Oz The Mentalist On Winning Marathons, Performing for LeBron James & Reading Minds | DSH #144

We had a magic off straight up like he did a trick and it was like can you top that and I did a trick and he did a trick and it ended up with him going out in the in the front yard and floating like a David Blaine style float card.

Was it red or black?

It was red.

Was it a heart or a diamond?

Diamond.

Which one?

10.

Take a look.

What 10 of diamonds are?

Oh,

that's crazy.

I was watching him the whole time too.

Say it.

What's her name?

Lauren.

Lauren.

No.

Lauren.

Oh, my God.

Lauren, what?

All right, welcome back to the Digital Social Hour.

I'm your host, Sean Kelly, here with my co-host, Charlie Cavalier, and our guest today, Oz Pearlman.

Thanks, guys.

How's it going?

Going great.

Man, the marathon runner himself.

Ultra.

Ultra marathoner.

Ultra marathoner.

Man, you've won four New Jersey marathons.

Dude, wow.

You did your homework.

I got a little plaque in my office that says Hall of Fame or New Jersey Marathon.

That's

the heyday.

You know what's fun about that race is it's an out and back, which means you kind of turn around.

And if you're in the lead, there's a police escort.

So there's like a police car in front of you.

So everyone sees you and have always been a battle for that race.

So it's, dude, you get fired up.

Like thousands of people are like, dude, yeah.

And by the time I, the third or fourth time, they knew me.

So you're like, yeah, oh, so you just get, dude, fired up.

That's insane.

It's like the closest thing to feeling like a real athlete, even though I'm not one.

Yeah.

What's the secret?

Because you don't have the ideal runner's build.

I don't know.

I uh

mental motivation.

I can just suffer better than other people, I feel.

Right.

You've trained your mind to be able to withstand.

Honestly, yeah.

And also psychological warfare, dude.

I, when I pass somebody in a race, not to tip my hat, I like literally I control my breathing.

I get myself rested.

I go by you really fast and usually give you encouraging words, which will break your spirit.

I'll be like, dude, you're looking great, bro.

Keep it going.

And like when you do that, and they're feeling, and then you, I don't think it's fair, is I just, you know, I, uh, it breaks you mentally.

Oh, so you're talking shit while you're running.

That's like some Kobe Bryan stuff right there.

Like, hit a three and then be like, don't worry, young fella, you'll get him next year.

Like,

you know, like, honestly, it's encouraging words, which are honestly discouraging.

Wow, I love that because runners don't really be talking.

Yep.

Because I used to be a runner and no one really talked during the race, but that's oh, if you can talk and you have a normal breathing pattern, it really messes with the other person because they're like, how am I breathing so heavy, dying?

And this guy is out for an afternoon stroll.

Yeah, they get in their own head.

Because now they're like, oh my God.

And if you pass them, like they're walking backwards, now their spirit is broken.

They're like, I'm not going to try to catch this guy.

Have you ever gotten into like a talking competition with somebody during a race that lasted maybe longer than it should have?

Oh, full on, man.

I'll start reading their mind, which will even like go Jedi mind trick.

I'll be like, think of something right now.

And I tell them what it is.

And they're like, dude, this guy's next level.

Like, I don't even want to pass him right now.

so how did you develop that ability was it at a young age or did you develop it later in life i started doing magic so most people who become mentalists which a lot of people don't know what mentalism is kind of magic but it's magic of the mind yeah like i can show up here right now i got no props and i could do an hour show you know for you two or for 2000 people because with magic like you go see chris angel david copper there's props there's big props and even though listen i love magic you know that somehow there's sleight of hand or there's something you're not seeing on stage, right?

There's like, they call it smoke and mirrors, you know, there's something.

With mentalism, it's like, it's the most pure pursuit, almost like stand-up comedy, where you just get up there with the microphone and you talk.

I don't need props.

I am the show.

So I've learned how people behave, how they think.

And it started with magic where there's misdirection.

Misdirection means when I say, Charlie, you see how I look there, you look there.

Naturally, your eyes go where I want them to.

So take that to the next level.

Instead of a card trick where I know where you're going to pick the card, I can just say, think of a card, look at a card, use your mind.

It's very different.

You start to know and analyze how people behave, what they think.

You can influence their thinking.

It's a little more cerebral.

I have a lot of people after my shows that go, I don't like magic, but dude, I love what you do because it challenges people on a different level.

He got me too.

I literally looked at the pillow as he looked, too.

Well, it's that pause, that timing.

It's the same as a comedian.

How do comedians make you laugh?

They could tell the same joke.

Ten men and women say the same joke.

One, you laugh the hardest.

It's because the way they time it, the way they look, the way their facial expressions, all those things are,

they're on an instinctive basis.

Gotcha.

And then how long did it take you to develop your mentalism skills to be able to go on America's Got Talent?

So it's funny.

I went on America's Got Talent and I didn't get on the first time I tried out, which is so funny with that show.

First time I tried out, didn't even get on.

Second time I got third place.

So go figure, man.

Timing is everything in life.

But I was still doing magic when I went on there.

But the year before, shout out to Matt Franco, who's here in Vegas, who's awesome.

He's a friend, amazing magician.

and shit are you someone that doesn't have life insurance why leave anything up to chance in a worst case scenario luckily policy genius makes finding the right policy simple and their team of licensed experts are on hand to help you through it life insurance gives your family a safety net that they can cover expenses with so they don't have to worry about money while getting back on their feet i've had friends and family members that have passed away without life insurance it's definitely left us with financial instabilities.

Even if you already have a policy, it may not offer enough protection for your family's needs and it may not follow you if you leave your job.

With Policy Genius, you can find life insurance policies that start at just $2.92 per year for $1 million of coverage.

Some options offer same-day approval and avoid unnecessary medical exams.

Policy Genius knows how valuable your time is.

Their technology makes it easy to compare life insurance quotes from America's top insurance in just a few clicks to find your lowest price.

Policy Genius has licensed award-winning agents who can help you find the best fit for your needs.

They work for you, not the insurance companies.

They don't have an incentive to recommend one insurer over another so you can trust their guidance.

Policy Genius is for parents, caregivers, and anyone else who has people who depend on them.

They simplify the process of getting life insurance so you can protect the people you love.

They got thousands of five-star reviews on Google and TrustPilot.

Your loved ones deserve a financial safety net.

You deserve a smarter way to find and buy it.

Head to policygenius.com/slash DSH or click the link in the description to get a free life insurance quote and see how much you could save.

That's policygenius.com slash DSH.

Show you should see it

is he won the year before I went on and I made a calculated decision saying, yo, if I want to go far, I got to differentiate.

Like I can't, if I do magic and he did magic, you're never going to win the same thing two years in a row.

So I was doing 50-50 mentalism, but it was kind of like a crutch.

Mentalism is scary to do because there's no safety net.

Like if you screw up, you screw up versus magic.

You know, you practice a card trick in the mirror.

You can always, it always works.

Yeah.

So I made a decision at that point.

Like, my social is owes the mentalist.

Everything is owes the mentalist.

I was full tilt, sink or swim, man.

I'm going to do all mentalism from here and out.

And are people able to combat your mentalism skills?

Like, can you penetrate everyone or are certain people unpenetrable?

That's a weird way to put it.

Who's penetrable?

I don't penetrate anyone in the show for the record.

Charlie, I'm not penetrating you.

It's true.

I'm safe.

I'm safe.

That costs extra.

Vegas.

But so certain people it works better with.

It's not really like hypnosis where certain people are more suggestible.

But what I would say is some people have bigger barriers.

So that when you're trying to guide someone, think of sales.

If you call someone on the phone, number one thing a telemarketer calls, you're like, dude, I don't want to talk to you.

Done, done.

So let's say not a telemarketer.

How does this salesperson build rapport?

How do they get you comfortable?

You have barriers in place.

First thing you want to say is, I don't need that.

I already got that, right?

So, what if they say, yeah, I'm with you?

You don't need this.

Oh.

So, I'm pretty much a salesperson, but what I'm selling is the feeling of I know what you're thinking.

And in a lot of ways, it's very much sales 101.

Is I need you to become comfortable with me and what I'm asking so that your resistance lowers.

And so, is I could do certain things on anybody.

But the difficulty for me is that

I'm not trying to be cryptic, is that certain people are easier to work with and they're going to give me bigger reactions quicker.

So in that sense, in my show, what I'm doing is curating content.

Think of like when you go on social, the best curators, like, you know, the fat Jewish, like certain people are so funny because they find you the best stuff that matches your sense of humor.

So the same thing is in my show, I can look at somebody and in one second know they're going to this thing.

Wow.

They're going to this thing and that's who I'm going to pick out of a thousand people.

But other times we throw frisbees out in the audience and anyone can catch it.

So you know it's not set up.

Right.

Right.

If somebody watches YouTube, they're going to be like, oh, he must have told you what to think or something.

No matter what I say, people think it's set up.

If you see me on stage with a thousand people,

yo, you throw frisbee, one, two, three people.

There is no way that could happen.

They stand up.

I guess your ATM pin code.

You know, it's legit, man.

Like, if you watch the ESPN stuff from last year, I hacked DK Mech S phone, dude.

He grabbed his phone so fast.

Oh, my God.

He goes, give me my damn phone back.

Like, it was, you know, it's not set up.

So I could do it with anybody.

Certain people are easier than others.

Yeah,

see, I'm a bit of a skeptic, too.

So, I'm the biggest skeptic, Charlie.

I'm also, that's why I became a mentalist.

I was like, this ain't this is not real.

I gotta figure out how they're doing this.

You use a lot of analogies about like stand-up comedy, and uh, my favorite thing to watch, and me too.

And I've done a lot of uh work with comedians where and I noticed that what they put out in a smaller room show is them testing material for those big stadium audiences.

Fully, is what you do similar?

Like, are you like, if the three of us are doing this, are you more willing to try out some like new material on us?

You're not just gonna walk into a 10,000-person arena and just try something and see if it works.

True.

If I'm getting paid and there's that many people in there, you don't want to bomb.

So in that sense, yeah.

It's exactly like a stand-up comedian because the difference between magic and mentalism and why if you were to look it up, there's so many fewer mentalists is because there's this steep learning curve where it drops off.

So with magic, you can practice magic by yourself.

So I could sit in a mirror and I can watch myself do a move, a sleight of hand move over and over and over and I can perfect it.

And now when I do it for an audience, listen, it might go wrong a little, but you still know that you can do it.

Mentalism is all about like there's a trick I do or I guess a number straight up.

Just think of a number one to 100.

It's kind of one of my signatures.

I've done it more times than any other trick I do.

I just get, I just thought I've done it probably 50,000 times.

And I've done it so many times that I can just analyze how it works.

It's one of the hardest tricks I do.

Wow.

Seriously.

So what I'm saying is that went wrong for years before it went right.

And most people don't have thick enough skin.

We're like, imagine bombing.

Like comedians, you tell a joke.

Only way you know if it's funny is if the audience laughs.

You can think it's funny.

That doesn't matter.

If it bombs in a show, you got to keep polishing the stone.

Get it better, get it better.

And suddenly you find a hook and a tag and it's suddenly, bam, it's hilarious.

So it's exactly that.

Like I've seen Chris Rocket, the comedy seller, just working material with a notepad where he says a joke bombs, bombs, bombs.

But then he started, and then you come back a week later, tweak it a little bit.

That lump sellers might like where i go in new york city in the village and yeah exactly a month later that thing brings down the house wow so with mentalism it's the same thing the tricks need to be get get perfected over time um or you know sink or swim man i most of the stuff i do on tv you're seeing i'm doing it for the first time right because i always challenge myself to do new stuff always like i that that's what's gotten me kind of the the momentum and longevity.

I've been on a lot of TV because I always do new things.

I kind of push the envelope.

I don't just do the same thing over and over.

Yeah.

Speaking of TV, you got on ESPN.

You even did a trick for LeBron James.

Yeah.

What did you do for him?

So I didn't do something for LeBron.

I wish, man.

Hopefully in two days I'll see LeBron at the SPs.

But I did a trick where somebody on Sports Center thought of LeBron James.

And one of my signature tricks, I have somebody think of someone famous, and I cut out a picture of them, like a silhouette.

I cut out a silhouette.

If you want to see, like, you go on Google, watch AGT.

It was one of the first things I did.

And so I cut out a silhouette.

So so on sports center that day I cut out LeBron and I'm gonna make this short story, but I was on ESPN on a show called Mike and Mike.

Mike and Trey classic

show and it was at seven in the morning in Bristol Connecticut for those that don't know ESPN shoots in Manhattan, but they also have like a major headquarters two hours from New York City.

And I drove up there.

I got driven up there the night before and there was a snowpocalypse, they called it.

All the roads, the governor of Connecticut closed the roads.

Wow.

legit state order executive order so you couldn't leave so all their guests that were supposed to come for the morning and afternoon segments mine was so early that they drove me up the night before right so dude i do mic and mic jay williams walks off set it's so funny man if you could find this on youtube you could waste a lot of time watching these segments so i get off and i go back to the hotel and i'm hanging out we can't go anywhere right and uh I get a call and they're like, yo, do you want to be on another show?

It was Sports Center.

And I'm like, uh, when?

They're like in 27 minutes.

And then I'm at the holiday in.

And I'm like in the suit.

And I'm like, oh, I got to go upstairs.

Always bring an extra shirt.

Lesson learned.

If you're going to be on TV, always bring an extra shirt, extra set of pants.

If you're wearing a tie like I do, I brought three extra ties.

So I go back to the studio.

I literally run upstairs and try to figure out what am I going to do?

I'm about to be about to be on Sports Center.

So here's what happened that day.

I got on four more shows because every one of them I killed it.

So like, do another one, do another one, do another one.

I was on Sports Center every hour for 24 hours.

So LeBron James, he either tweeted or went on YouTube and left a comment.

I got to remember, I think it was on YouTube a comment.

He goes, dude, who's this guy?

It was Pearlman because I cut out him and everyone tagged him in it.

He goes, who the hell this guy was Pearlman?

He's on Sports Center more than I am today because I was on every hour in ESPN all day for 24-hour cycle.

Wow.

Dude, sometimes it's better to be lucky and always say yes, man.

Always see yes.

They're like, can you do another one?

Yes, I can.

Hell yes, I can.

And dude, that

just.

boosted me like crazy.

It was luck.

Wow.

It was crazy.

So you believe in luck.

I think you make your own luck because that day, yes, was I lucky that it was a snow apocalypse and nobody got in.

But when they called me and said, can you do another segment?

Can you do another segment?

Dude, I work well under pressure.

Every segment, I did something new.

If you watch those, I was on, I made like probably 40 minutes of TV that day.

No repeats.

Everything I did was new and different.

Wow, that's impressive.

Do you think it's easy?

Like, is it harder for you to accomplish?

Well, I don't know if accomplish is the right word.

Is it harder for you to do what you're doing through a screen?

I.e., like with social media nowadays, do you think you could pull off some of the amazing things you can do talking to somebody like who's watching you on TikTok or Instagram or something like that?

You got to tailor stuff to the medium.

So I think you got to adjust, man.

If you're, if you're like, you know, TV's dead, like in certain ways, when I make stuff for TV, I make it with the thought of how are we going to clip this down for social.

So we get the furthest reach.

Smart.

Because if you distill what I do, like what do I do?

Right.

If you think, what do you guys do?

Right.

You're giving somebody a certain type of content that's going to add value in their life, or is it creating humor or entertainment?

I create memorable moments of amazement right and it needs to be genuine authentic reactions because otherwise if I'm watching myself I'm like this is fake

and everything nowadays people say is this fake and I don't even mind if people think some things are fake because that's engagement that's driving if you're in the conversation but if you make it authentic like especially when you do stuff with celebrities or sports stars or people that like you've been in people's ears you've you know they watch you they're loyal they know who you are so you get that feeling or just somebody random on the street you create these moments where you can sense.

You have this sense in your body of that had to be real, man.

You see the reaction, you see the pauses, you see those moments.

When people are acting, you can tell.

You can feel when something's fake.

Wow.

Don't you, don't you know what I mean?

Like, can't you see on certain videos?

I think most people can, and even if they can't.

So to answer your question, I'm always thinking, how will this be consumed?

And so I make stuff that gets right to the point.

Yeah.

Have you ever had a mentalist battle where you went up against another mentalist?

i'm all about that man let's go eight miles straight up i love that idea that sounds fun

that's a great tv pitch man i would love to go a magic off i've done a mentalist off in high school there was a kid um this guy named ryan hurts i love this guy who was a magician when i just started and this guy was when you're a magician other magicians unless they know you're a magician don't want to teach you a trick right like if charlie's like all right that was sick show me how you did i'm like i'm not showing you man but if he if he has the cred where i can feel that he's super interested he's read books and he's actually getting getting into it Then I'm gonna start showing you how stuff works because how did I learn right other people showed me so this guy didn't know if I was if I had like genuine

like

What were my intentions right and so after about a year of me bothering him like crazy being like dude show me I did that show me how to do that.

Please teach me he got the gist that I was legit into this and he was just getting out of this stuff and we had a party.

This is like a high school party sophomore year where we had a magic off straight up like he did a trick and it was like can you top that And I did a trick, and he did a trick, and it ended up with him going out in the front yard and floating.

Like a David Blaine's down float back in the day.

You're probably too young for this, but David Blaine's first street special.

He floated.

On water, right?

Dude, it wasn't on water.

It was just on the street.

And people went crazy.

And that blew him up, man.

This is the original like street magic special.

And once he did that, everyone tried to learn ways to do that.

How can you do that?

And this guy did it.

And it was just bonkers.

Like, I had to tip my hat.

I'm like, dude, I'm not beating this.

Like, no card trick of mine is gonna beat you floating in the middle of the street man it was it was so shout out to ryan hurts dude so that was the one magic off i think i've had recently and that was 25 years ago that's sick have you done anything with david blain

i have done shows where david blain and i were both performing one time at lance armstrong's house um and i've met david blain at some of his specials and stuff but man that is uh That guy's goaded for me.

Icon legend status.

I wanted to see him in Vegas, but every time I'm doing a show in Vegas and he's doing a show, we're both working at the same time.

The curse of both being in the same performance, we're like, he's doing a show at 9 p.m., so am I.

What do you call what you do?

I mean, I don't want to use the wrong word, tricks.

I don't care at all.

I'm not like precious.

I would call them tricks.

They're routines, whatever.

But at the end of the day, it is a trick.

But my goal is not to trick you.

Like, I don't want you to think like I'm smarter than you.

What I'm doing, you both could do it.

Both ability and ability.

No, but you literally both could do this.

But you'd have to dedicate your life to it for probably years.

Like, I've never seen anyone who could do it within like a month.

You might be able to do something simple, but it's everything I do comes down to one of two things.

One is if you see it, you go, that's insane.

If I told you I did it, you'd be like, there's no way you just did that on live TV with millions of people watching.

What if it went wrong?

I'm like, dude, that's the rush.

That's the yeah, that's the adrenaline.

Or two, it's so simple that you go, that's ridiculous.

Right.

It's very rarely in the middle.

It's either so hard or so easy.

But yeah, it's a trick, but my goal is not to trick you.

I'm not trying to show you I'm smarter than you.

I'm trying to just give you an authentic moment of being like, wow.

Because how often do you get that nowadays?

So since you're able to read people's mind, has that affected your personal life, dating, friendships?

So I can't really read your mind.

It sounds like that.

What I'm reading is other things you give off.

Okay.

Right?

You're communicating in other ways that you don't realize, but

it's not like, you know, it's not like...

an X-Men, you know, Professor X.

Like, I'm not, I can't get inside your head like that.

You're communicating things you don't realize, and I'm also pushing you in certain ways.

You,

I'm the director in my show.

I'm kind of pointing the camera in the direction I want for you to do what I want.

Got it.

It's a switch you flip.

So, day to day, am I doing the same thing?

No.

It's kind of like a poker player.

When they're there and they're playing poker, their skills are very refined for that exact skill.

Right.

They're not at the grocery store being like, does this guy think I'm a jerk?

Oh my God, they just looked at my butt.

Like, it's not, it ain't Jason Bourne.

Okay.

So it doesn't affect my personal life.

I try to use it as an advantage in certain things.

Like if I'm negotiating a real estate deal, i'm using my skills a bit yeah sure trying to get the best price i can

um so it's helped you in business for sure yeah yeah that would be a useful skill it's very helpful i can i can get a good sense of whether people are lying so that's always helpful in life so how can you tell if someone's lying so there's certain tells for certain people but again it's all based on a benchmark right so like if i just told you there's a certain moment where You can tell when most people aren't listening to you, right?

When their eyes glaze over, when they look, when their mouth is about to open, when you're speaking, that's them thinking of what they're going to say, right?

Or you can see their eyes, which is very basic level NLP stuff.

You can learn from one book, like Cliff's Notes, watch a YouTube video, but not everybody lies the same way.

So for you to know how someone is lying, you need to observe them for a longer amount because what works for one person might be different.

It's kind of like blood doping.

You know how they do a blood passport?

They check your blood against your own blood.

Because some people have higher testosterone levels naturally.

Wow.

You know what what I mean?

That's why they do like a blood, they check you versus yourself.

And that's how they know if you've been doping.

So the same example works for me.

If I have somebody in my show and I get them up and I start talking to them, it's like a polygraph.

I ask them questions that I know they're telling the truth on.

I'm like, tell me where are we at right now?

And they go, Vegas, and I can see it.

And I go, name somebody you've never talked to, and then say, I'm a huge fan of theirs, even if you hate them.

And I see what they look like when they lie, and I can kind of see the difference.

So now if I do a trick where I go, put a coin behind your back, hold it in both hands, something I like to do.

And I say, say it's in this hand.

And say it's in this hand.

I know they're lying on one.

I go, boom, I know 100% of you lied.

Because I can tell the difference.

Wow.

You see, so I can see the way their face moves, but I need to know a truth and a lie first.

Yeah.

Do you get it?

Yeah, for sure.

Got to build that benchmark.

You have to see a comparison.

Do you think you'd be able to beat a polygraph lie detector test?

I think so.

Really?

I haven't done it.

Well, I actually have.

I was on a TV show for it.

Back in the day, I never aired called The Moment of Truth on Fox, which is like crazy.

But

you'd have to have a polygraph to practice with, but I do think I could.

I also don't think the science is unequivocal on those.

It just measures your heart rate, right?

And if it goes up.

I think it measures a lot of things that if you practice on them, you can control or you can fake.

Right.

Right?

You can spike your blood pressure.

You can have like auto-hypnosis things you tell yourself to mimic a lie.

Yeah, we were talking about this yesterday, seeing if we could fool it.

Yeah, we should get a polygraph.

You should get one in your hand.

Calm down.

We would have somebody storm off as soon as we got an answer.

And they they would lock you in and they'd be like, do you actually like Charlie?

And you're like, yes.

And they're like, woo, woo, woo.

And it's like, truth is out, man.

Truth is out.

Have you ever

left somebody worse off, in your opinion, than when you started doing whatever you do with them?

I don't think so because anything that I'm about to reveal that's uncomfortable, like I don't go there.

Even though I've had stuff where I figured out something that's a little bit risque.

But that's always something people put out there.

Like if somebody's cheating on their husband or wife and stuff like that, where it's not psychic, but they're like, they challenge me.

They go, yo, I'm thinking of something you'll never guess.

And I'm like, I know what you're thinking, and I'm not going to tell them.

I'll sometimes write it and show them on a piece of paper and be like, if you don't want them to know, because in my show, I guess things like ATM pin code, social security, phone codes.

But I'll always say, are you comfortable with me revealing this?

And if not, I'll show them.

And I did this on CNBC earlier this year on Squawkbox, where I guessed the host's ATM PIN code.

And dude, she is the most skeptical.

It's really worth watching.

If you you go on my social at o's the mentalist from earlier in the year i guess her pin code she lost her mind she was like we need you out of the studio i'm changing it right now and i only showed it to her because again i'm not trying to burn bridges people will want that stuff but i won't leave you worse off my show is all about having fun leaving talking about what you experience and never feeling sad yeah sometimes people cry because if you they thought of someone that's passed away or someone close to them in their life, but I'm going to come give them a hug and I'm going to let them know like I feel, you know, I can feel that they're happy and sad together because they're being reminded of somebody they care about.

I also saw online you could predict financial market downturns.

I don't know about that, man.

My portfolio would say otherwise at times, but

I'm guessing.

So like when I try to predict Super Bowls, Final Four, I've had some good luck.

It's like a sports handicapper.

I'm friends with a lot of sports gamblers.

I love picking their brains, but I'm not psychic.

I do not pretend to know the future.

I am not talking to dead people.

I have skills that you could acquire if you were willing to work on them.

It is not something that I would say is supernatural or God-given.

It's a talent that I've honed.

Yeah.

Would you say your abilities are kind of spiritual?

Like you're able to read energies?

I don't know if I would call it that.

I don't know.

I've gotten, I've done things I can't explain, but again, I would never attribute those to psychic powers or like spiritual or from like a sixth sense.

Or

when I've done things like that, I think that it's the same way athletes have pushed themselves to a level they couldn't explain.

Like I've had ultra marathons where I'm literally throwing up for eight hours straight, where I have heat stroke and I come back from the dead man.

And it's like, I don't know how, but you can dig deep.

It's like we were talking about David Goggins, who I love that guy, known him for years.

He's got a rule that's like, when you feel like you've given it all, you've only given 40%.

There's so much deeper.

You could like, you know, like those Navy SEALs who hell wake, they don't sleep for five days.

They dig and you find out who you are in your soul.

I've done stuff where I can't explain it, but I think it's all those years of of reps and 10 years, 20 years of doing this.

My intuition kicks in and I just know something and I go, I don't know how I did that.

I don't even know how I did that because it wasn't my normal thing.

And I do not know how you just thought of that.

And I'm going to try to backtrack and figure it out, but I can't explain it.

Wow.

But I don't think it's psychic.

It's just, sometimes you got to trust your instinct.

Interesting.

I love it.

I love it.

So is there like, is there a Mount Everest for something you want to pull off?

Like, is there a trick,

whatever you want to call it?

Yeah.

Like that you're working towards that when you pull it off, that's going to go on your Matt Rushmore of things you've done.

I don't know if there's a specific trick, but there's an achievement, which is something.

So in this country, there's no, think of like, we're in Vegas.

There's Chris Angel.

There's David Blaine.

There's David Copfield.

These are names.

Like every Penn and Teller, legend status, where each of them is carved out like a niche of what they are and what they do.

And I feel like in this country, if you say to somebody a mentalist, a lot of people don't know what that is, which is wild because I guess it hasn't blown up in that way.

Like, think people know what skateboarders are.

Like, you wouldn't have known what X Games people were, but 20 years ago, but it blew up.

So I think there's a place, like a placeholder where to become the most known mentalist, where you're known for this, where I can get inside people's heads.

I know what you're thinking before you're even thinking at times.

I can control your thoughts.

I would love to elevate the craft to a level where everybody knows where it is.

And if I can be that person who, when you hear that word mentalist, you go, it's O's.

Like, that's the guy.

So So I'm working towards that end.

And that just involves kind of up in the ante each time, doing crazier things.

Like, you're going to see every time I do it, I try to push the envelope.

Like, at the Espies, I'm going to be on, I don't know when this goes out, but July 13th, you'll see me on.

July 12th.

My bad, I forgot the day.

I can read other minds.

I don't know my own.

I think July 12th in two days.

But I'm trying to do stuff that I've never done before.

Just kind of always step it up.

That's awesome.

And I feel like David Blaine's a beast at that.

Like, he'll always do like something crazy.

Putting like needles through his arms, holding his breath for 10 minutes.

When he did the, he was up in the air, the balloon one, I was like, I was nervous.

Yep.

But he pulled it off.

Well, he's taking that level of, is it magic or is it real?

Where you start questioning, like, you know, this guy an alien?

Like, is this, is this a trick?

Because with him, a lot of it's not a trick.

There's, you think, but when he's putting a needle through his hand, that's real.

These are real.

That's not a fake needle that's, you know, sewing his lips.

Like, that stuff is really being done.

And he just pushed his mind and body to the limits.

And I admire it.

Joe Rogan pushed a needle all the way through his arm.

Oh, dude, yeah.

I'm watching that.

I'm cringing because I'm not.

You show me a video.

I have a friend who's a plastic surgeon, and he always wants to show me.

He's like, look at this.

I'm like, oh,

I'm the guy who gets squeamish.

I'm not watching that.

The bone sticking out of a leg.

I'm about to faint.

Yeah.

Man, so what are you working on next?

You doing another ultra marathon?

You know what?

So last year, I had a couple big stunts.

I ran around Central Park in New York City.

It's a 6.1-mile loop.

And there's a record.

It's like a world record of how many times you could do it in one day okay and I broke that record it was front page of the New York Times and I raised uh I did 116 miles in about 18 hours at the time the park so I just kept going around non-stop non-stop and I did it for this is right when the war in the Ukraine started so it's fresh in everyone's mind I wanted to help out and we ended up raising a thousand dollars per month 116 grand wow and that that just blew up And then it was so fun and it was such a fun like team experience.

I was the only one running, but people joined me that I ran from Montauk to Manhattan, which is in Long island i ran long island in 21 hours hottest day of the summer so i think what i might be doing soon is i might run around a track as many times as i can i want to run 100 miles as fast as i can 401 loops around a track

i'm probably gonna do it on a hot day i don't know i like to suffer and then i'm just coming up with my next stunt you're insane man but i got a lot going on family front i'm having my fourth kid in a month so

thank you so it's busy in the household busy work busy family so i don't know i can't run too much running away from my problems yeah man that's insane insane.

100 miles.

Do we have time in here?

Can we try something fun?

Yeah.

You know what?

Let's do this.

We're in Vegas.

And so I asked you before I got here, Full Transparency said, find a deck of cards.

You guys ran around.

They're like, is there a deck of cards somewhere in here?

Yeah.

And you have like a box.

I got it.

Can we check these out?

Yeah.

Okay.

Now,

we didn't even check.

Is this a full deck?

Full deck.

Okay.

I get accused, Charlie, of not playing with a full deck in many ways.

Me too, but in mental ways.

Seriously.

So here's the difference.

If I take these cards, and I told you, I love magic, I love magic tricks, and I were to tell you to pick one, physically, take one out of the deck out, and you put it back, and I find it.

First off, that can be amazing, but it's expected.

Do you understand?

You know what the ending is going to be.

Yeah.

And also, you're going to think, well, he's doing something with his hands.

So if instead, okay, and it's going to be like deja vu.

You were to look through the deck and decide on one card that's, I'm going to call it air quotes, your favorite card card of the day and that you've not physically touched that you are imagining i want you to close your eyes close your eyes and you know the cards in the deck they're red and black yeah hearts diamonds clubs and spades and they go from ace all the way to king and i want you behind your eyes to see your favorite card of the day right there can you visualize it right now yeah visualize okay open your eyes watch

Red, black.

You don't have to say anything I want you to see that card that you saw.

Red, black, hearts, diamonds, club spades.

And you saw that card and you're visualizing.

Like I said, deja, you've seen this over and over in your head.

Ace, two, three,

four, five, six.

Look at his hands.

He's getting nervous.

Seven, eight, nine, ten, jack, queen, king.

Ace, two, three, four, five, seven, nine, ten, jack, queen, king.

There is no way he could know what this card is, could he?

No.

And swear to God, before you walked in this room, you had no idea what you were going to do.

what this card was going to be, any of this, before you walked in here, did you?

Yeah, no idea.

All right.

Hold your hand up like you're holding that card right there in your hand, your favorite of the day, and close your eyes.

Don't open them until I tell you.

See, I watched his reactions as he went.

I watched when I said red or black.

Hearts, diamonds, clubs, fades.

Please don't open your eyes.

I'm going to move the mic for just a second.

Sean, don't open them so no one thinks you're looking.

Keep them closed tight.

You're imagining a card.

I'm going to make a card appear.

Not really magically.

I put it in there.

Keep your eyes closed for me.

Keep your eyes closed.

And don't open them yet.

That card

that was in your head.

Tell us.

Was it, don't tell me the whole card.

Was it red or black?

It was red.

Was it a heart or a diamond?

Diamond.

Which one?

10.

Take a look.

10 of diamonds.

Oh, that's crazy.

I was watching him the whole time, too.

I'm like, I'm just like, and he's watching you.

Wow.

Wow.

That's nuts.

Was it the hands?

You don't, it was not the hands.

When they say that, that's exactly what misdirection is.

Misdirection is when you say it, people start focusing on the thing you said.

Right.

Right?

It's like, it's like Talladega Knights.

You remember?

He's like, I don't know what to do with my hands.

Do you remember that?

I don't know if you know that Will Farrell reference.

But so when you point something out, people always notice it.

Think of a pickpocket.

Always tell somebody, oh my God, where's your wallet?

And do that when they touch, now you know where their wallet is.

Sure.

Okay, that's a number one rule of pickpocketing is on stage.

If you see a pickpocket,

when they make you think about it, you instinctively touch it to check if it's there.

And that's after that moment is when they take it.

Yeah.

You know what?

Let me ask you a question.

Do you remember the name of your third grade teacher?

Third grade teacher.

Third grade.

Yes.

See, he wasn't sure.

But when you're in third grade, most people are around eight or nine years, I guess more like nine or yeah, eight or nine years old.

And so what's fascinating is some people do, some people don't.

I don't like guessing teachers or things that are available online because you're a young guy.

Facebook was around right around then.

Like you told me you were from New Jersey.

Anyone watching this is like, dude, he must have Googled you, you know?

Big fan base.

I like to do things that nobody's thought of before.

If you were to go back in time,

and I sometimes tell people, think of their ATM pin code, but that's kind of invasive because I'm going to steal all your money.

Or if I say, think of the first boy or girl you ever kissed, that's a good question.

That's like one thing you're like, how would you know that?

But the other person

kissed you.

So two people know that.

So technically, it's impressive, but there's still one other person.

Go back in time, and I want you to try to picture the face of the first big crush you had.

Okay.

Look at that.

Got a little excited.

That was like, go back.

I want you to count.

Have you ever posted about this?

Can you think to yourself, have you ever mentioned it on the show?

Or did this ever come up where you're like, oh my God, this girl had a crush on her?

Or no way.

No way.

No way.

Would he know it?

Nah, fourth grade.

Fourth grade.

All right, I said third.

That's funny.

Have you ever said this to somebody here?

Like, I don't know.

Have you communicated this recently?

You post this on Facebook.

Did you write this down a piece of paper?

Nothing.

Heart stop.

Before today.

And me asking you to think of this girl, fourth grade.

When was the last time you'd even thought of this?

Days, months, or years ago before today?

I would say years.

Years, before this even got in his head.

All right.

Count the letters without using your fingers, but count the letters in her first name just to yourself.

Okay.

Interesting.

So watch.

It was long, but it wasn't too long, right?

If that name's like Michelle Alexandra, it's a struggle.

It's a struggle in the moment.

You're like, oh, God, I mean, that was a medium-sized name.

If it's three letters, you don't count.

You can't fake me out.

He would have known.

Three or four letter names, you know.

So I'm watching him, and I know just by how long it took him, it's five, six, seven letters.

Guaranteed.

Watch him.

Five, six, six letters, isn't it?

Look at that head nod.

100% six letters.

All right, I'm going to write down.

Can I bring a pad of paper?

I brought something to write with.

I got something.

Okay.

Mix up the letters.

Mix them up.

Like you're just drawer jumble in her first name.

Stop, grab a letter somewhere in the name and just focus on just that letter.

You got a letter in your head?

Yeah.

See, people always try to avoid the vowels.

Not always, but they think the vowels are too obvious.

Did you do a vowel?

No.

Didn't because they know there's a vowel in the name.

You thought of them.

R.

You thought of an R, didn't you?

You did, right?

Yeah.

Rolled his tongue.

It's R.

It's not Rachel.

Most common name.

I think this is kind of, it was a little bit of a common name.

Tell us all.

Fourth grade.

You see what I wrote, right?

Charlie, you see this?

Because some people, I've already written this.

Say it.

What's her name?

Lauren.

Lauren.

Lauren.

Oh, my God.

Lauren.

Yo, what?

I'm about to walk out of our own show.

What is going on here?

That's insane.

No one knows her.

And you know the craziest thing is whenever I tell somebody, think of a card, like I told them, think of a card or think of a color or think of anything that's got like a finite amount, is people always, their minds race.

They race around.

And you ask me, what do I do?

I'm good at getting you to focus on the right thing at the right time.

Because you, when you were doing 10 of diamonds, you looked and thought of other cards before, but you're like, nah, not this one, not this one, right?

You change your mind a bunch of times.

That's natural.

That's human instinct, right?

marketers know that on podcasts you know when you do ads they say you have to listen to an ad 21 times before you buy the product you know like you never buy me undies the first time is that a shout out good thing to be a sponsor but like i must have heard that ad a million times before i bought me undies so when you thought of lauren

you thought of another person right i got you to think of somebody else that you're like i thought of lauren but there was somebody else in my mind too somebody else that i don't think you've thought of in even longer am i right yeah another girl not a crush did you have a crush on this girl or no no just like what was the connection because you thought of lauren you thought of of somebody else.

She had a weird name.

Why did she pop in your head?

Is there like a reason for it or you don't even know?

We were on the bust

or we were classmates.

We were classmates.

And do you keep in touch with this girl?

No.

Do you even know why this person's name popped in your brain?

Or you're like...

I kind of do.

Yeah.

Okay.

There it is.

Hold on.

Did she live in Las Vegas?

No.

Imagine she showed up here.

You'd be like, yo.

I cannot believe you're here.

And you say the name over and over in your head.

It just keeps repeating and repeating.

First syllable, second syllable, third syllable, fourth syllable.

It was two syllables.

Okay, hold on, hold on.

Keep thinking of it.

Keep thinking of it.

First letter is a hard sound.

Hard consonants.

Hard consonants.

Watch.

Watch him.

T or a D.

Don't say it.

Don't say.

Turia.

Is her name Duria?

Yeah.

What the fuck is happening?

What is happening right now?

That's insane.

That is like D-U-R or D-E-R or something like that.

Y-A?

Yeah.

Dude.

That's not even a name.

I don't even know what just happened, Charlie.

Yes, you do, but but like, what?

That's not even a name.

Dario.

Yeah.

That's insane.

Can you do the card thing with me?

I got to leave you wanting more, baby.

For next time.

All right.

For next time.

For part two.

That's it.

Part two.

Part two.

You got to leave people wanting more.

That's the, when Charlie goes, is it, what about me?

What about me?

That's when I leave you.

That's how I come back.

Do you like, I got to get him back.

I got to get back to him.

You got a part 10.

You got me hooked in.

That's it, man.

Sell the sizzle, not the.

The first hit is always free.

You know what I mean?

There were three hits for free just now, apparently.

I picked the hardest name.

I I mean, Duria, that's even, that's really a name?

I thought that was a fruit, bro.

Durian.

I'm thinking of like Daria, the show from the 90s.

Yeah, yeah, good call.

What are you working on next, man?

Where can people find out more about you?

You know, I'm always dropping clips on social.

That's the best place to find me.

It looks like Oz.

So everybody who sees this and is like, it's Oz.

Blame my parents.

Israeli name.

So it's Oz, but it's OZ the mentalist.

I post everything on like Twitter, Instagram, Facebook.

I'm doing the SPs.

I'm doing a ton of stuff for ESPN.

They've been really good to me.

Last season, I did stuff with a bunch of the teams.

I go to the training camps for NFL teams.

Nice.

I'm going to tease it here, but you're going to see me with a bunch of teams, also potentially some college teams.

And I just, I love doing stuff with athletes.

Yeah.

I mean, I love stuff with everybody, but athletes are just, I almost feel like they're kids at heart, and they really just wear their hearts on the sleeve and they just let it go.

And a lot of them are tough.

You got to get to this point where...

where you get just past this barrier of them being like kind of tough because you know you're on the field whether you're basketball or you got to stay tough but when they drop their guard yeah dude they just let it out like kids they go crazy because they're like how and their whole job it's like i told you is getting inside people's heads the mental edge what defines how you become a professional it's mental man it's physical but for every hundred people that don't make it 99 had that mental edge and so i love being around people that have that mental fortitude and it's a challenge for me too So yeah, a bunch of stuff for ESPN and just constantly working on new things.

Yeah, those are the ways to see me.

Love it.

My tour around the country.

Watch me on TV.

Thanks for having me.

I'll be watching, man.

Thanks for coming on.

Thanks for watching, guys.

I'll see you next time.