Jon Cryer | Club Random with Bill Maher

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Speaker 1 Chuck Chuck said, you need to get help.

Speaker 1 Charlie said, no, I'm not going to. He said, well, no, he knew what he did was.
He said, I'm going to do it for a week.

Speaker 1 The woke people that you're really mad at, it's me.

Speaker 1 I want to put that face on it. That's the, this is the one.

Speaker 1 John. Why hello? How are you? Why hello? Because I asked you.

Speaker 1 That's true. It was meant as just like a placeholder.
Like, why,

Speaker 1 hello? Like, that.

Speaker 1 I feel like

Speaker 1 you've been dodging me.

Speaker 1 Oh, really? Oh, really? Well, I'm not. Well, I feel like that.
I don't

Speaker 1 know.

Speaker 1 Because,

Speaker 1 you know, I feel like we both been in Hollywood a long time.

Speaker 1 I mean, I got here in the late 40s. You'd say right now.
I remember back in the silent air.

Speaker 1 I shared an apartment with Bob Mitchum for a while. For a while.

Speaker 1 And he did way too much. Okay.

Speaker 1 I was like, I can't handle that. Actually, he was busted for marijuana.
I'm sure. You know, all kinds of things.
Well, that was very rare. That was in 1948.
Robert Mitchum was busted for marijuana.

Speaker 1 Yeah. That was not something that you ever saw.
I mean, I wasn't alive. Yeah.
But the kids out there, they're like, oh,

Speaker 1 that's this Bob Mitchum guy. Yeah.
In 1948, that's about right for these two guys. They're like 100.

Speaker 1 Why back in my life? I just feel like we've both been here a long time and yet our paths never crossed. Our paths did cross.
Like I say, we're good friends.

Speaker 1 On this here show, Politically Incorrect, which I did a couple of times. Well, okay.
That does not count, I guess,

Speaker 1 for you. It does nothing, apparently.
Apparently, it was a meaningless time. That was the 90s.
We were actually alive in the 90s, kids, and working, apparently. Yes.

Speaker 1 But, you know, first of all, the 90s is a long time ago.

Speaker 1 And we did 2,000 shows. Good.
That That was

Speaker 1 political. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Five shows a night, nine years. It's a lot of shows.
It's a lot of people yammering about their politics. I mean,

Speaker 1 it all blends into this political mush for a while. I'm sure.
I mean, time plus like 2,000 shows times

Speaker 1 four people on each show. That's 8,000 people.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 Yes. But what was your memory of it? Were you happy with it? Oh, yeah.
Oh, I had a good time. I had a good time.
I distinctly remember you doing well. Yes.

Speaker 1 I remember one older woman who was very anti-immigration. And I remember she drove me batty.

Speaker 1 But I feel like I zinged her a couple of times. I was like, you're an old lady.
I think that was

Speaker 1 the height of my

Speaker 1 repartee. Who looks stupid now? Yes.

Speaker 1 Exactly. No.
I mean, I think the whole country,

Speaker 1 even unless you're like stupid woke, I hope you're not, but you know, it is Hollywood. Somewhat stupidly woke.
Okay.

Speaker 1 The whole country was like, I mean, I think the biggest issue for the election, one of the biggest ones, was Democrats pointlessly, totally just punted on immigration and let anybody who wanted to walk in for three and a half years did.

Speaker 1 And,

Speaker 1 you know. Well, I think they would probably disagree.
The people walking in probably felt like it was a little harder. No.

Speaker 1 no, actually, actually, there's a great 60 Minutes piece on it where the water, I mean, you don't get 8 million people here by making it difficult.

Speaker 1 But there's watch, they're just, I mean, you see they're walking through in that water, guys are just watching them do it. They're just watching them walk past.
You never saw that? I did not see that.

Speaker 1 See, that doesn't get in the liberal media. That's the problem, is the bubbles we live in.

Speaker 1 Well, 60 Minutes, arguably, is the liberal media. So

Speaker 1 I don't think that that that's it. Right.
But 60 Minutes play, 60 Minutes is still

Speaker 1 a show that

Speaker 1 I think,

Speaker 1 you know, can, not as consistently as it used to, but they do things like that.

Speaker 1 They did, they also did a great piece some years ago about a woman in London who was in the Muslim neighborhoods and, you know, they're screaming at her because she's wearing a skirt and stuff like that.

Speaker 1 And, you know, the point of it was, you know, there are places in Western civilizations that are like run

Speaker 1 not by Western standards. And that doesn't mean they're just different.

Speaker 1 Well, yeah, but I mean, there are, there are cultural enclaves everywhere.

Speaker 1 You know, right, but we should agree that women should be able to wear what they want. Yes.
If you don't agree with that, then you're not a liberal to begin with. Well,

Speaker 1 call me a crazy liberal, but I think women should have freedom. I agree as well.
Okay. I agree as well.
But they don't in these neighborhoods. It was the 60 Minutes piece that they did.

Speaker 1 One could argue that women don't have the freedom to dress where they are in, to dress how they want to dress in many places. They used to get cat called all the time.

Speaker 1 They used to, you know, there was. Used to.

Speaker 1 We're talking about now. Well,

Speaker 1 a lot of shit used to happen, but what's going on now in the world? Would you really want to have your wife live in Gaza? or any place where

Speaker 1 I mean before war-torn stripes. No, even before

Speaker 1 even before the war, where she would have to cover up. Well,

Speaker 1 again, that's not, that's not, I don't live there. I'm not, it's not my culture.
You know,

Speaker 1 and you won't judge it? I'm not going to judge it. No.

Speaker 1 But again, this is the case. That's crazy woke to me.

Speaker 1 That's where it all went off the rails.

Speaker 1 When we became so tolerant that we tolerate intolerance. I mean, you would never allow something like that to happen in this country.
If they proposed a law tomorrow at the L.A.

Speaker 1 City Council, women have to cover their face when they go out. I assume you'd be against that.

Speaker 1 Well, yes, I would. But again, you know, there are

Speaker 1 all, you know, again, this is a long, long subject that

Speaker 1 we stumbled onto. We stumbled onto, exactly.

Speaker 1 And, you know,

Speaker 1 I also, you know, this was started with immigration, which, you know, I don't feel like demonizing immigrants and migrants and saying that you want to deport

Speaker 1 millions of people. I think the history of

Speaker 1 deportations is horrifying.

Speaker 1 But we weren't talking about deportations. Of course, that's horrifying.
Yes. And an over-correction.

Speaker 1 What we were talking about was letting Democrats

Speaker 1 too many people in to begin with.

Speaker 1 But too many people.

Speaker 1 And what, well, again, this is going to be a long conversation that we probably...

Speaker 1 Is this how you want to spend your time?

Speaker 1 I never have any plan. I have never.
I've never seen a thousand episodes of politically angry. I never have any plan.
And you're still going down. I never have any plan for this show.
Oh, okay.

Speaker 1 Plainly. Yes, clearly.
Clearly.

Speaker 1 So, yeah.

Speaker 1 If...

Speaker 1 You don't want to talk about that politics at all. Well, I shouldn't, because I really started this podcast to get away from it.
So you're right. I kind of fucked up.
Yes.

Speaker 1 But I don't know. Sometimes people say things that trigger me.

Speaker 1 And of course, we just had the election. And I feel like my conscience is very clear.
I warned everybody about Trump. And then

Speaker 1 I warned them about what would get him re-elected, which was stupid wokeness, which is what got him re-elected. So I feel my conscience is very clear that...

Speaker 1 I told you and I told you and I told you and I lost fans for it. You know, lots of the super woke that's like, I'm not woke enough.
Yeah, but like, I think I had it right.

Speaker 1 Like, that kind of stuff is what lost the election for the Democrats. It's in all.
It may be part of it. I don't know.
I think a lot.

Speaker 1 They have polling on it.

Speaker 1 Well, I think it's inflation. I think Americans hate inflation.
Certainly we're not. They hate inflation.
They hate riots. And they hate black women.
They tend to. And they hate trans people.

Speaker 1 John, we're not. Dude, they just spent hundreds of millions of people

Speaker 1 trans people. And that's

Speaker 1 disgusting. Yeah, Yeah, we shouldn't talk politics.
Okay, we shouldn't. We shouldn't.

Speaker 1 Great.

Speaker 1 You don't have to.

Speaker 1 And this, you know, I mean, I have this kind of relationship with people on the right also who like, like,

Speaker 1 yeah, it's just going to take so long to even have this discussion.

Speaker 1 And I, I, I, like, I want, just like I would like

Speaker 1 to deprogram them. I feel like there's things that don't get in your bubble on the left that I would love to deprogram, but it's probably not the place to do it.

Speaker 1 Yeah, but

Speaker 1 you can try.

Speaker 1 If that's how you want to spend your leisure hours,

Speaker 1 deprogramming Ducky.

Speaker 1 There's a spin-off. There's a spin-off.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 I feel like...

Speaker 1 The immigration argument gets sidetracked because people just assume that

Speaker 1 there's a lot of generalizations about immigrants that dehumanize them and are untrue.

Speaker 1 You are mad that they let that many immigrants in because you think they, what? Increase crime? What? Because they don't.

Speaker 1 Because

Speaker 1 they decrease wages? Well, no, they don't. There's a whole bunch of arguments that anti-immigration people make.
And you say, okay, Democrats left. I'm not an anti-immigration people.

Speaker 1 Okay, so you say,

Speaker 1 well, wait a minute.

Speaker 1 So you're the one saying Democrats are letting in immigrants and

Speaker 1 they punted punted it. Okay.

Speaker 1 You're absolutely right. Immigration did go up during those years.

Speaker 1 Well, asylum. They changed the definition of asylum and they immediately reversed Trump's

Speaker 1 like stay in Mexico or wait in Mexico or something. He had a different

Speaker 1 chill out in Mexico. I mean, chill out in here.

Speaker 1 Yes.

Speaker 1 Just fucking chill, man.

Speaker 1 Wait. And we were, and we were still, you know.
letting in, as we should. We are a nation of immigrants and we need immigrants.

Speaker 1 But most Americans felt, including lots of Democrats and people of color, and he won the Latina vote by half. You know, come on, man.
Like, at a certain point,

Speaker 1 everybody was around the idea that, okay, immigration, fine, but it has to be somewhat orderly. And not anyone.
Yes. And again, an asylum had a certain specific meaning, which went up in the air.

Speaker 1 They overcorrected.

Speaker 1 You could be right. I don't know.

Speaker 1 But I also feel like, obviously, you can say Democrats took too long to address it, but then they did.

Speaker 1 And Trump, of course, killed it.

Speaker 1 So he doesn't care about that. And again,

Speaker 1 you've been outspoken.

Speaker 1 And he did kill. And I appreciate that, by the way, for you, that you were being outspoken.
I appreciate that you lost fans.

Speaker 1 You know what? They needed more free time. It's better that they don't watch your show.
It actually is.

Speaker 1 I'm sorry? It actually is because they're just, you know, here's how I know they changed and not me.

Speaker 1 It used to be the conservatives, the Jerry Falwell types, who you would do a stick up their ass joke about.

Speaker 1 Now it's the woke. They're the ones with the stick up their ass.
They're the ones who don't have a sense of humor. They're the ones who are too sensitive.

Speaker 1 They're the ones, you know, marching for Hamas, doing things like that.

Speaker 1 Yeah, again, I think conflating people

Speaker 1 marching for,

Speaker 1 you know, to not have Israelis, the, you know, the IDF

Speaker 1 carpet bombing is different than marching for Hamas. And yes, Hamas is a terrorist organization.
They are a mafia organization. I, you know, I do not support them in any way.

Speaker 1 Well, again, you know,

Speaker 1 they're probably saying, wow,

Speaker 1 Ducky is not on our side.

Speaker 1 This is crushing to our movement.

Speaker 1 We've lost Ducky.

Speaker 1 But my point being

Speaker 1 that

Speaker 1 conflating

Speaker 1 those two, and obviously there are outrages on the right and there are outrages on the left. And

Speaker 1 the right-wing

Speaker 1 media ecosystem

Speaker 1 is just a constant outrage engine.

Speaker 1 Constant. Constant.
And that is very pernicious to America, to having a nation.

Speaker 1 So I was only watching MSNBC. Not as bad.

Speaker 1 I mean, the right wing is definitely more dangerous because they don't believe in conceding elections.

Speaker 1 We are already past what I called,

Speaker 1 even before we won the first time, a slow-moving coup. Because when one side concedes, as the Democrats just did, and one side we know would not, you're already past democracy.

Speaker 1 You are already, I mean, they they make it sound like, oh, you know, we had a smooth election. Yeah, smooth when they win.
That's not good enough for me. It has to be smooth when whoever wins.

Speaker 1 Yes, I agree. So I have this in perspective.

Speaker 1 I think so. But

Speaker 1 what drives them crazy, the reason why they are willing to do

Speaker 1 these basically traitorous extra-constitutional things like not concede elections is because they think the the left is so crazy that

Speaker 1 whatever they have to do to retain power is worth it. Because if the left takes over, they will destroy life as we know it.
I don't think that's true. But

Speaker 1 when you see some of the things that the left has championed lately, you do wonder,

Speaker 1 and like I said, on my show last week, you lost a crazy contest to an actual crazy person.

Speaker 1 Okay, that's funny, but I disagree. that he's uh he's a good

Speaker 1 they lost the contest and that you're right and they lost the contest so yeah it's funny and you're right but

Speaker 1 but i'm going to reel that back in just because uh

Speaker 1 you know

Speaker 1 it's interesting to watch you

Speaker 1 having seen you so much on television that you like i'm not saying you didn't need the script but i see that you just

Speaker 1 you know, you just are funny, like with the timing and the thing, even without a script. Oh, well, thank you.
And you too.

Speaker 1 But that's all I have.

Speaker 1 I'm not an actor. Ah, gotcha.
See, I never have a script. Uh-huh.
Except the one I write.

Speaker 1 And it's not this kind of script. And actors are not,

Speaker 1 it's not in the job requirement to actually be funny.

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Speaker 1 You know, but you know, you just have that thing, you know, the way you

Speaker 1 play off something and then

Speaker 1 well, that's kind of you to say.

Speaker 1 No, I'm sure that's why you've had the career you've had.

Speaker 1 I've been lucky and

Speaker 1 had a lot of great, great experiences. And

Speaker 1 this is, you know, it's with the industry

Speaker 1 sort of figuring out what it is again, you know,

Speaker 1 it makes me grateful for all the opportunities I've had. I think you were lucky being born the person you were who had that timing.
Yes. And that quick mind.
That was the lucky part.

Speaker 1 I don't think the career itself was lucky. I think, you know, show business is full of bullshit, but I've always thought the cream rises to the top.
Well, it's very good.

Speaker 1 There's a lot of bullshit in the middle and anyone can be a success for two years or something. But careers that last,

Speaker 1 that doesn't happen unless there's something that, you know, is connecting and they're hitting the ball. You know, they're consistently hitting.
Well, thank you. Thank you.
And

Speaker 1 I've loved the vast majority of it.

Speaker 1 This is the down slide, right?

Speaker 1 Right here on this show. This is the moment that it's all curdling.

Speaker 1 I was doing great up until this moment.

Speaker 1 I'm actually enjoying myself a great deal. Hey.
We can cut all the political part out of it if you want. Oh, no, no, whatever, whatever.
No, whatever you're comfortable with.

Speaker 1 I'm happy to talk. Actually, one of the reasons that I wanted to, that I'm happy to talk about it, A, is it's a terrifying time in our history.

Speaker 1 You know, unfortunately,

Speaker 1 the Supreme Court has removed the guardrails in a terrifying way.

Speaker 1 Now, the Republicans

Speaker 1 don't have, there's no meaningful resistance. You know, there was in the first term.

Speaker 1 There was a certain normalcy bias that they had.

Speaker 1 I gutted the left like a fish last week.

Speaker 1 Thanks.

Speaker 1 Some of the woke people who are no longer fans would have hated it.

Speaker 1 Zillions of other people loved it because they deserved it.

Speaker 1 But I'm just bringing this up to say the ending, concluding remarks after I told them that the Democratic Party had turned into a Portlandia sketch.

Speaker 1 Again, I felt like they tacked to the right quite a bit

Speaker 1 in this.

Speaker 1 They tacked the right on immigration. Sure, a Hollywood in the bubble, blue sky.

Speaker 1 Dude,

Speaker 1 you're a man of the people, Bill. Is that it?

Speaker 1 Oh, really?

Speaker 1 You're part of the Hollywood community that is embraced. I am not.
Uh-huh. And that's I disagree.
We embrace you. No.

Speaker 1 I almost literally embraced you when you came in the room.

Speaker 1 I don't agree with you, Mark. I do not agree.
We won't get off on that. Okay.

Speaker 1 But we will get off.

Speaker 1 Produced by Chuck

Speaker 1 actually

Speaker 1 I'm not saying it's gonna happen uh-huh but this is also a show because what do you want on a show conflict yeah I mean

Speaker 1 I'll take it you did it like where

Speaker 1 you were you know with pussyhound guy

Speaker 1 sure that was uh that's uh you could call him that and I'm that may be why you and I our paths never crossed

Speaker 1 because I was more Charlie Sheen for many years oh really well I would I mean never got married. You're married.
Yes. No kids.
You know, I would be out at places you probably weren't out at.

Speaker 1 Probably not.

Speaker 1 Although I think I caught you out of the corner of my eye at one of Diddy's freak offs.

Speaker 1 Well,

Speaker 1 you were baked. I had to swing by.
No, I never met the man. Wish him the best.

Speaker 1 Diddy?

Speaker 1 You never met him? I've never met him. Yeah, I consider myself lucky.
Never met Jeffrey Epstein either. Wouldn't it be funny if he got out of prison and I said, how was it in there?

Speaker 1 He said, you know, the only thing that saved me was we watched reruns of Two and a Half Men Every Night.

Speaker 1 Yeah, that would

Speaker 1 be Suge Knight told me politically incorrect. Really?

Speaker 1 He said he watched it every night in prison. Huh.
And I'm guessing it's a communal TV.

Speaker 1 Yeah. Yeah.
It's like, that's who gets to rule. It was a rule.
I know. Who gets to pick that?

Speaker 1 Well, I'm guessing Suge Knight probably had more cred.

Speaker 1 He probably has more cred.

Speaker 1 But you and I in a prison movie, I think.

Speaker 1 That's what the public is yearning for. And we're like,

Speaker 1 we're escape. We're having a gun battle.
And we're doing that thing in movies where they do, where they have snappy dialogue.

Speaker 1 Let's man, it's a butch and sundance moment. Who are those guys?

Speaker 1 Yes, that's

Speaker 1 like bad boys.

Speaker 1 I told you not to talk to my sister one day.

Speaker 1 really in the middle of the gunfight. I'm sure when you're afraid for your life, that's when the quips really,

Speaker 1 really kick in. I'm sure the no coward in you comes out

Speaker 1 at that moment.

Speaker 1 Exactly. But no, yeah, I guess our Hollywood paths did not cross.

Speaker 1 But, you know, again, I enjoyed coming on your show.

Speaker 1 And I do,

Speaker 1 you know,

Speaker 1 I understand why a lot of actors don't want to talk about politics. I get it.

Speaker 1 You know, because as an artist, you want people to just enjoy your art, you know, and I and I still enjoy, there's plenty of people whose politics I strongly disagree with, but I still enjoy their art.

Speaker 1 I mean, there's John Boyt movies that I will love till the day I die because he's an amazing actor, you know.

Speaker 1 And he's not a monster. He's not a monster.
No, I know him, actually. I mean, I've met him.
I'm all for Troy. He's always asking about my mom, you know, in a nice way.
Don't worry.

Speaker 1 I'm not casting aspersions.

Speaker 1 He was like, how's your mother? Oh, well, John, she's fine.

Speaker 1 But anyway, I apologize. No,

Speaker 1 but just finishing what I was saying before about, yes, I gutted them, but only so I could get to the end where I said, I'm mad at the Democrats because the issues that are important to me,

Speaker 1 because that's always a big thing in elections, what issues are important to Bill Mark. To you, the voter.
My issues are democracy and the environment.

Speaker 1 And now, because the Democrats did what I told them not to do and went to crazy town way too often, now you blew it. You blew it.

Speaker 1 You blew it. I did not.
Go ahead. You lost everything.
Wow. So I have no one to champion and defend my issues.
But I would say

Speaker 1 all of the wokeness that outraged you so much was Republican framing, was right-wing media framing.

Speaker 1 I mean, again, again, the yes.

Speaker 1 I am telling you this. I am yes.
That is the case. That is not framing.
That is the key.

Speaker 1 I do this for a living. Okay.
I have a whole staff to vet this. I'm very suspicious of everything from the left or the right.
So if you're telling me that I've been hoodwinked.

Speaker 1 Oh, I'm not telling you who's been hoodwinked.

Speaker 1 I think

Speaker 1 everybody deals with framing in different ways. You can either deal with the frame and say, no, I'm afraid you're wrong, which I've seen you do.
You know, you say you can,

Speaker 1 you know, um, or you can say, Wait, I don't, but I don't even believe in the framing. I disagree with the whole framing of the question.
I believe in facts. I believe, for example,

Speaker 1 we're going to get into this now. Okay,

Speaker 1 but like America is the only country that does

Speaker 1 transgender policy the way we do now. We used to be closer to

Speaker 1 Sweden. I'm sorry, you got to be more specific.

Speaker 1 Kids

Speaker 1 can,

Speaker 1 you know uh what do you call um gender affirmation can they okay have the operation okay you understand first of all that the the the biggest the the the most prevalent gender affirming surgery is breast removal tissue removal for cisgender male boys okay but we don't understand about that okay but but the reason i'm bringing it up is because if people are okay with with you know people are always saying we don't want young people making those decisions for

Speaker 1 you know, lifelong decisions when they're still very young. I mean, that seems to be what people are saying.

Speaker 1 Well, that's where Europe, where all the liberal countries that we used to be aligned with on this issue a few years ago, we are not. I'm just saying, let's not even get into the details.

Speaker 1 Let's just get into the fact, just to start with the fact that America... does this in a way nobody else does.

Speaker 1 It doesn't mean, I'm not saying it's necessarily definitely wrong, although I do think it is, but no other country does a self-diagnosis by children, no age limit. That is that's not what's occurring.

Speaker 1 That is what is occurring. It's not occurring.

Speaker 1 And by the way, the thing you're talking about is called the Dutch Protocol, which obviously started in Holland. It started in Holland.

Speaker 1 I'm familiar. Yes, okay.

Speaker 1 So Europe, so you're saying the U.S. doesn't use the things that Europe does, but

Speaker 1 which they abandoned. They are abandoned.

Speaker 1 No, they did not abandon it. Yeah, they did not.
No, and I, and, and, And we can argue about the CAS review as well. I'm aware of it.

Speaker 1 Right,

Speaker 1 which did not, which is conclusions did not match its own data. But okay, we'll talk about that later

Speaker 1 if you're open to that. That's too in the weeds.
Okay, but see, that's what I'm saying is the truth is in the weeds, dude. And unfortunately.

Speaker 1 It's too in the weeds. Okay.
I mean, it's...

Speaker 1 And maybe for me at this point, because I don't have the CAS report right in my mind,

Speaker 1 many people are saying, what is that?

Speaker 1 A British woman who is a pediatrician and also was this

Speaker 1 field of study. There was a big controversy about

Speaker 1 NHS, yes, about the NHS transgender care.

Speaker 1 And unfortunately, you know, the NHS is under a lot of scrutiny for many things because, you know, national health care is often very controversial because people have to prioritize

Speaker 1 very specific care for specific people. It's hard to do that in a governmental way.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 there was a lot of people saying that

Speaker 1 kids who were going through gender dysphoria were not getting enough care before they were making lifelong decisions. And that's a concern, absolutely.

Speaker 1 But the report said that they were actually getting enough care. But

Speaker 1 they, as a society,

Speaker 1 were using it as a way to say,

Speaker 1 we don't want this to even be a possibility for people under 18. And so at any rate.
Right. And that's too far.

Speaker 1 And like, it's a shame that we can't ever just meet in the middle of what's common sense. Like Trump, I see they're like, they're not letting somebody use the bathroom.
Exactly.

Speaker 1 I mean, it's like, it's just, again, it just, can we just not do stupid on either side?

Speaker 1 But you know, but when I'm saying is that that parents who have kids who are going through severe gender dysphoria

Speaker 1 have very limited options to begin with. And they're usually trying to think about the survival of their child.

Speaker 1 And so

Speaker 1 limiting what they have access to

Speaker 1 when there actually is an enormous amount of statistical evidence that supported the Dutch protocols,

Speaker 1 I think it's wrong to limit their

Speaker 1 to to for government to limit what they feel is the appropriate medical treatment. There are cases where it is appropriate, I think.
Okay. Okay.
I think this is the standard liberal position.

Speaker 1 And then there's like the people who won't admit that some of this is social contagion. Some of this is just a TikTok trend that got out of hand.
I don't agree.

Speaker 1 And that's okay. And that's what friends are for.
Okay. To be able to come to it and go, okay,

Speaker 1 we've elucidated our points enough. People get where we're coming from.
And they just, you know, they'll, trust me, in this town, everybody, you'll be the big champion.

Speaker 1 You own Bill Moore because they just want to agree with you. And my take on this, just as like super friend to friend now, is just like...

Speaker 1 The people in this town, they just want to be warriors, social justice warriors. So they're just always looking for a cause.
And it's so much more often about them than the cause itself.

Speaker 1 Not that they're not sincere about stuff, but like,

Speaker 1 what bugs Dave Chappelle so much about the trans thing? I think it's the fact that they want to make it the social just issue of their generation, and it just doesn't compare to other ones.

Speaker 1 It's important. It's an issue.
I think it's great. We live in a time when trans people can be respected and protected.
But you're asking too much often to rewrite

Speaker 1 the idea that when someone is born, there is a default setting for humans, male and female not everyone is now a real conservative would say no everyone is i would never say that but i think there are a lot of souls there are chromosomes

Speaker 1 there's a default setting there's there's there's a default setting

Speaker 1 but then there's a whole other other section and that's great and we should protect those people but don't pretend there isn't also a default setting And you can't rewrite the world so that every baby is just a jump ball.

Speaker 1 Oh, it could be anything. No, if it's got a dick, it's probably a boy.
And if it's not,

Speaker 1 we'll deal with that. We'll deal with that in a compassionate way.
Well, yeah. And we'll also be apprised of the idea that children don't know shit about anything.

Speaker 1 Yes, sometimes it is obvious and we should address it that way. But I mean, kids, Christ almighty, I mean, the idea that I would, as a child, would have had to have dealt with something like this.

Speaker 1 Well, again, the people that go through it don't say this is the life I want. No parent wants to be in the midst of those choices.
It's terrible.

Speaker 1 Some kids these days actually just do want to be trans. It's a cooler job.
I don't agree. It's a thing.
Nope. I don't agree.

Speaker 1 I don't agree with Bill Marshall.

Speaker 1 That's the name of the show. Well,

Speaker 1 your eyes are not open to that, I think. I really,

Speaker 1 there are some kids,

Speaker 1 especially. Why is it like so much more prevalent here than Indiana? Well, are they suppressing it there? Maybe a little.
Yeah, there's a societal suppression, but it's like left-handedism.

Speaker 1 Left-handed, being left-handed was suppressed for, you know, for thousands of years amongst human beings.

Speaker 1 But once they, it was, you know, apparently in the 30s, scientists basically said there's no, there's no, left-handedness doesn't actually do anything bad. Right.
Left-handedness shot up.

Speaker 1 People just stopped training themselves to be right-handed. And this is a, this is a, you know, this has happened societally before.
It's.

Speaker 1 And that's the, that's the closest analog that I can think of. Okay, but I think the numbers are faulty in that one.
I mean, how many people are left-handed? 15%, something like that?

Speaker 1 They went from like 80%. So you think to 15%?

Speaker 1 15% of us are born in the wrong body? I don't know.

Speaker 1 But I do believe that parents who are dealing with that situation in their child

Speaker 1 need to be able to make those decisions.

Speaker 1 I don't think it's as high as 50%.

Speaker 1 It is a certain percent, but

Speaker 1 the statistician in Bill Marshall. The numbers matter.
No, they do. Numbers matter.
But what bothers me is that this becomes an issue to demonize people.

Speaker 1 But I'm not demonizing people. I know.
I'm not saying you are. But I'm saying the right-wing framing is, and it often starts with danger to your children,

Speaker 1 danger to your women.

Speaker 1 You know, the trans people are going in your bathroom. You know, and of course, by the way.
These bills that are

Speaker 1 in Congress right now are

Speaker 1 to

Speaker 1 force

Speaker 1 trans women into men's bathroom, also force trans men into women's bathroom.

Speaker 1 And these, you know, I don't think Nancy Mace really gets that she's inviting a bunch of trans men into her into her bathroom.

Speaker 1 I don't think she gets that. That's horrible.

Speaker 1 It's horrible. So, but and I agree with you.
But again, the demonization that they spent millions, hundreds of millions of dollars demonizing trans people

Speaker 1 was fucking loathsome. Well, loads of people.
That's politics, sweetheart. No.

Speaker 1 You give them an opening. Excuse me.
You give them an opening like

Speaker 1 people deserve respect. Yeah, that's the opening.
That's

Speaker 1 okay. Oh, God.

Speaker 1 Deprogrammer, please come in soon.

Speaker 1 Okay. She would not the deprogrammer.
When

Speaker 1 I want to deprogram you, yeah.

Speaker 1 You're doing a better. You do this for a living.

Speaker 1 Here's what she would not condemn.

Speaker 1 She had said when they asked her, Are you for

Speaker 1 operations in prisons, taxpayer paid in prisons for prisoners who want to

Speaker 1 transition.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 1 She just said, I'll follow the law. She wouldn't say, no, you know what? I said that in 2019.

Speaker 1 That goes too far.

Speaker 1 Well, except for the moment. Maybe she would have been somewhat in the race if she said something like that.

Speaker 1 But again,

Speaker 1 this happens.

Speaker 1 As you said, the statistical amount of trans people is so small. And this happens on so few occasions.
And this is statistically meaningless. You just said it was 15%.
No, but even I didn't say that.

Speaker 1 You said it. You're the

Speaker 1 but I said I don't know. Yeah, I don't know the statistics.
It does, but just from my point. From just looking around the world, you don't think 15% is a little high for that?

Speaker 1 Yeah, it might be. Again, I'd be guessing.
But see, here's the thing. You're right about a lot of this, what the right, the right does demonize.
It's a horrifying.

Speaker 1 Oh, God. It's politics.
Of course, you have to assume that the other side is going to use your vulnerable points. But here's what the left demonizes.

Speaker 1 They would take my conversation with you right now, which is in no way illiberal, and say, I'm some sort of bigot. Because

Speaker 1 in the left's view,

Speaker 1 the far left anyway, any just questioning of this.

Speaker 1 is a mic drop. Oh, you're a bigot.
I mean, it happened on CNN recently. Like, I will not not sit here and hear someone called a boy, you know, and they're talking about someone who's trans, but

Speaker 1 you know, it's like we're so pure, we know everything.

Speaker 1 That's the given. So,

Speaker 1 any discussion of this is bigotry to begin with. And that's not where we are with this issue.
Well, I'll tell you, I can tell you why they feel like that, if it helps you. They feel like that because

Speaker 1 when their very

Speaker 1 capability of being a person is questioned, when just the idea that they exist is questioned. Agreed.

Speaker 1 They are dehumanized and they say that it's bigotry.

Speaker 1 Now, again, somebody calling you a bigot, you know, you can take offense and get angry at that. I do.
Okay.

Speaker 1 You know, but again, you're fine.

Speaker 1 Somebody called you a bigot. People call me all kinds of awful things.
Really? You know? What do they call you? Who could be mad at you? People are mad at me.

Speaker 1 You're mad at me. No, you're not.
I'm not mad.

Speaker 1 I'm mad. I actually admire you for engaging.
Oh, well, happy to. You didn't have to.
No, I didn't. It's true.
What the fuck am I doing here? Kind of fun.

Speaker 1 It's fun to let it out, isn't it?

Speaker 1 Yeah, you know. Yeah, I, you know, I have,

Speaker 1 you know, the trans people in my life

Speaker 1 feel

Speaker 1 at this point really frightened. You know,

Speaker 1 the trans people in your life, if I may ask. Well,

Speaker 1 frankly, that's my own business. and okay that's fine i just but uh uh you know it it is it is they're in a place where they're personally terrified right now um because not only was

Speaker 1 you know this election was the outrage cycle of this of this particular election targeted them but uh uh it was accepted and people you know accept that it's like okay yeah we dehumanized them it was political

Speaker 1 reason why the democrats shouldn't have blown it well i i i

Speaker 1 again,

Speaker 1 you can blame them all you want.

Speaker 1 I believe, again, that there is a worldwide reaction to the inflation bump after COVID. Everybody,

Speaker 1 as I said, Americans hate inflation. You keep telling yourself that, and you'll lose the next one, too.

Speaker 1 And if they lose the next one. I'm not running, but okay.
No, well, I mean, the party that we, it's funny, we voted for the same person. Yes.
We, you know, are generally supportive of the same party.

Speaker 1 We just have very different views on like how to deal with that. Yeah.
Yeah, we do.

Speaker 1 But again, I felt like

Speaker 1 the Democrats in the very limited amount of time they had to fight this election

Speaker 1 did can't to the right a lot. You know.
But time has nothing to do with it. You could do it in two weeks.
If anything, she had too much time.

Speaker 1 She was doing good for the first two months, the joy shit. And then it just, you know, this, it's so antiquated, this idea that people need more than she had 107 days.

Speaker 1 It would have been better if she had seven. Other countries don't take 100 days.
I will 100% agree with you that it takes way too long and it's ridiculous.

Speaker 1 We get it. We get it quickly.
Yeah. You know, it's not like we have to go and see them at the end of a train station where they're doing a whistle.

Speaker 1 You know, they'll remember that when the 19,

Speaker 1 the back of the truck. And that's

Speaker 1 Lincoln, you know, having to get some

Speaker 1 going on a tour. Are you going to go see Garfield Saturday? He's going to be in the back of a train.
Yes, he's going to be yelling from the back of a train.

Speaker 1 I hope I think he said something that I agree with. I don't know.
I don't know what he said.

Speaker 1 You must have done a Western. I have never done.
Oh, well, I did sort of a punk Western, but it was a modern-day Western, so it doesn't really count. You could redo the Don Knott movies.

Speaker 1 I have been approached by that. I have been approached by the incredible Mr.
Limpet. I swear to God.

Speaker 1 Are born.

Speaker 1 No, really.

Speaker 1 I got nothing but respect for Don Knotts. Don Knott's a master.
He was a fucking master. Oh, man.
I think he was great. Me.
He was great. I could not agree more.
He was.

Speaker 1 And the movies, which I think are not

Speaker 1 really, I don't know why. I never see one on, you know, the channels.
But as a kid,

Speaker 1 Mr.

Speaker 1 Limpet and there's some chicken.

Speaker 1 Chicken in the West.

Speaker 1 He was a coward in the old West. Yes, there you go.
Okay.

Speaker 1 I think this is like.

Speaker 1 Yeah, you know,

Speaker 1 God bless him. He was, he's, he left behind a wonderful body of work.
Yeah, didn't he win like the Emmy like eight years in a row as Barney Fife? Something like that. It was like, you know, you know,

Speaker 1 yeah.

Speaker 1 Yeah. No, he's a genius.
He's a genius. Absolutely.
Absolutely. What were the other ones like that that you look up to?

Speaker 1 Jack Lemon, I thought, was pretty amazing. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Jack Lemon could do

Speaker 1 serious drama.

Speaker 1 And he could also be the, you know, high-energy kind of fun.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 You ever see Save the Tiger? Yeah. Yes.

Speaker 1 Now that's a movie. Yeah.
That's a 70s movie, and I mean that as a compliment. 70s, 70s was a golden era.
I mean, Taking a Pelham still is one of the

Speaker 1 rings. Yeah, they redid it with Denzel.

Speaker 1 It was good, but not as good no no the sneeze at the end yes no what was great about taking a Pelham is it's New York City in 1974 whatever and every single New Yorker is a wise ass every

Speaker 1 single one

Speaker 1 and it's true it's fucking true that's how everybody was in 1974 you think they're different in New York now I think no my mom's still there actually she's oh really 89 still living on the upwest side of Manhattan I lived in I lived on the west side of Manhattan and when i was doing politically incorrect oh really first i lived uh on the east side in a residential hotel across from smith and walensky's plaza 50.

Speaker 1 oh sure okay sure

Speaker 1 i remember smith okay okay walensky's then i lived on 70th

Speaker 1 in this building that was kind of distinctive it like had a name for it and all this Egyptian art on the walls or something anyway

Speaker 1 70th and Broadway but you know, New York and I never got along. Oh, I'm sorry to hear that.

Speaker 1 You know, I grew up there.

Speaker 1 I'm born on Midborne. I was just there.
I was like the beacon. I mean, I love it for a weekend, but like living there, I found to be tough.
It's not for everybody. It's not for everybody.

Speaker 1 First of all, you just have to like or be okay with living in buildings.

Speaker 1 It's okay.

Speaker 1 Well, that's not. Most of human history are people have lived in buildings built.
No, they haven't. They lived in

Speaker 1 multiple dwellings. Single dwellings.
Like, I don't live in a building.

Speaker 1 I live next door.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 I like apartment living.

Speaker 1 The best thing about apartment living, and I'm just, is superintendents is just guys who just, you just call up and say, get in here because something has gone horribly wrong.

Speaker 1 You know, and that you don't have in your single family home. You don't, there's not somebody you, well, maybe yours.

Speaker 1 The last time I had a super is when I lived on 8th Avenue in New York. And it was not

Speaker 1 you portray it.

Speaker 1 It was not the dream service situation that I'm

Speaker 1 coming in, and I believe he was Colombian. And

Speaker 1 he,

Speaker 1 he had some, he was running some weird shit out of the building. And I mean, could you get him to do something? Yes, but I mean, this was on 8th Avenue.

Speaker 1 You know, it was, you sound like you lived in a nicer sort of building where the super was, I don't know.

Speaker 1 No, I mean, no, my mom, when we were, when I was growing up on the upper west side of Manhattan, it was really, it was not a great neighborhood at the time. It has since become very gentrified.

Speaker 1 But at the time, no, it was, we had,

Speaker 1 you know, we had heroin acts coming in and stealing our

Speaker 1 fixtures.

Speaker 1 They would steal steal the you know the the the whatever lamps there were on the walls and stuff we had uh you know uh uh bulletproof glass in the lobby and stuff really um yeah i mean it wasn't it wasn't the wild west i mean the closest thing to the wild west was i we had a neighbor mr green who

Speaker 1 Mr. Green used to come by and he would bring oxtail soup for my mother.
He was very nice. Bald gentleman.
And he goes, well, is your mother around? Well, I brought some oxtail soup.

Speaker 1 Well, I do not know, but Mr. Green had a secret double life.

Speaker 1 One night night we're in the house and we hear a pop pop and somebody runs down the stairs. And my mom was like, what the fuck happened? And

Speaker 1 it turns out Mr. Green had, he liked to

Speaker 1 partake of ladies of the evening. God bless him, Mr.
Green.

Speaker 1 But this one particular lady of the evening had shown up, but then showed up with her boyfriend, who proceeded to tie up Mr. Green.
Boyfriend. Yes.

Speaker 1 Yes. I imagine.
I, you know, again, I'm romantic.

Speaker 1 I prefer to see it as just a love relationship.

Speaker 1 It is of sorts. Of sorts.
At any rate, he tied up Mr. Green and started to ransack his house.

Speaker 1 The pimp did. Wow.
Tied him up next to his bed. But Mr.
Green reached under his bed and found a pistol

Speaker 1 aimed from the hip.

Speaker 1 Swear to God, from the hip, because Mr. Green was tied up.
Just like in a movie. It's just like in a movie and shot the guy in the head, between the fucking eyes.

Speaker 1 And the next time when he came over with the oxtail soup, he insisted I come over to the house so he could show me where the bullets ricocheted.

Speaker 1 So that was, that was my building growing up.

Speaker 1 But mostly it was nice.

Speaker 1 If you called the police, would Kojak come over?

Speaker 1 Just because of the resemblance.

Speaker 1 No, no, I'm just saying. But the 70s.
Kojak is the great 70s.

Speaker 1 Do you remember Kojak? Yes, Yes, Tele Savalas. Who loves you, baby?

Speaker 1 Famous for having a lollipop.

Speaker 1 That was Tele Savalis'.

Speaker 1 I don't know.

Speaker 1 They should redo that one. That was a great card.
Kojak. Maybe it's time.
No. Shave the beard.
You're not. You're not Kojak.
I don't have

Speaker 1 non-nots. Kojak ain't woke.

Speaker 1 Maybe not.

Speaker 1 Maybe.

Speaker 1 Yes, I'll do some research on that. Kojak is the guy who's after the judge.

Speaker 1 Yeah, you see the defendants and I see their victims.

Speaker 1 I got to get the scum off the street. Yes, that was

Speaker 1 the 70s was the scum off the street. It was also Cerpico

Speaker 1 and,

Speaker 1 you know, there was, yeah, it was also,

Speaker 1 it was an interestingly grungy,

Speaker 1 awful period. Whenever I see period movies about the 70s, I'm like, there's not enough litter.

Speaker 1 We need more litter. I don't buy it until the litter is fucking a foot deep.

Speaker 1 But it is

Speaker 1 good. But actually

Speaker 1 the reason I came on this podcast, besides that I enjoy the work a lot,

Speaker 1 I must plug. Please, it is actually relevant.

Speaker 1 Please. Because

Speaker 1 basically,

Speaker 1 I've got a podcast that I produced. I'm not in it, but I produced it that is coming out called The Man Who Calculated Death.
And it is

Speaker 1 an insane story that absolutely fell in my lap. The man who calculated death.
Death. Yes.

Speaker 1 Absolutely insane story.

Speaker 1 Basically, I was at a dinner party with

Speaker 1 a friend of my wife. And she, at one point, she knew I was a big fan of the space program.

Speaker 1 The history of the space program is something I'm fascinated with. And she said, oh, you know, my grandpa worked on the space program.
And I was like, oh, that's wow. That's awesome.

Speaker 1 And she said, yeah. And then before that, he worked for Hitler.
But anyway, no, no, no, no.

Speaker 1 Really? Just, yes. You can just like have a conversation.
Werner von Braun?

Speaker 1 Actually, he worked with Werner von Braun because she had been on this. And we had a lot of Nazis.
Yes.

Speaker 1 She had been on this crazy journey because two years before we had this conversation, her mother

Speaker 1 had been diagnosed with cancer. And literally on her deathbed, her mother admitted to her, she said, I've been writing a memoir for five years now, but I won't finish it because I'm dying.

Speaker 1 Will you finish it for me? Wow. And so Suzanne had to, her name is Suzanne Rico.
She was an anchor woman here in Los Angeles. That's how my wife knew her.

Speaker 1 Suzanne had to go back through her family's history that she'd only kind of dimly been aware of

Speaker 1 and discover that her grandfather actually was a guy named Robert Lesser, who was one of Hitler's most important scientists.

Speaker 1 He invented the V-1, which was he and Werner von Braun were in a race to make secret super weapons for Hitler. Suzanne's mother was was in London when those bombs fell on it.
Exactly.

Speaker 1 And they terrorized London. And so Suzanne basically had to go on this journey, sort of rediscovering her family's history and understanding

Speaker 1 what the family went through to get through World War II and Operation Paperclip

Speaker 1 secretly bringing the Nazis to the United States and plopping them down. That's what it was called? Operation Paperclip.
I never knew that. Yes, it's a fascinating story.

Speaker 1 Well, here's a moral question. Okay.
And it probably for our show that we're going to do called The Purist and the Pragmatist.

Speaker 1 The pragmatist would say,

Speaker 1 bringing Nazis, ex-Nazis here to run our space program was the right thing to do. Yeah.
What does the purist say? You agree with that? Purist,

Speaker 1 well,

Speaker 1 you know,

Speaker 1 the argument at the time was these were the good ones.

Speaker 1 No, the argument was we need a space program before the Russians get one. And Nazis know how to do it because Germans are smart and efficient.
I always say this about Germans.

Speaker 1 They're so efficient that when they turn their efficiency toward mass death,

Speaker 1 even that's bad for that.

Speaker 1 But it's true. They're just, it's not like their ambitions to wipe out people was any different than Genghis Khan or lots of other people.
They just...

Speaker 1 were they had 20th century technology and they just are so crazy efficient Germans, and specific and detailed. So like when it was like, how do we kill all the Jews? It was like,

Speaker 1 be efficient about it. I think that's.

Speaker 1 Did you see that movie, The Zone of...

Speaker 1 Zone of interest, yes. I did see that movie.
The zone of no interest. Yeah.
It was a little slow.

Speaker 1 I will say

Speaker 1 that what I got out of it. No,

Speaker 1 it was not bad, but what I got out of it was a kind of a movie version of the famous saying from Hannah Arendt, the banality of evil. Yes.
It was, and of course, if you're showing banality in a movie,

Speaker 1 it's a little slow.

Speaker 1 You know, it could have used Chuck Lorry to punch it up a little. Oh, God.

Speaker 1 You know,

Speaker 1 you come in and you're just like this bumbling guard from,

Speaker 1 you know, that, because

Speaker 1 if you don't know the story, this German family, and they have this wonderful idyllic life in the Liebenstrom, the living space that Hitler wanted but it's right next to Auschwitz yes oh darn that's the only place that we could get a big enough place for the family well actually it's interesting because that's what the a big chunk of of uh the the podcast is about is is a family uh

Speaker 1 what happens to a family as authoritarianisms authoritarianism gradually takes over their country um where i'm sorry in germany that's what the podcast that's what the podcast is in germany yes because it's about like what year?

Speaker 1 Because

Speaker 1 Robert Lesser, the guy who it's about, the man who calculated death,

Speaker 1 he was a famous German pilot. He actually built his own planes that he flew and became a celebrity, actually.
And

Speaker 1 his family, he became an engineer. He invented the Bf-109, which is probably the most famous fighter plane.
So the 40s.

Speaker 1 Yes. So, yeah, this goes from the 20s.
The war ends in 45. Then we import the Nazis.
Yes.

Speaker 1 He actually was in hiding for a couple of years after the war because he was sure he would be tried for war crimes.

Speaker 1 But then the CIA found him and rather the precursor to the CIA, the OSS,

Speaker 1 and

Speaker 1 brought him to the United States illegally at the time.

Speaker 1 Undocumented immigrants.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 yeah, you know,

Speaker 1 and yeah, but it was interesting because that's a lot, the podcast goes into, you know, what exactly was he complicit in? What wasn't he complicit in? You know,

Speaker 1 some of the V1s were built at concentration camps. Well, I would listen to that.
That's interesting.

Speaker 1 And Suzanne,

Speaker 1 where and when?

Speaker 1 Can I hear this? It is on

Speaker 1 Apple Podcasts As We Speak, Spotify. Oh, it is, right?

Speaker 1 It's exclusive to Wondery Plus. So if you subscribe to Wondery Plus,

Speaker 1 what is the title? One One Time Death. The Man Who Calculated Death.
It's clearly a catchy. I'm the man who smoked pot.
So I,

Speaker 1 you know,

Speaker 1 don't hate me for

Speaker 1 the man who calculated death. This is probably not the optimum time to approach you.
This is definitely the optimum

Speaker 1 time. Oh, really? Okay.
Okay. This is when I'm at my best.

Speaker 1 I never drink all week. I save it for this.
It's the joy of my life to be able to get to know somebody. It's usually not this contentious, but I don't.

Speaker 1 That's okay.

Speaker 1 If it's okay with you, it's okay with me. It is, yes.
Because I do. And I love honesty, and I love getting right to what do we really think and feel.

Speaker 1 And I also just love that we can continue and feel like, okay, he's him, I'm me. We're not the, you know.
Duna, dun dun, dun dun. Yes, you know, it's like, and

Speaker 1 but we still have so much in common and can like each other and just go, there's always going to be things about other people. You're going to go, I don't know why that.

Speaker 1 I can't believe they think that way. But, you know,

Speaker 1 well,

Speaker 1 again, I do want to compliment you, especially in the context of talking about the rise of authoritarianism,

Speaker 1 is you have been a very clear voice

Speaker 1 talking about the very specific issues that have arisen.

Speaker 1 Nobody was taking me seriously about Trump for the longest time. And it was like obvious to me.
This is someone who can never say, I lost. I concede.

Speaker 1 an election.

Speaker 1 He couldn't do,

Speaker 1 I do this in my act, but I'll just say it to you.

Speaker 1 I don't want to be, you know, it's called an illegal spritz in comedy, but it is just the truth also, of course, because I don't really write jokes. I just, you know, observe them.

Speaker 1 But like when a football coach loses a game, you know, football coaches, that's all their life is. They have no other life.
They all just live for it.

Speaker 1 I mean, Bill Belichick now has a 23-year-old girlfriend, but trust me, for all the 40 years he was coaching, he did not because

Speaker 1 Tom Brady was his girlfriend.

Speaker 1 so when they lose a game it is just the worst but they force themselves to walk across the next field and put out their hand they seek out the lead loot the winning coach nice game andy and that is what this man can never do

Speaker 1 with elections and you know he jokes about

Speaker 1 Maybe after this one,

Speaker 1 you know, and

Speaker 1 is it really a joke? See, this is my thing with my friends on the right. I keep saying to them, you guys say your big theory is

Speaker 1 he just says a lot of shit. Okay, we're going to put the says a lot of shit doctrine to the test because that's not good enough for me.
People who say shit usually do it. Yeah.

Speaker 1 And, you know.

Speaker 1 And I don't know that the people, a lot of people that voted for him heard. some of the shit that he was saying, you know, because he just yammers on with that word salad, you know.

Speaker 1 That's his superpower.

Speaker 1 It is. He's so all over the map about everything that nobody takes him literally about anything, which is the biggest advantage a politician could ever have.

Speaker 1 You don't really believe what I'm saying anyway. You just trust me that I have the instincts of

Speaker 1 Let's not live in crazy town and we won't get over there again. Okay.
You know, let's not live in John Cryerville, wink, wink.

Speaker 1 It's fun in John Cryerville.

Speaker 1 All I can tell you is it's a fun life. Yeah, you probably do.
I'm sure.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 And you've been married twice? Yes. That's that's immediately what you go to.
You're like,

Speaker 1 wait, you've been married twice. And you actually had fun?

Speaker 1 Wait a minute. Wait.
I'm sorry. I'm going to have to

Speaker 1 go through this a little bit.

Speaker 1 Yes, I've been married twice. I had two kids.

Speaker 1 From your the same marriage?

Speaker 1 No,

Speaker 1 I had a son in my first marriage and another by my second. How long was the first marriage for?

Speaker 1 Four years. Four years.
That's about the right time for a start. I've heard the term.
I don't want to cast aspersion.

Speaker 1 But I've heard people use the term starter marriage.

Speaker 1 I think it's not an aspersion on the person so much as that you're usually young when you do it, so you don't know enough about being a person.

Speaker 1 Yeah, and sometimes you don't get married for great reasons, you know, and that happens, you know, and that's nobody, you know,

Speaker 1 I don't want to say it's nobody's fault because you did it, you know, so it's it's it's your fault.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 at the same time,

Speaker 1 you know, as you as you get older, things change and you had, you know, you saw a situation a certain way and you said, okay, this is the best thing to do. And sometimes it just wasn't.
So, you know.

Speaker 1 Yeah. I mean, when I think back at what I call the vulnerable years, when I mean, I did get engaged once when I was 29.

Speaker 1 And, you know, I, you know, always got my toe out of the trap, but boy,

Speaker 1 it was, it almost

Speaker 1 almost happened a few years later. And I would have been so unhappy and it would have fucked up everything.

Speaker 1 I mean, somehow I've done so many stupid things, but somehow that lodestar, like knowing that I am just not the kind of person who could be married, I at least kept to that and that was correct but that's fair like so much else I would just like

Speaker 1 and I always say to myself when I live my life over I'm sure not gonna do that because that was so stupid and I well interestingly I do think that there's a way there is definitely a societal stigma to not getting married and to not having children that people you know people judge people but I'm certainly judging you right now

Speaker 1 No, I'm not.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 I don't think it's fair. I think people...
That was great.

Speaker 1 I think, you know, if people know that about themselves, and

Speaker 1 it doesn't mean they're shallow. It doesn't mean that they don't have empathy or don't understand people or don't understand the human experience or whatever.

Speaker 1 I think those are ridiculous stigmas. Thank you.
I mean, it used to be much more, I think, of what you're describing now as far as what an outlier it was in society.

Speaker 1 I remember on politically incorrect in the 90s, but again, this is the 90s, it was a little bit of a, you're a weirdo if you never got married.

Speaker 1 I feel like it just became, no, that's a, so many more people are doing it, by the way. It's just a life choice.
And we do get more, especially with social media and that fucking.

Speaker 1 magic light box that transfixes everyone and addicts everyone and changes our brain chemistry, basically.

Speaker 1 It's harder to connect and stay like

Speaker 1 married and that kind of stuff. I mean, our attention spans just aren't there.

Speaker 1 You just can't pay attention to the same person for that long.

Speaker 1 I mean, well, that is a big problem with marriage: is that, I mean, that is the main problem. People can pretend it's other problems, but it's just hard to be with the same human being.

Speaker 1 But how, No one is that scintillating.

Speaker 1 I mean, I'm not.

Speaker 1 I just don't think anyone is. And that to me was a main reason why I never got married.
It's like that model is not going to work. So I'm going to find other models.
Literally.

Speaker 1 We'll be right back. Boom, boom.
Yes.

Speaker 1 Although I have to say,

Speaker 1 I love being married to my wife. It is.

Speaker 1 That's another, just a different personality type. And it's, yeah, it's very, I envy that to a degree because, you know, it simplifies life.
It does in some ways. And also, just

Speaker 1 having somebody else to

Speaker 1 go through life with, right? Like, just to go through the times that are great. Like you're, you know, you're going to say, I just had the best interview with Don Cryer.
to an empty house

Speaker 1 no full of models, I'm sure.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 It's not exactly

Speaker 1 empty right this minute.

Speaker 1 But I live alone and like living alone. And I don't know if that is something that you could ever change about yourself.
You just have to recognize it about yourself.

Speaker 1 I did have that instinct early on. It was the correct instinct.
It just has everything to do, as everything does, with

Speaker 1 when your personality is formed in those first few, some would say months, but years of life. You know, you're pretty much,

Speaker 1 at least this is what the experts tell us, you know, set. And I certainly have known parents who have said to me, you know right away what this kid is like at like one or two.

Speaker 1 Like, oh, that's a wild one.

Speaker 1 You know,

Speaker 1 I don't have that experience, but I think that's probably right. So it's just kind of what your personality is.
I think politics is something that much more comes out of personality.

Speaker 1 You know, you're a Republican. Yeah, you're a Republican because you're a square.

Speaker 1 You know, that's your personality. You know, not you.

Speaker 1 But like, you know, certainly in the old days, when I was a kid, the Republicans were more of the country club types. Yeah.
Well, now they're the fire-breathing, you know. It's kind of switched up.

Speaker 1 Destroy the establishment. Let's, you know.
The Democrats got to be the elitists.

Speaker 1 But again, I don't agree with that. But that's what America.
But I get it. I don't.
I know know you don't. That's the right-wing framing.
But that's how

Speaker 1 right-wing framing.

Speaker 1 That's your indoctrination. You've got to get out of MSNBC.

Speaker 1 I don't watch on MSNBC. Well, they're watching you.
Oh, okay.

Speaker 1 Because they're channeling it. Oh, my gosh.
I mean, that is not right-wing framing. Yes.
That's just how America sees it. I'm sorry, but the pro-union party, the Democrats,

Speaker 1 the Democrats are not seen as the working party. They're not seen as it because of the right-wing framing, Bill Moore.

Speaker 1 That is part of it. Of course,

Speaker 1 but they're going to take advantage of it.

Speaker 1 Yes, you're right. There is a certain amount of that that you would expect the opposition party to try to take advantage of, but they give them these openings.

Speaker 1 Yeah, do I understand why Sherrod Brown, who's very pro-union, lost in Ohio, where there's a lot of union jobs?

Speaker 1 Some of that is because of propaganda, and some of that is because they just didn't see what his championing got for them. Well, and,

Speaker 1 but I'm going to say this one more time, and you're going to get so annoyed with me. And inflation hit very hard, and

Speaker 1 their salaries did not catch up. Boom.
That's why. You know what? Denzel has a great

Speaker 1 quote from Washington.

Speaker 1 If you're looking for an excuse, you'll find one. Yes.
Well. So inflation wasn't good, but like, if you want to look at an excuse for excuses, you'll find it.

Speaker 1 If you want to look in the mirror and ever win an election again, follow me if you want to live.

Speaker 1 Well, again, I'm not saying there should not be introspection. I think the Democrats and the left are too much, are the kings of introspection.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 no, I'm saying obviously we're in a different fight now because,

Speaker 1 and by the way, I'm not a Democrat. I'm a registered independent.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 1 But I believe the fight now is to retain something of a democracy, something of

Speaker 1 a civil democracy. I am an independent, but I've never voted for the Republican.

Speaker 1 Oh, I have. So that's how we're different.
And I really. Who did you vote for? I'm not going to say.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 1 You know what? I am going to say

Speaker 1 because

Speaker 1 it deserves some introspection on my part.

Speaker 1 It was Rudy Giuliani in New York City. You don't have to be ashamed of it.
Well, he was a good mayor.

Speaker 1 He did change how New Yorkers felt about the city.

Speaker 1 He took problems that people felt were just intractable in New York City and made people feel like, oh, we can do something about this. It's so funny because.
And that I'm grateful for.

Speaker 1 What he did was unwoke some bullshit that was going on in the city. He was a Republican mayor.
So it sounds like when these issues were in your life personally,

Speaker 1 you're going to kind of like it. When the Rudy Gianni is not going to be able to do it.

Speaker 1 isn't, but okay, that's easy to do, but engage with the actual thought why it's wrong. Engage with that.
I'm sorry.

Speaker 1 I'm saying it sounds like when you were living in New York

Speaker 1 and these issues impacted you directly

Speaker 1 directly now, and I'm still, and I'm not voting for you. No, because you're rich now.
You're rich.

Speaker 1 So you're not like on the street. But Rudu Giuliani, you liked him because he made New York more livable, which was less crime.
You know,

Speaker 1 get the squeegee.

Speaker 1 Yes, they introduced broken windows policing,

Speaker 1 which at the time was supposedly statistically based. And you remember they had explain the theory.
The theory of broken windows is

Speaker 1 that

Speaker 1 by prosecuting petty crime,

Speaker 1 petty quality,

Speaker 1 quality of life crimes, like the guys who would squeegee your car whether you wanted them to or not,

Speaker 1 that

Speaker 1 it increased an atmosphere of

Speaker 1 civility and lawfulness.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 to the extent that

Speaker 1 some of that worked, but it also resulted in some very bad things. The stop and frisk policy that was that was incredibly racist and was and New York City has dealt with incredible racism over

Speaker 1 since its founding.

Speaker 1 And so you know, the,

Speaker 1 you know, I could say, yeah, it was, you know, it was nice not to have the squeegee guys, you know, but again, I, you know, the, the, the man has imploded as a human being, uh, Rudy Giuliani.

Speaker 1 What do you make of

Speaker 1 people like, I mean, there's so many people you think of, like Harvey Weinstein, Diddy, like people who are like at the summit, and then they're just in places now.

Speaker 1 I mean, Rudy's not exactly in jail, but he's certainly in show business jail.

Speaker 1 Uh,

Speaker 1 and I mean, Epstein, I mean, to go from like how they live

Speaker 1 to.

Speaker 1 Yeah, Giuliani was revered for decades. He was America's mayor.
He went for president. Yes.
Yes.

Speaker 1 And yeah, again, I don't know why the people in Trump's orbit gather there and are dismantled and destroy their lives and throw their lives away. to be loyal to this man.
I don't understand it.

Speaker 1 You know, my understanding with Rudy in his case was that he actually has a serious drinking problem. Again, I don't know.

Speaker 1 I don't call it defamation because I don't know for sure, but that's the story.

Speaker 1 That is brooded about. Yes, yes.
So it could be that. I don't know.

Speaker 1 I don't know. Again, I don't get the appeal of Trump as a politician in any respect.

Speaker 1 But obviously,

Speaker 1 I'm outvoted, literally.

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 1 I certainly not the kind of politician who's worth throwing your life away on, but plenty of people want to line enough to do it.

Speaker 1 No one has been harder on Donald Trump or, you know, tweeted at me a million times, never complimentary.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 I certainly understand why he won, and we don't have to go back over that. Some of it was what the Republicans do, but they ran a smarter campaign, as they often do.

Speaker 1 And some of us, what would the Democrats do? But there are moments where

Speaker 1 I look at him and he'll do something where I go, first of all, I understand why it works. But then at times I actually like it.
Like when he was talking in 91, he was talking about the

Speaker 1 Elon's rocket that came back and they caught it. He was like, can Russia do it? Can China do it? No.
America did it.

Speaker 1 And I was like, yeah, you know what?

Speaker 1 That's not bad to me. that someone likes America and is proud that we can do something amazing like that that nobody else can do now does this make up for the other

Speaker 1 myriad

Speaker 1 of course not i'm just saying that they're uh you know i thought it was good that he moved the capital of israel to jerusalem and if he does something

Speaker 1 in in the newt term yeah that's an embassy but but what yeah but now what what do you what do you like about that just out of curiosity jerusalem yeah

Speaker 1 Well, it's been the Jewish capital for like 2,500 years. Years, yeah.
No, I'm legitimately curious.

Speaker 1 This isn't a gotcha. I mean,

Speaker 1 there's no reason why every other country in the world gets to have their capital where they want it.

Speaker 1 And every American administration promised they would do it and then just pocket vetoed it and forgot about it for four years. It was the right thing to do.

Speaker 1 Again, in a sea of things I didn't agree with.

Speaker 1 But, you know,

Speaker 1 I'm not going to judge anything until it happened. This country

Speaker 1 needed a slap in in the face and a colonic. He would not be the guy I would have chosen to delivered the colonic.

Speaker 1 But I get the need for the colonic. It's not like we're not bloated and sclerotic and wrapped up in

Speaker 1 a lot of dumb things that we do. And we'll see.
I mean, they're disruptors. They certainly got that.

Speaker 1 That's what the Democrats asked for when they invited this disaster is, you know, now we'll find out what it's like to have Bozo the clown be be the Secretary of Education.

Speaker 1 Well, I mean, it's so beyond parody. Yes, the circus is literally in town with

Speaker 1 the Trump cabinet.

Speaker 1 But it is interesting because to me, it makes it all the more clear that the Republican project for the last 50 years is to delegitimize and

Speaker 1 dismantle the United States federal government. And they've said that.
I mean, you've got Grover Norquist. Dismantle, but

Speaker 1 Grover Norquist once said, strangle it in the bathroom. Exactly.

Speaker 1 That's too far, but is it super bloated? Yes.

Speaker 1 Even Al Gore back in the day was put in charge of doing what Elon exactly says he's going to do now. So they got it back in the 90s that this thing is out of control.

Speaker 1 Government is completely out of control. But I believe it's so true.
I believe it's a Trojan horse just to dismantle the things that they don't like.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 so I'm saying my issues are the environment and democracy. Yes.
And the environment is, my issue is going to suffer horribly because these clowns are in there. You're right.

Speaker 1 What on earth are you putting in there? What is this? That's

Speaker 1 something Bill Cosby gave me. I didn't ask.
Wait.

Speaker 1 What could go wrong?

Speaker 1 It's Cosby's finest. Look.

Speaker 1 Oh, my God. Let's not not judge him just because it's 79.
I think it's 79 rapes or whatever.

Speaker 1 Okay. Well, God bless you.
You don't have to tell me. So, what's your relationship with Charlie now?

Speaker 1 I'm not saying he's

Speaker 1 don't connect those two.

Speaker 1 It's like, wow. Okay.

Speaker 1 That's a segue. The only thing is it made me think of him.

Speaker 1 I don't think he's a rapist.

Speaker 1 But he's done other bad things. Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 1 We don't have a relationship anymore.

Speaker 1 Oh, that's a shame.

Speaker 1 I wish him the best.

Speaker 1 We have some mutual friends still, and I've heard he's been sober for a while, which is great to hear. I know that he has

Speaker 1 reconnected with Chuck Laurie, who was the producer of my show. Of course.
And

Speaker 1 their friction was what broke up,

Speaker 1 what

Speaker 1 caused that huge conflagration on the show.

Speaker 1 Why were they fighting? They were fighting. Well, it was really sad, actually.
It was incredibly tragic because

Speaker 1 Charlie was relapsing at the time.

Speaker 1 Chuck, you know, has been very affected. There was a period where he was sober.
Yes. He was sober for the first few seasons of the show.
For the whole time. The whole time, as far as I know.

Speaker 1 I mean, obviously, I'm not the police. Yeah, I had dinner with him in 2010, and he was completely sober.
Yeah. Yeah, and he was proud of his sobriety.

Speaker 1 And charming. And incredibly charming and smart and great at what he does.
Absolutely

Speaker 1 a a wonderful comedian, gifted with his timing. I mean, I loved working with him.
We had a great time.

Speaker 1 But he started, you know, after his marriage

Speaker 1 went south with Denise, he started having, you know, clearly he was using again.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 he started, you know, it.

Speaker 1 you know on the show he was still very professional um he was good to work with um but what happened was he you know he started having these things happen.

Speaker 1 You know, he got arrested at the Plaza Hotel for trashing the room. He got arrested in Colorado for fighting with his

Speaker 1 hookers.

Speaker 1 Yes, that was the plaza.

Speaker 1 And he was beating hookers with other hookers.

Speaker 1 I don't know what happened. No.

Speaker 1 But he

Speaker 1 is Houdini. The fact that he could get a Super Bowl ad.
Yeah. After all the things that he's in the press for doing, some of them on tape.
Well, because it's because it's oddly, he has a brand.

Speaker 1 He has the brand that is him.

Speaker 1 Exactly. And that's one of the reasons that Trump gets away with what he gets away with.
Correct. He has the brand.
And he's on brand.

Speaker 1 I mean, part of the reason that Biden suffered so much after the Afghanistan withdrawal was it was off-brand. You know,

Speaker 1 it was a mess. And up to that point, remember, he was pulling incredibly well.

Speaker 1 But then it was this, oh no,

Speaker 1 they don't actually have a handle on this. At any rate, with Charlie,

Speaker 1 he

Speaker 1 once

Speaker 1 happened with the show was he

Speaker 1 fell off the wagon. It was obvious.
They were doing all kinds of things to sort of work around it. He was missing days on the set.

Speaker 1 He would still show up on Friday night and he knew his lines and he was ready to go and he could do the show,

Speaker 1 but he was barely functioning. And Chuck, who's been very upfront about his own struggles with alcohol,

Speaker 1 was confronting him and saying, you need help. You have to do something.

Speaker 1 And Charlie, you know, just said, no, I don't. uh and that became the the the basic

Speaker 1 period where he there was a tremendous publicity blitz where he was like tiger blood and he was just on something ever well what caused that was that he that that chuck said you need to get help um charlie said no i'm not going to he said but no he knew what he did was he said i'm going to do it for a week and then he said then i want to go back to the show

Speaker 1 it didn't make any sense at the time but it but it i think it makes sense to me now he was already having monetary issues at the time, which is astonishing because he was the highest, he remains the highest paid actor in television.

Speaker 1 So he needed the show to go forward. So he was furious.
And Chuck shut down the show. And so that was what became the flashpoint.
And eventually he got fired because of all the tiger blood nonsense.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 he was

Speaker 1 doing anti-Semitic shit. And it was just like, what the fuck is happening here?

Speaker 1 I remember doing a thing about that. And

Speaker 1 my main thesis, as I recall, was: okay, you can say you're the greatest rock star of all time, and you're this great vampire with tiger blood, but you're on a sitcom on the old people.

Speaker 1 On CBS, exactly. Exactly.
And it's not quite a rock star. It's good.

Speaker 1 Exactly.

Speaker 1 I have the highest respect for people who

Speaker 1 do something that like has just huge mass appeal, like which I will never do. And I'm okay with that.
Everyone has their great niche. I love where I am.
But I will never have that.

Speaker 1 I mean, it wouldn't be right for me anyway. But Taylor Swift, I don't get that.
But, you know,

Speaker 1 I have total respect because Trump, you know, you got this just tremendous army of people to either watch your show for years. It was one like every year, wasn't it? Like one, one, one, one.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 It did great.

Speaker 1 That's, you know, there's a certain like automatic respect you have to get for success in my book, even if it's not what I would watch or do or vote for.

Speaker 1 You move people.

Speaker 1 Yes,

Speaker 1 there was absolutely, we had a lane that really worked, you know, and I was really proud of it.

Speaker 1 and we had a we had a wonderful time and again he was really good to me but when the breakdown happened that's when he just started lashing out at everybody including me and so obviously the friendship broke down and years later um uh he came asking he wanted to reboot the show and this is after we had already done it with with ashton for a couple of years and uh

Speaker 1 and

Speaker 1 uh And I said, no, I don't, this doesn't make any sense. I don't, you know, that's a roller coaster I don't want to get back on.
Thank you very much.

Speaker 1 And then he started going into

Speaker 1 social media and

Speaker 1 acting like I was begging him to do the show again, which I was like, that's just not cool.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 it's frustrating to me because he still keeps up the Tiger Blood persona socially on social media and stuff.

Speaker 1 He's sued for his boy. I know.

Speaker 1 But he is, to my understanding, is he's been sober for a while.

Speaker 1 And the mutual friends that we have, and again, and he and Chuck Laurie, as I said, they've reconnected. And he actually appeared on Chuck's most recent show on AB on HBO.

Speaker 1 You're going to wind up all working together again. Every band gets back together when the demand is enough.
Mike Tyson just got back in the ring. He's a thousand years old.

Speaker 1 Oh, God. He looked like my uncle Phil in there.

Speaker 1 Yes, he had about two rounds of like a little fire in him, and then it was, nope, gone, done, done for the evening.

Speaker 1 But yeah, you know, again,

Speaker 1 I like him and I wish the best for him. And I'm really glad he's sober.
And

Speaker 1 if you have him on the show, you'll have a great time. I would.
And you'll have a great time. I'm trying to have him.

Speaker 1 No, really. I would love to.

Speaker 1 But working with him in any kind of a regular capacity, I will not do again.

Speaker 1 I'll do a one-off, sure. But I wish him the best.
That dinner that we had, it was about 20, 10, I think it was six people. We had a mutual friend.

Speaker 1 So it was him and his girlfriend, me and the girl I was with at the time, and Charlie and Brooke,

Speaker 1 the wife. Yes.
You know, the one who held the knife to her throat. Again, how did this guy get a Super Bowl?

Speaker 1 Anyway, so at the end of the evening, you know, I go for my wallet and he's like, and he throws down, I remember it was at the time, but you couldn't get like one round of drinks for this, probably now.

Speaker 1 And I think it was at the polo lounge.

Speaker 1 He throws down six

Speaker 1 hundred dollar bills.

Speaker 1 I guess when the bill was $500 or $400, whatever it was.

Speaker 1 And ever since then,

Speaker 1 this girl and I, whenever we would be someplace and we want to get out quickly, we would say,

Speaker 1 I'm just going to sheen it.

Speaker 1 He's become a verb.

Speaker 1 Sheena means like you throw it

Speaker 1 cash in the group.

Speaker 1 This is more than it is. And plus, I'm gone.
Yes. So he was, he's a cool dude.
Dude. I mean, you know, the charisma is there.

Speaker 1 Yes, he is absolutely charismatic. And what's great about that and what's lousy about that is all encased in one being, you know.
Yeah. And,

Speaker 1 you know, and again, I'm going to say it one more time. I really wish him well.

Speaker 1 I loved working with him when it was. We'll be working again.
You'll be working together again. Because it becomes, it's, it's a thing.
It's a force in the universe. And also, you know,

Speaker 1 it's, there was an undeniable like uber chemistry

Speaker 1 that that probably cannot be extinguished. I mean, people can drift, but I don't know if that is, isn't so innate that it wouldn't always be there.
And then they'll offer you the right money.

Speaker 1 And like, everybody loves money. I mean, you're not so woke, you know, of money.

Speaker 1 But now, in the future, whenever you think of the woke people that you're really mad at, it's me.

Speaker 1 I want to put that face on it. That's the, this is the one right here.

Speaker 1 Just say John Cryer. Actually, whenever you say that, it was John Cryer who brought us to this awful pass.
No. He's the one who did it.
It's every Hollywood actor who sits there. Yeah.

Speaker 1 You're two guys who don't agree on much. You made me laugh.
Oh, good. Like continually.
Okay. I'm sure as much as you probably hate me now.
I don't hate you. I know.
There's no hatred.

Speaker 1 Me neither.

Speaker 1 Much as we disagree. I think you would at least give me this, that my laugh is genuine.
Yes, you're laughing. Yes,

Speaker 1 not laughs like a talk show host.

Speaker 1 Well, you know,

Speaker 1 that's, I thank you. That's

Speaker 1 that's kind of you to say, and I, and I've enjoyed my time a lot, and uh, I enjoyed doing political correct back in the day

Speaker 1 who can make each other laugh probably,

Speaker 1 you know,

Speaker 1 find a way to agree on more than they disagree. But, you know, we'll just say it's the beginning chapter.
Yes.

Speaker 1 Of our love relationship. Wait a minute.
Wait a minute. That went in a weird direction.

Speaker 1 It's great to be on the back of this train with you.

Speaker 1 Me and me America. Vice President Garfield

Speaker 1 pledged to America. Garfield got assassinated, by the way.

Speaker 1 Just to

Speaker 1 say, Arthur is the one who took over, right? Yes, I believe. All right.

Speaker 1 My president Arthur and I

Speaker 1 after you.

Speaker 1 Hopefully,

Speaker 1 we both have careers after this.

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