Best of The Program | Guests: Daniel Horowitz & Capt. Casey Murray | 10/12/21

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Hey, big program for you today.

We go from Loudoun County all the way to the skies with William Shatner and the Southwest Airline Pilot Association president, Captain Casey Murray.

It was a little confusing at times.

They are against the vaccine mandate, but Southwest just won't answer any questions about that mandate.

And

that's all they want.

Just give us some answers.

Are we going to get fired if we don't take the vaccine?

If we take it and we get sick because of it, are you paying for it?

So it's an interesting,

a really interesting conversation.

Also,

kind of a lead-in tonight's television show at 9 p.m.

Are we ready for a national divorce?

That was hour number two of this podcast.

And tonight, we really look into it at 9 p.m.

only on Blaze TV.

Right after a brand new Stew Does America.

Wow.

You're listening to

the best of the Blenbeck program.

Daniel Horowitz is here.

He's from the podcast Conservative Review, which you should listen to

and subscribe and rate with five stars, I think, is the appropriate number.

Five stars is the appropriate number of stars, yes.

Okay.

All right.

Daniel, welcome.

Well, it's great to be with you, and I'll take five stars any day at all.

Any day.

Okay.

So, Daniel, do we need a national divorce?

What would that look like?

Or do we just need

braver Americans?

Do we need braver,

I don't know, constitutional Americans?

Well, you know, Glenn, think about this.

How do you bridge the divide between people who think a man is a woman, a woman's a man, a criminal is a victim, a victim's a criminal.

If you don't wear a mask, you're a murderer, but I'll let murderers out of prison at the same time using that very virus as the pretext.

You don't have the right to have free, unrestricted movement unless you do as we say with your body.

But if you crash our border, man, you could go to all corners of the country anytime you want.

These are not light and transient causes.

This is not a matter of one issue.

Frankly, King George never did this.

King George never demanded we cover our mouths.

King George didn't have men and female bathrooms.

I mean,

those issues were really very economic.

It was over taxes.

We have never had this ever before.

It used to be politics was 10% of our life and the other 90%, you know, we all have to eat, we all have to drink, we kind of do the same things, we like the same sports teams, and we can live together harmoniously.

Now everything is political to the point of literally your life, even before liberty.

So we now have a scenario where they could force you

to take experimental therapies that, you know, show that they have a lot of problems, but you don't even have the right to try a Nobel Prize-winning drug.

This is how divided it is.

So what I would argue is we already have a national divorce, except it's one-sided.

So for example,

you asked me to define what it looks like, and I'll define what it looks like, literally a divorce, which doesn't mean you part ways.

You have certain amicable agreements when it comes to custody of the kids and certain assets.

And so we'll have the military, we'll have Social Security.

It won't be perfectly two different countries.

But what I think we need to do is make the red states that we allegedly already supposedly should have control over exactly like the blue states are.

And when Trump was president, they didn't tolerate anything.

Even something like immigration, which is very much within the purview of the federal government, they harbored illegal alien sex offenders and they actually in New York criminalized the enforcement and cooperation and transmitting any information to federal immigration agents.

So my point is, there is no reason we can't go in the red states where we have four to one, five to one one majorities and some of them in the legislative bodies and say this is immoral, illogical, illegal, it's unconstitutional.

It is not happening here.

And frankly, if we ever get the presidency back, that is what the blue states have already done and will do anyway.

Yeah, I mean, this is, it goes back down to state power.

I don't care what you do in California, but you're not going to charge me for it.

I'm not bailing you out.

I'm not living there.

If that's what you want to do, then that's fine.

But don't bring it to my state.

And I don't know why we are not defending the Constitution.

We're arguing about all of these crazy things that

have nothing to do with the Constitution and in many ways are in violation of the Constitution.

We should, I mean, how many, I'd like to know, really, honestly,

I really think we should begin conversations with people

like this.

Can you talk to me about the Bill of Rights?

Is there anything in the Bill of Rights that you disagree with?

If they say, yeah, I disagree with a lot of them, you know who you're dealing with.

If they say, no, not really, maybe the Second Amendment.

Okay, all right, well, we can talk about the Second Amendment later.

Let's just start talking politics now and

the policies.

As soon as they start talking about the policies, you say,

I thought you weren't against the Bill of Rights because I haven't moved.

They have.

They no longer believe in the Bill of Rights.

And you can't come together if you don't believe in the most important foundational document in our country.

And really, the most important right, as defined by Blackstone, is to walk in locomotion status quo without government acting against your body affirmatively in any way.

And the left always championed bodily autonomy in the courts, really, for 100, almost 100 years, that you have the right to kill a baby.

You have the right to a positive benefit to

get access to assisted physician-assisted suicide, all these cases we had, and now suddenly you can't even have don't tase me, bro.

Hey, look, you know, you got your vaccine, you got your mask, you can do what you want, just don't force me to do it.

And now you have the ACLU as the lead plaintiff in South Carolina, not only not defending your right to breathe in school, but actually defending your alleged right to force the other guy not to breathe.

And that's the point.

We don't shove things on them.

We're not demanding everyone take, you know, 5,000 I use of vitamin D and ivermectin prophylactically, which actually would probably stop the spread even more.

Hey, look, we want to do it.

Just allow us to do it.

Don't stop us from doing it.

You could do it.

But they won't allow it.

So right now we don't have a national divorce.

It's more like an abusive husband who has violated

that compact.

And we just have to evacuate ourselves from it.

And again, Madison's design has given given us

that design.

I don't want to hear about, oh, we'll win back Congress or something with a narrow rhino majority.

Republicans have 19 states where they not only have the trifecta, but they have it with super majorities.

But here we have, let me give you an example.

There's this 16-year-old girl we're all talking about in Wyoming who was handcuffed for not wearing a mask.

Now, Glenn, all I'm asking is that in a state like Wyoming, where there is a 28-2

GOP Majority in the Senate, there's two Democrats there,

that we could abide by and live by the same degree of post-constitutional liberty that we had on February 2020.

Is that too much to ask?

And yet we don't really have that.

The red states are a little better.

I mean, I know.

So why is that?

Why is that?

Why is it that Wyoming, of all places, doesn't stand up?

Well, you know, let me give you an example of what we just dealt with in Arkansas, a similar dynamic.

We couldn't even get a compromise bill immediately passed to allow an opt-out for weekly PCR testing.

That was New York's line in the sand a month ago.

So we can't even hold the line that New York was pushing a month ago or two months ago.

And that's because you look at a small state like Arkansas.

Overwhelmingly, people voted for Trump, but at the end of the day, it's not Republican and Democrat, conservative, liberal, right and left.

It's one oligarchy, this corporate government monopoly.

And you got Tysons, you got J.B.

Hunt, and you got Walmart there, and they get what they want, and the governor's bought out by them.

So you've got all these Republicans that get money from Big Pharma, from the Chamber of Commerce.

They'll douse very broadly on life and guns.

I'm pro-life.

I'm pro-gun, you know, in a very broad way.

But when it comes to the issues that matter most to our lives, when they matter, at the time they matter, look carefully and you'll see both parties are awfully close to each other.

You used light and transient causes earlier.

The second line in the second paragraph of the Declaration of Independence after the life, liberty, pursuit of happiness says that to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.

That's no longer happening.

That when any form form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish and institute a new government, laying its foundations on such principles and organizing its powers in such a form as to them shall seem most likely to affect their safety and happiness.

Prudence indeed will dictate that governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes.

And accordingly, all experience has shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed.

So it says here, it explains human nature that most of us are silent because it's still okay.

And I think that changes once the economy really is hit.

I think once people start to realize, wait a minute,

I'm losing my job, my money is worthless.

And I think it's probably too late by that point.

Well, I mean, this is why John Adams always said you have to nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud.

You know, they got a bad rap at the time, the Patriots, because it really wasn't that bad.

You know, a tiny little tax there, what's the big deal?

But they understood that if you wait until it is a big deal, it's too late.

And I think that's the problem.

I'll never forget a couple of years ago, actually right before COVID, our mutual friend and colleague Steve Dace and I did a show together, and we talked about just retiring.

I said, look, I'm always happier when I just tune it out, go on vacation, and it doesn't bother me.

But that was before March 2020.

Now

you can't run away from it.

They control every aspect of our lives

and our health,

what we do with our bodies.

It's terrible the emails I'm getting from show listeners that they can't get proper treatment.

People that got vaccinated, they get very sick, and we have to find all sorts of ways to get them treatment in a first world country like America.

This is something that I think we can't live through.

And Glenn, if we're just going to relegate those words of the Declaration to some sort of museum, some mosaic of history, then they're just hollow.

They're meaningless.

And we're not asking for a civil war.

We want to avoid that.

And I think a lot of people forget the Revolutionary War was catalyzed really by the body closest to the people.

It was the state legislatures that formed those committees of correspondence.

I think we need to make state legislatures great again, and that will make red states red again.

And, you know, we'll simply have red states that will behave the same way the blue states behave, and we'll have a degree of self-sorting, and that will be healthier for everyone.

Yeah, it will be.

Thank you so much.

Appreciate it.

God bless.

It's important that you listen to Daniel Horowitz.

He's really, really smart and really buttoned up on these issues.

Blaze podcast, conservative review.

Get it wherever you get your podcast, Daniel Horowitz.

This is the best of the Glenbeck program.

Welcome to the Glenbeck program.

Coming up in just a few minutes, we have the pilots union leader from Southwest Airlines.

He's going to be joining me in studio here in about 25 minutes.

Let me play cut six for you.

This is Nancy Pelosi lecturing reporters yesterday.

Our latest CBS news poll shows that only about 10% of Americans describe themselves as knowing a lot of specific things that are in the reconciliation package and that the majority don't know anything at all.

So do you think you need to do a better job at messaging and going forward?

How do you sell this if ultimately you have to go?

Well, I think you all could do a better job of selling it, to be very frank with you, because every time I come here, I go through the list.

Family and medical leave,

the issues that are in there.

But it is true, it is hard to break through when you have such a comprehensive package.

So difficult to break through when you control the entire government and all of the media.

I know.

So hard to get your messaging.

I know.

It really is.

Okay, so let me just, let me go through a few things.

These are not failures.

These are intended, and they are intended to bring you to a reset, the great reset.

Remember, when do you reset things?

When do you go downstairs into the scary basement to look at the fuse box?

When everything is fine?

No.

When there's been a disruption in power, right?

Something is blown in the house.

When do you push the reset button on your computer?

When everything is fine or just a little glitchy?

Or do you just like,

I don't want to re and you just keep going until it completely freezes up and you have no other option but to reset?

So the things that this government, quote, is failing in are not failings.

They are to lead you to the great reset.

Let's go through some of them.

Supply chain.

One more example of Biden failing at basic governing.

This is from Breitbart.

That's the headline.

It's not a failure of him governing.

This is intentional.

Southwest pilots warn fatigue, frustration could fuel further outages.

Well, I'll hear from the pilots union here in just a few minutes, but does anybody actually believe that the mandate plays no role in that?

CNN says Americans won't be able to go back to shopping like in the before times oh

okay

the US health care force is short half a million workers now a main hospital just closed its NICU because of staffing shortages due to vaccine mandate

Do you see what these all have in common so far?

U.S.

cities are having to boost budgets for cops after defund the police initiatives result in more crime.

Walgreens closes five more San Francisco locations due to theft.

This is happening in big cities where they have said, we're not going to prosecute anybody for shoplifting.

You're shoplifting under $1,000.

So people are just going in and they're just wiping these stores clean because police can't do anything about it.

Chicago suffering from officer shortage.

They can't find the recruits.

Believe they need, what is it, a hundred and

there's 877 vacancies.

I think they need about 1,600 officers, and they can't figure out why officers don't want to work in

Chicago.

Over the weekend, try this one on for size.

California moved one step closer to ending reliance on fossil fuels.

What they did is they banned all

off-road

gasoline engines.

So, you know, if you have a leaf blower, if your lawn service is cutting the lawn using a lawn mower, can't be gasoline, has to be electric.

This will bankrupt so many small businesses.

50,000 businesses are going to be affected by this.

And it's only a matter of time before everyone has to do this.

Saki said yesterday, and I quote,

the president wants to use the pandemic to make fundamental changes in our economy.

Is that what you voted for?

Did you vote for a fundamental change in our economy?

He feels coming out of the pandemic, it is exactly the time to make fundamental change in our our economy.

That's not what I voted for.

You want to know what's in that package?

All kinds of stuff that goes against the Constitution.

Janet Yellen said the $600

IRS reporting requirement is necessary because there's a lot of tax fraud and cheating that's going on.

Really?

Is there?

Do you know how much it costs to fill my truck now at the gas station?

$100.

$100 to fill my truck.

I can do that easily, easily.

In a month, six times.

If I'm driving the truck a lot,

at least four.

So

I pay my gas card.

It's a $600 transaction.

The federal government, the IRS, needs that.

That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen.

So now you're going after, you know, the post office worker,

the teacher,

the people who are the heroes in our society.

You're going after the people that have $50,000 to $60,000.

How much are you spending on food every month?

If you have a large family, can you spend $600 at the grocery store?

Wow.

So now

you need to be spied upon by the IRS

because

your transactions are suspicious.

We cannot allow these things to happen.

This infrastructure bill cannot pass.

Because it is infrastructure.

It is infrastructure.

So when they power everything down because everything is gridlock and you are out in the streets going, there's no food that I can afford at the grocery store.

My shelves are empty.

The ports are backed up.

They're not working.

I can't hire anybody to do the job.

There's crime all over the city.

My school board is completely out of control and the FBI is now interviewing all of the parents that were there at the school board meeting.

I can't afford gas anymore.

I can't afford a new car.

They're not even making the new cars anymore.

My oil or my gas bill to heat my house is two and a half times what it was before the election.

It's already double what it was.

We're not even in the winter yet.

When all of that happens, when the court system doesn't work, when the police can't work, when crime is out of control, when you can't afford

your groceries, when you can't afford your house,

when the banks are just making all kinds of money,

when all of these things are happening, this is not a failing of the progressives.

This is by design for the Great reset.

This is why we have to

this is why we have to speak out.

This is why tonight's TV show is so important because the answer really is local, local, local.

When the FBI said that they were going to look into terrorists, you know why they did that, right?

They did that to scare you off.

Well, Loudoun County wasn't scared off last night.

They had a huge school board meeting.

They were even more vocal than they have been.

We need to be at our school board meetings.

Even if you live in a good town where your school board is on your side,

you need to be there because the school board association is watching

and we must send them a message.

You don't scare me.

These are my children.

These people will do anything,

anything to win.

They don't play by the rules.

The only thing that frightens them is you waking up and standing up.

Read Barack Obama's Obama's book.

You know, Jonah Goldberg tweeted me the other day and he said, when I said, I think they've just started another tea party.

And he said, ooh, like the first one was so effective.

Did you read Barack Obama's book?

It was.

According to Barack Obama, it was.

It slowed him down.

There's still lessons to learn, though, of how if we're going to do something else like that, it needs to be done and hopefully have longer legs than this one.

We've complained about that several several times.

Right, and we are smarter.

We know that it's going to be taken over by

hook and by crooks in the Republican Party.

And we have to have certain principles.

It's really easy now to align on principles.

It's very easy.

It's very easy.

You know, do you believe

the school board, you should be allowed to go in and question the school board peacefully?

First Amendment.

Do you believe that everybody has a right to speak their mind out in open and disagree with with you know fauci or anybody else first amendment do you believe that people who disagree with us have a right to publish and to be seen and be heard or should they be canceled first amendment

do you believe i have a right to protect myself especially when the government is firing all the cops and they they're saying places like Austin, Texas, unless unless somebody has you you know in a chokehold with a gun don't call us we can't come somebody's breaking into your house oh well we can't help you

damn right i have a right to own a gun damn right

Do you believe that

the IRS should be into my bank watching every transaction of $600 or more?

No, that's a violation of the Fourth Amendment.

Everything is about the Bill of Rights.

You just just need to start asking people, do you believe in the Bill of Rights?

Let's go through them.

Do you believe in the Bill of Rights?

If you do, I'm with you.

If you don't, I can't talk to you because the gulf is too far.

You have moved.

I haven't.

You have.

Sorry, Bill of Rights, they are universal.

They are the thing that we all agreed on.

If you can't agree with me on the Bill of Rights, then I'm not the enemy of America.

No matter what you say, I'm not the terrorist.

you are.

You are.

You're the revolutionary, not me.

The best of the Glenbeck program.

The first round of flight cancellations on Saturday at Southwest Airlines came the day after the Southwest Airline Pilot Association filed a request in federal court to block a COVID-19 vaccine mandate.

So you know, and we'll get this information here in a second,

It doesn't appear that the union is against the mandate.

They just want it to happen after they've negotiated their contract.

Yesterday, the CEO Gary Kelly told CNBC, I've never been

in favor of corporations imposing that kind of a mandate.

However, they're complying with Biden's vaccine mandate, even though there isn't one yet.

The objective here, obviously, is to improve health and safety and not for people to lose their jobs.

2,200 flights were canceled over the weekend.

And to talk to us about this is Captain Casey Murray, who is the head of the Pilots Association, the Pilots Union.

How are you, sir?

I'm doing well.

Thanks for having me, Glenn.

Thank you for coming in.

I appreciate it.

Yes.

I was shocked when you guys said yes to our invitation.

Yeah.

Well, we're out there, you know, we're trying to get the word out, trying to clear up some misconceptions.

And

I'm proud of our pilots, I want to speak for them.

Okay.

So tell me what is happening.

What's happening now?

Well, since you brought up

the TRO that we filed, we filed that on Friday.

We also have a status quo lawsuit that we've been forced to file.

We've amended that to sort of add on this aspect as well to show continuing status quo violations while we are negotiating our contracts.

What does it mean status quo violations?

Well, the RLA, Railway Labor Act, that we work under um and and are contracted under uh requires the company while we're in negotiations can't make unilateral changes uh while we're negotiating okay and we've seen numerous numerous instances we've tried to work with them it is kind of the hallmark of what swapa and southwest do but we've seen that kind of fail over the past year or so because of covid you're they are just

wholesale changing some really important things that you don't you haven't ever negotiated And if I'm reading this right, you're saying, hey, look, we've done a lot here.

Enough is enough.

Correct.

And all we've been asking for, and this is specifically what the TRO is

about, is, hey, we need to sit down and have discussions around this.

Our peers, Delta, American United,

FedEx, UPS, they all have had agreements in place for six and at times 10 months

that addressed a lot of our concerns.

And your concerns are.

Well, pilots, one of the main concerns is pilots are required to carry a medical certificate.

Every six months we go in, I have a full battery of tests,

and every six months, I mean, there's a risk that you could lose your career.

So with our pilot's license, we also have a medical certificate.

So a lot of our pilots and our peers pilots

want to know and have answered how's the company going to handle any sort of either long-term issues that come from the vaccines,

because that has still yet to be determined,

and then

negative.

Negative.

And then

even shorter term, what's going to happen

if I have a reaction and have to call in sick?

Is that coming out of my sick bank?

And so now it's being required, mandated.

We need these questions answered.

And our peers have done it.

And we see vaccination rates from 90% and higher.

And then you look at United,

99.9% of their pilots are vaccinated.

We don't know, and the company hasn't shared with us what our vaccination rate is.

It is much lower than that.

And I would venture to say probably half that.

And a lot of that has to do with our pilots' trepidation with not having a lot of these questions answered.

And that's all we're trying to do is get them to the table.

I mean,

APA at American, their pilots union, has over 11

different

MOUs, memorandums of understanding, addressing these things.

And we see what it does to the vaccination rates.

So when I see pictures of pilots, because they're going, there's lots of them.

Do we have any of them here?

Here's one, a don't tread on me flag hanging out of the window of a Southwest jet, out of the pilot's window.

Show,

do you have the okay, there's all kinds of pictures of Southwest pilots out online as well.

And that seems to be anti-vaccine.

Yes.

Do you have any idea how many of your pilots are going to probably end up getting fired?

I would say that until a lot of these questions gets answered,

We really don't know.

It's kind of a two-fold sort of issue.

There are those

that feel very strongly that the government mandate crosses and steps on the Constitution.

And I respect that.

There's a lot of very personal decisions.

But the flip side is

they also don't want to go into

being mandated for a vaccine where their questions as to where their career and where their families stand and their families' well-being moving forward, um

they have to be able to make decisions um using um some concrete data um and and and we're still waiting on that from our company and by data i mean having some of these questions answered

so what is

you're just because i don't think i heard that uh yesterday from the ceo did you stu i don't think i heard him address

these

concerns.

It's very clear.

And I've brought this up twice already.

Look at our peers.

Look at where our peers' vaccination rates are.

Look at what they have done proactively to address this.

We have done nothing.

Southwest, we have tried for six months to force them to sit down and have discussions about this.

We even went so far as forcing a letter of agreement during negotiations across the table

because they weren't interested in having the discussions.

They have it.

It's in their hands.

We still have not sat down and had real discussions.

We did have a meeting on Monday that was really, I would say, forced by the TRO, even though it hasn't been ruled on yet.

But I mean, I think Southwest felt, okay, we have to do something.

And we presented them with dozens of questions, and we're still waiting answers.

We're a week and a half

past when

the federal contractor mandate came out, and we're rapidly approaching a deadline.

So

it's still just a vocal.

There There is no written policy.

It's not law.

It's not even an executive order.

Absolutely.

Yes.

But when your company tells you you will or you will be terminated,

there is

a conscious feeling of a threat.

So many people don't have a union.

And

a lot of people, I am, I'm glad I'm not in a union.

I think unions are really important

when companies get out of control.

And

in the same way, I think when unions get out of control, they're just as bad as the out-of-control company.

But this,

I mean, I'm wondering, if a union, if you're working as a pilot and you don't want the vaccine and you're going to get fired for it, are you going to defend those guys?

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

We have to, and we will.

We will defend them if that's what it comes to.

But it is our job in representing them to provide them with as much information and force the company to come and get these questions answered.

So what would that mean if you ⁇ after you get the questions and

because you guys aren't ⁇

is the union against the mandate?

We are against the mandate.

You are against it.

Not even with more information, you're against it.

We're against the mandate.

Our whole thing is it is a pilot's choice.

It is a pilot's family choice.

It's a very personal decision that has to be made.

And so

we believe that

by

providing these answers and the company providing these answers, I mean, there are so many things, even outside of the medical, I mean, we still haven't had questions as to

who's making the decisions on

these exemptions.

So medical, religious.

We don't have answers to that.

How's the information going to be protected in the HIPAA environment at the company?

We haven't had answers to those.

Is there an alternative means of compliance?

Like the original mandate that Biden put out even before this contractor issue,

there was an alternative means of compliance.

The other

testing testing.

Yes.

How is

what about natural immunity?

We have pilots right now that have COVID,

and those pilots now say they recover this week.

They still can't get the shot for 90 days.

Well, that's outside the window.

How is that going to be handled?

So, so many questions that we don't have answers to, and our pilots don't have answers to, and our pilots can't make decisions.

Our pilots use data.

Our pilots

look at all the available information

and then make the decision.

And again, I point back to our peers.

Our peers address this proactively and look at where they're at.

So

what is Governor Abbott's

ruling or his executive order here in Texas where no company has to follow that?

Well, that's part of the issue as well for us, not having the ability to sit down and have these discussions with our company.

Our legal team is looking at that.

And then in the midst of looking and seeing how that is going to affect our pilots, Gary Kelly comes out yesterday and says that he's not going to abide by that, that he's going to abide by

Biden's mandate.

Which doesn't exist.

But the governor's does.

Yes.

Yes.

They did send something over to OSHA supposedly over the past 24 hours or so, but it's certainly nothing's official yet.

It does seem like it's something to intimidate these companies to just go along with it before there's even a rule written down.

Yes.

There's a lot of, I think there's a lot of people that

are hoping somebody takes a stand because the little guy is taking a stand and getting squashed.

And the government is just telling them what they can and can't do.

And they are,

I mean, I think there was a lot of hope, at least there was with me.

When I saw you guys, you know,

have your difficulties this weekend.

I was hoping that it was the pilots stepping out and saying, no, we're not going to do it.

We're reasonable people.

You know, as you said, many have already had COVID.

I've had COVID.

I had a bad bout of COVID.

I believe in my antibodies.

I don't know why this is the exception to something that we know about the human body.

And I have no problem with the vaccine, but I know I don't really give a flying crap what the federal government says.

This is unconstitutional.

And

I think there's a lot of people hoping that you were

standing up for that, or at least a few pilots were standing up for for that.

And I was very clear, I think, earlier when I answered that question.

We are against the mandate.

We are not anti-vaccine, but our pilots are in a unique position.

Unlike the rest of the population, we have to maintain a medical, and there's a lot of unanswered questions.

And a lot of those questions can, and a lot of those fears can be allayed by how is our insurance going to be handled?

And we carry a loss of license insurance as well as an LTD, an STD.

So the long-term disability and short-term disability.

We also carry loss of license specifically for our medical.

So if we lose our medical, we have some at least income insurance when we can no longer fly.

We're with the president of Southwest Airlines Pilots Association.

His name is Captain Casey Murray, and we're talking about the Southwest Airlines vaccine mandates and the trouble that they had over the weekend.

So you mentioned the medical

certification you need to have every six months.

Yes.

So they're requiring you to upkeep some level.

What does that mean exactly?

What's on it?

It's an FAA requirement.

So

we have certain classes of medicals.

Our pilots have to maintain a first or second class, whether you're a captain or first officer.

And

so it's, you know, any type of heart issue, any type of high blood pressure, depression,

diabetes, I mean, any of those things can

kill your career.

And so.

So would they argue, though, that you, every six months you have to do this anyway?

Why

COVID-19, we're in the middle of a pandemic, why wouldn't you have to maintain the vaccination status?

Well, I think that

because of some of the unknowns with long-term issues with the virus, we've also seen some shorter terms, myocart, myokiartis.

Sure, sure.

Yes.

With the vaccine.

And it's a low number, but that can be a disqualifying event for a pilot.

And so

back to

how is the our loss of license plan is company administered.

So the company has to answer those questions.

So you and you and you're saying that

what would actually happen with the cancellations?

What's the story behind that?

Because

I've heard

what Glenn was saying, you know, that there was some sort of sick out situation.

You guys are saying that's not true.

What actually happened?

Well, I want to be clear.

So I'm glad you brought it up.

So

it's now Wednesday.

So we've kind of looked back over the weekend to see exactly what occurred.

And looking at our pilots' performance, I'm very proud of them.

Our pilot sick rates were right in line with where they were this summer during the same sort of long-term meltdown that Southwest had.

Looking at, our pilots are the most productive in the industry.

That means they do a lot of work on their off time.

It's what Southwest relies on.

It's what makes Southwest different.

Southwest does more with less.

And

so looking at our pilot pickup rates, they're working on off days, those things, those were as high as we've seen them.

So those two together sort of address where our pilots were.

There was no job action.

There is stress.

I mean, this mandate and.

So then what caused this?

Well,

Southwest works in a very dynamic environment, as do our peers.

Weather is what we deal with every day.

There's nobody else that was.

Correct.

So

Southwest does operate in a completely different environment,

meaning our network.

Our network is completely different than everyone else's.

It's complex,

point-to-point.

A line of thunderstorms moves through Atlanta.

Delta shuts down a push of airplanes, meaning all the ones coming in are out.

And when the thunderstorms push through, they're right back on.

They might have canceled flights, but they're right back on.

Our airplanes are at all of our out stations.

And so when someone gets sick, when an airplane breaks, when there's weather, then there is a domino effect that is more difficult at Southwest to recover from.