Dissecting Tuchel’s England squad and transfer talk – Football Weekly Extra podcast

This is the Guardian.

Hello, and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly football that just keeps on coming.

England gears up for Andorra, Senegal, and hopefully the World Cup by training in heated, tense bit gram football.

It could be the future.

Cristiano Ronaldo scores the winner for Portugal, a sentence you could say any time over the past 20 years or so, but it happened again last night in the Nations League semi-final in Germany.

His 137th goal for his country.

We've certainly never written him off on this podcast.

We'll look ahead to the other home nations, key qualifiers for Australia, and Chelotti's start in Brazil and beyond.

There's transfer stuff, Dilap to Chelsea confirmed, Liverpool closing on Kirkis, manager staff in Zagu leaves into Carrick sacked by Middlesbrough and Russell Martin to Rangers.

Paul Watson has a new documentary.

We'll talk about it with him.

And you've actually shown interest in the idea of Football Football Weekly or Football Weekly Weekly.

Baz was good yesterday, wasn't he, Baz?

Feels like something the world could do without.

All that, plus your questions.

And that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

On the panel today, Barry Glendenning, hello.

Hi, Max.

From the Excellent Sweeper podcast, Paul Watson, hello.

Hello.

And hashtag blessed.

Dan Bardell is here.

Blessed to be here.

Thank you, Max.

Ted says, what's the point of all this?

Come on, Ted.

It'll be all right.

Two games for England then.

We'll start with them.

A World Cup qualifier against Andorra on Saturday.

A friendly against Senegal on Tuesday.

Eight players who were included in Thomas Tuchel's first squad have been left out, including Phil Foden, Tino Livramento, Jared Bowen, Dominic Solanke, Mark Gay and Marcus Rashford both miss out to injury.

Trent Alexander Arnold and Bakayo Saka are in.

They were injured last time.

Ollie Watkins, Connor Gallagher, Noni Madweke as well.

Trava Chellabar gets his first call-up.

And perhaps the biggest talking point is the inclusion of Ivan Tony.

He scored 23 goals in 30 games for Al-Ali in the Saudi pro league.

Dan, I come to you.

How do you feel about this England squad and these football matches?

Fine.

It's all fine, isn't it?

I know Paul really likes the lower echelons of international football.

Feels like England have played Andorra about a thousand times in the last two years.

Yeah, I'll watch it.

Obviously, it's football, so I'm going to watch it.

England will undoubtedly

win this qualifier.

I'm just, just, yeah,

I like the squad.

I like what Tuchel's done.

Obviously, there's question marks over a couple of things.

I think Ivan Tony's interview could have been a little bit more interesting than it actually was with him talking about the quality of the Saudi Pro League and him saying you need to taste it to know what it's about, but then not really actually going into any detail about what the Saudi Pro League is about.

So he gets his chance, which I think just shows that Tuchel is very much focused on

the World Cup, the here and now, and players that he thinks can make an instant impact impact rather than blooding players.

What's the Andorra vibe, Paul?

Have we played them a thousand times?

What can we hope for?

As I agree, it feels like we have.

No, we haven't.

I know that I'm kind of here as the underdog representative to say, you know, take them seriously.

You know, we should be scared of Andorra.

It's hard to do that.

So one stat I dug out, which I think is amazing, is their coach, Coldo Alvarez, has been in charge since 2010, and it took him seven years to get his first win.

So I think that's patient, isn't it, really, from the Federation.

He then went on a run.

The Phonins, the Phonins, they were ignoring the Phonins on, you know, Talk Sport Andorra, weren't they?

He's got to go.

Give him another five years.

It'll be fine.

Well, he went on a run of 12 years after that without a point in an official qualifier.

So again, I think there's a lot of patience there.

Their captain is 42, Mark Pujol.

He's 42 years old.

He's sort of imitating, do you remember Ildefons Lehmer, the legend that was Ildefonz Lehmer, who played for Andorra for basically forever?

He played in four different decades.

He was their top scorer as a defender and also their CAPS record holder.

So this guy,

Mark Pujo, has sort of stepped out of the shadow of him now and is sort of doing the same thing, still going at 42.

But genuinely, this is a team that is largely from the Spanish fourth tier.

So,

you know, the perspective there is like, yeah, it's going to look a lot like England playing against a fourth tier side in the English system.

It's It's not going to be massively pretty.

They're going to be very happy to keep the score down.

And I'd expect it to be the usual three, four, possibly five, depending on when the first goal comes.

That sort of nil-nil at half-time angst and then suddenly they're two later.

Yeah.

Barry, what do you think about Tony's inclusion?

Like, I mean,

I suspect you don't know enough about the Saudi pro league, not saying I do, to have a strong view on whether he's included.

I mean, Tuchel made the point that other sides pick players.

I saw Ruben Nevis start ahead of Vitinia for Portugal last night.

You know, Ronaldo did score the winner.

We'll get to it.

England are playing a ski resort.

You could pick any 11 English professional footballers and they would probably beat Andorra.

You could probably pick a team from the National League that would beat Andorra.

So, in that regard, it doesn't matter whether Ivan Tony's in the squad or not.

I have this personal theory that Thomas Tuchel

likes just to troll the football press, the journalists.

He knows

I am professionally obliged to take some sort of interest in this game.

If I wasn't, I wouldn't have any interest in it because England will steamroll Randora in the very, very unlikely event that they somehow contrive to draw or lose.

It won't really matter.

Other journalists obviously have the same professional obligation to take an interest, but some of them seem seem really exercised about the inclusion of people like Ivan Toney or Jordan Henderson.

And I'm not really sure why, because

it's Andorra.

I suppose the point being is, you know, you are picking players who, you know, you are looking ahead to the World Cup.

He's not going to select someone who doesn't think he has any chance of getting to the World Cup, right?

That's how I view, say, the Henderson.

Well, he might.

Well, he might, but that would be odd, wouldn't it?

Why would he be doing that?

I mean, why would you you pick Jordan Henderson now?

Just for vibes?

Maybe he thinks Jordan Henderson adds something of value to the environment around the training camp.

I don't know.

But foreign managers are always...

They find it incredibly weird how seriously,

say, the English media take...

the inclusion of certain players in squads because you bring whatever it is, 25, 26, 28 players, and most of them, or a sizable number of them, never get on the pitch.

So it doesn't really matter who you bring.

And

you could have Jordan Henderson and Ivan Toney in every single England squad between now and however far they get in the World Cup, and they might not play.

It doesn't matter.

And trying to pretend it does is, yeah, I mean, you're welcome to do it, but it doesn't matter.

Harry's made me less interested than I normally was, which I didn't think was possible.

You know, they should be playing this in Andorra as well.

This is a, for me, this is a real shame.

They're playing this in Spain.

It's at Espanol Stadium.

And actually, Andorra's got this nice, shiny new stadium at NCamp, which they're using for Andorra, the club team who play in the Spanish system.

But it doesn't seem like it's been registered in time for this.

So they've been told they've got to send it to Spain.

I just feel like the only way these games could have any interest is you put them in Andorra, you make it as uncomfortable as possible.

You know, you literally play it in a ski resort.

Well, not on a mountain, like on a mountain, on a sort of 45-degree mountain.

If I was Andorra, I would, yeah, I'd have a pitch like that, like the old Hewish Park.

I'm genuinely, I would, I'd have a pitch like that that only they could play on.

That's the way.

Or one of these South American sides who play at altitudes so high that the other team have to have oxygen canisters.

But with all this going on in Espanol Stadium, I feel like it's taken the romance out of this.

I'm sorry, I'm curious to know, Max, do you honestly think it makes a a difference whether Ivan Tony and Jorah Henderson are in this squad or not?

Well, I suppose the argument would be, right, not in this squad, but I think you are picking a squad.

You're picking players you want to look at with the World Cup in mind, right, and qualification in mind.

And actually, when you do get down to the squad, what do you need?

You need options off the bench that can make a big difference.

You pretty much know who you're starting 11.

give or take two or three players will be and then presumably you pick game-changing players that can come off the bench and one of the criticisms of Southgate was that he didn't use the bench well enough or whatever.

I mean, interestingly, Tony did come on and change, I think, one game in the Euros, if not two.

So, yes, I think it matters because you want to get the best balance of your squad.

You don't necessarily want to pick the best players.

We've been through that a million times, but you want to have a balance in the squad.

I think it's interesting that Henderson and Dan Byrne are there,

but Tuchel knows much more about it than I do.

And maybe, you know, atmosphere in a squad is really, really important.

And maybe they will make a huge difference.

But

I mean, I don't totally disagree with you in that.

I don't think it makes it's not going to change the world, especially for this game.

I think you're right.

Centre-backs is probably one of the most interesting things about this England squad, but we'll probably learn very little because they're playing Andorra a lot.

No one's jumping out and taking that centre-back spot for me.

I think both of those spots are open at the moment.

Looking at the squad, it'd probably be Conservan and Colwell, and I think perhaps they played together in the last round of international fixtures.

But, you know, if you're trying to get a defence together, kind of playing Andorra isn't the way that you kind of mould that defence and see what people are about because they're going to have absolutely nothing to do.

They haven't scored since October, and that was against San Marino.

So, I think, yeah, the defense can have a pretty quiet day.

It's our job to our job isn't to sell the game, it's fine.

I think it's fine.

I think we all know this.

You know, we'll watch it and it will it won't gird our loins.

I mean, the more interesting game England are playing in this

break is the the friendly against Senegal.

I think it's at the city ground on Tuesday.

That could be a decent game to watch if their players are bothered to put in a bit of effort.

And I would totally excuse them if they aren't.

But

yeah, that could be good.

England are using heated tents as part of training to replicate the conditions they could experience at the World Cup in USA, Canada and Mexico.

Moonlight Hanger says, Do you think this heated tents business was a mix-up

over a need for training sessions to be intense?

thank you so much um

we should be playing the game in a heated tent that would that would definitely make it more interesting i mean it's i mean obviously these aren't the tents that is everyone in everyone's mind they are thinking of a tent like a two-man scout camp tent aren't they that's what everyone there's nobody listening going you know like a big like well sort of like the beckham dome or whatever oh they just shove loads of heat it doesn't sound environmentally that friendly maybe that's why tony and henderson are they they're they have their badges for putting up tents.

They hammer a mean thing.

Well, acclimatized as well.

It's probably quite hot in Saudi some of the time playing football.

So that might be it.

Anyway, look, we've tried our best there with England.

Let's see what happens.

We'll talk about it on Monday.

Before we do the other home nations, the Nation League semi-final was a pretty good game.

Germany won Portugal too.

Ronaldo scoring the winner.

Put on a plate by Nuno Mendez.

It's 137th international goal.

I mean, then there is Paul.

We've written him off on this podcast.

And,

you know, he's an interesting human being.

I don't know if that's a way of putting it.

But in a pure footballing sense, this is the highest level.

You know, this is Germany away and he is still there doing the business.

It is frankly ridiculous.

Yeah, it is.

And after the Euro, the fact that Roberto Martinez is still there and Cristiano Ronaldo is still there just feels bizarre.

Like how they survived that.

They must have just, I mean, Roberto Martinez must have just done that thing where you can't see me if you can't, you can't find me if you can't see me, right?

He must have just hidden because he looked like a dead man walking, right?

And part of that was Cristiano Ronaldo and this inability to leave him out.

It seemed like he was sort of another of these managers who felt like in some way to leave Ronaldo out would leave him too vulnerable.

So he kept playing him.

Can you remind me what happened with Portugal?

I mean, forgive me for forgetting.

Yeah, they went out in a penalty shootout against France in the quarters in a 0-0 draw.

But genuinely, throughout the competition, it just felt like they were playing with a handbrake on.

And to some extent, the handbrake was the fact they had Ronaldo in there and the way they were playing with that.

And it just genuinely felt like they, you know, Martinez was a dead man walking, and that would probably be the end of Ronaldo at that level.

So, yeah, it's a fairly phenomenal turnaround, to be fair to both of them.

Yeah, and to still be starting, I presumed he would have come off the bench.

I mean, the other goals in this game, Barry, were brilliant, weren't they?

I mean, the little dink pass from Kimmich to Wurtz, and then Conseil Sal's goal for Portugal was something else.

Yeah, I mean, I do think you're overstating Ronaldo's contribution to this game, Mike, just because his goal was a tap in.

And I am famous for saying I could score various goals professionals footballers have scored.

I'm quite confident I could have scored this goal.

It wasn't a tap in.

He wasn't six yards out.

It was a decent.

Yeah.

I mean, it was a gimmicky tap in, but it wasn't a tap in.

I'd like to see you have a go at it, Barry.

I think it was a tap in.

I think it was a tap in, but you've got to be in the position, Barry.

That's the point for a tap in.

Right, okay, yeah.

Have I had a pre-season last week?

You have.

You've done your half marathon.

You've had a full preseason.

Yeah, the other two goals were superb.

Yeah, Joshua Kimmich with this lovely, and I think it was his 100th cap for Germany.

Lovely scoop over the top

and a very precise Florian Vertz header, just a kind of curled header, just inside the far ball.

Delightful Liverpool fans will have been excited to see that.

And then

Francesco Conchisao,

his goal was the pick of the three, I think.

Advance

on the penalty area from the right and then just wellied the ball

into the far corner from about 25 yards.

That was a beauty.

And Diogo Costre in the Portuguese goal, he made some big saves.

And Andre

Terstegen pulled off a superb double save to keep the score down for Germany right at the end.

So, yeah, that was a decent game.

I wonder about Ronaldo.

Who is he keeping out of the side?

I meant to check this so.

Leal didn't even get off the bench.

Ramos.

Yeah, but you would.

Felix, there was.

It's Gonzalo Ramos, isn't it?

It's Gonzalo Ramos, who did score a hat-trick in something.

Was it the World Cup in Qatar?

And then we were all all like okay this is it Ronaldo is done and I suppose you're right there's not like a natural amazing number nine but Dan as you say Liao didn't get didn't get off the bench Paolini came on the 90th minute you know if we're looking ahead to the World Cup we will say this against Portugal they won't win the World Cup but they have a really good squad oh the the midfield the play I mean obviously they've got the the PSG midfield have a name which which helps there's they're fantastic players although John Neves played at played a right back last night kind of inverting and taking control of midfield which actually worked quite well.

And then they could bring Somedo on in the second half to attack the right flank.

I mean, Ronaldo is going to start up front for Portugal in the World Cup.

Obviously, he's got the contract situation with his club team at the moment, but wherever he goes, whatever he does, as long as Martinez is there, I think Ronaldo will start up front in the World Cup because it seems that in Martinez, they've just got the perfect manager to indulge.

Ronaldo, I remember after a game in the Euros, the way he was speaking about Ronaldo, and he barely touched the board.

I don't think he did anything in that game.

Yet Martinez came out after the game and waxed lyrical about what he was offering.

Wouldn't surprise me if Ronaldo has a say, and this is pure speculation on my behalf, if Ronaldo has a say with the Portuguese FA on who the manager is.

And if he likes Martinez, that means Martinez stays on because I was the same as Paul after the World Cup.

I thought, oh, they were so stodgy, they were so tedious, surely, surely he's got to go.

And I think that's been the problem with Portugal in a lot of tournaments.

You watch them, you see the players that they've got, but because Ronaldo is on the pitch, it all doesn't feel right, which seems a weird thing to say about someone who's obviously achieved so much, but he's older than me.

Yeah, we're talking about Andorra playing the 42-year-old.

Ronaldo's older than me, and I'm not suggesting I can do the things that Ronaldo can do.

I'm not Barry Glenn Denning here, but

he is getting old.

Yeah, it's interesting.

Who knows where he's going to be playing?

I've just written a column about the Infantino Panini sticker.

So I watched the whole of I Show Speed and Infantino, which was mainly iShow Speed

trying to show Gianni Infantino things that iShow Speed has done, singing songs or playing football, not particularly well, but Gianni was just trying to, you know, force the Club World Cup down everyone's throats and kept talking about whether Ronaldo would be playing in it.

It could happen.

So, yeah, I mean,

it would not be a surprise if he signs a short-term deal with somebody who happens to be at the Club World Cup.

I unfortunately watched, I watched iShow Speed at Wembley, unfortunately, earlier on in the year because I was forced to go to the side men charity game.

You know, they raise a lot of money for charity.

Obviously, that's great.

Osho Speed was actually more selfish than Ronaldo.

It's interesting.

I think he shows Yanni all the clips of playing.

And, you know, he has incredible pace.

Oh, he's rapid.

I think it's.

You'd have expected that, to be fair.

Yeah, you would expect that.

Yeah.

But not, you know, like a bit like Usain Bolt when he went to Central Coast Mariners, you know, the first touch of a trampoline.

Anyway, good luck to him.

He seems to be very successful.

It was an interesting half hour of my life, I will say.

I'm not the demographic.

That'll do for part one.

Part two, we'll do the home nations.

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Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly.

The Republic of Ireland are friendlies against Senegal on Friday night at Luxembourg on Tuesday.

Barry, thoughts?

They're friendlies.

Senegal should provide Ireland with a very stern test at the Aviva Stadium.

They've got Kaladu, Kulabali, Idrissa Gay, Ilaman India, Nicholas Jackson, Ishmael Assar, Papa Sar.

No Sadio Mane for this one.

They're all really good players.

They're all much better than anything Ireland have, really.

Hymer Helgramson.

has been massively underwhelming since taking over as Ireland manager.

I'm quite disappointed in how he's done because I was quite optimistic when he got the job.

He has expressed vocal

distaste or disinclination for travelling to England to watch games or meet players or

talk to potential recruits, which I think to me smacks of laziness, which in my opinion is kind of unforgivable when you compare it to, say, the work Craig Bellamy is putting in as Wales manager, which we'll get to.

I don't expect much from these games.

And if Ireland,

God,

you know, they don't matter.

I keep saying things don't matter, but they really don't matter.

But Ireland, good results, good performance.

Well, not even good results, just good performances would be nice to get on the board ahead of the start of the World Cup campaign.

It's interesting as a manager, as an international manager, to not really...

put it in.

You don't actually have that much to do, do you?

Like, sort of thing, if you're a club manager, I'd be quite tired, but I reckon I could manage just going to a few football matches, you know, seeing how Richard Dunn's getting on.

I mean, I could be doing him a grave injustice.

He said, look, I don't need to go and see these players.

I can watch them on my laptop on Wise Scout.

And if that's what works for him, great.

But it isn't working for him.

So maybe try and do something else.

Brentford have committed the signing of Creven Kelleher from Liverpool while we're on Ireland in a deal that could rise to £18 million.

I'd be interested to see him take the number one journey if he does from, we presume he would, from

Mark Flecken.

Well, Flecken's gone.

Well, then he probably will take it, won't he?

Where's Flecken gone?

Buyer Leave Accuser.

Oh, okay.

Well, good luck to Mark Flecken.

Thanks for keeping.

When Barry's the in the know, you know you you know you're taking your eye off the ball, don't you?

Excuse me, I think that is very unfair.

Well, I'm just I'm reflecting, Barry, on the Sergio Sergio Ramos.

Unlike Hymer Halgrimson, I keep an eye on various players and their whereabouts.

I take it all.

But yeah, I will give you the Sergio Ramos one.

You have me there.

Wales have two qualifiers.

Quite significant international break for them then.

Home to Liechtenstein Friday night, away to Belgium on Monday

in what feels like the most frequent fixture in international football.

Is it, Paul, that we go to, you know, check the stats?

Is it more frequent than England, Andorra?

It feels like

Ireland-Denmark is Ireland-Denmark is every.

I mean, I can't believe that's not happening this weekend.

They are always playing each other.

Yeah, no, I feel like they do play an awful lot against Belgium, don't they?

That's one that I feel is always going on constantly.

Like in some parallel universe, that match is just constantly being played, and we just have to go over to it every now and again and report on it.

Well, interestingly, Northern Ireland have Denmark this weekend.

You mentioned Craig Bellamy there, Baz.

You've done your work.

You did say before the pod, I I can do the home nations, so do them.

Well, if anyone else wants to do them, they're more than welcome to chip in.

But yeah, Craig Bellamy, I'm really interested and sort of invested in his journey as a manager because he seems to have really chilled out and become more mellow than he was as a player, while not being particularly chilled out or mellow at all.

Training sessions are reported to be very intense.

When he got the job, he moved moved to Cardiff and was incredibly surprised to learn that he's the first Welsh manager since John Toshak to be based in Wales because he thought, well, where else would you be based if you're the Wales manager?

But that hasn't always been the attitude.

Most of them lived at Heider Helgrenson's house.

That's where they've all been previously.

Does a lot of, you know, goes, watches underage games, goes around clubs, meeting players,

having chats with them.

He, while the Premier League, because most of his players are, or

an awful lot of his players play in the Football League, while the Premier League was winding down and they were all off, he took them on a

training camp to Spain to keep them ticking over.

He had a nice touch in that, you know, that team New Saints or Total Network Solutions, as they used to be known or officially known.

I think their goalkeeper, Connor Roberts, announced his retirement at the end of the season,

citing mental health issues because his father was struggling to deal with the fact that his dad had taken his own life.

Bellamy invited him along on the training camp as kind of

just a gesture and

an act of appreciation for all the work Roberts has done in Welsh football.

So Wales have played eight without defeat under Bellamy.

They should beat Lichtenstein at home on Friday Friday and then Belgium away on Monday.

That's a big game for them.

But he is reported to be incredibly meticulous in his preparation.

I think he's going to be a very good manager.

I've read somewhere he's lit a fire under Welsh football, which had started to stagnate under in the

last days of Robert Page.

Yeah, incredibly impressive.

And Belgium, are they still the golden?

Is it still golden, that generation?

What happens to gold?

Does gold rust?

And where are we at with the Belgians?

We'll find out on Monday.

One rule Bellamy has introduced to

the Welsh squad is you're not allowed to swap jerseys with opposition players because the thinking being you've worked so hard to get this shirt.

Why would you give it away?

I mean, it's a bit Brailsford, but I like it.

But if Brailsford brought it in, you probably wouldn't like it, would you?

Well, Brailsford's just got his cards from

the

who could possibly have foreseen that coming?

Scotland had two friendlies, Iceland on Friday night, Lichtenstein on Monday.

You got a quick minute on this, Barry?

Yeah, Scotland, Iceland down to 74th in the world rankings.

I still remember the days in 2016 where British journalists, and I don't blame them for it, were all being sent to Reykjavik to write about how great Icelandic football was and how they've revolutionised the way international football should be played.

Yes, currently 74th in the world rankings.

Finished third in their Nations League B sector behind Wales and Turkey.

Steve Clark has introduced a lot of young players for this international break.

Seven uncapped players.

Louis Ferguson is in the squad.

He's been really impressive in Italy with Bologna.

Won the COP Italia this year, but he hasn't really made his mark in a Scotland shirt yet for various reasons.

And

Scotland have a bit of a problem at goalkeeper.

Craig Gordon is injured and and he's also 42, so you'd imagine his days as Scotland keeper are numbered.

Angus Gunn doesn't have a club, he's just been released by Norwich.

And

the last time he got a chance in a Scotland shirt, he didn't cover himself in glory.

And the other two keepers are Robbie McCrory from Kilmarnock and Kieran Slicker, who's at Ipswich.

So they don't have a cap between them.

So Clark needs to sort out.

Um, what about Anthony Naemi?

That's quite a good gag.

Clearly, it's gone completely flat.

I understood the gag, but I'm not sure it was as good as you.

I think someone will, I think someone will like it.

I'll play you a clip later, Barry, and maybe it'll mean something to you.

Oh, I know the this is the talk sport.

Yeah, I thought it was quite a bit.

Wasn't that to do with his age rather than?

Well, no, the guy rang up saying,

Why don't they pick Anti Naimi?

And the guy went, He's finished.

And he goes, He's not finished, he's 28.

Obviously, he's now 53, so slightly different.

Okay, that was a good question.

Thank you so much.

All the best ones have to be explained and then just acknowledged.

Absolutely.

Northern Ireland have friendlies against Denmark and Iceland.

Quite a scandy break for them.

Sean says, Max, you refer to the socceroos as we in an A-league show you did recently.

Where do your loyalties lie?

That's very interesting.

I mean, obviously, with cricket, I can't stand them.

But with the Sockaroos, I definitely want them to qualify.

And like, interestingly, Paul, by the time people listen to this, they will have probably played their game against Japan, but they haven't played it yet.

And that's a massive game for them, isn't it?

It is.

And it isn't.

It is in that they could secure qualification, but the reality is they're almost certainly going to do that at some point, as I see it.

Like, I think we discussed before the system in AFC is so forgiving that, you know, you just get shot after shot after shot at it, basically.

So, you know i don't think i'm overstating it to say yeah it'd be lovely for them to do it against japan japan have already booked their place um but i'd expect them to to still give a good good performance but i just feel like australia pretty much there but yeah as we as we release this they might be there south korea pretty much on the brink too they they could book their place too just interesting paul you know and as someone who follows the smaller nations what i've noticed about being in australia is like the impact that qualification for the world cup has on nations where football isn't the main sport and momentum that it has and the sort of devastation that if they don't obviously if England don't qualify for a World Cup it's devastating but like football is fine because it's so massive so like the importance for the game in countries where you are competing against other codes like Australia and you know I suspect like

New Zealand or South Africa, whatever, those kind of countries and many others, like the impact on it is huge.

Yeah, it's actually a real pressure, isn't it?

I haven't really thought about this, but I guess australia's almost unique in having that many sports that compete against it i mean i i find australian sport completely baffling but they call every sport footy basically don't they they even call rugby league footy which makes like zero sense to me at all so i suppose australia's got almost a unique situation in there are so many sports people want to watch that if football just drops off the radar to some extent you know obviously there's going to be the hardcore fans who it doesn't drop off the radar but for a lot of people they'll just move on to watch one of the other 55 sports that australia is is excellent at.

So, yeah, I imagine they're feeling that pressure.

And they had a dreadful time during this campaign.

They've had some real ups and downs, but I do think they'll pull through.

Partly just because nobody else is particularly brilliant apart from Japan.

Saudi Arabia are not great.

They're having a bit of a bad time themselves.

They had the whole Roberto Mancini debacle going on there.

And also, as I say, this system just means you keep getting other opportunities.

Even if you don't get through immediately, you get another playoff and then another playoff.

So for the big nations, AFC is actually a really nice qualification campaign to have.

There are a lot harder ones around.

All I can remember from Australia in World Cups is Mila Yednak scoring penalties.

That's the

only thing I've ever seen Australia do in an international tournament.

Is that true?

There's the Tim Cahill volley,

which is pretty special in 2014.

I don't remember that.

But yes, hopefully, Yednak will be fit for the Socceroos next year.

Tell us, Paul, about Uzbekistan and Jordan.

Well, Uzbekistan and Jordan could reach their first World Cups.

Uzbekistan are in the strongest position.

They need just one point against the UAE

to secure their place.

And it'd be obviously a huge moment for Uzbekistan, but sort of the culmination of just a decade of really good football development there.

And we're seeing some of the fruits of that coming through.

You've got Kusunov at Man City, Shomorodov at Roma, who's the all-time top scorer for Uzbekistan.

And they actually,

won the Under-20 Asian Cup in 2023.

So they've got this generation of talent coming through in Uzbekistan, which is really exciting.

And they almost did it against Iran in the last outing.

And this time they really should book that place.

Jordan need to work a little bit harder to get their spot.

But again, they're really well placed.

There are actually about nine teams that could reach their first World Cup because of this new new system.

There are nine teams that have started well or are finishing well in their campaigns and look well placed.

And that is Jordan, Uzbekistan, Cape Verde, Curaçao, who only just started their campaign but done really well, Guatemala, Nicaragua, Suriname.

Venezuela and New Caledonia.

So what we might actually have is a new smallest nation to top Iceland, who we've been talking about at the World Cup, because Iceland only had about 400,000 people.

They were the smallest nation to reach a World Cup.

But say

New Caledonia, they have 300,000.

They would beat it.

But Curaçao only has 150,000 people.

Wow.

So as I say, very early days for Curaçao and their qualification.

CONCACAF's way behind in terms of where they've got to.

But they've had a really good start.

And

they also have Dick Advocate as their manager.

So they are, Curacao is a spirit, I believe.

And Advoca is a spirit.

So this is, that's a bit of trivia.

Has a footballing nation named after a spirit or a spirit named after it ever been managed by someone someone whose name is also a spirit?

You're right.

Wait till they get his assistant manager, Jeff Eggnog.

And

perfect blend.

Yeah.

Let's do some transfer stuff.

Chelsea confirmed Liam DeLap.

Dan, thoughts?

Yeah, I thought he did really well last season for Ipswich.

Probably tailed off a little bit towards the end, but I think it was quite well realised that he was going to be moving on.

Obviously, I think he lost his place a little bit towards the end of the season as Ipswich went for George Hurst, who they know is probably going to be there next season, but only to sign a six-year contract.

So he must be a little bit worried about his future to only sign on for six years when everyone else has got 12-year contracts at Chelsea.

But I like it as a signing.

I know a few Chelsea fans, I know that they're really, really excited.

He did damage against them last season, particularly in the game against Portman Road.

And it gives a bit of block beef up front.

And there's this kind of trend now towards teams moving towards something called a power forward.

And DeLap really fits into the air.

De Lap really fits into that mold.

And to score 12 goals for a really, really poor Ipswich switch side if he plays every week for chelsea i'd expect him to get between 15 and 20.

yeah it's great signing i think power a power forward it's exciting power forward i did a podcast on it the other day very exciting good stuff who's the best power forward uh goccares

at the moment he'd be classed as a power forward he's probably the the the main one the top one good stuff uh chelsea have paid five million pounds to not have jaden sancho Actually, you know, it's sort of a funny headline, but probably the right thing for them to do.

He's been linked with a number of Saudi clubs.

They'd also been planning to buy

another goalkeeper with a move for Mike Mannion from Milan, but they're not willing to match their £25 million valuation, which is a bit of a surprise.

Perhaps Man City have agreed a deal with AC Milan for Netherlands midfielder.

Tajani Rinders, Ait Norrie from Wolves, Ray and Cherky from Leon, also on their agenda.

So like the rebuild

is continuing apace.

Reinders, the oldest of all their new signings, including the January ones at 26.

Liverpool closing on a Milos Kirk,

adding Frimpong and Wurtz to that.

It feels like they're doing everything right.

I feel like they might win the league more easily than this year.

Yeah, I was a bit concerned about Liverpool's chances of retaining their title, but these signings...

do seem pretty astute.

I mean, everyone gets very excited about the transfer window, but landing your targets targets is half the battle.

And an awful lot of signings don't work out.

You know, just that's the way it goes.

A lot of them don't work.

I think Jonathan Norcroft had

an article in the Times last Sunday, and he reckoned, and this is, you know, proper analysis from egghead boffins, that over a third of signings, for one reason or another, do not work out.

But Liverpool don't sign too many duds, and these look pretty astute, as I say.

Yeah, and getting your business done early seems so sensible.

And why some clubs just don't do it?

It's totally baffling, I suppose.

Sorry, my Spurs hat on.

They don't know who their manager is going to be yet, or at least we don't.

So, you know, maybe they have to work that out before they try and sign some players.

Manchester United expects to open talks with Brentford over Brian and Bumo.

$60 million is the fee.

It would be a brilliant signing, as we mentioned the other day.

And as as Barry said, today, Brailsford is to reduce his role at Manchester United under a reshuffle being planned by Big Sir Jim.

Good luck in whatever your reduced role is, Dave.

I'm not sure anyone knew what his non-reduced role was, his full fat role was.

The athletic article on his

sort of departure.

The athletic is they're they pride themselves on almost forensic attention to detail.

I'm in no way having a pop at whoever wrote this article, but this seemed quite vague.

There was no real reason.

You know, is it a demotion?

Is it a sideways step?

Why is his, what was his role?

What will his new role, if anything, be?

But I suspect if he'd been doing a sterling job, he would not be having a reduced role.

The one very interesting take out from that article in The Athletic was

that he's just become a father at the age of 61.

Oh my God.

Good luck with that, David.

Wow, that is a you know, that is Herculean decision.

But he could probably afford to hire Josh Whitticom's nanny, Max.

That's probably true.

Yes, Dan.

I just want to know: has an organisation had so many reshuffles in such a short space of time before?

How many reshuffles have Ios had at Manchester United in the short time that they've been there?

Is it three already that they've had at the time?

Look, there's loads of stuff to get through, but we want to talk about Paul's documentary.

So, look, Simoni and Zaghi's left into

Allegri's the new AC Milan manager.

Quickly, Paul, Liam Manning has left you, not you personally, but left Crystal City for Norwich City.

You feel like he has.

Yeah, are you sad?

I am.

Yeah, I am.

And I think the funny thing is when a manager leaves, there's always a bit of venom from some of the fans about him.

But he did a fantastic job.

uh at Ashton Gate under very difficult circumstances in his sort of personal and professional life um And ultimately, the club, I just don't think, could back him with the kind of money he needed to finish the job.

You know, we got to the playoffs.

That was amazing.

And I think he's moved to Norwich because they've basically just got more money to throw at building him the squad he wants.

So, yeah, I don't feel any anger or ire towards him myself.

Being linked to Rob Edwards, I think would be a pretty decent choice, actually.

Now, George Elek is on the pod on Monday, so we can talk about Middlesbrough stacking Michael Carrick, financial problems at Sheffield Wednesday, and other stuff too.

Then, part three, in a second, we will talk about Paul's documentary, The Soccer Men.

Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly.

Paul, tell us all about the soccer men, the new documentary about your time managing the Micronesian island of Pompeii.

Yeah, well, I love that it's been called my documentary.

I'm in it.

I'm the idiot trying to coach a national football team that I regarded as the worst in the world back in 2009.

It's actually made by my mate, Matt, who is there as effectively my assistant coach.

But the poor guy has to keep pointing a camera at me at times when I'm sort of at my most stressed

and say, you know, why are there frogs all over the pitch?

Or why have your players all just walked off because you tried to tell them to do a very simple passing drill?

So yeah, this documentary has been a long time in the making.

This is

all about the story that my book was about up Pompeii about trying to initially having that conversation in a pub and saying could we play for San Marino and take it to its really ridiculous extreme and saying is there any country bad enough for us to play for uh which led to us inadvertently coaching uh a team on a tiny island in the pacific i think the interesting thing paul is i reckon loads of people have had that conversation in a pub and then have left the pub and gone to bed and got up and not gone and done it yeah and they're probably a lot better off than i am but no i'm i i think the thing that tipped it is and I always say this to people is we were semi-serious when we set off on this in that we were both like we didn't have a lot to do I was I was struggling to make it as a football journalist still am

and I was like you know this would be the dream right to play international football but the thing that tipped it was we went all the way down the world rankings we were thinking look there's no way we're even going to play for like Montserrat at the time they had rule fox you remember rule fox and I was like can you imagine even if I managed to naturalize which I think will be a question mark imagine me showing up on a training field with rule fox he'll find me out within five minutes so we went into non-FIFA football which we didn't know existed which is places that don't even get into FIFA's consideration and that was where we found Pompeii at the very bottom but but what turned it was we sent an email off to this decrepit looking website saying you know oh we're interested in football in your in your island on your island we didn't say we want to play for you because we thought it was scare anyone off but we genuinely never thought we'd get an email back and it was the fact that we got an email back from a guy called charles musano who said um lovely to hear from you but I'm moving to London uh so I can't really help you but do you want to meet up for a for a curry and we did we met up for a curry in Notting Hill and he looked at us and said I thought this was a prank from from my mates back home like why do you want to hear about this island and we we basically told him the truth and he said lads you know you can't go and and play for this team like it's almost impossible to get a passport there anyway even if you wanted to

but the team's basically given up after they lost 16-1 to Guam.

Do you want to go and set the team up again?

And we were like, yeah, all right.

18 months later, we were there.

That's amazing.

And like 2009, okay, so social media kind of existed.

People were poking each other on Facebook.

And I think Twitter was there.

But like, it's a very different time.

It feels like a sort of, you know, there's a lot more sort of phoning people up and emailing.

I don't know if the story would work quite as well now, or it would just be so different.

Yeah, I mean, I've noticed a difference in that I went back to the island a couple of years back and

everyone's just got their phones with Wi-Fi on them and they're just on Facebook.

Facebook's the big thing there now.

It's like running at that kind of that many years behind where we are here.

And I was like, God, in my day, there was one place on the island I could get Wi-Fi signal.

And I had to like crouch underneath this building, the telecoms building.

And some days it would just not happen.

And I'd be like, oh, there you go.

No internet today.

So it totally changed the dynamic.

We literally had to just go knock on people's doors to get them to play.

I remember when we were trying to put a league together, so that was the first thing we did.

We sat down and said, look, we've got to make a league.

And we wanted to get teams from different like community groups around the island.

And we went, there's a huge group of Mormons on the island.

So I went and cold called a Mormon hut, knocked on the door.

And the guy at the door sort of answered it.

And I explained we wanted to play football.

And he said, yeah, not really our thing.

And then at the end of the conversation, he said, have you considered letting the light of the Lord into your life?

I said, I said, yeah, but have you considered coming and playing football?

And he said, no, thanks.

And I was like, well, it's a nil-nil draw then, isn't it?

Are you the first person ever to knock on a Mormon's door?

Usually, it's the knocking on your door.

He looked terrified.

These poor lads looked absolutely terrified.

It was such a great role reversal that I was like, if you just give it a try, let the light of football in.

It's like, nah, no.

First off, I have to say, I love this, and it made me cry twice.

There's more than a

hint of dodgeball or cool runnings about it.

I don't think that's unfair to say, is it?

I mean it as a compliment.

They're two cracking films.

But this arrangement between you and

who's it, Matt, your mate,

you were very much the bad cop.

And I don't think it's unfair either to say that for quite some time, most of the players thought you were a massive twat and didn't really like.

They still do, Barry.

But you won them over.

And

you also had this guy, Joseph, who was the standout mercurial flawed genius.

who I don't want to give away any spoilers, but it would be fair to say you had a fraught relationship, but he was your standout player.

And I really love that bit.

I don't really have a question, but is there anything more you can tell us about that without giving too much away?

Oh, well, thank you.

That's really kind of you'd say that.

Basically, for me, one of the themes that comes through is like, this island just seems to reject football, right?

So everything we do.

seems to backfire like the the pitch is in a terrible state we try and make it into a better state and it somehow gets worse and like everything we do, we try and play at a different field, and we get kicked off, even though no one's ever used this field for like a decade.

And Joseph's a good example of this, so he's like our star player, and he's had a really tough life.

Him and his brother, Charles, the name's Charles, but they call him Charles.

That's how it's pronounced on the island.

They're these two kids who have basically been left to fend for themselves.

Really tough life, like quite an abusive family situation.

They've been in their whole lives.

As a result, like they're tough nuts to crack, but eventually, I sort of kind of get both of them playing Charlie's a really good goalkeeper Joseph's like the star striker he's our great hope but Joseph just will not do anything anyone tells him to do and so I have this relationship where I'm kind of pretending I'm gonna leave him out the squad if he doesn't buck up but he sort of knows at heart he's gonna call my bluff because there's no way I'm leaving out our best player and everyone kind of knows this but he goes through the motions of like quitting the team and because he quits his brother has to quit because of the island the way the island is and because his brother's like his only support in life They both quit, and it's all really like a terrible moment for us because we lost our goalkeeper and best striker.

They come back, and then, yeah,

I'm probably giving something away, but basically something happens to Joseph.

That takes it all completely beyond our control.

So it's like another great way of like how this island is.

It's like you do everything in your power, you get humbled, everything goes wrong, you think you've overcome the hurdle, and then the island just chucks something else at you that you're like, ah, there you go.

And it's just like everything you do.

You'd have planned session, you'd set it all out, You'd think, God, this is going to go great.

And then the heavens would just open and flood the entire pitch out.

And literally your cones are floating away and frogs are hopping around.

And you're like, let's just kick a ball around, lads.

That was my favourite part.

Again, I don't want to spoil it, but I really enjoyed it as well.

I found it very, very relatable.

And there was a lot in there.

And when I first started watching it, I thought, oh, this is going to be a little bit like Next Goal Winds.

But in a sense, and I really enjoyed Next Score Winds, in a sense, it was a little bit like that, but there was all these separate stories that went off in different directions from various characters characters in the film including yourself but that my favorite moment was when you were you were kind of at the end of your tether and you were picking picking your team and you were giving everyone who was playing the the blue shirt like this the sacred shirt and then if it wasn't bad enough not being in that first 11 you made them all the others wear Spurs shirts as well.

It's like that was the ultimate insult to them is that not only are you not playing, we're going to make you wear a Spur shirt for 90 minutes as well.

That is true.

And the funny thing with the shirts is, so Matt's a Spurs fan and he basically basically bought those Spurs shirts.

And you also, you'll see Bristol City shirts all over the place.

Like our goalkeeper's in a Bristol City shirt.

And so me and Matt are basically like sort of colonising the Bristol City and Spurs.

But also we wrote to every single club in England and asked for a kit because they have no kit on the island.

And a weird selection of clubs said yes, Yeoville Town, Norwich.

I'll forgive them for Liam Manning.

And so, yeah, if you go around Pompeii now, you'll sometimes just see an old guy with a Yeoville Town shirt on.

And the reason for that is because we were giving it out to one of the players.

And because of the hierarchical society, you have to give everything to an older relative.

So, like shin pads, for example, we gave out shin pads, which were totally useless.

We never realized this.

Because as soon as the players got home with them, someone older in the family would just take them and use them for like a, I don't know, like to hold something on a shelf.

Or so shin pads just dotted around the island.

Sometimes you'll just see a fisherman with shin pads on, and you'll be like, oh, that's where they ended up.

No one ever wore a pair of shin pads in my team.

How, like, when you were walking down the street, were you viewed as sort of weird outsiders or like royalty or just sort of totally random people like quite widely ignored actually like it's not an island where people um

get into other people's business too much like they probably did bind our backs but uh this name of the name of the film was the soccer men and that's what people would call us bind our backs so they would kind of explain our presence to people oh they're the soccer men that's why they're here it's like that but usually people are missionaries so it's like there's there's it's like why is this guy here oh he's a mormon why is this guy here He's with this church.

And we were soccer men.

So it's like, oh, oh, he's a soccer man.

And that's what people would say when we walked around.

But yeah, generally, it took me a really, really long time to sort of feel like I understood this culture.

But it's just that people were very friendly, but then didn't want to offend you so badly.

Sometimes they wouldn't even sort of engage with you.

It's a really unique kind of culture.

Do you still stay in touch with any of them?

Dilshan, this Sri Lankan young fellow, he was kind of your point man on the island and your go-between, seemed like a real nice guy.

And that would be my first question.

And also,

your then-girlfriend, now wife, must be a very understanding woman and tolerant woman.

Yeah, so yeah, I am still in touch with both Dilshan and my wife, luckily.

Good, good.

And they're not together.

That'll be a deal.

That'll be a twisting.

Yeah, Dilshan.

He's a good-looking fella.

He is.

Dilshan is like the real star of this film.

Dilshan's like the middleman because he comes from Sri Lanka and his family have to leave because of the civil war there.

And so he grows up on this island and just embraces football as like his thing.

And he's a brilliant player.

Like he's a million times better player than I ever was.

And funny enough, one of the things we had to do when we were preparing for Guam is Dilshan was like, look.

I need you to do me a favor.

I need you to foul me.

Because no one on the island wanted to like hurt him, basically.

that was one of the cultural things we had to deal with.

Nobody wanted to hurt anyone.

So, in training, I was really trying to get aggression in because I knew we'd go to Guam and play a proper team, and people would be into Dilshan because he's quite small.

So, he's like, Look, I just need you to mark me and foul me.

So, like, for week after week after week, I would play as his opposite, like against Dilshan, and basically just try and bring a bit of English Sunday League to him.

But at the same time, thinking, if I actually injure him, I've just crippled my best player.

Basically, my life's sort of central midfield dynamo.

So, yeah, Dilshan was like absolute hero he comes out of the film looking every bit as as as brilliant a player and person as he as he is he's in the us these days um like being a successful lawyer of all things um but he's um amazing footballer amazing person and yeah lizzy just just did did put up with it um my wife my girlfriend at the time uh the one thing that early on when i was saying about naturalizing one of the rules to naturalize um we went along them and i went through them with her and i was like so i have to learn the local language.

And she's like, yeah, I reckon you can do that.

I have a crack at it.

She's like, I do have to renounce my British passport.

She's like, yeah, this is starting to sound a little bit dubious, but I have got a Canadian passport pre-Brexit, pre-Brexit.

Pre-Brexit.

And I was like, you know what?

I don't know.

And then I was like, now the third one, you're not going to love it.

I do have to marry a local woman, but it could be for show only.

And she's like, yeah, I think we've reached the limit here.

So

if ever there was a doubt if I was playing or coaching,

it was decided there.

And And you say you've been back, what, a couple of years ago?

Yeah, I went back a couple of years ago.

How is it?

And like, are you still just largely ignored?

The weirdest thing is a couple of years ago, I went and we were organising a futsal tournament for, which actually people who listened to this show were massively instrumental in.

They all, about, in the end, about 900 people bought these football jerseys for the futsal competition.

So Koshrai, Chuke, Yap, and Pompeii, the four islands of Micronesia, had their first ever futsal tournament.

We got shirts made by this company called Stings, who are brilliant and they took no money for it.

They gave all the funds to the tournament.

So actually it's people from this show when we put out an appeal buying these shirts that funded this tournament, the first ever futsal tournament in 2023.

And so I went back

to the island, to Pompeii.

checked into this hotel that I used to go and sit with Dilshan and we'd have a beer and look over the ocean and chat about our plans.

It's where we cooked up the Pompeii Premier League for the first time.

Went in,

the woman came over to serve us and I was like, I think I kind of vaguely recognize you.

And she's like, oh, you've been away?

And I was like, I left the island eight years, well, nine years ago since I've last been on the island.

She's like, no, you've been off island?

And I was like, yeah, yeah.

And this is like, it was so Pompeii.

And it was like, either like, you're in the, it's time just doesn't exist if you're off island.

So yeah, it was, and it was funny going back because all the players in these futsal teams were the, they were all familiar and yet I'd never met them.

And again, they were the sons and nephews of this team.

Wow.

A couple of the old guards still there, Robert, who is in the film, who's amazing, and Bob, Bob and Robert, who are twins called Bob and Robert.

Bob and Robert Paul, whose dad, I think it's his dad, or maybe it's his cousin, is called Paul.

So it was Paul Paul, Bob, Paul, Robert Paul.

And yeah, they are the most amazing characters.

Like their story through this documentary, Matt has done an amazing job getting these guys.

Two men in their, like, I suppose, early 40s 40s now, never ever spoken about their feelings to anyone in the world.

And they let Matt come in and they talk about their brother who's killed in Iraq and how it's effectively kind of altered their lives in this way that they can't quite deal with.

And it's incredible to see that on camera because these guys, when you coach them, they were tough nuts to crack both of them in their own ways.

But they're complete opposites.

There's like clean living Bob.

and like uh and robert who'd be basically chewing beetle nut this kind of intoxicating substance as you're training and spitting it on the floor so amazing a couple of people what happens with the dock now you're looking for a distributor or is it you know or where can you watch it so it does festivals um it will be in festivals there's a few planned there's not any in the uk at the moment so if anyone in the uk does want to organize a screening we'd love that uh we've got one in palermo one in austria one in slovenia they're kind of dotted around but the hope is that if enough people want to see it this thing goes into distribution and hopefully goes on to a you know a amazon prime or a netflix sort of the opposite it's kind of the the opposite of an all or nothing, isn't it?

It's opposite of

Amazon Prime's usual output, really.

We will do what we can to

drum up the interest.

Is there anything our listeners, who I'm sure would all enjoy it, can do to give someone a nudge or anything without being overbearing or pushy?

Yeah, I mean, if on social media, so it's at thesocker men on Twitter

and the underscore soccer men underscore movie on Instagram.

I'm at paul underscore c underscore watson on both.

If anyone knows anyone in film distribution or if you just wanna if you just wanna help in any way you can we'd love that.

We just wanna in truth we want to get this film out to to show as many people as possible because I think people don't realize there are countries in this world who don't have FIFA representation and where people are trying to play this sport against these like ridiculous weight of odds.

So as you say, you mentioned next goal wins.

It's a bit like that, but it's weirdly even more of an underdog story than Next Goal Wins.

We always saw them as the Giants.

So, Next Goal is one of my favourite films, a brilliant film.

But, yeah, it's weird because

that's our World Cup to even be able to play against a team.

like, you know, Tonga would be a dream.

You can always email us footballweekly at theguardian.com if you are a Hollywood executive, and we'll pass you straight on to Paul, just taking a large cut in between.

Someone on Spotify said the pedantry corner, Max said the podcast about about Football Weekly would be called Football Football Weekly, but wouldn't it not be called Football Weekly Weekly?

Thomas says, dear Max, like many before me, I'm a long time listener, first-time writer.

I'm also not a fan of the international breaks or even care much for international football for that matter.

So it was with interest that I heard you mention in passing the podcast Football Weekly Weekly, a podcast that discusses football weekly.

Having previously been interested in West Wing Weekly and the Babysitters Club Club, I thought that Football Weekly Weekly seemed plausible and a great way to enjoy football weekly without necessarily having to re-listen to old content over the summer.

However, initial search results have not indicated that such a podcast actually exists.

I'm gutted.

My question to you is thus, were you just making it up or should I upskill on my search terms?

And lastly, as an ex-pac Melburnian living in the Netherlands, I'd also like to suggest you check out other Melbourne parks.

Edinburgh Gardens is indeed great, but don't underestimate the charms of the Botanical Gardens.

Lovely.

Studley Park, don't know it.

Yarrabend Park, very nice.

Thank you so much to Barry, you, Nikki, the rest for all that you've brought to my enjoyment of the beautiful game over the years.

Please keep it going.

Thomas, I mean, I don't believe, Barry, there's an appetite for football weekly, weekly, but it wouldn't be us who did it, would it?

It would be other people commenting on us.

I can't think of anything I would rather do less than listen to someone else breaking down my contributions.

If anyone likes to control myself, which I would like to stress are made first thing in the morning,

very early,

and possibly before I'm ready to attack today, if I'm quite quite honest, a lot of podcast people

should listen to is the Guardian Women's Football Weekly also out today.

England squad announcement, Millie Bright pulling out Frank Kirby's retirement.

So listen to that wherever you get your podcast, and that'll do for today.

Thank you, Barry.

Thanks, Max.

Thanks, Dan.

Thank you very much.

Thank you, Paul.

Thanks, Max.

Football Weekly is produced by Joel Grove.

Our executive producer is Phil Maynard.

We'll be back on Monday.

This is The Guardian.