Weapons: An Interview with Zach Cregger

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Speaker 2 First of all, before we even begin today, I want to apologize for having an iPad here. Yes.
Because

Speaker 2 you look sad. You look pathetic.
I feel emasculated. You look weak.
I hate my iPad. I hate having a little iPad.

Speaker 2 My MacBook is broken. That is an excuse that I'm using.
And so I just want to apologize to you, sir, first of all. He's a newly powerful man.
I know. And I've arrived with an iPad like I'm a boomer.

Speaker 2 in Europe.

Speaker 4 I use my iPad 70% of the time, so I feel insulted by how ashamed you are.

Speaker 2 Have you ever gone to a meeting?

Speaker 2 when you pitched, when you went in to pitch Resident Evil, did you did it with a fucking iPad in front of you?

Speaker 4 No, I did not.

Speaker 2 Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Unbelievable.

Speaker 2 You don't look like a pussy. I mean, it's like,

Speaker 2 no, no, he doesn't, Eddie, and you're right. So welcome to Last Podcast and the Left, and we have a very special person on this guy.

Speaker 2 Honestly, what's funny about this man is that not only is he on his way to becoming an extremely powerful man in Hollywood, And is he becoming a legitimate and crazy director?

Speaker 2 This man started from the humble, humble beginnings of sketch comedy. Oh, don't say it.
Just like us. Just like our shit-filled lives.

Speaker 2 He pulled himself up from the swamp and he made it to the big time. What you think you're better than me? Yeah.
He think you're fucking tough. He fucking tough.

Speaker 2 He's fucking no nice with your fancy clear glasses. This is the director of the new hit, Weapons, and the former hit, current hit, Barbarian.
Woo!

Speaker 2 And one of the Lord creatresses of Whitest Kids you know, Zach Cricker. Thank you for being here.

Speaker 4 I'm so thrilled to be here. I love the show, and

Speaker 4 it's a treat. Thank you so much.
Henry, have you talked about how you came in to help me with Barbarian?

Speaker 2 Has that been discussed? Only little, little pieces. I came in and I, because I didn't even know what the full extent of my voice was used.

Speaker 4 Well, sadly, it wasn't used.

Speaker 2 Got it.

Speaker 2 Okay, okay. That's fine.
It's fine, though.

Speaker 4 It was very kind of you to help, though, because what was going on is I was trying to get the screen down for the mother, and I just could not get the screen.

Speaker 4 And I was listening to your podcast, and you were doing some fucking character, and you just like very casually went like, and then they go like,

Speaker 4 and you did this like amazing, blood-curdling shriek. And I was like, that's, that's what I want.

Speaker 2 I was like, it's a shriek.

Speaker 4 Like, he did it. And so I got a hold of you and you were so kind to come in and and i made you scream for 20 minutes it was awesome and it was it was my pleasure

Speaker 2 yes it was my pleasure no it was so much fun uh i actually it's a good bring up so like we know each other from way back in the day why this kids was always held as like this wonderful esteem because when we the girl the girl i'm sure you hated us just like every other sketch group hated you know what dude what's nice is that you guys were awesome each one of you was extremely sweet to us.

Speaker 2 You never made us feel stupid. We were told, because we were the only other independent sketch comedy group, when we arrived, we were like a part of a pastiche of independent sketch comedy groups.

Speaker 2 And like, you were like kind of the bastion. You guys were the light on the hill that, like, oh, if you just, if you're just funny and you're right place, right time, they give you a television show.

Speaker 2 And then you sealed up the door behind you. You really did.
Well, that was part of our deal. We're like, you can close the door.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 But the part of sketch comedy, I feel like now we're... We even had Biederman trying to help us for a hot second.
He couldn't do that. Oh, shit.
Yeah, he couldn't do shit with us. We tried.

Speaker 2 We were a fucking disaster. We were hammered.
We were disgusting. That was the problem.

Speaker 4 You think we weren't hammered?

Speaker 2 Are you kidding? God damn it. Come on, I'm talking shit.

Speaker 2 But a lot of people now, like, now, Jordan Peale, a lot of people are seeing this connection between horror and comedy.

Speaker 2 And I think it's getting kind of like, everybody's saying sort of the same thing, right?

Speaker 2 Where that comedy hinges on timing and visceral response which is very similar to humor but i think it's deeper than that oh tell me tell me well no i i wanted to ask you if you felt that exercising dark ideas through sketch comedy actually creates a darker vision for like the world in general

Speaker 4 what a what an amazing question that i have never really considered and I think you could be right.

Speaker 4 And here's why I'm going to go with you on this journey here is because all the brainstorming that we would do to sit down and just start like, okay, sketch ideas, sketch ideas, you know, because we've all been there like, what would be crazy?

Speaker 4 You just start pushing your brain to think of like, what's an extreme situation. And I did that all day.

Speaker 4 every day for I don't know how many fucking years I committed all of myself to whitest because basically a decade honestly you know? Same.

Speaker 4 So I think like if there's a gym, you know, like a mental gym, I was working out the muscle group that was like, how far can I go? You know, how can I, how can I go left when I should go right?

Speaker 4 You know, so maybe that's, maybe that's in there. Maybe some.

Speaker 2 I feel like movies are almost like a series of sketches, like getting you from scene to scene in a weird way.

Speaker 2 Do you think that horror movies like comedies hinge on pivotal scenes or versus entire arcs?

Speaker 4 Well, that's a great question too. I think, look, a horror movie must have scenes that scare you, right?

Speaker 4 If you watch a horror movie and you're never actually scared, but it's telling a great story, it doesn't mean it's a bad movie. It just means it's probably not really a horror movie.

Speaker 2 You know, it's a drama.

Speaker 4 So, yeah, or it's a mystery. It's a thrill, whatever it is, you know, I don't know.

Speaker 4 But I mean, the best horror movies will have those, but they'll still, like, you could take the scares out and it would still tell a compelling story.

Speaker 4 Like, the shining is still a fascinating story, even if it wasn't, you know, as viscerally terrifying as it is.

Speaker 4 Because I want to know, I want to track this guy's decline and I want to watch how his family has to react. I think that's that's a really engaging story.

Speaker 4 So, I'm trying to think of like a terrifying horror movie where if you took all the scares out, it would be like let's let's examine Terrifier 2.

Speaker 2 Sure, yeah, yeah, yeah, terrifier 2, which is like for me, I view that even closer to like a comedy in terms of you have set pieces, like Terrifier 2 has set pieces that the movie is sort of moving towards that

Speaker 2 allow these things to collide.

Speaker 2 Where, like, you did did that so well in weapons with the the kind of way you told the story where you set four lines out at each other and then they all collide together yeah but terrifier 2 is a much more deeply simplified version of what you did

Speaker 2 you know like it's a much more simplified it's much more direct it obviously is like we got to kill a bunch of people like you know like terrifier 2 you know the the idea is to get just

Speaker 2 piles of guts. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That is

Speaker 2 just, it's just kill, kill, kill, kill, kill. You know, by the way, I've really liked Terrifier 2.

Speaker 2 I am a big fan.

Speaker 4 When I went to Fright Fest in 2022, the only movie, I was like, I gotta clear my schedule to go see Terrifier 2.

Speaker 4 Because I had been, I loved Terrifier 1, and I was like, I can't believe I had to wait this many years to see this fucking thing. I am ready.

Speaker 2 I was really happy.

Speaker 4 I'm into it.

Speaker 2 I mainlined all of them at once just because I was literally scared to see them. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Because I just like, like, I'm like, I don't know if I can handle all this core.

Speaker 2 And then, so I was just like, then we interviewed David Howard Thornton. So I just watched all three like right in a row.
And that was fucking, that's the way to do it.

Speaker 2 And he's the simplest little cow poke southern boy. Have you ever talked to him?

Speaker 2 Park the clown? No. Oh, he's all like,

Speaker 2 well, gee golly, I don't even know how all this happened. I'm just a theater boy, and I just, I love musicals.

Speaker 2 And it was amazing, honestly.

Speaker 2 Last night, I had the pleasure of seeing weapons in a packed theater. Wednesday night.
Packed theater. Tuesday night, I saw it in a packed theater.

Speaker 2 And not just that, it was playing in multiple theaters at once. And it was like everyone was going to see weapons.
It was fucking awesome. That's wild.
But the reaction,

Speaker 2 there was a part in this that I wondered. People were talking in the lobby.
Oh, yes. Everybody was hanging out in the lobby.
You have such a great...

Speaker 2 Like, when you were making, when you were making this movie, you ever see Exorcist 3? Did you put Exorcist 3?

Speaker 4 I've seen Exorcist 3. I think it's amazing.

Speaker 2 Were you inspired at all by Exorcist 3? Because I think you have one of the best jump scares that I've seen in a fucking minute. Dead, dead in the room.

Speaker 4 You're talking about the ceiling.

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 4 Yes. I mean, that's got to come from Exorcist 3, but that's kind of a combination of three jump scares.
Obviously, the Exorcist 3 ceiling gag is not a jump scare. It's just deeply off-putting.
Yes.

Speaker 4 You know, it's, it's, and it's great. It's mesmerizing, and I love it.

Speaker 4 The Exorcist 3 jump scare, which is to my, for my money in the top five of all time, is the hallway crash zoom on that fucking lady with the cleat with the scissors.

Speaker 4 That to me, I'm getting the hair on my neck is standing up right now just thinking about that scare. It's so good.
I don't know how it freaked me out so much the first time I saw it.

Speaker 4 And it's one of those scares where I could still put it on right now and it would still kind of get me. You know, I love it so much.

Speaker 4 The other one, and this is a little less like hip cred here, but the conjuring, dude, the Bathsheba on top of the armoire when it tilted up and she jumps.

Speaker 2 I was not ready for that, dude.

Speaker 4 That annihilated me in the theater.

Speaker 2 Dude, the first conjuring fucked me up. It was the best.

Speaker 4 Dude, the clapping sequence, it's ruthless.

Speaker 2 I always think of Insidious 2, though, which is my other big commercial one where I almost killed my mother because I knew it was coming.

Speaker 2 I knew the, we saw it with my mom, and I knew the devil, the fire devil scene was coming. And so I crawled.

Speaker 4 It was like over the shoulder?

Speaker 2 Yeah, I crawled behind the chair that she was sitting in. I pretended to go to the bathroom, and I crawled behind the chair, and as it popped up, I almost fucking killed her right straight.

Speaker 2 Man, it was so worth it.

Speaker 4 But I do believe that's an insidious one, if I'm not mistaken.

Speaker 2 Yes, insidious.

Speaker 2 That's my other favorite jump scare. But like, when you're thinking about the movie, when you're writing it, like, do you think about it in that way?

Speaker 2 Like, for those jump scares, for stuff like that, like, because

Speaker 2 in weapons, it came at a very specific moment. Obviously, it felt like you were like, it almost felt like the movie kicks in hard.

Speaker 2 Like, you were watching and all of a sudden it was like, the movie changed is that you is that on purpose

Speaker 4 to a degree yeah so my writing process is usually very stream of consciousness i don't outline i don't know where i'm gonna go so like i remember the first pass i did at that point in justine's chapter i actually didn't really know where the kids went i didn't know what was behind them running away so i was kind of like just like improvising and and so i don't think i put that ceiling scene nightmare in because i didn't know that gladys existed yeah and so when did Gladys show up for you?

Speaker 4 I think in the cop stuff, when I was getting into Paul and the cop and the junkies when I kind of figured it out. Like I think by the time I wrote James's chapter, I had that idea.

Speaker 4 I was like, the kids are in the basement. Why, though? Like, why would the kids be in Alex's basement? It's just, it just felt like it's where they had to be.

Speaker 4 And then I, and then I just kind of had this idea of like, it's, this is going to sound really woo-woo, and I really don't like to talk about the meaning of the movie, but I have said this before, so I guess I can, I can let this much out of the bag because it's already out.

Speaker 4 But, like, the Gladys and Alex chapter to me is just about living with an alcoholic parent. I grew up in an alcoholic household.

Speaker 4 My dad died of cirrhosis, you know, and it's a terrible thing that comes into a family dynamic and it changes everything.

Speaker 4 And so, you know, I had a happy house and then something came into my house, and it turned my dad into a scary person.

Speaker 4 And I'd go to school, and everything's cool, and I'd go home and I'd have a scary house with a scary dad, you know? And so, like, that to me felt so interesting.

Speaker 4 And this is such a personal movie, so it's like it, yeah,

Speaker 4 there's no overarching like lesson in this movie. This is not like I have nothing to say with this movie.
I'm not, I have no pretense of like, this is a treatise or anything like that.

Speaker 4 It's just a diary entry for me, and it just felt good to kind of have this dynamic at the core of it that is something that I feel really a personal connection to that had a ripple effect out into this town.

Speaker 4 And so that's all that is.

Speaker 2 I got to say, because that came off of the movie. Like watching it, I did not read any of your interviews leading up to it.
I had no idea. I didn't even see a trailer.

Speaker 2 I didn't even, I didn't know what the movie was about.

Speaker 4 It's the best way to go in.

Speaker 2 That's my favorite. And so I went and watched it.
And the first thing that one of my first reactions that came off when I, when I saw it was,

Speaker 2 there's so many allegorical layers within this story that can be applied that you wonder if it came from such a, if it came from something personal.

Speaker 2 Like it felt like it, because it definitely feels like they're all, like,

Speaker 2 it feels like there's a lesson to be learned here, but we have no idea what it is. And everybody that's a responsible person inside of the movie is also like, there's a lesson to be learned here.

Speaker 2 What's the fucking lesson?

Speaker 2 And they're, and they can't figure it out. They all do what they think is right, and it just doesn't work out, man.
It's fucking funny. Yeah.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 I, I,

Speaker 4 I've, I've definitely been kind of cognizant of some of the, there's a lot of theories out there about what this movie's trying to say.

Speaker 2 And, you know, yeah, what part of the AK-47? Can I ask,

Speaker 2 was it just elemental? Like, is it just a...

Speaker 4 If I gave you the answer, I would be robbing something precious.

Speaker 2 Great.

Speaker 4 And it's like, you know what I mean? So it's like... Dude, you're crushing it, man.

Speaker 2 That's what I was saying. I think that's the idea is that that's what we liked about David Lynch is the fact that he didn't give a fuck about answering the question.

Speaker 2 He doesn't care to answer the question. That's exactly what Julie and I, my wife and I, said as soon as we left.

Speaker 2 It's like, I hate when fucking movies, especially our movies, sit there and they kind of overexplain everything. Let my brain torture itself.

Speaker 2 And it was amazing.

Speaker 4 Some things in this movie, I don't know why they're in the movie. I genuinely don't understand them.

Speaker 4 But because I do what David,

Speaker 4 I read David Lynch's book, Catching the Big Fish, right? Where it's just about transcendental meditation as a creative tool.

Speaker 4 Ever since I read that book, I incorporated transcendental meditation into my writing process. I wrote Barbarian that way.
I wrote weapons that way.

Speaker 4 And part of the deal for me is if that's going to be my process, I want to go, I want to like do it all the way.

Speaker 4 And so there's things that come into my writing that I don't quite get, but I love them. And I maybe I love them because I don't quite get them.

Speaker 4 And sometimes I'll write shit in, and I, it'll be a couple, like a couple of years go by, and then I'll actually realize what it means.

Speaker 4 And it's like, I maybe I must have known it all along, but I didn't, I didn't quite crack the code until later. And to me, that is like so,

Speaker 4 I just think that's so wonderful. It's just such a fun part of being a creative person: to just like

Speaker 4 tap into something outside of yourself and try and be a conduit, you know, whether it's real or not, or I'm just deluding myself, isn't even important to me.

Speaker 4 But the idea of like feeling like an antenna is wonderful. Check off, kind of, that was his thing.
He would give that advice to actors.

Speaker 4 He'd be like, creativity and good ideas don't come from you, they come from outside. And your only job is to like tap into the frequency and receive them from without.

Speaker 4 And I just think that, that like, why, why can't that be the case? You know, I like to pretend that that's the way.

Speaker 2 And it's also about experiencing maybe, I don't know if it's just getting older in a way sometimes too. I wonder if it's being able to accept,

Speaker 2 almost accept the mystery of yourself. Yeah.

Speaker 4 I mean, David Lynch went a step further. He said that ideas are out there waiting to be caught.
And if you don't catch it, somebody else will.

Speaker 4 And that's a really fascinating thing where it's like these, and I like to think of it like he says, catching the big fish.

Speaker 4 I like to think you go down under the ocean and there are these big fish swimming around and I can I can hook them but if I don't that story is going to get told one way or another you know like time time comes for for these things you know that's why sometimes we get a lot of similar things that all seem to kind of come out at the same time so right now you're in Prague shooting Resident Evil how's the human trafficking going by the way yeah it's been okay I could use more yeah I understand same same also it's yeah it's not bumper to bumper

Speaker 2 no no not there not there now my question is that, but now you're shooting, you're so speaking of process, so you go from this smaller process with

Speaker 2 obviously you got a little bit more money with weapons, but it was like it's still all you and it's an independent movie and it allows for that.

Speaker 2 With something like Resident Evil, when you're handed something that is this, like, kind of a blanket IP, do they give you that same level of trust? Or, like, is it

Speaker 2 a whole different way of making movies?

Speaker 4 I'm in a very fortunate position with this movie where I have I have the same amount of control that I had for weapons.

Speaker 4 Really?

Speaker 4 It's pretty cool. Yeah, I have Final Cut.

Speaker 4 I wrote the script and

Speaker 4 this is the movie I'm making and everyone

Speaker 4 is in. So

Speaker 4 it's a very,

Speaker 4 very fortunate position to be in.

Speaker 2 Did you have to change your brain and how you write movies in terms of like, is it a different type of movie than what you've made already?

Speaker 4 Okay, so, well, it's a totally different type of movie, but I wrote it like way before I went and did weapons.

Speaker 4 So, and it was funny because I wrote it kind of like carelessly because I was like, I'm never going to direct Resident Evil.

Speaker 4 So I'm just going to fucking write, like, I'm just going to have fucking fun.

Speaker 2 I'm just going to like.

Speaker 4 play around and just be like, what if this happened? Oh my God, they'll never let me. What if this happened? And by the time I finished, I was like, oh my God, I fucking love it.

Speaker 4 You know, and by the way, I think that is the other real special key to creativity is to be careless and to like have no regard for the result and and play like a little kid colors with crayons right you can always do that with like yeah exactly like kurt vonnegut has that amazing lesson he's like dude he you know kurt vonnegut how he always starts everything like yo dude yeah yeah hey bro yeah it's good it's good listen check it check it check it um no but he would say you know write three sentences on a piece of paper and know that as soon as you're done, you're going to burn the paper.

Speaker 4 And I promise you, you will fall in love with what you write. And that is because there is no result expectation.
And so it's just this pure thing.

Speaker 4 And so if you're able to get yourself in a position where you can write from a place of joy and of fun and of carelessness, then that's when the best stuff comes out.

Speaker 4 And so because I already knew I was going to make weapons and I didn't really give a shit about, you know, Resident Evil, I thought at the time, I was able to just write just from a pure, like, this would be so fun.

Speaker 4 And then I ended up with something I was like in love with. So now I get to go make another movie that I think is going to be like such a blast so it's it's cool

Speaker 2 are you working with the original writers of resident evil or how do they feel about it no do they even know what you're doing

Speaker 4 i don't know hell yeah

Speaker 2 yeah no you can't be saddled with that you can't be afraid of what the video game people are gonna do video game by the way I love those games.

Speaker 4 Sure, love.

Speaker 2 Obviously, you wrote the thing for fun. You know, of course you love it.
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 4 So like Resident Evil 4, I've probably put like 7,000 fucking hours into just that game alone. It's like embarrassing.

Speaker 4 So so I mean, I'm writing this as a true fan and I want it to feel like the way that I feel when I play those games.

Speaker 2 Do you go back and literally play Resident Evil like in your room? Like, will you go to your room and play it and then go back and play?

Speaker 4 Yeah, my PS5 comes with me wherever I go. I'm not joking.

Speaker 2 And I play every day.

Speaker 4 I don't play Resident Evil every day, but I play, you know, I'm a big video game guy. It's kind of, it's my only vice, really.

Speaker 2 Yeah, what are you playing right now?

Speaker 4 Right Right now, I'm playing two things. I'm playing the new mafia game that came out this week, which is Mafia.

Speaker 4 Which is, yeah, it's cool. And I'm playing, I'm replaying for like the fifth time, Tiny Teen is Wonderland, because I'm so excited for Borderlands 4 to come out next month.

Speaker 2 That's amazing. Wow, that's right.

Speaker 2 You see, this is good. It's a peek inside.
I love you going, I love you working at the idea of you making Resident Evil and then going back to your hotel room and playing more Resident Evil.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I am.

Speaker 2 I do it. When I was a cook, I used to go home and play Burger Time.
You know, so like, it's like.

Speaker 2 So I understand. Oh, yeah, dude.

Speaker 2 Should we want to ask any, do we want to do a little, let me do a spoiler? You want to do any spoiler questions?

Speaker 2 All right, sure, sure. Unless there's any other, like, generals before we get in there, because that's my problem.
We have so many questions about weapons. Yes.

Speaker 2 But I don't want people to fuck, you got to go see weapons. Man, first off, before we go.
Dude, it's so funny.

Speaker 4 I was trying to get you guys to come over to my house to watch movies.

Speaker 2 And I know, and I'm so sorry, though.

Speaker 4 I know you couldn't make it. I know, but it's just like, by the way, my wife and I are both such huge fans.
So the idea that you guys would come over and watch it, I would never offer anybody that.

Speaker 4 But Sarah and I were just like, and they'll come and we'll make it real nice.

Speaker 2 We were very excited, too. We were doing the same way.
We were the same. But Henry's dad had to fucking fucking.
Yeah, my father had to pick the fucked up fucking ass.

Speaker 2 All right, dude. No, he fucking did everything.

Speaker 2 It did actually hurt my summer schedule.

Speaker 2 And I did talk with my father's ghost.

Speaker 2 It's going to destroy so I do. Well, Barbarian, first off, before we go any further onto weapons, Barbarian like blew me away.
I didn't know it was you when I went and saw it.

Speaker 2 I went and saw it by act. Like, I was like, I'll check out this weird movie, you know, and I went and I fucking lost my mind.
I was, like, cheering.

Speaker 2 I was like, Barbarian and weapons, like, both when I walked out of there, I was like. jealous you know i was it was one of those i was like god damn fucking did it you piece of

Speaker 2 anyway it was so good man. I really loved it.
I was re-watching it last night before I came here. And I just love, we were talking about this, how you just like blow up everything constantly.

Speaker 2 Yeah, you're having to blow the fuck up.

Speaker 2 And it just makes me so happy, man. It's like, it's like, oh, you want a sequel? Fuck yourself, you know?

Speaker 2 But

Speaker 2 I just wanted to gush about Barbarian for two seconds. I'll take it.

Speaker 4 I'd love to hear it.

Speaker 2 What is happening? You know what's great?

Speaker 2 Because I feel like we're finally entering the world of modern horror movies where people aren't writing it from the aspect of like cell phones and the internet are a fad.

Speaker 2 I feel like you're finally embracing this.

Speaker 2 My wife and I were talking about last night about the idea of like an almost like an urban fairy tale. Where it's like, it's taking place within a believable environment.

Speaker 2 Like when you were working on Barbarian, Detroit obviously had a lot to do with the movie.

Speaker 2 When you were shooting this movie on weapons, it feels like I've heard several critics already say the idea of Stephen King-like, right?

Speaker 2 You've seen this Stephen King-like, and both Natalie and I both said the same thing, oddly enough, as soon as I was watching. And I was like, that's where Pennywise lives.

Speaker 2 Like, as soon as I saw that bridge, I was like, that's where Pennywise lives. 217 is all in the Stephen King world.
And then,

Speaker 2 is that overt or is that subtle? Is that like on the inside?

Speaker 4 It's not intentionally, but you know, I don't think you could be our age and grow up in America and have an interest in horror and not be totally baked by Stephen King.

Speaker 4 You know, it's just like, it's unavoidable. So I loved, you know, I read it in Junior High and I fucking loved it.

Speaker 4 So yeah, it's, I'd be a total liar if I was like, no, man, there's no Stephen King in this because it's like the Beatles. It's like, yeah, yeah,

Speaker 4 it's everywhere.

Speaker 2 Yeah, there's Beatles in it too.

Speaker 2 Right up, right up top, man.

Speaker 2 Yeah, dude. How'd you get the George Harrison song? Oh, oh, yeah.

Speaker 2 Oh, look at your shirt.

Speaker 4 Oh, fuck yeah, dude. Yeah, dude.

Speaker 2 How did you get that? How'd you get that song?

Speaker 2 What a great moment, dude. I was so happy.
I'm just singing. I was like, peace.
I was like, I ate a little mushroom pill. I was like, yeah, I love it.

Speaker 4 I was having a good time. That song is so good, dude.
I mean, we got it. We just had to

Speaker 2 pick it up. Pay out the ass.

Speaker 2 Dude, I've been listening to All Things Must Pass ever since I saw the movie, just over and over. Perfect album.
It really is.

Speaker 2 The music is.

Speaker 2 How specific, and how involved were you in choosing the music for the movie? Because i mean you wrote a bunch of it

Speaker 4 yeah i scored it with my two like best best friends yeah the holiday brothers or something holiday brothers yeah yeah ryan and hayes they're like two dudes i grew up with in arlington virginia we were in a band in in college and um they're really talented musicians and we just share a musical mind because we've made music together for so long and when i was doing barbarian i was just kind of like i just realized like if i could do this with ryan and hayes it would just be so like psychic you know mind meld easy and so on this one they they had never scored a movie before.

Speaker 4 I'd never scored a movie before, but I was just like, I want to just try this. And the studio was cool.
And so, yeah, I just brought my

Speaker 4 best buds to New York and we just did it.

Speaker 2 It was great. What is that process like, honestly? Like, when, do you, is the movie already cut and finalized by the time you're doing that?

Speaker 4 We did a weird, we did it weird because we, before I went to Atlanta and shot the movie, I got together with Ryan and Hayes and we went through the script and we scored the movie.

Speaker 4 So, like, we wrote like all this music, for each scene. And so, when I was shooting, I kind of had an idea of like, you know, how it was going to feel, which was really helpful.

Speaker 4 And then, when I was editing it, they came out, and a lot of that stuff didn't make it in the movie, but some of it did. And I didn't temp anything.
So, they were just there.

Speaker 4 And as I'm cutting the movie together,

Speaker 4 I'd cut with my editor, I'd go in the room with them, and then we'd start doing the music, and I'd go back with my editor, do some cutting.

Speaker 4 And so, so we were able to just kind of stitch the picture cut and the score together simultaneously. So, I never,

Speaker 2 you know, they kind of informed each other it was really cool but also the music the song choices were all like elementally in the same like it was a very specific vibe like it was like that yeah like and is that like the wear of darkness and the percy sledge are in the script i knew i wanted the handsome family song like while we were shooting and then that mgmt song at the very i knew i wanted i knew i wanted that like like from the very beginning i love that band i never heard that song before it was it's a good thing yeah it's off of their their live at the guggenheim album is is amazing and it is just as good as some of their studio albums so i i highly recommend it i feel like that's one of those things that also just either raises a movie up or destroys it yes is the the soundscape in that way of like choosing because it really there's something about your song choices that made it feel like the suburbs it made it feel like a place that's safe You know what I mean?

Speaker 2 Like a place that you're in a safe place. You're being held by this like warm, understanding music, but it's obviously an extremely unpredictable world.
Yeah, yeah, I just love it.

Speaker 2 Great work, bro. Yeah, great fucking work, bro.
Also, thank you, Toby. Also, totally dug the Steamboat Willie, you know, usage.

Speaker 4 Oh, yeah, that's crazy, right? Because this is the year that like Steamboat Willie came up for public domain.

Speaker 4 And so, my costume designer was like, we can do this, and it won't be like totally played out.

Speaker 2 And I was like, let's fucking fuck out. That is awesome, man.
Just watching them go around, fucking covered in blood.

Speaker 4 Dude, all right.

Speaker 2 So, spoiler zone, I guess. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 So, you know, we're going to ask some specific questions about weapons. Just go see fucking weapons.
Yes, please go see this movie. I had so much fun.
The whole

Speaker 2 people were cheering and clapping during the movie. Dude, I will say, this is the biggest, one of the biggest kudos I can give to the movie.

Speaker 2 We were sitting next to two teenagers that were trying to fucking have sex with each other the entire time. I could definitely, they were hammered and they were trying to have sex with each other.

Speaker 2 They stopped to watch the movie. Wow.

Speaker 2 It doesn't get better than that. Yeah, that is as good as it gets.

Speaker 2 Only half penetration, man. They couldn't go all the way.
And then I was like, let me show you.

Speaker 2 Hey, hey, let me show you what to do. Let's do what my father did for me.
Oh, man. All right.
So, Benedict Wong was fucking awesome. It was a great choice having him in the movie.
The eyeballs.

Speaker 2 How the hell did you do the eyeballs? Was that CGI or was that makeup?

Speaker 2 That's VFX.

Speaker 2 I thought he could do that.

Speaker 2 That's good. That's great.
I'm glad you thought that.

Speaker 4 No, it looked real as hell. Yeah, it's crazy because what we did is like, so, you know, they scan his face and then they build his face in the computer, right?

Speaker 4 It's like these artists like meticulously build it.

Speaker 4 And then they basically create this system where I could go in and look at the cut and then they could, they had a little slider that would just do the bulge and the size of the eyeball so they could just go like all the way up and it looked like fucking insane Roger Rabbit or like back down.

Speaker 4 And so it was really fun to kind of like, you know, let's try it a 5.2.

Speaker 2 So that's crazy.

Speaker 4 Let's try it a 6.1.

Speaker 2 You know, it's really wild. It was so fun.
That's awesome, dude. When it came to the magical practices of your, is it fair to say you could maybe call weapons almost like a witch movie? Yeah.

Speaker 2 Oh, yeah, of course. Yes.
And when you built out her specific, because also Amy Madigan.

Speaker 2 Holy fucking shit. Terrified.

Speaker 2 Holy fucking shit. She's fucked up.
She's got to get her teeth fixed. Yeah, she's good at therapy.
She's all fucked up.

Speaker 2 But it's like, when she was making her, the magical practices and all the stuff that she was doing, are you like, did you have a firm idea of what it was that she was doing?

Speaker 2 Did you and Amy have a long conversation? Or was that like just kind of like, let's play it like it was like, you know, like you know, but nobody else has to know?

Speaker 4 You mean in terms of the rituals that she was doing?

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 4 No, no, no. That I worked out way in advance.

Speaker 4 And that was actually pretty complicated to try and get it because it has to like like serve different functions in different scenes, but it has to stay consistent.

Speaker 4 So that was something I worked on with my production court, my production designer, Tom Hammock, and I. We really kind of like

Speaker 4 ironed out together how the ritual would go. And that was fun to kind of create your own magic rituals.
There's a Mekons. You know, there's this punk band, the Mekons.

Speaker 4 And they have this song called Dancing in the Head. And it's just about, it's instructions on how to create a zombie using like voodoo.

Speaker 2 And it's fucking awesome.

Speaker 4 And I was going to call the movie Dancing in the the head at one point and and it and it's just the idea of like soak a dollar bill in rum and then light it on fire and have four windows that aim at the four corners of the earth all this i just love that kind of stuff and there's this great book called serpent in the rainbow which is a true it's like a non-fiction book about you know haitian magic and stuff like that great movie too

Speaker 2 anyway i i haven't um i haven't uh

Speaker 4 I didn't want to use real stuff, but it was such a fun opportunity to create my own, you know, rituals.

Speaker 4 So like I invented that tree and the idea of like, you know, it's all kind of adjacent to existing magic practices, but it's fake, you know.

Speaker 2 No, I recognized it, honestly, and I really appreciated it. She was never related to them, was she?

Speaker 2 I don't know. Ah, come on.

Speaker 4 That's why I do think it's fascinating that the way she describes her relationship is different from the way that Whitmer Thomas describes it. Exactly.

Speaker 2 He's like, so we saw her one time when she 15 years ago, and then the other one was like, I don't know if I've ever met her. I was just like, that's fun.
That was a great.

Speaker 2 When it came to Gladys' look, was that a long conversation? Was that a conversation between you and Amy in the production?

Speaker 2 Or was that, does Amy just, did you have to like convince Amy to not look like that? No, Amy. Did she just arrive like that?

Speaker 4 She's dead.

Speaker 2 No, no, no.

Speaker 2 I was like, Amy, can we kind of like dial it down a little bit? She's like, nope, in for a penny, in for a pound.

Speaker 4 So, yeah, her look is based off off of the in Twin Peaks Firewalk with Me when he gets out of the, out of the plane and there's that woman on the tarmac, that scared the fucking shit out of me.

Speaker 2 Scared me so bad.

Speaker 4 So I was just like,

Speaker 4 that is always kind of in my mind. And then the photographer, Cindy Sherman, who I've always adored.

Speaker 4 I don't know if you're familiar with her, but she does these self-portraits and she uses prosthetics to create this like uncanny valley asymmetrical look.

Speaker 4 And she's always like photographing herself looking grotesque. And it's awesome.
So I knew I wanted to incorporate some of that and then there's um

Speaker 4 there's just like that boca raton old retiree kind of fashion sense that i just think is so great and so trish somerville who is my costume designer and jason collins my makeup designer we we we had a wonderful time figuring out how to like build gladys it was because i i love it because it's obvious gladys is trying to figure out how to fit in

Speaker 4 right yeah i kind of Yeah, I like the idea of like Anton Shiger, you know, like how he's like, he's just kind of impersonating what he sees around him.

Speaker 2 So he's got this

Speaker 4 stupid haircut and his clothes are too clean. It's like he went into a Western store and just like didn't look too hard and he's just kind of like, he's impersonating something.

Speaker 2 I like the idea that it's like

Speaker 4 I'm not saying that Gladys is a demon, but I've just, I like the idea that it's just like, it's just off, you know, and that's that's what's so fun.

Speaker 2 Did you get any trouble from the Naruto people?

Speaker 2 I'm in litigation now with them, and it's a very awesome.

Speaker 2 Is there any fun? How is that going?

Speaker 2 Because it's hard. I do understand, especially after the Area 51 incident, people get pretty sensitive about running styles.
I was like, honestly, that was pretty fucking awesome.

Speaker 2 That's like, what a great visual.

Speaker 2 When you're writing it, like, is that one of those things that you just kind of saw immediately?

Speaker 2 Like the way that they were, like, the way, because they're fleeing almost like birds. They're They're running like, it's such a beautiful picture.

Speaker 4 And in the script, I think what I wrote, I know, was they run like the way that it's a terrible image, but that little girl in that famous Vietnamese war photograph with the napalm was.

Speaker 2 That's no, but that's a, that's really, that cements it, though. Yeah.

Speaker 4 It's like the worst image I've ever seen.

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 4 And it really fucked me up a bit. And so I, you know, I don't think, yeah, so I think that was in there.

Speaker 2 Dude, that it just because it really it it serves it serves the work like

Speaker 2 it's really amazing just hearing you talk about how much was both happenstance and but mixed with planning and stuff like it really shows that like movies are little miracles

Speaker 4 They are absolutely little miracles. Every single one of them is.

Speaker 2 They are.

Speaker 2 The fact that you could put it all together, the fact that all of these things happen and they all, like, but I think that partially it's because you're, it's also you're, you, you delivered a great lesson to our audience about the idea of getting out of your own way and just making it like playing it as it lays.

Speaker 2 You're going to make it as it comes out.

Speaker 4 I think, I think that's a really healthy practice, you know, and it's, it's that David Lynch thing. It's like you go, you go inside of yourself to receive something from outside of yourself.

Speaker 4 You know, it's like counterintuitive, but I think, I think it's, I think it's a, it's a real thing.

Speaker 2 And, um, because you aren't like an autocratic monster on set. You're not all like.
I know that's in the goddamn movie. I don't care.
Like, is it one of those where? Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 No, no, I try not to. I mean, I want everyone to have a better idea than me because then the movie gets that much better.
You know what I mean? So, yeah.

Speaker 2 One thing I really dug was like the tiny details that kind of like were misdirects.

Speaker 2 You know, you like, you think you think it really to me anyway, maybe I'm an idiot and it did mean something and I didn't think it did, but like,

Speaker 2 like, like the people drinking and stuff. You think, like, you know, the relationship between the cop and

Speaker 2 Julia Gardner, you know, like, I love all that stuff. And it kind of just like, and then it just becomes like, at the end of the movie, none of it matters.
And I thought it was.

Speaker 4 I've heard that worded as a criticism of the movie.

Speaker 2 I like it.

Speaker 4 I appreciate that for you, that's a good thing.

Speaker 2 But no, no, it's like, that's one of the things people don't like. It fucks up my brain.

Speaker 2 Like, because I'm going one way, and then all of a sudden it's like, oh, shit, it's this, you know, and it's like, I like that.

Speaker 2 No, it's about how everybody in the movie is willing to blame anybody else but the actual problem.

Speaker 2 Like, that's how it feels. Everybody's looking for a very simplified answer to an more than

Speaker 2 an answer to a question that literally there is no answer to. Yeah.
Yeah. So they, that's that, that's how I viewed it, where it's like, you have all these people that desperately want to help.

Speaker 2 The cop wants to help. You know, like Julie wants to help.
They want to help. They're like, even the even Josh Brolin, what is it like working with a movie star like that?

Speaker 4 It's wild because like Josh is, first of all, he's very cool. Like he's a very chill, like disarming, funny, kind of, he's a good hang, you know?

Speaker 4 So I'd kind of gotten to know him a bit before we started shooting. So, you know, I was starstruck when I first met him because it's like Josh fucking Brolin, like no country for old men.

Speaker 4 Like what, I don't even know what to say.

Speaker 4 But,

Speaker 4 you know, he's he's very, very good at quickly kind of disarming you.

Speaker 4 And so by the time, you know, we were like having our first day on set, I didn't, you know, he's just Josh, you know, it's like, it's easy.

Speaker 4 But I remember I'm looking at the monitor and he stepped in front of the camera and I'm watching it on screen. And I had like a real like, holy shit, it's Josh Brolin.

Speaker 4 You know, it's like, it's a moment. And

Speaker 4 I felt like

Speaker 4 so fortunate in that, in that moment.

Speaker 2 Like, I could just have this for the whole fucking movie.

Speaker 4 All the time. It's crazy.

Speaker 2 What is that difference? Because I see me on camera.

Speaker 2 I'm like, oh, god but then when you see a like um that like what makes a movie star like what is it about it it's a big head first of all he's gotta have you gotta have a big head

Speaker 2 helps josh jack black jack black literally has the largest dome i've ever seen on a person humphrey bogart giant he was like half head

Speaker 4 I have no idea what it is, but it's like every angle, there's just something that you're interested in. You know, there's something you can't quite figure it out, but you're just drawn in.

Speaker 4 I don't know what it is, dude.

Speaker 2 And maybe it's just a...

Speaker 2 That's a real thing though and that mystery is what sometimes turn I guess turns them into like weird when they turn into like you know like weird MAGA dudes is that what happens to like the older movie guys sometimes because they're like they're like I used to be interesting I think they were yeah like John Voigt yeah John Voyage

Speaker 2 I used to make love to my daughter every day I think there's a reason they were such good bad guys all the time you know like

Speaker 2 they were bad men yeah yeah yeah but Josh Brolin I love how in the movie like they all like they're against each other and then it just shows in society, you just need that one thing to happen, and then all of a sudden we're on the same team.

Speaker 2 And, like,

Speaker 2 all you need is a bulging-eyed zombie man to physically attack a woman, and then you're willing to

Speaker 2 be. Yes, a common enemy is usually an attack is what will do it, right?

Speaker 4 All right, so at the risk of

Speaker 2 asking this for, because I don't want you to, like, you know, do it. What did Josh Brolin do as a producer? I noticed he was a producer.
What is that? Is that, you know, like, I'm just curious.

Speaker 2 That's a little bit of movie magic. That's a little bit of movie magic.

Speaker 4 You know, look, he was helpful with like helping with some schedule stuff, and he's helpful in like helping us like make sure that we had the other cast that we needed.

Speaker 2 Season four for Your Pretty Face is Going to Hell when I did the Adult Swim show, they gave me my producer credit, and I legitimately felt like they just gave me a sash. And then I sat in a chair.

Speaker 2 Like, I sat in a chair. I had my own like my own ear set, but that's like all it was.
I was like, I'm a producer. They're like, Yeah.

Speaker 2 damn, fucking so funny, dude. Oh my god.

Speaker 2 It's just the truth.

Speaker 2 Dude, thank you so fucking much for taking time out of your busy day. I know you're working like a goddamn maniac right now.
Thank you so much for talking to us.

Speaker 4 Yeah, man. You guys, this was so fun.
I'm so happy to do it. I've been really looking forward to this.

Speaker 2 Just go get your ass to weapons. Go see this movie in the theater.
It has to be seen in the theater with a crowd. You're going to have the best time checking this movie out.

Speaker 2 Bring a crew, bring your friends. You're all going to talk about this movie forever.
Old-fashioned gasps and laughter in a film. Yeah, I can't.

Speaker 2 Like, people screaming. Like, literally, dude, people screaming.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 It's awesome. You did this scared.
You got that jump scare. I literally went, oh,

Speaker 2 I went like, oh,

Speaker 2 like, I yelled.

Speaker 4 You know what sucks? I'm in fucking Prague, dude. And Prague is beautiful and wonderful.
But like, I wasn't in America for the release of the movie.

Speaker 4 And I went to go see it opening weekend in Prague at a mall near here, and it was fucking empty.

Speaker 2 And I was just like, oh my God, man. I feel like something cool is happening right now.

Speaker 2 You should just be barking outside the theater. Just going, hey, what are you? It's my guy, movie.

Speaker 2 But don't worry. I'm out here telling people I'm you

Speaker 2 and celebrating your success. Don't worry.

Speaker 2 I'm the director of this film. I say that quite often.
I'm used to saying that.

Speaker 2 Zach Kreger, thank you so much and fucking good luck on Resident Evil. Yeah, man.
Go

Speaker 2 cock off a zombie for us. Yeah, go punch Auntie Tate's cousin for me.
Okay.

Speaker 2 Can we do this again when Revs is done? Can we do this again? Of course. Anything, man.
Anytime. I always want to hang, be honest.
Yeah, we'll hang out too. We'll just do like an extra social hangout.

Speaker 2 Can we be friends?

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