No Legume to Stand On

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman Podcast.

I'm Bailiff Jesse Thorne.

This week, no legume to stand on.

Emily brings the case against her cousin, Jess.

When Emily was three, her uncle chased her around a family gathering while wearing a Mr.

Peanut costume.

This traumatized her.

Jess was present at the event.

She still sends Emily pictures and memes of Mr.

Peanut.

She says it wasn't wasn't that bad.

Emily wants Jess to stop because she still finds it upsetting.

Who's right, who's wrong?

Only one can decide.

Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom and presents an obscure cultural reference.

Since the inexorable logic of reality has created nothing but insolvable problems,

it is now time for illusion to take over.

And there can only be one illogical candidate, Mr.

Peanut.

Bailiff Jesse Thorne, please swear them in.

Emily and Jess, please rise.

Raise your right hands.

Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

So help you, God or whatever.

I do.

Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the fact that Vizzini asked for no more rhymes now?

He means it?

I do.

I do.

Judge Hodgman, you may proceed.

Emily and Jesse may be seated.

I am flummoxed by that cultural reference, so we'll get into it.

For an immediate summary judgment in one of yours favors, can either of you, first of all, tell me what Bailiff Jesse was talking about?

And second of all, name the piece of culture I referenced when I entered the courtroom.

Emily, let's begin with you.

I don't know what Jesse was talking about.

Okay.

Wait, you do?

Oh, my God.

Okay.

Doesn't mean that cousin Jesse is going to win the case.

i should hope not um so let's just focus on this is the this is the one that will determine the outcome right and you name the piece of culture that i referenced when i entered the courtroom it sounded like like senator mccarthy's talking about something or other

senator joe mccarthy senator joe mccarthy and or from the red scare jay edgar hoover

oh yeah

i'm not sure i did such a great impersonation job on that one okay but the words didn't mean anything else to you Ah, whatever.

That's your guess.

It's my, yeah, it's my guess.

Joe McCarthy and or J.

Edgar Hoover.

Famous magician J.

Edgar Hoover.

Famous magician Jay.

Jesse, have I gone through a dimensional portal again?

Because I don't understand anything that's being dropped at the moment.

I'm sorry, John.

I thought mine was pretty obvious, and I bet a lot of listeners are pretty mad about it.

I'm pretty sure.

Jess, why don't you explain it?

What was Jesse talking about?

He was talking about the Princess Bride, and the following line from Andre the Giant is, anybody want a peanut?

Oh, no.

Oh, they don't.

That's a great.

That's a great one.

It's a very good one.

So apropos.

I am abashed.

A word from today's New York Times crossword puzzle.

Abashed.

Wow.

That I didn't catch.

But Jess, but Jess.

What is your guess?

Which rhymes with Jess.

Now I'm Andre the Giant.

What is your guess that rhymes with Jess?

Not good, but could be worse.

Better than my other one.

What is my guess to what the cultural reference?

Yeah, for Judge.

For the cultural reference.

The cultural reference of

the Princess Bridge.

Well, that's what Jesse said.

What I said.

What you said.

Oh, no.

I wish I knew.

I mean, yeah.

You have to make some guess.

You want to just guess the Princess Bride?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Sure.

It's not impossible that if this guy were alive,

he might have been in the Prince's Bride.

He might have been alive, actually.

I only know that he was in one movie.

But the thing is, I'm very embarrassed because I didn't get that Prince's Pride thing.

And I love the Prince's Pride, obviously.

And I used to do, back in the day, I used to do a pretty mean William S.

Burroughs.

I did a pretty mean William S.

Burroughs because I was listening to him all the time on that Laurie Anderson LP, Mr.

Heartbreak.

He performed Sharky's Night.

You know that one, Jess?

I have heard it, but not recently.

Here's the reason that I was quoting William S.

Burroughs, because that was a quote from William S.

Burroughs' actual real-life endorsement in the 1974 Vancouver mayoral race of Mr.

Peanut.

No.

Why?

An artist named Vincent Trazov.

I don't know if I'm pronouncing that correctly, T-R-A-S-O-V, of a Canadian, perhaps British Columbian artist, performance artist, and other artist, Vincent Trazov, had already begun dressing up in his homemade Papier-Mâche Mr.

Peanut outfit for various art projects.

And in 1974, disgusted at both parties that were running for the mayorality of Vancouver,

he entered himself as Mr.

Peanut and he never spoke, but he appeared at every debate in his Mr.

Peanut outfit.

And he lost.

But he did get 4% of the vote.

And thank you to Reddit user Tin Rall, T-I-N-R-A-L-L, for bringing this to my attention.

I found that today in the Maximum Fund subreddit as we were looking for names for this case.

Tin Rall mentioned that Mr.

Peanut had run and lost for mayor of Vancouver.

And William S.

Burrows endorsed him, and that was the endorsement.

But you didn't get it, so now we have to hear the case.

So who seeks justice before me in this fake courtroom?

I do.

And you would be.

I'm Emily.

I'm Emily.

Emily.

Emily, what is the nature of your dispute?

dispute?

Okay, the nature of the dispute is this.

When I was, and actually, I wasn't even three.

It turns out I was like 2.75.

Okay.

So when I was 2.75 years old.

A very normal way to state your age.

My cousin and I and all of our family members were at our uncle's house in Chesapeake City.

And we were, you know, cavorting at our family reunion.

And all of a sudden, my uncle Jimmy, who's, you know the main, I guess, antagonist in this case,

he

disappeared from the event.

And then not 10 minutes later, a giant half human, I guess sort of eight foot tall

Mr.

Peanut came loping, truly loping out of the woods behind my uncle's house.

And I didn't really, I had just barely gotten like object permanence.

Okay.

So like, I didn't even know what was happening.

All I saw was this truly like monstrous figure coming at me.

And it was,

it really started

truly loping.

And it really was the start of a lifelong fear of people in costumes, A.

And B,

Everyone was like, I, as I recall, everyone was like laughing like, oh, ha, ha, how funny.

But I really was traumatized.

And my cousin Jess was there.

And she continues to bring it up and send me all kinds of pictures and videos and things, and point out Mr.

Peanut when we're out and about in public, because

he still thrives to this day, even though he was supposed to be dead.

Wait a minute, let me understand this, Emily.

You were 2.75 years old.

Yes, that's correct.

And how old are you now, if I may ask?

I'm 34.5 years old.

34.5.

Okay.

And Jess.

How old were you when Uncle Jimmy came loping out of the woods in his Mr.

Peanut costume?

Well, if Emily was two or two point seven,

then that would have made me

seven

point seven five, right?

Seven point seven five.

Okay, so you were older.

And did you join the fan?

And do you dispute any of the facts of this case?

I do.

What's your dispute?

He did not come out of the woods, for one thing.

He came out of the house.

Was it a gray house?

If you go out in the woods today,

you're in for a big surprise.

It was, in fact, a gray house.

Actually, it was gray.

It was.

All right.

Well, at least you can agree on that.

There is some basis for memory here.

It was a gray house.

We're out there in the woods today.

It's a legume that has eyes.

So

for one thing,

yeah,

it was, he came from the house.

And

for another thing, he was wearing a Mr.

Peanut costume, which gave him some height.

But I will say also that we are

a hobbity family,

of which I'm one of the tallest people at like five foot six.

So

there's no way that Uncle Jimmy could have, even with the top hat, been anywhere close to eight feet tall.

He was like three feet tall.

I don't care.

Everything's relative, particularly at a family reunion.

Also, I have a memory of us.

I'm sorry, Jess.

I have to

interrupt you for a moment.

No, no, that's okay.

Call it, Val.

It's March 2023.

I'm resigning from the podcast.

Okay.

Thank you very much.

Can I fire myself?

Resigning from the podcast.

Make sure you get me slamming this door.

Oh, no.

Who's going to deliver justice now?

Oh, no.

Oh, gosh.

I need this podcast to pay my mortgage, Val.

Jeez.

All right.

I came back because even though by rights I should resign,

I owe Jess and Emily a fair hearing.

Thank you, Judge.

So

let me ask you this with regard to Mr.

Peanut, Jess.

Loping or not loping?

I wouldn't call it loping.

It was not a human walk, you know, like

it was

loping i feel no but i mean like loping is at least like a forward moving kind of walk whereas this is almost like you know when you're trying to act like something else like oh here i am like arms elbows out like it's very elbow yeah you know that kind of thing here i am playing it's more of a sideways sway than a forward lip he was not moving fast anywhere Long bounding steps seem difficult when, you know, basically you've got a peanut costume down to your mid-thigh.

I would imagine that would be a little kind of more of a shuffling.

Frankly, more disturbing in my imagination than looping.

It wasn't like not creepy as a costume.

So then what are you talking about?

It was not creepy.

It wasn't not creepy.

I will say this.

It wasn't not creepy.

So you are saying you acknowledge that this is a creepy thing, but I'm it some creepy?

The costume itself was creepy.

However, I will also say that I remember distinctly because we were the youngest people by a lot at this party that we were just looking for pets to play with.

So

Emily and I went looking for our Uncle Jimmy's cat, Katmandu, who didn't like people.

Sure.

And he was hiding in the basement.

Why?

I mean, I'm sure that cat got named Katmandu and then...

resigned.

Yeah, he also did.

He resigned from Cat Dum immediately.

And he's like, what am I doing here?

Judah.

Lord.

Catman don't.

Look, I can't resign twice.

So

the thing was.

The thing was that

we were in the basement looking for the cat.

We found the cat.

It was hiding.

It did not obviously want to interact with us.

And

I thought we both saw, but Emily doesn't recall, I think,

the

shell.

The costume.

The proverbial shell, shell,

and this is a bunch of and I remember pointing this out and thinking, like, and saying, why does Uncle Jimmy have an have a Mr.

Peanut thing?

That's weird.

And this is no more on it, manufactured memory on your part.

Wait, are you saying, Emily, that this did not happen?

It did not happen.

But at the same time, I don't remember a lot.

The only thing, this was like a formative memory of them.

Of course, you were quite young, 2.75.

I mean,

just a little over 139 weeks old.

Exactly.

But my question is, let's just stipulate for a moment.

Let's imagine that it did happen.

Jess, what is this supposed to prove?

That you snuck into a basement and you saw the Mr.

Peanut costume?

So that she'd seen it in its inanimate form.

Oh, so she had no right to be scared.

Just that it was a preview of what was to come.

Because she had already seen

an unaccounted for Mr.

Peanut costume in a basement.

She should already have been terrified.

The fact that it would come lope shuffling out of the woods/slash house should not have scared her.

Honestly, it's worse to see it inanimate and then have it be animated.

Later.

I'll tell you what.

I'll decide because

I have a photo of your Uncle Jimmy wearing this thing.

Right.

Of course, it is from the past.

So it is, Jesse Thorne.

Have you seen this photo of Mr.

Peanut yet?

I'm taking a look at this photograph now.

In the background, we see a classic suburban lawn featuring what looks like it might be like a Buick Roadmaster wagon.

Buick Skylark, maybe.

A truly classic family station wagon.

In the front, we see an uncle or grandpa wearing white socks up to his knees with shorts, his bald pate shining brightly in the afternoon sun.

Looks like he has a picnic plate and he's sitting on what appears to be a lawn chair.

And he appears to be wearing a teal and pink family reunion themed t-shirt.

All right.

And then what?

I hope that's not all you see in this photograph, Jesse, because then I would be very concerned.

Oh, for my own sandwich.

Look at that.

A gorilla ran across the screen.

No, not a gorilla.

Well, I was watching the basketball.

Can you guys confirm to me what relative this is?

Is this a grandpa, an uncle?

That's our grandfather, pop-up.

Behind pop-pop here

is

the terrifying sight of

a man-sized peanut.

However, I cannot emphasize enough that this costume features only a torso, head, and hat.

Yes.

So what we are seeing here is

true.

And a rich gentleman's walking stick.

Yes.

There is a man inside the costume who's wearing a white t-shirt and basketball shorts.

And the costume.

Yeah, the costume goes down to the waist.

It does not go down to the hips.

And there is what I will call one Mr.

Peanut eye and one creepy human eye peering out from what would be a monocle that's painted onto the costume, clearly not three-dimensional.

And on the hat where it should say peanut,

it says yeah.

No, I think that's just a trick of the like there.

I think that you can only see the E and the A in Mr.

Peanut.

Because I'm sure that this is a licensed Mr.

Peanut costume.

It was.

Well, what I want to know is why Uncle Jimmy has any kind of licensed or unlicensed Mr.

Peanut costume in his basement, ready to trot out at a family reunion for any reason.

Jess, do you have any explanation?

Well, I actually spoke to my Uncle Jimmy and

I recorded my conversation with him.

So I have brought it here

to the court.

Emily, are you aware of this audio evidence that's being I was not aware until my mom told me about it this weekend.

And she's like, you know, Jess got Uncle Jimmy on to interview about Mr.

peanut and i said of course jess even though you violated the the discovery process this is a fake court and i will allow it because it is highly germane to the case

valerie will you play the uh audio evidence please

so uh tell me what happened on the day of the chesapeake city family reunion and the costume incident.

Can you pause this, Valerie?

Can you confirm that as this was being recorded, a single pendant lamp was swinging from the ceiling as the two of you sat at an unadorned metal table in a police interrogation room?

I cannot, but I do know that my Aunt Martha was standing behind him to make sure he stayed on track.

Yes, and she really is good cop, bad cop, and all cops in between.

All right.

He had representation.

I'll allow it.

Okay.

See, there were two sightings of Mr.

Peanut.

One was on the Elk River and one was in Chesapeake City.

The one you're referencing in the Chesapeake City, it was like a family reunion, Father's Day thing, and everything like that.

And we would have a big barbecue.

I would get a bushel of crabs.

So anyway, we were having this big party.

And because...

Can we pause for one moment, please?

Can we pause for a moment?

Valerie, take a letter.

to Joel Mann in Orland, Maine at W-E-R-U.

Actually, make this a telegraph because it's important.

Dear Joel, stop.

Gallon of scallops out, stop.

Welcome to Year of Bushel of Crabs.

Stop.

That is all.

Okay.

Send that as soon as possible over the wire space.

Val,

can you send a quick message to Joel up there in Maine?

Dear Joel, stop.

This is Jesse from the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

Stop.

You are fired, coming

Unless you can start generating charming compound vowels.

Stop.

Yeah, we need more diphthongs.

In the Philadelphia style.

Yeah.

Not me.

I'm from Delaware County.

Oh, okay.

And I'm from Boston.

Oh, but where is Uncle Jimmy from?

He's from South Philadelphia.

Southwest Philadelphia.

All right.

All right.

That makes sense.

Okay.

Reality has reasserted itself.

You all, you all are full of, and I don't want to get you started, Jesse.

You all are full of beans today.

You're, you're making me guess, guess myself.

I love beans.

Guess reality here.

Now I understand what's going on.

Okay.

Let's hear what Uncle Jimmy has to say for himself.

Yeah.

And

because I was a salesman for several principles, and one of them was Planners Peanuts, owned by Nabisco.

And Planners

had a Planet outfit, which consisted of the spats, the white spats, and the pants, and the Mr.

Peanut Head.

Right.

So I'm

right.

And

that's the hat.

Yeah.

Well, the hat comes with the head.

It's all one piece.

Okay.

That's why they call it a head piece, I guess.

It's all one piece.

So as I recollected, okay, I said, well, I'm going to, you know, because my dad used to sing us the songs when we were little kids, and it was called Found the Peanut.

And he would sing it, Found the Peanut, Found the Peanut just now.

Okay, so anyway, I always wanted to.

I remember it well.

Dad, I finally found, you know, I was the peanut that he found.

So.

In doing this, I got upstairs to my bedroom and outside my bedroom, I had a small balcony, And I put the uniform on, and I came out the balcony and I yelled, Have a happy peanut.

I don't know what I said.

I don't even believe that really is.

Yeah, but I shouted up there, and people said, Look, it's Mr.

Peanut up there.

And I waved everybody.

Now, I don't know what happened down there,

but then when I came out, I came out all the way down in the basement, and

everybody was laughing and rocking and everything like that, except one little child who was not.

And which child was that?

That child, her name was Emily.

Valerie, I insist that you add ba ba ba.

Why did Uncle Jimmy make it seem like he was accusing Emily?

Does he understand what the purpose of the interview was?

I don't think so.

I don't think he understood.

I was lucky to be on Zoom.

Can you name the child who did not laugh at your Mr.

Peanut joke?

That's for me.

Yeah.

Wow.

God.

All right.

Well, now we've had three different versions of this Rashimon mixed nuts.

I don't know what's worse.

Him coming out, supposedly coming out of the woods, him coming out of the house, or him coming out like Gavita Peron on the balcony.

I love the idea of Mr.

Peanut being greeted by his adoring public, offering one of those queen waves.

Mr.

Peanut's a delight.

I have to say, Emily, and I'm not trying to diminish your.

I mean,

you had a horrifying experience that has apparently

colored your experience of Mr.

Peanut.

But for those of us who are not scared to death by Uncle Jimmy,

I love Mr.

Peanut.

I'd be glad to see Mr.

Peanut.

Although I have to say, Uncle Jimmy, he

he really, this is a really slapdash because Mr.

Peanut's a gentleman.

He did not have, not wearing the spats.

He's not wearing the tuxedo, not wearing the white gloves.

And, Judge, I also want to point out on that, what I know the photo that you're referring to, and I also want to point out the prodigious arm hair.

Yeah, that can be a little bit of a shot.

There is that.

Wow, is that arm hair?

Holy crap.

I'm almost there.

It is.

It looks like in this slightly blurry photograph, it looks like he has full arm tattoos.

Like his arms are tatted from the wrist to the elbow.

It's the tattoo of the Irish.

That's what it is.

And then there's one more photo from this family reunion.

This is the same day,

this extremely blurry photo.

Yes, I believe so.

I believe so.

This really looks like something from a sequel to The Ring, the Japanese movie.

Yes.

Looks horrifying, horrifying, blurry image.

Let's take a quick recess.

We'll be back in just a moment on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

You're listening to Judge John Hodgman.

I'm Bailiff Jesse Thorne.

Of course, the Judge John Hodgman podcast, always brought to you by you, the members of maximumfun.org.

Thanks to everybody who's gone to maximumfun.org slash join.

And you can join them by going to maximumfun.org slash join.

The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by Made In.

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Let them know Jesse and John sent you.

Okay, so we have verified that this happened.

You all have slightly different memories of it, which is understandable because Emily, you were 2.75.

Jess, you were, what, 7.75?

Correct.

Correct.

And Uncle Jimmy is a nut

and has had a lot of life since then.

Did Mr.

Peanut ever come out again, or was this the only time?

This was the only time we encountered Peanut.

We borrowed it for this occasion.

And Jess, when you were talking to your Uncle Jimmy, did you get the impression, like, was was his father still living at the time of this reunion?

Was he there?

Yes, that's pup-up.

Except, Judge, I do have to say that puppup, our grandfather, lost his sight many years before that.

So he could not see Uncle Jimmy in this costume.

It had to be pointed out to him many times.

And he just had to take it on faith that it was happening.

Uncle Jimmy was probably doing a peanutty voice.

I don't know.

Indubitably.

Didn't Uncle Jimmy insist that Pup Pup feel his midsection to feel his peanutty ridges?

I sure hope not.

Listen.

We're all full of beans now.

I guess what I'm trying to establish, just

not for any reason other than curiosity.

Uncle Jimmy talked about his dad's.

That's the opposite of resigning.

I'm signing a long-term contract for this program.

Billion-year contract for Jesse Thorne.

I'm in.

You and me, Jesse.

I'm in Ride or Die, billion year contract for sure.

But what I'm trying to establish is his dad sung him this song, Find the Peanut.

Find the Peanut.

I don't want to get asked.

Not Find the Peanut, but Found a Peanut.

It was Found a Panano.

Found a Peanut.

There are many verses.

He was the Peanut.

He was the Peanut.

Jimmy was saying he was the peanut.

So

suddenly he had this idea.

The improvisation was, I'm at a family reunion with my pup up.

He used to sing, Found a Peanut to me.

I have a Mr.

Peanut costume.

I'm going to delight him even though he can't see.

And

I will terrify my niece.

Correct.

Yeah.

That's a problem.

That's right.

Now I understand why this happened.

Now that we have established both why and that it happened,

Emily, how has Jess been plaguing you with Mr.

Peanut images?

You know, it's not...

It's not on a daily basis by any means, Judge.

I don't want to overstate

the acuity of it, but every once in a while out of the blue, so I'll be like lulled into a sense of comfort.

And then all of a sudden, I'll get a text like, hey, check this out.

And it's like, you know, her walking down the street and seeing Mr.

Peanut in a window or something.

Like, look at all these peanuts we have or whatever.

Or she'll be like, look at this funny thing.

It's a Mr.

Peanut video on YouTube or something like that.

Or I do remember also when he was allegedly.

like he died a couple of years ago.

I got a lot of imagery.

Got a lot of imagery at that time, Judge.

Yeah.

Jesse Thorne, you remember a couple of years ago, Planters quote-unquote killed off Mr.

Peanut.

And it turned out to be Bologna, like when Superman died.

Yeah, exactly.

It turned out to be.

He was driving the Nutmobile, and it went over a cliff.

But it turned out to be the Oscar Wiener Mobile because it was Bologna.

You know what I'm saying?

I know exactly what you're saying.

You know who he was driving with?

Matt Walsh.

from UCB and Veep.

He was in this Super Bowl ad where Mr.

Peanut died.

He sacrificed his life to save Matt Walsh.

And then he had a funeral.

And guess who showed up at the funeral?

Jesse, guess.

Can you guess?

My first thought is Superman, but...

The Kool-Aid guy.

Oh.

Was at the funeral.

Did he bring a certain gravitas to the occasion?

Well, he had to bust through that wall

to get into the funeral home.

Yeah.

That's what he said when he busted through the wall.

Oh, yeah.

My My condolences.

Oh, yeah.

This is all true.

This is what they were doing back a couple years ago.

Oh, I know.

I remember.

Killing off, Mr.

Emily, you can verify all this, right?

Of course.

I was elated at the time, but I will say that at that time, I got a barrage of images from Jess and others.

I will also say she's not the only one, but from Jess also.

And she's the only one who was actually there who then was sending me stuff.

And it just, even though he was allegedly dead, it still just brought me right back to, you know, the traumatizing time.

So, how is this getting around that you don't like Mr.

Peanut, that other people were sending you images and stuff?

Family lore or Jess?

Family lore, but also, you know, my close friends, we share sort of our formative memories and our childhood experiences and, you know, to get to know each other better.

And that's typically one of the first stories that I tell people.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Jesse, you hear about Emily?

She is friends.

Lifelong friends.

Close friends.

Plus she has all those crabs from the barbecue.

A

bushel of crabs and a bushel of friends.

Aw.

That's true.

So, but I mean, like, if this is truly, and again, I'm not questioning your trauma.

I'm just trying to establish here.

Like, this was a scary thing for you.

So surely your friends.

Must know you don't like this.

And surely your cousin Jess must know you don't like this, right?

Wouldn't you say?

Yeah.

So my friends, I think they weren't sending me images necessarily.

They were saying, oh, have you heard?

Like, are you happy?

Like, how do you feel?

You know, they were checking in about his death.

Whereas my cousin is constantly, she just doesn't think it was scary.

She doesn't think, she thinks I'm overblowing the situation.

And she doesn't think, she thinks it's a, it's a source of amusement.

Jess, what kind of things are you sending Emily?

I mean, pictures, yes.

Plenty of pictures.

Mr.

Peanut memes.

I mean, the thing is, the thing with Mr.

Peanut is

he's not like.

Finally, we're getting down to it.

The thing about Mr.

Peanut is he's not exactly like au Couron, you know?

Like, it's not.

He's one of the, like the country's oldest mascots of a food product.

Like, there's nothing current at all about Mr.

Peanut.

He's not hip like Charlie Tuna.

Listen.

Jess, what kind of pictures are you sending?

Are you like typing Mr.

Peanut into DeviantArt?

No, see, that's the thing.

I'll get to that in a minute.

But the thing is, I don't look for it.

It's if it comes in my path.

Right.

So, you know, one day in New York, I was in Times Square for some reason, and there was a billboard of Mr.

Peanut.

Duh, I took a picture and sent it to her.

Right.

But like, unless you're eating Planters Peanuts or you're watching Super Bowl ads every six years or something, I guess, like he's not just going to come up very often.

He doesn't.

I would say that the last time I did send Emily something about Mr.

Peanut, it was around Christmas time.

And

we, well, it's not that I sent it to her.

It's just that we were in this like antique small thing.

And there was a stall that was all like antique toys.

And there was one that was Mr.

Peanut.

She goes, Look, Charles, look, it's Mr.

Peanut.

I was like, Oh my gosh, if this wasn't $500, I would buy it for you for Christmas.

Like, you know, see,

and that is the

judge after that incident is when I submitted this case for justice because and the antique mall incident.

Yeah,

I turned

Mr.

Peanut into deviant art.

No!

Oh, my God.

No!

Let the record show for any young people who might be listening from their parents.

So DeviantArt is a

art-sharing website that often has a somewhat,

shall we say,

erotic...

Oh, no.

Don't be...

Jesse, don't text me these things.

It's an art-sharing website that often has some adult imagery in it.

Oh, brother.

These are not adult image.

These are just terrifying.

These are just upsetting.

Just upsetting Mr.

Peanut images.

Don't, Emily, don't look.

Oh, here's a very sweet one.

Mr.

Peanut is an angel.

No.

Oh, God.

I reject it.

Of course you do.

I reject it.

But

I would like to say,

you know, I do recognize that Emily suffered a trauma.

Oh, okay.

But

I do think also

that it's kind of tapered off in the meantime.

And I will say this specifically.

What, your harassment of Emily?

No, no, no.

Her reaction.

Her

visceral response, because what I will say, she did not eat peanuts for decades.

Decades.

And I love peanuts now, and I couldn't enjoy them.

She loves them now,

for one thing.

For another,

we were discussing this case in a group chat recently.

And

I had seen something on Twitter that was like somebody decided to rank like the hottest like

human-ish, like weird characters of food brands.

So like Tony.

Tony the Tiger.

Tony the Tiger.

Charlie Sunkiss, whatever.

Charlie Tuno.

Charlie Tuno.

The Jolly Green Giant was number one.

Yeah.

You know.

Sorry, guys.

I just found a tattoo of Mr.

Peanut being boiled alive.

Oh Lord.

No.

But the thing is, Emily contributed to this conversation by saying,

I need to look and see if there's any Mr.

Peanut fanfic now.

So she did.

All right.

You did send in some images of a text conversation among the...

No, you didn't.

Judge.

Apparently, without Emily's permission.

I'm just truly in which

they were discussing the most huggable and kissable, shall we say, cartoon food mascots.

I can't believe this.

And Emily, apropos of nothing,

Mr.

Peanut says here, Mr.

Peanut was not mentioned in the thread, but apropos of nothing, the screenshot shows Emily wondering if there is any Mr.

Peanut fanfiction on the internet.

And then there's another screenshot from the same group text.

And Emily has sent a screenshot of her search for Mr.

Peanut fan fiction on a popular fan fiction website.

And the name of the story that Emily found is A Tough Nut to Crack by Captain Cringe.

After the loss, this is the log line.

After the loss of the original Mr.

Peanut, the now adult baby nut helps Kool-Aid Man through his unresolved emotional struggles.

All right, that went to a different direction.

That's more

emo than sensual.

The promise ring were originally a Mr.

Peanut tribute band.

Emily, did you or did you not search a popular fan fiction website for fan fic about Mr.

Peanut?

You know, I won't deny that I did it.

I will say, though, that the text, seeing the text, you know, version, seeing Mr.

Peanut written out via text is not really that hard for me to stomach.

It's the imagery that really.

How do you feel when you get an image, an unasked for image of Mr.

Peanut?

I'm just brought immediately back to that time, to the time when I was standing there.

And I do recall it in the woods.

So maybe my mind transplanted it, you know, transplanted it.

Well, no, no, no, no, no, no.

I'm not talking about what happened then.

I'm talking about like what happened the last time.

Jess Mr.

Peanut bombed you with an image of Mr.

Peanut.

Physically, did you, did you, was your, you know, was was your heart racing?

Yeah, it's like a stomach drop.

It's like a stomach drop.

She's eyeing me with such suspicion.

And I just have to say that I just, yes, I take this.

Jess.

I hold you in contempt of court.

Stop eyeing with suspicion, Jess.

That's my job.

Okay, so she's turned away from me.

Turn away from me.

Turn away.

So it is.

It's a very, you know, it's a very physical reaction.

It is akin.

to the reaction I might have,

you know, when accosted by any costumed person in the street.

Now, you mentioned that this

set you on a path of feeling uneasy around costumed people in general.

We're talking about San Diego chickens.

We're talking about Phillies fanatics.

We're talking about any kind of wholly enclosed costume or what?

She's not saying that.

Yes, I am.

How do you feel about gritty, my dad?

Oh, I love gritty, but that's different.

There's always an exception to prove the rule.

My dad took me to a Phillies game when I was like six or seven.

We went to the Phillies game.

We were enjoying our time.

Of course, I wasn't eating peanuts.

I was eating like cotton candy.

Oh, you were holding a big bag of nine-volt batteries.

That's correct.

That's correct, Judge.

What your dad had gotten for you.

Right.

And the Philly fanatic came up into our section.

Oh, no.

And I literally started screaming at the top of my lungs.

And my dad had to take me away and leave the game at the bottom of the seventh inning.

How old were you, did you say?

I was six or seven.

Point what?

Point one I would say.

Okay.

Okay.

Because of the Mr.

Peanut experience.

Yeah, I can only guess that that's the root cause.

I just want to say that 0.15 would have put you in the postseason.

I'll just throw that out.

You ever go down the shore?

Yes, we go down the shore very frequently.

We don't go to Ocean City.

No,

we go to Cape May.

Because we're bougie.

That's where the antiques mall is.

Last time I saw someone dressed up as Mr.

Peanut, it was a really ratty Mr.

Peanut costume outside of Shriver's saltwater taffy.

I was wondering if that was maybe your Uncle Jimmy.

Oh, it might have been him.

Yeah, but when I was doing my research on the actual costume which now can be auctioned off for like thousands of dollars,

I guess it's from a campaign for the Atlantic City Boardwalk around the 40s or 50s.

Okay.

That's why it has like that.

I think the weirdest part about the costume is the mouth, but

the lips.

The small little mouth.

The red lips.

That's weird.

a dry mouth.

Yeah.

Jess, I heard when you were talking about the Mr.

Peanut doll in the antiques mall,

you mentioned the name Charles.

Yes.

Were you referring to Emily at that time?

I was.

We call each other Charles.

It is a long story that has to do with.

How did we get this far into the podcast without realizing that you call each other Charles?

It's a reference to The Ice Storm by Rick Moody, in which two siblings call each other Charles.

Charles.

Okay.

I did get to tell Rick Moody that in person, and it made my day.

I hope it made his.

Charles and Charles.

Okay.

So,

Jess, are you saying that Emily's representation of her own feelings are false?

I am saying that they are exaggerated at this stage in her life.

Charles, if I may ask, Emily Charles,

how do you respond to that?

You know,

the pain may have lessened over the years.

And so I don't, you know, I no longer, for example, you know, am scared of the Easter Bunny or Clifford the Big Red Dog or things like that.

I'm able to, you know, walk and go about my day and look at these things.

Charles, wait a minute.

Yes.

How are the Easter Bunny and Clifford the Big Red Dog come into this now?

Well, that's like all costumed people I would just associate with that time.

So I'm able to like, you know, take in, I'm able to like worship Gritty, for example, now and have, you know, these normal experiences.

But I will say that

seeing

an image of Mr.

Peanut or being accosted by an image of Mr.

Peanut during the course of the day, it does at the time have a very, you know, I have a very emotional and physical response, even though it might not be long-lasting.

When you search Mr.

Peanut in a fan fiction forum,

is there a little bit of a transgressive thrill?

That's all I'm going to say.

A little bit of an extra charge to it than if you were searching, I don't know, the honey nut Cheerios bee or something.

Um,

I'll plead the fifth on that, Judge.

Yeah, fair.

Let me ask you this question, Charles.

Did you ever ask Charles to stop doing this?

Stop sending images of Mr.

Peanut?

I did.

I did.

I like to call Mr.

Peanut Charles myself.

So you're saying, Charles, that you asked Charles to stop sending you photos of Charles.

That's correct.

And what and Charles, why have you not stopped?

because that's what makes it so funny

wow for you

for her to for her to

um

is it funny for you Emily Charles okay there is a bit there is sort of a

you know there's a thrill what you know in this life we don't get a lot of you know, of thrilling experiences.

And so, you know, if I'm just going about the day and I, and then Charles texts me an image of Mr.

Peanut, you know, even though I am terrified, I do experience, you know, it is, it is a little bit of a an exhilarating feeling, I would say.

So I understand where she thinks that she is providing me with some fulfillment in that way.

This exhilarating experience, this charge that you get out of it, to what degree are you assigning it to a Mr.

Peanut as a memory?

And to what degree are you assigning it to the long history of just teasing and pranking and bullying you with this image?

That's a good question.

I think they're inexorably linked.

Right.

But you would like it to stop.

I mean, you wouldn't have come to this courtroom if you didn't feel that you needed the mediation of a podcaster to force Jess

to comply with your wishes.

If she wants to send me Mr.

Peanut imagery in the future, I would just ask that she give me some kind of, say, hey, listen, like, am I able to send you this billboard of Mr.

Peanut or am I able to, you know, show you this doll or whatever or point this out to you?

If, if I may counter Charles.

I'll allow it.

Charles.

Charles,

how would the effect of sending that particular

gif of Lee Pace taking off his mask in that movie?

Yeah.

How would the effect of that?

be any different?

For example, if you had to say, hey, Charles,

incoming Lee Pace taking taking off his mask.

Right.

Wait a minute.

Wait a minute.

Is Lee Pace starring as Mr.

Peanut in a movie or something?

No, thank God.

What is the Lee Pace thing?

That would be incredible.

Lee Pace can do anything.

He really could.

But Charles brings that up because I, you know, we both have a reaction to that gif.

I would call that an

exhilarated reaction.

So I think she's saying, you know,

would the feeling diminish if I sort of prefaced it with like, incoming, this is, I'm about to send you this thing, which I agree.

What is the thing?

What is the thing?

I don't know what it is.

It is a GIF.

How many cultural references am I going to miss in one podcast?

It is a GIF

from the film The Fall starring Lee Pace.

And it is,

in this particular part, he's in slow motion taking off a mask.

Taking off his big Mr.

Met hat.

Yeah.

Mr.

Met head.

Yeah.

So it's exactly the same.

Yes.

Jess, are you saying that this is a specially charged,

I call it a GIF because it's a mask and Emily doesn't like masks?

I don't get it.

What does this have to do with, what does this have to do with the price of peanuts?

Because the whole point of sending it without the content preamble.

Without preamble means it's going to have a better effect.

Yeah.

Which is true.

I mean,

like a jump, like a jump scare.

A jump scare, yeah.

And a scary movie like the one that Emily endured as a child.

Right.

The scary movie that is my life.

Yeah.

Right.

But also, I mean, when I, let's, I mean, I'm not trying to scare you when I send you those things.

It's more like I saw this and thought of you.

Oh, come on.

No, it's true.

I mean, I have no feelings about Mr.

Peanut whatsoever, except in regards to you.

How dare you?

Mr.

Peanut is an important commercial mascot going back to 1916.

Jess Charles, you're trying to tell me that when you see Mr.

Peanut, you think of your cousin and you reach out to your cousin because you like her.

That's why you're doing this?

Yep.

Well, it sounds a lot better than I think she's exaggerating her trauma.

They're both true.

I don't know what's going on.

Emily, I want to take you back for a second.

Let's go back to Uncle Jimmy's house.

I really want you to take a moment and revisit it, if you're willing to do this with me.

And describe how scared you were in the moment and why it was so upsetting to you.

Well, it is weird that he and Jess both think he came, said he came out of the house.

I really do picture it from out of the woods.

And so it was like this, this sort of like

mysterious figure that slowly materialized and became,

in my view, eight foot tall.

Of course, I understand Uncle Jimmy is, you know, famously short, but but he came out and he was like eight foot tall.

It was just the last thing on earth I expected.

Really?

You didn't see that coming?

I really didn't see it coming.

And I just was filled with terror.

I can't describe it any other way, Judge.

I just had to, I was running away.

And I think Uncle Jimmy wanted to comfort me and he does feel bad.

I have to also say he does feel bad and has apologized to me many times over the years, Judge.

So he wanted to comfort me.

So he was chasing me even more,

which made me even more scared.

And everyone else was laughing, which was also part of it.

So it was very scary.

And I felt a physical sensation of fear.

Truly, my lizard brain kicked in, and it was a fight-or-flight situation.

And I certainly was no match in the fight.

And how, in the moment or in reflection, did you feel about everybody laughing at you?

I mean, I understand it.

Yeah, I don't really.

I don't think they were laughing at me.

I think they were laughing at Uncle Jimmy in the Mr.

Peanut costume.

Oh, they were laughing at you.

I happen to have 15 sworn affidavits for your family.

Only 15.

Only 15, yeah.

Well, I mean, that everyone else was enjoying something that was terrifying you.

Do you think that that plays into

your

overall experience of that moment?

I think it would if our family didn't laugh at one another's expense on a frequent basis.

I think it's kind of harfor for the course in our family.

So I, I think.

We all give and get equally.

That's right.

I feel.

So, um.

Well, so Jess has been giving you Mr.

Peanut, as they say online, giving real Mr.

Peanut.

She's giving real for a while now.

She's serving.

And you've been getting it.

Have you been giving anything back to her?

Is there any true fair play in this traumatization, re-traumatization,

double cousin handoff?

I don't think so, Judge.

I can't think of anything.

Except your whole childhood.

Right.

I did torture her when I was a child, but that's fine.

In what way?

Oh, I would just, you know,

I would pull your hair and chase you around.

I almost drowned in the pool because she jumped on my back and wouldn't get in.

Yeah.

I just followed you around and like screamed, probably.

Yeah.

Probably because

you loved your cousin.

Yes.

And you looked up to your older cousin.

I did.

And you would learn from your family that the way to express affection for one another is to terrify them and chase them.

Yes, right.

Yeah.

That's correct.

Okay.

I understand.

What does Uncle Jimmy have to say about this?

I believe we have some more

audio evidence from Uncle Jimmy.

Yes.

Let's roll that, Valerie Moffat.

I never thought i'd see trauma

in my face but i looked at her and i thought there's trauma and i felt very small actually i felt like a very small peanut

uh maybe maybe even like a uh sunflower seed sure

so i shrunk from a mr peanut to a sunflower seed because i didn't want to offend emily

but i was just having fun with the family you know that was a big thing.

Yeah.

So when you saw that Emily was

traumatized.

Traumatized.

Sure.

We'll call it traumatized.

Yeah.

Did she go anywhere?

Was she just freaking out?

Was she?

I think my sister Grace, Emily's mom, shrieked at me and said, get out of here, Mr.

Beanut,

and told me to stay away from Emily.

Oh,

Emily didn't want me anywhere near her.

She wasn't happy about it.

It's true.

She was not happy.

So, um, Aunt Grace did not

let you near her.

So, she didn't, you didn't.

That's my recollection.

Okay.

So, you would say that you didn't like chase her.

I hate to ask a leading question.

No, I did not.

No, I got out of there quickly and got out of my Mr.

Peanut suit as quickly as possible.

I see.

Okay.

I didn't know that it was going to cause that much drama.

Get out of here, Mr.

Peanut.

Get out of here, Mr.

Peanut, and you stay out.

She kept it up.

Like, she kept up the whole illusion that it was real.

Your mom.

Your uncle's, first of all, we will throw out your leading question about whether or not he chased.

That was obviously psychological manipulation trying to win your case.

Sure.

You also obviously loved to ask that leading question, not hate it, as you claim.

I needed clarification.

Uncle Jimmy saw trauma in little Charles Emily's eyes and acknowledged it on that tape.

And then

his sister, Grace, said, get out of here, Mr.

Peanut, presumably in Emily's earshot, thus validating the fact that Mr.

Peanut was a villain,

not a member of the family.

and someone to be shunned and evaded at all costs.

Someone who needed needed to be ejected from the scene.

Yeah, this tracks.

Really does.

Absolutely.

Tracks.

Yes, absolutely.

I know what Emily would want if I were to rule in Emily's favor.

Jess, what would you want me to rule if I were to rule in your favor?

My ideal outcome in this situation is that I can still send her stuff.

about Mr.

Peanut without preamble

because she can admit that she these days exaggerates the current feelings that she has about this past trauma for the sake of comedic effect.

You're calling her a liar.

I'm calling her a comedian.

Oh, okay.

A very thin line.

Like I said.

I think I've heard everything I need to in order to make my decision.

I'm going to go into my own creepy basement full of costumes, and I'll be back in a moment with my verdict.

Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom.

Emily, how are you feeling?

I thought I would come out of this case feeling much more confident, Bailiff, but I

don't know.

I think

Charles presented a confusing and confounding account for the judge, and I just hope that he, you know, that he kind of sees through the mirage, so to speak.

So feeling unsure, uncertain.

How do you feel, Jess?

I feel pretty good.

I feel like I have presented the facts as I have gleaned them.

And

I trust that his honor will

be fair in his judgment.

And yet at the same time, I do hope he delivers it in his Ayn Rand costume.

So I don't know.

Been a while since that's come out of the basement.

It's a great dress, though.

Do you two want to hear something that my friend Emily Heller said to me the other day?

Of Of course.

Emily Heller, of course, the co-host of the wonderful Max Fun podcast Baby Geniuses, she was on Jordan JesseGo the other day, and we were talking about characters that wear monocles.

Naturally, Mr.

Peanut came in, and her speculation was that the origin of Mr.

Peanut was that in the early 20th century, Planters was an idealistic socialist corporation that aspired to create a literal manifestation of the idea of eating the rich.

I like that.

I like that.

Yeah, I like that much better than any alternative, really.

I think it was like a contest, though.

This is what I gleaned from Wikipedia, but I mean, like, I think it was a contest.

Oh, hold on.

And a challenge.

Are you Emmy nominated?

Are you Emmy nominated?

Because Emily is, so I'm going with Emily here.

She's got multiple Emmy nominations for her work on Barry.

I don't say that wasn't why they chose the guy that looked like the rich that you could eat.

Right.

Okay.

that's a fair compromise.

But I do think that I think it was a contest and I think it was like a kid who drew it.

But maybe I'm just making that up now.

And can I also say congratulations on your Blockbuster Entertainment Award?

We'll see what Judge Hodgman has to say about all this when we come back in just a moment.

You know, we've been doing my brother, my brother, me for 15 years.

And

maybe you stopped listening for a while.

Maybe you never listened.

And you're probably assuming three white guys talking for 15 years.

I know where this has ended up.

But no, no, you would be wrong.

We're as shocked as you are that we have not fallen into some sort of horrific scandal or just turned into a big crypto thing.

Yeah.

You don't even really know how crypto works.

The only NFTs I'm into are naughty, funny things, which is what we talk about on My Brother, My Brother, and Me.

We serve it up every Monday for you if you're listening.

And if not, we just leave it out back.

It goes rotten.

so check it out on maximum fun or wherever you get your podcasts

all right we're over 70 episodes into our show let's learn everything so let's do a quick progress check have we learned about quantum physics yes episode 59.

We haven't learned about the history of gossip yet, have we?

Yes, we have.

Same episode, actually.

Have we talked to Tom Scott about his love of roller coasters?

Episode 64.

So how close are we to learning everything?

Bad news.

We still haven't learned everything yet.

Oh, we're ruined!

No, no, no, it's good news as well.

There is still a lot to learn.

Woo!

I'm Dr.

Ella Hubber.

I'm regular Tom Lum.

I'm Caroline Roper.

And on Let's Learn Everything, we learn about science and a bit of everything else too.

And although we haven't learned everything yet, I've got a pretty good feeling about this next episode.

Join us every other Thursday on Maximum Fun.

Please rise as Cable Ace Award winner Judge John Hodgman re-enters the courtroom.

I will not be delivering my verdict in the voice of Ayn Rand.

All of the impressions I've tried today have gone foul, and I would not disrespect Ayn Rand in that way by messing it up today.

Plus, I don't have the dress.

It's across the street, but I do have it still.

I used to do a pretty incredible act where I impersonated Ayn Rand, and I wore a dress similar to the one that she wore on the Phil Donahue show.

And then I would speak as her for a while, and then I would play the ukulele and sing as Ayn Rand, We're in the Money.

That was my act.

Wow.

But I will say that

Emmy nominations notwithstanding, and the genius of Emily Heller, notwithstanding, Mr.

Peanut is absolutely an oligarch.

He was designed to be an old-fashioned, wealthy gentleman, commissioned by the Planters Peanut Company.

In 1916, as part of a contest, a young schoolboy, Antonio Gentile or Gentile,

submitted the drawings of an anthropomorphic peanut.

Apparently, a commercial artist named Andrew Wallach added the monocle top hat and cane.

Frankly, no offense to schoolboy Antonio.

The adult did all the work there.

Yeah, those are the signature elements.

Just putting

legs on a peanut ain't shit.

You got two googly eyes on a peanut without a monocle.

You ain't got

put a monocle on.

You got something.

You got Mr.

Peanut.

And Antonio Gentile was given $5

and none of the rights to this now

more than 100-year-old mascot.

Although the owner of Planters put all the Gentile children through college.

So that's nice.

Noblesse oblige, I should say.

And I feel,

I enjoy, personally, I enjoy Mr.

Peanut.

I think that there ought to be more mascots with spats.

Never mind monocles and hats.

As far as I'm concerned, there are no other peanuts other than Planters' dry roasted peanuts.

That's correct.

Keep that lightly salted stuff away from me.

Double salt, if you don't mind, please.

No, the original is perfect, perfect stuff.

And obviously, I feel a certain kinship with Mr.

Peanut, insofar as I am also a famous corporate mascot.

But I will say,

as this role has been played by Uncle Jimmy, yes, terrifying, terrifying.

I urge everyone to please, please go to the show page at maximumfund.org and our Instagram account at judgejohnhodgman and see both the somewhat in focus image, but especially the blurry image.

Which now that I look at it, I said that it looked like it might be from an early 2000s Japanese horror movie.

I also feel like it might be from like a 1996 indie rock album cover, it feels like to me.

Feels like it might be be a super chunk album, a lost super chunk album.

Oh, chunk, chunky peanuts.

Hey, I resign.

Anyway,

it is obvious that Emily was totally terrified.

And it is obvious that when you scare a 2.75-year-old child, they may misremember some of the details.

Suddenly, they imagine Mr.

Peanut running out of the creepy woods, which is something I'm pretty sure I'm going to dream about tonight.

But the basics are there.

And anyone who has ever been scared by

a parent or an uncle when they were little at a family gathering can tell you that stuff stays with you.

For example,

when my wife, who is a whole human being in her own right, went with her sisters of an evening in Maine.

to walk by the scary graveyard,

only to find that her dad and his brothers and all of the family were hiding in the graveyard to scare them.

Oh my God.

After having a few too many cocktails.

It's horrible.

I may not be remembering that perfectly, but I know that my wife, who's a Holy Moon right, definitely remembers that perfectly.

Still feels scared.

Still feels scared.

And when it comes down to it, I appreciate that Uncle Jimmy takes

ownership of his actions and has apparently apologized several times.

He recognized trauma, and I hope that he's tried to make amends for it.

Can't say the same for you, Jess.

Charles, if you will.

There's one thing that I will not tolerate.

I believe you when you say that this is a fun family game, that you would never think of Mr.

Peanut at all were it not for its connection to Emily's past fears.

And that when you send her these images of Mr.

Peanut without permission or warning,

that,

yeah, you're teasing, but it's out of love.

That's some dangerous territory to tread.

There is settled law in this courtroom.

If it's not fun for everyone, it's no fun at all.

And frankly, Jess, your argument that Emily is secretly having fun

might carry more water with me if she hadn't asked you to stop doing it and you didn't stop.

And then Emily asked someone else to help her to get you to stop.

And that's me.

I urge you, I know it's clear, it's obvious that you love one another, but I urge you to remember that if someone says, please stop doing this, it bothers me, it is not cool to say, no, it doesn't.

That is not cool.

I know that you enjoy it, Jess.

And I acknowledge, Jess, that you're right, that Emily has,

to her credit,

processed and matured and grown.

and reckoned with her anxiety to the point that she is more Mr.

Peanut tolerant than before.

People who have allergies really have allergies.

It's not cool to throw some peanuts in there to try to prove that they don't have the allergies.

And she has real trauma.

Now, to her credit, Emily has worked through a lot of her trauma to the point that she now is more Mr.

Peanut tolerant than ever and

loves other weird mascots, including Gritty.

What do you like about Gritty, Emily?

Well, as I said, Judge, I believe I mentioned, you know, he actually is the antithesis of Mr.

Peanut.

He

is a champion.

I'm here to talk.

Yeah, he's a champion of the proletariat.

He's a champion of chaos.

And,

you know, he was born from nothing.

And,

you know, I think he stands in the face of Mr.

Peanut's quaffed exterior.

And I think would laugh heartily at his expense.

So I think.

I don't think that, to be fair, Emily, I don't think Mr.

Peanut has any hair to quaff under.

I was about to say.

What if he had a lush head of hair that stuck up in that top hat?

Actually, that would be pretty amazing.

A pompadour.

What if he had like curly harpo hair?

Yeah, that would be more humanizing.

Mr.

Peanut is uncanny and terrifying.

It's true.

But for all of that work that Emily has done to bring herself to this point, she doesn't need your help, Jess,

to go backwards.

And it doesn't mean that you get to choose where she is in her growth.

Now, I happen to think that, Jess, your evidence was well submitted in teasing out this evidence of Emily getting Mr.

Peanut fanfic curious.

Clearly, there is a transgressive charge.

And I would say that that transgressive charge that you are trying to provoke in Emily as part of your fun cousin family teasing would only be heightened by offering exactly what Emily has asked for.

You call it a preamble.

It's not a preamble.

It's a a trigger warning.

I want to send you a picture of Mr.

Peanut,

giving her an opportunity to say, no, I don't, I'm not in a place right now where I can see Mr.

Peanut.

And when she says no, Emily, I suggest you just go ahead and send a picture of Gritty saying no.

I wouldn't mind that.

I love Gritty as well.

Yes.

Yeah.

But Jess.

There might come a time

when you say, I want to send you a picture of Mr.

Peanut.

And Emily's like,

yeah, I really want to see that guy.

At least she has the option.

Got to see that nut.

Got to see that Mr.

Peanut.

I'm searching on fanfic.com all the time for him.

Well, she's an AO3 regular, actually, so

it could happen.

You know, if you say, I want to send a picture of Mr.

Peanut, and maybe, maybe Emily will say, don't send me the picture.

Describe what he's doing.

Tell me what he's wearing.

Yeah, we all know what he's wearing.

Top hat, spats, monocle, nothing else.

No pants.

Nothing else.

But I think that that's the only thing that's fair to Emily.

And I think there's still the option for you to reach out and

let your cousin know you're thinking about her and that you would like to re-traumatize her with her permission.

Otherwise,

believe what she says when she says it.

Honor what her requests when she makes it.

Give her a warning.

And if she says no and she sends you a gritty back, leave it alone.

This is the sound of a gavel.

Get out of here, Mr.

Beanut.

Judge John Hodgman rules that is all.

Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom.

How are you feeling, Jess?

I think that's fair.

You know, it does tone down my own fun, but I believe in consent as well.

And so,

you know,

I'll just ask Emily to remember that as well for the next time she wants to send me similar weird things that I didn't ask for.

Emily, how are you feeling?

I also agree.

I think that is a fair ruling, which I expected nothing less from the judge.

And

I actually, I can see this being a fun new element, you know, will she, won't she kind of thing.

So I like it.

I like the idea.

I just think it'll be a nice way to put a buffer between me and Mr.

Peanut, even though he does, I will admit, he does have some allure at this stage, you know, so gears removed from the event.

But I, but at the same time, there is some, there's some real trauma there.

So I appreciate this, this ruling.

Well, Emily Jess, thanks for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

Thanks for having us.

Another Judge John Hodgman case in the books.

In a moment, we'll dispense Swift Justice.

First, our thanks to Redditor Protogen for naming this week's episode No Legoom to Stand On.

Join the conversation at the Maximum Fun subreddit.

That's maximumfun.reddit.com.

We're asking for our title suggestions there, so keep an eye out for those.

A lot of fun when those get posted.

Evidence and photos from our show are posted on our Instagram account and Instagram.com slash judgejohnhodgman.

They're also posted on the episode page at maximumfun.org for this week's episode.

You can look at them in either of those places.

Judge John Hodgman created by Jesse Thorne and John Hodgman.

Our producer Valerie Moffat.

Our litigants recorded by Jeff King at Baker Sound Studios in Philadelphia.

Now, Swift Justice, where we answer small disputes with quick judgment.

Richard writes, On days when we're in the office, my coworker Mauro

and I usually get lunch together.

Today, we wanted different things, but we still walked downstairs together.

I left to get food, then he got a text from another co-worker saying there was free pizza left over from someone else's meeting.

Mauro went upstairs to eat and did not alert me so that I could also enjoy free, delicious pizza.

Please order Mauro to pay damages in the amount of $11,

which I spent on lunch unnecessarily.

Or, I guess he could buy me a coffee.

coffee.

Well, well, well.

First of all, here's a question for you, Richard.

And you too, Jesse, if you want to answer it.

Is all free pizza delicious?

No.

No, right?

I know this because I went to events with my wife when she was in law school for various law school clubs.

They often featured low-quality national brand pizza.

Right.

And it was always free and honestly pretty gross.

There's no reason to say that this pizza was particularly delicious, Richard, unless you know something more than I do.

I think that you just have FOMOP, fear of missing out pizza.

But Mauro is your coworker.

Even if they're your coworker spouse, they're not your spouse.

Mauro got the text.

He got the pizza.

Whether it was good or not, doesn't matter.

That's the way it goes.

Sometimes you have lunch with your coworkers.

Sometimes you don't.

Maybe there's a reason that you're not on that text chain for

that other department.

Maybe they got something against you, Richard.

I don't mean to make you paranoid.

But yeah, Mauro owes you nothing.

Nothing, I say.

Sorry about that.

But you know what?

Treat yourself to some nice, good pizza and don't share it with Marrow.

That'll be fun.

And then that turnout's fair play.

Hey, we're always looking for your submissions.

Disputes are what this podcast runs on.

So if you've got beef with your co-worker, your work spouse, your

regular spouse even, your dad, your mom.

your cousin, your sibling, your roommate, anybody that you've got beef with, whether it is old or new, whether whether it is big or small.

I want you to think about it.

I know you got one.

Send it in, please, to maximumfund.org slash jjho.

That's maximumfund.org slash jjho.

And hey, this is the last time we've got you in this Max Fun Drive episode of Judge John Hodgman.

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There's another banger coming next week, and we look forward to interacting with you on all the socials.

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