Psionics & Telepathy: The Future of Human Communication? | Ron Janix DSH 1323

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Speaker 1 Terms apply. They can't even communicate with you.

Speaker 1 You're struggling. It is a brutal existence to try to teach that child to eat or use their hands or anything like that.

Speaker 1 You're not hoaxing people for a joke.

Speaker 2 Yeah, there's no benefit to that.

Speaker 1 There's no benefit. You've got enough problems.

Speaker 1 So I think it's very unfair to even make that claim.

Speaker 2 All right, guys, Captain Ron in the building. How's it going, man?

Speaker 1 Hey, Sean, good to see you, man. It's going great.

Speaker 2 Upcoming conference soon, right?

Speaker 1 Six more weeks. We're getting ready.

Speaker 2 It's going to be my first one, but your 10th, right?

Speaker 1 Well, I've gone to them since about 2015. We've been the owners for three years now.
So this is our third event running it.

Speaker 1 But we used to go beforehand just as attendees and got to know the owners and got involved in the conference.

Speaker 1 And it's been going on for, yeah, this will be the 11th live times, the 11th time contact has happened live.

Speaker 2 Wow. Impressive group of speakers, by the way.

Speaker 1 Thanks, man. Yeah, we think this lineup is about as strong as we've ever had.
We have Ross Colhart this year, who's obviously at the forefront of this. He's on News Nation.

Speaker 1 You know, he's the guy who did the Jake Barber interview just a few months ago, which is a whistleblower who worked for the Army and claims that he's participated in. UAP recovery programs.

Speaker 1 So there's a firsthand witness that Ross has well-vetted, and he's a fascinating guy, and he's the guy that brought that term psionics kind of into the fold again.

Speaker 1 And before that, Ross was the guy who broke the news story for David Grush. Wow.
That actually happened, Sean, during Contact in the Desert.

Speaker 1 So while our event was going on, that broke live on News Nation, we stopped our event. We all piled into one single room and watched it unfold together.
So that was kind of a...

Speaker 1 Great moment for Contact in the Desert that it happened to be there right when we were all together. So watching something historic in this community with other people was really a great thing.

Speaker 2 Yeah, because 10, 11 years ago, this stuff was niche, right? Now it's kind of mainstream.

Speaker 1 Absolutely. I think since 2017, it's really been sort of a watershed year for us.
2017 was when the New York Times article hit, and that made everybody kind of pay attention to this topic.

Speaker 1 And then 60 Minutes came out and they did a piece on it. And we've had a lot of things happen.

Speaker 1 Also in 2017, Amuamua happened, which was that discovery of the first interstellar object in our solar system.

Speaker 1 So that year really changed a lot of things. Avi Loeb kind of hit big with the Amuamua stuff.
And suddenly, this topic was taken much more seriously in the mainstream world.

Speaker 1 And it moved out of the X-Files silliness into a little more serious.

Speaker 1 It's much more taken, excuse me. It's taken much more seriously today by the average person.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Well, now there's a lot of stuff coming to light, right?

Speaker 1 Absolutely. The

Speaker 1 governmental hearings. We haven't had congressional hearings on this topic in 50, 60 years.
And now all of a sudden we just had some in November, and they're coming up again at the end of April.

Speaker 1 They're going to have additional congressional hearings.

Speaker 1 Also, David Grosch, the whistleblower we were talking about that Ross interviewed, he is going to go into a skiff with members of Congress and tell what he knows.

Speaker 1 So this is the very historic stuff that's happening. And it does look like we're moving closer and closer to getting to what the government knows.

Speaker 2 What are these hearings focusing on? What are they talking about?

Speaker 1 This upcoming one is going to focus on the nuclear people, people that worked at nuclear bases, such as Robert Salas, who worked on a nuclear base and they saw a UFO hovering over the base.

Speaker 1 You know, this is way before everybody had a cell phone in their pocket.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 the UFO shut off all of our nuclear launch codes. and everything went dark.
And then the UFO moved and they all came back online.

Speaker 1 And we have, you know, people they're going to be coming to contact as well, including Robert Salas, who talk about this and they want to testify to Congress and let them know that, look,

Speaker 1 this is happening. And even if it's not alien per se, somebody's got the technology to hover over our bases and turn off our missiles.
It's even more scary if it's not alien, right?

Speaker 1 Because that means an adversary has this. That's true.
Maybe not more, but certainly scary nonetheless.

Speaker 2 Yeah. What's your theory on who it was?

Speaker 1 I have no idea. I am absolutely, I live right in the middle.
It could easily be technology, you know, but beyond what we know.

Speaker 1 Oftentimes we hear in this community that when you hear a plane like when the stealth bomber came out, they say that that was 20 years past.

Speaker 1 You know what I mean? It's like they're not going to show us the newest, latest, greatest thing. They're going to show us something that's past its useful life, basically.

Speaker 1 Sure, we could show you, look, this is new, but that's not really what they have. I would think that our top secret program.

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Speaker 1 Programs have things that are well beyond what the average person knows.

Speaker 2 Yeah, well, especially with the UAP recovery programs, they probably recovered some insane technology.

Speaker 1 If that's real, which, you know, I'm

Speaker 1 skeptical. I'm very skeptical.
I'm very

Speaker 1 cautious about all of these things. But there is a lot of stuff that points to this being real.
Roswell alone, to me, is a very credible case.

Speaker 1 And if we have recovered this technology, it makes sense to me that we would keep that very secure and very private. So, you know, throughout history, the

Speaker 1 wars are typically won by the most advanced technology. You know that famous opening scene in,

Speaker 1 what's that film, 2001, where the monkeys are there and they're fighting and then the one has a bone. Yeah.
His technology was better and he hits the other monkey.

Speaker 1 That's like the first sign of technology beating someone else. That's been going on if you look at throughout history.
World War II ended because we dropped a nuclear bomb. We had better technology.

Speaker 1 The better technology throughout history has won wars and changed the landscape of Earth.

Speaker 1 So if you had technology that was from a race that could come here from another planet, it's got to be far beyond what we have.

Speaker 1 So you would want to keep that very close to the vest, I would think.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I'm sure there's some underground government programs or something or Area 51 stuff.

Speaker 1 Why not? Why not? If we did have it,

Speaker 1 I would think we'd keep it very private. You know, there's a lot of different schools of thought to this.

Speaker 1 Dr. Stephen Greer,

Speaker 1 his philosophy is that we have these unacknowledged black programs where this information is housed and it's kept very secret. So it's really outside the government's purview.

Speaker 1 So Congress doesn't even oversee those budgets. Interesting.

Speaker 1 So even if all of this disclosure stuff that we're moving on now, you know, we're having these hearings, Danny Sheehan and others are moving forward with different bills.

Speaker 1 Last year, in 2023, we had the Schumer bill, the UAP Disclosure Act, to try to get the government to release their information. That would be awesome.

Speaker 1 But I fear that the real, true, good stuff isn't going to be accessible in our normal government. It's probably something like Dr.

Speaker 1 Greer says, where it's in an unacknowledged black program where we don't get access to that. It's unofficial.
It's not really on the books. So they're not going to release it anyway.

Speaker 1 That's what I would think is probably really happening.

Speaker 2 And that's where you see the whistleblowers come into play, right?

Speaker 1 And then this guy, Jake Barber, supposedly was involved in one of these and he came forward and he said he was personally directly involved in recovering crash retrievals. Wow.

Speaker 1 And, you know, there's many, many cases.

Speaker 1 Ryan Wood wrote a book that has 75 cases that have happened in the last hundred years of crash retrievals. So we do have some data on this.
You know, it's hard to say what's real. We'll never know.

Speaker 1 But there is more than Roswell.

Speaker 1 You know, there's there's just his book alone has 75 strong cases that we have recovered extraterrestrial craft or at least craft of unknown origin i should say because it is possible that an adversary would have technology well beyond ours and maybe we recovered that yeah did they ever find out what the drone thing was about in new jersey new york No, that

Speaker 1 boy, that went away quick. Isn't that crazy? It came in and the government was real weird about it.

Speaker 1 My suspicion is that they were looking for

Speaker 1 nuclear residue or checking for something like that. These were probably military drones.
Because if it was an adversary, I think we would have shut it down. And

Speaker 1 if it was us, we would just admit it. I think they didn't want to say that we're looking for a dirty bomb.
We're missing some nuclear material.

Speaker 1 I think that it was probably something like that, government-based, and we were trying to do that without letting that out.

Speaker 2 That's my suspicion. I can see that too.
Psionics is a hot topic right now. Telepathy tapes is blowing up.
What's your whole take on that stuff?

Speaker 1 The word psionics came up on the Jake Barber interview with Ross Colehart, and it also ties into these things. Like one of our featured guests is Diane Hennessy Powell.

Speaker 1 Dr. Powell has done incredible work.
I don't know how familiar with those tapes.

Speaker 2 Did you watch them? No, not yet.

Speaker 1 This is something you really need to look at. It's absolutely incredible.

Speaker 1 They brought it to my attention, and I'm like, telepathy, that's not something we're interested in.

Speaker 1 We try to be science-based. We try to be fact-based, we try to be academic about these things.

Speaker 1 And it turns out she's from Johns Hopkins and Harvard, and she's been studying autistic nonverbal children for, I think, 15 years. Yeah.
So this is, you know, on the autistic spectrum.

Speaker 1 I don't know the numbers. I don't know how this works, but basically, you know, let's say it's zero to 10.

Speaker 1 You could be anywhere on that spectrum.

Speaker 1 And these kids are way at the end where they literally cannot even speak the way she describes it is they literally do not know that they have hands and fingers to communicate wow they literally don't know so the way she described it to us was like it's almost like a helen keller kind of a thing where she couldn't hear or see and they had a teacher to hear and see or you know to communicate well these children can't communicate so

Speaker 1 They don't know they have hands and arms and they don't know how to communicate.

Speaker 1 So what she thinks is happening is between zero and two, the way the brain develops, they can't say hungry, they can't do this.

Speaker 1 So they telepathically are communicating to their mother or caregiver, I need food.

Speaker 1 Because she started coming across these cases where the mom would say she walked into the kitchen and like a picture of food would pop into her brain.

Speaker 1 And it was because that little child was doing that. So they started looking at it.
And now they have

Speaker 1 incredible evidence that these kids and their sometimes their mom, sometimes their caregiver, sometimes the father have these telepathic abilities.

Speaker 1 And it's a wide variety where some of them, it's just one person, maybe it's the mother. But there are some of these children

Speaker 1 have this happen everywhere. So if they went to a casino, it would be so noisy, they would freak out and scream because they hear everybody's thoughts.

Speaker 1 So, they literally, some of these parents have moved like out into the country because it's too hard for this kid because they're hearing so many different voices. So, it's really incredible.

Speaker 1 She's at the forefront of this. They're doing a documentary about her work and these discoveries.

Speaker 1 We are actually going to do a live demonstration on stage of this ability. Whoa.
She is bringing in Hakeem and her are bringing in this mother and her nine-year-old daughter, who

Speaker 1 is autistic and is nonverbal, but she's able to communicate with her mother telepathically. It's absolutely incredible.

Speaker 1 We're going to do a 30-minute demonstration live, and then Diane and Hakeem and a few others are going to explain what we're seeing and how it works.

Speaker 1 She said that there's some thinking in anthropology that

Speaker 1 literally hundreds of thousands of years ago,

Speaker 1 modern humans are about 200,000 years ago. They think in the infancy of that, it's possible that humans had telepathic abilities.
But as we developed vocal cords and things, we didn't need them.

Speaker 1 So they got kind of put to the shelf. Interesting.
So it's a fascinating area of study, and I think it's incredible. It ties into the whole UFO phenomenon because we often see

Speaker 1 cases where experiencers will claim that the experience they have with a being or an alien gray or whatever it may be, it's always a telepathic communication happening. So that ties right into this.

Speaker 1 And it's kind of at the forefront of science right now. I think this is an incredible discovery.
Whatever's going on here, it's amazing.

Speaker 1 You know, Sean, it ties into another area, if we could move over to this.

Speaker 1 It's also the whole idea of consciousness, which is a big thing in today's world and in our UFO community. Consciousness seems to play a major role in this.

Speaker 1 And there's been this debate going on for hundreds of years whether consciousness lives in our brain, which some people, science-based people tend to think, or is consciousness non-local?

Speaker 1 You have a guy like Carl Jung who talked about the collective unconscious or

Speaker 1 Edgar Casey talked about the Akashic Record, which sort of has all that knowledge. And they thought of our brain as a receiver.
that taps into

Speaker 1 this,

Speaker 1 I don't know what to call it, realm. And that's how we use it, that our brain is just a receiver tapping into this massive non-local consciousness.

Speaker 1 So that's still a live debate today that's happening. So

Speaker 1 it's interesting to see that she said that some of these children experience this thing where they go to a place called the hill.

Speaker 1 And these kids go to a place.

Speaker 1 And by go to a place, I mean in their mind. They're not physically leaving.
These kids rarely go out of their house.

Speaker 1 It's incredible that we've we've found somebody that can come to contact in the desert because most of these children spend most of their lives in their home. It's too hard to leave their house.

Speaker 1 They scream. It's too hard.
It's too much for them. And I can understand that.
So

Speaker 1 the idea of consciousness being non-local ties into this because these kids, some of them say they.

Speaker 1 I guess you would call it, let's say, an astral project or out of body. They go to a place called the hill and they meet another person with the same autism level that they are.
Wow.

Speaker 1 And they communicate to each other. And they've had cases where somebody will say, hey, look at this rock.
Go tell Jimmy. And Jimmy lives in London.

Speaker 1 And at night, the children go to this place and he talks about that.

Speaker 1 How would he know about that? So that would point to consciousness being non-local that we share that.

Speaker 1 You know, there's this other thing that they're really studying that's interesting too, because we don't know

Speaker 1 exactly how it's working. And it might be a multitude of these cases.
Are they talking telepathically? Like I'm reading what you're thinking.

Speaker 1 Like you're thinking right now, this guy's going on and on like an idiot, for example. Or are they really sharing consciousness? There's a couple of cases.

Speaker 1 There's one in particular out of the UK where this mother was at the eye doctor with her son. Yeah.
And her son is blind.

Speaker 1 And while they were there, she was reading the eye chart. He read the eye chart.

Speaker 1 He read it seeing it through her eyes. Wow.
Because they had some sort of connection that way too. This would be considered a psionic ability.
So that's a fascinating case. How is that possible?

Speaker 1 Is she seeing it and he's seeing through her eyes somehow consciously? Or is she seeing it and she gets the letter in her brain and he's reading her brain?

Speaker 1 You know, we don't know what's happening here. But this is sort of a new area of study that seems really fascinating to me.

Speaker 2 That is interesting. The other one that interests me is the ayahuasca where people will see the same aliens or whatever.

Speaker 1 Exactly. These beings,

Speaker 1 I've haven't had the courage to do it yet, but I'm fascinated by ayahuasca because exactly the point you just made, that two different people will talk about experiencing the ayahuasca experience, and they will describe seeing the exact same beings.

Speaker 1 Hey, I walked in and to the left was the snake woman with the black and white dress. Did you see her?

Speaker 1 Yeah. How is that possible?

Speaker 1 Are they really going to a realm? Does that exist on some astral plane that we're unfamiliar with?

Speaker 1 How could they have the same hallucination?

Speaker 1 To me, I think that's a really strong thing to study because it feels tied to this consciousness thing, right?

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah.
I think I lean towards non-local.

Speaker 1 Yeah, for sure. I do.

Speaker 2 Yeah. I mean, the CIA released remote viewing documents now.

Speaker 1 Absolutely. That's been going on for years.
Yeah. You know, we had the Stanford Research Institute, of course, with Russell Targ and Hal Putoff and those guys' findings.

Speaker 1 And they they found that people that came in off the street would try to do remote viewing and they would have great success, way more than you would think,

Speaker 1 which that's incredible, the fact that you could do it at all. Yeah.
So if it worked one in 10 times to me, that means there's something here. All of these things I feel happen.

Speaker 1 We just need more time to study them. Things that are on the fringe

Speaker 1 become normalized over time. There was a time when we all thought the world was flat.

Speaker 1 And then they figured out it was round. And then now everybody knows that, you know, not everybody, but 99.9% of us.
You know, it's that sort of thing.

Speaker 2 And in 1992, you know, exoplanet.

Speaker 1 This is exactly what I was going to get to. Well, let me back up here.
You know,

Speaker 1 here's a good correlation for that, Sean.

Speaker 1 In 1925, so 100 years ago,

Speaker 1 our scientific knowledge thought that the Milky Way was the entirety of the universe.

Speaker 1 The entire universe was the Milky Way galaxy. That's what we believed from 200,000 years ago up until 1925.
That was the consensus reality.

Speaker 1 Then in 1925, they put up a telescope in Mount Wilson, and Hubble actually was the astronomer who discovered that there was another galaxy outside of our galaxy.

Speaker 1 So now all of a sudden, wait a minute, this isn't the universe. This is our little galaxy.
There's another one over there.

Speaker 1 So in 1924, let's say, we all knew that this one little galaxy was the universe. In 1925, we realized there were two.
Do you know how many they know of today?

Speaker 2 How many?

Speaker 1 Two trillion

Speaker 1 galaxies. Holy crap.

Speaker 1 So in a hundred years, our scientific understanding went from believing there was one galaxy in the universe to believing or knowing there are two trillion galaxies in the universe.

Speaker 1 That is quite a change in understanding. So I feel that this relates to the idea of these topics, psionics that we're talking about.
Right now, some people have this ability to remote view.

Speaker 1 Some kids with this can do

Speaker 1 telepathic abilities.

Speaker 1 Let's say 100 years from now, 200 years from now, 1,000 years from now, these things might be like a normal thing that's happening in society, but we are just at the cusp of learning and understanding how they work.

Speaker 1 You know, another good example,

Speaker 1 if you don't mind, let me share with you the idea that

Speaker 1 let's go back 200 years. So from all the technology we've had from 200,000 years ago to 200 years ago, 200 years ago, it took

Speaker 1 to go from New York to London, it took a month. Wow.
That was how fast you could get from New York to London, about 29 days on ship.

Speaker 1 That's what you could do.

Speaker 1 Fast forward just a little bit, and today, within that 200-year period, we can do it in five or six days by boat but we can do it in under three hours on the concord

Speaker 1 so it's like this whole idea about people saying um

Speaker 1 uh that debunk the existence of aliens coming to our planet their argument is oftentimes well you can't get there from here what they really mean by that sean is you can't get there from here using the technology of the day.

Speaker 1 That's what they really mean to say, because using the technology of the day, if you said to somebody 200 years ago, hey, you can't get to London in three hours, it takes 30 days. Well, that's true.

Speaker 1 Flash forward 200 years, three hours we can make that trip. Yes, it took you with that technology 200 years ago, a month, but it takes us by boat five days, six days.

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Speaker 1 Just three hours by plane. So you can see how that would translate to

Speaker 1 200 years from now, do you think it's going to take three hours to go from New York to London? No goddamn way, right? It's going to be half that.

Speaker 2 They might have teleportation by then.

Speaker 1 anything's on the table right they're doing experiments with that already too yeah i saw so i can imagine that it's going to be much quicker than the three hours so if you look at it this way

Speaker 1 our universe

Speaker 1 it's pretty much agreed upon is 13.7 billion years old our planet's 4.5 billion years old so most of the universe has a nine billion year jump on us so you can imagine that they've had time to develop intelligent life and develop things.

Speaker 1 If somebody was technologically just a couple hundred years ahead of us, they would have

Speaker 1 a huge jump on where we are today.

Speaker 1 But it's more likely that they have a thousand, 10,000, or a million year jump on us technologically. Just mathematically, that's the reality of it.
If they got a 9 billion year jump

Speaker 1 on creation, why wouldn't they be? What are the odds that we're going to line up exactly that we develop the same time? Not. They're 9 billion years ahead, somewhere, something probably advanced.

Speaker 1 So they would have a technology to do something like transverse the space to get here, which someday for us will probably be nothing to them. But it's looking through our current lens.

Speaker 1 And I don't like us to be so limited by that. I feel like...

Speaker 1 The more you're dug your heels in on this is how it is, you can't get to London in under 30 days,

Speaker 1 Your view will become archaic one day because we're going to get the steamboat technology and then they could do it in two weeks. Then we got motorboat technology.
We could do it in five days.

Speaker 1 Now we have the Concorde Jet does it in three hours. So

Speaker 1 careful when you dig in your heels about, oh, no, you can't do that. Well, just give it some time for technology to develop and we will probably be able to do that.

Speaker 1 So I feel it's very limited and disingenuous to dig your heels in on, oh, you can't get there from here, or you can't do this, or you can't do that. Just wait for technology.
And guess what?

Speaker 1 We just started on AI. The AI is in its infancy.
With this tool, imagine what we could develop over the years.

Speaker 2 Yeah, AI is going to be a game changer for humanity.

Speaker 1 Absolutely. It's going to change everything.
I think another view I have is that,

Speaker 1 you know, we always see things through our human lens, of course. And

Speaker 1 AI is how we're going to explore the universe. We're already NASA's talking about they're going to send AI probes out into the universe.
Well, that makes sense. They don't eat.

Speaker 1 They don't sleep. They work 24-7.
They don't get sick. They don't die.

Speaker 1 So if it takes, you know,

Speaker 1 40 years to get there, so what? It's a machine. Why would another civilization not send AI as well?

Speaker 1 That's what I would think. Why would they send a biological being? Most likely they would send an artificial intelligence, something like that, that's a probe.

Speaker 1 So if they send that to our planet, we're not going to understand what that's saying. So we're going to have to use AI to decipher what message they're giving to us.

Speaker 1 So in reality, our first contact with an alien life form is most likely going to be artificial intelligence to some form of artificial intelligence. Wow.
Doesn't that make sense? It would, yeah.

Speaker 2 Do you think that's happened yet?

Speaker 1 Well, I don't think that's happened yet because we don't have any accounts of that. And AI, we are just starting, man.
We are literally on the doorsteps of just starting.

Speaker 1 We haven't even reached the singularity yet. Once we start getting there and going beyond, it's going to be more.
The alien accounts we do have are much more in the

Speaker 1 spiritual realm, ethereal realms, where you have these accounts of people claiming to wake up and have a first-hand experience with a being.

Speaker 2 Right, like abduction.

Speaker 1 Abduction, like a Whitley Strieber communion event where he wakes up and there's a being in the room with him.

Speaker 1 So it's been already,

Speaker 1 if this is all real, they've had face-to-face interaction with non-human intelligences, as they say. So

Speaker 1 we have a lot of people that make this claim. I don't think they're all lying.
I don't think they're all doing a hoax. People aren't trying to make money on that.

Speaker 1 Even I've heard that already about the telepathy tapes.

Speaker 1 And I find it very upsetting to me because

Speaker 1 if you have a child with severe autism that they can't even communicate with you,

Speaker 1 you're struggling. It is a brutal existence to try to teach that child to eat or use their hands or anything like that.

Speaker 1 You're not hoaxing people for a joke.

Speaker 2 Yeah, there's no benefit to that.

Speaker 1 There's no benefit. You've got enough problems.

Speaker 1 So I think it's very unfair to even make that claim. What's going on or how they're doing it, we don't know yet.
But something more is happening there. It's not a hoax.
It's not a scam.

Speaker 1 It's not a magic trick. I'll say that.

Speaker 2 It's very interesting because autism rates are skyrocketing too. So I don't know if there's a correlation with those two things happening.

Speaker 1 It is incredible. She showed us a chart.

Speaker 1 Have you ever seen the difference? It's like, again, I don't know the exact numbers, so don't quote me, but if it's a quick Google, like 50 years ago, it was like one in 100,000 or something.

Speaker 1 And then it was 1 in 50,000. Now it's like 1 in 300.
Like it is literally exponential.

Speaker 1 Why is that? That's kind of what she started getting involved in: is why are autism rates increasing so rapidly? Is it the pollution?

Speaker 1 Is it our, you know, all the stuff we have in the air with the phones and everything? We don't know. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And at this current rate, that means we could all be communicating with telepathy in like 100 years.

Speaker 1 I mean, there you go. That could be the thing.
I hope we don't all become nonverbal.

Speaker 1 Although a lot of people I wish would become nonverbal, but that's, we don't have time to go into that, Jamie. I'm going to leave that out.

Speaker 2 Oh, man. So with the CE5 protocols, is that related to this, the stuff too?

Speaker 1 It is. It is a form.
People, this, this one, I struggle with, I'll be honest.

Speaker 1 A lot of people believe that CE5, what that is, is

Speaker 1 we had close encounters of the third kind. This was a system that

Speaker 1 J. Allen Hyneck, excuse me, Jay Alan Hynek came up with.
Either it's a sighting, you just saw a light in the sky.

Speaker 1 Close encounter of a third kind was when you saw a being. So Whitley Straeber's thing we described was a CE5, a CE3.

Speaker 1 CE5

Speaker 1 is human-initiated contact. So there are people that believe if you go out into the nature and you have other people with you and you guys all focus on calling in these things.

Speaker 1 And this is what Jake Barber said to Ross, kind of where he lost me, but he claims that they were able to telepathically call in these ships.

Speaker 1 And so there's a whole school of of thought that thinks that either these craft have some sort of consciousness level or we're able

Speaker 1 to tap into

Speaker 1 speaking with them, contacting them. So people think you can call these ships in

Speaker 1 and they'll come and they'll appear and they claim to have seen it.

Speaker 2 I've seen Greer talk about this and Bledsoe too, right?

Speaker 1 Chris Bledsoe is absolutely, he's going to do it live on

Speaker 1 Sunday night. He's going to do a live CE5 at Contact in the Desert.

Speaker 2 So would that change your opinion on it?

Speaker 1 If you actually I will go out there. I never usually go because I just don't find that very interesting.

Speaker 1 I am really curious because Chris Bledsoe is one of the strongest people that we hear about all the time who has this ability. He's had a lot of sightings on his property.
He has an incredible case.

Speaker 1 He has tons of hours of video footage.

Speaker 1 So he's got something to back it up. And he's been out there a long time.

Speaker 1 So I'm very, very curious to see if he can do it and if we do see something that'll be pretty interesting you guys are doing a lot of cool stuff at this event i can't wait it's it's unbelievable we're we're we're putting it together and we're excited about it you know there's just so many different elements to this um

Speaker 1 you know unprecedented stuff chris blutzo doing a ce5 with a group of people that all are in that mindset That's supposed to be a big part of it, you know, that you're consciously positive about it.

Speaker 1 That comes up with the telepathy tapes as well, that sometimes if you come in with like a negative energy or whatever, or you're like Diane said she was around some of these children.

Speaker 1 And if somebody else came in and they like didn't, weren't receptive to them, or it would bother because they were very sensitive. They could feel that.

Speaker 1 And they welcomed her in because they could tell she was very genuine. I'm here to help you.
I want to work with you. I want to discover how this is done.

Speaker 1 And it's real funny. She told me one of the first ones she met, the first children that she met like this, she said that he didn't want anything to do with her.
And

Speaker 1 the way they communicate is typically they type on a computer or they point to a letter and then they spell words. And he didn't want anything to do with her.

Speaker 1 And she said, well, I just want to see if this is real.

Speaker 1 And he said, well, I already know it's real. I do it every day.
And she's like, I know you do it every day, but

Speaker 1 I don't, I can't do that. So I want to see you do it so that I can discover that this is real.
And he thought about it and he goes, okay, you can stay.

Speaker 1 And then she was, he was okay with her because he knew she was coming from a genuine place.

Speaker 1 And that seems to be an important thread through a lot of this, through a lot of psionics, through the telepathy, even CE5s. They say you want to be in that headspace, that kind of thing.

Speaker 1 You know, these claims have been going on for a long, long time. I mean, there's all kinds of beings people have visited throughout the years.

Speaker 1 You know, you heard of like the djinn djinn that became the genie. There's that kind of thing.
I mean, this has been going on an awfully long time.

Speaker 1 So it makes me feel like there must be something to it.

Speaker 1 I have no idea what it could be, but

Speaker 1 there's enough evidence and enough accounts here that something is happening.

Speaker 1 I certainly think it all warrants more scientific study. And I love seeing things like Avi Loeb and other big, respected doctors in the scientific community taking this subject seriously.

Speaker 1 Why don't we get to the bottom of it? And if we have millions of cases, you know,

Speaker 1 Cheryl Costa came out with a book, a reference book, just for 20 years and just for reported UFO cases.

Speaker 1 And we've done these surveys at Contact in the Desert and other places where we ask people, how many people have seen a UFO? And 100 hands go in the air. And then they say, how many reported it?

Speaker 1 And it's like three. Yeah.
So 97% of them don't report the UFO at all.

Speaker 1 She, she compiled 170,000 cases in just a 20-year period. Jeez.
And those are the reported cases. And if 97% of them aren't reported, you can imagine how many more.

Speaker 1 Now, granted, the lion's share of these are probably not alien.

Speaker 1 They're probably explainable, but we don't know.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 after all of this math and millions of people claiming claiming they've had an experience and millions of witnesses and all these eyewitness accounts you only need one of them

Speaker 1 if one of these people have talked to somebody from another realm then this whole thing's real

Speaker 1 you know you frame it that way and it seems to me like well it's probably likely that they're not all lying but they're not all

Speaker 1 hoaxing. They're not, most people don't want to talk about it.
Most people want to keep it very private.

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 1 I feel like there's not enough weight being placed on these witnesses, these experiencers. I feel like, why do we just dismiss that?

Speaker 1 I feel like there's not enough weight being placed on experts like Avi Loeb, who's the head of astronomy at Harvard, and John Mack, who was the head of psychiatry at Harvard.

Speaker 1 He looked into this topic because he wanted to dismiss it and prove that it was a psychological problem, that these people were having another psychological issue. It had nothing to do with UFOs.

Speaker 1 And after studying it, he came to the conclusion that none of these people that he studied had any other psychological issues. So that most likely something was happening to them.

Speaker 1 So where I struggle is a guy that's beyond reproach like John Mack, who rises to the top of academia and is the top head of psychiatry at Harvard.

Speaker 1 Why do we not believe him the minute he says, well, I studied this subject and it seems that these people aren't having another affliction. Maybe this is real.

Speaker 1 Why don't the rest of us all go, wow, this guy's really credible. He looked at it.
Let's believe him. Why? Why? Everything else he says is the greatest thing in the world because he's so smart.

Speaker 1 Then he touches this issue. Oh, no, crackpot.
He doesn't know what he's talking about. Why does that happen? I don't understand that.
And that's kind of what drew me into this.

Speaker 1 I don't know why we don't take some of these guys more seriously.

Speaker 1 I think they should get the credit that's due. Avi Loeb is this respected guy.

Speaker 1 A fun thing about Avi is I recently got to interview him and he was saying what he's looking for is

Speaker 1 trash. He wants an old UFO that they threw away or just blown through the galaxy.
If we discovered that, it would be

Speaker 1 light years ahead of us. to find an object like that, even though it's trash to them.

Speaker 1 So that would be pretty exciting to do.

Speaker 1 And we have new technologies coming out that are going to, going to enable us to do that. There's something called the,

Speaker 1 and this name is fantastic. It's called the ALT, the Extra Large Telescope.
They're building an extra large telescope in Chile that's going to vastly increase our ability to scan the sky. Really?

Speaker 1 So we think we're going to be able to see a lot more of these things.

Speaker 1 Just like

Speaker 1 these other technologies that we talked about, the ships going across, we talked about that. Oh, and then we got to the planet thing where,

Speaker 1 so 100 years ago, we thought there was just one galaxy. Now we know there's 2 trillion.
Do you know that 33 years ago, the number of planets that mainstream consensus science 100% believed was zero?

Speaker 1 That there were no other planets anywhere in the universe. outside of our solar system.
That was the consensus reality. Wow.
And this wasn't a thousand years ago. This was 33 years ago.

Speaker 1 33 years ago, that's what we thought. And then they discovered one.
Then they discovered two. Then they got up to eight.
Then they started running the math.

Speaker 1 And then they started through better telescopes and better technology. They realized right now, the belief is that for every star that we can see,

Speaker 1 1.6 planets surround that.

Speaker 1 So more than one for every star. So when you start talking about this math, Sean, it's ridiculous.
In our

Speaker 1 little Milky Way galaxy, the one, this that used to be the universe, but it's our little Milky Way galaxy, we approximate around 200 billion stars. Jeez.

Speaker 1 That is a lot. Now you add 1.6

Speaker 1 for every star, there's that many planets. So you're looking at 300, over.
300 billion planets. That's in our galaxy.
300 billion in our galaxy.

Speaker 1 60 billion are in a habitable zone, which is what we believe life could exist, our kind of life. Now, of course, there could be life that's not like us.
So that could be a larger number.

Speaker 1 But you have this 300 billion planets in ours.

Speaker 1 Now there's 2 trillion. So it's 2 trillion times 300 billion.

Speaker 1 And that's how many legitimate planets that we believe exist now. And if anything, that number will go up.
It will not go down.

Speaker 1 So if you run that math, you've got to start thinking that, geez, and considering that they're 9 billion years ahead of us,

Speaker 1 somebody evolved, some form of life evolved somewhere, somebody's scanning the galaxy. It's hard to believe that that much is going on and they're not evolving.

Speaker 1 It's more likely that many have evolved and been destroyed and are gone.

Speaker 1 You know, we forget how not only is AI in its infancy and art technology in its infancy,

Speaker 1 we as modern humans are in our infancy on this planet. Our planet's 4.5 billion years out.
So let's say this whole thing here is the calendar.

Speaker 1 4.5 billion years ago, we didn't even appear to 200,000 years ago. So it's at the very edge.
So like they said, I think on a calendar, we appear at like December 31st at like 10 to midnight.

Speaker 1 That's crazy. Like at the very end, that's the first modern human appeared there.
So we're just in our infancy. So the way I look at this is given that math, there are so many other possible

Speaker 1 life forms existing in so many other places that inevitably something's out there, most likely coming here.

Speaker 1 So I think we need to take it seriously, put some scientific resource behind it, and examine this.

Speaker 1 And I love that these new tools are coming on that are going to give us the opportunity to explore the skies more.

Speaker 2 So that being said, when you see guys like Elon Musk saying he doesn't believe in aliens, does that surprise you?

Speaker 1 It does. It really does, because a guy like Avi Lowe would argue with him.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I feel like that's not being genuine.

Speaker 1 I don't think that that's necessarily being fair. And I wonder how hard he's looked at this topic.
This is one of those topics, like many others, where The more you know, the more there is to know.

Speaker 1 When you get into this onion that is the UFO world, I think most people just have a cursory understanding of it.

Speaker 1 But the more you get involved in it, if you just study one thing, like if you just studied Roswell and you read the Don Schmidt books about all the people that they've interviewed and all the evidence that surrounds it, it's a pretty compelling case.

Speaker 1 That's just one famous case.

Speaker 1 You start looking into more and more,

Speaker 1 and pretty soon you start having this picture that something clearly is going on.

Speaker 1 I'm certainly leaning that way, and I've been very skeptical about this and very objective.

Speaker 1 And I try to be very rational both on our podcast beyond contact and with contact in the desert we try to keep a very neutral academic scientific approach to this but man there's a lot of stuff out there that really makes you start thinking that

Speaker 2 something could be happening yeah well that's needed because i think you could go too extreme with the beliefs too Oh, oftentimes.

Speaker 1 Most of the things I hear immediately, I think, too extreme for me. Not saying it's impossible, but I'm saying that it's very remote to me.

Speaker 1 On the other hand, there are other things that feel like, ah, that could happen.

Speaker 1 You know, people have like one case, they had one experience.

Speaker 1 Why not?

Speaker 2 Makes sense. Yeah.
Last topic, 1900, Lord Kelvin. What's that about?

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah, that's a good example of what we were talking about earlier. Do you know who that guy is, Lord Kelvin? He was like the head of

Speaker 1 physics in the year 1900. And he came out and made this statement that

Speaker 1 science has now discovered all there is to know. The only thing left is going to be developing the ability to measure more precisely.

Speaker 1 Isn't that silly? Because look at how far we've come since 1900. But that just shows the hubris of science and how they think, well, this is all we can do.

Speaker 1 Well, we used to think that, oh, we can get to Europe in a month. That's amazing.

Speaker 1 Now we do it in three hours. And 200 years from now, I guarantee we get there faster.
Yeah. I love thinking like that, actually.

Speaker 1 So I think it's important not to just dismiss these things and dig in to these positions because inevitably your view is going to become archaic.

Speaker 1 Just like Lord Kelvin, this respected physicist, he said that, that sounds silly today.

Speaker 1 They didn't have iPhones. They didn't have camera.
They didn't have any of this. And he said, that's what we've discovered all we can.

Speaker 1 That's ridiculous.

Speaker 2 Yeah, we got brain chips coming next.

Speaker 1 Well, that's already happening. Neuralink is already happening.
They have people with these in the brain who can control the internet with their mind. That's science fiction just a few years ago.

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 1 I'm fascinated to see what's coming. I think that being on the verge of AI just exploding is going to be really exciting.
Absolutely.

Speaker 2 Captain Ron, where can people find you, your events, and your podcasts?

Speaker 1 Everything's at contactinthedesert.com. That's the best place to go.

Speaker 1 We have a blog on there called The Captain's Blog where we talk about these issues and all of our speakers, everything that we're doing at Contact in the Desert is on there.

Speaker 1 And our podcast, Beyond Contact, every week we talk about these kinds of things.

Speaker 2 So, what's the date of the upcoming conference?

Speaker 1 The conference is going to be May 29th through June 2nd, and we're going to give all your listeners 10% off.

Speaker 1 So you can go contactinthedesert.com to buy tickets, and it's Sean 10, S-E-A-N-10, 10% off Contact in the Desert.

Speaker 2 We'll link it in the video below, guys. Check it out.
See you next time.