174. How to Finally Let Things Go

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Speaker 1 They've stopped asking directions

Speaker 1 to places they've never been.

Speaker 2 Hello to our favorite people in the universe.

Speaker 2 This is Glennon. Can you introduce yourself?

Speaker 1 My name is Abby.

Speaker 3 Mary Abigail is your name.

Speaker 1 Thank you. Spoiler alert.
Yeah.

Speaker 3 Abby's real name is Mary.

Speaker 2 Mary Abigail.

Speaker 1 Oh, I love it.

Speaker 3 She's the goodest girl. I am Amanda Flaherty Doyle.

Speaker 2 Such a beautiful name. Amanda Flaherty Doyle.
So beautiful. And this is We Can Do Hard Things.
Welcome back.

Speaker 2 Today,

Speaker 2 we are going to be talking about stuff we're letting go.

Speaker 2 We're letting go of some things and we're trying some new things. And we did an episode about this

Speaker 2 at the start of the year. And we called it, we're on some new shit.

Speaker 2 We're not calling this one we're on some new shit. And the reason is this.

Speaker 2 Some of our love bugs let us know that new shit, on some new shit or new shit is A-A-V-E, African-American Vernacular English. And so thank you for telling us that.
And we are changing the wording.

Speaker 2 See how not hard that is to do. Okay.
We are just trying to try some new things. We're letting go of some old ideas and trying to believe some new ideas.

Speaker 1 I love that. You just said trying to try.

Speaker 2 It's so good. Yeah, I'm not trying is way too much of a commitment for me.
I'm considering trying. And then I might try to try.

Speaker 1 Yep.

Speaker 2 Okay. And here's the amazing thing that happened.
Amanda Flaherty Doyle and Mary Abigail Wambach and I, we talked about some ideas we're trying to let go of

Speaker 2 so that we can be freer in 2023. And then the pod squad called theirs in.

Speaker 2 So we went through hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of messages from you all.

Speaker 2 about

Speaker 2 things you're trying to let into your life and things you're trying to let go of.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 they're so freaking good and so beautiful that we decided we had to let everyone hear them.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Just to get ideas for themselves. And so I just want us to consider one thing

Speaker 2 while we're listening to this, because I couldn't stop thinking about this this morning. So we have the idea of resolutions.
People are always resolving to do things or to not do things.

Speaker 2 Do things or not do. I will stop doing this thing next year or i will start doing this thing

Speaker 2 and if there's anything i'm learning in my recovery right now

Speaker 2 it's that

Speaker 2 you know how sister you're always saying so my biggest question is

Speaker 2 why do i do what i do

Speaker 2 i i do know that yeah i feel like the question of your life is why do i do the things I do and then why I am like I am

Speaker 2 and there's an answer to that.

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 2 you do the things you do because you believe the things you believe.

Speaker 2 You are the way you are because you believe the things you believe. So the reason why resolutions don't work is because they're always about actions

Speaker 2 without deep consideration of the beliefs. beneath the actions.
So for an example, I have a friend right now who's, I'm going to stop ghosting people. In 2023, I'm going to stop ghosting my friends.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 1 Okay. Like text messages, calls.

Speaker 2 Right. Exactly.
This is a friend of mine. I'm not going to stop doing that.

Speaker 1 I'm not ready.

Speaker 2 But

Speaker 2 I'm not even trying to try that. But, okay, that's never going to work until she figures out that she actually believes that conflict is death.

Speaker 2 That she actually believes that if people get to know her really, really well, they will leave anyway. So she'll just do it now.

Speaker 2 If sister decides in 2023, I'm going to relax more, I'm going to rest more.

Speaker 2 Unless she starts to believe

Speaker 2 that her life will become more beautiful and

Speaker 2 human, if she rests more, it will just become another thing that she becomes disciplined about. Here's what I think about that.

Speaker 2 So for me, I'm going to like eat more and I'm going to love my body, whatever the hell that means. Okay.

Speaker 2 I'm not going to do any of that shit for real real until I actually believe that living in my body on this earth is safe.

Speaker 1 If

Speaker 2 we

Speaker 2 are changing behaviors or actions without considering at the same time the beliefs beneath them, then it's just willpower and discipline.

Speaker 2 And that never lasts because it's not real.

Speaker 1 That's right.

Speaker 2 And the horrific thing about this

Speaker 2 is, because I'm in the middle of this right now,

Speaker 2 is that you can't do one first and then do the other.

Speaker 2 So it's like, cool.

Speaker 2 If I just have to change my beliefs before I can change my actions, then I'll just change my beliefs and then my actions will change. But that's not how it works.

Speaker 2 You have to do them both at the same time. So it's like, I'm going to start.

Speaker 2 considering that I don't have to ghost people because maybe I could get to know them and they'll still love me and maybe conflict isn't death.

Speaker 2 So I'm going to pretend like I believe that and keep calling this person back.

Speaker 2 And then

Speaker 2 slowly as the action unfolds and

Speaker 2 different results come, my belief starts to change. And then as my belief becomes bigger, my actions keep, it's this back and forth.

Speaker 2 You kind of have to live as if to get your actions to change, but you have to get your actions to change to start having the as if change at all.

Speaker 1 And so many of us do the action first and just are assuming that the belief will come later.

Speaker 2 Exactly.

Speaker 1 Yeah, you have to do both, right? Yeah.

Speaker 1 And I actually would argue before you even do the action, you have to really settle into the belief of it before any, because I do think the simultaneous nature of it will be effective.

Speaker 1 I have an immense amount of willpower. I can work out and do it.

Speaker 1 And I still, through the 30 years of playing soccer, hated working out until this last year when I've, I've really realized, like, what is the belief system around physical movement, physical fitness?

Speaker 1 And it was always attached to suffering. So, of course, I didn't want to do that.
Of course, I needed more willpower than the belief that it was actually good for me. So, I don't know.

Speaker 1 I think that this is an interesting concept. I've never heard it.
described quite like this. It's like the belief needs to come before the action.

Speaker 2 And so much about resolutions is the opposite it's just action without belief and so of course nothing is sustainable yeah that's why it's over by january whatever because it's like by now that was too hard if you actually believe something it's not hard it comes down to for me the difference between

Speaker 2 living in discipline

Speaker 2 and living in integrity Because discipline is, I have to do this hard thing. So I'm going to keep overriding what I want.

Speaker 2 I'm going to keep overriding what I want to do this thing that I have to do. It's overriding overriding your insides.
And then integrity is matching your insides to your outer actions.

Speaker 2 I want to want the thing before I make myself do the thing.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 That's really good.

Speaker 2 I just think it would be fun to listen to these and think about belief action with each of these. Like what would this person have to believe to actually change this action? Beautiful.

Speaker 2 Let's hear from our first friend.

Speaker 4 Hi. I actually was telling my therapist about this yesterday before I heard the pod.
So I'm so excited that I'm like on the same track. That my

Speaker 4 new shit for 2023 is that I'm not going to presume a problem when someone in my family brings me a statement.

Speaker 4 So if my 11-year-old comes and says, there's no more ice cream in the freezer, that's a statement that does not require problem solving from me.

Speaker 1 Wow.

Speaker 4 If my partner comes and says, I have a lot of work to do and the kids are still not back in school from winter break, that is a statement.

Speaker 4 That does not require an action plan from me, problem solving, or any emotional investment. I'm happy to have a conversation, but I'm not going to do all the internal emotional work

Speaker 4 of anticipating problems because you're not asking me to do it. So I'm not doing it until you do ask me.
And I have to say, it feels amazing. Whoa.

Speaker 3 This is good.

Speaker 3 I can resonate with this in a big way. And I think from the,

Speaker 3 I am constantly just like serving even before there's a problem or a suggestion of a problem or as our friend says, a statement to get in front of that and to pave the way so there isn't any friction.

Speaker 3 And I've been reading this this book called How to Raise an Adult.

Speaker 3 And it is

Speaker 3 fascinating because they're talking about how we are raising

Speaker 3 kids and solving all of their problems and doing their life for them.

Speaker 3 And the being of kids

Speaker 3 is what gives the skills to be adults. having to be resourceful, having to figure things out, facing conflict.

Speaker 3 I learned that first of all, in Japan, kids who are six years old routinely take the subway by themselves

Speaker 3 on the daily.

Speaker 3 And my 10-year-old cannot get the milk out of the refrigerator for cereal. Correct.
It's just like the level of independence is wild.

Speaker 3 And so I think the belief system that I've been trying to work on as they're, you know, not getting assignments done or struggling with friends or disappointed because they continue to forget their

Speaker 3 book on library day. It's like,

Speaker 3 I believe that by allowing them to solve those problems or not solve them, that I am doing what they need.

Speaker 3 Instead of

Speaker 3 viewing my job as doing what they need by making sure they don't have problems,

Speaker 3 but like allowing them to go through it because it's really compelling. How do we think they're going to get resourceful if they never have to access any resources other than us?

Speaker 2 Other than us. And when someone gives us a statement, like I think about what changed my life in my house, which was when someone said to me, I can't find.

Speaker 2 Mom, I can't find. Okay.
So, first of all, that doesn't mean I can't find. Because saying I can't find implies you've been looking around for something

Speaker 2 and it has become impossible. What I can't find means in my house is I didn't see it

Speaker 2 in my direct line of sight on my way to you. Yeah.

Speaker 3 I can't find it means it's not in front of my face.

Speaker 2 Yes. Right now.
I don't see it right now immediately when I'm looking at your face. I can't find my shoes means I don't see my shoes on your face, mom.

Speaker 2 Okay. That's what it means in my house.

Speaker 1 So what do we say to them?

Speaker 2 That sounds hard.

Speaker 1 Yeah, we actually say, have you actually looked? And 99% of the time, it's, oh, no.

Speaker 2 Like they didn't think that that was part of the process but that must be our fault right I must have for the first 10 years of their lives

Speaker 2 taken on so many of their situations

Speaker 2 just a situation as a problem for me to solve they think of me as like some sort of search engine like a google yes I've told them so what people do or have always done is think.

Speaker 2 And what thinking is, is it's like Googling your own brain so when you have a problem or an issue or situation

Speaker 2 what you do is you stop for a moment and you activate your brain and your brain might solve it before you come to me

Speaker 2 and they're like wow it's like googling your own brain right so

Speaker 2 i do think that when someone says a statement to us like they're in the office I'm having trouble with this thing or and we take it on the signal to the other person is I don't believe that you can handle that.

Speaker 3 Or if the other person is manipulative, we're teaching them, come to me and I will do the stuff that belongs to you.

Speaker 2 Right. So you can reflect instead of solve.
You don't have to be like,

Speaker 2 I accept this job. I accept this job that you have created for me now.
But you also don't have to be an asshole. Right.
That sounds hard.

Speaker 2 What do you think?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I think what you were saying before we even started the calls,

Speaker 1 this idea of what's the belief underneath what she's trying to resolve, right? And the belief and probably the family's belief is that Mama Bear is the problem solver, not me, kid, not me, husband.

Speaker 1 So what she has to do is she has to work with, I'm now a statement listener rather than problem solver and to disassociate herself from that role because it is a role.

Speaker 1 I'm the problem solver in my family. And so this one hit me pretty hard.
How do I not enable the people around me to keep this circus going? Because really, it's just a circus.

Speaker 1 And like you said, sister, we're actually doing our kids a disservice by not giving them the agency themselves to solve the problems of their lives.

Speaker 2 And then you have to find your worth in something else. That's interesting.
What am I worth outside of being the crisis manager of this situation?

Speaker 3 And that's, then you switch your, like, I am still the helper of my family. What I'm doing is helping them develop the skills they need.

Speaker 1 Yes. Yeah.

Speaker 3 By letting them figure shit out.

Speaker 1 Yeah. That's good.

Speaker 2 What I'm doing is trying to put myself out of a job consistently.

Speaker 1 Provoking. You really, you really hit it on the nail for me.

Speaker 2 And then also, before we move on, I think amazing things happen when we can suggest to people that some of their problems aren't even problems. Like this

Speaker 2 reminded me of.

Speaker 2 Something that I wrote in Untamed, which was that I remember when our oldest daughter was little, she came home and she told me there was a couple girls in her class that didn't like her.

Speaker 2 So she would say, so-and-so, so-and-so, they don't like me. They won't play with me.
And my fear was big. Like I had this belief that everyone's supposed to like you.
And so I started, well, why?

Speaker 2 What happened?

Speaker 1 Do we want to invite them over?

Speaker 2 My reaction to her was,

Speaker 2 oh, yes, this is a problem that we should solve. Now, I never said that, those words, but my reaction to her in engaging with that as a problem was

Speaker 2 confirming to her, oh, yes, if people don't like me, it is a problem that I have to solve.

Speaker 1 Oh, no, yeah.

Speaker 2 And then five years later, after mom doing some personal work around likability and people pleasing,

Speaker 2 that same child came to me when she was in like seventh grade and she said, so-and-so doesn't like me. I really don't think so-and-so likes me.

Speaker 2 And I remember looking at her and saying, huh.

Speaker 2 sounds like a fact, not a problem.

Speaker 2 And it was like, her face was like, oh yeah, sometimes people don't like us. And we don't have to struggle to fix it.

Speaker 1 So good.

Speaker 2 Anyway, thank you for that one because it got us thinking a whole lot.

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Speaker 2 Let's hear from Nicole.

Speaker 4 This is Nicole, and I got to tell you, I am leaving behind being clenched all day, every day. I keep it in my jaw.
I keep it in my stomach. I might breathe four times an hour.

Speaker 4 I'm subtly exaggerating, but that's been my MO for 38 years. And I'm over it.
I'm done. I'm so done.
And in 2023, I'm actually doing a stoplight challenge where at every mother effing stoplight,

Speaker 4 I ask myself if I'm breathing and what's going through my head. That awareness of my own thoughts, I think I have been sorely lacking.
And I am excited to

Speaker 4 completely do a 180 and start breathing and living again.

Speaker 2 All right, everybody, unclench your jaw right now.

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah, this is good.

Speaker 2 Deep breath.

Speaker 1 Nicole,

Speaker 2 I'm going to let you two talk about this. This is all all I'm doing in my life right now.
Like, I don't even know what to say about this one. I

Speaker 2 think

Speaker 2 10 times an hour, I remind myself to unclench my jaw

Speaker 2 because it's like the thing we talked about in the beginning. I'm clenching my jaw because I'm stressed or anxious.
Or am I anxious because I'm clenching my jaw, right?

Speaker 2 And it's this feedback loop. I can remember that my jaw is clenched, unclench, and suddenly I am less anxious.
It's not just that I'm anxious, so I'm clenching my jaw. Is this making sense? It is.

Speaker 1 It is. Yep.
It is.

Speaker 3 I love it. I don't think there's much to say.
I love it.

Speaker 3 And be aware and checking in with yourself with the stoplight challenge or if you don't commute, any other challenge you can think of every time, you know, right after you hang up from a call, unclench your jaw, check your shoulders, breathe.

Speaker 3 It's a beautiful thing to do for yourself.

Speaker 1 All I would say for this one is just be aware of the complete 180 you're wanting.

Speaker 1 That really like stuck out to me because it's like, hey, in the first couple of weeks, if you can literally unclench for one second, that's progress.

Speaker 1 And then in another few weeks, maybe it's for two seconds or two minutes, whatever it is. I think that the expectation to be this completely different person, it's going to take time.

Speaker 1 So the 180, I would, you know, maybe like hope by the end of the year, you're like 45 degrees.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I was just thinking this year, I'm going to do a complete seven.

Speaker 2 Let's hear from Kathy.

Speaker 4 Hello, beautiful pod. My name is Kathy, and one of my resolutions for 2023 is to take every single opportunity to speak out against oppressive comments.
And so, of course, I had to make this call.

Speaker 4 I was always a good girl, polite, respectful, and generally highly self-regulating.

Speaker 4 All of that good grooming resulted in me too often finding myself dumbstruck in the face of casual, racist, and sexist remarks that offended me to the core.

Speaker 4 My brain would seem to shut down for fear of being impolite until the opportunity for response would seem to have passed.

Speaker 4 Now, I am a fabulous 53-year-old crone, and I have no fucks to give for that kind of politeness.

Speaker 4 In 2023, I won't ask myself whether this or that comment warrants addressing or whether I have the right words. I'll just call it out.

Speaker 4 And if I inevitably suffer a politeness relapse, I won't berate myself or think, ah, better luck next time. I will go back to the person and address it as soon as possible.

Speaker 4 I will do it kindly and I will do it consistently. And I know from experience that it will open some hearts and minds.
I hope that other well-groomed pod squatters might consider this as well.

Speaker 4 Thanks so much for hearing me out. Love you all.
Bye-bye.

Speaker 2 We know Kathy's one of us because she literally wrote that down she prepared it so much she wrote it down and kathy that is a mission statement yeah beautiful i think something that it just brought up in me is like

Speaker 1 when we have these aspirations and resolutions

Speaker 1 especially about something like this that the world has conditioned us to

Speaker 1 respond and act in certain ways. And I think that what could be interesting about this

Speaker 1 is the response from the people around, right? Because that's what the fear is. The belief system that she's, she's operating or has been operating under is my politeness

Speaker 1 is more a priority than other people's safety. Yes.
And I think we all have done this, right? And I think that that's really an important distinction to make is actually my politeness is harmful.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it's not nice. It's we have a saying in recovery, nice is not nice.
Yeah. And it's like, it's, it's not even my place.

Speaker 2 It's like what these people in this group think of me is more important than other people's safety. It's, it's more self-centered.
And white women, this is what we are conditioned to do.

Speaker 2 We think it's nice. We think it's polite.
It's actually being foot soldiers for racism and patriarchy and all of these things. It's whatever the opposite of kind and nice is.

Speaker 2 It's actually quite malicious.

Speaker 2 Politeness is a maliciousness.

Speaker 3 And it's hard. I mean, I struggle with this.
It's very hard when it's like the casual comment that is, you know, your neighbor and you're going to see them 1400 times.

Speaker 3 And it's like not egregious, but it does kind of

Speaker 2 like a dog whistle.

Speaker 3 Yes. It's just like a little bit of a thing.
And I mean, I hear it more with sexism than other things. And I always, as I'm walking away, am I like processing it in time and being like,

Speaker 3 and then I feel sick and then I'm burying myself.

Speaker 3 So I really like what another pod squatter wrote in similar to this: they said, Um, one of the things they're trying this year is repeat back when someone says something that doesn't sit right, let them hear it another time.

Speaker 3 And so, if you struggle like I do, with what exactly to say in that moment where you're not like coming from your high horse and berating them, I think that's a really good suggestion.

Speaker 3 Just to repeat it back and say, You said

Speaker 3 that you tell your boys' team

Speaker 3 when they're not running their drills right, okay, ladies, looking good.

Speaker 1 And letting that's it.

Speaker 3 Like you're just saying it back. Yeah.
And you're just letting it sit because then, then it's for everybody to ingest.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 3 Or even saying, what do you mean?

Speaker 3 That's it. And letting the person explain it back to you.
It doesn't have to be the confrontation. It just, the call out can be the forcing the other person

Speaker 3 to be accountable for what they said.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Brittany Packnet Cunningham taught me that one, which is,

Speaker 2 has worked best for me throughout my life, which is you hear something that sounds, oh, here's a specific example. When we lived in Florida, we were sending our kids to the local public school.

Speaker 2 A woman said to me,

Speaker 2 Wow, you chose to send your kids to that school.

Speaker 2 And there was something underneath it. And I said, yeah,

Speaker 2 you look surprised. Why?

Speaker 2 And she said,

Speaker 2 oh, I just, you know, there's just like so many other schools around here that like

Speaker 1 are

Speaker 2 considered to be better.

Speaker 2 And then I said, what do you mean by better?

Speaker 2 Really? Better? And you can play this like dumb.

Speaker 2 So, so what she meant, whether or not she knew what she meant in the very beginning, was like, aren't there like a lot more low-income and brown people that go to that school?

Speaker 2 Maybe you just didn't know that there's a lot of other schools in the area that are mostly white.

Speaker 2 So what do you mean by better? Brittany

Speaker 2 says that racism never stands up in the end. It's not true.
It's not real. So like if you keep asking questions, the other person

Speaker 2 will always end up as this is, this is horseshit and this is not true. Yeah.
But just not letting it stand and keep asking questions is a good

Speaker 1 strategy. I also think just one more thing on this, because Tish has been teaching me a lot about this recently, the difference between kindness and being like a good person and politeness.

Speaker 1 And I think we get them mixed up. We believe.
that being polite is kind.

Speaker 1 But she said, if we teach our kids to just be a good person, to be kind, and some of being kind would be calling out racism, right? That's kindness.

Speaker 1 What she was saying is if you are a good person, the politeness will come.

Speaker 2 Well, it's, I actually think that an impoliteness often suggests kindness because politeness is like, here's this script. We have this situation.
We're in this patriarchy. We're in this.

Speaker 2 Here's your script. If you stick to the script, that's polite.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 And kindness is often going off script and saying something that totally disrupts the script. Right.
So it's being disruptive

Speaker 2 that is seen as impolite, which is actually often deep kindness because it's like there's something more important here than staying on script. Yeah.

Speaker 1 And it's like we teach our kids this, this politeness, like you, you say ma'am and serve.

Speaker 2 That's a status quo.

Speaker 1 Tish said this yesterday, like we teach our kids to say ma'am and serve. Then what happens to all the non-binary people? Or what if you misgender somebody? It's actually not kind.

Speaker 1 It's actually not kind. So it's like backwards.

Speaker 3 We're teaching our kids politeness so that they can be good people but it doesn't actually always work right well politeness like the origin of the word politeness is from to polish to make smooth

Speaker 3 so when you think about in your interactions

Speaker 3 what you are doing when you're being polite is making that situation smooth for all involved What you're doing is you're enabling everyone in that situation to feel comfortable and like there are no riffs.

Speaker 3 And that works great if what's happening in that situation is not harmful to folks.

Speaker 3 If what's happening in that situation is harmful for folks, what you're doing is still making it smooth and making sure there is no friction and there is no obstacle to whatever that person is doing.

Speaker 3 So you're making it easy by being polite. And

Speaker 3 I think that that is

Speaker 3 something to think about when you're deciding where to be polite.

Speaker 2 That's good. Where to be polite? That's good.
Yeah. If you're being polite in a shitty system, no thank you.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 If you're being polite in a system that's kind and honors everyone there, then go for it.

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Speaker 1 off.

Speaker 2 Let's hear from Meg.

Speaker 4 Hi, this is Meg. The new shit that I am bringing in to 2023 is letting go of the word should.
I am constantly, constantly using the word should to the point where I don't realize it anymore.

Speaker 4 I'm constantly worrying about what I should do, what other people are wanting of me instead of what I want. So the new should I am bringing in is

Speaker 4 tapping into my wants, even as simple as like,

Speaker 4 I should.

Speaker 4 I should call this person. Do I want to call this person right now? If not, I'm not going to do it.

Speaker 3 Alice's therapist sends home homework every week, and it's

Speaker 1 really good.

Speaker 1 So our whole family's been doing it. Amazing.
Super good for me.

Speaker 3 So I feel like it's a really good idea to get your kid into therapy and then ask for homework assignments because it's helping all of us.

Speaker 3 Anyway, she brought home this sheet. It's the

Speaker 3 what are you thinking team. Okay.
And there is 10 different sets of ways of thinking, thinking traps. It's all or nothing Alan blaming Blake over and over, Oliver.

Speaker 3 Anyway, the point is, are they all boy names?

Speaker 1 No, no, no, no.

Speaker 3 Okay. Okay.
For example, the one that described me is Shuddha Sharonda. So my kids have been calling me Shuddha Mama.

Speaker 3 Sharonda always talks about the things she should do or she must do, even though nobody else is telling her she has to do them.

Speaker 3 When When she's hanging out with her friends, she thinks, I should be studying so I can be a straight A student. No matter how much she does, she always thinks she should be doing more.

Speaker 3 Then she feels guilty. Sharonda also thinks a lot about what other people should be doing.

Speaker 3 If they don't do it, she gets very angry and frustrated.

Speaker 1 That's so good.

Speaker 2 Is there a solution for Sharonda? Because if so, I'd love to hear it.

Speaker 3 No? Me too.

Speaker 1 I think we have to wait till next week to find out what to do.

Speaker 3 But I'm just just saying that is, it's a whole shoulda syndrome.

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 3 You're shitting all over yourself.

Speaker 2 You can't enjoy what's happening.

Speaker 3 And so

Speaker 3 Alice and I were talking about this and

Speaker 3 she was like, explain to me more. And I was like, so, for example,

Speaker 3 that shoulda thinking trap happens if, you know, say I'm relaxing and watching the TV and I'm just thinking to myself,

Speaker 1 well,

Speaker 3 I should be doing that work. Then it messes up my relaxing.
And she goes, No, that just means you're never relaxing. If you're spending your relaxing thinking about what you should be doing.

Speaker 3 So, anyway, I love the idea of getting out of the shitty brain. And I'm with Meg this year.
I'm going to try to work on that.

Speaker 1 Traps.

Speaker 2 Can you ask Alice's therapist if we could maybe go through all of those on a pod?

Speaker 1 I want to know what all the thinking traps are. I'm serious.
Yeah.

Speaker 3 I mean, psych out Sam, badmouth Brandy, Emo Emily, drama queen Jean.

Speaker 2 Jean. Okay, just ask her.
Okay.

Speaker 1 Also, and I just, you kind of, you hit something that

Speaker 1 one of the most important things I ever learned in therapy early on was I was doing the should game and my therapist, you said it a little bit ago, but I think it's a huge deal.

Speaker 1 Don't should all over yourself.

Speaker 1 Yeah, exactly. I literally still say it.
This is 25 years a lot.

Speaker 1 Obviously, I love, I love like cussing and stuff. So it really like landed.
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 yeah you're like that's it that's what i've taken there's something with

Speaker 2 really exploring the want instead of the should and like should according to whom is an interesting question also i just want to say sister i think it's so amanda

Speaker 2 i think it's so great that shironda yeah

Speaker 2 i just think it's so great that you are incorporating all the things that alice is doing in into your family i think that's such a good idea because therapy is really just humaning lessons.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 1 for

Speaker 2 Alice to see that, because you can say that to your kid, but then if it's really just your kid going away for an hour with a therapist, they believe that it's just for them. So

Speaker 2 I think it's such a beautiful idea to bring it home to the whole family.

Speaker 2 And also just as a former teacher, I know that everything we do with kids is the distilled good stuff, like broth that's distilled. It's not for kids.
It's for all of us.

Speaker 2 I just love it. Okay, let's hear from Shay.

Speaker 4 Hey, Pod Squad. My name is Shay.

Speaker 4 I'm sitting here drinking my coffee thinking to myself, wow, I'm really ready to let go of just being that sweet person to everyone that anyone can ask something of me.

Speaker 4 And I'm like, of course, I'll do it. It'll be ready and it'll be perfect.
And moving forward, I think my new shit is, I think I'm ready to be a little salty. I think I'm ready to say to people,

Speaker 4 no, thank you. That actually doesn't work for me.
Or turn down invitations that I don't want to attend. So maybe

Speaker 4 my old shit is just being sweet, sweet shay. You can still be sweet, but maybe not all the time.

Speaker 4 And my new shit is allowing myself to be a little salty and not worrying how other people are going to react to that and just being really okay and comfortable with standing my ground and making choices that feel good to me.

Speaker 4 Anyway, have a good one. Happy New Year or at least New Year.

Speaker 2 Yes. New Year.
Thank you, Shay. New Year.

Speaker 1 Salty. So good.

Speaker 3 Salty and sweet.

Speaker 1 Salty.

Speaker 3 Nobody likes too, too, too sweet, especially the person that's trying to be too, too sweet.

Speaker 2 No, and she's done being Shay Rhonda. All right.
She's going to be a little more salty. I love that.
Let's hear from Sue.

Speaker 4 Hi, this is Sue.

Speaker 4 And one thing I'm thinking of is something my therapist said to me.

Speaker 4 I'm a mom of three children and I'm a teacher. So I spend a lot of time with young people and I give a lot of myself.
And my therapist said to me something that just kind of blew my mind.

Speaker 4 She said to me one day, when you over function, you allow others to under function. And that's going to be my new mantra.

Speaker 4 And I'm going to try to stop over functioning for others so that they can function on their own, which will be hard. It's a hard thing, but I'm working on it.
All right. Thank you so much.

Speaker 4 I love you guys.

Speaker 2 I would like to ask sister about that one because you are a massive over functioner. You are functioning the shit out of everything constantly.
Do you feel this? Talk to us about over functioning.

Speaker 3 I think that some people who identify with being perfectionists might might be over functioners. I think

Speaker 3 people who are highly stressed out and feel responsible

Speaker 3 for quality control for a lot of things might be over functioners. I think the first pod squatter who talked about not a problem, just a fact

Speaker 3 might be trying to come down from some over functioning. I think what's interesting about it is that sometimes it's like a chicken and an egg thing.

Speaker 3 If you

Speaker 3 have the the over functioning role in a relationship or a dynamic or a work setting,

Speaker 3 then it has a polarizing effect

Speaker 3 on the people that you are with. So if the one person started out as average functioning

Speaker 3 and then

Speaker 3 you were over functioning, they have a tendency to become less and less functioning,

Speaker 3 which causes you to be increasingly stressed out.

Speaker 3 So, you hype up your over functioning because you think that's the only way to net out with a functioning system is to continue to get more and more and more functioning, which just shuts down the other person more and more.

Speaker 3 I think that it is a really interesting thing to look at and just acknowledge and maybe

Speaker 3 know that it is, it is in fact all an ecosystem. So, if your kids keep coming to you to pour the milk and you keep pouring for them, they're never going to stop coming to you to pour the milk.

Speaker 1 If

Speaker 3 you keep taking care of everything,

Speaker 3 there is no reason why anyone would take care of anything.

Speaker 3 Not because they're assholes, just because that is the way the ecosystem works.

Speaker 1 Yes.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 I think

Speaker 2 I'm just thinking about like in our actual relationship, or I think when you are a highly capable, high-functioning person.

Speaker 2 So I would say like in physical activities, in things going on in this material world, here Abby is a high-functioner and I'm a little bit slower at things. So let me give you an example.

Speaker 2 If you're next to me and I'm loading the dishwasher

Speaker 2 and I'm not doing it exactly as fast as you would do it or

Speaker 2 correctly, the correct way. But, like, for sure, the way I'm doing it, the dishes are going to get done.

Speaker 3 Yeah, there is a level of good enough with dishwasher that is not good enough with Appy.

Speaker 2 Right. Or something else, like, just something.

Speaker 2 If we're traveling and I'm supposed to look up a map or a direction or something, I'm not like fast at technology. And so I will sense

Speaker 2 that I'm not functioning as quickly or as correctly

Speaker 2 in a lot of areas. And that just shuts me down.

Speaker 2 I will just be like, fuck it. I'm not doing the dishwasher then.
I'm not. I can't.
I'm not going to do the technology then.

Speaker 2 And then because I'm, because I'm scared I'm not doing it right. So then it becomes, oh, Abby's the only one doing the dishes.
Abby's the only one doing any map stuff.

Speaker 2 The fact is she can do it better.

Speaker 2 She can do it better.

Speaker 4 But

Speaker 2 is that really better in the end? Because then the overfunctioner really could take over every damn thing

Speaker 2 or feel like they have to take over every damn thing.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Yeah. So basically what you're saying is I need to calm down.
No. No, no, I'm actually, I'm not offended in any way.
I actually want to talk this through because

Speaker 1 in my mind, this is the mind of the overfunctioner. I think that maybe this is wrong, but this is what I'm thinking when we're doing the dishes.
Last night, I was like, kids, you guys do the dishes.

Speaker 1 But when I looked inside the dishwasher, there were a lot of dishes already in it. And so it was going to require a 10 level dishwash

Speaker 1 person

Speaker 1 to be able to do it correctly so that we could get all the dishes in and only do one load of dishwashing. And also, it just takes me so much less time to do it.
And so here I am just like,

Speaker 1 I'll do it. But there's like a little bubble in my head that's like,

Speaker 1 a little resentment gets built.

Speaker 2 Oh, yeah.

Speaker 1 You know, a little resentment's like, why the fuck am I the one that has to do this? Why can't anybody learn how to do this good enough?

Speaker 2 Yeah. And babe, what you would have seen if you had been watching from the outside is that you said, kids,

Speaker 2 you're going to do the dishes tonight. And then you walked directly, not even 30 seconds, you walked directly to the sink and started doing the dishes.

Speaker 1 Because I knew it was in the dishwasher and they did it. And they were overfunctioning.
I know. And I was like, I had already gone through the whole thing.

Speaker 1 Like, it's just, it will be easier if I do it. Right.

Speaker 2 So maybe the answer is to leave the room or something. I don't know.
Or just, I mean, I don't think this is not, it's not a criticism of you because I do it to you all the time in different areas.

Speaker 2 We all do it with each other in different

Speaker 2 areas.

Speaker 1 Okay, well, I love this. This is going to give me something to think about: over-functioning in certain ways.
Also, I don't want to get lost, that's why I do the map thing.

Speaker 2 Sorry, can we hear from Allison? She missed it.

Speaker 1 What? Nothing.

Speaker 3 Did you say something about math?

Speaker 4 Hi, Glennon, and Abby and sister. My name is Allison.
In 2023,

Speaker 4 I am

Speaker 4 releasing myself from a culture of urgency and

Speaker 4 quickness and

Speaker 4 always working towards releasing myself from what diet culture tells us a woman should be. And instead, I'm embracing the word slow.

Speaker 4 I'm embracing the slowness and permission to move my body in a slow and gentle way and approaching everything with a little bit more caution and slowness and

Speaker 4 presentness, I think, that comes with being a little bit more slow. I love, love, love your podcast.
Thank you so much.

Speaker 4 for everything that you're doing and making me believe that I can do hard things.

Speaker 1 Yeah. Flow.

Speaker 2 Slow. I think she might have said slow.

Speaker 1 I'm not sure, but I said

Speaker 1 she said slow. She said flow and slow.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I just want to wear a t-shirt that says I'm with Allison in 2023.

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Speaker 2 Let's hear from Sophia.

Speaker 4 Hey, y'all, this is Sophia. I'm bringing the 2020 streak that I provide my own safety.
I have spent years talking about which people are safe for me to be around, which relationships are safe.

Speaker 4 I think I was measuring that by like when I could openly express myself or how people responded to me and or made me feel or got triggered or whatever. But no, I provide my own safety.

Speaker 4 And so I'm just always safe. And I might exit rooms that I don't need to be in.
And I might walk out of conversations. I might not participate in discussions, but I'm just always safe.

Speaker 4 And so I'm not carrying the conversation forward anymore about who

Speaker 4 isn't safe. I am just always safe.

Speaker 1 Oh,

Speaker 2 I actually would love to just have a whole episode about this because,

Speaker 2 Sophia, this is really big for me right now. I have never felt safe

Speaker 2 anywhere. And so that is why I'm always controlling every single thing about everything all around me,

Speaker 2 because

Speaker 2 I feel like I have to create safe spaces everywhere I go because I didn't understand that I was safe inside of my own body.

Speaker 2 And something happened really cool recently, which is that I tend to be extremely triggered by

Speaker 2 anyone at a table or in a room that has a lot, like a touch of narcissism or like extreme self-centeredness or people who take up all the room or talk, talk, talk, talk, talk.

Speaker 2 It's a whole thing, which I'll get into another time. But I was recently at a table with a talk, talk, talk narcissist and I was like breathing

Speaker 2 and

Speaker 1 was

Speaker 2 realizing I'm safe in my body.

Speaker 2 I don't have to fix this person.

Speaker 2 I don't have to be triggered. This person, let's call him Nick.
Nick is just over there nicking.

Speaker 2 And I'm over here Glennoning.

Speaker 1 I kept looking at you, waiting, waiting for like any kind of outward sign that

Speaker 1 you were over this person and that we were at like a

Speaker 1 level red 10. And you, I just kept looking at your face and your face is fucking fine.
I was so fucking amazed.

Speaker 3 I wish you would have been there to witness that.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 I think we all have stuff from our childhood that when we were little, we didn't have any power in the situation. And so

Speaker 2 something

Speaker 2 in me always was like, now I have the power and I don't have to put up with this. And so then I would make my job to be to fix that person or put them in their place.

Speaker 2 My therapist went, I said, you know, everyone's clearly uncomfortable with this person because they're hijacking the whole thing. And so I have to make everyone more comfortable.

Speaker 2 And my therapist was like, how?

Speaker 2 By like blowing up the whole table by saying something that's so inflammatory that like maybe you're the only one who's super uncomfortable but now everyone is because you just said this thing that blew up the whole so anyway i'm not uncomfortable with narcissist i think it's hilarious well everyone's uncomfortable with something different because of the way they were raised because of childhood patterns that you know um

Speaker 2 so my friend recently who's who's doing all kinds of good al-anon work said something that made me so feel so good. And she said, I am never trapped.
I am always safe.

Speaker 2 I i am never trapped i am an adult i have a body i have an id and i have a driver's license i am never trapped anywhere and a credit card yeah and a credit card right meaning i can get up if i'm in a situation where i don't feel safe i get to stand up and walk away no matter where i am no matter what conversation i'm in no matter what room i'm in that we create our own safety thank you so fia

Speaker 3 yeah i think if this resonates with you go back and listen to the holiday episodes about about sturdiness. I think that that's a lot of what we're exploring.
Let's hear from Whitney.

Speaker 4 Hello, this is Whitney. I think I am leaving behind this notion I've held since I was a very little girl that I'm not allowed to take a break.

Speaker 4 I am almost finished with my grad school program for clinical mental health counseling.

Speaker 4 And literally the last day of finals, I sat in a coffee shop and pulled out a book book to start reading for next semester and had a deep reflection moment and thought, wow, I really truly think I don't deserve to rest deep down.

Speaker 4 And I'm working on identifying that voice because I don't think it's my own.

Speaker 4 And then, of course, I call my partner five years and tell him. And he's like,

Speaker 4 yes, I've noticed this. But to me, I was like.
sobbing with my brain melting out of my ears, which is funny. When your partner's not surprised, but you're like, you know, having an epiphany.

Speaker 4 And I think I'm going to bring rest into this new year. I think I'm going to bring

Speaker 4 peaceful

Speaker 4 acceptance. And like,

Speaker 4 I kind of want to work towards celebrating it. Like now I'm aware of it.
Now I kind of want to celebrate Spanish.

Speaker 1 My little naps during the middle of the day.

Speaker 2 I know. I used to think you were lazy and now I think you're a genius.

Speaker 1 I love them.

Speaker 2 Just genius. It's genius.
You all have to go back if you haven't and listen to the Trisha Hersey episode. I read every single article about Trisha when she put her book out after our interview.

Speaker 2 And she said she measures her success by how many naps she took that week.

Speaker 3 Think about that.

Speaker 2 Of course. Yeah.
You are that at peace that you have laid your body down to celebrate beingness.

Speaker 2 Yes, to that being the measure of success.

Speaker 1 By that calculation, I am very successful. No, I agree.

Speaker 2 I agree.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 3 I think with the, when you said about beliefs at the beginning, this one is core, right?

Speaker 3 I think it's for anyone, myself included, who struggles with worthiness around

Speaker 3 rest and peace or

Speaker 3 general discomfort with being comfortable because you think that that means something is wrong or you're not doing enough.

Speaker 3 I think it's interesting to think about that and maybe to think about

Speaker 3 if worthiness is too complicated. Like, yes,

Speaker 3 what is your belief about why good things come to you?

Speaker 2 Like, what is your belief about

Speaker 1 how

Speaker 3 you manage to have in your life things that you value?

Speaker 1 That's really good.

Speaker 3 Because if you

Speaker 3 believe that good things only come to you because you make yourself suffer and work really hard for them,

Speaker 3 then you will be looking for ways to suffer and work really hard. That's right.

Speaker 3 Because

Speaker 3 that is how you think

Speaker 3 you got and will keep and will continue to get. things that you value.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 3 And I think it's just an interesting exercise to do that part because general worthiness is confusing to me. It's so complicated.

Speaker 3 But if I really believe that, then I have to believe that I'm seeking out opportunities to suffer because I continue to want good things. Whereas if I

Speaker 3 played with the belief or even looked at my life a little bit more objectively and thought a lot of it has been luck and ease.

Speaker 3 and connections to the people that I love,

Speaker 3 then maybe I'd be looking for ease and connection as much as I'm looking for suffering.

Speaker 1 Fucking brilliant. Yeah.
It's really good.

Speaker 2 With that,

Speaker 2 we shall end this time of trying to try.

Speaker 2 We love you, pod squad. Gosh, they're just

Speaker 2 let's just think about our underlying beliefs that kind of program all of our actions.

Speaker 2 And we will see you back here next time.

Speaker 2 Have a day.

Speaker 1 Have a day. Have a day.

Speaker 2 Bye.

Speaker 2 I give you Tish Melton and Brandy Carlisle.

Speaker 2 I walked through fire.

Speaker 1 I came out

Speaker 1 the other side.

Speaker 1 I chased desire.

Speaker 1 I made sure I got what's mine.

Speaker 1 And I continue

Speaker 1 to believe

Speaker 1 that I'm the one for me.

Speaker 1 And because I'm mine,

Speaker 1 I walk the line.

Speaker 1 Cause we're adventurers, and heartbreaks on map.

Speaker 1 The final destination

Speaker 1 we lack.

Speaker 1 We've stopped asking directions

Speaker 1 to places they've never been.

Speaker 1 And to be loved, we need to be known.

Speaker 1 We'll finally find our way back home.

Speaker 1 And through the joy and pain

Speaker 1 that our lives bring,

Speaker 1 we can do a hard pain.

Speaker 1 I hit rock bottom, it felt like a brand new start.

Speaker 1 I'm not the problem,

Speaker 1 Sometimes things fall apart.

Speaker 4 And I continue

Speaker 1 to believe

Speaker 1 the best

Speaker 1 people are free.

Speaker 1 And it took some time,

Speaker 1 but I'm finally fine.

Speaker 1 Cause we're adventurers, and heartbreaks on that.

Speaker 1 A final destination

Speaker 1 we lack.

Speaker 1 We've stopped asking directions

Speaker 1 to places they've never been.

Speaker 1 And to be loved, we need to ink.

Speaker 1 We'll finally find our way back home.

Speaker 1 And through the joy and pain

Speaker 1 that our lives

Speaker 1 bring,

Speaker 1 we can do hard again.

Speaker 1 This were adventures and heartbreaks. Oh, mad.

Speaker 1 We might get lost, but we're okay.

Speaker 1 We've stopped asking directions

Speaker 1 in some places they've never been.

Speaker 1 And to be loved, we need to be known.

Speaker 1 We'll finally find our way back home

Speaker 1 and through the joy and pain

Speaker 1 that our lives

Speaker 1 bring,

Speaker 1 we can do hard things.

Speaker 1 Yeah, we can do hard things.

Speaker 1 Yeah, we

Speaker 1 can do hard

Speaker 1 things.

Speaker 2 We Can Do Hard Things is produced in partnership with Cadence 13 Studios. Be sure to rate, review, and follow the show on Apple Podcasts, Odyssey, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 2 Especially be sure to rate and review the podcast if you really liked it. If you didn't, don't worry about it.
It's fine.