S1E9: The We We Are (with Jon Stewart)

Speaker 1 Adam. Yeah.

Speaker 2 I want you to close your eyes and imagine you're working in Lumen's HR department.

Speaker 1 Okay, give me a second. It takes me 10 minutes to close my eyes.
Oh, wait. I did it right away.

Speaker 2 Okay, keep them close. If our partner, ZipRecruiter, was helping Lumen hire for various roles, how do you think HR would feel about ZipRecruiter's ability to search resumes quickly via keywords?

Speaker 1 Let me get into character here.

Speaker 5 I think they'd love it.

Speaker 1 It's efficient. It's targeted.
We can search words like cure lover and affinity for long hallways.

Speaker 2 Okay, you can open your eyes now. Oh, thank you.
So if you were actually a business owner and not an actor who plays a guy who works at a weird company like you do in the show. Hey, wait a second.

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Speaker 1 You know what? Lumen should make ZipRecruiter a perk. It's way more fun than a finger trap.

Speaker 2 Finger traps are not even fun.

Speaker 1 No, I actually get legitimately claustrophobic when I use a finger trap.

Speaker 2 Yes. I know.
Even the prop ones. Totally.
Because the finger traps are real.

Speaker 1 It freaks me out when I use it.

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That's right.

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Speaker 6 This show is brought to you by the farmer's dog. Hey, it's me, Adam, and I'm really excited about this one because we have two dogs.

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Speaker 6 That was a long time. Sorry about that.
But if I get that much more time with our dogs, I'm in. So yeah, I switched our dogs to the farmer's dog.
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Speaker 1 Do you have a seat belt on that chair?

Speaker 8 Over the shoulder strapped in, boys. Okay, great.

Speaker 3 Bring it.

Speaker 7 Here we go.

Speaker 4 Hey, I'm Ben Stiller.

Speaker 1 I'm Adam Scott.

Speaker 4 And this is the Severance podcast with Ben and Adam, where we break down every single episode of Severance.

Speaker 1 And wow, Ben, we're here at the finale, the season one finale, The We We Are, written, of course, by Dan Erickson and directed, of course, by you, Ben Stiller. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 4 How you doing? I feel, I mean, it's, first of all, we've gotten through all nine episodes of the first first season.

Speaker 4 It feels like an accomplishment, kind of, I think. And it's been a lot easier than I think when we were making the episodes.
Right. It seems like it went a lot quicker.
But it's been really fun.

Speaker 4 And I feel like you and I have kind of, you know, we're starting to get a little bit of a feeling of like what it is to be a podcasting team.

Speaker 1 Yeah,

Speaker 1 it's been super fun. It's been really interesting going back and going through the episodes from the mindset of I'm going to need to talk about this

Speaker 1 rather than just cringing and hiding and watching through my fingers and being freaked out about watching it.

Speaker 1 But really after not having watched it for I, the last time I watched it was before we started shooting season two. And then

Speaker 1 on set, we would go in and look at things to refer to if we needed information or whatever. But really just sitting and watching full episodes.
It had been a while. Yeah.

Speaker 4 And it's interesting when you work on something, you know, you're editing it and just living with it so much. And then all of a sudden you have a break of like a year or two in this case.

Speaker 4 And, you know, I was saying the other day, like sometimes you look at stuff and it's like, oh, all right, that was pretty good.

Speaker 4 And then there are other times you look at it and go, oh, I could have done that a lot better. Or you remember the pain of that day of shooting that one thing or what you couldn't get right.

Speaker 4 But overall, it's a totally different experience watching it when you're disconnected from it. when you're severed from the experience of having actually

Speaker 4 just made it. And so it's been fun.
It's been really fun.

Speaker 1 You brought it back full circle there.

Speaker 7 Thank you.

Speaker 4 Yeah, I like to use the terminology whenever I can.

Speaker 1 But I think if I were to sum up our little chat here, A, it's an enormous accomplishment that we've made this podcast, perhaps a bigger accomplishment than making the show.

Speaker 4 And I think we could maybe, yeah, like retire after doing this podcast. Yeah.

Speaker 1 We've done it all now. B, it's much easier to make a podcast than the actual show.

Speaker 4 It is easier than making the show, but it's and it's as fun, though, because making the show is fun.

Speaker 4 It's just like a, it's more like a long-term fun project where you work at it for a long time and the work is fun.

Speaker 1 Yes, I love making the show. And another component of re-watching it is it makes me want to get back and start shooting the show some more, to start shooting it again.

Speaker 4 Yeah, definitely, definitely. The other exciting thing about today is for our finale episode of the first season recap podcast is that we have a huge guest on the show.

Speaker 1 Oh my God, do we?

Speaker 4 Yeah. I mean, I have known this person for a long time, but he has become a television legend.
And I was honored to learn also is actually a Severin Super fan.

Speaker 4 Which just, I was, you know, it's so funny when you're working on this stuff and then all of a sudden somebody you really respect and know reaches out and says, hey, man, I love that thing.

Speaker 4 It's like, so I'm so into it. It's, it's such a great feeling.
But the person we're talking about is Jon Stewart, ladies and gentlemen.

Speaker 1 Oh, my God.

Speaker 8 Oh, my God.

Speaker 8 Guys, I thought you were about to introduce Letterman.

Speaker 8 I was listening to the intro and I was like, oh, my, I can't wait to meet this person.

Speaker 4 But, John, you have graduated to those ranks.

Speaker 3 Oh, God.

Speaker 4 You have.

Speaker 8 I mean, you've and I got the grace to prove it, man.

Speaker 3 We all do. We all do.

Speaker 4 You've

Speaker 4 put the work in.

Speaker 3 You've spent the time.

Speaker 3 Yes.

Speaker 8 I've grinded.

Speaker 4 You have.

Speaker 4 You've become someone that people, I think, look to

Speaker 4 for guidance and humor and relief. And sort of

Speaker 4 and you're just smart too, John Stewart.

Speaker 8 Or to angrily yell at by the Holland Tunnel.

Speaker 3 That also happens.

Speaker 1 I will say, I remember the moment you reached out to Ben about Severance,

Speaker 1 Ben, you texted me that Jon Stewart likes severance. It was a huge deal.

Speaker 8 Doesn't even like severance, obsessed.

Speaker 3 Oh, wow.

Speaker 8 There was an obsession. And it's the same way that I found out, and Ben had told me this, that you were filming an episode down near where I live.

Speaker 8 And so I was able,

Speaker 8 Ben was kind enough to let me come on the set.

Speaker 8 And it was this episode, actually, I believe, Ben. Is that correct?

Speaker 4 That is correct. You came by while we were shooting

Speaker 4 the Helly sequence for the last episode Lumen at the Bell Labs building, which you're in the vicinity of, I guess. I don't want to give away too much.

Speaker 4 That might be what those drones are.

Speaker 3 Central Jersey go?

Speaker 3 What's up?

Speaker 1 We can put your address in the show notes.

Speaker 3 Not a problem.

Speaker 4 As we speak, there's a drone issue over New Jersey, and I don't know if that has to be done.

Speaker 8 Yeah, sorry about that, guys. It's just a new business I was starting of

Speaker 8 giant drone swarms. I just thought, I didn't realize people would get so freaked out about it.

Speaker 1 Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 4 Whenever I see a report about that on the news or like on my phone or something, I literally feel like I'm in a Roland Emmerich 90s, you know, Independence Day movie or whatever.

Speaker 8 It's like no question.

Speaker 4 It feels like that's a scene from the movie where the reporters start talking about the, you know, these drones that nobody can identify and people are being told to relax.

Speaker 3 They're totally relaxed.

Speaker 8 Listen, everything's fine until they get lasers. And then the whole thing is, you know,

Speaker 3 yeah.

Speaker 8 And they've just been hovering every night.

Speaker 4 So you can't, yeah, but you came by and it was really fun. Our cinematographer, Jessica Lee Gagne,

Speaker 4 I'm just going to out her and say she's a big fan of yours and was like, and she doesn't really get impressed by a lot of people.

Speaker 4 And she got very quiet and was sort of like, oh my God, John Stewart's here. John Stewart's here.

Speaker 8 So. No, I made sure to stay really far away from her.

Speaker 3 I just sensed the vibe.

Speaker 4 And you'll notice a lot of the shots are out of focus in that sequence because she was.

Speaker 3 And completely out of focus.

Speaker 8 And I was just so, just, first of all, that Bell Labs, and I don't know where you guys found it, but it is notoriously for us who live around here, this odd dystopian development, sort of this.

Speaker 8 It was Bell Labs for a long time, and then it was bought by a guy who developed it and wanted to create like almost a

Speaker 8 village or a community around it. And it's the weirdest.
It's like if Mussolini had decided to plan like a

Speaker 8 subdivision, a suburban subdivision. Like it's the weirdest

Speaker 8 giant cement for.

Speaker 4 They actually have that on their brochure.

Speaker 3 Yes. Mussolini's subdivision.
As if.

Speaker 8 But I don't know. Like perfect

Speaker 8 for what you would think is this kind of luminesque dystopian.

Speaker 8 And you walk into it and it's like a full court basketball,

Speaker 8 right? Built

Speaker 8 in there. And then like one coffee shop and Hasidic couples meeting each other.
It's the oddest.

Speaker 1 It's weird. We spend weeks there and it's like frozen yogurt,

Speaker 1 coffee.

Speaker 7 Yes.

Speaker 1 It's really crazy.

Speaker 4 It's a mixed-use space. It's, it's, they've been trying to, yeah.
And, and it, it really, the thing that, that really blew us away was that nobody had ever filmed anything there. Right.

Speaker 4 There's been no movies or maybe some commercials.

Speaker 4 But, you know, that's one of the things when we're looking for locations, you want to find something that's not, you know, hasn't been in every Law and Order episode or, you know, in New York, we shoot a lot.

Speaker 7 Right.

Speaker 4 So this place was undiscovered.

Speaker 8 It's like in, you know, if you notice now in Atlanta, like any show that you watch, they're now using like Covington, Georgia.

Speaker 8 Like it's all like if you watch Stranger Things and then Walking Dead, you're like, I'm pretty sure that's the same high school.

Speaker 3 But

Speaker 8 this place, and there's that great scene when Mrs. Selvig was driving up that long,

Speaker 8 because there's this really long, beautiful sort of drive into

Speaker 8 the Bell Labs

Speaker 8 offices.

Speaker 8 And you guys captured that so well. And there's that, what's that funny tower, Ben?

Speaker 4 That's the water tower there

Speaker 4 that they built in the shape of a transistor.

Speaker 4 Because I think that's, Yeah, because that's where the transistor was developed by Bell Labs back in the day.

Speaker 3 Wow. Yeah.

Speaker 8 They've got to make everything shape.

Speaker 3 The water tower has to, does it have to hold water? No, it has to look like a transistor. Yeah, I know.

Speaker 4 It's so interesting. And we've really made that one of the sort of iconic

Speaker 4 things in the show that we put the Lumen logo on.

Speaker 4 All of those houses, the Mussolini subdivision of houses that are built on the sides of that driveway, they built, because we've been working on the show for five years, right?

Speaker 4 And when we first scouted this place, those houses were just being built. They had just decided to do subdivision on either side of the driveway, which we erase in the show.

Speaker 4 So when you see the wide scenes, right, you don't see them.

Speaker 4 But they built them all around there as a way to, I guess, you know, create a community. And it's a very, very interesting place.

Speaker 4 And that design and architecture, it was Iro Saarinen, the architect who designed it. Really? Yeah, who also did the TWA terminal at JFK.
And

Speaker 4 his great mid-century architect. So that's his design.
They expanded on it in the 80s and built on the sides a little more.

Speaker 4 But those little specific sort of touches that he has on the inside are kind of what cued us for the rest of the design of the show because we found this as the, it was the first location we found.

Speaker 8 It's remarkable. And it is, and people don't know, like,

Speaker 8 There's an atrium there that's like nothing I've ever seen before. It's like like these sides.
And I guess when they were working in Bell Labs, all those sides were the offices.

Speaker 8 It's the least efficient use of space

Speaker 8 you could ever possibly imagine. It's just like, what if we just put like single-file offices down what appears to be three acres and 10 stories high of just open space?

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 1 It's just a hollowed out, like three football fields that could have been offices, but instead it's just open air. It's wild.

Speaker 8 And they decided to put one cafeteria space in the corner.

Speaker 3 That was the end of it.

Speaker 4 And I don't think even in seeing it on screen, you don't get the size of it, the scale of it when you're there.

Speaker 9 It's so much bigger.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 8 During COVID, so that space became during COVID a place where people went to kind of avoid each other, but still have that feeling of being around people.

Speaker 8 And then those giant parking lots, they started showing outdoor movies.

Speaker 8 And they started doing really like music or comedy shows where people would sit in their cars because it's just this vast expanse. Wow.

Speaker 4 Wow. Yeah, that makes sense.
And I've been there when they've had like carnivals in the parking lot and all sorts of things.

Speaker 3 You could do any of those parking lots. It's the craziest thing.

Speaker 1 In spring of 2021, when we were shooting there and the vaccinations were just starting, there were people lined up all in that lobby getting vaccinated.

Speaker 4 In fact, I remember a couple of people from the show got vaccinated there while we were doing the show.

Speaker 8 I got to tell you, if the FEMA camps come, that's where they're going to set. That's where we're all going to be re-educated.

Speaker 3 For whatever's coming next,

Speaker 3 that is the place.

Speaker 12 That will be the place.

Speaker 8 That'll be the place where we all go to be re-educated.

Speaker 4 It'll be kind of ironic, you know.

Speaker 4 Yes.

Speaker 4 Okay, let's take a quick break.

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Speaker 4 Hey everyone, I'm Josh Radner, and I am so excited to tell you about How We Made Your Mother, a rewatch podcast looking back at how I met your mother.

Speaker 4 And I'm here with Craig Thomas, who co-created the show along with Carter Bays.

Speaker 13 Hi, Craig. Hey, Josh.
Somehow, it has been 20 years since the show premiered. That's, I'm going to check the math on that.
10 years since it went off the air.

Speaker 13 And we thought that made this a perfect time to look back, see what the hell we did, and why the show still seems to resonate with fans around the world today.

Speaker 4 Follow and listen to How We Made Your Mother wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 4 John, what was like the main thing that drew you about the show? What was the thing about it that was so?

Speaker 8 I follow Adam Scott everywhere. So, whatever he does,

Speaker 8 I jump in.

Speaker 8 Whether he's married to Reese Witherspoon or whether he's heading off into a dystopian, I follow.

Speaker 1 That's why you were such a fan of Piranha 3D, I would imagine.

Speaker 8 So, the 3D, obviously, for me felt a little much, but

Speaker 8 I'm always, I'm an Adam Scott fan, but I prefer you 2D. I prefer you.

Speaker 8 I prefer Lego, to be honest with you.

Speaker 8 Keep that in mind. You know, Ben,

Speaker 8 anything you're in, directing or any of that stuff I watch, but what originally

Speaker 8 it had such a unique

Speaker 8 style,

Speaker 8 atmosphere, tone. You know,

Speaker 8 anymore, it's so hard to find something where even the the rhythm of it feels so fresh. And so you're really invested in the world that you guys built out.
And it's done so meticulously.

Speaker 8 And there's touches in it that just feel so unique. It reminds me of, if you remember in the movie Her, where everyone's pants were just a little higher.

Speaker 8 And you're like, is that like, is that going to mean anything? Or is that just something we're like, in the future, our pants are higher? Like, so in the beginning,

Speaker 8 that's what intrigues you about the show is, are these little details salient?

Speaker 8 Are they merely, is it a bit of window dressing? But you're so invested in the intentionality that you guys infuse into the show.

Speaker 8 So much intention. And obviously, the execution level is so high that you're immediately like,

Speaker 8 you feel anytime you're on a show like that where you're watching and you're leaning in a little bit you feel yourself just drawn into this

Speaker 4 world

Speaker 8 that feels intentional unique but also

Speaker 8 utterly authentic to to what it is yeah and so that for me just

Speaker 8 even i mean that the opening credit sequence like even that

Speaker 8 where I'm just like, Sim Adam Scott in bed.

Speaker 3 Okay.

Speaker 8 I'll follow this anywhere.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 11 So I was just thrilled to find something

Speaker 8 that had built its own unique and intentional

Speaker 8 universe.

Speaker 4 Yeah. Yeah.
I mean, it's funny. I kind of get.
drawn in by things like that too. Even making something,

Speaker 4 it's hard to describe. And sometimes it sounds a little bit sort of really, this is like what you want to do.
But like, it's for me, sometimes it's just like living in that world.

Speaker 4 Like, I, I, and that's the music is a really important part of it for me, too. Yes.
And we, we work with Teddy Shapiro, who I've worked with since back in the day, like dodgeball.

Speaker 4 I go all the way back.

Speaker 3 I knew him when he was still Shapiro, you know, before he went with the

Speaker 4 well. I changed my name to Styler Ben Styler.
The long eye.

Speaker 8 I didn't know why. I said, give me the short eye.

Speaker 3 Don't give me the long eye. Yes.

Speaker 4 Then he moved out to LA and got affected.

Speaker 4 But what I was saying is this, like, for me, I get drawn in when working on something to wanting to like live in that world, you know, and like as we're editing it, putting it together, the feeling, the visuals, the sound, and all that.

Speaker 4 And it is, it's something that has, really, it has to do with the story and all that too.

Speaker 4 But there's just something about being in that world that you hopefully have created with all these different elements of the collaboration of everybody who works on it.

Speaker 8 I'm also curious, Ben. And Adam, I don't know if you feel this way when you're making those kinds of acting choices, but you know,

Speaker 8 on television, especially something like the Daily Show, it's very ephemeral. And you sort of go on one day and you'll know immediately kind of what the response is and all that.

Speaker 3 And

Speaker 8 sort of like egg salad, you make it, and three days later, no matter how good it was, it's already gone. But you're ensconced in this world for so long.
And like you were saying, like five years,

Speaker 8 and you're making really strong creative choices. Yeah.

Speaker 8 How scary is it to do that for so long without any sense of sort of like, how do you know when you've gone down a rabbit hole that's going to bear fruit?

Speaker 8 How do you know when you've made, because now you're making choices that build upon other choices and it kind of

Speaker 8 goes out in these sort of concentric circles. And unveiling that must be terrifying.
Yes.

Speaker 8 I would think.

Speaker 4 Yes. Adam, do you want to go? 100%.

Speaker 1 Sure. I mean, first of all, I totally agree, John.
When you're watching something that feels like it has been wholly considered, like everything has been, it's comforting. It's something I appreciate.

Speaker 1 And honestly, as a fan, something I've always appreciated about what Ben does, whether it's Tropic Thunder or Escape at Danamora, you feel like every detail you are looking at on that screen has been mulled over and figured out and considered, right?

Speaker 1 You are in very good hands, right? Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 I, as a viewer, that's all I'm looking for. Like that is it.
So to be in that world, and it was the same with Walter Middie, too, where you are.

Speaker 1 everything

Speaker 1 is there and ready. So you can trust completely in the world and in what, in your director and what Ben's doing.
But yeah, that was, I think it hit later than it hit Ben.

Speaker 1 But at a certain point, when it was time for the season one to come out,

Speaker 1 yeah, it was terrifying. And for me, it was when the billboards went up and I saw my face huge around town.
And that was the first time I had experienced that.

Speaker 1 That's when I freaked out because it's just like we really took a big swing here. Yeah.

Speaker 1 We really like it.

Speaker 3 The top of your head is gone.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 3 But like our people.

Speaker 8 I like this Adam Scott fella, but not crazy about his whole head.

Speaker 7 We got to take

Speaker 8 the top of Scott's head.

Speaker 1 That's right.

Speaker 4 That was the one where we go, that's the one.

Speaker 3 That's the one.

Speaker 1 It was just like, are people just going to make fun of us? Like, is this silly?

Speaker 1 You had the same kind of moment too, right?

Speaker 3 Well,

Speaker 4 for me, it's yes, for sure.

Speaker 4 But what happens is I go into sort of when I'm working on something, it's different because I'm not, it's not like what you're doing on television where you're getting immediate feedback.

Speaker 4 You just make a commitment. If you're making a movie, it's the same thing.
You make a commitment to it and you go and you work on it and then you show your first cut eventually.

Speaker 4 And that's when you're like, oh shit, I hope this works.

Speaker 4 And you try. But on this thing, it's different because it's, you know, nine, nine or 10 episodes.
So it's a much longer period of time.

Speaker 4 And we were doing it during COVID, the first season, and it was literally in a bubble. You know, the whole thing was so insulated.

Speaker 4 And it was a great creative experience that for me, I kind of like fool myself somehow when I'm working on something. I'm just in it.

Speaker 4 Like, like when I do a take in a movie, I'm like, well, you know, maybe it won't be that take. Maybe it'll be the other take.
So I don't have to worry about that now.

Speaker 4 And so that frees me up, I guess, just to try stuff. It wasn't until we finished the last cut of the last episode.

Speaker 4 I remember one night being at home because I was editing remotely with Jeff Richmond, our editor, and we finished. And I remember just having this thought of, like, oh, wait a minute.

Speaker 4 Like, we've been doing this thing for like two years.

Speaker 4 I think it's good. I like it.
I really like it. But like, this thing could totally just fail.
It could just be like, or nobody could watch it, or people could think it's not, it doesn't work.

Speaker 4 And that, but that, I kind of like put that off until I have to think about it. And then it is incredibly, yeah, this moment in time right now when we're about to release the new season.

Speaker 4 Um, Adam and I commiserate on it all the time. It's that feeling of like, oh shit, I hope,

Speaker 4 you know, and it's different the second time around because the first time we had our, you had no expectations, just it was like, I hope we're not embarrassed.

Speaker 3 You know what I mean? It's like, I hope people. Because it's so novel.

Speaker 8 I mean, part of it is, you know, sometimes when you're creating something, you have all these analogs.

Speaker 8 I mean, I don't know if you, you know, whenever I'm in a position to be able to build out a world, you're always sort of, you've got your Pinterest board of all the different influences and things, and you're pulling them from different places.

Speaker 8 But what you guys

Speaker 8 had made was so novel that it's really hard to find analogs.

Speaker 8 You can find inspirations, but if you're thinking about that, everything in

Speaker 8 television and film and all that is sort of boiled down to that. It's like gone with the wind, with the Muppets.

Speaker 8 You're always trying to tie those two things together.

Speaker 8 This had such a,

Speaker 4 there was such oxygen in it, such inspiration, such different things that it's hard to find that i imagine for you guys as a comfort hard to be like well it'll be like this yeah uh yeah i mean it's funny like we made the first three episodes and i i directed the first three and the last three and i remember thinking after i made the first three okay i think these are good i like these um and then i was like oh no but the last three I don't know if the last three are going to live up to the first three because I didn't have as much prep time and it got more, you know, it's tougher as you go along, you're shooting.

Speaker 4 Right. And then it was kind of like people, a lot of people had this opposite reaction.
I was like, oh, I think it starts out kind of, some people are like, it starts out kind of slow and then

Speaker 4 you get into it. But I was thinking the opposite, like, oh, I thought like we nailed it in the first few episodes.

Speaker 4 I hope that, and especially because the last episode, which we're talking about today, we shot.

Speaker 4 We shot the whole show like a movie where you'd go to like one location and shoot scenes from episode three, six, and nine at Debbie Rickens' house, you know? Yeah.

Speaker 4 And then we're going to go to Louisiana.

Speaker 8 Well, that's hard for the actors, too, I would imagine, because they're at different levels of investment in their characters.

Speaker 8 I imagine that's difficult.

Speaker 4 Yeah, and it's tough also just in terms of when you're thinking of a whole season, because I'd never really, I did that with Escape at Dana Moore, I guess, but this was like, I don't know, it was bigger.

Speaker 4 And when we got to Devin and Rickens' house to shoot, which is one of the first places we shot for the season, we shot all the scenes from episode one and whatever other episodes were there.

Speaker 4 And then we had to go and shoot the scenes for episode nine there. And this was like a month into the shoot.
Wow. Or something like that.

Speaker 4 And all of a sudden, Adam is doing, you know, his she's alive moment. It was like so out of context.
Wow.

Speaker 4 And I remember the whole, and the way it was for episode nine was we would have to catch scenes.

Speaker 4 for this episode every time we were like when we were at lumen when you came you know we would just catch scenes right we sometimes would go back and reshoot too but overall we were piecing this episode together piecemeal over the course of like nine months.

Speaker 4 So every once in a while, I'd check in with Jeff, our editor, and say, like, how's nine coming along? It's like, well, we have this piece and that piece.

Speaker 4 And I remember being very insecure about nine, thinking, I, because also I'd always imagined it, it's going to be totally different visually than the rest of the show because, you know, the show is very, you know, everything's kind of very set and like.

Speaker 4 ordered, you know, not a lot of handheld, if any, unless there's a specific thing.

Speaker 4 But for episode nine, we're like, we're going to use steady cam the whole time and it's going to be flowing because we want to be in the point of view of these characters.

Speaker 4 And so, that felt weird every time we'd pull out the steady cam to shoot.

Speaker 4 Because I was like, you know, it should be in their point of view the whole time, but you can't be in their point of view the whole time because then you'll never see them. So, how do you do that?

Speaker 4 And so, I was constantly feeling like I hadn't quite figured it out. Um,

Speaker 4 and

Speaker 4 was just sort of like doing whatever we could to try to tell the story, making this choice we knew that it was going to be very subjective.

Speaker 3 And yeah,

Speaker 8 and I remember doing fun that the choices that you made made that early on, because what I love about nine

Speaker 8 is that it's different from, you know, so much of it is kind of

Speaker 8 not an office comedy, but that sense of you have this sense of place and you can have a distance from it, you know.

Speaker 8 But those party scenes are so claustrophobic and suspenseful and almost hitchhakian.

Speaker 8 But to make that choice so far in advance, and even, adam for you the acting is so different that sense of when you come out and you say

Speaker 8 how's our baby like it's such a great like i don't know where the fuck i am

Speaker 8 right but but clearly i have a baby right like yeah it's such and the the speed at which you have to come up to knowledge as your innie is taking it in

Speaker 8 like the idea that you guys did that week one blows my mind.

Speaker 1 I remember doing quite a bit of experimentation at those party scenes. Like remember that rig I almost was going to wear for some of it, but it just ended up being too cumbersome?

Speaker 4 Yeah, we had this sort of helmet cam type thing we used in, I think in the first episode for Helly's point of view when she's trying to get out the emergency exit, where like the helmet would have a camera on it so you could actually see your hands and everything.

Speaker 4 That's right.

Speaker 3 Oh, wow. Yeah.
And we tried. GoPro.

Speaker 4 Yeah. Yeah.
And right. So the person's walking around like kind of like a camera, you know, robot or something.
And that didn't work. And it was, I remember that, that's what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 Like, I remember us sort of improvising and going, okay, let's just do, we'll do like handheld here. We'll do the steady cam here.
And I mean, talking about that, that part of the episode,

Speaker 4 I agree. Adam is like having to, every second, he's having to kind of take in this.

Speaker 8 He's recalibrating his relationships. Yeah.

Speaker 4 And I remember just, we'd have that discussion for every scene.

Speaker 4 Like even when you, you know, when you first see Rickin reading and then you go outside with him and we realize, oh, wait, you've never been outside before.

Speaker 4 But are we going to play that or not?

Speaker 3 No, well,

Speaker 1 I remember trying a take where I was like reacting to the sky and stuff. And it was like, we can't, like, we just have to stay on this one track.

Speaker 1 Because it became about like six things and it was just too much. And it was also about like reacting to the surroundings.
But he also can't be found out until he says the wrong name to Cobel.

Speaker 1 So he can't be.

Speaker 8 But even that, what a great throwaway, though. Like everything else is so intentional with your character, right?

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 8 And then all of a sudden you're just like, all right, Miss Cobel.

Speaker 3 And

Speaker 3 I was just like, what? No.

Speaker 3 Why did you die?

Speaker 1 He doesn't know her by any other name, so just assumes that suit. But

Speaker 1 I feel like I've said this on the podcast already a couple of times, but that was the moment where when we were shooting it, I went to Ben and Patricia and just kind of thought out loud about if the architecture has gotten us to the right place, this moment is going to be the moment where things start to fall.

Speaker 1 This is going to be so fun for the audience when I call her Kobell and not knowing the percentage of whether they'll be with us or not, but knowing like this will be so much fun.

Speaker 8 Right. and it's such an estimation of of where the investment is but it all delivered on that investment i mean that

Speaker 8 that whole episode is such a wonderful delivery on all the investment that the audience had put in as as a member of that audience uh it really was such a satisfying ride even turturo like being like car

Speaker 3 yeah

Speaker 3 that's so fun to watch.

Speaker 1 Oh, my God.

Speaker 8 Like, all that was just, you're just like, oh, this is so awesome to watch the Innies

Speaker 8 just try and figure this shit out.

Speaker 4 Yeah. Yeah.
I also always look forward to the meeting of Mark and Ricken,

Speaker 4 Innie Mark and Ricken, because this, you know, idea that Mark on the outside really doesn't like Ricken and Mark on the inside idolizes him. I just loved that juxtaposition.

Speaker 4 I thought that was such a really smart idea by Dan as a storyline. And so looking forward to this meeting that finally, you know, any mark will meet Ricken.

Speaker 4 And how will Ricken, not knowing it's any mark, react to this version of Mark that like likes him?

Speaker 4 And, you know, and so that scene for me, and also, I just, you know, I'm a Michael Chernis fan who plays Ricken. He, there's so much humor in what he's doing.

Speaker 3 And yeah.

Speaker 8 I mean, to me, the best part of the entire scene, honestly, is that

Speaker 8 his man Friday's name is Balf.

Speaker 3 Oh, I know.

Speaker 8 That's not even a name.

Speaker 1 I wrote Balf down this morning while watching the episode. It's my favorite, too.

Speaker 7 Yeah.

Speaker 8 Oh, the name Balf is just...

Speaker 3 Is that like, was it Ralph? And then he just... No, it's Balf.

Speaker 3 Balf. Balf.
Okay.

Speaker 4 But that's a Dan. Dan Erickson and names is just, it's just a thing.
He's

Speaker 3 great.

Speaker 4 I mean, also, he says, prepare the neti pot because his throat he just like does this thing after he's finished his reading that it's taken a lot out of him and he has to regroup but then he's outside and then he confides in in mark that he's you know insecure about it you know i'm like a sad yeah hamburger waiter that's the interesting really interesting is that suddenly we see that ricken is self-aware and aware of his relationship with Mark and where it is and how he sees him.

Speaker 4 Right. Yeah.
So that I think you're right, though, that the

Speaker 4 it was the writing of this episode that brings together all these threads that makes it satisfying.

Speaker 4 I mean honestly because when I watch it I just watched it last night and I was like all right you know it flows and it works and it builds and there are places where it like builds to crescendos and then kind of resets and then builds again tension wise.

Speaker 4 But really what I think is the thing about the episode that people like is that it's bringing together all these stories. You know what I mean?

Speaker 4 If you looked at it, if you said to somebody, hey, this is a great episode of TV, watch this out of context, it would really be like, okay, there's a guy driving, there's a guy talking.

Speaker 4 But I think what it is for the fans of the show, it seems, is that it's very satisfying to see

Speaker 4 all these things come together. And of course, what Mark learns, what any Mark learns.

Speaker 4 And again, when we were shooting it, it was a little bit of a kind of a shot in the dark in terms of like how much we could actually get away with in terms of like stopping the tension or slowing down to like have the scene with Devin where you have to talk about who you, you know, who you are, where she's telling you who you are.

Speaker 8 Sure. And you're also editing it together before you have a sense of what the audience's investment will ultimately be.

Speaker 8 In other words, television in sort of the sense that it happened before streaming, like when you think about Seinfeld or those kinds of episodes, it's all sort of happening in real time.

Speaker 8 And so you're getting a sense of, you know, it's how Urkel becomes the centerpiece of family matter.

Speaker 8 Like you're understanding what the audience is responding to, and you're adjusting, not necessarily in deference to that, but accordingly to what people are responding to.

Speaker 3 You did that in a vacuum

Speaker 8 and did it like,

Speaker 4 yeah.

Speaker 8 And I mean, it's not, believe me, it's not perfect. I do have some bones to pick.

Speaker 4 Okay, let's take a quick reflection break. And when we come back, we'll get John's notes on the rest of the season.

Speaker 12 Adam,

Speaker 2 I want you to close your eyes and imagine you're working in Lumen's HR department.

Speaker 1 Okay, give me a second. It takes me 10 minutes to close my eyes.
Oh, wait, I did it right away.

Speaker 2 Okay, keep them close. If our partner, ZipRecruiter, was helping Lumen hire for various roles, how do you think HR would feel about ZipRecruiter's ability to search resumes quickly via keywords?

Speaker 1 Let me get into character here.

Speaker 5 I think they'd love it.

Speaker 1 It's efficient. It's targeted.
We can search words like cure lover and affinity for long hallways.

Speaker 2 Okay, you can open your eyes now. Oh, thank you.
So, if you were actually a business owner and not an actor who plays a guy who works at a weird company, like you do in the show,

Speaker 2 ZipRecruiter has all these tools and features and more. And they're designed to make hiring faster and easier.

Speaker 2 So see for yourself when you try ZipRecruiter for free at ziprecruiter.com slash severance.

Speaker 1 ZipRecruiter excels at speed. It's smart technology.
Starts showing your job to qualified candidates immediately.

Speaker 1 And if you've got your eye on an exceptional candidate, you can use ZipRecruiter's invite to apply message to personally reach out to them.

Speaker 2 Yeah, see how much faster and easier hiring can be with ZipRecruiter. Four out of five employers who post on ZipRecruiter get a quality candidate within the first day.

Speaker 1 You know what? Lumen should make ZipRecruiter a perk. It's way more fun than a a finger trap.

Speaker 2 Finger traps are not even fun.

Speaker 1 No, I actually get legitimately claustrophobic when I use a finger trap.

Speaker 2 Yes. I know.
Even the prop ones. Totally.
Because the finger traps are real.

Speaker 1 It freaks me out when I use it.

Speaker 2 You know what else is real? What? ZipRecruiter.com is real. So go to it, ziprecuiter.com/slash severance right now to try it for free.
That's right.

Speaker 1 ZipRecruiter.com/slash S-E-V-E-R-A-N-C-E.

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Speaker 1 Okay, we're back. And John, do you have some notes for us for season one?

Speaker 8 I mean, it's not really the

Speaker 8 it's these are not foundational necessarily. It's really just one note.

Speaker 8 And it's really not the whole season. It's really focused more on episode nine.
And it

Speaker 8 the whole season is so considered. And each character,

Speaker 8 when it comes to giving the innies time,

Speaker 8 why would you pick the character with the shortest wingspan?

Speaker 8 Great question. You got Troturo there, who's lanky as hell.
I mean, he's got, he's a half pterodactyl.

Speaker 8 Yeah. He could have stood there, like Wembinana,

Speaker 8 dunking.

Speaker 8 You know, and you're in the meeting and you say,

Speaker 8 let me grab the guy

Speaker 11 clearly

Speaker 8 is going to have the hardest time bridging this gap 100 poor dylan 100

Speaker 8 dylan is the only it's the only note that's and listen i i do have a sub stack dedicated to this

Speaker 4 i'd appreciate it if you guys would at least subscribe honestly i never even thought about that other than dylan was so he really wanted to do it he really felt like he was the man super confident and i'll tell you something when we designed that set we literally had Zach Cherry go into that room, we create, you know, to stretch his arms out so we can get the exact length for his arms.

Speaker 8 Wow, that's so smart because he had to, he had to do that. And I love that they were at disparate heights.

Speaker 8 You know, you would almost think, like, when someone goes in there to build those switches, that they would have, that there'd be a sort of symmetry to it.

Speaker 8 But the idea that he had to go one up and then one down, I was just like, that's so fucking perfect.

Speaker 1 Yeah. It looks painful.

Speaker 3 I mean, it's

Speaker 3 horrible. Yeah.

Speaker 4 It's definitely Jeff Mann, who is a production designer who came on for the later part of the season, came in, and he's a guy I've worked with over the years a lot. And that was his brainchild.

Speaker 4 And he just really got that full kind of weird retro 80s-ish vibe in that room, too.

Speaker 1 Ben, you're saying Jeff Mann kind of designed the control room. Was there any Star Trek influence in the control room?

Speaker 4 Well, I mean, there's no like like literal Star Trek influence, but for me, I think everything comes back to Star Trek.

Speaker 4 It's like weirdly, just like it's such a huge thing in my life that I'm so obsessed with the original series. Yeah.
And so even when we were making the hallways and, you know, I'm such a trekkie.

Speaker 4 I have like, you know, the plans of what they had on stage nine at Paramount where they had the bridge and the hallway and sick bay and all of it, you know? Like that's awesome.

Speaker 4 It's fascinating to me how they, that was only just one little hallway section.

Speaker 4 So Jeremy Hindle our production designer and I talked about that a lot when we were creating all the hallways saying okay we're gonna have to reuse these a lot and we'll have to figure out ways to do that and so anyway yeah the room was really Jeff coming in and he had a real sense for that and I think we wanted to make sure that the monitors were CRT monitors and we don't know we just don't know what what this room is really about we know I love the dichotomy of you know it's such a futuristic technology and sort of this dystopian.

Speaker 8 And then you go into that control room and you're like, is this where Alan Turing did the code breaking? Like there is a certain 1940s, 1950s kind of switchboard vibe.

Speaker 8 Like, oh, I'll just take out this one fuse and put it over here and flip that down. You're just like, that's, wait, in the future? Yeah.
Big gone,

Speaker 8 you know, analog.

Speaker 1 Yeah. And being in there, every little switch and button did feel, it felt like we were walking into like 1973 or something.

Speaker 1 And also all those books we would pull out and flip through, those were completely just filled with specific instructions and procedures and stuff.

Speaker 4 Yeah, there actually was a real procedure that he did. All of those steps were real in terms of like the, you know, what he had to do.

Speaker 8 Oh, those aren't like, those books aren't lorem ipsum.

Speaker 4 Like no, no, because

Speaker 4 they're not, because we also know, even with the trailer that's out for season two now,

Speaker 4 people freeze the frame, like on the, there's like a newspaper in the trailer, and they freeze frame, and they read like all the, what's written there.

Speaker 4 So we knew that the handbooks and all that stuff, I didn't know that it would happen, but I assumed it might happen if people like the show.

Speaker 4 And Kat Miller, our props person, would work with Dan Erickson to make sure that all of the writing in every page of anything you read is real.

Speaker 4 So, yeah. And we wanted to also give Zach something to actually do, you know, because when you're shooting something like that, it's like you have to get all the little pieces, right?

Speaker 4 So if you have an actual series of things that he has to do, it makes it easier to shoot it also because you know that you're covering each bit of action. Right.
And so we did that with him.

Speaker 4 And then I would be lying, though, if I said that I did not many

Speaker 4 times over the course of making the show as we were getting ready to put it out in the world, I was nervous that people would buy that whole thing.

Speaker 8 Honestly. Oh, you buy it

Speaker 8 1,000%.

Speaker 4 I know, but I was really like, the things you're saying about, hey, it looks like it could be Alan Turing or that.

Speaker 4 On the flip side, if somebody didn't buy the show, be like, what the hell? It looks like, you know,

Speaker 3 it's like, that's what makes it so great.

Speaker 4 So that's what was a relief when people were bought into the reality of the show that when they get to this crazy control room, that it really, they believe.

Speaker 8 Listen, we buy into the whole, like, I still don't understand what they do.

Speaker 3 Right. Right.

Speaker 8 What cleaning, I don't know what any of this is.

Speaker 3 Right. And that's important.

Speaker 8 You're still invested in it. Yeah.

Speaker 4 And that's important because we also, you know, want the audience to feel that even though you don't know what this stuff is about, there's a reason for it and it's going somewhere.

Speaker 4 I mean, that's the sort of the bigger picture of what is it all about. Right.

Speaker 1 Yeah. Yeah, totally.

Speaker 1 So this is really interesting because in this next scene, we get to see Heli's Audi sort of in her natural environment. She's in a formal dress.
She has an up-do.

Speaker 1 She's talking to Natalie, the woman who's been the liaison between Kobel and the board all along. And it quickly becomes clear that Helly is at the Lumen Gala.

Speaker 1 And actually, not only is she at the Gala, she is actually Helena Egan. And the Gala is dedicated to her contributions to the technology of severance.

Speaker 4 What was your impression on the set when you came to visit it?

Speaker 8 I was there. So in that scene when Heliar comes in and she's sort of walking through the gallery of her severed story,

Speaker 8 it's so overwhelming

Speaker 8 because it's practical.

Speaker 8 You know, so many times you go into those sets and they are,

Speaker 8 I don't want to say shortcuts, but they don't have to create the fullness of experience.

Speaker 8 So

Speaker 8 when I walked in and I saw the severance story for Helly R,

Speaker 8 and it's all laid out across, and it's, it's vast. I mean, it's not a lot of times you walk on a set two and you'll be like, I had no idea the set of the price is right is so tiny.

Speaker 8 Like, or the oh, that wheel, it looked gigantic. It's it's like a

Speaker 8 so I was impressed by the scale,

Speaker 8 and then even like that little the scene where uh the one I was watching was when Patricia first interrupts uh Heliar and as she's about to walk out.

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah, let's let's take a listen to that scene.

Speaker 16 Hell yeah, is it huge?

Speaker 16 What are you talking about?

Speaker 16 It is you, isn't it?

Speaker 17 I'm gonna kill your company.

Speaker 16 Your company?

Speaker 16 Who the hell do you think you are?

Speaker 16 No,

Speaker 16 your friends are gonna suffer.

Speaker 16 Mark will suffer. You'll be long gone,

Speaker 16 but we will keep them

Speaker 16 alive

Speaker 16 in pain.

Speaker 16 You're on.

Speaker 8 She's walking out. She does that one look back.

Speaker 8 And you're just like, what a great moment of like, she's about to burn this fucking place down.

Speaker 8 And she just does this quick look back, like, okay, I guess we're good.

Speaker 3 Just like, boom.

Speaker 8 It just, so I was

Speaker 8 really

Speaker 8 excited when I walked around it because of the feel of it was so evocative as you're walking it.

Speaker 4 Yeah, those cubes were really cool. And that was, that was also Jeff Mann had, I think it was inspired by some, there was like some expo in Montreal in the late 60s.

Speaker 4 He showed me these pictures of like black and white photography that was lit up on cubes. And so that was his inspiration for that.

Speaker 8 Oh, yeah. You know, I didn't even think of that, but now that you, you said it, it does.
It's got that like 60s, 60s,

Speaker 8 the world of the future presentation. It's got like a real expo vibe to it.
Yeah.

Speaker 4 And also those pictures, we haven't talked about this, but the black and white pictures that Milchik has been taking all season.

Speaker 4 So if you remember in episode two, when right when she's getting the severance procedure, Milchik takes a picture of her in the operating room, and you see that on one of the cubes.

Speaker 4 And so the idea was every time we'd shoot one of those scenes across the season, we would, you know, shoot the shots with our still photographers who are amazing.

Speaker 4 And then Jeff Mann, who was doing production design at this point on the show, created these cubes and it really had this feeling, yeah, like you were saying, John, of like this sort of world of tomorrow.

Speaker 4 Yeah, yeah. And

Speaker 4 yeah, it was fun to also figure out how to tell that story and how Helly would basically come to the realization in that moment when she sees Helly a severed story that, oh my God, this is what her whole life has been.

Speaker 8 Right.

Speaker 1 Yeah. And sort of the crass commercialization of her entire life so far and that she's just this prop.

Speaker 4 Yeah.

Speaker 4 Essentially. And that Jon Stewart was at the gala walking around in the background.

Speaker 11 I was just walking around.

Speaker 8 I was checking out the expo trying to see if that was something I was interested in trying this severance experience. I thought it was interesting when her father.

Speaker 8 was talking to her, you know, you have this relationship between the innies and the outies and the people that are experiencing it.

Speaker 8 But the way that he spoke of her innie as a separate entity that had nothing to do with her, you know, I think he was talking about

Speaker 8 when that woman tried to hurt you, you know, when he was talking about the suicide attempt.

Speaker 4 Yeah. Oh, you know what? I would like to listen to that scene.

Speaker 15 She's in here, sir.

Speaker 17 Hello now.

Speaker 16 You look so nice

Speaker 16 like a fellow.

Speaker 16 Thank you.

Speaker 16 Are you.

Speaker 16 Are you still young?

Speaker 16 No.

Speaker 16 Not anymore.

Speaker 17 I cried in my bed when they told me what she tried to do to you.

Speaker 17 What that any tried to do.

Speaker 17 Thank you for going through with it.

Speaker 17 The grandfather would cherish what you've done.

Speaker 16 And one day,

Speaker 17 you will sit with me at my revolving.

Speaker 8 I thought that was such an interesting way for him to relate to this technology that I'm assuming he has a hand in, you know, that he has such disdain

Speaker 8 for this creature.

Speaker 4 Yeah, I mean, definitely

Speaker 4 you get the sense that the innies are looked on as less than human.

Speaker 9 Right.

Speaker 3 Right.

Speaker 4 You know, they're looked on as these creations, and yet he's created them. You're right.

Speaker 3 Right. That's what I was so like, awesome.

Speaker 4 Yeah. And so like, what is this guy up to? What is that about? And I think that in this this bathroom scene, there's this sort of connection he's having with her.

Speaker 4 You can see he's obviously a strange guy, but he has this sort of real connection with Helie, who he would think is Helena, but is Helly.

Speaker 4 And I think that's something that's there and interesting because, you know, you don't know what kind of relationship he has with his daughter.

Speaker 4 You get a sense it's not a very, I mean, the fact that his daughter's in the in the ladies' room and the assistant opens the door and says she's in here and he just comes in.

Speaker 3 Right.

Speaker 3 In the ladies' room. Yeah.
Why not?

Speaker 8 I'm just excited to find out if we are going to see him at his revolving.

Speaker 3 When he goes,

Speaker 3 well,

Speaker 11 you'll be there at my revolving.

Speaker 8 And I'm like, what is this now?

Speaker 7 Wait, what?

Speaker 4 John, I hope you'll come to my revolving.

Speaker 3 I'm going to come to all of your revolvings.

Speaker 8 I really, you know, a life well-lived is one with a fully attended revolving.

Speaker 8 but those are that's that's what i'm talking about those little moments of where you really do lay out the it's the absurdity of our rituals the absurdity sometimes of of how we go through

Speaker 8 these performances at different points in our careers and our lives yeah that are meant to be infused with all this meaning and when you really strip them away you're like oh Yeah, it's a revolving.

Speaker 3 It's a revolving.

Speaker 1 To someone else, it's just a revolving.

Speaker 3 It's a revolving.

Speaker 4 Well, to me, that's like the basic idea of the show that I always was drawn to is that you meet these people, and it is kind of like a workplace kind of workaday comedy vibe in the beginning of the banter and everything.

Speaker 4 But these people don't know who they are, what they're doing, why they're there. That's kind of a metaphor for life, you know?

Speaker 4 No question. And I think that, to me, is always what's sort of resonated.

Speaker 1 Also, we should take note note of how great Brit is in these scenes and with her father coming in the bathroom and seeing Helie just trying to fucking figure out what's going on, who this guy is, first of all, and what the fuck he's talking about.

Speaker 1 Just everything she's just doing

Speaker 8 that you guys do in episode nine is just beautifully rendered with how small those little realizations have to be.

Speaker 8 You know, you're basically undercover spies that are working this party as agents and watching you negotiate that and figuring out who to trust, what the different relationships, how to be reserved, but still carry on that kind of human bargain we make in terms of conversation of like the right non-verbal agreement.

Speaker 4 And also Taturo in the episode. Yeah.
He doesn't have a single line except for Bert at the end. So the whole episode is just John Toturo, you know.

Speaker 8 That was a heartbreaking one, to be honest. Yeah.
Like the Turturo arc in that Helliar is surrounded by community. Mark, as cut off as he is after his wife's death, is surrounded by community.

Speaker 8 John has a dog. Yeah.
It's nice,

Speaker 8 but he's alone. Yeah.
And he's got a box of memories and a dog and a love that he can't have. And you just, it just, like, it just breaks your heart.

Speaker 8 And then to know that his love is so fun to imitate.

Speaker 3 Worldwide.

Speaker 11 Worldwide.

Speaker 8 How many times I've said to you, muck?

Speaker 8 How can you not do the Christopher Walker?

Speaker 8 But that really, to me, was so stark. is to see his life and his paintings are dark and that like that hallway where you see the light.
And

Speaker 8 you just felt like

Speaker 8 so badly for

Speaker 8 his loneliness.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 4 Yeah. And he has such an inner life as an actor.
It's just, you just put the camera on his face and there's so much depth there, you know?

Speaker 1 Yeah. John is unbelievable.
And watching John figure out how to drive the car.

Speaker 3 It's the best. It's the best.
And even the power windows at one point, I think she figures out like the power windows.

Speaker 4 And it's also the question of like, what does a severed person know intuitively? Right? He obviously has some intuitive muscle memory of.

Speaker 4 Yeah. And that's always an interesting question for the actors, I think, in every scene, is that they get to choose sort of like how much comes through or how much doesn't.

Speaker 4 Sometimes it's more in the forefront.

Speaker 1 Yeah. And, you know, it's really interesting because we talked to John Toturo about this when we had him on for the last episode, but we didn't want to spoil 109 at that time.

Speaker 1 So why don't we listen to that right right now?

Speaker 4 When you finally come to consciousness in Irving's apartment and you find that trunk.

Speaker 3 Right, right.

Speaker 4 And we find all of this information that Irving has been amassing and we find some little clues to Irving's past somehow.

Speaker 4 And

Speaker 4 one of the things we see is a photograph.

Speaker 3 Do you want to talk about that? That's the photograph of

Speaker 9 your father, yeah. Right.

Speaker 18 Yeah, in the Navy.

Speaker 4 And I and i brought his actually uniform yeah uh from world war ii to the set we that's the first time and the only time i i will you know use that i mean i thought that was so special that that you did that and that moment of okay what does this mean what is this history who is that person you know it's probably irving's father that it's actually your your your father uh just kind of adds another layer to it and where we leave irving at the end of episode nine is it's such a big part of the end of the season, besides the cliffhanger that Adam has of, you know, what he says is you pounding on that door.

Speaker 18 I think it's kind of symbolic of the whole show. Everybody's sort of pounding on that door.
You know, everyone's in this raw state, you know, in a way.

Speaker 18 And so you are connected to the other people at the same time. We're all going through that in different ways.
I mean, Dylan is allowing us, you know, to do that. And so

Speaker 18 it was just an an interesting challenge, I think, for all of us as actors to be embodying this other part of ourselves

Speaker 18 and not knowing exactly how to do that. Like drive a car,

Speaker 18 find a place.

Speaker 4 You had to drive a car instinctually and you had to figure it out.

Speaker 3 Right. Yeah.

Speaker 18 You came a good direction. You were like, just try that.

Speaker 18 And that was kind of fun, you know, in a way.

Speaker 10 It was great.

Speaker 4 It was great to watch you do that. And then that raw emotion at the end.
I mean, anybody who has ever felt anything in their life for a real love for somebody else

Speaker 4 and the pain of a relationship that doesn't go well, who's ever been there knows what that is. And you just, you did that.
And you did it

Speaker 4 out of context. Shooting it was not easy because we shoot the show so out of order and in such bits and pieces.

Speaker 4 You just had to show up one night and do that totally disconnected from the rest of that episode.

Speaker 9 Yeah.

Speaker 18 Well, it's, you know, sometimes it's piecemeal work. That's why it's good when you've thought through the whole thing, you know, before, right, you know, and you have someone helping guide you there.

Speaker 4 But should we go back at the very end, just quickly, the very end is Dylan there, you know, as Milchik is trying to, and you were talking about like the perks that Milchik is offering him as he's trying to get into the security room.

Speaker 4 Should we play that, maybe just to play one bit of that? Sure.

Speaker 19 I bet the tempers were disappointing.

Speaker 19 I can still get you back in there.

Speaker 19 I can get you any perk you want, Dylan. Hey, this stuff you don't even know about.

Speaker 19 There's paintball. There's coffee cozies.
Dylan, come on.

Speaker 19 Just say the word and I get you a coffee cozy literally right now, Dylan.

Speaker 16 Come on, man. I want to remember my fucking kid being born.

Speaker 20 You have two others.

Speaker 18 I can tell you about them.

Speaker 19 Just open the door and I'll tell you their names. Come on, Dylan.

Speaker 19 Dylan?

Speaker 1 It's so fucked up.

Speaker 8 It again speaks to

Speaker 8 imagine

Speaker 8 you think you're dealing with idiots. You think you're dealing with idiot children that a coffee cozy would be enough.

Speaker 8 This person has risked everything to open up the floodgates, to open up the Indian. He's like, I got a coffee cozy.
He's like, I want to know my fucking children. Yeah.
And he didn't know what.

Speaker 8 I almost thought there was going to be, he was going to be like, I can get your children coffee cozies.

Speaker 3 Like that he wasn't going to understand.

Speaker 8 But you realize, oh, Milchik understands.

Speaker 8 He just thinks the Innies aren't capable of that level of emotional life.

Speaker 4 Yeah. I think also the coffee cozies

Speaker 4 probably worked and would have worked before he had seen his kid in real life. Right.
And then he's been right.

Speaker 1 Yeah, Milchik letting him see his kid or getting him in a situation where he could potentially meet his kid is an irreversible fuck-up.

Speaker 1 And the thing really is kind of that when each of the MDR people, all four of them, kind of get exposed to love and affection of some sort, that is when they all kind of start.

Speaker 1 turning a little bit when they get a taste of this human experience That's when they start pulling away from Lumen in one way or another.

Speaker 8 And I hate to say this, but there are times that the daily show when we reward the staff similarly to how Milchik does, and that we have had waffle parties

Speaker 7 for the staff. And when

Speaker 8 I can't tell you how when I saw that, my heart sank.

Speaker 3 I thought, well, geez, we got that waffle.

Speaker 8 There's that like, I don't know if you guys have ever seen it. It's like dingles and waffles truck.

Speaker 8 yes right you know after like a particularly long run we'll bring in the dingles and waffle truck sure and then as i'm watching you know milchik promising like i can get you all the waffles you need i'm like oh dear god

Speaker 1 am i milchik is that what this is if you think we didn't get the waffle truck brought over to the severance you would be wrong

Speaker 8 The day I was there, Ben had gotten you guys ice cream.

Speaker 4 That's right. We went and got the second crew.

Speaker 3 There was an ice cream truck.

Speaker 8 I got to partake in the ice. I got the reward

Speaker 8 without ever having to go through the trials and tribulations.

Speaker 10 Yeah.

Speaker 12 Yeah.

Speaker 4 What did you feel when Adam at the end says she's alive?

Speaker 7 And that moment happened.

Speaker 8 I mean, it's just heart.

Speaker 7 It's heartbreaking.

Speaker 8 Because it all, like, it's one thing

Speaker 8 to want to struggle to figure out what's happening, but then to think that

Speaker 8 involved in that is the greatest betrayal that a human could maybe undergo.

Speaker 8 It's one thing to think like, hey, these guys are fucking with us.

Speaker 3 Like waffle party? That's not so great. I don't like how

Speaker 8 that moves it from dystopian experiment to true malevolence, like true evil.

Speaker 8 Now you're like, oh.

Speaker 8 This is an evil that's beyond something we can even comprehend.

Speaker 1 Yeah, because we've seen Mark kind of gradually become disillusioned with the company.

Speaker 1 But I think that he figured he had hit the ceiling of the depravity of this place when he decided when they all did the overtime contingency and came out there stumbling across this photo.

Speaker 1 I don't think the furthest reaches of his imagination ever imagined that someone could do something this horrifying or a company could do something this terrible.

Speaker 8 You know what struck me, and I don't know if you guys have, if this is in the lore or however you do it, but it was the first time that I thought, oh, Lumen is setting people up for severance. Because

Speaker 8 his wife dying is the event that drove him to sever. So now you're thinking, oh, wait, are they

Speaker 8 conducting experiments and doing shit to people

Speaker 8 to drive them to sever?

Speaker 3 Like, is that also being manipulated?

Speaker 3 Come on, tell me. No, no.

Speaker 8 These are not rhetorical questions.

Speaker 3 You can't answer me.

Speaker 4 We're not on your show, John.

Speaker 8 We don't have to show you.

Speaker 7 That's right.

Speaker 1 This is our show, bro.

Speaker 8 Tracy said, all she said to me, I said I was doing this today, Tracy, my wife. She goes, I want every episode.
And I want it in bulk. I want to binge it.
I don't want to sit through week to week.

Speaker 8 You will get those episodes and you will get them in full.

Speaker 4 John, this has been so much fun. Thank you for doing this.

Speaker 1 Yeah, thanks, man.

Speaker 8 Guys, it's my absolute pleasure.

Speaker 4 And I know we're friends and everything, but I continue to be impressed and just sort of grateful for what you do.

Speaker 8 Thank you, friend.

Speaker 8 Much appreciated. And I can't wait to do this again season two, brothers.

Speaker 1 Definitely. Truly an honor.
Bye, John.

Speaker 4 All right. Thanks.

Speaker 7 Take it easy. All right.

Speaker 4 All right. Well, that's it for season one of the podcast.

Speaker 9 Wow.

Speaker 4 Congratulations. Yeah, congrats.
And if you're listening to this on the day it dropped, the premiere of season two is tomorrow, January 17th on Apple TV ⁇ .

Speaker 6 Holy cow, it's finally here.

Speaker 4 Yes.

Speaker 4 I mean, it seemed like it never would come.

Speaker 1 Yeah, and we're dropping a new podcast episode about the premiere right after it airs. And we'll continue to drop new podcast episodes every week with some incredible new guests.

Speaker 4 That's right. They come out right after the show so you can listen right away.
And I just want to thank all the guests who joined us for the recap of season one and thank everybody for listening.

Speaker 4 Yeah. And I hope you guys enjoy season two.

Speaker 1 The Severance Podcast with Ben Stiller and Adam Scott is a presentation of Odyssey, Pineapple Street Studios, Red Hour Productions, and Great Scott Productions.

Speaker 4 If you like the show, be sure to rate and review this podcast on Apple Podcasts, the Odyssey app, or your other podcast platform of choice.

Speaker 4 Our executive producers are Barry Finkel, Henry Malofsky, Jenna Weiss-Berman, and Leah Rhys-Dennis. The show is produced by Xandra Ellen and Naomi Scott.

Speaker 4 This episode was mixed and mastered by Chris Basil. We have additional engineering from Javi Crucis and Davey Sumner.

Speaker 1 Show clips are courtesy of fifth season. Music by Theodore Shapiro.

Speaker 1 Special thanks to the team at Odyssey: Maura Curran, Eric Donnelly, Michael LeVay, Melissa Wester, Matt Casey, Kate Rose, Kurt Courtney, and Hilary Schuff.

Speaker 4 And the team at Red Hour, John Lescher, Carolina Pesikov, Jean-Pablo Antonetti, Martin Valderutin, Ashwin Ramesh, Maria Noto, John Baker, and Oliver Ager.

Speaker 1 And at Great Scott, Kevin Cotter, Josh Martin, and Christy Smith at Rise Management.

Speaker 4 We also had additional production help from Gabrielle Lewis, Ben Goldberg, Stephen Key, Kristen Torres, Emmanuel Hapsis, Maria Lexa Kavanaugh, and Melissa Slaughter.

Speaker 1 I'm Adam Scott. I'm Ben Stiller.
And we will see you next time.

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