Portugal leave it late and the future of football governance with Sir Keir Starmer – Football Daily

Speaker 1 This is The Guardian.

Speaker 2 Hi Pod fans of America, Max here. Barry's here too.

Speaker 3 Hello.

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Speaker 18 But there's something new and exciting: the remarkable paper pro move remarkable a brand name and an adjective man yeah it's their most portable paper tablet yet it holds all your notes to-dos and documents but it's smaller than a paperback and an incredible 0.26 inches thin so it slips easily into a bag or jacket pocket perfect for working professionals whose jobs take them out of the office like maybe a football journalist Barry although not like you

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Speaker 34 Hello, and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly game of the tournament so far in Dortmund as Turkey and Georgia just went from it from the off until the last minute of injury time.

Speaker 34 Mohamed, actor Cogli, racing clear to seal the win as the Georgian keeper forlornly sprinted back.

Speaker 13 Just what you want to see.

Speaker 26 Brilliant goals, brilliant performances from both sides.

Speaker 34 Thanks to all of them for doing that.

Speaker 31 Meanwhile, Portugal leave it very late against Chechia.

Speaker 38 The Czechs had soaked up hours of pressure before taking the lead, but a soft-owned goal got Roberto Martinez's side back into it.

Speaker 34 And then two late subs, Neto and Conce Chao, combined to win it. We'll look ahead to tomorrow's game, including whether Scotland have to win or have...
have to not lose.

Speaker 38 And part three today is an interview Barry and I did with the Labour leader at Sakir Starma yesterday.

Speaker 34 We talk about the regulator, nation-state ownership, Manchester City's legal claims against the Premier League, and the impact of kickoff times on matchgoing fans.

Speaker 38 All that plus your questions.

Speaker 36 And that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

Speaker 38 On the panel today, Mark Langdon from the Racing Post. Welcome.

Speaker 40 Hi, Max.

Speaker 41 Jonathan Vaduba, welcome.

Speaker 42 Hello, Max.

Speaker 43 So then, Turkey 3, Georgia 1. Mark, you said in the WhatsApp group, there's always the Premier League fixtures if we struggle to get 20 minutes out of this game, but we might need longer.

Speaker 46 One absolutely brilliant game of football.

Speaker 40 Oh, it's crazy, Max. I've got, I started making some notes on the game, and then I've given up because I was just sort of writing down events.
And then I've just like, there's too much.

Speaker 40 I just hope I can remember sort of even half of what went on. The most enjoyable game.

Speaker 40 seen so far and by some distance now it had absolutely um everything really in in terms of two teams that went at each other, played in a frantic and frenzied atmosphere in a wonderful stadium.

Speaker 40 The weather with the pouring down the rain just seemed to help the game sort of tick along at the pace.

Speaker 40 And while Turkey won and deserved to win, I would also like to shout out Georgia because that sort of backdoor. entry into the European Championship via the lowest nations league group.

Speaker 40 I think that could go one of two ways. You could get a minnow that kind of stinks the place out.

Speaker 40 And then you get conversations about do we want to go up to 24 teams what are we doing allowing a side like this into the european championship instead um it was you know that they were a joy the match was a joy and i think 3-1 turkey was maybe something like 3-2 or 4-3 would have been even more um kind of fitting for for a game that seemed to have absolutely everything Yeah, but I mean, that's the thing, isn't it?

Speaker 50 You always support the underdog, I guess, or at least I do, Jonathan.

Speaker 13 And so there will be games where I'm supporting Turkey, but I was definitely willing Georgia to to get that equaliser.

Speaker 46 I don't know whether to go through the game chronologically, but I just want to start at the end. Like the last minute, there's nothing better than a keeper going up and something happening.

Speaker 36 Either he scores or he's got a sprint back.

Speaker 39 It was just such a brilliant end to this game.

Speaker 42 Yeah, it was a brilliant end to the match. Brilliant middle, brilliant beginning.
I think the whole match was fantastic. I agree with Mark, probably the best game of the tournament so far

Speaker 42 from a sort of neutral spectacle point of view.

Speaker 42 Even the technical quality as well, I thought Georgia, just the technical quality, they're not the best of teams, teams, but on the ball, everyone's really tidy. I found it quite an interesting.

Speaker 42 Shaq Vitadze was one of the best players on the pitch. And I don't know if anyone saw the first game, Germany, Scotland, where Graham Sunes came out and said, well, Watford players are...

Speaker 42 It sums it all up when a Watford player is playing against by a Munich player. Well, Shaq Vitadze, I think, had a bit of a ripos to that today because he was outstanding.

Speaker 42 The midfield three as well, I mean, Kotrashvili as well. Mech.
Vabishvili was also really, really good in there. Karach Kelly, of course, everyone knows.
I didn't think he was quite as effective.

Speaker 42 but just going forward for a team that's lost 3-1 the amount of energy and effort and skill and technical ability they put into the game was was really impressive yeah like you said the breakaway at the end it's always great when the keeper's out and uh and you know the the break from the corner and that's just a classic kind of euros thing isn't it reminds me of grosso back in the days uh that that that classic counter-attack in the of the germany italy game uh many many years ago but um i think Actually, that might come back and haunt Georgia, that one goal.

Speaker 42 And I think it was a little bit...

Speaker 42 I would question the value of throwing a keeper up there like last minute as if it was the last game of the, you know, the quarterfinal, like it was the quarterfinal last minute or something.

Speaker 42 Because Georgia played well enough to show that they can challenge pretty much every team in this group. And the question is, can they get enough points?

Speaker 42 And could it even come down to goal difference? Even if they were to finish third in the group, would it potentially maybe come down to the league table? So that goal could actually cost them.

Speaker 42 But all in all, I really, like you said, you admire their efforts for the first ever appearance as well, the effort they put into it.

Speaker 42 But also, Max, you've got to say, this game had two of the best goals of the tournament, right? I mean, we haven't even spoken about the two of the goals.

Speaker 42 And I really enjoyed Mikhail Tadzi's goal as well. I mean, for me, Mikhail Tadzi put pretty much one of the best central sort of all-round centre-forward performances of the tournament so far.

Speaker 42 I thought he was outstanding. So for Georgia to be on the losing side is really, really gutting for them.
But yeah, quality game.

Speaker 13 I did think actually about, you know, because we've talked so much about Karat Shalia and I just thought it would be him and then just some big lumps.

Speaker 48 And actually quite a lot of the players were a bit like Farret Shaley.

Speaker 39 You know, you just think Power League in Georgia must be impossible.

Speaker 49 These little sort of buzzy players who are just really technically good.

Speaker 33 But you mentioned it and the goals and

Speaker 46 the winning goal, I guess, the second goal, Mark, from Arda Gula, right, is it was my first involuntary noise of the tournament when that went in.

Speaker 40 Well, you've done well to get past Mulder's goal without making an involuntary noise because I think I think I made that sort of same noise and I always remember it back to the first time I think I ever did that noise was when Zidan scored the Champions League goal against Levakuz and

Speaker 40 I'm pretty sure that I made the same noise for both of those two goals that we saw from Turkey and we have praised Georgia a lot but you know the Turkish fans will probably be screaming at us for saying you know this team was

Speaker 40 you know

Speaker 40 sort of a laughing stock at the last European Championship because they were hyped up as the dark horses didn't show up at all, didn't play their football.

Speaker 40 They've played a great game, scored some amazing goals. And Goulair, I mean, he plays for Real Madrid, so there's clearly talent there.

Speaker 40 He got injured right at the start of the season, so unfortunately, he wasn't able to play much of a part for Madrid this season. He came into the team late on in La Liga, started to score goals.

Speaker 40 Spanish reporters were talking him up as somebody that might be able to make an impact next season for Real Madrid. I mean, he's got it all on to do there with players of all the people.

Speaker 5 Competition places are exactly.

Speaker 40 But he showed he was sort of worthy's sort of place

Speaker 40 in the team. It is a great goal.
I love the way that he,

Speaker 40 I mean, he's up against a very good goalkeeper, as was already seen with some of the saves that were made.

Speaker 40 And to bend it sort of that far outside the post and to get it sort of back into the top corner. Not sure how many revs there were on that one.
Was it four?

Speaker 40 Yeah, very impressive.

Speaker 39 The key is nought.

Speaker 51 What we want is nought revs.

Speaker 46 That is the ultimate strike of a football, isn't it?

Speaker 49 But I suppose if you're bending it, then I suppose

Speaker 26 you do need some revs, right? right?

Speaker 54 Yeah,

Speaker 40 Nor would be very difficult if you were trying to curl one in.

Speaker 40 So yeah, I thought all the Turkish players that kind of came in with reputations, Goulet being one, Yildiz, who sort of was marginally offside,

Speaker 40 another one that's playing his club football at a high level and a lot's expected. And then I also felt Kadiolu, the left back, was a player that I didn't know sort of anything about really.

Speaker 40 I was sort of Wikipedia him during the match. I mean, I thought he was an absolute delight at left back.

Speaker 40 I mean, the way that modern football is now, for him to be able to play left back just wouldn't have been a thing a few years ago. Feels like a winger, so creative, slight,

Speaker 40 sort of had a bit of the bright heels about him,

Speaker 40 the way that he looks. And yet, I absolutely loved these performance.
I love both teams, but Turkey did deserve to win.

Speaker 40 And, you know, I'm hoping that they kind of don't sort of change their style now. This is the template for what I want from them going forward.
A crazy game. 36 shots in the match.

Speaker 40 Yeah, long may it continue from Turkey's point of view.

Speaker 51 Yeah.

Speaker 43 Sort of the turkey that we've been expecting to see for about 20 years.

Speaker 26 Every tournament we go, this is the turkey we'll get.

Speaker 50 Yeah, he's only 19, Ardegura. So I'm looking forward to Dan Snow's tweet of, you know, people who've done amazing things by 19 and perhaps Barry.

Speaker 46 We don't need to know what Barry was doing at 19 when we learned what he was doing at 20 yesterday.

Speaker 16 And like the first goal as well, Jonathan, you're right.

Speaker 19 Merton Mulder, that is such a brilliant finish, isn't it?

Speaker 42 Yeah, I mean, it was for me the best goal of the tournament until Goulez strike. I think Goulez maybe just edges it for me.

Speaker 42 But yeah, the technical quality of it, and I know it's a bit kind of obvious when you say it, but the level of like international football is just so high in terms of the ability of every player.

Speaker 42 Even the players who maybe aren't amazing, teams like Georgia, Turkey, that you might think, well, they're not going to be in it to win it.

Speaker 42 But you see the technical ability of even like a right back to just boot it like that, top, you know, top bins. It was a brilliant goal,

Speaker 42 really well-executed strike.

Speaker 42 I think Turkey, it's a bit like what Mark said just now, in the sense of, and you said it as well, Max, you always have, there's always an expectation around Turkey of like, oh, they might be a dark horse or they might have a next messy type thing.

Speaker 42 And I've heard it so many times with Turkey, so you're always a bit wary about what to expect with them.

Speaker 42 This was the first time where I sort of genuinely watched them and thought that they do have those kind of top young talents in the forward areas that they had up front.

Speaker 42 Either side of obviously the striker, Yomaz Ovi Guler and Yildis.

Speaker 42 Both of them were really like technical and really sort of exciting to watch dynamic.

Speaker 42 You know, usually with Turkey, you expect kind of a sort of an experience, maybe slightly less entertaining, bit more turgid kind of style of play.

Speaker 46 Just lots of soyonchus.

Speaker 50 That's what I'm expecting.

Speaker 33 Yeah.

Speaker 42 Very committed, but not exactly filled with flair.

Speaker 42 Whereas this team, it's got flair in abundance i mean as mark said cadioglu i thought was outstanding at left back muldo with the gold from right back brilliant strike chalanoglu as well just spraying passes and and that experience he brought i mean i i really enjoyed there was one moment i'm not sure if anyone caught it where they won a free kick and goulet just sort of went to Chalanoglu's as if to sort of he sort of gestured to him to say, can I take it?

Speaker 42 And Chalanoglu just sort of shook his head just dismissively, like no chance, you know.

Speaker 42 And Goulet's goal actually came after that and made me think, you know, he thought, all right, I'm I'm going to hit this one.

Speaker 42 And there was a little bit of an interesting dynamic there because Goulet is obviously the big talent at Real Madrid and kind of the next big thing, whereas Chananoglu is the sort of main man and captain.

Speaker 42 So there was that interesting dynamic between those two players, but both of them are exceptional players. So it was

Speaker 42 a really entertaining and sort of dynamic, energetic turkey side, which I haven't really seen that much in

Speaker 42 previous tournaments where people tend to sort of maybe name on the dark horse. So they finally sort of lived up to their billing a little bit, which was exciting to see.

Speaker 42 It's only game one, of course, but yeah, really good performance from them.

Speaker 50 There was a moment where I think it was just for half-time when a Turkey player, I forget who it was, just the ball just came out to him.

Speaker 39 I reckon he was just in the centre circle, I'm not sure, and he just went and waited a strike.

Speaker 40 That was Cadiolu, that was, yeah.

Speaker 42 Was it gonna, yeah, and I was just like, this is it, it's it's 5:40 on a Tuesday afternoon, you know, in June.

Speaker 39 This is exactly what I want from the European Championships.

Speaker 51 Like that moment in this ridiculous game, and actually, like the atmosphere, obviously, right, Germany is just, is, is, there's so many Turkish people who live in Germany, right?

Speaker 31 And so, and Georgia brought a lot because it's their first ever game.

Speaker 47 The atmosphere sounded absolutely amazing.

Speaker 40 Yeah, and I spoke to a friend who's in Dortmund and went to that game.

Speaker 40 So, I spoke to him this morning, and he said it was already, you know, building and and the kind you couldn't really move for just Turkish supporters absolutely everywhere.

Speaker 40 And yeah, they certainly brought a lot to the tournament. And I know it's been referenced already previously, but having a tournament in kind of a traditional football country that's very easy for

Speaker 40 a lot of these competing nations supporters to come to

Speaker 40 in stadiums that are kind of historic and

Speaker 40 football ready. And it really does add to the tournament.

Speaker 40 sort of forgotten what that feels like with the you know the russia tournament um the covid one and then also the one in qatar so i think i think that is helping a lot of the matches so far Been a lot of first half goals as well, which definitely means that teams have got to come out and play.

Speaker 40 But the fans are definitely making an impact, I think, in this tournament.

Speaker 14 And actually,

Speaker 51 I mean, there haven't been that many bad games, Jonathan, have there?

Speaker 39 I mean, I just

Speaker 48 feel like

Speaker 44 a lot of the inverted comers lesser sides...

Speaker 41 you know, like you said, they're good, right?

Speaker 51 And so even though they haven't, well, only Belgium of the big sort of favoured sides have lost, it doesn't feel like, and I mean,

Speaker 33 who's run away with the game?

Speaker 27 Germany. I don't think Spain batted Croatia, and that's actually two sides at the top table.

Speaker 48 It feels like it feels like quite a tight tournament.

Speaker 42 Yeah, it does. And in fairness, I sort of questioned, and I think a lot of people have questioned

Speaker 42 the move to sort of more teams in the tournament and the ability for third-place teams to qualify,

Speaker 42 how that affects the dynamic of the competition.

Speaker 42 I'm not a massive fan of it personally, to be honest, but I think one of the things that it does maybe give is that maybe slightly more sense of freedom because you know that even if you lose the first game you know you've still got the ability to go through with just one win i mean take for example scotland absolutely battered by germany that in a in a sort of two teams qualified tournament that you're nearly out right but now they know that kind of they're still in it essentially and georgia will feel the same you know they've lost this game but they still know one win could maybe qualify them um out of the three so it's it's maybe slightly easier to qualify but maybe that adds to the sense of adventure because teams can then know that okay it's not the end of the world if you sort of if you lose that first match, and that maybe adds a bit more jeopardy and risk to teams and players.

Speaker 42 So, I think from that point of view, you could argue that, yeah, maybe the tournament structure is giving people that feeling of more freedom, or maybe we're just in a more of an attacking era in terms of football in general and

Speaker 42 teams and managers wanting to coach attacking football.

Speaker 42 I mean, you looked at sort of Montele as Turkey, you know, obviously he was a top striker in his day and a top forward in his day, and obviously,

Speaker 42 he wants to play that enterprising style.

Speaker 42 Sanyol, slightly more defense minded um bit like his playing career of course as a defender and and georgia is slightly more conservative but the what they're really good at is that that transitions and those counters and and put when the ball breaks down getting forward is what they're really good at so i think yeah that that it's added to that kind of sense of adventure i think to the tournament but i i don't know the reasons why but those are just two maybe suggestions as to why and uh you know a hat tip of course to guram kashir who played brilliantly and is the best player at the euros and that's not just because he's the only player that we know for certain listens to Football Weekly.

Speaker 27 But look,

Speaker 14 as I'm speaking to you now, Guram, like your team did yourself and your country incredibly proud.

Speaker 50 I don't want to mean that in a patronising way.

Speaker 51 I think you can get through.

Speaker 46 I really think they could, you know, they could do something.

Speaker 9 And it was a delight to watch them.

Speaker 39 That'll do for part one.

Speaker 27 Part two, we'll do Portugal versus Chechea.

Speaker 2 Hi Pod fans of America. Max here.
Barry's here too.

Speaker 3 Hello.

Speaker 4 Football Weekly is supported by the Remarkable Paper Pro.

Speaker 5 Now if you're a regular listener to this show, you'll have heard us talk before about the Remarkable Paper Pro.

Speaker 7 We already know that Remarkable is the leader in the paper tablet category.

Speaker 11 Digital notebooks that give you everything you love about paper, but with the power of modern technology.

Speaker 13 But there's something new and exciting.

Speaker 7 The remarkable paper pro move.

Speaker 15 Remarkable, a brand name and an adjective, Max.

Speaker 18 Yeah, it's their most portable paper tablet yet.

Speaker 21 It holds all your notes, to-dos, and documents, but it's smaller than a paperback and an incredible 0.26 inches thin, so it slips easily into a bag or jacket pocket.

Speaker 23 Perfect for working professionals whose jobs take them out of the office, like maybe a football journalist, Barry.

Speaker 12 Although not like you.

Speaker 23 A proper football journalist, mate.

Speaker 22 Exactly.

Speaker 26 Too much technology draws us in and shuts the world out.

Speaker 18 This paper tablet doesn't.

Speaker 28 It'll never beat or buzz to try and grab your attention, so you can devote your focus to what or who is in front of you.

Speaker 29 It has a display that looks, feels, and even sounds like paper.

Speaker 10 Think and work like a writer, not a texter.

Speaker 20 And the battery performance is amazing.

Speaker 21 No worries about running out of power before the end of extra time.

Speaker 7 The Remarkable Paper Pro Move can keep going for up to two weeks.

Speaker 26 And if you do need to recharge, you can go from naught to 90% in less than 45 minutes, Barry.

Speaker 16 Fantastic.

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Speaker 32 If it's not what you're looking for, get your money back.

Speaker 6 Visit remarkable.com to learn more and get your paper tablet today.

Speaker 36 Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly.

Speaker 43 Let's bring in Johnny Lou, who has just

Speaker 26 presumably Johnny, one of those annoying games where it all happened right at the end.

Speaker 45 And so you just had to rip up everything you'd written.

Speaker 34 You seem to have written it very quickly, considering the game only finished 10 minutes ago, and you're here talking to us.

Speaker 57 Yeah, it was, it was what they call a deadline buster.

Speaker 57 But I don't know, I've got the sense that there was going to be some late drama in this game.

Speaker 57 Just because it was kind of so tense and taut the first 40 minutes Portugal were, I mean, they were trying lots of things, but not coming off. And there was just a sense that when things clicked,

Speaker 57 they were either going to go into overdrive or they were just going to lose the plot a little bit. And as it turned out, both things happened.

Speaker 57 So, you know, sometimes a late last minute goal comes out of nowhere and you, you you know it absolutely screws you over but i don't know i just had a weird because there were so many kind of alpha males out there you just got the sense that something something alpha was going to happen yeah i don't know if neto or conseu are alpha but i did mark i mean and danny murphy to be fair to him called himself out on it because a minute before he'd gone what is the point in bringing on substitutes with five minutes to go like give them some time and then suddenly like neto whips in conseu steals in and they win the game for portugal i thought sorry i just i just say I think you might have to check this.

Speaker 57 I think Danny Murphy might be one of the most substituted players in Premier League history.

Speaker 17 Is that right?

Speaker 43 Okay, do you think he's sort of bitter about just substitutes in general? Do you think he's got that?

Speaker 35 I should message him and ask him.

Speaker 41 I'll find out. Anyway, Mark,

Speaker 35 the goal, I mean, it's the, no, don't apologise.

Speaker 38 It's the, it's, it was an important thing to bring to our Euro 2024 coverage.

Speaker 45 Um, that was the goal that won it.

Speaker 46 I mean, I don't have a question.

Speaker 40 Well, I mean, I tended to agree with the sort of UK commentary there and that, you know, Danny Murphy was right and that the substitutions did come really late.

Speaker 40 And the fact that they ended up impacting the winning goal, I still don't think actually changes the feeling that Portugal at that time could have done with some fresh legs and somebody to run in behind.

Speaker 40 Because when they took Rafael Leal off,

Speaker 40 albeit that he'd been ineffective for sort of the last 20-30 minutes of his appearance, they didn't have anybody running beyond the ball. Everything was,

Speaker 40 you know, Ronaldo wanted to come in towards to get the ball. Bernardo Silva, Bruno Fernandes were all doing kind of the same thing.

Speaker 40 And if it was going to be a goal, it was going to be a cross-in to Ronaldo. But they didn't look like they had kind of that ability to go around the outside too often

Speaker 40 to kind of break down the checks. And you've got all these wingers that could have come on.
And in the end, it was the two that combined. And, you know, I would like to see probably more of Neto.

Speaker 40 He showed in that very sort of fleeting appearance that he definitely could make an impact off the bench. And Conseil Sao, it's a nice story for him as well because it wasn't that long ago.

Speaker 40 He was considered an absolute flop when he went to Ajax, didn't work out for him, found himself behind Anthony in the team,

Speaker 40 which he'll probably be wound up about. But then, even when Anthony left, it was Kudos in front of him on that right-hand side.
So, he had to go back to Porto to prove himself.

Speaker 40 He's got himself into the Euro squad, and you saw how much it meant to him when he scored that goal and whipped off his shirt.

Speaker 56 Donnie Murphy is has joined 94th in the table of most substituted, along with Harvey Barnes, Oscar, David Dunn, Stephen Ireland, John Obi-McKellen, Stephen Peenard.

Speaker 35 Do you want the top 10, Johnny?

Speaker 57 No, I've wasted enough of your time.

Speaker 52 British.

Speaker 52 At 10, Raheem Sterling.

Speaker 35 Danny Welbeck, Aaron Lennon, Adam Lalana, Song Hyun Min, Sergio Aguero, Juan Mata, David Silver, Willian, and Theo Walcott.

Speaker 47 I mean, you're right.

Speaker 45 Maybe it's a waste of time, but I found that quite interesting.

Speaker 43 I mean, actually, more interesting than sort of the first 60 minutes of this game, Jonathan.

Speaker 39 And it came to live, I thought, when Chechias scored. And

Speaker 39 even though they didn't deserve it, I really felt gutted for them by the end.

Speaker 57 Yeah, I mean, it really was a great defensive display by them because I thought, you know,

Speaker 57 it is, but people joke about this, but I did really think the first 45 minutes were quite tactically intriguing.

Speaker 57 I mean, if you looked at the way, you know, Portugal was sort of shifting around and what Cancello was doing and what Bernardo Silva was doing and the way they were all basically trying not to get in Ronaldo's way while doing you know artistic things you know and basically hoping that Ronaldo would notice uh I thought that was quite interesting but it wasn't it wasn't obviously wasn't going anywhere they weren't producing anything apart from crosses there were a couple of night you know nice little flicks and and flourishes and some half chances and some good saves um but i you know i thought you know checkia i think check republic guardian house style is still check republic is that right i i i only discovered that tonight but they they defended really well uh i thought i thought um cray Chief was really good.

Speaker 57 The defender was off to, I think he's off to Tirona in the summer. And Stanek made some good saves.

Speaker 57 And I thought basically they didn't quite have the game under control, but I think they deserved a point. And obviously, what happens is they get up the field.
I think it's a goal pick, basically.

Speaker 57 And then there's a cross from the right. And Portugal are very slow to react.
And

Speaker 57 I kind of wrote about this in my report. This was basically right after Ronaldo had had his free kick and

Speaker 57 you know he'd sort of g'd up the crowd and basically the whole the whole thing was turned the whole occasion was turning a shade of ronaldo and i think what that does to the rest of the the portugal players is they subconsciously take up slightly more peripheral roles they you know they kind of lose their focus a little and they were they were just so slow to um to react to to that that second ball and and i you know a great great finish by uh provod i think it was um with curling shot and yeah they looked they looked good for it to be honest um i mean obviously you know they knew they were gonna have to settle in for 20, 25 minutes of

Speaker 57 pretty rearguard stuff. And Portugal, obviously, Martin has kind of rotated and used his subs and tried to freshen things up.

Speaker 57 But yeah, harshen them. I mean, I think we knew that they were quite a limited side, you know, that they've got a new coach and they haven't really had time to...

Speaker 57 to drill anything, you know, beyond just kind of sit back and try and nick one. But what they did, they did pretty well, I thought.

Speaker 51 Jonathan Faduba,

Speaker 43 it was interesting what Johnny said about Ronaldo there and sort of how it impacts on the rest of the Portugal side.

Speaker 41 And perhaps that's okay when Ronaldo is brilliant.

Speaker 39 But when he's a bit older and he isn't brilliant,

Speaker 43 that is a problem for Portugal, isn't it?

Speaker 55 If he's going to start.

Speaker 42 Possibly. I mean, I didn't think Ronaldo was the problem in this game necessarily for Portugal.

Speaker 42 I think there was a few other maybe tactical things, maybe like the three centre-backs is a question mark maybe going forward. Martinez, the way he styled it.

Speaker 42 I mean, watching the game, I had this sort of weird feeling like I was watching Premier League years for the past maybe 10 years or so, because there was part of the game was like Arsenal Norwich, you know, in late Wenga era, sort of Arsenal Norwich, where they passed it around a lot and it's very nice, but can't break through that low block, you know, and the deep defense.

Speaker 42 Then you had a sort of like Salt Star era United where... Portugal got the goal and Bruno Fernandes is screaming to the crowd and it's like everything of the day has been saved.

Speaker 42 Then there was like the sort of Jotter, I don't know, cat that that had a bit of a sort of a liverpool west hand feel about it something like that so there was a it was a quite a strange sort of uh and roberto martinez is sitting there the whole time right he's an absolute classic premier league just had a familiar feel to the game in a way that sort of seen these moments before but um i i felt as if martinez as you mentioned there max is is the interesting part of this this portugal side and i think the team that he picked today was quite different to how he sort of looked at things in the friendlies and that kind of thing and in qualifying.

Speaker 42 So I'm not quite sure he's got his balance right yet in the team. I felt that

Speaker 42 by that nature, that meant them getting the win is really important because I feel as if I hadn't got that win, I think there'd have been some criticism for him.

Speaker 42 So I think that's maybe bought him a few days extra kind of peace maybe from the Portuguese supporters and the scrutiny.

Speaker 42 But I think they did give me that kind of Martinez Belgian feel about them as well. A little bit kind of very nice and attacking.

Speaker 42 very open at the back,

Speaker 42 transition really quite easy to play against. And this is against Czech Republic, who are not a team who have a huge amount of threat going forward, let's be honest.

Speaker 42 I think one shot on target, perhaps, which was the goal.

Speaker 42 So, yeah, there were sort of reasons to be positive, but I wasn't really that convinced by Portugal if I'm being honest based on what I've seen.

Speaker 41 Mark, I appreciate by asking you a question about Ronaldo.

Speaker 14 I'm continuing to talk about Ronaldo, but I couldn't help feeling that just the coverage.

Speaker 55 You know, there are other players on the pitch.

Speaker 13 The social media you're looking at is just every, and it's a sort of cynical ploy by anyone going, well, if you we tweet about him, lots of people will retweet it.

Speaker 41 But people don't ask Bollock on about this bloke.

Speaker 39 It's just in mind-numbing.

Speaker 40 No, you want me to as well, Max. Yes.
Yeah.

Speaker 40 So I think one of the most frustrating bits of the coverage, and it would have gone sort of all around the world, was there was actually a gold kick at one stage that was missed because

Speaker 40 the TV producer decided to just focus on Ronaldo, sort of staring blankly, waiting for said goal kick to kind of come anywhere near him.

Speaker 40 And there is is that frustration and i i what um johnny was saying earlier on about sort of the players um feeling intimidated by ronaldo there was one moment when bernardo silva was looked like it was easier to shoot than it was to pass and yet he looked up saw ronaldo out of the corner of his eye and felt like he was obliged to um to put the cross in i think that's why i I like Jotter because when he plays for Liverpool, he doesn't kind of feel like he doesn't feel like he has to pass to Salah, for instance.

Speaker 40 He would just just take a shot himself. And I'd like to see more of Jotta as well, I think, in this Portugal team.

Speaker 40 It was a disjointed sort of Portuguese performance because Liao was playing very wide on one side, but then there wasn't really anything going down the right-hand side.

Speaker 40 But they still, I mean, they dominated the game. I mean, I felt like they, although I know the goals came late, but I mean, it was eight shots to one on target.

Speaker 40 And I feel like, in terms of those transitions, Jael Paulinha will probably come into the team when they feel like they're playing against a team where they may be more vulnerable and that might just give them sort of the solidity and I would be interested to see what Portugal are like against the other two teams in this group if they play like they did

Speaker 40 you know in the early game because there should be more space for Portugal potentially to exploit. I don't think it's easy to play against a team that packs out the defence the way the Czechs did.

Speaker 46 James says, how wet and miserable did shit look coming off?

Speaker 57 You may not have seen that, Johnny, but god it was wet out there wasn't it god yeah i mean it was it was sort of fine in the evening a little bit of drizzle kick off and then yeah second half it just it takes on this this biblical quality look i mean just just to you know

Speaker 57 more on ronaldo but you know to just add a little bit on that the players his teammates clearly like him you know they clearly revere him and i don't think that's necessarily a bad thing they want him in in the side they certainly want him around the place uh and as we saw with messi at the world cup that can have a galvanizing effect from the you know the very youngest generation of the side all the way through to the players who've been playing with him for 10 years.

Speaker 57 They feel a kind of you know, not so much a debt, but a responsibility. They want to do this for him.
Um, and I think that's fine.

Speaker 57 There are times when you wish they'd try and do it for themselves a bit more. There is so, so much talent in that squad, and you know, they need the confidence.

Speaker 57 I think those players need the confidence to try things for themselves to take on three men or to you know to make the run to the near post.

Speaker 33 Um, I think you know, Portugal will nil will need ronaldo uh at some point during the tournament but i i just uh you know there is there is very clearly an imbalance there and i it's interesting to see how martinez kind of deals with that as the tournament goes on uh johnny thanks mate thanks for coming on cheers good stuff johnny lou there uh out there uh in germany uh let's look ahead to the games tomorrow then scotland switzerland um you mentioned it jonathan like they've still got a chance but you know this is this is absolutely must-win territory now and like they have to turn up right because they just didn't okay germany are good but they didn't perform as well as we know they can last time out yeah i kind of agree and disagree there max i mean you you say it's the last it's must-win territory but it's it's not because they could draw and win the final game against hungary no good point it's must not lose it's must not lose territory i don't think it's as dramatic as that but i i definitely take your point in the sense of i think it's a must perform better than they did against germany performance if that makes sense because

Speaker 42 yeah though it can't get much worse really in the way they approached it and i think that that's probably what adds to the sense of urgency that you mentioned there is that feeling that

Speaker 42 it's like a really miserable feeling, isn't it? I saw, I think, on one of the tournament reports that they do on, you know, sort of ITV, BBC, and

Speaker 42 there was just a mood of like complete gloom and depression, really, around the Scotland camp, which is, you know,

Speaker 42 you can lose games. You can imagine Georgia have lost, but they're not going to go into the game.
probably in such a miserable frame of mind as Scotland might approach this game.

Speaker 42 So that does add to the urgency that you mentioned there, Max. I think Switzerland showed in their first game that they have some ability, but I don't think they're like an unbeatable side.

Speaker 42 They do have some weaknesses there. And so I think it's a game that Scotland can win, but the morale is so low at the moment that it feels, I think some defeats feel worse than others in the sense.

Speaker 42 And that Germany beating really probably would have sapped a lot of life out of them. Hopefully that could motivate them, but

Speaker 42 I worry about it. But I still feel as if the Hungary game is going to be the key one, really.
I think this is more about for Scotland.

Speaker 42 This is going to be more about putting in a performance to give them a platform to go into that Hungary game and really sort of take that game to the Hungarians and try and get a win.

Speaker 42 Because I think then they can make themselves clear and go through.

Speaker 42 Even if they win this game, Max, for example, against Switzerland, I still feel that there'd be a little bit of pressure in that Hungary game if that kind of makes sense. So, yeah.

Speaker 50 So, you're saying don't win this one because that's too risky to win this one and put the pressure on it.

Speaker 42 I'm saying play a lot better, play a lot better, but it's not the end of the world as long as you don't lose 5-1.

Speaker 41 How do they do that, Mark?

Speaker 39 Do they just, you know, because like individually, their big players didn't show up.

Speaker 40 Yeah, I think that there are clearly some players in that Scotland team that are of a lower standard, and that's been brought up already. And some of those looked outclassed against Germany.

Speaker 40 But I think it's about the ones that actually are good enough to play at that level. I know John McGimm was very hard on his own performance, and probably rightly so.

Speaker 40 McTominay plays for Manchester United. McGregor, whether they bring in Billy Gilmore, but these are players that are, you know, good players that are definitely capable of so much better.

Speaker 40 And even though they're not as good as Tony Crowes and Gundoran and all what Germany had to offer, they're better than what they showed on Friday night.

Speaker 40 And too many of their players just seem to forget about playing football. And the occasion just completely overwhelmed them.
And they lacked energy and they lacked quality. And that needs to change.

Speaker 40 I think sort of the Scottish fans are a very forgiving bunch, actually. I think they should demand more of their football team.

Speaker 40 If you have a look at sort of some of the other kind of home nations, they've all had a tournament where they can sort of go home and remember and talk about it for 20, 30 years.

Speaker 40 And Scotland haven't had that. And they've had brilliant footballers in that time.
They've had great managers and they've not been able to put it together in one sort of tournament.

Speaker 40 They normally sort of have one moment, or maybe it's one game, but they haven't been able to put it together for an entire group stage. So I think they owe the supporters actually a performance.

Speaker 40 I think they owe themselves a performance because it was humiliation really against Germany.

Speaker 40 So I agree totally that this is must not lose because if you actually have a look at sort of since Euros went to 24 teams, the draws statistically goes up a lot in the second round of group stage games.

Speaker 40 And I think that that is completely expected because for some teams that have got their win, a draw in Jafru, if you've lost that first game, it becomes must not lose the second one because at worst case scenario, you've got an opportunity in that last match to um it almost turns it into like a last 32 game rather than um sort of last 16 so i think that's the the aim for scotland don't lose and then you turn that hungry game into a knockout tie um no matter what happens and i think from switzerland's point of view they've already got three points on the board i don't think it draws a bad result for them either so um i'm not saying that it'll be one of those kind of mutually beneficial ones where after an hour that they what was it the battle of girona or something or he yeah

Speaker 40 or even there was one game i watched in league two uh this season colchester against crew yeah that's on the where the last couple of minutes five minutes were ridiculous weren't they they they were so i mean i don't think we'll get to that stage early on but from scotland's point of view be sensible play to your strengths and just play better germany hungry expecting more of the same from germany jonathan yeah i think so they

Speaker 42 They they looked really, really good against Scotland. And I think that's probably one of the things that Scotland can look positively about.
They're not going to play against against Tony Cruz

Speaker 42 for a while at least in this tournament. The level is going to be lower that they're facing from Scotland's point of view.
But for Germany they just looked magnificent.

Speaker 42 More will be expected of Mussiala and Wurtz obviously. Havertz I thought had a really impressive match as well in the way he sort of dovetailed between the two of those players, those tens.

Speaker 42 Cruise and Gunding, I thought were phenomenal in the way they controlled the match really and I'd expect more from them. I think Hungary, I can't,

Speaker 42 they're sort of quite a sort of tidy team, but I struggle to see how they're going to contain all the threats that Germany have to offer, especially on home soil.

Speaker 42 So yeah, I'm expecting a Germany win really, and I think they'll take the group fairly comfortably.

Speaker 42 And it just remains to be seen what Hungary's approach will be. Will they sort of think to themselves,

Speaker 42 let's try and go all out for this match, or will they sort of maybe

Speaker 42 save themselves for that Scotland game? That's what I think they may try and do. So yeah, I think it's going to be an entertaining game, but I would fully expect Germany to get the job done.

Speaker 50 And Croatia, Albania, Mark,

Speaker 33 we're in must-not-lose territory for Croatia.

Speaker 40 Yeah, I think I suppose because they've got that game against Italy last, they will see this game against Albania as right,

Speaker 40 we have to win this one, get the three points. The goal difference took a battering against Spain.
I felt unfairly.

Speaker 40 I didn't see the three goals between the two teams, but a good opportunity, I think, for Croatia.

Speaker 40 albania got a real big helping hand didn't they in that first minute against italy and i i thought they were i'm going to be patronizing i thought they were plucky and and kind of stayed in the game but until that chance right at the very end like Italy were cruising through most of that game.

Speaker 40 And so if Croatia don't sort of throw the ball to an opposition forward player in the first minute and do take their chances, which they didn't against Spain, I still think there's enough time for Croatia to recover in this group and make it through as a best third-place team.

Speaker 40 But to do that, they have to win. Pressure on, you know, Modric didn't have a great game against Spain.
So I would be expecting better of him and his fellow midfielders.

Speaker 40 But yeah, I think this is a good opportunity for Croatia to win against an Albanian side that I felt was flattered by that 2-1 against Italy.

Speaker 46 The disgrace of Hejon was when West Germany beat Austria 1-0, which was a result that meant both of them went through and Algeria went out of the 82 World Cup.

Speaker 50 We haven't mentioned the Germany fan who missed their game against Scotland on Friday after his left hand was broken by a wayward shot from Germany striker Nicholas Fulkrug during the warm-up.

Speaker 20 Can you imagine of all the players you wouldn't want to be on the end of?

Speaker 46 You know, when you're just sort of looking around chatting to a mate and then a Fulkrug, like just absolutely, that would be zero revs per second, wouldn't it?

Speaker 17 Going straight into your wrist and breaking it.

Speaker 8 Well, I hope you're all right.

Speaker 33 And exciting news for you and anyone else.

Speaker 50 If you happen to, you know, that man who's broken his arm is a Football Weekly listener.

Speaker 43 From now until the 25th of June, we're offering Football Weekly listeners 50% off for the first three months of our all-access digital subscription to the Guardian as a reader-funded organization.

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Speaker 51 And that'll do uh for you two because uh me and barry interviewed sakir starmer yesterday and we'll do that interview in part three but uh for the time being cheers mark thanks max thanks jonathan thank you max part three is next

Speaker 6 hi pod fans of america max here barry's here too hello football weekly is supported by the remarkable paper pro now if you're a regular listener to this show you'll have heard us talk before about the remarkable paper pro we already know that remarkable's the leader in the paper tablet category digital notebooks that give you everything everything you love about paper, but with the power of modern technology.

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Speaker 36 Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly.

Speaker 50 This is an interview that Barry and I did with Sakir Starma at half-time during the Belgium-Slovakia game.

Speaker 46 It got Barry out of a minute-by-minute, it got me out doing bath time.

Speaker 13 They approached us and said we could have 10 minutes, and we thought it was a good idea since if Labour do win the general election, he could have quite a big impact on the future of football.

Speaker 49 The reaction to the fact we're doing this has been mixed. This is an interview.
It is not an endorsement.

Speaker 19 You can support whoever you want to support in the general election.

Speaker 50 The offer is open as well to Rishi Sunak, Ed Davey, Nigel Farage, and everyone else.

Speaker 19 If they want to come on the pod, we would gladly have them.

Speaker 50 Here is our interview with Sir Keir Starmer.

Speaker 36 Sir Keir Starmer, welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly.

Speaker 19 How are you doing?

Speaker 58 Very good. Thank you for having me on.
We are

Speaker 58 deep in the election campaign, going from place to place. But everywhere I go, I'm trying to go to another football ground on the way.
So we're at Bristol Rovers today.

Speaker 58 We were at Crewe last week, Crewe Alexander. So really good to be here.

Speaker 13 Yeah, I'm trying to tick off the 92.

Speaker 33 I mean, you asked to come on this pod.

Speaker 5 I mean, quite a lot of our journalists don't ask to come on.

Speaker 3 Why do you want to talk to us?

Speaker 58 Oh, because I think football, firstly, football is my passion, my obsession.

Speaker 58 I still play football.

Speaker 58 I get an Arsenal season ticket holder, but also because I think there's a lot of politics in this in terms of clubs like Bristol Rovers, where we are now, and other clubs with the independent regulator, which is obviously a political issue

Speaker 58 because you've got your Premier League, which is fantastic,

Speaker 58 but also your Bristol Rovers, your other clubs, they need support to ensure that they can bring the talent through, they can have good players, they've got the infrastructure and the staff here that they need in all the different clubs.

Speaker 58 And of course, they're usually a big part of their community as well. But that will only happen if some of the politics through the football governance bill is, we get it right.

Speaker 39 And we talk a lot about the

Speaker 46 politics of football on this podcast.

Speaker 39 I've had a look at your manifesto right you you believe in the regulator right you say you want to protect football clubs across our communities and protect is quite an interesting word isn't it a lot of people don't think allowing clubs to be sold to nation states with terrible human rights records is protecting them i mean do you think that is protecting them do you think nation states should be able to own football clubs well i don't think any

Speaker 58 government and certainly not an incoming labor government will want to put off um investment um foreign investment into um our businesses into our football i do think think that the independent regulator will have a big role in who is actually suitable to run a club.

Speaker 58 Lots of issues about transparency and accountability. But of course, there's also vitally important the matter of the pyramid of structured payments and support from the Premier League down.

Speaker 58 So we've got in the Premier League the best league in the world. We saw a bit of that on show yesterday in the England game.

Speaker 58 But we also need to make sure that the money is there there for the lower league clubs to make sure they've got the sport they need. So it is a really important governance bill.

Speaker 59 As things stand, the regulator will be sort of hamstrung by a clause that forces them to acknowledge and take into account the government trade and foreign policy objectives when making decisions on the suitability of new owners.

Speaker 59 So surely you as Labour leader would remove this clause and allow the regulator to decide what is best for the game?

Speaker 58 Yeah, I mean, we do need, it was a government bill, it was a, and obviously it didn't get through, and therefore, uh, we want to get it through as quickly as possible.

Speaker 58 But I do want to just have a review of the bill itself because we put down a number of amendments to improve it, but obviously we didn't get that far. So there's a bit of work to be done on it.

Speaker 58 But I don't want to hold things up because, you know, it's very important that we don't have a breakaway super league out of the Premier League and the governance bill will help in relation to the powers there.

Speaker 58 It is very important that deal goes through in terms of the money structures. And we put in place the governance we need about ownership of clubs because, you know,

Speaker 58 there's obviously the question of sort of foreign direct investment, but there is also, you know, your stories of your Wigans, your Berrys, your other clubs that have reading, you know, clubs that have struggled and desperately need some of that governance in place.

Speaker 39 But you wouldn't do anything to stop.

Speaker 50 I mean, nation states already own clubs, right?

Speaker 45 So it's quite hard to say now you can't do it anymore. But I think a lot of fans.

Speaker 58 Yeah, we're not going down that road. We don't want to put off investment into football, but we do need more transparency and accountability.
And that will come through the regulator.

Speaker 58 We also do need to make sure there isn't a breakaway super league because

Speaker 58 that will be devastating for football in the UK.

Speaker 45 There were so many journalists who wanted to write and expose about Abramovich and his links to Vladimir Putin, right?

Speaker 37 But they couldn't because of this thing called slaps, which you will know more about than I do, which is, you know, legal threats to basically intimidate.

Speaker 46 and exhaust journalists and campaigners.

Speaker 33 Would you make more legislation to stop those?

Speaker 39 I mean, that's not just football, right?

Speaker 31 That is just sort of rich people avoiding justice.

Speaker 58 Yeah, absolutely. We do need to address that.
I mean, not just in football, as you say, in other areas, we've seen these slap injunctions and cases that inhibit the ability of people to criticize.

Speaker 58 So, you know, we do need to look at that.

Speaker 58 But I mean, I also should say, you know, the single most important thing, if we get it over the line to form a government, will be growing the economy, making sure we're creating wealth and that living standards go up.

Speaker 58 So we will also, at the same time, have to make sure that we've got an intense focus on the most pressing issues of the day.

Speaker 50 legal mind is considerably better than mine and Barry's.

Speaker 13 Do you think Manchester City's legal case against the Premier League is a kind of obstruction of justice of the type that I was just talking about.

Speaker 58 Well, look, the honest answer to that is: I have, I mean, I know what the charge, I know broadly what the charges are

Speaker 58 and how the system works, but I haven't looked at the details of it.

Speaker 58 I mean, as an Arsenal fan, I think I would be seen as someone who had an interest

Speaker 58 if I expressed too much on it. But, you know, the system's got to work.
We'll see what happens. But I think they've hired David Paddock Casey, who's going to do a big job for them there.

Speaker 54 Sakira, do you think what

Speaker 60 is too expensive these days?

Speaker 59 Are ordinary fans being priced out of the game in favour of, say, football tourists who come in and pay over the odds for tickets and go to a game and then fly out again?

Speaker 58 Yeah, I do think it's too expensive, particularly at the upper end. And I'd link that, by the way, to some of the late kickoffs.

Speaker 58 If you've got, for example, an eight o'clock kickoff on a Saturday, then the away fans, in all likelihood, have got to pay to get to the ground, they've got to pay quite a lot of money then to get into the ground.

Speaker 58 And then if the game finishes at 10 o'clock at night and it's the other end of the country, in all likelihood, they're also then having to pay for overnight accommodation.

Speaker 58 It becomes a very expensive package. And I do, you know, one of the things that will happen, obviously, is or envisaged is that the review into pricing and into start times for games as well.

Speaker 58 I'd actually put the two together.

Speaker 46 Right. Would you stop them then?

Speaker 50 I mean, I mean, you're not the regulator.

Speaker 45 The idea is the regulator is independent from government, but like, would you want the regulator to stop 8 p.m. kickoffs, for example, for so, so away fans could get home soon?

Speaker 58 Yeah, I want to, I want to see the regulator look at that and review it.

Speaker 58 And obviously, you know, I don't think it's that sensible for politicians to sort of wade in on things like what time should a football pit game kick off. But I mean, I go regularly.

Speaker 58 I mean, a season ticket holder at Arsenal. I go a lot to football.

Speaker 58 And I know what it feels like for away fans on a Saturday night coming out of the ground at 10, 10.30 at night and inevitably having to stay over.

Speaker 58 And if it's somewhere in a big city, London or Manchester or wherever, that's not cheap. I don't think politicians should wade in and say all games have got to kick off at X o'clock.

Speaker 58 But I do want a review of this because it is, you know, the pricing of it is pricing out a lot of people from actually being able to go to football in the way that they would have done in the past.

Speaker 46 Yeah, your manifesto says you want to put fans front and centre.

Speaker 46 Like, how much power do you think fans should have on who should own their football club, on the colour of their shirt, et cetera, et cetera?

Speaker 58 Oh, I think in the bill at the moment, there's not a big enough role for fans to be consulted and therefore what we do want to do is to improve the rights of consultation of fans.

Speaker 58 And look what are fans most concerned about?

Speaker 58 They're concerned about the name of the club, they're concerned about the colour of the shirt, they're concerned about the place where the football is played.

Speaker 58 These are real, I mean there are other things, but predominantly they are the issues that I think to most fans would be uppermost in their mind.

Speaker 58 And we want to make sure there's genuine consultation on that with the regulator. I should also add players and staff, by the way, who I don't think have enough of a role under the current provisions.

Speaker 46 You watch the England game last night? Were you screaming for Gareth to take the handbrake off?

Speaker 58 Yeah, I mean, look, the first thing I'd say is,

Speaker 58 I don't know how many times I've watched England in an open game of a tournament either lose or draw a game that we should have won. So the positive first, we're top of the group.
We did win it.

Speaker 58 It was a great header by Duke Bellingham and great provision by Sacco. I thought had a very good first half.
But we are going to play stronger opposition than that.

Speaker 46 So you're saying Southgate out. Are you saying Southgate?

Speaker 54 No, no, no, no.

Speaker 58 I'm a big Southgate fan. Look, we're top of the league.
We're top of the group.

Speaker 54 I'm never going to say that.

Speaker 58 And he's built a great squad. But

Speaker 58 basically, what I thought we would do was to go on from having scored that opening goal. to sort of make it a bit more comfortable.
And we didn't manage to get into that.

Speaker 58 But look, as I say, normally after the first game,

Speaker 58 an opener by England, we're all tearing our hair out as to why we didn't win the game.

Speaker 58 Usually they're not doing much better than the second game, and then desperately hoping that the third game of the group goes well so we can get through.

Speaker 58 We're off to a really good start in terms of top of the group, points actually on the scoreboard, and a great header, actually. I mean, it's a great cross, great header.

Speaker 58 At the moment he went for it, you could see it was going in the back of the net, and so that was really good.

Speaker 45 Um, well, look, I know you're quite busy, it's probably like spinal tap, you've no idea who you're talking to next.

Speaker 50 I'm I've done five pods for the Euros, and I'm exhausted, so I don't know how you're not absolutely knackered.

Speaker 45 You probably are, but you can't say you are.

Speaker 46 But look, thanks for your time.

Speaker 27 We really appreciate it.

Speaker 58 See you soon. Thanks.

Speaker 36 That was our chat with Zakir Starmer.

Speaker 39 But that'll do for today.

Speaker 33 I have no one to thank but myself.

Speaker 20 Thank you, Max. That's okay.

Speaker 46 I thought you were marvelous. We'll be back tomorrow.
Football Weekly is produced by Joel Grove. Our executive producer is Danielle Stevens.

Speaker 52 This is The Guardian.