And, I’m Talking To You About Tariffs

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Speaker 28 So the International Monetary Fund just announced that California is the fourth largest economy in the world.

Speaker 28 Only Germany and China and the United States have a larger economic output than the state of California. That's the good news.

Speaker 28 The bad news is there's no state in America that is more impacted by uncertainty and these tariffs imposed unilaterally by Donald Trump and the Trump administration.

Speaker 28 The impacts of that, of course, are felt small businesses, medium-sized large businesses, consumers,

Speaker 28 as well as supply chains, not just in our state, but all across this country and around around the world.

Speaker 28 So today we'll be exploring the impacts, real life impacts on real people, impacts in states large and small, from Montana to Minnesota to here in the great state of California.

Speaker 28 Tune in to this live program on the impacts of Donald Trump's tariffs in America.

Speaker 28 This is Gavin Newsom. Let's talk tariffs.

Speaker 28 Hey, Beth.

Speaker 29 I am trying to get my phone turned off. I just got this phone.
I don't know what to do.

Speaker 28 What is it? Android or an iPhone?

Speaker 29 It's an iPhone, but it's the new one.

Speaker 28 You're good. It's smart to buy it now and not in a few months when it's twice the price.

Speaker 29 It won't be twice the price. They're exempt from tariffs.

Speaker 28 That's right, because they made a phone call. Crony capitalism, Beth.
That's a whole nother conversation. Well, Breth, thanks for joining us.

Speaker 28 You're in Minnesota. Where are you exactly in Minnesota?

Speaker 29 I am in southeast Minnesota, Zambroda, 50 minutes south of the Twin Cities.

Speaker 28 And tell us a little bit about your business and when when you started it and the impacts of these tariffs.

Speaker 29 Yeah, I started my business eight years ago, right after my son was born.

Speaker 29 I had an idea for a baby product that solves a problem all new parents have of babies just dropping and throwing all their stuff.

Speaker 29 I made what I now know to be a prototype for myself and one of my friends who had a baby, and she forgot it and said, you should make this thing for real because I didn't realize how awful it was until I didn't have your mat thingy.

Speaker 29 So I invented the busy baby mat. It's just a silicone place mat that suctions to the high chair and has tethers that you can use to attach

Speaker 29 baby's things.

Speaker 29 Since that time, eight years ago, I was able to go on Shark Tank and show the world my invention.

Speaker 29 And from that, I was able to tell my brother to quit his job and join me in the business. And the two of us have expanded the product line now to eight products that all have the same mission.

Speaker 29 keep baby's things within reach off the ground at home and on the go.

Speaker 28 I love it. And you source your products from where? Where do you get the materials?

Speaker 30 Where do you get most of your supply?

Speaker 29 Yeah, we are 100% in China.

Speaker 28 100%. And did you look around? I mean, was it China first or it's just where it's sort of the dominant manufacturing occurs?

Speaker 29 No, we actually tried for a year and a half to manufacture in the U.S. And there's a lot of obstacles to that.
One is the raw material is not sourced in the U.S. So that has to be imported.

Speaker 29 We learned this morning, we've been continuing to find ways to manufacture in the U.S. and had a great meeting this morning with a silicone manufacturer here in New York.

Speaker 29 And we're still learning more. It's still not viable for us.
However, we're continuing to try.

Speaker 29 But the main obstacle is when you have a startup, when you are brand new, we're not making 20,000 units. We're not making 200,000 units or many companies, a million units.

Speaker 29 I was trying to get 2,000 units because this was a product that never existed before. I didn't even know if people were going to buy this item.

Speaker 29 I knew it was a good idea, but I didn't know if my fellow Americans would think it was a good idea.

Speaker 29 So there were no American factories that were willing and able to do this project on such a small scale to start. So we did have to start in China.
They were willing to do that with us.

Speaker 28 And so the impacts are immediate. The 145% tariffs.
I mean,

Speaker 28 what has that meant? I mean, is there sort of a dollar figure? Do you recall the first invoice purchase order came back and looked at that delta? And how did you respond?

Speaker 29 You know, it's more immediate than that. I could literally lose my home in less than three months.
So, I'll walk you through that real quick.

Speaker 29 This last six months has been amazing for us. I got a contract with Walmart.
I got a contract with Target. We're in both stores now.

Speaker 29 Minnesota awarded me SBA Small Business Person of the Year.

Speaker 29 It's been a really sunshiny last six months. I booked my flight with my eight-year-old son to take him to DC to get this award on May 5th.

Speaker 29 And then, nine days later, as my products were two days shy of being picked up to put on a container to come to the US, these tariffs came out. The announcement came out.

Speaker 29 So what I was expecting to pay 20, maybe $30,000 worth of tariffs, that's what I budgeted for, now is going to cost me $230,000 to bring into our country.

Speaker 29 I have maybe two months worth of inventory left in my warehouse here. And when that is gone, I have no more revenue.
I have no money coming in to pay my employees.

Speaker 29 I have no money coming in to pay my bills.

Speaker 29 The other American businesses that I support through my company, my marketing teams, my bookkeeping, my accounting, everyone who helps me run this business, all American companies, my transportation team that was going to bring that container to me, I can't pay any of them anymore.

Speaker 29 And the worst thing is I can't pay my loan. And when I got the contracts for Target and Walmart, I took a big business risk.
And a lot of us small businesses do this.

Speaker 29 I leveraged my home to be able to buy the inventory to support these contracts because that was the next big milestone step in our business. And now I am at

Speaker 29 grave danger of not being able to get my products here, not being able to continue to sell and have the cash flow that I've counted on, and not be able to pay on those loans, which means I could lose my house where my children live and my ability to keep them safe and feed them.

Speaker 29 That's how real this is for me in this moment.

Speaker 28 Sabeth, I mean, boy, I mean, you, you, you, you paint the ultimate picture.

Speaker 28 I mean, just the, the deep reality and, and, and, and, you know, in the fact that it was because of your kids that inspired this business in the first place. And now your home is at risk.

Speaker 28 Everything about that is an extraordinary picture of pain, of the pain and anxiety that you're going through. I mean,

Speaker 28 and forgive me, I mean,

Speaker 28 the options for you are what then right now?

Speaker 28 Do you, you called Walmart back in Target and you say, can you help?

Speaker 28 Is there a strategy there so they float 90-day invoices or something? I mean, is there a strategy that you can see an alternative if this continues?

Speaker 29 Right now with those retailers, I actually have their inventory here. That's why I had to take that big risk early on was you have to order the...
the products in bulk so that I have them here.

Speaker 29 So every week when they place their order, I have something to send them. So currently their product is here that should support us six months with those retailers.

Speaker 29 I did have the opportunity to expand. Walmart wanted to take on another product this year in November.
I had to call my buyer and say, I don't know if I can do that right now.

Speaker 29 As of right now, I cannot add another item. I cannot expand.

Speaker 29 And because of the situation we're in, if I can't get my products here, I'm going to have to just sell the products that I have set aside for Target and Walmart just to get some revenue in the door to keep paying my employees.

Speaker 29 So

Speaker 29 Walmart's been great. They have offered to, you know, let's just see how this goes.
We'll be patient.

Speaker 29 You know, they're not going to push the timelines that normally they're very strict to with suppliers.

Speaker 29 Let's just kind of see how this goes for a little bit. And, you know, they kind of said, we got you.
We'll figure it out.

Speaker 28 So, what, did you, and I'm curious, just, you know, and I don't mean this to be political,

Speaker 28 but when Trump was elected, he talked about these tariffs on China. Obviously, his

Speaker 28 first term, he advanced tariffs on China. So you must have anticipated something, but did this come as a complete shock, how quickly this happened, the level of the tariff, meaning how large it was?

Speaker 28 Give me a sense of how you prepared a little bit over the course last few months.

Speaker 29 Yeah, prior to this administration, we didn't pay a tariff ever. In my eight years in business, we've never paid a tariff.
We pay taxes, we pay duty, we've never paid a tariff for baby items.

Speaker 29 When the administration came in, knowing that they had talked about bringing in tariffs, we expected a reasonable tariff, 20 to maybe 30%. And we looked at our numbers and decided we can support that.

Speaker 29 It's going to be tough, but we can stay alive and support that. We budgeted for that.
We did not budget for 145%.

Speaker 28 No, I mean, no one can. No one can.
Well, Beth, I can't impress upon you how grateful I am.

Speaker 28 that you had the courage to come on the show and thank you for showing up and not just for yourself and your family, for your eight-year-old and your brother and your employees, but for others in your circumstance and your position.

Speaker 28 I think, you know, all of us out here in California, we're not only rooting for you, we have your back. We initiated a lawsuit to push back against the Trump administration.

Speaker 28 I mean, even in the conservative side, the Koch brothers are aligned in that as it relates to

Speaker 28 how this unilateral action by... Donald Trump is simply illegal.
And so we're asserting ourselves very aggressively in that space so you can get some clarity.

Speaker 28 But I'm curious, just, you know, as you look out over the course of the next days and weeks with all that anxiety and your house looming over this conversation, I mean, you got a week or how many weeks, how many months do you think you could hold on with this level of uncertainty before you just have to make a real decision that may be sort of closing up shop, so to speak?

Speaker 29 There's no closing up shop for me. I am a tenure Army veteran.
I am not a quitter. I am one who adapts and overcomes.

Speaker 29 got about two weeks until we need to make critical decisions where we now out, we sell to other countries.

Speaker 29 Babies are everywhere. We've lined up some distribution in Australia, in Dubai, in South Korea, and Canada.
That if we don't have a resolution in two weeks where we can bring our products to the U.S.

Speaker 29 and sell to our fellow Americans, then we're going to have to... you know, make that decision to sell outside of our country, which is going to be much more difficult for us.
It's all unknown to me.

Speaker 29 I've had to learn this business from scratch, and now I need to learn international distribution like this. But I'm up for the challenge if I have to.

Speaker 29 But what I really need is, I need our

Speaker 29 representatives to stand up for us and stand up for Americans. In my district, I have a Republican congressman who will not even talk to me.

Speaker 29 And

Speaker 29 I was at, I just watched your podcast with my governor that you recently did, and I was actually at the Capitol this week for Governor Wallace's State of the State address.

Speaker 29 And what I saw broke my heart and

Speaker 29 has me just feeling so depressed because we need our politicians to stand up for Americans when Wallace was talking about the achievements of our state in the last year.

Speaker 29 And one of them in Minnesota is free breakfast and free lunch for our students because science has shown well-fed kids have better outcomes.

Speaker 29 This is a great thing. One half of the room was standing and clapping, the other half of the room was sitting cross-armed with ugly faces.

Speaker 29 And I saw the opposite thing on the president's State of the Union address where one side is clapping and the other side is pouting. And right now, we don't need that.

Speaker 29 We need our representatives to come together for Americans. We need Americans to come together.

Speaker 29 I am feeling so much hate from my fellow Americans who think that because I make my products in China, that I am evil and that I deserve to fail.

Speaker 29 And where we learn things in our lives, you know, my children, I'm trying to teach them kindness. I'm trying to teach them love.
They learn from me.

Speaker 29 As an adult, we learn from our bosses and from our leaders. And right now, what we're leading, what we're learning from our politicians is to be divided, to be hardlined one way or the other.

Speaker 29 And if I'm on this side, I can't possibly celebrate something accomplished on the other side.

Speaker 29 And now the American people who should be coming together and supporting one another and loving one another, I had a woman tell me on TikTok that I am going to fail and I deserve it.

Speaker 29 No one deserves to fail. No one deserves to lose their house, the roof over their children's home.
No one.

Speaker 29 And so, you know, I need our politicians to come together and support the Americans and stop fighting each other. and work together for the American people.

Speaker 28 I personally love that in ways you don't even fully perhaps appreciate. My first three guests on this podcast were all conservatives that were all supporters of Trump.

Speaker 28 And I made exactly the point you just made. At the end of the day, we all want to be protected, connected, respected.
We can't continue to continue to talk down to each other, past one another.

Speaker 28 We're all in this together. We're all better off.
We're all better off. So I really appreciate that sentiment.
I appreciate you have no, I'm an entrepreneur. I love, love your entrepreneurial passion.

Speaker 28 The fact you putting everything on the line and putting a human face on this topic is inspiring. And I ain't worried about you failing.

Speaker 28 You got that gene. You got that grit that defines the best.
So thank you, Beth, for joining us. Yeah.

Speaker 29 Thanks for letting me use my voice to stand up for small businesses.

Speaker 28 Here, here. We appreciate you.

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Speaker 28 Hey, Jennifer.

Speaker 32 Good morning, Governor.

Speaker 28 Where are you? What's that background? I love it.

Speaker 32 Oh, fabulous. I'm in my restaurant.
I live and own and operate a restaurant in Crescent City, California, which is up in Del Nort County.

Speaker 32 I believe you visited last, about a year ago, up in this region.

Speaker 28 I used to go up there as a kid with my father, and one of the great gifts last year is bringing my four kids up there and walking in the same footsteps as I walked as a young child.

Speaker 28 There are few places, anyone listening, there are few places on planet Earth that are are more spectacular than where you operate your restaurant. The absolute physical beauty is extraordinary.
And so

Speaker 28 I love it up there and I appreciate you're running a restaurant up there, which is in and of itself amazing and remarkable.

Speaker 28 And I imagine with all of the uncertainty and announcements, and we just saw some new tourism numbers

Speaker 28 already

Speaker 28 coming in that show a decline in tourism across our state state that these tariffs have had an impact on your business?

Speaker 32 Yes. So

Speaker 32 in the area, just so the listeners know where I live, we're up at the very top coastal corner of California, extremely remote, extremely rugged, and

Speaker 32 rural, of course. And this area is historically economically depressed.
We get injections of money into this area primarily through tourism. It is one of the driving forces.

Speaker 32 And so, most of the businesses in this entire county get, you know, we have booming summers where our population with tourism increases exponentially. Our town population is only 7,000.

Speaker 32 The entire county population is 27,000. I mean, very sparsely populated.
We have a lot of trees and rivers, not a lot of people.

Speaker 32 And in the summer, in July, our town population can go up to 30,000 with people coming to explore the beaches and so forth. So those tourism dollars are what keep this local economy going primarily.

Speaker 32 And every business is affected positively by the influx of tourism. My demographic, you know, we're a small restaurant.
We're right on the beach. We have incredible local support.

Speaker 32 Our local community, really, they're here for us and we're here for them. But there just aren't enough people locally to sustain all of our restaurants and hotels and so forth.

Speaker 32 So, that influx in the summer keeps us flowing all year, even though it's only

Speaker 32 a part of the year. And the tourism, you know, we're expecting a 29% decrease in international tourism.

Speaker 32 In the summertime, Governor, my demographic is between 75 and 90% tourists visiting my restaurant. And that's not just my restaurant.

Speaker 32 Those are the numbers I have real, you know, tangibility in, but it's every restaurant in this area.

Speaker 32 And when we take up to 90% 90% of my cash inflow, decrease it by about 30% due to specifically and directly because of the tariffs, that's something that, you know, we're having trouble anticipating how we're going to navigate that.

Speaker 32 And the other part of that, of course, is cost of goods and services.

Speaker 32 We run a New Orleans, you see the sign behind me here, New Orleans, Cajun and Creole-style restaurants. So the bulk of my menu, we make everything from scratch.

Speaker 32 So we're using, you know, whole onions, tomatoes, spices, and then a lot of seafood. And shrimp is expected to go up.
We get a farm report forecast from our food distributor.

Speaker 32 Shrimp is expected to increase up to 46%

Speaker 32 directly because of tariffs. Most of my menu we can expect to go up about 25%.
This is tomatoes, onions, garlic, spices, just everyday things.

Speaker 32 And while we can adjust, of course, we'll have to increase menu prices, as will every restaurant everywhere. So, we can increase, and that feels

Speaker 32 it makes me sad for my local community. But then, when we decrease the tourism coming in, it's a double blow, and not just a double blow, but has that ripple effect that goes far and wide.

Speaker 32 If I speak only to my community, this rural community whose sports teams, you know, Little League and the marching band and different things rely on the local businesses supporting them.

Speaker 32 And this economic impact is so far-reaching. I'm an eternal optimist.
I'm always someone that figures things out and we look for solutions. This one is

Speaker 32 more

Speaker 32 difficult to see our way through it at this time.

Speaker 28 I appreciate it. You said two things that are important.
You talked about community. I mean, community at the end of the day,

Speaker 28 It's not something you can manufacture. It's a sense of pride.

Speaker 28 It's that connection to, as you say, these organizations and your neighbors where magical moments are created in your restaurant and friends and relationships are formed.

Speaker 28 And you're such a big part of that and a vibrant part of that. But you also highlighting something that's often overlooked, and that is tariffs impact tourism.

Speaker 28 And people don't necessarily connect that dot. as easily as they should or as consequentially as they must.
And when you say 29%, was that an analysis that was done by your regional chamber?

Speaker 28 Is that on the basis of what you're already seeing in terms of decline of visitorship that you would otherwise expect this time of year?

Speaker 32 This time of year, we would start seeing a lot of international tourism, a lot of people from Europe in particular. Later in the season, we see a lot more Asian

Speaker 32 tourists coming in. But as you said, Redwood National Park, which is here, draws people from all over the world.
We have the remaining 1% of old-growth Redwood, and that is really something to see.

Speaker 32 So, my 29% came from the economic forecast out of the larger chamber

Speaker 32 anticipation for how that's going to impact. And in this rural

Speaker 32 region of the world, I'm speaking to my county specifically, but this whole north coast is very rural. And so there's about five counties that all see the same economic impact.

Speaker 32 And it's this entire northwest

Speaker 32 region of California, Humboldt County, Delnort County, Mendocino County, Lake County, Trinity.

Speaker 32 You know, it's a huge portion of the state that is going to feel and reel from the effects of a lack of people wanting to come here directly because of the tariffs.

Speaker 28 So, Jennifer, you've weathered a lot.

Speaker 28 You got through COVID, which is extraordinary.

Speaker 28 You've got that entrepreneurial energy

Speaker 28 and as you said yourself, and it's self-evident to anyone listening or watching, you've got such a spirit of positivity. I mean, how do you...
How do you sort of game this out?

Speaker 28 I mean, what's the strategy for you?

Speaker 28 Are you looking at potentially layoffs? You can only pass through so much cost. Obviously, on the customer side, if they're not coming in, the fixed cost could devour even

Speaker 28 any variable menu prices.

Speaker 28 What's their strategy?

Speaker 28 How are you gaming this out in the next few months?

Speaker 32 Yeah, well, you know, it's a day-by-day,

Speaker 32 where can we pivot? Where can we pivot?

Speaker 32 Restaurants historically have a very tiny profit margin.

Speaker 32 And as a small business, as are most businesses in my community, we don't have the luxury that chains have to be able to absorb some of that impact because of other stores. So how do we navigate that?

Speaker 32 Of course, you know, increasing

Speaker 32 as needed. We don't like to do that, but things happen.

Speaker 32 Cutting costs wherever we can, cutting labor. You know, we as owner operators, we work 15 hours a day laboring in our restaurant, and it's a labor of love.

Speaker 32 I don't say that with anything except gratitude. But there are only so many hours in the day and so looking, you know, it adds more work to the people that we employ.

Speaker 32 So the way we're navigating this is looking at other ways we can bring money to

Speaker 32 the restaurant. So creating other events, you know, community events, things like that, always looking at what's working and trying to trim what isn't working, really making our menu hyper-efficient.

Speaker 32 We got our restaurant two days before the COVID shutdowns.

Speaker 32 And so it was an

Speaker 32 incredible lesson in business management in a very short time. And so we've learned to pivot, but that's not always easy when things are changing so rapidly.

Speaker 32 And as we are gearing up for our summer season, you know, it's really just again becoming hyper-efficient, hyper-educated.

Speaker 32 We rely on what's called the farm report forecast so we can look at

Speaker 32 where we can trim costs, you know, at some point in the day. There's only so much we can do.
And then we just try to ride it out with the support of our, you know, our community.

Speaker 28 Well, I appreciate, and I appreciate what you're doing, how you are representing not just yourself, but your community and others that are struggling with this new reality as well.

Speaker 28 And anyone that gets up to Crescent City, and if you haven't been, you got to go, needs to go to your restaurant. What's the name of the restaurant?

Speaker 32 This is Schmidt's House of Jambalaya. We're right on the beach at South Beach, and

Speaker 32 it's an extraordinary community. We're very thankful to be part of it.

Speaker 28 And go up when you're up there and visit and say hello. Really appreciate you taking the time.
Thank you for sharing your insight.

Speaker 28 And thank you for staying the course and being so positive. And we're going to work our tail off to try to curtail the impacts of these tariffs and the lack of,

Speaker 28 I think, understanding of the impacts it's having on people like yourself and communities all throughout this country, but certainly here in this north part of our state.

Speaker 28 Thank you so much for joining us.

Speaker 32 Thank you. And I just want to add, you know, I really feel advocated for.
I appreciate your leadership. We appreciate your leadership and everything that you're doing as a voice for the people.

Speaker 32 Thank you so much.

Speaker 28 And I'm grateful. Thank you for joining us.
Thank you.

Speaker 35 Bye-bye.

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Speaker 35 How you doing, Governor?

Speaker 28 I'm good, man.

Speaker 28 Well, you're Chino, California, right?

Speaker 35 Yeah,

Speaker 35 I live in Orange County, California. My company here is in Chino.
We also have a warehouse and location in Amsterdam, in Holland. I love it.

Speaker 28 So tell us about your business, the wheelchair business, huh?

Speaker 35 So we are in the durable medical equipment business, primarily related to wheelchairs and scooters.

Speaker 35 We provide,

Speaker 35 you know, the product for people that are either permanently or temporarily disabled, including organizations such as, I think I mentioned all my emails, the Steve Gleason Foundation.

Speaker 35 He was an ex-NFL football player for the New Orleans Saints.

Speaker 35 So we sell our product, we're a wholesaler, so we wholesale them worldwide.

Speaker 35 And we've been doing this for quite some time, about eight years. We're considerably growing company.
We typically grow about 200 to 300% per annum. Wow.
It's a very expensive business.

Speaker 35 It's not a business that is for the lighthearted.

Speaker 35 So it requires quite a bit of capital to operate this kind of company. And you have to have a passion for it,

Speaker 35 which is something that myself and all of our team members, we have a great passion for what we do.

Speaker 28 And Joseph, how many countries are you exporting to? How many countries are you working with?

Speaker 35 So because we have a European operation, we can export to Belgium, Switzerland, Germany, the UK,

Speaker 35 and of course, the Netherlands at the moment.

Speaker 35 And in America, from here, we export to Canada and parts of Mexico and

Speaker 35 Puerto Rico, which is still

Speaker 35 part of us.

Speaker 28 So what, I mean, so these tariffs are announced.

Speaker 28 I imagine

Speaker 28 you had to anticipate something might happen in this space. Tell me a little bit about that thought process.

Speaker 28 You know, when Trump gets elected, he was pretty clear that he was going to move in this direction. Did you expect it as quickly? Did you expect it as acutely?

Speaker 28 How has it impacted your business and your business plan going forward?

Speaker 35 Yeah, so wonderful question.

Speaker 35 We did have a feeling that this could happen. We didn't expect it to be as drastic as it has.

Speaker 35 And the reason for that is based on the fundamental sort of principle that our industry has been exempt from tariffs since we've had the operation.

Speaker 35 So even though we expected tariffs to apply, we did not expect that they would be applied to our industry as we've been exempt for all of these years, nor did we expect that if they were going to be applied, that it would be as high as they are.

Speaker 35 So,

Speaker 35 probably about eight months prior to this, I had set up a separate company prior to the election of

Speaker 35 Donald Trump. We had a separate company with the idea that we would manufacture our own products within the U.S.

Speaker 35 And so we started discussing things with even Chinese partners, Vietnamese partners, Mexico. I went down to Mexico many times to set up a Mikilodora down there, thinking that might work.

Speaker 35 Went to Texas, went to various states. What we realize, Governor, is that

Speaker 35 one, the cost of operating in America is still extremely expensive. Number one, number two, securing and obtaining the materials that we require are extremely difficult to find.

Speaker 35 We might be able to find some metals, some aluminum, but things like carbon fiber, things like lithium-ion batteries, things like technology that goes into our joysticks.

Speaker 35 You know, we're sort of a highly

Speaker 35 automated business to a certain extent that relies on technology.

Speaker 35 And what we quickly found is that what we required just wasn't available.

Speaker 35 It wasn't available as we needed it. And we thought, okay, this is probably

Speaker 35 something that the United States isn't quite ready for as yet.

Speaker 35 So when obviously the tariffs were applied,

Speaker 35 you know,

Speaker 35 it drastically affects our ability to

Speaker 35 You know, I mentioned in my email that we're working with quite a large community that is quite vulnerable, whether it's the geriatric community, which someday, as you know, Governor, if we live long enough, we might all be in a wheelchair

Speaker 28 or a scooter.

Speaker 35 But in addition to that, we deal with like the Gleason Foundation, which has, you know, their members are,

Speaker 35 they have ALS. We work with MS organizations, patients that have Parkinson's, et cetera.

Speaker 35 not only are they

Speaker 35 in a situation health-wise that is not ideal, but many of these folks just don't have the resources, financial resources to secure the product that we sell. And although

Speaker 35 we sell our products relatively inexpensively compared to the market,

Speaker 35 it is still

Speaker 35 a necessity for them. And unfortunately, you know, with the tariffs as they currently stand,

Speaker 35 you know,

Speaker 35 it becomes almost an impossibility, to be quite honest.

Speaker 35 You know, I'll give you a real number, a real number is we had ordered sort of a few containers here recently that we expected to pay about 600 grand for.

Speaker 35 Well, with the tariffs applied, it's now an additional 830,000 on top of that.

Speaker 28 So let's just want to make that clear. It's not from 600,000 to 800,000.
It's an additional 800,000, more than 100%. That's correct.

Speaker 35 That's right.

Speaker 28 and that was most of that product coming from China specifically.

Speaker 35 That's right. Yeah.

Speaker 35 That's right. So, you know, it's an additional 830,000.

Speaker 35 So our choices are, and in our industry, we, you know, I'm not a, I'm not backed by private equity. I don't have any VCs behind me.

Speaker 35 We are, we are operating ourselves and we've grown this company ourselves out of our own resources.

Speaker 35 So, you know, the idea of paying an additional 830,000 when we don't know if these tariffs are going to change tomorrow, you know, the story. It's been up and down.
Yes, we're going to reduce tariffs.

Speaker 35 No, we're not. So it's very unpredictable for myself and other companies in my situation.

Speaker 35 If we fund that money, you know, obviously we would need to recover it somehow. And unlike a common belief that the exporting company pays for these things,

Speaker 35 It's just not true. I mean,

Speaker 35 the import us, we would pay that additional amount and then we would have the decision to make. Do we pass it down to our consumer, which is in our case, our resellers worldwide?

Speaker 35 Or do we absorb the cost? Well, there's no business that I've been in. I mean, you were in the wine business.
You know this. There's no way that a company can operate with an additional 145% tariff.

Speaker 35 I mean, your net operating income is just not there.

Speaker 35 So, you know, it's sort of devastating to us

Speaker 35 on many different levels, but most importantly, on the level of the consumer, particularly ones that we serve, because

Speaker 35 when we deal with nonprofits,

Speaker 35 they have a limited budget. And so what it now means is that do they not get the share or do they get a third or 20% of what they require?

Speaker 28 So, Joseph, I mean, did you end up making the purchase or

Speaker 28 you just are waiting around with all that uncertainty? What'd you do?

Speaker 35 We wait right now because we have sufficient inventory to cover us for another maybe four months.

Speaker 28 That's it.

Speaker 35 But, you know, with lead times, et cetera, we really have to have those containers shipped within the next 15 to 20 days. Otherwise, we're going to run out.

Speaker 35 So,

Speaker 35 you know, it's operating a business, obviously, as you know, this is not always going to be, you know, rosy. If it was, probably everybody would do it.
It's not, that's just not the way it works.

Speaker 35 And you're in a game that's probably even tougher than mine.

Speaker 35 But the reality is,

Speaker 35 you know, you have to kind of deal with the cars as they are presented.

Speaker 35 And

Speaker 35 right now,

Speaker 35 I think what is hurting many of us in addition to the tariff is the uncertainty and the, you know, for lack of a better word, the flip-flopping of is it going away or is it staying? Right. And

Speaker 35 so, you know, we have a real

Speaker 35 urgency in our industry because of the necessity to satisfy the demand.

Speaker 28 What do you, Joseph, just out of curiosity?

Speaker 28 and, you know, look, I mean, you put everything on the line, all the risk, you leverage, you talk about how capital intensive, you just prove that point as it relates to, you know, just those kind of those purchasing orders that you're making and the bet you're placing.

Speaker 28 But how do you even talk to your employees? I mean, what do you tell these guys? What do you tell your folks around you?

Speaker 28 And as you say, I mean, you talk about the most vulnerable, what you're doing for charities and nonprofits. And I think that really paints a pretty powerful picture.

Speaker 28 But what's the anxiety level within the company, within the organization? Yeah.

Speaker 35 So we're very transparent. A lot of the guys that, you know, I've owned several companies in my career.
And this particular one, I brought in a lot of guys that I've worked with for 18 to 20 years.

Speaker 35 So they're friends.

Speaker 35 Most of them were either professional athletes or along the lines of playing at university, baseball, football, you name it. So we're all highly competitive.
And we all,

Speaker 35 our manner of operations, we're very direct

Speaker 35 in terms of how we speak to each other. So they're well aware.
And there was a point that,

Speaker 35 you know, a conversation was had where we said, guys, look,

Speaker 35 if this is the way it's going to be, I cannot promise everybody's job. It's just not conceivable,

Speaker 35 let alone my own, let alone my own company, right? Because if this were to carry on,

Speaker 35 you know, for the next 12 months or so, I just can't imagine anybody in our industry that's playing on a level playing field field would be able to operate.

Speaker 35 It's just not possible.

Speaker 35 So it's a really concerning thing. And I know I'm taking up airspace here, but if you don't mind me just saying also,

Speaker 35 had we,

Speaker 35 you know, if we had the infrastructure in America to do this, you know, in terms of what I mentioned earlier, the batteries, the joysticks, the aluminum, the ability to do this, and we had the resources of being able to kind of operate this business, which I mean, it's not inexpensive, you know, would require

Speaker 35 several million dollars to operate a manufacturing company. You know, I'm not opposed to that.
I'm not opposed to actually trying this out.

Speaker 35 But I will say this, given my experience, is that even if we were to do that, you know, a wheelchair that might cost somebody today $1,200 isn't going to cost $1,200 tomorrow.

Speaker 35 You know, if we're manufacturing this, it's going to be... you know, $2,400, $2,500.

Speaker 35 Yep.

Speaker 28 So the bottom line, I mean, and I appreciate at the end of the day, the bottom line is the bottom line. And

Speaker 28 one has to soberly sort of understand the consequences, the benefits, obviously, of bringing those supply chains back home, the opportunities and the jobs created in that.

Speaker 28 But from the consumer perspective,

Speaker 28 that's pretty stark

Speaker 28 increase and a reminder of the trade-off as it relates to this. Look, Joseph, I appreciate you painting that picture.
Thank you for highlighting some real world impacts that are acute and immediate.

Speaker 28 And also just the deep uncertainty as we wait day to day. And as you suggest,

Speaker 28 it changes day to day, the flip-flop, the lack of certainty. And as a business owner myself, and I appreciate that reference,

Speaker 28 certainty is the coin of the realm. At least you can work around that and you can make some decisions, but the inability to make decisions is perhaps to me the most stifling.

Speaker 30 And

Speaker 28 I think for you,

Speaker 28 I can't imagine the most alarming part of all of this.

Speaker 35 Yeah, no doubt. The uncertainty plays a huge part.

Speaker 28 And

Speaker 35 we're trying to represent a company that is American-based and grown. And

Speaker 35 again,

Speaker 35 we take great pride in what we do. There's a lot of stories here of individuals that have family members that require what we do.

Speaker 35 And it's just extremely frustrating. you know, to sort of

Speaker 35 be in a situation where we've grown and developed such a reputable organization and find ourselves in a situation that is completely out of our control.

Speaker 28 Yeah.

Speaker 35 You know,

Speaker 35 we're really just sort of,

Speaker 35 we have no control over this portion of what we can do.

Speaker 28 Well, I appreciate it. But you know what? It's

Speaker 28 the fact that you're willing to share that story gives you agency,

Speaker 28 gives people, I think, a deeper understanding of what's at stake. And you, and thank you, Joseph, as well.
You only reinforce the why, the why I'm proud on behalf of you and 40 million of us.

Speaker 28 California was the first state in the country to sue the Trump administration as it relates to his authority on these tariffs.

Speaker 28 And by the way, I am damn confident we're going to win that and we're going to get clarity on that in the next few weeks. So I really appreciate you willing to share your story.

Speaker 28 Thanks for all the good work, remarkable work you're doing, how you're changing lives for your charitable focus, not just for your entrepreneurial spirit.

Speaker 35 Yeah, thank you for that.

Speaker 28 Take care. Thanks so much for joining us.

Speaker 35 You're welcome. Thank you so much.

Speaker 28 Appreciate it.

Speaker 28 hey jennifer hi hi gavin newsom how are you doing i am good where you you're in the great city of palm springs right this is correct this is correct i love it and when and tell me a little bit about your business when you opened it up and how you're feeling about everything right now

Speaker 34 Well, thank you. Thank you again for taking the time and allowing us to share what's happening with small business right now.

Speaker 34 So my name is Jennifer Gold, and I'm the founder and curator of Grounded Body Works, a boutique well-missed spa, based in Palm Springs.

Speaker 34 We're celebrating our 13th year this summer.

Speaker 34 And when I started, there was just me and one of my massage therapists that I actually taught massage. I was the director at a local school for a minute and hired her, and it was just us for a while.

Speaker 34 And now I have a team of 12,

Speaker 34 And

Speaker 34 goodness, it's just been

Speaker 34 kind of a whirlwind. I've learned a lot.
Leading up to COVID, I think under

Speaker 34 Obama, our business was growing steadily year after year.

Speaker 34 And then the pandemic hit and that momentum was just gone overnight. Yeah.

Speaker 34 And if I could take a moment. to just personally thank you for your support during COVID.

Speaker 34 I took the grant.

Speaker 34 I have the EDA loan. I'm currently repaying, made the difference between closing our doors and surviving.
So thank you.

Speaker 28 No, thank you for that. So is this, I mean, Jennifer, right now, I mean, forgive me for cutting off because I think it's an interesting, I mean, the fact that you went through that experience and

Speaker 28 the trauma personally, professionally, as it relates to COVID,

Speaker 28 is this moment,

Speaker 28 does it bring back those memories?

Speaker 28 Is it on par with that, the uncertainty, the impacts to your business?

Speaker 34 It's definitely uncertain.

Speaker 34 The struggles are very real. They're still very real.
I can't believe it's been five years. You know, we're still recovering.
For many of us, it's fragile.

Speaker 34 And these tariffs can be the thing that pushes us over the edge.

Speaker 28 And how are the tariffs directly impacting the work there?

Speaker 28 I imagine, I mean, we've been reading a lot all over the national news, Palm Springs reaching out to Canadians. Two million Canadians last year visited the state of California.

Speaker 28 Palm Springs, one of the biggest beneficiaries of

Speaker 28 the number of tourist dollars spent. Has that had an impact? Is it more direct in terms of supply chain and materials that you're using at the spot? Give us a sense, paint the picture.

Speaker 34 Sure, sure. So there's, I'd say there's like three, three caveats that are

Speaker 34 that I'm experiencing right now.

Speaker 34 Personally, and then with my business, I'm just on a spending freeze. We're afraid.
I'm afraid to invest. As a business owner, I've paused paused all major purchases.

Speaker 34 I want to invest in growth, but right now, the uncertainty is just too great.

Speaker 34 Our customers are also hesitant. Even in an affluent area like Palm Springs, people are pulling back on non-essential spending.
That slows everyone down. I'd love to partner with Hydrofacial.

Speaker 34 It's a Long Beach.

Speaker 34 So I'm from Compton. My family's from Quebec.
So, you know, what I do with Grounded is I promote all these local businesses from LA, where I'm from, to all the way to Quebec, where my family's from.

Speaker 34 I'd love to bring in hydrofacial, this California brand and manufacture, but the machine costs over $30,000.

Speaker 34 I'm not about to

Speaker 34 invest in that right now, you know.

Speaker 34 And then I'd say the next thing would be our vendors, even like our skincare line is Osea in Malibu. I'm sure you've heard of them, women-owned, brand-based in California.

Speaker 34 Their ingredients and operations are all local, but that doesn't make them immune.

Speaker 34 If tariffs increase the cost of imported packaging materials, glass, you know, they have glass, but there's pumps, there's lids, it affects pricing.

Speaker 34 That increase comes to me and then it's passed on to my customers.

Speaker 34 Even if we're doing everything right and we shop local, We support California companies staying sustainable as we can afford to do that.

Speaker 34 But local, I'm sorry, global policy is still hitting our bottom line.

Speaker 34 And third, it's been a very emotional two months, but a month and a half, saying goodbye to our Canadians.

Speaker 34 You are correct. Ron DeHart, our mayor, just sent out an email addressing this.

Speaker 34 Palm Springs is amazing. They've been really trying to help support Canada.
They just hung all these banners downtown just to show our support. There's all these Canadian flags.

Speaker 34 It's beautiful, but it's been very emotional. Every spring we say goodbye to our Canadian visitors.
This year, many have said goodbye for good. Some have sold their homes.
They're not rebooking.

Speaker 34 These guests have supported us for years, including through the pandemic.

Speaker 34 Their absence this year is emotional and financially crushing.

Speaker 34 They spend, they bring in $302 million just to Palm Springs or the Coachella Valley alone.

Speaker 34 Palm Springs is deeply tied to Canadian tourism. And if we lose our small businesses and are left with only big box stores, we'll lose the very character of our city.

Speaker 34 I mean, we're still recovering, you know.

Speaker 28 Wow. Thank you for painting that picture, Jennifer.
It's, you know, in California, we're launching a multi-million dollar campaign to encourage Canadians to come back to Canada.

Speaker 28 A campaign we announced a few weeks ago saying, you know, California wouldn't be California without Canadians. But it's your, the response to it was interesting.

Speaker 28 People are very raw and emotional about it.

Speaker 28 And even though California is not, you know, it's not, it may be the most untrumped state in America, their state of mind is still a tremendous animus from the damage we've done to the relationships up north.

Speaker 28 And I imagine just for you, the emotion is extended to just family you have up in Quebec, right?

Speaker 34 I have one aunt left up there.

Speaker 34 The rest of the family moved to the States in the 70s,

Speaker 34 and she just couldn't leave her horses.

Speaker 34 So she's still up there. But it's really, you know, my vendor friends,

Speaker 34 we're communicating.

Speaker 34 We're trying. We're trying to make it work.
I only have two Canadian vendors right now.

Speaker 34 But

Speaker 34 if I may give you an example, our nail, so I run a spa, a boutique spa in Palm Springs.

Speaker 34 And

Speaker 34 we offer nail services in our vendor for our nail products are in LA. It's called Coat.

Speaker 34 And she's redoing her line. A lot of the packaging is from China.
So because of these tariffs, I've been rethinking, do I stick with Coat? You know,

Speaker 34 and then there's a line up in Canada called Be Kind, and they have a nail line and it's made in Canada. But again,

Speaker 34 I just feel like I'm going to lose, lose, you know, just trying to stay local, but make it all work.

Speaker 28 Well, Jennifer, I really appreciate you putting a human face, your own humanity behind this. And I extend that humanity, quite literally, your support for others in the region, other small businesses.

Speaker 28 And I think it's so insightful and helpful that, as you say, even locally made products have packaging components and other component parts that they have to import.

Speaker 28 And those costs are burdens that ultimately will be passed on to you and potentially your customers.

Speaker 28 And it's such a helpful, I think, insight to understand the impacts, the cascading impacts of these tariffs, including obviously the tourism component that compounds that.

Speaker 28 But what you said, I think, is the most damning is just the level of anxiety that you have to personally go through, professionally go through.

Speaker 28 And as a consequence of that anxiety, an unwillingness to make

Speaker 28 big, bold decisions, which are decisions often you have to make with some confidence about the future and what it will hold um and so thank you for for sharing your story thank you for um for

Speaker 28 weathering a lot of storms i'm confident you'll continue to and i think it's a big help for those watching and those listening i appreciate that thank you again for all your support couldn't have chosen a better state to be in right now so thank you again we're gonna we're we're gonna take it to the trump administration and we're gonna beat back these tariffs you watch we have our day in court quite literally, coming up very shortly.

Speaker 28 Jennifer, thanks so much for joining us.

Speaker 34 Thanks so much. Thank you very much.

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