You’ll Always Live Paycheck-to-Paycheck Until You Have a Budget

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This is the Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about their life, specifically their money, their work, and their relationships.

We want to help you win in all of those areas.

The phone number for you to jump in today is 888-825-5225.

Triple 8-825-5225.

Alongside the fabulous Jade Warshaw, I'm Ken Coleman, and we are ready to go to help you.

Let's start it off with Dallas in Birmingham.

That's not confusing at all.

Dallas, how can we help?

Good morning.

Good afternoon.

I'm sorry.

It's okay.

Just wanted to, my wife, my lovely wife and I,

of 26 years, we are just swamped in dead.

And I have been doing, we've been doing this for so long.

I am just, we're beaten down with it.

So we're trying to get some help here.

We have a decision.

Well, we were kind of trying to decide what to do.

I were,

where do you want me to start?

I have $76,000 in student loans.

I did do two stupid moves.

I'm an avid Dave Ramsey fan, by the way.

I listen to you guys' podcasts, and I listen to you a lot.

So I did do two stupid things.

I bought a truck

after selling my truck to pay for

my baby, our baby's

first

semester in college.

So I missed my truck.

I bought another one.

And my wife retired a couple of years ago.

So I got the bright idea to go out and try to buy her a car.

Oh, no.

Okay.

Yes.

How old are you guys?

We're both 50.

I turned, I'm sorry, I turned 51, and she will be turning 51 here shortly.

We're high school sweethearts.

Sorry, I know that had nothing to do with anything.

That's a good year, by the way.

In 74 is a good year.

I was born in 74.

It's a good year.

Great, great.

Good year.

Good year.

That's not relevant to anybody but us.

Thank you very much.

Give us the debt load on the car and the truck.

Okay, the debt load on the car, the truck, I owe $29,000.

Her car, we owe $33,000.

Okay.

Anything else?

And

$13,000.

Yes, $13,000 in credit card debt.

So

that's it.

Well, and of course, well,

house.

Yes, we have a home.

You want the total on the home, but we owe.

We owe $373,000.

Okay, I was just curious about that.

Tell me about your income.

I know you said your wife's retired, but what what do you guys take home every month?

Actually, she started back working again.

She had to start back working again.

Good.

So

she's a teacher.

She's a retired teacher, and then she's teaching now in the private school system.

So what do you guys bring it home?

Total, my pay varies.

Last year, I brought home.

Think about it by the month.

That'll help you out.

When you see the month, what's it look like?

I wrote it down.

My wife, she actually, and I wrote down numbers that we actually touched.

So she actually touches $4,049

a month.

Good.

And my pay varies due to overtime and things like that.

Give me a middle month.

A middle.

I can do you better.

I can do the worst month.

The worst.

Why are you

at this point?

I'll just take a number.

Yeah, I'm anxious for a number.

Just any number at this point.

I'm so sorry.

I'm sorry.

I'm sorry.

Okay.

6,723 is what I'm totaling this far.

So you guys are take home.

So you guys are taking home almost $11,000 take home.

Is that what I'm hearing?

I'll say $10,000.

Okay, great.

$10,000 a month.

I'll take it.

How much is your mortgage?

Mortgage is $2,137.

Okay, fine.

Okay.

Whew, listen, that was a lot, Dallas.

To get to that, okay.

So

you called in saying that you guys are just over overwhelmed.

When did your wife start back working?

Did that just now start or has she been back for a couple months?

Or since last year, I should say.

Oh, no, no, no.

Last year, she started back last year.

Okay, so you've had her income.

Tell me,

so you did mention a child that went to school, but it sounded like you were able to cash flow that.

Or is college still on the plate?

College is still on the plate now, and it's mainly her.

Well, it's mainly her apartment.

Are you so you're cash flowing that?

Yes.

What is the

okay?

I'm gonna, I'm gonna jump to the crux of this thing quick, Dallas.

But I want one more number.

What are you paying for her apartment?

$7.50.

$7.50.

Okay.

Does she have roommates?

Yes, but it's kind of one of those things where they both pay the $7.50.

Okay.

So

what is the car worth?

I know you owe $33.

Is it worth more than you owe?

No.

Oh,

I know we're.

Well,

I'm getting confused.

I'm sorry.

I'm so sorry.

Are you upside down?

All right, here's it.

Let me drive.

Let me drive.

Hold on.

okay let me drive because we we we got it we got three minutes so you you answer that's okay i got you dog all right so

are you upside down in the car

yes i don't have those exact numbers that's okay are you upside down on the truck very 14 000 all right that's okay we won't spend any time on that okay so jade i i'm i'm leaning in here i want jade to be able to help what i think is happening dallas is you guys have no idea how to budget because even with these numbers and i and i don't want to take up up any more time on what you're, well, you know what?

Do you know your minimum, you know, your payments on the car and the truck?

What are the trucks?

You need those.

Yeah.

Yeah.

My truck payment is $5.45.

Okay.

And the car payment is $6.68.

All right.

That gives Jade a thing.

I bet you guys just don't know how to budget.

That's what I think.

I don't think you should.

You have debt, so you're going to feel the squeeze.

But based on the numbers, I feel like the biggest squeeze is from the fact that you guys aren't on a budget.

And Ken and I can hear that in the way you're talking about it.

So before you get off the call, we are going to set you up with every dollar

and that's going to help you get control over.

Just seeing the numbers, Dallas, is going to give you so much control so that you know actually where your money's going and you'll be able to see once you plug the numbers into your budget, how much margin you should have left to be attacking your smallest debt.

I'm going to give you three bits of homework.

The first bit is, yeah, when we give you every dollar for free tonight, that's your date night with your wife.

All right.

So you guys are sitting down and I want you to complete it.

Don't start it and be like, oh, tomorrow we'll do it.

I want you to complete the budget tonight so you can see that margin.

Second thing is Ken and I want you to go on KellyBlueBook.com and get the true numbers on

what you owe on these cars versus what they're worth so that you can find out the amount that you're upside down.

Okay, so that's the next thing.

Find out how much I am upside down from a true source, not just, you know, Boo Boo who took a look at your car the other day.

Don't trust Boo-Boo.

Yeah, A real number.

And then the third thing is now we're going to find out: is it something that, you know, I don't know what your credit's looking like, but you're going to need to get a loan for the difference on this upside-down stuff.

Whether you go to the credit union, whether you go, I don't care where you go.

The point is, we need to get a loan for the difference so that we can sell these vehicles at least one, right?

And get ourselves into a cash hoop dee.

I didn't ask you, but do you have any money saved?

Quick answer.

Do not.

That's the issue.

I had to stop my retirement because I can't afford to pay for it.

But that was right.

That was right.

That was the right thing to do.

Okay.

And we just cannot save a dollar.

It's because you don't,

it's because you don't have a budget.

And to Ken's point, you're spending.

That's going to stop today.

Yeah.

Because you're going to see, yeah, debt is a problem, but you want to know, Dallas, you're also going to see we've been going out to eat and we've been doing things we can't afford.

And it really is just a lack of sight line on this.

Dallas, I'll say this as point blank as I can say I'm doing a rough look at the numbers you gave us, plus, I'm looking at utilities, groceries.

We didn't get the credit card minimum, but I have a general idea.

Your take-home, you ready for some good news, Dallas?

If you do what Jay told you and use the budget, you're going to be able to put a couple thousand dollars a month towards debt.

Yes, you guys have the margin.

You just have no plan.

No plan.

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All right, Quinn is up next in South Carolina.

Quinn, how can we help today?

Hi, I'm currently in college.

I'm $49,000 in debt, and I have three semesters left, and I still am going to need to come up with about $28,000.

Okay.

And what are we pursuing?

So

mechanical engineering.

Okay.

All right, keep going.

And so

I'm currently a senior, but I switched majors a couple times.

So I'm going to have an extra three semesters after my senior year.

And my parents have helped me these four years.

And then the next three semesters, I'll be on my own.

And I'm curious on whether I should continue to do federal loans

to pay for that or if I should

or how I should go about paying for that.

Well, when you said your parents were helping you the first four years, what does that mean?

Because you already have $50,000 in debt.

So they would help me, like, they paid for my rent, and

anything that federal loans plus my scholarships didn't cover, they would cover.

Uh-huh.

Uh-huh.

Okay.

So

the problem here, and you need another $28,000 is what you said.

What school are you at?

Where are you at?

Clemson University.

Okay.

I think the problem,

are you doing any part-time work?

I do.

And how much does that bring you?

A month?

I make about, depending on the week and like my classes, I make between like $100 and $200 a week.

Okay.

Which pays for groceries and then a little extra.

Right, but the problem is none of this is touching tuition, and the tuition is the problem because that's what you're taking out loans for.

The problem,

let's go back and identify the problem.

I know there's not a whole lot you can do for the spilled milk, but your school is too expensive for you.

That's the problem.

And so you have, you're at a really critical point where you're going to keep going or you're going to stop and reevaluate.

And part of you has already stopped because you're calling here, but you have to make a very clear decision whether or not

you're going to stop borrowing money or not.

And it has to start there.

And then from there, we can decide now what are our, what levers do we want to pull.

But the first question is, are you ready to stop actually borrowing money?

Yes, I'd like to borrow no more money on top of this.

All right, so let me tell you what I would do.

I'm going to walk you through the questions I would ask myself, but I'm asking you.

Is that cool?

Okay.

All right, here we go.

Absolutely.

What is it that I want to do, Quinn?

What do I want to do?

Let's fast forward and assume we have this degree.

What would be ideal?

I'd like to work in the automotive or aerospace industry.

Fantastic.

And what would an entry-level job look like?

Payment-wise?

No.

What are you doing?

A lot of it is like

doing tests on

engines and

like

already produced

products to make, like, to see if they're.

Got it.

I don't need to understand it.

I'm walking you through an exercise, but you understand what entry-level looks like, correct?

In those two fields.

Okay, wonderful.

So, the question is: the next question I would have is: can I do those entry-level positions now without the degree?

What's the answer to that?

No.

You cannot do entry-level without that mechanical engineering degree.

Not an entry-level engineering degree.

Okay, can you do adjacent work that is similar to it,

but

you don't have the degree, but you're doing similar functional type work.

I'm not sure about that answer.

I could look into that better.

All right, because I'm clueless about

your fields, I can ask this question: You want to work with engines, yes?

Yes.

Okay, and this is a mechanical engineering degree, so I know you don't want to be a full-blown mechanic who works on my car, but it's the same function, true or false.

Yeah.

Great.

Do you have any idea what mechanic, like, could you, could you go and do basic mechanic work right now on something?

Yes.

And you have any idea what that pays per hour?

I do not.

It's pretty good.

Pretty good.

So now I've arrived at a solution because I've committed to Jade and I've committed to myself.

I'm playing Quinn right now.

Yep.

Okay.

And I'm not going to, debt is not an option.

So this is where innovation comes from, by the way, as a mechanical engineer, you should appreciate this point.

True innovation happens at its purest and best form as a result of a lack of resources.

That's right.

Right?

It's why everybody loved the old show MacGyver that you're not old enough to know, but MacGyver was innovative.

All right.

The guy didn't have it.

He was under pressure and he saved the world with a tube of paper towel cardboard.

That's some duct tape

and the inside of a Bic Pen.

And he killed a man and operated on him at the same time.

And it was innovation, and we loved it, right?

It was this.

So

what I'm challenging you to do right now is to be innovative.

And if I'm you and I've got $28,000 I got to come up with, seems insurmountable when we put it in the form of a student loan.

But when I say, wait, can I make two grand a month?

using my basic mechanical skill set, the answer is absolutely bargain basement, you can.

So if it's me, I'm going to press pause on Clemson because because here's what I know about Clemson.

Clemson's going to be there.

Yeah, that's right.

When you come up with $28,000.

So my last point, I want to bring my partner in here on this one.

I would press pause.

I'd go make $28,000.

And then I would show back up to Clemson.

They'll take your $28,000, whether it's tomorrow or two years from now.

And it doesn't take two years to make $28,000.

I'm making the case to you that you can make $28,000 in less than 12 months.

Yeah, you can do that.

And go turn a wrench and get dirty and get nasty and go, I never want to do this kind of mechanical work, but I'm going to do it because I have to do it so that I can do what I want to do later.

And that's what I would do.

I would come back with the $28,000.

I'd lay it on the counter for the Clemson folks and go paid in full.

I'm going to finish my courses.

I'm out of here.

And now I'm rocking and rolling.

Yeah, you can do it.

That's what I would do.

What would you do?

Ken, I think you're 100% right.

Quinn, I think your battle here is with the clock because people think,

I'm in college.

I got to do it in four years.

I got to do it back to back.

I have to do it at this time in this amount of time.

And if you can change that and say the most important thing is that I get where I want to go.

That's right.

And where you want to go is not just, you made it clear.

You said, where I want to go is not just, where I want to end up is not just with a degree.

I want to end up with a degree without a dime more debt.

And since you said that's the destination, then you have to be willing to invest the time to go the right way to get there.

Otherwise, you won't end up there.

You'll end up with $28,000 more of debt.

So that's, those are your, your guiding lights there is you want to be clear about where you want to end up with this degree, without a cent more of debt.

And you've got to wrap your head around the fact that it's going to take time to get there.

And that's okay.

Yeah, I love that.

I love that.

Jay just nailed the, I gave you a, here's what I would do tactically, but she gave you the mindset that you were going to have to adopt.

You've got to listen to what she said.

If you adopt that mindset, you go, wait a second, I've now changed the clock.

I'm not racing against this concocted societal norm.

I'm racing against debt.

Now it's a different race I'm running.

I don't want more debt.

And I throw another one at you.

How many credit hours are we talking about?

Was it two more semesters or three more semesters?

Three more semesters.

How many hours?

Would you be able to do mechanical work and carry the class load?

Not at a full

time student.

That's fine.

That's fine.

Because I was going to challenge you to keep on, you know, getting the...

I mean, I got a movie in my mind.

Tell me what movie, Ken.

What is that movie?

Describe it.

It's Matt Damon and Goodwill Hunting.

Thank you.

You know, I got a hustler in my mind.

Thank you.

This is what happens when you throw an alley oop to somebody who can dunk it.

She just comes in.

Broke the broken.

She just ripped the rim off.

Love that.

But that's what I'm talking about.

I'm talking about

blue-collar attitude.

I'm going to work my way through this.

And I was hoping that you could make some money and pay off some of that $49,000 while we're doing it.

And so we got a little grease under our fingernails.

That's the price of admission.

So chin up, new mindset that Jade gave you, and decide today, I'm going to finish this and make it a new race.

I'm going to race against the societal norm.

Come on, Quinn.

We believe in you, man, so go do it.

Statistics show that half of Americans don't have enough life insurance, or they don't have any at all.

I don't understand this, John.

Why don't people want to take care of their family?

They think they're going to die or something?

Well, I used to be one of those guys.

I didn't even think about it.

And one of my buddies said, hey, the only reason to not have life insurance is if you hate your wife and kids.

And I immediately went and got term life insurance.

That's a gut punch.

And oh, you're telling me, and for decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse.

They've lost somebody important to them.

Me too.

They don't know what to do next.

Me too.

I mean, I mean, you're going to have a crisis here.

And, you know, you've got two options while you're sitting and talking to a young widow.

She's concerned about how she's going to invest all this money properly and not mess this up, or she's concerned how she's going to eat tomorrow.

That's exactly.

These are the two options.

And turn care of your dadgum family, man.

Term life insurance can replace income, pay off debts, cover funeral expenses, so your family can actually have the opportunity to just be sad.

Yeah.

To just miss you.

That's exactly what it's supposed to be.

It's saying I love you to your family.

Term life insurance.

Jeff Zander and the team at Zander Insurance makes it easy and affordable.

I've used them personally for 25 years.

They're the only people I trust.

Go to Zander.com or call 800-356-4282.

Hey folks, buying or selling your home is a really big deal.

And with all the clickbait headlines and conflicting data out there, it's hard to know what's happening in the housing market.

And we want to make the latest trends easy to understand.

To give you an example, median home prices stayed steady last month at about $439,000.

The number of homes for sale hit $1 million for the third month in a row.

So buyers have more options and more negotiating power while sellers are the ones facing a little bit more competition.

The average 15-year fixed rate dipped a bit to 5.86%

last month.

So if you're debt-free and have a fully funded emergency fund and a solid down payment, now is, in fact, a great time to buy or sell your home.

If you'd like to learn more about the housing market trends and get free tools to help you buy or sell with confidence, go to ramseysolutions.com slash market.

That's ramseysolutions.com slash market.

Or you can click the link in the show notes if you are listening via podcast and YouTube.

Paul is up in Washington.

Paul, how can we help?

Hey, guys, thanks for taking the call.

Sure.

About five months ago, my wife and I took FPU, and we've been working on baby step two.

So about two years ago, I took out a $100,000 HELOC against our primary residence in order to make down payments on three different rental houses.

It was an idea to, you know, for a retirement plan was to try to accumulate a bunch of rental houses.

We're seeing problems with that.

They've not been cash flowing well.

One of them, especially, that one's for sale right now.

Good.

When it sells, we're going to pay off.

We have about $17,000 in

like between a car loan and credit cards.

We're going to pay that off.

And then we're also going to, I was thinking it would be wise to have a six-month emergency fund for the rental houses to cover their mortgages in case the rental income doesn't.

How many rental houses are there?

Currently, there's three, but one of them is for sale.

We close on it next week.

But none of them are cash flowing positively on a consistent basis, correct?

Not consistently, no.

Do you have equity in all three?

Yes.

Okay.

We have, okay.

Let me address something before the call gets going too further.

We're going to tell you what to do, but I want to go and address something you just kind of said.

The emergency fund, the six-month emergency fund, is not there to cover the rent,

the rental income on these homes.

That's not what the emergency fund is for.

It's for actual emergencies that affect your life, that are your expenses, your income, your bills.

We want to cover your expenses.

It's for your personal expenses, not for your rental homes.

Okay.

So that's

a non-starter for that.

That's right.

Okay.

Ken, I'm glad you clarified that because that is so important.

What it sounds like is you could benefit from some simplification here.

Am I is that fair?

It is fair.

Okay, that's question one.

That's question one.

So that you said that was fair.

Question two would be, like you said, these

properties aren't making you any money, right?

Right.

So my,

since they're not making money and since you could benefit from some simplicity, I would recommend selling them since they're all worth more.

And you could actually make some cash on these things, get out of these $100,000 of HELOCs and obviously, you know, clear all your other personal debt and kind of start this idea over from scratch and just build it the right way.

Because

if you do that and you're able to use some of this money, because I mean, we could go through it if you want.

If you were to sell all three, what would you end up with after fees and everything?

I think of selling all three, I think we would clear the $100,000 HELOC

and the 17K in debt.

I think that is about it.

And then you'd be at zero debt.

Okay.

And we would be at zero debt except for our primary residence.

Tell him what he's won, Jay.

Well, you've won peace.

And now you've won the ability to focus in on your security, which is your primary residence.

What do you owe on that?

Shoot, Shoot, 100 and no, what are we at on that?

I'm sorry, I'm not prepared for that.

That's okay.

Around 100 and a half, something around there.

160.

Okay, 160.

And then what's you guys's income without the, I mean, your properties weren't making anything, but what's your income?

After like take home, I think we're at about 110.

Okay.

So with that income and with what you owe on the mortgage, I mean, with a little intensity or with just being intentional, you could clear your own mortgage out if you wanted to very, very quickly.

And then now you can start this real estate dream if you even wanted to.

Like this might have been your last, I don't know, maybe you're sick of it at this point, but now you could go back in and say, okay, next time we do this, we're going to do it for cash.

We're going to move a lot slower.

And we're going to make sure that no matter what, we're not putting ourselves in a risky spot and we're going to be making money on whatever we do.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's.

That's been the gist of how we've been feeling.

I just,

it was hard to let go of the idea that, you know, down the line, we would have all this rental income.

But

I'm afraid we won't even make it there.

Not now, but to Jade's point, if you clear all this and now you go about it the right way,

you still have time.

How old are you?

44.

And what do you have in retirement?

About 30K.

Okay, so we got to build that.

Yeah.

I am not thinking about houses.

Let me tell you why.

Just to kind of, if I was in your shoes, this may help your your stomach and your heart sell these three homes.

Here's why.

Okay, the three homes, let's say that you guys were cash flow positive, which you're not on these things.

But let's just say, you know, because we hear this call all the time, and somebody will say, Well, we're clearing, we're clearing about six to eight hundred dollars a month on these things, or let's go to a thousand.

Let's do a round number.

Okay, we got a thousand dollars a month, free and clear.

All right,

that's twelve thousand dollars a year, okay?

Yeah, that doesn't include expenses, right?

That home repairs.

$12,000.

I would rather be investing in the investment strategy that Ramsey teaches than I would be fiddling around with houses, especially in your shoes.

You're not what I would call completely behind the eight ball.

You're a little bit behind at your age with only $30,000, but the baby steps is the play for you.

So

you get this debt out of the way by selling these houses, and now we attack baby step three, go to three to six months of your expenses.

And then we think, all right, now we're all baby step four in the sense of we're now 15%

fully funded retirement accounts.

And let's see what happens above and beyond that.

But I just think for a lot of people, the rental house income, it just looks and smells and sounds way better than it actually is.

It's a lot of work.

A lot of work for $12,000?

It will never be me, Ken.

It's too much.

I'm I'm not doing it.

Yeah, I know.

On the other hand, I look at my little dashboard every month and I go, oh, look what the stock market did today.

That's true, Penny.

That's the true power.

I made money and I was snoring.

You know?

There's like, I got a guy in the audience thumbs up to me, and he's a, you're, you're a fellow snorer, but we're making money while we snore, bro.

Yes, sir.

Like, that's the play.

Yeah, everybody, everybody talks about real estate like it's some form of passive income.

It's so not passive.

But I think, I mean, I don't know what your wife wife says about this.

You guys have to go home and talk about it.

But I think to solve for the two things that you said, which is, hey, it's fair to say I could benefit from some simplicity.

And the truth is these things aren't making me any money anyway.

But you are losing, you know, your peace over them.

So your blood pressure is going to drop.

Yeah.

You're going to sleep better.

The baby steps is the plan for you, Paul.

It's not too late.

But I would say at 41,

this is the time to make this move.

And let me just be fair.

Let me, because somebody's listening and going, gosh, you know, anytime somebody calls in with real estate, you guys tell them to sell it.

That's not necessarily true.

I agree.

If he had called in and said, hey, I've got these three properties, they're killing it, you know, banging, I would have maybe suggested selling one possibly to clear some debt.

And I would have said, yeah, keep the others.

Here's the plan to pay them off.

Like there is a time where somebody calls in and they've gone and done what they're going to do.

That's right.

And it's not always about telling them to, you know, fold everything and start from scratch.

That's right.

So just

actually, it's a great point.

It depends on a person's financial position.

I know some of you are going, well, Ken,

okay, my little rant about the $12,000, that's okay if you're no debt

and your retirement's great.

And this is something we're going, we're trying to pay this off as quick as we can.

Yeah, right.

And now we're not doing it for the $12,000 a year.

We're doing this for a house that, you know, is going to be worth $400,000 and we're going to pay it off in a year.

Now, that's real money.

Right.

That's $400,000 cash that I could unload.

That's the idea.

So we're not anti-real estate.

It's just, does it fit the baby steps?

Does it fit your financial situation?

That's the question.

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Mary is up now in Boston, Massachusetts.

Mary, how can we help?

Hi, yeah.

I really would like to retire, but I'm very nervous about it.

I'm not sure I can afford it.

Okay, give us some numbers so we can figure this out with you.

Okay, well, I'm still working.

I work full-time.

I'm 71.

What is your income?

It's about $100,000.

Great.

What do you do?

I'm sorry.

What do you do for a living?

Sales.

What are you selling?

Electrical supplies.

Nice.

Wow.

For you.

I'm just curious because this is awesome.

I think you're like, you're the hero of today's show.

That is so fantastic.

Still be crushing it.

Is it straight commission or is it a base plus commission?

Salary.

Straight

salary.

Okay, wow.

Great for you.

Okay.

All right.

So walk us through

what you have.

What do you have?

Well, I have about a million and a half in a 401k.

Okay.

I have about a million and a half in stocks,

probably a little more than than that.

Mary, I've got great news.

This is breaking news.

It's coming in my right ear right now.

I'm getting this fresh from James.

It's right here, breaking news.

He says you're fine, Mary.

I mean, I have $3 million.

I was getting out my calculator like we were going to have real work to do.

I was nervous for it.

There's a lot of expenses, though.

What are your expenses?

Okay, yeah, let's hear it.

Well, I have two houses, two cars.

I mean, they're paid for, but

they're not going to have taxes, insurance.

Mary, you only need one car, so sell the other car, but it's not costing you.

Well, they're in different states.

Okay, well, why are they different states?

You got two homes in two states.

Yes.

Are the homes paid for?

Yes.

What are the states?

Is one your wintering home and one is your summering home?

Yes.

Okay.

Mary, America is about to get mad at you.

You are truly living the dream, Mary.

We're having a little bit of fun, but in all honesty, you're in great shape.

You have two paid-for homes.

You have two paid-for cars.

What are these expenses that you said you have that are so, so high that $3 million, as it continues to grow, is not going to be enough for you?

What are we missing?

Well,

I don't know.

It's about $45,000 a year, the expenses for insurance, and that's without any emergencies.

So insurances on all your assets.

I don't get any attention.

But my guess is you're going to have a pretty nice Social Security benefit, is my guess.

And you'll draw from your account

$4,400.

Sweetheart, how much does it take for you to live every month?

Because I know you know the answer to this, Mary.

What is your top-line expense for everything, all in?

Food, gas, clothing, everything.

Well, it's about,

I don't know.

Oh, come on.

You don't have a mortgage.

It's just you.

You're not married, right?

What do you need to live?

Take an educated guess of what you need every month to live comfortably.

How much money?

Probably about $4,000.

$4,000.

Okay.

You're going to have a Social Security payment of $4,400, so we've got that.

And then you've got $3 million that is continuing to grow.

Jade, I don't think I'm getting through to Mary.

She's in great shape.

You're in great shape.

In the words of Ken Coleman, this is a nothing burger.

This is a nothing burger.

Yeah.

Nothing there.

This has got ketchup, mustard, pickle, lettuce, the whole, it's the works.

You are great, Mary.

Great job.

Do you know how many people,

how many people who are in their 20s wish they had a job that paid them $100,000?

They would chew their right leg off on camera to have your portfolio.

Yeah, you're doing so well.

But I'm going to lose that.

Why?

When I retire.

That's fine.

What are you losing?

You will lose the job.

No, no, no, you won't.

You won't.

You will lose the job because you will choose, hey, I don't want to work anymore.

Then you can look over to any of these retirement accounts and say, I'd like to make $100,000 a year, please.

And they're going to go, okay.

And you can afford that.

By the way, you got that.

You could pull it.

How long would that actually last

your whole life?

Because you're not touching.

Let's, okay, let's teach for a minute because I want to make sure you understand this.

So if you have this money invested the way it sounds like you do, you should be making on average annualized rate of return.

You should be somewhere around the 9%, 10% mark.

Okay.

That is when you take all the years that you've had it invested and average those rates of return.

It should be around 10%.

Okay.

So that means let's just take a round number like, I don't know, $1 million.

If you've been making 10% on that,

What is 10%?

$100,000.

Does that make sense?

So you should be able to live off the interest alone without touching the nest egg.

Does that make sense?

If it doesn't, I'll explain it another time.

Well, let's use real numbers.

You've got a total of, you've got over $3 million in retirement accounts.

That's what you told us.

Right.

And I do have some CDs and cash.

I'm sure you do.

Well, listen, none of this is a surprise.

I think you got more money buried in your backyard than most people make in a year.

I think there's probably that level.

Sometimes I do bury it in the backyard.

I know you do.

The point, Mary, is

these things.

If you really lived off of 10%, you could take a $300,000 site, you know, salary.

Well, that's exactly right.

There's, we, we, we would account for inflation and we would account for, you know, I don't know if this is in Roth or what it's in.

So there are some things to consider here, but none of it.

None of those details are going to drain your nest eggs.

None of those details are going to cause you to be even close to broke.

Okay.

I, I would go on, I would stand on business today and say, if you retired today and took your same salary, you would be fine.

Now, if you don't believe me, that's okay.

I would encourage you to get with a smart vestor and let them show you this.

But here's what we haven't discussed yet, Mary.

Okay.

Yeah.

The 3 million you have right now, just the 3 million.

You got more than 3 million, but at this point, there's no need to get into it.

I'm getting closer to four.

Oh, sure, of course.

Let's just say three for a moment, okay?

Based on what Jade told you earlier with the historical return of the stock market that Jade laid out, you realize that you're a young and vibrant 71.

Seven years from now at 78, Jade, you want to tell her what that 3 million is going to be worth?

Yeah, so we call it like a rule of seven.

A lump sum generally at a rate, the right rate of return will double every seven years.

So that means

you got $6 million.

Yeah.

And the truth is you got four.

So let's just have some fun, Mary.

So $8 million.

$8 million at $78.

I mean,

this is you and your fried green tomatoes annual trip.

We're blowing it in Barbados.

We're having a blast.

Like, you are way

ahead of the game.

You should be, what you should have done was called Ken and I to invite us to your retirement celebration.

I will MC it, and Jade will sing.

It's a combo.

It's a great.

And all we ask for is four-star accommodations and travel expenses.

That's all we ask for, Mary.

That's right.

That's right.

No, Mary, we're having fun.

It hasn't been that great, great, though.

What?

That it's going to double in seven years.

No, Mary, this is, you can actually go, you can Google this one.

Yeah, this is real mom.

You can really Google this.

Check us on this.

This is the historical path of the stock market over this entire time.

Since its inception, okay.

This is a rate of return that you can expect.

But even if you didn't get the 9% to 10% that Jade, all right, let's go conservative.

Okay, yeah.

Let's go 6%.

Run your numbers on 6%.

And here's what we really want you to do.

Do you have somebody that manages your money, a licensed professional?

No, I do it on my own.

Oh, my gosh, Mary.

You are such a rockstar.

I mean, the superlatives, I can't summon enough.

Okay, here's what I want you to do.

I don't want to get on Mary's bad side.

We're going to put you on hold.

And Kelly is amazing.

And Kelly, let's make sure she gets to the Smart Investor Pro section of our website at ramseysolutions.com.

And I want you, Kelly, I'll walk you through this, but I want you to interview three or four or five in your area.

And And Mary, I know you got a gut.

And go with your gut on the one you trust the most and help let them tell you what they think your portfolio is going to turn into and where you are.

And then, if you choose to have them work with you, great.

But trust me, these folks are affiliated with us in the sense that they believe what we believe and they'll back what Jay and I are saying up and show you real numbers.

So thank you for calling.

And can we just slow

the whole audience is clapping for more.

This is what we do.

This is why we do it.

Mary, you're the poster child.

You won.

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This is the Ramsey Show where America hangs out to talk about their money, their work, and their relationships.

And we're so glad you've joined us.

I'm Kim Coleman.

The incomparably fabulous Jade Warshaw joins me.

The phone number is 888-825-5225.

Mike is up in Illinois.

Mike, how can we help today?

Hi, good morning.

So just had a question for you guys.

We

are new to you guys' program, and I'm talking really new, like maybe three, four or four days.

Welcome aboard, sir.

Yeah, we don't we don't really have a lot, and I'm not even going to say like this is even overwhelming for us because it's it's truly not.

We're in a pretty good spot, I feel.

All right.

we're about 150 a year um between the two of us and we we got about 45 000 in our cars 57 000 on our house we got really lucky on our house so yeah so we're good um we do have some credit card about um between seven and ten and we got some medical about four

um but we did some home improvement um

and we took out borrowed against ourself we took the advice of uh somebody else um and borrowed against our 401k.

So we have

about 25,000.

You're going to love the tax on that, pal.

Yeah, I know.

That's going to feel great.

We do have it paid down

to maybe 20-ish, I'm guessing.

So

we're just at a 401k loan.

We're paying that back.

But my question was, is because

we want to tackle all this pretty aggressive, you know, following the program.

Should we take the hit on the 401k,

get rid of that big monthly that we have there,

and then apply that $1,000 a month towards

paying everything else off more aggressive?

And then put the money back, and then put the money back quickly.

You know what I mean?

It just seems like

the way we've been kind of running the numbers is if we were to take away from, use that money from the 401k, the monthly part of it, we would be able to go really aggressive and really pay this down because we're super excited to get towards the finance, the investing part.

Are you familiar with our debt snowball?

I know you're three or four days in, so that's why I'm asking.

Are you familiar with the debt snowball?

Yeah, you know, and I think

so familiar with the Ramsey name, just didn't really know how we.

That's fine.

So, Jade, let Jade coach you through what exactly we would do if we were in your shoes.

Yeah, I'm going to simplify this for you because

I'm going to go back and kind of assess.

Can I just take a moment and go back and assess?

Do another diagnostic.

Yeah, because

then it will help us be in the right mindset to talk about the solution.

The problem is, you know, you make a really great income, you and your wife combined.

And the sad part about this is you didn't realize it.

And so you let people trick you into thinking you needed to use debt to do all of the things that honestly you could have done with your income because it's so great.

And the fact that your mortgage is only $57,000.

And so I kind of want you to get your head around the fact that your income and your money is real money.

And it's better than borrowed money.

And somewhere in your brain, you started thinking that borrowed money was better than your actual money.

And I really want you to spend some time thinking about that because I never want you to be here again.

again.

And

just not to interrupt you there real quick, but the only thing that kind of put us in that is I guess I didn't say in the beginning is I went through a divorce 10 years ago.

So I did have child support.

That was pretty, a lot of child support, which is pretty substantial.

Not complaining about it.

You know, me or my kids.

But that did play a huge part in us,

you know, financially.

Sure, it played a huge part, but it didn't make you take out debt.

You still chose to do that.

So 100%.

I just want you to go forward from today going, you know what, like my dollars are better than borrowed dollars.

And yeah, to Ken's point,

let's walk this thing out because if you have something like a 401k loan, if you owe money to the IRS, that business is jumping to the top of the list.

So typically what we would tell people to do is list your debt smallest to largest, but there are a couple of exceptions.

And like I said, owing money to the federal government is one of them.

And having something like a HELOC is, or I'm sorry, having something like a 401k loan is one of them because the implications around that are very, very big.

And so for this, for this, I would say to you, like,

you got to understand.

Every minute that you don't pay this back is a interest that you're missing out on.

Every moment that you don't pay this back means if something happens and your job is on the line, it's going to become paid due in full 12 months after you were let go.

So there's a lot here around that.

So I would, I would get in full gear on this and start getting it knocked out.

Now, the good news is you've got 150K of income, but are you guys on a budget?

Yeah, so

we kind of use a calendar system.

We kind of write everything out on due dates and everything on our calendar.

Good.

My wife's, she's pretty on top of it.

So we do know exactly what's due, when, where,

and we pay weeks ahead.

Good.

So So, how much are you guys putting extra on debt every single month?

Not a whole lot.

Why?

You don't have hardly a mortgage and you make this great income.

What are those?

Yeah, I wonder what those two cars are.

Yeah, I think the car payments are pretty high.

What are they?

We got one that's $600 and some change-ish, and then another one that's

for something, I believe.

Listen,

it's not as bad as as it could be.

That's not what's taking your income.

What's taking your income is you guys aren't, you're not on a budget.

You're still spending a lot of money in a lot of areas.

It's not the 4,000 of medical debt.

It's not the, because I can guess what the 10,000 of credit cards payment is.

It's you guys are living like 150,000 is the be-all end-all.

And I think that's what it is.

And I'm sure you're still contributing to retirement.

Am I right?

Oh, yeah, 100%.

Yeah.

I'm doing the match, and then I'm doing just the match right now.

And then my wife's doing 10%.

So let Ken and I give you a rundown because you did say you're brand new to the baby steps.

So let's just dial it in.

And from here, you're going to get to choose.

Do you want to do it?

Do you want to not do it?

And that's your choice to make with you and your wife later.

So what we would say is baby step one.

When you're in your situation, baby step one is, hey, I just, I need to go down to $1,000 saved.

If I can just keep $1,000 aside, that's my, you know, quick rainy day fund.

But every other money needs to go to baby step two, which is paying off all the debt.

And I told you before, it's list from smallest to largest with the two exceptions, and then we're there.

But part of baby step two says, hey, I need all of my income at its fullest power.

So that means I am not dwindling my income on, you know, investing right now.

I'm not putting too much into my withholding right now.

I'm putting just enough because I don't want that tax refund.

I want that money in my pocket every month.

So those are quick ways to make sure we have all the money.

And a lot of people don't like when we say pause investing, Ken, because they feel like they're missing out on time.

And they are missing out on time.

But the thought process of that is if I have, Ken, if I have a bucket of water, if I have a pitcher of water here and I have, I don't know, you have one, two, three, four, four or five different glasses of debt.

If I put a drop in each one, it's going to take me forever to fill up those glasses.

But if I just take all the income in my pitcher and pour it on one, I'm going to fill up that glass very quickly and it's going to be gone.

Okay, so that's why this works that way, Casey.

And then we can go on to steps three and four and on down the list later.

But right now, one and two is big.

And something tells me he might have some savings somewhere that he needs to tap into.

And I'd even, we're running out of time, but I would tell you that look at those cars.

If there's enough equity in those cars, you could go to a clunker.

Let's see if we can get that $1,000 as well.

So that's what we're doing here.

Thanks for listening.

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All right, Casey is joining us now in Wyoming.

Casey, how can we help?

Hey, thanks for taking my call.

I'm trying to get some input or advice on,

I started

building a home on a property that I own,

and I'm getting to the point where it's getting difficult to continue cash flowing it, and I'm debating on

just continuing down that path of cash flowing it or if I should take out a construction loan for what I need to do to finish it.

How much more do you need to finish?

Probably $100,000 to

finish out where I'm at.

So $100,000 is what you need to either cash flow, which is going to take you longer.

or your idea of a construction loan gets it to you and you can finish this house by what time?

If I took the loan out, I could probably finish it, I would think next spring.

I mean, we're heading into where I'm doing all this, all the work myself physically.

And so if you cash flow it, how long will it estimate to take?

So

probably

another two years.

And that's kind of where the

where the difficulty is.

I get it.

And I'm digging a little bit here to get full perspective.

So is this your dream home?

And you guys are already in a home that you can easily afford?

What I'm trying to figure out here is: is there financial pressure to finish this house?

Like, what is the status of this house?

So,

I bought the acreage, it's 40 acres, and I bought the acreage four and a half years ago with the plan of just moving out there and building the house over a couple of year period.

And then some things in life changed, and most of the money that I had saved up for the project

went away.

Okay, so the plan was to live out there on the 40 acres in some type of a temporary situation.

And that's where I am now.

I'm in an old, it's an old single-wide trailer on the property.

So

I'm building, you know, right next door to where I'm at.

Okay.

But it's just me and my two kids and

that little trailer.

So,

yeah, it's just getting to the point where a couple I've been doing it for three years and a couple more years.

Yeah, so essentially, the only so this would be like taking out a mortgage of 100 grand is what I'm hearing.

Right, plus I do owe some on the land itself.

I didn't buy the land out there.

What do you owe on the land?

I owe 130 on the land.

Okay, so if you were so if I'm in your shoes, I'm going to I'm assuming you know the numbers, but what do we what's our what will be our combined I'm going to call this a combined house payment.

That's what I'm looking at here because the land and the home what would be that combined mortgage payment

well it's it'd be a

a 15-year

rate on 250,000 give or take right and can you afford that at 25%

of your take-home pay

yeah I don't I don't think the payment is is that big a deal

not I don't think no is it underneath our 25% threshold so 25%

right

right at Okay.

Then I don't have an issue with this because

it's like buying a home.

And I don't think living in this trailer with the two kids is sustainable for much longer.

So yeah,

this is not what we would consider an irresponsible home purchase.

That's essentially, you're doing it a different way, but it's the same idea.

Am I right, Jay?

I want to make sure I'm

right on.

I guess there's,

well, because I am not a contractor, I can't qualify for, I would need to hire a general contractor and get somebody else involved in my business to

they won't loan,

and it makes sense.

They're not going to loan somebody that's just building a house.

No, of course.

I get it.

I totally know what he's ahead.

So you bring a general contractor.

Sure.

Of course.

What's your problem with that?

You don't want a general contractor?

Is that the biggest problem?

You want to do this all your own?

Is that the biggest thing?

I mean, that's a big thing.

And also, I mean, there's, I guess there's a pride component of it where I had a plan to cash flow building.

I had a plan to dunk a basketball in a game when I was in high school.

And it turns out I'm 5'9 and couldn't jump.

So I had to deal with it and become a past first point guard.

Life throws you things.

No, I'm just being honest.

No, no, no.

You're a bad person.

It's a lot of pride.

I don't care that you want to finish it yourself.

Well, I do because here's the thing.

You do?

I do because

there's that.

Because the financial side of it, there's not a wrong answer.

If you want to cash flow, cash flow.

If you want to get the mortgage, get the mortgage.

There's not a wrong one.

Cash is better.

But for a time, we would have said, yeah, go ahead and get the mortgage.

But then you turn around and said, well, here's the thing.

I want to build this thing.

I don't want to hire a general contractor.

So now we're talking about other things.

We're talking about values.

And so if you say to me, you have to then decide, what's it worth to me to have the timeline?

Do I want to sacrifice timeline to have the values I want?

Or do I want the values at the sake of the timeline?

That's really what it sounds like this conversation.

I hate my kids and hate my life all to keep my pride intact.

I mean, that's the thing.

Yeah.

The kids don't really get a vote in it.

I'm not talking about the kids.

You hate the kids.

I'm talking about you, brother.

You're the one that's on the phone, and you're the one that talks about everybody heard it on your voice.

I'm with you 100%.

The kids don't get a vote at all.

I don't care what your kids think.

I'm with you on that.

But I think you're the one going, I don't think I can stay in this trailer with you.

How old are they?

Am I right or am I wrong?

The kids are six and eight.

So you didn't answer me.

But they're not going to know if it's two days.

Yeah, they don't care.

They're not really going to decide.

All right, let me come at this a different way.

Can you live with these kids in this trailer for two more years?

Well, you can do anything.

I mean, my that's what I said.

You just have to have kids in a little two-bedroom house.

That's what I'm saying.

You have to decide.

Only you can decide.

Because Ken will say, hey, if it were Ken Coleman, he would say, I'm taking the loan.

Well, if it were me, I'd never even be in a trailer on 40 acres.

I don't like to sleep on anything less than 700 thread count.

And if it, you know, I'm not an outdoorsy sleep guy.

All right.

I'll be outdoors and then we take a shower and we stay in a nice room.

But

here's what I'm getting at.

This is up to you.

I just walked you into it and you went, well, I can do anything for two years.

Well, then there's your answer.

Yeah, I think you just want to cash it.

If, to Jade's point, your pride is like in building this thing yourself.

and it's really important to you i'm not going to poo-poo that right i said swallow it and get the house done But that's when I thought you were angst about staying in this trailer.

If you're going, I can stay in the trailer, I can do anything, Ken, for two years, then I think that's your answer.

So you build it yourself, and then you

and then you take two years, and the kids are six and eight, they don't know.

You know, get a pup tent in the backyard when the weather's nice in Wyoming, the kids can sleep outside.

You know, do whatever you want.

It's your 40 acres.

I was trying to like say,

I hear you.

It's okay for you to take out a loan, but this is before you threw threw the

it's important to me to build it myself.

Yeah, again, it's not paying process.

I can't even process.

I can barely put gas in my car.

Do you have tools?

Do you have any tools?

I do, but it's limited to the socket wrenches.

I got a cool little set of those L wrenches.

Wait, no, that's the stuff that comes.

I do have a, I got one of those little battery-powered drills that has a Phillips head and then a normal.

But I hire other people.

It's called a flathead.

What is it?

Flathead.

See?

No, that's all I know.

I'm just making that up.

That's all I know.

I don't know what to do.

I'm going to say hire a contractor.

Yes.

Because I got nightmares in my mind of you building this house.

But, you know, look, man,

you're a man.

You live in Wyoming on 48.

Right.

Okay.

This is something that's.

This is a different.

This is a different paradigm for me.

I go to Wyoming in a postcard.

Yes.

I go, oh,

that's nice.

I go to Wyoming when I watch.

What was that, Kevin Costner show?

I don't know.

What was the show that was big?

A show?

Remember?

Oh, Yellowstone.

Yeah.

That's the only time I go.

Yeah, oh, yeah.

No, I love that.

But see,

I'm in my living room with a nice blanket, you know, hot cup of tea.

Kevin Costner's roughing it.

He's cold.

And you're like, ooh, look at him.

I'm like, ooh.

It will never be.

I get a little shiver, and I tell Stacey to turn the heat up.

One of my favorite things about you is when you told me about your robe and and how comfortable your robe was.

My robe is next level.

It goes all the way to the ankles.

Restoration hardware, super plush.

It's great, folks.

It's like wearing a snuggie, but you have freedom.

Yeah, and

arms and legs.

Yes.

It's a great robe.

I think every woman should buy my robe for their man in their life.

So restoration hardware.

Robes over tools.

Robes over tools.

Which one are you going to use more?

It's pretty easy.

I'm using my robe.

365.

Hey, if you're tired of living paycheck to paycheck and feeling like you can't get ahead, you need to join one of our free Every Dollar trainings.

We've got one every week this month, and they're all hosted by one of our Ramsey personalities.

What are we doing?

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You get to ask questions during a live QA.

You can sign up for free at ramseysolutions.com/slash webinar, ramseysolutions.com/slash webinar.

Esther joins us now in South Carolina.

Esther, how can we help?

Hello.

Thank you for taking my call.

I'm just trying to

figure out a game plan.

I'm thinking about leaving my husband.

I don't work.

We have two kids.

And being a single mom

is potentially in the future for me.

I'm just trying to figure out how I'm meant to navigate this.

Okay.

Okay.

You're not working.

You're thinking of leaving your husband.

Tell us more about that part.

Is there danger?

I wouldn't say there's imminent danger.

We've had a domestic violence issue before.

It's when I was pregnant with my first.

My first is going to be two.

in a couple of weeks and I literally just had a newborn on Saturday.

On Saturday?

On Saturday, Saturday, yeah.

Oh my gosh.

Okay.

And

I moved from the UK about three years ago.

We've been married for about four years and I've only worked like short stretches of time since being here.

I'm in the medical field.

I'm a medical professional, but just with having the babies and the exams, I haven't had like the time to just physically just do my exams to be a pharmacist over here.

So I haven't been

working how much time and how much money would it take to get those exams done and essentially become qualified or current

there's one exam that happens

every October over here maybe about 3,000 I've literally only got about 700 in savings

but I just don't

My dad was abusive.

It's something I work on for sure, but I don't know whether to call this abusive just just because

I'm sorry just because I'm not getting beat down 24 7

of course of course hey

I need to figure out something

okay first off yeah you're right

domestic violence doesn't mean you're getting beat down 24 7 it can be

it doesn't have to be to that extreme um to be domestic violence okay um

i want to know what's going on because when i asked asked you earlier, you said not imminent, but then you went on to say that,

you know, when you were pregnant, there was an incident, which to me is pretty crazy.

But I just want to validate to you that any behavior that is in, they're attempting to intimidate you, they're

attempting to isolate you, frighten you, terrorize you, threaten you, hurt you,

like any of that, even if it's just a threat, okay, that's not normal and you shouldn't be in that

environment, especially with babies.

But even without, you shouldn't, you, you, you don't tolerate that more than once.

Do you have anywhere you can go before, like, let's forget about the legal separation or divorce piece.

Let's just say if, if you're going to take some of these steps before we talk about the finance stuff, do you have friends, family in the area that you could flee to and be safe with?

I mean, I've got the only family I've got are the in-laws.

It can be a bit difficult because of the first incident.

Well, yeah.

I don't know whether it's a cultural thing.

I got a lot of the blame for it.

Yeah, you can't.

No, no, they don't.

No, I can just tell you right now, they're not part of it.

So the answer is you don't have anybody.

What about a church?

Have you gone to church?

Have you visited any churches in the area?

I've got a church.

Again,

they were aware of the first situation.

That's fine.

They were a bit fitting this.

So I haven't, after the first situation happened, I just kind of kept myself to myself and kind of, you know,

been safe in the way I've reacted to things.

I don't get myself into a predicament.

Yeah, but I don't like that you're feeling like you're the one getting yourself into the predicament.

It's not you, it's him.

And I want you to, when you get off this call, A, I want you to call the hotline for domestic violence and domestic abuse.

I think you need to call and talk to someone because I understand if you don't want to share with us what's exactly going on, but you need to share with someone that's going to be able to advise you.

And I'd be looking into shelters in the area because what it sounds like is

he sounds volatile to me.

And it sounds like you can't, is that right?

Yes.

Okay.

Yes, he definitely is.

Okay.

Yeah.

I'm sorry.

And you, you're not in any position.

to be able you never were but now with a newborn on saturday you can't defend yourself from this person and they clearly don't care if you were pregnant if you have a newborn on your hip so you have to go someplace else and i hate that for you because you're supposed to be able to have a newborn and come home to a safe environment and i'm so sorry that that's not the case

okay i'm so sorry here's the thing you get you you call the number you find a shelter And then you get to a safe place.

Then your brain can kind of open up a little bit because you're safe.

We're going to make sure to put you in contact with a financial coach, and we're going to make sure that they talk with you, help you figure out what's next.

Do you have, yeah, and speaking of what's next, I do want to try to give you, and Jade's right, getting you safe and allowing your brain to slow down and function to its best is huge.

But you did call and say, How do I financially prepare for this?

And

if I were in your shoes

i would be asking friends or family in the uk that's where your base has been yeah

and i personally would have zero pride issues with asking for three thousand dollars because if three thousand dollars was what i needed to become a pharmacist in the united states where you can make really good money have fabulous benefits for those littles i would be i'd have no problem asking for three thousand dollars and i wouldn't say borrow i didn't i didn't say borrow

it.

We don't ask, we don't borrow.

So I want to make sure because I can hear the people going, oh, no, I didn't say borrow it.

I'm saying in your situation,

I would be very comfortable going to family and friends going, I am in a desperate situation, and I do not want to borrow this money.

If you could find, you know, can you...

Do you have people in the UK?

Real friends?

All of my family's family.

Well, I believe we could scrape $3,000 together out of family who love you

for the sole purpose, okay, in this situation, when it's right,

to finish out this qualification, get a current on

your stuff.

And that's not too much to ask.

And don't borrow it.

This is, you're going to ask people.

I need you to help me.

I have a very specific need.

By the way, a really good church would step up in that situation as well.

It would.

And so, because this gives you freedom.

I'm just wondering if you don't, I mean, I think what Ken said is a great place to start.

I'm just going to tag on to that list.

Is it better for you to go back to the UK temporarily to be around supporting people?

Can you take the kids to the UK?

Or is there some type of

this is outside of my legal normal?

That's true.

That's true.

I don't want to.

I don't.

I'm a little nervous with that.

Yeah, that's a good point.

You hear what I mean?

Yeah.

Now, it makes complete common sense.

Yeah.

I just don't know legally.

No, you're right.

I think that's a dangerous situation and I would not do that.

Okay, yeah, bad plan.

Given that she's not a U.S.

citizen, so you don't want to complicate things.

But I think

safe first,

okay, safe.

Then we work on stability,

whatever that looks like short-term.

That means if you're working at a Walmart, you know, and there's an old lady in the church who are willing to watch the kids.

I mean, because you got a challenge with childcare, which is very expensive.

So we got to get safe.

We got to get stable.

But I'm trying to encourage you that you becoming a pharmacist as quickly as you can.

It's going to set you free.

And getting hired is going to be a game changer.

You can, mama, you can take care of those babies on a pharmacist's salary and you'll be fine.

Just promise us you'll leave that environment.

Promise us you won't go to the in-laws because they're not for you.

That's right.

And he's there.

Yeah.

Right.

And just call us anytime, Esther.

Truly.

Anytime.

Don't lose lose contact with us because we want to follow you.

Hang on the line.

Kelly's amazing.

She's going to get you plugged in where we can plug you in.

So hang on.

All right, today's Ramsey Show question of the day brought to you by YReFi.

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Okay, today's question comes from Sydney in Colorado.

She says, my husband and I are relatively new to the baby steps, and I wonder if it's normal to find it hard to transition from using credit cards and thinking you have all this extra money to not using credit cards and realizing you don't have as much money as you thought you had left over every month.

If it is normal, does that feeling quickly go away or am I just going to be uncomfortable for the next few years?

Oh my gosh, what a great question, Ken.

Actually, really good.

You know, I think that, Sydney, what you're feeling is completely normal because the truth is, yeah, when you're on a credit card, it is a safety blanket, right?

It is, it's a crutch.

And what happens when you have a crutch, Ken?

You know this.

If you wear, lean on it.

You lean on it.

If you wear a cast for too long, if you sit in a chair for too long, the muscles, they atrophy.

You know what I'm saying?

And before you know it, doing things that should be normal range of motion, normal things become more difficult because you have atrophied that muscle.

So it's the same thing with your money.

It is a skill and a

learned skill to be able to manage your money, the actual money that comes home in your check.

And when you lean on credit cards, you can be willy-nilly, right?

You don't have to be as on it.

You know that if you break the budget, it's okay because I've got this extra, you know, the limit is here and I can go beyond and there's no real guardrails there.

So I think what's happening is for the first time, you're like, oh, I have boundaries.

I have limits and I must depend on my financial, you know, fortitude and my own kind of willpower to stay within those boundaries.

And yeah, that's a skill to learn over time.

And I think that you're on the right track.

And it could take a while.

You know, we do say that when people build a budget, can, you know, what is it, 90 days before they feel like,

I got it, I can stick to this, I can start to live like this.

And, you know, for you, I don't know how far out of bounds you guys were going.

But yeah, it's

a lifestyle change.

That's right.

And I would just

give yourself grace because everybody's different.

Yeah.

As to their discipline.

I know some people that they get this Ramsey plan.

They're like, oh.

got it.

Yeah.

And they're just such system, disciplined people that it's just like, okay, I'm in lockstep.

And then there's other people that it takes a while.

And here's what I would tell you: that once you finally get over using credit cards, what I found to be true for us years and years ago, we finally cut ours up and that whole deal.

And

it's kind of like when you give up something

food-wise.

Oh, yeah.

And what happens is your appetite changes.

And I think credit cards are much like food or beverages.

And I'm going to give you a specific example in my life.

Years and years ago,

I was a sweet tea animal.

I mean, I drank a lot of sweet tea.

I thought it was a rite of passage because I was born and raised in the South.

You know, it was kind of like water and sweet tea.

And I kept looking for sweet tea in the Bible.

I couldn't find it.

Oh, man.

No, it ain't there.

That's how much I love sweet tea.

And

I cut it out as a part of a massive physical goal.

And

this is the only thing I can describe in my life that means this where your appetite changes.

And so I was very disciplined for at least a year, Jade, to not have sweet tea.

And then a year turned into two years, and I just...

I just had all these other options.

And I remember one day I was at some thing in the summer, and somebody had a gallon of Chick-fil-A iced tea sitting on that picnic table.

And it was just going psst,

pss.

And you know what I did?

Yeah.

I poured a little bit over some ice and I took a drink.

And I promise you, this is the truth.

It was disgusting.

I believe you.

And here's what I learned.

I talked to a nutritionist about it.

like weeks later and I told that story and she said yeah your appetite changed.

Yeah, it's real.

And so, I think

as long, I know that was a long-winded metaphor, but I can't help it.

I'm a preacher boy.

Okay.

I think that once you get off of credit cards and you really truly follow the Ramsey plan, excuse me.

And you can't.

I'm not getting choked up emotionally.

Are you crying?

Yeah.

Listen, I was ready for this.

All of a sudden, I'm Verclimp.

Yeah.

I just believed, like the sweet tea, that the idea of a credit card, when it pops back up on the picnic table,

that you'll go,

I don't want what comes with that.

And for me, it was just it was too sugary.

Yeah.

And, but what had changed was my appetite.

It wasn't discipline in the moment.

Well, it was my appetite change.

So

I hope that helps.

And I think that's for a lot of people to go, okay, man, I don't know if I can really get myself away from these credit cards with it.

But I'm telling you, when you change your lifestyle and you change your habits, your appetite changes with it.

And that's game changer stuff.

So I hope that helps.

If I had an organ, I'd have played the organ behind you.

But I didn't.

Don't get me started.

I'll take an offering.

I mean, we'll do an altar call.

I mean, let's go, man.

I'll give you three points and an offering here quick.

No, I hope that encourages people.

And it's the same way with debt.

All right, let's get to Kyle, who's joining us now in Charleston, South Carolina.

Kyle, how can we help today?

Hey, Jaden Ken, how are you?

Thanks for taking my call.

Sure.

So I just finished baby step three.

Congrats.

Thank you.

Said the last couple of years, getting out of about $80,000 worth of debt.

And I just finished my emergency fund.

At this point, thank you.

At this point, I have no savings outside of my emergency fund, and I'm looking to start budgeting for the first time.

So you did all that without a budget?

How did that happen?

It was everything that was not living expenses was going going on to the debt.

So basically, insane disorder.

Yeah, you just went hard in the paint.

Good for you.

Good for you.

Okay, so we're making a budget.

Right.

And I appreciate the structure of the baby steps.

I think that helped me out a lot while going through the process.

And I wanted to see if you guys have any similar rules or best practices that I'm able to stick to as like a first-time budget or making a budget for the first time.

Great question.

I love this.

All right, Jade.

So here we go.

The guy's got his fully funded emergency fund.

Yeah.

So first off, yeah, I would recommend the same budget that I use, the same budget Ken uses.

It's called Every Dollar.

We both really like it.

Everybody around here seems to love it.

It's great.

And so once you have that budget, at the top of it, you're just going to put in your income, right?

Which what is your income every month?

It's about 100.

Okay.

Oh, I'm sorry.

Annually.

Annually.

Okay.

So you're going to plug in your money.

You know, I don't know what it is after taxes.

I, whatever that is.

So $8,000 right there at the top.

Then you're going to plug in all of your expenses.

Now, when you're doing the budget, you're going to keep in mind what your next goal is, right?

And for you, the goal is I need to be investing 15% of my income.

So let's say, let's just pretend you start the budget just to see the money you have.

Let's pretend you start the money, the budget without.

accounting for that, just to see, okay, here's the margin I actually have with the life that I actually live.

Then you're going to say, well, wait a minute.

I do need to budget for this 15%.

What will it look like when I pull this money away?

Because that's going to go into retirement.

And now am I able to budget less than 15%?

And so that's kind of the exercise that you need because that is the drum that you're going to be beating from now until the time that you retire.

You're going to be investing 15% of your income.

Then from there, it's like, okay, what are the other things?

things that I want to do with my margin.

Do I want to put savings anywhere else?

Am I thinking thinking of buying a house?

Am I thinking of buying a, you know, saving up a down payment?

And by the way, is that part of your goals?

Yes, it is.

Okay.

So those are the two things that are going to be driving,

the driving forces behind your budget right now.

Does that make sense?

Yes, ma'am.

Alrighty.

All right.

Kelly's going to pick up.

Kelly, you know what to do.

Oh, the assist to Kelly.

You got to love it.

Yeah.

You know, this is exciting.

I just want to say yay, yay, yay, Kyle.

I mean, the fact that you went so hard and fast to get to Babyset Three and are like, I don't even know how to budget.

I mean, that, again, I applaud that, and I love that you're now leaning in.

You're on your way to wealth, young man, and that is exciting.

Many of you listen to the Ramsey show because you're sick and tired of getting nowhere with your money.

You work too hard to live paycheck to paycheck with no money in the bank.

But here's the deal: just listening to the show won't change that.

If you want different results, you have to do something different.

We've helped millions of people save money, ditch debt, and build wealth.

And you can too.

But you got to have a game plan, and that begins with our get-started assessment.

Go to ramseysolutions.com/slash start now, take the free quiz, and get your free step-by-step action plan.

If you've had it with money stress and are ready to take control of your money for good, go to ramseysolutions.com slash start now.

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show alongside Jade Warshaw and Ken Coleman.

Let's get right to Josh here in Fort Worth, Texas.

Josh, how can we help?

Hey guys, thanks for taking my call this afternoon.

I had a question about buying my son a vehicle.

A little bit of background.

His mom and I have been split up for about eight years now.

He's 17 and recently got his license and I've been trying to talk with her about getting him a car for about the last year now.

And she doesn't doesn't want to participate financially

because his grandparents on her side are

willing to let him use a car

that they have.

It's still titled in their name.

It's insured on their policy, and they added him to their insurance.

And

I don't think it's the right kind of car.

It's kind of a sporty, you know, sedan that an inexperienced 17-year-old probably shouldn't be driving.

What is it?

Tell us more, for real.

It's an accurate.

It's an accurate TL.

I think it's about 15 years old, but it's 300 horsepower.

And he got his license like two weeks ago.

You think that he's going to drag race in this?

What is the concern?

No, but

he's a pretty impulsive kid.

What would you be ready for him to get his license?

I'm looking online at an accurate TL that's 15 years old.

That is not impulsive.

I am not seeing any, unless I'm missing something.

All right.

Josh.

I've got a little get up and go.

Josh.

It's a 15-year-old Acura.

Nobody thinks of that car as irresponsible for a kid.

In fact, an Acura is a fabulous car, a 15-year-old Acura.

What do you want to buy him?

Let's run this whole risky thing.

I'm dying to know.

What do you want to buy him?

I'm looking more like Honda Civic.

You realize Honda, Honda makes accuracy.

But that's the one folks trick out in race, is the Honda Civvi.

That's like what they do.

It's like pure stock.

It doesn't matter.

Wait a sec.

Okay, here's the deal.

Okay, I'll get out of your way, Jay, because I think you're revving up.

I like when you get revved up.

If I'm in your situation, I wouldn't spend my money on buying this kid a car.

The grandparents on the other side are doing you a solid man.

Don't look a gift horse in the mouth, is the old phrase.

Or at least try it out first.

At the very least, let him try with the Acura.

And if he races it, then get him a civic to race.

But that's his problem.

But the fact that you don't want your 17-year-old, you don't think he's ready for a license is also an issue.

There you go.

You know, I mean, is any 16-year-old ready?

I mean, I know when two of my three, and I'm getting ready to have a third one driving.

Y'all pray for me.

I'd like to keep my hair.

But I remember when the first two started driving, Jade, I was absolutely mortified and terrified.

I'm letting them drive a vehicle.

It didn't matter if it was an Acura or a Yugo.

If you people from the 80s, remember that car.

It was basically a lawnmower.

You know, it doesn't matter.

You know, it's the very concept of driving a car is dangerous.

So his impulses and all that, that's a bigger issue.

You getting him a civic versus them giving him an Acura is, and I'm just telling you as objectively as I can, you called us,

you're worried about the wrong things.

And I would take the gift.

I would too.

Listen, I second that.

I 100%, I thought you were going to say they're giving him a brand new 2025

Lamborghini.

Like, I was expecting something like that.

Even then, I'd take that.

I'd just ride with the kid.

But hey, that's me.

Yeah, I think that you have a gift here, and don't block the blessing well said josh we've spoken that's the gavel right there

you're gonna do what you're gonna do i got a feeling do you remember when i was in high school the car to have like if you had this car it was like oh i'm very excited i'm a little older than you so i'm anxious to see what this is well and i also grew up in like a like a country town if you had a trans am oh like that was the business.

It was speed.

Speed on wheels.

Oh, man.

And what's funny about a Transam is honestly a piece of crap.

Yeah.

But it looked fast.

It looked so cool.

It had the like the bird on the

bird.

That had the bird on the head.

No, that's from what's the

Smokey and the Bandit?

Yeah, Burt Reynolds.

Come on, man.

Now I'm dating myself.

Yeah.

There's like a whole demographic.

That's like, did he just say Smoky and the Who?

Listen, I'm going to act like I don't know what you're talking about.

You do know.

Because you're the real deal.

Dan is joining us now in Alabama.

Dan, how can we help?

Hey, Ken Jade.

I'm a new listener.

Welcome aboard, sir.

Well, thank you.

My wife and I, of almost 40 years, are searching for peace.

We're sick and tired of being sick and tired.

Good.

We

sold our

family small business of 20 years

back in 2021.

The buyer made it 18 months and bankrupted it.

Oh, no.

And

that really has thrown our retirement into

a spiral.

What were the terms of the deal?

Well, it was an owner finance deal for

three years.

And, you know, the deal was that he would operate two years and be able to get SBA financing.

No, I get that, but over the three-year period, when the three years was done, what were you expecting to be paid?

About a half a million.

So, you were counting on a half a million, and I'm guessing you're getting zero.

Well, we didn't get much.

Okay.

You have any other retirement accounts?

Well, I just well, we in trying to keep the facility operating because we had tenants renting out part of the facility.

I had to keep that up and going.

So we have kind of

blown through what

retirement we had saved up.

Now

what kind of facility is it?

Like, do you still have any food manufacturing facility?

Okay.

It's a large facility.

Who owns that?

Who has ownership?

I'm assuming

the new owner.

You still kept ownership.

Yeah,

I leased him.

He bought assets of the

well, tell me, give me real numbers.

How much did you get from the sale of the company?

You said you got a little, not much.

We need real numbers here.

What do you have?

We got less than $100,000.

90, 80, 75, 90, 90, 90.

Okay, 90.

Okay, so 90,000.

And then you have zero retirement money.

Right.

Other than we just received an inheritance hour rate from

how much is that?

How much?

It's now at $100,000.

Okay.

How old are you guys?

I'm 64.

Okay.

Okay.

And how much is the building worth if you were to sell it today?

I have it now listing for

1.375.

Okay.

Okay.

So go ahead.

Well, here's what we're doing.

Let's hold this because

there's more work to do here.

So hang on the line.

Keep those numbers handy, Dan.

We need those numbers.

And we're going to pick up where we left off.

All right.

We've all done dumb things with money.

I've done them with zeros on the end.

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If you're watching on YouTube right now, I've got it in my hands here.

And this is no joke.

It's nice.

I mean, if you judge a book by its weight,

this is valuable.

Substantial.

I could knock a man out with this with very little effort.

It's just that substantial.

A lot of tabs.

And I think that's probably a good feature for a planner as well, don't you think?

And it's a little bit smaller than last year, so it's easier to just smaller than last year.

What was last year?

The scrolls?

It was

wow.

This is

substantial.

I really am fascinated by it.

And you know what else I like?

This little, what do you call this?

The binder.

It's continuous, so it can't come off like last year.

Last year, we had a little bit of problems with it.

This year, it's completely solved.

It's great.

I feel like you might have engineered this, not only contributed to it.

You're speaking with great knowledge about all this.

I just, well, I'm part of the product and I care about it.

I love it.

It's great.

I love it.

There you go.

All right.

So we're going to come back to Dan.

And Dan kind of set this up here.

Dan sold his family business and the person who bought it was owner finance.

That means they were paying Dan over three years

and did not go well.

So we're running through the numbers.

So, Dan, we're coming back to you.

Let's recast on the numbers

to make sure that Jade and I are completely caught up.

You walked away with $90,000 cash from the sale of this company.

Is that correct?

Correct.

Okay.

And

you were expecting

to walk away with $500,000.

Is that also correct?

That is correct.

All right.

And you've depleted your retirement funds down to basically nothing.

to kind of keep this building that you still loan afloat.

Is that correct?

That is correct.

All right, great.

And so what did you tell me if we were to sell this building today and you have listed it, what do you expect to actually walk away with?

The equity, I would hope to walk away with around $400,000.

Okay.

And just to clarify, there's no business running out of it.

It's just a building.

You said you had a couple of renters in there.

Is that what I heard?

Well, I restarted a different version of the business that I sold because I had to keep the building going.

Yeah.

And how was that doing?

Well, my son came on board.

He stopped his career venture into insurance to

join with me and try to

restart the business that we were doing.

And how's it going?

Well, it's still not paying for the building, and it's just bleeding me.

It's bleeding you.

So you shut that business.

The building is too big for what we are able to do.

If you sell that building, would you keep that business going?

No,

because now my son has decided he wants to go back to insurance.

Good move.

I was going to suggest that.

So, you know, with the risk of having to build a whole new smaller facility in order to operate profitably, he doesn't want to take that risk.

Sure.

So if I'm reading the situation, if I've got the facts, Dan, correct me here.

You were hoping to walk away with 500K

over a three-year period, but if we sell this building, we're going to end up being at $490K now.

So instead of $500K later, you're going to be $490 now, correct?

Well, the $90 is gone.

Right, but

it was still money you received.

Wait, wait.

Oh, so you've already spent.

Okay, I was under the impression you retained the 90.

You're saying it's already been spent.

Yes.

Okay, but same scenario.

So instead of 500K after selling this business, once we get rid of the building, you're going to have 400K.

Hopefully, yes.

Okay.

So the only difference is we blew through retirement.

How much retirement did you spend?

Probably $250,000.

Okay.

So that's the number.

So when I look at, okay, where we thought we were going to be was $500K in cash and $250,000 continuing to grow in retirement.

Now we're going to be at $400,000 and zero in retirement.

That's the difference.

So we've got a $250,000 deficit.

Okay.

So we ought to adjust that.

You know, my head has just been so wrapped up in all the arms and legs of this thing.

I can't seem to critical think my way through these.

And, you know, I've tried to,

we never have been much of a budgeter.

So I've thrown all this mess together on a spreadsheet.

I think you've had this for so long and it went away that you didn't want it to go.

And so you're kind of trying to grasp at straws to keep it.

But I think the longer you keep it, the more loss you're going to feel.

And I get it.

You've sunk a lot of time and money and cost into this.

And that's deceiving, right?

You keep thinking, oh, there might be a way that I can re-get it and get it back and get it back.

But instead, you're just losing at a very fast rate.

Here's a quick question.

I don't, where's your income?

I understand the 400 because that was going to be a part of your retirement or were you planning planning to live off of the 500 in other words all I want to know right now is how are you bringing in income

well it's through the business that we're operating now but you're about ready to shut that down yes and so so now that's our biggest issue so how much money what do you need to make what kind of income do you need to replace

the hope is that I am willing to sell off what is left of the businesses that we are operating yeah because there there

there is potential there.

I mean, there are.

What kind of potential?

What do you think it would be in dollars?

Hopefully, at least another $300,000 or $400,000.

I think I can resell it again if I can split it up into two segments.

Well, now we're closing that gap with these new businesses.

And we can invest that in retirement and replace the $250,000 with these numbers.

But again, where's our income?

If you sell those businesses, you still need some income.

Yeah, what will you do?

Yeah, well, and that's the next thing:

this is all we've ever done.

So, you know,

manufacturing food is what we know.

And in order to duplicate that on a smaller scale, we still have to have expensive facilities.

But then we're going through the mind process of,

like your book, is what

are we really wired to do well i get that but i wonder if i wonder if you could go work for somebody instead of running the business you're 65 and and you're trying to play catch up and if we sell all these businesses and stack this cash if i'm in your shoes i'm looking to go do similar work but i'm going to go do it for somebody else in this twilight and and allow myself to to keep stacking on to retirement

for right now i'm not thinking that i have to start another manufacturing business i actually think at this stage with you checking out of all these things and exiting, I would go do similar work, you know, contract work, go work for somebody else that does it.

Is it ideal for you?

No.

But is it a lot safer and is it a lot calmer?

And does it help you continue to catch up?

Yes.

That's what I would do.

You also did say though, and I just want to play this out.

You said before, hey, we would be making money on the manufacturing business we have now, but our facility is too large, so we're bleeding because of it.

And you said we needed a smaller facility.

So, my question is: if you sold off the smaller businesses that you've created as a result of having all this extra space, would that create the money you need to have the smaller facility so that the existing business can actually be profitable?

And then over time, maybe you just have somebody else come in and run it.

Like, and that's kind of your plan to transition out.

Have you thought through that?

Well, we have considered that, but you know, without a son

to take take longevity, I just don't, I just don't.

You don't have it in you.

I can hear it.

I can hear it.

You don't have it.

Listen.

I've already retired once.

I get it.

I can hear it.

That idea.

While a good idea, I think for you it's exhausting.

You know, I'm in good physical shape.

So, yes, going to work somewhere for a little while and stack up some more cash.

It's just

so much to think through.

Well, I just simplified it.

I just simplified it for you, and you got you got to be okay with it.

Yeah, you got to be okay going, you know what, the deal went bad.

It's not my fault that the bonehead ran it in the ground.

Maybe I could have done something, but we don't play that game.

We're not gonna, you're not gonna just play armchair quarterback on yourself.

Let's move forward, sell everything, let's stack the cash, and let's retire with dignity.

You work your butt off for your money, but your money's never going to return the favor if all you do is hope for the best.

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Hey, how are you doing with the baby steps?

Are you on track?

You can take a quick quiz to check your progress and received a personalized plan just for you all you do is go to our show notes click on the link titled are you on track

with the baby steps and you can complete the quiz it's a great resource let's go to norman oklahoma tristan is there tristan how can we help

hey guys how are you doing good how are you

uh pretty good i have encountered a situation um i was not ready for it i've been listening to you guys for about a year now and um about a month ago, at the end of July, I got into a wreck.

I goofed.

I was trying to work the babysits out of order.

So

not the smartest part of my end, but I was trying to get rid of my debt before saving up the nest egg.

So I don't have $1,000 to help me out with getting a new car.

I was in a car accident, and it was his fault.

He ran into me and told her my car, but I just had liability.

Now I don't have transportation, and I am trying to find a vehicle off of like Facebook Marketplace, and I can't

seem to find one within my price range.

Right now, I have about $700 saved up, and that's about all the money I have.

Okay, hold up, slow down just one second here.

So because it was the other guy's fault,

have you talked to your insurance people and his insurance people?

Are you getting

from his insurance for your car?

Yeah, so the thing is, is like I said, I was working on Baby Step 2, and so I was $6,000 before.

I was trying to get it paid off by the end of the year, but I was

$6,000 under.

And it was a 2016 Hyundai Sonata.

And so

the value is just right around there.

I'm so confused, bro.

So you're saying you were upside down on the car.

Is that what you're saying, the 6K?

Is that what you were saying?

Upside down on the car.

Okay, so that's neither here nor there.

Yeah, what's the car worth?

What is the total when the car was total?

What is the number?

So my attorney's been working on that.

She has gotten to me, and the lumber that we're looking at is at $5,500.

So you should be getting a check for $5,500 from his insurance agency.

But I was told that that was going to go straight to the bank

since it's under a loan.

That is correct.

I apologize.

I was so focused on your next car.

Okay, so that's gone, and you have have $700

correct well that's a and don't be looking for a $700 car you might as well get a bicycle

because that's going to be more dependable I'm not even kidding how old are you I'm 26 okay what do you do for work I am a teacher a teacher okay how far away do you live from the school

I live about 11 miles

okay

so

you're still able to work like you're not injured from this

are you?

Correct.

Okay.

No, God was surrounding me.

I'm going through PT right now.

I am filing an accident injury lawsuit.

So we're on the steps of that, but I don't know what to do in the meantime before I get that money.

I think you're going to be on.

So the first step is we need to figure out where is there any margin in your budget?

Because that's what's going to be what you're putting towards saving up for a beater vehicle.

And in the meantime, you're doing a couple of things called the bus.

You're doing, you're taking the cheapest level of lift.

You're hitching a ride with...

How much bicycling have you done in your life?

I bicycled the other day to my workout.

Did you really?

Okay, the reason I'm asking is what do you think 11 miles, how long would it take you to ride 11 miles?

I can ride a mile in like, I don't know, like five minutes.

Because when I ride to my workout, it's about a mile and a half away.

Yeah.

55, yeah.

I mean, if it's a safe ride.

It's a bit faster than that, but I always underestimate these things.

If it's a a safe ride.

I was pretty good on the Peloton.

If it's a safe ride, try it.

You got to do something like that.

I mean,

that's the real reel, Tristan.

Like, you're going to have to save.

What do you think in your budget you could carve out every month to go towards a car?

Because you need like $3,000.

Yeah, I'm thinking

I'm just trying to, I'm still...

I'm still working on trying to get the, I have the every dollar pass, but I'm trying to get those behaviors in, so I'm not too good at it yet.

No, no, no, no.

Okay, you can do this today.

So I don't want you to over make this too difficult.

Today, you go in there and when you get paid from your, from being a teacher, do you get paid twice a month?

Yes.

Okay, so what are those checks?

They are $1,300.

Okay, so

okay, so you put both of those $1,100 checks in there and then you're going to say, okay, I've got $2,200.

Do you teach full-time?

Yes.

Okay.

I've got $2,200 to spend.

And then from there, you're going to, it's going to give you a place to put all the things you spend money on.

So you're going to put your rent out of there.

You're going to put everything out of there.

So when you were paying off debt, because you said, hey, I went too fast, I paid off my debt too fast, and I didn't do the savings.

When you were paying off your debt, how much extra were you putting towards paying off your debt?

Anything I could.

I didn't have a specific number.

I was putting too much.

I was paying my rent.

Give me a good month

on a good month.

On a good month, $600.

Okay, so now that essentially what I'm telling you is that $600, instead of going towards paying off your debt, you're going to stack that for the next two, three months, two months, until you have, okay,

$1,200 plus the $700 you had before, you're going to have about $2,000, right?

So it's like, okay, great.

Now I'm getting closer to being able to buy this car.

If you can put another thousand with it,

that's how this is going to work.

Now, the hard part is, usually we would tell people if they're saving for a car, you need to be side hustling, you need to be doing this and that.

But for you, it's a slim margin because you don't have transportation.

so

this is going to be a grind out for you for three months are you how much money are you generating because i'm over here um jay just you know i'm not um no i know you're over checking my stocks i'm looking up used cars are you actually near norman oklahoma Yes.

Okay.

I'm South Norman.

South Norman.

How much money have you generated for him with this?

In two months, he's going to have 2,000.

In three months, he's going to have,

if he grinds it out, he's going to have 3,000.

Okay.

All right.

So I'm just doing a check here.

You're going to need,

I think, to be safe, another thousand.

I'm looking at some cars that, again, will get you from 0.8 to 4.

I don't know.

Go lower.

I think you can go lower.

I'm just doing a quick, you know.

Okay.

I'm just saying

direct to say like Facebook Marketplace, you probably can.

Yeah, because he's only going 10 miles a day.

And then you can slowly

after that.

Yeah, but I like the 3,000 to 4,000.

I just was playing off of your number.

I think 3,000 to 4,000 is the number.

And I would say Facebook Marketplace is a good play.

But some of these dealers get really

seedy.

Well, they're very happy to unload a, like, here's a 2007 Pontiac Vibe Base.

I never even heard of this.

No, I don't get that.

I'm not saying you get it, but I'm saying you go to this dealer, they're asking $39.99 for that.

You go in there with $2,000 in $100 bills and lay it on the hood of that vibe, and you're driving that thing away.

Yeah, you shake his greasy hand, and you're out the door.

You don't even have to shake his hand.

Just, hey, here it is.

Spread it out.

And that guy's going to go, $2,000 cash for a Pontiac vibe.

Oh, don't spread it out.

You're going to get the man jumped.

Just

write a check like a normal.

No,

you're missing my drama.

You thought that was gangster?

I think that's a power.

I think it's a flex.

It's like you're like, unbutton your shirt, throw your chest hairs out, put a gold chain on, and just slip it off.

That works for $2,000.

My point is, cash for these older cars, cash really goes a long way.

It does.

And that's all I'm saying.

Just something practical there.

But that's what your play is right now.

And then hopefully you get a nice check from this

case or whatever.

Yeah, I hope so.

Gotcha.

So, yeah, man.

This is called

fine time.

That is.

You know, there's an old phrase.

You're a teacher, Tristan.

You probably heard this.

Where there's a will, there's a

way.

There you go.

And

this is the time.

And it's very easy, easy, by the way, because there's going to be a chorus of people singing,

go get a car payment.

Don't do it.

And there's the choir.

The choir is going to be singing it.

Don't do it.

There it is.

Don't do it.

Nice.

Nice.

I'm always ready for you.

You got to step out of the choir like Jade does.

Like she has a different color robe than everybody else, you know?

And she's got the mic, and she gets out center stage.

That's what you got to do here.

The soloist.

You got to be a soloist on this because the choir is going to get you in trouble with a car payment, you know.

Don't do it.

And I tell you what, folks, if you want to enjoy yourself sometime and you're really bored and nothing good on TV, pull up the old used car websites and look for cars listed under $5,000.

I'll give you a chuckle.

Our scripture of the day comes from Ephesians 2.10, for we are God's handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

Our quote of the day from Ephesians 2.10 to Janice Joplin, it's always just a natural bridge.

Indeed.

You are what you settle for.

Jesus to Joplin?

With it all day.

Thank you, Jade.

Well said.

By the way, I want to be known for quotes like that.

Just

you are what you settle for?

Yeah.

Six words.

Like Janice just dropped the mic.

She did drop it.

She just said it, lit up a cig, and walked away.

No big deal.

Nikki is in Missouri.

Nikki, how can we help?

There is a senior citizen widowed, and there is another senior citizen much older than me, a widower, who is interested in a relationship with me and with the goal of getting married because he wants to get married.

All right, all right, all right.

Nikki, you're putting out the vibe, huh?

Well, there's more behind it, though.

Oh,

I'm not financially then.

Yes, he does not know my financial situation, but I know his completely.

Okay.

I like how you roll, Nikki.

I like it.

So you've got money, and he doesn't.

Exactly.

So he doesn't know you could be a sugar mama.

He just got out of a sugar mama relationship.

In fact, I'm the one that pointed it out and said, look, let me lay this out for you.

And she's going to take all your money.

She had every bit of his money in a joint account with her name on it.

And did she take it?

Did she take it?

No.

But he doesn't have a whole lot anyway.

No, $125,000.

Ooh, that's it?

All right.

So what is your, keep going.

So what's your concern or what's your question for us?

All right.

My concern is he told me that that $125,000 is burning a hole in his pocket.

And it's like, you know, his pension alone is about $100,000 a year.

Okay.

And so, you know, he makes good money, but where is it?

Is he that bad with money?

Well, apparently he was spending it on this last lady.

Now he wants to spend it on you.

Yeah.

Well, I mean, what's this?

So is this leading to, should, I mean, I feel like you're leading to another question here.

I don't want to ask it for you.

I want you to ask it.

What's your question?

I'm ready.

I'm worried that he's going to end up needing very expensive nursing home care or something, and he's going to blow through his money instantly, and then I have to dip into mine if we're married.

How old is he?

He's 81.

How old are you?

68.

Oh, see, I don't know.

Interesting.

I don't know.

Well, first of all, we jumped ahead to all this.

The way this call started is I just met this guy.

He just got out of the seller relationship.

Seems very fast.

This all seems fast.

I mean, do you even like this guy?

Well, we've been Facebook friends for over three years.

Well, that doesn't mean anything.

I'm not going to marry my Facebook.

First of all, I'm married.

But if I was in your situation,

I wouldn't consider marrying a Facebook friend.

There's got to be more criteria.

Oh, well, no, we've liked each other's pictures for three years.

We thought maybe we would tie the knot.

What else is there?

Nikki, no.

This guy needs to court you.

Can I ask you?

I'm not saying that he's not going to.

But has he started yet is the question.

Or are we jumping ahead?

We're talking about something we shouldn't talk about is what I'm getting at, Nikki.

This guy's got to earn your love.

He's got to earn the right to marry you, at which point you discuss all these things in this process.

And if you guys aren't in line, if you're not aligned with your money at this late stage of life, you shouldn't do it.

Because, I mean, God bless him, 81.

That's my question.

Because he has such a good income, do I not worry about it so much?

Am I overthinking this?

I think, well, we're trying to get a bead on what the relationship actually is.

It ain't.

Are you dating Facebook?

No, it isn't yet.

I have been putting him off.

He asked me out two years ago, and I said, oh, I'm in the middle of a house repair.

Okay.

You were washing your hair.

She went to that one.

That's great.

But wait a minute, wait a minute.

Nikki, let me ask a question.

I don't think you really like this guy.

I feel like it's a line in the water and you're like, well, I'm not doing anything else.

I think you're 68 and you're a widow and this guy's interested in you and that's kind of nice.

But you don't, you haven't said anything that makes me think there's something there.

No.

You said he would like to get married.

There isn't yet.

Well, he asked me already.

To marry you?

I wonder, basically,

would you consider getting married?

And it's like, well, no, no, no.

I haven't

met you yet.

How do you expect that?

Do you live in the same space to actually meet each other in person?

We're going to in a week and a half.

He's coming here.

He's six hours away.

So you really legitimately have never met him.

Hold up.

How do we know this isn't catfishing?

Do you even know what that means?

Yeah, but I really don't think it is.

He is too open and honest.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

Nikki, you have a hook in both sides of your mouth right now, and this needs to stop.

You do not have any more communication with this guy until this 81-year-old wrinkled dude shows up in his Bermuda shorts and is the real deal.

Yeah.

This is a, I'm not kidding you.

Yeah, neither am I.

I wish Dave were here today, and I don't want to get mean like Dave, but I'm telling you, everything you're saying sounds like you are being completely punked and you are falling for it.

Yeah.

Your first reply to me was, oh, no, no, but he's so open and honest.

And that's how they get you.

And why would you even be talking about finances to this level with somebody that you've never even seen in person?

Oh, that was because of the scammer he was with last, and he just about went to the bottom.

Right, but even that part all-you don't even know if he's real.

Yeah, this all sounds like a scam.

Tell him to come meet you.

Let me tell you.

He is.

He's going to.

Well, let's wait until they do that for two months.

Let's wait and see if he shows up.

Yeah, let's see.

My shoes on.

This guy never shows up because he gets a mysterious case of overnight gout.

Yeah.

Do you know anybody else that knows him?

Okay, we get on Facebook widowed video chats.

And so, you know, you kind kind of get to know the people in the group.

And he was in that group for a long time.

Yeah, he was, because that's where I would fish if I was a scammer.

But you've seen his face.

Go where the fish are biting.

As a Zoom call, is what you're saying.

What's his name?

Yeah.

Charlie.

Yeah, it's not real.

It actually is.

Here's the ball.

You need to wait to see him.

If you see him in person.

I'm getting angry.

If you see him in person, you've had Zoom calls with him, seen his face.

Now, if he's doing the the the wilson from home improvement where you never see the

oh no it's always like this and you never see the whole face nikki if your daughter called us

if you had a daughter i don't know if you have a daughter or not doesn't matter but if you had a daughter or if you do have a daughter and she called us and you were listening to this call what in the world would you say to her

oh i know it but she's much younger than me it doesn't matter you're not a desperate lost case you you've got to be careful careful.

The only thing is, I honestly think he want he, I told him where I lived last year.

Gee, that's smart.

That's smart.

I know it.

I know it.

I do trust the guy.

No, no, no, no, no, no.

I'm done.

I don't care.

I'm not going to be as free as Dave.

But I'm going to tell you something, Nikki.

I'm going to tell you the truth because I feel like I have to tell you the truth.

And then Jade can clean it up.

I'm going to give you my 30 seconds.

Nikki, this is absolute foolishness.

Whether it's a scam or not, this is foolishness.

And I'm being very, very serious.

And I'm going to tell you why.

I don't care.

I'm not listening.

No,

I don't want to hear it.

Let me tell you why.

You need to protect your heart.

No, you need to protect your heart, whether it's a scam or not.

You are talking about finances and combining your life with a guy that you've never been on a date with, that is significantly older than you, that based on what he's told you so far,

he's reckless with money and all these other things.

There's nothing stable about this entire phone call.

Nothing stable.

The only thing that's stable is your financial situation, but you are putting your financial and your emotional situation in massive risk.

And I'm telling you the absolute truth.

You need to run from this.

If this guy's real, if he wants to pursue you like you were when you were 22, then we have a conversation.

And not that I need this, but everybody in the audience out there is shaking their head.

And this is insanity that you're considering this.

And so, Jay.

Only a desperate person would go forward with this.

Only a desperate, stupid woman.

And you are neither of those things, so don't do it.

Well, I might be a little stupid because the only thing that makes me think, well, maybe,

maybe,

would be he said his full pension goes to his wife when he dies because he's married.

You don't need his pension.

No.

You don't need to.

No, he doesn't.

Well, then why are we still having this conversation?

Go hang out with some fried green tomatoes and have some strong margaritas and cry yourself to sleep tonight about how lonely you are because that's what's going on.

You're lonely.

Up next, we are headed out to Chicago and Orlando for the Ramsey Show Live.

Yep, you heard me right.

We are taking this show to you.

This is going to be everything we love about the Ramsey Show, except you get to be a part of it.

Part of what, George?

The Ramsey Show Live.

Okay.

That's what I'm telling them about.

Ramsey Show Live in here?

Nope, we're doing it on the road.

You're going to Chicago with me and Rachel Cruz September 30th.

Are you free?

The windy city.

I like it that time of year.

You know what else I like, George?

I like the deep dish.

Oh, okay.

Maybe we'll have some deep dish.

You mind if I finish the promo?

Is that okay with you?

Okay.

Okay.

Appreciate that.

Questions and answers, real conversations, and I'm sure a few surprises here and there.

George, are you in here talking about TRS Live?

I am, Jade.

I'm trying to talk about it.

Nice.

So that means it's actually happening, right?

It's happening.

If I could tell the people, I think it could actually come to fruition.

Listen, just tell me when and where.

You don't know?

Okay, we're going to Orlando.

You're going to join Dr.

John Deloney and I October 2nd.

Yes.

Okay, great.

I'm going to go pack now.

Please, please do that.

Go pack.

Hey, George, speaking of packing, is this like sweater weather or is it not that cold yet in Chicago?

What is happening?

Can I please just get to how they buy the tickets?

Geez, I thought it was a good question.

Okay, this is not an arena tour.

This is a one-night-only event in Chicago and Orlando.

General admission is only 39 bucks.

Plus, there's a VIP experience if you're bougie like that.

But here's the thing.

There's only 300 seats available.

So get your tickets now at ramseysolutions.com slash events.

Hey, how come you get to go to both cities?

I just go where they tell me, man.

Hey, have you been there the entire time?

Maybe.

Okay, and also, are you reading a children's book?

I'm expanding my mind, George.

That's how we got those PhDs.

Yeah, that's probably where you got that jacket.

Okay, see you on the road, John.