‘Blue Chips’ With Bill Simmons, Chris Ryan, and Van Lathan

Hey Rewatchables fans, you already knew we were coming to Boston for a sold-out show on March 27th, but what you didn't know is we're sticking around that weekend.

We're going to host our first ever Rewatchables Film Festival while we're in Boston.

We're screening some of our favorite movies, movies that we have done on this podcast, plus maybe a couple others at the historic Coolidge Corner Theater.

We're doing it all weekend from March 28th.

through March 30th, one of my favorite theaters in America.

We might even make a few surprise appearances at a couple of these screenings.

It's your chance to see some of our favorites as they were meant to be seen on the big screen.

Classic mob heist Boston movies we love.

Goodfellas, the town, the departed.

Oh, yeah, we're doing heat.

Again, it's going to kick off Friday, March 28th at the Coolidge Corner Theater in Brookline.

Visit theringer.com/slash events for showtime and ticket information.

Hopefully, we'll see you there.

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You can find Chris Ryan doing the watch.

That's right.

Some good TV lately, finally.

Uplifting adolescents.

Yeah.

Talking about that.

Yeah.

And then White Lotus, Last of Us is coming.

A lot of good stuff.

Yeah.

Ban, higher learning.

Higher learning.

Midnight Boys.

What?

Don't Don't do it, baby.

Pipping.

I said, Pippi.

Thank you.

A lot of stuff going on.

Lots of political news.

Lots of news in the superhero space.

Great pod that we did just recently.

Me, Sean, Joe, CR.

What was the pod?

It was about the state of the MCU and superhero movies.

And you're skipping that one.

Okay, so Bill tells people not to listen.

So, yeah.

He's skipping it.

It doesn't mean...

I don't know.

That sounds like a great idea for a pod.

you know, my feelings.

I could have just come in for a cameo at the end and been like, yeah, I've been here for 10 years.

He's got to light a couple more candles for Abdul Carter for

start.

All right.

Well, come on, Cleveland Browns reporters.

We're going to talk about a very polarizing sports movie that is somehow weirdly endearing.

Blue Chips is next.

We don't buy athletes.

All the other sons are doing it, coach.

Like to have it in cash.

Did you cheat?

He bought him, Charlie.

I know he bought them.

Did you take money?

We owe it to him, Nick Nulty and Shaquille O'Neal.

Blue chips, right at PG13.

Starts Friday, February 18th at Theaters Everywhere.

All right, guys.

So, I wrote this in the mid-2000s about blue chips.

I wrote that it would, it turned out to be the penny hardaway of sports movies.

Ironically,

um, unlimited potential, great start, peaked early, some ups and downs, ultimately disappointing, and then kind of grows on you year after year.

And I wrote that

mid-2000s.

We did like kind of a tester sports movie Hall of Fame Pod maybe eight years ago, and

I liked it more.

Yeah,

and now we're in 225, all these years later.

And I like it more than I used to.

And I think it just makes me nostalgic for whatever this weird era of sports movies and young skinny shack and young Penny Hardaway and Nick Nulty and whatever they're trying to do in this movie.

I don't know.

I really enjoyed re-watching this.

I think it actually is an inverted sports movie.

And if you look at it that way,

it works better.

It's inverted because it's a feel-bad sports movie.

It starts out with them losing.

It starts out, then it goes to him compromising on his principles, and then it goes to his career's over.

There's no heroes, there's no takeaways.

No,

there's a lot of unintentional comedy, Van.

There's some really fun basketball that's shot in a super weird way, but it's still compelling to watch.

But you're watching it going, why didn't they?

Just bring the camera back.

I just would have loved to have seen all of these famous players from the 90s play together.

And Louisiana's in it.

So I know your feelings.

Love it.

Well, first of all,

it was part of Shaq's media rollout as a pro.

Shaq and Penny together was like, oh, my God, Shaq and Penny are in a movie.

But we barely knew who Penny was.

Barely knew who Penny was.

Shaq had real gravity.

Shaq was a gigantic star, but Penny was, Memphis was still Memphis State at this point.

Penny was this silky, smooth, big guard from Memphis State.

And then when you see him in the movie, it's part of what makes him a celebrity.

But the film itself also is interesting in that it predicts the future it's an easier film to watch uh retrospectively because so many of the things that it was about like came to pass like it well that's why we want to do this because now we're in the nil era which is the era that blue chips was telling us for 30 years we should be in this era yeah and now we're actually in the era and it's you know i remember i saw this movie in the theater with my my dad and my buddy kurt sanger and we were really excited

there's something every time you mention a guy you went to the movie kurt sanger The Juice Man.

For sure.

The Juice Man.

The Juice Man.

He was in town.

We called him Juice.

It was one of those things where we would give.

We also had a friend named Night Train.

We would give our friends weird nicknames.

Yeah.

We would do like weird football nicknames from the 40s and 50s, just for normal people.

But anyway, we saw this movie, super excited.

Nick Dalty, free.

Super excited because you thought it was going to be like.

I thought it was going to be great.

It's like, and this was the era where sports movies had shifted from that Rocky model that we talked about in the the Rocky pod, which goes from like through Hoosiers to the late 80s.

Then there's like a little kid's era, but then the Ron Shelton era comes in.

He wrote this movie.

Bull Durham's happened.

We're moving toward like a more sophisticated sports movie, but we're not quite here

yet.

And this movie never really figured out what it wanted to be, but on cable, still really re-watchable.

And I think it has a weird kind of tail.

Yeah,

yeah, it for sure.

Number one, I mean, you know, it's it has that tale because of nostalgia, has that tale because of the relevance of the subject matter of the movie.

Yeah.

But also, it's an easy watch.

It's

an easy watch.

The movie doesn't,

it talks a little bit about some of the poverty that the players live in and like what they're going through, but it doesn't get too deep into it.

It talks a little bit about the corruption of the NCAA, the NCSA, or their draconian rules, shall I say, but it doesn't really go too hard into it.

You know, Happy is a very easy villain to root against.

It's like

Chris isn't rooting against them.

To Chris, this is a happy movie.

It's a J.T.

Walsh extravagance.

I love J.T.

Walsh.

You know what's funny?

If in today, in today's happy would run shit.

Happy is the hero, and P.

Bell, the guy who doesn't want to pay the players, he's the villain if you do the movie today.

There was a nostalgia thing in a couple of different ways, but one of the things that, you know, it was such a big deal that all these college guys were in the movie and even like Calbert Cheney and Hurley and people like that in the game scenes.

Yeah.

And I was just thinking about how much we cared about college basketball when I was in college.

Like we were talking about, it was the anniversary, it was St.

Patrick's Day and I was on a thread with my college buddies.

And like one of my great sports members in college was Princeton and Georgetown.

Oh, yeah.

On St.

Patrick's Day.

And we were just at a party watching that.

And the entire campus was locked in on that game.

Like we all watched the Leitner shot game together.

We really cared about Kenny Anderson on Georgia Tech and what Shaq was going to do on LSU and just all, and Leitner was like a college god and

UNLV Larry Johnson just showing up and being like, it seemed like he was like 25 and just kicking ass.

We cared about all these people.

So them being in this movie with Bobby Knight, with Petino, with Boeheim, with Tark.

as like these funny characters, like it really meant something back then.

Well, we also obviously naively believed in like the power of these institutions to recruit these players just like based on the reputation alone.

And one of the things that I remember so clearly about like my college basketball fandom back in Philly was like when a kid would go to a school that was kind of on a little bit of a downswing, it's like, no, like Mark Macon's going to revive Temple or

this guy's going.

Can you believe that this guy's going to LSU?

Like this is amazing.

And we were

with short of like, we weren't like pounding recruiting newsletters or anything, but we were like very aware when a big time freshman would come into a school and how that might change everything.

Yeah, Shaq and Chris Jackson, who then became McMatto Dora, but those guys being on OSU together was like

Penny going to Memphis.

But the fact that this movie was so explicitly broadcast as being about recruiting and about bringing these guys in, and it was very obviously going to be like, this is like UCLA.

You know what I mean?

And there was a bunch of real coaches, real players were going to be in it.

It was like, I think you were almost led into believe, like, this is going to be basically a movie version of my college basketball fandom.

And it wound up being like, Hey, but it was directed by the guy from The Exorcist.

And this whole thing is about as about as morally upright as New York City was during the French Connection.

Yeah, and you know, at that point,

just back to the Shaquille O'Neal thing, at that point, there was just so much interest in him.

Yeah.

Like,

in a way that I don't know, I mean, I guess LeBron, right?

Like, in terms of all those college, like Fab 5, Shaq,

Leightner, those guys were like massive stars.

And Shaq didn't do the thing that a lot of players do where they play four or five years in the league and then they go, you know what?

I want to be a multimedia star.

I want to rap and I want to do all of that stuff after they've gotten their feet wet in basketball.

No, Shaq got into

our

cultural sphere and was like, I'm going to do all of these things and you guys are going to deal with Shaquille O'Neal as an entertainment force for like the rest of

Backlash for it.

Right.

He did to a lot of people.

We were on a tech start talking about that.

And I was saying how I thought it took a while for Shaq to become kind of, he was pretty polarizing.

Like because he was trying to, he was trying to be in movies.

He was trying to rap.

He was doing commercials.

And there was this attitude of like, you haven't earned any of this yet.

Like, win a playoff series.

What, what is this guy doing?

What I'm saying is that was a testament to the fact that you could become a real deal superstar

off college basketball.

Like, and you could become like this complete household name

based on what you did in college basketball, like a Christian Leitner did or Patrick Ewing.

Chris mentioned Mark Macon.

I was like, I was invested in Mark Mankin.

I really liked his game.

But there was like 50 of those dudes.

That year, Kenny Anderson was with

D.

Scott, who's the third guy, Brian Auver.

Lethal Ep and three.

We love that team.

I remember watching a March Madness game late night with those guys.

They're on the West Coast, hoping, you know, we and what do i care about georgia and before we started recording you mentioned the nolan richardson 48 minutes or 40 minutes of hell or whatever yeah these teams all had like weird identities

some based on the coach like night in indiana was the best something like it would be like there were the teams that ran this very smooth like like like incredibly elegant offenses then there were the like slammed their hands on the core defensive teams and there were the run and gun teams there were the teams where you're like man like we're yeah they're definitely

tark whoever tark is currently the prep school killers from duke yeah and then like the like the the the ucla at obey the o'bannon brothers with toby bailey and cameron dollar and all of these different guys it was it was like a legitimate there was a whole landscape of stars to choose from in college and they were there for three or four years yeah and you and ov duke was kind of that and then uh in the Weber timeout game, the Leightner shot.

There are all these like beats.

Hank Ather's dying was like

probably the biggest?

Is that 98?

Fab 5 started in 91.

Kind of went through.

So this comes after Fab Five, right?

I got, well, I'll save.

I have a Fab Five thing for this, but we also have Friedkin directing,

which was a big deal for the movie nerds.

And I was like becoming a movie nerd, but didn't really fully understand the impact of how weird that would be to have this guy who did the French Connection and The Exorcist, who just knew he was a good director.

Didn't have a shitload of it.

But obviously, he has a pretty

dim opinion of humanity.

You know what I mean?

Like, I think he's like, we are all basically corrupt hustlers.

Yeah.

But love basketball.

There's this crazy backstory with him where he was this massive Celtics fan and had a chance to buy the Celtics in the end of the end of the late 70s.

Does he know this whole story?

There's this guy, Irv Levin, who ended up switching franchises with John Y.

Brown.

Freaking could have been Shishim.

Irv Levin.

John Y.

Brown owned the Clippers.

Irv Levin owned the Celtics.

irv levin didn't want to own the celtics anymore because he couldn't deal with red our back and the fans were mean to him because he didn't live in boston and he freedken was this huge celtic fan he's like i'll i'll let you buy one third of the team and you can run it and freakin was like a famous director there's you can read this he tells the whole story and he's really thinking about should i do this

And then ultimately decided not to do it.

They switched franchises.

That's how the Clippers end up moving to LA.

John Y.

Brown sells and we get Larry Bird.

Did you ever meet Freakin?

no but i i i had no idea until i did the research what a massive fan he was and it's why koozy's in this oh yeah because he was friends with koozie like he asked koozie for advice and then spoiler alert koozie wins the movie like this is an all-time incredible bob koozy but he's also a natural actor yeah

yeah and he has the free throw scene uh cr is this a nick nulty movie a jt walsh movie or a shaq movie for you it's a nulty movie okay i think it the the two things in my mind that i keep turning over about what ifs with this movie are what if somebody different played Pete Bell and what if Ron Shelton had directed it?

I think if Shelton directs it, it probably has a lot more humor.

It's more fun.

And there's a little bit more warmth to it.

And I think Nulty is perfectly cast because these coaches do have this kind of like irascible, never happy vibe to them.

Like you never saw Beheim smile.

You never see Tom Izzo really smile until the end of the season.

Like these guys are always screaming.

They're always coaching.

And Nulty really brings that out.

I don't know what it would have been like if Redford Redford had been Pete Bell or something.

Yeah, and in a weird way, it's almost the most realistic possible version of this.

It's interesting because he's obviously doing his Bobby Knight thing, right?

In which he

shadowed him.

No, you know what it is.

What?

It's Bobby Knight crossed with Jack Cates.

Oh, there you go.

Ah, this sucks.

But there's something else.

Give my girlfriend the high-hard one.

But

I'm here.

Ah, Jesus.

Shercroft loser like you.

But

there's something else that we never got to see from Bobby Knight.

Every time we saw Bobby Knight, he was either being like, you know, kind of a rascal, like very humorous,

picking at people, or, you know, being a guy who was right on the edge of being too intense and then obviously crossed over that edge later on.

But they do something in this movie where they show you.

times where Pete has to humble himself, where he has to like contend with the fact that he doesn't have a handle on his team anymore.

He He has to kind of ask his ex-wife for some ass a little bit and get rejected.

Like they kind of knock him off the perch of all-powerful college basketball coach.

Yeah.

And that is why the character works.

Plus, you can just walk around apparently in this part of LA where the university is, just have a walk back home to your house.

There's no people anywhere.

What part of LA is this?

Where is this?

It's like something that's like, it's UCLA, but it looks more like USC, but it also looks like Louisiana.

It's a giant arena that has no parking lots and no parking and just houses right outside

and no people.

The interesting thing is you probably could walk home if you're the coach of UCLA.

You definitely can't walk home if you're the coach of SELA.

Right, right.

So you definitely don't want to be walking around down there.

But I always thought it was supposed to be UCLA because of the colors and all of that.

But they're on SEC.

Well, one of the things with this movie, and it was a big part of the marketing and Friedkin talking about it and just in general, it was like we are going to do basketball correctly we're going to have real players playing real games we did all this we had patino coaching a team against nick nulty with the players everything was like

boom same thing with bobby knight there's all these stories about bobby knight taking it too seriously they filmed it in indiana in front of a crowd of 6 000 people and they're like we are now elevating the sports movie and it doesn't totally work it turns out there's still some good stuff in actually just structuring sports movie scenes I think basketball is the hardest sport to shoot.

Yeah.

I just think over and over again with, you know, White Man Can't Jump works because it's two on two.

I think full court five on five basketball is so difficult.

It's why the angles, like, it's like when they change the angle in an actual game, you're watching like an NBA game.

You're like, please just go back to the

as soon as they are like, here's a

baseline shot of this.

I'm like, no, I want to see coaches angle.

Yeah.

And it's like, I think that that is

whether it would have been freaking or Scorsese or Coppola or PTA, like five on five hoops is just incredibly difficult to capture.

That's why some of the 70s stuff, I mailed you a white shadow pickup basketball scene yesterday.

Some of the 70s stuff, they just didn't overthink it.

They were just like, I'll let it go.

Hey, wag camera, let's just watch some guys playing.

And then they, as soon as they try to get fancier, Hoosiers has some good stuff and some bad stuff.

The thing that I like about you is when you have an agenda, that agenda is all-encompassing.

I like the 70s basketball footage.

You love white shadow so much.

He kind of wants to do white shadow instead of Blue Chips.

Now it's too dated.

It's like 50 years.

But

now it's like Coach Carter, we had that finding Forest or Coach Carter era of basketball where they went back to the wide shots.

Oh, I like that.

You got back into the, you went from White Shadow to Coach Carter.

So it's kind of like those were the basketball movies.

Like a DEI thing you did.

No, they went.

They went backwards, though, and they stopped being like, we're going to be right on the court.

We're going to go.

Here's the wide shot again.

And then the Wayback, I think, did a good job.

Oh, The Wayback is like, like, you know how I feel about that movie.

Yeah.

That's a completely underrated sports movie.

I'll say this.

It's properly rated because we're doing it this year in the rewatchable.

Oh, right.

I'll say this.

This movie was attempting to do something that I think they, I do agree with you.

They overthought it because they're trying to shoot the game from the coach's perspective and put us right on the bench where you can see that the team comes out.

They're playing with a lot of energy.

And then the game is getting away from them.

And you watch the coach just

unable to control the fact that he just doesn't have the talent and you're supposed to be able to see that and it just doesn't quite work.

But every time I watch this movie,

something always dawns on me.

You watch so many basketball movies where they're playing basketball, nobody is sweating, nobody looks like they're into it.

This does have the feeling because competitiveness.

Yes.

Of the competitiveness, of that, the fact that they're actually playing basketball at a high level and trying to beat each other.

So when the drama comes and it looks like

his team is overwhelmed, that kind of does work.

But the basketball itself doesn't work that well.

Widescreen helped it a little more during the Square TV era when this was rewatchable.

Combined with how they shot it, it was really hard to follow the basketball.

And then you'd watch like Teen Wolf.

Yeah.

And you'd be like, man, these basketball scenes are great.

My favorite basketball scene in this one is probably the Indiana game because I find it very easy to like kind of navigate Bobby Hurley on the court.

And I feel like it, that that was the one where maybe it's just because I was so familiar with Bobby Hurley at the time.

Really missed his game.

I liked his.

But it's like that's good.

That kind of

car accident.

Yeah.

His car accident is kind of underrated.

I think he would have been a good player.

Little swaggy, confident, right playmaker.

Tough cherse.

Yeah.

Tough.

Steal the ball like was an all-time favorite college.

He coaches Arizona State now?

Yeah, yeah.

In any case, he just directs traffic in a way where you're kind of like, oh, you're right.

Like, there's a pick and he's going to come over over there.

Old school that stuff is good, but they don't actually even flash to the scoreboard that much.

I mean, Western gets their asses kicked most games of this movie, except for towards the end.

You know what I mean?

Except for that very long time.

I have a lot of thoughts on that basketball.

I'm going to say one more thing about the basketball.

Do you know what the best basketball in the movie is to me?

The practices.

Yeah.

Yeah.

The practices to me.

And the coaching in the practices.

And the coaches in the practice.

Put your leg behind him when he's spinning around.

I like all that.

Like all of that.

Gets his hand right up on Ricky Rose's cheeks.

Yeah, he's like right there.

Get out of here, Ricky.

Right over the front of the rim, butch.

Unlock the left hip.

Take your jersey off, right?

Go with the blue team.

Like all of that stuff, the practices are the stuff to me that actually grounded the movie in being actual college basketball and authentic.

You know what I mean?

When I tried to recruit Van for the ringer and he's like, I want 30K in a gym bag and a tractor.

I said, get out of here, man.

Take that.

You don't even have to wear it.

Then two days later, he was working for us.

It was like, like, it never happened.

Never understood that part of blue chips.

With the, with the pay stuff,

so the movie kind of shifted, especially as in the last 10 years, people are like, these guys got to get paid.

And that whole thing.

By 2023, Esquire was writing, Shelton and Friedkin seem to be foreshadowing the everyone sells out influencer culture of the 21st century.

Interesting idea.

I don't know if I 100% agree with it, but it does foreshadow something.

I don't know if it was intentional because I really think they were just in the moment.

I think they were saying the quiet part loud, which is like, these guys deserve to get paid.

This is a multi-billion dollar business and the players deserve to get paid.

But we did this in the 70s, though, with one-on-one and with

Fast Break, because those are the same premises.

Like, how can we cheat to win basically in college basketball?

Sure.

I think also like

there's an argument to be made that a lot of what happy says is like kind of makes sense.

Do you know what I mean?

Like where he's just like, the collectives will take care of these people.

You don't have to know about it.

Like, happy kind of is.

Let's do it now.

Which is, which is is why the gambling stuff is in there with happy because if it's not right, then what happy is actually but even the gambling stuff now is like almost quaint.

Tony shaving points in a victory to miss the line is yeah, yeah, well, I mean, yeah, but it's still that at least still has enough of a stench to it that it is actually affecting somebody's giving less than what they should be competition-wise.

You're right, yeah, but with happy has the gambling stuff only because Happy is making so much sense when he's talking to Coach Bell that he wouldn't be villainous.

Just talk about happy.

I love happy.

You love the pool.

I love it.

I love just the random women in the pool for no reason.

JT Walsh does something so crazy.

Like, it's so swaggy.

JT Walsh Walsh goes out on his diving board as he's dressing down Coach Pete and is just bouncing on the diving board.

He's like, for you to talk to me, fucking fucking make it work.

I'm bouncing on the two Playboy Playmates.

What does he say about them when he introduces them to Pete?

He's like, they're both huge fans.

The movie could have easily taken a he got game term right there for Coach Bell.

The problem with this movie is Happy is by far the most interesting character in the movie.

He has that one scene.

He's dressed up to play tennis.

What do you think Happy does?

That's a good question.

Like, you think Happy's in Hollywood in some way?

I think he'd probably made all his money in.

I feel like he's like a film producer.

He's like,

he has a lot of time to worry about western basketball well he plays he's the tennis bar too

if i ever got divorced i'm just turning into happy it's just gonna be like dressed to play tennis all the time doing phone calls

bouncing on the diving board run the harvard western cougars two cougars at the pool and i'm just trying to boost that pull across them wasn't no cougars you go

those were the well the ones he introduced to coach those are those those were 25-year-old women.

What are you talking about?

Those were cougars.

Those were in like their 40s.

Christy Brinkley, what are you talking about?

Late 30s?

No, Bill.

No, no.

Which ones are we talking about?

The arguments like in the bar.

Those babies are in the bars.

All right, you're right.

They're definitely not.

Yeah, don't argue white women with me.

Don't do that.

But I'm saying, happy is the man.

Happy is the one.

Hey, is there somebody you can call to tell me whether or not, you know, if I leave school and my mom, the mom will lose a house and job, calls him.

Hey, he's the coach.

You're the coach.

Get him to play.

His mom's got a house with a yard.

I'm like, talk your shit, happy.

Get out there and stop acting like a bitch.

He didn't know how to be in a motion offense.

No, he didn't.

He needs to be in a different offense.

He needs to be in a 1-4.

What the fuck's going on there?

Where you can handle the ball and ditch to other people.

You know what's really good?

Is emotion offense.

It's so funny.

Where's the go back and watch this movie and listen to all that terminology and just be like, you almost have PTSD from basketball practice of guys yelling that out?

Like, you're just like, one, four, two, three, like, two, three, four.

Yeah, like, like, box of one.

And now it's all like flare.

Watching people run a three-man weave and all of that stuff.

So, Nolty's having, he's coming off the resurgence when he cleaned up a little bit.

Yeah.

Another 48 hours down and out in Beverly Hills, like he's Cape Fear.

Tides is

Prince of Tides.

He's, he's a pretty famous star.

So they build it as a Nick Dolte movie and they made a big deal.

He shadowed Bob Knight.

He modeled Pete Bell after Bob Knight.

So we had that.

We had the Shaq and Penny stuff.

And I got to say, I think Shaq's good in this movie.

Shaq takes a lot of shit for his acting.

I think he's like borderline stealing scenes when he's in there.

I love every time he's in there.

Yeah.

He's really funny.

He's very funny.

He's very funny.

They let Shaq kind of be Shaq in the movie.

Yeah.

He's a bright spot, which is good because every other athlete that acts in the movie is fucking terrible.

Yeah.

It's tough.

I don't know.

I thought Penny was okay in the home shit.

No.

Like, it

one thing that I learned that I not learned, one thing that sparked my brain while I'm watching this is athletes as actors has come really, really far.

And it's probably because these guys are so used to being on camera now.

They're on camera every day.

Oh, that's a good point.

Like Anthony Edwards and Hussell.

Yeah, like they're just used.

They're performers.

It's better and they didn't get as many reps.

I like that.

That's the day as they do now.

But there's some rough, rough athlete acting in this movie.

It's also like a really Dr.

J was the nadir it's officially saved pittsburgh choice for penny and and shaq to do it honestly for all of the people who participated in this movie to do it because it's a pretty dim portrait of college basketball right like i mean the craziest thing is they let indiana use the uniforms of bob night i just have no idea what the nca was thinking with that and nitpicks if you're gonna let indiana do it then why do we have to get fake teams everywhere else western texas yeah texas state or whatever it was like hey we're gonna do we're going to do a movie about

digital media and the corruption and terrible stuff.

Can we use all the ringer studios and all your logos?

I'm like, sure.

Go ahead.

You're a color.

Do you want to put Craig Horlback in it?

Like, I just don't understand why they would even participate in this.

I will say, Tony is a good actor.

I think he's an actor.

I think he's an actor.

He is an actor.

I know him a little bit.

He is, but he's awesome.

Here we go.

All right.

All right.

He's dropped.

I know Tony from Blue.

Oh, my God.

But he's actually an actual real basketball player.

Anthony C.

Hall, right?

Yeah, he's a real basketball player.

He was the only one they cast because he actually could act.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So we have Petino Knight Raveling, Koozie Bird.

Talk about the legend in a second.

Tarkanian.

Some of the players, Alan Houston,

George Lynch, Wex Walters, Greg Graham, Chris Mills,

our guy, Rick Fox.

Boy, Calvert Cheney.

Cal Cheney.

Is there Cal Cal Cheney in this?

So there's a lot of people that it's this glimpse.

And I could have done this for probably unanswerable questions later, but I'll do it now.

I don't know where the fuck the fab fibe is.

Like Jalen, Jalen not being in this personally offends me.

Have you ever talked to Jalen about this movie?

No, I wish we could almost like call him and find out.

You should make it call Jalen Rose instead of call Russell.

I don't like he's right there.

He's as famous as any player they used, and he would have been perfect.

And honestly, he could have played Tony.

Yeah.

I feel like Jalen could have acted.

Yeah, probably, yeah.

Um, kind of the same story: like you go up to Detroit instead of going up to Chicago.

Like, yeah, you know what?

When I did in doing the research for the movie, they say that Kevin Garnett is in the movie somewhere.

I cannot find Kevin Garnett in the movie.

He's too young.

Yeah, he would have been like

16 years old.

They say he's in the movie.

Oh, maybe he maybe is a high score.

Yeah.

Geert Hammack is in the movie, though.

Oh, yeah.

Remember Geert?

Yeah.

From LSU.

Yeah.

So the backstory, ron shelton developed it in 1981 for time life films bounced around the whole decade ends up at 21st uh 20th century fox

script goes and turnaround and then wet men can't jump hits and they're like whoa this movie um paramount pictures acquires it buries it and then sherry lansing the famous sherry lansing who is green light married to freaking at the time or dating him there might have been some romantic something

um Gets Friedkin because Shelton can't do it because he's writing and directing Cobb, which is an insufferably bad movie.

Like, if you want to have a bad two hours, watch Cobb.

I have tried over and over.

Just watch adolescence and then watch Cobb.

Oh, my God.

I've tried so hard to like that movie.

And everything's perfect about it, except the fact it's unlikable and not fun at all to watch.

I've tried so hard.

Like, Cobb was online.

A couple of months ago, it's not a watchable movie.

It doesn't work.

So that's why he didn't do it.

Basketball scenes filmed at Frankfurt High in Indiana.

And Friedkin was talking about finding basketball players who could act

because real actors just don't work in basketball movies.

They kept changing the script and then eventually did the Pete versus Bobby Knight

last game, and they could not convince Bobby Knight to basically throw the game.

And

he was telling his guys what to do on defense and fucked up two different versions of the ending before they finally got the

mob.

But they said it was like

just full games, play pickup as hard as you can.

We're filming everything.

And then they had a couple set plays at the end and that was it.

$35 million budget made $26 million.

A rare loser of money for the rewatchables, but I bet it made it back in DVD and all that.

Yeah, and it's still, I feel like it's still around in the culture and it still gets referred to a lot.

Yeah, it beat its box office for sure.

Our guy, Raj, what do you think?

He didn't fuck with it.

I think he liked it.

Three stars?

Yeah.

Okay.

What Friedkin brings to the story is a tone that feels completely accurate.

The movie's a morality play told in the realistic, sometimes cynical terms of modern, high-pressure college sports.

I have a question for you guys.

Is the 90s the best sports movie decade?

I mean, it's my sports movie decade.

Blue Chips, The Program, White Man Can't Jump Above the Rim, 10 Cup, Rudy, Necessary Roughness, Little Big Lee, He Got Game, Rookie of the Year, Hoop Dreams, Jerry Maguire, Any Given Sunday.

Sunday.

Varsity Blues that you know?

Yeah.

So, like, you're looking at a complete, it's not just, because some of these movies are like super laudable.

McGuire's in there, too.

Yeah, it probably is.

It's like, it's like Jerry Maguire, yeah.

They're definitely the most.

It's like the sons of the Rocky era.

The ones I revisit the most.

I don't know if there's, with the exception of Maguire, it's not really, but like a movie like, say,

Rocky or Moneyball that kind of transcended out of sports movies to become like a critically acclaimed film as much.

I don't know.

I think the 90s were the best because they made the most of them.

They learned from all the mistakes from the other generation, but then the model kind of worked.

Like, this is my friend Mike Toland.

He made like seven of these.

Like, he made Varsity Blues, Coach Carter, Summer Catch.

Like, he just kept making them over and over again because it worked every time.

You'd make them for 15 million and they'd make 30 million in the box office.

I think that the money kind of shifted against it eventually.

But I just think they made like a shitload of them.

I also think that.

So I think you're right.

Sports.

The sports culture was at a point to where there were more things to litigate.

That's true.

So they were just, it,

the underdog story is something about sports that will always work.

But when you get to the 90s, now you're talking about marketing.

You're talking about agents.

Like some of these, some of these movies are about sports culture.

But you know what changed?

What?

Documentaries come at the end of the 2000s.

Yeah.

That's when the sports docs came in and the content was immediately as good as a lot of these sports movies and doing the same themes.

And some of them, it's like, I'd rather watch the great documentary of this.

I'd rather watch The Last Dance than a Michael Jordan movie.

Or I'd rather watch YouTube highlights as it's happening because everything was filmed in.

Yeah.

It was just less access.

And

I think that the territory was just ripe, which is why I

still like

air.

I loved air.

I did too.

And I loved air because I'm like, huh, I want to know.

Air could have been done as a documentary.

Yeah.

But I want the dramatic version of all of that shit happening.

So anyway, I just, when I, when I was doing research and I looked at all the movies, I'm like, wow, like this is a very, very deep decade for the sports movie.

I used to,

when I had my old site, I would always write about sports movies.

And then when I got to ESPN, I would do reviews every time.

And it got.

pretty dark in the mid-2000s.

They were kind of running out of ideas.

Like after Friday Nightlights or whatever.

We moved into like this kind of gridiron gang era of these like specific ideas they were trying to do and there'd be one big star what was that movie with josh lucas was another one oh

one star for the poster that was baton rouge one star for the poster they'd kind of cheap out on everyone else they try to make it for a certain amount of money they're a little bit of the same movie you'd already seen type going to be an inspirational story rather than

a slapshot or this or something where it's like oh you know what i just like watching dudes curse while they play sports um let's take a break and then we'll do the categories.

This episode is brought to you by Loom by Atlassian.

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All right.

This is a fun one.

What's the exact perfect age to see this movie?

I'm going to say like

14, 15 when you're a college basketball junkie, but I don't know if 14 and 15 year olds are college basketball junkies anymore.

I went with, I went with 13.

Yeah.

12 or 13.

I went a little bit younger.

But now, if we're talking about now, I'm actually

not sure.

It might be 45.

It might be a little older.

Yeah.

But for me, I saw it at the perfect age.

Yeah.

And I was like 12 or 13.

I would have said 16 in 1994.

Like, oh, Shaq.

Yeah, that's basically what I was.

Yeah.

Most re-watchable scene.

Possibilities.

Pete Bell's first scene.

Awesome.

Fantastic.

Comes back in two times, just yelling at them, comes back.

He's the dumbest team I've ever coached.

It's some good nothing.

It's a good way to start a movie.

Every time we get ready to play, I just want to throw up.

I'm goddamn sick of watching you guys play.

There's not one of you, not one of you, that's learned how to win.

We got hammered the last four games, and it stops right now.

If you keep playing the way you're playing, we're gonna get an ass beat again tonight.

So depressed, I don't even want to talk about it.

I'm through fighting, you sons of bitches!

You're the dumbest king I ever coached.

You guys think of something.

It's also like an interesting gambit.

Nulti's such a vulnerable actor.

He really doesn't need big glory moments and in fact seems to hunt the opposite.

You think about all of his characters like like Kate's character in Princess Tide, Prince of Tides, this.

He's just a punching bag, man.

And when he comes on screen, you're like, oh, this is going to be cool.

He's going to like give them a motivational speech.

It's an anti-motivational speech.

And then, like, just the way that you contrast him with Patino.

Like, Pete's hunched over.

Patino's standing tall and is like, you're a great official.

That's why you're the best.

He just goes smooth.

Yeah, I love you.

I love you.

And that was like Pete Petino then.

Yeah, Pete's wearing every loss.

Next thing, Koozi shooting free throws.

Wow.

You're the only person in America who makes this three watches.

Oh, my God.

Well, let me give you some backstory.

Watched an interview with Bob Kuzzy yesterday.

He said Nolte suggested this because Nolte was kind of a jock.

And Nolte's idea was, you will do the scene.

You shoot a free throw when you miss.

I'll get the ball, then I'll shoot.

We'll go back and forth because he kind of wanted to show off his free throw shooting.

And Kuzi said he made 21 in a row when they filmed it.

So in the movie, he makes 10 straight, including a lefty.

And Nolte's like, don't you ever miss?

Yeah.

And that, which was ad-lib because Nick Dulte was getting pissed because he thought, when am I going to get to shoot my free throws?

But the whole scene's good too, because he's like, you got horses.

What you need is thoroughbreds.

But Kuzi can barely say thoroughbreds because he had the French accent.

But then we get the two reasons.

I'm incapable of cheating.

One

French accent?

Hey, Bob Kuzzy is French.

He's a French immigrant.

That's why he had that weird, he couldn't say all this.

I thought that was always just like a Boston accent.

No, he's like this French, then the Boston.

That's why there were like certain people.

When did he come to America?

His parents were like French immigrants.

But, like, when did he come to America?

He probably born there or came earlier.

I can't remember, but yeah, he was a French accent.

How about that?

I didn't know that.

You can learn more about that watching the Celtics documentary on that.

His character, you don't even have to really think about it as Bob Koozi.

Well, he's allegedly named Vic, but you know,

he's like this

kindly figurehead who's kind of like, ah, what I don't know.

I don't know.

You know what I mean?

But it's like, we're a good program, but it's like, you're guys are fucking cross.

He's doing the Tom Hagen.

Yeah.

It's like, ah, we went to the matches.

I have no idea what's happening.

You feel the worst for him.

You feel the worst for him when Pete Bell goes off on his thing and they go back to Koozi and he's just putting his hands on because the AD's got to go too.

They're going to get rid of everybody.

Wait, so you guys are telling me Bob Koozie hitting 10 straight free throws during a scene?

Yeah, well, I can't beat anybody with banners.

I need players.

I need horses.

You got horses.

What you need are thoroughbreds.

Well, everybody in the country is buying these kids out of high school, giving them cars, money under the table.

God knows what.

Don't you ever miss?

That's the idea of the game.

Put the ball in the hole.

Isn't rewatchable for you?

The guy was like 70.

I'm sure you'd agree with fucking legend.

He said the crew was going nuts after.

What?

Crew was going nuts.

J.J.

Reddick was here right now.

The crew was going nuts.

You should start saying that about yourself.

Like when I was interviewing McShay,

oh my God, Sarudi was going nuts.

Everybody was applauding me.

Well, Kuzi tells the story that the day before they filmed the scene with Shaq and he missed like 14 of 15 free throws.

Yeah, but Kuzi can't fucking do that.

Kuzi can't do shit.

Why is the way you do?

Listen, you saw what he can do.

He's the best basketball player in the first 15 years of the league.

How dare you?

Go hang out with JJ Reddick.

Multiple MVP.

Eight-time champ.

They applauded him.

The crew.

He's an American.

He's a French-American.

The crew applauded Bob Koozie.

Just said, Shaq was super free.

Josie could.

Bob Koozy showed up, Shaquille O'Neal.

He literally says that in the interview.

He said the crew reacted because Shaq was so bad the day before.

Oh, my God.

It's on YouTube.

We can run a social video right now.

Bob Koozy will say this in a YouTube quick

next siege.

So my favorite part of this movie is when he goes recruiting.

It's awesome.

This is the best 15-minute stretch by far.

I love seeing Butch McRae in Chicago.

I love the gimmick of the other coaches there at every stop.

He's getting like

the red carpet.

So

we get to see real Penny Hardaway highlights, him just kicking ass in some Chicago gym.

Some guys really willing to take some smaller roles.

Edo G.

In like three scenes.

Yeah.

Robert Wool is in one scene.

Alfrey Woodard.

Alfrey Woodard's one scene.

Is this the origin story of Arlis?

He might have been wool.

Oh, man.

I haven't thought about that show in a long time.

I thought Gossett was great.

Fantastic.

One scene.

Uncredited.

This is like after Toy Soldiers.

Like, it wasn't like he wasn't red hot.

Yeah, he had already won an Academy Award.

Yes.

No, but I'm saying Toy Soldiers, I got a little worried about Lou.

It's kind of awesome to, if you know.

Rewatchables, I love that movie.

It helps to know a little bit about college hoops and recruiting at that time period or whatever.

But like, he comes out of that office and you're like, I know this guy is.

He's the dude who runs this Catholic school.

He always has

a fucking awesome

kid.

Yeah, but he does look out for their best interests and he knows all these guys.

And for whatever reason, Pete and him are good.

When he comes out and he like

positions this as essentially a slave auction, right?

Yeah.

You can tell that he's having fun with it, but he has a cynical enough opinion of it to keep these guys in line.

And he can read and write that whole thing.

It's, it's, it's perfect.

Alfred Woodard

sucking a cancer stick at one point there, CR.

Maybe has the line of the movie when Pete's like, what's he going to become?

And she's like, a millionaire?

Yeah.

She wants a job in a house.

Then we go to see the legend in Indiana.

Why are you grunting?

I'm grunting because we're about to,

he knows where this is going.

He knows where he's going.

You can't help himself.

He's grunting because it's the same feeling I just had.

Just get it off your chest.

Do it.

First of all, only movie he's been in.

Okay.

You know where they filmed it, though?

In French Lick.

What was his house?

French Lick.

Okay.

You know what else was filmed in that house?

What?

The greatest commercial of the 80s.

Yeah.

That was the same drive.

Pete drives down the same driveway that Magic drives down in the limo for the Converse commercial, which was the day that they became friends.

They became boys.

I thought Larry's not terrible as an actor.

I don't think their eyelines are matched up.

So at one point, like Pete's like looking over here and talking to Larry Bird, and Larry Bird's like, hey, coach.

Yeah, hey, coach.

How are you?

Larry has enough aura, like the kids say, aura, to just kind of Larry Bird his way through any scene.

Yeah.

So when you see Larry Bird and Larry Bird is like keeping it like 100% real with him, just, you know, tell me what you want.

You want to, it's, it works.

Do you think Larry Bird in 94 was still just going out into the hot Indiana sun and getting shots up?

Or was he

I had something for this later, but the, the, the short answer is no.

He had like two back surgeries.

There's no way.

He's like, I'm just going to go out and shoot some pickup.

I have like get my own forgery, three surgery repaired hernated discs.

I'm just going to go shoot some get some shots.

Get my own free throw misses.

Then we go see Neon in Algiers.

Give us the Algiers scouting report.

Well, because it seems hard to get there.

Well, it's West Bank, New Orleans.

It's not as hard as they made it seem.

It seems like they're going to like cute jungle crazy.

They made it seem like, but we laughed at that because, you know, in Louisiana, when people go to Louisiana in a movie, they always make it seem like you got to ask an alligator directions when you're getting around the state.

It's not like that.

No, it's not.

It's West Bank, New Orleans.

So you do have to like, I don't know that you have to go through the swamp.

Yeah, to get to get there.

There There are places like that, but they're further south in the state.

Listen, don't spoil this for me.

I like this movie gimmick.

It's like the deepest recesses of America.

You need it.

Only one guy can get you there.

With silk, and you got to get through that and come back.

You got to climb a hill.

Can I ask one question about the recruiting

visit with

Bell, with Ricky Bell?

No, no, Ricky Rowe.

I have a lot of Ricky Rowe thoughts.

Was that race

by his father?

The First Baptist Church, Second Baptist Church.

Well, did I detect some racialisms?

Second Baptist Church more black was the infrared Baptist.

Southern Baptist.

Southern Baptist.

Because I was like, I always thought that he was just, but then I watch it now with my race eyes.

And I was like,

that's a good video gimmick.

Race eyes.

I can find it in his

race eyes.

Infrared race eyes.

Dad watches Bob Koozi Koozie make free throws with race eyes.

They're trying to make Shaq look bad with this.

Yeah, exactly.

So like, what, was he, was he being racist?

Like, I think that there were some undertones.

I don't really know a lot about it.

I think Indiana has like the greatest history with this.

The most KKK is.

Jim Beaver really good, though, is Ricky Rowe's dad.

Yep.

Yeah.

Yeah, I think there was a whiff of something.

I fucked with Ricky Rowe the most, though.

I like this game.

Ricky Rowe was cool.

He just wanted girls and money, man.

Ricky Rowe, we lost him to an ACL.

Think about what modern medicine medicine could have done for Ricky Rose.

He's on the tractor right now, wondering what happened.

Wondering what happened.

That one year.

That's his whole career.

Bed's still out there getting 35 million.

Ricky Rowe's probably in the problems right now.

Nean and Algiers.

Ricky Rowe.

What's Ricky Rowan?

Ricky Rowe just got pardoned.

It was really easy to spot him.

He was 6'6.

Ricky Rowe is now the Secretary of Defense.

He was the one shooting baskets on Pelosi's trash can.

He's totally rise there but coach

520 you get 400 for signing your name yeah that was all it's all larked for him um i like all the shaq scenes i like when he brings the next one is when he brings shaq to mary mcdonald's kindergarten class or first grade class that's fun to play with the kids how gigantic he is how childlike he is and the shaq basketball scene in algiers is just fantastic he's playing in a basketball shaq in a barn in a barn like but somehow it's like seven nba players are there so there's a lot of questions about that pickup game they're playing like five on five half court and just exclusively throwing him alley oops right yeah and at one point he tries to block a shot and then gets the ball and then dunks it yeah it's like what are the rules here with no takeout at all algiers rules yeah

uh so how far is algiers from new orleans

algiers is new it's like it's like brockton you know it's not that hard to get algiers all right so it's a neighborhood so the big lesson is it's not nearly as hard to get there as they made it.

On the west bank of New Orleans, you take a ferry across the river to get there.

My favorite thing about the recruiting trip for Neon is that for about 40 years, if you had a scene in New Orleans, you could either use Suzy Q or Baby Please Don't Go.

And those are the only two songs you were allowed.

That's such a good point.

It's an awesome song.

What other songs could have been used?

House of the Rising Sun.

House of the Rising Sun is a good one.

But at this point, they would have dropped like Bling Bling or some classic cash money, some juvenile or some shit like that to let you know you and John.

I was going to do this later, but the lack of hip-hop in this movie when it came out.

You don't think Billy Freakin was rocking?

I had some missed opportunities later, but it's...

There's not a lot of hip-hop in White Man Can't Jump, though.

I'm just saying by 94.

We had some options.

It was more RPG.

We had options in 94.

We had options.

Next scene, J.T.

Walsh lays it out for Pete Bell.

You're a better coach, you're pissed off.

My money is untraceable.

CR, just you want to cook on this?

I know you love Happy.

I mean,

I just love, I love his brazenness in this.

And I love how they position this character.

He's not doing anything.

He's like, everybody is a cheater.

I'm just going to cheat better than everybody else.

When he brings those girls up to him, and he's like two big Dolphins fans.

But I have like a, I just feel like Happy essentially invents collect NIL collectives, right?

Like he's like a precursor for that, and he's just like friends of the program.

We owe them this money.

Yeah, these athletes generate millions of dollars from the university.

What do they get?

It's nothing.

What do you get?

You get a multi-year contract.

You get a six-figure shoe deal so your team can be a walking billboard, and that is all legal.

And then you get another six figures for that lousy TV show.

Get out of my face.

We owe them this money.

We owe it to him.

We owe them this money.

Can we just give him the Ruffalo Hannah Rubinik Partridge overacting word right now?

And did we throw him into the category?

It's up there.

I don't understand.

I mean, it's so good.

He's just going for it, but it is an overacting extravagant.

The only person competing with him is the assistant coach who's just like.

Freddy?

No, not Freddy.

The guy who's like, Tony's my guy.

Oh, that's right.

Tony is my guy.

Shut up, Freddy.

My favorite J.T.

Walsh scene of all time is in Outbreak.

Wow.

That's my favorite one where he's talking to the people.

He's only in it for the one time.

He was like, was anyone,

there was no other way.

You're with the president.

But this is, to me, the most JT Walsh of JT Walshiness that exists.

You want to go breakdown?

Breakdown is, to me.

It's like a stripped down JT Walsh.

Stripped down JT Walsh.

This is the most JT Walshy that JT gets.

Love JT Walsh.

Do you think in any of the scenes he should have dressed like Lieutenant Marketson?

I had that for later.

Okay, great.

We owe them this money.

We owe it to them.

I like the montage when everyone gets paid off.

Yeah.

Butch's mom gets a job in a house.

Corner office.

Ricky gets a tractor.

Ricky gets a gym bag with money.

Neon gets a Lexus, but makes the point that he didn't ask for it.

He didn't ask for it.

We're playing some cool music.

Neon's the only pure soul in the movie.

Fun one.

Next one, is Homesick.

We talked about that earlier.

I like that scene.

Happy telling Pete,

I own you.

Yeah.

I bought one of your boys, Coach.

I own you, Pete.

You're mine.

This is a minute after he says, I didn't break any rules, you did.

And then he's like, by the way, I own you.

I shave points.

I'm pretty sure you.

So does Happy shave points, or is he just aware that Tony did shave points?

He said he bought one of his

boys.

So Happy's just like getting a little crazy crazy there.

So he's like a booster, but he's also shaving points.

Like Happy's worst booster ever.

You know what?

For Happy, the action is the juice.

He needs a little fucking taste of Asperger.

So we go right into the point shaving game, which I is my favorite part of the movie.

Western U verse State, 1991.

Yeah.

What a clean program here, man.

We worked hard to keep this program clean.

I guarantee you didn't cover this spread that night.

It must have been heavy action in Vegas.

Somebody got rich.

It's the worst case of ballhamming I've seen in the two years I've been here.

Look, he was a freshman, Freddy.

He's making freshman mistakes.

Got a bad leg, too.

Don't forget that.

All night, all night mistakes, all night.

No signs at all that this game might have been shaved as we see Tony just throw the ball to the other team over and over again and look at the clock to see how the time is going.

I don't know how they.

Do you think this is a better point shaving scene or the one in the gambler yeah

i think it's gamblers the gamblers

a little more so it is cool how like they use video footage to like to start to like look at how he lets i like seeing the video cassettes too so this is the best scene in the movie i don't know if this is the most watchable scene in the movie but this is the best scene in the movie you hate freddy I hate dude Freddy's such a narcissist Freddy wasn't there he's just being I was in Oklahoma we did things through him

and the entire time Freddy doesn't have he doesn't have any skin in the game here because he didn't recruit Tony.

He's not hanging out with Tony.

Look at this kid.

He's just throwing it to the team.

Worst ball.

I bet the people in Vegas went crazy that night and he's pissing this fucking guy off.

They've just spent all of this time praising Tony and it just bills and bills and bills and bills and bills until it explodes.

That's the best thing in the movie to me.

Tony was my guy, all right?

My guy.

He's my guy.

It's also funny now because when you watch like mind the game and they're like, oh, yeah, that was the third quarter of a February game against Toronto.

And I read the back screen, like the assistant coaches are like, I think I remember this game.

It's like, it happened last year.

And you won.

Were you writing a novel?

What do you, why don't you remember this?

It's a good kid, man.

It's a good kid.

He is a good kid.

He plays acoustic guitar, you know?

Yeah.

And then Nick goes to go see MPPL.

And we get the Kid Cuddy Pursuit of Happiness Award for Best Needle Drop.

All of a sudden, Hendrix and all on the Watchtower.

It's the one time the movie gets supercharged by a song.

And those songs are so college.

Yeah.

It's also cool because that's the time when you realize like it feels more like a campus because he goes from the gym to the guy's housing over there.

And it's like, oh yeah, you could just run across here.

How do you feel about Pete's performance in this scene?

Son, you took the purest thing in your life.

You corrupted it for what?

He's talking about himself.

I think that that's the whole way of responsibility.

But he's talking about it.

But then Tony stays on the team?

Yeah.

He can't get rid of Tony.

Tony's going to go fucking tell everyone.

I wish you would keep me off the team.

But that's a more interesting scene.

What do you mean?

It was more interesting scene if like Tony going, am I off the team?

And Pete's like, you see the wheels going back?

He's more guilty than

I know, but I want to see that in the scene.

Like Tony actually has leverage over Pete.

I think the year before,

Pete would have kicked Tony off the team.

But I think that Pete's.

He's in too deep.

Yeah, he's frustrated that he kind of has to shut up and swallow this.

The big basketball scene I'm throwing in.

I enjoy enjoy Bobby Knight yelling at the refs.

I agree with your Bobby Hurley point.

Um, the last play is so terrible and out of

just what we're watching.

Has there ever been a game-winning alley-oop like that?

I know, like, the NC State thing happened, but like

I watched this scene more for the nitpicks, and I can't believe the music sound choices with this.

The music and the sound of this scene, it's such a fucking fuck up.

The crowd sounds bad.

I don't know what the there's like this weird droning synthesizer scene.

And I went back and I looked at all my favorite 1994 like hip-hop rap songs.

If you just put Holler if you hear me in here for four minutes, this, this scene's amazing.

Yeah.

And instead, it's like, he's, he's just got this weird droning synthesizer.

Or maybe the Randy Newman, the natural score

or short shot by the beasties was the other one I was thinking.

Like, you need like, this is fun.

We're watching people play basketball.

I need to like be tapping my leg as I'm watching it.

I think that they're going for high drama, though.

I disagree with the choice.

Yeah, I get it.

Yeah.

I mean, but you know, like above the rim, it's like, we know what we are.

We're going to have a really fun basketball scene here and there's going to be good music.

But that was street ball.

And this, and that's like supposed to have that raw energy of whatever.

This is supposed to be like more of a symphony of basketball.

Yeah.

I just didn't agree with it.

And then Pete's final press conference would be the last scene.

I'm going to agree.

Ed does the SVP CR.

He invented it.

I wouldn't be doing my job if I didn't ask you.

Coach, what is up with Neon's new Lexus?

Yeah, he's like, No, it's not a car, this is a fine automobile, you know?

Yeah, it would have been a hell of a deal.

No, it's a nuclear surfboard.

You guys asked me to win, and I gave that to you.

It's about money, it's the goddamn money.

Happy does a great meltdown.

I've become what I despise.

I've become what I despise.

Yeah,

I cheated my profession,

Cheated myself.

I cheated basketball.

There's two words I didn't think had ever come out of my mouth.

I didn't think I'd ever be able to say.

I quit.

I cheated my profession.

I cheated myself.

I cheated basketball.

I quit.

This is kind of the basketball version of

the now imagine she's white scene.

It's like where he gets all the way to the end.

He's like, I quit.

What do you got for most rewatchable?

The press conference.

Oh.

Yeah.

The press conference is the most re-watchable, but the Tony scene is the one that I'm always so gleeful to watch whenever I see the movie.

I love the point shavings.

I love the point shaving scene and Bob Cruz hitting 10 straight free throws.

Fucking man.

Also cool the way they shoot the point shaving is I think Nulty's in the back and they don't really it's not even in the focus.

It's the two coaches up front and Freddy talking shit.

Yeah, it's just Freddie makes that scene.

Freddy just like grating on the other coach.

Freddy's just like, if I was here, I would have noticed this, by the way, the first time.

Look at that.

He's throwing them by the other team.

What's he doing?

What's the most 1994 thing about this movie?

uh

i have a good one for this what do you got it's the sportscaster guy who's like it's time to tell pete bell to take a hike

like early jungle room yeah you know like

early seeds that guy's like he's probably the actual sports like broadcaster for the local news and they're like you can have 22 minutes after the get college games to do like your he's like rob fukazaki yeah and he's like okay i love rob that's his name but it's early takesmanship.

He's working on it.

And he also ruffles feathers when he interviews Pete Bell on the court.

Yeah.

And Pete Bell curses him off.

Don't mean to ruffle feathers, coach.

Good luck in the second half.

I like that guy.

Right now, that guy's out around the horn saying goodbye to everybody.

Young Shaq and young Penny, I put forget 94.

Skinny Shaq is definitely.

That's the most 94 thing.

I want to shout out VHS tapes and crappy TVs for coaching staffs.

Just how

digitally, now he'd be like, let's find that game, blah, blah, blah, press it up.

It would be a plasma.

I was like, when Pete goes over to Jenny's house the first time after they lose to Patino and he pours himself a glass of the good stuff and immediately goes to game tape, I was like, this is Bill.

This is what Bill would love to do every night is go home, pour a glass of the good stuff

and watch a little bit of it.

I can't believe you got bummed out by my around the horn joke.

No, it's great.

No, you got bummed out for a second.

I'm just saying.

I didn't realize you were a big around the horn guy.

I've been watching it in years.

Two points for you

mute uh

what's aged the best uh i got tony flunking tv

uh really like that i always loved the classes that they would come up for for for college hoops and jerry tarkanian saying butch mccrae couldn't make it at his school academically right um you know what's aged the best it's it's weird so this movie is supposed to be at ucla right it's their colors i mean it's technically yeah technically

it's a gesturing towards it yeah.

Right, it's actually UCLA that broke college sports.

Oh, banana.

Oh, banned, yeah, yeah.

And O'Bannon sued,

and that lawsuit

made it all the way up to the Supreme Court and then ushered in the NIL.

Was Tyus Edney on the O'Bannon teams, or is that?

I was enjoying Tyus Edney.

He got hurt.

I have a one of What's Age the Best off of that?

What's Age the Best?

Okay.

When sports movies

had to use Western Assist there, well, when they had to use like Western University, Big State,

they had to use these fake college names.

There's two Western Universities because the other one is in one-on-one with Robbie Benson.

Oh, yeah.

Same thing.

And I think they might have even had the same colour.

So, what is Western Texas Patino's team?

No, he's Texas.

What does he coach?

It was like, no, it was like Texas Western or Western Texas.

I really like some of the music in this movie with the

it's good um

the uh ricky rose outdoor hoop i wanted to shout out

when the the thing underneath it that rolls back just nice little touch the phrase friends of the program that's become a big podcast phrase all over the place i think i don't know if it started with this movie but uh i noticed that um

I like whether it bends the rules or not.

Doesn't bother me nothing because it ain't my rules.

Thought was a good quote

using brooms as fake shotbockers ban loved it

always

i thought i just thought a lot of the touches with the coaching the players was really high level all of that

i really like that part it's also like it feels very real when i mean obviously because they were actually playing games that they were just filming but patino and night coaching yeah felt very real like it felt like they were giving like actual instruction and the coaching stuff in the movie is actually they didn't really lean into it that much but the coaching stuff is actually really good because they were coaching against each other.

And it was like, don't guard this guy, don't guard that guy.

And then you hear the other guy trying to adjust off of that.

It was like a little deeper look into like the scheme and strategy of the game.

Yeah, it

was a good basketball nerd kind of stuff.

Even down to like when Nulty's, when Pete's like,

I'll go into the Indiana locker room and give Bob Knight our game plan because it doesn't matter.

I was like, fuck yeah.

Rick Petino in the closing credits of this movie is Richard Petino.

I just wanted to shout that out.

Do you think he was thinking maybe I'll move

Richard?

Honestly, like, kind of awesome in this movie.

Yeah.

I have him and Larry Bird and Bob Cousy all being awesome in a sports movie.

It's a Woodstage best.

There's a locker room sign in the Peep L locker room that says, what you see here, what you hear here, let it stay here when you live here.

That I just want to flag for later for the one more thing.

Here's my number one, though.

I almost feel like this should be a new category because we had this last week with Nicole Kidman asking if she should study neurosurgery for her crazy fun.

Jerry's like, Nicole, we're good.

Just show up and get your scenes on time and don't wear heels because you're already taller than Tom.

This research, Nick Nulty wrote a 200-page novel about Pete Bell to tap into his character's psyche.

That's all right, man.

And gave it to Friedkin.

And Friedkin's like,

yeah, it was okay.

You got to get the green light before you write the 200-page novel.

So is this a new rewatchables award?

Maybe it's conditional, the Nick Nolte's 200-page Pete Bell novel award for most ridiculous commitment to a movie.

Yeah.

Like, that's fucking insane.

Yeah.

He wrote a 200-page novel about Pete Bell.

Can we get it, though?

Would you do that on Ringer Books?

I imagine it's not good.

It might be awesome.

Freaking just might have had too much on his plate.

What's better, that or Nicole Kidman wanting to take some neurosurgery classes for things of that?

That's sort of response to Nicole Kidman, her being like, I really want to get into like

that's the category.

Craig, what should that category be?

Nick Dolte or Nicole Kidman?

Why can't we do both?

It's like overacting.

Let's just start compiling.

All right.

Both of them.

I'm going to mark that one down.

What did you have for Greg Shot Gordo, CR?

Just the push-in shot when Pete's giving his confession at the press press conference and it kind of goes over all of the audience.

I think

the neon basketball scene for some years in Algiers is just like

deep recesses of black America, where they play aggressive

life or death basketball.

Watch out for those alligators.

We get eaten.

It's a specific time because Silk and Pete get there just as they're playing.

They know what time they got to get there, what time the lions are out.

Denneth's Benny Hanna award for scene stealing location is either there, but I really like Butch's Gym in Chicago.

I thought that was great.

Those gyms where you could run laps around the top.

They had a few of those in Boston.

They have some in LA.

They have like ports where they have dead spots.

Yeah.

It's like, oh, you can't catch you from the left elbow.

That one's right.

To your point, that basketball actually looks good because they're shooting it like they're watching it from above.

Yeah.

No, that's the best basketball scene in the movie, bro.

Right.

And you can watch Butch get busy.

And you can see, and man, I gotta say something.

Something, something else about this movie that really ages well to me.

Just

it's just like how fucking awesome these guys were, man.

In their youth, just watching what's the best.

Everything that pre-enie surgery, Penny, yeah like a young thought the same thing ridiculously dynamic penny hardaway who was that far above the rim who could handle the ball like that who was that smooth i mean people don't remember him now but fuck man we remember him i i honestly feel like he was a one-on-one i haven't seen a a tall point guard like that who could really play the game who was who was so athletic

yeah he was like basically a 6'8 shooting guard who was a point guard yeah i don't even know who that is though

and unselfish was penny the first prop 48 wasn't there a big didn't he have like a big sports illustrated cover about

it was like prop 48 and it was like how he was going to go to memphis yeah i can't remember there was definitely an si cover with penny in when he was at memphis i mean he was first team on nba in 95 he was like 21 years old this was somebody that it's basically like whatever john moran is three years ago yeah um or edwards last year that's well i don't know they made the finals in 95.

i don't want to jump on prestige sequel prequel, but sequel with Penny coaching because he's coaching Memphis now.

Oh, Butch McRae?

Butch coaching now?

We are of the same brain.

That's the sequence of the movie.

It's not bad.

Butch's boys.

The Chess Rockwell and Brock Landers Award for best character name, which is turning into my favorite category.

Can I just make a case for Butch McRae?

Sure.

Butch McRae, just a great name.

Could be really anything.

Could be like the bad bad guy at American Gangster, could be the lead cop in a movie, yeah, could be like a musician.

I, I don't, there's just a lot to play with.

What year was this movie written?

94.

Well, it's written in the 80s.

That character was white.

Butch McRae.

Yeah, interesting.

And they, and when the movie, almost certainly, when the movie got made or like whatever,

they urbaned it up.

They wanted, they got, they want to bring Penny into it.

Then they added the scene with

Lewis Gossett Jr.

addressing the fact that his name is so white-sounding.

That character was white.

In general, Butch, great name.

Butch, great sports name over the years.

And then Ricky Rowe, I think, is saw it too.

But yeah, Neon Boudeau is the classic.

Let's take one more break.

Then we'll come back with CR's Flex.

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All right, CR, what do you got?

I'll go Vincent Chase here.

And I'm just going to say, despite the two natties, I'll reassure Pete Bell is a good coach.

As a recruiter, what is the shit with the lamp and the chair and the grandma and in Butch's room?

Like, does anybody get sold by that?

Like, oh, wow, what an offensive mastermind.

Yeah.

Maneuvered two toddlers and an 80-year-old woman with a cigarette.

So he's drawn up that bullshit.

It's pretty obvious.

Ricky is going to want the bag.

He tells him in the first place.

And then he asks so indignified by it.

Like, he's just so furious about it

and then finally like it seems like his big wrinkle as a coach once the team is put together his game plan is to throw two guys at calpert cheney yeah and it's just like all right well maybe maybe your time had passed as a as a basketball scout also maybe penny hardaway should have been in the one four yeah if you adjusted

that fucking guy justin he's he's unhappy he's out here his mom wants to keep the house and job maybe change your offense this is why coach bud is in in shambles right now he's trying to run this corner you know dude if you watch penny hardaway at that age for five minutes you'd be like i'll run whatever offense you want dude what do you want to do bro the offense is you throw alley oops to neon how about yeah how about we'll set you some picks and just go to the battle i have a feeling that p bill got a little tibbs in him that he that he was telling mikhil bridges to stand in the corner yeah just got a little my way or the highway you playing 90 minutes a game type situation yeah but the thing is is that patino calls him out in the first game where he's just like these guys aren't aren't in good shape yeah so it's like if you're not in good shape and you don't like to have sophisticated offense, what are you doing?

The way they had it, they made it seem like he had the same credentials as Bobby Knight did, like he'd won multiple national championships.

Which is another reason why I have this later in nitpicks.

We can get to it then.

But if you've got two national championships, you having one losing season is not going to make it.

I think he's had a couple that were like not good, though.

I think the whole Tony era has not been that good.

Right.

But like it's college.

Tony was shaving points.

It's college, right?

So like you watch Indiana go up and down for like a decade.

If Bobby Knights brought you two national championships, it's I'm just saying, like normally that guy's job is not going to really be in that much jeopardy.

2025 blue chips.

Tony's just betting the under on his player props.

I was going to make that joke, but I wasn't sure if it was a profit.

Like your two and a half rebounds.

The Butcher's girlfriend award for weak link of the film.

It's clearly.

the point shaving subplot and the coaches having no idea

when we watched the video and the guy has 25 turnovers.

And then there's been rumors about it for the three years since like they're all blindsided you think the raptor staff had that meeting about jante

not jante

jante's not in discords talking about his own under and then happy being a huge booster in support of the program but then also buying one of the kids for a point shaving thing it's just it's a bridge too far what's age the worst

uh in the opening credits it says penny hardaway but there's quotation marks for the penny yeah

i just don't like it we didn't know to your point, we didn't know him.

Just go amphorne penny hard away then.

Or if you're going to do that, do it for everybody.

I have Richard Petino.

I didn't like that.

I mean, I'll go and then you guys can take some.

Nobody would know who Neon was.

This is an era where we actually had a college top 100 infrastructure.

was into place.

He was really like the Fab Five is like from that moment on, they had the camps.

This is when they're making

so much exposition as to why you're not supposed to know yeah because he was in the military because he remembered he grew like he was he went to a juko they said he was in desert storm is neon like 25 he's got to be at least 26 years old at least he's got to be

for everything that they said because he went to a junior college and then he went to the army and he's got to be at least 26 years old at least it seems like he's pretty well versed in the green knight like that's culturally biased right and then off of that like wouldn't sports illustrated be crawling around this team?

Like, what happened here?

He got Butch McRae, he's got some 26 different dudes.

What happened with Michigan, where it's just like, how did these guys all decide to go to school?

I would think

college basketball was huge back then.

Neon coming out of nowhere as a 25-year-old, like, I just feel like that would have been amazing.

There was nothing more exciting than like a cool freshman class going to a school at the same time.

Like, I think people would have been like, awesome.

Pete got his shit together.

What do you have for Witsidor?

I think starting your press conference referencing 900 million Chinamen, probably, probably not the the best move.

That was, they were, they were, some coach did that thing.

Yeah, that was based on something.

I have that too, but you know what aged the worst about that to me?

Is the Chinese not caring about basketball?

Yeah, that's right.

That's right.

Oh, that's a great point.

You took off your race size.

Put the hoop size.

Yeah, the Chinese not caring about basketball aged super poorly when he's trying to make that point.

Neon's joke.

to Jenny and Pete when he's like, I see why you left the bitch.

I think that probably would have landed off.

Yeah, they would have cut that.

I loved it, though.

I thought it was so funny.

How is he talking to her like that?

And finally, Nick Nulty getting the John Belushi White Guy Dancing in Baptist Church Award for

Dancing in Baptist Church.

That's a good award.

I'll add that to the list.

Anything, Van?

That was my main was the Chinese not caring about basketball.

It's just

my other biggest ones, Butch not being able to run the motion offense is just absurd.

Mary McDonald, we didn't talk about her.

She's coming off Dances with Wolves.

Everyone was in love with her from that movie.

She's 41 when they make this movie.

They give her a hairdo, like she's like the person on the right in the view.

She looks like a hairdo of like a 59-year-old.

They dress her.

They dress her like a.

Hold on.

I'm not done.

They dress her.

Go for it.

They dress her like a grandmother.

She's a second-grade teacher away.

Yeah, she's a, she's a

41 and divorced.

Mary McDonald can't get some.

She's like her only hope is Pete Bell coming over after a couple drinks.

Are you saying that she's undesirable in the movie?

I'm saying they made her look undesirable, and I don't appreciate it.

I don't think she was cute.

I think she would have been feeling herself a little bit.

She's a divorced lady.

She's not dressing like she's like your aunt Stella.

Do you think she just loves the game?

Do you think she just loves hoops and wants to be a part of the program still?

Like the purity of basketball.

Well, she's presented as the moral compass of the movie.

It seems like Josiah's dad was trying to hit

Marquez Johnson.

It seems like he was trying to, when he was talking about

the drinks and the wings, he seemed like he was kind of putting it down a little bit.

Maybe he was trying to snake old Pete Bell right there.

So we're going to get some wings later.

What if that was a little subplot?

A little subplot.

Yeah,

you know what?

I'm not going to have that drink, actually.

I'm not going to.

Yeah, she was a wonderful thing.

The only other thing I was going to say is what changed the worst is just

the shame people feel because people don't feel it anymore.

They would have just denied and denied and denied, like at this point, like Pete Bell having a crisis of

his

morality and everybody feeling bad that this thing had happened.

And like, nobody does that anymore.

They're just like, ah, I'm just going to just say I didn't do it.

I mentioned Bob Cousy as Vic.

I just would have called him like Bob Cruzy.

Bob Luzy.

I don't know.

What about Le Bob Cousy?

Because he's French.

What's Age the the worst?

It's God bless Dickie V, but the Dickie V scene's 40 seconds too long.

It's like, we get it.

Dickie V's at the game.

It's just going.

He's

baby.

He's listening to all the players.

I would have cut that.

Or Packer?

I would have cut that.

Dickie V was such a fucking huge star.

I get it.

I would have cut it.

Pete Bell's coaching style.

of just screaming at everyone and having no basketball technician ship at all and also like yelling at people he's trying to recruit and i just didn't really understand do you think freddie is the actual brains behind the operation yeah freddy's probably the one that got him from oklahoma to install the one four

you know i really wanted you to be my wingman for the merry mcdonald

you know what you just abandoned me so i i did so they dressed her like a 70 year old i needed your i needed your help and instead you just sided with cran't be honest with you i didn't see anything she still looks hot to me though what i still think she especially the part where she goes you want to take a little play a little one-on-one i'm like i want to play a little one-on-one you're mad at me today because i made fun of koozie earlier i don't appreciate that at all divorce lady i don't know i just feel like she'd be breaking it out a little bit more okay what's the hottest she's looked in the movie to you was it dancers with wolves dances with wolves looks great

what the are you good in that movie she's one of the hospitals she's good in it but she

she's good craig you got to put dancers with wolves she's like She's very, it's very earthy.

I didn't know you were into the whole.

I just think she's

good in that movie.

I think she's a beautiful woman.

She's gorgeous.

That's my point.

Right.

And she looks good in the movie, though.

I think she looks good.

They dress her like a fucking grandmother.

You want her to dress like Roxy from Basic Insights?

Somebody who's a divorced lady.

Put a blouse on and a pair of jeans.

Okay.

Like she's out there still trying to

market that thing.

Fine.

Yeah.

Whatever.

So he calls Happy to see if Butch can keep his stuff.

Yeah.

Which is a very cool scene on paper.

Because now he works for Happy.

It shows that he's powerless, that Happy's calling the shots.

Do they disdain?

I have this in a What Sage of the Words.

Do they do too much to make us just not like Pete?

Pete is not a hero in this movie.

He's

not like him.

But I think that's why we have such a complicated relationship with this movie.

Because it's like, I don't even think I really like Pete.

Well, I think that what you're supposed to get from Pete is a sense of helplessness to the changing landscape of college basketball.

And that scene where he has to humble himself in front of Happy and call Happy about one of his guys is supposed to reiterate the fact that he's completely, his hands are off the stage.

It's actually a run.

Great, you're a spineless loser.

Why am I rooting for you in the final game?

It's kind of like

when Bobby Knight was winning, his antics were like

unique and charismatic.

And when he was losing, he was a brute and a bully.

It's a context thing where it's like, as soon as Pete starts losing, it's like, oh, look at like this, like, look at this guy.

He can't keep control of his temper at all.

Last week's age worst for me, Ricky Rowe, just asked for 50K in the tractor.

What's 30K?

It's a fucking major program for

three titles.

Yeah.

Yeah.

My number starts with a five.

The 30K is a weird thing.

30K.

Yeah, 30K is a weird thing.

Come on.

Maybe that's like what his dad needed to pay off the bill on his farm or something.

You're in 50k.

50 combines or moving.

I'm in 50s, 100s at this point.

It's like I go for 50K, 75K, or 100.

Ricky.

30K is taking that that 30K straight to Heidi Flys.

Oh, my.

Oh, definitely.

I don't, I don't, I don't, I'm not.

We're gonna get to that.

It's uh, that would be $63,000 today.

It's not a lot.

Ricky should have spent some of that 30K in a blouse for Nick Bothik's ex-wife.

Oh, Ricky could probably hit that.

Ricky could get in there.

She's got her pair of jeans.

What's your flex category choice, man?

What is the best?

I've made up a new one.

What's the best possible starting five you could create from the actual

fucking cameo?

I like that.

It's a fantasy GM.

A fantasy GM.

The best possible starting five you could create from the actual basketball players in this movie.

What they actually wound up doing in basketball or

the reality of the film.

No, no, no.

Not the reality of the film, but the guys that are in this movie.

What's the best?

Do we get to your Shaq and Penny?

Yeah.

I mean, I do Shaq, Penny, Bobby Hurley, Calbert Cheney, I think.

No, I think it's Penny, Alan, Houston, Shaq, or three of the five.

Have to be.

Penny, Allen, Houston, Shaq, and then probably Cal Bercheney because he was really good in college.

You run Penny at the two and put Bobby Hurley at the three.

Pre-car accident, Bobby Hurley was fucking awesome.

I know, but I want Penny to have the ball.

So then you put Penny at the one.

Bobby Hurley doesn't make it.

Plus, Penny can't play in the motion offense.

So then do you put because Ricky Roe was a real player, too.

What's his name?

Matt Nova.

He wasn't over.

Honestly, George Lynch was really good in college.

George Lynch was super cool.

He said probably George Lynch, Houston, Penny, Shaq, and Cal Cheney.

And you just have the one center, you have the three, and you just have athletic,

long athletes.

That's like a

pretty awesome team.

Yeah, so there's no real power forward.

Hurley is six-man, huh?

Hurley is six-man.

You don't need a power forward with Shaq.

Shaq, yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

I don't mind Ricky Row off the bench, though.

Just to stretch things out.

Sure.

You don't have much shooting.

You don't, if you don't have Bobby Hurley, you don't have much shooting in that.

I don't think Ricky's a great locker room guy because he's trying to fuck everybody's girlfriend.

Yeah, that is true.

The CR thinks Luke Wilson could have been Harrison Harrison Ford Hottest Takeoard.

I think we're all lingering the same way.

Blue Chips 2 should have happened.

I don't know what part of the Butch McRae neon experience it should have happened, whether it should have been like a late 90s or like what we were talking about where Penny's Butch is a coach in the late 2000s.

But Blue Chips 2, I'm just...

You have my interest.

Do you think Blue Chips 2 now would be these guys have an X Player pod?

Wow, that would be amazing.

What a great idea.

um it's them it's it's neon it's butch and and tommy alter as tony tony amica

christ it's the three of them uh my hottest take is uh based on ricky row yeah i think he's probably like just a stick man but the way he kind of instantly brings up girls and is always talking about girls i feel like if it keeps going on that's the kind of guy who finds himself in bangkok talking about wanting to be the girl he's fucking

like if you can't ever satiate that, yeah, and then he blows his knee out.

You know, it's just like he just keeps plumbing the depths until he finds himself drinking chamomile tea in Bangkok.

But it's butch on the other side

at their team reunion.

Oh, you know, sometimes I want to be the girl fucking me, and I'm the guy fucking me.

Sometimes I get an Indiana girl to watch.

Oh, shit.

That's great.

He was so horny in this movie.

You have a hottest take van?

No.

Okay.

Casting what ifs.

I don't really have any other than.

Oh, I do have a hottest take.

I'm sorry.

Okay.

This movie is a good movie directed by Freakin.

It's an all-time great movie to me if Sheldon directs it.

It's an all, it's an all-time, it's like he had, he knew what tone that he wanted to go through.

He knew the way he wanted to tell the story.

And he makes it more fun.

He makes it more fun.

There's a glitch in the movie, a small

kernel of self-righteousness that doesn't really work

and kind of drags the movie down a little bit.

So I think if Shelton directs the movie, it's one of the great basketball films.

Biggie backing off that, what do you think if this is the third of the Shelton Costner sports trilogy?

Oh, interesting.

Different coaching style.

I don't think he's as much of a yeller.

Yeah.

Probably adopts more of like a Jim Bayheim.

But you could see Costner being like, I run a clean program and then getting corrupted by somebody.

Yeah, that's good.

Maybe he has a little no-way out energy.

People are coming to get him.

A little edge.

We could have gotten Hackman to play happy.

Yeah.

I'll tell you.

Hackman is happy as hell.

If Coster's in this movie, Mary McDonald's dressing a little.

I like that.

Yeah, she's

getting a little more spark every time Coster's coming over.

Uh-oh, coach, whatever.

Have a drink.

Casting would have nothing except for

Friedkin wanted Nick Nulty only for people.

And Nick Nulty had wanted to work with Friedkin since the 1970s when you didn't get a Chris Ryan favorite, sorcerer.

Yeah.

Danny McBride Award for Playing Yourself.

We don't necessarily get to give this out that much.

Richard Petino?

It could be Richard Petino.

It could be Bobby Knight.

Tark was good.

It could be Tark.

Who would you give give it to?

Petino.

Okay, I agree.

Best that guy were JT Walsh.

We're moving on.

Okay, he's not that guy anymore.

Well, Craig just gave a whole monologue a couple episodes ago about how.

Oh, we overrate.

We overrate that guy.

His generation doesn't know what JT Walsh is.

Marcus Johnson, too.

But what about

he has like multiple all MBAs?

But JT Walsh is like one of the great actors of I know, but I'm just trying to cater to Craig's generation.

What about Silk Coser?

Oh, yeah, as Slick.

As Slick.

Yeah.

The guy guy who brings him to,

like, he's also in White Man Can't.

What about your guy, Anthony C.

Hall?

Anthony C.

Hall is another one.

Like the assistant.

No, the real answer is the assistant who's like, not Tony.

That's that's my guy.

Oh, yeah.

That's one of those guys.

I don't even know what that guy's name is.

I don't know.

He's a one of those.

I don't know that I've seen him in anything else.

What else has he been in?

Or maybe I've just seen him in this.

Yeah.

Deion Waiters Award.

Incredible candidates for this.

Happy's Two Blondes.

JT Walsh.

Lou Gossett, Larry Bird, and Bob Kuzi.

Larry Bird and got Bob Koozie.

No thought that it could be Shaq.

No, no, he's in it too much.

Nothing for Alfrey?

Alfrey too?

Oh, I guess she's qualified.

You're right.

She's in multiple scenes, but yeah, she's in two scenes, and she has like one of the best lines in the movie.

Okay.

Or I think it's Lou Gossett.

As much as I love Koozie, but I think Koozie's in it too much.

Yeah, if Shaq's in it too much, Koozie's in it too much.

Koozi's in like four or five.

Gossett comes in hot.

He's great.

He's basically like the officer and a gentleman guy.

And he's out in three minutes.

Recasting Couch Director City.

I would like to find, like, Pete Powell, I would like to talk this one out a little bit more.

Well, whether Nolte was the right guy.

He's too close to Bobby Knight and Jack Cates.

Like, I almost can't separate it.

Well, that's what he's doing.

He's going for the quintessential college basketball.

I think the image of the college basketball coach, even though Hurley's brother at UConn is kind of flipping it back to that Dan Hurley.

I think the image of the college basketball coach has kind of changed.

But at that time, remember, this was, what's your man from Temple?

John Cheney.

John Cheney.

So this was John Cheney and all the rest of these guys, these really overbearing personalities.

And, you know, Bob Knight, I think he was trying to get into that.

I think that

Nick Nulte is the perfect actor for this version of Pete Bell.

If you want Pete Bell to be,

you could talk me into like, this is where Norman Dale goes, and it's Hackman playing this, and he's always had, like, control over the program, and then he loses it.

You could talk me into

a Pacino kind of playing a Pacino calipari type.

Pacino hands it up too much.

Yeah, he goes crazy.

But I think that Nick Nulty is perfect for this version of Pete Bell, but Nick Nulty is the reason why people are like, yeah, Blue Chips is okay.

Could Lou Gossett play Pete Bell?

Interesting.

Yeah,

do you go black coach there or have the

or do we have to wait till after the Million Man march to make that happen?

No, we had some real, we had some big-ass black coaches in the 90s.

I don't think it would have,

I just think they wanted him to be Bobby Knight, and they decided Nick Nolt was the Nick Nulty was closest to Bobby Knight.

Do you think this movie

works as an LA movie?

Like, it's cool, like, when he's like, not at all.

And the weather, the weather couldn't be better.

No, I almost feel like it should have been at like an SMU type school and put in like Texas.

yeah they they were talking and happy like an oil guy yeah they were talking specifically about

uh which is another thing that kind of you know aged a little poorly specifically about the rise of big east basketball and how all the television had moved over there but that's really yeah that that kind of aged pretty poorly too but that's really the only thing that's regional about the movie like it had it's not California culture there's like nothing that goes on they don't lean into they're playing a lot of non-conference games you know right can i give you one more recasting just from the era?

Because it's Shaq and Penny, right?

Third star has to be white because it's Indiana.

Could this have been Leightner?

Huh.

It could have been.

If you're really trying to capture this era and you get Shaq Penny and Christian Leitner as Ricky Rowe, it's a more interesting movie.

I'll be honest with you.

I bet Shaq wasn't fucking with that.

Yeah, Shaq's like, he's out.

Yeah,

Shaq.

That kid from Indiana instead.

Yeah.

Oh, Craig's up with the flex category.

What do you got, Craig?

I'm going to tweak the art imitating real life, and it's just Pete Bell berating his team at halftime was an exact reenactment of the SDSU head coach after they were.

We should mention we're taping this on a Friday, and we're taping in the morning because Craig's like San Diego State.

We might be playing on Friday if we win the play-in.

It's going to probably be late.

I think it's at one o'clock and then Tuesday.

Would they lose by 25?

27, but they were down down like 38 at one point.

Yeah, so Craig Costa, San Diego State, the thing.

Half-ass,

it's your fault.

Half-ass internet research.

Um, Shaquille O'Neal nominated for a Razzie Award for worst new star.

That hurt my feelings.

Shaq's good in the sports movie.

Ridiculous.

Freakin says, well, after they made the movie, it was weak at the box office.

It's hard to capture in a sports film the excitement of a real game with its own unpredictable dramatic structure and suspense.

I couldn't overcome that.

Completely disagree.

Sour grapes.

Make a better movie.

Lots of sports movies have worked.

Fuck you.

Bill, you are all one today.

It's more deeply watchable.

So I'm always more here to.

Apparently, Frieden didn't want Shaq to be too tall.

So he had like shoes that had like tiny quarter-inch soles.

It's probably like a frame.

And then boost for other people because he was like too much taller than everybody else.

And

it's that funny scene where he's just like like at 6'6 and Penny's like, I'm not 6'6.

And Shaq's like, I am 7'4.

But if you look at that one scene where it's Shaq, Nick Nulty, and Mary McDonald, if you look at the way that they shot, you have to frame it.

You have to frame it in the right way to like have him a little far off.

He's standing so far away from them.

Because if not, it looks

Shaq's final college game came against Indiana and Bobby Knight and Matt Nova.

Indy beat LSU by 10 in round two of the tournament tournament and eventually went to the final four and lost to Duke and Coach K.

That was Bobby Knight's last final four.

Love Dale Brown.

We had some real studs come through and we couldn't get to the final four, man.

Dale Brown, not

opposed to maybe sliding something under somebody's door that had some dollar bills on it.

Dale was with it.

Dale,

he had a.

Dale might have thrown a pair of car keys at somebody.

That's a good example of when Chris Jackson went to LSU.

I was like, how did that happen?

Yeah.

I mean, Shaq, he got in in on Shaq early.

Because Chris Jackson was from the Northeast, right?

He's from Mississippi.

Oh, he's from Mississippi.

Yeah.

He was like an all-time scoring.

He was fucking ridiculous.

The gym that they used for Butch McRae in Chicago was Mount Carmel High School.

And then I like this.

The crew.

including Shaq, stayed at the Howard Johnsons in Lafayette, Indiana for two weeks.

Over the Howard Johnson's.

All right.

We're going to try it again.

Oh, great.

We're going to go for, this has not worked yet.

We're going to call Rosillo

and we're going to see if this works.

He's going to pick up now because I called him out for his low answer percentage.

Unbelievable.

It didn't even ring.

He's got you on like straight to voicemail.

He does.

Call Roscillo again.

He might be on Do Not Disturb.

A second one might go through.

That's not weird at all.

You think that's possible?

If there was no ring, he's probably on Do Not Disturb.

he's probably do not disturb because i'm lifting

grinding tape oh a ring for russillo

oh yeah yeah

finally we're doing rewatchables

you finally picked up

what is that i'm with van and cr

and we're doing blue chips And we need your take on blue chips without any prep at all.

The white guy knew exactly what he needed.

Like, he was so rude.

I remember being like, this guy had a plan, but he was the most, most ruthless about the ask.

And Nolte was just like, that's when Nolte gave up on life.

I saw it at the theater.

I remember I walked home from campus, or actually, one of our rich kids had a car as a freshman, which you weren't supposed to do.

But rich kids always figure out a way to stay ahead.

And we went to the theater, I'll just never forget, like, because the funny thing was that, like, Shaq got it.

Of all the people, Shaq understood what it was really about.

And Nolty was just shattered when fucking French licked wanted all sorts of benefits.

All right, that's it.

Great cameo, Rosillo.

Great to talk to you.

Yeah, when's this post?

I'm going to send it to my friends.

Monday.

And the hang-up.

And the hang-up.

That's great.

All right.

What a category.

Love that.

Completely redeemed the idea.

Yeah.

We knew it had high potential.

Was that the first successful execution of it?

Well, producer Craig, call again.

Maybe the second time we'll go through it.

That tells me something about Craig, by the way.

Apex Mountain.

Keep calling.

Over and over.

Never give up.

DM them over and over.

Apex Mountain, Nick Dalte.

No.

cheating in a basketball movie?

What else you got?

No, because like the white man can't jump when he's like, when he's not cheating, but he's like

he's hustling the game above the rim.

Like him playing terrible in the last game until he gets called out because Birdie.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's a good one, actually.

Yeah.

Mary McDonald, no.

No.

Bob Knight, no.

Alfred.

Alfred team coming right off season on the brink.

They win the title.

Yeah, Keith.

Smart Shot.

Yeah, 87.

Yeah.

Flunking TV in college.

Yeah,

100%.

Not done again until 1996 when I did it.

Rick Fox.

Very brief.

In a really nice run here of this, then Eddie, and then he got game.

He got game.

And Oz.

Oz.

He was making a way as a really serious actor.

Who do I need to fucking hear to get high?

I can't never forget Rick Fox saying that on Oz.

You remember?

Oz.

Oz is crazy shit.

Did we just say what?

That's when everyone will know I'm about to retire when we do the one for us Oz Rewatch.

We just do the Oz Rewatch.

Four seasons of Oz.

The Adab C scene.

It's like, oh, this is it.

Bill's done.

Point shaving movie scenes, you're still going gambler.

Yeah.

I think it.

Also, it's just so crazy because like, you know, he's got the tennis pro or the tennis kid betting on the game for him.

Yes, yeah.

Shaq and Penny know.

Oh, wait.

Shaq are talking about Shaq as an actor?

What are you saying?

Sports betting scenes?

Point shaving in basketball games.

What about?

Okay.

Because I was going to say, Uncut Gems is like my favorite.

Uncut Gems is one too.

It's not point shaving.

Yeah.

If we're just talking about taking a dive in a sports movie, that's longest yard.

But what about the end of color of money, though?

Oh, yeah.

That's a fucking crushing one.

So Shaq and Penny know, but Shaq as an actor.

as an actor i think 100 yes yeah i don't think that's this is the best i think shaq would admit that yeah

bob kousy is an actor 100 richard patino is an actor definitely

um

algiers

algiers as the hardest location to get to in america definitely the most it's like burning man yeah um that's it unless you have any other apex uh college basketball movies i had that as a as a question too

i mean i still i'm still partial to the ones in the 70s.

Okay.

Even though I wouldn't say Fast Break is age great from a political correct school.

Is he Drive?

He said, is he a coach in that one, or is he just an expert?

That's in the 70s.

I still come up with the other one.

This is probably my favorite college basketball movie of all time.

My two.

I mean, it's like basically our generation snapshot.

I mean, we get to see all of our favorite players.

What about recruiting scenes?

Apex Mountain for recruiting.

I still like when Brad Pitt goes to Chris Pratt to get him to come to the A's in Moneyball.

And Moneyball?

He's like, we're going to move you to first base.

I would go Gene Hackman going to see Jimmy Chitwood and then doing the, I don't care if you play or not.

Fucking bold move by Gene.

I'm going to say that, you know, even though I'm going to say that the recruiting scene at

Tech and He Got Game is pretty special.

Oh, with the Jill Kelton and Chasey Lane.

Yeah.

They're listed IMDB in that movie.

Yeah.

Cruise or Hanks?

Hanks.

Hanks.

Yeah.

Hanks.

You like Cruz.

I got Hanks.

Hanks.

Really?

Yeah.

You want to say our guy, Tom?

Tom, I never would have believed ever would have been in any way part of

a collection.

He's just, he's too college.

Like, he's five.

I've got six.

Like,

Tom is interesting for happy.

Oh, yeah.

Doing like a less grossman?

Like a Tom is interesting for Happy as the fucking like evil Jerry Maguire type.

Scorsese or Spielberg?

Scorsese.

Yeah.

What role would Philip Seymour Hoffman have played?

The guy who delivers Neon's Lexus.

That is Philip Seymour Hoffman.

I think he would have been an unbelievable happy.

Yeah.

Craig, you got one more flex.

I have two flexes?

You don't need it to do it if you don't want uh i i just want to pile on on cruise that i just imagining cruise in the paint trying to teach neon footwork is just all time with wearing like six inch boots disguised as nikes neon picking him up so he can dunk i think if cruise had the jerry maguire energy as peep bell and it's a completely different movie i'm not sure i'm against it as a movie him doing the speech at the end yeah Where he's just like, I'm a completely broken man.

Yeah.

No, the answer is same.

It could be Cruz now, like old Cruise, maybe.

Young Cruise.

Old Cruise, maybe.

Old Cruise, maybe.

Tom Cruise isn't old.

I know.

That's what he's telling Anna Darmus.

Picking nets.

So no conference tournament for Western you

that before Penny and Shaq get there.

Season's just over.

There's not like, oh, we're in the quarterfinals next week against so-and-so.

Just regular season and we're out?

What is this like the fucking like Nescack?

Generally speaking, they miss a couple of times on like just references to real college basketball.

I think they like talk about the NIT.

It's like, oh, yeah, we had a good season.

We were in the NIT.

Right.

You guys would have been really disappointed if you were in the NIT.

I feel like the last game of the season would have been a conference tournament.

The basketball stuff in the movie in terms of the week.

Yeah.

The actual like what would really happen and how things really just expect you to go along because then there's another part.

They're recruiting Neon and they're recruiting all these guys.

And then Neon comes to LA to get tutored by Pete's ex-wife.

And we have no idea what time of the year is and then he passes the SATs in a week and then all of a sudden he's in class and it's like well she well

she peeps the fact that he could pass it at any time that he wants yeah but it still takes a couple weeks to get it back is this August or in September is school going at this point once hoops starts a Halloween whoa yeah but it's just so they I just had I was left with some questions they were getting recruited in the summer because after the season or they're getting recruited when their freshman year

starts in September, they're getting recruited that spring.

Like, everyone has committed already.

He goes right to, well, yeah, they so.

I mean, I mean, you know where you're going.

There's still a couple players that would be holding out, but for the most part, those guys would then

he goes to Chicago, but Butch McCrae's High School is still playing.

Like, there's a lot of timeline stuff that's tough.

Maybe that's AAU.

Yeah,

um,

Western University's name is the Dolphins.

Yeah, the fuck is that?

You're in LA and you're the Western University Dolphins?

Wait a minute.

What are you doing?

It's at the beach.

They got mad dolphins.

They're not near the beach.

We don't see the beach once in this morning.

No, we're in like where it's like where USUCLA is.

But you would think that you could have the Dolphins.

It's on the coast.

Maybe the Dolphins.

What's Pepperdine's team?

I could see Pepperdine.

At least you're in Malibu near the Malibu Dolphins.

The Western University Dolphins.

I think generally speaking, fictional sports teams are really bad at picking like the game.

I'm I'm recognizing that.

I recognize the waves.

The waves.

The waves.

Which is much better.

Again, I'm always here as the sports movie consultant.

That's an easy email where I'm like, don't name them the dolphins.

Are there any

sports colleges that have the dolphin moniker?

That have the dolphin mascot?

Anybody using that?

Probably not.

Maybe that's why they did it.

Got the dolphins.

It doesn't bother me that much about it.

Jacksonville University has Nellie the Dolphin as their mascot.

Okay.

And the College of Mount St.

Vincent.

So

Julio.

Another nitpick.

Ed O'Neill just has pictures of all the recruiting violations.

Yeah.

Here's a picture of Neon getting a car.

Here's like, he just happens to be

the enemy of the

Smin technology on his computer.

First of all, it's 1994.

We don't even have like the internet yet.

He's a local reporter

who's made it his goal.

to take down the school that is the most beloved thing.

This guy's house would be be burned down.

This guy doesn't exist in Baton Rouge.

How do you have this guy killed?

Everyone hates this guy.

Yeah, this guy doesn't exist.

The one guy, like, if there's a national reporter,

I don't know, maybe he works for USA Today or something like that.

I don't know.

But if there's no, he's supposed to be Plashki, right?

He's supposed to be like a LA, big LA guy.

If there's a national reporter who's doing this story, that's one thing.

But if there's a guy who's doing a WBRZ, WAFB, who's making it his fucking job or at the

advocate in Baton Rouge to take down an LSU coach, he's like living in hell the entire time he's walking by.

Probably doesn't get on around the horn.

Probably stays local.

Picking Knit,

when Freddie says under the table, recruiting is his version of personal hell.

It's just like, take it down, Anash, Freddie.

What are you doing, Freddy?

You're a fucking college basketball coach.

Freddy got hired by Oklahoma State three years later and was fired within 18 months just for being a shitty coach.

Picking Knit, so they could get

Indiana's rights to be in the movie for Bobby Knight in Indiana to be but not without Kentucky Kentucky or like any of the other and not the NCA because it ends up being the NCASA what the fuck is up with that like you have Bobby Knight and Indiana the movie is actually 10 to 15 percent cooler if you have all the schools

in Kentucky and all of these other schools I think Bobby Knight was so powerful at that point that they probably asked him he's like yeah fuck it I'll get it done.

Right.

Just like crossed lines and didn't get permission would be my guess.

At the end,

first of all, there's a bunch of young kids playing pickup basketball at 10 at night outside.

That's a possibly unanswerable question I had for you.

Yeah, they're just outside at 10 at L.A.

And none of them know who Pete Bell is when he comes over to help them with some.

some coaching.

We've already established this is the most important guy in this whole universe.

None of them know who he is.

And I don't know why they're playing basketball that late.

Also, furthermore, if you were like watching Ben practice and like a random guy came out and just like stopped the game and was like, he would think he was like an alcoholic foremost,

that's the nit, right?

Them playing out there, I don't know what time it is, but them playing out there after a basketball game, so it's probably close to like 10 o'clock.

Them playing out there just speaks to the greater ills of society.

We all need to kind of come together and help the children.

But

you bet not get your dumbass off the basketball court court trying to teach me how to shoot.

Yeah.

Like, get off the court.

Well, in 2025, this guy wanders onto the court and his pants are down by his ankles and probably takes a shit.

And that's the end of the movie.

Any other pics?

No, you just nailed it.

Thanks.

Thank you.

My pleasure.

Sequel, prequel, Prestige TV, Blackcast or Untouchable.

This would have been the easiest layup for an eight-episode streaming era show from 2012 on.

And it's probably better suited for a streaming show, I would say.

So I have a pitch.

Yeah.

So it's an early 2000s pitch.

It's a sequel, but it's not with Penny.

The pitch is actually Pete Bell's return to college basketball, right?

In the 2000s.

Neon is his assistant coach.

He's just got finished playing and they're coaching against the dirtiest coach in college basketball, who is now Ricky Rowe.

Oh, yes.

Like Ricky Rowe.

Ricky Rowe is tractors for everybody.

Ricky Rowe is the Louisville Rick Petino.

Yeah.

Girls, hoes everywhere.

Not even girls anymore.

He's past girls.

He's paying guys to come over.

Ricky Rowe is running the dirty program.

Pete Bell has a beef with Ricky Rowe.

Ricky Rowe's on top, and he's coming back into college basketball with Neon to clean up college basketball.

Or couldn't that be 2025, Butch McRae versus Ricky Rowe?

Could be.

Yeah.

Neon as the assistant.

Yeah.

Could be.

And now the guy who's like, take a hike has like a podcast that is really influential college basketball.

Tell us about the podcast.

Take a hike.

The podcast is called Take a Hike.

Yeah.

Where he talks about everybody who needs to get fired.

He's like, today I have Tate Frazier on.

We talk about the Final Eight.

Tate, tell us why

St.

John's coach Richard Petino needs to take a hike.

Take a hike presented by State Farm.

Is this movie better with Wayne Jenkins, Danny Treo, Doris Burke, Sam Jackson, Nell, Byron Mayo, Chris Berman, Barney Cousins, Tony Romo, Harley Mays, Chris Collinsworth, Daniel Plainview, Long Legs, or Wilford Brimley in the firm?

I'm bringing back J.T.

Walsh.

Okay.

He's in the movie, so we can bring him back.

And I'm bringing back JT Walsh as Markinson.

When Pete Bell calls him out at the press conference, he goes, I don't want a deal and I don't want immunity.

I want you to know that I am proud neither of what I have done or what I am doing.

It's the nickel plated.

That's the last scene of the movie.

And then the take-a-hype guy is like, looks like Western got the death penalty.

Oh man.

No, then we need

that's where you need like Tom.

How do we get drunk Tom Cruise in there for the next scene?

Oh my god.

Maybe Tom.

Like if he was the Ann O'Neill part, he comes in.

Tom Cruise is shit.

No, Tom Cruise is koozy.

Oh no.

Poor Markinson, bro.

He had so much on his mind.

There is no Markinson.

Markinson doesn't exist.

Markinson doesn't exist.

Technically.

I'm neither proud of what I did.

Oh, my God.

Oh,

happy was way more like colonel nathan jessup than he was like maybe he was marketson yeah i was workshopping something where when they're in algiers they run into nel for two seconds looking for the gym and she's like

they're like this lady's crazy let's get away she's in the woods yeah she's in the woods she's in the woods in algiers with the alligators uh just want to ask her who gets it

tough one yeah it's tough

Because it seems like the obvious answer is Nulty, but he's going so far that

I think I'd probably go Shelton Screenplay and just because he's probably the best writer of movie sports movies ever.

Yeah.

I'd probably go J.T.

Walsh, but I don't really feel like anyone deserves an Oscar.

Not really, but if you had to give one, it'd be the script.

Probably unanswerable questions.

Why wasn't Jalen Rose in this was my number one?

I don't really have any other ones.

We've already covered everything.

Yeah, we've heard a bunch of them.

What piece of memorability would you want or not want from this movie?

Pete Bell's ring, which is probably his championship ring, which is prominently shown over and over again, I think would be a good one.

But for me, it would be Tony's number 44 blue western jersey during the point shaving game, which I just think would be a great thing to have in the house.

I'd like one of those TV VCR combos and then all the game tapes.

Oh, all the game tapes would be fucking fantastic.

Yeah.

And I would also honestly love

B-roll extra footage that Freedkin had of just the practices and games that Finnish.

Yeah, that should just be on YouTube, those games.

Yeah,

watching the Bobby Hurley, Calbert Cheney, Indiana.

Like how they actually were getting down and going crazy.

That's a fun re-watchables category.

If this footage existed, how much of it would you watch on YouTube?

I think I'm in for over an hour of the game footage.

Absolutely.

Watching Hurley.

Just watching Hurley in the Indiana uniform is so surreal.

It's kind of like, oh, I look pretty cool.

Yeah.

Do you feel like that point guard style is just gone now that that point guard with the head up pounding the ball who's always looking who's always ready to run like the start

two set so fast yeah he's just it's it's morphed a little bit it's it's kind of gone but i see it in some players bronny

you're hating on him he had

17

he had he had he had 17.

all right stephen because now it's like but the point the type of point guard now is like the darius garland type would be the type in this the opposing guy in the movie you know who has a little bit of his new scoot I was about to say scoot like scoot has a little bit of thanks for that card

no it's like it's more like a maxi type

and i have so much scoot stock it's like our brokers are like telling us to offload it right now

up and down you think Reed Shepherd used to be a guy that would be like that, but Reed Shepherd's a little too silky.

He can do a little bit too many things.

The Zawatney Award for what happened the next day.

I'm bringing this back just for this movie.

We talked about, I just think we have to go through the three guys.

Well, they do that with the title cards, right?

We find out Ricky Rowe injured his knee and works on a farm.

Tough beat.

Karma for him.

They made him somehow the least likable guy in a movie with a point shaver and a booster who's shaving points and paying off players and Pete Bell who's not likable.

Racist, horny,

well, at least his dad, like asshole.

Like his character, Ricky Rowe is like he welcomed all races.

I think

he would have had sex with anybody.

I think Ricky Rowe was cool, but they didn't give his character and his handshake with Shaq at one point.

And his family,

they gave them no dimension.

He also really does not have much of a role on the team as they kind of, I like there, they don't, there's not a lot of Ricky Rowe footage we get outside of him shooting in the yard.

That was kind of the last era for the Ricky Row type guys.

Those that kind of 6'7, 6'9.

Harpering type dude.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It peaked with Austin Crochier in the 2000 finals, and then he was getting busy.

Slowly went down.

Gordon Hayward is the last gasp.

Butch,

I just think it's the actual careers the guys had, except Neon would have been like five years older getting into the league.

But same kind of, I think, Arcs.

I think Neon might make an all-NBA.

Neon's playing Shaq.

Yeah.

So he's Shaq in personality.

Even when he walks out there after all of this stuff has happened and he goes, coach, and you think he's about to say something profound?

Like, you really changed my life getting me out of the jungle of Algiers, snakes everywhere, alligators all the time.

He's at the whole deal.

And he goes.

He goes, you like my spin move?

Yeah.

And then, you know, that's who Shaq is.

Coach Vinstock award, best life lesson.

I guess if you're going to cheat, don't act ashamed of it.

You know what I mean?

Like, that's sort of what comes along with all of this.

Mine is just fucking cheat.

You know, just fucking cheat.

Yeah, why not?

Stop acting like a bitch.

Cheat, get the wins.

Like, nobody cares.

You coach, now you're coaching in the Midwest somewhere, kids, and whatever.

Just cheat, man.

Did Jenny and

Pete get back together?

Seems like not.

I mean, if she Marcus Johnson, I think he circles back.

I mean, I mean, after Pete quits, I think he's coming by with a user

back call twice.

The reality is, like, who's going to fucking want her, CR?

I think she should.

Why did she move after the divorce?

Get out of there.

Start your life somewhere else.

She's a teacher in Los Angeles.

She moved to move to like wherever.

Maybe to Anaheim.

She takes some

fucking pride in herself and the way that she looks and her appearance.

Maybe she can actually get a man because she's not going to get Marcus Johnson looking like that.

Disgusting with you.

She's going to have to be empty jet beauty of the week.

Go to a store that sold clothes from the last 10 years.

Zwant Neo, does Bob Koozi's Vic character have a massive heart attack when his entire athletic program is brought to its knees?

Yeah.

He's got the football program.

it's fine

they're dirty too the football program gets outed at the football program

says a linebacker and they buy in people friends of the program my coach finstock award for best life lesson is go wide on the basketball scenes don't try to reinvent the wheel we like to see basketball from a certain perspective and don't overthink it best double feature choice

I think white man can't jump just because.

No, you know what?

I'm going to go above the room.

Let's go above the room.

I'm going with the program.

I have one-on-one with Robbie Benson.

I watched that first.

It's also Western University.

It's basically the same things, but it's the 70s perspective on it.

It's a really good movie.

One-on-one with Robbie Benson?

Robbie Benson.

It's a big moment now.

Out of all the 70s basketball movies, which I obviously have loved and seen a million times, I think it's weirdly aged the best.

It's got Seals and Croft as the soundtrack.

Annette O'Toole, soon to be seen in 48 Hours, is the love interest.

It's got good basketball scenes.

And I don't know.

Robbie Benson could kind of hoop, like for real.

He's like a little Austin Reeves-ish.

Hey fan, check it out.

Should San Antonio just put a contract on the table?

Yeah, baby.

Very youthful-looking 70-year-old guy.

He's in severance now.

And

some 70s babes in that movie too.

Like for real.

No, there's like a let's get the lead character laid scene.

Okay.

Yeah.

I think you'll like it.

Look at that yeah um

who won the movie tough one i'm gonna say no

it defines the movie his performance defines the movie for me personally koozy wins it but i actually are you kidding me koozie's amazing like what

are you doing bill 10 straight free throws the camera's rolling

was there a better was there a better athletic moment than a sports movie in the 90s like 10 straight bill shaquille o'nil is

larry bird is shooting free throws yeah like it like Penny looks

what the heart was.

You're joking.

You're joking.

I said, for me, Bob Koozy wins the movie because I love seeing the goose as the movie.

Not Mary McDonald's costume designer.

Shaq wins the movie, I think Shaq wins the movie.

Yeah.

I think all these years later, I think this movie's a huge win for him.

It's the only time he's really been hyper.

He can charisma his way through anything, but the only time he's been really competent in a movie to me is this one.

All right.

Producer Producer Craig had never seen this movie.

Really?

Let's get the take.

Also, not to outdo Koozie, but Ricky Rowe hits like four straight jumpers on a dirt road.

So he just, Ricky Rowe is just fucking, and they real shots.

By the way, the sequel to me has to be Nolte goes to like, or Pete Bell goes to like Montana State, builds a team the old school way, and then ends up meeting Western in March as like a 15 first two season.

Fred is coaching them.

West Dillon, West Dillon style.

Yeah, yeah.

That would be awesome.

But

I love this movie.

This is an early contention for top five rewatchables of 2020.

Wow.

Wow.

That's really exciting.

A really great nostalgic look at an old era.

It takes a lot of swings.

I think, honestly, most of it works.

I think all the Pete Bell, the Pete Bell stuff plays for me.

The romanticism plays for me.

As I was watching, I just jotted down.

Six bullet points is what I wrote down watching.

One of the great opening sports movie scenes ever.

Fantastic pace for a movie where, you know, a lot of it takes place in offices or in like homes in the Midwest.

Happy as the most, what's age the best and worst speech of all time.

I think it's the best basketball in a movie ever.

Interesting.

I think they heard the case made.

I think it's the most refreshing came, old school cameos that kind of also represent an era that's like Jim Beheim just sitting in the background.

It's just,

that'd be like if Damian Giselle made a football movie today and it was like, oh yeah, Kyle Shanahan's in it.

Malik Neighbors is the main character.

Drake May is in it for a couple scenes.

Like, something that wouldn't happen today.

Don't get Bill Mad with only a couple scenes.

Why isn't Drake May the start?

What happened?

I also wrote down Creedon's Clearwater Revival, Jenny Bell, greatest ex-wife of all time, and Bob Koozie.

You'd sooner believe that Koozie was an actor they taught to play basketball than the other way around.

Koozi's very good.

Koozi's very good as an actor.

That's also a shot at his form, though, I got to say.

It's a little Stanley from the office, not going to lie.

uh what were you surprised by the ending don't ignore that

address it no i think you i i think it needed to happen i think um

it's one of the only sports movies i can remember that doesn't end on the big game and the actual games don't really have too big of an impact on the movie yeah it's impressive that the basketball is so good considering that the basketball is not that essential to the film and it doesn't end i mean the the end of the movie is the first game of the season which i can't remember when that's happened um

so i thought the ending really worked for me Also, you guys didn't, did you guys do a better title?

I think there's a better title for this movie.

What is it?

I think it's Friends of the Program.

Friends of the Program is good, but then it reorients the movie around the Friends of the Program and not really the players, which is what the movie is essentially about.

What about where the dolphins swim?

Did they say blue chips in the movie?

No.

I feel like they should have.

It's the rare time when I think they should have said, like, we need to get some blue chips on this.

But I'll be honest with you, this, the title of this movie, is how I understood what that meant.

Yeah, I think I'm good with the title, but I like Friends of the Program pretty good.

They should do a movie to refer to

Friends of the Program that's oriented around, like a movie about happy and those types would be super duper interesting.

I think you needed an extra scene that then set up the title.

Where if you have, if they're going like, we need to get guys in the top 10, we need top 10 groups again.

And then you call it top 10 and it's like, we got three top 10 blue chippers or the blue chippers.

Something.

Somebody says that at some point.

I'm down with that.

I also just like when great directors make movies that are outside their typical, what you would expect of them.

Like I almost wish there were prerequisites like in college where directors had to make every kind of movie before they could choose a major.

Like the guy who just made the exorcist doing a basketball movie is really cool.

And I think it's why visually it is a little bit more unique than typical sports movies.

movies it's not just the exorcist that he made craig he also made cruising yeah

yeah so this is we haven't done french connections so this is our third freaking

i think there's a fourth one we haven't done to live and die in la yet i love

that oh auditioning i'm not just saying i love it i mean you know out on 4k blu-ray

well you know mulaney's kind of bringing it back to the netflix show i know he he basically ripped off

credits do you don't think Jenny Bell is apex mountain for X-Wives in a movie?

She basically gives up her personal life to crush tape.

She lets you come over after the game to blow off Steve and drink, and she recruits students for you for free.

It's weird because,

I mean, she's basically doing everything for him except giving up the push-ups.

She does more than Fresh.

She's basically

too long to get her clothes off.

She's wearing like five different pieces of clothing.

Shirt, a sweater, a jacket.

She's still so involved, he can ask her for anything except for physical effects.

She's going out to dinner.

It's like they're still married.

It's taking

the wet blanket sports movie, girlfriend/slash/wife.

Yeah, for sure.

It's starting with Adrian.

Yeah.

She's like wet blanket, though.

I don't know.

No, they try not to make her the wet blanket, but then at the end, when she's super disappointed, and oh, she definitely becomes

she wet blankets it up, but she's kind of justified because she's the only person with a soul in the movie.

I was going to ask you, we didn't really do Big Kahuna Burger, Craig, but

would you like it if basically everybody from work went to the same restaurant every night?

Yeah, hell yeah.

And I walked in one night with like two ladies.

Craig, she's a friend.

These guys are fans of the fantasy pod.

These gals love hyphens.

Who would be the

first in their fantasy league?

If we were all at the bar together, who would be the person that walked in with two ladies on their arms?

Brian Curtis.

That's always the answer.

It's a friend of the program.

Hello, media consumers.

Craig, really glad you like that movie.

Don't forget, people listening, we're coming to Boston for a sold-out show, and we're doing a first-ever Rewatchables film festival at the historic Coolidge Corner all weekend, Friday, March 28th through the March 30th.

We're going to make a couple appearances.

Yeah.

But we're playing all the hits, man.

We're showing heat.

We're showing the town.

We're showing Goodwill Hunting.

We're showing Friends of Eddie Coyle, a couple old school ones, The Verdict.

So, these are all Boston-based movies.

Oh, they're Boston or heist movies.

Are you guys going to be showing the H.

Bill Max Donald community and murder in Boston?

That would be good for the matchup.

We're showing all seasons of Oz.

Yeah,

all the Rick Fox episodes of Oz.

I want to say to the people of Boston: if there is, in fact, any pickup basketball happening around 10 p.m., Bill is happy to come and coach

10 p.m.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, or have Bob Cousy shoot free throws so you guys can be amazed.

My dad is incredibly pumped for the verdict.

How many of the movies do you think Dr.

Bill is going to see?

Over unders four and a half.

Okay.

He doesn't have a lot going on.

They got the new puppy.

Celtics are away.

What kind of dog?

Got another golden.

That's what I'm talking about.

Yeah.

And guess what?

It might have been a mistake because he's 77 and the dog wakes up three times a day to pee.

He's got scratches all over him.

And it's like, I don't know if we should have done this.

But yeah, Coolidge Corner.

One of my favorite.

Do you ever actually live there?

Yeah, I lived in Brooklyn.

Yeah.

For a year.

The best.

So we'll see you.

Visit ringer, the ringer.com/slash events for Showtime's ticket information.

You've never been to Boston, man.

Not really.

You've been through it?

Yeah, a little bit.

You know what Boston hasn't appreciated?

Your shots.

Your shots at the city.

At the city.

I just said the needles.

I'm sure that Boston is a

fine place.

Boston would love you.

I just have to keep you honest, man.

I believe it.

Because the agenda is so

easy to do.

Today you guys went too far with Bob Kozi.

I said he won the movie for me.

I said he won the movie for me.

But when I said Nick Nulty, you looked at me like, what a conflict.

He's the star of the movie.

Bob Kuzi is the majority.

I just think Shaq clearly wins the movie.

Bob Kuzi makes like the free throw.

And by the way, the free throws, even though he's shooting them, you know,

it's impressive, but come on, man.

The free throws did not impress me at all.

Is that bad?

They didn't even cross me.

Also, Koozy, maybe not a great scene partner.

He's not letting Nick Nulty shoot.

I'm done with this podcast.

See you later.

This episode is brought to you by Warner Brothers Pictures.

One battle after another is coming to theater September 26th.

Don't miss legendary writer, director, and producer.

My guy, Paul Thomas Anderson, teaming up with Leo DiCaprio for the first time ever.

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They almost teamed together in Boogie Nights, actually, alongside award-winning actors like Sean Penn, Tiana Taylor, and Benicio Del Toro in this hilarious action-packed adventure, following Bob Ferguson, an ex-revolutionary, on a mission to find his missing daughter and overcome the consequences of his past.

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