Welcome To The Julia Louis-Dreyfus Brain Museum [VIDEO]

Speaker 1 So good, so good, so good.

Speaker 1 New markdowns are on at your Nordstrom Rack store. Save even more, up to 70%, on dresses, tops, boots, and handbags to give and get.
Because I always find something amazing.

Speaker 1 There's so many good brands. I get an extra 5% off with my Nordstrom credit card.
Total queen treatment. Join the Nordy Club at Nordstrom Rack to unlock our best deals.
Big gifts, big perks.

Speaker 1 That's why you rack.

Speaker 1 This This episode is brought to you by Nordstrom.

Speaker 2 Cool temps are here.

Speaker 1 Time to level up your wardrobe at Nordstrom. You'll find the best cold weather must-haves, including thousands of styles under $100.

Speaker 1 Shop head-to-toe cozy from faves like UGG, All Saints, Nordstrom, Skims, The North Face, and more. Plus, free shipping, free returns, and quick order pickup make it easy.
In-stores are online.

Speaker 1 It's time to go shopping at Nordstrom.

Speaker 2 Okay, as soon as you're ready I'm ready I'm ready

Speaker 2 all right go let's do it

Speaker 2 action and action

Speaker 2 was

Speaker 2 do you like the and

Speaker 2 when they do and action or do you just like action and

Speaker 1 doesn't and just become isn't it like saying action action basically no because and is before action so it's half the beat before it's like saying

Speaker 1 One, two, three, go. Same thing.
Same idea.

Speaker 2 Okay, so it just gives everybody like a moment to.

Speaker 2 yes as opposed to action oh yeah i can feel that you feel that i can feel that does the does the way a director kick off a scene influence how the scene goes it can like if you're doing like a really intimate calm scene or like and someone's like action does that throw everything off or

Speaker 2 what do you think i don't know i genuinely

Speaker 2 throw it off it would be a disaster for everyone oh i want to be the director who switches it up And action Will Smith.

Speaker 2 That's great. That's great.
Love the way you ran across the bridge.

Speaker 2 This is What Now

Speaker 2 with Trevor Noah.

Speaker 2 Welcome to another episode of What Now, the podcast where we have interesting conversations with interesting people who oftentimes make us think or feel.

Speaker 2 And I think our guest today is honestly, you know, the pinnacle of that. If you watched everything or anything, you'd know her from Seinfeld,

Speaker 2 the character Elaine, the best dance move ever in history.

Speaker 2 If you watched HBO or if you had access to the show, you know Veep, the show that satirized American politics. And then American politics were like, well, we're just going to do that.

Speaker 1 Sorry.

Speaker 1 Sorry, everyone.

Speaker 2 Oh, wow.

Speaker 2 If you watch movies, you know her from really wonderful, fascinating movies that oftentimes don't match up with what you think she would be doing from what you've seen her doing on TV.

Speaker 2 And today we're having a conversation about one of those movies.

Speaker 2 It's a film called Tuesday, a fascinating story about a mother and daughter who are grappling with death that is knocking at their door in the form of a macaw.

Speaker 2 So, Julia Louis Dreyfus, welcome to What Now?

Speaker 1 Thank you, Trevor.

Speaker 2 It's so good to have you, especially considering like, A, how busy you are, and then B, how famous you are. I like, do you ever,

Speaker 2 no, I was thinking about this, and it sort of framed, you know, what I'd want to talk to you about today, and it's evolution in all forms.

Speaker 2 And it's not really about the fame, it's just about like, sort of, let's call it impact even. Okay.
You know, you have...

Speaker 2 impact in the 90s starring in one of the most successful sitcoms of all time. Yeah.
And then, you know, you have impact in the 2000s on Veep as one of the, you know, it's the most successful,

Speaker 2 like hardcore, you know, HBO, like, you know, go all in. But that's, that's the vibe at the time.
SNL. I even forget SNL.

Speaker 2 Think about like, cause that was before my time as an, I wasn't watching American TV. And then now you're doing it again in film and you're in the podcast space, which makes me feel good, by the way.

Speaker 2 Why? Well, because if you're doing podcasts, then I think I'm in the right space at the right time.

Speaker 1 You're perfect for podcasts because you're you're such a conversationalist.

Speaker 2 Thank you.

Speaker 1 You are.

Speaker 1 Yeah. I mean, I've heard your podcast.

Speaker 2 You're quite good at it. Just

Speaker 1 throw some back at you.

Speaker 2 Thank you very much. I like to start with a little self-compliment.
Thank you very much. But no, seriously, like, let me ask you this.
Like

Speaker 2 selfishly, maybe. Okay.
But also for people who are like evolving or trying to evolve in life. Like, how do you keep your finger on the pulse of what will be versus on just what is?

Speaker 2 I don't know. Have I done that? I'm not.

Speaker 2 You don't think you've done that? Well, I don't know.

Speaker 1 I haven't ever thought about my life like that. I mean, I've been,

Speaker 1 I know you're going to think it's bullshit. I think I've been pretty lucky, but I'm also incredibly ambitious.

Speaker 2 I don't think it's bullshit at all.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I mean,

Speaker 1 it's been both. I've also failed,

Speaker 1 by the way, but carried on from it because I just like to do this.

Speaker 2 That's all.

Speaker 1 But I would add that I don't feel regret.

Speaker 1 I don't have regret.

Speaker 1 So even the things that didn't work in the way I had hoped that they had worked,

Speaker 1 I can stand by proudly, you know? Like even SNL, for example. I stunk on SNL,

Speaker 1 but it was not a good experience for me. But guess what? I just, I

Speaker 1 met a lot of people and I learned a fuck ton on that show. I did.
I really learned a lot. And that

Speaker 2 and it, and, but I learned the hard way it was hard it was hard do you bounce back quickly from those

Speaker 1 uh i guess i do wish it takes sometimes it takes some time you know you can get a little bruised

Speaker 1 and i've take it to

Speaker 2 sometimes i cry and stuff and then and it's okay yeah because i know for for stand-ups we try and find that next joke or the next moment that'll make us feel like we're in the right place.

Speaker 2 How do you help yourself bounce back? Like, what's the thing?

Speaker 2 Because with stand-up, it's easy. You go tell another joke, and then it sort of

Speaker 2 helps you get over the previous failure. Yes.

Speaker 1 I walk away from it completely. Oh, damn.
Yeah. So I can just, you know, I get out of that headspace.
That's the thing that's so nice about like, since we're not, you know,

Speaker 1 we're not brain surgeons here. We're actors.
And so you can like be like, all right, fuck it. It's just, it's just movies.
It's just TV.

Speaker 1 I'm going to go focus on something else. And so I do.
And that's good for me too, for real.

Speaker 2 You know, one of my favorite people I've seen speak about this is Denzel Washington, where he, oh, he like, he doesn't take it as seriously as people would think he does. Right.

Speaker 2 But he loves doing it and he respects the craft. And he, but he also goes, what a fun, silly thing to be doing.

Speaker 1 It's ridiculous. You know what I mean? Yeah, you're making a living doing pretending.

Speaker 2 Yes, pretending, but then making people feel real.

Speaker 1 Yeah, which I love. I remember when I was little, really little, and I was in the car with my mom,

Speaker 1 and she was driving, and she was, I don't know, talking to somebody in the front seat. And I was listening to the conversation, and I was noticing how it didn't sound like people acting.

Speaker 1 It was people talking. So I've already started to notice things like that.

Speaker 2 How old were you when this was happening?

Speaker 1 What do you think? Maybe eight.

Speaker 2 Wow.

Speaker 1 But I remember noticing that. And anyway, I don't know why that just popped into my head, but it did.

Speaker 2 You're just sitting in the car.

Speaker 1 Listening.

Speaker 2 And you're going, this sounds real.

Speaker 1 This sounds real. Yeah, this sounds real.

Speaker 2 When did you know you wanted to do that?

Speaker 1 Like, I... Oh, from the get-go.
I mean, I don't remember knowing that I didn't want to do it. I've always wanted to do it.

Speaker 2 But what did you want to get into, the show or the business?

Speaker 1 The show. I wanted to be in a show.
Yeah? Yeah. I mean, I wanted to, you know, play a part.

Speaker 2 I was listening to your conversation with Conan, which was really great. And the two of you talked about how there used to be like a linear path to success.
It was like

Speaker 2 you make a sitcom, and then you hope that another one comes, and then maybe there's a movie, and then your life is over.

Speaker 2 You've broken that mold time and time again.

Speaker 2 And when I speak to people who are in the industry, Like if I say, oh, I'm going to be talking to Julia Louis Dreyfus, it's amazing how they all admire you for forging like a

Speaker 2 new idea of what you can do.

Speaker 2 Do you feel that for yourself as well? Do you ever, like what I mean is,

Speaker 2 do you think to yourself, I'm going to do something new purposefully, or is it the luck that's coinciding with you just wanting to work?

Speaker 1 It's not something necessarily something new. I wouldn't sort of characterize it as such.
I would say I'm going to do something that gets me going and I'm going to find that again.

Speaker 1 Does that make sense?

Speaker 2 That makes complete sense.

Speaker 1 Yeah, that's what I'm looking for, that.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 it's exciting. It's kind of like fishing.
You don't know what's going to bite.

Speaker 2 Do you fish?

Speaker 1 I do.

Speaker 2 Really? Yeah. What kind of fishing?

Speaker 1 Any kind I can do if I'm on a boat or if I'm near a river. I'm not very good at it, but I do love it.
There's something about the excitement. You don't know what's coming.

Speaker 1 And I sort of feel that way about

Speaker 1 jobs, you know, touch wood.

Speaker 1 I'm also superstitious.

Speaker 2 Superstitious. Okay, I like that.
So you just go, I don't know what's going to happen. I don't know what it's going to be, but I'm going to jump into this excitedly and then see.
Yeah. Totally.

Speaker 2 What do you like about working? Because I feel like everyone has a different thing. Some people are running away from something.
Some people are running towards something.

Speaker 2 So what do you like about working?

Speaker 1 I like.

Speaker 1 Well, there are a few things I like. I like being part of a team because when you're working on something, you're, you know, as actors and with crew and the director and so on, you're part of a team.

Speaker 1 You're all working towards this common goal of making whatever this is. Right, so

Speaker 1 I'm making the assumption that everybody's on the same page. That's not always the case.

Speaker 1 Sometimes people are bumping heads, but let's just assume when it's really working, that part of it is incredibly satisfying. And then

Speaker 1 I like the play of work.

Speaker 1 I like playing. I like the playfulness of being an actor.
That just really appeals to me.

Speaker 2 And were you like, I've met you out, and I feel like, like at the club, I want everybody to know this. You were partying hard.
We were at the club. It was a good time.
I was like,

Speaker 2 I was like, JLD, what are you doing in the club? She's like, I can't hear you. I was like, that's because we're in the club.
Yeah, I know. But when we met,

Speaker 1 we were wasted.

Speaker 2 No, but when I met you out,

Speaker 2 I was pleasantly surprised at how close you are to some of the characters you play obviously not as crazy and as quirky as as you know as some of the moments but there's there's there's the underlying current of you in everything sure you know and then and then you know like like in this in this new movie for instance that you're in tuesday i i don't recognize you to be honest okay i don't know which i think is a good like i see parts of what i who i think you are but yeah i don't see you you you know the the me that you know yes the yeah exactly exactly who who do do people think you are versus who you are?

Speaker 2 Like, how far do you think those two are from each other?

Speaker 1 Well, they always think I'm going to be funny, which

Speaker 1 I'm not. I mean, I am, but I'm not, you know.
Yeah, but you are. But you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 Yeah, okay, yes.

Speaker 1 I'm sure it's the same for you.

Speaker 1 People are expecting

Speaker 1 something to come from you.

Speaker 2 I often disappoint people.

Speaker 1 Yes, I do the same. I do the same.
I'm actually kind of,

Speaker 1 I'm an observer. I'm listening to those conversations.

Speaker 2 This is what I try and explain to people.

Speaker 2 If you're always performing, when are you absorbing what you're going to put into the performance? Correct.

Speaker 1 That's exactly right.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 2 Okay, I see this. Yes.
Yeah, Tuesday was,

Speaker 2 first of all, thank you.

Speaker 2 Oh, wow. I know it's a weird thing to say, but thank you.
Oh, wow. So I, because I watch things before the interview, and then sometimes they're terrible.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 And I don't mean that in like a, like a, like a disparaging. It's just like they're terrible.

Speaker 1 Oh, they can't all be good, right?

Speaker 2 Yes, exactly.

Speaker 2 You know, half of my stand-up, I'm sure, is terrible. So I understand, but I don't put it out.
But this was like, it wasn't just amazing.

Speaker 2 It was also way deeper than I thought it was going to be. And I didn't know what to expect.
Oh, good. Oh, good.
I'm not going to lie. So I watched it cold.

Speaker 1 You had no idea?

Speaker 2 No idea what I was getting into, which is like, which is how I like to watch movies.

Speaker 1 Sure, that makes sense. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And then I got into it and I was like, Is this a horror? Then I was like, no, it's not. No, wait, what is happening here? It's really disconcerting.

Speaker 1 Yeah, well, I mean, it's, yes, it's a fantasy. It's a, it's a sort of a fairy tale with magical realism.
And you go on this journey with

Speaker 1 the sort of three main characters. My character, Zora, my daughter, Tuesday, and, of course, death.

Speaker 2 I almost don't want to spoil it for anybody, but I want to talk about the themes and the story. I will say things that hopefully will make people watch watch the movie.
Okay, that's good.

Speaker 2 But won't make them understand the movie. Okay.

Speaker 1 We won't be able to pick it completely apart anyway, because it's sort of multi-level, that movie, I think. But anyway, I'm so curious to know what

Speaker 1 appealed to you or didn't or whatever about the movie.

Speaker 2 I really can't. So the first thing for me is

Speaker 2 I couldn't tell whether or not it was a comedy. which I think

Speaker 2 I genuinely think is one of the best things you can create in life is

Speaker 2 a story where people are unable to discern whether or not it is or isn't funny. Because I think that's what life is, depending on how you're looking at it all the time.
Couldn't agree more.

Speaker 2 You know, like if somebody falls in the street and it's like that like funny splaying fall, it's funny if you're not the person.

Speaker 2 When you're the person, it's not funny until they have a little time away from it, then it becomes funny. And I feel the same way about like stories and movies and things.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 Depending on what moment you're watching it from, you go, man, this is funny. No, it's not funny.
This is very sad. This is deep.
Right. This is hilarious.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's got a little bit of everything, but I would say it's much more

Speaker 1 dramatic than it is comedic. But, by the way, completely off-subject, but somewhat related.

Speaker 1 Have you ever seen that footage on

Speaker 1 somewhere on the internet where they took like the shining and they put a comedy soundtrack to it?

Speaker 2 Yes, I have seen that.

Speaker 1 Isn't that fascinating, by the way?

Speaker 2 Yeah. But I talked to,

Speaker 2 it was Jordan Peele about this

Speaker 2 and i said to him please don't be offended you know it's sometimes i say things i i understand people might take them wrong so i said don't be offended but sometimes i watch your movies and i go this is a very funny comedy and he said in his opinion all horrors are comedy with scary music oh it's the same pacing it's the same rhythm it's the same that's fascinating And so I wonder when you...

Speaker 1 I need to work with him.

Speaker 1 I would love to work with him.

Speaker 2 Yeah. When you're reading the script for a movie like Tuesday,

Speaker 2 are you seeing it as something because they've told you it's that? Or are you going, oh no, I can make this what I want it to be because I'm going to be in it?

Speaker 1 Neither.

Speaker 1 I read it cold, so I did not know what it was.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 you can imagine, I was just sort of like

Speaker 1 blown away by what was on that page and was really quite immediately intrigued, but

Speaker 1 had to get some understanding of what the writer, director,

Speaker 1 what her vision was here. And because there is animation in it,

Speaker 1 I wanted to make sure what she was thinking about vis-a-vis the animation. Because if that animation doesn't work, this thing is going to be a piece of crap.

Speaker 2 I didn't even think of it as animation now.

Speaker 1 I know, although it was played by this extraordinary actor named Arinze Kenne,

Speaker 1 who is this great British actor. And he was

Speaker 1 with us the entire time.

Speaker 1 He is a cast member in the movie, and then they animated over him. So we were playing scenes with him.

Speaker 2 Okay, so as the, I thought it was a parrot, but then I was a paranoid.

Speaker 1 It's a macaw, whatever. But it's a kind of an exaggerated version.
of a macaw. It's a fantastical version because macaws don't really look like that.
They're not that color.

Speaker 1 They're not, you know, blah, blah. And of course, he morphs throughout

Speaker 1 Size and color-wise.

Speaker 2 It's very disconcerting.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it is, in fact, because in the beginning of the film, my character is completely in denial about what is happening in her life and more importantly, what's happening with her daughter, and is making very, very bad decisions because of that denial.

Speaker 1 Right. Denial is not a great, not a great

Speaker 1 response most of the time.

Speaker 2 And yet it seems like the most natural one.

Speaker 1 Yes, exactly. I think we all do it to a certain extent.

Speaker 2 I think it would be weird if we didn't.

Speaker 1 Yeah, but you know what else is weird? We're all good. I mean, this movie,

Speaker 1 you know, it's a conversation starter, I suppose, about death and dying and afterlife and all of that. And it is extraordinary to consider that we're all going to die.

Speaker 1 And we don't really think about it too much. But it's funny to think that all the people in this room, you know, we're all going to be dead one day.

Speaker 2 You hear that, folks?

Speaker 2 Did I create you out?

Speaker 2 That's what I loved about the movie was you were playing, in my opinion, everybody's idea of who should and shouldn't die.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 2 Like you represented the idea that we all have of who,

Speaker 2 like we all think we know who should and shouldn't die and when they should and shouldn't die.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I'm negotiating with death.

Speaker 2 Yes. Yeah.

Speaker 2 I have a friend who always says, you don't know that you're going to die.

Speaker 2 He has this theory, and I actually believe him. He goes, we all do not know that we're going to die.

Speaker 2 We think, like, as a theoretical idea, we understand that death is the conclusion of life. Yes.
But he argues, and I felt it in this film in a way.

Speaker 2 He argues that nobody knows that they're going to die. Like, we,

Speaker 2 I know it seems like it's.

Speaker 1 Well, would he agree that your body will stop working? No, no, no.

Speaker 2 He says, but he just says that.

Speaker 1 Because if that's not the case, your friend needs some majority.

Speaker 2 No, no, no. So this is what he said for me tied into the film because

Speaker 2 every day people are dying. Yes.
Right?

Speaker 2 I would argue that most people are shocked when they die.

Speaker 1 Shocked. And the people around them are shocked.

Speaker 2 Yes, but and that's what he's saying is because nobody knows. Like nobody, it's like we don't know that it'll happen.
We don't believe that it'll happen. We're told it like a theoretical thing.

Speaker 2 That's right. And everyone goes, yes, of course, death is, yes, of course.
And then it's like, wait, me?

Speaker 2 Totally.

Speaker 2 My family?

Speaker 1 Exactly. Isn't that amazing? Isn't that amazing to think about? Yeah.
Yeah, it really is. Me?

Speaker 1 No, no, no. You mean them over here?

Speaker 2 Not. No, no, no, not me.

Speaker 2 We're going to continue this conversation right after this short break.

Speaker 2 Okay, so this is what I wanted to ask you about comedy-wise. I'm fascinated by physical comedy.

Speaker 1 It's really fun, isn't it?

Speaker 2 It is both the lowest form of comedy and simultaneously the highest. Yes, yes.

Speaker 2 And so I wanted to know from you, like,

Speaker 2 how are you thinking of physical comedy in a movie about death that's really sad, but you're still doing something really funny, but it's not the same way you would do the funny as Elaine.

Speaker 2 Like, okay, like the scene, for instance, where you grow to the size of the room.

Speaker 2 It's very funny. You think?

Speaker 2 You didn't think it was funny?

Speaker 1 No, I didn't think of it as being funny, but I'm delighted you did. It's fine.

Speaker 2 Oh, damn. I might have that comedian brain thing where I laugh at the wrong things.

Speaker 1 It's okay. You know, you're the winner.
You laughed.

Speaker 2 Well, I didn't laugh. I thought it was funny.

Speaker 1 Oh, I see what you're saying.

Speaker 2 It didn't make me laugh, but I went, this is a funny...

Speaker 1 It's weird. I would say it's weird.
It's weird. But that's different than physical comedy, you know, I think.
I mean, in my view.

Speaker 2 Well, but you're the expert. I would defer to you.

Speaker 1 Well, I mean, when you say physical comedy, I'm thinking of using your body sort of physically to get the laugh, to enhance a joke, as opposed to in this film, there's all this crazy physical stuff that happens, but it wasn't in service of a joke necessarily.

Speaker 1 Does that make sense?

Speaker 2 That makes complete sense. Okay.

Speaker 2 And so the way I interpret physical comedy is I go, how does somebody do something with their body that can make you laugh whether or not the int that's why I talk about falling.

Speaker 1 Yeah, falling is great.

Speaker 2 Like, I think think falling is the best physical comedy. Yeah.
But no one who's falling intends for you to laugh. It is not punctuating a joke.

Speaker 2 They're walking, and then there's a joke at the end of it. But there was not a joke.
No one wrote a joke. Yeah, right.
Walking, walking, walking, no more walking.

Speaker 1 There was a scene that we did on Veep.

Speaker 1 It was in the last season, and we are, I think it's... I think it's the convention.
Maybe it's the final episode. I don't really remember.
But anyway, in which my character's having,

Speaker 1 I can't even talk about it. It still makes me laugh.
My character is having a really bad time, per usual. Nothing's quite going her way, and she's flipping out.

Speaker 1 And I'm sitting at a couch, and Tony Hale, who plays my

Speaker 1 beloved, or would like to think he's beloved assistant, comes up to me and he says, and I'm out of my mind, and he comes up to me and he goes,

Speaker 1 Do you want, do you want six almonds? Sort of a nod to do you remember the Obama almond story. Yes, which was seven almonds for him.
And so he goes, do you want six almonds? And

Speaker 1 this is physical comedy that I thought really helped

Speaker 1 that joke because it was written, do you want six almonds?

Speaker 1 But then what happened was Tony comes up sort of behind the couch and into my ear, and I turn and I scream at him, full pitch scream in his ear. No, I'm telling you this now.

Speaker 1 It's not funny in the telling, but it's a huge scream at him.

Speaker 2 And he fell backwards

Speaker 1 behind the couch. And I honestly, to this day, as you can tell, I think it's one of the funniest things I have ever been a part of, his fall.

Speaker 1 And it made me think of it because it was a fall, because he also falls out of frame, which is, you know, it doesn't get better than that.

Speaker 2 Falling out of frame.

Speaker 1 Oh, we planned it in rehearsal. So in other words, it was written,

Speaker 1 do you want six almonds? Selena screams no, but then I have this idea. Well, how about he comes over, he whispers it, and we put do it in such a way so that my no knocks him out.

Speaker 1 And I mean, it was very, it was very tech savery cartoon-like, but it was, but in the scene itself, it seemed to make sense. Anyway, watch it, you'll see what I mean.

Speaker 2 This is what I'm now understanding. What I find funny oftentimes in life is not the intention of the person,

Speaker 2 it's not whether the thing will or won't be a joke, and it's whether they said,

Speaker 2 it's how ludicrous the action is.

Speaker 1 Yeah, and how it, yeah.

Speaker 2 Like when you literally, when you eat the head of a fully charred creature thing,

Speaker 2 it is, it's so like, and there's a, there's a thing you do with your eyes, which is like, it's almost like you're thinking, like, this is, this is, but you know what? It's done. It's done.
Totally.

Speaker 2 I've done what needs to be, and you even pause while chewing it. There's like a, like a mid-chew pause.
Yes. And then more chewing.
Yes. And that's what I, I don't know, that's what I find funny.

Speaker 1 I think it's yeah, that, I guess that is funny.

Speaker 2 I mean, I think in the theater, people laugh or they're like oh jesus you know i mean it's it's also i guess disgusting i don't know yes and i i think that's that's that's a great story that's a great performance that's i'm humbly saying as an audience member please i'm not a director i would shout action at the wrong times so i don't think so you strike me as a clever person

Speaker 2 i couldn't help find myself wondering when i when I was watching the story about Tuesday, I couldn't help wondering how much of it

Speaker 2 you drew from your from your life or how much of it like reminded you of of your life you know

Speaker 2 you you've shared um you know your story of like the pain of loss in your life you know losing your dad for instance yes and and just like how much he meant to you his love of poetry and and you know the the way he connected with you as a human being and shaped you into who we see you as today

Speaker 2 and you know you've you've shared your journey for instance diagnosed with cancer and and how that affected you etc when you're watching the movie tuesday

Speaker 2 I feel like everyone can and will connect with it because everyone has or will deal with loss and grief in some way, shape, or form.

Speaker 2 And I wondered when you were, like, when you were doing that, was there a part of you that was

Speaker 2 either remembering or processing or feeling, or, you know, did it connect with you in a way that went just beyond the story? Oh, without question, the entire movie.

Speaker 1 I tapped into my experience as someone who is, I've lost a number of people who are very close to me.

Speaker 1 I certainly tapped into that. I tapped into the ferocity that I feel as a mother

Speaker 1 and my bond with my children. Yes, I would fight death to save my child's life.
I would fight death. I wouldn't even hesitate.
So I tapped into all of that stuff, all of it. And

Speaker 1 to

Speaker 1 because that's your job as an actor, you have to bring honesty. And so that's what I was, I did.
And it was not easy.

Speaker 2 How do you move on after

Speaker 2 loss? Like loss.

Speaker 2 Well,

Speaker 1 I mean,

Speaker 1 in my experience, anyway, and people suffer all kinds of different loss, and

Speaker 1 of course, but in my experience,

Speaker 1 you know it obviously it takes time and and then

Speaker 1 something that sort of helped me and I've found it to be the case is that it's not like the relationship with the person that you've lost has ended it's just shifted so for example you mentioned my father so I think of my father all the time.

Speaker 1 I feel as if I still have a relationship with him. And it's maybe more of a

Speaker 1 mysterious spiritual relationship, but he's very much in my

Speaker 1 being

Speaker 1 and

Speaker 1 so it's a shift. It's a shift.
What about you? Have you had a lot of loss?

Speaker 2 The only loss I've experienced in my life, I think, is my grandmother. I remember thinking about this.
When it happened, I didn't realize that I'd never experienced grief until that moment.

Speaker 1 Were you with her when she passed?

Speaker 2 No, no, I wasn't. But I remember when my grand passed, it was a it was

Speaker 2 it's almost like there was a door inside my chest that had never been opened oh and all of a sudden somebody opened it yeah and i was feeling something that i i couldn't you know it's like a it's like a color on a wheel that that doesn't have a name or label attached to it so you go it is neither sadness nor nor is it

Speaker 2 nor is it joy, but it feels like both at the same time.

Speaker 2 I can't explain it. I found myself crying, but also smiling.

Speaker 2 You know, because I was like,

Speaker 2 I don't know. It was like every memory of her, every moment when I would walk into a room and she would smile at me,

Speaker 2 every dish she would cook for me,

Speaker 2 it felt like her life was

Speaker 2 playing again in my head.

Speaker 2 And I was celebrating that with tears. It was a very, very strange

Speaker 2 feeling.

Speaker 1 You still think of her a lot?

Speaker 2 Oh, yeah, yeah, all the time.

Speaker 2 Whenever I'm feeling

Speaker 2 lost, is the wrong word, but whenever I'm feeling a little unmoored,

Speaker 2 there'll just be moments where I go, go to a mirror and look at yourself the way your grandmother looked at you.

Speaker 1 Oh, that's very moving.

Speaker 2 Do you know what I mean? Yeah. Because I feel like that's oftentimes what it is.
You know, we,

Speaker 2 you know, going back to the film, funny enough, I think sometimes what we're what we're not trying to lose is not the other person per se,

Speaker 2 but it's what the other person holds of us in them. them.

Speaker 2 Yeah,

Speaker 2 totally, 100%.

Speaker 2 You know, and that's something that I, that I loved

Speaker 2 in the way you were portraying this mom.

Speaker 2 At the beginning, she seems overwhelmed, overworked, like doesn't have time for it.

Speaker 2 Can't even have the conversation. You know, like when your daughter in the movie says, can we speak? And she's like, let's speak tomorrow.

Speaker 2 And then it's amazing to see that shift

Speaker 2 when we, going back to we know we're going to die or we know somebody's going go,

Speaker 2 it's like, oh, actually, I do have the time. Actually, I should make the time because

Speaker 2 I'm not just losing you, I'm losing a piece of me that is in you.

Speaker 2 And so, that was, yeah, that's why I say thank you. Because I, you know, I mean, I clearly laughed at moments where it wasn't funny.

Speaker 2 I still say thank you, though.

Speaker 2 Don't go anywhere because we got more. What now after this?

Speaker 2 So, you're also the host and creator and driving force behind a podcast that has become really successful, wiser than me.

Speaker 2 It's different because it's not the same type of project, it's not attached to a giant studio, it's not a machine, right? But it still excited you, I'm assuming. It did, yeah.

Speaker 1 I mean, it excited me because it was that decision was really driven by my own, my own curiosity. I mean, for real, and um,

Speaker 1 and sort of like

Speaker 1 consternation at the fact that older women become invisible and older men, particularly older white men, are not invisible. And that irritates me.

Speaker 1 But it's not really being driven by irritation. It's being driven by curiosity because I saw this

Speaker 1 documentary about Jane Fonda. which if you haven't seen it, you really should because you'd really be interested in it.
And so it got me thinking like, wow, I didn't know all of this about Jane Fonda.

Speaker 1 She's got this huge life, she's done all so many different things. Yeah, and I hadn't really given that consideration.
And then I thought, well, who else is?

Speaker 1 There must be so many older women in the universe who have done so many things, and we're not hearing from them in an in-depth kind of way. I wish that somebody would do that.

Speaker 1 And then I thought, okay, I guess I'm going to do that because I was because I was very curious about it. But it's hard work doing a podcast in case you didn't know.

Speaker 2 Yeah, but yours seems like it's it's particularly hard because you you you have a conversation with a person who you admire that sort of like starts in the benign and really blossoms into this beautiful examination of life and how you see yourself and the stories you'll tell and the stories they'll tell and and the advice that they'll give you like on the show.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's amazing, right?

Speaker 2 Do you know what I mean? Like there was one episode, I forget who it was, and she was, she was basically like chastising you for being worried about death and aging and everything.

Speaker 1 Isabelle Allende.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it was, but it was really amazing. It was, it feels like you are,

Speaker 2 in a way, connecting us with a,

Speaker 2 it's spiritual. That's the way I put it.

Speaker 1 It feels spiritual to me as I'm doing it, even though it

Speaker 1 just takes so much time, but it does. It feels.

Speaker 1 Every time I finish one of these conversations, first of all, I'm exhausted. And, but I am, you know, half the time I'm weeping and I I feel

Speaker 1 better for it.

Speaker 2 If you were interviewing you as like, like the young you, let's say it was, it was, let's say you were on your podcast

Speaker 2 as you now, but then speaking to you when you were like kicking things off, is there anything you would change? It doesn't seem like there's anything changeable in your life.

Speaker 1 Oh, that I would tell myself? Yeah.

Speaker 2 Oh, absolutely. Sure.
No, like what?

Speaker 1 Well, you think I'm making a joke, but I'm not. I would say, wear sunscreen.
I'm not kidding you. Wear sunscreen.

Speaker 2 I know.

Speaker 1 It's not deep, but it's really practical.

Speaker 1 And I would say trust your instincts.

Speaker 2 When did you ever not trust your instinct and regret it?

Speaker 1 I was not as self-assured as I wish I could have been when I was...

Speaker 1 I had an interior monologue of questioning myself a lot when I was younger. And I wished felt more self-assured.
You know, it was a different time, too, I think, to a certain extent.

Speaker 2 So, what do you think changed? Because now you carry that swag. I mean, I don't know you like without that swag.
So, what changed?

Speaker 1 What changed experience?

Speaker 2 I've learned a lot. Yeah.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 I've learned a lot, you know.

Speaker 1 You know, for example,

Speaker 1 when I first started to try to produce the television that I was in,

Speaker 1 I felt nervous about asking for it.

Speaker 1 And I sort of wrung my hands about that.

Speaker 1 And then if they, the powers that be pushed back,

Speaker 1 that would sort of make me feel self-conscious in a way. Yeah.
And now I know that that's ridiculous and that I have a lot to offer. And

Speaker 1 yeah, I'm going to produce it.

Speaker 2 You're Julia Louis Dreyfus. Fuck off, yes.
That's what you do now.

Speaker 1 That's what I do.

Speaker 2 I saw, I was reading this thing about,

Speaker 2 I think it was a profile in the New York Times, and they were asking you a question that I feel like everyone is getting asked all the time.

Speaker 2 I don't remember people not being asked it in the last, let's say, like seven-nish years.

Speaker 2 And the question was, do you think that there is comedy that cannot be told? And, you know, do you think that comedy people are becoming more sensitive?

Speaker 2 And I really loved your answer. Good.
I'm glad. No, I really, I really loved your answer because

Speaker 2 maybe because I agree with it. It'd be funny if I like.
I loved it and I think it's wrong. But I

Speaker 2 know I loved it because I agree with you.

Speaker 1 I loved it. You're full of bullshit.

Speaker 2 Yeah. I love the fact that you said there is nothing wrong with being sensitive to how comedy is or isn't affecting people.
Right. Right.

Speaker 2 And I also agreed with the sentiment that, like, it's not like you can't make the jokes.

Speaker 2 People are making jokes.

Speaker 1 People are continuing to make jokes. Yes.
It's continuing. Nobody's, we're not being hamstrung.

Speaker 1 And I'm in big favor of being

Speaker 1 of evolving.

Speaker 1 Of evolving. Think of what entertainment was 50 or 60 years ago.
I defy you to look at that.

Speaker 1 We have evolved from then.

Speaker 1 And I think we must continue to evolve.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah, I completely agree.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 I also don't think there's anything wrong in accepting that evolution does not necessarily mean that the past was bad. I think sometimes we're unfair to ourselves as people.

Speaker 2 And I go, especially as a comedian, I'm like, comedy is going to evolve. Society evolves.
Like there are things that society, you know, used to deem very acceptable, but it doesn't anymore.

Speaker 2 Like right now, we could be doing things in comedy or in conversations that people think are cool today. And then in 20 years, they'll be like, oh, we might even go, huh?

Speaker 2 I can't believe I spoke like that. Oh, I can't believe I said that.

Speaker 1 I can't believe I said that. I hadn't realized.
I hadn't realized. I wasn't looking at it through that lens.
Yes. There's more to understand.
There's a lot we don't understand.

Speaker 2 That's true. I do also wonder, maybe you think about this.
Do you ever think about

Speaker 2 how we find the balance between caring what everybody thinks about everything we create and also creating because we think something is worth creating? Yeah,

Speaker 1 I do.

Speaker 1 That balance is, that's the balance right there.

Speaker 1 Because if you start to care too much about

Speaker 1 how it's received,

Speaker 1 you will be paralyzed by that. So it has to come from within about what appeals to you.

Speaker 1 You come at it from that. And if it lands, fabulous.

Speaker 1 But if it doesn't, well, at least you're true to yourself, so you can walk away with your head high.

Speaker 2 That's what I think.

Speaker 2 So here's what I think. I always think it's about acknowledging the possibility that you might share the world with somebody else,

Speaker 2 but then still moving forward with what's true to you. Yeah.

Speaker 2 You know, so it's like I try and do comedy the way I drive, like when I'm on the road.

Speaker 2 I drive because I'm trying to get somewhere, and I, you know, I'll change lanes when I feel it's appropriate, but I acknowledge that there may be other people using the road.

Speaker 1 So, I am amazed that you've brought this up because I have often thought

Speaker 1 that if government and

Speaker 1 people and societies,

Speaker 1 let's see, I'm going to articulate this just right.

Speaker 1 I wish very much that politics could work exactly as you say.

Speaker 1 Because,

Speaker 1 in other words,

Speaker 1 you want to get ahead of the car in front of you, okay, that's fine, but you're not going to do it so that you, unless you're out of your mind, you're not going to do it so you're going to drive that other car off the road, right?

Speaker 1 So there are parameters of respect

Speaker 1 that are built in

Speaker 1 and

Speaker 1 self

Speaker 1 preservation. Yeah.
We all want to get somewhere quickly, I assume.

Speaker 1 But there is an understanding that we're all doing it at once and that has to be understood.

Speaker 2 Anyway, I don't know.

Speaker 1 It sounds maybe silly, but

Speaker 2 I love that. I think it's because here's what I, I mean, mean, I could be wrong.
I think what's happened in the world is we are

Speaker 2 in many ways, we've become so insulated from each other that we no longer believe that other people are actually moving in a direction that is similar to us.

Speaker 2 There was something that we should never take for granted about everyone watching the same show, even if you didn't like it.

Speaker 2 But having a similar point of reference about what reality is and where you want to go and how you see other people.

Speaker 2 And I think politics is the same now.

Speaker 2 We now exist in a space where people go, it's me and it's you and you not trying to do the same thing. I don't even think your kids are real human beings.

Speaker 1 Are they kids? It's me or you.

Speaker 2 Yes, exactly. Zero-sum.

Speaker 2 And I feel like going back to the beginning of this, like with comedy, I don't think comedy is a zero-sum game. I think it is possible to laugh with and at people with them knowing that it is.

Speaker 2 like they're doing it with you as well. Does that make sense? Totally.

Speaker 1 And to that point, so I had the great opportunity, honor to meet Supreme Court Justice Elena Kagan. Oh, wow.
This was a number of years ago. This was back when Veep was on the air.

Speaker 1 And she told me that she and Justice Scalia, who was alive, obviously at that time, they would get together weekly and talk about the show. No ways.
Swear.

Speaker 1 And they would talk about the show and what they loved and blah, blah, blah, blah, and laugh about the episode. And that

Speaker 1 was a dream. That is a dream to me.
That is a dream to me. I'm pretty almost 100% sure.
Nothing about any decision Scalia ever made lines up with how I think.

Speaker 1 However, the fact that he was able to enjoy it and she was, and they were both able to laugh at it.

Speaker 2 That is magic. That's magic.
That is. That is magic.
That's magic. Yeah.

Speaker 1 So there you go.

Speaker 2 All right.

Speaker 2 There's a question I ask everybody on the podcast. Okay.

Speaker 2 Because of the name of the podcast, What Now. And everyone has a different what now for me.
After speaking to you, I feel like the what now question for me is more like

Speaker 2 what now

Speaker 2 as you go into this stage of life, if we want to call it that, because it

Speaker 2 you know, it feels like now you're in a different movie vibe, but also like a different person vibe. Is there a what now for you?

Speaker 2 Where do we find you and and what is the now, like that you're moving on to?

Speaker 1 Oh, well, I feel like I'm just starting. So I feel feel like I'm just like, I've got a lot more to get done.

Speaker 2 In life?

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I do. I feel like I'm still going.
Like a lot, well, I am still going, but what I mean is, is that there's a lot more that I would like to be able to chew on.

Speaker 2 Oh, sink my teeth into. Do you know what it is?

Speaker 1 No, but I just feel that way.

Speaker 2 That's a great way to be.

Speaker 1 I'd like to do a musical on film. Yeah, that would be really fun.

Speaker 2 I like this for you.

Speaker 2 I also ask you because I've noticed in a bunch of your interviews, people, you'll say something like this and then it happens. I don't know if you've noticed that about yourself.

Speaker 1 No, I haven't.

Speaker 2 Someone asked you if you'd ever do a Marvel movie and then you were like, yeah, I'll do it pew pew. And then you were in one pew pew.

Speaker 1 Yeah, and I just, I just rapped like a week ago.

Speaker 2 So this.

Speaker 1 Pew, pew, pew, pew.

Speaker 1 That's the movie, guys. I just gave it away.

Speaker 2 Spoiler alerts. Spoiler alerts.
But this has been fun.

Speaker 1 Really fun. I mean, it's really nice to just have a conversation and talk.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Well, that's what I've selfishly always wanted to do with you.

Speaker 2 I think your brain is probably one of the most powerful and interesting brains. And because it's like societally, it's not acceptable to like

Speaker 2 take brains out of heads. And I like to then speak to the person who has the brain in them and try and understand a little bit of the magic that it contains.

Speaker 1 Do you want me to like when I die, do you want my brain to

Speaker 2 I wouldn't be able to to understand it. I would like that, but I wouldn't be able to understand it.
So then I would just have a mushy thing.

Speaker 1 In formaldehyde sitting on your bookshelf.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it's not great.

Speaker 2 This is what I would like to do. And this is what you gave me.
I hope one day there's just like a museum of all your works.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I'd like there to be a museum, too. You know what I mean? I'd like a museum.
That'll be my next thing. I need a museum.

Speaker 2 I think it would be great. Think about it.
We walk through the museum of your performances, your comedy, your drama, your life,

Speaker 2 your impact.

Speaker 2 I think you might even be shocked at how amazing that museum would be.

Speaker 1 Can I tell you something? First of all, you have a lifetime membership to that museum. Thank you very much.
Just giving that to you right now. And if anyone's listening and they want to donate to the

Speaker 1 Louis Dreyfus Brain Museum Fund,

Speaker 1 we'll get you the HTTP, et cetera.

Speaker 2 Right. Yeah,

Speaker 2 we'll put the link up. Okay.
We'll put the link up.

Speaker 2 This was so much fun. Thank you.

Speaker 1 Likewise, I feel the same. Yeah, thank you for being.

Speaker 2 I hope there's not too much selling of the movie as you carry on.

Speaker 1 No, but also just the right amount. Yes, so people see it.

Speaker 2 Go and see it. That's the one thing I will say to everyone.
Go and see it because it is a fascinating,

Speaker 2 funny for me in more parts than maybe for you, possibly disgusting, but all-around beautiful exploration into the meaning of life by

Speaker 2 examining death at our door. There we go.
Perfect. Thank you.

Speaker 2 What Now with Trevor Noah is produced by Spotify Studios in partnership with Day Zero Productions and Fullwell 73.

Speaker 2 The show is executive produced by Trevor Noah, Ben Winston, Stanaz Yamin, and Jodi Avigan. Our senior producer is Jess Hackle.
Marina Henke and Claire Slaughter are our producers.

Speaker 2 Music, mixing and mastering by Hannes Brown. Thank you so much for listening.
Join me next Thursday for another episode of What Now.