The Criterion Episode

It's a lonely island and Seth Meyers criterion

collection

podcast episode.

Oh shit.

Hey everybody, welcome to a very special episode of the Lonely Island and Seth Meyers podcast.

Before we start, I want to stress that we've put exactly as much thought into this episode as all previous episodes, which is not much.

But I am joined by two luminaries

who are going to help us select the criterion collection of the first 34 shorts we have covered on the podcast.

We are joined by Mike Scher and Jake Tapper.

Hello, gentlemen.

Thank you.

Hello.

How are you, Seth?

It's about time.

Really good.

It's about time.

Yeah, okay.

Slow your roll, Tapper.

So real quick, just credits-wise, Mike Scher and I met at SNL.

He then went on to work in the office, played Moe's on the office.

Thank you.

He's created a bunch of shows.

Parks and Rec, good good place.

Man on the inside right now.

Ted Danson on Netflix just got picked up for season two.

Congratulations.

Thank you very much.

Most importantly, though, for the purposes of this, Brooklyn 9-9 with Andy Sandberg.

So there is a connection, multiple connection points, really, considering the SNL time as well.

And then Jake does news stuff.

I do.

So you guys reached out because you have some thoughts.

That's right.

Jake actually reached out to me.

I'll let him tell most of the story, but he reached out to me and basically said, I think you and I should be the official judges of what is and is not part of the criterion collection.

And I have to say that when he said it, it made perfect sense for a couple of reasons.

Number one, he and I have never actually met before.

No, that's good.

And number two, as you put it, I mean, I worked at SNL admittedly before the Lonely Island showed up, and he is a newsman.

Yeah.

And so when you put all of that together, I think it makes perfect sense why he and I should be the official judge and jury of what is and is not criterion.

Yeah, agreed.

I should also note that we were texting about the pod.

We had been texting about the pod.

We are fans of the pod.

Right.

Listeners, we should say, more discriminating than fans, but listeners to the pods, consistent listeners.

I think, Mike, you and I have both listened to every single one as of today, correct?

Oh, absolutely.

And also, I should note that Jake started sending me, again, he and I have never actually met, but he started sending me his reviews of every episode.

I would say essentially in real time.

Like, I don't know what time the pod is posted, but Monday morning, 6 a.m., I think.

That's good.

Yeah.

And so like the length of time of the pod after it is posted is when he texts me his thoughts about the pod.

Yes.

That's great.

And I'm very excited to find out you guys have never met because this pod works on a stranger chemistry.

If anything, the people who listen to it like the fact that nobody here knows each other.

I will clarify, we have corresponded for many years.

Yes.

I've done some charity stuff for Jake's excellent charity.

Here we go.

Here we go.

And we have corresponded about a number of things, including once,

I believe the way it started, Jake, was you just sent me a very nice text or asked someone for my email or something and just said that you were a fan of Brooklyn 99.

Isn't that how this...

Yeah.

Yeah.

So again, it makes perfect sense.

Oh, no, it might have been a good place.

Oh, okay.

But I'm a fan of both is the truth.

Thank you.

It would have been way better if you were like, because I don't ever remember liking Brooklyn 99.

So that's true.

Also, you asked me to blurb your book.

Yes.

Which was a delight because it was fun to read and everybody should go buy it.

Look, niche is not the right word, but it is a rarefied audience that listens to the Lonely Island Seth Meyers podcast as religiously as Mike and I do.

And also fans of The Lonely Island and fans of the pod, obviously, and fans of Seth Meyers.

There you go.

Right.

Hey, I wrote down something, Shirk.

So Mike and I met, and I do want to establish, because I think the history of SNL is a big part of this podcast.

Mike and I are dear friends, but you were more than a friend when I started the show.

You were, I feel like my first, and I think to succeed at SNL, you need many of these.

You were my first life raft.

As I was struggling at that place, I could always come to your room.

You were running weekend update at the time, so you were a man with a far bigger job than I had.

And I would come to your room and I would pitch you dumb ideas and we would often write them up.

And a lot of them went to dress before getting cut.

But we got to wear costumes and see what the set looked like.

And that was fun.

But I just had an idea for a sketch and I realized, I was like, oh, this would be a sketch I would come to your office to tell you about.

Great.

So just flashback, it's 2001.

You know, it's October 01.

And I walk into your office, I go, oh, God, wait, is it?

There's anthrax in the building.

We have to get out of here.

Okay, great.

Let's meet at your apartment.

So

my idea is like there's a serial killer.

And, you know, he's got that like thing where he's like plastic all over the room.

Sure.

He's just, he's just done one of his kills.

And there's a knock at the door.

And it's someone who says, I grew up in this house.

Can I look around?

Can I tell you that I wrote a sketch very similar to that before you got to SNL?

It was a family having dinner and I think Farrell and I can't remember who the host probably came to the house and were like, we're brothers.

We grew up here.

Can we look around?

And then they just told stories and they were just the most horrifying stories that you've ever heard.

And I thought it was very funny.

And Shoemaker, Shoemaker used to decide the order at the re-through, put it up very high.

He was like number four in the re-through.

And that was always a good sign because it meant that you were optimistic about it if you're Shoemaker.

Yes.

And it, I mean, like everything I wrote my first year, it just played to like dead.

Like my memory of it, and I'm sure you have this too, is of the only sound in the room is the sound of 150 scripts being turned page by page.

Yeah.

Like there's no, like that's a silence that doesn't exist elsewhere in nature.

It's like, it's like the absence of sound more than it is a sound.

And that's how that sketch played.

And

like every one of those read-throughs in my first year was brutal, brutal to sit through.

I do want to shout out only for the purposes that then we'll find a clip and play my terrible British accent, but you wrote one of my favorite sketches that I got to be in at a time where, again, Life Raft era, just being in a sketch was very important.

Sure.

You wrote one of my favorite all-time sketches, Hot Air Mystery Balloon Theater.

Yeah.

On the contrary, my dear Miss Petit, I believe the killer is still in this very hot air air balloon basket.

How do you know, Professor?

In due time, Admiral.

But first, let's look at the facts.

Do please explain where the idea came from and who the host was.

I have no idea where it came from.

Hot Air Balloon Mystery Theater was an old-timey, like Agatha Christie kind of era mystery story killer, you know, detective, like Sherlock Holmes-y detective.

But the whole thing was taking place in a hot air balloon, like in the basket of of a hot air balloon.

And so there was a lot of like the detective saying, like, you had ample time to kill Mr.

You know, Witherford and get from this part of the basket all the way to this part of the basket without being noticed.

And then there were like reenactments.

We all chased each other around a little basket.

You chased each other a lot.

I don't remember who I wrote it for, but I submitted it like four times.

It just made me laugh.

It felt.

Did it?

It was a four time because I will say it aired with Ian McKellen, who seemed like the perfect person for it.

Well, that was the trick.

I don't remember who I wrote it for originally.

I I think I submitted it maybe three total times, but the third time was when Ian McKellen hosted it.

And it was like, oh my God, this is now undeniable.

Now this will work.

He's doing it.

And I really loved it.

And everyone picked a different sort of archetypal British like mystery theater.

You were a sort of James Mason.

You went like James Mason.

And it really delighted me.

And I thought of it as like, it was one of the first things I wrote.

I sucked at this job, not false modesty.

I sucked at the job for a good year and a half or so until I finally figured out how to

write.

And it was one of the first things I wrote that I was like, oh my god, this is like a legitimate sketch premise.

And it didn't get chosen.

And I was convinced it would work.

And I resubmitted it and it didn't get chosen.

And then finally, Ian McKellen did it, and you were there, and Poehler had shown up, and all these great people did it.

And it finally got to air with Ian McKellen playing the lead detective.

And it probably was like a what, B minus?

B minus, but air is great.

Age is great.

It's not any worse than a B minus now.

Seth, you do a James Mason, you do a Mason accent?

I was our Mason until Hayter showed up.

Can we hear a little?

Yeah, Lolita.

You know, again, I fell out of favor.

I fell out of favor once Bill did all the dead British people once he showed up.

All the 85-year-old British celebrities were taken up by Bill Hayter.

Yeah.

The other thing, well, two things I want to say about it.

One, it was then there's the hallways of SNL have black and white photos from sketches of throughout the years.

And the best pictures are from sketches that have a lot of people in them that have really funny costumes.

The mise-en-sen of Hot Air Mystery and Balloon Theater is great.

And I remember that was the first sketch I was in that was on the wall.

Oh, wow.

I was always looking for like touchstones where I'm like, well, they're not going to fire a guy who's on the wall.

They framed it.

Just think of the money they paid on the framing.

And the other thing about resubmissions is a lesson I learned is you don't tell the host.

I remember once saying, I'm so happy we're doing this.

This is like the fifth time I've submitted it.

And then the host, the host who thought they had inspired you is like, oh, so I'm just and also four other people rejected this.

Why would I do it?

So I'm just word meet.

You're like, yeah.

I have the,

I'm staring at it right now.

I got Mariella and the photographer from SNL to get me a print of that sketch because it meant so much to me that it aired.

It's on my wall right now.

I'm looking at it.

Fantastic.

So you know how great the photo is?

Yeah, it's a great photo.

It's an excellent photo.

All right.

Now, just on logistics, because we started talking about the idea of naming the criterion collection shorts.

We did not discuss what that really meant, but we did reach out to viewers and let them vote without giving them any, you know, rules.

And they very clearly picked some over others.

My question to you guys before we get started is, what percentage of shorts do you believe should be criterion collection?

Not judging on it, but like, is it the top 25%?

Is it the top 33%?

What do you think rises to it?

20 max.

20.

20 max is my take.

I'm willing to go to 25, but 33, then you're just, that's just loose morals.

It's a morality issue for you.

Yeah.

I think that's right.

I think when you're talking about criterion collection as a concept, you're talking about.

on a grading system, these are the A's, right?

Yeah.

So A, B, C, D, and below, that's 20%, 20%, 20%, et cetera.

So I would say no more than the top, I mean, really an A is top 10%, but I would say you're breaking them into five categories and the top category is criterion.

And so I would say 20% is one out of every five, I think, is the most you could say.

All right.

I also feel as though we're going to have different, so in the NFL, Pro Bowl voting, you have the fans, the players, and the coaches.

So I do want to let you guys know.

A perfect system.

You will be at best a third of this voting block.

Okay.

That's fine.

But my question to you as well is the voters, our listeners who voted, do you think it's like the Hall of Fame?

Because they voted yes or no.

Do you think it has to be 75% of voters for it to be a yes?

Oh, interesting.

I think it depends on how many voters there are.

Yeah.

3,000.

3,000 plus.

Really?

Yeah, we had 3,000 plus vote.

Yeah, I think you need like whatever, 2,250 out of 3,000 or something.

I mean, the one problem with that is that like internet voting is famously unreliable.

You might get people who are trolling you.

You might get people who are like, you know, or do you feel like based on what you've seen so far that it's pretty, people are taking it seriously?

I feel it's, I feel looking at the results.

Yeah, I do think they are.

I would say that you need minimum two-thirds.

I would say it's a minimum like Senate confirmation hearing kind of a deal where you need minimum two-thirds of the vote.

But after that, I think it's up to you guys to decide.

Yeah, senate confirmation hearing is just a simple majority, but I take what you're doing.

You're talking about it.

Oh, man, isn't it good to have like a news guy here?

I meant non-filibuster version.

Right, yeah,

that's 60%.

Yeah, okay.

The breaking the filibuster.

Two-thirds of the breaking the filibuster.

That's what it takes to convict in an impeachment.

In an impeachment trial.

Yeah.

Jake, we gave you a list of words we didn't want to hear on this pod.

Filibuster was definitely on it.

Very disappointing how quickly.

Markup committee appropriations.

All right.

So this is very interesting.

I'm going to say just for fun, 75%.

Okay.

And it was actually 3,072 voters.

So that's 2,304.

And I'll tell you that six, only six of the 34

from the fans,

which is about right.

I think that's what we're talking about.

Yeah.

So I guess my question to you guys is, do you want to talk about the no-brainers of the first 34 that you think are criterion?

Well, we're obviously not going to talk about all 34 or even the top 10 or 15 or whatever.

I mean, look, let's just go through real quick.

Lettuce.

What do you guys think about lettuce?

No, no.

By the way, my suggestion was going to be we go through them each.

If it's no, no, we just move on.

If it's no, yes, we discuss briefly.

If it's yes, yes, we're good and we can talk about why.

All right.

So lettuce, no, no.

Correct.

I feel like I do want a category for lettuce, which I feel like I want to call syllabus.

I think that's fair.

Right?

Like, it's on the syllabus if it's a class.

You're not going to believe this.

I suggested a second category, and my name for it was additional reading.

Great.

Which is basically what you're saying.

Basically.

So it's basically like this is not criterion, but in order to fully understand the oeuvre,

this is like a highly suggested additional research you do into this topic.

Yeah.

Yes.

It cannot be dismissed.

That's right.

It's essential knowledge, but it's not maximum appreciation.

Correct.

All right.

Lazy Sunday.

Of course.

Yes.

All All right.

So there we have our first.

Lazy Sunday.

Wake up in the late afternoon.

Call Parnell just to see how he's doing.

Hello, what up, Pawn?

No, Samburg, what's cracking?

Thinking what I'm thinking.

Audio, man, it's happening.

But first, my hunger fangs.

I stick it like darkness.

Hit up, MacNoka, and Mac on some cupcakes.

Back up bakeries, got all my bars for me.

I love those cupcakes like McAdams loves gauntlets.

Can I tell a brief story about Lazy Sunday?

Yes.

By the way,

I was at the show.

I'd left the show.

I believe my last show was the last show before this and golden era began.

When did they get hired?

Did they start at 05 or 06?

05.

Yeah.

So I left at the end of the 04 season.

So it was right before they started.

I was back for that show, and I was in Amy Pohler's dressing room, and Lazy Sunday aired, and I was standing next to Will Arnett.

And I remember this clear as day.

He and I looked at each other, and he was like, that was incredible.

And I was like, yeah, that's going to be a thing.

And at the time, the only way that you could see stuff stuff on s l was like if you had ti voed it you would like bring your friend to your home and show it to them yeah but then you know college humor and youtube started because of lazy sunday and all that sort of stuff but i remember i literally it's like landing on the moon for s l comedy like i remember where i was the moment that lazy sunday aired i happened to be at s n l but like i remember it so clearly because of how obviously important it was in the history of comedy that's a very funny really i remember where i was where were you that was there i was there yeah Well, then that's obviously you remember.

It's like Neil Armstrong saying, I remember where I was when I landed on the moon.

My dad, rest in peace, Franco Harris.

We had dinner.

I don't know if I told you this.

We had dinner in Pittsburgh with Franco Harris.

And I know a lot of people listening to this podcast might not be huge football fans, but Franco Harris was the centerpiece of the most famous play in NFL history called The Immaculate Reception.

And we sat down for dinner with him.

And of course, my dad told him where he was during the Immaculate Reception.

And I then said to Franco Harris, I go, I bet you're the only guy that doesn't have to tell people doesn't feel the need to tell people and then he immediately which is really funny goes i'll never forget where i was i was in the backfield

jake are you just going to allow seth to tell a steelers anecdote like that without returning one of your own i feel like after the eagles thumped the steelers he's entitled to his memories and nostalgia for a team longer exists that's kind of you classic rope a dope let you guys get confident loved everything about it went according to plan i certainly understand Seth not wanting to talk about the game.

That's fine.

I want to say that your last, I was very sad when you left SNL.

Sure.

I felt very a C, as you famously like to say.

Kind of you to say.

And do you remember your last table read?

I think it was also the end of Seinfeld.

So it was a really hard time for me.

But I wrote a sketch about the guy who played the bass that was the transition music out of Seinfeld, like boom, boom, goon, goon, goon.

And it was just him doing a farewell concert.

Yeah, because Seinfeld.

And then I remember writing in on, by the way, this was also a real paper turner in that that's all you heard.

But I would be like, also, shout out to Mike Scher, who's leaving, leaving us off.

The same day I left, Paula Pell and Tracy Morgan, two other beloved figures of the show, also left.

And I remember I was very emotional the day I left for obvious reasons.

It had been six and a half years.

And Tracy was at Good Nights.

And then people were holding up signs that were like, I love you, Paula Pell.

And I was like, Ah, all right.

Well, yeah, I guess that's that's like a perfect SNL send-off.

It's like you're really emotional, and the show kind of flips you off a little bit.

Like these two other people that people like more are leaving.

Sure, what were you leaving to do?

Uh, go to work on the office.

Nice.

Season one of the office was starting.

What?

But when was the comeback?

So the office, uh, season one writing was from like June to October of 2004.

Gotcha.

And then they were editing it, and it didn't air until March.

So after we were were done writing, I got hired to the comeback in December and I was there from like December through April.

Then the office aired and then got picked up for season two.

So then I went back to the office to do season two.

So it was between seasons one and two.

Do you think that you should recuse yourself from judging Japanese office?

It's possible.

Yeah.

Yeah.

We'll get there.

Although, based on the way that these things are going nationally, not only am I not going to recuse myself, I'm going to just double down and insist that I'm right.

I should also say, feels crazy to say it now.

It sounded a little bit nuts that you were leaving to reboot that popular British show.

Oh, well, I mean, it was.

Yeah.

So briefly, you and I and Polar and Matt Murray and a bunch of people were watching the British Office before it was airing in America because you had a friend who was sending you like Region 1 DVDs or whatever.

And we watched the Christmas special.

We watched the Christmas special.

And when Don left and then, spoiler alert for a 15-year-old piece of art came back back and kissed him, I jumped out of my chair and thrust my arms in the air like my team had won the Super Bowl.

Yeah.

Because that's how much we cared about that show.

And so I went off and interviewed for a bunch of shows because I was leaving to my then girlfriend, now wife, JJ Philbin, had moved out to L.A.

We had to be together in order to make it work.

So I interviewed on a bunch of shows, had an interview at the office and was like, I don't think this is a good idea at all.

I think this is a terrible idea.

I didn't say that.

But Greg Daniels, who was adapting it, was so smart and interesting.

It was pretty clear to me that like he was the guy that I should work for.

So I was just like, this is going to be a disaster, but if he offers me a job, I'm going to take it.

And then it was the greatest decision of my life.

The two most emotional things I watched in that office were both with you, which was the Christmas episode of The Office and game seven of the Yankees Red Sox.

That's right.

Yeah.

So there were some very good things that happened in that office.

Young Chuck Norris.

No.

No, but I do like it a lot.

You took your time.

It was really intense.

I thought your internet had gone out.

I would also say not necessarily syllabus either.

No, no.

There's another category.

Okay.

Kim's Videos.

Ooh, like cool underground.

Yeah, like all Kim's Videos was a video store in New York that like the cinephiles would go to.

And the people who worked there were sort of like the jack black for music and high fidelity, right?

Like, oh, you know, this is the one.

You want to watch young Chuck Norris.

Maybe it's Kim's video.

I think so, yes.

Okay.

A tangent.

Kim's videos.

I don't even think it's Kim's video.

No, I do.

I'm going to make an argument.

I actually think it's additional reading.

I think it's syllabus.

Interesting.

The simple reason is that, first of all, a heroically great performance from Fred.

Yeah.

And everyone who knew Fred was like, oh my God, right.

I think it presages a lot of Fred's other characters.

A lot of stuff he did on update.

I felt like they were the first people to figure out how to do it.

It's a great performance by Hayter as the executive.

But also, the way it zips through time, I remember thinking, oh, this is a live-action Saturday TV function.

Any kind of cereals that have sugars on them, that's an obvious thing to do.

Jerry, it's me.

Listen, I'm on the street.

He's exactly what we're looking for.

No, here, I'll put you on with him.

Listen, let's just cover up the entire thing.

Passports have to change every four years.

Like, they were tapping into the same energy that Smeigel tapped into.

It's not criterion by any stretch, but I would actually argue if I were teaching this class, I would say, like, no, you need to watch this early juvenilia in order to truly understand what the Lonely Island accomplished.

That's my argument.

All right.

I think that's probably one of the nicer things anybody's ever said about the tangent.

Close talkers.

No.

No.

Yeah.

And I say that reluctantly because, and I'm sure everybody here is a great admirer of Steve Martin and everything he's meant.

But yeah.

I mean, if there was anything we proved that episode is that Steve Martin can be written for us so poorly that it doesn't work.

That it ruined Steve Martin.

Not ruined Steve Martin.

It's just he can't save it.

I want to say, though, and this is an important disclaimer.

I don't know, Jake, if you want to say something along these same lines.

It goes without saying, and Jake sort of made reference to this by how closely and intensely we listen to this podcast.

I love everything that these three ding-dogs have done in their lives.

100%.

100%.

I love every single thing.

I have made this argument to their faces.

I believe that The Lonely Island is arguably the most important comedy collective that has ever been at SNL.

If you take away Lauren and maybe Jim Downey, I think they are geniuses and I devour everything they make.

So when we say no, not criteria, not Kim's videos, not additional reading, that is not an indictment of the piece.

It's merely a reflection of how much we revere the things that are criteria.

And if I could just say, we have a lake house and when we go out on the boat at the beginning of any weekend, I'm immediately blasting I'm on a boat.

And one of my proudest moments as a father was when my son learned all the lyrics to Finest Girl.

Oh, that's great the bin laden song i mean yes 100 what sure say and when i go on a boat i take out my phone and i make everybody watch close talkers

i just want to say incredible way to work into casual conversation that you own a lake house yeah really nice really smoothly done like that if you said i have a boat we'd be like where you keep it

wait don't track tap it where you keep it

um Natalie's rap.

Yes.

Yes.

Yeah.

Again, you know, we talked about it on that episode.

Completely created a whole new thing.

Yeah.

You're in it too.

I mean, we should know.

I am in it.

You have a lyric.

I have a that golden touch.

Let me say a couple of things about Natalie's rap that I think put it over the top.

Obviously, like proving that for the first time, the host can also explode out of one of these digital shorts.

That was the first one of those where like it was like, oh my God, that's the host.

That's not Parnell or Samberg.

That's the host now getting this boost.

And I think that probably more than Lazy Sunday, Natalie's rap is probably responsible for the run that they had because the hosts were now coming in going, like, do for me what you did for her.

You know, generally a bad idea when you're talking about someone as talented as Natalie Portman to be like, I can do that too.

But the other thing I will say is when I was running Update, Parnell used to do those raps that were like the er lazy Sundays.

He would come on as himself and talk about the host, and then he would perform a rap.

I always really liked them and thought that he was like a better rapper than he ought to have been, given his personality profile as like the everyman suburban dad guy.

But I also, he's an SNL cast member.

So it was like, of course, that SNL cast members have things like that in their bag.

I didn't think that any host could do what she did in Natalie's rap.

That's like a one in a million that you can like take over a digital short or a sketch like that and perform at that level.

And I think it was like a eye-opening thing for the show, not just for Lonely Island, but for the whole show.

It was like, if you tap into what is, what these people are really talented at, they can like be a rocket ship and take the show to another level.

That's why I think it's a criterion.

We're sitting here today with film star Natalie Portman.

Hello.

So, Natalie, what's a day in the life of Natalie Portman like?

Do you really want to know?

Please, tell us.

I don't sleep motherfuck off that yak and that's

worth it.

You a crazy chick.

You shut the f off and suck my I agree.

And I would also add that it also is something that I can understand why hosts would want to be in them because it really, like when I think of Natalie Portman, that's like one of the first five things I think about that just like comes to your flag.

Same with Rihanna and Shirani and same with Bolton and Jack Sparrow.

Like those are now things that I associate with that guest star or guest host and like top of mind.

But Steve Martin, you don't think of close talkers.

Is that what you're getting at?

Okay.

That's correct.

Yeah.

To his benefit.

To his benefit.

The other thing about Natalie rapping is it was a burden for the guys that they rose to many times because, of course, then every host did want that.

Right.

Right.

And the incredible thing they did was not fall into the trap of doing other raps with other stuff.

Because every, I shouldn't say every, 95% of celebrities think they can rap.

And the fact that they only did the one who could to an impressive level was, you know.

I mean, that's the ethical standards that these ding dongs have.

Like, they wouldn't do that.

Like, that would be an affront to their morality, their comedy morality.

It's true.

They have incredibly, for real, like, the most incredibly high ethical standards.

Ethical is such a funny way of putting it, but it is true.

Uh, doppelganger?

No, no, Kibbs Videos, no, no, I don't think so.

Laser cats.

I think laser cats is criterion.

Really?

I do.

I do not.

Thanks for saving my life earlier today, Admiral Spaceship.

I owe you one.

As long as we have cats that shoot lasers out of their mouths, we'll be okay.

Oh, geez, I'm getting a transmission from base.

Hello, a princess has been kidnapped.

Robotron.

Let's roll.

I believe it's Kim's videos or additional reading, whichever one you want, but I do not believe it's criteria.

Now, we're gonna get to at least two more.

Do you believe any laser cats?

I stick with just number one.

All right.

My testicles.

No.

No.

Correct.

Peyote.

Nope.

Correct.

Andy Walking.

Nope.

Cubicle Fight.

I would say additional reading.

No.

Yeah.

I like it, though.

And Dane Cook's good in it.

He is good in it.

Harpoon Man.

I would put Harpoon Man in Kim's videos.

What's above Criterion?

Is there like a super criterion within Criterion?

It's just called Harpoon.

Oh, Harpoon.

I put this in Harpoon then.

Criterion Collection named their better one Harpoon after Harpoon man

so citizen kane is harpoon i see in the criteria gotcha uh so that's actually a cold run for our geniuses insofar as they were not uh churning out criterion but then of course dick in the box yep yes of course dick in the box holds based on the 3072 votes we had uh the most yeses

and my heart is open wide

Gonna give you something so you know what's on my mind.

I give for you special

to take off the dog.

Take a look inside.

It's my finger in the box.

I think dick in the box might also be on the cover of the Criterion Collection.

I think so too.

Because it's basically Lazy Sunday, but you replace Pardell, an incredibly talented comedian, with at the time, the greatest pop singer in the world.

Yeah.

And so it's the same family of kind of digital short, but now you've got like Mozart composing with you.

And as a result, it elevates it.

And Mozart has comedy chops.

Yeah, man.

Because it's not just the singing, it's the real funny moves.

And you put Wig and Maya in the background, yeah.

And also, just to refer to the last episode of The Pod, it's not something that you would see on Delta Airlines, which I think is a plus for it.

Yeah, good call.

Laser Cats 2.

No, no.

Nurse Nancy.

No.

No, but the name Scott Garbasiak goes in the Criterion Collection of Great.

That goes in the Sure collection.

Absolutely.

Let me tell you something.

Mike Scher will write a dumbass name.

Off the top of your head, I wish I had done some of my research.

Classic sure name?

Do you have any to throw out for us?

Oh, God.

I mean, there's thousands.

I mean, Toby Flenderson on the audience.

Flenderson.

That's a great one.

Yeah.

Which came from an SNL sketch I wrote.

That I was in.

Which you were in.

That aired.

Oh, my God.

You had aired.

That thing aired.

One of my all-time favorite.

Flenderson bows.

Flenderson giant carbos.

Flenderson's giant carbos.

It was based on the, those like Lexus ads or whatever, where people come out and they present a brand new SUV to their wife or their husband or whatever, and there's a giant red bow on the top.

And so you saw that happen a bunch of times.

And then Seth's wife took him outside and presented a card who's a new car.

And he reacted very angrily.

And his wife was like, You don't like it?

And he's like, No, it's fine, but it doesn't have one of those giant red bows on the top.

So I hate it.

And he stored back inside.

And then it was for Flenderson's giant car bows, which are like when you want to present your spouse with a new car for Christmas, you got to get a Flenderson's.

Every time I see one of those ads, I think about my dad trying to get a bow around a car on Christmas morning and the amount of like, fuck it, that fucking bow.

All right.

Body body fusion.

No, no, I mean, I appreciate it, but no, I would say Kim's videos, yeah, that's fair.

That's a classic Kim's video.

Um, Andy popping into frame, no, no, uh, business meeting, no, but you know, that I love, this is the maybe the greatest classic too many of the lowly islands, yeah, you love a too many, I love a too many, and this was an excellent one with an excellent ending, I should add, too.

The building being destroyed, but no,

uh, United Way ad.

This was a hard one.

What did you say, Jake?

No.

I ultimately said no, but I love this sketch so much.

I think it has a unique on its own.

I think it's ESPN Classic.

Oh, new category.

New category.

ESPN Classic.

ESPN Classic.

All right.

And it just goes, ESPN Classic comedy.

So this is just because you're a sports fan and you're kind of like putting it aside in a special way.

I just think for sports comedy, it's as high as you get.

You wrote it, right, Seth?

I did, yes.

So the thing that I want to give you props for specifically is when athletes host, you and I loved it.

People like us love it who are huge sports fans.

Yeah.

And they're usually like good in a clumsy way.

Yeah.

Because they're not scared about the crowd or the live TV aspect because they perform live all the time.

But they're usually not like excellent comedians.

I think this is the best performance in a sketch ever given by an athlete that I can think of.

It's unreal.

It's incredible.

It's unreal.

And granted, he's literally playing himself and he's playing football, but the only things that come close to me are Tom Brady in the sexual harassment video, which is a very specific kind of you don't have to act to act in this thing.

Jeter in the Derek Jeter sucks.

No, I don't.

Thank you.

Back and forth that you wrote.

You, I believe.

I think we wrote together.

Yeah.

But I think this is the best athlete acting ever.

Peyton uses strip ball to teach valuable lessons of communication.

Check, check, check, check.

Watch the sale, watch the sale.

Pink, pink, watch the blitz.

Brown 55 razor.

Turn.

Open.

I can't even look at you.

You know what?

Let's sit in the portal for 20 minutes.

That's right.

You stay in there.

Dear sister, yes, I agree.

I'm not going to tell you much about the voters, but I will tell you they do too.

I agree.

Dear sister, by the time you read this, do what you say

that you only meant.

Do what you say.

Roy rules.

Roy rules, I say no.

No,

because you hate Roy Rules.

I know there are more than 100 of these.

And, you know, if there were 200, who knows, maybe Roy Rules would be in the top 40, but in the top 100, and it's 101 from a certain year.

And I don't even know if you guys are adding the new ones from this season, but I just don't think it's top 20.

But, you know, it might be top 25.

Syllabus?

Kim's videos.

Yeah, I would agree to that.

Also, a special shout out to Succulent Rub Downs.

And My Dong Is His Peg Leg.

You can't ignore that kind of lyrical genius.

They're great.

Yeah.

I think syllabus.

Yeah, syllabus.

Talking dog.

No.

And I also say one of the reasons I give it a strike against Talking Dog is because the best dog SNL skit, not a Lonely Island skit, is when the scientific, like now we know what the dog thinks and the dog was a Trump voter.

Yeah.

That's just the best dog skit ever.

Yeah.

Seth, what do you think is the best driving cat cat sketch ever?

Residential history.

Oh, don't put me on the spot.

I mean, I haven't done any research.

Can I just, I like the ones where the cat knows how to drive.

I'm sorry.

Oh, okay.

I'm just disappointed.

I'm like, ugh.

Oh, I ran so far.

Yes.

Yes.

To classic.

Classic.

Butter-becan thighs, and your hairy butt.

Yeah.

And diary.

It's great.

Um, Brian diaries.

No, no, and I will say you should probably recuse yourself.

Yeah.

I get a recuse?

I thought we were just because it's like newsman v newsman.

We know how you guys

Mike and Alyssa are always trying to outdo each other.

When Alyssa got a small water bottle, Mike showed up with a four-liter jug.

When Mike started gardening, Alyssa started beekeeping.

Oh, come on.

They called a truce for their holiday and used Expedia Trip Planner to collaborate on all the details of their trip.

Once there, Mike still did more laps around the pool.

Whatever.

You were made to outdo your holidays.

We were made to help organize the competition.

Expedia, made to travel.

Charlie Sheen is an icon of decadence.

I lit the fuse and my life turns into everything it wasn't supposed to be.

He's going the distance.

He was the highest paid TV star of all time.

When it started to change, it was quick.

He kept saying, no, no, no, I'm in the hospital now, but next week I'll be ready for the show.

Now, Charlie's sober.

He's going to tell you the truth.

How do I present this with any class?

I think we're past that, Charlie.

We're past that, yeah.

Somebody call action.

Yeah.

Aka Charlie Sheen, only on Netflix, September 10th.

Uh, people getting punched right before eating.

No.

No.

Kim's videos, though.

Uh, grandkids in the movies.

No.

No.

Cute.

Not criterion.

The mirror.

I say yes.

That's the one with Elliot Page, right?

Yeah.

Correct.

Yeah, I'll give it to you.

Yeah.

Oh, someone's in here.

Someone's in here.

Hero song.

This was the hardest one for me.

I understand why.

Let me guess why.

Okay.

Because it is really good, but it could have been better.

I I wouldn't put it like that because Andy's my friend.

I don't think it could have been better.

I think it hit the ceiling of what it is.

I kind of agree.

I think it's incredibly well executed, but its sum total is not quite at the level that you would need for criterion in terms of like substance.

It's just an incredibly well-executed premise and idea.

But at the end of the day, it's one joke.

And I think the criterion requires more than one excellent joke.

That's a better way of saying what I said.

I mean, I think the issue is act one is great, act two is hilarious, and there isn't an act three.

Yeah.

I still think for me, and it's why it's a solid Kim's videos, is that I love so much when Andy sings big and gets so far over his skis.

And so, like, when I think of like favorite lyrics of mine that make me smile every time I think about them, it's just like, when I look out on the city, like, it's just the best.

So much crime and evil,

Everywhere deceit and lies.

Brothers turning on their brothers.

Sisters steal it from their sisters.

Where the dying go today.

It's an incredible performance.

It's a great observation about characters like Batman.

There are really excellent twists in it.

Like I think you mentioned this on the pod when he opens the recycling and he shakes his head sadly at the cardboard.

Yeah.

There's just little tiny grace notes in it that are wonderful.

I think it's absolutely syllabus or kim's videos but not quite criterion andy's dad yes i say no oh interesting all right we'll start with the yes make your case tap first of all always great to see downey i mean he's just really good and uh jonah hill he's got that great like incredibly sincere straight delivery he's a wonderful actor yeah and just the love scenes it's just hilarious it's just a very hilarious although i will say, I don't think of the skit when I think of Jonah Hill, unlike Rihanna and Adelie Portman.

Yep, but I, yeah, I mean, I just, it's a consistent laugh.

Is this a joke?

No, I mean,

I wish it was a joke.

It would be easier if it was a joke.

It's just that Ben is my dad.

Yes, you're dad, my boyfriend, whatever.

Yeah, but it's

not as if you're.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

It's gotten extraordinarily physical.

I mean, take that out of the mantra.

I agree with all that.

I think Downey's incredible.

If you could ever get Downey to do your sketch, it was like a home run every time because the guy's incredible.

I have like a tiny quibble with it.

Andy's great.

Jonah's incredible.

Downey's great.

I think that ultimately the thing that gets the biggest laugh is like Jonah kissing Downey.

And I just can't quite bring myself to say this is a criterion collection thing when it's not quite gay panic, but it's like gay panic adjacent, where it's like, ha ha ha, that man is kissing that other man.

And I can't, and it's, it's funny.

It's not, they didn't do anything wrong.

It's not homophobic or anything.

No.

But I think the reaction to it is like a little bit over the top based on the premise of the.

It is that trick where the reaction is almost makes you judge it more than the actual work.

If you watched it quietly in a room, you wouldn't feel that way.

That's right.

I felt the comedy wasn't gay panic adjacent as much as it was look at Jonah making out with this old man.

That is the charitable read on it, certainly.

And I do think it's also a little bit of like this very famous actor, Jonah Hill, is kissing Jim Downey.

And like the two personalities involved are also part of it.

But I just, I don't know, it doesn't quite rise to the level of criterion for me.

Laser Cats 3D.

No.

Nope.

Daikiri Girl.

No.

No.

Best look in the world.

No.

No.

A hardcore Kim's video for me.

Excellent Kim's video.

I feel like that's a dude where a guy slides it across the counter.

He's like, hey, kid, you want comedy?

Because I will say, much like Roy Ruhl's lyrics, cool breeze tickling your knee pits is as good a line as they've ever written.

I laughed so hard when I watched it again after the pod, I remembered, I had a like a Proustian memory of seeing it the first time and seeing the words pale stems across some like meaty white legs and like bursting out laughing.

I think it's absolutely Kim.

Kim's videos category was made for the best look in the world to me.

Jimmy Capp's crowning like a newborn.

I mean, that is Nobel Prize-winning poetry.

Yeah.

But you guys also in the original discussion absolutely nailed the problem with it, which is that it starts a full octave and a half too high.

And too fast.

Too fast.

Just me that.

And it's also contradictory.

As you point out, it's contradictory.

Yeah.

It's great.

It's great.

And the Japanese office.

No.

I say no, but I do wonder recusal-wise if Mr.

Scher is bringing any of his office baggage with him.

I will say, so when Steve hosted, was it the first time or second time he hosted?

I don't remember.

No.

Second.

Second.

It was a very big deal when he hosted the show for for us, even though I think by that point, the show, the office, was fairly well established.

And it was a very big deal that he hosted.

It was a big deal that Rain hosted.

Like, you know, I worked at SNL, but you still feel like SNL at some point, some level is an arbiter of what matters in the culture.

And when he did the Japanese office, I remember being a little bit rankled.

Like, I was a little rankled.

I loved the first time when Rain hosted and you did the like parody of the office with his monologue.

I was like, they're nailing this.

Everyone's nailing it.

Sudeca's nailing it.

Wig's nailing it.

Everyone's great.

This, I I was a little bit like, oh, okay.

Like, it didn't feel right to me in some way.

It didn't like,

I don't know.

It didn't like scratch the itch of like reflecting the show in the way that I was hoping the show would be reflected somehow.

I don't know how to describe it.

I do like that there was Lazy Scranton.

Right.

So I like that SNL was in the.

world of the office and then the office was in the world of SNL.

100%.

The Uruburos, as you like to say, Jake.

I find it was going back to milk a cow a second time, right?

Yeah.

I mean, that's if Rain had not done his office homage with Sudeikis and Wake and all that, and then this was the first time that we saw that, maybe.

I also just don't quite understand the premise of it because it's like they stole the show from me, but I stole it from the Japanese version.

But then all the actors in the Japanese version are white people.

It sort of didn't track to me somehow.

And on the 34th one, we run into our first logic problem.

We knew we'd get there eventually.

All right.

So, just to go through, you guys said yes to Lazy Sunday, Natalie's rap, Dick in a Box, you said yes.

Yes, on Dear Sister, a yes on Iran so far, a yes on the mirror, you were a split on Laser Cats, a split on Andy's dad, and I think that's basically where we are.

I'm going to bring in our final guest, who is Alan Seppenwall, who is joining us now.

Hello, Alan.

Gentlemen, good source.

Alan is a television critic for Rolling Stone.

I think he was the first person who recapped television.

Maybe not the first, but one of the first people.

We used to just watch TV and that would be, you'd never think about it again.

And then Alan was like, no, I'm going to write, we did it for the Sopranos and NYPD Blue.

He's written a great many books, two books on the OC, Breaking Bad, book on the Sopranos.

He and Mazoler Seitz wrote a great book about the 100 greatest television shows.

Alan, thank you for joining us.

My pleasure to be here.

We've been listening a little bit, and I just want to open the floor.

Have these two made any terrible mistakes?

Terrible, no.

I mean, they're definitely going, you know, small haul here, which I think I endorse.

You know, I had a short list myself, which was a little longer.

I think the only one I might strongly disagree on is Roy Rules, which I have like just the softest of soft spots for, just because there's so many great jokes in there.

Like I think Andy noted in the episode you did on that when he says he loves wearing t-shirts and Roy is wearing like a button down in the tie.

Like that's, it doesn't get better than that.

Not a big tent joke, but a pretty great joke.

But there's so many of them in that one sketch.

So I would say that I would agree.

United Way is, it's a great sketch.

It does not feel like a Lonely Island sketch.

It's a Peyton Manning sketch.

So that shouldn't be on there.

So wait, did you guys not take any of the laser cats?

I was pro first laser cats.

I was anti.

I feel like you have to have a laser cat somewhere in criteria.

I got that 100%.

Yeah.

So you missed, we did did say though what if there were like two other categories one is additional reading which is these are important if you were doing a college course on it and another would be kim's videos which is this is not you know high art but if you're sort of like a deep cut fan outside checkout yeah

But I just think that Lasercats is so fundamental to the story of the Lonely Island and of the digital shorts.

You have to have one on there.

Even if you're not like the hugest fan of the idea or the execution, it's, I mean, they did five of them?

Seven?

I've lost track.

Alan, which one would you put on if you could only pick one?

Which one was Chris Dodd in?

I would probably do, I think Chris Dodd was in 3D, which is also the one with walking.

So it's got walk-in, it's got Chris Dodd, it's got Keenan, it's got Andy getting his bionic eye.

I mean, I think that's your one.

I love how Chris Dodd is mentioned alongside Chris Walken.

I mean, it's got the two Chrises, the big two.

Yes.

You know, kids, before it was like Evans and Pratt and Pine.

Our Chrises were Dodd and Walking.

Alan, is it safe to say that you were a fan, having written two books about the OC, that you were a fan of Dear Sister?

Yes, I remember watching that and realizing what they were doing and saying, wait, they're doing a parody of that?

And I just couldn't believe it.

And like a lot of their humor, they just kind of kept going to the well and going to the well.

And the more they did it, the funnier it got until you get to the moment where the song just sort of keeps restarting over and over and over again in the span of about 10 seconds.

That's, I mean, maybe that's in some ways like the quintessential Lonely Island sketch.

Cause A, it goes back to their origins with the boo.

It's making fun of something that by that point was relatively obscure.

And like they sort of kept picking at the scab over and over again until they got through all of it.

It did not require any knowledge of the OC.

And I would argue that while OC fans might have liked that moment of, oh, I recognize this, I don't think OC fans enjoyed it any more than, say, I did, not having known the scene.

Agreed.

I can say that, by the way, my wife, JJ Philip and wrote for the OC and was there for that episode.

And her head exploded when we watched it because she was like, because it had been years since that had aired.

It had been some long amount of time.

And what she realized in that moment, which I think is important to note here, it was marking the Lonely Island as like the next gen comedy.

Like for them, that was nostalgia now, where for people in my generation and my wife's generation, it was like that was just our lives.

But for The Lonely Island, they were like tapping into a like fairly recent nostalgia, but a nostalgia nonetheless, which I think is a kind of crucial point.

Interesting.

She worked on the show when that episode aired?

Yeah.

Does she remember where she was?

In the backfield.

She's with Neil Armstrong.

The, I also, because again, it speaks to the integrity of the ethics of these guys.

It was not the cheap nostalgia where you get a laugh because everybody recognizes what you're doing.

It was genuinely not built on them.

It was, they were nostalgic for it, but they knew that that had no currency with their audience.

Yeah, exactly.

It's like cool guys don't look at explosions.

It's just sort of it's taking a trope and, you know, hanging a hat on it.

And anything else, Alan?

We do appreciate you coming on.

I feel like they just had to have some quality control here.

Smart.

No, no, I think they did a good job.

I mean, the only one I even really thought about that's not on their list is the tangent.

And that's one I think I discovered through the pod because it was so hard to find for so long.

But I think that's probably more of a Kim's video anyway.

I think that might be like in a, I don't know, grad school program on Fred.

Yeah.

They maybe show you the tangent.

Yep.

Yes.

That's a good call.

It's like when you go and look at like the Mona Lisa or whatever, but then if you're a student who's studying at the Louvre, they'll be like, you should look at these early sketches of the Mona Lisa.

And

they're like pencil sketches where you can see the future genius but it isn't quite fully realized on the page yeah you're like at one this at one point this is nick fane but it didn't start at nick fan yeah yeah yes and when nick when if you're a nick fan fan to understand nick fane you have to go back and watch the tangent yes 100 yeah

Yeah, and like Andy doesn't have to be the central character in a short for it to be criterion because he's not in Natalie's rap.

He just does a verse, but it has to in some way like have the sensibility of those guys in order, I think, to coincide with it.

And I think that's why United Way isn't Criterion.

Okay, we get it.

All right.

Fucking the one I wrote isn't criterion.

But Jesus, back to it a third time.

Great stretch.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Oh, my God.

Great.

Thanks.

But Harpoon Man is.

Harpoon Man is, to be clear.

So we decided on the 34 that we went through, we decided six unanimously, and then we diverged on two.

So I picked eight and Sure picked six.

I think that's good because they get stronger.

Yeah.

I think the Lonely Island oeuvre, I think, like as they proceed.

I would say the next 34 are likely to have more than six

that we both would agree on.

Yeah.

And just to echo what you said earlier, every single one of these is fun to go back and watch.

Yep.

Yeah.

They're all great.

Yeah.

I will say just because, you know, the odds of me and Mike being on this podcast again a second time, maybe not that high.

One day I was at the Parks and Rec writer's room and they played Captain Jack Sparrow on the writer's room TV at least seven times.

Endlessly.

Absolutely endlessly.

And also that was like the first one that my son got into

and like knew all the words to.

So like, i think jake's right the speed at which the criterion is filled up is going to accelerate so it's good that we sort of tapped the brakes a little bit yeah we you know purposefully we're we're appreciating their excellence there was a mindfulness to this yeah good word for it that's also one of the reasons that we're honored that we are chosen to be criterion judges yeah and that no one else will get to weigh in one way or the other this is the definitive decision agreed and just real quick and i do appreciate your time before we go um jake if you could just help me do the ad read for we're doing MSNBC is the sponsor, and I would love to get you to join in for that.

Tired of the news

into a warm bath of resistance nonsense.

All right, I can't put it on a T and then be mad at Tapper for taking a great big hack.

I will say, just for the record, to prepare for this, I did some research.

I looked into what the Criterion Collection's actual mission statement is.

Oh, it's interesting if you want to hear it.

Yes, please.

What it says on the website is this: it says, since 1984, the Criterion Collection has been dedicated to publishing important classic and contemporary films from around the world in editions that offer the highest technical quality and award-winning original supplements.

And what's interesting about that is how completely unhelpful it is in terms of determining what it is that they're looking for in a Criterion Collection movie.

I love Criterion Collection.

I do feel like in recent years, they've maybe expanded a little bit.

Have they?

I'm all for it, by the way.

But, you know, all of a sudden it's like tremors or whatever.

I don't know if that's it, but I feel like there's a couple like, tremors is good.

Tremors is good.

But if you, you know, like all of a sudden, if you're like, oh, okay.

I did something for criterion.

You know, I did an introduction for the Manchurian candidate.

So I feel like that's also that Criterion expertise.

I actually did something for Criterion, Seth, which you didn't bring up.

I don't know why.

No, I know, but you kept bringing it up on text.

All right.

Gentlemen, thank you.

I really appreciate this special episode.

And it's sad because you're not going to end it by telling us that you love us.

Of course, I was.

Well, I know.

It would feel insincere if I did.

So let me just say with a firm handshake, I appreciated our time together.

I appreciate our time together too, Seth.

That's really nice.

Good job.

Love you guys.

Hey, everybody, this is Seth.

We have just signed off with Mike and Jake and Alan, and we wanted to do a quick recap.

We realized that would be a helpful thing to do here at the end.

So, as I see it, and I do want to talk one last time with our Lonely Island trio to make sure they sign off as well.

Here are the no-brainer criterion collection.

Nominees after our first 34.

Lazy Sunday is in.

Natalie's Rap is in.

Dick in a Box is in.

Dear Sister is in.

I ran so far is in.

So those are the five for sure.

And then there were two yes votes for The Mirror from Mike and Jake, but The Mirror did not receive receive a plurality of votes from you, the listeners.

Andy's dad did receive a plurality, but did not receive 75% of the plurality and was a split vote between Jake and Mike.

So I'm going to ask the guys how they feel about that.

People getting punched almost got 75% from the voters.

Two no's from our guest pickers.

So that one will come up as well.

And then we are going to have to discuss Lasercats.

Lasercats received over 75% of the vote.

It got a yes from Jake.

It got a no from Mike.

It got a yes from Alan.

So, on that, I feel as though we're going to have to let the guys be maybe the tiebreaker.

So, we have five in for sure.

We have three maybes.

And I also will want to run down with the trio how they feel about our Kim's videos, how they feel about the additional reading selections as well.

All right.

Thanks, everybody, for listening.

Thanks one last time to Alan and Mike and Jake.

And the next time I'll I'll be back, it'll be with the fellas.

All right.

Be well, all.