There’s No I In Trevor Noah [VIDEO]

Social media is so multifaceted, right? So sometimes you're using social media to connect with family that are living abroad. Sometimes you're living on social media to get your news.
I would ban WhatsApp. Why would you ban WhatsApp? African aunties just use it.
What does that have done to you? Love a bit of WhatsApp. Let me tell you something.
During COVID, the misinformation. Nothing sends photos faster.
Listen, Ben. Yeah.
The misinformation that African aunties spread about COVID during COVID-19.

It actually is one of the biggest spreaders.

But you know why it became that?

They were like gargle with salt and vinegar instead of getting the vaccine.

And I'm like, this is not going to work.

That's just the wrong family.

That's not my fault.

That's just talking about who you grew up.

No, no.

I'm telling you it's all of them. The people on my WhatsApp aren't saying anything like that you're in the wrong whatsapp well maybe i'm in the right whatsapp you're listening to what now the podcast where i chat to interesting people about the conversations taking over our world today on on the podcast, my favorite question, if I ruled the world, we love a good thought exercise on what now.
And this is one of our favorite questions to ask with friends. If you were in charge and you could change one thing about anything, schools, airports, commerce, restaurants, whatever it may be, what would you change? Well, we've got three folks on the show today with three massive ideas, maybe terrible ideas.
Who knows? We'll see. Either way, joining me, writer, journalist and professional hater, Cristiano Mbacuay-Madina, and one of our very own executive producers and my good friend and fellow football watcher, yes, you say soccer, Ben Winston.
And let's get into it. This is What Now? with Trevor Noah.
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Use promo code Trevor for 15% off. that's actually really good no i see real talent of mine it's it's almost it's almost like you did it welcome to the podcast everybody how you doing good terrific you paused for such a long time yeah because we've got kids did you pause because you're english or did you pause oh yeah yeah it's probably a british it really is well we were being polite i was sort of going ladies first you can see how you are and then yeah i know i'm off the back of it oh wow and now i'm gonna apologize for us pausing because wow it was compulsive well happy podcast day everybody this is an this is an all colonial edition i guess it's like degrees of colonization yeah we have the colonizer uh we have one who was integrated into into the colony and then one who was just oppressed but has has made his way out i'm not going to come across well in this pilot at all if that's how if that's how we're you're the colonizer okay maybe i'm not uh this is fun actually this is fun this is fun ben we we barely get to speak to you because you're always like off doing something like if there was an asteroid coming to earth now you would probably be asked to produce it as a as a concept like they would be like the world's ending we would like to get ben winston to produce this for us yeah the final ending concert of the world it's lovely to be here trevor when 14 people have said they can't make it and then i get that call it's like he's already a producer of the pod no one else is about we want to do it in person let's just get that dude oh that's what we're fake humility fake humility and as always as always the rose amongst the thorns i love that phrase christiana how are you friend i'm good i'm good feeling good being a rose i the thorn.
Where are you the thorn? Because I'm just like, I'm a friend with the opinions that destroys the group chat. You know what's funny? I feel like you've lived in, maybe you've lived in like the Western world for too long.
Because if you were in South Africa or many parts of Africa, I feel like you would be like the friend. Yeah, of course.
Because it's just like, they like chaos. Yeah.
I mean, like think about Joseph, like our like our friend from uganda oh my god we need to have him on literally there was a group text that was sent out to our soccer group and um they didn't mention his name but they said hello gentlemen please note that this is a casual game and nobody needs to be instructive and stop telling other people that they're useless and what they need to improve on and i sent sent it to him. And in classic Joe style, I said, Joe, this is definitely directed to you.
And he was like, oh, first time I've been called a gentleman. He wasn't even phased.
Because I think as Africans, we're blunt. We're like, whatever.
It's not about being polite or anything. How are you doing, though? I'm good.
Where have you been? Where have I been? My favorite CIA asset. Oh, wow.
You always ask that question in such an accusatory way. I'm sorry.
And no, it's fine. It's fine.
Because I feel like you're up to mischief. You know what? You're not wrong.
Where I am in the world is generally for a mischievous reason. And where I am in the world is actually the perfect question to ask for our brand new segment.
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Okay, I've debated whether or not I should tell you this. Oh, wow.
This is one of those moments in life where I like to be honest with my friends But I also like to be right By the way if a man tells you he likes to be honest That means he's a liar But What? I can't believe you'd say that It's just that when men are like Oh I'm really honest No no I didn't say I'm really honest I said I like's a difference. All right.
What's this got to do with where you've been?

I've been traveling quite a bit.

Yeah.

In part of my travels,

I had a meeting and a conversation with the assistant director of military operations at the CIA.

So, yeah. Interesting.
Is that what you've been doing? You've been having a conversation with the CIA? I think you've truncated everything I've said and made it sound a lot more click-baity than it is. What did you meet the CIA about? Again, you've just moved on from, you've now made it the whole organization.
I just met an individual. Lovely, lovely gentleman.
Okay. And yeah, but I wanted to tell you this because if I omitted it, I would always feel like I'd kept something from you that sort of made you right.
And why did he reach out to you? You see, these are like, this is not like he reached out. We just happened to be in the same place and we were having a conversation.
You have a strange life. We're the cannot tell you um i've been to other places well i saw you recently we bumped it we literally bumped into each other in an airport yes in dubai it was in dubai i wasn't in dubai i was flying you were coming from abu dhabi i was coming from abu dhabi and i was flying to la and then we just happened to be texting i was like where are you like i've just landed in dubai and i was like Dubai.
And I was like, I'm in Dubai airport. You're like, so am I.
And we met at like the business center. Yes, we did indeed.
And we had like a lovely 20 minutes. It was so bizarre.
I love those like encounters in those meetings, just randomly bumping into people in the world. But you had been in Bhutan with a load of monks.
Yeah, Bhutan, Japan. And now you're meeting the CIA.
Like it didn't involve the CIA and I was traveling and enjoying good coverage. So let's jump into the podcast.
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I think it is time for us to jump into this week's podcast, which is really exciting for me because sometimes I think we limit ourselves in how we think because we think through the lens of what is and what could be and every now and again i like to think to myself what would i do if i ruled the world and that's when i find the magic happens that's when the true magic happens so i'm gonna kick it off uh so i've been thinking about it this week if i ruled the world i know this is going to be controversial but if i ruled the the world, I would shut down social media. It's done.

It's finished.

There is no more.

Considering especially people are probably watching a lot of this on social media.

Yeah, it's done.

But it feels like you're being hypocritical because how much stuff you're putting out on social media. No, I'm not being hypocritical at all.

All of it?

Yeah.

Now, let's be clear about what I consider social media.

So it is Instagram, Facebook um snapchat uh tick tock uh twitter and are there any others there's we chat which is like i don't think truth social i'm big on truth social i love it i love truth social as the white member of this panel i'm i actually i'm huge on truth what's it like over there it's where the truth Wow. And it's social.
Wow. It's true social.
Do they know that you're Jewish? No, I hide that. I hide that.
I hide that. I thought I was hiding it from this podcast as well, but apparently not.
I've been outed. So you're going to explain why you want to ban on social media, but you at the same time need to acknowledge the many incredible things that happen because of social so this is what i think we do sometimes in society that is uh you know like there's this idea and i think it's neuroscientists um have have states of this and psychologists they've said that as human beings we overestimate how happy something will make us and we underestimate how unhappy something can make us.
I think social media falls into one of those categories. We take for granted how unhappy it has made us as a civilization.
We take for granted how much it's hurt us. So I'm not saying it hasn't brought the good things.
But I think the good things are far outweighed by by the bad my issue is we talk about tiktok and all these algorithms knowing us well i think the thing we take for granted is that we're creating a feedback loop where the data that we're putting out becomes the data that we're getting in what you don't realize is happening to you is for the most part the algorithm is contracting your view of the world and leaving you in a world where you like the things that you like. And it's just giving you slight versions of the things that you like.
Do you get what I'm saying? I do. And I worry about what it's going to do to us as a society.
I worry about what it's already done. Now, I know some people are going to say, oh, but Trevor, I mean, because of social media, I know what's happening in the world.
Yeah, we knew what was happening in the world before social media. Did we, though? We did.
We did. But hold on.
We did. No, we knew.
Ask me about things. I'll tell you if I knew them.
But here we've given the power. Social media.
Yes. And listen, one of the things I was thinking about in the lead up was maybe banning social media for kids who are under 16.
And actually just letting them never have smartphones, but only have phones where we can reach them and find out where they are. Because I don't there's any good to be had from that but essentially back in the day pre-social media people would get their news yeah from five organizations that would decide how to tell that news and we have to acknowledge that now we are giving the individual power to tell their story that you're now taking away from them yes i hear what you're saying which is works for your dictatorship but might not work for the world i hear what you're saying and um i love you as my friend that you're now taking away from them.
Yes. I hear what you're saying.
Which works for your dictatorship, but might not work for the world. I hear what you're saying.
And I love you as my friend, but you're wrong. So the reason I say you're wrong with such confidence, Ben, is because I'm not saying that I will get rid of the internet.
The internet still provides everybody the opportunity to in some way, shape or form share their opinions. Social media has created a specific machine, an algorithm that is tasked with one thing in particular, and that is keeping our attention, keeping us engaged.
So I'm agreeing with you, yes, there were maybe like five networks, but I think that would change. Cable news comes out, cable television, cable whatever.
But then there's also the internet. You can go on the internet.
You can search something. There'll be other websites.
There'll be other news, et cetera. Because in the same way that you're saying social media has given individuals the opportunity to tell their stories, I think it's also robbed us of a collective understanding of what reality actually is.
And I know, I know that I'm sacrificing some things. but the things that I think we're benefiting from are the fact that reality starts to come back together because your feed can feed you a reality that isn't completely real.
How many times have people looked at, like, let's look at the conflict. You want to be delusional? Yeah.
Yeah, you're in an echo chamber. I'm happy there.
The thing is- But you're unhappy there, I argue.

But life is suffering.

Like, people are going to be unhappy, Trevor.

Like, with or without the social-

No, honestly, I think they're going to be unhappy.

And I'd rather them be unhappy on their phones than out in the real world doing real damage.

But okay, think of it this way.

Pre-social media, you are a crazy person somewhere in the world. Yeah.
You crazy idea how do you connect with other crazy people a religion and you have a very hard but people's had cults people very hard so you're so very hard to really blow you want to raise the threshold is that what you're saying yes to back in the day a crazy person had to be on the corner holding a flyer telling you why you have to join their thing to end the government that is what you're saying and again uh i'm okay with it if you want to be that kind of dictator but what you're essentially saying i don't like the fact that you're calling me a dictator i just said if i rule the world we're sat in a room with your name everywhere i just said i just said no no no i can't move for trevor noah yes yes but it says with trevor noah with it's small and you are with i am with i am with and i think it's important to remember that okay with but my point is if you're saying there's mad people who we're giving a voice to what you're essentially saying is you want to clamp down on free speech yeah censorship i'm not saying that you are you are because you're saying there's crazy people on the street corner we're now giving them a megaphone i'm not disagreeing with you that we are musk paid you ben? Oh, no, I'm not. I'm all about the TikTok dances.
That's why I don't want to lose. Think of all the avocado toast recipes I'm going to miss out on.
No, I'm just saying that your reason on the one hand is because we're unhappy, and I can take that. And then you moved on to the algorithm is damaging, and now you're saying there's crazy people on the corner we're giving a megaphone to.
That's a wide spray of bullets you're going with. Because I think it's a wide spray of bullets that's affected us so let's break them down really quickly so i'll give them to you as a list the reasons i say we should get rid of it right in my world if i rule the world number one misinformation and disinformation spreading at a rate that is far far far quicker than any other traditional media could be number two limiting people's ability to live a life online that is making them more alone more lonely and feel artificially connected when in fact they're not that's fair right because it presents it presents the veneer of connection that isn't in fact there number three i would go with it's fracturing our collective reality now i'm not saying we have to agree on it or disagree i'm not saying that i'm just saying we all have to agree that it happened or it didn't happen and i think social media is fracturing that social media is breaking it down i'm not saying my world would be perfect but trevor don't you think that like wait so neither of you agree with me here but wow you guys are parents by the way the reason i don't agree you're gonna wish your kids lived in my kingdom listen maybe the world's a mess i don't disagree but i think social media is just exposing how fractured we already were most people never had a real sense of collective reality no how can you say this honestly people the graphs for loneliness the graphs for loneliness if you look at it if you look at it as a graph yeah all that's happened like it's i would say from the industrial revolution that's when it really starts to go up but if you look at loneliness from social media times it's it's skyrocketing isn't it because we live in this like hyper capitalistic culture where people have to work all the time very valid don't People don't have money for like holidays and housing.
Very valid as well. Cost of living.
Very valid. Even if people didn't have social media, they wouldn't have the means for connection because we're in this capitalist hellscape.
I can agree with many possibilities. Social media is just a reflection of like these kind of dystopian times we're in.
You know what my favourite part of social is close friends on instagram that little button have you ever used a little close friends because then it can just be the 15 of you that you allow into your world and then it's not a status thing it's not a opinionated thing it's just it's just a little close community just putting it out there there's lots of good things about social media lots of good things i've met. I met my husband on Twitter.
Wow. There you go.
Look at that. People, people, okay, here's what I'm trying to understand here.
She met her husband on Twitter. Guys, let's go with, are you saying, are you saying that you wouldn't want her children to exist? You can't believe you're killing off her kids.
Just because you met your husband on Twitter does not mean Twitter is now a good thing. A good thing can come from a bad thing.
There are people who've met like someone they like in prison I don't like prisons I'm not cheering for prisons I'm so sorry tell me about I think there's lots of negatives one of the things that I was thinking about genuinely was like in the things when you said let's do it about what we would change I was gonna say let's ban social media for okay so now let me ask you this question let me ask you this why would you ban it for under 16s and not for over 16s if it is such a good thing for the world i didn't say it's such a good thing for the world i said i don't think it needs to be banned if i remember correctly i think it needs to be regulated if we rewind the tape you will hear ben winston say i love it it is the best thing in the world i want to dance with dictators see that's the problem with ai you've made me say that and i never said that no but really why would you why would you ban it i would ban it because i actually think the biggest problem with AI. You've made me say that and I never said that.
No, but really, why would you? Because you're having lunch with the CIA. Why would you ban it? I would ban it because I actually think the biggest problem with social media isn't about what you've said.
I actually think the biggest problem with it is the insecurity that kids feel and the bullying that can happen on there. And that's what worries me about social media far more than like an adult reading a Twitter feed.
And they should just know better to believe and research facts that they're getting that are true or false so if i'm hearing you correctly you're saying that children are affected by the bullying and the shaping of their reality but adults are not i think adults have a freedom of being able to not feel as pressurized and if they want to enter into that world where they're bullied like when people say and this is gonna this is gonna be brutal when i say this but i'm saying anyway like you know when people go in the news and they're like i've had death threats i've had death threats oh no my twitter i've had death threats i'm like which don't go on twitter we're not talking about somebody sending a letter to your house where they've cut up like magazine letters and like real death letters. We're just saying like some dickhead on Twitter who's like DMing them.
I'm like, just don't go on social media if it's so upsetting for you. But like for me, I was on a flight yesterday, had an hour to kill.
I went on TikTok. And you said death rate.
I had a lovely time. No, I just had a lovely time.
I looked at Arsenal scores. I watched clips.
The algorithm, what is frightening about it is the algorithm now knows me better than i know me yeah because like it started sending me this show about a porn shop not not like sexual porn p-a-w-n correct which i it's like from the 90s this shop this porn shop in detroit and it's decided tiktok that i will like it and it's right i really do and like, it's showing me. It knows what I like more than I would.
If I saw that on a cable menu, I'd be like, I'm not going to watch that. And now I'm hooked on it.
It's another reason I've banned it. The algorithm's too precise? It's another reason I've banned it.
It's such a precise algorithm. Do you not worry that you wouldn't be here if it wasn't for social media? Would you have become, without social media and without people going, oh, I love that guy.
I want to hear him talk about about this it's unlikely that you would have had the success that you've had we would not be sat here today on your with with your name on the mugs if it wasn't for social media so are you not worried about the fact that you're cutting the hand that feeds you what's the expression i i am willing to accept that there will be some things we lose in society because now you've got the house and cars no no no no no no no i and i mean that honestly i mean that honestly i go i think sometimes it's hard for us to think about the possibility of a better future because we haven't lived in it and i don't even mean this in like a dark way yeah like if i didn't grow up in an abusive household i might not be here with you right but would i want that for myself are you Are you saying primed you for a friendship with ben winston in many ways it did in many ways it did okay what i'm saying is what i'm saying is like i do not think that we have to accept something bad because there has been good that has come out of it there will always be good that comes out of bad things okay but in my world, if I ruled it, I would get social media

and I would ban it.

We would still have the internet.

We would still have TV and radio.

I'm not like creating North Korea, people.

Yeah, no, I accept that.

You would just have to learn

your own dances

in your own world.

I'm going to miss it so much.

And you'd have to discover TV shows

on your own.

So, okay, vote.

Ben, are you in my world or not?

No, no, I'm afraid not.

I think you're,

I think, no, I wouldn't want to ban social media entirely because i think whenever you take something away yeah you create a vacuum that's filled with something else and i worry more about what will fill that vacuum than what we will have by it okay all right fine and i also think christiana would never met her husband you would never have been sat here necessarily because of clips that went viral. Art's going to be fine.
All of this. But you too.

All of this fine all of this all of this all of this christiana are you are you voting for my world or not no not voting and your reason is um i i just think that humans are gonna suffer anyway and i'd rather suffer in a world where i can doom scroll on tiktok at 1am in the Okay. Well, um, well, okay.
On that positive note, on that positive note, we'll take a quick break. And then when we come back, let's see what would happen if Christiana ruled the world.
And then we're going to see what would happen if Ben ruled the world. And, uh, yeah, it's a great place.
We'll see. We'll see.
We'll be right back. We're going to continue this conversation right after this short break.
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is not just a new ev it's a new way to experience driving learn more at audiusa.com always pay careful attention to the road and do not drive while distracted Okay, so I created the perfect world and neither of you want to live in it although you will send your kids to live in my world until they're 16 which tells me a lot which tells me a lot yeah uh christiana yeah what would you do if you ruled the world if i ruled the world I would abolish private schools and say that every child goes to a school assigned by a blind lottery. So you don't know where in your city or your district where your child would go to school.
Because I believe that would incentivize rich parents to make sure all schools are good because you don't know where your child is going to end up and i'd make it mandatory for people in the community to volunteer in the school you'd have to get like a crb check we'd have to make sure you know a pedophile or a weirdo and stuff like that hmm abolish private schools hmm now trevor without children is probably never considered schooling or what it would mean i'm sorry i spent 20 years of my life in school, my friend. I'll have you know that.
Okay. So it's not a lot about schools.
It's not a lot about schools. I spent half of my life in schools.
I'll be honest. My initial instinct is yes.
Like you, you, you know, I, I, I like this idea quite a bit, but, but let me ask you a few questions. Sure.
Are you afraid that you'll rob kids of community? Because a lot of the time, schools represent the communities that they're in. And while they may not be perfect when it comes to the education that they dole out, but I do think we shouldn't take for granted what it feels like to be in a school that is part of your community and what it's like to hang out with kids that speak your languages or come from your cultures or you know you know what i mean how would how would you deal with that counter is that like most rich people like the idea of a neighborhood school is collapsed for rich people it doesn't exist rich people like will drive in la they'll go 45 minutes across town many places to a fancy private school and be like i don't want you to be around these but i'm not talking about them i'm talking about let's say the poor middle class oh that's even better they need to be able to be like this is who's probably going to be your boss perhaps right they need to be integrated and be exposed to how like the wealthy and affluent people live i'm actually doing this social experiment where everyone gets thrown into the blender together earlier because the problem is it happens too late.
It happens if you're really lucky, if you're a poor kid, maybe you get to go to an elite college. And you get there and you have a miserable time because you're like, who are these people? They've played sports I've never played.
They have references I don't understand. And it's an isolating experience.
Or you get to meet them in the workplace and you're like, oh, I don't want to be around these people. They like air conditioning.
It's always cold. Why do white people want to be cold all the time? If you go to school with them, you're like, oh, white people like to be cold and you're used to it, you know? Okay.
Very cold. Yeah.
Here's a thought that I have though. Yeah, but here's a thought that I have.
We're now making the assumption that your opportunities in life come from your school yeah when in fact there may just be a correlation between who goes to these schools and the opportunities that they receive well that's why I'm saying if it's a lottery right that's just a lottery for the school yeah it's a lottery for the school so you could be like the poorest kid in your city yes sitting next to the kid of say Bill Gates right Bill Gates is going to make sure that's a good school i i hear you and the spread of opportunities the speakers that you get at the school the sports you do at the school the computers you use trust me i'm just trying to spread the opportunity because parents you're allowed to donate well sure yeah no i'm saying that's a big part of your school damn no because that's what you're essentially i see what you've done i just see what you've done because then you're turning it into a private no no but wait but that's what a lot of these like good public schools are essentially right they are privatized public schools in good neighborhoods because send your kid to that school you need to be able to afford a two million dollar house ben say jump in with your point i don't know this is like watching a football match and i see a counter-attack wait so what it does i actually don't care as much about like the parents giving their money yeah the parents who can afford to give their time the mothers and the fathers let me be politically correct who bake things you know all these people that look out for the teachers like that type of like social capital the thing that is like very intangible those parents i would i want those parents to be involved in all children's lives well no i was going to say that the issue you're bringing up is on the one hand we're saying we don't want private schools and we don't want extra funding for certain schools but then with the other hand you're going a kid can sit next to bill gates's kid and then they got lucky because bill gates then funds the school and then essentially well he does you said he put his money in i mean to put his money in to make sure that school's good so then when he's funded that school then that school suddenly becomes the bill gates no you're describing a charter school i don't want charter schools no but you've you're actively seeking donations from rich parents alongside oh no donations no donations oh wow then what's no donations but then bill you want bill gates to bake rather than donate no no no because i'm like when go to, and I say this as someone who like for primary school, it wasn't the best school. Secondary school is a very okay school, but I ended up doing well in life.
My son goes to a really nice school, right? Yeah. And the level of investment, I just mean personally from the parents and the time they can give.
I'm like, oh, it makes a difference. And not all kids have that.
Some kids have parents that work night shifts. Some kids have parents.
The knock-on effect for the government funding for schooling if we put your plan into place if you ruled the world, where are you going to get the absolute millions that it takes? Where they get the money for the bombs. I agree.
I mean, you see those bombs you're going to buy? I agree. The bomb money.
You agree with her. The bombs or my point? No, no, no.
Christiana's point. I think she's right here.
They've got the money. The money's there.
They had the money when they wanted us all to take the COVID vaccine shot, which I took. I'm not an anti-vaxxer, guys.
But before you get on me, the money. I thought I said I'm Joe Rogan.
The money. But I'm saying the money is there.
You're right. You're right.
They spent a trillion dollars on the F-35 jet that didn't work. They've got the money.
They've got the money. That is such a ridiculous way of playing politics.
So you a huge problem that what problem why are we creating the problem because investing in children is a problem no quite the opposite i would say you're actually investing less in children no i'm investing wait wait wait wait wait i'll say this and then you speak and then we'll go from there so i think what christiana is, if you misinterpret how the money moves, it can seem like you're creating a gap. But if you look at how we currently run schools, let's say in America, and many parts of the world is different, but in the US, for the most part, a school's success or failure, if it's not private, is determined by the zip code that it exists within.
In Christiana's world, if I'm correct, and you will correct me if I'm wrong, I think what Christiana is saying is our tax dollars now become amortized and you can't just aim rich neighborhood money into one school where they now have random programs like lacrosse donkey dancing, which is excess money vibes, and it goes to all the schools. And so she's saying because of that, because all schools will get all money and all parents will have kids in all schools, all parents will want all schools to be good because they don't know where their kid will end up.
So it's not more money. It's just the money will be spread out differently.
Yeah, I'm not sure that's right. Why? Because I think that private schooling essentially means that there is a load of government money that is not needed because it's taken care of by those wealthier parents who can afford private schools.
Let's say, and I don't know the percentage, what percentage would you think go to private schools over public schools? People or money? No, no, people. Let's say in America.
People is nothing, but money is the thing I'm worried about. But my point is, is that that amount of money is coming from the parents.
It's not coming from the government. Yeah, we don't care.
But let's say it's 10% schools.

Now you're taking that 10% and you're creating that burden on the state school system.

No, no, so that's not what...

Because now you're having to spread how much investment you're making

and you're not allowing donations from parents in your system.

So suddenly an education system that was already stretched, that didn't have money,

you're now going, all of those people that were willing to pay for education

so it wasn't our government problem. Now you are our problem too.

So this is what I'm saying.

So like in LA USD, like in LA right now, they are under enrolled because of combination of COVID,

people leaving California and all of this stuff.

And that's like a lot of schools are at risk of closure.

This is true.

And when we say you can no longer have that route of plucking your child out of the system,

it creates a different set of expectations of the government. So parents like yourself are going to be be like you're going to make sure that's a good school right forget the money it's never about the money the systems are underserved there aren't actually enough students like the schools are under enrolled and by the way and i'm it's actually i just want to say that this is a thing that i find a lot of affluent black and asian parents like have a dilemma about it's something I think about a lot how old are your kids what's your oldest so my eldest kid is four right and my youngest is 10 months and the funny thing is with the public schools that are really good they're not very diverse right but the private schools are more diverse so like now it's like I want to send into a good school right and in my mind I'm like okay public school great option free but there's a risk he'd be the only black kid in the class private school that's not the case you've got black kid asian kid jewish because the connect there's money and the private school is really they're like we care about diversity and inclusion for our school brochure so they're like so they're like we make sure we like we want to want to have anything like they'll be like yeah we've got a non with four fingers.
So what are you going to do? You know what I mean? I don't know what I'm going to do. You haven't decided.
I don't know what I'm going to do. That's why I want to ban them.
So wait, wait, wait. So here's something I would want to ask about your magical world, right? This is you ruling this world.
Unfortunately, when you look at history, you will see that time and time again again if you try to do this type of system people who are rich people who may be a little bit racist i'm not even saying racist people i'm just saying a little bit racist like you know just like just sprinkled with racism those types of people will find ways to get their kids out of or into something else yeah let's look at a recent example covid covid came yeah a lot of parents didn't agree with what was happening and what did these parents do they're like you know what we're actually taking our kids out of this little zoom system you have and we're going to create little pods i believe you now may create with your system yeah you may actually create a bootlegger movement of schools where parents are going to be underground with like speakeasy schools. That's happening in this country already.
You know, you've got this homesteading movement, unschooling movement, homeschool movement. You don't think yours would accelerate it more? Well, I think there's always going to be like the people who say, I'm going to pull my kid out.
I'm going to try and get around the system. But most humans, especially parents, are lazy.
This is what you underestimate. People are very lazy.
And no one wants to be with their kid all day. Oh, my God.
No, no, no. If you're like, okay, you say to the mums and the dads, you have to be a parent who teaches your kid, they'd rather kill themselves.
They're going to start it, I'm sure. But some people will be like, okay, we're going to do our pod.
Week two, they're going to be like, send sure But some people will be like Okay we're going to do our pod Week two They're going to be like Send these bastards Back to that Integrated lottery school And they're going to figure it out I just think I will I'll throw this last thing For myself out Just from history You would think This would be the case But don't ever forget America used to have Public swimming pools They were everywhere Yeah People would go to the corner. They would jump in the pool.
See you at the pool, Bobby. See you at the pool, Jamie.
Everybody loved the public pool. You watch movies from back then.
There was always a public pool. That's where the bully was.
I'm going to punch you. And then one day, America passed a law.
And America said, these pools should also be open to black children and the black children came to the pools and initially there was just a little bit of racism people being like you shouldn't be here you're making the water black and people peed in the water while they were in it some people threw acid and etc but even though even that even as that died down what happened to the pools they started closing they stopped getting funding people were like I don't know if we need down, what happened to the pools? They started closing. They stopped getting funding.
People were like, I don't know if we need pools. And what happened at that exact time? Private pools started going up.
The idea of having a private body of water in your house was a crazy concept pre the 1960s. And now everyone's like, I want a house with a pool.
I want, why? Because because there is no pool and i think what you may be creating unintentionally is a world where those same people will go okay actually why are schools even a thing in our society maybe we should close schools down i mean we're kind of on the road there with the charter but i think yours i think yours would literally as we say in south africa like lights off instantly. It would just be like an exodus.
And we'd look back and go, wow. You know there used to be a time when there were schools, public schools, and people were like, I can't believe it.
And they'd all be gone. And so that is why I would not be voting for your world, unfortunately.
I think there are many great, the ideas behind it, I love. But I would, as much as I would love to see Bill Gates' kid sitting next to like some other kid from like Compton who's telling him why Kendrick won the beef.

Listen.

Ben?

I'm still reeling from the pools thing.

I thought people would just shut them down because you got Verrucas.

That's why people didn't go to public pools.

Rubber sock I had to wear as a kid. All that horrible fungus cream.
It'd be hypocritical in a way for me to vote for it as someone who went to a Jewish primary school and then a private secondary school and really enjoyed my education. Oh, well, you see, no, no, no.
Before we go to your vote, actually tell us more about that. It's a tricky one.
I think it gave me a lot of, I think religion was always a really big part of my upbringing and my family's life and our heritage and our history.

And actually getting that education between the ages of four and 11 of who we were and where we'd come from kind of helped my identity even today.

So I think that there'll be a big part of me and the way I run my life every day that would be missing if I hadn't have gone to that Jewish primary school. And because I'm happy with like how things have showed up in my life and how it turned up, I wouldn't really want to change that or tweak that.
But I do think there is always a responsibility to make sure that children are exposed to all ways of life, however that is, especially if they're in an insular school system. But I also think you make really good points about what you're saying with the community spirit of everybody being part of the same thing going forward.
So I'm kind of on the fence. I'm voting more against it than for, but I'm closer to voting for this than I ever am banning social media like Trevor.
the thing is what you said about um the primary school you went to when you don't have a child of that experience in the classroom with you it feels like an abstraction that's true and that's something i worry about not just for my child's own identity as being black and latino like how he views himself but then other people if you're only in a very insular world where you don't see much outside of it i think so here's the one way the one way i would augment my vote for you if your world was school swap i'd be in so if you said for like two months of every year kids all go to a different school then i would then i would be in this is like a premise of like a hollywood movie it's a no vote from me ben i think it's a no from me i think it's a no for me i think it's a no for me i made a i think it's a valid point it's you've brought up great points that we genuinely as parents need to think about about how like how we approach things and how we don't just push everybody else out of the way to get what we need for our children and there is a a sense of community and integration that's needed in the school system that currently maybe doesn't happen. Yeah, I feel like we should be equally invested in everyone's children, not just our own children.
Because when that child grows up and robs you, you're going to have some opinions on it. Yep, that's right.
Every robber is somebody's child. Don't ever forget that.
Okay, all right. Sound like my dad.
We're going to take a quick break. We're going to come back

with the final one. Ben Winston.

If I ruled the world.

Don't go

anywhere because we got more What Now

after this.

Alright, this is it.

We're back. Time for the final

If I ruled the world. So far we got two.
Yeah. Ben and Christiana voted against me.
Clearly, the empire strikes back. And then we voted against Christiana.
So, Ben Winston. Well, I thought about a few things on the way in, and they were, you know, flushes on toilet should be on the floor rather than on the wall, like for hygiene.

And then I was thinking about like.

I've used one of those.

They're great.

Much better.

Like a slow lane for people who are walking slowly.

Stuff was annoying.

And then I sort of sat here.

Japan does that naturally.

I love it.

Do you know what I mean?

It's like there was stuff like.

Or like the fact that the plug changes depending on where you are in the world.

And there should just be one, you know, straightforward one.

And then I realized YouTube were coming up with really intelligent things. And I was like, i better think about this so i was quite glad i came last um just giving me a good 40 minutes to work out what i was going to do um i'm going to go for something that has i think been a positive effect in many people's lives which came from religion but, it isn't religious.
And I think that we should make the seventh day and not for religious reasons, because we're worried about God or whatever else. I think the seventh day should be a day of rest where we go extreme, no electricity, no phones, no driving, where for one day for 24 hours we switch off we exist with our family and friends we eat together we drink together we don't go down to the shops and get the stuff we had to prepare for it in advance we don't work we exist with whatever we've got we go for walks we enjoy each other's company we switch off from everything

else in the world and i think that actually it comes from something that came in my childhood

i grew up orthodox jewish right so my family they wouldn't use cars on saturday we wouldn't use

phones we wouldn't work and my dad is quite well-known sort of infertility specialist he

would be working from 7 a.m till 11 p.m six days a week but from a friday night to a saturday night

Thank you. quite well-known sort of infertility specialist he would be working from 7 a.m till 11 p.m six days a week but from a friday night to a saturday night as a religious family we were just with each other the time we would spend together the joy that that would bring us the switch off that we knew for 24 hours i just had my dad and like nothing else mattered uh and we would all be together and exist together i think is such a beautiful thing to have and to almost like reset because whatever job you do whether you work down the store whether you host a podcast whether you're a doctor nurse whether you do something silly like make tv shows like i do it's always the most important thing in the world and if for one day you just turn off and just breathe for a minute i actually think that could be great for society and family values and everything okay this is this is very beautiful i'm gonna i'm gonna start by asking some questions just to clarify to understand yeah is everyone resting on the same day correct everybody does the same day because otherwise because we need other.
So what we would have to do on this day is we would go, right, all day Saturday or Sunday or Friday. It doesn't matter.
We can choose. I'm open to whatever my cabinet feels about it when we discuss it in government.
But the one day that we choose, everything stops. Okay.
Everything stops. No flights.
So if you are. No flights because then you need the air hostess.
I'm saying for one day we shut down. If you get stabbed the night before.
Yeah, hospitals do that. If you get in a car accident...
Hospitals are allowed. Hospitals are allowed.
Wait, hospitals are allowed? Yeah. So who's working in the hospital? Life and death.
Anything that is life and death. Shift work.
Anything that is life and death, we carry on. No one should die because of my policy.
I don't want anyone to die. I'm a giver.
For some people, the liquor store is life and death. But then they can stock up.
On a Friday, they stock up. Like many religious people do.
They get drunk on the Sabbath, but they stock up and you get ready for it. It would also be incredibly good for the environment because for a day, everything's grounded.
Electricity, planes, cars. It would be phenomenal for the world.
And for one day, do you know what? We all just chill out. christiana do you have anything i have i have a bunch so i like it thank you in principle let's just vote now let's go straight to the event this is because of like accents i don't this is i just realized i'm i didn't want to like it because i'm a hater i should have been the american on this podcast because josh is i should have in fact for the next of the segment i'm just gonna be i to be the American voice on this.
I don't agree with what you guys are talking about. Okay.
This is trash. We should work.
Okay, but Christiana, go ahead. You go ahead.
You know what it is? Because like growing up, we didn't have, we went to church on Sundays, but the thing is, it, it, my dad's a pastor, so it felt like work. It was like, it was always a bit much, but what I did love was after church, we'd always have like a family meal and people would be over the house like sundays are a lot of good memories we'd have 100 apple pie and custard it just created that there's something about a ritual as a collective group that is very 100% grounding that i lack now do you know what i mean because like my mom's gonna listen i don't go to church much don't go as much yeah got myself in trouble but like you know and the people in my world don't observe any rituals because you know if there's a day where everyone's like okay sunday i'm gonna be free but everyone's so over scheduled it's impossible to make plans and i do feel if there's something like collective we all know that you've got nothing happening on sunday we can come together and i think i think what religion gives people if you take out the religious bit, right? If you take out the God-fearing bit, you take out the going to church bit, you take out the guilt bit.
You take out all of those elements and then you're just left with a day of rest. Actually, like literally rest.
And that can be joy and fun and enjoyment. Then you've actually got the really great side.
There can be no doubt that is beneficial to us all i think actually just to go seventh day bang okay no work okay okay i love it i feel you i get it thank you okay i think both of you are probably tired and so you're just like agreeing like ridiculous ideas right now so let's let's go through this okay ben let's go through maybe let's start at the top then because you are ruling this world what happens to people who don't rest do you arrest them i'll be here all week folks with the jokes what do you do what happens to somebody who drops somebody a line on your internet that has no social media i mean like are we talking about discipline and punishment now yeah no and i'm being serious i'm asking i'm asking what do you do because no one can use my social media because it's banned okay so i'm saying what do you do well roads don't rest well roads are shut so they can't drive right you're not allowed to shut the roads the police so they shut them the night before but now you can't you just can't drive that the roads but how do you how do you can't drive what i'm telling you oh you can drive actually for emergencies so this is what i'm saying so i'm i'm talking about the pandemic is a perfect you know what i love about the pandemic it was one of the most powerful natural experiments that humans will probably never be able to conduct ever again and one of the things that showed me is that while most of society will follow a rule yeah there are some people who are just like whoa i just i just heard you say roads are empty there were so i find you wait wait wait wait wait wait ben ben ben this is not remember this is not me as no i get it but you're not acknowledging the great things i'm talking about you're just saying well how are we gonna enforce it ben wait wait wait please understand this as an optimist the number one thing i have to do in my life is i first have to probe an idea okay with all the things that might make it fall apart before i've obviously i love this idea optimist if the first thing you're asking is well how do we enforce it and people are going to do that's not that's a cynical way of doing it the first thing actually actually the first thing i said was that's beautiful thank you that was the first thing i'm not sure you meant it that's the first thing i said i said that's beautiful ben that was the first thing i said so i'm just asking you what happens to all the people who don't rest the same thing that i mean it's lots of people break rules and laws yeah but what happens to them in your world they're fined they're fined they're fined how are they not on the saturday because we can't touch money but then how do you know how do you know that they weren't there's not so such thing but then how do you know no money wait but how do you know but how do you know that's no electricity, so you can't do online shopping and you can't touch money. How do you know who was breaking the rules? We've gone like that with the power, like we shut down the electricity.
Yeah, but how do you know who was breaking the rules? So Trevor's gone out. You're really getting in the weeds.
There's so many more problems than that. There's so many more problems than that.
There's industries like, if you're going to unpick it intelligently, then start thinking about, well, how are people going to travel to the hospitals? how are businesses and restaurants going to survive when one of their weekends are gone the reason how is sports going to happen when at the weekend no so let me explain to you this is what i this is why i'm starting with the rule right this is why i start with the rule anytime you change the world with a rule you then have to worry about rule breakers right so now you're saying people may not work and now what i'm saying to you is if they do not work what happens to them then you're like well we're gonna have to find them then i go but who's looking at them we have to get some sort of police people to make sure that the people then the police are working that's not to make sure that people are not good or bad idea trevor i think there are some parts of it no you're trying what you're saying you're forcing me to rest on a day i don't want to rest on one day why must i rest on your day you can rest on all seven days if you like no no but what if i want to rest on more days what i'm saying what if i like to rest for a week and then work non-stop for other weeks what kind of dictatorship is this where you're forcing people to sleep i'm forcing people to have a day where they just take a breath they surround themselves with people that matter to them what if those people are far from where we literally make those people are far from? To move neighborhoods. I mean, move neighborhoods? But what are you saying? You're saying, therefore, the world only existed when we had electricity.
No. So therefore, pre-electricity, pre-public transport, pre-cars, the world was a disaster.
Wait, no, that's a false argument. People enjoyed themselves.
Let me explain why it's a false argument. And it's not the right comparison.
Before we had the electricity and the the trains and everything people were generally confined to the places where they lived we now live in societies where people are not where they were always so some people have had to go work somewhere where their family is not okay some people have had to go live somewhere where their friends are not so now what i'm asking is if somebody works a job that ends at night like late shift on the day before the seventh day yes how do they then get to their friends and family to get there some people live four hours away three hours away so at nine o'clock they can get there's four hours by midnight they wake up for the day of rest with their family i i don't know christiana my my only modification would be the no electricity thing. Okay.
Just for, especially for me, like I love music and there's something to like being at the dinner. Well, in Ben's world, you better learn guitar, lady.
I know. But there's something about being at the...
You better beatbox. I know.
I want to be at the dinner table, play some Clio Soul in the background. So no music at it.
So there's something about the... Because listen, I'm a musician, I play piano, but I don't want to play piano.
No, I accept that. So like,

there's something about like music

and the atmosphere.

And so for some people,

it's a cookout with the DJ.

Yeah.

We need electricity for that.

No, I think.

So someone's cooking at this cookout.

I never cook.

They're not allowed to cook.

They wouldn't be able to.

You create a fire.

You don't have to create anything new.

Okay.

I think we should modernize.

No cooking at your cookout.

We need to modernize it somewhat.

We need to modernize it.

I'll accept that.

Because for some people, like cooking is resting. You're accepting electricity? No cooking at your cookout.
We need to modernize it somewhat. We need to modernize it.
I'll accept that. Because for some people,

cooking is resting.

You're accepting electricity?

No.

Okay, no electricity.

Cooking?

No.

I think it needs...

No, it needs the electricity.

Okay.

What if somebody's on an oxygen tank?

No, you can do an open fire.

Oh, no.

I said life and death.

Don't try and pull me up on the life and death.

I said life and death.

You said it.

What I'm saying is,

firstly, Trevor,

I know you are breaking out in hives about staying still for a day in your own peace. Because one minute you're in Bhutan, the next minute you're in Dubai, the next minute you're on at the Hollywood Bowl, then you're meeting with the CIA for lunch.
I understand that just standing still for a day and being surrounded by love and human beings is difficult for you. But I think you will find a community locally.
And you know what? If you're far away from people from people go for a walk everybody else will be out for a walk people won't be on their phones there is something nice about community and community has been destroyed by the modern way of life and what i'm saying is wouldn't it be beautiful if we all just went back for one day just one day and we just had a little simple beautiful life where we actually had a moment to spend time with the people we love love this and to and to just appreciate i love that idea we have i love that otherwise before you know it we're all dead and we've just been running around on the freeway can i just say struggling to get to a meeting can i just say and i hope this is very clear i love the Thank you, Trevor. It is beautiful.
It is beautiful. Now, I think the road to hell is paved with good intentions.
I'm saying if we create one day where everybody has to rest, where everybody has to do it the same, we may not necessarily get to what you think we're going to get to. Because there are some people who go, I don't like my rest being on a predefined day.
And some people might go okay ben what if we want to do another day and the reason i'm asking these questions is because it takes me or it makes us all think about many of the things that we have lost in creating a world where people can move around a bit more and that is it becomes a little more fractured right so what i'm saying and i mean this honestly it's not me just trying to play devil's advocate. What happens when Christiana wants it to be Tuesday? And Trevor goes, well, I like Thursdays off.
And then Ben goes, no, I like Sundays off. What happens in that world? So you like the idea, you back the idea.
The only problem you've got with it is you want to choose different days to have your day off. No, no, no, I'm saying- Inay the jewish days are saturday the muslim days are friday i think if i'm right what you're saying is you like the variety but you love my idea you just don't like it all being on the same day is that what i i'm not saying i'm forget i okay there's no i in this okay well what we're looking at does have your name on the mug but it doesn't have i no and it says with what we're looking at is with each other we're looking at yeah what happens when your world suits some more than others what happens then well that is life isn't it and who decides then well it's i ruled the world that's the name of the game so when you say who decides if you're going to do a podcast and you're going to invite me here as the 15th choice guest and you're going to say if you ruled the world what would you do and then when I give you a very very well thought out plan that's much better than banning social media or scrapping schooling systems as we know it and then you go and then you go and then you go who's gonna be in charge i'm gonna say well you just told me i am because you created a stupid game called if you ruled the world well i'm gonna put my vote in and i'm gonna say if i was voting for the system i would say no because i think it would lead to unnecessary unrest i think it would lead to massive conflicts i think it would lead to um a group of people we'll call them the thursdays who would rise up and want to know why their day is not the day shame on you um and i unfortunately cannot vote for this even though and i must reiterate i love the sentiment.
And I mean this not facetiously, my friend. I genuinely believe, and it's why I do it in my life as well with my people.
It's so important to take time off to be with people. But I unfortunately cannot vote for your world where it's enforced on everybody on the same day because I don't think that will lead to peace.
I think that day will be the day of revolution. And so my vote is no.
Christiana? Yes. But with a caveat, I would need electricity.
Okay. Because I think...
But then wait. Does that mean cars though? No, I don't.
I hate driving. Wait.
So your world's going to have electricity? Well, hold on. Which electricity? Can we define what you mean by that? I wouldn't want to cook.
I very so what you essentially want you essentially want just let's negotiate here atmosphere you want music you want to be able to play a record i think music is a big part of the black experience okay and having a day of rest no no i'm saying ben is screwed now what is ben gonna do now a day of rest i've been gonna say no to the black experience now a day of rest where black wow a day of rest where black black people can't watch what they like or play music. Ben, tell us why you don't want the black experience.
Yeah, why don't you want black people to listen to music on their special day of rest? As the minority in this podcast, let me tell you about the minority experience with you two and Josh. I, as the minority,

no,

you know,

listen,

here's the deal.

Nothing's passed today.

Everything's got shut down.

They've been two no's,

right?

This,

I'm about to win the game

because when you vote,

that means two one,

it passes

because you got two one against you.

You got two one against you.

No,

no,

because I voted before,

before you're amending.

So please.

Okay.

So what I'm going to allow, here's what I'm gonna allow guys yeah okay so in orthodox judism what they have so that people can cook is for 24 hours they plug in a little hot plate and they have a little kettle and it lasts 24 hours it's just what they do so so so with that spirit in mind i'm gonna make a little exception and everybody can buy a little generator you have it in your house so it's limited because we don't want people to go crazy we don't want to like your whole you know everyone going wild but you'll have your generator and therefore if you want to play music it will happily do that for the day i accept that will mean that you get your rest some people don't want to sit in quiet my wife's one she can't accept the quiet she goes insane with it she needs stuff in the background so i think with a little bit of generator i think in order to get this policy through like all good politics you need a few amendments to get through congress yeah i'm willing to provide this solution so that we can vote on this and we'll have a day of rest okay so christian yeah absolutely you vote yes now okay all right so now that it's changed i should be able to vote again because that's how it works i think that's how it works Oh okay Once it's changed you So But it's still on the same day Trevor I'm not shirking from that Yeah yeah So now I will vote yes as well Wow I will vote yes as well Wow Because I will team up With all of my friends We will combine our generators And we're throwing a concert It is the only show in town If you want to come and watch Trevor Noah perform Yeah all his friends at the, we're going to call it the Electricity is Alive bash, come on through. We've got charging.
We've got phone charging. We've got food cooking.
We've got music playing. We've got movies because we've got all the generators and we've combined them.
And the good news is there's no police because they're not allowed to work today. The vote is yes.
Ben Winston, you've won the game.

Thank you so much for coming, everybody.

Welcome to another episode of What Now?

If I Rule the World with Trevor Noah. Produced by Spotify Studios in partnership with Day Zero Productions and Fullwell 73.

The show is executive produced by Trevor Noah, Ben Winston, Sanaz Yamin, and Jody Avigan.

Our senior producer is Jess Hackl.

Marina Henke is our producer.

Music, mixing, and mastering by Hannes Brown.