at the Institute of Functional Medicine.

Speaker 1 I got trained in ozone by Dr. Shellen Berger.

Speaker 2 Wow. Yes.
I love Shellen Berger.

Speaker 1 Absolutely.

Speaker 2 I've trained a lot of my.

Speaker 1 clinical team. The first place I got trained actually was Gerson Therapy.

Speaker 2 So that was the Gerson Institute.

Speaker 1 There's what they taught me about nutrition a a lot. They taught me about coffee enemas.

Speaker 1 And I still use some of their tenets in my practice today.

Speaker 1 So so yeah, I got a broad range of I mean, those are, I mean, you went right to the pinnacle.

Speaker 2 I mean, lucky for you. I don't know if you knew that, but I mean, I didn't.
Like, went to the Harvard University right out of the gate. I mean, those are, those are foundational

Speaker 2 in functional medicine and what I would call lifestyle medicine. I mean, that's as good as it gets.
And Gershon is infamous for their cancer diets and cancer treatment.

Speaker 2 So you get trained, and then what did you do? Go into private practice? Did you open up a rent a little place in a strip mall and you put a shingle on the wall?

Speaker 1 How'd it go? Actually, I was living in California at the time. I was driving an hour each way to shadow a naturopathic doctor in East LA and then Dr.
Julian Whitaker over at Whitaker Wellness.

Speaker 2 I was going to say in LA an hour could be like two miles. Yes.

Speaker 1 Exactly what it was.

Speaker 1 It was very stressful and I didn't make any money, but I wouldn't change anything for the world because that's where those doctors were kind enough to teach a medical doctor what they had learned.

Speaker 1 And I was open enough, open-minded enough to let them teach me, to let someone be a teacher. I don't know everything.

Speaker 1 And that's part of what's wrong with medical doctors, some in the system, is that they aren't open to learning things that they weren't taught in medical school.

Speaker 2 And you know, what's really interesting is, you know, part of the Hippocratic Oath is about our intellectual curiosity, right? Always asking why.

Speaker 2 And I think one of the greatest things that a physician, especially, could possess is that intellectual curiosity,

Speaker 2 is to be just fascinated by what you do. Like, I'm fascinated by what what I wake up every day like a little kid.

Speaker 1 It's not a job. It's part of your life.
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And I always, I want to know more and I want to know everything and I'll never know all of it, but I want to know all of it. And I'm like, you know, it's really just an amazing journey.

Speaker 2 And, you know, sitting down with amazing people like you. So, you know, as you moved into this functional medicine role,

Speaker 2 what really caught your attention? What did you gravitate to? Because functional medicine is broad as allopathic medicine, right?

Speaker 2 And I'd love to hear what, you know, fascinated you and piqued your interest and curiosity, and what sort of rabbit holes you decided to go down and become a subject matter expert in.

Speaker 1 You know, at first I was dabbling in things like hormones, thyroid hormones, sex hormones, things like that.

Speaker 1 I really didn't understand because I was taught as a physician, you don't really understand root causes. There are labels, but you really don't aren't taught.

Speaker 1 They'll say something in the environment, something in your genes caused it.

Speaker 2 I just get stressed out of your life.

Speaker 2 Okay, so I'll leave my wife, not talk to my kids and quit my job. Like, right?

Speaker 2 I don't get stressed out.

Speaker 1 It's not sustainable. So, so, you know, it's, they really, you know, I think with me, I started asking questions until I couldn't ask questions anymore.

Speaker 1 And one particular patient sticks out in my mind here at Whitaker Wellness. Actually, I was there when Dr.
Mark Philladay was there, who does a lot in mold and lime.

Speaker 1 And it was the beginning of my career in functional medicine. I didn't know a lot about those topics.

Speaker 1 And a patient came in who had heart palpitations at night, and his thyroid was all messed up, and he had severe anxiety and all these other kind of

Speaker 1 just

Speaker 1 very vague catch-all symptoms. And

Speaker 1 I was new. So I asked Dr.
Mark Philladay to see him for me as a second opinion. And he came back and said, this guy's Lyme.
And I missed it. And I didn't even think to test for it.

Speaker 1 And by God, I never missed it again. I'll tell you that.
That was my lesson. And so I watched him, you know, nurse my patient back to health.
And I was on the periphery. Lyme's a tough one.

Speaker 1 That's a tough one. Yeah, yeah.
And I said, okay, this is something that is being missed by conventional medicine. And I want to find the mystery reasons, the symptoms for people.

Speaker 1 I want to find the root cause for them. And I kept asking why until I couldn't ask why anymore.

Speaker 1 And it led me to things like biotoxin illness, like mold and water-damaged homes and Lyme disease and parasites. Because, you know,

Speaker 1 people say, oh, we live in a first world country and all parasites. Well, parasites don't get borders.
They know that, right? They don't understand borders.

Speaker 2 COVID had borders, though. There was a time where you could actually walk up to a bar with a mask on and then take your mask off when you went in.
Remember that? Oh, I do. So

Speaker 2 COVID didn't go by the bouncer.

Speaker 1 It was smarter than, you know, it was smarter than other viruses, actually.

Speaker 2 And then it would jump on the plane, but then when you got off the plane, it would jump off.

Speaker 2 It was pretty interesting.

Speaker 1 It only went six feet. That one was scientific, too.

Speaker 2 It only went six feet. That's it.
Exactly.

Speaker 2 And, you know, we were using masks that were like 10 microns and it's 0.0003 microns. I'm like, you guys are trying to to catch water in a cargo net over here.
That's right.

Speaker 2 But we can go down that road later.

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Speaker 2 So you have this line patient, and I think

Speaker 2 a lot of physicians' careers are shaped by an interaction with the patient because nothing's worse than not knowing, you know, than having a patient sit across from you and you're looking at the labs and you're like, there's nothing in these labs.

Speaker 2 And you can see and they're describing the symptoms and you just don't have any rationale for it.

Speaker 2 And your training tells you, well, there's nothing wrong with this patient because the conventional labs don't show it.

Speaker 1 They haven't changed in 30 to 50 years.

Speaker 2 Yeah, CBCs, CMPs.

Speaker 1 I mean, I can pick them apart and look at them functionally. I know you can too, actually.
And it's one of my favorite things to do.

Speaker 1 But I love functional tests that dig a little bit deeper for me, too, because the blood work tells a certain story, but sometimes not deep enough. Right.
Right.

Speaker 1 And that's what I was doing. I was looking at this patient's blood work, and everything was within normal limits.
Yes. You know, and he definitely wasn't normal.
Yeah. And I see this all the time.

Speaker 1 And these people look well. They look like they're healthy, but they're not.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 And sometimes they don't have the like catastrophic symptoms, right?

Speaker 2 They don't have the symptoms that take them to the ER, but they've got this myriad of symptoms going wrong that seems like the whole world's going to hell in a handbasket.

Speaker 2 They got brain fog and weight gain and water retention and poor sleep and poor focus and concentration.

Speaker 2 And they've got anxiety, you know, sort of out of the blue that's not tied to anything in their outside environment. And they're mood numb.
And

Speaker 2 they know that something's wrong they're like man here i am on the vacation of a lifetime with the people i love the most and a place i've always wanted to go and i just can't get out of first gear right i can't feel it i'm just not um and they know that something's wrong but they you know and because those symptoms don't link to a specific you know they're not that's not type two diabetes you know hypothyroid hyperatension because it doesn't slot into a neat category they they they just get on the hamster wheel of medicine and never find a solution that's exactly right it's never been talked about what the root cause is.

Speaker 1 And some of these labels and ICD-10 codes that we've built for it in the hospital, I mean, like sarcoidosis is mold, it's water damage.

Speaker 1 That's an autoimmune condition from water damaged buildings. The fungal balls in the lungs, the extra pulmonary manifestations, that is mold.
It's fungus.

Speaker 1 And so that's one of my favorite things to do: take people who have labels given by the Western system and say, let's dig deeper and see what is causing your body to be out of homeostasis.

Speaker 1 What is it causing? What is causing it not to be in normalcy? And this one particular patient early in my career, I missed that. And I will never do that again.

Speaker 1 Now, I don't test everyone for Lyme disease, but I go, I spend an hour, hour and a half with people. I dig into their antecedents, their triggers, their traumas.

Speaker 1 These are the things that put people on the wrong path throughout life. And eventually their toxin bucket fills up and you have to empty that toxin bucket.

Speaker 1 And oftentimes it's full of frenemies that run together, BPA. and industrial man-made toxins and heavy metals and the pathogens that are there for cleanup.

Speaker 1 I've said metals and things.

Speaker 2 Oh, yeah, yeah. Aflatoxin.

Speaker 2 So

Speaker 2 I want to walk through like a patient experience because,

Speaker 2 you know, a standard set of labs, you know, people are familiar with, you know, you look at the CBC, you look at the comprehensive metabolic panel, you look at a lipid profile, maybe a hormone panel, some basic nutrient deficiencies, B12, vitamin D3.

Speaker 2 But for you,

Speaker 2 is there a sieve that you put them through? Is there like a vibrant panel or something that you like? I love vibrant. I love vibrant.

Speaker 2 You guys should be paying me 10%.

Speaker 1 I actually spoke at their first conference for them. You did? I did.
And they knocked it out of the ballpark.

Speaker 2 No, I actually just did the vibrant test because

Speaker 2 my whole family had mold exposure.

Speaker 2 My daughter actually just had to have a doctor write a letter to her.

Speaker 2 The reason why she moved in next to me was because she was living in a mold-infested apartment downtown Miami, and she started having mold-like symptoms.

Speaker 2 And I was just sitting there with her one night, and I'm like, Maddie, something's just not right.

Speaker 2 And we went and did the

Speaker 2 vibrant test on her, mold off the charts. And so then I had the condo tested and they found the same species of mold in the condo that showed up in the blood.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 our clinic director wrote a letter and they were kind enough. They let her out of the lease and she moved in next to me.
I was very good.

Speaker 2 But then we started the mold detox program, which is definitely something that I want to talk to you about because I pretend to know what I'm talking about with mold, but I really would love to talk to an expert in that arena because I think there's a real paucity of expertise on

Speaker 2 how to support the body's detox,

Speaker 2 how to detox without making yourself sick. Because, you know, a lot of these

Speaker 2 remold,

Speaker 2 well, there's mold remediation for your house, but a lot of these mold detox protocols make people really, really sick, in my opinion, because they don't fix their own detoxification pathway.

Speaker 2 It's one thing to dump the mold out of the tissue, let's say into the blood.

Speaker 2 But now you're really sick.

Speaker 1 Now you're really sick.

Speaker 2 And so if you're not using binders and glutathione and sweat and

Speaker 2 these mechanisms that activate our own natural detox pathways, then now all of you've done is just increase the toxic load. That's right.

Speaker 1 You're just recirculating toxins and can't get them out of the body.

Speaker 2 Yeah. So let's talk about

Speaker 2 what kind of symptoms would drive somebody to have one of these tests? I want to isolate mold for a second, and then I want to go down the lime rabbit hole.

Speaker 2 And if we have time, I'll go down the parasite rabbit hole.

Speaker 2 I think all three of these things are so important, and they're so not talked about.

Speaker 2 I put myself on a parasite cleanse for 10 days every few months.

Speaker 1 Man, you're my people.

Speaker 2 I'm your people.

Speaker 1 I have to say. Parasite cleanse.

Speaker 2 Yes. Parasite cleansing people.

Speaker 1 Our indigenous relatives need to do this once or twice per year.

Speaker 1 And so we don't ever do it. You're right.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I'll do the fenbendazole and the, you know, the ivermectin and, you know, some, some other compounds and make sure that I'm, you know, taking a lot of glutathione. I'm intentional about sauna.

Speaker 2 So I just try to, try to, and I always feel really good afterwards. Sometimes I, I,

Speaker 2 because I like to do everything all at once, I do like mold, mycotoxin metal, and parasites, and then I don't feel so good.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's hard, right?

Speaker 1 But I have to say, your detoxin drainage pathways are definitely open because you work every day at that in your life with biohacking most people don't do that so i have to start at ground zero with them right um so i have learned yet another important topic um about detox here in my career not that long ago actually in the last couple years you know i would always talk about herxheimer symptoms which is our healing detox reactions um if people's bodies aren't prepped and ready for a kill and a bind and a whatever else to get things out enemas or sweat then they will recirculate like you said toxins that make them feel like they have the flu and guess what?

Speaker 1 They're probably not going to continue your detox if they feel sick all the time.

Speaker 2 Yeah, this happens a lot with our

Speaker 2 high-dose ozone clients.

Speaker 1 Eboo will fix that. Yeah.
Eboo because it filters. But still, yet, how do you prep someone properly so they don't quit the detox and they come back to themselves a little more naturally and easily?

Speaker 1 And so I used to just really work on drainage pathways, but now I back up and I do a step before that. Okay.
And this nervous system dysregulation.

Speaker 2 Are we talking about mold?

Speaker 1 I do this with mold and Lyme and parasites and any sort of detox that someone needs to go through because I used to with Lyme sometimes you'd have to keep them on detoxes for a year. This is a war.

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah. But you know what?

Speaker 1 Now that I go back to nervous system regulation, if I can put someone in homeostasis in balance between parasympathetic and sympathetic, all their endorphins, all their neurotransmitters, all their

Speaker 1 bodily functions are working on a different level that a pill won't fix. There's no pill to fix that.
You have to regulate that first. Wow.

Speaker 1 And then the drainage and the detox is about half the time that it would normally take.

Speaker 2 See, I knew I would learn something on this podcast. Because I already paid for that.
I'm telling you.

Speaker 1 See, there you go. Great.
I'm glad I can oblige here.

Speaker 1 So, yeah, but you know, whenever you're in nervous system dysregulation and you're stuck in flight, fight, or even worse, functional freeze, your body contracts.

Speaker 1 It contracts so it won't release some of these things. It doesn't feel safe to let go.

Speaker 1 And so I'll do like a vibrant total tox on somebody, looking at mycotoxins, looking at heavy metals.

Speaker 2 So vibrant total tox, just for the people that are listening.

Speaker 1 Glyphosate, pesticide.

Speaker 2 This is a blood test that you do, and it's looking for all these

Speaker 2 urine tests, you're right. That you do, and it's looking for all of these different.

Speaker 2 I want to back up just for one second because we're getting into an awesome area and say, you know, what are the types of symptoms that someone would be having

Speaker 2 that would even lead you to say,

Speaker 2 let's run this panel?

Speaker 1 Such a good question. So

Speaker 1 it's such a good question, I'm telling you.

Speaker 1 So if I want to look at a total tox, with somebody who comes into my clinic, we do that test on every single person, as well as a blood work panel on every person that comes through.

Speaker 1 and what I look for with people with this brain fog mystery symptoms like migrating joint pains maybe they might have fatigue weight gain that doesn't come off it's pretty resistant they might have hormonal issues which hormones are never root cause they're always a by a byproduct of something else that's confused within the body I could not agree with you more yes 70% of our hormone therapy patients that qualify for hormone therapy actually don't need hormones.

Speaker 2 That's right. Right.
They need precursors for hormones. They need to get other things out of the way, sex hormone binding globulines.

Speaker 2 And we go straight to cortisol, especially for women.

Speaker 2 You know, I feel like you can't

Speaker 2 supplement or treat your way around poor sleep. Like you can't

Speaker 2 eat your way out of not exercising. That's right.
You know, there's certain foundational basics.

Speaker 2 But back to symptoms. So

Speaker 2 because a lot of people listening to this are in that place in their life where something's going on, they can't put a finger on it. They've been told by everybody that they're fine.
Yes.

Speaker 2 And the end road for them is they get referred to psychiatry.

Speaker 1 That's right.

Speaker 1 And most of the women I see have mast cell activation syndrome and histamine, especially after COVID, especially after the 5G towers went up, especially in the new stress, the new society.

Speaker 1 People are so stressed out. And the number one and number two reason for histamine release, which I have to start there with everyone and fix that first, is mold.
and nervous system dysregulation.

Speaker 1 Yes. Wow.
Thoughts can release histamine from mast cells 1,000%. Wow.

Speaker 2 Yes. That is incredible.
So they're having brain fog, let's say water retention, poor sleep,

Speaker 2 you know, poor short-term recall.

Speaker 1 PMS, headaches.

Speaker 2 PMS, headaches, you know, a lot of these things. And they've been told they're fine.
So you run this vibrant panel on them. And vibrant's looking at mold, mycotoxins, metals.

Speaker 2 It's very thorough. Glyphosate.
Glyphosate. I mean, some of the things on there, it's like jet fuel.
I was like, what? You guys test for jet fuel?

Speaker 2 But they do.

Speaker 2 The butanes and the butylates.

Speaker 1 The phthalates, the plasticizes. The phenols.

Speaker 2 I mean, it's a very,

Speaker 2 it's a very thorough test, and it's obviously it's not invasive. It's a urine test.

Speaker 2 And then you don't have to freak out, right? I mean, the good news is now you've got an enemy. And if you don't know who you're fighting, you feel rather hopeless.

Speaker 2 But once you identify the enemy, now there's a mechanism to go forward. So now that somebody has aflatoxin A, aflatoxin B, they have these, these, these mold

Speaker 2 invasions. And you know what's really interesting is we live in the mold capital of the world here.
Miami, Florida won the mold lottery.

Speaker 2 But people that are in drier climates like Malibu or Scottsdale, Arizona, they think, well, we don't have mold out here.

Speaker 2 Oh, yes, you do. Yeah.
And because it's not, maybe the environment's not naturally a moldy environment, but just, you know, construction's come a long way, but these moisture barriers are not perfect.

Speaker 2 That's right.

Speaker 2 And mold's not something that pops out on the carpet or always comes out of your your vents. It's very often behind the wall.
And when it sporulates, these are spores that you can't see.

Speaker 2 You often can't smell them.

Speaker 2 Really sensitive people can.

Speaker 2 My wife is one of those people who was like, this, like, we walk into a hotel room. And it doesn't have the right scent.
We're banging a U-turn. She is

Speaker 1 a canary in a coal mine. And we thank God for those people.
She is.

Speaker 1 Because back in the villages, when we used to live in communities and villages, those people would drink the water in a creek and say, oh, I am sick. Don't drink that water to the warriors.

Speaker 1 And they would prevent the warriors from getting sick who had to go out and fight the wars. So now we have warrior genotypes.
I'm a warrior genotype. I'm a horrible test subject.
I smell nothing.

Speaker 1 Nothing ever bothers me.

Speaker 2 Is that your comp tea? Like warrior, warrior?

Speaker 1 Yes. Okay.
Yes, exactly.

Speaker 2 Yeah, the catechol of method.

Speaker 1 I have a fast

Speaker 1 comp tee.

Speaker 2 That's what I have. You have a fast comp tea.

Speaker 1 So I can break down adrenaline, nor adrenaline, things like that very quickly. So I don't worry that much.
And I can't do that.

Speaker 2 You can get a warrior. Yes.
Yeah, not a worrier. Right.

Speaker 1 There you go. And that's really the try to say those back-to-back worries.

Speaker 2 Warrior, warrior. Well, you know what's so funny is my wife and I are fast and slow.
So she is a warrior.

Speaker 1 Now, you know why? Evolutionary-wise, your guys' pheromones will attract each other because you're giving children 50% totally different DNA than each other. So that's why they're attracted easily.

Speaker 1 And that's the case. So she's a canary in a coal mine.
Thank God for her because she can warn you about things. She smells mold like a dog.
She does.

Speaker 1 And I see people on the total talks, they'll show up with like some byproduct of gasoline. And I'll say to them, Do you smell gasoline a mile away? Yes, and I hate it.
It's the worst smell ever.

Speaker 1 And I know, I smell it every as soon as the car door opens the gas station i'm like that's your body warning you because it smells it so acutely it's telling you we can't get processed this and get rid of it very fast get the heck out of here wow that's

Speaker 2 that's really interesting you know it's funny how those warrior and warrior genes really when you look at it on paper i mean they really do manifest yes like we did these personality tests and my fear was less than one percent and her fear was like 99.

Speaker 2 wow that's probably why she's only had one parking ticket since 1996 and i my license has been suspended three times

Speaker 1 day.

Speaker 2 Because I keep blowing tolls on, you know, I-95. But, you know, I'm like, I'm not worried about it.

Speaker 2 If I go fast enough, maybe it won't pick up my receiver, you know, but it does. Cover my face out so we can't take a picture.
So, so

Speaker 2 you do this test, and let's say that you find a mold species.

Speaker 2 You know, I've been told that the cardinal rule that you can't violate and sort of nothing else matters in the detox protocol is that a person has got to remove themselves from the toxic environment first.

Speaker 1 Avoidance, first rule of environmental medicine. a thousand percent.

Speaker 1 And I will tell you, based on genetic predispositions, how full their toxin bucket is, how stressed out they are, there are a number of multifactorial reasons people may not do well in mold.

Speaker 1 But I can sometimes open people's drainage in mold if they're more of a warrior genotype.

Speaker 1 If they have HLADR, which is a haplogenetic haplotype, but that is on the like a little sticker that's on the immune cells. These people don't recognize pathogen proteins as well.

Speaker 1 So they don't recognize Lyme. They don't recognize mold spores as well.
So they can't remove them from the body. And they cause sickness in these people.
I mean, really deathly ill sickness. Wow.

Speaker 1 And so I definitely can't get open the drainage if they're still in the exposure.

Speaker 2 So first stage is identify it.

Speaker 2 And the second stage is get them out of that environment or remediate the environment they're in because nothing that you will be able to do is going to help them if they're just continually inoculating themselves.

Speaker 1 Right. And people will say, you know, my house is new.
We had it checked, blah, blah, blah. And this is all very subjective within the mold and water damage world.

Speaker 1 And what I want to say to people here, people say, you know, mold's been around forever. Why is it the enemy here? You know what? You're right.

Speaker 1 The reason is, is because the way we're building modern housing, we're using toxic adhesives, toxic carpet, toxic, we're letting

Speaker 1 it be exposed to the environment where it rains on the wood while we're building the house. And then we do things like energy efficiency, which is not natural.
Airflow controls mold.

Speaker 1 So when you have an airtight home, that's great for energy efficiency. It's not great for mold growth.
And then some of these toxic things get wet within the house.

Speaker 1 Mold is there to digest organic waste. That's what it does in the ecosystem.
That's what it does when it gets in CIFO, small intestinal fungal overgrowth.

Speaker 1 It's digesting putrefying food within the gut.

Speaker 2 Wow.

Speaker 1 That's what it does in the environment. We are part of the environment.

Speaker 2 So you get them out of that environment or you remediate the environment. And now what does the protocol look like to

Speaker 2 fix the nervous system and get them more into balance between sympathetic and parasympathetic? And what does like a supplementation and regimen look like for somebody who's going through a mold detox?

Speaker 1 Absolutely, great question. So, first and foremost, there are idiosyncrasies between each person.
Everyone has a little bit, you tweak things a little bit different for each person, right?

Speaker 1 Based on what they're dealing with. But in general, first and foremost, like I mentioned, the nervous system regulation and taking care of histamine, which is so many people.

Speaker 1 I can't have their body just like so confused with chemical communicators that it's not gonna take a protocol. So, I have to calm the inflammation down.

Speaker 1 I have to give them antioxidants and basic building foundational nutrients so that they can fight. Right.
Right. So I make sure they have things that calm the histamine.

Speaker 1 Something like vitamin C, stinging nettles, sometimes DAO enzyme, which breaks down histamine, and they can be genetically low in this. Wow.
Yes.

Speaker 1 B vitamins, methylated B vitamins, sometimes SAMI if they're sensitive.

Speaker 1 Idenosylcobalmin, hydroxycobalmin. And then I make sure they have antioxidants and bioflavonoids.
Then

Speaker 1 calm down everything.

Speaker 1 Then when they're sleeping a little bit better,

Speaker 1 they feel a little bit better. They feel less anxious, less itchy and puffy, that's ready to open drainage.
And that can take a month or two. Now, what is opening drainage?

Speaker 1 We have these natural emunctories in the body. Things like your bowels, your liver, your bile, your sweat.
For women, they're cycles even.

Speaker 1 And so I have to make sure that those are all running properly. Because when things enter the body, like mold spores, if you're open, you can just jump out of the body.

Speaker 1 If you're closed up and you tell me you can't poop, every day or

Speaker 1 you can't sweat in a sauna within 10 to 15 minutes, people tell me they can't sweat. That's not normal.
You can't, your bile and liver should be moving properly.

Speaker 1 You should be sleeping in a decent amount. And if that, I have to tune that up because if I can open those drainage pathways, then when I start killing and binding, they can drop when I'm binding.

Speaker 1 That's like a mop-up toxins. They can drop it out of their body, out of their bowels, out of their liver, out of their sweat.

Speaker 1 And if that's not open and I start a killing protocol, we're not going to be friends. They're not going to like it.

Speaker 2 That's exactly what we've experienced. I'm so glad you're talking about this because most people think I just take something and I start detoxing.

Speaker 2 And then the and the problem is the detoxification process can make you much sicker than the

Speaker 2 process of, because at least your body has hidden it and it's in the tissues and it's contained it. And, you know, it's having a low-grade inflammatory response.

Speaker 2 Your immune system is probably in a low-grade fight, but it's manageable. And then all of a sudden it flares up.

Speaker 2 And I noticed too that people that have mold toxicity very often, especially younger kids, will have repeated sore throats. That's right.

Speaker 2 You know, I feel like there's been this battle between mold and

Speaker 2 bacteria for so many years, right? I mean, penicillin's mold, right? And it kills bacteria. It's an antibiotic.
And so they've had this war going on for centuries.

Speaker 2 And when they're in the same biome, you know, and somebody has a streptococcal infection and they have a mold. And then when the mold sporulates or flares up, then bang, they've got a sore throat.

Speaker 2 And then they treat the sore throat with antibiotics. And six weeks, eight weeks, nine weeks later, they've got another sore throat.
Yes. and then they want to take the adenoids out, right?

Speaker 2 They want to take the tonsils out.

Speaker 1 And the adenoids and lymph nodes are the heralding organs of the lymphatic system. They tell the whole lymphatic system to drain.

Speaker 1 So, when you remove those, I already know someone's lymphatic system is stagnant, which is where we hold cellular memory, we hold emotions, and it holds a lot of the toxins that lay in the fascia and the lymphatic system as well.

Speaker 1 So, that's a big one. And I see that a lot too in mold, huge tonsils, huge tonsils, sore throats.
I actually think oftentimes it lowers immunity enough for things like EBV and SREP to take over.

Speaker 1 In fact,

Speaker 1 mold, I'll drive the point home, mold is so immunosuppressive that they take mycophenolic acid, which is a type of mycotoxin, and they make mycophenolate out of it, which is a suppressant when you get a kidney transplant.

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Speaker 2 So

Speaker 2 you start these people by getting just the natural detox, you know, urine, stool, sweat, helping, you know, the liver function,

Speaker 2 probably kidney function.

Speaker 2 You get a, you get a baseline of nutrients in their body. So you're getting their methylation pathways going.
That's right. And then get them sleeping a little bit better.

Speaker 2 And then a month later, you start the quote unquote drainage. Yeah.

Speaker 1 And it's, it depends. It gives and takes if how quickly I can get people calmed down because sometimes they don't want to calm down in their thoughts, and that drives a lot of this process.

Speaker 1 But yes, I can cut down on drainage and detox for people, make them a lot happier if I can prep their body properly at first.

Speaker 1 And that oftentimes I'll give them something for the liver to open that up. Castor oil packs as well.
I'll do a lot of biohacks with people. Sauna is one of my favorites.
Infrared.

Speaker 2 And the castor oil packs are external, right? Yes, they are. Okay, castor oil packs, external.
Milk thistle.

Speaker 1 Milk thistle, knack, tudka. You know, I really look at things like opening the bowels has to be first and foremost.
I can't give binders if people are constipated because it binds them up even more.

Speaker 1 Number one rule of detoxing, you cannot be constipated

Speaker 1 at all. So, you know, sometimes I'll bring in them as in if it's needed.

Speaker 1 That's a worst case scenario for people, you know, but I'm definitely utilizing biohacks to open up all their natural amongctories and drainage pathways so they're ready for the killing process.

Speaker 1 for the binding process, for all that.

Speaker 2 Wow. So I love this because you're sort of this roots up up approach.
You know, first you get them out of the environment.

Speaker 2 Second, you supplement them, not even for the detox, but supplement them just so that they have healthy biomes. Yes.
Then you activate the natural detoxification pathways, sweat, urine,

Speaker 2 you know, stool, liver,

Speaker 2 kidneys.

Speaker 2 And then what does the detox look like? When do we go in after the mold?

Speaker 1 Yeah, absolutely. So the detox, I usually use something like biocidin.
I also will usually do a parasite cleanse before going after the mold.

Speaker 2 And what does a parasite cleanse look like?

Speaker 1 So parasite cleanse, you know, I like things like mimosa puddica seed. I like mimosa puddica.
It's an Indian seed that is very, very, very sticky.

Speaker 2 Because I feel like you just made that up.

Speaker 1 I know, right? I just jumbled a bunch of words together like pig Latin.

Speaker 2 Mimosa puddica just doesn't roll off that fun. I mean, I might have that for lunch.
I mean, I'm going to talk to my friend.

Speaker 1 It's hard to taste awful. Be careful.

Speaker 1 So anyway, it's this really sticky seed, and it acts like almost like when you put it in the gut.

Speaker 2 Like one of those, remember those sponges, kids sponges you put in the bathtub and they'd swell up oh yeah the little dinosaurs i love those because it would come out of like a capsule and it would get like this big you're like how'd they do that that's mimosa foodica yeah it's still like the eighth one or the

Speaker 1 so it literally scrabs everything in the gut it's called the gut scrapberg okay so that i really like wormwood i like cloves i like um black walnut hole if no one's allergic to walnuts um i like paldiarco uvaursi i use all of these as a killing protocol because people say oh this is a parasite cleanse well just like antibiotics they they have broad coverage.

Speaker 1 These herbs will get bacteria, they'll get candida, they'll get parasites. And parasites in the animal studies hold things like heavy metals and environmental toxicity.

Speaker 1 So when I'm pulling parasites, I'm also pulling mold spores.

Speaker 1 I'm pulling heavy metals as well that they digest because they're there to digest things in the environment that's not supposed to be in you.

Speaker 1 So in fish studies, they hold six times the heavy metals that you think the fish itself can hold.

Speaker 2 Really? The parasite in the fish? Yes. That is incredible.
Yes. And

Speaker 2 are you

Speaker 2 a fan of like fenbendazole, ivermectin? Yes. Hydroxychloroquine.

Speaker 1 Yes.

Speaker 2 Any of those for parasitic cleansing?

Speaker 1 Yes. So ivermectin gets some parasites, but not all of them.
It has not full coverage for everything. Fenbendazole is the same way.
It really works on intestinal worms.

Speaker 1 And just for everyone watching, this is a dog dewormer.

Speaker 1 So it literally,

Speaker 1 I learned about it in Gerson therapy.

Speaker 1 We would have people give people fenbendazole and they would poop out intestinal worms and start their cancer would start to improve yes so this has been well known to me underground on fen benzazole for a long time now i usually don't put people on these um but i will if they already have ivermectin or something i'll be like yeah let's try it with some herbs i'll usually match it with herbs so we get more coverage the herbs is the part that i'm not you know very familiar with so i would love to have if if if it's possible i'll put your protocol and links to your supplements in the show notes because

Speaker 2 i'm such a big believer in this but i'm not really familiar with with

Speaker 2 the different herbs that are really good, especially for mold toxicity.

Speaker 2 So these different, do they come in, are they separate? Do you, or is there like a package that you put them on? How does it work?

Speaker 1 Yes, there are two different parasite cleanses that I really like that come in packages. And I love, we even use some mushrooms like Uncia and things like that in some of these.
But definitely

Speaker 1 the herbs increase the broad coverage for ivermectin and fennamenzazole. and they actually help with everything, not just mold, right? So, bacteria as well.

Speaker 1 And so, yeah, some of those herbs, like I like biocidin a lot. It's lysosomal.
So, I know that it's absorbing in the bucal cavity.

Speaker 1 If you hold it under the tongue, it has broad spectrum activity against Lyme and Candida and some mold as well.

Speaker 2 I did some this morning, thanks to you.

Speaker 2 It did have a little sulfur vibe, though. I'm gonna be honest with you.
Yes.

Speaker 1 Nice little

Speaker 1 rotten egg body. Oh, the nano glute bee, my product.
Yeah, so the nano glute bee is

Speaker 1 methylated bees, glutathione, which I'm sorry, guys, it just made of sulfur and it smells like a fart. It just does.
That's the way glutathione does.

Speaker 2 Everybody hot boxes themselves. They don't want to talk about it, but they do.
Yeah, you see. Dutch oven, if you've ever done it.

Speaker 1 Things you do for health.

Speaker 1 So,

Speaker 1 and vitamin C. So that one is something I give people really to calm them down to help in the inflammation period before we go into drainage and detox.

Speaker 1 That's some of the foundational support that they need. But yeah, if I can get them past the sulfur taste or smell.

Speaker 2 No, it really wasn't that bad. Actually,

Speaker 2 it tasted like lemon. It actually tasted good.

Speaker 2 You know what's crazy is I've been on this journey for so long.

Speaker 2 I know it sounds crazy, but I can put something into my body five minutes after I swallow it or the second that I taste it or put on my skin, I instantly know if it's working or not. Yep.

Speaker 2 Like, I, I, I don't know what it is. I inherently can just take it once and go, that, that didn't do anything.
Or I can take it and go, that did something.

Speaker 2 And maybe I'm placeboing myself, um, but but you know I actually can see it on on labs like I

Speaker 2 was experimenting with different things for C-reactive protein and I finally found this tincture Sun Foods brain fuel and

Speaker 2 it had rice bran bio aloe um silica clay a bunch of different things in it and i'm telling you we started using it in the clinic with um clients that had high c-reactive protein and it would just collapse it and we would bring it back back down under one point 0.25

Speaker 1 um yours you were telling me at one point was eight it was incredible i don't think i've ever seen one that high it was in november 2022 and it that was all from nervous system dysregulation and stress so and i i had an mcv of 106 really high mean corpuscular volume yes okay so that's on your your cbc so that's um mean corpuscular volume is is sort of the volume um

Speaker 2 the corpuscle is a red blood cell but it's the volume inside of the red blood cell so some of these measures kind of go missed because I don't just throw out MCV and people don't know what that means.

Speaker 2 When you look at a comprehensive metabolic panel, very often things like hypoxia hide in plain sight because there's a range for red blood cells, for example,

Speaker 2 3.69 to 5.8, I think it is, if you're on a lab corp.

Speaker 2 And then there's a range for hemoglobin, for example.

Speaker 2 And you could have red blood cells down in the bottom 10% of the range, but you're normal. Hemoglobin down in the bottom 10% of the range, but you're normal.
Your RDW is high.

Speaker 2 Your red cell distribution width is high. And this is like hypoxia hiding in plain sight.
And the doctor looks at it and goes, all your labs are normal. And they're like, but doc, I am exhausted.

Speaker 2 I go to bed exhausted. I wake up exhausted.
I can't get out of first gear. Falling asleep at my desk.
You know, it's almost like anemia, but not

Speaker 2 meeting the clinical protocol.

Speaker 1 It's a thick red cell. And it's because I didn't have B vitamins, which I needed to make red blood cells and have correct production of them.

Speaker 1 If you have iron deficiency anemia, they're super small, the red blood cells.

Speaker 1 I see that a lot with parasites because parasites eat iron and they don't let people absorb and assimilate properly because of the inflammation.

Speaker 2 So now you have,

Speaker 2 you now you've gotten to the detox part. Yes.

Speaker 2 And now

Speaker 2 what are the, what are the nervous system regulatory things that you can do?

Speaker 1 I love that you asked this question.

Speaker 1 I love it because

Speaker 1 the reason my labs were so messed up was because I was stressed out. So I had to be my own patient.
And then I took what I learned on myself and brought it to the clientele.

Speaker 1 And so, you know, when people are in nervous system dysregulation, they do things like they have this horrible startle reflex. They'll speak without breathing.
Just blah blah blah.

Speaker 1 They'll do these, they won't be able to get into a deep REM sleep at night, right? Because they don't feel safe to get into rest and digest. Wow.
And so it's very hard to fix.

Speaker 1 You think about how hard it is to change yourself. I'm asking other people to change that are dysregulated and don't see themselves.
So sometimes I have some herbs and some supplements that will help.

Speaker 1 Things like one of my favorites is liposomal GABA with L-theanine.

Speaker 2 Gamma butyric acid with L-theanine. Yeah.

Speaker 1 That's a good one. Because there was controversy before whether GABA could cross the blood-brain barrier, and now that we think it does.

Speaker 1 But even if it doesn't, you have GABA receptors in your gut that attach via the vagus nerve and the gut brain axis to the brain, and you have receptors here too.

Speaker 1 So it's modulating the entire gut-brain axis in someone that's really spun out in flight or fight. And that really helps to calm the monkey brain at night, calm the anxiety during the day.

Speaker 1 I really love, depending on their genes, which you'll love this, I decide what kind of type of B vitamin they need.

Speaker 2 I do the same thing. That's so good.

Speaker 1 Not everyone can handle methylated B vitamins. No, unfortunately.

Speaker 2 THFR, COMPT, MTR, MTRR,

Speaker 2 those matter.

Speaker 1 That's right. And so I'll go with the denosyl, hydroxycobalmin, or SAME, depending on the person.
And if they can handle methylated B vitamins, I'll give them my nanoglute B, but not if they can't.

Speaker 1 Right. And so that I can.

Speaker 2 To determine that, sorry to cut you off, but to determine that, you're doing a genetic test. You're looking at the pathways for

Speaker 1 sometimes, sometimes. That's not something they come in my clinic and get automatically.
We can do it, but we don't a lot of times. What I'll do is spend so much time with them, I'll ask them.

Speaker 1 I'll spend a lot of time going over symptomatology. And, you know, have you ever tried methyl AB vitamins? Did they make you feel like you had too much coffee?

Speaker 1 How do you deal with glutathione? There's a CBS mutation where people cannot handle gluten sulfur outside the body.

Speaker 2 Right. Right?

Speaker 1 Exactly. So I test them and I ask them things.
And, you know, if they can't handle it, I'll stop and change for them usually.

Speaker 1 and then there are things that I like like homeopathics yeah so when there people tell me they can't handle any supplements I'll give them homeopathics like Pecana's big three that has liver lymph and kidneys in it and help energetically drain those organs emotionally and physically so people get teary eyed they go emotions because you hold emotions in the body and the organs I totally agree with that yeah we know that frequency can be stored in water I mean there's no

Speaker 2 in my opinion controversy about that that's right these are repeatable demonstrable physio

Speaker 2 physical changes to the structure of water. And we know that emotion has frequency, and that frequency can impact fluid structures.
And we're 67% fluid. Absolutely.

Speaker 2 So I think it's ridiculous for us to not think that our emotions don't have physiologic consequences.

Speaker 2 So as a part of this detox protocol, you're trying to calm their nervous system down by finding out, well, what are your triggers? I mean,

Speaker 2 and are you digging in? Like, what are your...

Speaker 1 Do you feel safe in your body and your environment? You know, many people say no. I can't heal a body you hate.
I can't heal a body that's not safe.

Speaker 2 So I can't. That's a big step.
That's amazing. Yeah.

Speaker 1 I totally agree with you. So I have to get them to that place where, like, I trust the unknown.
I trust something bigger than me. I trust that my body is intelligent and not broken.

Speaker 1 You know how hard it is to heal somebody that has that perspective? It's almost impossible.

Speaker 2 And what does this have to do with? Like, is this like a deep-rooted self-image of themselves? Like, they say very often, you know, someone that's overweight sees themselves as an overweight person.

Speaker 2 That's just the image of themselves that they have. And it's very hard to overcome that self-image or smokers see themselves as a smoker and they don't quit smoking.

Speaker 2 Or, you know, I mean, they're, they're, or, or maybe they're in an abusive relationship and they've been convinced that they're, you know, not the victim, that they're the perpetrator and they, they feel like bad person.

Speaker 2 So they're like saddled with guilt. And so there are all of these different states that people are in.

Speaker 2 And if you don't get that to them and maybe even help them recognize them, give them some form of release. And most people aren't really doing anything to care

Speaker 2 for their nervous system or their emotional state. They're not engaging in prayer or breath work or, you know, a good,

Speaker 2 you know, self-care routine. It's astounding to me how many people I talk to about, you know, what's your routine to go to bed? And they're like, I just get in bed.

Speaker 2 I'm like, well, when do you get in bed? Well, whenever I'm done with my day, right? I mean, so now, so now sleep is getting bullied around in the schedule like the stepchild.

Speaker 2 And then, I'm like, well, what's your morning routine? You know, how do you wake up?

Speaker 2 Oh, sometimes I brush my tea, sometimes I don't, depending on if I'm in a hurry or not, I just get dressed and grab coffee, run out the door.

Speaker 2 So, I mean, that's just wake, fight, or flight out of the gate.

Speaker 1 Yep, right. 1,000%.

Speaker 1 And, you know, these women, they take care of everyone else but themselves.

Speaker 1 They would never treat their friend or their children like they treat themselves.

Speaker 2 I think 82% of all autoimmune diseases in women, I think it's specifically linked to that.

Speaker 1 That's exactly where I was.

Speaker 1 Yes, 1,000%. It goes back to the childhood and then what their continued stress is in life.

Speaker 1 Because what I've noticed is if people started out with a chaotic childhood with a lot of trauma, they will put themselves in that familiar state later on, even though it's not good for them.

Speaker 1 But it's familiar. So they'll take, you know, drink three cups of coffee in the morning because that reminds them of how they felt in their childhood.

Speaker 1 So I have to make them aware, the observer of their thoughts to see what they're doing that is actually standing in their own way of their body healing itself.

Speaker 1 Right.

Speaker 1 So it's very much an awareness game with me. And I'll go the first question I ask people is, Did you have a happy and healthy childhood? Can you tell me about it?

Speaker 1 And then you can learn so much about an adult who is still masquerading as an adult, really in a child's body from that time when they were younger.

Speaker 1 So I really spend a lot of time there with parents, with, you know, what happened to you, divorces, you know, illnesses, things that happened when you were younger, because that sets the tone for your health as an adult.

Speaker 2 Wow.

Speaker 1 Right. So, so I go there and I use a lot of biohacks that you talk about.
Breath work is a huge one I have people do. Wow.
Huge.

Speaker 1 You know, sometimes people can handle cold plunges and sometimes they can't. These women in fight are fights.

Speaker 1 Right. I'll utilize fasting when we're ready for it.
That can also be something that is a stressor for too many people. Right.

Speaker 1 And so, you know, I use enemas. I use sauna.
I use a lot of PMF, a lot of lymphatic massage. And myofactual release with breath work is huge.

Speaker 2 How do you use the PMF? Do you have them put it in their bed and run it at night when they go to bed? Yes. And a lot of people just fall asleep on it.
Okay, great.

Speaker 1 Yes. And I'm using the parasympathetic balancing autonomic nervous system type of stuff for these people with PMF.
That's a great way to get them there. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Because if they've never felt that way and you put someone in parasympathetic mode, they go, whoa, this is weird. I feel vulnerable.
I don't know if I like this. Yeah.
You know?

Speaker 1 Because they're always guarded.

Speaker 2 I've seen it. I've seen that happen to people at our Colorado place.
We have a shift wave. It's sort of a combination of frequency and like almost like a light massage.

Speaker 2 And it looks like a lawn chair. And you lay in it.
And I've.

Speaker 1 I know what this is. It vibrates.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it vibrates. It has

Speaker 2 those cylinders kind of on your calf.

Speaker 2 I got this thing and unpackaged it. And I was like,

Speaker 2 this is like, I'm not so sure I'm on board for this. And I'm telling you, I had clients get on there and cry when they got off of it.

Speaker 2 People that had pretty significant anxiety would tell me, Mo, this is the first time I actually started to dream. I fell asleep and I actually started dreaming.

Speaker 2 I don't remember the last time I had a dream. I was like a little child.
I love that.

Speaker 2 So there is a shift, you know, state shift, you know, Vemi, these Vemi acoustic bows.

Speaker 1 You talk about a Flow Presso? Have you heard of Flow Presso?

Speaker 2 No, but I will have one here in a day.

Speaker 1 Okay, shout out to Kelly Kennedy, my friend who's the lymph queen here.

Speaker 2 He taught me about Flow Presso. That's the only device I haven't found.
I love it.

Speaker 1 I got you. Okay.

Speaker 2 I'm getting ready to move my kids out because I have no more room for.

Speaker 1 I have a biohacking device that Gary Brecker doesn't have. I'm so proud of myself right now.

Speaker 2 I'll be here by Friday.

Speaker 1 Okay. So a Flow Presso.
It looks like a giant Michelin man suit.

Speaker 1 So it's basically, you have it on a table, you're laying out, you have these things, you velcro them on your legs, velcro them on your arms, velcro them on your torso, and then you set the machine at the bottom.

Speaker 1 It has warm infrared heat and microcirculation, and it starts like a warm hug. It hugs you all the way up the legs, all the way up the arms to the heart.

Speaker 2 I have a balancer pro.

Speaker 1 It's like a rhythmic hug with heat.

Speaker 1 That moves the lymph, and people cry in it, and they release everything.

Speaker 2 Really? And so

Speaker 2 it's rhythmic or it just squeeze and dump?

Speaker 1 No,

Speaker 1 It's rhythmic. It's almost like a warm hug that goes up, up the arms, up the legs, the torso, all the way squeezing to the heart.
Wow. So it puts you to sleep because it's like an ocean wave almost.

Speaker 1 But you're like the

Speaker 1 kid from the

Speaker 1 arm at all or your face. You can't scratch anything.
You're stuck.

Speaker 2 I love that.

Speaker 2 I love that. I will please put that in the show notes.
Float presso. Okay.
Float presso's just got an order.

Speaker 2 So

Speaker 2 I love that because, you know, truly, this is a really refreshing angle because I think very often we get so bogged down in the science, like what kills it, what eliminates it.

Speaker 2 And even

Speaker 2 in the functional medicine or lifestyle medicine arena, we forget to like take us that step back and really look at the person.

Speaker 2 And, you know, there's the analogy of when fish get sick, you clean the tank.

Speaker 2 You don't treat the fish. Sorry.
And yet we have the sort of opposite approach in medicine where we have a fish swimming around in toxic soup and we're trying to treat the fish.

Speaker 1 I love that you said that.

Speaker 2 The tank's dirty and the environment's dirty. And that environment represents their relationships, you know, their diet, their lifestyle, their spiritual well-being.
That's right.

Speaker 2 You know, their habits. You know, people, I think, are beginning to realize that like life's not this collection of goals and priorities.
It's a collection of habits.

Speaker 2 You know, when I see somebody that's really in good condition,

Speaker 2 the minimum I know about them is they have certain habits

Speaker 2 And they have some level of discipline.

Speaker 2 But people have the goal to lose weight, but they don't develop the habits of somebody who needs to lose weight, right?

Speaker 2 I mean, they have the goal of being really healthy, but they don't have the habits of a healthy person.

Speaker 1 Yeah. I'll quote Joe Dispenza here who says, you know, your thoughts turn into your beliefs and your beliefs turn into your actions.

Speaker 1 And those actions over time turn into a personal reality, which is your personality.

Speaker 1 So it all starts from our thoughts and beliefs after that. And our actions come from those, that energy, right?

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Speaker 2 Now let's get back to the ultimate human podcast. So I love that you're treating these.
And so you're getting them into a parasympathetic state. So

Speaker 2 you've done the testing, you found the invader, you got them out of the environment or cleaned the environment up, you put them on a basic supplement protocol to just get them functioning as optimal supplements.

Speaker 1 That's a good point. Sorry to interrupt, but I never put them on more than six to eight things.
Green pharmacy is one of my biggest pet peeves.

Speaker 1 And if we do that, it's the exact same thing as allopathy, treating every abnormality we find on a lab. That is not pulling back.
You're stuck in the forest. You can't see the trees.

Speaker 1 You need to pull back and look at a big picture of what organ systems and the body as a whole is not functioning at peak performance. It's not about killing and eradicating.

Speaker 1 It's about harmonizing and balancing.

Speaker 2 Yeah. You know, it's interesting.
I saw an interview with Elon Musk one time, and he said that most entrepreneurs think that businesses are about addition, but business is really about subtraction.

Speaker 2 And he has this philosophy that every time, you know, he gets in these board meetings and

Speaker 2 they're trying to solve a problem, the first thing that they have to do is say, what are they going to take away? Like, what are you removing from your department?

Speaker 2 What is unnecessary? Like, and if you're not coming to these meetings telling them what you're going to delete and you're only coming to add,

Speaker 2 then he fires you.

Speaker 2 And, you know, here's a guy that's running, what, six companies

Speaker 2 worth over $100 billion a piece.

Speaker 1 Absolutely.

Speaker 2 And sometimes widely different interestries, all successful. But it's, and whether you like them or not, it's this philosophical approach to, you know, the same thing with the human body.
It's like

Speaker 2 you can't take somebody who's... in a toxic environment and then just overload them with every supplement and vitamin and mineral and amino acid.

Speaker 2 And, you know, because now you're just overloading a body that doesn't process it anyway.

Speaker 1 I see the sickest of the sick. Most of them are bloated with inflammation in their gut.

Speaker 1 So I try to give them powders, liposomal liquids, things like that that I know they can absorb because 15 capsules with fillers, most people can't handle that if they're sick. They're chronically ill.

Speaker 1 Very true. And I will say to you, and this might drive the point home for you.

Speaker 2 People say, I'm really sensitive. No, you're really toxic.

Speaker 1 You're really toxic. Thank you.
That's right.

Speaker 1 So for me, and this will put it in a different perspective for you, the reason I get people out of nervous system dysregulation and into parasympathetic mode is because most of them are in cell danger response with a mitochondria.

Speaker 1 What?

Speaker 2 Cell danger?

Speaker 1 Cell danger response for the power. I've never heard of that either.

Speaker 2 I haven't.

Speaker 2 This is like, I got to take notes.

Speaker 2 I never take notes turn podcast.

Speaker 2 I'm so honored. Thank you.

Speaker 2 I might even watch this one again.

Speaker 1 Thank you.

Speaker 1 So mitochondria, they do have a number of different functions within the body, but what they do mainly, the two biggest functions are immune system and making ATP through the Krebs cycle and electron transport chain, right?

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 1 when you have to choose between those two, you don't do both very well. So, that's why so many people are tired and chronically ill.

Speaker 1 And so, if I go in and try and give them a killbind sweat or a detox and bind and all that stuff, their mitochondria are already just fighting for immunity right now.

Speaker 1 Then, I'm going to make them exhausted. I'm going to wear them out.

Speaker 1 You have to get them there where the mitochondria are more balanced with energy production and immunity so that they can actually handle the detox.

Speaker 2 Right. So,

Speaker 2 when you say that you, um, so you're actually having them them do things like grounding breathwork maybe morning sunlight.

Speaker 1 Yes, circadian rhythm. Yes, watch the sunrise and sunset.
Put their bare feet on the ground.

Speaker 2 Huge, huge, huge, huge on that.

Speaker 2 I actually just had a client who was who was trapped in fight or flight,

Speaker 2 very well-known DJ, and

Speaker 2 was actually having suicidal ideations because of the severe tinnitus. And it wasn't actually tinnitus from damage.
It was tinnitus from

Speaker 2 frying his immune system.

Speaker 2 You know, circadian rhythm always off, constantly, you know never never waking up or going to bed at the same time you know four or five shows in a week always on a plane multiple time zones multiple you know you know

Speaker 1 different hotel rooms you know why he had tinnitus the body sees that sorry to interrupt the body sees that as um

Speaker 1 it's a a a flight or fight or fear of sounds so the body is stuck and it's a it's a kind of trauma response from sounds that's what the tinnitus is from so well you know the first thing i did when he yeah i I actually had him stay with me for a couple weeks.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 I would walk in to the bedroom and I insisted that he go to bed at the same time every night. Even if he didn't go to sleep, I was like, get in the bed.
And

Speaker 2 literally like a dad. And he's a grown-ass man.
And

Speaker 2 then I would, you know, I'm up for my morning light. I would go in and knock on the door and I would wake him up, even if he was sleeping.
And we would go out every morning. We would get sunlight.

Speaker 2 And then his girlfriend would take him down and they would do walks in the park and touch the ground. I'm like, you have to give your body some normalcy.

Speaker 2 Like it just doesn't know when it's awake, when it's supposed to sleep, when it's supposed to be on, when it's supposed to be off.

Speaker 2 Sometimes you're drinking at one in the afternoon, sometimes 1 a.m., sometimes not at all, then sometimes binge drinking. Like your body has no circadian cycle.

Speaker 2 And it was astounding what happened after, you know, just about a week of doing this solidly. One night, he was like, oh my God, I slept eight hours.

Speaker 2 And the ringing went from like a 10 to a two and then we brought in hyperbarics and you know red light therapy and other other things like you know mycelized tumor concorcum and things to just try to you know reduce reduce inflammation and now he's now he's back on the road and he did a beautiful post about it um but i think too a lot of people are not caring for the nervous system and you know i mean how many times have you been in your physician they ask you what your diet is or if you exercise or what the stresses are in your life what do you do for a living um they're just looking straight at the symptom.

Speaker 1 That's right.

Speaker 2 So, so, as you get them into this detox profile, because gosh, there's so many people that have mold and don't know it,

Speaker 2 and you're working on the nervous system. What kind of things are they doing at home? Breath, besides breath work, what kinds of other things you have in the house?

Speaker 1 Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 1 So, most of the time, I'll have people look watch the sunrise and sunset, as I met, as I mentioned, and early on, even if they're in a cold atmosphere and they can just look at it out of an open window or something.

Speaker 1 That's what I say, too. You know, just do that.

Speaker 1 Because people don't understand that that really turning food into energy is a light-driven process. The mitochondria is a light-driven process.
And so such photovoltaic beings.

Speaker 2 Right. We are really photovoltaic and people don't believe that.
And yeah, we've been taught to fear the sun.

Speaker 1 We have a circadian clock in every single cell that responds to light and dark. So if you're staring at a blue screen, if you're never out in the sunlight, I can't get people better.

Speaker 1 So I have to have them following that recipe as well. Hiking at a sunrise.
My favorite thing. Can't beat it.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 Cannot beat it. Literally, we were talking about this before the podcast.
Nothing makes me feel better.

Speaker 2 I have a

Speaker 2 busted log cabin, a little one-bedroom log cabin. I'm building a nicer one, but I have a one-bedroom log cabin that Sage and I have on 50 acres, middle of nowhere, Colorado.

Speaker 2 And it has solar-fed electricity, glacier-fed spring water, well inseptic,

Speaker 2 propane stove. It is the polar opposite of what you see outside the studio.

Speaker 2 It's my favorite place on earth. And we go out there and spend the whole summer out there.
We're 10,500 feet. And I get up in the morning and I just put this

Speaker 2 old school rucksack on and grab a sidearm. And I go for this little four-mile walk in the woods.
And when I get back, I'm telling you, I feel like I took a limitless pill. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And I got all the gadgets in the world in here and they kind of get me the same place, but nothing feels better than that.

Speaker 1 You can take people who are super anxious and depressed, even suicidal, and put them on a, you know, a week of camping like a new person. Yeah.
They won't even forget.

Speaker 1 They'll forget that their mood disorder existed.

Speaker 1 So with those people, have them do stuff like this.

Speaker 1 I also really regulate their diet, but to be honest with you, their diet is usually fixed by the time they come to me because these are people who are really sick. They've seen 30 doctors.

Speaker 1 They have mystery symptoms. So by the time they come to me, they're gluten-free.
They're dairy-free. They're soy-free.
They're nut free. They're egg-free.
And I'm like, it's not your diet.

Speaker 1 that's keeping you sick. Okay.

Speaker 1 I see this so much. And so I regulate that.

Speaker 1 And, you know, most of the time, I have to instruct people to stop scrolling, to distract themselves or dissociate because they're not able to process their emotions if they're scrolling all all the time.

Speaker 1 They don't know how to be a human being. They're a human doing all the time.
And so can you just sit with your feelings and emotions? Can you sit? Can you just sit and breathe and not do anything?

Speaker 1 So many people can't. It's their biggest feel.
So true. And so that alone lets me know where they are.
So that kind of stuff throughout the day, right? I'll get them in the flopreso.

Speaker 1 I'll put them in the sauna. Take a binder before and a binder after.
We're mopping up toxins. You'll notice your body starts sweating sooner with the binder in it.

Speaker 2 Do you do pre and post sauna binders? I do. Okay.
I do. Do you like activated charcoal, zeolites?

Speaker 1 Activated charcoal is great for hangovers or food poisoning because it stays in the gut, but it doesn't go systemically.

Speaker 1 So I do like zeolite and bittonite clay, but not all of them treated equal. We have to look at how they're made, right? Do they have aluminum binding in them or not? Some of them do.

Speaker 1 The zeolites, yes. Wow.
And so I don't like that all the time. What I really like are fulvic and humic acids.
Wow. Binders because they turn on pathways like the Nerf2 pathway.

Speaker 2 So fulvic and humic acids, like okay, so like Sheilajit is a fulvic mineral. Yes, but you're not talking about Shelajit.

Speaker 1 Well, it comes from Sheila Geet, for sure, for sure. Um, but you know, like some of the best binders out there are dibasics of fulvic acid.
You know, they have lots of fulvics and um humics in it.

Speaker 1 In fact, my company, if he each formulas, we put fulvic acid in every single supplement. Wow.
Because it's 86 different trace minerals. Yeah.
Right. And it acts, it has a binding component.

Speaker 1 So you put fulvic acid instead of like methyl folate or yes, just because not everyone can take methyl folate, right i like folinic acid so folinic acid i love too yes love yes love so so you know i'll do things like this with people and um really just have their their day regulated because i can't if i could go live with everyone from nine to five i'd be able to tell them what's going on or their roadblock in about a week but i can't go do that with everybody that's awesome so i have to rely on their description of their life to me and so i regulate their diet make sure they have a water filter they have good air filters I make sure they're on the right basic supplements then to open drainage the right supplements, very targeted, streamlined protocol without a lot of extra supplementation.

Speaker 1 And then, you know, I really look at their mindset as well. I have to do, I have a mindset and a health coach who's wonderful, who is a specialist in heart math, specialist in favor of insulation.

Speaker 1 Yeah. And I have to talk to these people about this.
Yeah. Because I believe all autoimmunity comes from an imbalance in the autonomic nervous system.

Speaker 2 I believe that. I believe in that too.

Speaker 2 So

Speaker 2 let's move on to another big invader. I mean, guys, there's so many things we're going to talk about, like

Speaker 2 breast implants. I mean, there's just so many things.

Speaker 2 But I want to talk about Lyme and viral pathogens, too, because I've had some experience with these. And

Speaker 2 I think this is another one that very often hides and doesn't manifest itself. And it's terrible for the people that have it.

Speaker 2 I think the lucky ones are the ones that get the symptoms that are so severe that they actually can't do anything but figure it out and then they find it.

Speaker 2 It's the people that actually have, because it hides in the dorsal reganglion, right?

Speaker 1 It hides the fascia and the lymph, the joint fluid, so many things.

Speaker 2 Yeah, and then it has these,

Speaker 2 you know, periods of being dormant or latent and then, you know, periods where it surges. And what's incredible is you can do a test and you're, you know, remissive or you only have an IgG, like a

Speaker 2 response. And then a few weeks later, you're IgM positive.
You didn't like re-catch Lyme. It just, you know, like Epstein-Barr, you know, it's not really something you caught.

Speaker 2 You've always had it, right? It can flare back up. Yes.
And so

Speaker 2 it flares, and then they have all of these symptoms. And usually

Speaker 2 they seem related to completely different systems. They're, you know, the joint pain,

Speaker 2 inflammation,

Speaker 2 intermittent tinnitus, neuropathic symptoms, tingling, numbness, you know, all of these different

Speaker 2 symptoms that, and we always go to the system

Speaker 2 that links to the system, the symptom.

Speaker 2 And by that, I mean you got these paresthesias. We're after the nervous system.
Um, you know, you have crushing fatigue, you know, and we're looking at the blood. And then we, you know, you have a

Speaker 2 brain fog. Now we're, we're looking at a mental issue.
And, and the truth is, it's, it's like, I say this a lot, you know, it's usually one thing that causes everything.

Speaker 2 You know, it's the one thing that's at the hub of the wheel and it's causing all of these symptoms. So when you, when when you test and find somebody who's got a Lyme infection,

Speaker 2 what's the approach there?

Speaker 1 Right. So, mold and Lyme often run together, known as biotoxin illness, and they have

Speaker 1 overlapping symptomatology. But for Lyme, you're right, three major symptoms, brain fog, fatigue, and migrating joint pains.
And you said so many things that I want to touch on here.

Speaker 1 Lyme disease is caused by the bacteria called a spirochete. It's corkscrew-shaped.

Speaker 1 Remember, form follows function. So, you've got to think of it, what else is corkscrew-shaped? Syphilis, neurosyphilis burrows into the brain.
So can Lyme. H.
pylori burrows into the gut lining.

Speaker 1 So can Lyme. It burrows.
The form follows its corkscrew-shaped function. Now, when you put it on something, someone on something like monotherapy like doxycycline, an antibiotic for Lyme.

Speaker 2 21 days.

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 1 Lyme is smart. This is a bacteria that has been around as long as humans.

Speaker 1 It rolls into an L-shaped form, which is a sphere, and lowers its metabolism and dives deeper into the tissues with just doxycycline. So I'm not a fan of monotherapy for Lyme disease at all.

Speaker 1 And it's called the great mimicker. So a lot of things like lupus, rheumatoid arthritis, oftentimes are Lyme masquerading and high

Speaker 2 almost always with rheumatoid arthritis.

Speaker 2 What is fascinating is our clinical team found three

Speaker 2 clients, I call them clients, they're patients of theirs,

Speaker 2 that have been diagnosed with

Speaker 2 Parkinson's that actually had chronic west nile infections.

Speaker 1 Oh my gosh.

Speaker 2 And when you actually look at the literature and you look at the symptomology, they're like pill rolling tremors, dystyaticokinesia, flexor dystonia, mood collapse.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 you run that symptom down to the wrong

Speaker 2 qualified neurologists and they're like, you have Parkinson's. And then there's usually nothing that's definitively diagnostic.
It's not like a brain scan. There it is, right?

Speaker 2 You don't see the amyloids or something.

Speaker 2 you know it it sort of evades capture and it like you say it masquerades at something else and now the sad thing is you're on this pathway to being treated for a chronic disease that you do not have yes and and and the invaders still

Speaker 1 you know that's right in the house it's like the enemies put on your uniform similarly i had an a ls patient who swam in the red tide right before his diagnosis

Speaker 1 so these fungal infections and lime disease often run together and look like these neurodegenerative conditions in people um with heavy metals mixed in for good measure usually too unfortunately yeah so so with patients with Lyme, you know, I get a test.

Speaker 1 I like a number of them. I like tickborne 1.0 and 1.2 by vibrant, the tick born test, but it's by vibrant.
I like iogenics, which is the gold standard for alternative testing for criteria for Lyme.

Speaker 1 And I like Armin Labs too. Armin Labs is great out of Germany.

Speaker 1 And so, you know, the thing about Lyme that people have to know is it's usually indirect antibody testing, which means we look at these bands and see if these bands are possible. positive.

Speaker 1 Two of the most sensitive bands were removed by the CDC in the early 90s because they came up with a Lyme vaccine.

Speaker 1 It failed miserably because it had side effects and they had to pull it off the market.

Speaker 1 And the reason they took the bands off was because people who are vaccinated for the Lyme disease popped off positive on these two bands on the testing. So they couldn't have that happen, but

Speaker 1 they never put the bands back. So the CDC criteria for testing is often very stringent and misses the mark because of that.
So the functional testing, we've put those bans in

Speaker 1 and it's a little more accurate to get a positive diagnosis.

Speaker 2 Now, a lot of- You're not saying there's corruption in the governmental regulatory bodies.

Speaker 2 Okay, go ahead.

Speaker 1 So, yeah, so you know, there's no agenda at all. So, you know, you have to know this about people.

Speaker 1 And then another thing is if their immune systems are immunosuppressed, which is a lot of people today, this is a lot of people who are sick with lowered immune systems, their body is not going to produce a positive ban because the immune system is suppressed on this test.

Speaker 1 So we take all this with symptomatology, with their story, with everything else for a positive diagnosis.

Speaker 2 So I'm going to make sure that I link those tests in the show notes because

Speaker 2 discovering is the first stop, right? Yes.

Speaker 2 So once you want now, once you find it,

Speaker 2 there's got to be a lot of similarities to mold, mycotoxin, detox, and Lyme detox. A thousand percent.
I mean, I think that your best,

Speaker 2 I always believe that your best choice is to empower the immune system to do what it does best.

Speaker 2 Even though Lyme's a formidable adversary, you need to help it out.

Speaker 2 So, what are the ways that you provoke it and

Speaker 2 then kill it?

Speaker 1 Yeah. There's actually, you said provoke it, Ramon.
There's another line test called DNA connections where you go get an infrared sauna or you get a lymph massage and then you pee.

Speaker 1 And it gets a positive test because you provocated the bacteria out of the hidden tissues with the massage of the sauna.

Speaker 2 Right. I do the same thing with metals, right? I mean,

Speaker 2 I've actually done, I got this water machine from this doctor that I trusted who told me it was restructuring my water. It wasn't.
It was a Chinese welder.

Speaker 2 And this Chinese welder that I was running my water through, which I never, ever, ever do. I'm such a psycho about testing, but I didn't test this machine because the doctors

Speaker 2 were so qualified.

Speaker 2 So I just said, yeah, send me one. I started drinking this water two to four liters a day, and I started having symptoms of metal toxicity.
And lo and behold, I had heavy metal toxicity.

Speaker 2 And the same metals that were in this machine were in my blood, but one in my urine. But one of the ways that we found it, you know, some of the testing that I did showed very scant levels.

Speaker 2 And then I did a chelation provocation. Yes.
And what did you use?

Speaker 1 DMSO or DMPS?

Speaker 2 DMPS, DMSO, EDTA. Yeah, EDTA.
EDTA.

Speaker 1 Yes.

Speaker 2 And so we provoked it

Speaker 2 with a chelation. And then I did an eight-hour urine afterwards, and it was off the charts.

Speaker 2 And so I think these provocations sometimes are really good ways to say, because remember, not everything is just like floating around the blood waiting to be discovered, right?

Speaker 2 I mean, it leaves and enters the tissues. You know,

Speaker 2 it hides. It goes into dorsal root ganglions.
It goes into fascia.

Speaker 1 Yes. It's like you got to kick the dust up at the contraction side.

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah. Some of the metal tests now are, you know, lights through the palm of the hand.
I forget what it's called.

Speaker 2 You know, but it's looking for the metals in the tissues, not in the blood. And I think this is another way that these things evade.

Speaker 2 capture.

Speaker 2 Well, they at least evade detection.

Speaker 1 Yes, you have to

Speaker 1 have an acute poisoning for a metal to show up in the blood. That's what conventional medicine needs to understand when they test for metals.

Speaker 1 So for me, once once I get a positive on a Lyme test, depending on what test it is, I then break the news to the person, they often think that they can't heal.

Speaker 1 They often think you can't put it in remission.

Speaker 2 Everybody thinks Lyme's permanent. Yeah, but it's not.

Speaker 1 It's not. 1,000%.

Speaker 1 And so, you know, another thing I like to tell people is the German studies have now shown that you can get Lyme disease from mosquitoes.

Speaker 2 Really? I need to look at that because I'm in the middle of the moment.

Speaker 1 If the larvae is a full mosquito, it can stay in mosquitoes. The German studies have proved it now.

Speaker 2 Okay, because I have often thought there's not just a tick-borne illness. That's right.
No doubt.

Speaker 1 You can get it through childbirth. You can get it through, they think it's sexually transmitted, just like syphilis.
It's a cousin of syphilis, actually. So a number of different ways.

Speaker 1 And I am of the belief that most people have been exposed to spirochetes. What is the difference between my body and your body and someone who has full-blown Lyme? A lot of it is the nervous system.

Speaker 1 A lot of it is their toxin bucket and their stress, right? So that's why I start there with them. When that's taken care of, we don't need nearly as long.

Speaker 1 And most of the time, people's livers are stagnant, people's bowel is stagnant, and they can't sweat when they're full of Lyme and metals.

Speaker 1 They're all jammed up and they can't release anything and they're just toxic.

Speaker 1 And so if I can rattle that body awake and put it back in homeostasis, sometimes that's the worst part for people in the very beginning to kind of get them stable.

Speaker 1 Get them sweating again, get their liver working, get their bile working, get their lymph moving, and then bam, I'll give them something like biocidin, something like Para1 or Para2, something like Parafy,

Speaker 1 mix with fembendazo or ivermectin sometimes if they need it. And then wait an hour or so, take a binder, something like fulvic or humic acid, because you don't want to bind up

Speaker 1 any any of the killing protocol right so you have to wait a little while

Speaker 1 oh take the fenbendazole the ivermectin allow it to work its way through the gut and then put the binder on it i got you and then get an asana and then we're going to kick some dust up at the construction site but guess what hopefully you have the binder in your system it's enough to mop up those things we're kicking up so you don't go to the brain to cause neuroinflammation and irritation and then if you're pooping your liver's working you're sweating we're going to get those right out of the body immediately yeah and the and and so like the ivermectin and the fenbendazole those are, those are, those are going to irritate it.

Speaker 1 Or, you know, for some people, they can, right?

Speaker 1 Some people like, I mean, you can give people sometimes any sort of supplement. Like I can give people GABA sometimes and it turns to glutamate and makes them irritated or anxious, right?

Speaker 1 So any supplement cannot do what you think it's going to do in someone's body when they're really toxic and their body's overall confused because there's interleukins and TGF beta and all these different chemical communicators that are pro-inflammatory that make the body confused and not work in a proper symphony as it's supposed to.

Speaker 2 So if if you're doing the um

Speaker 2 nervous system regulation you're doing the detoxification you're doing some of the binders giving them support um you know supplement wise what are some of the external modalities that you're a big fan of i know you're a big fan of ozone yeah but what mechanism for ozone like hocat

Speaker 1 i do love ho cat okay i love that i love one i have love ozone saunas i owned one i owned one um and i love that you know and not everyone can handle ozone right you know people hurts from ozone because it's a killing protocol so your drainage and your nervous system do need to be regulated before you go try an ozone iv unless you're doing ebu which is extra blood uh let's see

Speaker 1 yeah extra blood corprio

Speaker 1 i can't even remember let's see oxygen nation

Speaker 1 yeah i don't think ozone oxygen ebo2 yeah yeah there you go but what it does is it filters everything first and then it runs ozone through everything almost like dialysis with ozone through the whole body and so people will handle that better because of the filtering i do love ozone when the time is ready ready.

Speaker 1 But in general, most of the time I'm calming people down. So I'm using calming modalities.

Speaker 1 Tai Chi and Qigong are something else I use for people sometimes just to feel their body and feel their energy.

Speaker 2 Right. No, so good.

Speaker 1 And then I use a lot of things you do too, Gary.

Speaker 2 A lot.

Speaker 1 I don't use the same biohacks you do, for sure.

Speaker 2 That makes me feel good. I mean, I've done EBO too.
I did three sessions when I found out about the metals. What was really interesting is, you know, the collection container,

Speaker 2 I was talking to

Speaker 2 the clinic, and I was like, can you send that to the lab? I want to see what's in it because ideally, I'd love to see that full of toxins and mold and metals and everything else.

Speaker 2 And they said, Well, it's you know, thousands of dollars to get it tested. And I was like, Just send it to the lab as urine, you know, just as urine.

Speaker 2 So, of course, we sent it as urine, then it comes back to them and kidney failure because of my

Speaker 2 you know, blood renitrogen created. Like, yeah, but so I ignored that part, but um, but what was in there? I actually, I should actually, I don't mind sharing my test.
Um, you should, What came out?

Speaker 2 Glyphosates, bisphenols, aflatoxin A, aflatoxin B, microplastics.

Speaker 2 I mean,

Speaker 2 everything that

Speaker 2 that filter works

Speaker 2 because it was able to filter those things out, put them in the collection container, and then it does lower dose ozone, but it's circular.

Speaker 2 I think it's only four gamma or something, four or five gamma. Yeah.

Speaker 2 Whereas an ozone IZ V will do 65 gamma, but it's low gamma and then it runs it through the light filter. I felt amazing by my third one.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I just think you have to watch the sugars, you know, because ozone has a mechanism. I'm not sure what it is, but it really pulls the glucose out of the blood and dumps it into the cell.
Yep.

Speaker 2 Yeah, and so you're

Speaker 2 from like 130 to in the high 70s.

Speaker 1 Vitamin C will do that too. Yeah.
It will do that as well.

Speaker 2 Yeah, that's why I run those soups.

Speaker 1 Do you know about inupheresis?

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 1 this is a filtering of the entire serum. They do it in Germany, clinics in Germany and Switzerland where they do biological medicine.

Speaker 2 Is that total plasma exchange? Yes. Oh, okay.
Yeah, I've done TV. You have done TV.
Yeah, yeah, there's a clinic here called Next Health TV.

Speaker 1 I didn't think inupheresis, I didn't think they had anything. Maybe it's a little different.
I didn't think they had anything in the U.S. Yeah, maybe.
There's a clinic in Sarasota getting it.

Speaker 2 Is there? Okay. Yeah, this is,

Speaker 2 you know, they took two liters of plasma out and then replaced it with sterile albumin. So they exchanged the plasma for

Speaker 2 albumin. And I did it right.
I did it in LA, And then I had a 16-hour flight to Dubai, thankfully, because I was very tired. But then the next day, boom.

Speaker 2 I mean, like, I was so, I got off that plane and I was wide awake. I was ready to like solve global peace.
You know, I was.

Speaker 1 That's my next biohack I'm doing for sure. For sure, for sure, for sure.

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, the total plasma exchange. Yeah.

Speaker 1 So, so back to the line patients, really quick. You know, my trademark protocol is Killbind Sweat.
It sounds like I'm an SM doctor.

Speaker 2 Killbine Sweat.

Speaker 1 It went viral online because people were like, what the heck is that?

Speaker 1 But really, that's taking herbal antimicrobial that I was talking about, waiting an hour, taking a binder, and then getting in a sauna because you can sweat out microplastics. You can sweat out BPA.

Speaker 1 You can sweat out a lot of these mycotoxins. You can sweat out a lot of man-made industrial toxins in general.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 I think, I mean, look, the jury's in on sauna. I mean, there's no question.

Speaker 2 I mean, as a, as a, as a standalone modality, I don't know that there's anything that has as much data behind it as dry sauna for all-cause mortality, for reducing toxic load.

Speaker 2 I mean, there's that, it's so, I, I, I'm in there every day.

Speaker 1 There's actually a small study, it's very small, but it says that you can sweat out certain metals, specifically cadmium.

Speaker 2 Get this iron.

Speaker 1 What? And sorry, lead? Cadmium, lead, which we thought stored in the bones. It doesn't, you can sweat it out according to the study and mercury.

Speaker 2 So that is amazing. Yeah.

Speaker 2 Dr. Petrus, this, I feel like I could just talk to you all all day.
I'm definitely going to have you back on.

Speaker 1 I would love.

Speaker 2 this is this is amazing so um i want to take a few minutes and go into uh a private room with my vip community you know these are these are the folks that i'm the most intentional with and really trying to build a community wait i want to be in your vip community well you're about to go in there right now we're going to go into the vip community

Speaker 2 if you're interested in becoming a vip member you can just go over to theultimatehuman.com and sign up to be a vip member this is the community i'm the most intentional in we do private podcasts in there we do a lot of uh group um uh QAs.

Speaker 2 You know, I have a few hours of QAs with this group. I bring experts on like Dr.

Speaker 2 Petross, and we pick different topics and we isolate gut health or brain health or mold or mycotoxins or heavy metals or autoimmune. And we pick different topics and we take deep dives.

Speaker 2 There's lots of resources in there. So go over to theultimatehuman.com and just sign up to be a VIP member.
You'll see Dr. Jessica Petross in there in a few minutes.

Speaker 2 But I wind down all of my podcasts by asking every guest the same question. So there's no right or wrong answer to this question.
And it is, what does it mean to you to be an ultimate human?

Speaker 1 I love that. It's almost like the ultimate human is the ultimate pinnacle of wellness.
So what is wellness to me? Wellness is the absence of disease and the

Speaker 1 you're full of vitality and energy and happiness and satisfaction with your choices and your life. And the ultimate human, it's mental, it's emotional, and it's physical well-being.

Speaker 1 And in all those areas, in that wellness will, you are satisfied and feel full. And to me, that is being the ultimate human because in this human experience, we all have failures.

Speaker 1 We all make mistakes. We're not perfect.

Speaker 1 And so how can we grow through that to become a better person and the full potential of ourselves? That's the ultimate human.

Speaker 2 That's amazing. I mean, I truly believe God meant for us to thrive, right? He wanted us to thrive.
So that's an amazing answer. Dr.
Petross, thank you so much.

Speaker 2 Thank you for coming on to the ultimate human.

Speaker 2 You're super welcome. So, we'll head into the VIP group.
And until next time, guys, that's just science.