68. SARAH PAULSON IS PLAYING GLENNON ON TV!!

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Speaker 3 Hello!

Speaker 3 I don't know if I've been more excited about a show or to tell you this cool thing that I've been holding inside of me.

Speaker 3 I have been working really hard with a few amazing people to take the magic and the fire and the love in the untamed book and turn it into a TV show

Speaker 3 to come into your living rooms.

Speaker 3 And I haven't really wanted to talk about it.

Speaker 3 much even though it's been going on for a long time because I I feel like when I talk about things too early that I'm making they like lose all of the magic like I need the the the containment to build the pressure of it inside of me or something so

Speaker 3 so I've been keeping it to my little self um

Speaker 3 but we have kind of a milestone right now which is that we are getting ready to take the beginnings of this project we've made and try to find a hope for it so we thought we'd celebrate that by sharing with you today

Speaker 3 first

Speaker 3 on the We Can Do Hard Things podcast,

Speaker 3 the person who is going to play me in the untamed TV show.

Speaker 3 So today we are joined by

Speaker 2 her.

Speaker 3 You're about to find out who she is. Big hint is she is a she.

Speaker 3 And I'm so freaking excited to introduce you to her and her to you. Many of you are going to already know and love and adore her.

Speaker 3 But if you don't know her yet, you'll be in love with her in the next hour. She has become such a force and friend to me, just so important to me and to our family.

Speaker 3 And I cannot wait for the magic that we're all going to make together. So today she joins us.
Let's jump right into our conversation.

Speaker 2 Okay, so... So I would like an apology from my wife.

Speaker 3 Okay, we're going to start We Can Do Hard Things by apologizing.

Speaker 3 I am sorry, Abby, for not handling the technical difficulty that we just had with the grace that you have become accustomed to in moments of crisis for me.

Speaker 2 Got it. Okay.
Thank you. I feel better.
Okay, everything's fine.

Speaker 3 Welcome to We Can Do Hard Things. Bless you for having missed the last five minutes where the tech went wrong and my life was over, but my life is back.

Speaker 3 And I'm glad because there's no way I could be more excited for the next hour, which in my defense is why I wanted everything to go perfect, which is why I was so upset before. Okay.

Speaker 2 Here we go.

Speaker 2 So

Speaker 3 what we're about to do, dear listener of we can do hard things

Speaker 3 is we are about to share with you. Top secret.

Speaker 3 This top secret magical information, which is that as you know we can do hard things listeners untamed is being made into a TV show this is not the big news

Speaker 3 exciting but not the big news

Speaker 3 but I in my little sweaty heart have known

Speaker 3 the person that I needed

Speaker 3 the universe the only person the only person that I needed the universe to provide

Speaker 3 to play me

Speaker 3 in the untamed show that I have always known in my little sweaty heart. One shot, one shot for this human.

Speaker 2 We're going to go down to, we're going to start Eminem literally.

Speaker 3 They say to me, Give me your list. What is your list? I say, here is my list.

Speaker 3 They say, your list has one person on it. I say, I realize this might be difficult for us.

Speaker 2 This is not a good definition of list.

Speaker 3 We've only got one shot. Do not miss your chance.
Miss your chance.

Speaker 2 Sarah.

Speaker 3 comes once in a lifetime.

Speaker 3 Sarah Paulson

Speaker 3 comes once in a freaking lifetime.

Speaker 2 That is actually right.

Speaker 3 And tragically, I was not the only one who knew this.

Speaker 3 The whole universe knew this.

Speaker 3 And so that's why it was going to be tricky. So

Speaker 3 first of all, Hello, Sarah Paulson. I love you forever.

Speaker 4 That was quite an introduction. Quite an introduction.

Speaker 2 Hi, Glennon. Hi, Abby.
Hi, Amanda.

Speaker 4 Hi. I'm starstruck about Amanda.
Is that weird? I know.

Speaker 2 Isn't she striking?

Speaker 4 I just feel starstruck because, you know, I've seen her a lot, but this is our first real,

Speaker 4 aside from share the mic now when I was, you were there a lot, but this is really our first like eye contact, you know?

Speaker 4 I know. It's like looking at the sun looking at you, Sarah Paulson.

Speaker 2 My God.

Speaker 4 And are you in the closet?

Speaker 2 Are you in a closet, Sarah Paulson? We're just going to call you Sarah Paulson the whole time. Okay.

Speaker 4 I'm in my closet. I'm in a closet in my home.
Not the only closet. But this one is the one I chose.
Yeah, there's this one. It's got sweaters and I thought I needed soft things.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 How do I sound?

Speaker 4 Am I too close to the mic?

Speaker 3 Maybe a smidge.

Speaker 2 Oh.

Speaker 2 I like your honesty.

Speaker 3 But I don't care because like I said before, you are perfect and everything you do is perfect forever.

Speaker 3 So what what I want to say to you, Sarah, and what I want to introduce the world to is how we came to each other.

Speaker 3 Because for a very long time, we had a sad relationship where I was the only one who knew how close we were.

Speaker 3 And honestly, I felt like it was a little lopsided and

Speaker 2 non-reciprocal.

Speaker 3 But the team

Speaker 3 of people from Bad Robot, Jesse Nelson, and this team that was making this show knew that Sarah Paulson was the North Star of this.

Speaker 3 And so at one point they said, we're going to have to ask her to do it

Speaker 3 if you're going to continue to be certain about it. And I said, that doesn't, is there any other way?

Speaker 3 And so they recommended that I write you a letter,

Speaker 2 which is why, because they didn't want me to speak to you in person yet, because

Speaker 4 they wanted us to have a shot which is wise because sarah might right now be reconsidering this this whole situation she is not she's never been more excited about anything truly ever

Speaker 3 ever that's the truth you can see as evidenced by what i think uh is about to happen now if it's happening now is it happening now yeah let's do it so i'm gonna read the email that i sent to you

Speaker 4 and am i reading the one i send back would you like to i mean i don't like acting on the spot i would like to hear your interpretation. Okay.

Speaker 2 So I think that that would be kind of great. Yeah.

Speaker 3 So so so I'm going to be Sarah Paulson.

Speaker 2 This will be so funny. In a minute.

Speaker 3 Okay. So this is what I wrote to you.
Dear Sarah, everything is hard right now.

Speaker 2 I like to just start with that just as a level setter in all the things I say.

Speaker 3 The way I love the world when things are hard is to keep creating beautiful, true, hopeful things. And the way I love myself is to co-create those things with beautiful, true, hopeful people.

Speaker 3 To that end, I have forever worshipped you as an actor. I understand that this is not a unique experience as the entire world worships you as an actor.

Speaker 3 I will tell you this, I never imagined I'd dare to ask you to play me. I thought you were too elegant, sophisticated, cool.
I am many things, but cool is not one of them.

Speaker 3 I am warm, toasty, sweaty even.

Speaker 3 Then,

Speaker 3 You showed up at our first Share the Mic Now call. You were goofy.
You were real and present and so open-hearted and vulnerable, a little sweaty even. And you took the action seriously.

Speaker 3 You were careful. You cared about the women involved.
After Share the Mike ended, I began watching every interview you've ever done and reading every article ever written about you.

Speaker 2 Sarah.

Speaker 3 Untamed is, on the surface, a sexy, funny, modern classic love story between two women.

Speaker 3 Underneath it is a story about women breaking free from conditioning and tribalism to save ourselves, each other, and the planet.

Speaker 3 The reason the book is selling at astronomic levels is that this is what's needed in this exact moment. We need a woman to lead us out of the matrix of patriarchal capitalistic white supremacy.

Speaker 3 But we need her to do it a little clumsily and sweatily and simply by trying to live her own fucking life.

Speaker 3 Now I ask you, who the hell else can play this role but you? You are already this role.

Speaker 3 Your lifelong resistance to labels and commitment to creating a life and love of your own, your activism and love for others, your twinkly eyes.

Speaker 3 Are you aware that every few few words you say, your eyes twinkle? I am obsessed with eye twinkles because they are proof that a woman is up to something.

Speaker 3 Dear God, give me a woman who is up to something.

Speaker 3 And Sarah, your constant ability to sway between the dark and the light, the way you stay joyful while rushing towards the hard stuff, the pain of the world.

Speaker 3 I like how you use your life and talent and fire and power, Ms. Paulson.
I really want you to play me.

Speaker 3 I want to make something together that the entire world can claim as a moment of hope and beauty and a map of the way forward.

Speaker 3 I want to make something that the queer community can claim as our own celebration and proof of what we've always known, that the best life lies just beyond where they told us to stay.

Speaker 3 We would have so much fun. We would have so much fun.

Speaker 2 Love Glennon. Oh, my God.

Speaker 4 One of the great emails of all time, I think. Wow.
Personally. She'll really get you.

Speaker 2 So I send it.

Speaker 3 I send it.

Speaker 3 And then I sweat. But think only like two days later,

Speaker 2 I get back this email. Quick turnaround.

Speaker 3 It just says this.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 3 Let me be frank. I have never gotten an email that made me sweat and cry and sweat and laugh and sweat and cry and sweat whilst that's right, whilst

Speaker 3 making my hands shake a little.

Speaker 3 Also, did I mention the sweating?

Speaker 3 Glennon.

Speaker 3 Glennon.

Speaker 3 Glennon.

Speaker 2 I,

Speaker 2 I,

Speaker 2 I

Speaker 3 truly don't even know what to say or where to begin.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 4 Here's what I know.

Speaker 3 I revere you top to toe.

Speaker 2 I love that line.

Speaker 3 I cannot believe that you want me to play you. I feel, I feel, I have so many feelings.

Speaker 3 Always with the one million feelings.

Speaker 3 Is this email making you rethink things?

Speaker 3 I'm sorry. I will stop shouting now.

Speaker 2 All caps, all caps.

Speaker 3 Line break. We take a breath.

Speaker 3 I would be so honored. I would be so blessed.
I would be so scared. I would feel so incapable.
I would do it anyway.

Speaker 3 I'm sure I'm not supposed to tell you all these things that I'm feeling,

Speaker 3 but I don't know how else to do,

Speaker 3 well, life, really.

Speaker 3 Your letter made me feel like I could fly.

Speaker 3 More soon.

Speaker 2 Sweaty Paulson.

Speaker 4 I think that's a pretty good email, too. I have to say.

Speaker 4 Mostly just because it was, it is just me represented as clearly as I possibly can represent myself. There's not a single hyperbolic,

Speaker 4 even though I, on the face of it, I can imagine someone going, this is not, who could possibly, but it's, that's just me.

Speaker 3 Yeah, it is.

Speaker 4 In a nutshell, in little words, put to letters put together that form words.

Speaker 3 It is.

Speaker 3 So, Sarah,

Speaker 3 at the point that you reached, that this email reached you,

Speaker 2 you could play anybody in the whole world, right?

Speaker 3 You are.

Speaker 3 Sister, can you read her just actual bio real quick?

Speaker 2 Oh, my God.

Speaker 4 It would be a damn honor. I mean,

Speaker 4 it would take the hour, so I'm just going to condense it.

Speaker 2 But

Speaker 3 as you know,

Speaker 4 Sarah Paulson is the first person to ever, that's ever in the whole wide world, win all five major TV awards in one year, sweeping the Emmy, Golden Globe, SAG, Critics Choice, and Television Critics Association Awards for her portrayal of Marsha Clark in FX's People vs.

Speaker 4 OJ Simpson. She starred in the run,

Speaker 4 which was the most watched original film on Hulu. She stars mesmerizing Ratchet.

Speaker 3 Ratchet. Ratchet.

Speaker 4 Eerily Transcendent as Linda Tripp in Impeachment, both of which she also executive produces, as well as as Complex as They Come in the Academy Award-winning film 12 Years a Slave.

Speaker 4 She is a Sagittarius, an Aquarius Moon, a Virgo Rising. She's afraid of flying.
She loves watching. the real housewives.

Speaker 4 And most importantly, she and Holland Taylor are mothers to two absolutely perfect rescue pups Winnie and Louise oh wow that that got all the good stuff that's all the job Sarah good job Sarah Paulson so funny when you hear it sort of spelled out like that it's like oh all those things I have told myself about maybe um it's not going well or maybe I haven't done it and then I go oh wait a minute you're talking about me that's wild that is wild wild like I wish every listener of we could do hard things when they wake up in the morning could just get a bio read Yes.

Speaker 3 Somebody read them a bio before they get out of bed. Everybody's done a lot of good shit.

Speaker 4 It's so hard to remember when you're in the thick of your day and you just go, wait a minute, everything feels so hard.

Speaker 2 And then you're like, but wait, I've done, I've done some hard things.

Speaker 2 Yes, that's right.

Speaker 3 So why then?

Speaker 3 You know, at this point, you can do any role. Like, why did you, why, Untamed, why? did you say yes to this role?

Speaker 4 Oh my God. Okay.
Well, you know, I told, I think I told you this a little bit that I was convinced it would be a different actress. And I don't know if I'm supposed to, but yes,

Speaker 4 I thought it would for sure be Reese Witherspoon. I thought for sure.

Speaker 4 I remember, you know, I was following the whole launch of the book and Abby, you know, getting you on the speakerphone with Reese and the book being chosen for, you know, it just was, I just thought, oh, it's going to be Reese.

Speaker 4 It's going to be Reese. It's going to be Reese.
And of course, why shouldn't it be Reese? Reese is incredible.

Speaker 4 And then I thought, well, that'll never be me. And then I thought it would be Kristen Bell.
Then I thought it it would be, you know, a lot of sort of, I don't know, very

Speaker 3 charming littler.

Speaker 4 You know, I'm a little taller than you. I don't know how maybe I'll play the part on my knees.
I'm not quite sure what we'll do. Put like knees and shoes on me.

Speaker 4 Cause you're like, you're like we compare. You know, I'm like a,

Speaker 4 so I just thought,

Speaker 4 I don't know. I just, I thought it would never be me, but I dreamt about it being me.
And I would, I would watch you

Speaker 4 read passages of the book, every place I could possibly watch you read passages of the book. And I kept thinking, I don't know.
You know, sometimes there are these,

Speaker 4 and I know you'll know what I'm talking about, these things that are impossible to describe, but this sort of feeling I felt in my body that it should be me.

Speaker 4 Just thought it should be me. And I didn't even know it was going to be made into.
a television program for people to watch.

Speaker 4 But I just thought, if they make this, when they make this, it should be me.

Speaker 2 It won't be me, but it should be me.

Speaker 4 Um,

Speaker 4 and I think the reason I want to do it is because I'm terrified of failing, which is a barometer I often use for the things that I know I must do.

Speaker 4 So, I didn't know it was going to come to me, but I thought it should be me, and I didn't know why, and I couldn't explain why, but just something about it.

Speaker 4 Just, I almost sometimes get a, this is going to make it sound like I think I'm some kind of psychic friends network person, but but I'm not.

Speaker 4 But I had this like shaky feeling when I would see you read it and I would watch you and Abby and I would see interviews with you and sister.

Speaker 4 And I just thought, this is something is, I just would get a little shaky.

Speaker 2 And I didn't know why.

Speaker 4 And then when I got your email, that's why, even though the email seems a little over the top, my response.

Speaker 3 We don't do over the top.

Speaker 2 We really do.

Speaker 4 We don't do over the top. This is just, this is just really what I felt.
And I couldn't believe that it was happening. I couldn't believe it.

Speaker 4 But it terrifies me. It terrifies me because

Speaker 4 you belong to people is what I feel. There are people who kind of claim you

Speaker 4 and need you and all that you represent to feel brave enough, I think, to take steps, to make...

Speaker 4 just little movement, even internalized movements, anything. I think you really are a North Star for a lot of people.

Speaker 4 And I feel that is an enormous responsibility to,

Speaker 4 that people will have attachments to the you that is the you for them.

Speaker 4 And I will, of course, try to do that, but it also has to be sort of filtered through the you that is you that I see, you know, and that, um, because that is the ultimate thing too, is that you have to, you're going to sort of give this over.

Speaker 4 I mean, not that you won't be around for all of it and tell me when I'm doing it wrong, which

Speaker 3 no, cause I won't know.

Speaker 4 No, I I won't. You will.
You'll be like, that doesn't, that doesn't feel like me. Like, I sometimes think about like, will I do a voice? Will I try to do your voice? Will I not try to do your voice?

Speaker 4 All these things that I'm already thinking about. And there's so many things we still don't know yet.
So,

Speaker 4 you know, I just don't want to mess up what, you know, but I do believe that sometimes that is, for me anyway, a incredible motivator

Speaker 4 for like a lockdown deep dive to sort of block out the fear component and just focus on the only way for me to deal with the fear is to focus on the act of the doing and learning everything I can and and

Speaker 4 you know so the fear the fear is mostly why I want to do it and also you're the greatest person who ever lived oh

Speaker 2 I agree and I think it's so fascinating that to be such a high performer

Speaker 3 you are there's only one greater one and that's Sarah Paulson I don't think so might be Abby

Speaker 2 weird. And also you and also sister.
That's a weird thing. I just said, honey, you are the greatest person.

Speaker 4 And my wife just said, Sarah Paulson, you actually are the other one.

Speaker 2 That's right.

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Speaker 3 What do you do? Like when you said right now, you're trying to figure out, can you just, again, I'm dripping with sweat right now.

Speaker 2 I'm sweating too.

Speaker 4 I'm sweating too.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 3 This is a sweaty one.

Speaker 3 Can you talk about what do you do? Like you're trying to figure out

Speaker 3 how to play someone. Like freaking Linda Tripp.

Speaker 2 Yeah, you've got your eyebrows back.

Speaker 2 I see. Oh, they grew in.

Speaker 3 Good job.

Speaker 4 They grew in. Congratulations.

Speaker 4 Thank you because it really was a very painful time for me.

Speaker 4 I mean, can you imagine if you you just took your eyebrows off your face, what you might feel about that?

Speaker 4 Like, it doesn't seem, it's a sort of silly attachment to have to one's eyebrows, but really think about taking them off your face.

Speaker 4 And all of a sudden, the distance between, and also, I have a bit of a high forehead. That's not my.
So if you take the eyebrows away

Speaker 2 between the top of the eyelid and the top of the head is too big.

Speaker 2 It's too big.

Speaker 4 And so it's hard. And it was hard for me to feel, you know, you're playing a character at work 16, 18 hours a day.
Great. Nothing I could want to do more.
It was a heaven on earth to me.

Speaker 4 But then you come home and you still have nothing on your face that used to be there. And so it's like you're still Linda Tripp at home, but you're you.
It's really unpleasant.

Speaker 4 That was the most unpleasant part of it.

Speaker 4 I had no eyebrows on my face.

Speaker 2 How is Holland?

Speaker 3 How did Holland deal with this?

Speaker 4 You know, this is one of those moments where it was very clear to me that this person loves me

Speaker 4 because she always was so she said i think you look beautiful all i can do is see your beautiful features you you know she i mean i'm not going to say what she says to me because it will sound self-aggrandizing and that's not i'm not in the market of that it's uncomfortable for me but she made me feel

Speaker 4 you know i had to gain weight for it my body changed my eyebrows were gone I have these hideous nails that I lived with for these like, no offense to all the people who love an acrylic nail.

Speaker 4 It's not not my jam. I don't love it.
They were, they were like square 90s French tip.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 4 And it was almost a year of this, and I couldn't take them off. So I would come home hairless, you know, with a body I didn't recognize with, you know, hands that weren't mine.

Speaker 4 It just was a trying time. And this is the part that is a little deranged is that I kind of get off on it.
I'm like, look at me.

Speaker 4 I'm, I'm allowing my body to be taken over by another person and I'm that committed. And then there are other moments where I'm like, what was I thinking? This was a horrible mistake.

Speaker 4 And for what, you know, to like embody this other person to then let I don't know. It just, it's a really weird thing to choose to do with your life.

Speaker 2 It's like how are you going to transform to be like Glennon?

Speaker 3 Well, because you do transform. That's the thing about you.
It is so, there are so many people who just

Speaker 3 you're like, oh, yeah, that's that person playing someone, but that's not what the experience is. Watching you act is freaking weird.

Speaker 3 It's like yeah i'm like an actual transcript i hate her i hate her why do i hate her she's my friend and i hate her or she's just like brilliant at getting you to see the whole full humanity of a human being because she doesn't play a character she plays a human being every time all the prism of it so what the hell and how and wtf what the hell and how do you do that how are you prepared to do play me Do you, can I ask you a question to maybe answer expression?

Speaker 4 I could no more explain to you how I do it or what it is i can tell you all the like

Speaker 4 i will work with a movement person and you probably you move in ways i don't think you know but you're going to become aware of them

Speaker 4 you can say that again yeah she doesn't have any idea you're going to become aware of the way you walk and the way i could help

Speaker 2 yeah

Speaker 4 i mean it's beautiful it's not bad like you're making a face like it's bad it's just like the way you are yeah it's the way you are it's the glennon isms there'll be things you know i will watch more video of you than you've ever watched of yourself.

Speaker 4 I remember having a conversation once

Speaker 4 with someone who was married to a person on Saturday Night Live.

Speaker 4 And she told me that the only way that he did what he did was he would pick like one, all you have to do is pick like one undeniable physical communication of a person, like something that everybody notices right away.

Speaker 4 And whether you notice, you notice it or not, maybe not even a thing, but it's the way they move their hair or what they do with their hands.

Speaker 4 And it will sell it if they've got all the right things on in the costume and stuff. So there's a version of that.

Speaker 4 Like I remember with Linda Tripp, the woman I worked with, whose name is Julia Crockett, who you will come to know.

Speaker 2 And she's an incredible person.

Speaker 4 I'm not a singer. I apologize for that moment.

Speaker 4 Neither is Glennon, so we're good. We got a couple of good, I hope we have a singing moment in the show where I can try to

Speaker 4 do that.

Speaker 4 But she watched so much tape of Linda and she, we, there were some things Linda did that if I did them, you would turn the television. She had a blinking thing that was very intense.

Speaker 4 And I thought, well, I can't do, I can't do that blinking thing. It will be so distracting.
And so there'll probably be things about your physical self that I won't do because maybe it would be a lot.

Speaker 3 Like the voice.

Speaker 2 Like me.

Speaker 2 No, I think I have to say, good morning, everybody. Good morning.

Speaker 2 Good morning. Good morning, everybody.

Speaker 2 Good morning. Hi.

Speaker 2 Good morning.

Speaker 4 I don't know. I mean, this is, this is just like my initial hit on it that is like not with any work on it at all.
So it will be better than that. But it'll be a thing you'll decide.
You'll go, I,

Speaker 4 I can't, that feels too, I don't know. I don't know how any of it will happen.
I just know that it will. Yeah.

Speaker 4 I'm trying to embrace this new thing in 2022 for myself, which I have never, never dipped my toe into, which is allowing myself to be confident that I can do what I have spent 20 years of my life doing.

Speaker 4 I have spent an enormous amount of time fertilizing this part of my being that thinks that in order to do my job well, I have to be disparaging about my own abilities. I have to not bring

Speaker 4 self-reverence. I'm not allowed to sort of acknowledge that.
And it's like we all, I think, collectively,

Speaker 4 I know that I've been guilty of this, like a confident woman freaks me the F out. Like I get so.

Speaker 4 freaked and it's because I don't operate that way that I allow myself to decide that it's somehow negative that a woman would think that they're good at what they do, that a human being would allow, but I think men get such a sort of broader, there's so much latitude for them to embrace their

Speaker 4 greatness. Whereas I think as women, it's really hard for us to do confidently.

Speaker 4 And some of that is from the dangerous things that happens, the interplay between women, about not wanting that from other women and feeling so threatened by it.

Speaker 4 And so I am trying so hard to acknowledge that I have spent over 20 years doing what I do.

Speaker 4 And there were times when I didn't know that I knew more and less, but I have to acknowledge at my current age that

Speaker 4 I know how to do it. It doesn't mean that I'll always do it well, because I do believe in that thing of like the Marsha Clark thing was

Speaker 4 I was the right person to play that part. And it was a magic alchemy and synergistic thing across the board.

Speaker 4 And there are other things that I've done since and that I will do in the future that will either have that or won't. And some of it we can't control.

Speaker 4 But I can acknowledge that I know I will, I will do my absolute best and that will be

Speaker 2 good enough. That's right.

Speaker 3 That is right. What do you think are when you think about playing this role? Are there things that you see for yourself? Now I know you're going to point and I so I'm going to stop.

Speaker 3 Do you know when you were at my house and we were chatting on your hands?

Speaker 2 i was so

Speaker 3 i was so yes i get self i'm like oh wait is am i doing a thing that she's going to notice and start doing okay my question is if i remembered how to breathe or move what i would say is

Speaker 3 are there things that you find are similar about us and are different like what thing about me or the me from untamed or the me that you watch in videos feels like something that you're tapping into because they're similar.

Speaker 3 And what do you feel like are is a huge difference between us i think there are more uh

Speaker 4 alignments in our um

Speaker 4 essential being i think

Speaker 4 i really do feel this which is why when i would think that it was gonna be kristen bell i would get so upset because i'm like i don't know if she's the same that i'm the same like glennon and inside

Speaker 4 I'm like Glennon inside. Kristen Belle is great.
She's the greatest ever. Did you see that sloth video on Ellen?

Speaker 2 Like, there's nobody better or greater ever.

Speaker 4 But it's really how I feel. And I don't know why, except for the things that I do know about why.
But

Speaker 4 in terms of the differences, you are braver than I am.

Speaker 2 I think.

Speaker 4 I think you are. I understand why you're making that face, but I do think you are.

Speaker 4 I do know why you're making the face, but I do think you are. I just,

Speaker 4 because let me say this. Here's why.
You, I hide behind character. My self gets revealed in the roles that I'm playing, right? And if people are paying attention, they might notice some

Speaker 4 like connective tissue that's in each character that they might be able to connect to something about me. You are you out in the world as you.

Speaker 4 You are not hidden. You are.

Speaker 4 you are not you are you are you are not hiding i ultimately as a performer inherently am

Speaker 4 hiding a little bit and revealing at the same time. So I think

Speaker 4 there is an inherent bravery in just revealing oneself the way you do.

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Speaker 3 Where do you feel like you're not hiding?

Speaker 3 In what parts of your life

Speaker 3 do you feel like you are the most seen and held and where you're not performing and you're you're just

Speaker 3 the coziest and the most

Speaker 3 where do you feel you're belonging?

Speaker 4 with holland most significantly for sure um it's the most i've never slept the way i sleep when i'm next to holland and i just like a kind of it was the most significant indicator to me beyond the other sort of more

Speaker 4 overt obvious things it was like oh the peace i feel

Speaker 4 and i'm not a peaceful person internally. I am a kind of chaotic, anxious, overthinking person.

Speaker 4 And Holland has some of that too, but she's a much more practical,

Speaker 4 logical,

Speaker 4 optimistic person than I am generally. And so, but there's something about, you know, we sleep holding hands.
This is a real thing that we do.

Speaker 4 And it's not even, it's not even something we started doing or tried to do. It's just how we sleep.

Speaker 4 And that is,

Speaker 4 I just feel most peaceful with her for sure. And I have pockets of of that in my relationships with some of my closest friends in the world.

Speaker 4 You know, Amanda Pete and I have been known to literally wet our pants while being together from laughing so hard, like an actual pee.

Speaker 2 Same. Actual pee.

Speaker 4 We had to pull over once on the road.

Speaker 4 And she was wearing a kind of sweatpant where there was like a bloom of water all of a sudden. I was like, oh my God.

Speaker 2 You peeja!

Speaker 4 And we could, but I couldn't speak.

Speaker 4 And there's a sound that I make and that she makes when she's laughing so hard that is so funny that even just thinking about it really makes me it's just like unacceptable.

Speaker 2 It's like a,

Speaker 4 I can't explain it. It's so horrible.
And it's just, we've almost gotten into car accidents. It's been bad, you know, it's bad.
It's bad and great and delightful.

Speaker 4 And when she laughs, sometimes she goes,

Speaker 4 like something happens with her teeth in her, she's got really big teeth.

Speaker 2 You can play the piano

Speaker 2 on Amanda's teeth.

Speaker 4 And just last night, it was her birthday yesterday and we were talking on the the phone and she something happened and she laughed and she did that like it's almost sounds like a machine gun which there's nothing worse than a machine gun but it's like when it's coming out of her teeth it's only funny

Speaker 4 anyway that was a tangent i went on but there is a lot of peace i have with a person who can pants laughing yes um

Speaker 4 and my sister as well we have my sister and i have a have a very um we're so close in age and um

Speaker 4 So we, we have a laughing thing too that's unnatural. Very natural to us but that's i think people are like okay nobody laughs at it nobody nobody thinks it's funny yeah

Speaker 3 i get it we learned my sister and i learned very young that in uncomfortable situations we would start laughing with each other so this is when we were like seven and ten so sarah we have this we had this thing that when my dad would be yelling at us we figured out if you put your arm over your face like you're scratching your back you can cover your face.

Speaker 3 You can be laughing. We would just be standing next to each other, covering our faces.

Speaker 2 And to this day, the laughing, Abby told me,

Speaker 3 I said, asked her one time, when is she most jealous? Because I'm kind of a jealous person. And so me too.

Speaker 2 Me too. Yeah.
Yeah. Jealous.

Speaker 4 Jealous, really too. Holland, not jealous, doesn't get jealous.
No, no.

Speaker 3 Abby doesn't really get jealous either. And I told her, I said, when are you ever jealous?

Speaker 3 And she said, the only time I'm really jealous is when you're laughing so hard at your sister because she can make you laugh like never.

Speaker 2 More than anybody

Speaker 2 yeah

Speaker 3 speaking of abby yeah abby we you know we haven't i know we haven't we haven't cast an abby because it feels so huge and important what are you hoping for in that casting in that chemistry in that what are we gonna do don't you think abby kind of has to weigh in very heavily about who that person is um that's what i meant to say abby what do you think

Speaker 4 I'm just saying the reason why is that I wonder if it should be for Abby what it was for you with me.

Speaker 2 Ooh, that's interesting.

Speaker 4 I honestly, when I think about it, my brain goes to like,

Speaker 4 where is she? I don't know. Is it who? I don't know.

Speaker 2 That's the thing is.

Speaker 4 That's the thing. It's got to be.

Speaker 2 We've talked about it and it's very weird to have to actually have this conversation about who's going to play me in a television.

Speaker 2 It's a very weird conversation to have so i have to like all right fine i'll do it abby i'll do it go ahead

Speaker 3 um wait sarah you should know that lizzie our my one of my best friends liz gilbert tried out for the role over the phone so she was sending me pictures of like her hair in a mohawk and then like

Speaker 3 like trying to look like abby and then she sent me pictures she said well i know sarah's great but have you seen this and she sent a picture of of herself in like a cartigan with two glasses on her head trying out for the role of me.

Speaker 2 So I don't want to compete.

Speaker 4 I can't compete with Elizabeth Gilbert for the character of Clennam Doyle. Like, I kind of feel like if you have to pass the baton, I would understand.

Speaker 4 I would understand. Yeah.
I don't know who it should be.

Speaker 2 I don't know either.

Speaker 4 And I kind of feel like

Speaker 2 it should just be like a new person.

Speaker 4 I was thinking about that too, because

Speaker 4 here's why. Let me say why.

Speaker 4 Even in the book, and I can just, it's very cinematic.

Speaker 4 Even in the book, it is, it's cinematic, this moment of you seeing Abby for the first time. And the idea of not having an attachment to an actor that audiences have any particular feeling about,

Speaker 4 but the idea that it's about Glennon's experience, aka me, or Elizabeth Gilbert.

Speaker 4 I'm sure there's others. I'm sure all the people will comment below

Speaker 4 about who they would rather see. And that will be a great day for me.
And they will not. So in advance, I say thank you and F you.
Um, no, um, uh, um, um, some people might and no, they won't.

Speaker 3 I will have a block party.

Speaker 2 I will have a block party that day, and I will block, block, block, block, block. Okay, great.

Speaker 4 I've never liked a block party more. Um, but the idea that it is your experience of seeing this person and what happens to you when you see her

Speaker 4 is easier to do when it's a person that nobody has any, um,

Speaker 4 you know, should just be some some girl out there woman out there who's a star and she just don't know it yet that's right

Speaker 3 but we do that's right i think open open casting call for abby yeah do you know what's interesting is that that is what sarah mccarron who is um gonna be the showrunner and you and i had a meeting with her sure did during that meeting sarah paulson i don't even know if you know what you were doing in that meeting but when sarah mccarron started talking, we were needing somebody who understood, who was the same as us on the inside, and who understood all of the layers of what this show needed to mean to the world.

Speaker 3 And she started talking fire out of her mouth. Okay.
The fire we needed. And Sarah, you started, you were like in the feet, you were rocking back and forth.

Speaker 3 I was like, okay, so yeah, you were rocking back and forth in your chair the whole time she was talking. And I was like, okay, so I guess we're not having a poker face during this one.

Speaker 3 I guess we're just going to, we're going to,

Speaker 4 I'm not great at that that's not my that's not my strong suit you were so excited and i was so excited she's amazing she's just amazing have you guys been watching station 11 yes email you about this because i'm obsessed by it and there was one episode in particular and written by sarah mccarron and i was like boom bong bing bong we already have her ding dong ding dong yes and we've been meeting every day to like we've just been talking about all of what the show needs to mean i'm bringing her up because she said those words to me that you just said.

Speaker 2 She did?

Speaker 3 Yes. She said, I feel like it needs to be, everyone needs to have the reaction when they're watching,

Speaker 3 their own reaction, like you had. Like we want everybody to go, holy shit, who's that? Right.

Speaker 3 Holy shit, what is that?

Speaker 4 Holy shit. So

Speaker 4 she is that.

Speaker 4 There she

Speaker 2 is.

Speaker 3 So that's interesting. I can't wait for you to like just this.
Sarah's amazing.

Speaker 4 We knew it. We knew it.

Speaker 2 We knew it.

Speaker 3 We knew it. She got on the call, started talking.
We're like, there she is.

Speaker 4 We're like, there she is.

Speaker 2 What is that?

Speaker 5 What? That's

Speaker 4 that. There she is.

Speaker 3 So, Sarah Paul's saying question.

Speaker 4 Your whole theater background informs everything that you do. And I heard you say that.

Speaker 4 text is queen. You're text derived for your process.
And I heard you say that you dig in there until you find out what is at stake in every story, like what's truly at stake and then you let that

Speaker 2 your

Speaker 4 person you become emerge from what's at stake

Speaker 2 do

Speaker 3 what is at stake in this story in the story of untamed

Speaker 4 um a life

Speaker 4 everything

Speaker 4 everything

Speaker 4 i think oh my god i mean um Sometimes when I get asked a question where there's 15 answers to it, I almost like see a, you know, like a paint wheel that you get when you look at colors of paint.

Speaker 4 And if you spin it really fast, there's a million colors on there, but they actually go white when you spin it really fast. So it's like I see nothing all of a sudden.

Speaker 4 The reason I said that about stakes when it comes to acting

Speaker 4 is because I believe in every person's life,

Speaker 4 everything is at stake all the time. And I think sometimes people,

Speaker 4 When you're acting, there's a lot of like throwing it away things and this casualization of things and making making things less important uh sometimes is a style of acting um and it's just never been my style because i always think

Speaker 4 anything anyone is pursuing in life matters more to them than anything in the world whether it be you know uh

Speaker 4 finding shelter for their child or you know making a choice to leave a bad situation for a better one or you know what they want to put in their coffee like sometimes things like that are vitally important

Speaker 4 exactly

Speaker 4 you know and um

Speaker 4 in terms of what is at stake in Untamed, to me, it's about survival and freedom and stepping into one's power and owning one's choices and

Speaker 4 being able to breathe.

Speaker 4 I think the book is too huge in terms of its importance and its value to even put, and almost also because of the way it's written, each piece of it, each individual, I don't even, what do you call them, Glennon?

Speaker 4 I mean, are they chapters? They're not even, are they chapters? Are they, you know, they're yeah, they're not. They're not.
So it's like each

Speaker 2 story.

Speaker 4 Story vignette. I mean, I don't even,

Speaker 4 I don't even know how to categorize it, which is what's so incredible about the book is that it's totally original, too. It's just never been, which is what's so exciting about what I imagine will be

Speaker 4 the thing about what Sarah, you and Sarah will, that is so important, I think, to it feeling like the book is to have it not be a sort of traditional way of telling a story. That's right.

Speaker 4 You know, because it isn't a traditional story. You are not a traditional person.
And yet, in its lack of traditionality, is that traditionality? Is that a word? I like it. I don't know.

Speaker 4 I went with it. It becomes completely universal.
It's like in its uniqueness, it is the story of every woman, you know, person, really.

Speaker 4 But it's hard for me to put into a kind of categorical stakes

Speaker 4 because I think each little part of the book, each one has a different

Speaker 4 velocity to it. And sometimes they're still and sometimes they're full of fire and sometimes they're quiet.
And I don't know. It's just so like a person.
It's so multifaceted like a person, you know?

Speaker 4 So it's so amazing to me.

Speaker 3 What do you feel like is when you think about

Speaker 3 your life and your relationship to all people and to the queer community?

Speaker 3 What do you, because it was very important to me. I mean, I was just really grateful that you, what I would have called before now, queer, that you were queer.

Speaker 3 Thanks for that, by the way.

Speaker 4 You're welcome. I did it for you.

Speaker 2 I needed that to be true.

Speaker 4 I did it so I would be right for this part.

Speaker 3 Thank you. Thank you a lot.

Speaker 3 Because that was actually very, really important to me.

Speaker 3 And I read this. that you said in the New York Times a long time ago, I read this, probably when I was obsessing about you.

Speaker 3 And it's funny that you just think that you were sitting there in your bed thinking I should play this part. And it was coming from nowhere.

Speaker 3 It was coming from me across the country praying in my bed to God that she would tap you and say, make you really feel like you needed to play this.

Speaker 3 But you said, if my life choices had to be predicated based on what was expected of me from a community on either side, that's going to make me feel really straitjacketed.

Speaker 3 And I don't want to feel that. What I can say absolutely is that I am in love and that person happens happens to be Holland Taylor.
This is an ongoing life conversation between me and Abby.

Speaker 3 Do you identify as anything?

Speaker 4 I identify as a human being in love. That's how I identify.
I sometimes, and this is a more complicated,

Speaker 4 I reject and resist that which is sort of insisted upon me by any person. It makes me crazy.
And it's not because I don't want to belong or I don't feel part of

Speaker 4 the community as it is. I want to be the

Speaker 4 president of my life, the governor, the governess, the mayor of my town. And I don't want to be.

Speaker 4 And I think sometimes it is a bit of a pushback that is just a,

Speaker 4 you know, because I feel,

Speaker 4 I don't know, like, like,

Speaker 4 I don't want to have to answer to anyone. I want to answer to me, and I want to answer to those people in my life.
And I want to live honestly and make honest choices for me.

Speaker 4 And I don't want to worry about disappoint. I'm already like at war with my own disappointment in myself.
And I already am having to fight that battle with me. And I'm quite a worthy adversary.

Speaker 4 And so I just, I just,

Speaker 4 just can't have the other noise. It's too much for me.
So it's not because I don't feel part of it. It's just I don't like a label in any which way and certainly not put on me by anyone other than me.

Speaker 4 So does that make sense? Does that sound like

Speaker 4 I don't want it to feel like it's a rejection of something to choose

Speaker 4 that idea or to that belief system for me works for me and I don't mean it to be a rejection of something else.

Speaker 4 I have no problem if somebody else, you know, wants to label me in one particular way or the other, I suppose, because, but it's not how I,

Speaker 4 I don't know, because, and this is, I mean, this will be the most inflaming thing a person could ever say, but, you know,

Speaker 4 I don't know what the future holds. I just don't want to worry about letting anyone else down.

Speaker 4 I want to be the only person that I'm worried about doing that with, except for the people that are in my immediate circle that I, you know, who I depend on for my brain health and my heart health.

Speaker 3 And, you know, I get that deeply. It's kind of like religion in that way.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Well, every inclusion is an exclusion.
Exclusion. That's right.
I remember when

Speaker 2 actually Chase came out to us, I remember saying, you know, and if one day in the future you change your mind, like, great. Like, we are good with you.

Speaker 2 Whoever you want to bring home, whoever you want to be, we are good. Yeah.
It's not about us. It's about you.

Speaker 3 You make you happy.

Speaker 2 That's right.

Speaker 4 What did he say when you said that? Was he relieved or did he expect that you would say that?

Speaker 2 I want to know. I think that, I think he was just like really overwhelmed with having just come out.
So I don't know if he actually heard me. I'll circle back around in a couple of minutes.

Speaker 2 Let's just come on with him.

Speaker 3 We know what's so funny is that

Speaker 3 we, that was our reaction. And that was like the same thing that

Speaker 3 a person who is very different, like a mother who, like your mom. was like, this isn't necessarily real.
Like you can change your mind.

Speaker 3 And that was on one side. And we were on the other side going, oh, you can can change your mind.
But we meant it like in the most fluid, progressive way.

Speaker 2 But it was the same thing as saying, Well, no, my mom didn't say you could change your mind, she just said you're not, no, you're not. Yeah, I was like,

Speaker 2 No, I am. No, she was like, No, you're not.

Speaker 4 She's like, I'll just wait here until you change your mind.

Speaker 2 Yeah, whatever. This is not about me.
I just, I think it's so beautiful because I think it's really important that

Speaker 2 you just have to, every single person gets to be and do as they please, I believe. And that is true, truly, what I think being a queer person in the world.
It's just like you do, you.

Speaker 3 And we shouldn't have to belong to people in order to be seen and respected and celebrated. Like that belonging and

Speaker 3 checking all the boxes shouldn't be a requirement

Speaker 3 to be seen and allowed in the world.

Speaker 2 Except you. You belong to me.
Except for you.

Speaker 4 Yes.

Speaker 2 Yes.

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Speaker 4 Glenn, your hair has gotten really long.

Speaker 2 Do you know what happened, Sarah Paulson?

Speaker 3 Is that my wife for Christmas got me this fancy thing that is a blow dryer that blow dries in magical ways from some weird company?

Speaker 4 And because my entire life, it's a Dyson.

Speaker 2 Yeah, this is not a commercial for Dyson.

Speaker 4 Sorry, but it works.

Speaker 4 It's a great blow dryer. I have it too.

Speaker 3 And Abby looked at me today and I was actually using it, which is weird. And she was like, what's happening with all of these waves? And I was like, I just, life is such shit right now.

Speaker 3 Like, I swear to God, Sarah, I just, I, I don't understand what's happening. The pandemic.

Speaker 2 2022 has been a dizzy. Yeah, I went into

Speaker 3 just already a total

Speaker 3 shit show. And I don't remember who I am or how to be human.
And, and I'm just fucking blow-drying my hair, Sarah.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I blew dry. I'm just blew.

Speaker 4 I blew dry. I blew a mind dry.
What is it? Blew it.

Speaker 2 It's a tough one. I blew dry.

Speaker 2 I blowed it.

Speaker 4 I blowed it. I blow-dried it.
You done.

Speaker 2 I blow-dried it. I blow-dried it.
Wait.

Speaker 4 I blow-dried it.

Speaker 2 I blowed it dry.

Speaker 4 I blowed it dry. No, that's not.

Speaker 2 I blew it to dry.

Speaker 4 I blew it dry.

Speaker 4 I blew it out. I had a blow-dry.

Speaker 4 I blowed it. No, it's not bloated.
It's definitely not that. That shows you how, but I did this.

Speaker 2 That's so good. You have a curly dry.

Speaker 4 But see, my hair is curly. I have a curly, weird hair.

Speaker 3 Same.

Speaker 4 Yeah, same. Another place where we are aligned.
But I do think about sometimes the joy I'm going to have with your hair in this show. Yeah.

Speaker 4 Like early days, long, long, long time hair.

Speaker 3 You can get real housewife extensions. I'm going to get it.

Speaker 2 I might get real housewife.

Speaker 4 I do like them. And I, it's only because I want to play them all, really.
That's the thing. Right.

Speaker 4 I just look at them and I'm like, explain to me what you're doing. I'm trying to understand what you're doing.
And I'm fascinated.

Speaker 4 Maybe I'm just tricking myself into thinking i'm doing something when really it's just like a way of creating some negative space in the brain where i usually have none you know that might be it so you're calling it's like a lot of so i'm calling it research but really it's just like this

Speaker 4 like a test like a test pattern

Speaker 4 that's the extent of my singing

Speaker 4 blew it i blew it dry guys

Speaker 2 i blew it i blew the front of my hair dry i blew it dry well i blew it dry

Speaker 3 i do hope you get to do I hope they put in the scene when I first went out for Karen Warrior and I went on the Today Show and I was watching a lot of Real Housewives back then, Sarah Paulson.

Speaker 3 And they told me,

Speaker 3 I was a mom and I didn't go anywhere really, but the bus stop and

Speaker 3 a few other places. And they told me to get TV ready.
Okay. So if you're going to tell me to get TV ready and the only thing I'm watching is the housewives.

Speaker 3 What I need you to do is Google at some point my first Today Show.

Speaker 3 I had extensions down to my waist i had a skin tight dress on with chicken cutlet plastic things in my boobs so that my boobs would look bigger i had eyelashes that were a mile and a half long i had botox in my forehead and my topic was how we should show up as we are vulnerably transparently as ourselves in the world okay and nobody knew what to do with me because obviously

Speaker 3 so at one point they discussed you had this viral essay about about don't carpe diem, which has to do with you know

Speaker 3 knowing that being a young mom is hard and time going by fast. So, you know how they put the ticker at the bottom with the yes, it's you know, it will be like

Speaker 3 Nobel Prize winner or like whatever. Mine said, Mother who understands that time goes by fast and is okay with it.

Speaker 3 That

Speaker 3 was why I was on the dated and is okay with it.

Speaker 4 My question is, do you have a date so that I, because I'm sure that you've been on the Today Show a lot, what is it? What year was it?

Speaker 2 I am going to send it to you.

Speaker 2 Please send it to me.

Speaker 2 This is

Speaker 3 too much to be real. It's, it's too much.

Speaker 4 But I just, I'm excited about it, you know? Yeah. Yeah.
I'm excited about also how I can find a chamber that I can step into that will just reduce my height by like, I know, isn't that interesting?

Speaker 4 It's just like, I wish I could just,

Speaker 3 you know what we'll do, Sarah? We'll just make every other person

Speaker 3 really around you four inches taller.

Speaker 4 Listen, they do things like this.

Speaker 4 I mean, we don't want to give away all the secrets, but they could like make a countertop much higher looking so that I'm actually not that much higher than the countertop compared to the and then the person.

Speaker 4 Yeah, you can do all kinds of, there's all kinds of short, short movie stars that have been towering over women for years.

Speaker 3 That's right.

Speaker 4 With the help of lifts and boxes and apple boxes and camera angles.

Speaker 3 So we can make how tall are you?

Speaker 2 What? How tall are you?

Speaker 3 I mean, I know I've already Googled five, you're five, six, right?

Speaker 3 Five, seven.

Speaker 4 No, I'm like five, six, and three quarters.

Speaker 3 Five, seven, yeah.

Speaker 4 But I'm not really five seven because things have already started to like, yeah, they're right. 2020 was

Speaker 4 2020 and 20, but it was really hard. So I think I'm like five, four and a half now.

Speaker 2 Exactly. Probably.

Speaker 4 How tall are you? Are you five?

Speaker 3 I'm five three.

Speaker 2 No. No.
Sister, yes, I am.

Speaker 4 I just went to the doctor's point.

Speaker 2 Tell them.

Speaker 2 It said 5'3.

Speaker 4 Look at Switzerland over there.

Speaker 2 It said 5'3.

Speaker 4 The form that Glendon reported her height, it said 5'3. How tall is she, Amanda? How tall is she? She is 5'2 and 3-quarters.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 What is a quarter? My God.

Speaker 3 I can't believe I've gone through all this for one little quarter of an inch. I'm just reporting it.

Speaker 4 She said she's 5'6 and 3 quarters. And you're not taking her three quarters.

Speaker 4 You're rounding your zone nobody will know nobody knows how tall people are in television well i just think whoever our abby is she just has to be taller than i yeah so oh gosh

Speaker 4 open casting but you have to be seven and a half feet tall you have to be seven and a half feet tall or we won't even see you that's fair we won't even see you we won't meet we don't want to see your reading we're sure you're great but no

Speaker 4 so it'll help us narrow it down honestly yeah exactly i just think and what i mean by that is five nine five ten is fine because i'll be in some flats, I guess.

Speaker 2 That's right. That's right.

Speaker 3 Unless it's the today show and then you're going to need to work.

Speaker 2 I'm going to use the letters. Okay.

Speaker 3 I, we need to let sweet Sarah Paulson go right now.

Speaker 2 Oh, I hate when Sarah Paul

Speaker 3 has all these beautiful conversations because we're going to make such beautiful, wonderful things together this year.

Speaker 2 And I'm just. I know.
I need us to start.

Speaker 3 Oh, don't worry. We've been starting, Sarah Paulson, every day.
I've been, Sarah, McCarran, and I have been writing and working every single day.

Speaker 3 And if you understood the fire and beauty that is going on,

Speaker 3 I mean, Sarah, Abby walked into the room into a Zoom the other day.

Speaker 2 I thought she was in a proper fight with somebody, like that somebody was attacking. I walk in and I was like, what's going on?

Speaker 2 And she's just discussing, you know, feminist theory with Sarah McCarran. Like,

Speaker 2 like, they're just discussing the theory of it all. And she's like, she's like, don't tell me.
And I was like, is everything okay? She's like, oh, yeah, no, we're just talking.

Speaker 3 I'm yelling at them.

Speaker 2 Right. Not her.
Right.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 4 So the greatest greatest news about this is that there she is. We found the right person.

Speaker 2 We did. Yeah.

Speaker 4 That's so incredible. And she is great.

Speaker 3 She's a passion for her.

Speaker 2 I've actually spent a few hours with her.

Speaker 4 She's great.

Speaker 2 And she's, she's very, very, very smart. She's way smarter than that.

Speaker 3 And so's Ben. And Jesse has gotten us to this point.
Yeah. I think she understands the book better than I do.
So that was a bonus.

Speaker 4 You were like, that is what I meant.

Speaker 2 That is exactly what I meant with that sentence.

Speaker 3 It's just like no one else has brought it up.

Speaker 4 No one knew it, including me.

Speaker 4 But thank you.

Speaker 2 Oh, my God.

Speaker 3 I'm so glad you exist. And I'm so incredibly grateful that you said yes to this.
And I just love you so much. I love who you are in the world.

Speaker 3 And I just think this is going to be the beginning of many beautiful things to come.

Speaker 4 I hope and pray that that is exactly right. And I know it is.
I just don't want to let you down. I'm working on it, though.
Never. Working on my

Speaker 4 confidence about being able to do this. Yeah.

Speaker 2 Aren't we all? You're going to be great. And I will be the best fucking cheerleader in the whole wide world.

Speaker 4 Correct. I know that to be great.
You're going to do great.

Speaker 2 And Holland and I will sit on the sidelines and just marvel.

Speaker 3 And they'll talk about how beautiful we are, even without eyebrows.

Speaker 4 We love you. Oh, man.
I love you. I love you.
You're doing so many hard things.

Speaker 2 Thank you for having me. Goodbye.
You're the absolute best.

Speaker 4 You're the absolute best. I love you.

Speaker 2 We love you.

Speaker 3 I give you Tish Milton and Brandy Carlisle.

Speaker 3 I walked through fire.

Speaker 2 I came out the other side.

Speaker 2 I chased desire.

Speaker 2 I made sure I got what's mine.

Speaker 2 And I continue to believe

Speaker 2 That I'm the one for me

Speaker 2 And because I'm mine

Speaker 2 I walk the line

Speaker 2 Cause we're adventurers and heartbreaks on map

Speaker 2 The final destination

Speaker 2 We've stopped asking directions

Speaker 2 to places they've never been.

Speaker 2 And to be loved, we need to belong.

Speaker 2 We'll finally find our way back home.

Speaker 2 And through the joy and pain

Speaker 2 that our lives

Speaker 2 bring,

Speaker 2 we can do a heart thing.

Speaker 2 I hit rock bottom, it felt like a brand new start.

Speaker 2 I'm not the problem,

Speaker 2 sometimes things fall apart.

Speaker 2 And I continue to believe

Speaker 2 the best

Speaker 2 people are free

Speaker 2 and it took some time

Speaker 2 but I'm finally fine

Speaker 2 Cause we're adventurers and heartbreaks on that

Speaker 2 Our final destination

Speaker 2 We stopped asking directions

Speaker 2 to places they've never been.

Speaker 2 And to be loved, we need to be known.

Speaker 2 We'll finally find our way back home.

Speaker 2 And through the joy and pain

Speaker 2 that our lives

Speaker 2 bring,

Speaker 2 we can do a hard things.

Speaker 2 We're adventurers and heartbreaks on that.

Speaker 2 We might get lost, but we're okay.

Speaker 2 we've stopped asking directions

Speaker 2 in some places they've never been.

Speaker 2 And to be loved, we need to be known.

Speaker 2 We'll finally find our way back home.

Speaker 2 And through the joy and pain

Speaker 2 that our lives

Speaker 2 bring,

Speaker 2 we can do

Speaker 3 We Can Do Hard Things is produced in partnership with Cadence 13 Studios. Be sure to rate, review, and follow the show on Apple Podcasts, Odyssey, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 3 Especially be sure to rate and review the podcast if you really liked it. If you didn't, don't worry about it.
It's fine.