‘The Bear’ Season 4, Episodes 7-9: Breaking Down the Wedding Episode

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Speaker 2 Welcome to the Prestige TV podcast. We are back to discuss the pen ultimate episodes of the Bears Season 4.
I'm Charles Holmes. He's Van Lathan.
Together, we're known as the Midnight Boys. Pee-bewoo!

Speaker 2 At Van, it came faster than I would have have predicted. We finally got the wedding episode.
All right, then. All right.

Speaker 2 You were fucking reading the fucking Midnight Boys Reddit.

Speaker 2 Now it got you in the zone. Okay, I'm fine.

Speaker 2 This is not the Midnight Boys coming. It's fine.
It's called the CCV podcast. We have to be adults here.
This is the house that sales and Joanna and Rob and Rob.

Speaker 2 We have to be adults. Oh, and CR.
And CR.

Speaker 2 Okay. We have to be adults.

Speaker 2 Before we get into the episode, let's do a little housekeeping and then let's do a little bit of a background and uh plot action okay so housekeeping guys you need to stay tuned to the fucking ringer higher learning is on mondays and thursdays tuesdays and thursdays tuesdays and thursdays twice a week midnight boys wednesday but we're we're dropping some shit we're dropping some midnight courts we're dropping some drafts superman fantastic for jurassic park iron heart fucking tune in if you want some squid game season three coverage don't come here go straight to house of our all right now background for this episode today we're covering episodes seven through nine: Bears, Green, and Tonato.

Speaker 2 Last three episodes of the season, directed by Christopher Storer. Joanna Kahlo writes episode seven, while Kylo and Storer share writing credits on eight and nine.

Speaker 2 So, we finally get our wedding episode. Richie realizes Frank is just as nervous as he is about fatherhood and life as they both struggle to get young Eva out from under the table.

Speaker 2 Carmy reunites with his mother for the first time, and after suffering a mild panic attack, shares a heart-to-heart with his Uncle Lee, played by Bob Odenkirk.

Speaker 2 Uncle Lee tells Carmy that Michael was proud of him and that he shouldn't feel guilty for leaving Chicago.

Speaker 2 By episodes end, Cindy and Donna bond, Carmy and Claire rekindle their romance, and Natalie finally forgives Nancy.

Speaker 2 Back at the bear, the team is working until the deadline to ensure that the kitchen is safe, but the computer reveals to Natalie that Uncle Jimmy is pulling the plug on funding the operation and questions if Carm and her can afford to keep this place running on such short margins.

Speaker 2 Meanwhile, Carmy visits his mother and finally makes peace. peace with her.
We fast forward and we're left with some big surprises.

Speaker 2 Albert arrives just in time to pitch Ibra and the Beef Gang on an idea for expanding that operation across Chicago. Marcus is named one of the best new chefs by Food and Wine.

Speaker 2 And Pete finally explains to Sid that Carmy is potentially leaving the bear to her and Natalie. You, when we were off bike, you said something that I had the same thought.

Speaker 2 Our predictions were fucking wrong. This is like we were like,

Speaker 2 if you're tuning into the podcast to listen to Chuck and Van predict the plot of the bear, then you're listening to the wrong podcast.

Speaker 2 I think on the last batch, on the last episode with the last batch, I think that I said that Sid would leave and take the job. She didn't.
I think that I said that Luca would step in for Sid.

Speaker 2 That did not happen. It didn't happen.
I think that I said that the wedding would be the last episode. It was, in fact, the next episode.

Speaker 2 So so many things. And by the way, this tells you guys we're not watching ahead.
We're watching.

Speaker 2 We're watching with you, but I think what is, what is, it also says is that this season has done a good job of subverting my expectations.

Speaker 2 I feel like I'm ahead of the show and I know where it's going. I know where it's going.
And we'll talk about it a little later. Even the wedding episode, I was a little bit like,

Speaker 2 oh, this is not how I thought. This is not how a typical hour-long episode of The Bear with all the Bears Autos happens.
Yeah, let's start right there.

Speaker 2 I mean, this is obviously a spiritual successor to Fishes, right?

Speaker 2 And you expect it to get the same breakneck pacing

Speaker 2 intensity, particularly when Brie Larson pops up, that you got in Fish's. But what you got was

Speaker 2 an episode that was excellent, but a really

Speaker 2 sweet, emotional, funny, deep dive into the Brazilo family, even more so than Fish's was a deep dive into their family.

Speaker 2 I mean, the reason I enjoyed this episode was because it does that wonderful thing where the characters are experiencing what the audience is feeling, where they're all before the wedding is starting, Richie's like throwing up, he's puking, like Carmy's almost having a panic attack.

Speaker 2 They're all like, we know what happens when you get all of us in one room.

Speaker 2 And then the

Speaker 2 episode opens up like this beautiful flower and you realize, I think the spine of this entire season

Speaker 2 are these various characters breaking patterns. They even say, I think Uncle Lee, played by Bob Odenkirk says it.
He's basically just like, the best way to break a pattern is to break patterns.

Speaker 2 And it was like, I wasn't expecting it, but it was almost beautiful to see these characters in a moment where they're finally like, I can do better. I could be better.
Absolutely.

Speaker 2 Everybody got to play a home game and everybody got to play an away game. Everybody had the conversation.
that they needed to have and then they had some that they didn't.

Speaker 2 Sugar is my favorite character of this season. She's so great.
She's so hilarious. When she sees Franny Fack and she goes, oh, like, like, and then they, they start their whole thing.

Speaker 2 That being the comedic B-plot that was going on, these two bombastic characters. When Pete, the Pete, look on Pete's face when the facts are just like, yeah, they, they hooked up.

Speaker 2 He's, you know, they hooked up with like, hey, he's right.

Speaker 2 By the way, did we ever actually find out what happened with them? No. We, we, we,

Speaker 2 it, they don't tell us if it had something to do with whatever encounter they had or if it was something else but we still kind of don't know exactly what happened between sugar and frannie fact but that's what i loved i loved that comedically where it was just like oh it didn't matter and even i'll be honest we were so critical last season a lot of people with just the like It was like a fucking DJ Khaled album with just the people fucking coming in out of the woodworks.

Speaker 2 I thought Brie Larson was really. good.
Oh, she worked. I thought she fit in perfectly.
She got the humor. She was, I was just like, oh, this is, this is amazing.
But I also,

Speaker 2 it was, I thought everybody did a phenomenal job. I think Odin Kirk

Speaker 2 and

Speaker 2 the scene with him and Carmy

Speaker 2 was really, really fucking good. Of all of the conversations that we have here, right? There's so many things here or in this episode that come to a head.
yeah um yeah richie and frank

Speaker 2 sid and donna sid and donna

Speaker 2 uh

Speaker 2 carmy and

Speaker 2 claire to a degree not really but it's not the beginning not to but it's the beginning of it

Speaker 2 which one do you think was the one that the episode centered around which which conversation in the episode had to happen I think there's two, and I'm cheating.

Speaker 2 I think it's Carmy and Uncle Lee, and I think it's Donna and Sid.

Speaker 2 Because with Donna and Sid, I was just like, oh, this is the moment when she chooses the bear. Yeah.
Like, this was the conversation she needed to have. Right.

Speaker 2 In terms of just like, why am I staying here? And then the realization that these people are my family. That I think

Speaker 2 all this season, like Sid is having like a lot of these logical arguments about why going with Shapiro is better. And Donna, weirdly, is the, because I was like, oh,

Speaker 2 this was the first time I was like, oh, I didn't realize that the show was kind of telling us that Sid and Donna

Speaker 2 operated similarly in the restaurant where Donna was like, when it was the beef, I was the person that came in and they were my family and did it, did it, dot.

Speaker 2 And I was just like, oh, the show is always drawing a line between Donna and Carmy.

Speaker 2 I didn't, like, her being the character to, like, Jamie Lucurst did an amazing job to be like, Sid, like, you love these people was incredible. I think it's Donna and Sid, and I'll tell you why.

Speaker 2 Because two things happened there. Number one,

Speaker 2 we tie a bow on Sid's aspirations outside of the bear. Very important.
Number two,

Speaker 2 that scene is an appetizer

Speaker 2 for Carmy and his mother reconciling. Yeah.
That has to happen. He sort of...

Speaker 2 you know, avoids her as much as he possibly can.

Speaker 2 She's looming around,

Speaker 2 but

Speaker 2 really,

Speaker 2 as she sits down and talks to Sid,

Speaker 2 we get an understanding of how the character has deepened. Yeah.

Speaker 2 Because one great thing that the bear is able to do is to create such anxiety around two characters meeting.

Speaker 2 You know, there's anxiety when a character has a gun on another character.

Speaker 2 We went and saw Jurassic a world rebirth and there's a scene I'm not gonna ruin it or spoil anything but there's a scene where one character is in the foreground and something's happening in the background and there's a tremendous amount of anxiety with that but those are fucking dinosaurs to be able to create this much

Speaker 2 uncomfortability or anticipation around a conversation the two characters are going to have that's not life and death but feels like more like death and life than life and death it the show does such a great job of that and in this particular one i'm like okay

Speaker 2 donna's back in now it's okay

Speaker 2 to uh to feel something for donna she mothered a little bit and we had i had never seen her do that yeah in the show i had never seen her like be a mom and the first time i saw her like be a mom was with when she was talking to sid and carmen is his mom right now i mean and i think what's beautiful is that this show, even though it is so centered on an Italian family, what I think they locate when you come from a large family is whenever there's a gathering.

Speaker 2 I've experienced this every single time I go home, every single Christmas, Thanksgiving, whatever it be, where the beefs that are happening

Speaker 2 around the party or the gathering.

Speaker 2 Everybody like knows the backstory or knows little bits, but like depending upon your relationship to the story, it's just kind of like, oh, they're just fighting. Like our cousins are fighting.

Speaker 2 The sisters are fighting. The brothers are fighting.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 even the trio of our three leads, Richie, Carmy, Sid,

Speaker 2 them all kind of realizing at the same time that they're all feeling the same emotion, that they're all nervous, that they're all afraid, that they're all fighting for something in different ways.

Speaker 2 Even it was very on the nose, but like by the end, I even thought Ava hiding under the table and all the people coming under, I was like, oh, this is a little cordy.

Speaker 2 But by the end, I was like, oh, this is so sweet. Like, this is so.
Well, yeah, the Ava thing was interesting because

Speaker 2 it was a situation that those two guys weren't going to be able to figure out. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 it kind of underscores everybody gets under the table. They all talk about what they're afraid of, right?

Speaker 2 The only thing that can make all of those people come together and hook together like that is somebody that hasn't been initiated into their trauma yet. Yeah.
Got to be a little kid.

Speaker 2 Everybody going to rally around and protect the little kid, right?

Speaker 2 So if it's about getting her out from under that table and maybe helping her find her dancing shoes or her dancing spirit or whatever, everyone would do that.

Speaker 2 There's not one other thing that would have happened at that wedding that they all would have got around that could have gotten them all under that table like that.

Speaker 2 Lil Hokie, yeah, but that took the pressure off Richie, who I really, really,

Speaker 2 really identified with in this episode. Richie was just.
Richie is just,

Speaker 2 he's trying to be a dad. And normally being a good dad,

Speaker 2 it's about letting go, but it's not about letting go so somebody else can fill in.

Speaker 2 So he has to believe that his daughter's heart is big enough to love not only her father, but the guy who's going to be there as her stepdad. He has to trust a kid, and that's difficult to do.

Speaker 2 And it's not just that. It was like there was this one moment where Uncle Jimmy goes over to

Speaker 2 Richie and he's just like, he's looking at, he's like, Claire's gorgeous, Tiff is looking beautiful. You two fucked up.

Speaker 2 And the look on Richie, on Emma's Microsoft's face is just like, because I've been in those situations where like you're friends with a dude

Speaker 2 and his ex is like happy with someone who's better. And like, hey, if you love her, you gotta like, you gotta be happy for her.
You gotta be happy for the daughter.

Speaker 2 I've had to have that talk with my friends with kids being like, yo,

Speaker 2 you fucked up. Yeah.

Speaker 2 You kind of have to eat your, and to, for Richie to be graceful in that and to try to help Frank through that was almost, I was just like, oh, we're seeing a side of him that he's been fighting against this entire series.

Speaker 2 As this functions as

Speaker 2 a sequel to Ficious, John Mulaney is back. Yep.

Speaker 2 And he's been in, I think, a couple of other episodes. Paulson's back.
She doesn't stay for a very long time. She does her thing.
She kind of gets gets out of the episode.

Speaker 2 But when you see the extended family of them and you see people who are

Speaker 2 just

Speaker 2 used to it,

Speaker 2 that

Speaker 2 they've been through so much. Like Mulaney's character in this is very important because he likes it.

Speaker 2 He's in the family. And whereas a lot of people go, wow,

Speaker 2 these jokers are too much for me. He's no, he likes it.
He's there for for it. He gets it.
He understands it. And he helps kind of Sid

Speaker 2 get her bearings around what's going to happen because really,

Speaker 2 Sid

Speaker 2 is him.

Speaker 2 Sid is him. Yeah.
Sid, everybody else is kind of around in the orbit of whatever. Even Frank, the guy who Richie's ex-wife is marrying, seems to be a part of their extended circle in some way.

Speaker 2 Yeah, because he is, he high, because he has this running bit with marcus's best friend who sold his house right yeah like he worked and that guy seems like he knows the facts or it's just like to your point i think also what this introduced to me is i'm like oh like claire is actually ingrained in the like she knows the bears autos and even tiff is like i thought because i was like wait tiff's not related to them And then she's like, yeah, only the bears showed up.

Speaker 2 My own family did it.

Speaker 2 And I was like, oh, the Barizados, their family structure mirrors the bear in a way, where they're, no matter how toxic they are, they're very good at adopting people into the larger family and taking care of them.

Speaker 2 And they have so much love. And to your point, Mulaney and Claire seem very much like

Speaker 2 this is just the bears. Yeah, I mean,

Speaker 2 Claire and Carmy almost seem like an arranged marriage. Yes.
It almost seems like they are two people that in this entire group were

Speaker 2 fell in love, but also are designated partners for everyone. That's why when you're trying to get at Carmy,

Speaker 2 you know, you're fucking up with Claire. You're fucking up with Claire.
And that's something that they use to kind of pull him or rein him back in, should I say? Yeah.

Speaker 2 But watching Sid

Speaker 2 be in that situation with the wedding, with everything on 12, everything turned up as much as it can be turned up. And then still make the decision that now this is kind of her family.

Speaker 2 She's talking to Donnie. He says, hey, like your work family can be

Speaker 2 just like your real family. She says, no, it's like it's just family.
Yeah. It's just family.
It's just family.

Speaker 2 And then she makes that decision not to stay at the bear, but she kind of makes a decision to become a brazato in a way. Yep.

Speaker 2 I mean, and I will say, if we stay on IO, she's been phenomenal through this entire series. I have been blown away with what this season has like asked her to do.
Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 2 And how she's risen to the occasion in terms of like having the episode when her dad has a heart attack and she's, she's crying and she's breaking down.

Speaker 2 And then this episode where she has to be almost soft and initiated into this family and talk to Donna and she's dancing with Richie.

Speaker 2 And even when she's becoming more of a leader in the next couple of episodes, I'm like,

Speaker 2 it's weird, but I all, the greatest thing about watching TV is seeing young actors who kind of made their big break on a show get to do this and get to like level up.

Speaker 2 I was just like, oh, because if we kind of flash forward, I was wondering, I was like,

Speaker 2 is there a version of this show

Speaker 2 where Io

Speaker 2 is more of the lead than Jeremy Allen White? Because we end the Penultimate Ninth episode. Correct me if I'm wrong.
My understanding with that is that Carmi has essentially said,

Speaker 2 I'm no longer in the kitchen. I'm no longer even a part of the bear.
The only people who are part of the ownership group now are Natalie and Sid.

Speaker 2 And then obviously Jimmy. It seemed like that was Carmy's way of saying, I'm stepping back from cooking.
Like,

Speaker 2 did I misinterpret? I'm not sure yet.

Speaker 2 I really don't know.

Speaker 2 Carmy's

Speaker 2 quest in this season is not professional at all. No.

Speaker 2 Which he seems on a parallel path to those stuff happening. He's rarely in the kitchen.
Yes.

Speaker 2 Carmy's deal is not professional.

Speaker 2 It is so

Speaker 2 subtle

Speaker 2 how they

Speaker 2 have

Speaker 2 switched places when last season seemed to be all about everybody's personal growth and like personally what they were going through, you know,

Speaker 2 kind of

Speaker 2 oriented around what was happening at the bear, you know.

Speaker 2 And Carmy was just tunnel vision, tunnel vision, tunnel vision. One thing, chef cook restaurant.
And now, when you think about it,

Speaker 2 you don't see him cooking very much in this. You see him

Speaker 2 diversifying his humanity, and you see everybody else kind of locking in on what has to work for the restaurant to work. Not overly locking in, not getting crazy like he gets crazy, but

Speaker 2 it's weird. Like between Carmy and Sid, it's like he almost became D-Wade in the Heat championship years.

Speaker 2 Like D-Wade went out, won a finals MVP,

Speaker 2 got Shaq a fourth ring, got his first ring. Hey, I can be the man at whatever point.
But then it was like, it got to a point where D-Wade averaged 30, do the whole nine.

Speaker 2 Then LeBron comes and D-Wade goes, I can win a championship averaging 22 points a game, 21 points a game. I don't have to get 26.
I don't have to get 28. I don't have to get 30.

Speaker 2 Like, I can be a part of an ensemble and rise to new heights.

Speaker 2 Now, I'm not saying that Sid is coming in like LeBron, but I'm saying it's like Jeremy Allen White is getting his D-weight on a little bit.

Speaker 2 Well, but I think that that what's interesting is that's made the bear more successful.

Speaker 2 The more Carmy has been like, I'm trusting Sid to take over more, I'm trusting Richie in the front of the house, I'm trusting, like, I'm putting Luke, I put Marcus next to Luca, they're good. Like,

Speaker 2 I think it's actually when you think about why Carmy started the bear, this was a promise that he made, one of the last promises that he made to his brother that they were going to open up this restaurant, the bear.

Speaker 2 And all this season, people are like, what are you chasing? Why are you chasing? What are you chasing? And then Sugar is just like, hey, if you've fallen out of cooking.

Speaker 2 You don't have to be like, you don't have to be in love with this thing. And have we been on this trajectory where I'm like,

Speaker 2 is Carmy's ultimate salvation realizing that Sid has it? Like Sid, like passing along this to this woman who like actually doing something better than Shapiro.

Speaker 2 Shapiro was pitching her on, you're going to be my partner. I think Carmy's pitching on, you don't need me anymore.
This is yours. So we have to talk about Shapiro in a second, too.

Speaker 2 But I think that Carmy and the audience through him are supposed to get an idea of what it means, the difference between being obsessed and being invested. Yeah.

Speaker 2 You can be obsessed, and sometimes that feels like you're super invested, but it's blinding. You're obsessed with something.
You're obsessed with it. All great people that I

Speaker 2 look at their greatness all had to learn the lesson of what it means to be obsessed and what it means to be invested.

Speaker 2 If you're obsessed, it's like, got to do this, got to do this, but it's a very singular thing. Yeah.
It's your relationship with whatever that thing that you're

Speaker 2 obsessed with. And obsession is normally about seeing you grow.

Speaker 2 And sometimes what you think is, if I'm as good

Speaker 2 as possible at what I'm doing, everything else will be better.

Speaker 2 Being invested in something is different because when you're invested into it, you want to see it grow

Speaker 2 and you want to see the people around that grow. Like if you're invested into your team, then you want everybody to be better, not just you, so that you guys can do the best that you can.

Speaker 2 And I think that

Speaker 2 we saw in season three

Speaker 2 that Carmy was obsessed, and that's a part of who he is and

Speaker 2 which made him so good at

Speaker 2 singularly being a chef.

Speaker 2 Now we're seeing him try to figure out how he invests, how he invests into Claire, how he invests into his mom, reinvests into his mom, even sometimes with diminishing returns, how he invests into

Speaker 2 the restaurant, into Sid. And some of that has to do with letting go a little bit.
And watching him let go in this season has been phenomenal.

Speaker 2 I mean, also, because you brought it up when we were talking about the first episode, I found it so funny where

Speaker 2 In that we saw how Carmy, even when he was making like tomato sauce, has this tendency, because he's so obsessed and shit, shit to almost get frazzled and not actually pay attention and put love into what he's making.

Speaker 2 I might be wrong. Over these past couple seasons, we've seen Marcus make food that is talking about his upbringing and his family and trying to connect.

Speaker 2 We've seen Sid make an omelette for sugar.

Speaker 2 And this was one of the first episodes in a while where I remember where we're not seeing Carmen try to cook something that is like highbrow, technically perfect.

Speaker 2 He's making chicken for his mom. For his mom.

Speaker 2 And it's this, I was like, oh, that's a beautiful scene because I'm like, he traveled the entire world running away from something, learning how to cook, trying to prove himself.

Speaker 2 And he ended up at the place where he needed to be, which is infusing love. He's like, I made this at the French laundry every single day.
Here you go.

Speaker 2 And like, I was just like, oh, that's what he needed more than the rest of the day. And that's the peace offering right there.
And I was like, that was a beautiful fucking scene. Right.
And look,

Speaker 2 his mom had gone to Italy, had this,

Speaker 2 you know, I don't know if you've ever been mad on vacation before.

Speaker 2 It's so wild that Kanye

Speaker 2 ended up fucking over himself like he did and doing all this shit. Because there are certain Kanye lyrics that when I would hear him, I would laugh.

Speaker 2 Because when he said in Bound 2, he goes, How are you going to be mad on vacation?

Speaker 2 And I've been there before. I've been in Anguilla with Khalika.
Like,

Speaker 2 can we just like, just, can you just stall me out? Just give me three days, and then you can whoop my ass when we get back because we wasting, we wasting beach right now.

Speaker 2 Like, we there's no, there's no worse feeling than being on vacation. You had gotten into a fight with your partner.

Speaker 2 I'm like, five, I'm gonna go out by myself just like drinking that, like, drinking some mixture.

Speaker 2 It's happened

Speaker 2 people, you looking around, everybody else looks like they got it figured out. You're like, yo, can I get another Bailey's banana and cream? And then, you know, it's funny, we got a quick sidebar.
So

Speaker 2 there's a drink that they make in the Caribbean,

Speaker 2 and it's called the Bailey's Banana and Cream. Okay.
Has anybody ever had this drink before? I have not had a Bailey. I've never had this.
So it's Bailey's Banana and Cream.

Speaker 2 It's like a mixed drink, right? Now, Kai,

Speaker 2 the drink is called Bailey's Banana and Cream.

Speaker 2 What is that for short? All right. You're setting me up.
No, I'm asking you because that's what the drink is called. What is that for short?

Speaker 2 short bbc it's the bbc so you british broadcasting that's crazy you brought me in for that that's why shout out to kai so what time is it man oh yeah

Speaker 2 so we would shout out jack sanders so we would i remember i'm at the bar

Speaker 2 and you know everybody's hanging out and i'm mad Me and Khalika got into it. I'm mad.
And

Speaker 2 there's a white lady. She wasn't, i don't think she was white she well she was white but i think she was more like a latin latina or something like that and the the

Speaker 2 you know i'm by myself now and

Speaker 2 the guy looks over and she and she goes can i get the bbc

Speaker 2 i remember i just got in a fight with my girl i don't know if if she's talking to me or or to the bartender and she goes can i get the bbc and i'm like

Speaker 2 uh no i'm not that mad no you can't

Speaker 2 I'm on vacation.

Speaker 2 So, anyway,

Speaker 2 did that set Kalika off? She wasn't even there. Kalika was over on the

Speaker 2 thing. I had left.

Speaker 2 We at the beach shack or whatever,

Speaker 2 Blanchard's beach shack in on Meads Bay in Anguilla. And so

Speaker 2 if you have a Blanchard's, it's crazy. It's really good.
So we, we, you know, she over there, she pissed off, whatever. I'm, I'm mad.

Speaker 2 So I go over there to get the drinks and a woman walls up and she asks for the bbc and i'm like oh did you look good yeah

Speaker 2 i had to ask

Speaker 2 because we had had him in grenada but i had forgotten that people that the bbc was a drink real quick so donna's mad on vacation at their father

Speaker 2 and that memory becomes about a meal yeah about an italian woman who had brought her a meal when she's like crying furious i forget yeah it's something

Speaker 2 to

Speaker 2 i looked it up it looked disgusting yeah that that and

Speaker 2 even in the the the dish itself it's something that looks disgusting but you have to eat it to know how good it tastes bro that's what family is if you step back and you look at if i tell people about my relationship with my dad or if i tell people about

Speaker 2 some of the other stuff I've been through with loved ones in my life or some of these people's lives, you would think it would look like all of this stuff was so messy and nasty and disgusting. But

Speaker 2 if you're there, you have to be there to understand how good it really tastes.

Speaker 2 I mean, there was even a moment when Carmy was talking to Uncle Lee where I felt this so much, where Carmy is almost taken aback. He's like, yo, my Uncle Lee is a prick.

Speaker 2 And he's like, me and Mikey got really, really close before he died. And I've had those moments where I've been the person who's left home.
I come back.

Speaker 2 I'm talking to a brother a cousin whatever and they're talking like they're best friends with someone we had sworn our whole life and uncle whoever i thought you didn't with them did it

Speaker 2 and then you learn the story of he was the only one around when i up he helped pick me up he helped keep me comfortable he came and got me he bailed me out the whole and it's like and it's funny because i was just like usually it is those uncle figures who have been in that state where they're like oh they're a little older they're like i was young i up i remember when i needed someone and it was interesting seeing Carmy, seeing Uncle Lee in a different light and seeing his brother in a different light.

Speaker 2 Yeah. In that mall, I was like, oh, that is a very honest

Speaker 2 conversation. It was just,

Speaker 2 it was, that was a wonderful episode. And it was something where I was like,

Speaker 2 did it almost in a weird way feel like a funeral for the bear a little bit? Which episode?

Speaker 2 The wedding episode, where it was just like, if the season, if the series ends with this season, I could see that being in terms of just like, if fishes was like teaching us the history of the Bears Autos, does the wedding episode be like, this is how they break the patterns, this is their future?

Speaker 2 It did at the time, but then the next two episodes made me wonder how long they want to do the show because they could do the show for a very long time.

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Speaker 2 Talk about the Shapiro thing, though. You wanted to bring it up.

Speaker 2 How Shapiro's reaction is. I don't fuck with Shapiro.

Speaker 2 Shapiro sucks. There was something.
There was something that I don't know who got this idea for this type of character, but I think we've been very, very hard.

Speaker 2 on Carmy in terms of like, and rightfully, rightfully so, how he's treated not only everybody out in the restaurant, but specifically Sid.

Speaker 2 But I think if you watch the series, you can definitely say that, like, Carmy loves Sid on a personal level, but on a professional level, he actually thinks that she's respects her, he respects her.

Speaker 2 Like, this is the chef that he wants to stand next to, and also get to a point that he can leave her something to be like, even if he's out of this world, like,

Speaker 2 yo, you got this, you don't need this, run the team by yourself.

Speaker 2 And I think Shapiro in that moment proved

Speaker 2 he just wanted

Speaker 2 her talent. Yeah.
There's a difference between, like he didn't want to give her like true, true equity in this thing. Like a true, like, no, this is your house.
I am like partnering with you.

Speaker 2 So this can be yours one day. It seemed like Shapiro was building like a nice house, a nice foundation.
She would get health insurance.

Speaker 2 She could make a lot of decisions, but she's not the boss at the end of the day. Well, I mean, honestly, she's just another state-of-the-art thing, meaning that like he has a state-of-the-art

Speaker 2 healthcare system.

Speaker 2 he has a state-of-the-art sound system he was showing her all of the incredible incredible immaculate stuff that he was gonna she's just another stuff she's another thing she's she's literally a talented black woman that you can feel cool when you're playing anti-op yeah she's a state-of-the-art chef she's just another thing she's there but there's no family there's no there's no connection i don't know if he even sees her as a person in the same way that carmy and richie and tina do in terms of like no we see your talent as a chef, but we also see your beauty as a person in this world, in our family.

Speaker 2 I don't know if Shapiro would ever have given her that. Yeah, I mean, look, that's a part of

Speaker 2 the calculus that we all have to do in our heads in terms of what is meaningful to us. You know, like if you're a basketball player and

Speaker 2 you are a part of the culture of the city that you're in, you know, think about if like Steph left Golden State. Now, it might be a time where

Speaker 2 Steph might want to leave Golden State, but it's not going to be for no money.

Speaker 2 That wouldn't be why that would happen. So

Speaker 2 like when you have a player or somebody that's a part of the culture of a place, a part of the thing, like I am definitively a part of this, for you to leave,

Speaker 2 that

Speaker 2 we see this all the the time that has to be a major major pull either you have to leave so that you could achieve more you believe more about yourself or you have to believe that it's worth building culture again somewhere else and so i think the wedding um

Speaker 2 plus all of the other questions that she was having about herself i mean part of sid might have gone well if my dad is sick Shit, I don't even know if I can be in a new place where I'm not really looked at as a human being.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 If I'm going to need to be able to take care of him, you saw some of the dreams that she was having about operating inside of all of this chaos and stuff like that.

Speaker 2 You know, when she eventually talks to him, he insults her. Yeah.
So that tells you what working with him would have been like. If he would have treated her like a person, he might have,

Speaker 2 he had no interest into why she made the decision. So this is very important.
If you're listening out here and you want some advice from an old head,

Speaker 2 in that situation where you've made a decision not to do something

Speaker 2 and you're on the other end of the phone with somebody who actually cares about you,

Speaker 2 they're going to be interested in what made you make that decision. They're going to care about why you came to this, particularly if they think that you're making the wrong decision.

Speaker 2 But if they just, if somebody just looks at you and says, what you're doing is dumb. then they've sent it themselves in a call that was difficult for you to make.

Speaker 2 Or even if they're disappointed doing the like, like, hey, I'm disappointed, but I'm here whenever you need me.

Speaker 2 If, like, if you ever need help, if you ever need to call me up, text me, whatever, like, I'm here for you. Did it, did it, da.
Are you excited? You know what I mean?

Speaker 2 But even if it's even if it's a little bit more cynical than that, it's like, you know, I'm really disappointed.

Speaker 2 Just what about the bear makes you feel like you can get, you can be the best version of yourself there? What am I not offering you that you see there? Yeah. Right.
Just

Speaker 2 a sliver of actual concern for how difficult it was for you to make the decision. Just something

Speaker 2 more than your disappointment. Because no, and you always learn your disappointment

Speaker 2 is paramount. And it would have been the same way had she disappointed him in some other way, which is going to happen when you're in a working relationship with somebody.

Speaker 2 And also, do you think it's she met Carmy and everybody at the beef at their worst? And Carmy never hid who he was from her.

Speaker 2 Like, Carmy's always been an asshole, Richie's always been an asshole, it's always been chaotic.

Speaker 2 And I tell people all the time, especially when I'm dealing with white folks, I'm like, sometimes it's way easier for me to deal with someone where I'm like,

Speaker 2 hey, yo, they're all their cards on the table versus someone who is just like presenting themselves as an ally. And I'm like, and then when they fuck up, I'm like, this is kind of who you always were.

Speaker 2 You were just hiding it from me. Versus I'm like, Carmy has almost worn his heart on his sleeve to too much.
He He can't help it. He can't help just but be himself.

Speaker 2 And yeah, I thought

Speaker 2 if we're talking about our predictions, what I think, I started thinking, like, is this kind of like an anti-sitcom where

Speaker 2 it has the structure of a sitcom? It has the beats. We get the wedding episode.
We get, we get the facts. We get Richie saying little stuff like that.

Speaker 2 But it's not giving us what fans have wanted, which is the Sid and Carmy relationship or potentially Sid breaking off and competing with Carmy or like all the stuff that we were like predicting.

Speaker 2 I was just like, the show almost went in the more, I don't want to say realistic, but the more we're not.

Speaker 2 It's about people making weird decisions. And

Speaker 2 that's what life is. Life is about people making weird decisions.
Think about how many times you didn't talk to somebody and you're like, yo, why you do that? And they go, shit, man.

Speaker 2 How many times have you been in a situation? It's like, why you do that? Or

Speaker 2 our inability

Speaker 2 as people

Speaker 2 to see past the thing that's right in front of us.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 like

Speaker 2 every year, every moment you spend not talking to somebody that you into it with

Speaker 2 has to really matter because

Speaker 2 particularly if that person is in your family, like it's your mom, it's your dad, it's your brother, it's something like that. And your feelings are so important

Speaker 2 and you've centered them to such a degree that you're like, I can't fuck with them, I can't talk to them right now.

Speaker 2 And then you have no clue

Speaker 2 when the last time you're going to talk to that person is,

Speaker 2 or what's going to happen during the time that you're not fucking with them. Yeah.
But we make these decisions every day.

Speaker 2 We make, and we, it's up, it's in our nature as human beings beings to not look at the big picture. If we were thinking

Speaker 2 it's it's odd, I'm rambling, but I want to land this. If we were thinking at of the big picture the entire time we were on this planet,

Speaker 2 we would not be able to exist. We'd be in existential dread every single second, every single decision.
We think and move based upon the input that's right in front of us.

Speaker 2 And so when I'm watching the show, I'm watching people that are trying to think about the big picture, but they just love, they love,

Speaker 2 they're mad, they're jealous,

Speaker 2 they're scared, they're

Speaker 2 confused. And that is a bigger thing.
Like Uncle is losing his shirt on the restaurant, but he just wants to be able to take care of these kids. Like, you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 He's, it's, he's, the decision making, it doesn't make any sense.

Speaker 2 But, but it's, it's, and it's funny because, like, even it does a very sitcom thing where it's just like, you have the Ibra plot line where you're just like, is this going to be the

Speaker 2 saving grace? And to your point, the person that's actually looking at the bigger picture is the one person that was almost pushed to the side.

Speaker 2 And you're just like, oh, you're like, we're watching it to the entire, and you're like,

Speaker 2 almost these also rans of the bear, the people that aren't doing the fine dining thing, are now the ones that I was going to ask you: is

Speaker 2 for the bear to survive, do you think that they're also saying something about the restaurant industry?

Speaker 2 How many places do we order from DoorDash or fucking whatever you use that don't have a physical location anymore? I think that that's an interesting question,

Speaker 2 and it makes me think of two different things. Number one,

Speaker 2 you

Speaker 2 have to have the place that you're comfortable going in order to have the place that uh you're it is daring yeah like i like a restaurant here in uh

Speaker 2 in beverly hills it's called steak 48.

Speaker 2 okay it's a chain it's got a couple of them maybe five six of them around town but steak 48 never misses right i go there i get the shells and the cheese they got lobster they got chicken fried lobster oh my daddy so i go there right

Speaker 2 and i go there when i know when I know.

Speaker 2 And this is not like a mom and pops. It's like a fancier steak restaurant, but it's good.
Yeah. So if I have, if it's my birthday, I'm going there.

Speaker 2 If it's like, I'm going there because I don't want to go to a place with all different types of shit if

Speaker 2 I want to be certain. But life isn't about certainty.
So the question is, how do you juggle comfort? with being daring. This season, really, we've seen a lot of people,

Speaker 2 even in the conversation that Luca has with Tina, where he's talking about how much pressure do you want? Yeah.

Speaker 2 Like, how much

Speaker 2 of your life do you want to be uncomfortable so that you can achieve something? Are you supposed to be comfortable?

Speaker 2 Is there a time in your life where comfortability is supposed to, comfortability is even something that you should be trying to attain? And there is.

Speaker 2 Just not all the time. Yeah.
We're watching Carmy become more comfortable with situations that were uncomfortable.

Speaker 2 And we're watching everybody else adapt to pressure, which last season was more about Carmy putting pressure on everyone and breaking them into little bitty pieces. Yeah.
And so

Speaker 2 he's becoming whole because he's becoming more comfortable. And some of these other people are becoming whole because they're adapting to pressure.

Speaker 2 Marcus is the best chef, one of the top upcoming chefs. So, this is, did you see that coming? Because what I and we haven't even talked about my man who's trying to guess the wines.

Speaker 2 Oh, fucking sweeps. Yeah, sweeps.
Once again, putting a shit ton of pressure on himself.

Speaker 2 And every single, I love taking the little breathers with him as he's trying to guess the wines and do all of that stuff.

Speaker 2 I thought, but once again, a character who started off is almost just this, like, a very small part of like season one. And to your point, I'm just like,

Speaker 2 him with the facts and they're like, it's not Skittles.

Speaker 2 It's, it also shows you how Carmy has now built a place where

Speaker 2 these other people can feel ownership of the restaurant and their role in the restaurant. And I think the show is saying a couple of things about

Speaker 2 just, because I watch a lot of like food shows, read a lot of food shit where it's like, for some place like the bear to exist just financially in 2025, I don't know how many restaurants I've wanted to go to in LA where I'm like, my friend's like, you need to try this restaurant.

Speaker 2 I checked temporarily close, closed, closed. We couldn't stay open.
Did it, did it,

Speaker 2 or they'll say, we're going straight just delivery. There's no place you can eat here.
Did it, did it, da. I think even with Marcus's role in the bear, I might be totally wrong.

Speaker 2 We might have to ask Dave Chang about this, but have you ever heard that like pastry chefs

Speaker 2 in the culinary world world sometimes are looked down on? Pastry chefs, desserts

Speaker 2 just in terms of just like you have to think about it. There's one of Marcus

Speaker 2 in this restaurant, right? There's a whole bunch of other chefs, sous chefs doing everything.

Speaker 2 Usually it's just Marcus in the corner away, just like grinding away, kind of just like, but he's making beautiful stuff. We've seen this entire season, people be like, this is delicious, chef.

Speaker 2 This is perfect, chef.

Speaker 2 And it was interesting when Sugar

Speaker 2 announced who the best new chef is. Carmy didn't look at Marcus, yeah, Carmy looked at Sid.

Speaker 2 Yeah, and that was even like a telling where it was just like even Carmy hadn't located, like, had it located like

Speaker 2 you have the best new chef in your restaurant. You were so, you would say, were so focused on like dinner and making that, you didn't realize that you had this kind of like gem.

Speaker 2 Yeah, and even Luca, I think, in that moment, was just like that. I think Luca that entire time was like, oh, he's gotten good.

Speaker 2 You know what?

Speaker 2 Speaking of Marcus,

Speaker 2 he was only in a couple of scenes in the wedding episode.

Speaker 2 But Marcus, what's homie's name that Marcus is, that sold his house for him? I forget.

Speaker 2 Look that up for me.

Speaker 2 You guys know I'm not great with names on television shows. But he's like,

Speaker 2 when he's talking about the fact that they weren't invited, he goes, fuck.

Speaker 2 We're about to get kicked out of this fucking wedding. I love Marcus.
Also, I have been in that exact situation with someone where I'm like,

Speaker 2 you didn't have we're not supposed to be. I hate that feeling, bro.
Let me tell you something real quick. I got, I gotta hit y'all.
Chester. Chester.
I gotta hit y'all with another one real quick.

Speaker 2 The years 2006,

Speaker 2 maybe 2007. Nah, it had to be 2006.

Speaker 2 I'm living in the apartment with Dan and Brett. Okay.

Speaker 2 Brett Bulatek,

Speaker 2 Dan. Okay.

Speaker 2 Our friend Nick Sheptek.

Speaker 2 Shout out to Nick.

Speaker 2 All these guys are Chicago guys, right? They all went to Columbia College of Chicago. We had a friend named Will.
Will was a little bit more plugged into Hollywood stuff than we were.

Speaker 2 Cool, Will, black guy. The rest of these dudes are white.
We go to this party. We go to this party and we hanging out in the party and we chilling.

Speaker 2 Me, Nick's friend Joe, me, Joe, Dan, Brett, all of them. These are my

Speaker 2 still in college mode, first got out to LA, made a bunch of friends, white boyfriends. And I started looking around and I started looking at people.
I'm like,

Speaker 2 yo, these people don't want us in this bitch.

Speaker 2 Like, we're at somebody's house.

Speaker 2 And it was

Speaker 2 Will was either invited. Will Jellon is his name.
Shout out to Will, wherever you at, brother. Hit Hit me up.
Will was invited

Speaker 2 or

Speaker 2 he came with somebody. Will told us to pull up.
We pulled up. So we inside the house, we chilling, we having fun.
We're meeting people. We're doing the whole thing.
Like, everybody's hanging out.

Speaker 2 And then people start asking us, like, who are you here with? Like, why are you, why are you here?

Speaker 2 And I'm like, and you know, I'm like, yo, cool. I'm good.
Whatever. We about to, we'll get the fuck out.
I'm out of here. It's cool.
We'll, we'll leave. So we get up.
And

Speaker 2 I'm,

Speaker 2 I always had it in my mind that I wasn't going to get caught up in no shit with these dudes because the shit would be different. You know, this would be different.
So

Speaker 2 we're getting ready to leave. And Nick Shemtek,

Speaker 2 my homie, nice guy, tall dude. White Sox fan, cool guy.
I started to see a little static. There's some static.

Speaker 2 Nick, Brett, Dan, there's some static. I'm like, okay, I'm about to get out.

Speaker 2 So I walk out the door, right?

Speaker 2 And I'm walking out the door. And there's a hill where we had to walk.
The person's house was up on the hill. Decent, nice little house.
So I'm walking down

Speaker 2 and I see Nick

Speaker 2 at the door pointing at people.

Speaker 2 Like, pointing at people. Dan, Nick, everybody.
And all of a sudden, I see people coming down the hill. Stop.

Speaker 2 gigantic brawl

Speaker 2 like bro huge

Speaker 2 brawl everybody was getting bitty

Speaker 2 no crazy

Speaker 2 you think i'm about to go up there so the cops could pull up one dead

Speaker 2 like well boy the cops killed one guy i'm sitting down there i'm looking everybody is getting busy Dan is a fucking wild man. Dan had took on like three or four people.
I got to actually go get Dan.

Speaker 2 I'm like, Dan, you're about to to kill this guy i gotta grab dan off of the guy nick

Speaker 2 joe joe gets a gigantic gash over this is crazy white boy

Speaker 2 and but when we was on our way to the party joe had on flip-flops and or one of them had on flip no uh brett had on flip-flops and joe was telling brett don't wear flip-flops what if we get in a fight and i was letting i told them straight up i was like if y'all get in a fight i'm letting y'all know i'm not about to fight for y'all this bitch it ain't that type of fresh showing up to another person's house you don't know a flip-flops.

Speaker 2 And by the way,

Speaker 2 this shows you. We showed up.
Think of how many people. None of us invited.

Speaker 2 Me,

Speaker 2 Dan, Brett, Nick, Joe. It's five people.

Speaker 2 Was it that type of five where you could just blend in because there's so many motherfuckers? Obviously not, Charles.

Speaker 2 So it's like, like, obviously not. I remember looking, because at first we having fun, we playing a little card game.
We talking to girls and all of that stuff like that. We're a hit at the party.

Speaker 2 People are enjoying us at the party. And then people just start to like, get the fuck out of my house.
Like, who are you? Like, and so

Speaker 2 I'm like, all right, cool. I'm gone.

Speaker 2 Boom. I'm talking about, when I say a huge brawl, I'm talking about like eight or nine people fighting.
Hell yeah. The dudes and eight or nine people fighting.

Speaker 2 Dan and bust somebody up, blood everywhere. Like, it was, it was really fun.
And that's what I'm talking about. That's why Marcus, Marcus, like, I'm around these white folks.
Around these white folks.

Speaker 2 And Mark, we didn't see Marcus again. Maybe we did once or twice in the episode.
Because, look, got to get out of here. I can't do it.
Boy, then was the days. Busbees.

Speaker 2 We will go to Busbee's on Wiltshire. We went there right after the Tony Soprano final episode.
Anyway, whatever. Final episode of Sopranos.

Speaker 2 Played Don't. What do you? Because

Speaker 2 we have not seen the season finale. I haven't seen it.
Or the series finale. I'm very excited.
I am just like, it is

Speaker 2 so much of this feels like the death of one version of the bear, where I'm just like,

Speaker 2 I might have, that might have been a total misread, but it's like, it seems like Carmy is putting his affairs in order. He is like, I'm no longer a chef.
Y'all got this.

Speaker 2 I'm riding off to the sunset with my girl. I'm a because he was

Speaker 2 at Frank Lloyd Wright's house in the other episode. Like, he's appreciating art and architecture and the finer things.
He might be like.

Speaker 2 And the conversation between him and Claire Bear, we have to talk about in episode nine, where it seems as if they have, he is vulnerable enough with her to where she forgives him and they are back on.

Speaker 2 Did you think that,

Speaker 2 are we supposed to believe? Because basically, it's a very romantic scene where he's like, he calls her to talk about the mom, has to hang up. He wants to tell her something again.
They call back.

Speaker 2 She reveals that at one of the parties, Don almost burned down the house. She lost a green sweatshirt, and Carmy finds it.
And I was just like,

Speaker 2 Did Carmy keep that after that? Has he been in love with this woman for years? And it's been in his closet, and he's like, I can finally give it back to her.

Speaker 2 And him giving it back to her is like him giving himself to her.

Speaker 2 It's closing the loop.

Speaker 2 It seems like even him cooking his mom that chicken felt like, is this show trying to say

Speaker 2 Carmy's journey or what he was chasing? What Tina was like, you don't have to chase the shit anymore. You're the shit.
Is this him being like, I don't have to chase being the best chef ever?

Speaker 2 I can move on and do something else. Here's the question.
It's a good question.

Speaker 2 Is Carmy's journey to become Mikey?

Speaker 2 Mikey, who didn't have any excellence professionally, but was the rock of his family.

Speaker 2 Right?

Speaker 2 Whenever you see Mikey

Speaker 2 on the show, he's surrounded by family. They're doing something together.
He was present.

Speaker 2 Obviously, there was a lot that was weighing on him, obviously, but he was present.

Speaker 2 Is Carmy's real goal, or not his real goal,

Speaker 2 the real salvation of the character in marrying that part of his brother with still being able to achieve something in his professional life.

Speaker 2 Because remember, he asked him first episode, first scene, when he's talking, he's like, the car rental thing, did you love it? Did you love the car rental thing?

Speaker 2 And he's like, no, I didn't give a shit about it. So, I mean, there's enough love to go around, but I think this season has really been about Carmy trying to figure up how he divides himself.

Speaker 2 I mean, that is interesting because it is funny how many people are so surprised when Carmy shows up at the wedding or are so so surprised that he's seeing his mom.

Speaker 2 And I was just like, oh, I had not really thought of like, are they surprised? Because Carmy does have that thing in him that Mikey had, which is just like,

Speaker 2 you make people better. You make people better.
Yeah. People want to be around you.
Even if, like, let's say he doesn't leap cooking. Is there a version of his life that's okay

Speaker 2 helping being the rock that is like, all right, we're going to set up little locations so we can get these sandwiches across Chicago, but I don't need to be in the back of the fucking kitchen doing like

Speaker 2 fucking high cuisine shit. Is it okay if the bear is never French laundry?

Speaker 2 Which, by the way, I can't get anyone who can get me in the French laundry. Listen, I'll be honest with you.
You can't get anybody?

Speaker 2 I've been trying to go eat there.

Speaker 2 I bet Bill has been there before.

Speaker 2 Bill can't get us into the French laundry? It's a question. I don't be one to ask him for stuff like that.

Speaker 2 I don't want him to do stuff like that. I don't want to have to go through Bill.
Bill, you know,

Speaker 2 It's like,

Speaker 2 to me, you should never, you know, he's kind of, he started this whole thing. You don't want to ask him to go to the French laundry.
You want to go, you know who you want? I'll give you an example.

Speaker 2 You want the Shapiro in your life to get you into the French laundry. Ooh.

Speaker 2 That's Tommy. Tommy could get you into the fucking French laundry.
Tommy, whatever. You want the Shapiro.

Speaker 2 You want the Shapiro, somebody that is trying to wine and dine you.

Speaker 2 That's the person that you want to get into, want to get you into the French laundry because then you can get them to do the favor and you can dub them after, like, oh, Hollywood Heisman.

Speaker 2 But but, but if if it's the guy who is kind of the dude around here, then he, then you're gonna be in a situation with him and you're gonna be like, Hey, remember that time I got you in the French laundry?

Speaker 2 You're gonna be fucked. All right, I'll do the podcast, man.
You know what I'm saying? You don't want to be beholden, you know.

Speaker 2 Fuck good advice.

Speaker 2 All right, so wrapping up, we are so bad at predicting what's going to happen next,

Speaker 2 but

Speaker 2 season or series finale,

Speaker 2 how are you feeling going into the last episode of the Bear? Are you kind of like rejuvenated?

Speaker 2 Because, like, I've seen, I haven't read any of the reviews, I've kind of been trying to keep myself very pure, but I see people are like a little mix or whatever.

Speaker 2 How are you feeling about this season and just the bear as a project?

Speaker 2 I'm really enjoying it. I,

Speaker 2 to me,

Speaker 2 this season is,

Speaker 2 I think it's incredible in terms of the growth of the show. I'm laughing.
I'm getting really weighty, important scenes, the artistic vision of the show, the music, all of that.

Speaker 2 Chicago is still a major character in the show. It's beautiful shots of Chicago.
I'm really enjoying it. I think

Speaker 2 sometimes I think what we do with shows like this, shows that.

Speaker 2 Because we don't get as many of these anymore, shows that feel like appointment viewing.

Speaker 2 I remember that first, second season of The Bear, it felt like, finally, we all have a show we can talk about again.

Speaker 2 I think sometimes we have a rocky relationship with them in terms of just like our love and hate relationship and pushing back on the thing. But watching the season,

Speaker 2 what I remembered is I'm like, oh, this show,

Speaker 2 what it's trying to say

Speaker 2 about grief, about dealing with people in your family who have substance abuse issues and like, how do you grow? How do you break cycles of abuse and break cycles of toxicity?

Speaker 2 The talk that Carmy has with Uncle Lee and then the talk he has with Donna as someone who has had to have similar talks with many people in my life who either alcoholism or substance abuse, seeing people take their lives and seeing like what it does to a family.

Speaker 2 I know it's not always the most fun thing to watch. And I know this is going to sound very corny.

Speaker 2 I feel lucky being able to watch a show that's kind of like, we want to tackle this shit yeah we want to talk about it even if it's not pretty even if it always doesn't work even if one season might not be as good as another

Speaker 2 seeing those actors seeing the writing seeing what they're trying to achieve and the emotion of that

Speaker 2 i'm not like i got misty out i'm just like they're fucking locating something about all of that that is fucking true and i'm just like i'm excited to see how they land the plane what they do i don't know but i thought i think so far this has been a fucking phenomenal season

Speaker 2 this Things have been great. This has been great.
Can't wait for the finale. All right, yo, that has been your Penn Ultimate episode of our coverage of the Bear.

Speaker 2 We will be back on Monday to talk about the

Speaker 2 talk about the season or the serious finale. We honestly don't know.
I haven't read anything about it. Thank you so much to everyone behind the boards: CT, Kai, Justin.

Speaker 2 You all have done such amazing work, and we'll see you soon.

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The sound of an Etsy holiday, which sounds like this.

Speaker 5 Now that's special.

Speaker 2 Want to hear it again?

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