Status: Untraced - E6: He Looks Guilty

Speaker 1 You're listening

Speaker 2 to a Tenderfoot TV podcast.

Speaker 3 Ready to level up? Chumba Casino is your playbook to fun. It's free to play with no purchase necessary.

Speaker 3 Enjoy hundreds of online social games like Blackjack, Slots, and Solitaire anytime, anywhere, with fresh releases every week.

Speaker 3 Whether you're at home or on the go, let Chumba Casino bring the excitement to you. Plus, get free daily login bonuses and a free welcome bonus.
Join now for your chance to redeem some serious prizes.

Speaker 3 Play Chumba Casino today. No purchase necessary, VGW Group, Voidwear Prohibited by Law 21 Plus.
TNCs apply.

Speaker 4 It's one of Britain's most notorious crimes. The killing of a wealthy family at Whitehouse Farm.
But I got a tip that the story of this famous case might be all wrong.

Speaker 6 I know there's going to be a twist, won't they? A massive twist. At every level of the criminal justice system, there's been a cover-up in this case.

Speaker 8 I'm Heidi Blake.

Speaker 4 Blood Relatives is a new series from In the Dark and the New Yorker. Find it now in the In the Dark podcast feed.

Speaker 7 Up in Advanced presents Status Untraced.

Speaker 7 Episode 6 starts now.

Speaker 2 You're listening to Status Untraced, a production of Tenderfoot TV in association with Odyssey.

Speaker 2 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely those of the individuals participating in the podcast. This podcast also contains subject matter which may not be suitable for everyone.

Speaker 2 Listener discretion is advised.

Speaker 9 India has reopened its borders to foreign tourists and has ended a 20-month clampdown due to the coronavirus pandemic. The reopening of international borders comes at a time.

Speaker 12 We purchase tickets scheduled to land in New Delhi, November 17th, 2021.

Speaker 16 Two days after travel restrictions lift.

Speaker 12 In preparation for the trip, I dig deeper into the Parvati Valley.

Speaker 17 What I find is chilling.

Speaker 19 A dark pattern stretching back decades.

Speaker 20 The earliest I find it begins is in the summer of 91.

Speaker 11 Odette Houghton, 24 from Australia, was living her travel dream in India, regularly writing to her family and sharing her adventures.

Speaker 13 Suddenly, the letters sent to Odette began to return, and she was reported missing.

Speaker 10 She was last seen in Manali, but since, there has been no trace of her.

Speaker 12 August 1996, Ian Mugford, a 21-year-old from the UK, was exploring the Himalayan village of Monikaran.

Speaker 26 There, he befriended a Baba.

Speaker 27 And soon after, Ian disappeared.

Speaker 27 To date, there's been no sign of him.

Speaker 6 September 1997.

Speaker 13 Nadov Minser, 26, an Israeli soldier, went missing in the Parvati Valley.

Speaker 22 Four years later, his passport was discovered being offered for sale in Manali markets, and his remains were found wrapped up in a sleeping bag.

Speaker 22 July 2000, two young German travelers, Jorge Weirich and Adrian Mayer Tesch, were camping in the valley when they were ambushed in their sleep.

Speaker 34 Adrian escaped with four shotgun wounds to the leg, but Jorge was killed at point-blank range.

Speaker 13 A month later, UK Resident Martin Young was camping in the valley with his fiancée Maria and her 14-year-old son Cristobal when they were also attacked.

Speaker 19 No one was arrested.

Speaker 14 No witnesses ever came forward.

Speaker 22 Martin is the only one who survived.

Speaker 13 July 2007.

Speaker 20 Five Israelis and a tour guide set out from Kirganga on a Sunday morning.

Speaker 35 Dr.

Speaker 20 Shek, 23, started to lag behind.

Speaker 17 One of his friends went back to look for him and found Dror lying near the path, bleeding.

Speaker 37 Beside him, a knife stained with blood.

Speaker 18 The hikers carried Dror back to Kirganga.

Speaker 37 He didn't make it.

Speaker 13 August 2015. A year before Justin's disappearance, Bruno Mushalik, a 24-year-old Polish traveler, went missing in the Parvati.

Speaker 17 Bruno's father, Pietr, was suspicious of the police's efforts and has filed a report with the High Court of Himachal Pradesh demanding an independent agency investigate law enforcement.

Speaker 24 June 2016, just two months before Justin began his trek, 27-year-old Japanese backpacker Shoto Sakai shared a photo on Facebook of an Indian man in a dhoti.

Speaker 38 He captioned it, My Guru.

Speaker 23 It's believed Shoto was headed to the Parvati for a music festival, but two weeks after the guru post, all his communications went cold.

Speaker 17 Records hint that over 57 foreign travelers died in the region between 98 to 2009 alone, but the true number of disappearances is likely more harrowing.

Speaker 11 I've remained hesitant to jump to conclusions about foul play within Justin's case.

Speaker 5 After all,

Speaker 22 motives are murky, reasons unclear.

Speaker 21 Why target him?

Speaker 28 But now, looking at this list, my skepticism is giving way.

Speaker 6 And what I find out next leaves chills running down my spine.

Speaker 19 Just past midnight, 21 hours before our flight,

Speaker 29 The Times of India publishes breaking news.

Speaker 26 A tourist, last seen on the trail leading to Kirganga, has just gone missing.

Speaker 26 Sometimes I get the feeling I'm lost.

Speaker 26 Can't hide and then it's never enough.

Speaker 26 Now I find in every mirror of ghosts.

Speaker 26 Oh, that once I saw the killer.

Speaker 26 Once I saw the killer of close.

Speaker 20 I'm Liam Luxon, and this is Status Untraced.

Speaker 42 Episode 6.

Speaker 30 He looks guilty.

Speaker 30 Yes. I need to see that one too.

Speaker 6 It's nearing 7 p.m.

Speaker 20 when Alex and I check in at LAX.

Speaker 46 The one you filled out? Yeah.

Speaker 22 Our itinerary, Paris first,

Speaker 11 then onward to New Delhi.

Speaker 13 The trip is long.

Speaker 19 In fact, it's the longest flight I've ever been on.

Speaker 13 But for the majority, I'm awake.

Speaker 30 Gazing out over an endless ocean, the weight of reality begins to sink in.

Speaker 19 In a few hours, we'll be landing in India, a place I've never been before.

Speaker 6 And though I've been working on this case for months, this next step feels different.

Speaker 27 It's been five years and two months since Justin Alexander was last seen.

Speaker 13 If we're going to unravel this mystery, we will have to venture into the paths untaken. We'll have to face the same dangers that Justin did.

Speaker 42 Do you need anything else to find here?

Speaker 42 Have a good day.

Speaker 11 We emerge from the New Delhi terminal under a moonlit sky and are immediately hit with the heat and thick smog of the city.

Speaker 30 A type of air that sours my eyes and scrapes my lungs. Yes, sir, how you doing?

Speaker 11 Our driver, a weathered local, leads us to a beat-up minivan.

Speaker 30 As we navigate the foggy highways, colorful lights from street vendors' wagons pass by in a blur.

Speaker 33 They wave their wares at us.

Speaker 13 Everything from exotic snacks and trinkets.

Speaker 16 The roadside is dotted with little fires.

Speaker 27 I watch as flames cast shadows over the faces of the homeless, the deletes.

Speaker 11 Wanderers and families alike, they huddle together and alone, curled up on the dirt ground.

Speaker 14 An hour passes.

Speaker 18 We arrive at our accommodations, somewhere in a neighborhood called Lajpat Nagar, and enter a four-story building squeezed in among countless others.

Speaker 40 I'm disoriented.

Speaker 27 I need to sleep.

Speaker 14 But I'm stressed about the days to come.

Speaker 48 It's 7:30 right now, so.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Day one.

Speaker 49 Day one.

Speaker 27 When I was stateside, I reached out to people in New Delhi to schedule interviews. Essentially, no one responded

Speaker 50 except one guy.

Speaker 43 Kabir?

Speaker 5 Wonderful. pleasure to meet you.
Kabir, how are you?

Speaker 12 Say hello to Kabir.

Speaker 21 Part guide, part Enigma.

Speaker 19 Though his frame is small, Kabir's network is vast.

Speaker 51 People know that I was linked to the search for Bruno.

Speaker 52 Yeah.

Speaker 51 So people keep informing me, sometimes the cops, sometimes friends.

Speaker 11 He offered to help with our investigation, but anticipated in New Delhi and India in general, it'd be difficult to schedule interviews.

Speaker 51 We are pretty much used to

Speaker 51 people just coming and we are used to such culture.

Speaker 27 So we start knocking on doors.

Speaker 28 Our first prospect is a detective company called PI Sleuths, a group that could help us track down individuals across the country.

Speaker 31 We drive to their address and step out into a street of chaos.

Speaker 28 Bicycle carts and three-wheeled buggies dash around corners.

Speaker 13 Motorcycles and mopeds, sometimes seated with three to four people, weave through throngs of pedestrians, wild dogs, and cows that roam the streets.

Speaker 30 And the scents, aromas of ginger and spice and dusty air, are inescapable.

Speaker 51 Did you talk to somebody here?

Speaker 53 No, we emailed them, but I never returned.

Speaker 38 I find an intercom for PI sleuths and ring the call button.

Speaker 13 But no one is available.

Speaker 21 I wish I could say it was our only hiccup of the day.

Speaker 28 But bad luck follows us throughout Delhi. Be it the embassy or an expert on India syndrome, everyone's too busy to talk.

Speaker 13 Managing to make one success, I do speak with the recipient of Justin's last sent WhatsApp message.

Speaker 51 Yeah, this must be the auntie.

Speaker 11 Auntie owns a motorcycle shop at the center of a swarming market.

Speaker 46 He gave me a call only on that time, and after that, he never gave me any call.

Speaker 42 Gotcha.

Speaker 11 She confirms that she mailed the Royal Enfield motorcycle part, the starter, to the U.S.

Speaker 13 for Justin.

Speaker 17 While to me, it indicates he intended to return home, this is where Delhi's trail goes cold.

Speaker 27 Not many answers here.

Speaker 26 With every rebuffed interview, my thoughts keep drifting back to the other disappearances in the Parvati Valley.

Speaker 28 Are there clues in their stories?

Speaker 23 Any parallels that might shed light on what happened to Justin?

Speaker 13 In particular, I think about the story that just broke, Dharuv Agarwal.

Speaker 28 And it feels obvious, almost inevitable.

Speaker 14 We need to look into it.

Speaker 7 I think everyone's had that what-if moment. What if I started my own business? What if I finally took that leap? But here's the thing.
Those what-ifs don't have to hold you back.

Speaker 7 Because with Shopify, turning your idea into something real has never been easier.

Speaker 7 Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world, including 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S.

Speaker 7 From household names like Mattel and Gymshark to brands that are just getting started. Worried you don't have a big team? Shopify helps you do it all.

Speaker 7 Design your website, manage inventory, handle customer service, even global shipping. Tight marketing budget?

Speaker 7 Shopify's built-in email and social tools make it easy to reach new customers and keep them coming back. Want to sell in person too?

Speaker 7 Shopify's award-winning point of sale connects your online and in-store sales all in one place. And if you're dreaming big, you can sell in over 150 countries with Shopify's global tools.

Speaker 7 With 99.99% uptime and the best converting checkout on the planet, you'll never miss a sale. So stop asking what if and start saying why not.

Speaker 7 Turn those what ifs into wins and keep giving those big dreams the best shot with Shopify. Sign up for your $1 per month month trial and start selling today at shopify.com slash up and vanished.

Speaker 7 That's shopify.com slash up and vanished.

Speaker 3 Ready to level up? Chumba Casino is your playbook to fun. It's free to play with no purchase necessary.

Speaker 3 Enjoy hundreds of online social games like Blackjack Slots and Solitaire anytime, anywhere with fresh releases every week.

Speaker 3 Whether you are at home or on the go, let Chumba Casino bring the excitement to you. Plus, get free daily login bonuses and a free welcome bonus.

Speaker 3 Join now for your chance to redeem some serious prizes. Play Chumba Casino today.
No purchase necessary. VGW Group Voidwear prohibited by law 21 plus.
TNCs apply.

Speaker 6 The only people we're missing right now is the family of the missing persons case right now.

Speaker 23 That would be the only thing we want to do here for sure.

Speaker 56 You said the brother is up there right now.

Speaker 51 He's up there, but the rest of his family could be here.

Speaker 39 Yeah, we want to talk to his cousin.

Speaker 20 From a Times of India article, we know that Dharuv Agarwal, age 32, was from New Delhi and was last heard from on November 9th, about a week ago.

Speaker 15 The Times quotes Dharuv's cousin who said, He boarded a bus to Kisol on November 8th.

Speaker 17 He wanted to trek to Kirganga.

Speaker 33 He made a WhatsApp video call on November 9th at 12.25 p.m.

Speaker 26 And he last checked his second WhatsApp account at 12:37.

Speaker 17 It's not much to go on,

Speaker 37 but Kabir came through with a potential lead.

Speaker 12 He's obtained the number for Daruf's brother.

Speaker 18 So,

Speaker 51 I came to know that you lost your brother a couple of days ago in Parvati.

Speaker 51 So, Usike, regarding, I wanted to meet you if it was possible. Are you in Delhi or you're in

Speaker 23 Kabir asks the brother if he would be open to speaking with us.

Speaker 56 Did he say why he went up there?

Speaker 51 He had seen the trek on YouTube and he thought that he would make it alone.

Speaker 43 So.

Speaker 17 According to the brother, Dharuv embarked on the Kirganga hike for exercise.

Speaker 40 But Kabir's heard other stories.

Speaker 11 There's been murmurs suggesting Daruv's family might be concealing his real reason for the trip.

Speaker 17 Furthermore, Kabir learned a significant detail that the Times of India failed to report.

Speaker 54 He made it to where?

Speaker 22 On the track.

Speaker 51 On the track, just beyond the dam there.

Speaker 21 Okay.

Speaker 19 And there's a camera there that they saw yesterday.

Speaker 50 Yeah, it's the dam.

Speaker 51 Yeah, you crossed that.

Speaker 18 At the Kirganga Trailhead, there is a dam.

Speaker 26 Supposedly, a newly installed CC camera caught footage of Dharuv starting the hike alone.

Speaker 11 We ask if Daruv's family hired a private investigator.

Speaker 40 But Kabir explains PIs in India tend to be contracted for other services, like tailing on faithful spouses.

Speaker 26 They aren't hired for a missing person.

Speaker 51 No, not at all. Never that I've heard of in India.

Speaker 13 However, Dharuv's family has engaged a Parvati Valley search and rescuer.

Speaker 51 They've appointed

Speaker 51 and

Speaker 58 he's not doing anything so he's just throwing in pictures

Speaker 52 so he needs to be warned that they're paying for what the guy is needing.

Speaker 12 Kabir says they need to be warned what they're paying for.

Speaker 33 I'm not entirely sure what he means by that statement.

Speaker 54 So I ask him to clarify.

Speaker 51 This guy,

Speaker 58 he's been highlighted by the police, the department and all as as a rescue guy.

Speaker 43 Yeah.

Speaker 58 You know, he parties around with the corps and everything.

Speaker 43 Yeah.

Speaker 52 And he charges a high amount for his search operation.

Speaker 43 We believe

Speaker 52 from our research and things

Speaker 58 that he could be the culprit.

Speaker 52 The people who are always sick.

Speaker 53 You think he's like robbing them and then taking the stuff?

Speaker 58 He's basically murdering them, I believe.

Speaker 58 After that,

Speaker 42 posing to

Speaker 42 look for the people

Speaker 51 to get the money, extract the money from the family or the MSC or the...

Speaker 53 Is that all speculation or do you have like...

Speaker 42 I don't have evidence.

Speaker 42 There's no evidence. I don't have evidence.

Speaker 51 You cannot say it is speculations.

Speaker 43 You see,

Speaker 51 until today, whoever's been found there has only been found by him.

Speaker 37 What Kabir is saying is that this search guy might actually be murdering people in order to funnel more work into his business.

Speaker 14 It's a pretty heavy claim, and honestly, I'm not sure what to make of it.

Speaker 30 For obvious legal reasons, we'll give the search and rescuer an alias.

Speaker 34 We'll call him Khor Khan.

Speaker 26 To my knowledge, he was never hired for Justin Alexander's case.

Speaker 14 Nevertheless, hearing these rumors, I'm getting anxious to get to the Parvati.

Speaker 18 So I look to Kabir,

Speaker 26 seeking guidance.

Speaker 27 We take Kabir's advice and are on a flight to the mountains the next morning.

Speaker 59 Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. On behalf of Alliance Air, Captain Daniel, Cabinet Chad, the Shoti and rest of the crew, he welcomed aboard a flight to Chattigar and then onwards to Kulu.

Speaker 23 Our aircraft to Kulu is a mid-sized twin-prop plane.

Speaker 27 There are maybe less than 10 other passengers on board.

Speaker 56 As we lift off, we break through the smog, and the first rays of light peek over the horizon.

Speaker 17 It's not long before I catch a glimpse of snow-capped giants, the Himalayan mountains.

Speaker 24 Looming like gods, they're all at once majestic, fierce, and terrifying.

Speaker 38 Touching down on a small open runway, we step off the aircraft in complete awe.

Speaker 38 Wow.

Speaker 38 Wow.

Speaker 44 This is incredible.

Speaker 35 Holy shit.

Speaker 18 Shortly after, we are greeted by our driver and new guide, Kabir's nephew, Arshdeep.

Speaker 53 The breathing quality difference is just so insane.

Speaker 5 That's why I didn't go to dinner.

Speaker 19 Arshdeep operates a trekking and motorcycle expedition company.

Speaker 27 Like his uncle Kabir, he's from this district and has assisted with missing person cases.

Speaker 6 All these houses are beautiful color. Blues and greens and yellows.

Speaker 53 We're along the right side of the valley.

Speaker 16 Every hill is a collection of pine and oak that tower up towards the sky.

Speaker 26 Colored rooftops dot the colossal landscape.

Speaker 13 And all of it is covered by a blanket of misty clouds.

Speaker 44 Just living in some clouds today.

Speaker 13 We swing around a bend, and a soft rumble begins to grow.

Speaker 5 The river.

Speaker 15 Glistening like sapphire, its color is unlike anything I've ever seen.

Speaker 53 I'm genuinely surprised by how many houses and cafes and stuff are along the road.

Speaker 24 I expected it to be much more.

Speaker 33 The buildings multiply, the blacktop shifts to cobblestone, and within minutes we're inside a lively market.

Speaker 13 We've hit the heart of the district capital, Kulu, where an essential stop awaits.

Speaker 1 He's here to speak to you.

Speaker 42 He is here.

Speaker 13 Enclosed by a barbed wire gate, we enter the two-story, unassuming office of the superintendent of police.

Speaker 53 Hello, how's it going?

Speaker 42 How are you doing?

Speaker 44 Wonderful.

Speaker 27 From the looks we get, I can tell it's a rare sight.

Speaker 15 Foreigners at police headquarters, requesting an unscheduled chat with the superintendent.

Speaker 13 Much to my astonishment, he accepts a meeting with us, but only off-mike.

Speaker 13 He's new here, just five months in, and Justin Alexander's case isn't on his radar.

Speaker 13 I provide him with the case number, and he promises to do what he can to search for information on the porter, Anil Kumar.

Speaker 13 Out of curiosity, I also ask what he knows about the search and rescuer Kor Khan.

Speaker 11 He states, matter-of-factly, that the man is a well-known figure in the Parvati, even lending a hand in police searches.

Speaker 13 I sense it's the extent of an opinion we'll hear from an officer of the law, but I want to know more.

Speaker 14 So, after our meeting, we head to Arshdeep's home for lentils and rice, and I casually bring up Korkhan's name.

Speaker 13 And so, I was speaking with Kabir.

Speaker 23 What do you think about

Speaker 60 according to Kabir? it's a different thing.

Speaker 60 That he thinks that every person missed in the valley is found by

Speaker 41 most of the cases.

Speaker 60 So he thinks that he knows who's doing the things and who's the main culprit.

Speaker 23 But what do you think?

Speaker 12 What's your see?

Speaker 48 I never had a conversation with this guy.

Speaker 20 Yeah.

Speaker 21 So I can't.

Speaker 60 Because I never met him and

Speaker 5 never dealt with him.

Speaker 60 But I can't say things like that easily, you know.

Speaker 27 In contrast to his uncle Kabir, Arshdeep's a bit more careful in his thinking.

Speaker 13 Not one to rush to judgments or conclusions. And that impartiality catches my attention.

Speaker 21 You see, before we left for India, the interrogations of Baba Rawat and Anil Kumar were translated and transcribed into English.

Speaker 40 Although we can read the words, we lack the cultural understanding to discern if how any of it is being said is suspicious.

Speaker 28 We needed a trustworthy local to help us decipher it.

Speaker 32 And I'm now thinking, our sheep could be that person.

Speaker 7 Cold mornings, holiday to-dos, and all the hustle. I just want my wardrobe to be simple.
Pieces that look sharp, feel amazing, and that I'll actually reach for every day.

Speaker 7 That's why I turned to Quince. And the bonus? Their pieces make gifting completely effortless.
This season, Quince keeps it smart and simple.

Speaker 7 $50 Mongolian cashmere sweaters that feel like a little everyday luxury and wool coats that are both stylish and durable.

Speaker 7 Their denim fits perfectly and is insanely comfortable and all without the high-end price.

Speaker 7 By working with ethical factories and top artisans, Quince delivers premium quality while cutting out the middlemen. So you get luxury pieces without the luxury markup.

Speaker 7 I'll be honest, I've been living in their cashmere sweaters. They're so soft, they look good, they hold up beautifully, even through all the holiday chaos.

Speaker 7 Quince also has amazing options for home, bath, kitchen, and travel. If you're looking for a great one-stop shop for gifting, I'm telling you, Quince is where it's at.

Speaker 7 Give and get timeless holiday staples that last this season with Quince. Go to quince.com/slash up and vanished for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns.
Now available in Canada, too.

Speaker 7 That's quinceq.com/slash com slash up and vanished. Free shipping and 365-day returns.
Quince.com slash up and vanished.

Speaker 61 Y'all, the holidays are approaching. The air is crisp and cozy.
Polished layers have never felt more essential. That's why I'm loving Quince this season.

Speaker 61 Their sweaters, outerwear, and everyday essentials feel luxurious, look timeless, and make holiday dressing and gifting so effortless. I've been living in their silk slip dress and cashmere layers.

Speaker 61 They've become my go-to for holiday gatherings, errands, and everything in between. The layered look is the best.

Speaker 61 Step into the holiday season with layers made to feel good, look polished, and last from Quince. Perfect for gifting or keeping for yourself.

Speaker 61 Go to quince.com/slash vanished weekly for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Now available in Canada too.

Speaker 61 That's quince.com slash vanished weekly to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com slash vanished weekly.

Speaker 7 Home security shouldn't wait until it's too late. Personally, I've trusted SimplySafe for over five years.
And it's the only system that actually gives me peace of mind.

Speaker 7 The old school systems only respond after a break-in, but SimplySafe's active guard, outdoor protection, can stop a crime before it even starts.

Speaker 7 With AI-powered cameras, they can detect threats outside your home and alert trained agents who can take action immediately. Talking to intruders, triggering alarms, and notifying the police.

Speaker 7 Even if you're not there, SimplySafe has you covered. They have no long-term contracts, no hidden fees, and a 60-day money-back guarantee.
It's no surprise that U.S.

Speaker 7 News and World Report has named SimplySafe the best home security system five years running. Don't miss out on SimplySafe's biggest sale of the year: 60% off.

Speaker 7 Right now, our listeners can save 60% off a SimplySafe home security system.

Speaker 7 Just go to simplysafe.com/slash UAV pod. That's simply safe.com/slash UAV pod.
There's no safe like SimplySafe.

Speaker 31 This is the Baba questioning.

Speaker 41 He's in the SP office, I think.

Speaker 29 This looks like an SP office.

Speaker 20 What are they talking about right now?

Speaker 41 He's just asking the questions about like uh

Speaker 20 the interrogation video of Baba Rawat unfolds in an office much like the superintendents we were in earlier.

Speaker 27 It's shot on Jonathan Skills' iPhone and shows Baba Rawat, a thin man with a tangled beard and orange turban, standing before a desk, uncuffed.

Speaker 30 Seated around the room are Susie Reeb, a few police officers, and several Indian men in plain clothing.

Speaker 27 One of these men is Rohan, a local who translates for Suzy and Skiels.

Speaker 20 But it's worth noting that at the time, this footage was not professionally translated.

Speaker 20 In full, The recording is 11 and a half minutes, but we've narrowed it down to these key points.

Speaker 17 Baba Rawat says Justin approached him in Kirganga.

Speaker 34 I said, okay, you can learn yoga.

Speaker 49 Serve Baba, and then only you learn yoga.

Speaker 38 Sometime later, he told Justin that he needed to go to Mantalai Lake.

Speaker 13 He said, I will also go.

Speaker 36 I said, then come.

Speaker 11 Then he went with us.

Speaker 62 Who was there with you?

Speaker 49 Sir, I had taken a porter along.

Speaker 13 Baba Rawat says Justin managed his own gear, while the porter carried Baba's items.

Speaker 17 Their journey began from Kirganga on August 28th.

Speaker 33 They made overnight stops along the way and reached Mantalai on September 4th.

Speaker 27 Baba Rawat wanted to descend that same day, but Justin wanted to stay behind. That's when he says four Indian trekkers arrived.

Speaker 49 So I told them I don't know English. Tell Justin in English that go with Baba, otherwise if something happens to you then Baba will get defamed.

Speaker 13 Baba Rawat recounts that he and the porter proceeded down the mountain and reached the resting stop of Pundapur by 5 p.m.

Speaker 30 Justin supposedly arrived later around 8 p.m.

Speaker 49 We stayed for the night. 8 to 10 more people who were going to Mantalai.
They also had stopped there.

Speaker 24 No questions were asked about these 8 to 10 people.

Speaker 49 In the morning on 5th, Ras Takor Kohn sat a little and had some food, smoke some chilam.

Speaker 49 And then I said to Porter, you go ahead, make some eggs and food and keep it ready. I will reach slowly by evening.

Speaker 5 So, Porter went ahead.

Speaker 49 Behind was Justin and after that me.

Speaker 49 And in between, Takarkon and Tondabuj, where he stayed, he fell down or what happened. I don't know.

Speaker 50 Sir, I do not.

Speaker 10 Why didn't you report after he had not come?

Speaker 33 Justin is missing.

Speaker 19 I have come this side from Vaidianath for the first time.

Speaker 49 Sir, I don't know much about this place.

Speaker 13 I asked Karshi if he finds Baba Rawat's answers suspicious.

Speaker 5 See, that's.

Speaker 1 He

Speaker 60 is like, you know, carefree guys, these Babas, they don't bother.

Speaker 41 The people whom they meet, they're like gypsies for them.

Speaker 41 They come, they meet, they go. It will never come to his mind that I should report the police about him not arriving.

Speaker 48 That doesn't actually seem suspicious to you in any way, shape, or form.

Speaker 60 Because he met him accidentally and he left, and then it's just like normal for him.

Speaker 13 For the full interrogation, Baba Rawat sticks to his story.

Speaker 22 Despite neglecting to report Justin is missing, he didn't run or hide, nor give any indication that he intended to.

Speaker 13 All things considered, he doesn't sound as malicious as the role he's been cast in.

Speaker 33 Put him inside.

Speaker 62 Arrest him.

Speaker 22 Take him out.

Speaker 22 Call the second one.

Speaker 25 After Baba Rawat, the porter Anil Kumar is immediately summoned for interrogation. but it's not recorded.

Speaker 5 Only on October 26th, five days after Baba Rawat's death, is Anil questioned again and it's caught on tape.

Speaker 13 This time, it's a different office, different police officer.

Speaker 11 Anil Kumar, who looks to be 20-something, clutches a red beanie and shifts his weight anxiously.

Speaker 27 The recording lasts an hour and 12 minutes.

Speaker 15 But again, we've distilled it down to these key points.

Speaker 14 Anil says the trek began on August 28th.

Speaker 38 He too describes reaching Montalai on the 4th and how Justin wanted to stay behind, but ended up meeting them later that night at Pundapur.

Speaker 37 The following day, Anil says they continued down the mountain and reached the rest stop of Taku Kuan by 12.30.

Speaker 8 We had prashad and they had chilam. Then Baba told me to make food at Thunderbooj.

Speaker 36 What did Justin say?

Speaker 8 Justin didn't say anything. He used to agree to whatever Baba said.

Speaker 34 Okay.

Speaker 8 So I picked up all the ration and other things and I came straight to Thundabuj.

Speaker 40 This portion of the hike takes about 4-5 hours for Anil, who reaches Thundabuj around 5 p.m.

Speaker 22 He says Baba Rawat arrived an hour later.

Speaker 8 After coming, Baba asked me directly that Justin is not seen.

Speaker 5 I said, Baba, he was with you.

Speaker 8 I left him with you. He said, Okay, must be here or there, clicking some photos.

Speaker 34 Then,

Speaker 8 after some time, he sent me to look for him. Some people were coming.
I asked them, Did you see some foreigner? They said they had not seen.

Speaker 36 Why didn't you tell the police after that?

Speaker 8 I told Baba if he doesn't come in two or three days, then we should make a police complaint. Baba said, Okay, he will come.

Speaker 13 Susie Reib then intervenes, posing a question to the officers.

Speaker 63 One of the stories say that Justin and the porter had a fight or an argument and somebody got hurt. That was one of the very first stories that we heard.

Speaker 17 We heard about a fight from the hiker Nermal Patel.

Speaker 13 But according to him, the argument was between Justin and the Baba,

Speaker 22 not Anil Kumar.

Speaker 63 Because that's what the Baba said.

Speaker 53 And I'd like

Speaker 36 What they want to ask is that between you and Justin, there was a fight? And Baba has given his statement.

Speaker 8 No, sir, nothing like that has happened.

Speaker 5 Nothing with me.

Speaker 36 Then what happened in this? Someone was hurt a little or was injured badly?

Speaker 8 No, no, no, nothing of this sort has happened. There was no meaning of a fight.
We went together and came back together.

Speaker 36 Did any fight take place in front of you?

Speaker 8 No, absolutely nothing. What do I have to do with fight?

Speaker 46 Okay, he is denying this thing.

Speaker 46 He is denying.

Speaker 46 There was no fight between him and yourself,

Speaker 46 according to him.

Speaker 64 That day they left Takuhuan for Tundubush.

Speaker 46 Yes.

Speaker 64 Was anyone else on the trail? Did he see anyone else?

Speaker 8 There was a local party there.

Speaker 36 How many people were there?

Speaker 8 There were five to six people.

Speaker 46 He's saying that there were five to six local people

Speaker 43 at Thakurkua.

Speaker 24 does he know these people these five people

Speaker 8 do you know any one of those people no sir they were all locals and I'm also new here so I don't know them

Speaker 27 they continue to press anil for a reason why neither he nor the baba ever filed a missing person report

Speaker 8 sir that baba told me that he will come in one or two days i said all right then i got busy with other work

Speaker 33 Anil circles back to the same points, that Justin was Baba's student, and that Baba assumed Justin wandered off with other travelers.

Speaker 11 But here's where things get weird.

Speaker 21 The cops demand Anil Kumar to speculate what happened.

Speaker 36 What do you feel happened to him? Tell us that.

Speaker 36 Like, I feel that either you people have done something to him or Baba has done something to him. What do do you feel?

Speaker 8 What do I feel, sir? I don't know.

Speaker 36 Either you have killed or Baba has killed. One of you have done something.

Speaker 36 Did something like this happen?

Speaker 8 No, sir. I had gone ahead.

Speaker 36 He would have come behind you. Baba was fragile.

Speaker 8 There are two people more were sitting. I moved ahead.
I had to make food.

Speaker 36 If you will tell the truth,

Speaker 36 Then only you will be released. Don't worry, nobody will hit you.

Speaker 8 Whatever I knew, I told you, sir. I don't know anything as I came ahead.

Speaker 36 Has this Baba done anything like this before? Has somebody else gone missing like this with him?

Speaker 8 I don't know, sir. I just met him in Kirganga.

Speaker 36 What do you think happened to Justin? I'm still asking you.

Speaker 8 I don't know, sir. I can't tell where he is and what happened.

Speaker 55 He's saying that he is having no idea about Justin.

Speaker 63 So, what I want to say to him is this. If he has had nothing to do with my son's disappearance,

Speaker 63 I apologize that he is going through the interrogation. However, if he's withholding something, it will be his karma.

Speaker 63 And I don't, I'm sorry for him. Can we say that?

Speaker 42 Dek so many bad friends.

Speaker 36 Listen to me. If you are telling the truth, then they are saying that we are feeling bad that you are in custody of police at this time.

Speaker 36 But if not, then they'll also do everything possible to make sure you get punished.

Speaker 8 But I am telling the truth, whatever it was, I'm not telling lies. I'm telling the truth.

Speaker 64 An innocent man would do everything he can to find out the truth.

Speaker 64 Why is this man such a coward?

Speaker 63 At least an opinion.

Speaker 64 An innocent man would be remorseful, would say to Susie, he would say, I'm sorry that your son is missing.

Speaker 8 I had nothing to do with it.

Speaker 64 But this man can't stand there and even look at her.

Speaker 64 Tell him he looks guilty.

Speaker 24 To me he looks guilty.

Speaker 30 Skiels and Susie's frustration boils over.

Speaker 27 And the police, they just stand there.

Speaker 8 What should I say?

Speaker 36 If you have not done anything, then you could have told them that I have not done anything.

Speaker 38 He's a coward for not going back. It's okay.

Speaker 64 He's a coward for not telling the truth.

Speaker 43 Tell him.

Speaker 64 If he was telling the truth, you would have remorse.

Speaker 38 Please tell him he's a coward.

Speaker 36 Did you feel sorry for them? Have you apologized that I was with him and during this visit he got disappeared? But I don't have an idea about this. I have no fault in this.
Did you say this?

Speaker 5 To them?

Speaker 8 No, I have not said anything to them.

Speaker 36 Do you want to say anything to them? She is his mother. You want to tell something to them?

Speaker 8 Sir, I have not done anything. I have not seen also.
I have stopped anger also. I don't know anything about previous things.

Speaker 54 And that's it.

Speaker 27 The video ends.

Speaker 26 Watching these interrogations, they feel fumbled.

Speaker 27 The situation is a delicate one, as I feel for Susie and Skiels, who are just craving progress.

Speaker 11 Yet, having them practically lead the interrogations seems like gross misconduct.

Speaker 12 Their assertive approach leaves me with the impression that it steered the investigation.

Speaker 33 Most likely, without them even realizing it.

Speaker 13 Delving into case specifics, these recordings revealed that before Justin went missing, he passed at least three groups on his descent.

Speaker 12 And from my knowledge, law enforcement never approached any of them.

Speaker 13 I'm lost in thought about all these neglected leads when I notice Archdeek steps outside to take a call.

Speaker 32 When he returns, he says he's put out an interview request to to a group who can provide some more answers.

Speaker 21 A little eager, I ask if it's possible to have them come by that very evening.

Speaker 42 How's it going? That's Roman. And that's Liam.

Speaker 43 Liam.

Speaker 27 We pull together chairs in a cold rustic dining hall and flick on a single space heater.

Speaker 21 Manu?

Speaker 1 Here we are.

Speaker 42 Very nice to meet you.

Speaker 22 We meet Manu and Jagdish,

Speaker 13 two rugged men that run one of the few search and rescue companies here in the valley.

Speaker 24 Manu carries most of the conversation, as Jagdish speaks little English.

Speaker 57 We are a Himalayan rescue team. We handle lots of search operation, rescue, technical rescue, and water rescue.

Speaker 15 Manu walks me through the numerous cases he's been involved in.

Speaker 22 Among them, Justin's.

Speaker 55 When did you first hear about Justin's disappearance?

Speaker 57 The administration approach us to do that.

Speaker 42 I'm sorry, who did you say?

Speaker 57 With the administration, like police approach us.

Speaker 57 Basically, that time we thought it's just a recovery case, like we have to go there and pick the body or the person.

Speaker 57 So the police approach us and they tell that he was missing near Tunda Buj. And Ruby go there and search with the police team.
And we take around 12 days there.

Speaker 13 Manu and Jagdish briefly switched to Hindi.

Speaker 11 And Arskeep translates in unusual detail about this search.

Speaker 27 We know the porter, Anil Kumar, assisted a search team at some point in the investigation, but we didn't know who.

Speaker 33 In light of the news that it was Manu and Jagdish,

Speaker 54 I ask what exactly the porter started to clarify.

Speaker 57 At that time, this thing will be in knowledge. And when the porter says he told that both person goes in front of him and third was the porter

Speaker 57 fourth and fifth was Justin and Baba

Speaker 13 I pause trying to process the words Manu just said

Speaker 22 he says the porter Anil Kumar told them that the group coming down the mountain with Justin was not a total of three

Speaker 5 but five did the porter did anil say that they were like all together they were all yeah that's what he's saying so the the two other people that you're referring to right now that were with them do you do you know their names or no no no nobody knows if true this means moments before justin vanished he left with the baba and these two individuals allegedly Anil Kumar does not know who started down the mountain after him, but claims what happened next was strange.

Speaker 45 After maybe an hour or so, this couple crossed Anil Kumar because he was carrying a luggage with him, quite a heavy one. The first were the couples to arrive at Tundabuj.

Speaker 45 And the day Justin was lost, this couple didn't stay in Tundabuj. They came straight to Kirganga's.

Speaker 13 And they never came forward and talked to the police.

Speaker 60 They didn't do anything.

Speaker 13 This couple breezed past Anil.

Speaker 22 They did not stop, nor make any mention of the Baba or Justin.

Speaker 20 They just continued on, silent and alone.

Speaker 26 So who are they?

Speaker 20 And what do they know?

Speaker 27 Coming up, unstatus, untraced.

Speaker 31 I find it tough to believe actually.

Speaker 31 There's something more to the story which they're hiding.

Speaker 22 And trust me, there are plenty of Babas that are corrupt and sadhus who are trying to rip you off.

Speaker 45 They believe that there was some, you know, sort of a backstep by the police.

Speaker 51 During that time, a lot of people got killed, and it was definitely the same group of people.

Speaker 50 I mean, from that, the whole story, do you feel suspicious at all about the guy and the girl, or just the Baba?

Speaker 57 Yeah, the same thing all three had done.

Speaker 11 If you have tips or information on the individuals in this podcast, please email us at statusuntraced at gmail.com or leave us a message at 507-407-2833.

Speaker 55 Status Untraced is a production of Tenderfoot TV in association with Odyssey.

Speaker 13 I'm your host, Liam Luxon.

Speaker 24 Executive producers are Alex Vespested, Donald Albright, and Payne Lindsay. Producers are Meredith Stedman and myself.

Speaker 13 Supervising producer is Tracy Kaplan.

Speaker 12 Consulting producer, Jonathan Skeels.

Speaker 28 Associate editors are David Bash and Charles Rosner of GetUp Productions, with additional editing by Sidney Evans.

Speaker 16 Artwork by Trevor Eiler.

Speaker 13 Original music by Makeup and Vanity Set.

Speaker 13 Our theme song is Colder Heavens by Blanco White.

Speaker 6 Mix by Cooper Skinner.

Speaker 20 Voice acting provided by Omer Walla, Samir Goel.

Speaker 17 Kaushal Patel, and Panaki Carr.

Speaker 13 Thank you to Oren Rosenbaum and the team at UTA, Beck Media and Marketing, and the Nord Group.

Speaker 44 And also special thanks to Arsdeep Sharma and Kabir Sharman.

Speaker 20 To Samir at India Someday, who juggled all of our endless last-minute itinerary switch-ups.

Speaker 18 And to Niha Barara.

Speaker 31 For maps and exclusive photos related to the podcast, find us on Instagram at StatusUntraced.

Speaker 56 For more podcasts like Status Untraced, search Tenderfoot TV on your favorite podcast app.

Speaker 17 Or visit us at tenderfoot.tv.

Speaker 3 This is the story of the one. As a custodial supervisor at a high school, he knows that during cold and flu season, germs spread fast.

Speaker 3 It's why he partners with Granger to stay fully stocked on the products and supplies he needs, from tissues to disinfectants to floor scrubbers.

Speaker 3 All so that he can help students, staff, and teachers stay healthy and focused. Call 1-800-GRANGER, clickgranger.com, or just stop by.
Granger for the ones who it done.

Speaker 62 Every story has layers, and sometimes the truth hides in plain sight. I'm Josh Dean, host of Chameleon, the podcast about people who transform, deceive, and survive.

Speaker 62 From con artists to unbelievable yet true occurrences, we dive into stories where nothing is ever quite as it seems. Because to understand the world, you sometimes have to change the way you see it.

Speaker 16 Listen to Chameleon, wherever you get your podcasts.