Making $3 Million Off Patio Covers and The Pursuit of Happiness | Clark Wagaman DSH #257

I got your Facebook ad and I saw what you were up to, I was like, patio covers?

And you're making millions with this?

I got to learn more.

If you're an attorney or you're a doctor and you go to a party or you talk to your family or friends, they're like, oh, you're a doctor.

Oh, you're an attorney.

I'm like, what do you do?

I'm like, well, I build patio covers.

They're like, yeah.

Or if I'm like, I'm a general contractor, they go, oh, you're a general.

Do you build houses?

I'm like, no, I build patio covers.

They're like, what?

Yeah.

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And here's the episode.

Welcome back to the show, guys.

Today I have a very interesting guest for you guys in an industry you probably know nothing about, actually.

Clark Wagaman, how's it going?

Hey, good, Sean.

How are you?

I'm good, man.

When I got your Facebook ad and I saw what you were up to, I was like, patio covers.

And you're making millions with this?

I got to learn more.

What is this?

What is this?

This is ridiculous.

I know

that's my point with it.

And that's why we're, well, we have the franchise, which I suppose we'll get into, but we're franchising in Vegas.

We're out of Sacramento.

And that's like what I do.

Like, if you're an attorney or you're a doctor and you go to a party or you talk to your family or friends, they're like, oh, you're a doctor.

Oh, you're an attorney.

I'm like, what do you do?

I'm like, well, I build patio covers.

They're like,

okay.

Yeah.

Or if I'm like, I'm a general contractor, they go, oh, you're a general.

Do you build houses?

I'm like, no, I build patio covers.

They're like, what?

Yeah.

You build what?

So subsistent, like such a niche thing, right?

Yeah, aluminum patios.

They have no idea what it is.

The cool thing about that is like the opportunity is huge, right?

For someone who would like to get into that who's handy or who's a contractor.

I think it's great for that person, right?

Yeah, and you were able to generate 3 million in just one city, right?

Well, yeah, I mean, we do, I mean, my company now does like over, we do about 5.5 million a year in Sacramento.

And so like the start of it, when I was working out of my truck, I just had a trailer and my logos and stuff like that.

And I just started advertising a little bit.

And like the first year we tracked, I did 680,000 then 1.8 million then 2.2 million that was one two three year three like in three years wow it was it was very fast because there's not like I hate to let the cat out of the bag but like there's not a lot of super professionals in that industry right plumbing there is electrical you'll find that around you know in your town here yeah they're everywhere right and they know how to advertise but like with what we do they don't know right so how did you even develop that skill were you working for someone else first oh yeah i started in 2000.

I was in the Navy, got out of the Navy, my buddy got me a job building patio covers.

I was like, sure, let's give it a shot.

I wanted to be a chef.

I was making like eight bucks an hour cooking.

Nah, I'm good.

I'll go back to patios, make two grand a week as an installer.

I hated installing.

I felt like there was like, I could do more with myself than install patio covers.

So anyway, I worked my way up through the ranks in the company and, you know, did the projects, designing and engineering.

Wow.

Eventually I got fired in like 2008 or 9 or something.

What'd you do?

I was a prima donna.

Like all patio guys are prima donnas because we know nobody knows how to do it.

And we're like, huh, find someone else.

And so I was a punk, right?

And so I started kind of doing my own thing.

And the company didn't have good direction.

So long story short, I get fired.

I'm like, all right, I'm already on Craigslist advertising when Craigslist was a thing, right?

Back in the day.

Yeah, when you can still get stuff on Craigslist.

I got one of my dogs on Craigslist.

Actually, it didn't end up well, though.

I did too, actually.

Yeah.

I think my

that didn't end well either.

Yeah, there's a reason they're on there.

It didn't go back.

Yeah, exactly.

So yeah, I don't even know if Craigslist is around, but who knows?

So anyway, I started on Craigslist and then I met an advertiser, started doing some mailers and stuff like that, and then found SEO company.

And they're actually out of Vegas here.

Nice.

Yeah, Ring Ring Marketing.

They're great guys.

If anybody wanted to check them out.

And then, boom, started just like, I couldn't even answer my phone.

Then you hire one person for the office.

Then you hire guys to install patios.

The next thing you know, you need a location.

It's just like...

crazy.

Wow.

So talk to me about the importance of SEO.

So if someone's in your town and they Google patio cover installation, are you on the first page?

For sure.

Yeah, for sure.

We've been with Ring Ring since, I mean, for like

12 or 13 years or something like that.

So a long time.

So

Welton Hung is the owner's name, and he really knows what he's doing, especially with windows, patios, home improvements.

And we started a long time ago, so we're grandfathered in, which is cool.

Yeah.

But yeah, I mean...

Plus my website is sacramentopatio.com.

That's a good domain.

Yeah, right.

So, and he was like, when he came to me, he was like, how did you get this domain?

I'm like,

I looked it up and it's like Sacramento Patio is available.

Well, that makes sense.

I'll buy that.

And I'll buy Sacramento Patio Vegas.

And I'll buy Sacramento Patio.

And it's like, let's have some domains, right?

And if that's the field you're going to be in.

I like your business, man, because these don't get, these old school businesses don't really get.

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The spotlight.

It's all about these newer, trendy businesses on social media.

Well, and I was watching your stuff and I'm like, dude, I'm so out of place with like NFTs and all this.

Jackson and I were talking about like, what the heck is all this stuff?

i wish i knew more about it but i don't have the bandwidth i'm like i'm too old for it now i'm like i'm a blue collar guy like micro that's what we do that's where we're from you know i grew up in a construction family so but you're right like there's a lot of opportunity there because nobody's really considering that it's not a focus anymore right so have you seen it work in other cities or do you think it's just excelling in sacramento no no it's huge like it's big there it's huge in la it should be really huge here there's a new manufacturer in town i mean they've been here like five or six years so um I started a manufacturing company with the leverage of CW Designs in Sacramento.

So I have Ceduloom manufacturing there also.

So we manufacture patios.

So it's like

all that industry needs is someone to show others how to do it.

How to build a patio, how to design, how to sell, how to get the permit.

And that's why we're franchising here because if we teach people, then it'll grow that industry faster.

It doesn't grow.

It's not growing fast enough.

You can't advertise too much right now

in that industry.

So you said permit.

So who needs a permit?

The homeowner?

Yeah.

Well, if you're a contractor, you have to get a permit to build a patio over a certain size if it's attached to the house.

Oh, got it.

Yeah.

I remember Drake had to get permission to expand his house in Toronto.

Of course.

Well, I mean, you don't have to, but you probably should.

If you want to sell it and get money back out of the house or not get in trouble if your neighbors aren't nice people, they could turn you in.

So that's the problem.

Yeah.

And then they're like, tear it down or get an engineer that'll sign all this off.

And that's a huge mess.

What's the most expensive patio you've built?

No, I mean, I got away from commercial because we just,

commercial is like a whole nother entity.

Like, I see a lot of people take everything on.

I think that's a mistake.

Like, if you specialize, you can do really well at that one thing and make sure that you're netting, like you're making money, right?

Yeah.

Not just bringing in cash flow.

Cash flow is good, but we got to bring some home, right?

Well, the commercial job that we did the last one was $116,000.

Damn, just for a patio?

Yeah.

Yeah.

And that's not, that's not, that's, that's normal.

Really?

So we're going to open up the commercial again, especially because my AirLube line, the opening louvered roof that I designed and patented, there's a lot of them out on the market.

Ours is the least expensive, the most, I wouldn't say it's the least expensive, it's the most affordable and most high quality, the least moving parts, the easiest for the contractor to install, and because it was designed by an installer, right?

So we're really pushing that.

That's like the latest and greatest.

They've been around a while, but it's really popular right now.

Opening louvered roofs.

You go to restaurants around here, they have these louvered roofs that open and close.

You know what I mean?

starting to see those yeah yeah and i mean those projects when you look at on a restaurant i mean that's like a quarter million dollars easy because they've got they've got heaters and tvs and all kinds of stuff lighting right wow yeah how long does it take on average to build these like and do you need a full team or can you do it by yourself well i okay so i'm not a good example but i also i have good experience I did work alone for like six years.

Wow.

Because I just wanted to make all the money.

Okay.

Now my body's kind of paying the price for that a little bit because running up and down the ladder like 125 times a day is waste.

You were going up a ladder with no one holding it?

Yeah, well I would just build, yeah, I would just build it myself.

So it would be a ladder on.

So when you build a patio, you got the front and the back.

So you're running up and down, running up and down, running up and down.

It was like 120 times 20 times a day.

So

a little brutal on your body, but I made all the money and so I was happy with that.

And once I finally did get a helper, you know, usually teams are, it's a team of two.

Okay.

And so even bigger projects will leave it alone like that.

If we have a project with tons of footings, big, huge footings, we might bring another crew in and have them help with that.

But the average project would probably be two days.

Wow.

A medium or small house project is a day.

And that's pretty quick.

And let's say the average this year in Sacramento is $11,000 is the average purchase price for our sales.

Wow.

That's a really high average order value.

Right.

So

and of course that's gone up a lot since 2012 and it's like at least doubled.

Material cost went up.

Just everything, yeah, exactly.

and what we have to offer is just it's it's it's over and above everyone else like we take care of people but wow that makes sense how you're doing five million a year then yeah i didn't know they were that expensive and if you're doing a couple a day yeah i've got four crews we do about 450 a year something like that yeah yeah that's impressive yeah so so i mean the last you know the last year we kind of took the alex harmosey you know, his last book kind of took some of that and went, you know what?

Great book.

Let's offer more.

Yeah.

Let's offer the most value possible that i can find within what we have that we're not already selling yeah which is stupid and i we found that you know and let's charge more like let's take care of people when something happens let's just say look we got you dude one of the best books ever it led to me making like a million dollars 100 million offers right yeah yeah i thought that one was better than his new one really did you read the new one not yet yeah it was good but harry got it harry picked it up yeah it was good but 100 million offers i mean that changed my mindset right because you want to just make as much as you can but you don't realize the more value you give the more you can make yeah well the more value you present and of course I tie that in with branding like obviously that's the huge Gary Vee thing right or anyone who's knows anything about advertising like if you can advertise like crazy yeah and your brand is everything then you don't need specialized salespeople you just need a nice person that knows what they're doing to close the deal right because your branding is already there and available so that also will net you a whole lot more rather than paying you know yeah so what's the plan to scale this to an eight figure a year business now you're doing franchising right exactly yeah um I don't think we're tapped in Sacramento we can do more but I'm also doing the manufacturing and I've developed the products and and we're doing personal social media and so I'm pretty thin now yeah so I see the franchise as a better way to go to to it's another business really but we already have the mothership We'll have the partnership of the franchisee come up and spend two weeks with us to learn everything

that we're doing.

And then I'll go out and see them a couple months later, and we'll take care of them.

We'll be in contact the whole time.

And I think the franchise is the way to go.

Not only does it build CW Designs as CW Designs franchise, but it also builds the manufacturing side because they'll be buying the Cedaloom patio cover materials as well.

So it's like a vertical integration, right?

Nice.

Yeah.

I've seen a few of your clips on Instagram.

You talk about the importance of mental health and meditation, right?

Yeah, oh, yeah.

Did you have some struggles early on?

Oh, yeah, for sure.

I mean, I'm a Gen Xer.

I don't know how everyone else feels out there.

It's kind of a thing out there, right?

Gen Xers or this or that.

I haven't even heard about it.

I mean, I'm definitely like the epitome of a Gen Xer, latch key kid, and all that from the 80s.

Parents were great, they did the best they could.

They're good parents, but it was a split, you know, marriage.

They split up, so I was all it was real messy when I was a kid.

Right.

So I just kind of came out of that all a little goofed up, you know, and I needed to.

I started in the self-help realm with tony robbins like when i was 22 so that would be like 95 six no 94 94 and just started diving into that stuff because i knew that i could do better and think and have a better way of thinking and not be so um

so explosive with my like you got to get a hold of your ego is what it is like our egos can make or break us the ego is a great tool but if it leads you then it's like you're just like on a carriage with a horse out of control.

Yeah.

Just going crazy, and there's no, there's like nothing.

But if you, you got to be able to turn that off.

So another long story short is, you know, I like to cover stuff that helps people just daily.

And hopefully some people get something out of it.

What I'd really like is people to respond and like message back and say, hey, this, that, or the other.

I agree.

I disagree.

I like that conversation.

I think that's healthy for us to all like talk about these things rather than.

Everything we see is just like money, money, money.

Go out there, do everything you can, buy fancy cars.

It's like materialistic, maybe for some people, but like for the majority of us, that's not going to do jack.

No, it's so temporary.

It's not sustainable.

No, no.

Well, like we were talking, it's like you watch like, uh, can we even say Grant Cardone?

Like the dude

everywhere.

Controversial.

Oh my God.

So controversial.

Yeah.

And we even, I think the reason I got canceled, like, we got a violation for

what's his name?

Zuckerberg.

No, what's the dude?

I was talking about cigars.

I'm like, I'm not a cigar guy.

Oh, Tate.

So Tate.

So I'm like, Andrew Tate's got cigars.

Schwarzenegger's got cigars.

Community violation in TikTok.

I'm like, why?

Because I said Andrew Tate.

Wow.

It's not because I said cigar.

Yeah, it's got to be Tate.

You know what I mean?

Yeah.

So I'm like, hey, Jackson, next time, don't spell his name Andrew Tate.

Spell it something else.

You know what I mean?

Because maybe the spelling is part of it.

But

we're just trying to have fun and, you know, make things fun and share with people like that we're human.

I'm not inhuman.

I don't, you know, we're not going to go out and like, to be able to run a business and be an introvert like me, you really have to like, you're going to go through some hard times probably.

Like I had days where I was so stressed out where I felt like I, I would just like cramp up and like shake.

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Wow.

Because I was like, what am I doing?

Your emotions were just bottled up.

Yeah, this, yeah, something.

It was like nuts.

I like, did I get bit by a rattlesnake?

What's going on here?

Like, it was crazy.

Yeah.

I think maybe some people are more wired for it.

I'm not, but I did it.

And I know everyone can if they want to, you know, run a business, get in front of people, train people, be a leader.

Yeah.

You know, to some degree, you just have to do it.

You have to be willing to be nervous and get used to it.

The intro for a thing really fascinates me because a lot of people that are successful are introverts and a lot of people that have come on this podcast are introverts, but they are able to kind of tune into another side of them when they need to.

Yeah, yeah, I agree.

I kind of have a theory on a lot of that where like ultra-driven people can tone back and live a life that's more harmonious.

Whereas people that aren't don't come out of the gate with that drive, I just don't know how they're going to find the drive.

So it'd be interesting to kind of look into that and see if there's a way to help people find drive.

Yeah.

But like, like you say, like, is that like what you're saying to the introverts, does it tie into like the C group people?

Like, I'm a C student, like for sure.

I barely got through high school.

I'm like, dude, I'm looking out the window.

I don't want to be here.

Like, I got A's and P E, and that was it.

Everything else was screwed.

Everything else, like, screw it.

Yeah.

So, like, that's true.

Like, a lot of successful people are like C groups, like 2.9 average got barely got out of school, introverted.

Why is that?

That's super interesting.

Yeah, it is.

It's kind of like they don't want to be in the system, right?

Almost.

Yeah, and that's what makes you successful.

Yeah.

Because you want to do everything your way or at least another way, not like everyone else.

Yeah.

So that is helpful.

Like with the social media thing, people talk about don't be on social all day, don't get carried away, scroll, scroll, scroll.

Well, we're not because we're hardwired to see it and go.

oh cool i'm not going to do that yeah i'm not going to do that i'm not going to do that i'm going to do my thing it's cool you did that but i'm going to do this and that's really what life is like it's your own thing.

You have to do your own thing and appreciate yourself because no one else is going to.

Everyone else is only worried about themselves.

And that's not a bad thing.

That's just real.

Yeah, it took me a while to realize that because I used to try to please everyone and I realized no one gave a shit about me.

So that was like a big wake-up call, I think.

Yeah.

To be a little more selfish.

When did you realize that?

Late, man.

Like 20s.

Really?

Late 20s, yeah.

My whole life, I was pleasing everyone.

I was that nice guy.

Got no girls.

And I just realized I need to be more selfish.

Right.

You know, was there like one thing that triggered it?

No, I think it was just accumulation.

And then I just realized like, this isn't working.

Right.

You got to be a little selfish.

Yeah.

Yeah, for sure.

Which is hard if you're someone who does like to please people.

And you like my birthday, for instance.

My birthday comes up.

I just want my whole family over.

That's all I want.

I don't want anything.

I just want to be with.

the people I love and just share that time.

That's all I want.

So if someone else has a birthday and they're like I want to go do this or that I'm like how do you not want to just be with everyone and you know and that's the that's like the just the love that's we all have that we all need that and so the sooner we tap into that and realize it and get back to that yeah that's cool

there's a show on I think it's uh it's probably Netflix it's like about it's called like People that live over 100 years.

I don't know if you've seen it.

Oh, it just came out, right?

The Blue Zone.

Yeah.

I want to watch that.

Yeah, super fascinating.

Like these people like live forever because, not because they go work out hard, not because they eat the right thing or whatever.

Of course, some of it is diet, right?

They're not eating donuts every day.

They have a little wine.

They get up, they work in their yard.

They do yard work.

They clean by hand.

They don't have sofas and chairs.

They sit on the floor.

Wow.

They do hard hand labor work until maybe 11 in the morning or noon.

And then the rest of the afternoon, they just enjoy each other's.

company.

And so that's that more fruitful, like happy.

We all want to be around each other and together rather than today we are getting carried away, especially in America with just like, I've got this, I've got that, this is my next goal, this is my, where are you at next?

Well, dude, that, that, that,

that stress.

That path is never going to end.

Adds up.

And like the higher you go on that path, the harder you drop once you realize you don't, that's not really for you.

Yeah, there's a balance, man.

Yeah.

There definitely is.

I mean, I used to work way too long, 18 hours a day, and I realized I'm probably taking years off my life.

Right.

So I was like, yeah, let me take a step back.

You know, you never know when your last day is.

Right.

What do you do for enjoyment?

Basketball, play with my dogs.

I do like some movies.

I'm watching Suits right now on Netflix.

It's a good show.

And I like stuff that makes you think, like escape rooms.

Right.

Yeah, stuff like that.

What about you?

Like puzzles, like things that are like puzzling.

Because my dad has the Alzheimer's gene, so I always play chess every day, actually.

You got to watch that show then because they talk a lot about that too.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And there's a lot of,

there's always, there's always something new out there, right?

But I do think it's just like, we don't have any idea what we're supposed to be eating.

Everyone's confused.

Even the latest is like just another fad.

It's always a new thing, right?

Oh, exactly.

Who's the guy that did the,

he does like, I forget his name.

He's a doctor.

He's very popular online.

And he did with Chris Helmsworth.

He did it.

He did that.

Was it David Sinclair?

Joe Dispenza.

Not Joe Dispenza.

I know that.

It's about,

what he's gone to is,

he realizes it's the fasting thing, right?

So it's like fast every week, fast every day,

sad guru.

I like that guy too, but does he fast?

Probably.

Anyway,

he's like, basically, he says, I'm fasting.

I take it back.

I'm fasting too much.

This is too much.

So my point with that is that nobody really knows.

We're all experimenting.

And then we're talking about experimenting.

And then you put it on social and people go, oh, that's what I'm going to do now.

That's what I need to do.

Just do your own thing, right?

Exactly.

I think the best way to do it is take a blood test and see what you need to do.

Right.

Not everyone's the same.

Right, right.

Yeah.

My wife's a dietitian, so

that's a good thing, but it also makes it more confusing.

We have supplements like everywhere, all over the place.

Yeah, that's a whole nother thing, right?

The quality of the supplements.

Is it natural?

Is it man-made?

Yeah, it gets complicated, man.

There's no like one solution.

No, no, it does get confusing.

So it's like, just enjoy your life and like, you know, have that balance everywhere.

I think that's the best anyone can do.

And just enjoy yourself.

As far as me,

I fly.

I like to fly.

You're a pilot, right?

I got my pilot's license a few years ago, so that's cool.

Although it does take a lot of time to do it well and not hurt yourself because I want to be there for my kids.

Music, I was a musician when I was younger.

I kind of sacrificed my musicianship for building patio covers and making money, right?

Yeah.

And it served me very well.

I've done it very well.

What type of music?

Well, I want to get back to music because I think it's missing, that creative outlet.

I was in hard rock bands as a bass player, heavy metal, and but my thing is acoustic rock.

Like, I play acoustic rock music.

Nice.

I like to write.

I've got tons of songs I've written.

I'm getting back into that.

That's the direction I need to go back to, and I just know that's what I need to do right now.

And I'm not here to

show anybody that I can continue this, that, or the other.

I'm just doing my thing.

And that's what everyone should do, whatever they want to do.

And let's talk about like singing in the car.

Who likes to sing in the car, right?

When someone comes up next to you, you're like, oh, I'm singing in my car.

But if you were to sing in your car and someone sees you do that,

you're going to give them joy by them seeing you do that.

That's true.

So why not be brave?

Who cares?

Wow, I'm going to do that next time, man.

They're like, dude, this guy's going at it.

Yeah, you're right.

Why should I care that they're looking at me?

You're right.

You're actually going to

give a smile on their face, like, unless they're super angry, like, whatever.

But I bet you later that day, they're going to go, man, I just want to be the dude in the car singing.

Yeah.

That's awesome, man.

So when you see younger people, like, in their teenage years, 20s, what advice are you generally giving them?

If I had to give them advice, I would really say

take the opportunity to do what you want, what really is in your gut that you feel.

It's hard to get support for that.

A lot of times your parents want you to college and all that stuff, and they just want what's best for you.

Mainly don't ride motorcycles on the street.

Take them to the racetrack.

Don't go on the street.

It's way too dangerous.

I'd rather you were alive than like, yeah, I did.

It's like, it's just so sketchy.

Everyone I know that has one has been in an accident.

It's not good.

Like, I was really lucky.

I had lots of them, rode them for a while, got away from it, and thank goodness, nothing.

You never got an accident?

No, I mean, it was close a few times, but it was usually my fault, you know.

But anyway, it's like,

it's just so bad.

Like, if you're going to get in an accident, at least make sure it's on four wheels, like in a car or a big-ass truck or a BMW because they're really, you know, I guess Tesla's the strong.

I'll go Tesla, yeah.

Yeah, that's a good frame.

Hopefully.

Let's not get in an accident, right?

But like, I would just say to kids, just do what you want to do.

Like,

definitely don't be in a hurry to get married and have kids and all that.

You can be with someone.

You could get married if you want to.

Just take time.

Like, I have a two and a half and a four and a half year old.

I'm 49.

Like, you've got a lot of time.

Like, I sound ancient to these kids, for sure.

But I feel like them.

Like, physically, I feel young.

Yeah.

You know, know i feel good was that a choice to wait until you were 45 to have kids or was it kind of planned i mean i wasn't ready like i burned so many relationships you know just goofing around lots of girlfriends wanting to get with as many as i could it was just as i wasn't in the mindset so i wasn't ready it wasn't as much a choice as Maybe I was making choices and maybe in a way that was a choice, right?

I just wanted to have fun and just

be a dude.

And unfortunately,

now I look back and I realize it's way, way, way more healthy and it feels better to have a really great, solid, lifelong partner.

Things just get way more intense on both sides,

mostly in a good way.

Yeah, that's great.

Yeah, that's something that's overlooked in today's culture.

Like

it's cool to hook up with a lot of people almost.

I hear that.

I don't know that.

I really don't talk to enough younger generation people.

I have, they work for me, but we don't.

I I mean you don't talk about that no it's just like yeah why are you late or make sure you do this make sure you do that I'm just a boss so

I like to be more less I do I do have trouble with like the bot like the boss thing right like do you are you just an authoritarian boss or are you a nice boss or yeah you cross a line you can't really be a friend because what kind of boss are you well I think I'm I'm I think I'm

I would say I'm too nice oh you're too nice yeah I'd say I'm too nice okay but people that know me like my longer employees they know there's a side of me that like don't let that out of the cage because I will lose it.

But and what you need to learn is as someone who's really passionate and maybe that allows, you know, the ego could get out of the box a little too easily when I was younger, drinking too much.

I stopped drinking like a year and a half ago.

You learn how to like control it and use it as a tool.

So it's another tool you can use to go, look, I'm getting fired up here.

And they go, whoa.

So if you can, let's say if you're always crazy and mad and yelling, then they just know you're always crazy, mad, and and yelling.

So there's no effect.

It's just normal.

But if you tone it way back and you're chill, and you come across respectfully in a mature manner, every once in a while someone needs to get lit up a little bit.

You go into that red zone just for a touch and they go, ooh,

I didn't see that coming.

And then you go back and you go, see, I don't need to stay there.

I'm still chill and I can manage myself.

That's a trait that's difficult if you don't have it already, but it's very important and other people respect that whether they know it outwardly or not.

It's very respectful to see that you can do that.

That's a leader.

Yeah, I like that.

My favorite video of you was, you said it's hard to make a lot of money if you're a.

Yeah.

What did you mean by that?

Did you call up with that one?

Jackson goes,

well, I just think like

what you give out to the world comes back to you.

So

obviously I say everything from the screen that is Clark Wagaman, right?

Just like we were talking about a minute ago.

It's only about what we see and what we know.

So I want to be as kind as possible to people as I can and give and you get back.

If you're constantly taking and, you know, it could be an actual mean person or someone who's just

sales, sales, sales, take, take, take, money, money, money.

One day that blows up and burns out.

It always does.

And that's being a d ⁇ also, in my opinion.

If it's all money, People see through that.

You're going to take advantage of a bunch of people.

Yeah.

And

eventually they're going to get pissed.

If something's going to come down, it's not going to work out.

Some regulatory service is going to come along and say, whoa, whoa, whoa, that's not right.

And then boom, you get cut.

Yeah, you saw that with the guys selling like those passive income courses.

They all got like shut down.

Yeah.

I mean, these courses, all these courses have been around forever.

I mean, I bought a course back in the day.

It was like in the 80s.

And

this guy was hilarious.

He was a great actor on TV.

And he sold

these booklets on how to become a

millionaire like he did.

His name was Dan.

Oh, God, I can't remember.

But it was place

these little ads in classifieds, free classifieds, all over the country, because classified ads are free.

So place these free classified ads for like $1.25.

Sell anything.

Sell a plastic spider, sell anything you can find, and just do it a zillion times and make a million dollars.

You're like, yeah, sure.

Okay.

That makes sense.

that doesn't sound fun at all no and then you're right you just buy this his crap his 60 worth wow there was courses in the 80s oh yeah oh yeah how'd you buy it like over the phone don lepre

dawn lepre that was his name he ended up i believe he's not he's no longer with us okay and i won't say how or why because i really i don't remember but i think he just had enough yeah if i remember right but yeah he had he had the he had the it had to be a rented mansion and a rented cars on the video just exactly this was pre-social media people were doing oh yeah oh Oh yeah.

On TV.

Interesting.

For sure.

It's been around forever.

Wow.

There's nothing new.

Yeah.

I thought it was like a social media thing.

No, I saw it and I'm like, here we go again.

Yeah.

Should we go rent a Lambo?

I mean, and then people are like, you know, whoa, this dude must be the shit.

And I just, I just like, mine more.

I can't do it.

Like, I could, but I would have to like tell them what's up on camera.

I'd be like, just kidding.

Yeah.

I rented this thing.

This is.

It's not authentic, man.

When you're renting the luxury car, renting the house, and then acting like you own it, I just can't get behind that.

There's a lot of that, right?

Almost everyone.

I'd say that.

Almost everyone.

Yeah, exactly.

That's what I'm saying.

It's this,

I don't, yeah.

I mean, I don't, you, you, you, Rub Evolves with some, some, some people.

And I could have went down that path and launched a course and made millions, but I just felt like if, if you're making more money off the course than what you do, that's not authentic to me.

Right, right.

You know what I mean?

Yeah.

I was good you're able to realize that like early on.

And that's why I like Hormozzi so much because he doesn't have any of the paid courses, but the value he's providing is just massive, life-changing stuff and he'll make it back from relationships he makes.

Yeah, yeah.

And that way you actually make more, in my opinion, than a course.

Oh, yeah.

There's a lot to be said about giving out the value, giving out the value, giving out the value for free and waiting until the very last moment that you have to sell something or then you finally have something to offer.

In his case, I guess now he's just really into other businesses and helping other businesses grow.

And that's how you become a billionaire through equity.

So now that he's investing in all these startups, I i think he's going to become a billionaire yeah he might be one he's one of those special people that we're not going to see again for a while yeah you know it's it's when he talks you're like dude how smart are you i think i'm pretty smart like you should think you're smart because we need to be confident in ourselves right but that dude is on another level different man especially in his early 20s he was like already already making all that information yeah what is going on in his 20s

amazing yeah man so what's next for you where can people find you?

And what do you want to close off with?

Yeah.

Well, we're everywhere, Clark Wagman, Clark Wagman, at Clark Wagman on Instagram.

And I own Sacramento Patio by CW Design.

So sacramentopatio.com is the website in Sacramento.

We'll be franchising.

So Clark Wagman Designs franchises, plural, is also a website.

We're franchising.

I've got my manufacturing business, Cedaloom.

We're building patio covers from scratch up there in Sacramento.

And we're growing that business by franchising and getting our materials out there.

We have our Heirloop opening roof system.

So we will be pushing the Heirloo opening roof system out

with more ads as well.

We're working on that right now.

So we'll be pushing that out all over the place.

And we just want people to know it's the best system that they can get their hands on.

And I just want to get out there and do my personal brand stuff.

Just have a good time and kind of see where it goes.

And I just want to share with people and have fun with it.

Sickness.

Just say, hey, this is what I've done.

Maybe you can do that or maybe not.

Do you agree?

Do you disagree?

Just enjoy it and feel good about it, right?

Love it, man.

Yeah, I'm buying a house out here, so I'll hit you up if I ever need a roof.

Right on.

Can't wait to see what you do next, man.

Right on.

Yeah, thanks for coming on, Clark.

Yeah, thank you, Sean.

Great to meet you, man.

Absolutely.

Thanks for watching, guys, and I'll see you next time.