Ed Sheeran: You Either Love Me or Hate Me

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What is up, daddy gang?

It is your founding father, Alex Cooper, with Call Her Daddy, Daddy, Daddy, Daddy.

Ed Sheeran, welcome to Call Her Daddy.

Hey, okay, wait.

I was going to ask you,

a musician never is sitting in the seat at 9 a.m.

Like, I've never had a musician.

Is that the coffee?

There we go.

Bring in the coffee.

Thank you.

Thank you so much.

Thank you.

I'm honestly an early riser.

Like, I'm an early riser and an early bedtimer, but I'd have two very young girls at home.

So, like, I'm up at 5.30 every morning.

Oh, my God.

So, yeah.

I was up at about 6.30 this morning.

And what time did you go to bed?

3.30.

Oh, wow.

So you could get, like, do you get a little like loopy?

Like, are you going to get like weird, funny?

Are you going to like fall asleep on me?

Honestly, I have no idea where my body is at the moment.

We've been in India, China.

And then just and then UK for a bit and then now in America.

So my body is all over the shop at the moment wait you were in Boston we're in Boston last night yeah that is one of my favorite places ever I went to college there so Boston to me is like

Boston University amazing I spent many nights on bar floors and club floors and so where are you originally from Pennsylvania amazing and then I went to school in Boston and I remember being in Boston and be like this is the greatest fucking place these bars are epic the people are epic like everyone just goes so fucking hard it definitely feels European it definitely has like a vibe vibe about it that every time I've gone to Boston, like it's always been the first

place for me, like the first biggest theatre I played, then the first arena I played here, and then the first stadium.

And it's always been, but I guess there's something to do with the Irish heritage, I guess.

But yeah,

I love Boston.

Last night was fun.

We did, it was obviously St.

Patrick's Day.

And

I flew the folk band that played with me on Galway Girl, I flew them over, and they learned all my songs.

And we basically did a trad jam of, it was like a set, but it was like with an Irish trad band.

And was that where you were like running on top of the bar singing?

No, that was in Nashville.

That was in Nashville.

Oh, you've been like getting after it.

Yeah, I've been around.

I kind of, this whole entering into this album campaign, I was just like, I don't want to do anything that I've done before.

And for me, all of that sort of stuff is so fun.

It's like way more fun than like organizing a like proper gig that's ticketed and blah, blah, blah.

If you just turn up somewhere and play, you still play the gig, but it's just chaotic and fun that's fun though that you're at a place in your career where you're even interested in doing those type of things because i feel like the bigger people get they're like no i don't need to go do random shit like that oh no it's the that's i feel like that's when you actually connect with people i think i find it so fun uh i like the balance of having all of it like Even when I was on tour in the States last time, I was doing a theater on a Friday and then a stadium on a Saturday and I loved the juxtaposition of the two.

And I think being a performer,

no matter what you do in life, if you do the same thing all the time, eventually it's going to get tiresome, even if it's playing a stadium show the whole time, which is obviously like a really, really amazing thing to do.

But when people, I talk to people about it and they ask about doing these pop-up shows to 20, 30 people, I'm like, you wouldn't eat a burger, breakfast, lunch, and dinner every single day.

So it's nice having

a little mix-up.

We're switching.

I love it.

Yeah.

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Okay, I want to get your take on some very American things as a Brit.

Okay.

Rodeos.

Yeah, I'm down.

I like...

Do you know what I like is culture?

And I feel like a rodeo is culture.

I like going to countries and feeling...

Like, that's what I,

I lived in Nashville for a couple of years.

I lived in New York for a year.

I've lived in LA, like, on and off.

And doing things that are so specifically American,

if that makes sense.

Like, you go to, whenever I travel the world, I'll try and do things that feel cultural.

And I feel like going to a baseball game and having a hot dog feels, for me as a Brit, I'm like, this feels American.

I think, like, a rodeo is that for me.

Like, get getting into the swing of that would be fun.

Like, I would love...

I spoke to my promoter and I was like, do they do tours of of rodeos?

I'd love to just tour rodeos, even if it's like for four weeks, just

do it.

Okay, you living in Nashville at that time, or any time, have you ever considered doing a country album?

I think there's, yeah, I guess so.

But I, the, from living in Nashville, you can't just like dip your toe in.

If I'm gonna do it, I have to do it, and then that's it.

Do you have like a good twang?

Like, could you pull it off?

I feel because my heritage is

sort of Anglo-Irish, and I grew grew up with trad music in my household.

I think it would have to be a little twinge of that.

I think I'd have to bring Irish trad music into country because it's all kind of, it's the same instruments anyway.

But yeah, so I wouldn't have a twang.

But

I've made country songs in the past.

They've just never come out.

I feel like

I have to do it

properly.

And I think when you transition to country, you can't transition back.

Once you're there, you're there.

So maybe you'll do it like you're later.

100%.

And Nashville is like my favorite city in the states and i would yeah it's always been like my end goal would be like i'm gonna move to nashville and transition to country but i yeah i i think you just have to do it properly it's like uh it's a genre you have to really respect and um it's not just uh dipping and out i get it

um okay the super bowl i like it have you ever been asked to do the super bowl There was a conversation about 10 years ago to go on with someone, and I think that would be the only way that I would do it at the moment.

I don't think, I've had this conversation before.

I don't think English artists are like, I mean, there are some that have the pizzazz of Super Bowl, fireworks, dancers, blah, blah, blah.

But me going up there and being like, here's the A-team, and here's perfect.

I just don't, like, no one wants to see that.

Whereas if there was a show with a lot of that, like, say, like, if it was Beyoncé's show and she had all the kind of bells and whistles, and then there was a moment where we sung perfect together, that makes sense to me.

But me, I don't know, I can't, i can't picture myself doing it can you picture me doing it i as you're talking i'm trying to picture it yeah what what if it's like a spotlight and for 15 minutes

you know i would definitely go on and do it with with someone i think i think yeah just to do the super bowl but i don't think my uh

set

lends itself to that i don't know i just you know like you got horses for courses you got to do what like suits you don't get it twisted I really appreciate the self-awareness.

Like most people would be like, call me whenever and put me in.

You're like, you know, I don't know if I've got that side of the things where I'm like going out and outfit changes.

I think I could nail one song.

I think I could, if someone brings me on, I think I could do it really well for one song.

But I can't.

Just my, the catalogue that I have doesn't really lend itself.

Have you seen me play as well?

Because it's with a loot pedal and you have to build the things.

It doesn't really lend itself to the Super Bowl.

Hey, hang on, guys.

I just got to set this up for two minutes.

You know, it doesn't really.

And also, like, you saying, like, and I come out and I'm singing like 18, like everyone just starts sobbing in the audience and it's like getting in their feels.

And then they just go and get a beer.

This is so comfy here, buddy.

Are you?

Isn't this cozy?

So comfy.

I wanted you to feel like you can really, like, you could take off your shoes.

You don't have to take off your shoes, but some people take off the shoes.

Very clean.

Okay, don't take off your shoes.

Keep your shoes on.

Ranch dressing.

I got really into ranch dressing when I lived in Nashville.

And then I got really fat.

So I've kind of like eased off the rants dressing a bit.

I'm more of a like balsamic vinegar boy.

Sorry, what, yeah, a bell salmon, balsamic vinegar?

You never had that?

Oh, balsamic.

Oh, right, yeah.

I have this in restaurants where I say water, and they're like, What?

Oh, water, water.

Wait,

say it balsamic?

Balsamic.

Oh my god, I thought you said a

ball salmon.

No, I thought you said

a ball sack.

No, I thought you said a ball salmon.

Then

okay, yeah, yeah, yeah okay so you're into your balsamic vinaigrette yeah oh hell you know we have a cider uh where i'm from in in suffolk that's like it's like the number one cider in in the uk and it's called aspels and i was saying that to a friend and he was like y'all i have a cider called ass balls

you never see it it does sound like that what is it aspels it's like uh it's well it's a It's a cider.

It's like a, oh, you guys would call it a hard cider.

What is your favorite thing to eat when you're here?

Chicken wings.

But the chicken wings are like the size of my fist.

And when you see the chicken wings in England, they're like, you know, actual chicken wings, but they're quite like meagre.

And, you know, but here it's like you're literally eating steroids.

Because they're pumping them with all that shit.

And then we're like eating it and acting like nothing.

Chicken wings.

Okay, the best American fast food chain, in your opinion?

Five, guys.

I think.

Everywhere around the world.

But I'd say when I'm in America, Whataburger in in Texas.

I think that that burger bangs the most in terms of all the burgers that I've had.

What a burger bangs.

But if there's it's an American fast food chain around the world,

I'd usually go five guys.

Oh, I fuck with KFC as well, man.

I really like KFC.

Yeah.

Have you had In-N-Out?

Yes.

I've had in and out.

I do like In-N-Out.

But I feel like there needs to be a wide...

Wide lens view on a fast food restaurant and I don't think In-N Out's chips bang.

Sorry, they're fries.

I don't think they bang.

Whereas KFC actually do the best fries.

KFC fries bang.

What?

They bang.

I've never

had their fries.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

I need to go to the bathroom.

And I think this about Burger King as well, because I've never really been keen on Burger King's burgers, but their fries are always good.

Oh, their fries are so fucking good.

But yeah,

KFC fries

bucket.

I actually made both kids the night before we stayed at my manager's house and both my children the night before we had a big family bucket.

That was like our initiative.

Big family bucket and a bottle of Dominus.

You know, Dominus red wine from Nappa.

Yeah.

A really nice wine with a family bucket.

That is like so high-low.

You're like eating KFC and then you're like drinking your nice wine.

You're like, this is life.

Okay.

How do we feel about Disneyland?

My kids like Disney.

We went to Disneyland.

They weren't

like,

they just weren't fucking with it.

And it was sort of like, I wanted.

I wanted to sort of see them go, wow, but they were just sort of like,

I don't know.

Yeah.

I think it's, there is no one that's like, that was fine.

It's either like, ugh, or I'm getting married there.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Which I think is great.

I think it's great.

I think like I find anything in life, it has to be those extremities.

That's what I feel about my music is I either have people that really hate me or really love me.

There's no kind of like passive, eh, yes.

And I think that middle bit is what you have to avoid.

That like, yes,

it's all right.

Like you have to be like fanatical about something, or like, I don't like that thing.

So, you would rather someone be like, fuck Ed Sheeran rather than be like, he's alright.

Yeah, that's been my entire career.

And that's how you have a fan base is

people that people really ride for you or they really fucking want to take you down.

Why do you think people don't like you?

I don't know.

I think that sometimes overexposure goes into it, like songs being on the radio too much.

I think also I don't like necessarily fit the social norm of what a pop star should like look like or act like.

And I don't know if that like rubs people up the wrong way that um that i do look like their brother who works at a pizza shop i feel like people are like why like why has that happened um and maybe that annoys them and then you pair that with the overexposure and

has anyone ever in the beginning days of your career tried to convince you like wait let's dress like this and cut your hair like this and do this totally yeah and i think you kind of i've sort of like slipped into that as well especially like because of the uh the era that i came up in was

you know justin bieber was massive one direction was massive and i think there was always part of me that goes should i

sort of look like that what would that have looked like what would we have done i just don't i don't look like that as a like you it's like dressing a mannequin that just doesn't need to be dressed like that you know so i feel like I always have to stay true to like who I am.

And also my fan base from the beginning started out kind of missed fitty like me.

And my gigs were just full of people that, you know, it was like ripped jeans, baggy, you know, converse, big shirts, uh, rather than we're getting glammed up to go out to the gig.

It might like have segued into that now that the gigs are bigger and people have got older, but I found being a misfit, I attracted misfits.

Yes, I do remember the like Tumblr era photos of you, and those were cool.

I liked that side, but then I get what you were saying.

Like, I couldn't have seen you in like a purple leather get up with like a backwards hat and like yeah yeah yeah i think it's good that you stay maybe when i'm on maybe the super bowl maybe that's when i debut it oh my god you're gonna come out at the super bowl you're gonna have a full leather getup and then the year after you're gonna go right to country music and you're gonna wear a cowboy hat for the rest of your career and actually leather trousers you could reuse them on both because you being a being a cowboy you gotta have some leather there you know Do you own any leather trousers?

Yes.

Yeah, because I dressed up as Ed with Scissorhands for

I did a Christmas.

I do a Christmas party every year with my best friends.

I'm dressed up as Edward Scissorhands.

So I was like full leather.

How did that go?

I had to take off the jacket after about 10 minutes because I was like, I am hot.

And bear in mind, this is December in England when it's freezing and I was still roasting.

Oh, interesting.

Yeah, leather trousers aren't.

I don't fuck with them.

Okay.

Can we talk about your home in England?

You built a pub in your garden.

Explain how, why, what was the inspiration?

I think, like, there was a local pub that I would always go to, and I still do go to it, but there's, you can never really let loose the way that you used to be able to, as in my teenage years.

You know, you go to a pub to blow off steam.

And I think it sort of turned into everyone always knew that I went to this place.

So,

I don't know, you could never really get to the point where you're actually like blowing off steam and proper drunk because you have to kind of keep an eye out on anything you know anything could happen

so there was a dilapidated barn on my land so I was like we could just turn it into a pub so I bought an old pub off eBay like the kind of the counter and the whatever off the eBay it was on eBay yeah it's on eBay it was just an old pub that had sort of taken the sort of shelving and counter and stuff

and then I got all the plumbing wiring I don't really even know the pipes put in

and it's sort of like it's a room for memorabilia.

I think Cherry was like

eventually there was so much shit in the house that actually just having it all in one place, like even just like meeting this football player and having a shirt sign and having it on the wall, like it's better having it there than in the bedroom.

Absolutely.

She's like, take all of your shit.

It's basically, I have, because there's like a tunnel to it.

And in the tunnel, there's like, I've built like a listening room and there's a cinema.

And that's kind of my, I'd say it's less of like a man cave and and more of a man catacombs.

Um, I love that for you.

Cherry's like, go and be gone, and like, do your thing.

Because I collect um movie props too, so I've got like all of that there.

What is your favorite movie prop that you have?

Uh,

I'm a huge hook fan, so I bought uh Robin Williams' pan costume and Rufio's sword, and then uh Julia Roberts's Tinkerbell costume, so probably those two.

How much above six figures, frankly?

No, no, no, not on those, Not on those.

I have done on props before.

Like, I bought C-3PO that was

not cheap.

Do you regret it?

No.

I do it every birthday.

I just buy one prop a year, and for my birthday,

it's like the thing that I look forward to.

I think all year, what am I going to get?

There's always a movie prop auction around that time.

And yeah, I choose one thing.

Is there anything out there that you're like, I've got my eye on this?

Yeah, because the auction's coming up.

I'm trying to get the George Clooney Batman costume.

Because everyone doesn't like the Batman and Robin film, but that was my first Batman film that I saw.

So I have a real

draw to that movie.

I bought the Alicia Silverstone Batwoman costume from that.

So it would be like a matching.

So are you going to these auctions?

It's online.

It's online.

You're like an eBay guy, huh?

Yeah.

But I spend a lot of time in hotel rooms.

My main hobby outside of music is movies.

That's like the only,

I do music.

music, and when I'm not doing music, because it's shows and studio, and I do that pretty much like 95% of the time when I'm not like doing home family stuff.

And then if I've got spare moments, I watch movies.

So those are like my two passions.

What are your top three movies?

Goodfellas, Cool Runnings, and

this will be like, I don't know if everyone would see this, but I still watch it every single year.

I think Love Actually is a masterpiece.

Every single year I watch that, and every single year I'm not tired of it.

And those three films I could watch anytime, any place.

Good fellas.

I'm reading Goodfellas again at the moment.

That movie, just I can't ever tire of it.

Cool Runnings, I can't ever tire it.

I've never seen Cool Running.

Oh, Cool Runnings is a phenomenal film.

It's really, really worth watching.

It's kind of humorous, heartwarming.

It's not like the Hollywood ending where

I'm not going to ruin it for you, but

it's a really, really perfect movie.

Now I got to watch it.

No spoilers.

Okay, so we're going for the Batman costume.

Yeah.

I'm glad this isn't going to come out within the next two weeks, is it?

Oh, because you want to make sure you get it?

I want to make sure I get it, yeah.

Can you give me a ballpark of how much you're willing to spend?

I would go up to six figures for it, I think.

Ed.

That's like history, though.

It's history.

It's like, you know, someone bought the

red slippers, Dorothy's red slippers, but they spent like, I think they spent like 25 mil on them.

Do you wish you had gotten those?

I have never seen The Wizard of Oz.

Yeah, it's on my list, but as soon as I had kids, there were certain films that I was planning on seeing that I was like, I'll just wait to watch them with my kids.

But yeah, I've never seen The Wizard of Oz.

Yeah, get ready.

It's a great one, but

look at you.

You're like ashamed.

I'm kind of ashamed about it, yeah.

You're allowed to say it.

No one can come for you.

You are a movie person.

You've been busy.

You're watching other things.

That hasn't been top priority.

Does your pub have a name?

Yeah, it's called The Lancaster Look.

It's basically my mum's maiden name and my wife's mum's maiden name because they both,

yeah, I think I wanted to sort of immortalize their maiden names.

I feel like even more getting married and having daughters, it's sort of like I want to preserve.

It's kind of weird, like the old tradition of taking names away and having names there.

You know, our daughters have both of our last names, and I sort of wanted to preserve my mum's maiden name and my wife's mum's maiden name in something that was permanent.

That is the like for women around the world listening, everyone seemed like, yeah, he's a really great guy.

Because do you know how many men and their like toxic masculinity can't handle the concept of like, what do you mean you're not going to take my last name?

Or what do you mean you're not?

That's how I grew up, though.

Yeah.

Because that's the only thing that I knew.

Like my mom had my dad's name.

And, you know, I come from a very large Irish Catholic family.

Sheeran was the name.

And I think it wasn't until getting married and having daughters where your perception of it shifts.

I I think you have to like, you can't just be born and just believe things.

You have to kind of experience and be brought over.

And now I very, very much believe that that should be the case.

That you should obviously keep both identities when you have children.

No, I think that's beautiful.

Sorry, I'm obsessed with this pub idea.

Can you explain to me how many people, like, are you throwing ragers in this thing?

Yeah, yeah, but I think if you're throwing a rager, it should be like five people.

I think that's like, or like 12, five to twelve people is a really good night.

I do, we built a chapel on our, on our land, and we do like Christmas carols there.

And then after the Christmas carols, everyone comes in for like mold wine and mince pies and stuff.

That's like, we can hold 40 or 50 people, but it's like a crammed space in that.

Wait, you're not singing Christmas carols all year round.

Just you're talking about...

A Christmas, yeah.

Okay.

I know you're all saying, no, every week, we're doing Christmas.

Or are you?

No, we do.

Do you know know, it's, I, I know it sounds weird to like sort of build an infrastructure on your property where you don't have to leave it, but I feel like so much that I want, there's certain moments you just want to spend with your family and not have someone filming you while you're doing it, especially like whether it's something like that at Christmas or whether it's memorial or there's just certain like intimate moments you want to have.

Like that.

I don't think it sounds weird at all.

I actually it's refreshing to hear you're like in a beautiful way not that you can't complain about it, but you're like, I'm just going to take matters into my own hands.

And I now have the resources and the funds that I'm going to like build this thing so that I can go to my pub and I can go to the chapel.

But I let other people enjoy.

Like, my security guy got married in my chapel.

And that was like really lovely.

Really, really lovely.

So the chapel is like

it's there.

Yeah, like sign up if you want to get married and we'll let you come by.

Which celebrity would you like to invite to the garden pub?

I

had a glimpse of what a night with Post Malone would be like.

We hung out in New York at Global Citizen Festival.

I actually bought him a...

I found this company that do the huge vinyl dinosaurs that you get at zoos.

You know, the ones that are like the size of buildings.

So I've sent him a T-Rex because we were sort of joking about it.

And he was just like, yeah, yeah, send me one whenever I live here.

And it's done.

And it's going to arrive.

And he's going to get this fucking huge T-Rex that is just going to...

And I've only met him once.

So he's just going to be like, what the fuck?

But I feel like because I hung out with him for that amount of time and I can sense the kind of person he is, I think he's going to appreciate it.

But I think he would be the hang.

I'd want a couple of days hanging with him.

No, Post Malone is like one of those people that when you're in a room with him, even if you're in a room for with him for like a couple minutes, you're immediately like, I need 19 more hours with you.

This isn't enough.

He's a really sweet guy.

Really sweet guy.

He is.

What is the most embarrassing thing you can recall of just like a drunken night, whether you're with your friends or you're out?

I've never said this publicly, but I'm going to say it.

I was playing a city in Europe.

This is like 2018, 2019.

And my best mate was out with his mum and his sister.

And we sort of started drinking espresso, not espresso, what are they called?

Cafe Patron.

Oh, yeah.

And then I went to bed and I got up in the middle of the night to have a pee

and I was sleeping naked And I walked out to have a pee.

And then I hear a door close.

And I open my eyes.

And I'm in the corridor naked.

No key.

It's like 4 a.m.

And I'm like, oh my God, what am I going to do?

And I'm kind of looking around.

And as I look around, it's like CCTV, CCTV.

And I'm like, ooh, this is not good.

And there was like...

Someone had had room service.

And I went to go and get...

the napkin and I put the napkin on, clicked the lift, went down to the lobby.

Bear in mind, it's like 4 a.m.

There's like people working in the hotel, and I just kind of walk with this thing.

And I was like, please, can you let me back in my room?

And please, can you not tell anyone about this?

And my security guard went to go and wipe all the CCT.

Well, he told me he wiped it.

He might have kept it for blackmail later on down the line.

But yeah,

Ed.

I think that's the most embarrassing thing that I've ever done.

What was the reaction of the people standing at the front desk?

It was very much sort of like you could see their eyes widen and be like, you're.

And me going, please just don't ask

and don't tell anyone.

Just the thought of also like you walking down and 4 a.m., those people are probably like so not paying attention to what's going on.

They're like half asleep.

And then just like Ed Sheeran walks into the lobby naked.

Holding a napkin.

Yeah, yeah.

Did you wake up in the morning and like fully comprehend what you did?

Or yeah.

Did you go back to bed easily?

I went back to bed, yeah, because I was like, nothing's going to change the fact that that just happened.

You know, I messaged my security guard and I was like, please, can you wipe the footage?

But yeah, I was sort of like, nothing's going to change.

And also, like, it's a very human mistake.

Oh, yeah, for sure, for sure.

So casual.

Everyone's done that, right?

No.

Everyone could do that, though.

True.

Very true.

Everyone could do that.

I definitely, I then bought pajamas and I started sleeping in pajamas.

Every time you're on the road, you're like, put something on my body.

Well, I don't, do you know what?

I'm sober at the moment.

So that's definitely like helping the not doing stupid shit.

How is that going?

Good.

I just, you know, I saw the schedule for this year of album release and I was like, because I'm, I'm basically, I'm flying all around the world and then flying home and being dad as well.

And I'm like, I don't want to, I don't want to then add on an extra layer of tiredness on that.

So I'm just going to not drink and be very focused and energized, I guess.

That's amazing.

I feel like that is a

underrated thing that when you're going so hard with work that you think that you need like a drink at the end of the night to relax you.

But then I've been feeling it recently where I'm like, I just wake up feeling like fucking shit.

Like there are times different ways to relax.

So I get, I get in and I put on a movie and actually that sort of does the job because you kind of relax into the movie and then by the end of it, you can just go to sleep rather than being, because I also find when you drink, you never really have a proper sleep anyway, because there's so much sugar in your body.

I have the worst sleeps.

And even if you have like one drink, it still is affecting you.

Okay, maybe,

maybe that's in my future.

We'll see.

I'm not going to be sober for forever, but I've definitely changed my relationship with alcohol because I used to drink every single day.

Every single day.

Not like, I'm not a spirits guy, and I'm not really...

I kind of do beer a little bit, but I'm more of like a wine guy at the end of the day.

But now I'm not doing that.

Me and my wife do date night once a week, and I feel like that'll be the time when I do start drinking.

We'll do a bottle of wine together that night rather than like every single night having to have something.

I love that for you.

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I do want to know what do you think is the biggest like misconception about you?

I don't really know because I feel like all the all the misconceptions that are about me people don't they're people that don't know me so I think that um

there's lots of things flying about the the internet.

There's like rumors that also like

really gather steam because i think that people want to believe them there's all these things that like come out and unless i actually come out and go these things didn't actually happen people just run with it because i think they like they people love negative stories like that and um

yeah i think that uh

there's just I think being in the public eye, there's just always, always a lot of misconceptions about you.

But I think unless someone actually knows me as a person, they can't pass judgment on who I am.

Do you think you handle being in the public eye well?

This has been my life since I was 19.

So I think that the first five years, six years of my life, no,

I really didn't and I really struggled with it.

Relationships-wise, not just romantic, but just relationships in my life, friendships, family, everything, like it just everything shifted.

And I know people go,

you know, when someone becomes famous, they change, they dis, but genuinely I didn't for the first three years.

I was exactly the same person and everyone around me changed just in their way of treating me, or acting, or talking, or like leaking things, or doing this and doing this.

And then, and then you start changing and you become a paranoid fucker, and then it all starts sort of like shifting.

So, I think at the beginning, it's that transitional period where you're just trying to work out

how who you are, and whether I am my stage name, and that's me the whole time, and I'm pop star, and I'm this, or whether there's like two human beings, and I can be,

you know, a son to my mum without having to be a pop star or like a husband without having to be a pop star and then sort of like separating the two.

And I think over the last, since COVID, really, being at home and separating the two and knowing that it's quite, it's a really, really

fun

job

to dip into.

You know, it's really fun.

It's really fun to be a pop star for the night and go to the Grammys and sort of be like, wow, look at everyone.

But then it's important to be able to go home and be like a regular human being.

And I think that's why I don't live in Los Angeles because I don't think I would ever switch off.

I think I'd always just be pop star.

I think that makes sense.

I think it's healthy for you to have like a good balance.

Like you're talking about being like, I can go work nine to three and then I go home and I'm like with my daughters and my wife and I'm having like a pretty normal life.

And then I'm going to the pub in my backyard and then we're going to the lake and then we're going to the chapel and it was a full day and it was like,

but I think you have to create that world for yourself because you're right.

If you do just keep working, then you are just like Ed Sheeran where people are thinking you're just like this pop star and you're mega famous and you're so rich.

And then it gets to people's heads.

And it's like, you need to have some semblance of normalcy.

And honestly, Cherry is the biggest grounding force.

Like anytime that anything is a little bit like a little bit too Hollywood, she's like, bro, go on.

It's, and it's really, and especially because I grew up with her, there's...

There's always just a lens of suffoc over it, of just like, come on, man.

Like, I tried to build a bowling alley in our backyard, she was just like, come on, man.

You don't need that.

She's like, the chapel and the pub are enough.

Are you good at bowling?

Not really.

Do you like bowling?

Yeah.

Okay, yeah, yeah.

Everyone likes bowling.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I think I'll become good at bowling.

I think as long as it's not on the property, I think she's, she's, I think she just wants to, she doesn't want our kids growing up and it being like, you know, the Richie Rich Houseworth.

There's literally McDonald's in them.

Have you seen Richie Rich?

Yes, but like so long ago.

Classic.

Macaulay Culkin.

You should do something with like movies.

I didn't realize you were this into movies.

I mean, I've got a letterboxed.

No one knows I have a letterbox, but I do have a letter boxed.

Wait.

Explain?

Well, I just review movies online for myself just to log them.

Just to see what I've watched.

I have no followers on it.

Like, it's literally, I've just logged the films that I watch.

Ed.

Wait.

What?

No one reads it, though.

It's just for me to log it.

Wait, why wouldn't you let it be public?

It is public.

But no one knows it's you.

What's your username?

I guess they'll find out now.

I think it's more fun for people to find it.

I watched Gladiator 2, and there's a character in it who's like the really crazy Emperor that has syphilis.

Oh my God, yeah.

Apparently based on me.

So that is my profile picture.

Is that Emperor?

Wait, what?

I saw an interview with him where he's like, Ridley Scott based this character on me.

I don't know if I'm offended you know

or very complimented thank you very much Ridley where was my call

because as a moviegoer you're like oh my god like they're basing something on me but then that character is like character was pretty uh yeah obscene if kind of fucking crazy okay wait would your username would we be able to find you yeah

What is it like Ed Sheeran?

No, it's like it's similar to my Instagram.

It's like Teddy.

I think maybe it's Ted's.

It's Ted or Teddy's something.

Uh-huh.

Oh, I'm going to look it up.

Yeah.

Start googling.

What is something embarrassing that you used to care about like growing up when you were younger or in your like

early teens that you don't really care about anymore?

I think it would be like the older that I've got in the music industry, I think that

the first like five years of my career, everything worked and went well.

And then the first like song that didn't work or like flopped,

that was like a real like learning curve for me.

Um, and I think the older I get, the more I'm like, those moments are going to happen.

But it's about the kind of overall catalogue that you're building.

And

I think my rule has just always been: make music that I can stand behind.

Sometimes it'll work and sometimes it won't.

But as long as I like it, that's kind of all that matters.

And yeah, I think I used to be quite embarrassed about that when I was like 24, 25.

Because obviously, like, it's never fun putting a load of work into something

that, and then you put it out there on the line, and you're like, this has to work.

And then, when it doesn't, I think at the time there was like a transitional period of me sort of living with that.

And now, I think that I, it's kind of like what I'm saying about like these pop-ups and stuff like that.

Like, my rule for everything now is I just have to really enjoy it.

And then the success or not success kind of comes secondary to that.

I think that's beautiful because I feel like also as a creative, you have to know that sometimes you don't need extreme success to enjoy what you're doing because sometimes as long as you actually really believed in it.

Well, that's the whole point.

That's why we get into it, isn't it?

That's the whole, that's the whole point of it.

And I think that

also it's about like realistic expectations.

I think that my second and third record and first to a point, but second and third record was so big

that it's,

you know, aiming for that every single time is just not realistic.

And they both happened kind of by accident.

It just clicked.

And so it's just something will click, something won't click, something will click.

Like there's so many songs in my career that I didn't expect to do well that ended up becoming massive over time.

That it's again, just make shit you like, put it out.

You have to give it the best opportunity as well.

You have to work every single song the same as you worked all the other songs and time to talk, the rest follows.

What is the song that surprised you the most that popped off that you're like, what the actual fuck i put out a song called afterglow that charted at like 92

and it was the first time anything that i put out within that 10 year period had charted outside the top 10 and i remember being like oh oh my god uh and then over time it climbed to number two and ended up having it's almost like half a billion streams now but it's such a like It's such a learning curve of just like sometimes you just got to let things sit and then they find their audience.

um and i close my set with that now it's like a really important song within my set list but i remember that week being like oh my god

why because did you not love it as much when you no i loved it it's just like going when i just saw it going at 92 i was like oh

maybe i'm wrong that's a nice feeling though right yeah definitely um let's talk about your tattoos do you have any like what do you think of all of your tattoos what has the best story behind it for you they've all got stories really i think my left arm is my first five years of my career.

My right arm is kind of the next five years.

And then I got my chest and back done.

And my back is kind of the most recent one.

I got my kids' footprints, like the week that they were born.

So I quite like that because they're tiny.

And obviously they're a lot bigger now.

My legs have actually started being my kids' drawing books.

So my daughter's just done a little bunny rabbit for my leg and you can put like the date.

of it.

It's quite nice seeing it.

Wait, does she come up to you and be like, dad, get this as a tattoo?

Or are you like going and looking at their drawings and be like, genius?

And going.

Sort of that.

Yeah, sort of that.

Now she's like, she'll draw something and be like, get it as a tattoo.

But yeah.

I think I'm going to get one each for each of them every year.

Is there ever a tattoo you've wanted to remove?

I think if I was to remove one, I'd remove all of them.

I think that I kind of believe that about tattoos is you're either a tattoo person or you're not.

And I, yeah, I think if I was going to remove, I'd go completely nothing.

Or, because I kind of see it as one tattoo, it's like one long story.

Yeah, beautiful.

Um, okay, you and Taylor Swift have been friends for decades.

I'm a big Swifty.

What has been your favorite memory together?

That's a good one.

Um,

do you know what?

I

have this,

uh, I was in these court cases for like two years.

Well, I mean, it was a lot longer than two years, but there was one each year, and I had to go through all my old devices to give them like, you know, voice notes and blah, blah, blah for the lawyers to have.

And going through all my old texts with people that I've known for that, for that long, it was really like nostalgic going through.

And I think that the period of time that I was on the Red Tour would have been, you know, I lived in Nashville and she lived in Nashville.

And we used to fly to and from the gigs together and do all sorts of,

I don't know, I was literally spent almost every single day with her for about six months.

So I think that period of time,

and I do, you know, I see her when I see her.

I probably see her like four times a year.

And we do what I said like instead of catching up the whole time we have like proper sit-down six-hour catch-ups and I think that that's like a really nice way to to do it but I think that period yeah 2013.

It's beautiful.

Okay, which of your love songs is your wife's favorite?

Oh, it's actually track 13.

It's the last track on this new record.

And it wasn't, it was meant to be a 12-track album.

And there was this song that from the beginning of writing it, she was obsessed with.

and she kept being like is it on their album is it on the album and i was just like i'd played it to lots of people and it didn't have the same reaction as as everything else and in the end i just gifted it to her and i just went i'm just going to put this on just for you and you can you can name it what you want to name it and like yeah so so that i think is her favorite and yeah it just exists because of her basically wait that's so sweet wow that's so nice to just be like yeah i told my husband to put it on so it's just for me it came from i spent a bit of time working with um bono from from you too and he gifted uh this song called you know the sweetest thing oh the sweetest thing he gifted that to his wife he missed i think he forgot her birthday and then he wrote a song for her and then just said you can just have this song and like all the proceeds go to like a charity of her choice and stuff and so i had heard that story hanging out with him and his wife and i came home and told cherry that and yeah i think it kind of was born out of that that is beautiful um you have obviously written so many songs for huge artists.

Is there any song that you wish you had kept for yourself?

No, because I think that they all have their own space and stories.

And I do honestly believe that like a song like Little Things for One Direction does not exist in the same way if I sing it, that they sing it.

I think it came at like a pivotal point of their career and

was what it was.

And I think the same thing for like,

I don't know, Love Yourself with Justin.

I think it came at, it came after What Do You Mean and Sorry, and it was like stripped back and the perfect point.

I don't think if I'd have sung it, it'd be the same.

And East Side with Paul's and Cleed, it was like Benny's first single.

I think if I'd have released that, that wouldn't have been.

Yeah, I think they all

hold their own

space, I guess.

And if I'd have done it, maybe I wouldn't have done it properly.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Is there any song of yours that you are secretly sick of playing?

No.

Honestly, no.

And I think that it goes back to what I was saying of like, you have to be able to stand behind it.

I think if you compromise yourself in music to like do a certain thing, like reach a certain fan base or like whatever, and you can't stand behind it, if it doesn't work, then you've kind of failed in your mission because you've made it to work.

And if it works, then you have to play it for the rest of time.

So I'm very, very careful that everything that I make...

I have to be confident enough to sing it forever.

And also, even if you've sung a song 2,000 times, it's always different every time you play it with the crowds.

So yeah, I'm not really sick of playing anything, really.

Okay, let's break down some of your lyrics.

Okay.

I'm going to give you a lyric and you're going to tell me the meaning behind it or any story.

Okay.

He's got his eyebrows plucked and his asshole bleached.

What?

Are you referring to, Ed?

Oh my god.

Yeah.

Do you know what?

That's a song called New Man.

And

I actually haven't heard those.

I haven't sung that song in years.

It's basically, I don't know, it was a 27-year-old's take on

that, you know, like being the ex-boyfriend and sort of, I don't know.

I think it's beautiful.

Yeah, I wrote that with Jesse Ware, actually.

We had a lot of fun writing those lyrics because it was all just kind of like throwing out stuff that we all thought was a bit like like funny.

Have you ever had an ex call you out for writing a song about them?

Of course, yeah.

Of course.

But I'm a songwriter.

Like I always say like, and I've dated songwriters in the past as well.

And it's kind of one of those things that I've got to be able to take it as well as write it.

And I think that,

you know, it's the good and good and bad.

And also like writing songs is

the two extremes.

It's the same thing.

You can't write a song about a feeling that's like, yeah, my day was all right today.

And I'll kind of write about it either is like I am the most in love that I've ever been or I am the you know most hurt or blah but it's like two extremes and those those are the things that come out and also those things that connect with people so you know you can listen to an artist's songs and be and be like well they only really they're either like they either love someone really much or they hate someone but those are the times that you write songs that actually feel

something.

So yeah, I've definitely had,

I wouldn't even say arguments, conversations.

And I think that because I've been a songwriter since I was 11, that anyone that I've been romantically involved with at least knows that you take the good with the, because you're going to, like,

there will be both sides.

You will get both sides, you know.

Would you often, back in the day, would you just like press upload or were you ever giving people a heads up?

It was.

Yeah, I've always given people.

heads up unless I haven't been in touch with them anymore.

I mean, obviously there's like breakups of people you just don't speak to anymore, But yeah, there's.

Yeah.

I feel like I have a good enough relationship with my exes that, yeah.

You could be like, hey, a banger's coming.

Get ready.

This one slaps.

You want to hear it?

They're like, fuck you.

Yeah, fucking hell.

Okay.

They say I'm up and coming like I'm fucking in an elevator.

I wrote that when I was 15.

I was really proud of that line.

It's pretty good.

Thank you.

It's pretty good.

What headspace do you think you were in when you wrote that?

I loved rap battles.

I loved rap battles.

So

I would be watching like online.

There was a couple of like leagues in the UK.

There was Jump Off and Don't Flop.

And those were the two that I would like watch as a teenager.

And it was all about

metaphors and similes and just saying clever shit line after line and punchlines and stuff.

So I would, that was, I was in a phase of writing songs where I was just trying to fit in punchlines.

And when I wrote that, it went down so well at gigs from the age of 15 as well.

Everyone's just like, oh, that song.

But it just kind of stayed in.

It's quite weird actually singing that song as a 34-year-old,

having written it at 15, because you're singing it.

And like, this is so different to how I am now.

Even like, I have lines and like, I spit fast.

I know that all my shit's cool.

I will blast.

And I never went to Brit school.

And like, I'm singing it as a 34-year-old-year-old dad now on stage.

Like,

yeah, I just don't know if I believe this anymore.

You're like, ooh, yeah.

15-year-old me, I've really people love it, though.

People love it, you know?

But I feel like that's what's fun, though, is that you still will play those type of songs.

You know what I mean?

I love the fact that I closed my show with a song that I wrote when I was 15.

It's like

a kind of really nice full circle moment.

Because I used to play that song to no one.

And now you close a stadium with it.

Still, it's the same song, same setup, everything.

It's pretty amazing.

Yeah, it's fun.

Okay.

Azzi zomb i want to get lost in your ocean and drown this obviously is a lyric from your new single what are you talking about ed

um i think with that song it was uh

it kind of just all felt really really fun and immersive i think that's where the ocean thing came from is just like immersing yourself in the night that line definitely had some people in my circle being like do you really need to say drown

um i don't know it sounds it sounded good sometimes that's all that counts in the studios does it sound good and what does azizam mean azizam is uh farsi and it means uh my dear or my love um the guy that i made the tune with ilya is persian and we were literally in the studio we were just trying different things and he was like would you ever do something persian influenced and he just sort of led me on this journey we've got like footage of the moment where he's like i'm like what's like my love in farsi and he's like oh azizam and i was like that's a fucking cool word.

And you kind of like, it really like, it's a, it's a really fun song.

Well, it's funny because when I was listening to it, it's awesome, but I like hear it the way that you sing it.

Yeah.

Of like, well, I'm not even going to fucking try, but like how you kind of leave like a pause where you like, ah, zomb.

Yeah.

Okay.

Okay.

Moving on.

That was embarrassing.

Did you like the songs?

They're amazing.

They're so good.

Okay.

Can we talk about your wife, though?

You guys met in high school and then you didn't start dating until much later.

How did you reconnect?

Uh, I

started employing like my best mate on tour.

Um, so I kind of went, I went through um periods of time on tour.

Like, I'm a solo artist and I don't have a band, so and I'm very much like I would just tour on my own.

I would obviously like I have a crew, but my crew were like 50-year-old blokes.

So, there's only so much

bonding you can do, I think.

And I got intensely lonely and burnt out.

And yeah, I remember I spoke to my mate.

She's she grew up opposite me, Lauren, and she was she'd just left university.

She now like works in tour management on my tour and stuff and has been doing it for 10 10 years.

But she was very much, I guess, worried about me and just came on tour, started working on tour.

And then we were in New York, and her sister was living with Cherry.

And I had had,

you know,

moments with Cherry when when we were younger.

And i guess like we just kind of reconnected and picked up where we left off i guess and it's one of those things where i wasn't really expecting it to happen i kind of just got out of a relationship i was on tour for god knows how long and it just felt really i was sort of like unless i do this it i will always regret it so i just sort of jumped in and yeah best decision i think i've made you have two daughters how has your life changed since becoming a father very dramatically actually.

Very dramatically.

I think just

I mean, even just not being a fucking maniac with drink and drugs or smoking or, you know, I exercise now, never exercised before.

I get up in the morning.

Rather, I used to sleep till like 4 p.m.

Like, it really has changed dramatically.

And just in the way that I'm home more and my work schedule is based around them rather than based around me.

That's incredible.

Do you sing to them?

Like, do they understand?

Yeah, of course.

It's usually Moana.

Like,

it's usually just me singing Moana.

Yeah.

They like, I have a song on the album called Sapphire that they love.

So it's either Moana or Sapphire.

Moana, by the way, top fucking tier Disney music.

Oh.

Top tier.

Absolutely.

Do you just like walk around the house and sing that to them?

Yeah.

All the songs, actually.

And Moana too, actually.

When I went to go and see it, I wasn't like...

straight away enamored with the songs and now those songs are my favorite songs too.

Which one is your favorite?

Putting me on the spot here.

Probably the chi-hoo song.

What does that sound like?

Can I get a Chi-Hoo?

That one.

Who were you going to be?

Gonna make some history.

Come on up.

Moana.

Go get your desk.

Mate, my children fucking love it.

Oh, that's good.

And they've got the, we went to go and see Mufasa, and they love the brother song.

Oh.

Coincidentally, same writer as Moana One.

So, yeah, it's all in Manuel Miranda.

You're going to be singing it up.

Your kids are in heaven over there.

They're lucky.

That's nice to have.

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right now we have a single out is there more coming yep i have a uh

my my idea was because the album is so broad i didn't want to just be like here's the single here's the album so they're kind of there's music coming every sort of like two three weeks so there's asyzam now there's a song called old phone that comes out in a couple of weeks and then after that there's there's another song that comes.

And we've shot all these videos.

And

I'm less about

single moments and more about I want people to sort of feel the breadth of the record.

And I'm very confident that one of the songs will work.

But it's more about just putting them out and letting people hear some of the record before it's out rather than what I've done before is just like, here's my first single.

Here's the album.

And yeah.

How is this music different than everything you've put out before?

Or is it?

Yeah, it's it's definitely different.

I think I've been more explorative with this album.

I've kind of had an attitude of why the fuck not, like, and not really felt like I have to be in a box of being a singer-songwriter of, like, I have to do this or I have to do that.

And I lived in India for a little bit and worked with a load of Indian musicians and producers and blah, blah, blah.

Obviously, I made a song like Azizam with Ilya, who's Persian, and that's in that world.

And

Oldphone, I think, is more in a Nashville country world.

And there's just lots of different moments on the record and the the record is called play and therefore it has to be playful it has to be celebratory I released two albums that are kind of on well one one was the sort of main album and one sort of came off the back of it but they were both very like

very depressing about quite hard-hitting subjects very muted um

I still think they're beautiful records but I feel like coming out of the that of having you know going through grief and all of that sort of stuff coming out.

I needed to have something that felt bright and colorful and playful.

And that's where doing St.

Patrick's Day, playing at Tootsies in Nashville, doing the New Orleans thing, the whole record just has to feel like fun and exciting.

How do you avoid writer's block?

I think you just write all the time.

I think you have to, I think writer's block is actually fear of being shit rather than because I think everyone can write.

You have to just sit down and write, but you have to accept that sometimes it's shit and it's not good enough.

And I think that I just write and write and write.

Sometimes it's good.

Sometimes it's great.

And sometimes it will be a song that you keep.

And I think if you do that year in, year out, you're left at the end of the year with like 10, 11 songs that are really great.

And then you can actually start forming an album.

It's really interesting to hear you talk about like the way that you're approaching.

projects, albums, essentially, but they're projects in your brain of like, this one was like more intense.

So now this needs to feel more fun.

And like, I can feel that energy from you.

Okay, Ed, last question.

What do you want your legacy in music to be?

I would love

for it to seem possible to any kid out there that just wants to pick up an acoustic guitar.

I think that

I think the thing that's jarring about me to people is also the thing that creates hope.

Because I am a regular dude who picked up an acoustic guitar, who's not from a major city, who made it happen by going out there.

And I would love for all kids to go, fuck, I could probably do that too, rather than feel like it's an impossible thing.

Because it's really not.

It's really not.

I think that it's, I couldn't sing.

When there's footage of me online, where have you seen it?

But now I'm going to Google it.

Where I can't sing.

I mean, we could play it.

We could play it now.

Wait, you can't see it.

You couldn't sing.

It's got it.

Type in Ed Sheeran Addicted.

It's me when I'm 14 singing.

It's that bad.

It's bad.

But then I like practiced and became.

You can actually just find the

one online.

Yeah, someone leaked all my old EPs, which I guess shows progress.

Listen to it.

You can fast forward it a little bit.

I've got an intro because I love an intro.

Here we go.

I think I took too long.

It's alright, you wait.

I'm addicted to your

talking.

You sound like little baby Ed.

We, that's cute.

Yeah, but it's not like, it's not professional standard, is it?

Oh, no.

That's what I'm saying.

We can turn it off now.

But I'm saying, like,

I didn't know how to sing in tune.

And then I taught myself how to sing in tune by practicing.

So

honestly, when I go into talks at like music schools and to kids and stuff, I always play that and go, because everyone just assumes that you're born and you

just got it.

And And you can teach yourself.

I taught my, well, I didn't teach myself how to play guitar, but I learned how to play guitar.

I learned how to perform.

I learned how to perform in front of lots of different crowds.

I learned how to songwrite.

I learned how to sing.

And I'd love my legacy to be any kid anywhere, literally anywhere, goes, I can do that too.

Because I think that that's like music's, music is a thing that it's also for.

Kids that aren't good at other things, who don't have a lot of self-worth or self-confidence.

If they start music in any form in poetry or singing or instruments or even like work in a studio or whatever, it gives you so much like worth and confidence in yourself as a human being.

And I think that in school, there's so much like importance put on you must be good at this subject and you must be good at this subject to actually be a good human being and to go out in the world and achieve.

And I just wasn't good at anything as a kid and I didn't have a lot of self-worth because of that.

And I felt like I was stupid.

And music, I was only good at music.

And that became my career.

And I think when I go into schools and stuff and talk to people, I'm like, you only need one thing that you're good at.

And then that is you for life.

You find one thing, you work really hard at it, then that is your career.

And I think that that I would love for my legacy to be.

I think that is so beautiful.

And I appreciate you bringing up the concept of like kids looking at celebrities and musicians and actors and anyone in the arts.

Like it seems like this far away concept.

And you have made it feel like achievable in a way that can be actually like everyday motivating for a person being like, I'm one step away from my gorgeous cover going on YouTube and sounding like Ed.

And then look where you are.

But then not being embarrassed about that phase of your life.

Because another thing that I've found in my career is...

I've learned everything from my failures and nothing from my success.

It's not like I was on stage at Wembley Stadium being like, I'm learning a lot from this.

I learned everything on the way to there.

And I think that what that shows is actually failing at something is good because then I learned how to sing after then and there's so much like importance nowadays on you just even on social media about like succeeding and showing you're doing well and like not being in but like the embarrassment of something failing or flopping when actually all of those things every single artist in the world has played to two people in a room and sucked every single and that is a really important um stepping stone and everyone has written songs that have released that other people didn't like.

That's an important stepping stone.

It's all about like learning from failures rather than just always, your career just can't do this the whole time.

You can't just get bigger and bigger and bigger, better and better.

Everything works because that's just not real life.

It's about like

picking yourself up after the failures and trying again rather than giving up.

Again, always say, sorry to bang on about.

education stuff, but I think with anything, it's important that when you have that thing that you love, uh that you want to do don't give yourself a plan b because if you have a plan b and it gets really difficult and starts failing you will always revert to the plan b and if you have plan a

at all points you go this has to work and even at the points where you fail like i've done really terrible shows where it it's there was a show that i did in exeter where it was like I think like 60 quid to get down there on a train, but I had a rucksack full of back

CDs.

And I was like, do you know what?

If I sell seven CDs, I've made my money back and a tenor.

So all I need to do is sell seven CDs at this gig.

And I got to the gig, no one turned up.

I waited too long to see if people had turned up.

And then I missed my train home and had to sleep at the train station.

And in that moment, it was like 18, 19, I was like, why am I doing this?

Like, all my friends have just gone to university.

Some of them have gone out to get jobs.

They're actually like on their path.

And I feel like I'm not

achieving anything.

And in that moment, my head just went, but this is the only thing you can do.

So just keep doing it and hope it will work.

And I think that in that moment, had I had a plan B, I would have gone, cool, I'll just, I'll go and do, I'll go and do that now.

You must find that, though.

I mean, you're hugely successful.

You must have just been like, this is going to work.

I, well, I

yes.

And I relate a lot to that of not having a plan B.

And then people, whether it was like making fun of you for it or you feeling like, why am I not doing a traditional, like I remember being in college and all the girls were taking courses courses that were like finance and all that.

And I was like in the film school and everyone was like, where is that going to get you?

And a lot of times I was like, I don't know.

But those feelings,

you know, in you what you actually love.

And the people making fun of you as well, because that is a huge thing.

It's like, it's, it's so easy for other people to like.

make fun of someone for taking a risk and and doing something and i i actually think it comes from like an internal thing of

when they they say what's she doing she can't do that it's actually because in their own head they can't do it and they haven't got the thing that goes you know fuck it i'm just gonna do this fuck what other people think and it's it's like almost a taking the piss out of you for even dreaming about it because why the fuck would you dream about being successful like just do do your plan b I think it's like almost a scary thing sometimes for that.

And I got look mate, I had none of my mates, even my best friends now, none of them really came to the first gigs I did.

It wasn't until it started like catching steam that suddenly people were like, I'm not saying like all my mates, but a large amount of my mates who are now my best friends and have, you know, have been since, since school.

I had my

best friends who literally like, you know, godfather of one of my kids, when I was a teenager, rung me up pretending to be Zayn Lowe and was like,

Zayn Lowe worked on Radio 1 at the time and had this thing called Hottest Record in the World, where he would like debut a new record of an unsigned artist.

And he rung me up pretending to be zane low and then all of you know he had all his my other mates on the phone and they were all laughing down the phone and i was like

you know stuff like that

that is traumatizing i was so crazy and then four years later guess what i'm hottest record in the world on zane low

that's so crazy you can never let them forget i'm like these little fuckers never came to my shows in the beginning

i mean one my mate zach real one zach always came to the shows.

Zach, there's always one.

Shout out, Nick.

No, I, that is such a beautiful message to leave this on because I can imagine there's so many people watching this right now that are either like gonna quit the job because they're not making enough and they hate it and they're like, okay, I'm just gonna like not pursue it anymore and I'll just go do what like my parents had wanted me to do.

Or there's someone that is like doing something in this moment that people are making fun of them for or they feel let down and they feel like there's no way to actually get to what they want.

This is like I think it all comes down to, it all comes down to enjoyment, though.

Because I think if you're still enjoying what you do, because even though I did that Exeter gig and no one turned up for it, I was still playing music that night rather than doing something I didn't want to do.

So I think there will come difficult times in everyone's careers.

But as long as you love what you do, you've always got that at the end of the day.

But I'd say if you're in a job that you don't love,

like try and find something that you love.

Yeah, you know, go go for, go for your passion and make it your job if you can.

Um, Ed, this has been so fun.

I wish I could talk to you for like 10 more hours because I feel like we could do one an entire podcast on just movies in general.

You could do it again?

I know.

We could do it again.

Maybe I'll see you again.

I would love to do a movie one.

I would sit here with you and geek out over a movie because I'm a movie girl too.

Like, I'm full movies.

Have you seen the Florida Project?

Yes.

Just literally just watched that the other night.

Oh, my God.

Blew my fucking movie.

Did you see Nora?

Of course.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But I I hadn't really heard of Sean Baker before then.

So then I went back and did like Tundreen and the Florida Project.

But Florida Project, like, I haven't cried like that at a movie for just at the end with the little girl.

I was just like, no, he's so fucking talented.

Thank you for taking the time.

I know you're running on like two hours of sleep and you were fucking great.

So thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

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