Episode 454: Group Fitness Reality Check: Why F45 and Barry's Bootcamp Might Be Sabotaging Your Goals

Hi, guys, it's Tony Robbins.

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All right, welcome to another edition of Fitness Friday.

I have my friend Liron.

Hello.

Hello.

Joining me, which he does on the regular.

We disbant her back and forth and we pick a fitness topic.

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Without further ado.

Without further ado.

Here we are.

Okay, Leron.

You know what I want to talk about today?

What?

The idea and group fitness overall, right?

Because, you know, the F-45s, the Orange Theory, the Berry's Bootcamp, because there is some controversy around if it's effective or not, especially when you're in like in middle age, right?

For your hormones and all sorts of different things.

The reason why I want to bring it up also is because I remember back when, not even that long ago, that was like the thing to do, right?

Everybody wanted to do Barry's bootcamp.

If you went to Barry's bootcamp, it was like the hardest workout in the world.

You feel like you're like, you're sweating.

It's like super difficult.

You feel like you've done so much.

But I actually, and you're going to hate me because I know, because Leroy actually owns a group fitness gym, which is kind of viral.

You do a lot of things, but group fitness is a big part of what you do.

Yeah, you do a lot of things, but group fitness is a big part of what you do.

I want to know, and the first question I have, have you seen an incline or a decline in popularity with group fitness?

I think an incline and I think it will continue.

Really?

Yeah.

I mean, I think it's great for the social aspect, the community aspect, but now this may be controversial, but I'm not necessarily sure that if you really want to like change your body composition and get next level fit, it's the greatest like mode of exercise.

And I'll tell you why.

I think because it's a lot of like running around aimlessly and you're not really doing heavyweight.

You're kind of doing this, you know, you're kind of just like a lot of times it goes so fast.

You're just trying to keep up.

And it's a lot of cardio at the end of the day, even when, because they're, the, the whole goal is to like make, to kill somebody basically.

And what I've had a lot of happen to me was I had a lot of injuries and I had my appetite went like through the roof after that class.

So I ended up eating double or triple the amount that I would have otherwise had if I just kind of did more of a moderate workout or just did strength training and a walk.

Go ahead.

So

I agree with both of the things you said.

One, that group fitness is good for the social aspect.

And two, that a lot of group fitness is kind of aimlessly running around like a blue ass fly, as we say in London.

What did you say?

A blue ass fly.

I don't know where it comes from.

It's a stupid, stupid phrase, but

it works.

For you, maybe, not for me.

I wouldn't get away with it, but okay.

Your accent, you can get away with anything.

And I do.

Yeah, so there is a lot of aimless running around in group fitness.

So the thing I would point out is that

the form of the group fitness is flexible, but the idea of group fitness, meaning people coming together for a shared goal, is awesome.

And the form of it can be awesome and it can be crap.

True.

Okay.

So I should have had that.

I should have made that caveat, right?

The idea of group fitness as a whole for the social aspect,

great.

Big picture.

Big picture.

And by the way, now you know, like people are now doing that, like they're kind of doing these like more fitness

running clubs.

Instead of going to meet at a bar, people are doing dates by doing by the coffee and chill.

Coffee and chill.

Coffee and chill.

Right.

And just in terms of like all those things i think for that aspect it's amazing but i'm talking about if you are somebody who has a particular fitness goal that you want to achieve i don't think it's the best mode to get there it but but if you're somebody who is who doesn't do anything and you this is now you've now part

now you're doing something you're like now you're being active it's amazing yeah two different things though altogether yeah for sure i mean there's definitely downsides um to group fitness because a lot of times you're losing quality for quantity.

So, unless you have a very skilled instructor or you're tailoring the workout with great expertise, you get something very general.

So, you get like, I don't actually know about Barry's or in theory, I don't know much to be honest.

Yeah, I don't know.

I'm not that interested in it, to be honest.

Like, I get, I have basically have the same feeling you have.

Not to hate on him, it works for a lot of people, and a lot of people love it, especially Barry's.

I know people who love Barry's.

So, it works for them, but I don't know specifically what they do.

I'll tell you what they do.

Let me tell you what Barry's boot camp does.

They make you run at an ungodly pace that is almost impossible.

And then they say, now just put an incline at 15.

And so now you're running so fast where like the fact, like if you're not going to sprain an ankle or like bust your knee in the process, you are very lucky.

And then they go back and forth between doing a lower body strength training and then going back on the treadmill or an upper body strength strength training or they have the core days.

But I, what I find is that it burns your adrenal glands, number one.

You can't be doing that every single day.

And like I said, like you're like, you're like dead at the end, and you feel good because I personally, I love that feeling.

But like I said, it was counterproductive because I was so hungry.

I was starving after doing those classes that I want, I would, like, I would eat anything and everything in sight, which then, like I said, it's counterproductive.

Counterproductive.

It's very, very common.

I've heard that many times to do with cortisol and stress.

Yes, because you're stressed.

That's exactly it.

Like, if you're doing that once in a while, it's great.

But to do that on a regular basis, and like then you feel like guilted if you're not being, if you're not able to run at like 12 miles an hour at a 15 incline because the other person is.

So I found it to be like, you know, like, I just found it like, that's what I did when I was in my 20s and my 30s.

But then like, I had to like back off a little bit from that.

But anyway, that's what, that's what it is.

A PE class, I call it.

Do you have PE class here?

You mean like phys?

Yeah, of course, but you're not doing Barry's Boot Can and like you're shot in the internet.

But this is what I'm saying: it's kind of untargeted.

There's a little bit of a

sadist kind of vibe to a lot of these group fitness.

Again, don't know specifics on this.

Okay, that's true.

It's like, just punish yourself.

And then the people get off on it.

It's this weird S and M thing, you know, where the coach is like, you.

Can I swear?

Yes, you could swear.

Yes, you know, like, I know.

Whatever.

I'm not going to now, but, like, you,

whatever it is.

Basically, the vibe, whether they say it with their words or not, is that you're like some lowly, you know, you're not good enough.

You're not good enough.

And then people get off on it.

Like, I've seen it.

There's a, there's a.

I know a lot of people go to a specific gym who really, that's the core foundation of culture.

Really?

SNM thing where the guy.

Where is it?

I'm not going to name names.

No, I'm not going to name names.

Why is it it in LA?

No, I don't know.

It's in LA.

It's kind of West Hollywood-ish,

Beverly.

And they get off on like

and there's a cult around it.

And it's just shaming somebody?

Yeah, and they love it.

And to be fair, it works while they're doing it, but long-term, it doesn't.

Tell me, I want to know where.

I'll tell you, Osprey.

I want to know.

I want everyone to know.

I'm curious.

There's no way to know.

But anyway, either way, what happens is in those classes, it's very untargeted.

It's very not a long-term thing, as you were saying, right?

It's not a healthy, long-term approach.

It works while you're doing it.

As soon as those people stop, they're usually fatter than they were, just unhealthier than they were.

They've lost muscle.

A lot of women lose periods.

And I'm talking about maybe the extreme cases because it goes with this.

It's basically like a form of sort of sport-like anorexia, bulimia.

It's all very negative.

You know what I'm saying?

Well, you know, like, I never understood.

The one that I never understood was spin classes, like soul cycle.

I never, I mean, besides the community aspect that I think that people love.

But that's huge, though, Jen.

Like that, that is, you separate the positive and the negative and you take, you don't want to throw your, the baby out with the bathwater.

So

the, the, the,

with Barry's, I've heard that the big thing, the big draw of Barry's is not the actual workout itself, it's the culture around it.

So it's like the hot people and it's like a scene and it's a sexy place and everyone feels sexy when they go there or they see other sexy people and they want to be you know what I'm saying so that is the emotional driver for people in everything

in everything and and fitness is absolutely number one for that so it's motivating people to work out so it is positive but I think it's important to to separate what people actually what's productive about it and what is not productive it could be improved for sure well this is the thing have you heard of high rocks it's like the new hottest thing I've heard of it again I don't explain what it is see to me I I like the concept of that because it's basically, I haven't done it.

I want to do it.

It's a high, well, it's kind of like, it's kind of taken over the, you know, how CrossFit was massive.

I was going to mention CrossFit and like the thing with CrossFit was

community, but people would get injured a lot.

Oh, well, that's what I'm saying.

So, so the thing about all group fitness, right?

Like when something takes off, it build it, it basically becomes, like you said, it becomes like the culture.

It becomes a, it's the socialization.

It's the building of a community, all that, right?

So so crossfit had its moment crossfit's still i'm sure popular with some people but now like high rocks is that what it's called even yeah it's it's it's having its moment big time like i see it everywhere a lot of my friends are doing it all the time people i never even thought would even actually like partake in what's it composed of fitness like that and well it's it's a it's a very much like what i like about it it's it's hardcore but involves it's kind of like rowing like look it up hold on a minute I'll show you I'm gonna tell you very specifically what it is it basically is a fitness competition that combines endurance and strength it consists of eight rounds of one kilometer runs followed by eight different function fitness stations such as sled pushes burpees broad jumps farmer care farmer carries and the goal is to compete in the race as quickly as possible.

So the whole purpose of it, like what I, it's gamified basically.

So like they gamify this whole thing, but it's doing things that like, that's why I, I prefer this type of like high rocks versus like a CrossFit, because it's things that I think more of the general population can do if you, if you train for it.

Like if you train well,

then you can get better at pushing a sled.

If you train well, you can do burpees.

If you train, you know, you can run a mile, right?

CrossFit, I found had more dangerous moves like power lifting.

Olympic lifting.

Yeah, like Olympic lifting and like things that like the average Joe will actually really hurt themselves.

Especially in a class of 10, 20 people in a state of fatigue too.

So that was the biggest thing is you need to be really dialed in for something like that.

And because it's a group fitness atmosphere, this is the downside of it.

People would be tired.

There'd be 20 people in a class.

The coach has not like doesn't know who's doing what.

And it's a recipe for disaster.

So it sounds like Hirox has kind of fixed that issue.

Yeah, like the High Rocks has been really good.

So this is what it really incorporates: running, functional training, and basically the race format, right?

Like who can finish first.

And like I said, that is building a real community for people.

And it's like the hot thing to do.

And so I'm actually going to be doing one.

I'm not sure where, because they do it in different cities and it's a whole thing.

To me, and because you're not doing that all the time, what I love about it, it's also a goal that you can work towards, right?

So like, if you want to get stronger, if you want to improve your endurance, then, you know, here's a great goal.

Now train for it versus going to a lot of these other group classes that really, there's no real goal.

It's just like, yes, it's a great community and make someone work out, but it's just like, can you kill yourself today?

Can you push yourself?

Great.

You did it.

Okay.

Now go home.

Like that to me, you know, and I think with women, especially as we get older, especially in our 40s with hormone, like all the hormone issues we have, I don't think it's great as a, I don't really love that, like the orange theories.

My friend's going to kill me because he owns a bunch of them, but let's just say F-45s or all those things.

I don't think it's the greatest use of time if you're trying to really kind of build muscle, get stronger and get fitter.

You never want to trade your long-term health for like a short-term aesthetic.

Like you don't want to, it's not a good,

you know, trade.

Like.

Yeah, you get skinnier or whatever in the short term, but then you've lost all your muscle or you're just like really burnt out or you haven't, your metabolism is down on the floor.

Long term, it's going to come back and it's going to come back with a vengeance.

So I think people need to maintain their like long-term vision of what they want for their body and don't sacrifice the short term for the long term.

Right.

And I will also just say, besides like have a goal in place.

Again, if you are not doing something, this is a great aspect of community building.

If it, if it motivates you to work out, I think it's great.

if you have a specific fitness goal in mind you may want to do something in addition to it but that's basically all so again you guys should try hybrid if you like try something like that where you have a goal and you can sign up with a bunch of friends which i think is a great other social element and um yeah if you're in la you should also go check out livern's classes you do boxing classes right we do hybrid so We do boxing.

We do a little bit of like our twist on

Pilates.

We do a bunch of weightlifting, but but the flagship, like the main thing that everyone loves is the combination of weightlifting and boxing.

So you're getting two very different systems.

You're getting muscle building, you're getting fat burning, you're getting, you know, power, and you're getting metabolic conditioning.

So you're really training to be very well-rounded.

Right, that's good.

That's good.

One other thing I want to bring up was Pilates.

Pilates is the number one workout.

That's why we have

our twist on it.

Pilates is the number one workout of 2025.

Everyone, like Pilates is like on a short time.

It's been around a while, too.

It's been around forever.

I love that.

I respect that.

But

it's become like the workout of the year.

My opinion, if anyone cares to know.

I think they do.

I don't know.

I mean,

I would say if my opinion is, I think it's a great additive to something else you're doing.

I agree.

I don't think Pilates takes the, like, it does never, doesn't take the place of strength training or endurance training or endurance training it's great if you want to strengthen your core but i think if the misconception is if you do pilates you're gonna have like an elongated dancer's body because you think you see like you see these images of like these like beautiful ballerina type bodies like these lean tall girls going by the droves to pilates and that's just not realistic i mean unless that's unless that's their genetic type okay but if i just don't think that pilates is going to move the needle that much for you So I think, you know, I think that if you want to do Pilates, all the power to you.

But if you really want to

be your only workout.

It should not be your only workout.

In general, I think this is a theme that both of us harp on quite a lot is you do want to have more than one type of training.

Like you do want to be well-rounded.

I think that's really important.

Like my protocol always, like my training protocol always has an element of, even though I say I don't like cardio, because when I'm talking about cardio, I'm talking about like walking or running on a treadmill.

But I play soccer every single week.

I box every single week.

My heart rate is going up to 180 plus every single, like numerous times a week.

So being a well-rounded, well-balanced athlete or just person in general is super crucial.

And I think a good group fitness gym will try at least to check those boxes or admit that they only do one thing and that somebody should be doing some.

By the way, like most gyms aren't doing what you do.

I think people are doing a lot of these like one-offs.

They'll go somewhere for Pilates.

I'll go to one place for Pilates.

Not even, by the way, not even class pass anymore.

Just like, hey, you know what?

Like, I like this place for Pilates.

I'll go there.

Yeah.

I'll go to like a main gym to do my strength training and my cardio.

I'll go to a boxing gym to do my boxing.

Like they, it's very fragmented now, which is fine.

But I guess my point is, there's two different points.

My point is, if you really want to change your body in a real way, then maybe,

you know, do Pilates in addition to something else, like strength training.

But the other thing is, again, the other component is if you just want to move and that's the only thing you like, then something is better than nothing.

And like that social element again.

But I just think that, like I said, everything has its like 15 minutes of glory and fame.

And I think Pilates is like having it right now.

But it's been around a long time.

It has, but like, I'm telling you,

it really taps into a niche, though.

It's very much a woman

thing.

It has, it has no eccentric component i think it's very little eccentric i i actually there are guys a lot of a lot of it's started by a guy pretty hardcore dude mr pilates he was a hardcore german guy really boxer weightlifter like serious serious guy well the I see a lot sometimes the professional athlete guys I know, they go to Pilates on their like active recovery days or like their

off days just to kind of like do other things, just for like stretching.

Band work, activation, you know,

flexes.

Yeah, but some of these classes could be very challenging in these intricate muscles that you just don't ever, ever work.

Again, I have nothing, I have nothing against Pilates.

I just don't think it should be your be-all end-all.

And with that, I think we should wrap this group fitness and then move on to next topics.

But tell us, what is your favorite group fitness class?

Have you guys tried High Rocks?

Because like I said, I'm very curious and I'm going to try it very soon.

And tell us what you think.

Do you agree?

Do you disagree?

Always comments, feedback, so important.

Thanks, Lee Ron, for being here.

You're welcome.