Live in Washington DC at the Lincoln Theatre

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

I'm Bill of Jesse Thorne.

This episode recorded live on stage in Washington, D.C.

at the Lincoln Theater.

We have some excellent cases for you, and we were joined on stage by our friend Linda Holmes from the pop culture happy hour.

And our musical guest was the great Brian Farrell.

It was a really fun night, and we're so happy to share it with you right now.

Let's go to the stage.

Washington, D.C., you've come to us desperate for justice and we're here at the Lincoln Theater to deliver.

Let's bring out our first set of litigants.

Please welcome to the stage Sarah and Susan.

Tonight's case, Emergency U in Court.

Sarah files case against her mother, Susan.

Susan is a volunteer EMT in a rural community.

Sarah would like her mother to refrain from responding to emergency calls when Sarah is in town visiting.

Susan feels a responsibility to respond to the calls whenever they come through.

Who's right?

Who's wrong?

Only one can decide.

Please rise metaphorically as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom and delivers an obscure cultural reference.

Bailiff Jesse Thorne, I yield my time on the floor to DC native Jay Jones for the cultural reference.

Please step forward.

So yielded.

When I get up all in you,

we can hear the angels calling us, and we can see the sun rise before us.

And when I'm in that thing, I make your body sing.

I make her say, wee, wee, oooe, wee, ooee, ooooe, wee, wee, ooi,

like a cop car.

Wee, wee, ooe, wee, wee, wee, wee, wee, wee.

Thank you, Jay.

Jay Jones.

Stand by, please, Jade.

Please swear them in, Bailiff Jesse Thorne.

Sarah and Susan, please rise and raise your right hands.

Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you, God or whatever?

I do.

I do.

Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the fact that he has never been an EMT, only a fraudulent medical doctor?

I do.

I do.

Judge Hodgman, you may proceed.

Sarah and Sis, you may be seated for an immediate summary judgment and one of yours favors.

Can either of you name the piece of popular culture that Jay Jones sang when we entered the courtroom?

Susan, let's start with you.

I think I heard it on TV show Active 911.

You heard it on the TV show 911.

Yeah.

Is that a TV show?

It is.

It's a real TV show.

What's that?

It's a real TV show.

It's a real TV show?

And as a volunteer EMT, is it your favorite TV show?

It's one I enjoy.

I don't get enough calls.

Let's get some pretend calls up in here.

Sarah, what's your guess?

My guess is it's that song that goes like, we, we, we, we, we,

like a cop car.

That one.

Well, it's not a bad guess.

We'll add that into the guest book, but my question I have to ask, I apologize, Sarah, is, do you know the name of the song?

The name of the song.

No, of course not.

Well, guess what?

Neither do I.

Jade, what is the name of the song please?

The name of the song is Mrs.

Officer by Lil Wayne.

Mrs.

Officer by Lil Wayne as performed by Jay Jones.

And Jade.

So Jade, you're a DC native and you're a theater person and a performer.

What's going on with you these days here in the District of Columbia?

Sure, I just finished Into the Woods at the Fords Theater, not to be confused with the Lincoln Theater.

Right, of course.

People easily confuse it because Ford's Lincoln.

We get it.

Oh, and this place totally named itself Lincoln Theater to confuse people.

Like, they're totally like, they're going to think Lincoln died here.

Then they're going to come, all the podcasts are going to come here.

All the history nerds are going to be like, let's go to Six Separate Toronto's Land.

We got tricked.

Correct.

Yes.

So I'm a musical theater actress.

I will be working at the Shakespeare Theater for the next six months.

So if you like

high art,

come out and see it.

My Instagram is LiddyOfficial.

I'm not making that up.

So, if you like Instagram, you can follow me.

How do you spell that?

L-I-T-T-Y

Liddy.

Official.

All I wanted to know is that there was no underscore between Liddy and Official because

all underscores are canceled.

All right.

Jay Jones, thank you very much.

We're going to hear the case, Jones.

Let's get to the case.

Sarah and and Susan.

Sarah, you bring the complaint against Susan, your mother.

Is that correct?

That is correct.

And you, Susan, you live here in the D.C.

area or no?

No, I live in the northern Shenandoah Valley, in a valley in Shenandoah Valley called Fort Valley.

A valley within a valley?

This is some inception stuff.

How deep does it go?

Are you...

It's a hanging valley.

I don't mean to be rude, but are you a mole person?

Are you simply describing the center of the earth?

It's a hanging valley.

It's actually a body.

What are you talking about?

Hanging, a hanging valley.

A valley doesn't hang.

A cliff hangs.

It was named by George Washington, right?

Well.

Wait a minute, Sarah, what's that supposed to mean about anything?

The fact that it was named by George Washington is supposed to sort of fill me with utter reverence, so I won't, I'll stop questioning the reality of what your mother is saying.

Oh, well, if it was named by George Washington, our first president, oh, no, you know what?

I believe patriotism is questioning authority.

And I question your authority, Susan.

What is a hanging valley?

It's a geological feature, and I don't remember how it, but it's actually above the Shenandoah Valley.

So your valley is a little bit above the valley.

So it's like here's the plateau, valley, and then woo valley.

Well not exactly but yeah.

It says here you live in the Shenandoah Valley but you technically live in the valley within the valley, the hanging valley known only as Brigadoon

or what is it again?

Fort Valley.

Fort Valley.

And there you are a volunteer EMT?

I'm a volunteer EMT.

EMT being one of the great crossword puzzle answers.

Those people know what I'm talking about.

And how many calls a week do you get, would you say?

We average one to two calls a week.

And

you said we, so there's more than one of you?

Yes, there's the active running EMTs.

There's about nine.

And when you say active running EMTs, you're people who are

who are not volunteers or?

No, no, we're all volunteers.

Some people are not released, which means you're licensed to practice as an EMT.

And some people

just have not been released.

And some people have just moved or gone away, but they're still part of the fire department.

Right.

And so

that's how it goes in rural communities.

It is.

Right.

I see you're wearing a hat, VFD hat.

It's a very hard initialism to pronounce.

Fort Valley Volunteer Fire Department, I presume.

Yeah, we're all volunteer.

We don't charge for services.

Oh, well, thank you.

Unlike the rest of America.

About eight of us, but a lot of them work outside of Fort Valley.

Oh, okay.

Over the mountain.

Right.

And so.

Just over the mountain or also through the woods?

A little bit of both, actually.

And you never know who's in Fort Valley when a call happens.

Right.

So when a call happens, how do you get alerted?

I wear a pager and I have a radio and it goes off.

Is this a valley in ancient times?

Yeah, I have a sub-question.

Are you a drug dealer in 1994?

You have a question within a question, a hanging question?

Okay, you have a pager.

I have a pager and I stop whatever I'm doing and I get my car, and I drive, and it takes about five minutes to drive to the fire department.

Right.

You should drive to where the person's having an emergency.

It depends.

Sometimes I do.

Okay.

All right, because you don't have the ambulance parked in your parking lot.

I have a jump bag.

All the release DMTs in Fort Valley have a jump bag that has an AED and things that you can treat a trauma with.

But it's...

Do you have that with you tonight?

Because I do some of that.

Yeah, it's in the parking lot.

It's wherever we parked when we got here.

Okay, fine.

I do take it with me wherever I go.

Right.

I'm sorry.

I asked, you're trying to answer my question seriously now.

I'm distracting you.

No, no, no.

If it's closer to me than the fire department, I go straight there.

And then somebody can go to the fire department and bring the ambulance to me.

Right.

And so there's eight people.

Voor Valley is 20 miles long and five miles wide, and we have about nine

released eight or nine

EMTs that

don't speak to your daughter.

She doesn't understand your life's work.

She wants you to stop.

And so if...

She knows nothing of what life is like in Fort Valley.

She's just hearing sounds coming out of your mouth and looking at you and wondering if they're like vampire weekend albums.

Her life is meaningless.

It's just a long string of avocado toasts.

I would follow that life path.

Like, if it were just like avocado toast, avocado toast, leaving to a grave in Greenwood Cemetery in Brooklyn, I'm there.

I'm on my hands and knees.

I'm just going to eat that up.

Follow that line.

Anyway, Susan, I apologize.

And so we meet, and sometimes only two of us show up, a driver and an EMT, and sometimes five or six people show up.

And when we get there, we decide who's the best team to go and take the person to the hospital.

And this discussion, I presume, takes about 45 minutes.

No, it takes.

Gosh, Susan, I don't know.

I mean,

you trained in CPR more recently.

Let's get our certificates out and look at them.

Who was the most recent person to train in CPR?

Will you hang on a second, ma'am?

We're trying to figure this out.

So

let's roll for charisma real quick.

Okay.

And And then you take them to the hospital.

Right.

Right.

And how did you get started in this line of not work, but volunteerism?

We moved there in 2012.

We have horses, and we found a beautiful place to move to with our horses.

And somebody that I met said, do you want to become an EMT?

And I said, yeah.

That's amazing.

So when you say we, you're talking about

your husband and your horses.

How many horses do you have?

Now we have four big horses and two minis.

Oh, wow so

I have pictures how tall are the minis

oh let the record show that Susan is indicating about three and a half feet maybe four follow-up three

three three okay do you have any miniature donkeys known popularly as donks no

I'm sorry Jesse I signed in your daughter's favor

Someday we'll find a case with donks for you.

What are the names of all the horses, including the miniature miniature horses, if you don't know?

Let's start with the four bigs and then go to the two men's.

Belle, Wally, Zario, Rags.

Yeah.

Zario.

Yeah, he's from Colorado.

He's okay.

Therefore, I understand.

You may not know that's a common Coloradan name.

For horses.

And the minis are Christopher Robin and Daisy.

Yay, four horses.

The miniature horses are kind of jerks, though, right?

No.

They're very sweet.

They're really nice.

Sarah's jumping in now to finally defend her mother.

Well, like ponies, you often hear have bad attitudes.

A lot of those attitudes.

Ponies have bad attitudes.

But minis are different.

Minnis are just little horses.

They're just little.

They are.

They're little horses.

They're like munching on them carrots.

I'm really upset that you didn't bring them today.

But that's okay.

I'll give you a third upside.

And you move to Mysterious Valley with your horses

in

retirement, if I may ask, or a change of life of some kind?

My husband is a consultant, and so.

I never understood what that meant.

It's a murderer for hire.

That's right, I have to imagine.

Okay, so your husband retired from mysterious consultancy, right?

And you moved to Mysterious Valley.

I know what it's really called, but I'm going to call it Mysterious Valley.

Mysterious Hanging Valley, Impossible Valley, USA.

And you just were asked to volunteer and you said yes.

And how many, you know, I don't want, I know you don't want to brag, but like, how many lives would you say you've saved or been part of the saving of?

Most of my job is taking sick people to the hospital.

I understand that.

There have been.

Thank you for that.

I'm certainly not saying you have to save a life every time or else it's not worth it.

Like, I'm certainly not saying you should say to whoever recruited you into this, like, this is boring.

These are just sick people.

I thought it was going to be life or death every time.

Yeah.

I got so excited when I saw them plunge that needle into the heart and pulp fiction.

And this is just a bunch of whooping cough.

Once or twice a year, we have somebody that we have to get to the hospital very fast.

We fly people out if they're having a stroke or a heart attack or have serious trauma.

About twice a year, you would say a life is preserved.

Intervention occurs that allows a life to continue.

Yeah.

And you've been, let's say, as part of the team, you are part of those efforts.

And how many years have you been doing this?

I think I've been released since 2014.

So that's

carry the right.

Five years ago.

So at a minimum, you've been party to five life savings.

Would that be fair to say, Susan?

I think that's fair to say.

So stipulated.

The point I'm raising, Susan, is that your daughter, Sarah, would rather those people have died.

Is that not so, Sarah?

I think some people would say that.

Yeah, I just did.

The fact that you are not saying no, no, no,

suggests to me that you agree with those people.

Is that not so?

That is not so.

All right, finally, you put your human mask back on.

Thank you for showing us who you are, though, to begin with.

So, Sarah, where do you live in this world?

I live in Charlottesville, Virginia.

Charlottesville, Virginia.

Thank you.

Thank you.

How are things there?

They've been better.

Yeah.

No, actually, they might not have ever been better.

I should stipulate that.

Sounds like you enjoy living there.

Yeah,

I do like living there, but there's some things

a brewing.

Yeah.

It's happening everywhere.

What do you do there in Charlottesville, if I may?

I am a grant writer for a small nonprofit women's mental health clinic.

Oh, well, thank you for what you do as well.

You are helping to save lives in a much, much more indirect way.

I agree.

But it is still important work.

I hope so.

And from time to time, you make the journey over the hill and through the woods.

It is brilliant.

And through the magic portal.

And

you find the wardrobe and you walk through it

into the impossible valley of Fort Valley.

It's not an easy place to get to.

No,

what's involved?

Is there a

switchbacks?

Switchbacks.

You have to go through the national forest.

Right.

That's why they have a volunteer fire and EMT department.

That's true.

Because people can't come in there to save lives.

Difficult.

You heard about the helicopter that they have to take in.

If anyone gets really sick.

I mean, it's basically a death bowl.

I know.

And my parents moved there when they retired.

Right, exactly.

And so when you go and visit.

Yes.

And you're hanging out with your mom and you're angry because she's responding to these emergency calls.

Tell me your side of the story

so I may dissect it.

So I have two small children.

They love to visit their grandparents.

They love to look at the horses.

Yeah, I was going to say grandparents, sure, but horses.

Yeah, you know what they're there for.

She got too many ponies.

Little Daisy and little, what's the other little one's name?

Christopher Robin.

Christopher Robin.

The whole audience is unison.

Christopher Robin.

So your kids love to visit.

Yes, they do.

And so what happens?

Let's just say you're there, you're hanging out you know doing something fun and then all of a sudden these loud sounds go off and my mom's just like you know like she just bolts what do you mean loud sounds just like loud tones you call them tones right yeah oh this is the

reggae airborne or something

it's yeah what do they sound like if sarah if you were going to impersonate them and they sound like it's like

that's probably not it at all What does it sound like?

Susan, was that a good impersonation or no?

No, she says.

Can you do it?

Beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep.

Oh, yeah.

I have an impression.

And then, do da.

What was that?

What was the last one?

Doo-da.

And then...

Doo-da.

No, thank you.

They have to change that one.

And then they tell you what it is, where and what it is.

They come over the radio then, John.

It's over the radio.

You can hear me now.

Do they come over live over a radio in your house?

On my pager, yeah.

Wherever I am.

Right, but does a voice start talking to you?

Yes, it's 911.

Oh, okay.

It's the people you call when you call 911.

So the 911 operators

push a button

and then they just start talking into the house.

Right, right.

And they say there is an emergency at blah, blah, blah, blah.

Who will respond?

And you jump up and say, and you jump up and you throw your children, your grandchildren off your lap.

Yes.

And you're like, I cannot wait to get out of here.

You just like trample over the Cami Land set.

Is this true or is this not true, Sarah?

It feels that way.

It feels that way.

You feel your mother is too responsive to these other emergencies and not responsive enough to your family time?

Yeah, I think that's accurate.

Okay, and when your mom jumps up and goes away, how does that make you feel?

You know, I could feel a little bit abandoned or a little bit out of sorts because I'm not, this is not my house.

Right.

It's their house.

And so I'm oftentimes alone with my two small children on a 20-acre horse farm in the middle of nowhere.

Right.

And you're just here.

What if you run out of carrots?

Then what are those little horses going to eat?

Yeah, they're going to miss.

She doesn't want us to play with the horses without her there.

Susan, why not?

Horses are large, dangerous flight animals that if you don't know how to behave around them because you don't come up and visit often enough.

That was good.

Do you feel that Sarah does not visit often enough?

I wish she could visit more often, but she and her husband both work.

It's difficult.

Well, isn't it the case then that since they cannot visit as often as any of you would like, I presume, that shouldn't you maybe turn your pager off and spend what time you have with them with them rather than leaving them at risk of being trampled by your wild horses?

Sometimes I'm the only EMT in Fort Valley.

I thought you said there were like eight or nine of them.

Are they all just blowing it off?

Yeah, they are.

Tell me, Sarah.

So she is the person who takes the most calls year after year.

She's the lieutenant, the EMS lieutenant.

So she's like the most caller.

She's not Mrs.

Officer.

She's Mrs.

Lieutenant.

Yes, she's the lieutenant.

But she, I think at times, people know that she's there and that she's going to respond to all the calls.

And so they're like, meh.

What, you're talking about sick people?

They're like, no.

Whoa, she's the only one left.

I think this is a good time to get sick.

The other EMTs.

Oh, I see.

So I think that they know that she's dependable, so they can just sort of like.

Oh, they're taking advantage of her.

They're taking advantage of her.

Yeah.

Do you have any actual evidence that this conspiracy theory is true?

Susan is shaking her head.

No, Sarah says she knows.

She understands.

I get it.

Susan, do you have any other option?

Can you press the pause button?

Can you assign your responsibilities for a period of time to another volunteer EMT?

That's not how we work.

We don't take duty shifts because you can go a week or more without a call.

And so

if your duty, you know, you spend all that time waiting for something to happen that never happens.

So

the way it works there is if you are in Fort Valley and able to respond, you go.

When you get to the call, like I said earlier,

the person who is best able to deal with whatever the situation is Does so.

Does so.

Right.

I am a top responder, but I'm not.

Oh, not to brag.

Is this about your medallion status, ma'am?

Top responder.

Well, they have a banquet every year and they give you.

You get four stars every time.

Oh.

You get access to all the responder lounges around the world.

There's a responder upgrade available.

You get it first.

So no, I imagine that it was like a rideshare driver situation where every time someone has a heart attack they're they're pestered by their phone to rate their EMT driver four stars top responder but I

the number I respond to is significantly less than the number I transport people out of Fort Valley so I

frequent and that's a usually it's a total of about three hours to take somebody to the hospital and get everything done right so you respond you show up someone else is better qualified to deal with it you go back on home.

Right, right.

Okay, so tell me about the last time that your mom responded to a call.

I don't know if I can remember the exact last time, but

one that sticks in my mind is that she had invited me and my family to visit them for the weekend, that she was going to teach my daughter and I how to make strawberry jam.

Nice.

It was very

lovely, grandmothery gesture.

Right.

And so we get all the strawberries and the sugar in the big pot on the stove.

Right.

And then the tones go off.

And she's just gone.

And then I have this like giant

strawberry jam.

Get out of house immediately.

I have this big pot of like sticky strawberry goo boiling on a stove.

And I've never, I don't know how to make strawberry jam.

And how they can Mina Guan make jam.

Yeah.

Then I have this big responsibility and no mother.

Yeah, well certainly no one comes home to visit their parents to have to spend time with their children.

But how long was she gone for before the strawberry jam project restarted again?

I mean she was gone, I think at that time you did take them to the hospital.

And so you were gone for several hours.

I don't know.

The strawberry jam got made.

It could have been tastier.

Could have been tastier.

Susan, do you recall this incident and do you remember what the the emergency was that you were responding to?

I remember the incident, but I don't remember

and I really couldn't tell you

because of HIPAA laws what the incident was.

Suffice it to say, it might have been something more of an inconvenience than having half-made jam lying around.

I would assume so, because I really wanted to do it with them.

And if that person needed to go to the hospital, or we could have flown them out.

And it takes pretty much everybody to get everything set up for flying somebody out.

So, and it takes a long time.

So what do you like about doing this, Susan?

I like

helping the people in the community.

I like knowing that I'm being supportive.

And, you know, I do like the adrenaline rush.

Do you think...

Sarah, you say you have two children?

Yes.

And what's their ages and styles?

I have a six-year-old daughter and an almost three-year-old son.

So the three-year-old son is just a creature who just eats Legos and doesn't know what's happening.

So that's.

No, I agree completely.

But your six-year-old daughter is obviously cognizant of what's happening and that her grandmother is going away to save lives.

Yes.

Everyone's very proud of her.

Everyone's very proud of your mother.

Right.

Yes.

And

while obviously it is a sad situation that your daughter can't make jam with, what does she call you?

Grandma?

Goggy.

Goggy.

Could this get more adorable?

I think this is the last episode of the podcast, Jesse.

I think this is it.

Yeah.

We better close with a miniature donkey or we're busted.

Don't you think that even though she's sad she can't make jam with her Goggy, she appreciates that Goggy's got responsibilities and is kind of a superhero?

For sure.

And you know what?

When we go to visit them, my mom takes us to the fire station and lets them climb up into the ambulance and the fire truck.

Right.

It's like super high-level grandma.

But you're not asking your mother to stop being a top responder.

No, not.

Just a medium responder.

Yeah, I think

sometimes responder.

I think that she does take a lot of calls.

I do think that she has even mentioned that people don't always respond when they know that she's there.

Well, obviously, you've already accused the Fort Valley, and this time I'll remember the name, because you are accusing the other members of the Fort Valley Volunteer Fire Department of being creeps and shirkers

who go out of town or I should say out of Valley

when they know your mom is hanging around because they're like, we can go away.

We can F off.

Top Responder will take care of it.

And when they're even there, they get the beep, beep, beep, beep, beep.

And they're like, never mind.

Susan's got it.

They're all a bunch of losers and wasteoids.

These are your words, Madam.

You feel that she takes on more responsibility than she has to.

I think so.

Yeah.

Do you think that that's true, Susan, or no?

No.

No.

And you would never betray your colleagues, even though secretly you know Sarah's right.

No.

Let the record show that she is saying no, but I know that she's saying yes.

No.

No.

You know your colleagues and you trust them and you have each other's backs.

We have each other's backs.

Backs, yeah, exactly so.

So it's Sarah who's lying.

It's Sarah as a fabricator.

That hurts.

I think that that was a sincere form of feeling.

I think that was a sincere expression of feeling.

Does it hurt?

Oh, it does hurt.

Yeah, I will admit, yes.

It does hurt to feel like, you know, she actually doesn't like to leave the valley because they depend on her.

So she doesn't come and visit us as often as I would like.

And when we go to visit them, sometimes we'll be alone there for almost the whole weekend.

She can't, it's not every time that we go that she gets a call, obviously.

Like it's one of the things.

I think the records show that Mrs.

Lieutenant Officer just gave her daughter some serious side eye.

I miss that.

It It was when you said sometimes we come and visit and she's barely there for the weekend.

Yeah, I think that's accurate because it's not just the time that she's away, it's also that it's hard physical work that's also mentally and emotionally taxing and she needs to rest afterwards.

Sure.

So she'll go and do it and then she'll come back and maybe take a nap or rest.

It's understandable, but she's still away.

Your father, your husband, is alive and in the picture?

Yes, he is.

Yes.

So is is he also volunteering and doing stuff?

No.

So what do the children call him?

Guppy.

I'm sorry, I didn't hear that.

It's Guppy.

Did you say Guppy?

I said Guppy.

Guppy and Goggy.

God, I wish we could just drop the mics and walk off stage.

Where is Guppy in this picture?

When Goggy goes away, doesn't Guppy step in and help out with the jams and the things?

It's a 22-acre horse farm.

There's a lot of work to be done.

Like, when we go up, it's the weekend.

He's been working all week.

Like, he's off, like, doing farm chores.

Do you have brothers and sisters?

I do, yeah.

Where are they in the world?

They live in upstate New York.

Do they visit and have similar complaints?

They would not go on record as such.

Oh, right.

You won't betray your colleagues either.

Do you have any sources in the deep state?

No comment.

So, Sarah, if I were to rule in your favor, what would you have me rule?

I would like it that when we come to visit, that she tell her colleagues that she would be unavailable to run calls and that she would turn off her pager and the radio for the weekend.

And also, this is something we didn't talk about yet, but she also is like very active in the firehouse.

And like, sometimes we'll go up there and she'll be like, oh yeah, there's bingo tonight, so I got to leave at three to go, like, run bingo.

So, so that she would just tell me if it's going to be a bingo night before we get there.

So, you might plan ahead and not come for a bingo night.

Or just get a new grandma back, right?

Have you ever considered hiring a substitute coggy to hang around?

Oh, no.

Goggy.

Is it possible for you to tell your colleagues I'm taking the weekend off?

I mean,

I'm not talking about possible for you personally, but like, would it be acceptable within the

laws of the volunteer fire department?

It's not something that people do

ever.

Unless you're drunk, no.

Well, a solution has just presented itself.

I've heard everything I need to in order to make my decision.

Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits

the courtroom.

Sarah, how are you feeling about your chances in the case?

Oh, I knew coming into this that I was going to be the unsympathetic character.

No,

what are you, reality show producing our podcast?

Everyone in the family that I told we were going to do this, they're all like, you're going to lose.

Susan, how are you feeling?

I hope I

am

supported supported and keep get to keep doing what I feel is necessary to do.

I

hold your applause.

Well, we'll see what Judge John Hodgman has to say in just a moment.

Please rise as Judge John Hodgman re-enters the courtroom and presents his verdict.

So, my dad

is a grandparent to our children, a very devoted grandparent.

He also does a lot for his community.

He helps raise money for teacher development in the Brookline Public Schools, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

He's a great dad.

He's a great dad.

Great grandparent.

He is

trained as a bookkeeper originally and has an actuarial view about existence, which is to say he lives with one foot in the grave.

He is constantly extrapolating towards death.

And at one point I was visiting him

a few years ago when our children were a little bit younger.

And he said, I would like to set up a schedule where I see

your children every three weeks, either here in Boston or Brookline or New York, one visit or another.

I'm like, that sounds fine.

Sure.

And he said,

I've calculated, the reason I want to do this

is that I have calculated that I have about

four more years where they will want to spend time with me.

And I said, hang on, Dad.

I understand what you're saying.

There is a period of transition when kids become preteens and teens, where they individuate and they don't feel as excited about spending time with guppy and Goggy.

You're not wrong to think ahead to that time, I suppose, but if you are calculating the amount of time you have left, then the time you spend with them will be overshadowed by that, and it will become a self-fulfilling prophecy, and they'll realize that you're a death-obsessed weirdo.

If you just take it a little bit easy and not think about it that way and spend the time with them, you don't know how long they will enjoy spending time with you.

And I thought that that was very insightful, my part,

until I realized his calculations were absolutely correct.

Almost to the day.

I mean,

he didn't show me the spreadsheet, but I know there is one.

And while my children still love their guppy, They are now on their way in their own lives, and they are not as interested in making strawberry jam with him.

You know, this is what happens when you have children.

I don't need to tell you, Susan.

They are the entire investment of your life, and you are the entire investment of their lives for a very intense period of time, and then they grow up and

they reveal themselves that they have always been whole human beings the entire time.

They've been tricking you into thinking they were just a reflection of your own self that you could take pictures of and put on Instagram and and get street cred for their cuteness.

But that's all over now because now they're there, now they want to be away from you.

And they go away, and that's a hard thing to deal with.

And particularly when you go through transitions like that and then into later adulthood and retirement, these are big transitions, big life changes, and you have to find a way to make yourself feel happy and fulfilled and reconnect.

Don't

stick it.

Let the record show that Susan just stuck her tongue out at Sarah.

Because you think you have it in the bag, don't you?

No.

You think you have it in the bag.

No, not at all.

I think you do.

No.

You and your friends sit around the firehouse

talking about how, no, anyway.

You don't have it in the bag, goggy.

I know.

You're a top goggie, but you don't have it in the bag.

Still figuring it out in my head.

That's why I'm talking so much.

So

your mom went through this transition that you're going to go through, right?

And the transition she made was to go to a fictional valley,

surround herself with dangerous horses,

and throw herself into the service of her community, both in terms of life-saving and bingo.

And I know that you're proud of your mom.

I am.

You have your own family now,

and I think that you will come to appreciate, if not now, then later, that while I'm sure Gagi loves you and her grandchildren very much,

she loves her life.

This is it's inc.

Look, I know you're grateful for your mom.

It's incredible to have a parent when you're an adult who is self-sufficient, engaged, healthy, saving lives,

dodging horses, I don't know what's going on.

She doesn't always dodge them.

Do they get you sometimes?

A neighbor blew up something and they knocked me down.

Who knocked you down?

A neighbor blew up something really big and my horses knocked me down.

Why are we not talking about this?

John, we have other justice to discuss.

I know, I'm sorry.

I'm sorry.

I just want a series of novels set in your world.

Is that so much to ask?

A trilogy, at least.

You know, lots of people have adult parents

who are not capable of taking care of themselves, who have

big,

who do not manage this transition well.

Maybe they have financial issues, maybe they have health issues, or maybe they're just like,

you know, charting their course to the grave, like my dear father is doing.

I love him so much.

This should be a point of joy for you.

And while I appreciate that it is hard that when you go to Fictional Valley to get a break from your children so that you can pretend to be the retired mom that your mom is

and she's not there to stick around and take care of it,

that it's frustrating and also hurtful because you have traveled far and wide through various dimensional portals to get there.

Several, yes.

I

share your suspicion, Sarah.

Thank you.

That there, that there is that your mom has taken on a mantle of responsibility, a heavy mantle of responsibility, that her drunk colleagues do not share.

You don't have to tell us.

Which may or may not be true.

Just as you will not snitch on your siblings, so she will not snitch on her fellow FVV FDs

but nonetheless I do not think she will put it down lightly and it's clear she will not put it down even for her own daughter

I cannot compel her to put down that mantle of responsibility I appreciate that it's frustrating

instead of having her be the role model of the goggie who stays at home and makes jam You have a wonderful role model of the goggie who starts making jam and then kicks it off the stove because someone else is calling

because her life is an adventure novel.

That's true.

Your siblings were right.

You are wrong.

This is the sound of a gavel.

Judge John Hodgman rules.

That is all.

Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom.

Thank you to Sarah and Susan.

Thank you.

You're listening to Judge John Hodgman.

I'm Bailiff Jesse Thorne.

Of course, the Judge John Hodgman podcast, always brought to you by you, the members of maximumfun.org.

Thanks to everybody who's gone to maximumfun.org slash join.

And you can join them by going to maximumfun.org slash join.

The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by Quince.

Jesse, the reviews are in.

My new super soft hoodie from Quince that I got at the beginning of the summer is indeed super soft.

People cannot stop touching me and going, that is a soft sweatshirt.

And I agree with them.

And it goes so well with my Quince overshirts that I'm wearing right now, my beautiful cotton Piquet overshirts and all the other stuff that I've gotten from Quince.

Why drop a fortune on basics when you don't have to?

Quince has the good stuff.

High quality fabrics, classic fits, lightweight layers for warm weather, and increasingly chilly leather, all at prices that make sense.

Everything I've ordered from Quince has been nothing but solid, and I will go back there again and buy that stuff with my own money.

John, you know what I got from Quince?

I got this beautiful linen double flap pocket shirt that's sort of like an adventure shirt.

And I also got a merino wool polo shirt.

Oh.

It's like a mid-gray, looks good underneath anything, perfect for traveling.

Because with merino wool, it like it basically rejects your stink.

You know what I mean?

It's a stink-rejecting technology, John.

It says, get thee behind me, stink.

Yeah, exactly.

And, you know, honestly, even if I do need to wash it, I can just wear it in the shower when I'm traveling and then

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That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash JJ HO to get free shipping and 365 day returns.

Quince.com slash JJ Ho.

The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by Made In.

Let me ask you a question.

Did you know that most of the dishes served at Tom Clicchio's craft restaurant are made in, made in pots and pans?

It's true.

The Brace Short Ribs, Made In, Made In.

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That heritage pork chop that you love so much, you got it.

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But Made In isn't just for professional chefs.

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And even some of your favorite celebratory dishes can be amplified with Made In cookware.

It's the stuff that professional chefs use, but because it is sold directly to you, it's a lot more affordable than some of the other high-end brands.

We're both big fans of the carbon steel.

I have a little

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And I know that she can, you know, she can heat that thing up hot if she wants to use it hot.

She can use it to braise if she wants to use it to braise.

It's an immensely useful piece of kitchen toolery.

And it will last a long time.

And whether it's

griddles or pots and pans or knives or glassware or tableware.

I mean, you know, Jesse, I'm sad to be leaving Maine soon, but I am very, very happy to be getting back to my beloved made-in entree bowls.

All of it is incredibly solid, beautiful, functional, and as you point out, a lot more affordable because they sell it directly to you.

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For full details, visit madeincookwear.com.

That's m-a-d-e-i-n cookware.com.

Let them know Jesse and John sent you.

Please, everyone in this wonderful theater, put your hands together once again for Brian Farrow.

You only have to say

so much

The rest you can say by touch

Don't struggle over words Don't fret over verbs

Me and you

I know what I've heard

Only speak your native tongue.

I hear your intention

sung,

the sweet melody be found over me.

Brush my skin, the meaning within

tangle fingers and no delay.

What more

is there

to say?

Firmness of hands

hid

that demand

Not one word can speak those commands

So

You can find me at

kidbyfaro on Instagram and brianfaro.com.

Thank you all so much.

Y'all hear the guitar all right?

Land of the brave, home of the free.

Don't want to be mistreated by no bourgeoisie.

Cause it's a bourgeois town.

Oh, this bourgeois town.

I got the bourgeois blues, and I'm gonna spread that news all around.

Me and my wife, we was upstairs.

Those white folks downstairs said

they don't want them around here.

Cause it's a bougeois town.

Oh, this bourgeois town.

I got this bourgeois blues.

I'm gonna spread that news all around.

Yeah

Them folks in Washington, they know how.

Call the color man names just to see them bow.

Cause it's a bourgeois town.

Oh, this bourgeois town.

I got the bourgeois blues, I'm gonna spread that news all around.

Tell all the color folks, listen to me, all all the colored folks, raise your hand real quick.

Tell all the colored folks, listen to me.

You don't want to make your home in Washington, D.C., because it's a bourgeois town.

Oh, this bourgeois town.

I got the bourgeois blues.

Gonna spread that news all around.

Can y'all clap with me?

Hold on.

I got you.

There you go, that's where it is

This is the legacy of your town in any grow, it just changed the mold

Don't play ignorant, y'all should know nothing's gonna change until the veto rolls so

Get your lungs ready, scream and shout as I go ahead and take this song on now.

Cause it's a bourgeois town.

Oh, this bourgeois town.

I got the bourgeois voice gonna spread that news all around.

Y'all can sing it too.

Cause it's a bourgeois town.

Oh, this bourgeois town.

I got the bourgeois booze gon' spread that news all around.

Oh,

I got the bourgeois gon' spread that news all around.

You know, we've been doing my brother, my brother, me for 15 years.

And

maybe you stopped listening for a while, maybe you never listened.

And you're probably assuming three white guys talking for 15 years, I know where this has ended up.

But no, no, you would be wrong.

We're as shocked as you are that we have not fallen into some sort of horrific scandal or just turned into a big crypto thing.

Yeah, you don't even really know how crypto works.

The only NFTs I'm into are naughty, funny things, which is what we talk about on my brother, my brother, and me.

We serve it up every Monday for you if you're listening.

And if not, we just leave it out back and goes rotten.

So check it out on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your

All right, we're over 70 episodes into our show.

Let's learn everything.

So let's do a quick progress check.

Have we learned about quantum physics?

Yes, episode 59.

We haven't learned about the history of gossip yet, have we?

Yes, we have.

Same episode, actually.

Have we talked to Tom Scott about his love of roller coasters?

Episode 64.

So how close are we to learning everything?

Bad news.

We still haven't learned everything yet.

Oh, we're ruined.

No, no, no.

It's good news as well.

There is still a lot to learn.

Woo!

I'm Dr.

Ella Hubber.

I'm regular Tom Lum.

I'm Caroline Roper, and on Let's Learn Everything, we learn about science and a bit of everything else too.

And although we haven't learned everything yet, I've got a pretty good feeling about this next episode.

Join us every other Thursday on Maximum Fun.

Should we introduce our special guest on tonight's program?

Yeah, that's right, we have a special guest expert witness.

Surprise witness, folks.

Yeah.

Let's please introduce this this person, won't you?

You know her not only as one of the greatest friends of Judge John Hodgman, the coiner of our classic phrase,

by the way, I just claimed it for us, I guess, by saying our classic

phrase, Little Weirdsies,

off-referenced on this program.

She's one of the hosts of NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour.

Please welcome Linda Holmes.

Linda Holmes.

Yes.

Yes!

Yes!

Linda, what a delight to see you.

It's a delight to see you too.

It's a real thrill to have a successful podcaster here tonight, folks.

This is a very imposing show to be part of if you're a person who has no act.

I feel like the Baroness Schrader, I'm like, I would.

I'm not the same way.

I'm like, I would have brought my harmonica.

Do you play harmonica?

No, but it's the Baroness Schrader.

Some of them know.

Oh, I'm sorry.

Right?

I miss her.

It's the sound of music.

The Baroness.

Oh, yes, right.

When all the children are singing, and she has this wonderful line.

She's like one of the best characters in all the films.

And she says, oh, I'd wish I'd known something about the singing, and I would have brought my harmonica.

And it's this wonderfully dry.

Yes.

She deserves so much better.

Ice coming out of her mouth.

Absolutely, in the best way.

When you're young, you think that she's a villain.

And I'm not the first person to observe this, but when you're young, you think she's a villain, and then you're kind of like, meh.

Yeah, no.

When you've seen enough Moppets, it's like, hmm.

I don't belong here.

And

she lets him go, basically.

She does.

And she tells him, go get your nun.

When I was a kid, my dad used to play the harmonica very badly.

He would bring on a tape, a cassette tape, and then just play along with it with his set of harmonicas.

He was terrible.

And I thought it was the worst thing ever

when I was 10 years old.

I would just be like, look at my dad, oh God,

oh, playing the harmonica.

And I feel like growing up is understanding that actually

it was the greatest thing ever.

Yeah, absolutely.

So, Linda, you obviously observe and comment on popular culture, but you recently became a best-selling novelist, the author of Evie Drake.

Evie Drake Starts Over,

Evie Drake Starts Over.

True.

And how does it feel to be on the other side?

Well, it feels, right now it feels tense because I have to write another one.

I have a contract for another one.

When's the due date?

The first draft due date is April 1st.

Oh, you'll never make it.

You know, as a former publishing professional, I can tell you, those deadlines mean nothing.

Yeah, but here's the thing.

The deadline of every book contract should be April 1st because it is meaningless.

But here's what you don't know.

Okay.

The original one was September.

Oh, you've already blown by a deadline.

Yeah.

Make them wait.

Make them wait, Linda Holmes.

You two are Maine buddies, aren't you?

You two are both Maine enthusiasts.

Evie Drake Starts Over is set in the Great City.

It's true.

It's set in Maine.

It's set in Midcoast, Maine.

If you've ever been to the kind of like Rockland, Camden.

Wonderful part of Midcoast, Maine.

It is set in that area where I vacationed vacationed frequently when I was a kid.

But you don't come back as an adult?

Yeah, I do.

I do when I can.

We came back a couple times to the same cabins that we used to rent when I was in high school or middle school.

My family came back when we were all, when my sister and I were adults and she had little kids.

But then I also went back a couple times while I was working on the book.

I actually wrote most of the second draft in the public, I wrote a bunch of the second draft in the public library in Camden, which is

very beautiful if you've ever been there.

And you didn't call me either.

I was there probably.

No, but I will tell you, one of my trips to Maine, I came back and I saw the banana man.

Oh, really?

Yeah.

Jonathan Niederer, the fresh banana man?

I saw the fresh banana man.

I stopped at the rest stop and I came in and I said, I know you from the internet.

Oh, really?

Yeah.

And I was not the first person to have done this with him.

And he was basically like, yeah.

Yeah, nobody loves being the fresh banana man like the fresh banana man.

God bless him.

That's kind of how it went.

Yeah, this is some old school Judge Sean Hodgman stuff.

Listen to the archives.

In any case, time is short and there is still injustice.

Let's hear some more cases, but we have to be fast because we're moving along here.

Time moves in one direction.

Jesse Thorne, what do you putting 10 minutes on the clock so we can hear three

cases in swift succession, what we call swift justice, shall we?

Please welcome to the stage Liz and Emmanuel.

Liz

and Emmanuel.

Now, full disclosure: I must reveal that I saw Liz and Emmanuel at Tattooed Mom Bar in Philadelphia last night.

You're visiting from Philadelphia where you live, is that correct?

Yes.

Right.

And who comes to this court to seek justice from me, John Hodgman?

I am taking Emmanuel to court.

You are, you are, and what is your complaint against Emmanuel?

I am lactose intolerant.

And

thank you.

Such a classic JJ ho-woo.

And often when we go to get coffee, I will first order like a soy mocha, for example, and then Emmanuel will come up and order after me, and they will order like a mocha with regular or normal milk.

Emmanuel will order regular milk.

Yes, normal milk.

Normal milk

to differentiate their milk from your soy milk.

Yes, so you feel othered.

Yes.

Yes.

Is this a matter, Emmanuel, of cow milk hegemony?

I mostly just panic.

I think they found the key to the heart of the Judge John Hodgman listener.

Well, I mean, Emmanuel, I happen to know that you use they, them pronouns.

Yes.

So obviously you appreciate the

irony in normalizing one certain kind of milk

against all other milks that

you have chosen to accept that there is not a normal

in human personhood and interaction and so forth.

So what leg do you have to stand on?

I mean a lot of it just comes from severe anxiety around like ordering and like talking to anyone.

Right.

And so like so normally she'll order first and it might not even be something I want but I'm so panicked that I will just be like I want this

same thing but you go back to ancient social training

and conditioning and you're like normal milk.

Yes.

What would you not that weird stuff?

I'm not her.

What would you prefer that they say dairy milk?

I think that saying something like, I would like whole milk or 2% milk

would address their concern of not wanting to have a longer conversation, quicker even than saying normal milk.

Because they have been asked sometimes to clarify, right?

Sure.

I was also a barista for a while, and so I know too, like, I'm not going to pretend that there isn't a standard.

So, if somebody would say, I want a medium latte,

they will default

to dairy milk.

So, they don't have to add normal.

I see.

So just don't, so just say milk.

Yeah.

Sure.

It would be part of your argument.

Yeah, you know, regular milk.

Oh, damn, I just did.

The anxiety defense is a strong defense in the court of Judge John Hodgman.

Panic attack while ordering coffee is something I can feel.

Like, that's for sure.

Can I argue again?

Yes, please.

So.

Yeah,

Liz Liz felt me wrapping it up.

She's like, this is not over.

So can I argue more?

I grew up lactose intolerant, obviously, and my mother, for my entire childhood, called my milk special milk.

Oh.

So I have.

So this is bringing up some trauma for you.

Yes.

Right.

Yes.

What's your favorite kind of non-dairy milk?

Soy.

Soy.

You don't care for the oat?

That's big in the podcast right now.

Yeah.

I'm okay with oat.

Soy is my preference.

And then there's almond, almond milk.

What are all the milks, Linda Holmes?

My favorite is cashew, personally.

Cashew milk?

Yeah.

They make that out of a cashew.

Yeah.

We get cashew almond milk and Emmanuel drinks it.

Right.

Here is my order.

Thank you, first of all, for coming to the court of Judge John Hodgman.

Emmanuel, you have to say milk or

dairy milk.

Stop othering

Liz's soy milk, and I appreciate that it makes you anxious, but maybe you can just print out a little card

that says,

I suffer from ordering anxiety.

Please just put regular milk in my coffee.

This is Santa McGann.

Emmanuel and Liz.

Please welcome Julia and John.

Julia

and John.

Julia and John have entered the courtroom with a bottle.

John has something on a plate, and Julia has a bottle of maple syrup.

For the at-home listener, I just want to clarify, John is wearing a Bonneroo t-shirt,

and the rest of the clothes a guy wearing a Bonneroo t-shirt would wear.

I was really hoping you would say that.

Something.

Say something.

I presume that you you are here to seek justice for John's outfit.

Is that correct?

And that this weird stuff on a plate and this maple syrup is just something you carry around every day.

I've given up on that one.

I see.

Well,

you are Julia, and you seek justice.

What is the nature of your complaint?

John scrambles our pancakes.

John scrambles

your pancakes.

And may I presume that what you have brought on stage is a scrambled pancake?

Absolutely.

Then I absolutely presume that.

John,

how do you

set aside

Set aside the fact that pancakes needed no improvement?

That it is a time-tested,

delicious, though not for me as a sweet.

I don't care for sweets.

I don't have a sweet tooth.

I have an alcohol molar.

A time-tested thing,

primarily tested through time and improved through time by the work and labor traditionally of frontier women, but that you, a white man in the 21st century,

have figured out a new way of making pancakes.

Setting aside all of that context.

How do you scramble a pancake?

First, I just want to address the history of this.

They're actually.

So you're telling me, actually.

I'm prepared.

Look, if you've done some serious pancake history, because I don't know what I'm talking about.

Oh, yeah.

I will definitely listen sympathetically.

Go ahead.

You got to understand the system, John.

Yeah, right?

Long ago, Francis Bonnaroo was at Birdingman.

So actually, in the early 1900s, scrambled pancakes were invented in Germany, I believe.

Oh, and were they called scrambled pancakes?

Actually, wait, this is wait.

I got it on a cocktail napkin.

Okay.

I can see you've done a bonnaroo level of

the screen.

Wikipedia, a cocktail napkin.

Wikipedia and a cocktail napkin.

That's all you need.

Yeah.

A cocktail napkin is otherwise known as a bonneroo book.

Does anyone have a spent piece of hash I can write with?

Cigarette, yeah.

It's called Kaiser Schmarn.

I can't say that.

Here, let me see it.

Yeah, there you go.

Oh, very nice handwriting.

Kaiser Schmarn.

Or aka

Emperor's Mess.

Emperor's Mess.

Linda Holmes.

Also, what America is known as.

2019.

Linda Holmes, I am passing the evidence to you for your scrutiny, and perhaps you may want to ask a question or two of the witnesses.

Did you begin scrambling your pancake because you want to salute the history of the Kaiser Schmachen Emperor's mess or because you can't make a pancake?

I was impatient and it cooks faster.

Okay, are you aware that the idea of a pancake properly made is that it has like a slightly bit of a crispy outside and then it's like soft in the middle.

I like the chewiness all around.

Hey.

I give up.

I want to follow up Linda's question.

Did you learn of the history of the Kaiser Schmartzner?

And like, hmm, I want to give that a try.

That sounds interesting.

Or did you just f up a pancake?

And then be like, I bet there's a German word for this.

And like everything you think there's a German word for, you are right.

Yeah,

I was pretty hungover.

Interesting.

New layers emerge.

I think as hangover food, it's clearly acceptable, I would say.

My question is, you wanted to make a pancake fast, which is to say, you don't know when to flip a pancake.

Right?

Because it's hard.

It's hard to know.

Julia, do you make pancakes?

Yes.

And do you make good pancakes?

Yes.

What do you like?

What size do you like?

Medium.

Sometimes I throw a couple mini or large, depends on how I'm feeling.

You ever make it?

I think we're trying to say mini and large were synonyms.

Sometimes I throw a couple mini, also known as large.

I also come from a long line of pancake makers.

My father has made a pancake for breakfast every morning since probably I was born or before.

Oh my goodness.

So by long line, you mean you and your father?

Yes.

It does sound like her father counts as several.

That's fair.

So he eats the pancakes of many men.

Your father makes a pancake every morning.

I bet he's good at it.

He is.

What is his technique and

what did he teach you?

I learned more by watching because it's a very, you know, it's his thing and it's the size of the pan, so I usually get a slice.

What are you talking about now, Tuba?

It's huge.

He makes a huge cake?

Huge pancakes?

A huge pancake.

It's really good, but it's not quite what we're making.

Why do you associate only with men who don't understand what pancakes are?

I thought your father was going to be a role model instead of some other weird creep.

Yeah, this whole thing is something you need to address with your therapist, not us.

When you make pancakes, it's just regular pancakes, right?

Not giant pancakes, not scrambled up pancakes, round pancakes in a cast iron pan or maybe a nonstick pan.

Cast iron and I usually do blueberry or chocolate chip.

Right.

And I do them very traditionally.

I'm a very traditional pancake maker.

Except the chocolate pancake.

Pancakes.

I'm sorry.

I said, except the chocolate chips.

Those are not traditional, really.

I think that they're Belinda's steam.

Wow, I'm finally a voice for real pancakes.

And the crowd turns on me over time.

Could you elaborate on that?

On the not-traditional part.

Well,

you know, I think that the Judge John Hodgman crowd is always going to boo the exclusion of chocolate chips.

It's the only thing they love about the podcast.

They pick out the chocolate chips and they leave the rest of the podcast on the plate.

All right, I'm going to try these scrambled pancakes.

Now,

do you want to put maple syrup on?

Let me do a taste with you.

So they do have almonds and coconut oil.

It's like almond.

What are you doing?

I mean, I just got my head around scrambled pancakes.

But you're one of these guys who's like, let's add on, add on.

Anybody guy Fianti?

You know what this needs now?

Some jalapenos.

It's like Emerald.

Like, bam.

Yeah.

Thank you for that, that ancient shout out to my friend Emerald Johnson.

So you added in, I appreciate your warning me from an allergy point of view.

Yeah.

The coconut oil is no problem.

Actually, a very good cooking oil for stuff like this, in my opinion.

When you're trying to cook eggs or pancakes or something that'll release easily.

But the almonds are chunked up in here?

No, it's like, so it's like almond meal flour.

It's like.

Jesus.

Are you gluten-free?

Is that what's happening?

No, I'm just weird.

No, there is no normal.

Understand, Emmanuel?

All right, so this is not wheat flour.

No.

Common flour.

Yeah.

Coconut oil.

Any other allergens I should know about?

No.

He learned to do this at a Dr.

Dog concert.

All right, add the maple syrup.

Thank you.

Let the record reflect that they have a 75-gallon bottle of pimple syrup.

It looks like nice maple syrup.

Is there something you want to talk about?

Is this your dad's big maple syrup company or something?

No, I wish.

Okay, what brand is it?

I think it's Trader Joe's.

Is there maple in the maple syrup?

Because I'm deathly allergic.

This basically tastes, first of all, it's got a very nutty undertaste.

And

for that reason, it's a little extra savory, and I like it.

It tastes like you are a three-year-old who took your pancake.

It tastes like you're a three-year-old who like instead of eating his pancake grabbed it in his little hands and went moosh moosh moosh moosh moosh and left it behind and I'm the older brother going like I'll eat it

But altogether it's not an unpleasant taste.

My question is what kind of mess does it leave behind in the pan?

Exactly.

A big mess in the pan.

And then I go to make my pancakes right, and I don't have a pan.

Right, because you don't clean the pan after you do your emperor's mess in it.

We have two pans.

I rule his and her pans, one for the emperor's mess, one for Julia.

Never touch her pan.

Keep your pan and your weird plans to yourself, sir.

Julia and John,

please welcome Jason and Allison.

Jason and Allison, who comes to this court to seek justice before me?

I'm coming to seek justice.

Thank you.

And you are Allison, I presume?

I am.

And what is the nature of your dispute?

I feel strongly sometimes when there has been some form of injustice towards myself or my husband that I want to speak up and say something to correct it.

And that makes my husband very anxious.

Well, that all sounds very reasonable and rehearsed.

What do you, what is actually going on here, Jason?

So sometimes there's like an awkward

social situation that kind of calls for a comment, and she'll say, I'm going to say something, and I really hope that she doesn't go say something.

Why are you worried that she wasn't going to say something?

It's like a spidey sense, it just feels really wrong.

Just like that she's talking, or no.

yeah

sorry walked walked around no I do have a question though I do have a question I I need an example like like are we you don't want her to say something about politics or you don't want her to say something about somebody punched you in the face or

when we moved into our house our next door neighbor used to tie their dog to our front tree

To your front tree.

To our front tree.

And Allison is upset.

Yes.

I was.

We at the time had two dogs ourselves yes and the the tree was clearly in the center of our front yard and this dog could the the leash would reach to our front porch

and so this little dog would be barking on our front porch it sometimes would bark at our neighbors who were walking on the sidewalk right and since it was tied to our tree

they thought you yes they thought that a-hole dog was yours correct and and it's really weird that your neighbor tied their dog

to your tree.

Yes, I agree.

What was going on there, in your opinion?

I think they had done it for years before.

We had just moved in.

Oh, I see.

Yeah, and so we...

So rather than trying to blend into the neighborhood gently and go along with the traditions and customs, you kidnapped the dog.

Mr.

Bobo, I had nothing against him personally.

He was a pleasant enough dog.

Is the dog or your neighbor?

Mr.

Bobo's a dog.

Mr.

Bobo is a dog.

Mr.

Bobo's the dog.

Goggy is the neighbor.

Is Mr.

Bobo no more?

Mr.

Bobo and his family have since moved.

Oh.

Yes.

Not our fault.

Not in any provable way.

No.

In fact, we became friends.

So ultimately, I confronted

Mr.

Bobo's owner.

Yes.

Senior Bobo.

But this was awkward for you?

It just felt so weird.

Yeah.

Tell me more about how it made you feel.

We would see them a lot, and they were very friendly, and I had

to feel weird.

We had two big dogs at the time, so I would walk them a lot, and so it just felt like I wanted to crawl inside myself.

It was kind of...

After she confronted me.

Correct.

Yes.

But was there any sense that there was a bad feeling about this?

No.

Do you feel that your sensitivity to this issue is the fact that you're

gentrifying a neighborhood where they don't speak English?

I do want to share this, the neighbors who ultimately did move away before they moved away, they came to our son's first birthday party.

We went to their granddaughter's first birthday party.

They're very good people.

No, I mean,

having hard conversations is part of being a neighbor.

They're not all easy.

And being willing to put yourself out there and engage in conversation, particularly if it's a cross-cultural conversation, is, you know,

whether it's responsible or brave or just basically human and decent, it's part of being a neighbor.

And I'm glad that that seemed to have deepened your relationship with your neighbors until they inevitably got priced out of your neighborhood and had to leave.

But that wasn't your fault.

Capitalism is fundamentally morally corrupt.

In any case,

I applaud your, presuming that you are not a sociopath who has tricked me.

I applaud your assertiveness,

and I encourage you, Jason, to be grateful that you have someone to hide behind.

Thank you.

Jason and Allison.

Live Justice from the Lincoln Theater in Washington, D.C., our thanks to all of the litigants who shared their disputes with us.

This episode, recorded by Jeff Bird, produced by Hannah Smith, edited by Jesus Ambrosio.

Our producer is the great Jennifer Marmer.

Follow us on Twitter at Jesse Thorne and at Hodgman.

Hashtag your JudgeJohn Hodgman tweets, hashtag JJ Ho.

And check out the Max Fund subreddit, maximumfund.reddit.com to discuss this episode.

We're on Instagram at judgeJohnHodgman.

Make sure to follow us there for evidence and other fun stuff.

And a hey, you made it this far into the credits.

You owe it to yourself to get more John Hodgman content by subscribing to iPodius.

Just, this is the end of this show, so you might as well listen to that next.

Yeah, if you're one of these real dead enders who goes all the way to the end of the credits,

you're definitely going to enjoy iPodius for sure.

We'll see you next time on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

It's you

I like

It's not the things you wear

It's not the way you do your hair But it's you I like

The way you are inside

Way down deep inside you

It's not the things that hide you

It's not your toys.

They're just beside you.

It's a hell of a lyric, Mr.

Rogers.

It's you

I like

every

part of you.

Your hair, your skin, your feelings,

whether old

or new.

I hope that you remember

even when you're feeling blue.

It's you I like,

it's you yourself,

it's you,

it's you

I

like.

That's our show, everybody.

Kid B.

Pharaoh over here

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