RAINN WILSON talks Dwight, Clowning, Baha'i

We're talking about the film, okay?

Stop it.

No, no, it's not that good.

It's really, some of them are.

Rain's team wanted me to pass along a message.

He's totally fine to talk about the office, but he doesn't want it to be a main focus of the interview and appreciate it.

Not a main focus.

We're talking about the topic to more of a minimum.

We're talking about the Bagadavida.

That's pretty true.

They glean that.

I'm happy to talk about it.

We got to call you faster.

Well, no.

I want to talk about your new film,

Code 3.

You know how you talked about the Midwestern person saying thank you you and not really meaning it?

I'm so interested in hearing about your new movie.

Tell us about your movie.

Oh,

Welcome back to the Adam Friedland Show guys.

Adam Friedland here.

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great stuff.

My guest this week is actor Rain Wilson.

Wilson is, of course, best known for his portrayal of the buffoonish Dwight Schroot on the NBC's hit sitcom The Office.

During the series' eight season run, America reveled in Shroot's humiliation at the hands of Jim Halpert, who was played by John Krasinski from also the Benghazi movie, if you guys have seen that one.

During one such episode,

famously, Shroot's stapler was put in a gelatin mold and it was hilarious.

Now, as everyone knows,

one of my strengths as an interviewer is my natural charm and charisma.

Practically every guest I've had on the show has left an interview in love with me, which is frankly kind of annoying.

But my conversation with Wilson was perhaps the polar opposite.

It was contentious, it was uncomfortable, and after he left the studio that day, it came to my attention that he had cyberbullied me on the popular social media app Instagram in a post that both doxed and ridiculed our office's bathroom.

But it didn't end there.

The following week, Wilson sent me numerous threatening text text messages, which in this current political climate has left me on edge and afraid.

But I didn't want to be a victim.

I wanted to put myself in Mr.

Wilson's shoes.

Why was this beloved comedic actor being mean?

Perhaps the answer was right in front of us this whole time.

On NBC, during prime time, before Parks and Wreck, I think it was 8 on Thursdays.

Perhaps art bled its way into reality.

Perhaps he'd been driven insane after eight years of publicly broadcasted torture.

Kind of like Heath Ledger Joker.

I'm not a licensed psychiatrist, and in order to confirm my theory, I needed to consult with one.

So I called up friend of the show, sexual misbehavior expert, James Foley, to see if my suspicions were proven correct.

James Foley.

Hi, James.

Adam Friedland, Adam Friedland Show.

How are you?

I'm doing great.

I miss you, brother.

You're doing well?

I miss you more.

I'm doing fantastic.

No, you couldn't possibly.

No, but yeah, thank you.

Wait, quick question.

Okay, this is kind of random,

but like if someone was like played like a complete,

like complete joke or like a clown or a buffoon, like for maybe, let's say, eight seasons on a popular television show where America just loved loved laughing at them, just getting their comeuppance and just like stepping on rakes and like, you know, kind of like metaphorically speaking, having their pants pulled down and then exposing their middle-school genitalia to...

I don't know what they ignore that part.

If someone plays

a heel, right,

in an incredibly popular context on television, let's say NBC during prime time before Parks and Rec maybe, okay?

Would that potentially affect their real life?

I would think so.

I would definitely, when you say potentially, I would definitely think it would have a drag on their emotions.

Yeah.

Kind of like a Benoit situation.

I don't know.

I don't know

who Benoit is.

Chris Benoit from WWE.

Oh, oh, okay.

Yeah.

Anyway, okay, thanks a lot.

I won't keep you.

I think that answers my question.

Okay, thank you, Kev.

Okay, bye.

So what can we do as an audience when we see a beloved individual teetering towards self-harm?

We can all go and see Code 3, which is the new movie that he's in with Lil Rell.

It's in theaters.

Oh, it's about an ambulance.

It's hilarious.

Guys, enjoy the show.

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Our next guest is a legendary Hollywood actor whose new film Code 3 comes out this month on the 12th.

Please welcome Rain Wilson, everyone.

Big noise.

Ooh, I like that.

With the drink.

You're like a, you're like a.

They used to do that on the old talk shows with the cocktails.

They would come out like with cocktails.

Well, I think they were all hammered.

They were.

I think,

yeah, what's his name?

Ed Sullivan.

I only did Leno.

Obviously, I was not old enough to do Carson, but they would have the drink cart down the hall and wheel in the drink cart.

Like with the shakers and the cognac and how it was.

How was Jay?

You know, he was nothing but nice and supportive to me.

He gets too much crap.

I think he gets too much crap.

He was a really good...

Like, first of all, when he first started as a comic, like, especially in like the late 70s and the 80s,

he was edgy, or he was considered edgy.

Everyone from that era says there was one guy, and by far, he was the best, and it was Mr.

Jay Leno.

Yeah.

And for people my age, we're like, oh, the guy that's like Monica Lewinsky?

Like, you know, we're like, that guy?

Yeah.

But like, the Republicans are crazy.

The Democrats are crazy.

Like,

that guy was edgy.

Yeah.

But.

Yeah, apparently he wasn't.

But he was always really nice to me.

And I would go on and whore whore myself out to promote my...

He prostituted you.

Yeah.

He really would.

Mr.

Jay Leno.

He was, apparently he was the guy in the 80s, so I let him

have me.

Yeah, really.

Out of respect.

Yeah.

Yeah, I did the same for Weird Al Yankovic.

Yeah, he was.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah, and he'll go there.

He will go there.

Yeah.

He really does go there.

Actually, apparently he's the greatest guy of all time.

Weird Al?

Yeah.

Al is the nicest.

You know him.

He's a friend of yours.

Well, I also did did that.

His story about his parents dying and then him performing that night is the most.

Did you know about that?

I didn't know this story.

Please tell.

His parents both died, and then...

Do you want him on the show?

Because I can get him on the show.

Yes.

Yes.

Yes.

Okay, here's another thing that gets too much crap.

Funny songs.

Parody songs.

Funny songs are like, people are

say it's the lowest common denominator.

It's the funny.

Adam Sandler's Hanukkah song?

Well, listen that one in in this day and age we can't let come on it's too it's too dicey these days you can't sing a Hanukkah song because of Gaza yes yes exactly

out of respect for Hamas I will not listen to it no no

no but did you tell the dead parents joke it's not a joke or joke a story sorry um his

his parents I think there was a gas leak and they both died and he had a concert that night and he went out and you he was like I'm fat you know he did he's like I gotta do the show must go on.

Yeah, and he was like, you know, living in an Amish paradise.

I'm fat.

I think I lost respect for him.

He should have canceled the show.

I'm sorry.

I think he probably should have canceled the show.

We're talking shit on this guy about his lowest moment.

Al is the greatest guy alive.

I was in his movie, Weird the Al Yankovic story.

Have you seen that movie?

No, wait, no.

Very funny.

They wrote up a fake biopic of Al Yankovic, and it's got a great cast of a lot of comic actors.

He's in in that other movie, which is the three letters.

That movie is so funny.

That's very funny.

But this came out a couple years back.

Weird Al Yankovic story is very funny.

It's a kind of alternate world as if Al Yankovic was more popular than and dated Madonna and was like the most popular pop star on the planet.

He should have been, if you ask me.

Right?

Yeah.

How is this interview going so far?

It's not an interview yet.

We're just feeling, we're like two dogs at the dog park sniffing each other's asses, right?

How is this show

itself?

How is it going so far?

How is the Adam

Finland show, episode number 237, with Rain Wilson?

We're six minutes in.

How's it going so far?

I feel like, again, like we're two dogs at the dog park smelling each other's bums.

Okay.

And your shit,

it smells like roses.

Oh, right.

It smells phenomenal.

Yours smells like...

Freshly baked chocolate chip cookies.

Oh, thank you so much.

Is that good or bad?

I love it.

I mean, chocolate kills dogs.

I mean, this is a weird.

Good point.

Okay.

I was looking at your filmography, and you were in a film directed by Mr.

Rob Zombie.

Yeah.

Called, what was his name?

House of a Thousand Corpses.

And

correct me if I'm wrong, did you wear costumes on the set?

I wore costumes, yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

And there was someone that

was a costumer on set?

I imagine that there was.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And her name was Amanda?

Could have been.

Friedland, perhaps?

It could have been.

Yeah.

Perhaps my aunt.

Your aunt Amanda dressed me for that show.

And she said she laid out my wardrobe in the trailer for me.

I don't know how you guys put the clothes on.

Yep.

It's usually laid out in a trailer.

You've got your trailer.

It says like

Rain Wilson, and you open it up and there's your wardrobe is laid out.

And then a convenient person comes by and they're like, here's your pants and we steam those.

And if you can choose, you can either wear these tennis shoes or these for this scene, and there's a change of underwear in the closet.

You know, let me know if you have any questions.

And then

perhaps there's a vote on set of who in the production is most fuckable, and perhaps my aunt wins that vote.

Wow.

This is what I was told on the phone yesterday by Auntie Amanda, and I just want to know, did you vote for my aunt or not?

I would have voted for Rob Zombie's wife, Sherry Moon Zombie, Zombie, because she is smoking.

Okay.

You didn't vote for my?

I don't remember Amanda Friedland.

I would have liked.

Oh, okay.

She said she saw you at Comic-Con.

You were very nice.

You remembered her.

But

you would have remembered that she was voted most fuckable on set.

Is that something that happens a lot in Hollywood?

You know, where the fellers get together and they vote for who's the most fuckable?

They do, yes.

Every production.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Who it is.

Yeah.

Who won the office?

Oh, The Office.

Leslie.

Jan Levinson.

Oh, Jan Levinson Gold.

Yeah.

I want to ask you.

See, the annoying thing is this.

Every interview, you get the question, are you tired of being Dwight or something, right?

Sure, some of you.

Because it is an iconic, ubiquitous, like American comedy

legendary character.

And everyone asks you about getting

approached on the street, but they don't ask you about

what gave birth to Dwight.

So right down the street at NYU,

you know, I was always really good at coming.

I was a theater actor, and I was always really good at comedy theater, whether it was doing sketches or a farce or doing clowny kind of characters or Shakespeare clowns or something like that.

But I did pretty wide-ranging theater training.

But one of the things we did is we took a clowning class.

And this is like,

who's the guy who plays Borat again?

What's that guy?

Sasha Baron Cohen.

Sasha Baron Cole.

So he went to the guy in Paris.

He went and go see.

He was a C guy, right?

Yeah, Lecoq.

And that.

That's funny.

That's funny.

But this woman, Gates McFadden, was our clown teacher just for a couple of weeks or months.

And

she was actually played Dr.

Crusher on Star Trek the Next Generation.

The beautiful red-headed woman.

She teaches clowns.

She is a clown teacher, a master clown teacher.

That was a childhood.

I didn't even have like a know what sex was, but I was like, I need her.

Crusher was incredible.

I think she's still available.

Is she?

Mm-hmm.

And she teaches clown?

She doesn't regularly teach it, but she is capable of teaching a mean clown class.

She could be your clown tutor, your private clown tutor.

My clown teacher.

Yeah.

Crusher.

Yeah.

Did Worf, was he funny or no?

He was hysterical.

He was my voice.

Michael Dorn.

teacher.

No, he wasn't.

Yeah.

Michael Dorn was?

Yeah, and Patrick Stewart

taught...

He taught non-disclosure agreement.

So, but anyways, in this clown class, you did a lot about...

you know, creating a character kind of out of nothing.

And that when you put on the red nose, it amplifies whatever you're doing.

And the big mistake with like red nose clowning is like you do something clowny.

And there was this exercise we did called circle of fire which is basically you put on a red nose you go in front of people and

you can only leave the stage once you've made everyone laugh really and sometimes people would be up there for 45 minutes yeah because you had enemies in the class people that like really do you know

good good thinking but because it's really hard to make people maybe not for you and maybe not even for me a little bit but it's really hard to make people laugh with a red nose on your face.

What if you fart really loud?

Get out there.

It's gonna, it's not gonna be that funny.

Really?

Yeah.

Because no, what you think is gonna be funny doesn't work with a red nose.

So what's really funny is being totally vulnerable.

And like if you were to cry about like a dead relative, that would be hysterical.

Really?

I'm not even kidding.

I cried on this show a couple weeks ago.

I don't think it was about people.

What did you cry about?

No, we don't have to get into it.

All right.

So

I'm just saying that the roots of creating a character like Dwight come from these ideas of clowns.

Like you go back from, you know, there have always been clowns in human history.

And you can go back to the Greek comedies and then the Roman comedies and then Commedia dell'arte, that was traveling clown troops in wooden wagons all across Europe.

And then Moliere and Shakespeare took those tropes and those ideas, put them in all their plays, and then those became like British vaudeville, that became American vaudeville, that became like, you know, Jack Benny and early television and the honeymooners and sketch comedy and that became, you know, Monty Python.

You can trace clowning and some basics about building those characters back to the classics.

There were probably

Hebrew clowns

back in the Old Testament.

The slaves in Egypt.

They were like, what?

I can't be out in the sun this long.

The slaves sound like Woody Allen.

It's ridiculous that they...

My friend Mike Racine used to have a joke.

He's like, imagine having a slave and it's a fucking Jew.

He's like, those would be the worst slaves ever.

Well, okay.

So I...

But do you want me to...

Is there a universal comedy language?

Because it's very interesting.

You were saying that you have to go up on stage and make someone laugh.

I've been thinking this, I've thought this for years.

Like, what, like, if you went to like a tribe in the Amazon and, like, that's been like

what would be funny?

And I, it's a very interesting thing to ponder, but I think there's only one thing I could, I would consider farting balls, like, just getting, hit, hurting your hands.

Hitting the balls.

Yeah, hitting the balls is funny.

That is universal.

I think there's some universals.

I think someone like trying something and failing is

universally funny.

I think, you know, I think if you went in the the...

If that happened

to the Amazon, they would be hysterical, right?

Crusher taught you that?

Crusher taught you that?

Go to two.

Go to two.

There's a real pro.

We got a pro!

So those elements come into playing Dwight.

Like, first of all, I saw Mackenzie Crook on the British office who was brilliant, and there was a thing that he did.

that no one had done as well as him before, which was to say the most absurd, ludicrous things with an absolutely straight face, without any kind of hint at all that there was a joke there.

And he was so brilliant at that.

And Ricky really, I think, taught him that and Stephen Merchant.

Like a lack of self-awareness, basically.

Yes.

But without, you couldn't see the actor, because it was a documentary, you couldn't see the actor kind of doing a weird line like,

I drink my own urine and putting any kind of spin on it.

Just like, I drink my own urine, just completely.

and so i loved that and then there were some other elements of like i knew that dwight needed i needed i have a huge weird head and i needed a haircut to showcase just how gargantuan and melonic my head is and so i sculpted that and the self-seriousness and i knew he was kind of like he was a nerd and kind of a bully at the same time like you can have your lives matter yeah he respects the yeah police yeah yeah totally respect that.

He wants to be a cop, right?

Yeah, it was a Lackawanna County Sheriff's

deputy.

So you put these elements together and you kind of create a clown almost in the way that you would have a red nose on.

Is your audience going to give a fuck about this?

Yeah, I think so.

Okay.

Okay.

Wait.

And everybody likes to wait.

Well, my son is a huge Adam Friedland fan.

What's happening?

Does he have emotional problems?

Sorry.

A little bit.

I want to get my,

sorry, my stupid thing.

Should we call him?

Yeah, call him right now.

This is very unprofessional.

I think he's in class.

He is?

Tell him to get out of class.

Send him a selfie.

Sorry.

Okay.

I'm just going to take one of these stupid things.

I'm sorry.

The person you've dialed can't take your call now.

Oh, my God.

He blocked you.

They go by Kenzie.

They, okay.

Mm-hmm.

And they're a big fan?

Where do they go to self-confidence?

They're a big fan.

Bard College.

Here, you can leave an audio note.

Oh, yeah.

No, they're doing ketamine right now.

Hello, Kenzie.

I'm with your dad right now.

This is Adam Friedland.

Oh, you sent him the Richie Torres interview?

That's so embarrassing.

What else did you say?

You sent it to me.

You said...

Please don't read my texts.

Okay.

Well, you're...

Should I pick up?

Yeah.

Hey, what's up?

It's Adam.

I'm with your dad right now.

We're chilling.

It's who?

It's Adam Friedland.

oh hi adam freedland what's up how's bard going this is so surreal yeah yeah yeah how's bard you you go to class

oh it's it's nice are you wearing all black

no but i do some time you gotta stay away from all those nyc kids they're they're no good

yeah

um

yeah well i heard that you like the show i just want to say hello real quick oh hi yeah i like the show what'd you say i have a friend who's more of a fan of you than me who likes you more than me.

Oh, well, I'm sorry, dude.

I'm okay.

Well, tell your friend I say what up.

Alright, we gotta get back to this interview.

We're doing a bad job so far.

Oh, am I on tape right now?

I'm serious.

No, no, no, no.

You're not on the show at all.

Okay, bye.

Alright, bye.

He's not a chest.

Wait, okay, so

they released the auditions.

for the office.

And the amazing thing is this, and I don't like, not to freaking blow smoke up your up your hole or whatever they say.

But like it's Seth Rogan, Judah Friedlander, Patton Oswald, and you, and you're just Dwight.

You're like, you're, you've, the character is fully fleshed out just in an audition, like a self-tape.

Yeah.

And it's like, it's amazing to see.

that like you know these guys are like heralded comedic actors right and you just destroy i mean you're just dwight so in that sense what when i watched that i was like oh he's crafted this it's not a a matter of like, yeah, that the writers kind of have done it.

This is a guy that's auditioning for a role.

And that's, to me, made it like all the more impressive, you know?

Well, I love all those actors.

They're all great.

I think

you come at a character from a different way when you've had theater training versus when you come from a stand-up or improv or sketch background.

And nothing against them, like Steve Corell comes from a sketch and improv background.

And he's one of the, I think, and truly one of the greatest American actors of all time his dramatic work and his comedic work yeah so that's nothing against them I just think when you when you have theater training you're you're you're trying to create a character a three-dimensional character that can be funny but taken seriously and could walk down the street and you and you would believe it there's not anything kind of like you want to

you know, theoretically, make that character like fully living and breathing.

And so I try and do that kind of work when I'm going in, especially on an audition.

But this was one of those rare auditions where I had seen the BBC office, loved it.

It's the best.

How good is it?

It's so good.

And I took so many things from Dear McKenzie and just kind of put my own kind of American, kind of white trashy spin on it.

Pennsylvania Dutch, kind of.

Yeah, yeah.

Well, that whole thing came out of an improv.

So you brought, did you bring that in that, like, you had, you're a farmer and your cousin was like oh so yeah.

So that's another question I had like how much was that the writers and how much was it you

creating backstory?

Just like how Greg Daniels does that that no one else does and it's he's amazing in this way.

Early on I did an improv.

We would just kind of improvise all the time to just kind of find the character and find the tone.

And I did this improv.

I don't even remember when it was.

I think it was in the first week and I was like, and I just improvised and I went,

I really had not planned it it at all.

I was like, my name is Dwight Schrood.

My father's name?

Dwight Shroot.

His father's name?

Dwight Shrood.

Amish.

And out of that, they're like, oh, we'll make him and his family Amish.

And then I did something about, I brought in like family photos of like my farmer ancestors in Wisconsin and Minnesota.

And Greg's ancestors, Jewish, were actual beet farmers in Poland.

And so, like, we'll make it, we'll have this farm-amish backstory to Dwight.

That's perfect.

It's in Pennsylvania anyway.

Yeah.

So it came out of that.

It came out of all that.

So, you know, that's amazing writing that you can kind of like

just kind of go with what you pick up.

Well, you know, it is just a legendary, I mean, it's like Costanza-level, just like comedic character.

I mean, it's like, and it's just like, it's so impressive.

Oh, no, no, no.

It's better than Costanza.

I mean, I don't know.

Costanza's pretty good.

Costanza.

Costanza's pretty good.

I mean it's anti-Semitic for you to say.

Even though it's not Jewish characters.

Wait, wait, you were quoted as saying that one of the best parts about the show was that there were no Jewish characters.

Is that correct?

That's correct.

Yeah.

I guess who...

I guess there were.

Actually, I just made that up.

Oh, Jan.

Jan Levinson.

That's...

Jan Levinson, yeah.

Actually, that's.

That's Braharden, non-Jew.

That's probably the most...

She wasn't a Jew.

How could she possibly understand what it is to be Jew?

I can't be the most accurate.

She hasn't been canceled.

That has to be the most accurate character, actually.

Like, she's just playing a proper Jewish psycho.

She's like, my friends' moms were like that.

They were all like Joseph Stalin.

The dinner party is my favorite.

Of course it is.

Of course it is.

That's your favorite episode.

And it is.

It's next level.

Going to a couple whose

relationship is falling apart for dinner.

And you bringing an old lady, an old dinner.

Your babysitter.

Your babysitter.

There's also an implication that you're like an incredible fuck throughout the entire show.

That you're just like a...

Yeah, you do that.

Which is another, like, no one else would do that, would create a show, a character like Dwight, and like, let's not have him like fuck up in love.

Let's have him bed like 20 or 30 women over the course.

He's an incredible, incredible lover.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

You know, on Peacock, they have the extended episodes, and I've seen a couple of them, and it's really fun to watch those.

I don't know, I'm sure that one is up, but I would love to see the extended episode of of that one.

Oh my God.

Because every episode, you know, this was back in the days of Network TV.

We had to get every episode down to one, to 21 minutes and like 40 seconds.

So lots of stuff got cut out.

So much stuff got cut out.

It's also amazing they used to do like 25 of them, like

a season.

Like that's so much work.

We would do between 21 and 25 episodes in a nine-month span.

I mean, it's just like a testament to like that operation had to be like a well-oiled machine.

Daniels had to be like fucking like a nate like an admiral or something.

It is.

He is like a general and not only that, but he's making decisions about what about this location and what about this hire and what about this payroll?

And he's meeting with the network and like Staples wants to sponsor these next episodes and how do we work that?

And so you're dealing with everything.

But the writer's room was like 15 strong and just amazing, amazing talent.

Like 87-year-old Jewish men that were like dying.

No, I'm just obviously.

38-year-old Jewish men.

I'm sure it's like Harvard kids.

I think.

I'm sure it's like Lampoon.

It was a lot of Harvard kids.

Lampoon.

I think my grandmother was Jewish.

I'm sorry.

But

we don't know that for sure.

You say that in Hollywood?

Her name is Marie Nunberg.

And she's from northern Romania.

And the rumor is that she was Jewish, but

she died young and her family all died and blah, blah, blah.

We don't know.

We don't know.

But Marie Nunberg, it sounds pretty Jewish.

Where's the rest of your family from?

Brazil, right?

No.

I thought they just showed up in like around the late 40s or something.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, they showed up in the 1948 in Brazil.

My name is Heinrich.

In the Males.

Yeah,

we've been Brazilian this whole time.

We are Brazilians.

We love

Threesomes.

Did you ever see that movie Boys from Brazil?

Of course.

In the 70s?

Of course.

So.

Yeah, that was a Mengele, right?

It was about Joseph Mengele.

It was about they had cloned Hitler.

And he cloned Hitler.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's just an insanely stupid premise for a movie that in the 1970s you could make.

You could really make that.

In the death wish era of Hollywood, where it's like, what if a guy's really pissed off and he just kills

a thousand minorities

on the subway?

Yeah.

Well, okay.

I kind of wanted to like,

let's parlay that.

You were talking about your grandmother.

But I know that you talk a lot about faith and in your, like,

you have a podcast.

And like, and, you know, like in your career since then,

you're very upfront about spirituality.

And you're a Baha'i.

I'm a Baha'i, yeah.

And that's an Abrahamic religion.

I know nothing of Baha'i, but

it's new, right?

Well, it is an Abrahamic religion.

I would say it's the fourth major Abrahamic religion.

Yeah.

Yeah.

How many boys you got globally?

Six million, so?

Small.

Small.

Yeah, six million, yeah.

And you're like the number one?

I'm

number,

I'm like number two or three.

I've done.

You found Dizzy Gillespie was Baha'i?

Yeah, Dizzy Gillespie was Baha'i.

That's not bad.

Yeah, yeah.

What's your Hollywood?

What's the Baha'i, like, what's the thing that you guys have on lock?

What's your, what's your, there's like seven Baha'is in Hollywood.

No, I mean, saying, like, like our thing is like we control the media and the banks.

Yeah, like what what do you guys control?

Baha'is control non-profit international development service work.

That sounds evil.

That sounds real evil.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah,

my bro I'm staying with my homie, my Baha'i homie's letting me stay in his apartment in Harlem.

He's off working on the international food program for Rockefeller Foundation, you know, feeding the...

feeding the kids, you know, feeding the kids.

And you guys have that

unlocky.

What's sorghum?

i don't even know okay

what so what's like the what's the book what's your like uh by like what language is it because it's not like uh it's not attached to like a an ethnic identity right like it's it's an international faith but it started in persia in persia right yeah so the the you know the main languages of the main baha'i writings were uh persian farsi and arabic so both when you go to shul or when you go to church church or no church temple no synagogue no temple you don't go no clergy No clergy.

No.

So like, do you, like, do you, do you have songs or something?

There's some songs that people make up and stuff like that.

There's a bunch of Baha'i books and tablets and prayers.

We're here in New York City, so every year, all the Baha'is of New York City gather and elect nine Baha'is they feel like kind of are the most wise and spiritual to get on there?

Democratically

run the affairs of the Baha'i community in New York City.

So that, and then there's, but none of them have any authority over any other.

So it's completely democratically elected religious faith.

Are you thinking about running?

No campaigning.

No campaigning.

Campaigning

is illegal in the Baha'i Faith.

So what?

They just have to think of someone?

Yes.

You literally go into prayer and contemplation and you write down, silent ballot, the nine names of the people that you want to vote for.

So if you get on that, you have to do it?

Can you decline?

You can.

You could decline.

You can either just stop showing up or you can decline for like health reasons and some, you know, some other like hardship reasons.

So, how does one practice the faith?

If there's no church, you can't go to the place and like, you know,

we meet and gather at community centers or people's homes or something like that.

So Baha'is read from the holy writings in the morning and the evening.

We say one prayer in the middle of the day.

And there's a fasting period, kind of similar to Ramadan.

Okay.

And

so, Baha'is do a fast.

These are some of the things the Baha'is, these are what the Baha'is do in your neighborhood.

And your parents were Baha'is.

My parents were Baha'is.

You were raised Baha'i.

Yeah.

Is it kind of in America, is it like kind of hippie or it was kind of a hippie.

It's this weird amalgam where my parents are Baha'is, kind of bohemian Baha'is from the 60s.

A lot of people became Baha'is in the 60s and the 70s when people were exploring kind of different spiritual paths like Kat Stevens became a Muslim and, you know, Yusuf Islam, I call him.

Yeah.

And Steve Jobs was at a Buddhist monastery.

And

then there was this influx of all these Persian refugees from the revolution in 79 and 80.

So you had all these like hippie Baha'is,

you know, singing peace and love songs.

And then this influx of Persian refugees.

Baha'i MW, leopard skin couch.

Yeah, yeah.

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Yeah, I left the Baha'i Faith for a long time.

I didn't want anything to do like a lot of young people with religion or faith or God or morality or anything like that.

You went punk?

I went punk.

Yeah.

Were you punk?

NYU?

Yeah, well.

86 NYU.

What are you listening to?

I got a buzz cut and dyed my hair black.

Buzz cut and black.

Yeah.

Really?

Yeah.

I look kind of like Henry Rollins a little bit.

Really?

Yeah.

What were your bands when you were punk?

You know, I wasn't really that hardcore because I was like Clash, you know, stuff like that.

What's wrong with that, dude?

Well, yeah, but I wasn't like...

Best bit.

I wasn't like,

I wasn't like going all like black flag and, you know,

stuff like that.

Too scary.

Yeah.

I don't even hurt.

That's smelly.

A little bit.

I smell.

I like the, yeah, my first,

my grandma gave me 20 bucks.

I got a three CD set, self-title, London Calling, and Combat Rock.

Oh, amazing.

When I was like 13.

And I was like, life-changing.

That's what I thought.

I was punk too.

Yeah.

And then my mom was like, fucking, you're an idiot.

You're a Jewish.

And I was like, I'm a fucking.

There's a lot of great Jewish punks.

Yeah.

Who?

Henry Rollins, not Jewish.

I can't think of him.

Ugh.

What is he on about?

You know, he hasn't got the same voice as the B-52's guy.

No one says that, right?

It's annoying.

That's true.

The government doesn't like transfer

President Reagan.

Yeah, it's whatever, dude.

Anyway, I wait, so I've been to the Baha'i Temple in Haifa in Israel.

I have.

It's a new religion.

You guys, you think about maybe

get the hell out of there.

You don't need to be in the world.

We were there.

We were there before,

certainly not before the Palestinians or the Jews.

No, no.

But Baha'is were, you know, the Baha'i Holy Land was coming to existence, you know, late 19th century, early 20th century.

So Baha'is are so like neutral about the whole.

Oh, so you guys are wait and see.

That's your vibe.

Baha'is are just trying to survive and keep our holy lands intact.

It's just kind of like, please make peace and stop fighting.

And it's beautiful.

And

yeah, but it was, you know, it was pretty intense because the war was raging as the Baha'i temples were being built and the administrative center was being built and then there was the, you know, the 1948 and stuff and we weren't sure like where where's the Jewish state and the Palestinian state and how is that going to subdivide the Baha'i?

You guys were just gardening.

We're just like, yeah, just pruning shrubs.

It's really beautiful that they keep the Baha'i gardens.

Yeah.

I mean the buildings I was like looking online, the one in India is really stunning.

The Lotus Temple.

The Lotus Temple.

Yes.

It's really, you guys have nice places.

Baha'is are very good at building houses of worship.

They really are.

The community, you pay a tithing?

Is that how do they afford that?

You donate whatever you want to donate, but there is another thing

called

forgetting the name of it.

I'm blanking on the name.

But

where we pay 9%

of all profit over, it's kind of like a tithe, over and above all essential costs.

So once you pay your rent, your insurance, and blah, blah, blah, your kids' tuition and

the cost of living, electricity, cell phone, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Anything extra,

you pay 9%.

So you have to ask your accountant to figure that out.

I do.

That's what I literally do.

Craig Tessler.

Jew.

Of course.

You shouldn't let him near your money.

But anyway.

It's too late.

No, but like, so wait, so I'm just interested because I was reading about it and I was like, I'd rather just ask you about it.

But there was a guy named Bob, right?

The Bob.

The Bob.

Which means the gate.

T-A.

In Arabic.

B-I-B.

And then there was an offshoot that became the Baha'i, right?

From the Babists.

Yes and no.

It was a movement, kind of like John the Baptist had a religious spiritual movement that then became Christianity.

And Christianity came out of John the Baptist's movement, saying, like, there is a Messiah that's coming, there's someone greater than me, it's going to be, it's going to rock your world, it's going to be amazing.

And then Jesus gets baptized and sees the dove and the Spirit of God and

etc.

is kind of similar to that.

So there was this religious movement called Babaism, followers of the Bab, who claimed to be a new prophet in this Abrahamic tradition.

And he kept saying there's a Messiah even greater than me that's coming imminently.

And then Baha'u'llah is the founder of the Baha'i Faith.

His name means the glory of God.

And Baha'is.

Baba Bubu.

Baha'u'llah.

Wow.

Do you guys have beef with Gary De Labate?

He's kind of making it.

With Baba Bui.

And then there was a third prophet named Baba Bui.

Yeah.

Do you believe in God?

It would be nice, but I don't.

Are you a Judist?

No, I didn't have anything to do with that.

No, like Buddhist, but so many Jews.

Oh, I thought that was...

Because the Old Testament is so like, I don't know.

We didn't have to do it.

We didn't have anything to do with that.

It was the Romans.

We just

may have

maybe you wanted to, maybe if you could, maybe would

crucify him.

I just read this whole thing.

I read a whole book

about how

they did that spin, trying to get it away from the Romans.

And the reason they did that, the early Christians, and they spun it towards the Jews.

Because the empire.

Because they feared the persecution from the Roman Empire, especially in those first 300 years.

And then the whole empire converted.

And then the whole empire converted.

But before that, if they had in their writings, hey, our Messiah was put to death by the Romans, then the Romans would come in and be like, what the fuck?

Wait, so do you abide by like, kind of like the New Testament, the Old Testament, kind of the Quran?

Is there

anybody accept from all that?

We absolutely do, and Baha'is accept all of the world's holy books, including

Buddhism.

and Hindu.

And we read the Bhagavad Gita and the writings of the Buddha as all of our book.

So you have to know every single one?

We have it memorized.

And you don't ask me any line, any page.

What's the best book?

What's the best one?

Our one sucks.

The Jewish one is like researching

chapters.

God is just so...

It's kind of like Dune.

God is so insecure.

God is like, oh, you don't respect me?

I'm going to smite you.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

God's like,

he's mean.

God changes, though, over the course of the Hebrew Bible.

You know, there's an evolution.

As you read read it, you can kind of see his.

Have you read the Haktua?

I haven't read the Haktua girl.

Did she tell her no?

No, no, no, that's an ancient text.

The Haktuah.

The Haktua girl?

Yes, an ancient text.

No, it's not.

Oh, I didn't know.

You've never read the Haktua?

It sounds like a Jewish prayer, doesn't it?

Lunacy.

What do you mean, lunacy?

People have a good time.

People watch the show.

What are you hating on the show?

A little bit.

Why?

I can't finish a sentence.

Have you read the Haktua?

I just said that you.

So, Baha'i like everyone.

They're nice to everyone?

They're nice to everyone.

Yeah.

They're nice to women?

Women can be...

Yeah.

They're nice to gay people or they're nice to...

Yeah.

They don't like gay people.

Well, they like gay people.

Why do they like gay people?

Well,

this is a matter of a great deal of...

So you guys are like Rastafarians.

You're like spiritual, but you still don't like gay people.

There's that Abrahamic thing about marriage and men and women and stuff that is still in the Baha'i faith, and I really struggle with it.

I really personally, I don't know how to do that.

I really struggle with it.

But if I like 90% of the faith, then

that's enough for me.

What other parts do you not like?

That's the main one.

Yeah.

Religion is kind of a pick and choose thing.

But it's a little different in the Baha'i Faith.

It's not like there's no hell, there's no damnation.

Sin doesn't work the same way.

it's kind of like here's the moral laws but they're there for your guidance so it's it's much less there's none of this kind of like gays going to hell gay evil stuff like that it's accept and love everyone they're just being bad they're being bad boys are you you're a blazer or no i used to be you used to be you're you're a sober gentleman sober yeah i'm a sober gentleman what was what was your vice back in the day Mostly alcohol.

Booze.

Yeah.

Yeah.

During your New York days?

But yeah.

And I had some

drug phases.

I dated a Coke dealer for a while that was not.

A girl Coke dealer?

Yeah.

Down on Wall Street.

Yeah.

Oh, to like Wall Street guys?

Yeah, she had a leather satchel and she would open up.

She had everything in there.

Wow, she's cool.

What's she up to now?

She works in the Jewish community?

She's running JP Morgan.

She is.

Yeah.

Really?

Wow.

That's a really cool kind of girlfriend.

She definitely fucked your life up.

You were that was definitely like a it didn't it didn't help yeah well no just in like a like a high fidelity sense like remembering all the girls of the past.

Right.

She, you're like, you were like

long for the ride.

This was for a nerdy Baha'i boy from suburban Seattle that was a sharp left turn.

Oh my god.

Like 21 New York City.

Exactly.

Oh my god.

23 and a half, 24.

Yeah.

We're talking about the film.

Okay.

Stop it.

No, no, it's not that good.

It's really, some of them are.

Rain's team wanted me to pass along the message.

He's totally fine to talk about the office, but he doesn't want it to be a main focus of the interview and appreciation.

Main focus.

We're talking about the topic to more of a minimum.

We're talking about the Bagadavid.

That's pretty true.

Yeah.

I think that's pretty true.

I don't know that I ever said that to them, but they glean that.

But I'm happy to talk about it.

We got to call you faster.

Well, no.

I want to talk about your new film,

Code 3.

You want to tell us a little bit about who you play, what it's about, and then we can kind of get into...

You know how you talked about the Midwestern person saying thank you and not really meaning it?

I'm so interested in hearing about your new movie.

Tell us about your movie.

Is it a little bit of bringing out the dead?

A little bit?

No, it's not as artsy and dark as that.

It's more funny.

It's more funny.

Yeah.

You did a ride-along with Real Paramedics.

And

how long did you do that for?

Like six or eight hours in South Central.

No big.

Well, that's like kind of

it's there's a real intimacy

in doing that job because you enter people's homes.

You see people's lives.

And you see people.

And you're riding with them in the back of an ambulance to a hospital for

in moments of crisis.

You see like a son become the man of the house.

You see people in their

worst moments.

They kiss their pants or they've got vomit on them.

And then you also see the different ways that people live.

Right.

And you see like you see like

and I did it.

I was in Israel up for a year doing it and I really saw the difference in like the way Arabs and Jews lived and the way like Orthodox and secular lived and

and it was intense.

I mean it was there were a couple funny parts of it but like there was a hypochondriac like a Russian lady and me and my friend

she would call like every three days and she was just a liar.

And then yeah another time we had to go to a funeral and because they were afraid that it was like this big tragedy that like a police officer was killed in the line of duty and they were afraid of like people passing out because of the local tragedy.

And we didn't speak like

our Hebrew was pretty bad.

And there was this woman in.

She was just there just in case.

Just in case, and there was this woman like who had like smelling salts and she's like, she was walking around like they were crying women like

and she'd make them smell it and slap them across the face.

And they had me and my friend Matt behind the rabbi giving the eulogy and we were just watching this lady, just slapping other women in the face.

That's insane.

And we were trying as hard as we could not to laugh.

Oh my gosh.

It was the hardest I've ever, like, I was like about to beat my pants at a theater.

But you know what?

They should have every 19-year-old be a paramedic for a while.

No, it's not.

It's, it's, well, it's.

Yeah, they should.

You really see, like,

I mean, like, you really see people in moments of extreme crisis.

Yeah.

And you know.

Mostly at their worst and occasionally at their best, I imagine.

Yeah, and you see...

You see humanity rising through the ashes.

Exactly.

You see how families are immediately reshuffled and reorganized.

And like,

a doctor sees the end result.

This is like a very, there's an yeah, there's a real personal, intimate aspect to it.

And yeah, I think I was maybe a little too young.

I think it was like a little bit like intense.

And I think like...

Well, this is what Code 3 deals with is kind of the mental health ramifications of these frontline workers and EMS workers who are paid essentially minimum wage, maybe a little bit more, that we entrust to save our lives.

You know, in the movie, we tried to make it a comedy.

It is a comedy.

It's very funny.

It's a very good movie.

I hope you'll see it.

And I really do mean that.

Audiences are loving it.

And the EMS frontline worker community are loving this movie.

They feel like they're like this is like their story.

But

it's so rare to do a movie that's like funny, entertaining.

If you want to just go watch an action comedy and eat popcorn, that's great.

But it also is like about something.

And it really is about looking at the underbelly of the American health care system and how these poor people, we're paying essentially minimum wage and we're entrusting them to save our lives.

It also costs like $8,000.

Yeah, and then you get your bill from the hospital

for $10,000 or $20,000.

And it's just all, it's all, it's all fucked up.

But

I did ride-alongs with the fire department in South Central LA.

And that was fascinating because down there, there's no health care.

I mean, they've shut down all the hospitals because all the hospitals are owned by conglomerates.

And they're like, this South Central hospital is not making us any money.

They shut it all down.

There's no walk-in clinics.

There's no like, you know.

It's like a food desert for hospitals.

Yeah, for health care.

And there's barely any doctors.

So they call 911 for everything, the people down there.

Oh my gosh.

Because they kind of have to.

And the firemen are the heroes down there.

The cops are kind of, obviously, there's some issues there.

But the firemen are the heroes.

The firemen are getting them,

getting their locked keys out of the car, you know, breaking down bathroom doors, getting a guy some diabetes medicine, taking someone to the hospital because they can't get an Uber.

And these guys, these are the most white-bred dudes you could imagine,

all these firemen down there.

But they're cheered wherever they go in South Central.

You don't hear that story.

It was really interesting.

But one of the

darkest call we went on that night was,

and this happens occasionally, this woman had fallen out of bed and needed the firemen to bring straps and get her back up on the bed because she weighed about 500 pounds.

So they needed like four

hardy men to kind of get her back up on the bed.

The family couldn't do it.

That was really intense.

But that's the kind of work that they were doing.

But you're right, you're going into people's homes

every day, too.

He's doing it 12-hour shifts, you know, three or four days a week.

There were laps, though.

You're saying that it was a comedy, but I remember they just

played Black-Eyed Peas or LMFA or like pumping on the way to like

because there's just like a sense of humor because these people are like about to deal with some fucked up shit.

So then they play some like, you know, goofy, like, you know,

no industry has a more gallows sense of humor than that.

These people are seeing just fentanyl overdose, gunshot.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I, uh, yeah, telling that story, I think, is very worthwhile.

And I haven't really seen that story told very much.

And like from my experience,

that seems like an incredibly worthwhile and noble thing to depict.

And with that, my job here is done.

Bye.

Bye.

Is that what I sound like?

Yeah.

That's your imitation of

a Jew circa 1000 BC.

Like, Moses.

Why do you go up to the mountain for me?

And then I went to bed with her.

She was a fabulous woman, and I went to bed with her.

And she was my analyst.

How do you deal with the Woody Allen of it all?

Do you still watch Woody Allen movies?

100%.

Yeah?

He's the best.

The best.

One of the best ever.

Even the bad ones?

You watch them all?

I watched every single one.

Yeah.

What's your favorite?

Oh, Annie Hall is my favorite.

There's so many.

What did you watch this weekend?

You did this weekend?

I was a good friends.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Now, what about the cancellation and the thing and the the whole thing uh i don't know i mean like it's a movie ronan farrow and the how do i i don't know i mean it's a movie i'm asking you if generationally because i don't know like i know i stand on it which i'm the same way i'm like it sounds like listen if we're going to separate the art from the artist like we're not going to listen to beethoven because he fucked his seventh daughter or we're not going to listen to i don't know chopin because he was a racist and we're not going to lavagio as a murderer yeah how are you how do you differentiate that it's a it's a really tricky moral argument well i really also just seems like it's like this horrific thing that i don't know like i don't know yeah and it's also very he said she said and it's not doesn't seem like there's like a damning evidence of like i don't am i the one to adjudicate it i mean i think that we have these this notion of like well roman polanski was adjudicated would you watch chinatown

i watched i watched bitter moon the other day

so good

have you seen it no what's it called?

So horny.

Bitter Moon?

Yeah, the one where they're on a cruise ship.

Yeah.

No.

There's a milk scene.

It's one of the sexiest scenes I've ever seen.

Sign me up.

Bitter Moon.

Yeah, you gotta watch it.

How do you adjudicate it then?

I watch the art because I just feel like we're getting a bunch of trouble if we're gonna try and like cancel the art made by people who are racist, sexist, you know, abusive,

whatever.

I'm not sure how to play that one out.

And maybe we'd love to hear from you in the comments section if you have ideas about.

What's your favorite Wagner?

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah.

De Goovenden.

Yeah, I like the

Tannahauser.

Tannhauser?

Yeah, what do you call it?

The

epic.

The epic one.

Yeah, what's it called?

The Flight of the Valkyries?

No,

that's played out, dude.

That's hack.

Yeah.

So 1979.

I'm all over it, dude.

No, the Tannhauser, whatever.

There's one part of it that's stunning.

But like, yeah, he hated Juan Devi.

I like, I don't know.

But

I love the Looney Tunes where they do the Wagner opera.

Oh, Boom Hilda, you are so love we.

Yes.

Yes, I know it.

I can't help it.

I mean, Hitler had a lot of great paintings.

I mean,

let's be honest, though.

Do you play music?

Yeah.

What do you play?

Seattle Grunge.

I play the skin flute and I play the...

No, you don't.

Yeah.

Do you guys catch that?

I also play

a little guitar and drums.

Really?

Yeah.

And I played the bassoon in college and a high school.

What is a bassoon?

Fuck you.

In my mind, I think kazoo.

Fuck you.

What is a bassoon?

You know what a bassoon is.

It's not a kazoo.

A bassoon sounds like a...

It sounds like an antiquated racial slur.

Like in the 1800s, a bunch of bassoons.

Bassoon.

I don't want my daughter wild.

What is a bassoon?

You know what a bassoon is.

You don't claim

to be a kazoo.

You don't really believe that.

I only know rock, bro.

Ray and Wilson, everyone.

Hollywood legend.

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