John Cerasani On Interviewing Bob Menery, Gambling with Kevin Durant & Cancel Culture | DSH #185

And I went from a 20 grand bankroll gambler to offing it because I was just, hey, I got all this money, you know, whatever.

And we're at about 600 grand.

So I basically just tripled my stock.

And I get this email from the CEO that was going to all the shareholders.

These other shareholders have been sitting around waiting for this to happen for the last six years.

That just happened two months ago.

Welcome back to the Digital Social Hour, guys.

I'm your host, Sean Kelly.

Got an amazing guest for you guys today, John Sarasani.

How's it going?

Excited to be here, my man.

Blue Wire Studios, Las Vegas, and the win.

I mean, it doesn't get better than this.

Just hoping this visit doesn't cost me 100 grand by what am I doing afterward.

Oh, man.

What's the most you've lost?

here you go.

You're going right there, huh?

All right.

I've never admitted this, and I will right now.

When I sold my company

and I fulfilled my employment contract, I had a little

stretch between December of 2019 and March of 2020, going right into the pandemic.

And I went from a 20 grand bankroll gambler to upping it because I was just, hey, I got all this money, you know, whatever.

And

yeah, let's just say between two Vegas trips and three Bahamas visits, uh, we were

at about 600 grand.

Yeah, yeah.

Now, now we will not leave it there, though, because in 2022, I went 12 for 12 next door of the Palazzo and won about 490 of it back.

Just an FYI, just an FYI, 12 for 12 and what?

Exactly.

Uh, blackjack, and the real thing that got me, man, Venetian,

I think they all, all, well, I not think I know, all these casino hosts share information of their players.

Okay, now, Venetian finds out about me, invites me on a private jet, it's a Boeing 737 business jet.

I mean, I didn't even know this existed.

It was awesome.

Come out, do everything to the nines, and end up taking them for like 70 grand.

Okay, cool.

They end up inviting me back out two months later, invite me into this poker tournament.

Only 36 people invited.

It's

a half a million dollar tournament.

Grand prize is a quarter million.

Boom.

I come out.

I win.

Okay.

So I'm looking.

I'm up 320 on the Venetian right off the bat.

So they keep inviting me back and I keep winning.

That 250 grand one was the biggest, but

I've had a couple of good guys.

You're a bit of a degenerate.

Yeah, exactly.

Exactly.

I had the Mirage actually put me in their villas.

The people of the Mirage, the Hard Rock own them, and they put us in the villas there and they marked me as a Advantage player.

Oh.

Which I'm not, which basically is saying like you're doing something.

You count, right?

Exactly.

I'm not counting cards.

I just got f ⁇ ing lucky, man.

2022 is my year, pal.

Man, so was that the year you sold your company, 2022?

No, I sold it in 2015, but I had to do because the nature of the business that I was in, I had to,

I had to

fulfill an employment contract.

Okay.

And that was five years long, which I know sounds crazy for an employment contract when you sell.

Yeah.

But it was insurance brokerage.

I was doing corporate employee benefits.

And it's so relationship driven that they need those five years to institutionalize your

business.

So you didn't get get the money until five years after you technically sold it?

That's a great question.

No, I got 80% of it up front.

Okay.

35% of that I took in stock, which is a story in itself.

And then they withheld 20% until that 36-month mark.

So you're motivated up into that 36-month mark.

You got to make sure that revenue stays on the books.

Yeah.

Those last two years, you kind of feel like

dead man walking out.

You're sussed out.

Yeah.

But a lot of people that were in the same position as me was a private equity roll-up.

So they were doing the same model for everybody.

And some of these guys, you know, are in their 60s looking to retire and they're sailing off into the sunset.

You had some people my age, but they maybe had seven or eight different partners at their company that was bought and maybe their book of business or their

profit margins weren't as good as mine.

So they would still be motivated after that year three

because they're not able to live on a beach at that point.

And I basically was.

I'm glad you said the stock thing.

I sold one of my companies for stock and I would never do it again.

Really?

I mean, because they could show you insane numbers on paper, but at the end of the day, is it actually liquid, you know?

Brother, this is my, this is my claim to fame, though.

This is my private equity case study on how it could go the opposite way.

Okay.

In a good way.

I sold April of 2015.

Okay.

Now, I don't know about private equity.

All right.

I'm like, okay, here's a gotcha.

They're making you take this percentage of your in stock of the new company.

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Gonna do it.

We're going through diligence, blah, blah, blah.

Still makes sense.

Okay.

Well, two months after we close, the private equity firm changes hands to another private equity firm.

I got in for like a buck 08 per share.

Yeah.

It goes to $3.12 per share.

Two months after, and this was 35% of my deal.

So I basically just tripled my stock.

And I get this email from the CEO that was going to all the shareholders.

These other shareholders have been sitting around waiting for this to happen for the last six years.

I just happened two months ago.

So I'm like, holy.

So my whole deal just went up.

This was like, oh,

now it was all on paper, right?

Yeah.

But because you had an event, a capitalization event, they were allowing you to pull half your money off the table, 50% of your money off the table.

So everyone else in the company's high five and they've been waiting six years for this.

I'm scratching my head.

Dude, this was not money I even expected anyway.

So my accountant, accountant, my lawyer, is like, dude, it's a bird in the hand.

It's better than two in the bush.

Take the money, take the money, take it off the table.

Then, my accountant goes, but you are going to have to pay short-term capital gains on that.

Right.

Because I had just bought technically the stock, even though it was from selling my company.

It was thought of as buying stock in a new company.

And we're under the 12-month mark, which means you're going to get taxed federally as ordinary income tax, which puts you around 40%

instead of 20%.

Exactly.

So, I'm like, you know what?

Leave it in.

So I leave all the money in.

Now I'm one of the bigger shareholders at this damn company.

Company continues to grow, grow, grow, grow, grow.

At the four and a half year mark, right before I walked out the door, private equity changes hands again and it tripled again.

So I like, I had sold my company thinking the stock was just going to stay the same.

Did all my math, my Excel spreadsheets.

Okay, I'll be able to live a nice life,

live off 5% investment income, interest conservatively over the next, you know, 30 years.

I'll I'll never have to work again.

And that was my plan.

Yeah.

And then the stock ended up being worth more than the whole deal.

Holy c.

It's like, you know what, dude?

I guess I should open up about it more.

Maybe it can work both ways.

Yeah.

But I feel like a lot of people, the stock goes down.

Did you take it in the or what happened?

It went to zero, yeah.

Okay.

And you took 100% of the deal in stock?

Yeah.

Wow.

What was the nature of the company?

It was a marketing agency.

Okay.

Yeah.

So I was what, yeah, I mean, insurance brokerage corporate, private equity had squeezed every drop out of the sponge of every other industry.

So now they looked at insurance and

they were buying us for multiples of EBITDA.

So I had a cash machine, man.

I had an ATM machine.

Right.

So in order to incent me to even sell in the first place, they would have had to have to have paid a good multiple, in which they did.

And there was really no way with the private equity roll-up model that it could really go to zero.

Yeah.

That wasn't really on the table as an option.

That makes sense.

So when you sold the company, you finally got all the money, where were you at mentally?

Were you just like checked out of working?

So, what sucks, man, is, and I'm sure other people have experienced this as well.

You know, you sell your company, but I have all these carrots in front of me, and even a stick, not to get the 20% of that there's still owed to me.

So, head to the ground, head to the ground, head to the ground.

I'm being this corporate guy for those first three years, and high-fiving.

I'm on track to be an executive, and all this other

signing up for committees, flying to help the Cincinnati office, make the sale because they don't know what the we're doing, you know, like that.

And eventually it's like, dude, what am I doing all this for?

And,

you know, so I eventually kind of put the brakes on it.

People start stepping underneath each other's toes.

Egos get in the way.

It became clear to people in the know what my net worth was at that point, which caused some animosity

because

my timing was impeccable.

It couldn't have worked out better from a timing perspective.

Right.

And you got this 37-year-old at the time that owns, that owned 100% of the company he saved,

sold, versus these 55-year-olds that had six partners and not even a profit margin like me.

Right.

So now it starts to become clear.

You know, this, yeah, do the committee.

Yeah, fly out there.

Look how much money we made you.

Look how much money made you.

You guys, how much money you guys, by the way, that private equity from selling the book of business.

What was the big profitable piece of this book of business collectively?

My,

not your s.

You know what I mean?

But, but they're like, you know, the process did make me a lot richer than I should have been.

But, but, um, it still creates animosity, you know.

So, anyway, my point was going to be that,

you know, the last two years of that employment contract, it's like dead man walking.

You have nothing else to do.

So, finally, when I saw, when I worked my last day, now it was like, hey, let's party.

You were fully checked out.

Let's get, exactly.

I'm like, let's get the f ⁇ out of here.

It's December of 2019.

Went crazy for four months.

And

then the pandemic hit.

So

exactly, exactly.

I took my kids to Cabo.

We went to Cabo, Cabo for a month

during the pandemic.

People thought I was, but we had the trip planned.

We flew out before Chicago had closed down.

We were the only people in the airport.

And I'm like, guys,

why?

We know the, we know the virus is coming to Chicago any day now.

Why would I stay in Chicago?

I have a chance to go to f ⁇ ing Mexico.

We did just that.

It didn't hit Mexico until later.

So we stayed in Mexico until they kicked us the f ⁇ out.

Then we came back to Chicago.

Smart.

Yeah.

And at first, oh, you're a terrible parent.

How are you doing this?

You're endangering your kids.

Yeah.

How would I endanger my kids by staying in Chicago,

waiting for it to get us?

You know what I mean?

They brainwashed everyone during that time, man.

Yeah, exactly.

It's like, I stay away from that subject.

But if I could scroll back on my Facebook wall from, you know, whenever that was, I'd be like, oh,

I told you.

I told you.

Oh, man.

So you never have to work a day in your life now.

So like, what's that like?

What's that feeling like for you?

It feels good, man.

It It feels good.

You know, I came from a very middle-class background, Scheinberg, Illinois.

On my social media, I like to talk about that a lot.

My dad was a high school gym teacher and football coach.

We have a great family.

Both of my parents, unfortunately, have passed in recent years.

But

it's pretty cool.

I think, you know, some of the shit I'm involved in now.

is

puts me in circles with people that I wouldn't have been planning on rubbing elbows with.

For instance, I got in a network of people out in Orange County, and we bought the Newport Beach Marriott Hotel.

I'm part of the investment group that bought that.

And we reimagined it now as the VIA.

It's awesome, right?

Right on the PCH.

I mean, it's great.

Sick.

And I vacationed there when I was a kid.

Wow.

And my dad would save up money.

We'd do no vacations one summer, and then the next every other year, we'd do something kind of cool outside of what you would think the normal budget would be for a teacher's family.

We'd go to Hawaii.

And one year we went to newport beach and stayed at the newport beach marriott so

unfortunately passed away but

he probably thinks that he probably thinks that's pretty cool football played a big role in your life right you played at notre dame yeah that's really the only advantage bro that i that i think i've uh had um

and it's really the privilege i should say more than an advantage um i was always good at football um you know i had no business getting into a school like north or excuse me like notre dame academically yeah football got me in but once you're there now, okay, you know, what do you do with this?

You know, do you, do you, do you say, okay, I'm the, I'm the jock, beat it, nerds, or do you embrace these kids that you're sharing a dorm with?

Yeah, okay, this kid that, you know, oh, that building I was in for math class is named after that kid's great grandpa.

You know what I mean?

It takes you from, you know, being in Schomburg to being around these kids that have grown up with generational wealth, you know, and not just that, too, really smart kids too, Valedictorians that maybe didn't have that background.

But if you embrace that and kind of start picking up the that they're talking about, they talk a lot different than me.

Well, father did this.

But don't hate on it.

Yeah.

Take what you can from those relationships.

And some of them I'm still good friends with to this day.

Interesting.

So were you like that high school bully, the typical full bucket that bullied everyone?

I don't think anybody would ever call me a bully from Schomburg.

I think the opposite.

I think,

yeah, I think the total opposite.

And people that didn't know me might have thought that, but people that ever met me, I don't think anyone said that.

Yeah, because there's that notion with the football kids.

Like, dude.

No.

Bro,

my dad was the high school, was the football coach at my high school.

So if anyone was getting bullied, it was me.

It's like, oh, dude,

you're only going to Notre Dame because your dad's the coach.

I go,

how does that make any sense?

It's not because I'm 6'5 ⁇ , 270, and I could run a 4-7.

It's because my dad's the coach.

You were fast.

What position were you?

It was tight end.

470 at tight end with that weight.

Bro, back then it was good.

Nowadays, I watch this.

I don't even know if I could play tight end of the league right now, bro.

I'd have to play like I'd probably had to gain 30 pounds and play center.

These tight ends nowadays are like big receivers.

You're nasty, man.

Who do you got as your goat for tight ends?

You got Kelsey?

Yeah, but dude, I go back, man.

I like the blocking tight ends back in the day, bro.

There's a kid on the Bears right now that went to Notre Dame named Cole Komet.

I like him because he could go out and catch passes, but he also comes off the ball and blocks.

Not that Kelsey can't, but I'm just saying a lot of these guys, dude, like Jeremy Schockey.

Like when he was playing, if I'm a running back, I'm not running behind Jeremy Schockey.

If I'm a quarterback, I'm throwing him the ball, but I'm a running back, I'm not running behind him.

Back when I was playing, dude, it was like, you know, big dudes like Ben Coates and, you know,

Mark Bavaro.

Those kinds of guys are my heroes that could catch and block.

And it's a different game now.

Yeah, tight ends are just not being asked to do it much.

Did you want to go to the NFL?

Yep.

Hurt my spinal cord the last game of my senior year.

And it sucked, bro.

It sucked.

There's a thing in football that you get called stingers, and everyone's kind of used to it.

If you played linebacker or fullback or line where you hit someone and your arm kind of goes numb for three seconds.

Yeah, I've heard of it.

It's dude, it's so scary.

But you get used to it.

Okay.

All right.

Well, I was getting those all my senior year.

Okay, no big deal.

Well, the last couple of games, I started getting them in my leg.

And you touch me like in my shoulder or neck.

I'd feel the sensation like in my ankle.

So I get invited to play in this blue-gray all-star game.

And it was on Christmas Day.

And they make you get a physical before the game.

Yeah.

And

like two weeks out, it was in Mobile, Alabama, I think.

And I take my trainer, we go get a physical and

you know, whatever.

And the doctor asked, man, anything feel weird or anything?

And I just happened to mention this.

Well, I've been getting stingers in my leg.

They're like, stingers aren't supposed to go in your leg.

That's your arm.

Let's do an MRI.

Let's check this out.

And I'll never forget it, man.

Me and my dad were at the doctor.

They're looking at the MRI results.

And here I'm thinking I'm getting drafted in a few months.

And they break it.

Listen, this is a contusion to your spinal cord.

You're fine, but no one in the NFL is going to take you.

And you shouldn't want to play anyway.

because you're more apt to get paralyzed

because of this contusion.

And looking right at it, I mean, there was really no, there's really no decision to be made, Sean.

Like, you know what I mean?

My mom has multiple, had multiple sclerosis and was in a wheelchair.

It's like, okay, if you could choose between being in a wheelchair or not being in a wheelchair the rest of your life, you know, you wouldn't take that risk.

But I got to tell you, though, man, it was also at the same time a big weight off my shoulder.

I'd played five years in college,

like a lot of people do.

I had an early birthday.

I was a December birthday.

So by the time we're having these conversations, I'm 23 years old, man.

I'm a grown man that's been playing football his whole life.

Right.

It's like, all right,

time to do something else.

And then I jumped into the business world.

Were you super passionate about it?

Because that seemed to be a big part of your life.

Like, was NFL your dream?

Yeah, I mean, I think everyone kind of, it's their dream, right?

But, but for me, dude, listen, I went and generated all of that energy toward being passionate about being a good salesperson in white-collar America.

And I learned so much in that competitive business-to-business to business sales environment that by the time I was 27, all right, everybody else that was in the NFL is out there looking for their first job.

Their NFL careers are over.

When I was 27, I was taking the last five years of information that I've picked up and started my own company.

Started up from my kitchen table, walked away from a job where I was making $140,000 a year, which was a lot back then in 2005.

Turned around and started my own company.

When I'm seeing guys that I played football with, you know, contacted me, hey, could you get me a job at your old company or whatever?

I go, dude, you played on the the Packers the last three years.

Yeah, that was the last three years, dude.

I made 250 grand each of the last three years.

I still got to work the rest of my life.

And then it kind of hit me, dude.

How up football is.

So my dad always used to say, like, not playing in the NFL might have been the best thing that ever happened for me.

Really?

Yeah, because I wouldn't have been paid in Manning, dude.

I would have played, you know, maybe two years if I was lucky or whatever.

And I was injury prone at that point anyway.

Yeah.

And I just worry about it, man, because if you're not a first-round draft pick and you didn't get paid paid, dude, you think your shit doesn't stink.

You're walking around.

You're supposed to go get some accounting job for 60 grand a year now when you just been on national TV signing autographs.

I mean, that's something to your ego, man.

That's something to your ego.

Yeah.

Not a lot of players actually make good money playing pro sports.

No.

If you dive into the numbers, like if you're not a top hundred athlete.

So if you look at the NFL roster, I want to say like 70% of the team is at whatever the league minimum set up for that year.

And the rest of the money is just being shifted to pay the quarterback or whomever.

That's crazy.

Or the backup quarterback nowadays.

Why do the Bears suck?

Because the fourth string quarterback makes more than the starting tackle.

I don't know.

That's funny, man.

I saw you in some videos with Bob Menery.

How did that happen?

Me and Bob made friends randomly, dude.

And

I got to tell you, man, I think Bob tries to gravitate towards whoever he deems is good people.

And I think I've gotten that recognition from him.

And

I help him with a few different things but he he's so funny because he tries to like pay me back in the form of like instagram stories hey man that was really nice of you to do that i'm gonna tag you in an instagram post thanks bob appreciate it but i will say though man his followers some of his followers have started following me okay and uh it's it's hilarious they'll dm me hey i'm really worried about bob right now he did this last night i'm like dude i don't check his stories they're gonna have to just tell me exactly what you're talking about

okay you know does he do a signature 12 a.m face time with you

No, but I'll tell you what he has done.

He's done, he stayed at my condo in LA for a little bit.

And my son and I were out there too.

So we got a full, full flavor of Bob for a few days together.

And he's kind of funny, man, because he'll be like FaceTiming randomly.

I'll be like, hey, John, come over here.

What?

What?

Come on.

Dana White is FaceTime.

Hey, Dana.

He's like, this is my friend John.

Hey, Dana, how you doing?

Dana's like, hey,

it's almost like Dana's like used to Bob's random phone calls with like this.

That's funny.

You had some hot takes on your Instagram.

Can I go through some of them?

Yeah, sure.

Oh, God.

Let's hear it.

You said, uh, never listen to W-2 employees for advice.

Listen, if you were like 400 pounds, bro.

So, say some guy that's 400 pounds is walking down the street, like eating a donut.

All right.

Are you going to go up to him and say, Hey,

could you give me some dieting advice?

No.

Not unless you're like a mean person, right?

So if you have the entrepreneurial mindset, why the f would you go to a W-2 employee and ask them what they think about you starting your own company?

They don't get it.

They don't understand it.

Okay.

They aren't programmed to think that way.

They've been drinking the company Kool-Aid their whole life.

And even if they do understand it, they're not going to admit it.

All right.

Especially someone that's a little bit older than you.

If you're in your 20s and this guy's in his 40s or something, oh, a terrible idea.

You got to get through this from an accounting standpoint.

You got to get these lawyers.

This is what the licensing.

They kind of go like this with their f ⁇ ing head.

It's like, dude, go ask an actual entrepreneur for that advice.

All right.

Because all these people you're asking are people that were too scared to do it themselves.

Did you struggle with that with your parents, trying to get advice from them for your business?

Yeah, a little bit.

But my parents,

my parents are funny because

I think I gave them

this bad joke because they actually both died of heart attacks later.

I think I almost gave them heart attacks when I told them I was leaving Arthur J.

Gallagher, which is based in the chicago suburbs it's an international insurance brokerage and their son they're bragging about me to everyone i was area vice president and i'm only 27 years old and i'm going to be climbing that corporate ladder and i'm going to be an upper management one day at arthur j gallagher who gives a who gives so i go tell them i go guys

I'm going to start my own company.

Well, John, where's your office going to be?

Well,

I'm doing my house, my kitchen table.

So you're going to like put your 816 Sears Road and Schomburg address on the on the your business cards oh no I'm gonna put suite 300 869 East Schomburg Road well what is that well it implies that I have the whole third floor of this grand office building

but it's actually the UPS store it's a mailbox of the UPS

so it's like little things like that and they look at me like I'm nuts and yeah it all can't it all work man it all worked funny you also said it's it's usually cheaper to rent a house than to buy I thought that take was interesting yeah you know and I and I um I actually don't say usually in that.

People take it that way as if I'm making it a recommendation.

And it's so funny how

the nerve that got struck on that, on that reel, if you look through the comments, I've actually posted it two different times.

Yeah.

And it's the same amount of comments, same, you're an idiot, you're a moron, don't listen to this guy.

And it's a lot of times because you're telling realtors are telling you always buy, always buy, always buy.

All I'm saying is the math is this, bro.

All right.

Do the math.

Figure it out because it's not a no-brainer to buy a house all the time.

And I got to tell you, after college, I bought right away.

I own right now, but there was a two or three year gap in like 2010 to 2012-ish

that I rented.

And it was the best feeling of my life, dude.

It was,

I didn't have to worry about.

And if you added up the rent price versus owning that same unit where you looked at your mortgage interest, everybody forgets that you're not paying that whole mortgage to yourself.

The interest is going, it's gone, just like your rent is.

Your homeowners association fees, that's money gone.

You know what I mean?

You need more homeowners insurance.

You don't get that money back.

Property taxes, especially in states that have property taxes like California and Illinois, forget about it, bro.

So you add up those numbers, compare it to what that rent price is.

Okay, now it's about even.

Don't forget, you have closing costs.

You buy a house.

You got to pay a realtor commission.

So now you start actually doing the math.

Okay, well, this only makes sense if it appreciates 4% a year and I own it for at least four years.

Okay, fine.

Are you going to do that?

Now you did the math and it got you there.

But what's hilarious is people get so pissed about that deal because 95% of I made that number up.

I don't know if it's 95%, but

95% of the world don't do

for investment purposes.

They see their house as their nest egg.

They see their 401k as their nest egg.

Then that's it.

Then that's it.

All right.

They're not diversified.

Yeah, maybe they have a thousand bucks in an Ameritrade account that they around with and bought, bought Ethereum or something with, but but at the end of the day,

it's slapping people in the face.

The very idea that owning would not be a better option than renting when they've based their whole livelihood in retirement on this concept.

You know, that ain't my fault.

I'm just giving you the math, guys.

All right, you don't listen to me.

And it's always so funny, man, when people scroll, especially when those reels go semi-viral, you'll get people that don't follow me.

We'll see that.

And, you know, they're immediately thinking, oh, what's this guy selling?

What's this selling?

Don't listen to this guy.

Yeah, yeah.

But the people that actually follow me can see that I'm actually just trying to help people.

I like really am.

So you would never sell a course or a mastermind or anything?

I put together this networking group.

We did an event in Chicago recently that was supposed to be an intimate networking thing.

I wanted to cap it at 50.

I forgot to turn it off on the website when we were selling tickets.

So we ended up with like 75-ish and it went really well, man.

Nice.

We were charged at 250 bucks a ticket, but nothing for that networking.

I mean, dude, exactly.

And that's what people don't understand.

And I didn't make a penny on it.

So now I'm, when I did the math, I mean, because there was things like, but breakfast didn't have to be $90 a head.

We did kind of everything higher end than it needed to be.

So

I didn't make any money on it.

But

it's now, Sean, led me to,

I really enjoyed it too, man.

I really enjoyed it by putting all these people in the room together that wouldn't have been otherwise.

People flew in from Atlanta, from Florida, from New York, from Dallas.

And it was a really good, good group of people.

And there's demand for it now to do it again.

And I think I might make that my thing.

And I've added now to it a curriculum and course that does come with a fee, but it's relatively inexpensive.

I'm not one of those guys where like, hey, I'm going to be a f ⁇ ing coach and I'm going to teach you to be a coach too and pay me 50 grand and you get to hang out with me.

It's not like that at all.

It's not your primary income.

That's when it's an issue.

When it's the person's primary income selling courses.

Well, exactly.

Cause they got to shove it down your effing throat.

And

what are they selling a course at?

How to get rich?

Well, how the f are you getting rich?

You're getting rich by selling me a fing course?

This is your business plan?

I'm going to teach you how to become rich and it's going to start with you paying me $1,000.

Like, give me a f ⁇ ing break, dude.

It's nuts.

It's not.

I get those ads every day, man.

It's crazy.

You also said on your IG, a lot of people in corporate America are miserable.

Now, you've worked in corporate America, so you can make that statement.

But what did you witness when you were working there?

Well, I think people get so wrapped up in,

as Robert Kiyosaki talked about in Rich Dad, Poor Dad, the rat race.

Okay.

And, you know, you're trying to climb, but you're not really ever accomplishing.

really anything and in your in your little sphere of employment you have this relevancy and yeah man you want to be your boss's boss one day and you might be able to get to his job when he's 42 and you're going to get this promotion and you're going to make president's club it's in jamaica next year and all this

dude it all seems so

important but it really doesn't matter everybody outside of your organization does not care okay

and the first time i learned this bro i switched jobs

I went from one insurance company to another one.

And I was like touting all these people.

This guy, Scott, that worked at my other organization.

He was my boss's boss, and all this,

dude, no one at this new company even knew who the f he was.

I'm thinking it's this influential person that's changing the world.

Yeah, because we're brainwashed to think that in this corporate climate, you know what I mean?

Now, over here, Ken was that guy.

We were all going to be Ken one day.

You know, so once you actually have that epiphany,

I think you get a lot happier.

And the way what I was saying about people that are W-2 employees never actually being happy, it's the successful ones, namely the successful sales ones, because it becomes out of whack.

Now, that lower performing salesperson is typically overpaid in a business to business.

That guy making 80 grand in a B2B sales environment, dude, he's overpaid.

He should probably be making zero or not even have a job, but he has to exist.

Okay.

I'm not talking about 1099 commission-only jobs.

I'm talking about business-to-business corporate sales environments.

Okay.

That guy making 80 grand is actually overpaid.

He should be making zero.

The guy that's making 300 grand, he's subsidizing all those 80 grand guys down here.

All right.

That 300 grand guy is actually underpaid.

Wow.

Right.

It's a crazy way to look at it.

Yeah.

And it's true.

Because that guy that's making 300 grand, they've now put the golden handcuffs on him to try to never get out this, get out of this place.

That's crazy.

You've got a wife and kids, or you got a husband and kids, and whatever, dude.

You're not going to quit your job, bro.

You were making 300 grand.

You nuts.

He'll make 3 million out on his own, bro.

Man, it's been a pleasure.

What are you working on next?

Where can people find you?

2,000% raise, man.

2,000% raise is my book that came out.

It's a very good, easy read.

Getting great reviews on Amazon.

And also my podcast.

I'm so excited about my podcast.

Hoping to grow up to be like you one day, man.

I think you're already there, man.

All right, guys.

Thanks for watching, and I'll see you guys next time.