The Premier League’s race for Europe and Celtic’s title – Football Weekly Extra podcast

This is The Guardian.

Day Scratchers from the California Lottery.

Play is everything.

Those games sent the team's energy through the roof.

Are you saying it was the off-field play that made the difference on the field?

Hey, a little play makes your day, and today, it made the game.

That's all for now.

Coach, one more question.

Play the new Los Angeles Chargers, San Francisco 49ers, and Los Angeles Rams Scratchers from the California Lottery.

A little play can make your day.

Please play responsibly.

Must be 18 years or older to purchase, play, or claim.

Want to stop engine problems before they start?

Pick up a can of C-Foam Motor Treatment.

C-Foam helps engines start easier, run smoother, and last longer.

Trusted by millions every day, C-Foam is safe and easy to use in any engine.

Just pour it in your fuel tank.

Make the proven choice with C-Boam.

Available everywhere.

Automotive products are sold.

Safe home!

Hello, and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly.

The race for sixth or even fifth is still alive.

Manchester United's win over Newcastle means that Eddie Howe's men need United to win the FA Cup, have any chance of the Europa League, while Chelsea's win at Brighton means they could still catch Spurs.

Does that mean we have to re-record a season's worth of pods for our reviews of Maurizio Pochitino's season?

At Old Trafford, Amma Diallo hit a ball so perfectly it was worthy of winning this game for sure, and perhaps some better ones.

While at the Amex, Cole Palmer, again the difference.

Anon Cuckoo, Gallagher, even Coca-Cola performing.

Could they be a force next year?

We'll talk Wolves War on VAR and Celtic winning the Scottish Premiership.

And Tarek Panja joins us from the FIFA Conference in Bangkok, where Gianni will no doubt save football once again.

All that, plus some Alessi Twins, corrections, your questions, and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

On the panel today, Nada Manuha, welcome.

Morning, sir.

Hello, John Bruin.

Morning, Max.

And good morning, Barry Glendenning.

Hey, Max.

So these games last night then, Man United, Newcastle and Brighton, Chelsea, were important for European qualification.

If Manchester City win the FA Cup, then fifth and sixth get Europa, seventh Conference League.

If Manchester United win the FA Cup, then fifth gets Europa and and sixth gets the Conference League.

Let's start at Old Trafford.

Manchester United, three, Newcastle two.

Casemiro's sixth game in a row at centre-back.

We all waited for another disaster, but he actually played quite well.

And actually, Manchester United, John, started this game really well.

Where did that come from?

You might say it was a definition of madness to play Casemiro in that position so many times over.

Yeah, it did work, didn't it?

He appears to have become the master of the last-ditch tackle,

one of which was obviously should have been a penalty, though it wasn't his foul that was the offending item.

But there was a couple of clearances off the line.

I think one of the things with playing Casimiro there is obviously Ten Hag has the faith in that Casimiro is a pure footballer, isn't he?

He's a really good footballer and he and he has a sense of where the ball is going to land.

But in previous occasions, particularly the previous game against Arsenal, where he forgot what the off-side law was,

he was lax.

Obviously, there's been some sort of coaching session that's taught him maybe you need to step up and gen up on that rule a little bit more and push up with Johnny Evans.

Johnny Evans, by the way, is four years older than Casemiro.

So,

which, you know, we've all talked about, you know, Casemiro being the old man in defence, but the guy next to him is just, you know, is older, more experienced.

And at times, you could see that Evans is trying to guide him through that.

It's an emergency situation, and it paid off last night.

Manchester United, as ever, were wobbly, but what they did show was

quite a lot of bite in midfield, perhaps a little bit too much bite from Amrabat.

I'm not convinced.

His is a loan deal, isn't it?

I'm not convinced that's going to be extended.

I'm not sure he's quite of the level, but he worked very hard.

And then you've got Scott McTominay, who played this sort of almost

withdrawn centre-forward role, but which is also leading the press.

It was a decent performance for Man United.

It was coherent.

We've not seen that too often.

I think Newcastle can be disappointed in their performance, in the fact that they did have moments in the game where they were on top, but didn't make them count enough.

They obviously, yeah, the foul on Amrabat to Anthony Gordon, yes, it was a penalty.

They should have received that.

But a good win for Manchester United, good heartening win.

And if I may add one point, Eric Ten Haag, as a public speaker,

very impressed.

I don't know if you saw his post-match speech.

It made me think that I could imagine him

in the small Dutch town he's from, dressed in some sort of ceremonial garments.

Yeah.

And him being, you know,

hear ye, hear ye, that type of guy.

If all else fails, Eric, the town crier, town crier.

Town crier.

crier.

The Dutch Town Crier.

I was just checking, Nadim, if Johnny Evans was older than you, but he isn't.

All right, all right, calm down, calm down.

Don't have to be like that.

But, you know, Casemaro is not the story of this game, but I'm just interesting to get your insight on that.

Like, have you been watching him play there thinking, hey, look, it's not as easy as everyone thought it was?

Or what have you made of that?

I think it's mixed, to be honest, because there have been times through the last, say, 10, 15 years or whatever, where midfielders have gone back there and looked very comfortable.

Not least of all when I'm thinking of Masherano just dropping back in there and just being really successful, making it look really easy.

And we have seen other people do it, not necessarily for extended spells as such, but I think as well, a lot of it depends on how your team plays.

We have seen Casemiro make mistakes, obviously, but from when, if you play for a team that has good control of games, good possession, and so on, you don't really get exposed in the same way that maybe Casemiro has to a certain extent.

And yes, some of that has been his own doing, like in the weekend against Arsenal, like to a certain extent against Palace, I think a week ago.

You know, as a defender, you to do it properly you've got to have certain attributes whether it's physical mental and so on but some people can dip back there every so often and say oh look it's easy you know what i mean this is all you need to do but then in the same breath like defenders can score goals so imagine if a defender went up scored and said to a four look this is how easy it is just do this just do this every time i can't see him staying there much longer obviously with martinez being back and i like but then it you know the as john was saying like united i thought it looked good in midfield yesterday and i also thought the return of fernandez because he doesn't miss games, it's tough to really grade his value until he's not there anymore.

And then when you look at him not being there, you see how important he is to that team because of the way that he can link the play, some of his energy getting around the field, and his organizational skills as well.

So, yeah, Casemiro, he's not a centre-back, is he?

But, you know, when you're next to Timeless Wonder that is Johnny Evans, then, yeah, I suppose you can find a way to be effective whenever you need to be.

Yeah, by all accounts, Fernandez is

the latest rumor is that he's staying.

I mean, the moment of this game, Barry, was Amadiallo's strike, which the guardian Minute by Minute described as a rip snorter.

Obviously, you would have seen him doing this week in week out for Sunderland a couple of years ago, but it's some goal.

Yeah, he was hugely impressive at Sunderland.

I'm not sure why he didn't get more game time this season.

He may have been injured.

I'm not sure, but

obviously, playing for Sunderland, playing for Manchester United, is different levels.

But yeah, it was a brilliant strike.

One of those balls that stays hit.

Just what you were saying about Fernandez there.

He did give a slightly odd interview after the game in which he seemed to suggest he thought Manchester United might not want to keep him.

And it was like, well, if they want me, then

okay.

But if they don't, I'll leave.

That was the general vibe.

I mean, I can't imagine them not wanting to keep him because, as Nadum was said,

we saw how bereft they are when he's not there.

And I do wonder when Wayne Rooney suggested that some Manchester United players were,

you know,

feigning injury because they didn't want to be associated with a losing team.

I did see some people were pointing fingers in the direction of Bruno, but I reckon that wouldn't be his style.

I think he would want to play every minute of every game.

But, yeah, I'd be astonished if

Manchester United don't want to keep him.

And, yeah,

Ahmed hasn't got many opportunities this season for whatever reason, but I do think he's a fine player.

There has been this word out there that

during Sir Dave Brailsford's detailing of

the club,

there is this idea that United are prepared to sell just about everyone apart from a couple.

One of them is Rasmus Hoyland, presumably because they think he's talented and they paid a lot of money for him.

The one's Copy Mainu.

I would have thought Diallo is going to rejoin that list.

He's going to join that list at least.

But Fernandez pushing on a bit could probably get a fee for him, that type of thing is the logic.

And I think that's possibly what Bruno's talking about.

Possibly the word's gone out there in the world of agents

that players are for sale.

But I would agree with Barry and Adam.

Fernandez isn't the problem at manchester united there are times when uh you can see why he annoys people because there's a certain petulance to his play and you can see that um he sometimes isn't afraid of telling other players where they're going wrong but when he works hard like he did last night and and plays like he did last night then he's not the problem there are there are other problem players that you would get shot of first but i suppose he's worth a bit of money and that's that's the aspect of it that that comes into it but what about marcus rashford nadam like he made his 400th appearance for Manchester United.

I mean, that is an extraordinary achievement for any footballer.

And yet, you know, there was footage before the game of some idiot in the crowd having a go at him and him sort of answering them back.

And

it just seems too easy to say, would a move be beneficial for everybody?

But would a move be beneficial for everybody?

I'm going to say no.

I think the point that John was making about, say, Fernandez being worth something, I think right now Rashford is as well.

So maybe from a business standpoint, you could make that case.

But ultimately, like, that's the club that he's been at.

And if we go back literally just a year, he's coming off one of the best seasons that he's probably had.

In fact, it was the best season he'd had to this point.

And 400 games for a club side, 400 games for Manchester United, that's a huge amount, especially for somebody that's still in their 20s.

So he's clearly not at the final stage, you know, of what he's going to be looking like as a player.

And it's just a case from, I think, from United deciding whether this is a down year for him or whether this is who he is.

And given the fact he's been there for so long, I think they should be able to sense that and understand what the future should look like.

If they believe that this is who he is,

maybe it's simple and you say you should sell him, but I don't think he'll be wanting to go anywhere because, you know, home comforts are definitely a real thing.

And then if he's playing well, you get to see the benefits like you saw a year ago.

So I think

he should be kept.

And I don't think realistically he'll be that keen to go because, you know, this is a Manchester United boy playing for Man United, knowing that he can do better, knowing that with the new ownership as such,

to quote something that's happened in my career,

when Stephen Gerard went to Rangers, he was recruiting people based on the idea that you could be the first person or the first team to win something back again after everything they've been through.

And that's for a club like Rangers.

And that's exciting to be the first to do it.

And you saw the celebrations when they did do it.

And I think for this, like, um, Enios-led football club going forward, imagine the time when they win or if they win their first Premier League title in however many years, you could be a true, true hero to one of the biggest fan bases in world football.

So I think if Rashford decides that it's best to go now,

then I think if he leaves and he gets to see that happen, I think it'll be, in my mind, a regret for him.

Did Stephen JR try and get you?

Did he get you?

And I just

got to,

but I said I'd rather go to Utah instead.

So make it that whatever you want.

What about Newcastle, Barry?

Like, it looks like they'll get Conference League.

So from Champions League last year to Conference League this year, of course, their injury that they have been beset with injuries.

They're not the only club,

but they really have been hit hard.

Where does that sort of leave Eddie?

How?

Where do you think the owners, especially, will feel about this season?

I've no idea what the owners will feel about this season.

It's been up and down for Newcastle.

You mentioned the injuries, and they're around the turn of the year,

they were really running on fumes.

They could just about feel the team.

So, for them, I think, to be in with a shout of Europe, it's not guaranteed, is it?

It's they could still not guarantee, no.

But they sh chances are they'll get in the conference if City beat United in the FA Cup final.

Well, if they get in the Conference League, that's a tournament they really should be going all out to win.

That's a start, and maybe it's the best place for them.

I mean,

if Champions League is off the table, Newcastle that is a tournament, if they are in it, they should win.

But Newcastle find themselves,

so they've got to deal with profit and sustainability rules.

They've got some really, really good players, and they've got some players who are bang average or past their prime or, you know, going to be shown the door.

So, Eddie Howe is going to have to do a lot of

buying and selling during the summer,

players will have to be moved on.

Will he be able to keep hold of Alexander Isaac?

I don't know.

He wants to, obviously, but

Isaac's been moved with a or linked with a move to Arsenal and elsewhere.

And

he would get a lot of money in a transfer fee.

Same with Bruno.

Do they want to stay?

We don't know.

Sandro Tranale presumably will be back next season.

I mean, what a disaster that's been.

Oh, God.

I think 55 million they paid AC Milan.

You know, we remember he arrived

and didn't look that keen as he was getting off the plane.

Really flattered to deceive in his first few games.

Then his form dropped off.

And I think the reason his form dropped off is because he knew he was about to get a big ban and he did seven months out.

So like an absolute disastrous signing so you'd imagine he he owes the club newcastle could go either way for them next season i think but if they do end up in the conference league that is a tournament newcastle have not won a trophy for a very long time so that is one they should be targeting obviously wilson would uh he would take sunderland's relegation for them not to win the conference league or we didn't quite go that far last week did we uh yesterday rather uh michael says should cole palmer wear warmer clothes given how cold he always seems when he scores um he scored a header and a brilliant header.

I mean is there anything he can't do, John?

How close are we to being he has to start for England or let's build a team around him levels of clamour?

He's my player of the year if this if that matters to anybody but

I do think it's a he's a throwback.

Now actually can we say Chelsea is struggling, a struggling team?

Not really, not now.

Well, mostly because of Cole Palmer, that's the point, I suppose, but because he has been

so far ahead of the rest of that team.

And so far ahead of much of the rest of the Premier League in terms of his performances.

Only Erling Haaland scored more goals.

As you say, I didn't know that he was able to head the ball like Alan Shearer, but it turns out he is.

And there's someone who a year ago, Manchester City played the final game of the season.

Pep arrested a lot of players, played Cole Palmer, and I didn't really see Cole Palmer get a kick at Bramford at all a year on he's one of the best players in the Premier League so full credit to him for taking that opportunity full credit for Chelsea for

working out that City were willing to let that player go I mean to be fair Chelsea did buy everybody so it might just be completely random but they got a good player I was talking to someone the other day and

it was something to do with an agent got wind of this and one of the one of the sporting directors at Chelsea, people who don't get much credit, by the way, and for good reason, considering some of the players, got wind of the fact that Cole Palmer wanted to go.

The move was made, and Cole Palmer ends up at Chelsea, was happy to go there, had said to Pep Guardiola he wanted to play more football.

And do you know what?

He's thrown it back in Guardiola's face by being so good.

And there are times when you look at Manchester City, the best team in football, and think actually Cole Palmer could do a job there.

You know, like with Jack Grealish being injured and, say, Doku injury, you think Paul Palmer could come and play there and do do okay.

Though would he be able to play with the free-spiritedness that he has at Chelsea that Poch has given him that responsibility.

But I think in him, and I should mention another player as well, Malagosto, he's been a good signing.

Now, so this Chelsea thing,

maybe,

maybe they did sort of know what they were doing.

It's just that if you throw so many darts at it, that and the other thing is Casado is now playing well.

Now, I was talking to Chelsea fans last night.

They were saying the reason for that is that he's no no longer playing with Enzo Fernandez.

So that's a problem.

But again, that's the problem.

If you buy so many players at one time, they aren't all going to fit together.

But to the original point, Cole Palmer, brilliant.

Can't praise him enough.

From what you know, Nadum, are there any regrets at City for letting Palmer go?

Are you talking more so from within the club or like a fan base?

What would you say?

Oh, I'd like to know what, you know, if you know that Pep is really angry, I'd love that.

I don't think they're angry because I think across the last few years, if you've seen seen players that have wanted to leave, they've tended to leave, whether you're looking like a Jesus as Inchenko types, you know, and others that have less, where maybe Ferrantor is like two, three years ago as well, going to Barcelona.

So I don't think they hold people hostage like that as such.

I think the regret could have been maybe based around the potential because they would know how good he is.

But then, you know, you now flip it over.

And say at this point in the season now, as was the case a year ago, the person that plays on that high right side, for four City is Bernardo Silva.

And he's one of their best players in that whole team, one of the most pivotal in that whole team.

We say, well, maybe he could play centrally.

All right.

Well, at the moment, you've got Phil Folden and Kevin De Bruyne.

So for as good as Cole is, and he could fit in with those people, I think in some ways he'd need to have like true opportunity.

And overall, the plays are robust enough to where he probably wasn't going to be given that.

I think given it's been such a good year for him because we're talking about the goals he scored for Chelsea, but he's also scored for City in the Super Cup final, scored for City in the

Community Shield as well.

So he was on to something and it's a great signing for Chelsea.

And obviously City will be disappointed that he's not doing that for them.

But you know, you can only pick 11 players and they're disappointed players every week, like even now at City, John Stone, Jack Grealish, these Doku, these guys aren't starters, but they're good enough to be starters.

But fair play to him, I'll hold my hands up.

I suggested the idea of giving him, of like him being my player of the season a month ago.

And people are like, oh, but Chelsea's a really struggling

all right okay but he scored 20 goals in the premier league like surely that counts for something because the when we asked the audience this like think of some of the best attacking midfielders that you can think of are some of your favorites have they ever had a season where they've scored over 20 goals in the premier league and the answer will be no so you can say oh but the penalties but the penalties okay and how about everything else as well he's he's been amazing far better than say i'd probably say 99 of people would have thought and the ones that sit in that one percent

they're probably a bit deluded, and they've probably got some bad takes out there as well.

So it's very, very impressive.

It's very, very impressive for me.

What audience was that?

Is that just in your house?

Do you just have an audience with Nathaniel?

No, this is the Guardian Football Weekly audience listening to this podcast right now.

Think of your favourites.

Because even myself, I remember Yayatore scoring 20 goals in the Premier League.

Did he?

Cole Palmer sitting on 22?

Yeah, he did.

Literally.

I remember that.

That's what I mean.

That's ridiculous.

That's ridiculous.

I know.

Rhys James was sent off, petulant, quite funny.

As producer Joel says, in his defence, the rules may have changed substantially since he was last regularly playing in the 80s or something.

Under the bus, he gold, Joel, under the bus.

Keeps him fresh for the Euros, doesn't he?

Do you think you've got the Euros?

They're quite good at right backs.

Yeah, but are they.

We don't have eight at the moment, do we?

There was a time when you could build an entire team of.

He could do eight right backs, you're right, yeah.

Yeah, you know, but sort of Max Aaron's has slipped down.

Look,

he can also play as a sort of centre-halfie thing if gareth wants to play three at the back as well can't he you know you know like the sort of the car walker thing yeah but i suppose if you if you're going to play the car walker thing you might as well play you might play car walker walker yeah that's true uh what have you made of brighton baz um nigel says why has deserve got a free pass this season brighton been quite rubbish for a long time now uh yeah he's mentioned with all the big jobs he's alan kirbishley with a goatee says nigel

what have i made of brighton that's a good question

they've been very up and down this season, haven't they?

And probably more down than up.

But I think,

like Newcastle, they have had terrible, terrible injury problems, which probably haven't been mentioned as often as Newcastle's have.

Deserve

is an interesting character.

I think he's a very good manager.

And when he arrived, quite a lot of proper football men were like, oh, who's this guy?

Pointing out that he'd failed in various places when, in fact, he hadn't.

He just moved on for whatever reason, whether it was, you know,

being poached by a bigger club or because war broke out in the country he was working in or whatnot.

We were all hugely impressed with them

last season.

And then this season,

they're playing in Europe for the very first time.

I'm sure Brighton fans who travel to various places to watch them had a great time.

That's obviously going to take its toll on league form

because it always does or invariably does for teams who don't play in Europe every season.

And I think

he has a petulance and narciness about him that doesn't do him any favours.

He's always complaining about referees.

He gets very animated on the touchline.

I read somewhere yesterday, Paul Barber, the Brighton chairman, said, you know, if the coffee machine isn't working, it'll end up out the window and on the lawn.

He's got a very fiery, Italian temper, I suppose.

And I think that doesn't do him any favours, but that's who he is.

So, you know,

if you want to take him, that's the package.

That's what you're getting.

But I think he might have talked himself out of a couple of big jobs in recent months.

And obviously, Brighton's poor results won't have helped him either.

And I was worried at one stage he might talk himself out of his own job

because he was sort of looked as if he didn't want to be at Brighton.

So I've no idea if he'll still be there at the start of the next season or not.

He might be fired or he might go somewhere else.

I don't know.

I just don't know.

We'll see.

All right, that'll do for part one.

Part two, we'll begin by congratulating Celtic for winning the Scottish Premiership.

Coach, the energy out there felt different.

What changed for the team today?

It was the new game day scratchers from the California Lottery.

Play is everything.

Those games sent the team's energy through the roof.

Are you saying it was the off-field play that made the difference on the field?

Hey, a little play makes your day, and today it made the game.

That's all for now.

Coach, one more question.

Play the new Los Angeles Chargers, San Francisco 49ers, and Los Angeles Rams Scratchers from the California Lottery.

A little play can make your day.

Please play responsibly.

Must be 18 years or older to purchase play or claim.

Sucks.

The new musical has made Tony award-winning history on Broadway.

We demand to be home.

Winner, best score.

We demand to be seen.

Winner, best book.

We demand to be quality.

It's a theatrical masterpiece that's thrilling, inspiring, dazzlingly entertaining, and unquestionably the most emotionally stirring musical this season.

Suffs.

Playing the Orpheum Theater, October 22nd through November 9th.

Tickets at BroadwaySF.com.

Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly.

Congratulations, Celtic, for winning the Scottish Premiership.

Yeah, they beat Kilmark 5-0.

They are the champions.

Jim says, can we have a voice note from the other Jim, Barca Jim?

Okay, then, here it is.

Good day, everyone.

A report from

Fitback Corner about the termination or the end of the Scottish football season last night when Celtic won the league at Rugby Park.

I know that people really won't need this because of your stunning in-depth analysis that you do on Scottish football every week.

But I thought it'd be nice just to

sum up the season.

It's actually been a proper title race in Scotland this year.

Rangers started badly, sacked Beale and they brought in Philippe Clement, and he did an excellent job.

He really steadied the ship.

He won a trophy.

And then come December, Celtic lose two games in the trot.

We even booed Santa at Celtic Park.

Such was the feeling in the camp at the time.

So really looked that in February, it certainly looked as if it was Rangers title to lose.

Much like is happening in England just now with Man City, that muscle memory kicks in.

And you know, Brendan Rogers has been over this course before, so yeah, it's been great.

You know, Brendan coming back, as you know, Max, I still hold you personally responsible for the appointment of Ange.

I still love him.

You know, Brendan, he's like a stepdad, you know, he's not my real dad.

But we got there in the end, convincingly, at Rugby Park last night, and now onward to the cup final.

So that's the Scottish season in a nutshell.

And for me, as a Celtic fan, it's been okay.

Toodle Pit.

Thank you, Jim.

Two minutes of Barcelona, and yes, apologies.

As he referenced,

we have not given Scotland as much attention as perhaps we should this season.

There's a lot of football, we can't do everything.

I'd quite like to steer everyone to

Ewan Murray's jazz bar on the Guardian website.

He's written a sort of a piece about

the Scottish season, which I would say will antagonise pretty much everyone

who supports any Scottish club who reads it.

I thought it was quite balanced and fair, but

he did refer to Rangers having quite a few serial bottlers in their squad.

Yeah, he was quite uncomplimentary.

about Brendan Rodgers as well.

Brendan Rodgers has been very spiky this season in his dealings with the media.

And

Rangers now, so they're meeting in the cup final and Rangers really need to win that.

Really need to win that.

To the title race in the Premier League, then ask Leverton Man City West Ham on Sunday.

Nadim, it's come up on quite a few podcasts that we've done that it's boring.

Man City being sort of this metronome of success is boring.

As a city man, presumably you don't, you're not bored.

Am I bored?

No, i'm suffering from success that's uh yeah no that let's let's not be

for me like

when i see them and i see the journey that they go on and you know whether it ends with success or failure is what it is but there are other teams who are involved in this and if we go back i think it's six game weeks

Everything changed when Arsenal and Liverpool lost at home on that Sunday.

That had nothing to do with City.

Nothing to do with it.

Someone might say, oh, but City won on the day before.

Well, that's football.

Like, teams play games and they win games.

But in that moment, City were third and it was out of their hands.

And they weren't going to be playing Liverpool.

They weren't going to be playing Arsenal.

So if either of those teams were able to continue the form that they'd been into that point,

then there's nothing City can do as such.

But from then, obviously points were dropped.

City won their games in hand.

And then here they are.

Obviously, Liverpool fell off as well.

But again, even like the Spurs game, the further we get away from it, people say, well, obviously they won that game.

They were always going to win it.

It's the easiest game in the world because it's against Spurs.

Like, if you watch the game, when Son is running through on goal, like the goalkeeper makes a save.

Son should, in my opinion, Son finishes that probably seven times out of 10.

But this time he didn't.

But what happens if he did?

And then there was a chance for Kulasewi as well, which Ortega saved.

There was a chance again for Son, which Ortega saved.

That game was anything but comfortable for Man City.

But because they won 2-0, be perceived as comfortable, they've done it again.

Easiest thing in the world.

They've not had to work for it.

And I think any side that wins a league title has to work a lot harder than most people perceive them to do.

So I'm not necessarily convinced that it's the easiest thing in the world and it's boring because you see the jeopardy on a week-to-week basis, as was the case for Arsenal when they played United on the weekend.

They're 1-0.

And in those last 10, 15 minutes, you're knowing that if they concede,

everything changes.

And that sort of fear and panic that exists in the second half of the season doesn't just exist for people at at the top it's it's people everywhere and i think the fans that go and watch the games they understand it but when you're not really watching the majority of minutes for any particular team then you just kind of go at fibers as opposed to reality so i'm i'm at ease now

because i trust them to do well in that last game of the season but then even historically you know 2012 they nearly bottled it against qpr didn't they and then two years ago against Aston Villa.

2-0 down.

They were 2-0 down.

So they end up winning both titles.

And people say, oh, of course they won it.

But in reality, if you watch the games, you know that there's a lot more to football than just the favourite winning easily all the time.

Yeah.

John, do you,

is the, for the neutral, is the best thing

Man City failing to beat West Ham, but then Arsenal failing to beat Everton as well?

I'm just trying to think what's the most entertaining thing for the neutral.

I suppose for the neutral, it's that the final day does become a chase of some sort.

There is jeopardy in it.

You know, you go back to the 95, 94, 95, Blackburn, Man United scenario, Man United at West Ham, Blackburn at Liverpool, that type of thing, where

to the very last minute of the season, you're wondering where it is, or of course, the 2012 featuring one of our guests here.

That's what you want from a final day.

That's what the broadcasters want.

That's not necessarily what the fans want.

A Manchester City fan is wanting this serene De Bruyne and Haaland carve two goals.

David Moyes decides to play the kids.

You know, everyone shakes hands and goes into Manchester for another celebration.

And Arsenal,

I was seeing today that they've been trimming the topiri around the ground and have readied themselves

if a party can take place.

And Arsenal just have to hope and hope and hope and hope that their players don't fall apart.

We always, this cliche, anything can happen.

Well, no, probably what will happen is that Manchester City will beat David Moyes' West Ham.

But if you have a hope as a neutral,

I'm not sure some people would call me a neutral in this.

Yeah, let's just see something happen that doesn't mean I'm just watching, oh God, I'm turning off.

I'm looking for...

I mean,

I was at the City game last week and I was trying to work out what Arsenal fans turned the TV over to when City started winning that game quite easily.

And I worked out it was Cotswold Farm on ITV.

Oh, yeah, I bet that's good.

Yeah, so I mean, like, but maybe work out if you really care about this, but you, you know, you obviously on Sunday, we hope it's good weather, so you can maybe go out, you know, relax, take in real life outside, or you can switch over the TV or, you know, hit Netflix or something.

You know, it's just

how are you going to deal with this if it's not going your way I would really like West Ham to so we've had you know the

Fabianski Areola

boo-boos in the pod this is

bin both of them and bring back Ludo McClosco

who

put in one of the most stunning goalkeeping performances I think I have ever seen for West Ham against Manchester United that day.

What year was that, John?

John Heads in His Hands, yeah.

The pay knife.

I watched that.

It was quite astonishing how good he was.

For West Hampton, Dad, nothing to play for, as far as I can remember.

And he more or less won the title for Blackburn, despite not being a Blackburn player.

Yeah, Michael Hughes X City scored for West Ham.

And the thing is,

I was at university at the time,

and I was in a room in which the entire room wants Blackburn to win the title.

And it had, it's in the old days of Sky, you know, the Sky.

Oh, yeah.

So that

would show footage of Brian McLare equalising it.

He's like, oh, yeah.

And he sat there.

And then

when West Ham scored first, the whole

play celebrates that is one of the loneliest feelings of my entire existence.

John says, if Gary O'Neill kills VAR, where should we build his statue?

Brummy, if the Premier League decides to get rid of VAR, will someone in Stockley Park get to review the decision?

Yeah, so Premier League clubs will vote at next month's annual general meeting on a proposal by Wolves to scrap VAR from the start of next season.

Wolves said after five seasons, it's time for a constructive and critical debate on its future.

Our position is that the price we're paying for a small increase in accuracy is at odds with the spirit of our game.

A Premier League spokesperson said the Premier League can confirm it'll facilitate a discussion on VAR with our clubs at the AGM next month.

The league fully supports the use of VAR and remains committed alongside the PGMOL to make continued improvements to the system for the benefit of the game and fans.

Nadam, your thoughts?

So I'm in a funny position because

obviously I was coming from Wolves and the manager is Gary O'Neill, who 10 years ago was bailing me out in the playoff final at Wembley after I made a mistake and you get sent off.

You know, would you do it?

Would you take someone down?

Yeah, he did it, hero.

But I couldn't disagree anymore with this, but more so in terms of how it's been wrapped up.

I think we've heard Wolves be critical of decisions that have gone against them this season many times.

And whether that's right or not, I don't know.

But this

is being sold as if it's to be done for the spirit of the game.

But

for me,

you can sense that it's just not that.

When you're saying, oh, the price that we pay, even though there's been an increase in accuracy, well, that means that,

well, to be fair, let me put it this way.

So when you get the chance to speak with referees, PGMOL and so on, they understand and listen to the grievances of other stakeholders within football, like the fans and so on.

And they're all constantly working to try and streamline it to where at some point they'll reach a level where it's easier for people to understand.

And some of their biggest complaints have been addressed.

They want things to be quicker, you know, whether it's the semi-automated offside.

They want to be able to explain to people what's going on.

So it's heading in that direction.

But Wolves almost feels like they're trying to say this to, I don't know, because I don't think they're going to get the 14 votes to begin with anyway.

Especially if you say, if you say, oh, yeah, it's been more accurate, but, well, if it's been more accurate, then what's the need in the butt?

Like, talk about other things.

So

I'm not sold on this at all, to be honest.

It's a bit disappointing because it feels disingenuous.

And I think

it's almost like a footballing level of populism because it says, we're trying to help you out, the fans, but their biggest issue has been with decisions that they feel have gone against them.

But they're also saying it's more accurate.

So I'm not buying a single bit of this at all, but I'm struggling to really explain myself without putting my foot in my mouth.

So could someone else please take over, please?

Before I say too much,

I was going to the word that made him use absolute correct populism.

If you go to Molyneux, I was at a game recently, they played Luton, and Richard Masters was actually at the game, chief executive of the Premier League.

At Wolves, they play Robert Plants there, who is the life president or whatever his job.

So they played Led Zeppelin Medley

at the start of the game.

And so you can see Richard Masters there, like, oh, I get treated to the full Wolves treatment.

What he didn't know was what follows that is a song about fuck VAR, right?

Because at Wolves, they hate VAR.

Like you wouldn't believe, right?

And if you walk through the corridors of Molyneux, the mutterings are VAR VA VAR oh it's rubbish this it's killing the game and

I'm not joking I mean I'm okay I'm being slightly uh

cartoon like but that's my impression I've been to Molyneux two three times this season and VAR there was one game I went to was the

uh is it uh was a goal was turned down against um

Newcastle, which was a very lengthy VAR and it should have been awarded and it was you yeah and and Gary O'Neill has led the charge against VAR as a manager manager.

When he was at Bournemouth, he did the same last season.

And he is

Gary O'Neill is popular among Worlds fans.

One of those is that

they hate VAR too.

So this is a VAR

crusading club.

Now,

I think, certainly, I think Max and Barry, I think both of we all share doubts about VAR or the implementation of it.

Is it realistic to expect the clubs to overturn it?

I think there might be some idea that again to,

if they have this meeting, they have this discussion, that they will turn and say, oh, VAR's on notice, you know, we need to see improvements, which is fair enough.

But I think getting rid of the process, once it's come in, to go back, because what VAR's biggest problem, I think, is that it's created focus on referees.

It's created focus on such and such from Greater Manchester or whatever, that referees have become more famous.

and that's not been a good development.

And if we go back and we take away VAR, that's not going to change the pressure on referees.

That is still going to be there.

And that's what VR is supposed to do, it's supposed to help them out.

I mean, I think I probably would like to get rid of it.

And then when they got rid of it, I'd just be a massive hypocrite and say we need to get exactly going into the cycle for the rest of my life wanting what we don't have.

Anyway, that'll do for part two.

Tarek Panja from the New York Times is out in Bangkok at the FIFA Congress, rather him than me.

But we'll talk to him about the things that Gianni's planning this weekend.

Coach, the energy out there felt different.

What changed for the team today?

It was the new game day scratchers from the California Lottery.

Play is everything.

Those games sent the team's energy through the roof.

Are you saying it was the off-field play that made the difference on the field?

Hey, a little play makes your day, and today it made the game.

That's all for now.

Coach, one more question.

Play the new Los Angeles Chargers, San Francisco 49ers, and Los Angeles Rams Scratchers from the California Lottery.

A little play can make your day.

Please play responsibly, must be 18 years or older to purchase play or claim.

Today, we'll attempt a feat once thought impossible, overcoming high-interest credit card debt.

It requires merely one thing, a SoFi personal loan.

With it, you could save big on interest charges by consolidating into one low-fixed-rate monthly payment.

Defy high-interest debt with a SoFi personal loan.

Visit sofi.com slash stunt to learn more.

Loans originated by SoFi Bank NA, member FDIC.

Terms and conditions apply.

NMLS 696891.

Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly.

Let's bring in Tarek Pander from the New York Times, who is in Thailand, where the annual FIFA Congress is being held.

Hey, Tarek, how are you?

Hi, good afternoon.

Good afternoon.

Do you like going to the the FIFA Congress?

I don't know if this is.

How many have you been to before?

Is this an exciting time for you?

Actually, I like wearing lanyards, so of course I enjoy coming to the FIFA Congress.

What are we expecting?

Are we expecting Jani to do a big address and tell us all how wonderful he is again?

Well, it's interesting.

This Congress is coming with the backdrop of events in Gaza,

and that's going to be one of the big issues around the Congress.

I'm not sure much will happen in terms of substance, substance, but the Palestinians will take the floor and ask for,

I guess, some type of sanction against Israel, which they have been doing actually for several years previously to this, because some of the issues they're raising aren't related to Gaza per se.

For example, the Palestinians have said there are teams

based in the

settler lands, Palestinian lands that have been taken by, they say, by Israeli settler groups who are playing in the Israeli football leagues, for example, and they say that is a breach of FIFA's rules.

The weird thing here is this isn't a question of morality or anything like this, because

this isn't the purview of football.

So, what the Palestinians have done is gone through the FIFA statutes and said, these are your rules, This is happening.

Now do something about it.

You know, behind all of this, what I've noticed is,

you know, these people are humans, but it's seen the news like everybody else.

And there is a feeling among a lot of the federations here that there should be some support towards the Palestinians.

However, when it comes to saying what should happen, I think everyone is kind of looking away at that point.

So I was going to ask, that was the question I was going to ask, is how much support do the Palestinian FA have?

I read somewhere: did six other associations, or maybe the West Asian

Federation, supported them even before they'd put their letter to FIFA?

Yeah,

which is quite rare, to be honest.

Normally, you don't need this support to take the floor at a FIFA Congress.

Every member has a right to speak.

In this case, they've got half a dozen letters of support.

And so that's quite rare in that sense.

And I was at the Asian Football Confederation annual Congress

this morning, and it was made clear that the Palestinians have the support of the AFC.

What is that?

So 45 Asian nations.

What does that mean?

It's very hard to know because

they're supportive of the Palestinians raising their questions.

They're supportive of the Palestinians'

plight here.

But what does that mean in concrete terms?

Now, I'm not sure there's much that can happen at Congress.

It's not going to be be a vote.

I don't see there's a vote and saying, right, who votes to kick this country out?

Because I don't think that can happen.

Only the FIFA board or the FIFA council has those sort of powers.

And you just get the sense there isn't a mood to do something like that.

And the Palestinians are then saying, you know,

they seem to believe that they are the victims of kind of football hypocrisy.

They're not happy with Yanni and Fantino.

I haven't been happy with him for years because obviously they're saying Russia

is a pariah nation for the invasion of Ukraine

and they have been barred from FIFA and UEFA, etc., etc.

Others would say

this situation is not exactly the same, there are degrees of complexity here, but I think they are getting sympathetic hearings, and not just from Asians.

Lisa Klavnest, who you guys know, the Norwegian FA President, she said that there is no way, under the current circumstances, she could not support whatever the Palestinians are asking for.

Now, so when Russia were banned, that wasn't a vote at a Congress.

That was just FIFA, you know, saying, you are banned.

So there wouldn't be, there's not sort of like a majority, if any country, if somebody said, I don't want this country to

stay within FIFA or be chucked out of tournaments, that isn't a kind of majority vote type thing.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

In the past, that could have happened.

But I think almost because of this issue, FIFA changed the rules, so it can't be a member vote.

But the Russia thing is also interesting, and not to bore your listeners, some of it's to do with kind of the way football is structured.

Israel plays in UEFA, which is Europe.

The Palestinians are in the Asian Football Confederation.

They can't meet.

They're not in the same leagues.

The nations aren't in the same competitions.

So why is that different to Russia and Ukraine?

They're both in UEFA.

And what happened was Ukraine couldn't play in UEFA competitions because another UEFA member was essentially invading at that point.

And also a bunch of other European nations, Poland being one,

I think Sweden, a couple of others, so we will not play against Russian teams.

So

Russia, then basically FIFA and UEFA said, this has implications on our smooth running of our competitions.

So not a moral judgment.

It's a we need our competitions to take place, so this is what we're going to do.

We're going to bar Russia almost in a force measure situation.

So FIFA didn't say

Russia you're out because you've done something

you know appalling like invading Ukraine.

It's from a legal point of view was we can't have smooth running of our competition because of this country, so you are out.

And that kind of argument maybe doesn't exist here.

But it's such a weird thing to be talking about, given, you know, as we're sitting here recording this, bombs are being dropped, and people are dying, and this conflict is sort of raging on.

Yeah, so

your presumption is that they will have the floor,

they will bring their case forward, and lots of people will say, well, we agree with you, but we don't agree with you quite that much, that kind of vibe.

Yeah, this kind of thing, because if you talk to people in the hallway, and there's something really, I've never seen this before, and this happened in the AFC Congress.

These Congresses are pretty, you know,

straightforward.

There's a speech and then we're going to vote on this, we're going to vote on that, give some awards out to someone.

Gianni and Pantino might make a speech, blah, blah, blah.

But this time they said

we're going to show a video that the Palestinian FA has sent it.

And I must say, it was quite an arresting video.

It featured

pretty much carnage in Gaza.

and kind of overlaid with data and numbers.

And then I don't know why, but

of you see all of that graphic stuff.

But then they said, you know, they had a list of people who've died related to football because this is a football event.

And this list sort of scrolled down on the screen.

And it took about a minute and a half for these, and they weren't in big type.

These are tiny, tiny type.

I couldn't read them from where I was sitting.

I was, wow, that is a lot of people.

And it was quite an arresting moment.

And I was talking to some of the members after, and they were like, that was quite something to sit through.

And look, we're all watching the news.

We have these things every day.

And I don't think it's ever going to be normal, is it?

To just having to see that stuff happening day after day.

No, not at all.

And

I think for lots of people, you know, it almost feels totally trite when you're talking about that to talk about anything else.

So for me to sort of say, oh, and what else is happening seems so sort of.

Before we move on, Max, I just mentioned that last night in Dublin Bohemians

hosted the Palestinian women's team for a game in Dalymount Park.

It was packed.

It was a real festival occasion and they raised money for

Palestinians who are suffering because of what's going on in Gaza.

I think President Michael D.

Higgins was there, loads of musicians, artists, poets, real party atmosphere.

And

yeah, compare and contrast with

Bohemians who really, their heart is really in the right place.

They're a wonderful club in Ireland.

Compare and contrast with

Robbie Keene, who's about to manage Maccabee Tel Aviv to the Israeli title.

you know but Robbie doesn't want to talk about politics uh but yeah I just thought I'd mention it anyway that great occasion in Dublin last night.

Presumably the Israeli FA are also at this Congress.

This is the other thing.

You can see the thing around the conference.

So I'm in a hotel.

This hotel I'm talking to you from basically has three confederations in it.

It's got UEFA, it's got the Asian Football Confederation, and it's got Comnobol

from South America.

So the Israelis and Palestinians are staying in the same place.

So around the Hawks,

you are seeing these groups lobbying in kind of real time,

talking to FAs.

It's just as messy and murky as kind of anything I can think of.

And to your point, Max, it's really weird then to talk about something else here.

But there was, you know, in the middle of this, I sat in the AFC Congress

and,

you know, you're just sort of shaking your head and rolling your eyes.

They had a vote, a statute change,

to get rid of term limits.

Is that across all of FIFA or just Asia?

Today, at Asia, today.

Where Asia leads, others follow.

Who knows?

So it was like FIFA and like

the other confederations, maximum of three terms of 12 years.

That feels ample, right?

Good enough.

But nope.

Easy enough.

No more term limits in Asian football.

And that's become a

bit of a theme.

At FIFA's Congress on Friday, we're going to see FIFA roll back some of its good governance reforms.

Let's not forget, maybe some of your listeners might be young.

They might not remember people being led away in handcuffs in 2015 from a five-star hotel in Zurich, which was supposed to herald a really big change for international football.

But what we've seen more and more in recent years is back to

the past when it comes to governance.

We'll see that tomorrow when FIFA has its reforms announced.

Right.

Tarek, always good to talk to you.

Thanks for coming on, pal.

Thanks.

Nice to be with you guys.

Tarek Panther there out in Bangkok.

Just time for a tiny bit of any other business and changing the subject quite dramatically.

Peter writes Steer Football Weekly.

This is a strange request, but my friend is collecting all the seven-inch vinyl singles that reached the UK top 40 in 1985.

300 or so.

He's down to the last few, and one of the many remaining is Everton's 1985 FA Cup final song.

It's called Here We Go.

Yeah, do you know how it goes?

Uh,

I could hazard a guess.

Um,

could uh, you ask your lovely listeners or Barry uh if they have a copy to get in touch.

Uh, it does make me wonder if any of your panel would admit to buying a single album that they would rather forget.

Love the show, Peter.

Um, he will accept anonymous donations.

This is a terrible record.

I reckon I know someone who probably has that.

I reckon I do as well.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah,

I'll put out a feeler.

I'd say he has it.

I'd be astonished if he doesn't have it, but I doubt he'll part with it.

Everton were very popular at my school.

Because we lived in Cheshire, it was like United's up the road, so city.

But then there were those that decided to, because Everton were good at about 84, 85.

Everton were very popular.

I remember that song, it's like E-V-E-R-T-O-N, because we are, you know, Everton and Everton forever.

Yeah, good.

It was a classic.

Andy Gray on it, of course.

Of course, yeah.

And big Nev, hopefully.

My first ever single was the Anfield rap on vinyl.

Speaking of music, Dr.

Grogonopoulos,

referring to yesterday's pod, said, I've never heard a more middle-aged back and forth than the Timberland chat, one of his stuff.

And on to the Alessi twins.

Barry writes, it'll be interesting to see how long this crucial fact stays on Jonathan Wilson's Wikipedia page.

It now says on his Wikipedia, Wilson is exactly 10 years younger than Australian actresses Gail and Gillian Blakeney, who played Caroline and Christina Alessi in Neighbours.

And David writes on the subject of the Alessi twins, Wilson made an understandable pronunciation error.

They were played by Gail and Gillian with a hard G.

This was the basis of the finest joke I've ever heard when their music video was played on Going Live, after which one of Trev and Simon said, People often ask why it's pronounced Gillian, not Gillian.

Why don't they ask why it's pronounced Gail, not Jail?

Which let's face it is where everyone involved in this music video deserves to be.

Jeb and Simon were good daddy, weren't they?

Anyway, that'll do for today's podcast.

Thank you, Nadam.

Thank you very much.

Thanks, John.

Cheers, Max.

Thank you, Barry.

Thanks.

Privileged Weekly is produced by Joel Grove.

Our executive producer is Phil Maynard.

This is The Guardian.