Overtime - Episode #517: Ingrid Newkirk, Michael McFaul, Alex Wagner, Erick Erickson

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Welcome to an HBO podcast from the HBO Late Month series, Real Time with Bill Ma.

Hello.

Uh, okay.

Oh, hey, you are.

How are you?

All right, here we are on overtime.

Alex, has traveling with the campaigns across Iowa affected your opinion on whether or not Iowa should be first in the Democratic primary?

Man.

Let me say one thing about Iowa, because I think this is sort of unsung or it's unspoken.

The reason Steve King is a congressman from Iowa is because the demographics of Iowa are changing.

There are a lot of immigrants in Iowa.

Some of them are undocumented, some of them are not.

But the face of Iowa is changing and changing rapidly, especially in the labor market.

And so we shouldn't just dismiss Iowa as an all-white state.

Having said that, it is pretty damn white.

So,

do I think that, I mean, I was interviewing Julian Castro this week, and,

you know, I think that there is a reasonable argument to be made that the party, if it wants to accurately reflect its electorate, should at least rotate among states that have higher Hispanic and African-American populations.

What do you think, panel, of Trump saying he'll go after entitlements if he's re-elected?

Bullshit.

Bullshit that he said or not going to do it.

Nobody's going to do it.

I mean, this is what the president says, but.

But why say it then?

Because he wanted more money from the Republicans in his budget for nuclear defense, so they gave him more money by saying we'll deal with entitlements next time around.

And next time around, just like George W.

Bush said he'll do it, he won't actually do it.

Okay.

Well, I think he's.

I mean, he's been pretty good about following up on all the big promises.

I mean,

people always get through.

Right.

But, like.

There's no way.

And even the Republican, because Paul Ryan wanted this forever.

You had both houses of Congress and a Republican president.

They wouldn't touch it.

When we finally go bankrupt as a nation, they'll all deal with these issues.

And until then, you're not going to.

But he did not do well with that.

I mean, he's added like a trillion dollars to the deficit.

It's horrible.

Horrible.

I mean, I used to remember, I don't even, I used to be an elected Republican.

For God's sakes, I have no idea what the Republicans' Party stands for other than humping humping the president's leg these days.

But you're still.

But you're still, you're going to vote for the leg that you're hooking.

That they're up to the house.

I've seen the other side.

I honestly, a friend of mine said it's like God's judgment.

I don't like the guy, and there are enough of his policies I do versus the people who I really like Joe Biden.

He's a fine human being.

I would sleep well with him as president, but God, the policies, can I just...

So you would vote for Biden over Trump?

No.

No.

No, not even Biden?

No, even.

Not even Biden?

I would sleep well with Biden.

I know.

Sleep well.

If you could sleep well.

Wait, wait, if you'd sleep well with him, why couldn't you vote for it for him?

I am, I really, life is a big issue for me.

The pro-life cause is.

And so, yeah.

All right, so I was right about that.

It is all about the law.

Even though Biden were the Joe Biden of 20 years ago,

the Democrats don't understand.

They would wipe out the Republican Party if you had a pro-life Democrat because a lot of people don't like the president and will vote for him on this issue who really don't even like the Republican Party anymore.

Or

at least don't talk about abortion like you like it.

Derek.

Yes.

They used to know how to do that better.

Clinton knew how to do it.

Clinton is a good example.

Same thing with guns.

Don't talk about it with such glee.

You know, like, ooh, we're going to take all the guns and

we can't wait to kill all the babies.

I mean,

nobody, by and large, the Democratic Party is not running.

I mean, Bedouin Roar can say things on a debate stage, but by and large, the Democratic Party is not running around saying, we're going to take away all the guns.

No, but they're not running on abortion either.

And Americans...

But if you look at the polling data, this is not at the top of the list.

But here's my thing.

Americans, and I think

Democrats or Republicans.

Binary.

There's only two camps now, right?

There's only two teams.

Everything that the blue team, anybody on the blue team does, gets thrown in the blue team hopper, and we all have to answer for it.

So you're right.

Not every Democrat is doing that, but when they make the ads, the people in Iowa will fix it.

At least the blue team doesn't have as much to answer for these days.

That's true.

But you're still voting for Trump.

This guy

sticking to his guts.

Ingrid, how will Trump's repealing of Obama?

Oh, yeah, this is a horrible story this week.

We didn't even get to it.

Trump's repealing of Obama-era water protections affect animal populations in the wetlands.

Yeah, you're now, we can go back to dumping pesticides and fertilizers directly into waterways and to destroy wetlands for construction.

I mean, this is going to be a big issue for you.

Yeah, I mean we really can't point to any president who's done magnificently for animals, but certainly this administration with who they've put in charge of the Department of Interior, the Department of this, that and the other, they're no friends of animals.

One good thing has come out of the Trump administration I have.

He did sign a bill.

He signed a bill.

He also, the EPA, has said it will move away from animal experiments, and we've been meeting with them and they have come further in this administration than they have in past administrations.

The use of animals is going to go.

But no, in any other area, it's been a disaster.

Okay.

So I have one last question.

I'm going to quote something.

And Eric, I know you have really done a human job.

It was my night.

Just one night.

Special job.

I didn't get to it during the show, but this is, I've read this before.

It's a transcript of a...

recorded call between Paul Ryan, when he was the Speaker of the House, Kevin McCarthy, and Steve Scalise, right?

This is June 15th, 2016.

I didn't know they were being taped, but we've heard it.

McCarthy, there's two people I think Putin pays, Brahrbacher and Trump.

Swear to God.

Ryan says, this is off the record.

No leaks, right?

This is how we know we're a family here.

Scalise, that's how you know that we're tight.

Ryan, what's said in the family stays in the family.

So McCarthy says Putin pays Trump.

And their reaction is not, oh my God, Trump is on Putin's payroll.

It's, yeah, we keep this in the family, right?

That doesn't bother you?

I don't think he.

Rohrbacher, I wouldn't be surprised if he's not.

But he said the president is.

He said it.

I think Putin pays Rohrbacher and Trump swear to God.

Just in case we didn't think he meant.

He met Kevin McCarthy, though.

I mean, doesn't the specter of that, or the idea that history could determine that in fact there was some arrangement, doesn't Doesn't that shake people into wanting to go to the bottom of it?

Whether paid or not, I don't know the facts on that.

And I've been talking a lot about facts.

We've heard this.

That's what they say.

But what really bothers me about folks like this,

they don't like Trump.

They talk like you.

I mean, they all talk like you.

They don't like

all those guys.

I mean, you know, when they're talking in the family, that's what they say among the family.

And yet when they come out in the public, because they care about taxes and for you, maybe foreigner issues or maybe power,

they just forget about all this other stuff.

And that's what I can't respect.

I will support any Republican senator that gets up

and says, I've listened to all the evidence and, you know,

for my beliefs, my opinion, this president shouldn't be removed because of this.

What I can't stand.

is when they won't let us see the facts.

When they are saying, it's, you know,

I can't hear the facts.

I can't hear the facts.

The facts matter.

And I'm optimistic about America, because actually, if you look at the data, Americans care about facts too.

Most of Americans, by the way, are not polarized.

They're purple.

We, the elites, we, the media, we, the Republican, the candidates, because of gerrymandering and money, we're polarized.

Montana is not polarized.

Guess, I'm going to put you on the spot, Bill.

Guess how many Montanans voted for Barack Obama in 2008?

In 2008, Montanans, 43.8%.

Oh, you're pretty close.

47.

Wow.

Yeah.

47.

Is that right?

No, I would not have guessed that number.

Don't tell me we're polarized.

We're not polarized.

We maybe are polarized.

Glad you're optimistic.

Did you hear that thing I said at the end?

I did.

All right.

Thank you, everybody.

I appreciate that.

Enjoy.

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