Episode 617: Jerry Brudos: The Shoe Fetish Slayer (Part 1)

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Hey, weirdos, I'm Ash. And I'm Alayna.
And this is Morbid. This is Morbid.
We're apart again, you guys. It's like a fucking running theme.
It's tis the season. Like we both said at the exact same time.
Yes. That was wild.
That was. Yeah, it's the season of weird stomach viruses.
So it has hit our household. And so I decided, you know, let's not spread it around to anyone else.
Yeah, I said, I'm happy here in my non-diseased household. Yeah, it's hit one of my kids.
We're hoping to contain it, but you know how that goes, everybody. So pray for us.
Yeah. Well, two out of three now, technically.
Yeah, technically it has. And just parents out there, so you know, weird virus, strange virus.
Very quick. So so that's good that's nice um it's a stomach virus but it's not as intense as like the normal like norovirus or something like that yeah if you're gonna have a stomach virus the best way to do this is the one quick yeah i mean i'm gonna knock on wood i'll take this one because it seems to be a literal 12-hour experience.

Oof.

And then they're kind of just on their way out of it.

Like it started last night, was over pretty quick with my oldest.

And now she's sitting eating saltines.

Queen.

And, you know, watching Bluey.

Oh, what I would give to be watching Bluey right now.

Right?

She's living. I love Bluey so much soothing it is so soothing yeah it really is i love it it's very nice so i'm hoping you know she'll be on the mend and be eating by tomorrow like real food so we'll see yeah last week was a doozy of a week specifically but like it was pretty rough for me but i feel like for you it was like there was a couple extra hits that you took that i didn't necessarily yeah um so we then we did like a little simmer pot i'll post what we did it seemed to be a good one i did it twice and only we did it in the pod lab once and i feel like the negativity went away and then i feel like your oldest barfing she just barfed out the last of the negativity I know I feel like she's she's like a real one like she really is and I think she was just like I got it she's kind of she's like uh she's like in the green mile John Coffey I've never seen that he just like takes in all the bad stuff he'll like touch someone and take in all the bad stuff and then he evacuates it out of his body through, it's like bees or something or like bugs.
Oh, okay. I think I've seen like a preview of that.
Yeah. He just like, he like coughs it all out.
And I feel like my girl, she did that last night. She took all the shit of the week and then she just barfed it out.
Yeah. She said, bleh.
She's a real one. That's my girl right there.
You woke up to like a lot of good news this morning. Yeah.
We woke up to very good news about a guest we're going to have in the first part of the year next year, like February. We can't tell you yet because it's too exciting and we want to make sure we lock it down first.
But it's going to be a very exciting one. It was like first thing first thing in the morning it was like hey here you go and I was like oh you woke up and texted that like it was going to be a little bit before we could record so I like stayed in my warm cozy bed but I put my ringer on in case I went back to sleep and then I saw a group text with you and this person this person oh my god because we were just talking about it at the end of last week yes and we were about to check in just to be like oh do we think this will happen and they checked in which was wild so that's going to be exciting and then guys this is a biggie I knew Ghost was announcing something this morning and I said oh no what is it what could it be they had a chapter in the lore, and they edged us on Papa again.
But no. They announced a fucking world tour.
I thought Alina was going to, like, combust. Lost my damn mind.
They're coming to Boston. Coming to Boston.
They're shipping up to Boston. They're coming to Boston, kid.
And I'm so fucking excited. Where are they playingoston the td garden oh shit that's a yeah that's a fun venue yeah he they're doing the big ones i was gonna say that yeah damn i think they're going to new york doing madison square garden for the first time too that would be a square garden is also such a fun venue i saw harry styles they're very different but yeah very different.
Very different, but still wonderful. Still awesome.
And theatrical. So there's that.
I want to go to that one really bad. I feel like that would be a fun one.
To New York? Yeah. I'll go to New York with you.
Yes. You heard it here, folks.
I said to New York with you. To the New York show.

I'll go with you.

It will be, but I'm really excited.

And that means, I mean, guys, we're going to know who the new Papa is soon.

Because they haven't, they redacted the name of the tour.

Because I'm assuming it has something, it would give something away.

Yeah.

But this will be the new Papa on tour.

So we must be getting new music, I'm assuming.

I'm very interested to see, like, who this Papa will be.

the next episode. away.
Yeah. But this will be the new Papa on tour.
So we must be getting new music, I'm assuming. I'm very interested to see who this Papa will be.
The next iteration of Papa. Yes.
I can't wait. I love the excitement that you get is akin to a child on Christmas morning.
Like the light within your eyes even right now via Zoom, it's just radiating at me. It is.
I get so excited. When I saw that they were going to be announcing something today, I sat with my little YouTube app up and they count down and I just waited for it.
I love it. I get excited for you.
It's so fun. And even when I see it, I'm like, oh, I was a little interesting.
I know you guys are always like, here you go. There you go.
But we also, and like this ties in, we went to the night fair this weekend because I went there with Wicked Good Books from Salem and we did like a fun little meet and greet signing thing, like a very impromptu thing. It was really fun.
And they still have some books and they ship everywhere. Yeah, they still have some signed books.
So, So Butcher and the Ren and Butcher Game. So check it out.
We'll link Wicked Good Books in the show notes so you can go to it if you want to grab one. But I got to meet a ton of people.
And a lot of people, the amount of people who said, you got me into Ghost made my heart sore. And it was so funny because it was like super cold.
So we had like big jackets on. But anytime someone would say it, I'd be like, show them your shirt because she was literally wearing a ghost shirt.
And it was like, obviously John showed me ghosts like a couple of years ago. And it's so fun that now I'm like, spread the good word.
I'm just spreading the good word of ghost. And it's nice to hear.
I love it. I love seeing you guys like unite in the wild.
Yes, I love it. Whenever somebody says it, I'm like, fuck yeah, another one down.
I love it. I love it a lot.
But we also got to meet one of my favorite people that I've ever met in my life. My favorite person I've ever met in my life.
Chelsea. Chelsea.
Chelsea from Alaska. Chelsea from Alaska.
Just, I said it too. I was like, Chelsea, this has been a shit week.
Like it's been a real shit week. Like that morning, Elena got a flat tire on the way to my house for book club.
And found out I have to replace all four of the tires on my vehicle at the same time. That was my favorite.
You got one flat tire were like hey yeah actually all four of these are about to go and it wasn't even like uh you know sometimes you go to the car dealership and they're like oh my god the whole car is broken should you just get a new one yeah it was literally like yeah they're bald because mikey had looked at your tires recently and was like yeah girly these are bald they're getting kind of bald so that happened and i was like oh awesome we're just taking this right into the weekend but then the night fair was so lovely and so amazing and everybody we met was so was such a fucking shot in the arm like it was such a cool experience i love the night fair salem just gives me always gives me life just oh yeah breathing the air in salem gives me life it really does yeah the The second we drive over, when you cross into Salem, we're both just like, ah. It's just like this nice little ah moment.
And then meeting everybody was just like the Salem Night Fair, that environment is such a fucking cool environment. Yeah, Matt and Ryan absolutely kill it.
Chelsea, we kept Chelsea as a highlight on our Instagram because Chelsea forever.

When I tell you this, the energy that Chelsea brought was unlike anything I have ever experienced.

Yeah, but just pure, pure light radiating out of Chelsea.

Yes.

And all her friends, too, and her sister.

Yes.

They were all so lovely. And I was like, Chelsea, I've had such a shit week, including getting the flat tire this morning.
And I was like, I think the universe rewarded me for putting up with this week with you. I think they were like, here's Chelsea.
Yeah. I truly believe that.
No, Chelsea was iconic. If you follow us on Instagram, go find the Chelsea highlight highlight and you will see just how iconic chelsea is yeah she just chelsea's from alaska she's a fucking marine biologist like you could never be as cool as chelsea never tried nobody can you you should try aspire to be as cool as chelsea but i don't know if you'll get there bud that's that's all of that's gonna be my new year's resolution is she's like be more like chelsea yeah radiate the light that chelsea really it was amazing and also it's so funny my uh my nephew aiden who we've talked about a lot on this podcast i think he just texted me and said in all caps did you see that ghost is going back on door he just left i was like oh man I missed it I wanted to see that live reaction right I want to I wish I could have seen him but yeah so a wonderful start to the week not great truly last night but no but it was the end you know she my my girly is feeling better this morning so I'm hoping that that that trends in the right direction.
And we got two good bits of news this morning. So that was nice.
I get to carve pumpkins with my nephews later. I'm pretty stoked about that.
See, the A-plus behavior today. Yeah, it's a great Monday.
Yeah, and after this, I'm going to go downstairs. I'm going to watch more Bluey with my girl.
Oh, fuck you. I'm going gonna watch bluey by myself when i go hell yeah it's very calming but before we do that unfortunately everybody i'm gonna take you to a dark place yeah now spooky season is never over here um never it's never over but you know when we are in the official spooky season mode we give you a lot of like the paranormal stuff and the strange history and the haunted stuff and all that um and now i'm gonna uh i'm gonna rip you out of that with a bang she's like come on get in the true crime car we're back in the true crime car uh we are doing a pretty uh a pretty big one today yeah we are doing jerome brudos the foot fetish slayer i didn't know his name was jerome yeah you might know him as jerry brudos i do uh i didn't feel like we were on that level yet but i probably will refer to him as jerry because it is, yeah.
I don't know why. I think I've only heard him as Jerry mostly.
I think just because he's widely known as Jerry. Yeah.
I get that. If you've watched Mindhunter, they portrayed him in a horrifyingly accurate way on there.
The way they do that with like every killer that they portray, like Ed Kemper, that was so accurate. I was like, did you hire Ed Kemper to act in this show oh yeah Richard Speck and uh Son of Sam yep like David Berkowitz I was like that's David Berkowitz like it's crazy you brought him on the show yeah it's like uncanny de-aged him like it's really scary um if you haven't watched Mindhunter it's a it's a brilliant show and it was taken away from us too soon.
Yeah, kind of ridiculous. I need to finish season two.
It's pretty great, but it's gonna make you sad. I'm sorry.
Can I just tell you one thing? Drew and I started Dexter. Oh my goodness.
Yeah, we've never seen it before. I am so jealous that you get to experience it for the first time, but I have to warn you.
We know. The end is not to it's it's it's one of those we've heard that the end is not quite like the beginning no no it's not but everybody loves it like so much like overall so i was like uh actually drew said it he was like because it's on netflix right now yeah and he was like have you ever watched dexter and i was like i've seen i seen the episode of Boyd Fowler, because that's what me and Alina call each other.
But I've never seen beyond that. It is, the first few seasons are literally like immaculate.
Yeah, we watched the first half of the first episode, but I fell asleep because it was after the night fair. So it was late, but I'm ready to dive back in.
Oh, you're going to love it. Yeah, I really like it so far.
You're really going to love it. I'm excited for you.
Sorry, I just had to tell you that. But you know what? Back to business because – Yes, here we go.
This is going to be a rough one. So – Okay.
Buckle up. Buckle up, everybody.
So this is going to be two parts because there's just a lot going on. You're going to need a minute.
Okay. So this takes place over the years of 1968 and very well into 1969.
It was in Salem, Oregon. Several women went missing during that time and would later turn up dead, all murdered horrifically and showing signs of being brutally tortured.
At first, it seemed like they were never going to connect these women, and they were never going to figure out what happened to them. But luckily, finally, investigators questioned the friends of one of the victims, who we will get to, and they finally came to identify their suspect and eventually arrested a 30-year-old.
It was like 30. 30 years old? Yeah, and when yeah when you look at him you say that's a hard 30

yeah well when you when you are that full of yuck it usually is yeah it leeches out of you yeah uh 30 year old jerome jerry brudos now ultimately jerry was going to be convicted of the murders of Jan Whitney, Karen Sprinker, and Linda Sally.

And his capture and the study of his mind actually ended up establishing what would eventually become the FBI's Behavioral Analysis Unit. Oh, really? So he was part of that whole thing.
So it was a very important capture, very important event. I would say so.
So let's talk about Jerry, shall we? I guess. Unfortunately, we need to at least know what the fuck was going on with that.
I don't know a lot about his, like, you know, childhood or, like, entrance into life. It's not great.
Okay. I mean, I had a feeling when he ended up doing what he did that it probably wasn't awesome.
But then there are those cases where it is fine, you know?

Yeah. I mean, I feel like it's rare that it's like a very nurturing environment.

It is, yeah.

But he was born January 31st, 1939 in Webster, South Dakota.

He was the second born to Eileen and Henry Brudos.

Henry, the father, he was kind of like, when it came to employment, he was very unstable. He would find work farming, you know, random odd jobs, but he wasn't very good at it.
So he would end up having to move his family around a lot. So they were never, they didn't really have a lot of stability.
Yeah. And at no point would the Brudos household be considered safe or supportive for those children.
Henry was a very insecure man because, again, he was not good at anything he did. So, you know, what is there to be secure about, I suppose? He was also an asshole.
He flew into a rage a lot, like very quickly. He could not accept any kind of criticism, what he deemed criticism.
And Eileen, the mother, was referred to as a stolid woman who dressed neatly and plainly. Oh, okay.
It was made pretty clear from Eileen, the mother, that Jerry's brother Larry was her favorite child. Oh, that's always so fucked up when people like.
Yeah. Like you can't announce who your favorite is.
And also, what is wrong with you that you have a favorite? Yeah, that's insane. Like.
Like it's like what? It's that. They're children.
That in and of itself is very strange to have a favorite, but then to go the extra step and announce who it is is fucked. That's the thing.
Like maybe you get along with one on like a better level and you feel like more of a connection there. Like maybe that's what she was talking about.
But it's like to then let the other one know that. It's messed up.
And then not just like work on that. Right.
Yeah. So she really, she was very much more supportive of his brother Larry.
And honestly, she didn't make any bones about letting Jerry know that she wanted a girl. And she was hoping he was a girl.
Oh, no. So it's a little, it's got some Ed Gein vibes with the mother kind of thing where it's like these awful feelings of like, you not good enough and you're not what I wanted.
And you like you weren't supposed to be born even you know. Yeah.
And she literally did not hide her disappointment that he was even born. Wow.
Yeah. That's somebody who should not have had children.
Yeah. And they didn't form a bond.
Yeah. If you have that like I understand you know like when you're like, when you're, like, having kids being like, oh, like, I'd love a girl or, like, oh, I'd love a boy.
Of course. But to be disappointed in what you get is insane.
You should be psyched that you have a healthy child. Exactly.
Like, that's, and because of this whole thing, like, they never bonded and she never made any attempt to bond with that child. And then she was very abusive and hostile to him his whole life.
And just Jerry, not Larry. Mostly, I think she was just, like, I think she was in general, but she very much.
Took her anger out on him. Took it mostly out on Jerry.
I don't think Larry got as much at all. That's so fucked.
And later, Jerry would describe his mother as stubborn and a selfish egotist. Oh, okay.
Damn. Yeah.
So she sounds like she was also like very narcissistic. It does sound that way.
Kind of vibes. I'm not diagnosing, but like has those vibes.
Yes. Now, this one incident that Jerry could remember from when he was younger definitely had a profound effect.
The kind of thoughts he would have later on. I'm not saying what he did later on, but like definitely led him into a strange thought process.
One afternoon while exploring an old junkyard when he was five years old. That's good that he was just out in the junkyard at five.
Yeah. That's your youngest just in the junkyard.
Like imagine my youngest in a junkyard by themselves. No.
No. He was just, you know, he was was out there five years old just exploring a local junkyard and he came across i know and he came across a pair of patent leather high-heeled shoes in the trash awesome and his mother was a very very extremely conservative woman so she did not wear high heels she wore plain flats and that was it okay so he did not wear high heels.
She wore plain flats, and that was it.

Okay.

So he had never seen high heels.

So this was just something new to him. He was just like, whoa.
And he was kind of fascinated by them, so he took them home. Okay.
Because, you know, like, he's like— He's five. He's five.
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See nerdwallet.com for details. And so he's back in his bedroom and he's like playing with the shoes and he's putting them on himself.
He's just walking around like they're a fun thing to play with. and he was just kind of parading around his bedroom at five years old with these shoes which honestly is so his mother caught him which any i feel like in any other circumstance this would just be like adorable oh you found like what i hope those aren't dirty like my only fear it's like okay let's wash they're from the trash.
I'll get you some costume ones. But she did not take it well.
Very different time. Yeah, very different time.
And she was very conservative. So this was how she felt no matter what.
And she was furious. She berated him.
She was very harsh on him. She punished him for it and demanded that he get rid of the shoes.
It's like at five years old, you don't understand why that's wrong. Precisely.
That is literally what happened. It's not wrong anyways, but you wouldn't understand that.
Why she would say it's wrong. And that's the thing.
He could not understand why she was angry. Right.
Why did that make you angry? I didn't do anything to upset anybody. I wasn't hurting anyone.
I wasn't hurting myself. I'm just playing with these things I found that aren't hurting anyone.
I don't understand what the problem is. And so he didn't think he'd done anything wrong.
Because he hadn't. And so he hid the shoes in his bedroom instead of getting rid of them.
Okay. And a few days later, she found him playing with the shoes again.
And she was even more angry and then forced him to watch as she burned them in the backyard. What the fuck? That's like sadistic.
And it's just fucking weird behavior. Like you're burning the shoes.
What the fuck? What are they going to do? Like, what are you doing? And not only that, she then locked him in his bedroom for the rest of the day at five years old. Locking your kid in their bedroom ever is a weird thing to do, but at five years old, like, hello? Yeah, that's diabolical.
That's insane. Also, like, what if they get hurt? That's the thing.
I'm like, what are you doing? And when he was finally let out of his bedroom, he immediately ran to the home of a neighbor who was a single woman that he had bonded with oh this single woman kind of was like a stand-in for her mother it sounds i was i was wondering if that was the like she kind of took care of him a little bit she was like she knew what was going on sounds like your mom sucks and it's like it sounds like this woman was like a real one like she was just trying to she was be there for him. Yeah.
But she knew, especially at the time, it's like, you know, in the 30s and 40s. And it's like, she's not going to step in.
She doesn't know what the boundaries are here. Right.
So she's just kind of being there for him when she can. Right.
Kind of thing. And letting him into her home, which I'm like, what a nice lady.
I know. Yeah.
Like, damn. I wish that lady was more of an influence in his life, to be honest.
Sounds like his mom was just there too much. Yeah, exactly.
Well, and then, unfortunately, a year later, the family moved to Riverton, California. Oh.
And that's where Jerry started attending first grade. Years later, Jerry would talk about this period as another significant moment in the development of his fetish that would later come out later violently.
His first grade teacher would wear high heels every day. And every day, Jerry would just be fascinated with them and daydreamed about them.
He just thought they were the prettiest shoes you could possibly wear. He loved them.
I mean, high heels are great. I mean, I love high heels.
I get it, too, at this point. Yeah, and it was well known that this particular teacher would bring two pairs of shoes to school, a pair for work and a pair for the afternoon.
She would, like, change into sneakers kind of thing. Yeah, she was like, my feet hurt.
I'm good. Yeah, and, like, I guess, like, you know, she would change into them, like, later in in the day.
Yeah. And one afternoon when he could no longer resist the temptation, he stole the pair of high heels out of the teacher's desk when she stepped out of the room and he hid them in the play area.
And he was intending to bring them home later. Yeah.
But he was hiding them for later. This is so interesting.
But one of the children found them. Yeah.
And, by you know before the end of the day and brought them back to the teacher and nothing crazy happened

from that but it was just clearly a moment of like he's kind of taking it further yeah by stealing

them now yeah and this time in jerry's life was also significant because he was dealing with a

lot of health problems oh um in fact during second grade he missed a lot of school. He was home a lot and in the hospital a lot with measles, laryngitis.
He had two fungal infections that required surgery. Wow.
And he also had, according to Jerry, he had problems with the veins in his legs, and it would cause him a lot of pain and difficulty moving. Oh, wow.
Yeah, so according to him, he said the veins were ballooning, and I had to have the operations because they were not doing their job. So I'm assuming there was a lot of, like, circulation issues.
Yeah. Now, the multiple surgeries and other things he was dealing with meant that he had to stay at home a lot.
Oh, no. And that meant he had to be with his mom a lot.
Uh-huh. And at this point, in second grade, he had already come to despise her.
You're like seven years old. Literally.
That's crazy. Like, that's sad.
Yeah, that's very sad. He spent most of his time trying to avoid her in second grade at seven years old.
And like a lot of young people, these early life experiences

are eventually going to kind of mingle within your adult experiences, and they're going to create

certain things. Fetishes, certain fears, certain things that you're attracted to,

like things that repulse you. Your early childhood really does have a lot to do with that they call them your formative years exactly it's like you're developing where you're developing is like so such a huge part of you and it's like that's where we all end up being in fucking therapy and finding out these random things that you're like fuck that's where's where that comes from.
Oh, shit. That's why I do that.
Or that's why I fucking hate that. Yes.
Like a lot, and a lot of it is trauma-based. A lot of it is negative-based.
Of course, there's those core memories that form great things later in life. Yeah, like traditions and, you know, things that make you happy.
Things that you love and make you happy and things, you know, your career. Hobbies.

But these negative things really make their mark, unfortunately. And the poor relationship with his very abusive mother and feelings of abandonment, you know, those kind of things would lead to negative opinions about women in general, as he grew older.
It's interesting how that happens a lot with boys. Yes.
You know, like when when boys have especially like when they're younger and they have such a bad relationship with their mom a lot of times it leeches into their opinions about all women because that's just like their first experience with a woman yeah i feel like the same doesn't necessarily happen with girls like as often you know yeah it is interesting yeah i feel like it almost flips a lot with girls and their fathers where if you have a poor relationship with your father you end up trying to seek out yes almost that without realizing it yes like you you end up finding men that are like that you know and not necessarily punishing them for it but almost receiving the punishment over and over yourself. I was going to say exactly punishing yourself.
Yeah, it's an interesting psychology. Yeah, psychology is wild.
It really is. And so as he grew older, his opinions about women were dog shit.
And also the secrecy around his fascination with women's shoes, because he grew out of that he it stayed and what he felt was like taboo excitement about them that he would get from them he it kept growing and growing and that would be fine like that's a fetish is a fetish a kink is a kink you nobody's here to shame anybody about that right you know You know, what you like is what you like. You shouldn't feel ashamed

about it unless it's hurting someone.

And the problem here was

it took a sinister

turn. Yeah.
Because

he wasn't

just keeping these secret

for his own well-being. He was keeping

it secret because he was taught to. And he was taught

that it was wrong. And he was taught that what

he was doing was disgusting. Well, like she and something to be sh be shamed of yeah his mom almost fetishized it for him yes you know it's true she turned it into a taboo thing right because at first when he was five he sat there and said like why is this weird like why are you mad at me like these are just pretty yeah these are just pretty i just like these shoes right and when he reached puberty and began to associate those feelings with other things, he would associate them with secrecy, shame, and excitement with sex.
But then it was also transfused with being abused around those years when he was finding this thing that he liked. Right.
So he was associating it with violence. Yeah.
And it was all kind of mingling into something really bad. This also kind of went with, he experienced death at a young age as well.
A childhood friend passed away, one that he was close to when he was very young. And then also that neighbor, who was his only source of support, she passed away as well.
Oh, no. no yeah so that also became mixed up with these feelings as he was entering puberty and so he would forever associate his sexual interest in women's clothing and shoes and that would kind of be fused with his resentment of women and then it would also fuse with his fascination and kind of of like dealing with death at a young age.
So it all kind of fused together. And again, you never know when these things are going to fuse into one of these little shitballs of just nightmares.
Because people grow through these things all the time. People go through death at a young age.
People go through being interested in something that you've, you kind of feel ashamed about, that you've been taught to be shamed about. And, you know, like people deal with shitty parents and shitty mothers and shitty, you know, authority figures all the time.
Sometimes they deal with all three of them and they don't turn into this. So you just, you just don't know.
It's like, is it a timing thing? Is it, you don't know what's going to just fuse it into that like shit ball that's going't turn into this. So you just don't know.
It's like, is it a timing thing? You don't know what's going to just fuse it into that shit ball that's going to turn into this. Yeah.
No, it's weird how it works. Yeah.
You just can't. You really can't predict it.
No. But by the time Jerry reached adolescence, the family had moved again, this time to Salem, Oregon.
And that's where Henry Brudos, the father, was trying again to be a farmer. And Jerry didn't realize it, but by this time where he was like reaching adolescence, he had already started developing particular sexual interests that he knew, whether from inference or whether it was implicated to him, he knew he couldn't discuss these sexual interests with others, especially his parents.
Okay. Which is a problem.
In fact, in the Brudos household, it's not like he couldn't just discuss these kind of niche and maybe taboo interests he was forming. He couldn't discuss those with his parents, but there was an air of secrecy and shame that was just around all sex.
Like, sex was not talked about. It was treated as something that was disgusting and dirty.
Like, those are already problematic things that you're teaching your kids because that's not going to give them a healthy relationship with it. But then he's got all these private fantasies that he's being taught were taboo.
And it's like you infuse all that together. And that's a mess.
He's holding it in. So eventually it's going to explode or he's going to be doing it in secret ways, which is going to lead to him like stealing things and spying on people and like doing it in the shadows.
And you don't want that. Yeah, exactly.
It's not good.

I mean, at no time did his parents ever explain sex to their children.

Sex education was not taught in schools at the time.

That's so, I mean, it makes sense, obviously, but it's like crazy to think about that.

It's like you need to know the basics. Yeah, that's the thing.

So what he learned about it was what he saw on the farm.

Roll that around in your head. No.
Yeah. He saw things happening on the farm that no one explained

to him. Or from what like little he could take away from like boys conversations at school.

Yeah. Which is also going to not be an education that you really want.
No. So yeah.
No. We're not coming into adolescence.
Strong. You know, we're coming in guns blazing.
Yeah. Not in the best way.
No. So when he reached his teen years, his fantasies were already taking a violent turn.

It was pretty much on track. Unbeknownst to his parents, he spent days digging a hidden tunnel on a rarely visited part of their farm.
And in that tunnel, he would just sit there and fantasize about keeping a girl there captive. Oh, fuck.
Yeah. And by his own admission later, he said he didn't even know what he wanted to do with her there.
He said he just knew he wanted a girl to be there and to not be able to leave. Oh, no, Jerry.
He didn't even know. He said he didn't know enough about sex or what he was feeling to even think that that's why he wanted her there he just knew he had these like overwhelming feelings enough that he had to dig a tunnel and make that actually a reality and he knew he wanted to keep a woman there okay which is like so fucking chilling and just the fact like obviously you I know he growing up at the time where it was like come home when the streetlights go on but just the fact that he could be gone for that long to build a fucking underground tunnel yeah nobody noticed like nobody asked where he was he and at this same time he was already stealing women's undergarments and shoes.
He would steal them from clothing lines. Okay.
And sometimes he would go into unlocked houses in the neighborhood and steal them. Oh, that's fucking bold.
Yeah. So he's crossing lines in a big way here.
He's jumping right over them. Yeah.
When you're breaking into houses, like locked or unlocked, that's a turn. Yeah.
That's a place of no return a lot of the time.

Yeah.

Now, these fantasies finally converged when Jerry was only 16 years old.

One afternoon, he stole a neighbor's underwear from her laundry line and later approached her and offered to help her find her missing clothing.

But when she arrived at his house a short time later, he just took her by knife point at 16 years old.

Thank you. to help her find her missing clothing.
But when she arrived at his house a short time later, he just took her by knife point at 16 years old. What the fuck? And forced her to undress while he took pictures of her.
Where are his parents? That's what I'm saying. He's in his parents' house doing this? Yeah.
What the fuck? And at this time, Jerry had been wearing a heavy black mask so that the girl couldn't see who he was. But she knew who he was.
Yeah. He's at his house.
Because he had offered to help her and she came to his house. He said, hey, meet me at my house.
Yeah. And years later, somebody asked her because she didn't report the crime to the police.
Okay. And years later, people asked her, like, why didn't you report this crime? And she said, I knew who it was all the time.
I was scared if I told, he would find me out and he would kill me. I mean, yeah, I don't blame her.
So she, I mean, just knowing what he was doing there, you know he's capable of a lot. But I think also she's like, I knew who he was.
Like, I could tell. It sounds like this is like a grown woman like, her own clothing line, you know? And this is a 16-year-old kid to instill that much fear.
Whatever she went through had to be dark. Horrific.
Yeah. Horrific.
And this whole incident had been the first foray that he took into actual sexual assault. And while it was probably unbelievably, like, something we can't even fathom traumatizing for this girl, she was able to get out of there with her life, fortunately, but it was the victim right after her that didn't get away so easily.
So he did this to this woman, which is unthinkable, and then immediately escalated to murder? He escalated. He didn't escalate to murder, but he escalated.
Okay. She didn't get out of there unharmed physically.
Okay, okay. So from the moment that this first girl, who we're not going to name, that got away, like, just talked about it later and said, I didn't want to report it.
As soon as she left the house, Jerry was immediately fantasizing of doing it to another woman. He loved it.
But he was worried he was going to get caught. So eight months passed, and still he didn't do it again.
But he felt confident after eight months that he could get away with another assault. So in 1956, he lured a 17-year-old girl into his car, promising her a ride home.
So as they drove, the girl became confused when Jerry started talking to her as though they were on a date. Oh, no.
And she was like, this is not, you're just driving me home. Right.
Like, what the fuck? Like, why do you think that? No. And her confusion turned to panic when it occurred to her that Jerry had already driven well past where he was supposed to drop her off.
Oh, no. And he was just driving further and further into a more remote part of Oregon.
And once they had reached a vacant location in his mind, Jerry pulled the car off the side of the road and hit the girl with a pipe in the face.

Holy shit. And then hit her in the neck and chest with it.
My God. She was screaming and trying to flee, but Jerry was much bigger.
And she had already been beaten at this point, so she didn't have her wits about her. She didn't have any strength to get away.
She was just completely out of it. and he hit her several more times with the pipe and his fists

and then dragged her from the vehicle and demanded that she start stripping for him. Oh, God.
And when she refused, he punched her in the face, squarely in the nose, and she started screaming again. Oh, my God.
This poor woman.

And fortunately, at that same time that he was punching her in the face and she was screaming, a couple was driving down the road with their windows open.

Oh, my.

Thank God.

And they heard the screams. So the man, which I was like, what a badass man.

He immediately pulled over the car to investigate.

And when they reached the location, he saw this large man looming over this screaming woman on the ground.

So he ran right to her aid.

Wow.

Thank you. Like, no.
Yeah, I'm assuming at this point she's like bloody and like. She's been beaten with a pipe and punched in the nose.

Yeah, bruises are probably forming.

And he's like, she just fell out of the car.

Yeah, and she's just scared. It's like, okay, why are you vooming over her then?

So this guy was like, shut the fuck up.

I know that's not what happened.

So he changed his story and said, oh, well, actually she was attacked by someone, by some weirdo.

And she was fighting him off when I drove up and ran to help her.

Oh, the hero.

Yeah.

So according to Jerry, the attacker ran off into the woods just before the other couple had driven up. He was like, oh, thank goodness you're here.
How convenient. But you just missed him.
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Excludes restaurants. And when it was just him and this relatively defenseless young woman, Jerry had no difficulty asserting himself and being horrifyingly scary.
But in the presence of anyone else, when someone else came upon them, oh my, did he yield. He made up the lie, but he shrunk right down.
When the second explanation was also not going to convince this guy, he also was like, fuck you, I know that's not what happened. You're the attacker.
I know that. Like, I'm not an idiot.
Yeah, he was like, so when that didn't work, the couple insisted that they take the girl and Jerry back to their house to get it sorted out, and they were going to call the police.

So he agreed.

And once they were there, the husband called the Oregon State Police,

and they transported the girl to the hospital,

and Jerry was taken to the police barracks for questioning.

Gave right up.

This poor girl having to even get back in a car with him after experiencing that.

And with another stranger, like, holy shit.

Right.

So once he was in custody, he confessed everything to the police.

Just boom.

He claimed he'd only wanted to scare her into taking off her clothes so he could take pictures.

And then he denied he'd ever done anything like that before, which we know is not true.

He said his temper just got the best of him.

Now, unfortunately for Jerry, detectives searched his car and found his photography equipment in the trunk, which they very correctly interpreted as a sign of premeditation. So, meanwhile, other officers went to the Brudos household and spoke to Eileen, his mother.
Oh, God. Who gave them permission to search her son's bedroom because she doesn't give a shit about him.
Yeah. And they found a hidden bunch of stolen women's clothing and photographs of a nude girl, clearly posing under duress.
Oh, no. That was the first victim.
Now, well, when Eileen confronted her son about what they'd found, he claimed another boy had taken the pictures and forced Jerry to develop them for him. He said I had to.
He said he'd beat me up if I didn't. Jerry, come on.
Jerry, shut the fuck up. Jerry was arrested and charged with assault and battery, which prompted the state authorities to take a closer look at his history.
So they spoke with neighbors and they discovered the previous assault that Jerry had committed against that original woman, who a year later finally felt safe telling the authorities what had happened. Now that he was in custody.
And given what they had learned, and what they found in Jerry's bedroom, he was taken to the Oregon State Hospital for evaluation. Okay.
Because they were like, something is very wrong here. Now, at the time, Jerry Brudos was a 16-year-old sophomore in high school.
Oh, my God. Yeah.
The fact that he already has like this kind of rap sheet at sophomore year, like, are you serious? He's already this brutal at 16 years old. That's horrifying.
And in his interview with hospital staff, he said he didn't like rough sports, but instead performed things like 4-H and Boy Scouts and photography. And despite the circumstances under what he'd been arrested for, he was very visibly uncomfortable talking about sex.
He had been arrested for forcing a girl to strip in

front of him and he could not talk about it right so jerry told the doctors he suffered from nocturnal emissions about every two months but he had quote tried to live a clean life and didn't smoke or drink what is a nocturnal emission uh Wet dreams. Oh.
Yeah. Wish I never asked.
Oh. Yeah.
Oh. In fact, while they were aware of the things he'd done, doctors still struggled to arrive at a diagnosis.
I mean. Or to even provide insight.
Yeah. They were like, you're a strange one.
And. I mean, he is.
Yeah. In one evaluation, the psychiatrist wrote, the boy does not appear to be grossly mentally ill.
Ah. He comes shyly into the interview situation and sits down in a dejected fashion to talk with great embarrassment about his difficulty.
He tends to be evasive on a basis of his acute embarrassment and is somewhat rambling and verbose in trying to tell his story. There is no evidence of suicide, homicide, or destructive urges.
Wrong. He feels that he sometimes has trouble controlling his temper, but that has never got him into trouble except on this last occasion when he maintains that he cannot remember too clearly exactly what he did.
How convenient. Yeah.
But was told that the girl received a broken nose. His insight and judgment are questionable.
He feels there must be something the matter with him, and he hopes that he will be able to find it out and have it cured here. Strange.
Yeah, I wonder if that was him pretending like he wanted help or if he actually did want help. Or if he really wanted help.
Who knows? Now, ultimately, doctors arrived at a diagnosis of adjustment reaction of adolescence with sexual deviation fetishism. Yikes.
So, despite having been convicted, Jerry was allowed to return to school during the day. But then he would have to go back to the hospital at night.
Yeah. So somehow this was kept secret from his peers at the time.
Wow. They didn't know about him being in the hospital.
They didn't know about his arrest. So he wasn't dealing with any attention based on that.
But after about nine months at the state hospital, the medical staff determined that he was no longer a threat and he was discharged back into his parents' care.

Nine months is a pretty short time to determine that. No, he was going to kill that woman.
Absolutely, he was. And a year later, Jerry graduated from high school and enrolled at Oregon State University for a few semesters before dropping out in March 1959 when he joined the U.S.
Army and was sent to Fort Gordon, Georgia for basic training. It's never good when these kinds of guys enter the Army because then they see some crazy shit and they get even more bold.
Exactly. For Jerry, the Army was his first chance to be completely away from his parents, particularly his mother.
Which you would hope would be a good thing, but it wasn't. And he wanted to establish his own life.
He wanted to like go get away from what he had been doing, but his old habits and interests were plaguing him. They could not be put away.
During the day, he trained at the Signal Corps, giving him the opportunity to pursue his interest in electronics and communications. But at night, his fantasies overtook and he just couldn't get away from them.
Not long after transferring to Georgia, he became convinced that, quote, a Korean girl was sneaking into the barracks each night and crawling into his bed and trying to seduce him. All right.
Which I'm like, so he's hallucinating now? Yes. He said, I didn't want her, and I came up fighting and beat her badly, he later said.
What? And he said the scene would replay itself every night. And to him, it was very real.
Is that a nightmare or is it a straight up hallucination? It must be a hallucination because no one else in the barracks ever saw a woman sneaking in, heard any noise. Like, wasn't happening.
Soon, he came to dismiss this thing as a kind of hallucination or dream. But he was disturbed, he said, that the woman in his dream had aroused such hatred in him.
Okay. He said he could feel how much he hated her.
And he said he not only wanted the woman to stop trying to seduce him, but he also wanted to beat her. And at times he said, I wanted to kill her.
What the fuck? Yeah, his revelations later are like, what the fuck? Yeah. I feel like we've never heard anything similar to that.
Well, and interestingly here is he became concerned about his own mental health here. Like he became self-aware.
Really? And he knew that this was a problem. That he felt anger and hatred towards this hallucinated woman and that he wanted to beat her.
He wanted to kill her. So he's consulted the army chaplain about it.

And this army chaplain referred him to the staff psychiatrist, Captain Theodore Barry.

So after hearing the story about this woman and his desire to harm her, Barry was convinced that Jerry was unfit for service. So on October 15th, 1959, he was discharged under AR 635-208, which is a determination that the individual is unfit for service despite reasonable attempts to correct the problem.
Now, he was 20 years old at the time and now he's unemployed, so he has no choice but to move back in with his parents, which I think is the worst thing that could happen. Yeah, it's too bad they didn't like send him to some kind of like counseling counseling yeah of some sort right but so he had to move back on the farm in oregon and he started sleeping in the spare bedroom but not long not long after he did this larry his brother returned home from college and his mother said that larry should have the spare bedroom and he she said jerry you go live out in the old shed i'm sorry what yeah also was there not two bedrooms the entire time both of them lived there they must have shared a bedroom what the fuck and now they're not allowed now he's not allowed to share the bedroom with larry he has to stay in the old shed.
Go live in the old shed. I'm like, lady, your kid is already mentally ill and you're making him even more so.
Yeah, she sounds like a truly just piece of shit individual. If you have a child and make them live in a shed, that's your piece.
You're a shit person yeah like you're just a shit person now frustrated and very uh very isolated in the shed he fell right back to his old habits and you know he was trying to relieve his anxieties and his hallucinations now at first it was he went right back to stealing women's underwear and women's shoes like he had when he was a child and an adolescent, but it quickly escalated. One evening, while Jerry was running errands in nearby Salem, he spotted a woman in a red dress and started following her.
When she reached her apartment doorway, he followed her into the dimly lit vestibule, which is when she realized that someone was right behind her and had followed her in. Before she could say anything, he grabbed her by the neck and choked her until she lost consciousness right there in the vestibule.
Which takes a while. He just dropped her body to the floor.
He didn't know what to do next, though. So he stole the woman's shoes and ran back to his car before anyone spotted him.
So that's it? He just choked her into unconsciousness. This is the wild part of him is it's like him digging the hole.
He digs the hole. He know he wants a, he wants a woman to be in there.
Right. But he doesn't know what he wants to do with her.
Right. And even now he chokes this woman.
He does something physically violent, chokes her to the point of unconsciousness, drops her on the ground, and then says, I don't know what to do now. And just takes the shoes.
Why did I do that? Like, what's my next move? I wonder, and I don't know, if he just like blacks out in these moments and like does something. Not blacks out because I think he fully has intentions to like do something.
But it's almost like he enters this like different part of his brain where he does this. And then he almost like comes to and is like, what am I doing? Yeah.
And I think it might be that he is so fucked up about sex and what he is interested in and what excites him. And it's been, and he's had it drilled so hard into him that it's like shameful and taboo and secret and all this shit and like violence and all this stuff is intermingling that he literally does not know what to do with a woman.
Right. Like he knows he wants to do something.
But he doesn't know. But he's so fucking uneducated about it in a healthy way.
Right. That he literally doesn't know what to do next.
He's like, I know I want to do something. Right.
And I know this excites me. I just don't, literally don't know what the next step is.
Right. Like, he doesn't know what sex even is.
Yeah, like, he doesn't even know what he's supposed to be doing. In his, like, deranged mind, you know? It's very scary.
It's very strange, and it's, like, very different from a lot of these assholes we've covered. Right.
Now in the weeks that followed that, a pattern started emerging where Jerry would become stressed and go out for a walk and he would stalk a woman he noticed on the street, follow her for a time, and then would attack her, choke her, steal her shoes or other clothing items. and then he would just leave her and return to this shed on his parents' farm where he would fantasize and sleep with the shoes and just like touch the clothing.
What the fuck? And feel like he was like in control again or like feel some sort of power. Yeah.
Yeah. That's very very bizarre at a time in his life when he found himself again under his mom's like domineering ways and like abusive ways i think the stalking and thefts he said later gave him this like weird sense of empowerment and control that he was looking for yeah and he was so fucked up that that's the route that he took you know yeah i'm just like just even just picturing this in your head you're just like like i'm just picturing him like falling asleep next to a pair of shoes and like yeah it's like that's not weird but it is so fucking weird like the way that he goes about it because you know they're stolen it off of an unconscious woman that he's just attacked right and it's like what is this about like i mean we find out what it's about right and it's just so strange to get that violent and then to just like to to escalate that far and then to just de-escalate so yes like it's like a sudden drop off where he's like okay i got what i wanted like bye yeah gotta go bye and then he just relives it and not harm them any further like obviously he harms them and what he does is so fucked but then just but to take it there and then abruptly end it dip yeah like it's just strange and he didn't have any friends at this time he didn't really have any home life like he's got nothing going on except his own anxieties and fantasies.
And shed life. Yeah.
So apparently his professional life, though, is one of the bright spots, like the only bright spot in his life. His training with the Signal Corps had prepared him for a career in radio communications.
And after he had returned home, he found a job as an engineer with a small radio station in Corvallis. Wow.
That's a good job. Yeah.
And it was there that he met Ralphine Schwindler, who was a 17-year-old girl who was friendly. And, you know, she was friends with a boy who hung around the radio station most afternoons.
So like Jerry, Ralphine was shy and timid, had basically no experience with dating. And when she first met Jerry, she was not into him.
She was very unimpressed, which I don't blame her. He was six years older than her.
I was going to say, he's well above 17 at this point. So this is already inappropriate.
And she later said, I probably wouldn't have accepted a date with him at all, except that he asked me to go swimming.

And I love to swim.

She's like, you know what?

Any chance to go swimming?

Any time to jump in that water, you know?

What a queen.

But by the time he was in his early 20s, Jerry's hatred and disgust of women was well cemented.

Yeah.

But he felt differently about Ralphine.

I was going to say, it doesn't sound like he has hatred or disgust for her. Yeah.
Most women intimidated him, which is why he hated and was disgusted by them. But Ralphine seemed to be kind of easygoing.
She laughed at his jokes. She's young.
Yeah. Like, seemed to eventually care for him in a way that he had not experienced with any other woman.
Like ever. Besides that one neighbor when he was, so I think maybe it hearkened back to that.
Right. And while most people view Jerry as just a fucking failure and a loser, she kind of didn't.
She didn't make him seem that way, at least.

And Ralphine was, honestly, she kind of showed that she was a little, like, impressed by him at times.

Like, while she was not impressed at first, she, like, later became impressed with him,

like, his knowledge of his job and all that.

And it made him feel a little good about himself, I guess, for the first time.

But her parents, they were not impressed by him.

Yeah, because what the fuck is a 24 year old doing with a 17 year old exactly uh her mother whom jerry described as stubborn and independent and said it like an insult i was gonna say oh how horrible yeah she strongly disapproved of her teenage dating a man in his 20s. And her father fucking loathed Jerry.
I would. And Jerry later said he felt because he was older that he could decide what we would do, where we would go, all that.
I think he just felt because he was her father that he would do that. It's like, fuck you, Jerry.
Yeah. You're a fucking creep.
Now, the fact that Ralphine was still a teenager probably had something to do with her being attracted to Jerry in the first place. To her, he seemed more sophisticated than boys her age.
Worldly. And the fact that her parents hated him only made him more attractive.
It always does. Her age was also probably why she didn't notice any of the red flags that an older woman might have picked up on.
Oh, yeah. He was very jealous.
He was very possessive, very controlling. So when Ralphine became pregnant early on, Jerry proposed that they get married and she happily accepted.
Oh, Ralphine. And the way he later talked about it, he said, I wanted someone to sleep with and she wanted out of her home.
Oh, how beautiful. And somehow Ralphine later remembered things on pretty much the same romantic playing field.
She said, while my home life was a good one,

there was this feeling that getting married would be much better than listening to my parents.

She's so young.

I'm like, so true love, guys, I see.

It's just so sad.

It's so sad.

At 17, you think you're starting your own life

and going after your dreams with this man of yours.

You get mixed up with this asshole.

Oh, no.

They married in 1962, and a few months later, Ralphine gave birth to their daughter, Megan. Now, at first, Jerry and Ralphine's life together was actually pretty happy.
It seemed like it was going well. He would lavish his wife and daughter with small gifts and attention.
And as far as Ralphine knew, they were doing okay financially. Everything was fine.
Right. And even though Ralphine's attention was more or less dominated by the baby at the time, they even had a healthy sex life.
Like it was a very normal, healthy sex life at first. But then things turned a little bit and things started making Ralphine uncomfortable.
Like whenever they were at home, Jerry insisted that they both be nude. Oh, just like at home.
At all times. At home.
Okay, that's strange. And also you have a child.
Well, and that only stopped when Megan grew from an infant to a toddler. And Ralphine said it's not appropriate for us to be nude in front of our child.
So it did stop. Okay he was not happy about it that's just bizarre yeah because he also is like requiring it right like it's not like they both made this decision together that they're just like that's what we well exactly like that's very different from like people who like what is it called when you're is it a nudist i think so yeah like whatever like that's and not even nudists like it's just like some people when they they're at home, they like to be naked, I guess.
I mean, yeah, go off queens and kings. Live your best life.
But it doesn't sound – Yeah, like we're not a naked household. But I know people have naked households.
I'm not a naked household either. Yeah, you know, that's just your thing.
But also it doesn't sound like this – like she wasn't necessarily consenting to this. No, this felt very much like it was him requiring.
Yeah. And she was probably happy to be like, OK, she's a toddler now.
We need to stop. I'm glad that she was able to get through to him like that.
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The black and white images were something Jerry could develop himself at home because he didn't know how to do that. She was like, that was fine, I guess.
Like, whatever. That's in our house.
He's developing them himself. But then he wanted to take color ones that had to be developed at a lab, which meant other people would see them.
And Jerry was like, no, it's fine. This is normal.
No one's going to care about it. They're not even going to blink an eye.
But she said she never felt comfortable about it. She didn't like it.
Yeah. Which is not consenting.
Right. And she said she was also not comfortable with what he would have her do in the photos at times.
Which I feel like he probably got off on. Yeah.
Like there was times like she didn't mind like the casual shots around the house of them just like living their life. But she said sometimes he would insist that she pull a nylon stocking over her face or wear spiked high heeled shoes.
And she just she said it made her uneasy. uneasy her uneasy yeah because like you like people can have fetishes and that's completely fine you like we're not fetish shaming but if you're not interested in that fetish then it probably feels very off and wrong to you you know like you it is not okay if your fetish is being forced on another person exactly You need to be in an agreeing situation where that person agrees and is comfortable with engaging in your fetish.
Yeah. That's what a healthy fetish is.
There are boundaries. And I feel so bad that she felt like she had to do this.
And she was young. So she's like really being forced into it and there's a power dynamic yeah

because he exactly and after a couple of years what had begun as a happy marriage started to kind of devolve into like a difficult frustrating and very confusing relationship for her and the more preoccupied that Ralphine became with their daughter Megan because children require attention the more depressed Jerry became.

Well, and also he doesn't know what like a good mother-child bonding relationship is. Yeah, he doesn't understand that, why she's paying attention to her.
And so he would leave the house. And when he left the house and spent a lot of time out of the house, he would engage in his own, his old habits.
And when they were at home, Ralphine couldn't help but notice that Jerry seemed distant and became very disinterested in their daughter. Actually just ignoring her, pushing her away whenever she wanted his attention.
Oh, that's really sad. And later Ralphine would wonder whether Jerry resented Megan for taking up so much of her time.
And I believe that is it. He became more depressed, more unhappy when he was at home.
And the more he isolated himself from his family and spent time outside of the house, the worse it got. So by the end of the 1960s, his ability to resist his darker impulses that we know he has inside of him, they were weakening considerably.

Now, his path to becoming a killer was very long and very complicated, obviously. Yeah, because we're only in the beginning of the 1960s, and at the top of this, I think you said 68.
Yeah, and we're starting to enter the late 60s, but I mean, he's going through so many iterations of what his darker impulses are. and if you try to identify any one thing that pushed him over the edge into violence and brutality, I don't think you'd be able to figure out what it is.
But we know that an event that happened right before things got really bad was the birth of his second child. And it was in late 1967.
And so in Jerry's head somehow, he believed witnessing the birth of this baby would somehow absolve him of all the bad things he'd done and would set him on a better path. Okay.
He said he just believed if he witnessed the birth of his child, he would become a better person. Okay.

Which, like, that in and of itself is not, you're like, okay.

I kind of get it.

Sure.

Like, why not?

It's a beautiful miracle, whatever you want to call it.

Yeah.

So he made Ralphine promise that when the time came, she would have one of the nurses come get him from the waiting

room and bring him into the delivery room so he could witness this. Yeah.
Okay. But when the time came, no one came to get him to see the birth.
Okay. And he tried to force his way into the room, but the hospital staff actually blocked him and said they were given explicit orders from the doctor to keep him out.
So what the fuck happened there? So this obviously devastated him because he had this whole plan. And then he learned that it was Ralphine who told the doctors not to let him in the room.
And so he demanded to know why she would do that. Now, this is horrifying.
Soine explained that jerry had always been so possessive and jealous of her that she thought it best that he not witness what happened during the delivery of a child she said i didn't and this is the way she says this horrifies me to be quite honest so i want everybody to know a little bit of a trigger warning because this is a little graphic and gross okay the way she says this in my opinion she said i didn't want you to watch another man play with me um that's not what happens during birth no that's like there's nothing sexual about birth in any way that's what horrifiesifies me. The doctor is not playing with you.
The doctor is delivering your baby. And what happened, Ralphine, that you are suddenly like, and I think it's like she is being conditioned into believing every part of her life is being sexualized in some way.
Oh, wow. Yeah, that's dark.
Isn't that horrifying? Yeah, that's very dark. It's so dark.
Like, so dark. And she told him this.
Okay. So this marked a big shift in their dynamic, this moment.
Jerry had always had a disdain for women, obviously, but his wife was never included in that because she, according to him, had accepted and loved him in ways that he had never experienced before.

And it was because of that and her refusal that it was because of that, that her refusal to allow him into the room, he felt it was a huge betrayal.

Like he took it as an immense betrayal.

And I kind of get that.

Yeah.

Right.

In his mind, I get it why he, where his mind is right now, why that would feel like a betrayal to him. Yeah.
And obviously, like there's many layers to this because it's her decision. You know what I mean? Like that's her body.
experience of going on but i can see why in his deranged mind right now where his mind is very rancid at the moment that he's he had convinced himself that this was going to save him this was his salvation seeing this and now she took it away and now she And now she, in his mind, took that from him.

Right. So he's twisting it into something far worse than what it actually was.

Well, and that's also just, like, from a trust standpoint. Like, you've been married,

this is your second child, and then, like, you know, they have this plan or whatever. And then to say, like, no at the last second, he probably saw it as, like, oh, you don't trust me.

Exactly. There's so many layers to it.
she it sounds like she doesn't she didn't him yeah and it sounds like why would she had every reason not to yeah exactly why would she you can see where both of them are coming from at this point but my god the statement she made about it haunts me yeah one the statement that haunts me and also that's just so sad like a lot of like i would say like 99 of the time when you have a child with like a partner and you have a happy marriage like that's a beautiful amazing thing yeah have it turned into this weird dark betrayal you know like fear moment of fear yes and it's being sexualized, which is very upsetting. The whole thing is really just fucked.
Yeah. That poor baby.
It shows you, though, like his upbringing and how fucked up he was about sex. Yeah.
He imprinted that onto her through their marriage because she was young. Yeah.
And it obviously is manifesting in ways like this. And what's worse is that night after his child was born, after Ralphine had fallen asleep, he left the house and went into downtown Portland and drove the streets until he finally found a woman that caught his eye.
So the night that his child was born, he went out. Wow.
And he watched and followed the woman for hours as she went from one location to the next. Hours.
He followed one woman. What the fuck? And finally followed her home and watched her windows for hours until the lights went out.
Oh my God. As soon as the apartment was dark, he crept into it and found her sleeping in her bedroom.
And as she slept, he started rummaging through her closet, looking through her shoes. But he was noisy, and so she woke up and found this man in her fucking room, looking through her closet.
Uh-huh. So before she could even scream, Jerry was on top of her and had his hands around her neck.
He claimed he had only intended to render her unconscious so he could do what he always does, find a light, go through her things, and leave. But as soon as she lost consciousness, he said he could not help himself and he sexually assaulted her.
Oh, no. And then he stole her shoes and fled her apartment what the fuck yeah yeah his pathology is so fucking weird it's the stealing of the shoes and it gets weirder because after all that that's what he did the night of his child's birth his second child's birth after the whole thing with ralphine and she's thinking after that whole thing she's like like, I thought it was going to go downhill.
Our marriage really fall downhill. I thought we were done for.
But she said, strangely, in the months following Jason, their son's birth, Jerry seemed to be getting better. Okay.
And she said, and this is sad, she said, unlike his relationship with Megan, their daughter, which was distant and cold, Jerry was attentive and engaged with his son. Like, she was shocked.
That's sad. When he was home, he would play with the boy and talk about all the things he hoped to do with him when he got older.
Whenever he went on errands, he insisted on taking Jason with him. And he even went out of his way to take on some of the responsibilities around the house.
Like, allowing Ralphine to have a little time to herself as a new mom. Yeah, which is so important.
So like ideal. Like it's just like, what the fuck? But of course, at the time, she had no idea that despite how he was making things look and how he was trying to put in effort at home, at least with one of their children, on the inside, he was just trying to cover up the feelings that he was barely keeping under the surface.
Like he was still, he had all kinds of shit brewing in there that he was just trying to shove down. It sounds like it.
And it was only Jerry's nighttime activities that he kept doing because he kept doing this. He kept sneaking into women's houses, kept choking people unconscious, sexually assaulting people.
It was only that that he claims kept him from exploding every day. So she's thinking he's just on the up and up and he's doing horrible shit at night to keep himself from doing it during the day.
What a stark contrast there. Yeah.
And by January of that year, he finally lost all control. Oh, no.
On the afternoon of January 26, 1968, he was out working in the yard when he spotted a young woman coming down the sidewalk. She was carrying what appeared to be a very large book under her arm.
It was 19-year-old Linda Slauson, and she had only recently graduated from high school in Rochester, Minnesota, and she had moved to Aloha, Oregon to start her first job, which was in selling encyclopedias door-to-door. Despite the long hours and a lot of walking involved, the company required their female sales agents to dress nicely and wear high heels, even though they walked everything.
That's great. Yeah.
So she was standing on the sidewalk in front of the Brudos house and trying to figure out which direction she was supposed to be going into, and it started to rain. So she, you know, she just wanted to get out of the rain to get, you know, set those books that she was carrying down.
So she approached Jerry and said she was trying to find the address of a certain house where she had an appointment to show these encyclopedias, and she wondered whether it was his house she was looking for. Jerry looked her over for a moment, and he said he lingered for a second or two on her shoes before he told her, yes, come on in.
Oh, no. As they entered the house, Jerry mentioned that his wife was having company company upstairs and he said, why don't we meet in my workshop downstairs to have some privacy? No, thank you.
Go over this. So she went in the basement and she started giving her pitch on the encyclopedias and just making small talk with Jerry as she started to lay out all the products on the countertop.
And it was dark in the room, so she was fumbling to find the right brochures and stuff that she was trying to show him.

So he was like, oh, let me turn on the overhead lights.

And he got up from his stool and went behind her.

But instead of flicking on a light switch,

he grabbed a length of two by four

and swung it at the back of her head.

My God.

And is his wife actually upstairs having company?

His wife is actually upstairs. Oh my God.
Yeah. And this is just happening in her fucking basement? Yep.
Okay. And yep, he knocked her from the stool and sent her to the floor unconscious.
And like we said before, since he had been an adolescent, a teenager, Jerry had fantasized about kidnapping a woman and keeping her somewhere and just doing what he wanted, even though he didn't know what he wanted to do. And now he had just taken a step to make that a reality.
So he knelt down beside Linda on the floor and detected slight movement in her chest. So he wrapped his hands around her neck and began choking her until he was certain that she was dead.
He choked her to death. Oh my god.
In the days that followed this, he dressed and undressed Linda's body, putting her in the undergarments he'd been stealing throughout the previous months. And at night, after Ralphine and the kids had gone to sleep, Jerry would sneak down to the basement to rape her dead body and photograph her in various states of undress.
I did. Yeah.
I did not know that part of that, he was into that yeah that poor 19 years old and she's just doing her job and it was so fast and so horrific and and then his kids are playing upstairs i was just gonna say and his kids are upstairs and she's and his is upstairs, and this dead woman who he murdered is just in the basement.

Yep.

And he's just keeping her.

Fair warning.

He's a brutal sadistic fuck.

So, like, fair warning for the rest of this.

I mean, part two is going to get somehow even worse.

Oh, good.

But after a few days, when Linda's body had begun to decompose, Jerry used a hacksaw to remove Linda's left foot, which he kept in the back of the chest freezer in the basement. What? He kept her left foot in a freezer in his home's basement.
With the shoe? Well, in the rest of the remains, he bundled up among some old car parts and threw them, according to him, over a rail somewhere into the Willamette River. And later, for reasons that remain unclear to this day, Jerry told investigators he, quote,

didn't know where he disposed of Linda Slauson, but thought she was still alive when thrown over the railway route railing.

How would he think that if he choked the life out of her?

Exactly, and spent days dressing her and undressing her and committing necrophilia.

Yeah. Yeah.
So it's just just he was a strange motherfucker yeah when linda failed to return home that evening that she was killed her mother mildred reported her missing to the police and told them she'd last been seen in portland where she was going to sell encyclopedias and her disappearance coincided with the disappearance of another local girl, a 14-year-old girl named Terry Chambers, whose parents speculated she'd maybe run away to join a quote-unquote hippie community in Washington. So Mildred Slauson insisted her daughter was not doing that.
She had not run away. She had never given any indication that she was unhappy or wanted to leave home.
But the two stories wound up being associated, and Linda's disappearance was just treated as she was a runaway. Oh, no.
It's like, meanwhile, she just graduated. She just got this job.
She's literally outdoing this job when she disappears. And also, when the parents are saying she did not run away, they do know their child.

Yeah.

Like, you should at least take that into consideration.

Mm-hmm.

Now, the photographs and souvenirs Jerry kept from Linda Slauson's murder appear to have been sufficient enough to keep his urges at bay for a little while. Mm-hmm.

But by late November, the holiday period began and the Brudos household was full of Jerry and Ralphine's families. And Jerry's stress began spiking.
In the previous months, he would relieve his stress by looking at his pictures. Or, if it was particularly bad, he would go out prowling, steal some clothing from neighbors' clothing lines, like do the same old thing.
But since the weather had turned cold, no one was leaving clothes on the line. And finding a new trophy meant that he would have to go inside a home.
Now, on the evening of November 26, 1968, 23-year-old Jan Whitney was on her way to see her parents in McMinnville. And her car broke down.
It was on the I-5 freeway between Salem and Albany. I just have to point out, this is 10 months to the date of the last person he killed.
Yeah, you're right. That's interesting.
That is wild. That's weird.
Now, a few miles before this, Jan had stopped to pick up two young male hitchhikers. So the three of them got out of the car when the car died and they were all looking under the hood.
None of them knew what to do, so they were just like, we gotta figure out what to do. So Jerry Brudos was on his way home from work and driving down the I-5 when he spotted all three of these people standing by the car.
This is what's shocking. He spotted two men with her.
Yeah. And he pulled off to the side and got out to ask what the trouble was.
and when he learned that the car had broken down, he said he'd be happy to fix it since he knew a lot about that stuff, but he didn't have the tools to do it. Instead, he said, I'll give all three of you a ride.
So he did. He gave them all.
He put them all in the car. And then he let the two men out of the car at the nearest off ramp.
Mm-hmm. Which I was like, what the? So they could catch another ride.
It's like, hey, guys, maybe take this girl with you. Yeah, take her.
Maybe don't leave a girl in a car with a stranger. No, especially a girl that just gave you a ride.
Mm-hmm. And he and Jan drove on to his house where he said he would get his tools and take her back to fix the car.
When they got to his house, Jerry went to the front door but was soon back at the car telling her, the house is locked and I don't have my key, so we're going to have to wait for my wife to come home. Which is a way of soothing her until, like, my wife is coming home.
Oh, I have another woman here. Yeah.
He told Jan his wife would only be a few minutes, but in reality, Ralphine had taken the kids to a friend's house and wouldn't be back for hours. Oh, God.
And he knew that. So while they waited, Jerry got into the back seat behind the passenger seat and started making small talk.
And he said, I said it was a funny thing to ask someone to close his eyes and try to explain how to tie a shoe. Like, that was part of their small talk.
Like, oh, have you ever tried to have somebody close their eyes and explain how to tie a shoe? It's funny. And he said, you know, without using your hands to show how when you can't see.
And Jan was like, oh, okay. So she closed her eyes and started describing how to tie a shoe.
And while she did that, he reached down and grabbed the belt that was on the floor in the back seat. And by the time Jan realized what was happening, it was too late.
He had looped the belt around her neck and pulled it tight, choking her. When the belt was securely tightened around her neck, Jerry got out of the car.
And this is like an, I don't know why this like really chills me. He got out of the car and closed the end length of the belt in the door tightening it even more and leaving it so that she would not be able to untighten like it was a constant pressure and then he went inside to double check that ralphine was really gone and when he came back to the car jan was dead.
She had strangled to death alone in his car. And just outside of his house.
It's so wild that he takes people back to his house where he lives with his wife and kids and murders them. Yeah.
Like intentionally does that. Yes.
So she was, he confirmed that she was indeed dead. And then he raped Jan's body.
And then he took her out of of the car so in the car in front of his house he did that then took her out of the car and brought her down into the basement of the house and started photographing her in the various undergarments and shoes he'd stolen from the neighborhood jerry repeated these acts in the following days like dressing her undressing her taking. And then it would become clear that he would need to get rid of Jan's body.
And he decided he wanted something more than photographs to remember the experience. This one's particularly heinous.
I want everyone to know that. This might be something that you've heard about this case, but maybe you didn't know it was this case.
Okay. He later said, I thought I could make paperweights out of her breasts.
So he said, I cut off her right breast and I was going to make a plastic mold and then I could make lead paperweights. But I added too much hardener and it didn't turn out how I wanted.
Oh. Okay.
Now he was going to be making paper weights out of a woman's breasts to use around his house uh-huh and he was expecting to just be able to do that yep which is shocking to me makes you wonder what he was doing around that house exactly now certain that no one would go into his basement workshop, because he always made sure that they did not, Jerry and the family took a short trip to Portland for a few days, leaving Jan's body in his basement. Like, dude, that's going to permeate the rest of the house.
Yeah. Well, and also, they were pretty surprised when they came back, because they discovered that someone had driven a car through their garage door, leaving a giant hole where the door had been.
So the police came out, and they wanted to get into the garage, but it was locked. And he said that was close.
And he ended up being able to get them away without them looking into the basement it always happens and even that wasn't enough to convince him to get rid of jan's body he still kept her yep he wrapped her body in a sheet and hid her in the pump house while the police looked over the garage wait while they were there yeah oh my god then when the coast was clear he took her body to willamette river and waited it waited her down and then tossed her body in the river okay now when jan failed to show up at her parents house in mcminnville because remember she was on her way to her parents house right her father. Her father, John Whitney, reported her missing immediately.

And a day or two later, Jan's car was found on the side of the road

with all the doors locked.

And investigators were able to get into the car

and found that there was nothing to indicate that she,

you know, why she disappeared.

Right.

And really, other than a camera found in the back seat in her bags,

there was nothing of note in the car.

And police had a film in the camera developed and discovered photos indicating she might have had a flat tire that day. But that was really all they had.
And it wasn't really a lot of help with a lead. It was just like, did someone help her? And was that the person? But we don't have anything to go on other than that.
And nearly a year passed between the murder of Linda Slauson and Jan Whitney, but far less time would elapse between the next killing.

Yeah, because he's heating up and he's getting more and more bold.

I mean, the police just came to his house and he was able to fucking hide a dead body while they were there.

And you would think that would be when there would be a year between murders, but he takes less time now.

He goes right back into it.

I think it makes sense because he was able to get away with that. he's so he was emboldened yeah and that's where we're gonna leave part one because i knew it you bitch because we're part two is gonna get somehow even worse um this is all terrible he's a really really bad man he's a really really bad man and it's gonna be a lot so just please be aware of that i feel so bad for these women first these young women like and for his wife and children who were just living in their home while this was going on unbeknownst to them yeah no idea what's going on just Just hit the shit luck of having him as a father.
Yeah. Seriously.
Fuck. You feel so bad.
That's terrifying. Yeah.
All right. Sorry about that, everybody.
Well, we'll see for part two. We sure will.
In the meantime, we hope you keep listening. And we hope you keep keep it weird but not so weird that you'd be

stealing people's undergarments because what the fuck is wrong with you yeah don't do that and

not so weird that you're mean to your kids if you don't want kids don't have kids yeah don't be a

dick

bye Bye. Thank you.
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